What is up, Daddy Gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy. Nelly Fertado, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Hi. I am so happy we are finally doing this. I'm the biggest fan. Thank you for coming today. Oh, my gosh.

This is so fun. I've only been here a few minutes. I'm having so much fun.

I'm having so much fun. We have to tell the Daddy Gang who are my audience. First of all, Daddy Gang, Nelly's daughter is Daddy Gang. Can you tell me what did she say when she found out that you were coming and called her Daddy?

Well, she's been wanting me to come on the show forever. She's been talking about it since we started making music for this album, some of it together. And I was like, yeah, I love that. It'll be great. But your show's amazing. You're amazing. Love your energy. So she's thrilled. She's like, right on. And then I was like, okay, can you come help me with that? So, yeah, her friend are here today. They're excited. She'd almost stayed in the room, but I was like, I'm just going to be looking at her the whole time. So she's in the other room.

It's It's so fun to have you here, and it's so cool to know that your daughter is Daddy Gang. Meanwhile, I'm the biggest fan of you, so it's all coming full circle. You've had such an incredible career, obviously. You've been in the spotlight. You've also made decisions to step out of it at times. When are you at your happiest?

Oh, wow. In general, in life? Yeah. Oh, my God. Probably when I'm at the park with my children, just pushing them on a swing or something. But then I'm also quite happy when I am waving my freak flag at a concert and singing on my concert, on stage. Because it's also my other chance to really be myself. I do feel very myself when I'm on stage. I'm like, this is my chance to just be I'm just weird as I want to be. I fit in when I'm on stage, right?

I think, though, that's a somewhat relatable idea of we have these two sides to ourselves. No one is just one dimensional, right?

Not at all. And that is key. That is like, yes.

Would you say you're able to have somewhat of a normal life? If you're at the park, are you at the park as Mom Nelly, or do people come up to you?

No, I am very good. I'm very chameleonic, not only in my music, but in the way I look. So I can be... You wouldn't recognize me. I mean, sometimes I don't care. Sometimes a little... It depends what mood you're in, right?

So true. Sometimes you're like, let's be social.

And other times you're like, yeah, but usually if I'm around my I was like, I'm not really... I don't really want to engage in that way.

Okay, I have to know because this is Call Her Daddy. What is the difference, in your opinion, dating Canadian men versus American men? This is such a good question.

Now we're getting the juicy bits. Just so all my friends know this about me. I love love. It's my favorite topic. I try to set people up all the time poorly. I don't have a very good success rate, so they roll their eyeballs at me. A little Cupid. But I do love American men. I But I've found some interesting Canadians along the way. You have?

I was going to say, if you had to say...

Some high quality.

What is your type?

My type? It's changing. Okay. Yeah, my type is changing.

Talk to me about it.

Well, I'm in my 40s now, so I'm about... I'm 45. I'll be 46 soon. It's a new beginning for me. It's a very fun time in my life because I did I didn't really get to be single in my 20s, right? I was pretty locked down in relationships from the time... I'm not locked down in a negative way, but just I was in long term relationships for much of my 20s and 30s. So only recently, I think in the last few years, I've become single again. It's so fun dating. I love it.

You do?

I do love it. Wait, Nelly- Because it's on my watch when I feel like it. Right.

You're on my terms, on my terms voice.

And it's like when you come, correct. You know what I mean? So now my type is like, come correct. They ask me out on a date or for dinner or just like, it's all in the way. The words use the... Yeah, I like confidence. I adore confidence.

Not you saying, Come, correct, boys. Come, correct, men. I'm upset. That's a great attitude to have because I know I have a lot of single girls listening, and it's like, I think a lot of people want to have that excitement towards dating. Yes.

But you have to enjoy being single, authentically. You can't just say, Oh, yeah, I'm out here. I'm having fun dating. No. If you're looking for a relationship for real, then be authentic about that. But if that's not what you're looking for, ask yourself, What do you want? And if you want to just have fun and see what's out there, and that's fine, too.

True. You just have to know what you want.

But be real with it.

We're going to talk so much more dating. First, I have to acknowledge, there is another very famous musician that obviously is from Canada who you actually performed with. Can you please explain how you ended up singing, I'm Like A Bird with Drake?

Oh, my God, Drake. Yes, we go way back. Actually, he just asked me to come sing again a couple of nights ago. On Saturday night, he's like, he asked me at 11:00 PM to show up at 1:00 AM, and I love him to death. But I was like, I am not showing up without glam.

I thought you were going to say, I'm asleep. I'm asleep. You're like, Bitch, get me glam. Then maybe I'll roll up. I I was up.

Stop. Okay. I was up, but it was an event. It was this really fun event in Toronto. And I was like, No, I can't show up without glam. Because, of course, he's so famous. It'll be everywhere.

You're like, I want to have my beat on, okay? I want to make sure he looks- I want to have my beat. You're like, I want to have snatched.

Two hours, fit, outfit.

Wait, you got to come snatched to the gods with the lashes and the beat. You're like, Babe, give me five hours. Yeah, I know. Oh, my God. So you just didn't go.

No, I couldn't make it that time.

I'm obsessed.

But anyways, yeah, I do love him a lot. He's a great guy. And I think that... I mean, he's done a lot for the music industry. Toronto was a secret for a long time. A secret that I loved as well, growing up there and making music there in my teens, my early 20s. But now it's just so nice. He really put Toronto on a map in a different way in Canada in general. But anyways, that's how that went down.

The fact that you can be like, Drake, I don't have my makeup tonight. I'll pass on this one. Oh, my God. So baller. I know.

I wish I did, though, because I saw a video and he looked pretty cute. He had a yellow tracksuit or something, and he looked good.

Shout out, Drake.

But then I'm like, what would I have worn? Pink? Because it would have been all videos of yellow and then what color.

I love that you think of all this stuff.

That's what performers do. We I always think about what things pop, especially in pop music. You think about what things look like, too.

I want to talk before you were a performer because it is such a glamorous life, and we get to talk about the outfits and the fashion and all of it. But before you were famous, you worked as a housekeeper in a motel.

Yes, a chamber maid.

Was that your first job?

Well, that's a good question. My very first job was actually... It was the same year. I would jump over the fence at my childhood home, and I would do filing for a home inspection company. But it was long hours, but it was helpful, I think, to just sit there and organize. And then I got a job at the motel. It was called the Robin hood Motel. Yes. And my mom worked there, my sister, my aunt, my cousin. My sister My aunt, my cousin, my mom ran the housekeeping Department. She was the head honcho there. And so she hired me. And I would every morning just show up. I mean, harder in the teen years when you're out the night before and then you get there at 6:00 AM and I'm like, where's the coffee?

Right. So you're like, hello. Yeah.

And my brother was gardening there at the time, too. So we'd be Saturday morning. It's like, okay. But it was such a good experience because I worked there for probably 10 summer straight. I even worked there one summer when I thought But after I graduated high school and I went to Toronto and thought I was going to be famous in two months. But reality, that's not how it works. Your goals take a while to achieve. Move back home, worked there again that year when I was going to college in my hometown. Victoria. Oh, my God. And that was the year where I was like, oh, I wonder if my dreams will come true. But growing up doing that was good because the work ethic, because when you get into this industry, the hours can be long. When you're starting out, it's a lot of hustling.

I wanted to talk about that, though, because the juxtaposition of being someone that is hard working, working with your family, and then you get famous. And I think everyone in the world now has an understanding, at least, of when you get famous, people start treating the famous person differently, right? Is there a moment that comes to mind when you really started to notice, whoa, people are just treating me nice because I have all these things and I am famous now?

That's an interesting question. I think for me, in particular, my parents come from these really, really working class roots. My parents are from the Azores Islands, from a tiny island called San Miguel, from a tiny village. Farmers, they were already picking beans and carrying their water from the main water fountain to home, when they were 10 or 11. You know what I mean? They're already working at the farm by the time they're 12. And so that's where I come from. So you really can't get bougey on people when you come from those. You get canceled in your family. You can get canceled. So you can't. You can't even go there. I have no business acting like I'm better than anyone because I know I'm not, because I go and I'm humbled.

I think that's So fun to hear, though, because obviously, I didn't know that, but hearing that immediately, it does paint a better picture of how you are so normal and even talking to your daughter before you came in here. You're like, I need to start being. I need to air. Sure. But it's interesting even talking to your daughter, how she was like, I grew up with a very normal life because she had stepped out of the spotlight. And now all the resurgence of everything and you coming out with this album and TikTok and everything. She's like, now I'm seeing my mom out there being like, oh, my God, that's Nelly Fertado. But it's cool to see that you've been able to live a pretty normal life while also having this superstardum on the other side of your life, if that makes sense.

It's really funny. Sorry, I have a story in my mind because she said, I remember, be careful what you wish for, right? Because she's like, oh, mom, yeah, you should start working again. And then a year later, she's like, why are your hair appointments five hours long and your nail appointments are three hours? You've become a diva, Mom.

And I'm laughing Well, but this is my job. You're like, Sweetie, you know Mom Nelly? Now you're about to meet Nelly Fertado, the superstar. She said, What do you mean you can't pick me up at the airport anymore?

I'm like, Sorry, my hair appointment went over. She was livid.

I'm I'm obsessed. Oh, my God.

It's like, Well, you want a mom to be back at work here? I'm doing my thing.

I'm back to work, babe. It's what it takes.

Yeah.

That is amazing. She's like, God damn it. I read that magazines used to edit your photos by lightening your skin and changing your body. How did that affect you back then?

It's so funny because I always find it interesting what people cling to in stories. So I did a general interview with my daughter for people. But then that became a thing like, oh, this is the story. But then I realized, oh, I get it. I wrote a song about it in 2003. I think it was my second album. And yeah, it's called Powerless. And it's like, paint my face in your magazines, make it look lighter than it seems. Paint me over with your dreams, like Shabuwe, my ethnicity. So at the time, it's more about the idea of, okay, wait, I'm in this... When you're young and you're 22, 23, it's a whirlwind, right? All of a sudden, becoming successful at the career you always dreamed of. And if you're in it for the music, like I always was, I think that all that other stuff with the visuals and the esthetics and the, oh, wow, they like you and you look great on the red But then the opposite is true as well, and just questioning it all. But it is true. Yeah, I bring my own clothes to photoshoots because I was a girl.

I was 21, 22, young girl. But yeah, you'd see at the time, I think the beauty standard was a bit different. So I think that they would Photoshop a lot and just like, Oh, I thought I had hips or am I? But it's hard anyways, because when you see yourself on TV for the first time, you always look different on the camera, and it can be a little jarring to be on TV and in at the spotlight that much at a young age, I guess.

When you look back, because obviously, I think it's helpful. I get what you're saying. You're like, Wait, I did such a long interview, and that's the one thing people picked up on.

I think- No, I know.

No, but I get what you're saying. It's like that, I think for a lot of people now pick up on things because people finally do feel more comfortable to talk about things that were like, Hey, that was a weird decision. Am I not good enough as me? When do you- Oh, my God. When you look back, when did you feel your most confident when you were younger?

You know what's so funny? I feel the most confident now.

What do you think that is?

100 %. Wow. It's now. I don't know. Something happened. I don't know. I just had the '40s glow up. I was just like, wow, I just feel like me. I feel like I know what happened. I had time to work on my inner life. I had time to work on the things you don't have time to do when you're busy, right? And then when you're burnt out and you don't get to journal, you don't get to go to therapy, you don't get to go do those things. But I had a good time of three or four years of doing that. So I think by the time I got to this stage in my life, I just feel super happy with myself, even when I get criticized. You know what I mean? Who doesn't read the comments sometimes, right? It's hard not to. I think it's human in nature to go, oh, what are people saying?

Of course.

And then you're like, wow. Certain things, right? I feel like me personally have experienced my body's polarizing. You know what I mean? Which is so... It's crazy to say that, but it is. Because I see like, oh, wow, why did It's just like, wow, there's a lot of comments and people arguing about what I look like or you know what I mean? It's so interesting what fuels and triggers people. But I think at the end of the day, it can be really positive because you're starting conversations. And that comes from confidence. And I think that's what it is. It's like when you are confident, I don't know what it is, but I guess sometimes it can be threatening or very empowering.

I think sometimes, yes, people online are so triggered by certain things Which is interesting because you never know what's going to trip people up. And the fact that you're saying, my body is so polarizing, why do you think that's been?

Well, first of all, my body's changed a lot. I've had three kids. I'm curvy, and I have a curvy body. If you go to where my parents are from, from San Miguel, my body is no big deal. Every girl on the beach has the same bum that I have.

I love it.

It's true, though. So it's all context. And just maybe they're comparing you to another era when maybe you looked different or anything like that. But I've had fun with it because I've been wearing very body con clothing, and it's very empowering. And I just... I love... I love I love feeling this confident. I literally didn't even wear underwear on stage till a year ago. I'm upset. Not even. It's only been six months. I only let the booty out six months ago.

I'm upset. Nelly, I appreciate you talking about that.

It's 25 years into my career.

I love it. I love that you're talking about that, though, because I do feel like people tell you, Oh, my God, your 20s are going to be the best years of your life. And as much as those are really fun years, I do think the amount of women that I get to speak to, it is very inspiring to hear, No, it actually only gets better because you do get to know... When you're young and you're 20, as fun as you can have, you don't fully know yourself yet. You haven't fully lived enough to really know what makes you happy, what makes you sad, what makes you uncomfortable. And it feels like I've now had enough conversations with these really inspiring women to be like, oh, bitch, it only gets better. Get ready. Get ready for your 30s, get ready for your 40s, get ready for your 50s. That's really exciting.

Yeah, because you learn, you know yourself, and then you can look back and not laugh at yourself, but find things charming. Oh, wow. Even in my 30s, seems like a lifetime ago. You know what I mean?

But each decade is so beautiful. But I feel like as women, we just get more confident. And when you can block out the noise of all the comments that are negative, it's like, oh, yeah, bitch. My booty looks amazing. Bye. Get out of here.

When I was 37, I had a flingationship. I just coined this term. Wait, sorry. What? Flingationship is like a fling relationship. So flingationship-Of love.with someone who was 23. And at the time, it wasn't that big a deal, but I was contextualizing it in my mind. Like, oh, that's so interesting because your perspective continues to change as you get older and you reflect on different things in your life differently. My new album just came out, but I was listening to the one before it, not this one. So it's like a diary, so you can go back and go. And so for me, music is a diary. So it's fun.

It makes it fun. Let's talk about some of your iconic songs. Yeah, let's talk about songs. Okay. First, I just want to discuss I'm Like a Bird. A Bird is such a classic. What inspired that song?

I'm Like a Bird was inspired by I was in a relationship in my very early 20s. It was a first relationship, first more like very serious relationship after my long term high school boyfriend. It was the next relationship after that. And yeah, I was in a relationship, and I was out in Los Angeles finishing my album on my own. I was very isolated. I was probably 20 I was 20 or 21 or something out there in this little apartment, just working on music. And my collaborators were older than me, and they had their girlfriends and their wives out there, but not me. So it was a bit lonely. And they're like, okay, write some new songs and bring them into the studio. I think it was our first day working in LA, trying to finish my album after having made the rest of it in Canada. And I was sitting on a sofa at time, this place was called the Oakwood Sweets here in LA. And you'd go to the gym and you'd see, I don't know, kids, I guess, who are doing... I don't know if they're working with Disney or what they're working.

But it was the place that people went to make their dreams come true, where they would stay when they weren't yet living in LA. So I sat on a sofa and picked up my guitar, and I wrote three songs that day. And the third one I wrote was I'm Like a Bird. And I'm I'm telling you, the one I wrote before was trash. It was a really bad song, really corny, not good. Yeah, you never know. You might just be on the edge of something good.

Do you remember when you played it for everyone on your team? Was everyone like, yes?

My manager was at the studio. Yeah. My manager Chris was at the studio, and he's like, okay, I want to hear what you wrote today. So I played him the three songs, and I was convinced the corny one was good. It was really bad. I I can sing it.

Wait, please sing it for me.

I'll sing it in a second. But it's really crazy. No. But anyways.

How corny are we talking?

All right. So this is the one that I thought was better than I'm like a bird. It goes. Okay, wait. It's like, He was cocky sure, and I was a pussy, had it in the corner, I couldn't come out. He was cocky sure, and I was a pussy, had it in the corner, I couldn't come out. And I I think the end was like, Here, Kitty, Kitty. I swear to... I'm not even kidding. I thought that was better than, I'm like a bird, which then was the third song on, the demo that I had made that morning. Melly, no. And my manager said, I don't know. Yeah, okay. I think the bird one's really good. They both had bird themes. One was cockshairs, like a rooster.

Sorry. I am literally like- That's a little zany. No, this is the best thing heard all day to know that it was between a cock and a pussy versus a bird. Oh my God. Watch that literally trend on TikTok now, people are going to cup that.

Isn't it funny, though? Because I actually forgot about that till a couple of months ago. And I was like, Whoa, that's crazy that I'd written a very horrible song and a song that might be quite good right after.

I mean, I'm Like A Bird is, I feel like, forever going to be iconic. I'm curious because that song is so inspiring, right? Have you ever walked away from someone that you felt like was holding you back, in a romantic relationship?

Well, that song was about that. So that song, I did want to break up with that guy. So I wrote the song.

Oh, my God. Did you write the song and then break up with it?

Well, I sent it to him, and he said, Hey, I feel like I heard the song. What's up?

No, Nelly.

Yeah, I did.

So no context, you just sent him the song?

Well, I was like, Oh, this is my latest thing. Yeah. No, I think I ended up... I ended that relationship on tour, but it was literally... It wasn't very... It was from a pay phone on tour. I was with my band. It was one of those moments, but it's very normal. It's like your college boyfriend or something, and then you move on. So that was my college, just making music and touring. So I only did one year of college. So then I met him around that time. So I had I had to make my dreams come true. You had to. I had things to do and places to be.

But not as sad as it is to get broken up with for him. It is iconic that there is a man out there that can be like, That song is about me. That is pretty fucking cool. I'm sorry. I would take that song, Being Written About Me. I can't. I can't. Historically, are you usually the one ending relationships, or are you- Oh, I like this question.

I've been dumped before. Okay. Yeah. Only Oh, flex. It is a flex. No, that's not true. Two or three times, but more like when I was younger. But yeah, having your heart actually broken by someone that doesn't want to be with you anymore really hurts really badly. So sad. Yeah, it's really, really upsetting. And I hadn't experienced that till much later in life, till quite recently in the last five years. And that was really hard for me because I wanted to hang on. I wanted to hang on, and I didn't get it. And I built up a lot of expectations and things based on things that maybe were more about me and selfishness, right? And then it was like, okay, when do I come to grips with reality? But I've also left. Yes. I've been the breaker upper.

Do you think it's easier to be the person breaking up or getting broken up with?

Oh, my God. It's hard. It's easier to break up with someone than to have somebody dump you. Being dumped is the worst.

It is pretty hard, I think. No, it's the best, though.

Because then you grow. Tell us. Because then you go, it's that whole thing. You got to hit dirt, man. You got to hit dirt. You got to hit rock bottom. I have hit rock bottom before, and it's beautiful because then I just come out so strong. And it's good. And I'm not saying it's perfect. And I'm like, oh, we wear our wounds, don't we? Our wounds never really go away, I don't think. We can work on them. You know what I mean? We can work on them. But it's okay. You have stuff to deal with, stuff to work through. But yeah, I think I think it could be a good place, that bottom of like, oh, you know what I go back to a lot? He's just not that into you. If you're ever struggling with somebody who's broken up with you or somebody, even anybody, a flingationship, something like that, and you feel they're not giving you the attention you want and something's off, just go look up quotes from, he's just not that into you. It is so healing. You do that often? I've done it before. I think twice in my life, where I'm like, Oh.

Humbling. It's good. It's good stuff. Me too. Yeah. I'm obsessed with you. You're like, Yeah, it's great stuff. It really just knocks you back to reality.

Yeah, because it's that whole if he wanted to, he would thing.

Absolutely. It's so true.

It is. If we're girls, if we wanted to, we would.

Done. Okay, one of my personal favorite songs of yours is Maneater. How would you describe the woman you're singing about, essentially?

This is so interesting. So I really did face that off of a woman that was friends with at the time, that was a colleague was engaged to her, and she was a knockout. And just really was, did personify that man-eater energy. And what at the time, what I really, really felt at the time when I was making that whole album with Timbaland and when we were making Man-eater, as I did feel very... I It was actually only about 26 or something when I wrote that song, but I felt like there's something really empowering about masculine and feminine energy together. You know what I mean? When somebody embodies both. And I was trying to capture that in a song. And I really feel that when I play it live, it feels primal. It feels like it's for everyone. It's almost like a verb, like you're man-eatering. You're like man-eatering right now.

You're man-eatering. Yeah.

I think it's an energy.

It's such a confident song. I actually a part of it in my tour because I'm like, Oh, I can't wait for you to see it. Nelly, it's like all of these men come up and they're like magic mic dancers around me, and I'm just in my element. I'm the only woman on stage. And it's like, it is this empowering feeling when you hear that song.

I love that. I love that for people. It's so good.

Did anyone in your team ever, when you have the song, you're like, The Pussy Cock, the Bird, the Man-Eater, Permiscuous Girl, did anyone ever think that it was too edgy, or was everyone around you like, We love No, not really.

I think I was just making that record in Miami. I was feeling the vibes. I was feeling myself. I'd spend all day in a bathing suit, playing with my kid on the beach. I was feeling myself in the sun, to be totally honest. And I was newly single, see? Every time. God.

Newly single brought us a man here, Permiscuous Girl. Oh my God. Yeah. That's amazing.

It just had that fresh energy. Seeing the world through new, I guess, red-colored glasses. I love it. Yeah, that energy is very red and passionate. But also with Promiscuous, I actually didn't write that chorus. It was Timbaland's idea. It was? Yeah, it was. And then I sat down and finished the lyrics with Attitude, this amazing rapper that he was working with at the time. I was hesitant, but my good friend Jim Beam sat me down. He's like, I think this is authentic, and I really like this energy, and you sound great on it. I did know that I laced up the verses, and I sounded good and all that. And now when I sing it, I love it. It's like karaoke time.

It's promiscuous is another one of my favorites. I made a really bad music video to When I was Younger, which you'll never see. Can you tell me, though, from that song, how has your... Because it is a very, again, emboldding, empowering song. How has your relationship to your sexual has your relationship to your sexuality evolved over the years? How has your relationship to your sexuality evolved over the years?

That's a good question. I will also give a quick shout out to the music I grew up on. So Salt & Peppa, TLC, Trailblazers. Those girl groups in the late '90s, when I was a teenager, I was coming of age, 14, 15. I was blessed to have that music to listen to. It was like Mary J. Bludge, TLC, Salt & Peppa, and they were giving this empowered sexuality and choice. It was It was not about choice. It was about I'm in control of my choices. And that was the energy we wanted to capture with a song like Permiscus. It's a choice. It's an even playing field. I think to feel sexy, to feel sensual, you have to spend time on yourself. You have to spend time alone. You have to spend time... You have to tap into pleasure, which is joy. Joy is pleasure. If you really feel... And embodied in your body. I'm not going to I feel pretty sexy when I'm dancing. I'm in the dance studio because it's such an act of self-love to apply your mind and body to something like choreography and to just feel that... I would say it's almost like an equilibrium.

And I think from there, you can feel very confident. And I think it's something you develop. I think your sexuality is something you develop. When you start whenever in your early teens, and then you just develop for the self. And I think that's a healthy place to start.

I think that's such a good piece of advice because I think sometimes women can really feel like, oh, my gosh, whether they were repressed when they were younger or religion or whatever folds into it or shame. Sometimes we can feel like, maybe I just am not as sexual of a person as I want it to be, or maybe I don't feel as empowered to own it. And it's really like, the more you know yourself, the more you'll know what you enjoy, and the more that you'll feel confident to be able to explore.

It's almost like it's a quiet game. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yes.

You're just on the search for whatever makes you feel your best, and no one can tell you, and you shouldn't ever search for it through someone else. No.

I think people can teach you. I think you can grow in relationships. I think you can grow, and you can pick up things as you go, and that ebb and flow again. But at the end of the day, yeah, you got to feel good.

You got to feel good, right? Do you fall in love easily?

I'm changing. I used to. That was a pure... Yes, Alex.

And I'm a lover.

I love love. I need muses. I'm a muses girl. I think it's because I'm an artist. I'm a writer. I create. And it's like I grew up thinking and just feeling like I love lovers. I love the idea of being just really inspired and the joy in dating and like that. It's like there's nothing like that. But I also How do you enjoy my solitude so much that I have had people ask me, friends, colleagues, why are you even in a relationship? You have so much going on in your mind. You should just date yourself. How are you even able to be with... And it is true, I like my solitude so much that sometimes it is hard for me to be in a relationship. Because I'm just like... Get away from me. It's too hard. It's always felt more comfortable to be more like an enjoyable... I'm not going to say part-time. I don't know what to say.

No, what was That's the thing you said earlier? I don't know. A flipuationship? No. What was it? Oh, a fling-ation-ship.

A flingationship.

You're always wanting to be in your flingationship. Is that how you say it?

Yeah. Fling-ation-ship. Yeah. There you go. Flingationship. I think it's fun. I don't know. I follow my passions and my lust and my interest, too. I do have ADHD, and I think it's affected me. Women experience it differently than men. I was only recently diagnosed, but I read a great book, and it talked about how even as women with ADHD, we can pick partners that make us feel like we're in the passenger seat because you want somebody else to make all the decisions for us, and we just want to Coast. I found that really interesting when I read that because I was like, Oh, yeah. I think when I'm on my own, I'm more able to navigate to my whole life in a way that works for my brain and for my comfort levels. But I do love love, and I do love falling in love, and I find that fun still, but I think my priorities have changed.

I mean, I think that's amazing to even just acknowledge your priorities have changed, and you even talking about recognizing something that can affect your relationships. You being like, I don't want to just Coast. I do want to have more control over my relationships. Even you just recognizing that will probably affect the next relationship you get into and how you approach it, right?

Yes. And you want to stay yourself. I think that's the most important thing. I have had a tendency to lose myself in relationships.

A part of why you return to music was because you were going through a difficult breakup. You talk about in these songs, that experience. Can you share what made this breakup so painful for you?

Oh, my God. I need a sip of water.

Yeah, let's take a sip of water. I saw your body just go, two of an hour, sweetie. Where did we begin?

Yeah. I don't know. Isn't it like life? And then again, we talk about this experience, even when you're in your 20s and you're I'm growing. Everybody... I always wanted to have a family, you know what I mean? And have children. And we all have that dream of just settling down and like, oh, now I'm at the yellow brick road. This is so great. Oh, wait. And now I'm at the yellow brick road, right? And it comes in all these variations. But I think I just had that feeling like I had finally arrived at that yellow brick road, and it was going to be that for me. And then it turned out that it wasn't. And that's why it hit so hard. You know what I mean?

I absolutely know.

Because it was the first time it had felt like that right, where it was like, oh, where you felt like you had that profound sense of a certain piece, you know what I mean? And a certain certainty, right? And it's that idea when the certainty just gets pulled out from under you or the rug gets pulled out and you go, oh, my God, I have a lot to learn still. I have a lot to learn about me. And you might have had a horrible experience experience. For sure, I went through a very difficult time where I think I accepted some things that I would never accept now in terms of the way you're treated.

Could you share just a little bit?

Yeah, I can.

I will say- Just for women listening.

Of course.

I know. Because you can't see it when you're in it sometimes.

You cannot at all. You cannot see it at all when you're in it. Sometimes we just love so hard, and we love. And I'm sure there's women out there, too, when we become mothers, we're quite vulnerable when we become mothers because we just want what's best for our kids, and we want to protect them. And I think that in general, I'll say that it can really happen to anybody feeling powerless. You know what I mean? You could have all the money in the world and all the resources, but in the mind, really, that is your only wealth is in your mind. And so if you can't feel strong enough and clear enough to move out of a situation that might be toxic for you and not the best for you, and also abusive in any way, I think that... Yeah, I'm definitely not here to tear anyone down or anything. But I think that it's honest to say that it is hard when you're in In a relationship that has that imbalance, I will say, and abusive qualities. It is hard to see outside of it Because you isolate yourself. You stop talking to your friends.

You don't tell your friends the truth about what's going on in your life. You live in a bubble, and it's hard to admit. You know that you have chosen to not say anything, right? It's hard to admit to yourself. It is. And then on top of that, the love, right? Love, It keeps you there because, oh, you want to... And I will say that, too. I think as women, I think we tend to sacrifice our happiness sometimes once we're in it. Of course. Once we've fallen in love, we We're all in love, right? We sacrifice ourselves sometimes, and we think we're doing the right thing.

Yeah. So often. And I appreciate you sharing that, too, because I think when you are in those situations and you get so isolated, a lot of times you're like, how would I even begin to unravel this, right? How do I even begin to get away and to restart?

Fear. Fear is huge, too, because when you fear, when you have fear, that can be a very powerful emotion. You can be afraid, but you can... It's like you created in your mind. You can be afraid, what's the person going to do to me or say about me, et cetera, et cetera. I don't know. You fear that. And again, it's heightened when you have kids and there's whole other things to think about.

And I also agree with you because I have talked about this on the show before, too, of the thought sometimes of leaving and all the things that you think it would take to leave. It just feels more daunting almost than just staying. Can you share? How do you know?

I have a song about it on my album.

And I appreciate you writing about it because it's so real, and so many women listening to this are going to be like, Nelly, thank you. Water. Thank you for sharing, though, because I do think, and it's not on you to help all these women, but it is the more we talk about it, the more people I know someone's going to be watching at home right now being like, oh, my God, if Nelly was going through this and she says that she got out of it, I can, too. Can you share how you knew it was time and how you actually took the steps to get away, essentially?

I think there were moments where I almost had the strength. But again, something would keep me there where I was like, oh, this is the moment. So I think that I will I would say having remarkable friends. I'm very lucky. I have some really, really, really amazing friends, really core childhood friends that have been there for me my whole entire in our life, and they just knew what to say to me and knew what was too much or too little. And even the hard stuff. I have some friends that I will say to ladies out there, you know what? Those people that are telling you what you don't want to hear, those are the ones you need to keep close. Hopefully, they know you well enough to not repel you with judgment or anything like that. It's not judgment. You can sense when it's love. I think everyone has someone, maybe one person or one voice in their life that is maybe like, reminding you when stuff is not okay and what your worth is and what behavior is unacceptable if you cannot see it for yourself.

It's so true. It's like you just need one person.

Yeah, you do.

Person.

Yeah. To just be like, no, actually, I'm not going to talk to you anymore.

Right.

Or whatnot. But tough love doesn't work all the time. But it's in doses, right? And I'm trying to think of another thing that helped me. I think, oh, jeez, that's such a good question. I think you have aha moments. You know what I mean? They just have sometimes a moment where you're like, okay. And then sometimes, I guess I was lucky in a way Because maybe on top of it, I wasn't really the one who chose at the end of the day. Do you know what I mean? I went through a rough time, but then at the end of the day, it wasn't really my decision. But then I quickly learned that then, okay, now I'm doing me. I'm doing me now.

It's such a vicious cycle that you can get so wrapped up into. And then when you get released from something like that, it can almost feel like withdrawal symptoms because you're so used to the up and the down and the toxic. You do.

And then for some reason, your brain only feeds you happy memories. It's really weird.

Nelly, it is so fucked up. You're like, maybe she was actually the restaurant, the coffee shop.

The coffee shop, the movie we went to. It's very weird.

It's so fucked up.

That's a tough phase. That's tough phase when your brain feeds you all these happy memories. Let's flood you with happy because there are happy memories, right? Of course. That's why you stay there because there are some great things, right? So So it's tricky to navigate. It is. It's a big mind, F-U-C-K.

But I really appreciate you talking about it that way, too, because I know so many women write in feeling like, I feel so much shame that I'm even thinking about this person that hurt me. And I feel like it's like- No, don't feel shame.

Right? No, don't feel shame about it. It's not natural. You know what I mean? It's natural to want to still feel a multitude of feelings. Yeah, it's just totally normal. It's a process. You know what I mean? Because the truth is, it's like anything, right? How many bandaids do you have, right? And how long do those take to heal? It takes time.

What is a difficult lesson that you've learned about love that you would tell your kids one day?

Oh, my God. Love. It's funny. I almost call my album, Let's be honest, you know nothing about love.

Oh, my God. Stop. I'm serious.

It was either called Seven or Let's Be Honest, You Know Nothing About Love. Maybe I'll call the Deluxe that.

I was about to say, that's what you call it in your head, and then to the world at seven. You're like, what it really is. Let's be honest, you know nothing about love. Oh, my God.

It's the story of everyone's life, right? It's like we know love, of course. I know great love. I'm blessed to be a mother and have wonderful family and friends and things like that. So I know what love is. But if I was to give advice on romantic love to my children, I'm going to vote for the golden retriever. I'm sorry. Sorry. You got to be best friends. I think you have to have an authentic, true friendship. It's about partnership. Forget all the other stuff. It's about partnership. But also stay you, man. Stay you.

And listen to your friends. When you have a gut feeling, your friends are usually always...

Oh, that's the other thing. Your gut is always right. The little voice in your head that tells you... And this is not even this... And this is past relationship, but the little voice...

It's always right. And it's so hard because I I know it's so cliché to say, but it's like, then why do we always ignore her gut? Why are we always like...

But that's like, we gaslight ourselves. I have a song, actually, I think I'm going to put on my deluxe called Gaslight. Yeah. Another album title was Red Flags.

Oh, my God. Too relatable I'll take these.

So anyways, yeah. So Gaslight. We gaslight ourselves in a way. You know what I mean? Because it's like, boom, boom, boom, boom. Oh, it's like an echo chamber.

Can you share, how do you get your confidence back after I'm in a breakup?

Oh, me? Kind of like exercise and going out. I started to go out a lot after my breakup. I was ready. Because it was such a long, dwindling breakup by the end. I was like, okay, I'm dating now. This is awesome. I'm going to say after we... All the ending stuff. And then I just went out and had fun. And just I think I really found A lot of joy in dressing up again and clothing and fashion. Yeah, because I think I was really wearing a mommy uniform for three years.

What was your mommy uniform?

My place was a block away from the Target.

Oh, what were we buying at Target?

Okay. I do remember taking my teenager on a tour. Of Target? Of a university. She was shopping for universities out in California. I thought my shirt was nice, but it would look like a tablecloth because it was blue and white checkers, but it wasn't even a flattering cut. And I didn't have time to shop, so I would just grab whatever I saw. Nothing against Target, but-I love Target. Yeah, Target's fun. You can find great stuff, but I think that I didn't diversify. Got it. I wasn't really... I didn't have time. I didn't have time. Or I just wore stuff that was baggy, which is totally normal. I'm breastfed all my kids. Of course, you need easy access to the moops. So you just weren't You do.

So you just weren't feeling yourself as much. And then once you got through the breakup, you're like, you know what? I'm going to start putting my cute outfits on. I'm going to do my glam. I'm going to get out there. I'm going to go have fun.

Well, the studio helped me, too. So I started going to the studio, and I started writing. I started recording music again, and I got so many emotions out. Oh, my God. I got so many emotions out of the studio. I would cry in there. I would get angry in there. It was so good for me. It was such a good therapy.

Wait, is it true that you actually wrote 400 songs? I did, yeah. Nelly, Can you just rewind and tell me how...

If this house was my studio, what I would do is I would have just like, we're in LA today, so I'd be like, who's in LA today? Which of my friends are in LA? Which producers? Which writers? Which friends? And that's what informed this album. This album is really just a let's party type of album because I was getting over a breakup, and I was like, my social life became the studio. I wasn't in the mood to go away and write songs by myself on a guitar. It was like, no, we're bringing everybody in. I would invite people after their concerts to come hang out and make music with me. Yeah. And then my daughter was really coaching me on, too, because she was having fun in there, too. So it was like, we're making music now. We're really cooking now and really having fun.

How do you pick between 400 songs of what to put on an album?

I like to stay up late making music till really late, till the sun comes up, and I get really inspired, and I get my Bongo drum. Just joking. I I'm like, Stop.

Picturing you in there with a Bongo drum, like, Let's go.

Let's go. My djembe, and I just go till seven. No, but it's pretty much... Yeah, we just like a bunch of music. We just have fun. And the way I pick the songs, oh, my God. It's almost like... I always say, you put flowers together at a flower shop, it's like, why do you like those flowers? And I think it's also whatever goes together. And it's a bit like a fashion collection, just putting it together. I love it. One session I had, had a bunch of different people who didn't even necessarily make music. I think at one time, a comedian ended up in there, this girl. I was like, Oh, what you got? I'm a hippie that way. If you were, I would make you sing. No. Yes. I believe anybody can write a song. I've done that before. I've done art shows.

Wait, let's do it right now. How do you start? Let's do it now. Okay, how do you start writing a song? Where does you even start?

I'd be like, What's your favorite childhood vacation you went on? Oh.

Shit. Like, Disneyland.

See how it's got you in your feels?

Yeah, I'm like, Oh, my God.

So we start there. Okay, Disneyland. So like in a Disneyland. So what did you like about it?

Just the euphoric feeling of seeing these things come to life that I always saw on TV.

Yes. Yes. Just like, so you'd be like, oh, like euphoria. Everything's telling me a story. Oh, seen it before, yeah. Seen it before, yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean?

I am fucking chilled.

That's how I write.

That's how I write. Starts a song in two seconds.

Yeah. Then we'd go somewhere with it if I keep going. But yeah.

I am fucking obsessed. I am not okay that you just said that. Thank you.

Bioworks above the Castle, blowing my mind.

No, your voice.

I can stay here every night. It's like, whatever.

Nelly, me just being like, Okay, for the rest of the interview, just saying... No.

And then we call it Disneyland.

What is your stance on breakup sex?

Oh, that's a good question. I mean, I think it's necessary at a certain stage. It is. Let's be honest. Aren't we honest on this show?

We're being very honest today, Nelly. I think that's all we're doing. Come on. I love it.

I mean, it's always like energy. You have to like, squeeze the lemon. Oh my God, I love it. Right? It's like, squeeze the lemon until the juice is gone. So that's what it's like. So then I'm one day like, well, this lemon has no more juice, so no more break up sex. Yeah, I think it's natural. That is the best take. And I want to hear from other people, too.

I think that's a great take. I love that take.

Guys, when they break up or something, they're like, Yes. Well, yeah, we might have seen each other once or twice. Last week. Literally.

Okay, so are you single right now? Okay, you're single.

I'm dating, though. I'm dating, but I'm seeing different people. Oh, love.

You've got a little roster going on.

I mean, I have a little roster, but it's like, I feel like it's derivative. I like the roster.

I've got a plethora of options.

No, I mean, I call it the flingation chips. Flingation chips. So it's like, oh, it's like a potential. I will say that. I have like, there's different potentialities and there's different levels of interest and just and romance in different areas. I love this. I'll describe it that way.

Are you going on- So yes, I'm single again.

I've been single for a couple of years.

What is your ideal date?

I went on a really nice date recently where it was daytime.

Okay. Yeah. We love that.

Yeah. I I think I recommend the daytime date for a first date because it's broad daylight. So there's a particular date. It was very hot, so it was very sweaty. But that was unfortunate. I actually had boob sweat. A classic. I know. Or just dinner, that type of thing. I love being like, yeah, just like...

Chill.

Yeah. Just going out for dinner. But I like the idea of dressing up for a date sometimes if it's appropriate. But ironically, I never have time, so get ready so fast. But I do like that idea.

Would you ever bring a guy to one of your shows?

I brought guys to my shows. Yeah. But it's not really fair because they just go, oh my God.

Right. They're going to just fall in love immediately. They're like, I love you.

It's like show me so different, but it It's cool because you get to show what you do. You know what I mean?

But they're immediately in love. I mean, it's pretty awesome.

The concert's awesome. It's cool. You see me go up there and do my thing. Oh, my God. Yeah. So I'm strategic about inviting the win, though, right? It's not always appropriate or the right setting, but-For sure. It's almost like, what would be the best weapon in the weapon shed? What would it be called? Like a machete?

Like a machete.

The show is like a machete move. Yeah. You'd be like, Come to my shell. So you don't pull out the machete right away. You want to time it out. Anyway.

What? I'm upset with you. What's your next question? You're like, Moving on. Oh, my God. The machete is the show. Nelly, the machete. Yeah, I'm done. We're moving on. What are some non-negotiables that you're looking for in a partner? You're like, If they don't have this, I'm out.

The self-work. Yeah. For actual partnership, long term partner, I would want somebody who's worked on their self in an authentic way. Not in a surface way, but more like the spiritual side Like a little bit of exploration there. You know what I mean? But authentically and also some growth in that department, I would say. Maybe growth and, specifically, ego, I think. Let's just pause on that. We need some third eye coming into the mix.

When the ego is out of control, especially when you start dating a guy, you can first think it's confident and hot. But then all of a sudden you're like, Oh, you're a dick.

But it I want somebody confident. Yeah, but confidence comes from, I think, a genuine good heart. You know what I mean? I think for partners, you want somebody with a good heart. You want somebody nice. I don't know why, but sometimes we're attracted to people that aren't that nice, just to people. I watch how they talk to the people you encounter on your date or whatever when you're dating, how they treat your friends, your family. If your friends like them, if your family likes them, all those big green flags.

Sometimes we don't listen to our friends, and our friends at some point don't really care. They have no agenda other than wanting you to be happy. So when you guys are trying to math it in your head, well, my friends just don't get it. They don't see that good side of him. It's like, no, your friends just want you to be happy. They don't care. Listen to your friends. If they're like, he's a dick, there's a reason. And they're only seeing a percentage. How crazy is that? And they can even see he's not a good person. But we rationalize in our head.

A lot of rationalization.

Okay, back to your music. You ended up taking a break from music. Were you nervous at all? How people were going to react with you coming back?

I'm very lucky because I got to tippito very slowly into the waters, and then things lined up in a really cool way. So started with... I was already making music by the time I showed up on stage after five years with Drake at an event in Toronto, and I sang, and it was like, oh, this is fun. I realized, oh, maybe I have something new to offer this. I've worked on myself. I feel different. Maybe I'll be better at my job now. I'm older, better, wiser. That vibe. Then And I started booking more shows. I booked a show in Australia where I met Dom Dala. Then we make this track, and then we're playing it at Lollapalooza and Coachella, and it's crazy. And his raves that he throws after his show, just the whole thing. So fun. So everything lined up so nicely that I was making my album while I was getting out there again. So it wasn't so scary, right? It was baby steps. And that, to me, was a blessing.

What did you learn about yourself from writing this new album?

Oh, my God. Wow. I learned that I've become an even better producer and person who brings people together because I got to try new ideas. I got to try... I have weird juxtapositions of people and sounds on my album. And I think that's just because Oh, my God. I love people, genuinely. I have such a curious mind. Like I told you, I'd love to have you in the studio, and I want you to sing. So I am more interested in the craft of making it almost than the outcome. Does that make sense?

Yeah, interesting.

Yeah. I'm more into just like, oh, the That's the bad scientist part. And I found such confidence in there this time around. I've always been confident, but this time I was more open-hearted. Before, I used to not like writing songs in front of people. And now I don't care. I would just turn the mic on like this, have everything blast with the speakers. It feels like you're at a live show. And then we just hang out and have a good time. So I think I grew in vulnerability. That's amazing. Yeah, my vulnerability.

It's really incredible to see how your life has evolved. And you're such an incredible talented performer and producer. And you've built an incredible family, and you have these gorgeous children. Last question, what are you the most proud of with this new album as a whole? And why do you want people to go stream it?

Oh, my God. I think the album has a lot of emotion. I think it has a lot of prarity. And if you just want to escape, if you just want to feel, like you have that music that makes you feel something for real, I will humbly say that I think a lot of the songs do make you really feel something and make you really escape. I spent my time making it, and I definitely think it's just really good quality music. Oh my God. Genuinenly.

Nelly Fertado, I- But of course, I'm just thinking about, What do I make now?

I'm just never satisfied.

I mean, you have 400 in the bank.

Meanwhile, I'm like, It's high.

Stop. Would you ever pull the songs from the 400 and make another album out of them or no.

I'm working on my Deluxe right now.

Who is your dream collab?

Dream Collabo. I mean, I still think it'd be cool to have a song with Drake. I think people would love that because we're both Canadian. The Lore, the Toronto lour, a Toronto lour.

Can you please? Our last request is yes. Anella Fertado, Drake's Song, Putting in the Crest Now, done.

Yeah, I think it would be really good.

Thank you so much for taking the time and coming on today. It was truly a pleasure. You are even better hanging out with you in person. Thank you so much.

Oh, thank you for having me. This was really fun. I had a good time. Yeah, I even cried.