You can't make someone else change. And so you know what you're doing when you put energy into being frustrated about other people who either won't or can't make that change you want them to make? You're just burning energy. Imagine if you took all that energy that you're frustrated at other people and you just poured that energy in a positive direction to make your own life better. So yes, try to be compassionate and understanding.

But all of that energy and frustration that you can hear in Lisa, I wanna scream sometimes. I'm sure you do because you're trying to make them change. That's why you're frustrated. And that brings me to the 3rd rule. You gotta stop being mad at people for not being who you want them to be.

I will never be a accountant. I will never be somebody who is OCD detail oriented. That's not me. My genius is in being creative. It's in connecting with people.

It's, you know, flying by the seat of my pants. That's my genius. And somehow, Chris and I have made it work for 26 years. And I think it has to do with the fact that we are 99% compassionate, understanding, and supportive of 1 another. And then there's those 1% moments that happened today over me being a dumbass.

And of course, I feel terrible about it, but I will never be Susie Q with the calendar. That's just not who I'm supposed to be in life and that's okay. But I can be more responsible about getting the support I need so I don't leave other people in breakdown. And we are gonna get into boundaries because I know you're already gonna, well, what do you do, Melvin? We will get there.

But I wanna address 1 other aspect of Lisa's question, and it's this.

Meeting people where they are in life is so important. I know and understand this, but my patience is tried when people wallow. Any advice, Mel?

I'm gonna give you a specific tactic for people who wallow. I call this the 6 month rule. The people in your life get 6 months to wallow in anything. They have 6 months to wallow about the divorce. They have 6 months to wallow about the weight they've put on.

They have 6 months to wallow about the job they lost or the circumstances or the weather or whatever else. And once the wallowing passes the 6 month mark, you have a boundary to draw. Okay? And this boundary works like a fricking charm. Because number 1, if they don't want to, they're not gonna change.

You're just gonna wallow. Number 2, you can't make them change, so don't even try. And number 3, you gotta stop being mad about this person not being a person that you want them to be. But you can draw a boundary. And you wanna hear the boundary?

It's the 6 month rule. Here's what you say. So and so. I'll give you an example from my own life. So I have a, friend that got a divorce after a really, like, horror like, it was like, you know, 1 of those divorces is just ugly, just ugly, ugly, ugly.

And the divorce was finalized. Okay? This friend of mine, every time I saw her, constantly complaining about the x and the this and the that and the other thing and the other thing and the other thing. And finally, after 6 months, I looked at her and I said, you are no longer allowed to talk about this in front of me. I have recommended therapists.

I have been a good friend. I have given you books to read, all of which you have done nothing about. I am no longer available to be a soundboard for your wallowing because it is clear to me that you don't wanna do anything about this. The second that you would like to change this, I am here to support you. I am here to help you, but I am not available for you to stay stuck.

I care about you too much. So if you'd like to go complain to somebody else, please do. But you are not allowed to bring this person's name up. You are not allowed to talk about your marriage, your ex marriage, your ex, any of it. I'm not available for that anymore.

And an interesting thing will happen. That person will be mortified, and they probably won't call you for a while because they're still addicted to their wallowing. You're not trying to change them. Isn't that interesting? You're not trying to change them.

You didn't say stop wallowing. You said, I'm not available for it. So you know who changed in that relationship? You did. You changed what you're available for.

So I want you to understand that when you understand and you accept these 3 truths about people, if they wanted to, they would, you know, unless they can't. Number 2, you can't change anybody. And number 3, stop being mad at people for not being who you want them to be. You take all the power back. None of this says you can't change.

And so when you get frustrated by somebody else complaining, cut off access to the complaining. You're not saying I don't love you. You're actually saying the opposite. You're saying I love you so much that I'm not gonna be a part of you staying stuck. And as long as I listen to this garbage come out of your mouth, you are gonna be stuck.

I'm not here for it. I'm here for your transformation. I am here for you creating a better life. I'm here for you moving on. I'm here for you no longer giving airtime to this asshole that you're divorced to.

I am here for your future. I am no longer here for your past. When your friend is ready to change, guess what? They will because they will want to. Remember, that's rule number 1.

If they wanted to, they would. And, you know, 1 of the things that I wanna say before we move on to question number 2 is that I think a lot of us learn that part of a relationship is struggle, that there's conflict, that there's tension, that you've gotta have somebody to fight against or push against, that you saw these patterns growing up or they have been patterns in friendships or relationships. And so you're just kinda used to this push pull. Well, what if I told you that it doesn't have to be that way? That maybe if you're in relationships that feel like a lot of work, that that's a sign that the relationships that you're in are no longer working for you.

And 1 of the fastest ways to get rid of the struggle is drop the rope. Now, what does that mean? So think about tug of war. When you are playing a game of tug of war where you're on 1 side of the rope and, you know, you got other people on the other side of the rope and you're pulling back and forth and it's a lot of effort pulling yanking yanking, You wanna know the best way to win tug of war? Literally, if somebody goes to yank backwards, let go of the rope, they fall on their ass and then yank the rope back towards you.

Who said that's not fair? Of course, that's fair. Letting go of the struggle often makes the struggle go away. And so notice that Lisa's question was, Mel, I'm struggling to be a more tolerant person. And so the way you become more tolerant is accept those 3 things about people.

If they wanted to, they would. If they could, they would. Number 2, you can't make them change. Number 3, stop being mad at them for not being who you want. And then you've learned some other things.

Doesn't mean you can't change. Doesn't mean you can't draw boundaries. Doesn't mean you can't say you can do all this stuff you want, but don't do it in front of me. I think it's a real wake up call when you start to look at how much you're trying to change other people. We all do it.

You know, you want somebody to be healthier. I'm sitting here thinking to myself that I really worry about my brother, and I want him to be healthier. He's 6 foot 5. He's a big guy. He's always had a big build.

And I worry because, you know, the ticker, the heart, it works extra hard when you're a tall guy. And so, you know, I can't make him change. I can love him. I can tell him I'm worried about him, but he's gotta be the 1 that is motivated to do it. And 1 of the things that I did because, you know, I'm guilty of wishing people would change.

I'm guilty of being frustrated. You know, I've shared with a lot of you that I really miss my parents. We don't live near each other. And my parents don't like to travel over the holidays. And I'd like them to come visit us here in Southern Vermont.

They're down in Florida and they don't wanna travel over the holidays. And I have a choice. I can accept them and love them, or I can feel frustrated and wanna change them. And what is feeling frustrated and wanting to change the people that you love do? It just makes you feel frustrated.

It makes you feel negative energy. When you're trying to change somebody, you're not loving them. You're judging them. Accepting somebody where they are and offering support in a way that feels loving and supportive, that's what we need to do for the people in our lives. Meet people where they are.

Because trust me, everybody that you know is so damn hard on themselves. If you're worried about their weight, I promise you they're worried about it too. If you're worried about their drinking, unless they're plowed all day long, they're worried about it too. If you're worried about their finances or their marriage, I guarantee you, they are too. And so you adding your worry only increases their tension, your tension, their struggle, your struggle, your judgment, your evaluation.

It just adds on shame and pushes people away. So if you really want to be closer with people, come from connection, come from acceptance, come from love. I'm not saying this from some high and mighty thing. I think you can tell that I struggle with this shit. I struggle with giving it.

I struggle with having receiving it. I am a work in progress like we all are, which takes me to our next question from a listener named Dan.

In doing this work, I was able to see myself grow not only by my daily actions, but also by the way I started to think. 1 day, my wife and I were chatting in the kitchen, and she actually said to me to stop acting like I'm on a pedestal, a selfish mister know it all, which I had no idea I was doing. So this got me thinking perhaps my change was affecting her, and for some reason, I felt I was at fault. Can you speak specifically to your transition from being a regular parent to being mouth fucking Robbins and how you overcame the family shakeup and what was all happening around that time? Thank you.

Okay. This is a great question. So 1 thing first, you know, how I went from being just like a normal person to quote Mel Robbins. There was not like some overnight thing that happened. I am who I am today because of the work that I've done over probably a decade.

Like, this is not like I won the lottery and I went from being broke to being a millionaire. This is I went from being nearly bankrupt and basically a drunk on the verge of divorce in 2,008 to meticulously 1 foot in front of the other, slowly changing, slowly learning about myself. And so my family has had, the benefit of seeing a slow, I mean, sometimes so tedious, evolution. Because that's what true change is. It doesn't happen overnight.

It happens over time. But what you're talking about is really important for us all to understand. And this is 1 of the most common questions that I get. Doesn't matter who you are, what kind of change you're making. The fact is when you make a change, you create ripples that hit other people, whether you intend to or not.

And this thing that I'm about to explain to you is so life changing, and I didn't see this for a long time. I was guilty of being the kind of person that it sounds like you may be, that when you're really excited about something, you become a huge cheerleader. Let's all go gluten free. Let's all become vegan. Oh, the best thing in the world is keto.

Oh, you know what we should do? We should take this seminar. We should all exercise. We should do this. We should do that.

You should become an entrepreneur. I became, like, a just big advocate. And when you do that, it can come off to other people like you think you're better than them now that you've quit smoking or you've quit drinking or you suddenly don't eat animals because you're a vegetarian. That sounded terrible. Now that makes me wanna be a vegetarian, honestly, when I say it that way.

But you know what I'm saying. And so let me explain why that happens. Okay? Number 1, everybody, any change you make impacts any relationship you're in. Because relationships are about energy and relationships are also about overlapping patterns.

And if you think about that, it's true. The people that you feel closest to in terms of your friend group are people that you click with. It also happens that you probably have a lot of overlapping patterns, whether it's you have patterns of interest that overlap or you work together in that overlaps or you have kids the the same age and that overlaps or you live in the same neighborhood and that overlaps. And so it's this energy and this pattern thing. The second you change anything in your life, energy shifts and patterns change.

And that means every relationship's gonna change. And you can't that's not anything you can avoid. It's a fact of life. If you decide that you suddenly wanna launch a side business, all of a sudden, you're not going to have time on Saturday nights to hang out with your buddies playing poker. It's a fact because you're gonna be interested in working on your side business.

And as you work on your side business, you're gonna start meeting other people that do the same kind of business. And because you are interested in that, you're gonna be spending more time with them. Patterns change. I want you to accept that as a fact. It doesn't mean anything's wrong, but let's talk about the issue that you are facing with your wife.

Okay? Because this is what you need to understand about other people. Your changes do not inspire other people. They confront them. I'm gonna say that again.

Your changes do not inspire other people. They confront them. And I'm gonna give you a famous example from my marriage. I am once again the jerk in the story and Chris is the winner. There's no winners.

That was me being funny. Chris is the transformed 1. I'm the jerk. Okay? So a couple years ago, Chris made this decision that he was gonna stop drinking for a while.

And I was so excited for him. He had had a major problem with alcohol as the restaurant business was really struggling. It was basically the way that he dealt with his stress. And so when he got out of the restaurant business, he's like, I gotta make major changes. I gotta stop drinking.

I need to get healthy. I gotta figure out who I am and what I wanna do with my life. And so he decided step number 1, not drinking. I'm like, Yes. I was a, Yes, for about 2 days.

And then by day 3, dinner time rolls around. And I had a habit of loving to open up a bottle of wine while I was cooking. And so day 1 and day 2, I did not do that. I was supportive of my husband's change. And day 3, I'm like, I think I'm gonna have a glass of wine.

Just because he's not drinking doesn't mean I can't drink. And by the way, Chris was also amazing in that he wasn't like, I'm doing this. You need to do this. He's like, I'm doing this for myself. So I open up the bottle of wine, and I'm cooking, and Chris is standing there, and the kids are running around.

And I take out the wine glass, and I'm like, glug glug glug glug glug. And then I say, hey, would you like to have a glass? And he is like, nope. Like, you sure? I mean, it's basically just juice.

You know, it's not that big of a deal. It's not like you're having some bourbon. He's like, no. I don't want any wine, Mel. Like, come on.

And he looks at me kinda like he did this morning, actually, with the veterinary story. He looks at me very frustrated, and he said, Mel, I don't wanna drink. Stop asking me to have a glass of wine. And then I said, I'm sorry. Sheesh.

You know? I I just I just feel bad because, you know, I feel bad having a glass of wine on my own. And then he said something that was a mic drop. He said, if you're concerned about what's in your glass, then maybe you should figure out your relationship to drinking. Because the fact is, Mel, nobody cares what's in your glass but you.

And if me putting non alcoholic seltzer in my glass makes you think about what's in your glass, then you've got some changing to do. And he's right. And this is my point. If somebody is confronted by your change, it's because your change is making them think about what they're doing or not doing in their own life. Just like Chris's decision to stop drinking made me think about my decision to have a glass of wine while I was cooking dinner every night.

And here's the thing. He's right. Nobody gives a shit what's in your glass. But people who get confronted, it's easier for them to attack you or to get you to change your behavior than to take a look in the mirror and change their own. It's easier for me to question what Chris is doing than to look in the mirror and go, well, should I have a glass of wine?

Maybe I don't want a glass of wine. Maybe it's just some dumb habit that I've had for 10 years. And I don't really care about drinking wine, but now Chris is making me think about that. And it's a hell of a lot easier for me to question him than for me to question me. There's actually science around this.

It's called my side bias. There is so much research about this cognitive bias. That's a fancy word for your brain has certain ways that it thinks that are totally screwed up. Okay? And my side bias is what's called a true blind spot.

It doesn't matter how smart you are. It doesn't matter how much money you have, how educated you are. My side bias impacts absolutely every single 1 of us. What does that mean? That means once we have an opinion about something, we will argue for our side no matter what.

Chris is gonna argue that not drinking is the best thing on the planet, and I'm gonna argue that there's nothing wrong with having a glass of wine. And here's the problem with my side bias. Number 1, it prevents you by being defensive about your side. It prevents you from being open to other ideas, other possibilities. Maybe you don't wanna have a glass of wine when you cook dinner.

Maybe you don't wanna be playing poker with your buddies in their garage every Saturday night. You really would like to get started on that real estate business you've been thinking about for years. But instead, we argue for our side. In fact, at the University of Toronto, there is a doctor. He's also a professor, doctor Keith Stanovich.

He's a psychologist that teaches there. He has done so much research on my side bias. He's considered the scientist scientist when it comes to the field of cognitive science. And some of the research that I dug up as I was looking at this because I was curious, why are we so resistant to change? Why is it that when a friend of ours wants to roll out of bed and and go to the gym at 7 o'clock in the morning, we tend to roll our eyes instead of rolling out of bed with them?

Well, it has to do with this my side bias. In fact, there's interesting research here. And this is why it's so important for you to do what Chris did, which is don't try to make somebody else change. Don't try to make them have the water instead of the wine. Don't try to make them positive when they're wallowing.

Don't try to make them healthy when they're not. Because based on the research, when you give somebody a lecture, which is basically the way that it feels when somebody says, you know, you should lose some weight. You know, maybe you're drinking a little bit too. That's a lecture. Only 3% of people change when they feel like the change is being forced upon them.

3%. Those are not great odds. You wanna know better odds? When they think it's their idea. 37% of people will change when they believe the idea came from themselves.

That is so important because if you actually would love to see people in your life make positive changes, you have to operate so that they believe the change is their own. So let me go back to the example with Chris. So if Chris had told me that he thinks I have a drinking problem, I would resist that because of the my side bias. I would argue, oh no, I don't. But when he says, stop pressuring me, nobody cares what's in your glass but you.

And if you're concerned about what's in your glass based on what I'm doing, then you need to think about what you should be doing, Mel. By asking that question and forcing me to think about my own behavior and my own choices, of course whatever I do next is gonna become my idea. Because he's forced me to think about what I actually wanna do. So back to Dan. I'm sure, Dan, your wife feels judged.

So first of all, apologize if anything that you've done in terms of your enthusiasm made your wife feel less than. Super simple thing to do. You can certainly invite her to participate with you, but do not tell her to. Do not lecture her about it. Do not force anything on her at all because now you know only 3% of people ever change when they feel like the change is something somebody else wants them to do or is forcing them to do or is lecturing them about.

So that's takeaway number 1. Takeaway number 2, you can ask your wife questions. Why does this bother you? What about what I'm doing inspires you? You know, is there anything that you would want me to change?

Invite that kind of dialog and you're gonna open something up. Because if your wife or your spouse or your partner, your roommate, your friend, whatever, like let's take this broader than dance question. If somebody in your life is confronted by the changes that you're making, they're passive aggressive, they roll their eyes, this this is normal. I want you to stop for a second and let's come back to a little bit of compassion. Your behavior sent a ripple that's making them feel triggered.

And we know it's easier to question you than to question themselves. But trust me, if they're questioning you, they're also questioning themselves. And so remember the 3 rules. If they wanted to or if they could, they would. Number 2, you can't make them change.

You can make them laugh. You can make them think. You can make them feel included, but you can't make them change. And number 3, please stop being mad that they're not who you want them to be. They may never be who you want them to be.

Loving somebody means loving them where they are and where they're not. It means loving and accepting them for who they are and who they're not. Now remember, you can have boundaries. You should talk to your wife about the ways in which you could talk about these changes that would be supportive to her. You can have boundaries with her and she can have boundaries with you.

Maybe your tone of voice is a little lecher but she loves hearing about it. She just doesn't wanna hear it as if it's a lecture or if she has to participate or if there's something wrong with her for not doing it. Chris, I have to say, handled this like a boss. He actually handled this like a boss in something going on right now. Every morning when that alarm goes off at 5:45 and I roll over to my left and I see that Chris is already up.

He's already up and at him. And when I walk into the kitchen and I see his gallon jug of water and he's already drunk a quarter of it, and it's only 6:15 in the morning. And at 6:30 AM after I've written in my journal and I've had my cup of coffee and I've set my intentions and he's come in from his first workout of the day with our 2 dogs trailing behind, he doesn't say, you should be doing this. Why aren't you oh, you're up now? No.

He's just focused on what's making him happy. And what's interesting is all these changes he's making, it is sending a ripple effect. You know what it's doing? It's making me go, I wonder what would happen if I got up a little bit earlier. Might be kinda nice to get up with him and take that walk with the dogs outside.

Or, I wonder what would happen if I exercise twice a day, if I took on this structure. And so the truth is Chris made a change. It sent ripples through our marriage and our relationship, and he never said a damn word about it. The change itself is impacting me and making me think. Pretty cool how that works.

You receive so many people from around the world every day and so do I writing in because they can't find love. Because they have a string of relationships that have failed, and they have a story about needing to find love, about I can't find love, about and I I, as a mom, having had 2 daughters who are now in really great relationships, seeing them chase it, seeing them, like, attach their value around somebody else, picking them, loving them, and I think a lot of people can relate to that. Where do you begin when it comes to building this new skill around how you think about love? Mhmm. Where would you tell somebody?

Is it rule number 1?

It is rule number 1 in the book, but I think you've just brought out a beautiful point that I want to respond to and it's that we all have a story that we're writing about love. And the interesting thing is that our mind makes us fiction writers and we're writing our own fictional version of what our love story looks like and it changes every single day. 1 day we feel like anyone would be lucky to have us, but then there's months that go by when we feel we're completely unlovable and we're not enough. And I think it's really interesting because we both know this, that the story you're saying to yourself, the story you're telling yourself naturally becomes your reality because you're looking for the facts. You're looking for those truths in your life.

So if you think to yourself, you know, no one's attracted to me right now. You're now going around looking for how many people are not attracted to you and don't look at you. It's almost like when you make a decision to say, I'm thinking about buying this brand of car or I'm thinking about buying this brand of whatever it may be. Now you see that brand everywhere. You hear it everywhere.

Right. Right.

It's not that suddenly everyone just started buying that car on the streets or buying that product or brand, but you see it everywhere because it's at the forefront of your consciousness. And so if the story is I'm not good enough, I'm not ready and I'm unlovable, which is a very true and real story of the people that are riding in for us, that unfortunately is what you're going to perpetuate. And that's why rule 1 is about what you do alone. Because if you're waiting for someone to love you, to believe you're lovable, that means you're saying that the day they change their mind, you're now immediately unlovable. And so you're deciding whether you're lovable or not based on whether someone else thinks you're worthy of love.

And I think that that sets us up for a lot of pain, a lot of stress, a lot of pressure. There's this beautiful thought from Paul Tillich and he talks about how in the English language we have 2 words for being alone, but we only talk about 1 of them and that word is loneliness. I'm lonely, I feel alone. It's been a lonely day, it's been a lonely year, I'm experiencing loneliness, but we never use the other word and the other word is solitude. It's just not used in our vocabulary and he says that loneliness is the weakness of being alone and solitude is the glory or as I say the strength of being alone.

And what I want people to understand is that when you take the time on your own to do 3 things, the first thing is you have to learn about yourself. You have to learn what you like, what you don't like, what experiences you're into, what you're not into, because what we don't realize is when you start dating someone, you adopt all of their likes and dislikes only

in

a few years to feel like you don't know who you are anymore, and you lose yourself.

Well, this

is gonna sound like a dumb question, but I have to ask it.

Yeah.

How the hell do you figure out what you like? No.

I'm not. I'm serious.

Like, if you've always been somebody

Yeah.

So so let's let's role play.

No. No. No. Let's do that. Life coach.

Yeah.

K? My parents are divorced. I have had terrible relationships through high school and college, Jay. And, the last person I was with cheated on me. And every time I go out to the bars with my friends, all my friends get approached by people.

Mhmm.

I don't know who I like, how do I find love? Like, how to coach me?

So so first mistake, and I wouldn't I wouldn't say this in a coaching session, but to speed it up for us. First mistake, you're already thinking it's about what do you like about the partner. I'm saying what do you like about yourself?

And where do you start your own? Don't know

yourself. So very simple. When you go out for a dinner Uh-huh. As soon as you get back, you know whether you like the food at that restaurant or not. Don't you?

Yes.

If you went out for a burrito you know whether you like it or not. If you went out for Italian you know whether you like it or not. How about we start doing that with people, places and projects? How about we start reflecting when we take on a project at work? After we complete it, let's sit there and reflect.

Don't reflect while you're doing it because that can often be misleading. Sometimes a piece of food comes out and it looks awkward or uncomfortable or it's a weird color. Then you try it and it's incredible. So it's only by trying do we know. And so after you finish your project to work, did I like it or not?

What did I like about it? What didn't I like about it? Was that my comfort or was that my discomfort? 3 questions really easy. Did I like it or not?

What did I like about it or not like about it? And what I didn't like about it was that just because it was uncomfortable or is it because I actually found it terrible? And if you did that with people, groups you spend time with so many of us never change our friends over a decade because we never reflected when we left. You'd never go back to a restaurant if you had a bad experience.

That's true.

But you keep going back to the same person.

Oh my god. We crawl back. We

crawl back. We crawl back.

We beg them back in our lives.

Because we never took that time to reflect because it was always about them. We make it about them. So give me I'll give you a relation.

Okay. So stop. I wanna make sure everybody's heard that. Skill number 1. Rule number 1, let yourself be alone.

But what I wanna say is this was the huge paradigm for shift for me. So much of our us are chasing and seeking love. And step 1 that I just got from you is you gotta make it about yourself and not about the other person.

Mhmm.

And until you understand the things you love and the things that make you come alive when you're alone, that's the beginning of this.

Yeah. We keep making lists of what we want in someone else. Right? We keep making a list of I want them to be kind. I want them to be tall.

I want them. So all of our energy is being pointed outwards rather than saying, who am I becoming? Who am I striving to grow into? What is it that I'm passionate about? When you're focused on all of that, all of a sudden you feel you have so much more to offer in a relationship.

You walk into it recognizing that someone would be fortunate to be with you and you'd be fortunate to be with them because you have something to share. I think most of us, we walk into relationships because we're scared of being alone. And when we do that, studies show we do 3 things. If you're feeling alone, if you're scared of being alone and single and you're going into a relationship because of that fear, research shows 3 things happen. The first thing is you're guaranteed to settle for less than you deserve.

Guaranteed. The second thing is you're more likely to be dependent on that person because you think they're out of your league. And so now you'll become, do, mold, fold, become anything they want they want you to be. And the third is you're gonna be scared to leave them because being with them in your mind is better than being alone. And so you think about all of us who've been in that situation before and by the way, it's not your fault.

Movies have done

this. Situation before?

I have been in a situation before many times in my teens

Yeah.

Where I sadly, and I regret this, I showed love to people in order for them to validate me. So it wasn't that I didn't like them, but I showed them more extreme forms of passion and love because I thought they'd say, Jay, that's amazing. You're the best person I've ever been with. I just wanted to hear those words. Yeah.

And that comes back from my childhood trauma of being bullied for being overweight, for being bullied for being Indian, for having a group of girls who lined up next to my football match when I was 11 years old shouting she's out of your league.

What?

Yeah. So I was, I was 11 years old in primary school or elementary school as you say in the US and I was there was 1 girl in school that everyone had a crush on. Right? You're 11 years old and there was 1 girl that every guy had a crush on. And all the guys knew and all the girls knew, but she didn't know we had a crush on her.

And 1 day I came in late from I think a doctor's appointment or something like that and everyone was laughing when I came in And I didn't know what they were laughing about, so I sat down and everyone was giggling at me and pointing at me and I was thinking what's going on here? And then 1 of my friends slipped me a note and the note, I opened it and it said, 'she knows.' I was like, 'she knows what?' I realized that all the guys and all the girls had told her that the only person in the class that had a crush on her was me. And I was considered 1 of the least desirable people in my class because of my weight and the color of my skin. And so for the rest of that week, all the girls bullied me standing behind literally were playing foot when I say football, I mean soccer, but we're playing football and I was a goalkeeper because that was the only position I'd be allowed to play. And the girls lined up behind the goal and shouted out, she's out of your league.

I can't believe you thought you could get her. I can't believe that you thought she could be with you. And I realized that that trauma, that experience transferred over to my teens when now all I wanted was a girl to say, you're the best. You're amazing. You're incredible because of that other statement I'd heard all those years before.

You know, it's amazing how we have these experiences, and it just blocks our ability to let love in because we don't believe that we're worth it. That also, I'm realizing, impacted how you first showed up when you started dating your wife, Roddy.

Yes. Yeah.

Can we talk about that? Yeah.

Because, you

know, I know that you were in business school when you first heard a monk speak at the age of 18, and you felt the call to become a monk. And did you meet Roddy before you became a monk, or how did you guys meet?

Yeah. So going back to that that moment, and then I'll dive into that question. I feel like you spend your life seeking validation. You then don't get it in the way you wanted it. And then you finally decide you have to validate yourself.

Yes. And that journey can be 10 years, 20 years or even 50 years. And so the shorter we make that journey the better it is. I met the monks when I was 18 years old and I met Radi just before, 6 months before I was about to go and become a monk, so my final year of university. And the way we met was I was using the last 6 months.

I would use all my weekends to go to the temple in my local area to train and to be honest just to stay out of trouble because I was like, if I'm at university during my weekends, I'm gonna get into trouble. So I need to go and practice. And I was asked to show a lady came in 1 day. She was around my mom's age and I was asked to show her around to do some services and some rituals at the temple. I've never been asked to do this before this day.

I've never been asked to do it again. And at the end of it she said to me, she has, she said, I have a daughter that I'd love to introduce to you. I'd love for her to meet someone who's into spirituality and meditation. She's probably around your age. And I said, well, I'm so sorry.

I'm gonna go off and become a monk, but I'd introduce her to my sister. So that woman that I'd met happened to be Radi's mom and she brought Radi in to meet me and I introduced her to my sister and I saw Radi. I probably exchanged like 3 words with her. I thought she was stunning and attractive and beautiful. Hence what I was saying about finding her attractive.

But in my head I was like no no no. I'm training to be a monk. I need to stay focused. Like, don't worry about it. And so her and my sister became friends.

When I came back from the monastery, her and my sister had become really close. Radu was at my house all the time, my sister was at hers all the time, and then my sister was our our middle person who our wing person who helped us get the message across. So we met before and it was 4 years from and and then I found out that her mother that day, prayed that her daughter would find someone like me and I found that out many years later and now I know she hates me because we moved to LA. So Oh,

your mother-in-law hates

me. My mother-in-law hates me because we moved to LA.

So you mentioned though that you made you you've made mistakes in love, and I I wanna just connect that that experience of being bullied as a kid. And then feeling like if you just really get somebody to love you back Mhmm. Then you're gonna feel worthy Mhmm. For how you showed up in the beginning with your now wife.

Mhmm.

Yeah. So I realized that I don't I think another big thing for me was chasing the approval of a male figure. My dad was quite aloof when I was growing up and I've always considered my dad to be more of a friend than a father.

And

even till this day, my dad's my friend. I can always talk to him, but it was my mom who taught me how to, like, shave my beard and, like, that's why I have great grooming habits. I was gonna

say is that why you still have a beard?

Did she not do a

good job with that?

No. Yeah. Exactly. But my mom told me how to take care of my skin. Like my mom was the 1 who was teaching me and guiding me through all the things that you think a dad would do.

And what was really interesting about that is I think the monks became my first male role models and I was looking for them to validate me. Now the interesting thing when you're trying to get validated by monks is they don't validate you. They're just trying to teach you the truth. And so that's when I learned to validate myself during that time and it was really powerful. But here's the interesting thing.

We're conditioned so deeply. We've watched so many movies. We've listened to so many songs. We've seen so many cliches and examples of what love truly is that we snap back into those habits as soon as we're back. So as soon as I came back from the monastery and I started dating Ravi around 6 months later, I snap back into all my old habits because that's how strong it is.

So if anyone ever feels compelled and you keep thinking, I keep dating the same person again and again. I don't

know what's

wrong with me. Like Yes.

What is wrong with us Jay?

Well, that's the thing. It's that the conditioning of the gifts and gaps that our parents left become the map of how we look for love. So if our parents gave us gifts, we're looking for people who give us those same gifts. If your parents were present, if they turned up to your dance recital, if they turned up to your soccer game, you now are looking for someone who's forever present. Unlikely as an adult.

That's not always gonna happen. And if your parents left gaps, maybe they didn't believe in you. Maybe they criticized you. Maybe they compared you to a sibling or a family member or a cousin. Now you have that gap and you're hoping someone else is going to fill it.

And what I learned during my time as a monk was whatever you want from someone else, first give it to yourself. If you're looking from compliments from someone else, give it to yourself first. If you're looking for understanding from someone else, understand yourself first, and if you're looking for validation and affection, do that for yourself first. That's why I love, your high 5 habit. Like it's perfect.

Right? The reason why it works is you're asking everyone to look in the mirror every morning and give themselves exactly what they need from the day and they can give it to themselves in the mirror. You're high fiving yourself like that is a perfect demonstration of how deeply you believe in this.

I'm gonna ask Jay to do something in a minute because he's in the middle of explaining rule number 2, which is don't ignore your karma. Yeah. And you have this beautiful meditation, but I just wanna offer up something to someone who may be listening and feeling like, but but but but but. 1 of the most simple exercises you could ever do, if you feel like you just can't break through in this area of being in a healthy relationship or or truly, finding or attracting love with the right person. Just write down on a piece of paper everything you're looking for, and then be that person yourself.

Mhmm.

And something funny happens. You're, like, actually looking for things that are a void, and if you be those things for yourself, that person starts to show up. Mhmm. But Jay has an even But Jay has an even deeper tool. You have this younger self meditation.

Mhmm. Would you be willing to just walk us through that meditation for just even a minute of what that is like?

Yeah. Eyes closed? Yeah. Amazing. I love that.

Yeah.

We

I'd love to do that. I think so. For anyone who's doing this, I'm just adding a disclaimer that this can be emotive, it can be challenging, and so please do this when you're in a safe space, when you are, feeling more steady and you're feeling at ease. And maybe do it when you can follow it up with a bit of journaling or a bit of moment of reflection, and maybe even a conversation with a partner or a friend or or someone that you trust. And so just to give that before before we dive in, but just want everyone to gently and softly close their eyes and just take a moment to be present with your breath, the seat or bed or floor beneath you, and whatever sounds are in your environment.

I want you to visualize yourself meeting your 13 year old self. Visualize their face. Visualize what you were probably wearing. Visualize yourself at that age, and as you get closer, give them a warm, loving embrace. And now I want you to share with your younger self everything you wish you heard at that age everything you wish you were told, You can give it to them right now.

You are enough. You're worthy of love. You have what it takes. Whatever it may be for you, shower them with all the love that you deserved then and now. And now ask them what wisdom or insight they have for you.

Just listen carefully. And if nothing comes up immediately, allow it to arise even after this meditation, tomorrow or this week. What advice or insight or words does your younger self have for you? Once again, give them a warm loving embrace. All the love, all the connection.

And know that that inner child is forever within you. And you can revisit them, shower them with love, whenever you like. And when you're ready, you can gently and softly open your eyes and just be present.

Thank you.

Thank you for allowing us that space.

I I literally, do you mind if I share?

Please. I'd love to hear if you're Oh, yeah. Feel so willing to.

Yeah. I I I, saw myself standing there with this Dorothy Hamill haircut, which was that famous figure skater. Let me tell you, the 13 year old Mel Robbins does not look like the average 13 year old.

That's why I picked that awkward age. Like, no 1 at 13, I don't think there's anyone is.

Oh, man. I've got this, like, bedtime sweater on. I don't know why I'm focusing on

clothes. Right? That's good. No. It's no.

That's really good visualization. Like, the more I mean, if we had longer and as I described in the book, the more detail, the better. That's great. That's fantastic. Yeah.

You have this incredible framework that you use when you're coaching people on relationships using 4 levels. It's called the 4 levels of a relationship. Can you explain it?

Level 1, admiration. Level 2 is mutual attraction. Level 3 is commitment. Level 4 is compatibility.

I love this concept and this framework because if you don't know what level you're in, no wonder your relationship isn't working. Mhmm. Let's go through these levels 1 by 1 and really break them down.

Let me start with this. Level 1 is just admiration. That's when you see someone you may even see them from afar. They may not know you exist, but there's something you admire about them. You think they're attractive, hot, impressive, whatever it may be, compelling.

Now, on its own, not important. The person doesn't They're not attracted to you. This is completely unrequited. There's nothing important about it. It's just you having decided that someone is an impressive, wonderful, just attractive person.

Then there's level 2. Level 2 is mutual attraction.

K.

Now, this is when 2 people find chemistry, a connection. There's a shared attraction between them. Now, this is perhaps the most dangerous level because when we get attracted to someone at which, by the way, for many of us, we feel like doesn't happen nearly often enough, and then we find that that person is attracted back, we feel like we found the Holy Grail. Yes. Like, this is it.

It feels like an explosion. Yes. Like, oh, my god. This is the most important thing in the world. I have to do everything for this thing.

Yes. So this is level 2 and it's dangerous. Why is this dangerous?

Because on its own, it's not that important. A connection is not the rarest thing in the world.

That's

true. Sexual chemistry is not the rarest thing in the world. But it feels when you find it like it's so important. But we realize it's not important when we get to level 3. Level 3 is commitment.

2 people actually saying yes to each other. You know, the the number of people that I speak to that start with, I have this amazing person in my life. They're this, they're that, they're the other, they're, you know, Matt, you you this person that we can talk about anything. We have the most amazing time together and I and I know. I already know there's a huge but coming.

Otherwise, it wouldn't start with all of this amazing stuff and the punchline often is some form of, but they don't want a relationship. But they say they're not ready. But they're confused about me. And it's like, okay. So, we're in level 2.

We're not in level 3. And there's a world of difference between those 2 places. Level 2 is a plot of land. It may look like a plot of land that's in a great part of town or it looks over a lake or it's in an amazing part of the city. It's an amazing plot of land.

Something amazing could go here. You meet a person and the connection, the attraction, the chemistry makes you feel like you've got an amazing plot of land and all you can see is what could get built on that plot of land and how incredible that could be. Yep. But in order for that to become that, you need a builder. And the next question is, do you actually have a builder?

Because when you have a builder and 2 people build together, they create something extraordinary on that land. They build their castle, whatever that castle is, and the more you build it, the more ornate it becomes, the more beautiful it becomes. It is weathered in all sorts of ways that are distinct to your relationship. The secret rooms no 1 else knows about, that only the 2 of you know about. It's your castle together.

That's what's beautiful. That's what makes a relationship really really special is all of the work that's gone into building something truly unique that only the 2 of you could have built. Now, imagine the scene of you sitting there, building away at this castle and the other builder is AWOL. They're not even there. They are somewhere else because they're not trying to build with you.

They're not trying to have a relationship. They just want an experience. It's a completely different thing. So, level 3 is a relationship. It's commitment.

Level 2 is just an experience.

This is painful. Well, I shouldn't say it's painful. I'm I'm thinking on behalf of so many of the, listeners who are single in their twenties and on and thirties and forties in online dating because I would imagine that there's a tremendous amount of confusion between level 2 and level 3. And my next question is how the hell do you know if you're in level 3? How do you know if somebody actually wants a commitment the way that you do?

You have the conversation you're too afraid to have right now. The 1 that you've been putting off because it feels so good to keep enjoying this thing that you don't wanna wreck it. You don't wanna drive it away. You are afraid that if you have the question, you're gonna be seen as difficult. So we don't say it.

We're we're afraid of the effects. And what we think is, by the way, if I could just keep getting closer and closer and closer to this person, if I can make myself indispensable, if I can just get so close that I'm basically, you know, integrated with their every part of their life, then essentially, they'll see my value and and by the way, they'll start giving as much as I am because they'll realize my value. Unfortunately, the opposite happens As we give and we give and we give and we give and someone learns that there's absolutely no price to pay for the giving. So, everything we give gets completely taken for granted and assumed and we come to find after months or sometimes years of being in limbo with someone when we finally say what is this? They are like, I don't know.

And you realize you've wasted all that time and energy all because you weren't prepared to have a hard conversation. And the every every great relationship is formed in the crucible of of hard conversations. And a hard conversation, by the way, is it doesn't have to be an aggressive or or, you know, a pushy conversation. It could be a very elegant conversation. You can A hard conversation is just the 1 you're afraid to have.

That's true. You're gonna find out very quickly where you stand and you're also introducing an element of, I'm not gonna be here forever. So let's role play. So I'm in we're

in a level 2 relationship.

Yep.

And I want a commitment. I'm scared to death to ask you. I don't know how many other people you're dating. We've kind of been in that zone where we're hooking up and we're going out on dates and I feel like it's vibing. And I now, I don't even know what the language is anymore.

That's how old I am. Do we say monogamous? Do we say exclusive? Do we say exclusive? Do we say that we're like dating, heaven forbid?

Is that not a word we use? Like, I don't know. Every time I would say something to my daughter, she's like, that's always, blah blah blah. I'm like, okay, okay, okay. Okay.

I don't know what the terminology is. Anyhow, we're in a level 2. How do I bring this up with you? Can you give me the sentence, Matt?

Yeah. There are different ways to come at this, but I'll give you 1 way.

Yeah. Let's do it.

But I realized I'm investing a lot of kind of time and energy into this and it's an amount of time and energy and intimacy that I wouldn't be giving if we were still giving it to other people. And I know that I'm not because it's just not me. And, you know, I wanted to know if you're in the same place. If you're not, that's totally okay. Like, I get it.

It's fine. You know, there's no pressure. But if you're not in that place, I I need to reevaluate how much I'm giving to this because, you know, I'm I'm excited to meet someone, you know, that values the same things I do or has the same things in mind that I do. And I wanna give my energy to someone who's in that place. And I and I realized we haven't even had that conversation.

You know, Matt, I I am having a great time with you. I feel like I'm on The Bachelor right now. I am having a great time with you, but, you know, I just got out of a long term relationship, and I I I don't wanna hurt you.

Yeah.

I I'd like to still see you, but, like, this is why these are hard conversations.

So Yeah. But that but that's a very real response. Right? So let's keep

Okay.

Because that's a very realistic response

Okay.

By a lot of people. You say, look, that's that's totally cool. I can't keep giving my energy to someone who's not on the same page as me. Like, it's not for me. I know my my energy is really precious.

I know how much I have to offer someone. And if you're not in that place, it doesn't you know, you don't need to worry about hurting me because I'm always gonna just do what's right for me anyway. Mhmm. And as much as I like spending time with you, you know, I I value what I want more than that. So I'm gonna I'm gonna do my own thing.

But, you know, I wish you the best and you're a great guy and it's okay. Like, I get it. You're you're a great person. I I hope you, you know, find happiness in whatever you do, but I can't keep giving time and energy to someone who wants something different than I do.

There's a couple of things I wanna pull out that I think are incredibly important that I noticed, and I wonder if it was on purpose. First of all, I loved that you didn't say that you liked me. You specifically said you liked the time that we had spent together. And that left you, like, playing the person that's not as interested in in the level 2, I'm not ready to go to level 3, hearing that you liked the time made you seem stronger and more confident because you weren't sounding like, hey, I really like you. Do you like me?

And fishing for an answer. And then when you said, you used the word energy. You didn't use the word, I'm looking for a commitment. I'm looking for monogamy. You didn't use those words that feel like you're locking someone down.

The way that the coaching went that you just gave us in the script that you can now play and you should repeat in your dating and your relationship life was 1 where you said, I value my energy and I know myself and I wanna put my energy into things that are going somewhere. And so I wanna have that conversation because this has been a lot of fun and I enjoy spending time with you, but I wanna make sure that, you know, I wanna check-in with you because I don't wanna date a lot of other people. Do you see what I'm saying? Like, you were making powerful in that because you weren't actually looking for me to say I like you back. You were looking for clarification on whether or not this was worth your time.

And so that was super important for you listening to understand the nuance of that.

Massively different.

Yes.

Because you're not you're having a conversation about the allocation of an incredibly valuable thing.

Mhmm. And

you're and you're showing through the conversation how much you value it. I know what I have to give is incredible. Like, that's the subtext. I know what I have to offer someone is incredible. So, you know, I'm very careful about who I give that to.

This isn't a, how dare you, you know, hook up with me or how dare we spend any time together if you weren't in the same It's like, no, it's not. I Again, so quickly, I think a lot of people can lose their power that way because they don't take ownership of the time they've invested Yes. Or the ways they've spent time with someone or even the intimacy. Like, you're an adult. If you wanna do something with someone, do it.

Own it. Enjoy it. But if it's no longer working for you, then don't go to resentment about the time you've spent. Instead, just take ownership of Well, I know what I've been giving you and what I will continue to give is incredible. I know it's really valuable.

I'm deciding whether this continues to be a good investment of all of that time and energy. And if it's not any longer, that's okay. I'm not turning you into the villain, but

I You're also not turning yourself into the loser. Like, I think here's the thing that's really helpful about level 1, which is, oh, I see that person over there is super attractive, but there's nothing mutual. Level 2, which is this mutual connection and attraction and chemistry. And then if you wanna try to go to level 3, which is where you have a mutual commitment, that's where you have to have the conversation and starting to understand for yourself, not where is the other person, but where am I? The second that you start to feel in a relationship where you're giving more than you're comfortable, where you're unsure of where somebody stands, where you're starting to get sketchy about stalking people in terms of legally on their, you know, where they are, or they are, or they're on their hinges.

You know when you're doing that, it's time to have the conversation you're avoiding, which is this is to a point where I gotta be clear about whether or not it's worth me investing energy in because I think we all know that point for ourselves where we tip into either super clingy insecure or sort of like resentful, like anger mode. And you don't wanna be there because it's not the other person's fault that they don't wanna give you a commitment. It's your fault if you continue to show up to something that isn't actually good for you.

And the standard itself can actually be the thing that creates attraction. We think, you know, we we ask a lot of questions about how can we create attraction with someone. Well, 1 of the most amazing ways to create attraction is to have standards and to and to live by those standards. Let me tell you a story because you're gonna love this and your audience is gonna love it.

Okay. Great.

This is a story from something my own wife sent to me at a time when I was not the heroic, you know, ultra giving 1 in the situation. Okay. I was the 1 who was, like, all over the place.

K. By all over the place, you mean, like, you were like a player? So you're dating a bunch of people at the same time or what?

We went I we were we we had met in London. K. I'd, like, literally come back for a couple of weeks to see family.

Okay.

That was where we met. Then I went back to Los Angeles where I live. We just had had a great time together.

Level 2?

Very much level 2.

Got it.

Okay. Deep level 2.

Got well, I don't know what that means, but level 2.

Lots and lots of attraction. Absolutely no commitment.

Can I can I just say something? Yeah. There is no such thing as deep level 2. Let me tell you why. There's only level 2.

You I mean, this is exactly

the lesson. Like,

this is exactly the Right.

You're, like, letting it be something. It's just level freaking 2.

Correct. That's exactly right. Okay. So I go back to Los Angeles and we're texting back and forth. We're having some calls.

It's still fun. It's still engaging. We're excited to speak to each other. Gradually, I start to fall off.

What does fall off mean?

Like, I am not text Look

at you smiling. It's like

No. Day by day, my texts got less frequent. I stopped So I probably at some point, I stopped calling and started only texting.

Mhmm.

Then the texts are less and less frequent. And then, I think I don't know what it was. A couple of weeks, something went by where we'd already been not texting for a while. Maybe a few days went by or a couple of weeks. I can't remember.

Audrey probably remembers. But at a certain point, I sent a message that said it either said, miss I miss you or I'm thinking of you. She sent me a message I'll never forget and for every woman out there, take this message and run with it because it is so powerful. It's so amazing and it's word for word perfect. Now, bear in mind, I I just wanna stop for a moment.

What's the instinct to to do in that moment if you like someone?

I miss you too.

Yeah. Like, you you just rush of blood to the head, nervous system activate it. Right. I'm just happy this person reached out and that they're saying something affectionate. Like Yes.

Oh, my god.

And this is for every human being. Like, I don't care how old you are. Nope. I don't care, like, gender, whatever. Like, this is every 1 of us has that where somebody's gone silent and all of a sudden you get that little boop.

You're like beep.

There it is. And that, what you just said, is why level 2 is the most dangerous stage because the instinct in that moment is to text someone back.

Right.

To fly to see them, to do whatever we can to be with them. But that instinct might be the most dangerous instinct you have in that moment. So, she didn't do that. She sent this message back. She said, hey, I hope you're well.

To be honest, when I get a message like this from you, I don't really know what to say. So, again, that's like that first line is like confusion. She's she's pointing out that there's something at odds with my words and my behavior. Mhmm. So, hey, I hope you're well.

To be honest, when you send a message like that, I don't really know what to say. Or, I'm not really sure what to say. We haven't really felt that close for a while now. And, then she put in parenthesis, rightly or wrongly, this message feels like comes across like a bid for attention. Woah.

So, if you break down that message, let's do it. It has every It communicates so much and this is why I'm not someone who says like, you know, here's a 1,000 scripts. Use them word for word, but you have to understand why language matters because language matters deeply. And, if you know why it works, you could say your way. But why does it work?

Well, I hope you're well. So, there's still warmth to that. It's not like, how dare you?

Mhmm.

I hope you're well. Don't wish you any harm. But when you send something like this And I'm not really sure what to say. Why? Because we haven't really felt that close for a while.

So, it's a little strange. The fact that we've kind of like stopped talking very much. There's The interactions we have are very superficial, very non committal. There's not a lot of energy behind them. There's not much thought or intention behind them.

They're more and more sparse and then at the end of all of that, you send, I miss you. That is completely out of sync with everything you have done over the last month or not done. We haven't felt that close for a while now. Now that again is exposing the elephant in the room, because what most people are hoping for in a situation like that, consciously or unconsciously, is that you will not point out the discrepancy between their actions and their words, but you will mirror them. That I'll say I miss you and you'll come back and you'll mirror that.

That's true. We do. So, she's saying, I'm not gonna mirror that because that's not where we're at in reality. So I'm shining a giant spotlight on this elephant in the room. So you've got nowhere to hide.

And then she said, rightly or wrongly. Now, rightly or wrongly is very powerful language there because it's also humility. She's not bringing ego into it and she's not flaring up my ego. She's like, I might be wrong. Right.

Maybe I've misread this whole situation, but it looks an awful lot like you're not really trying. You don't want anymore and you want attention right now.

Yes.

It comes across rightly or wrongly like a bid for attention. Now, in that moment, I'm called out. So, what do you do with that information? Well, it depends on the kind of person you're dealing with. Some people in response to that will love bomb you.

Especially an unhealthy person is gonna go, now I'm gonna get you. So, oh my God. Let me call you right now. Blah blah blah. Charm, charm, charm, charm, charm.

Like, let me fly out to see you this weekend. Can you come out to see me? You know, you know, like, goes full charm mode. I'm not gonna, I didn't do that then, but there was a time in my life where I absolutely would have done that.

And just to be clear, that's still in level 2 because you haven't had the conversation, right, about the commitment. Yes. Yes. They're keeping you in level 2. I love how simple this is, that you're either attracted to somebody who which is admiration that is not interested in you or there's this level 2 dangerous mode where it is all about the attraction and the game there is to keep you in that lane.

Oh, 100%.

And so you have to know for yourself, which is very clear that your wife, Audrey, did in that moment that I'm done with level 2. And the fact that you probably were pulling away made her realize she wanted to have something that was more certain with you if it was gonna continue. And she did the thing that most of us don't do, which is she acted consistently with somebody who no longer wanted to be in level 2. She wanted to be with somebody who was willing to go to level 3 and have the commitment. And she is also smart, and I need every 1 of you listening to hear me.

You will stay in level 2 for the rest of your damn life if you're unwilling to have the conversation about level 3.

Because no 1, no 1 cares about your time and your life as much as you. And expecting them to is a recipe for wasting your life. So many of my audience are not in their early twenties where it's like, well, I could throw away 5 years on

a Mhmm.

Person in level 2 and, you know, plenty of time to go. And I deal with people in their thirties, late thirties, early forties and many of them are Their life's greatest dream is to have their own biological family and they are in level 2 right now at risk of sacrificing for many of them, their biggest goal, their biggest dream in the entire world, for someone who I guarantee is either not gonna regret having wasted all that time of yours Or even if they do, which many do, when I look back on my life, I regret wasting people's time. I don't have the power to give it back to them.

I love that we're talking about this because I have seen too many of my friends literally waste a decade Mhmm. With somebody. And this doesn't have to look like 1 night stands and dating. This could be somebody that you're living with that doesn't wanna get married

That's right.

Or who you keep thinking is gonna change your mind on having children with you and you won't have the conversation. Like, the the moving from level 2 to level 3 is really about the type of commitment you're looking for.

And level 2 doesn't just refer to someone who's keeping you in limbo in month 3 where they don't want a relationship and you do. It's anyone who can't give you the level of commitment that you're looking for. There are couples that have begin been together for 3 years and 1 of them deeply wants marriage, deeply wants to have a family, and the other 1 just cannot make up their mind or says, I really don't want this. That represents a level of commitment you know you need in order to be happy that someone else isn't giving you. Woah.

That's

a really important point. Because we've been focusing on dating, but you're basically saying that you could be trapped in level 2 for years because you are in a relationship justifying staying because of the attraction or whatever else, but you don't have the commitment that you deeply in your heart want. Yeah. Holy cow. Let's keep digging into level 2.

Yes. And the hardest conversation that you have to have is the 1 you have with yourself, where you come to terms with the fact that this conversation that you have out loud with them might be the 1 that ends the relationship. And so, we're afraid to have a conversation with them because we haven't had a conversation with ourselves first. About what we're prepared to make peace with. About what is most important to us.

In our love lives, and this is a model you can use for any part of your life, but in our love lives, in order to change, in order to get a different result, we have to rewire our brain. I put an entire chapter in this new book called how to rewire your brain. Now, how do you do that? When you've been doing things for a certain way for so long, how do you get to the point where you're actually prepared to do something different? The first thing you have to do is you have to make change absolutely necessary for yourself.

Now, 1 of the things I do is get people to have the conversations with themselves that they're they've been putting off year after year after year. That conversation might be with a 35 year old or a 37 year old who finally has the conversation with themselves about how important it is to them to have children. Because it all starts with getting really, really, really honest about that.

How do you make somebody who's in their thirties or even late twenties who is starting to panic about this? Mhmm. How do you how do you coach somebody to have that conversation with themselves? Because we will come in and rationalize, oh, they might change. Oh, I have time.

Oh, I could just do this. Oh, I could just do that. And there is a biological reality if you are somebody who's 1 of your biggest life goals is to have a family of your own and, you know, after coaching people for 17 years, you've seen this window close on people.

I've seen it close. I've seen the protracted grief that takes place for many years afterwards, that many of them still haven't been able to process. I mean I've, I've watched the pain. I've had a front row seat to the most terrible pain that people go through. I had a woman at my retreat who just balled up on the floor and was inconsolable because she had spent 10 years married to a man who always said that he would, he wasn't sure about having children.

And year after year after year she delayed the conversation not only with him but with herself. And missed her window, biologically and then he ended up leaving the relationship anyway. And the grief that she felt was profound. The conversation starts by truly assessing how important is this to me? What is it about this that makes it something that I feel is a non negotiable for me?

At least a nonnegotiable that I'm gonna try for. Because even for those for whom it's a nonnegotiable, we all know not everyone has it as simple as they think it's going to, and a lot of people find this impossible.

Well, and I also wanna broaden this out because what you're actually talking about is the level of honesty you have to have with yourself to go from level 2 to level 3 if it's not happening, whether that's dating to moving in, or it is living together to engage, or engaged to married, or whatever, or trying harder in a relationship, that there is this movement that has to be intentional to get you to the commitment phase. And I can see how if you don't even know what the hell you want and you're not being honest with yourself, you wouldn't be able to have the conversation in a casual sex situation of saying, hey, I just know myself and I don't wanna put my energy into something that isn't actually heading somewhere, And so I just need to check-in with you because having a lot of fun, but I know myself and I prioritize my well-being and my time and I just need to do the check, the gut check now.

Even to have the conversation lightly and playfully, you need to have a very strong sense of what matters to you. Of of the path that you're on in life. You have to. Otherwise, you'll never back it up. Anything you do will be a tactic.

It won't be a standard.

I think the mistake that a lot of us make is that we look at a person across from us and we think, even if this isn't up to my standards, I can fix this person, I can twist this person, I can get we're not thinking this consciously, but if I can get close enough, I can change this. And that is a tactic that will backfire on you.

Yes.

You've seen it happen over and over again.

The idea that if I get close enough and try hard enough that they're going to change is a non sequitur.

What does that mean? That's a big word.

It's, it's, it's a really dangerous assumption to make. I call it the 1 day wager. I stake my life, my energy, my time, my most precious resources on in the world, the ones I can't get back on the idea that this person is 1 day going to suddenly change into all of the things I need them to become for me to be happy. The the irony is people can change, but they change through hard conversations and you also find out they can't change through hard conversations because you'll learn even if they say they're gonna do something. You'll learn whether there's progress or not, and if there's no progress, there's your answer.

It is a great Jacob M. Broad quote that goes, consider how hard it is to change yourself and you'll understand how foolish it is to think you can change someone else.

That's I wish I said that because that's

a good 1. It's just think I I It's so true. I want to eat well right now, Mel.

Okay.

I'm not eating well.

Why why not?

Because we're on the road and there's so much good food in every city and I we have been doing a lot of broadcasting and I haven't been getting to the gym and I'm not making excuses but I kind of am as well. And it's just really, really, really been hard. And when I don't train, I eat badly. And when I eat badly, I then don't feel good. But then I'm in a cycle.

And that's kind of the cycle I'm in and have been in for the last week. My relationship with food has been a really challenging 1. I've been very like, food's been an addiction for me for since as long as I can remember. And it has been an extraordinarily difficult thing to fix. Very, very, very, very difficult and I'm still working on it.

It's an ongoing thing. When I and I want to change that. I'm motivated to change that. So, when I And, anyone who goes to therapy knows this. If you decided to go to therapy, that's an amazing step.

Now, all of the work is ahead of you Right. Because you're gonna see things you might wanna change and it's gonna be really, really difficult to move the needle on those things. If it was easy, you would've done it already. So, now take someone who's may not even accept that there's something that needs to be changed, Even if they think there's something that they could change to make the relationship better, they now have to be motivated to do it, and now they have to have the stomach and the resilience and the continued sustained effort to actually go ahead and make that change. That is an extraordinary assumption to make of someone that we are with.

Now, can someone change? Yes. Have you had the conversation with them? Is there progress? Is the progress continuing?

Well, you're you're probably not even close to that level of understanding because right now, you're having a conversation about what's bothering you with your friends and not even with It's true. The person.

It's true. I'm in level 2. I won't even have that conversation about level 3. So I'm definitely not gonna talk about the wait. I actually need I wanna make sure that I get to level 4.

Yep.

Because when you have the hard conversation, and is there a mistake that people make when it comes to level 3, meaning the commitment piece?

Thinking love is all you need. Love is not all you need.

What do you need?

You need level 4. What's level 4? Compatibility.

What is compatibility in your work?

Do we work together? How do you know?

Because a lot of people don't know. Like, they they want it to work together. Mhmm. But how do you know if it works together?

Well, I think the baseline is can we get our fundamental needs met in this relationship? There are, I think, lots of luxury items in a relationship, but at the core, can I get my fundamental needs met? You have to ask yourself what those things are. What are the things I truly need? Like I have a friend of mine always dated dancers and I said to him, does you you're married now.

I said, you always date dancers. Does your wife dance? He said, he said, least coordinated person I've ever met. And I was like, so does it bother you? You know, because that was always your preference.

And he said, Matt, how much of my life do you think I spend dancing? So I maybe dance once or twice a year. He said, it's literally has no bearing on the quality of my marriage. This person is an amazing partner, an amazing mother. We have the best time together.

She's my best friend. Like, those are the things that affect my life every day.

I'm so glad that we're talking about compatibility because I believe that this is 1 of those topics that you don't understand compatibility until you meet somebody that you're actually compatible with. And you go, Oh, wait a minute. This is so much easier. And when I reflect back on prior relationships where I realize now, I just wasn't compatible. There may have been a commitment there, we were in level 3, but the level 4 piece, there was no compatibility even though we wanted to be compatible and here's how I know.

There was always so much friction, Like everything felt like an effort. There was underlying agitation, whether we're trying to pick a restaurant or making plans on what to do on a Saturday or like those relationships that you find yourself in where everything that the person does irritates you. That's a sign that you're not compatible. When you're compatible with somebody, it's not that hard. Sure, you fight.

Sure, there are things that bother you, but it passes so quickly because there's this energetic match. You know, I'm, the kind of person that has massive ADHD, and I'm very competitive and hard driving. And the reason why I'm so compatible with my husband is probably because he is a very easygoing, very kind kind of person. And if I were with somebody that were more hard driving like me, we'd probably kill each other because there'd be a ton of friction around the energy with us. And so compatibility for me, Matt, really is when it just works.

And it's easier to tell when you're not compatible because it's hard And you're always kind of upset with somebody or walking on eggshells or you don't think like you can be yourself. And I guess the bottom line is that. I knew when I met Chris, he was the 1 because I realized, oh my god, I can be exactly who I am and exactly who I'm not. I don't have to pretend. I don't have to work hard to be somebody different to make this work.

That is what is at the heart of compatibility, that you can be you. And when you find that, you'll know it because it'll be easier than any other relationship you've had in the past because the energy matches. Hey. It's Mel. Thank you so much for being here.

If you enjoyed that video, by God, please subscribe because I don't want you to miss a thing. Thank you so much for being here. We've got so much amazing stuff coming. Thank you so much for sending this stuff to your friends and your family. I love you.

We create these videos for you, so make sure you subscribe.