Hey, what's up, Kansas City? I keep meaning to practice that before you come out. I know so bad at it, I'm these days I'm doing it where it sounds like I'm being kind of like insinuate I'm. Could be anything. I'm like, I know you guys did something bad, like, what's up, Kansas City? I don't know if that's right.

We know the bad things you've done in studying them and researching them poorly for days, hours, even cutting and pasting Wikipedia the fuck out of things. That's not true. Sorry, but this is kind of a big, big. Yeah, and you're right here. No, you're right. I feel like they added a row and you guys are just like in the back of a plane fucking you brought your own chairs. You're like, we're with the painting company.

We're just going to be one moment. Twenty five folding chairs. Second Rose lidded would be awesome. They brought the rug there. There's so much. This is a gorgeous piece. It's so nice. Oh yeah. Oh it's the history of Missouri right on this road. You see it starts over here with the founding of the state. You know, here it was. And why you remember, you don't want to go over it again. This is not a history lesson because we don't have dates and places.

We have nothing to offer you but MARD.

I'm sorry, I don't I don't have my glasses on. Is there a bride sitting in the stand up for one second? She has it, it's a beautiful bride and it says the husband did it on her. Oh, shit. Are we going into a cosplay area we've never been in before? Or. What I like to think is that you just got married and then right after the ceremony, you're like, I'm going to be back in two and a half hours.

Is it your bachelorette party? Oh, I did two months ago, two months. Your day is over. Girl, now you're just a wife. Hey, wait a minute. I was representing I made this go to the car because I lost my bra and I was like, can you go check my bra? Then I was like, is this a tour manager job or is this a husband job? Yeah, because if you and I go get my bra, he could take me to court.

That's not allowed. That's true. It's simply not allowed. Yes. Also, that's funny because that's something that happens to you in real life and that's something that would happen to me in a terrible nightmare where like in the middle of a bout, I'm about to go on stage and I'm like, I'm not wearing a bra, but. This show cannot go on see if I'm not wearing a bra. I look like a little boy. Oh, so it's not like I need a bra.

I don't know. It's just a different mindset. It's more of a presentational thing as opposed to holding back the style. Yeah. Yes. Because last night this has been a weekend issue weekend for me because this so this dress. Let me tell you about it. It's it's me. Take a walk.

Take a walk so all the people can see through. Georgia's invented a new way of modeling, and I think it works. I think it's fierce and they just just armpits out. All of her fashions are armpit based. But sorry I interrupted you. I wish you would. This is my parents favorite poet and feminist, Jessica Simpson. Yes, she is a leader and a visionary and we get behind her. That's right, 100 percent of her proceeds from the stress that I didn't buy go to Jessica Simpson, the Jezus Jessica Simpson Foundation that teaches her about Starquest Tuna.

Remember remember that old thing from 97 years ago? That's what you're going to get here, all references, just like old, like a VH one reality show, references get pulled on your hat from a better place and time and. Oh, yeah, so. So she makes these dresses and it's for people with boobs, even if it's like a small dress and people who are smaller that don't have boobs, they're just she's just like I mean, everyone has them.

Yeah. So I had to like stuff this dress. And so I came out last night and I had like Double Deepu because they were stuffed to the fucking hill. They were happening. Yeah. And then I took the cutlets we learn, you know. Yes. Left on one stage. They're gone. Did those colors come with the dress or do you own it? I own them because Vinton's dress as a guy with a tiny waist, big boobs.

You have to fill them out. I'm Chivas fucking I won't get anything altered or fake boobs just fucking kicked out that 15 grand or however much they cost. I think that's like a low like get a Groupon boob job. Yeah. I don't splurge. Let's talk about this fucking thing. There you go. Thank you. So show the work that was I went all the way off the rug. Thank you. God, I wish I could explain my clothes.

I've given up on dresses, but not enough. I was having a lot of fun with them. And then we stopped touring for a little while. And when we started again, the first show that we did, I just brought the last dress I had worn, not accounting for the time in between there where I had been eating fast food like it was my passion in life. And so I went to dress on.

It was like and then I sold for that shows like, look, I simply can't wear my dress. And then once I was up here in my regular clothes, I was like, no more of my regular clothes.

It's so fun. I don't know why you can do this for life. I mean, but it was very celebratory, kind of like it's a big deal to us to be here. So I shouldn't wear my pajamas, but it just turns out that that's what I want to do. You fucking did your hair, right? Look and listen to your hair. I couldn't have more eyeshadow on it. I'm doing a lot of neck up shit right now.

It's just where I am and I'm not going to apologize. And you shouldn't either. It's very stress. It's a stressful time. It's a stressful time for us to talk about your airport incident.

So when we left to come here, all of our friends and of course, our tour manager, Vince, told us, yes, the greatest tour manager on the road today, he let us know that we were going to be leaving L.A., which was around 78 degrees with fires on all sides, every every single circle of fire. It looked like Sauron, is that right?

No, it's the reference I'm trying to make. I don't know. Was that right? Oh, is that Game of Thrones? That's a close, close, close, close, same outfits. It's Lord of the Rings. It's what? Lord of the Rings, The Return of the Jedi. Whatever was I at twenty one, I stopped pretending for guys that I gave a shit fantasy just like, no, I don't want to sit through that. I want to watch 13 going on 30 again.

Goodbye. It's a classic film, so Vince was like, we're leaving here and this temperatures and we're going, it's 20 where we're going. So and then that kind of work he has to do because we would just come. Yeah, we are. You have to be like, here's how degrees it's going to be. Here's the time you need to leave for the airport. Here's what day you're leaving. No flip flops, no gloves. So I had to call people that I knew traveled across the country often and were wealthy.

And I was like, can I borrow your nice coat? Can I borrow things? So I, like, rounded up a bunch of warm I mean, cold weather clothes. But then I was like, I'm getting out. I'm not going to borrow shoes for anybody.

So I went to the designer shoe warehouse, which you guys have those here. Right? So what I always forget, it seems like the best idea because it's a very convenient. But what I always forget is the reason that shoes are at the designer shoe warehouse is because they're broken and they don't work. And people like department stores were like, what the fuck is this neon tennis shoe with a heel, fuck you. And they throw it over their shoulder and then someone comes and picks it and drives it over to the designer shoe warehouse.

You hate to admit it, you know, but yeah, you want but you want to show you just want to pay nine ninety nine and pretend it's going to work out.

So I bought these beautiful fleece lined boots and then when we actually landed in the airport bathroom, I changed from my slip on shoes with no socks into these, but they, they weren't made to hold human feet.

You so tried them on right. I had not tried them on. Of course not. I do love to live on the air to know about Karen. There's no way you tried that on before. No fucking way. I live in department stores and girls that work with the women that work in department stores will come and be like, can I get a dressing for Amy? Like never no means none of my business. Whether it fits or not, I, I have to try these on, but I'm so claustrophobic that I just change in the middle of the story.

I find like a corner mirror and I have like a weird tee shirt on. Yeah. Go on. That's boring. Well no but you're because you're a bit of a nudist, you have a touch of the nudism. I just do. OK, going.

We're opposite sex.

Anyhow, I'm trying to put these boots on in the bathroom stall in the St. Louis airport.

It took me fully ten minutes, a full on ten minutes. They probably thought I was like dying of appendicitis or something and I couldn't like. You couldn't you can't slip your there's a there's a hard left turn inside the shoe that my foot can't take. I'm just saying sales, their sales shoes are to be avoided, you know, would be great is if you had not removed and I haven't seen you without them, these pants and these shoes, the same type of contract.

I'm just hoping that I haven't seen you without them. I'm sleeping in this ninja outfit every night on top of the blankets. Yes. They'll never find me. They'll never detect me.

Look at these flowers. Oh, yeah. So my age, they're from one of your local florist.

Biko, Biko. Biko. Yeah, they know. I think they smell really good. Warren, Christopher, Rachel. Thanks, guys. Classy guys. Classy smell good. They said I think you might be sick of murder. So we got you flowers like at a funeral and no one ever sick of murder. These are the flowers I want at my funeral. Every single thing is death related. OK, I'm done spending those. What else do we have on to the Ozarks today?

Oh, we went to Ozark Land like you recommended there. Like, no, we would have told you to run. It was pretty great. I mean, the shit that they were advertising on the side of the wall, how could we not stop?

What was it?

We're going to buy a plaque that would only have taken a broom and had no purpose except to like to hang it in your sassy kitchen. What did it say? It said something. Something something like it said it just said two things. What were the first two? It was like good times and tantalizes good times and tanlines good times. Hairlines, I mean, who in this world doesn't appreciate, I feel like because we're from Los Angeles, we don't appreciate how great tan lines are, but here you guys are like, I want to fuckin tan line.

Yeah, give me a tan line. That means vacation. Yeah, but we bought a present that you guys are going to be privy to later. Yeah. For whoever does the hometown murder. Pretty exciting. I want to do the hometown murder now because I fucking want it. I'm like, why don't we buy more?

It's let's just say it's a it's a timeless piece that we got it. Ozark Land. Yeah. Along with some taffy, I did the dumb thing of, like, they have like a joke, like a, you know, like gag gift section.

And I was like, oh, I get my nephews like seven some gag stuff, even though I don't think you're supposed to do that anymore. It's like bullying and like gag gifts are like, oh, really?

We can't have some garlic gum. Come on. Well, I once asked him in front of everyone, we were like lunch. And I was like, Mica, who's the stupidest kid in your class? And my brother was like, Georgia, you don't do that. Oh. What's he like, everyone's smart, the same. No, he was like Ricky, he knew he couldn't do it. So I'm like and also my brother Bullie that my brother broken egg over my head when I was a kid.

So his kids get in gag gifts and he's going to use them on his dad. And so they had the gum, like the looks like Wrigley's fruit chew and then you got to take it in his APSEY. And I was like, I bet these have been here forever and they don't work. So I did it to myself on ACSI. I bet this I'm going to try it. And I was like, it was it worked. How stupid is that?

That I did it to myself. Do you think it was kind of a high voltage gum? Was it a good zap? It was a great little without. Really? Yeah. My brother is going to get it. Yeah. Yeah. Happy Hanukkah bucker from Ozark Land.

There was, I have to say, and I have a picture of this to prove it. The best graffiti I've ever seen in a bathroom in Ozark and Ozark Land was a Jewish star someone had drawn and it said, we are not alone on the. Oh, Missouri Jews, are you OK? Is everything but one guys like Cordano. Well, good news, you're not alone. Go to Zyklon, they meet there every Wednesday in that bathroom stall, bathroom stall.

Also underneath that, in a different color pen, someone had written for a good time called Jesus.

And I was like, you know what? That's disrespectful to everybody. That doesn't work out in any direction. You're saying Jesus is a slut? I don't think so. What kind of phone do you think Jesus has for iPhone X? Probably. I think like I think he has an old wall, like an old rotary phone that he walks all the way around the world with a really long cord. You've got somebody paint that for me. I don't fucking ask for things is crap.

You know, you're the people that can do it.

Someone at the meet and greet last night gave us this beautiful gift of a doll walking towards us, not saying a word with a like 1970s knitted clown doll.

And then she hands it. She was lovely, don't you? Yeah. Health. Then she and the clown smiling and she said, turn it over and you turn it over.

And there's a face on the back of its head and it's it's like angry or has different angry feelings. I was crying. It was crying. I don't know. It had needed silver tears on his cheeks. It was haunted. It was the most haunted item in America. And you can tell that, like, it's it's like forty years old, but it look brand new. So some like. And who gave it to her. Her nephew and not knowing what kids like because she's like I'm not having kids.

And the kid was like I hate it. No one ever loved this doll. Yeah. They're like Mommy put it away. And then it went up into the attic forever and now right next to the Ouija board. And then it started touching the Ouija board. Yes. Hold on. And then the devil came. Wait. And then Jesus called, who was like, not today, but you. There you go. Well, it's going to fucking Podmore.

So my house is now haunted. Yeah, that's that's the next podcast. Yeah. Speaking of podcast. Yeah. This is my favorite murder. Oh.

Thanks. Much, Karen. And this is our Sharp Frank. These are the faces of the voices that you've been listening to. And then we turn around and are crying, crying. That's for when to start doing the dance routine at the. Can't a doll dance routine, who's ready? No one's ready. No one is ready. No one's ready. My uncle Michael Hardtalk Stark came to the show last night, lives in St. Louis. He's he's an older gentleman, lovely man.

And he came backstage afterwards like I didn't know what to do. I don't know how say I didn't know what to expect. I knew you had a podcast. I thought they're not going to be dancing, are they?

Like, you know, at all. And then we're talking about Bonar's on stage and stuff. Yeah. Uncle Mike, it just slipped out. Although now that we sit down that we're talking about it, I feel like a dancing podcast might be insanely badass because it just be like distant music and then the sound of feet and then you just kind of fill it in. I'm like, this is huffing and puffing a little. Yeah, so much. Here's our singers.

Our next might be this will be slow cariboo. Right.

Oh my mom. Steven's not here. Yeah. Sorry. Thank you guys for coming. He can't come on the road because he dumps too many cats. We just have too much to, like, pick up kittens, these he's like, you know, every once in a while, like every six months. Well, not anymore, but used to be every six months in the news, you hear a story of a guy that I'd like, 15 turtles shoved up his sleeves trying to get across the border like, oh, that's totally Stephen with kittens.

He's just out, Stephen. He's got a fake leg and like. Stuffed with Kit, he didn't even need to have his leg amputated. I'm just wondering if I can place to put can he did it for the love of kitten. That is dedication. He would do that. Let's spread that rumor. He's perverted for a good time. Call Stephen in his leg. He's perverted for kids. And he's actually not watching my cats this time.

And I think I think I saw his heartbreak in his eyes when I told him that our friends were staying in town at our place. And I just saw it. And I know he's like watching the Instagram being like that. They're not going to be better than me. I got the better of me. And I can see, you know, this is fucking nice. These bummed. Yes. He misses Stephen. Yeah. Never again. I love the way we talk about Stephen as we do hear a recorded show as if he's never going to listen to it.

He's the first person that hears all of this before you guys even it gets in your ear. He's already he's on it and has edited out this part every time. All I want is a sip of that beer that's honest and be honest, kind of straight at arm's length. Should we sit down and get away from that beer?

Yes, please. Big screen, big stuff, you guys, let's put this here, OK, the table there, the water there. I'm going to do this.

OK, Harry, can I get an Allen wrench for this chair?

Just type just tighten up some nuts on this chair. A little bit. Beautiful. I have a chair. Fear. Oh, no. Is it wobbly? Show the crowd. Is it wobbly? It's a little wobbly. It might be me. You might be wobbly. It might just be me.

Oh yeah. That's secret. OK, ok, that's for later. You'll see flowers. Are you guys ready to talk about some murder. Yeah.

We should let everyone know this is not in case you don't know yet. This is not Les Miserables. You went to the wrong place, if that's what you thought it would be. And it's not Mannheim Steamroller Christmas concert. Yeah, those are those that if you go that way, I don't know. That way you'll find that. And the other way you'll find that. So this is not what this is. Unless Lamees, Rob is a true crime podcast now.

Well, it is kind of there's a pretty true crime right at the beginning. OK, and then the crime of war. Anyhow, it's also it's a comedy podcast where we talk about true crime and sometimes that bums people out.

And so if you're the kind of person that gets bummed out by stuff like that, get the fuck out.

I'm joking. I'm joking. That's the comedy part. You do get bummed out. Don't worry. A little hilarity will ensue, but not because of the crime. You never.

You go first tonight. Yeah, I'm first, I'm first and I have to say, yeah, this case is fascinating to me.

I first saw it on an episode of 48 Hours, came in in the middle half and was so hypnotized by the subject that was being interviewed on the story and his personality and what was happening, that I couldn't stop watching it.

And I became obsessed with it. And then Stephen, who sends us suggestions of cases that we could do, sent me this suggestion. And I freaked out because I didn't realize that it was in this area.

So I don't know if you guys know about about the International House of Prayer and the Tyler beaconing.

I don't know. But, dude, OK, buckle the fuck up. Now, this is technically this is technically not a murder.

And I have to say that for legal reasons. I when I was researching this, there's an amazing Rolling Stone article that is called Love and Death in the House of Prayer by a man named Jeff Tietz.

That's an amazing article that's incredibly thorough. But I highly recommend that you read.

But at the beginning of this Rolling Stone article, there is this disclaimer which I'm going to read to you.

So it also counts for me, because when I read it, because I was like, oh, this is amazing. I'm just going to retell that 48 hours that I love. And then as I read this, I was just like, holy shit, I think some people wrote some cease and desist letters or something that I don't know. I can't wait.

So at the very top of this article, it said Editor's Note. In October 2014, nearly a year after this story appeared, the case against Michael Moore.

You'll meet him later, not Michael Moore, the documentarian. God, you guys loved him was dismissed.

Basically, they say that's a long quote from a lawyer you don't really need.

OK, with no trial, with a trial no longer eminence, the prosecutor's office and more defense attorneys released critical pieces of exculpatory evidence for the first time.

When we reported this story a year earlier, without access to this new information, we presented the criminal case against Moore as entirely credible.

Moore implicated Tyler Deaton in the alleged crime and we presented that implication is credible as well. But the evidence available now suggests overwhelmingly that Bethany didn't committed suicide and that Moore and Deaton are innocent of any crime. We now know every verifiable statement Moore made to the detectives was either proven false or was contradicted by the evidence. After confession, investigators discovered no additional evidence that a crime had occurred and both circumstantial and forensic evidence point to suicide. We urge readers to reconsider this story in light of the totality of the evidence, a comprehensive account of that evidence, including more detail on Moore's confession and the suicide is presented below in the original fuckin article doesn't say OK.

You guys get that, did you? So we have a court reporter that's writing a story so that felt important to say, but I don't follow any of that. Great, perfect. Because I realized I kind of I kind of buried believe there, but boiled it. Well, not really, though, because the story itself is fascinating.

Whatever the truth of it is, I'm not sure where we are with that right now. So at the end of this. Right, it's true.

OK, and I want to pronounce Bethany's original name is Lieblein.

Does anybody know if that's incorrect? Pronunciation Lieblein, then that's it. OK, so I think it's right.

OK, I just don't I just don't want to say it wrong. OK, so Beth bafflingly Lin grew up in a devoutly Christian home in suburban Dallas. She and her four siblings were all homeschooled. She read every Dickens novel except for one by the time she was 13.

And upon finishing high school, she won a scholarship to Southwestern University in Georgetown, Texas, near Austin.

Did she ever finish that last Dickens? We do. We will never know. Why didn't they? Why did that get included? She was miserable. They write. Every old book is written by Charles Dickens The End, and she was a genuinely talented writer.

And in this article, if you go read it, they have chunks of her writing. She had a blog for a while and she really is.

Her writing is really, really good and very original, as super impressed by it.

So she became the pride of Southwestern's writing center and she eventually would graduate magna cum laude.

But in 2007, she was invited to join a prayer group that was started by fellow student and Christian named Tyler Deaton.

So according to Tyler, right before he was about to begin his junior year at Southwestern University, while he was standing outside Barnes Noble waiting for the midnight release of Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows.

We were there, right? No, I was God commanded him to form a worship group in line. He just got the word he got bored and started hearing the voice of God. So apparently that summer he had been doing missionary work in Pakistan.

And he claims that while he was there, he saw a number of supernatural things occur, one of which was a young boy who had one leg, acquired his second leg, and the word used is acquired, Steven.

It was feeling that, like that's the singularity taking place and then I die on this stage, I was just like, what? The biggest circle has come full circle. OK, so they name a couple other supernatural experiences that he claims to have had.

And a lot of them seem to be maybe intuition or maybe just some of them are like things like he would command birds to fly away and they would where it's like.

So if you say something in a loud voice, birds fly away. I've seen that happen before to people without powers. One of them said one time people neighbors were playing music loudly and Tyler yelled, Jesus. And the music stopped.

And it's just like, well, you just sound like the angry neighbor that wants them to turn the music off. That doesn't that's not religious specifically. I'm going to need more than that.

And so, anyway, he came back to America and he wanted to see these supernatural things happening here in America.

He wanted he wanted more of that in his life. And so, of course, the answer came outside of Barnes and Noble Gods.

God said to him what you just did in Pakistan. So apparently he he it was him who acquired the second leg for the boy. What you just did in Pakistan, you're going to do it.

South-Western and the Lord told him who should be in this prayer circle that he was supposed to start a guy named Justin, a girl named Jun and Bethany Leveland.

So Tyler starts the group with those four people. They're all Christians. They are all at the small university together. So aside from when they would get together, aside from Bible study and praying together, they would spend hours discussing Harry Potter books and films, which they approached with a, quote, religious devotion.

A guy who joined after the initial four.

His name is Boz Harrington. And he he he was the person who talked to this reporter the most in Rolling Stone. And he said that the book's few, quote, fueled our sense of being on a divine mission.

They also supported Tyler's obsession, the paradigm of good and evil.

So Tyler had been a champion debater in high school and he applied those skills to his religious pursuits in college. He believed that he was right. And anyone who didn't share his beliefs, which would be kind of evangelical Christians believe was was ignorant.

And his senior quote in the Klyn high school yearbook from Corpus Christi, Texas, read The intolerance because some things are just stupid.

Newsier. Lawsuit. I love that gut over God's paging through that yearbook, and he reads out things like, I'm going to talk to this guy. This is this is who I want to start sending messages through. I was going to do the guy who quoted Led Zeppelin, but no, no, this guy. So now everyone's heard that one. Yeah, OK.

But this this ability to argue this, the logical thinking and this passion and dedication also made him a very effective evangelist.

The four person prayer circle soon grew to have over 20 members. And in that 48 hours episode, Tyler says they interview him.

And I highly recommend that you watch that if you haven't seen it already, because it is. And he's an amazing individual.

And now he clearly went on that show to prove his innocence and to to prove that he didn't have anything to do with Bethany's death. I guess I should just say so on that in that interview, he says my gift and something that is also a curse is that I'm charismatic, I'm charismatic. I've owned that from the beginning. I'll own it to the end. I can be electric and magnetic.

Oh, good. I'm glad he's owning it. He is owning it now. What do you say is I'm gassy. I've been gassy from the beginning and I've got rid of me and I'm OK. I'm owning it. And that's what you own. You don't own. I'm beautiful. So gorgeous. Look, I look people have accused. Fine. I'll take it hauntingly beautiful and electric and magnetic.

OK, but he was also conflicted because from from since he can remember he had homosexual impulses that he could not control.

And he felt very conflicted about that because it did not line up with his evangelical Christian upbringing or beliefs that he held himself.

He told friends that he knew that there was a connection between this, his interests in these because he also liked shit.

What's the other? The Narnia books? Yes, thank you.

The Chronicles of Narnia. I was so close. I mean, as fuck and V.C. Andrews.

Oh, selling daughter. I have I have the audio. I'm still listening to it on the audio book because it's hard to take, but oh my God. Some of the phrases that those that they use in that book get my sweet Audrina if anyone's reading along.

I don't know if anybody noticed this at one point near the near the beginning. I think she's describing Véra, the cousin, and she says clumsily clambering down the hall calombaris.

Not a word, is it OK? Tyler basically told his friends that he knew he was obsessed with these fantasy novels and Harry Potter and witchcraft and all these things, Bethany, in that this as the prayer group gets bigger, Bethany invites her friend Micah more into the group. In 2007, they had met in an English class.

They hit it off. They were really good friends. He told her story about dropping acid and having visions of angels and demons fighting over his soul.

And so she's like, I think you should come to our prayer group. That sounds like acid.

Yeah, right. Like, yeah, it could be that or it could be like one time I took acid and then it was just goofy face spinning and spinning and spinning. I think you should come to Disneyland. I can't see that goddamn dog again.

So she believed that Michael was a lost soul in need of saving.

There are many of these people on the southwestern campus and this prayer group's job, they slowly began to believe that their job was to save these souls.

So December 2007, Tyler, his cousin, told him he should go to a seminar at the International House of Prayer in Kansas City.

And it's a charismatic Christian movement based here in Kansas City and nearby suburb of Grandview.

And the people, the people that go to this church, maybe some of you are here. Close your ears for what she's about to say.

You don't think about these things until you're saying it out loud to a large group of people that on this podcast, what like exists, if we had to have said every episode in front of a bunch of people, you know, no way there's something about the comfort of my living room. Oh, just those cats staring at you. No one else, Stephen. But basically, this is the tenant and it's there.

You know, this is an editorial. This is a fact.

They're their belief is that the second coming will be soon and that God needs our help on Earth to return Christ to Earth by fighting the Antichrist.

So this is all very eminent issue, they believe.

So they also believe that young people will make up God's army and they will fight the Antichrist in a seven year battle called the tribulation. And when that's over, Jesus is going to return to Earth and then take up a sword and kill all the unsaved people.

And then the survivors will rule heaven and earth for eternity. Oh, my God, I need a nap.

That's fucking exhausting shit. And just witchdoctor. I say that. I just want to really quickly remind the Jews of Missouri, you're not alone. It just feels relevant for this moment. I mean, a lot was I mean, a lot to you, it means a lot to me, OK?

And also in in their teachings, they're the way that they explain things, the way you should pray and interact with God, as you should see Christ as your bridegroom and bridegroom, and that your prayer experience should be one of intimacy with him.

And there's a lot of strong sexual undertones in in the way they worship, according to ex members who tell who talked to Rolling Stone and at the International International House of Pancakes, prayer flags. You just can't help. I mean, it's it's actually brilliant marketing of them because they're just like, you know it. Now, come over here. You have breakfast now, come over and get saved. And it's like if you're trying to recruit someone like him, you want to go to IHOP on Sunday morning.

I'd love to have to go to I like I love how they have different flavors of syrup and God chert. I feel like IHOP is the opposite of church, like in the feeling I have when I think about how much time I've spent in church, staring, starving, hating them here. And I hope. And you're just like Sara.

That's my issue. Now we're talking Catholicism, we're going to. Don't worry, then we're going to go to Hindoo. We're going to hit it all tonight and I got to run out the back. OK, so at the at this complex, the the IHOP complex, they play music all the time in cafeterias, in the hallways, the prayer rooms.

And it's composed by the elders of the church to enhance the ecstatic experience and make it omnipresent.

And former IHOP has talked about being addicted to that music that when it's turned off, they become very nervous and irritable.

And they also talk about the sedative atmosphere of the prayer room. They all go into a prayer room for hours and hours at a time. And when they leave the prayer room, they become anxious, discouraged, and they often say to each other, I got to get back into the prayer room.

So just scientifically, we've got a lot of things here that are matching up with cult practices and indoctrination into the cult and brainwashing.

But just in that way of like, hey, turn that music off for a little while, you know what I mean? Put some pants on. Let's have some fucking fun. How about an hour, a solid hour of prayer and then you go throw a Frisbee for a while. It doesn't need to be four hours, but I'm not in church. So members of the church prayed all day and night long sessions of mesmeric musical worship, repeating the same phrases over and over for hours at a time.

So when Tyler came home, he went there at his cousin's urging and he had it. He went and had it like a weekend there or whatever, in my mind is like a weekend. But it could have been fuckin 70 days.

But when he came back to college, he told all of his friends in the prayer, his prayer group, he'd had a transformation and that he had been chosen to train God's final army.

So things are getting serious. So in spring of 2008, everyone in the group believe that Tyler was an end times apostle and that they had so themselves are receiving prophecies from God.

So in the stories that you read, these kids are starting to believe they also are being talked to by God and then they're telling each other the prophecies. And it truly is are things like I God told me a prophecy that I should marry you. And then the other person would be like, well, I don't agree with this prophecy. And there everything is becoming very like it's a message from God. It has to happen.

Where are the fucking teachers in this whole story there? In that part of the library, no one goes in with the weird magazines that are in plastic. Yeah, yeah. And bad coffee. Yeah, a lot of whispering. Yeah. Nobody really knows what's going on.

But OK, so basically Tyler tells the group that they're all going to move to Kansas City to be closer to IHOP central and they're like, we're down, we're in.

We are soldiers in God's army. So in early 2009, Tyler and Bethany moved to Grandview, Missouri to begin IHOP six month internship program. So from eight a.m. to four p.m. every day, they absorbed biblical analysis theology. And then from six till midnight, they worshiped in the prayer room. Six till midnight is six hours.

We're going to sit here for six hours. No, wait till you understand how much worship that is, because it's a ton. So then slowly, the other kids from the prayer group who either were still in school, whatever, they were slowly moving up to Kansas City to move there.

And they started a thing called the community. And this is Tyler's idea.

They lived in two separate houses, boys in one house, girls in the other. The houses were four miles apart. And they then they would meet together in the boys house when they had have communal meetings.

And Tyler was receiving messages from God not only about the coming tribulation, but he also had messages about where people should sit at dinner and how they should dress.

I don't think God gives a shit about that stuff. Now, I'm going to go ahead. That's not what the messages that Tyler was getting said. Stop. All right.

OK, there was a lot of a lot of control. And a lot of you don't think for yourself. I think for you because God told me so.

Then the members of the group start kind of cutting out friends and family members who aren't that into what they're doing, of course, because they're repressing their allegiance to God's army for the tribulation.

And and then he starts discouraging relationships between them, saying that they're a distraction and an offense to God.

But he did encourage prolonged affectionate contact, particularly among men, because he said they were had been wrongly socialised against it.

So they needed to hug and cuddle, give each other massages, because if you were uncomfortable with another. Hands touch, then you hit a wall in your heart and you are only experiencing part of God's love and that you couldn't function as a Christian in this way.

So then Tyler claims to the group that he has a revelation that his homosexuality is actually a choice. And so a few days later, he says, as he's sitting in the prayer room watching Bethany worship.

So Bethany had actually had a big crush on him for a long time. It was a big part of why she was such a huge part of this group. And she had told him that she had a marriage prophecy about him.

And when she told him that he like Easter and was just like no and was really cold to her and it broke her heart. But she stayed in and she believed that she believed homosexuality was a sickness that needed to be cured in him and that she was just going to stand by and be patient and basically love him out of it.

So one day he announces to the group that he was, in his words, sitting in the prayer room watching Bethany worship, and he felt a giant vat of affection rush over him.

That's a direct quote. Oh, that does not sound very romantic. It's not I mean, everybody's different, but it just that spilled all over just a boiling, scalding vat of affection. Tumblr, just this.

He actually later wrote in an essay I was experiencing real passionate sexual knocked me off my feet, pure and glorious attractions for the most beautiful woman alive.

So then when they complete their internship there, he asks her out and in the summer of 2009, he announces to her that he intended to pursue her unter marriage, which is, I guess, the Bible way of saying it.

So, of course, she's thrilled.

This is like what she was kind of hanging in there and waiting for. And she thinks he's finally seen the light and they're going to be all aligned in the spirit and just made that up.

Karen, are you joining this poll right now?

And then the idea of Jesus with a sword does kind of make me smile a little bit.

It's just exactly the opposite of how he works in every way. Like, yes, you can say that, like a fallen angel would come are like there's some maybe Michael.

He was a big fighter, but Jesus isn't going to come and kill people with a sword. That's not a hippie, OK? Look, we all have our own beliefs, OK, with. So here's how they did it to the group. They think this is a staged relationship and this is why they went on a date every Tuesday between six and nine, and then they spent Fridays baking bread together.

That was the extent of how they hung. There was no Netflix thing and there was no chilling episodes. Courtney Lee got his head in the eye, huh? Just Vince baking bread for hours. OK, Tyler claimed that anything more than that would be subordinating the needs of the group to their own needs.

So group first, group first, group first, which is another huge cult thing. He discouraged Bethany from physical displays of affection and they would not kiss until their engagement two and a half years later.

Where is that fat of affection? We were talking about the VAT is at a tilt. It's not pouring, it's not a stream or a waterfall of affection. Yet she was promised a VAT and I'm to. OK, so they get married in August of 2012, and in this procession he sings, Come to me and my beloved.

So the groom is singing at his own wedding. Wrong, right, wrong. How much would you pay to be at that wedding? So much money. Well, the mother. So there's of course, the mother is in this 48 Hours episode. Of course, it's tragically sad because essentially her daughter just got taken away from her and then died in a way that she in no way believes she would do.

She's no as she knew her as her daughter, she would not kill herself.

And she says that at this wedding, it looked like this this adjoining of these apostolic like it looked like a religious ceremony about something else, as opposed to a wedding of two people that were in love.

And she said it was singing in her. He was singing at her. And there was little you know, of course, it was a lot of like, you know, the leaders of the army. There was just a lot of shit that was very exclusionary to family and friends. But but they were there anyway.

So they said that Bethany seemed resolved and serene resolved at your wedding.

Look, look, I'm doing it doing this fucking doing. The Normans have been purchased and put into little baggies. There's no going back.

I got 1000 pounds of Jordan almonds, and I'm not throwing them away. Not for you, not for anybody.

But some people in attendance said that they were super uneasy and they were spooked by tailers evident power over Bethanie. And several of her old friends said they had a deep sense that they were saying goodbye to her for the final time.

It's very sad. So members of the prayer group say Bethany showed a marked change when the couple came back from their three week honeymoon. They said that she was really different. She was very withdrawn and she was acting really weird.

And she was she had moved into the men's house, into the basement with Tyler, but she kept coming back to the woman's house and staying there for days at a time.

Then on October 3rd, she was temporarily admitted to Truman Medical Center after threatening suicide, not attempting, but threatening it.

So 10 weeks later, on October 30th, 2012, at 940 p.m., sheriff's deputies respond to a report of a dead body in the parking lot near Longview Lake Picnic Shelter number 12 in a tan Ford Windstar van.

In the back seat, deputies find the body of Bethany Deaton, a white plastic trash bag has been pulled over her head and tied under her chin.

She's twenty seven years old at the time.

On the console, there's two bottles of Tylenol PM one is unopened and the other is empty.

Now, Bethany, in in the time of them being up here and being at this church, she had gone back to school and gotten she became a registered nurse, which is, I think, an important factoid to know about this, that she was a registered nurse with access to any drug that she wanted and did commit suicide by taking one full bottle of Tylenol PM and then putting a bag over your head doesn't make sense. It also doesn't make sense because her eyes were open and she had inhaled the bag.

And if you OD'd on something, you would be out, especially like a sleeping pill, like over-the-counter sleeping pill like that. She would've been asleep and her eyes would have been open. So the police were baffled by what what they found here, because there was also a suicide note next to her.

But it just said, I am evil. It just said all the stuff that kind of didn't sound like her. It was written in her handwriting, but it wasn't her voice. And it certainly wasn't like any of the writing that they put in this Rolling Stone article in the beginning. That's beautiful and very original and a very, very accurate self-expression. She was very good at expressing herself on paper. And this was like a weird list of I'm bad and wrong and it should just be over.

Now, she did her friends did say there was a marked change when they came back from the honeymoon. So who knows? I mean, like something could have happened and we don't know. So ten days after Bethany's bodies found Michael Moore, her friend, that she got to join the group who had eventually moved up in 2011, he moved up to Kansas City as well and joined the community.

And when he did, there was a big upset in the men's house and all the rooms switched around. And Tyler had basically wanted Michael to move into his room. And there was kind of it was kind of an issue. So anyway, ten days after the bodies found, Micah walks into the Grandview police station and confesses that he killed Bethany.

His account is bizarre and salacious, but he knew things about the crime scene that you couldn't have known unless you were there in that van.

He also claimed that he did it under Tyler's orders.

So basically. He told detectives that over the past few months, Bethany had been dosed with the antipsychotic Seroquel and that he and several men in the house had been sexually assaulting her when she was out. They thought she would tell someone about it. And under questioning by detectives, two of the men in the house who had recently moved out revealed that they were in ongoing sexual relationships with Tyler. And one of them said this relationship was long term. A fourth said that Tyler had groomed him to be part of their sexual group.

They said he was manipulative and exercised in control over all the members of the household, and he characterized all of their sexual activity as a religious experience.

So then two weeks later, after this huge so when he confesses all of this and then it's suddenly the cops are like, well, that would actually make sense if someone strangled her in that van, then we know why these things that don't line up with an overdose happened. You know, it's all starting to line up for them. And then Michael Moore's lawyer recants his admission on his behalf.

She declares his confession bizarre, fictional and made by a distraught, confused young man. And then the charges are eventually dropped. And Bethany's death, a death is ruled a suicide.

But very few members of the original group of I think right around 20 somewhere or 23, maybe none of the almost none of them believe Bethany would commit suicide and that after her death, the community disintegrates, everybody leaves, people go back.

Peoples' parents come and pick them up like it's the whole the whole thing's over.

So now I'm going to read you the speech that Tyler gave at Bethany's funeral.

Oh. Uh huh. As some of you know already, I am a man who was in love with ideas, with crazy paradigms, and then he laughed and and when they brought me Bethany's body, at first I cried. But then I laughed because I said to her, Bethany, if if you could see you, you would not like the way you look right now.

Oh. And last night, we had worship time together very briefly as a group, and it was wonderful and it just showed me the Lord's supremacy over this wretched thing that is death. And I thought to myself, what a crazy paradigm. And then I thought Bethany would love my paradigm because she loved me and was so fiercely supportive and believed me hundreds of times when I thought I was crazy or heretical in the end.

But can you imagine following that speech? And now it feels like we're going to close this down now because everybody has to go to their car and scream at the top of their lungs. Like what in the living thought, oh, my God, what in the fuck? Just really quick, I'm going to read you my favorite part of the 48 Hours interview, because basically he, the interviewer says, is Troy Roberts. And he says, I have to ask you this question directly.

Did you order Micah to kill your wife? And he says, no, no, of course not. I mean, I have read the media, so I know the image. Micah is easily manipulable, manipulatable. That's not the word.

What's the implication? Tyler manipulated him. And then Roberts says, I'm asking you if he wanted to please you. And then Tyler gets real, like real hot real fast, too. This is kind of right where I came in. The first time I saw it, I was like, oh, what's happening down? Here we go. Is it something of like they don't they don't they don't know how they're being seen. They think that they think they're smarter than everybody.

And he says, is the reason you're asking me if he wanted to please me is because you think his desire to please me somehow led to foul play.

My sense listening and definitely the way I think anybody watching would interpret is did Michael want to please you? If the answer's yes, then he could have done this thing that the media painted him as doing. And I don't think that's fair to Micah or to myself.

A simple no. I mean. None of it's fair to Bethany, in my opinion, not fucking. So anyway, there's your super unsatisfying yet insane story of. I wish I wish this is the kind of sure, then we could just watch that episode together because I want you to see it's so bad. It's it's quite something. It's go to IHOP, right? We'll get the pancakes. We'll sing the same song for six hours. Those fucking incredible.

So not to watch that. So not OK. My story and all the alleged. Alleged. Alleged. OK, here we go. Steven. My story is about the oldest people ever sentenced to death in America. Ray and Faye Copeland.

Oh, you're friends. Everyone's grandfather, grandma here, right? You're all Copelands great. You're all Copelands. We sectioned off a whole Copeland area right down here. This is the Copeland family reunion. Yeah. Let me tell you about your fucking grandpappy. OK, Ray Koechlin was born December 30th, twenty look, nineteen fourteen. You're doing great, you're doing great. Are you up to a good start? 1942, he grew up in Ozark Hills, Arkansas.

He dropped out of school after fourth grade to help on the family's farm, as a lot of kids did during the Depression, even though it was the Great Depression. He for some reason, his parents spoiled the shit out of him and he got whatever he wanted. But what a strip of molasses touring. I don't know. Could I have an orange, please? This is just what all the things say, and I'm going to believe it. OK, no, I like that a spoiled child during the Depression is kind of a great thing to think about sex.

But, you know, he got one boot instead of two. My mom has first documented crime is was at the age of 20.

He stole two of his family's hogs and sold them in another town.

So he's setting up his fuckin M.O. He just lured them away from all the other hogs and no one was looking.

And then he's like, hey, you want to buy these? How old was he? 20. OK, so. So he continued to practice his love of stealing livestock in the area so he'd like, steal livestock and then sell it to someone else, pocket the money, and then the person would be like, what the fuck? And then I think they call that a wrestler. Isn't that wrestler? No. I think they go got a professional wrestler.

Hulk Hogan used to do it all the time, but then he started. He fell. He fell in love with a new thing that he loved forging checks. Oh, I understand that. Yeah. So that was. Yeah, and that was his new thing, and that landed him in county jail for a year, 1936 and the spring of 1940, Ray made a routine visit to his physician's office and he meets a woman named Fadila.

Wilson falls in love with her fate. She's 19 at the time. She and Ray's been raised by a hardworking couple from Harrison but little money and raised seven children while living in a dirt floor cabin.

What a fucking bummer, right? Yes, that's what it was like. A dirt floor cabin that was like five bedrooms, three bathrooms. What happened after subway tile?

Yeah, it's funny because it always seems like if you were raised in a dirt floor cabin, you're either going to grow up to be like a check for dirt like murderer, or you're going to grow to be like a country sensation like those. Yes, it's Dolly. It's Dolly. Are these people. Not a lot in between. This isn't Dolly story. OK, just FYI, I do want to see a picture of Fay and. Right. Sherri, this is them young and pretty old.

I can't see their murderers don't on. Oh no. They're kind of attractive. Right. I take a bad check from him. That's it. Her hair is like what I that's usually what I rocked in the 90s, some some weird random bobby pin right there. I'm like, it's called style. Let's get drunk. OK, so they started dating and in six months, they're married within a year, have their first kid and then I wrote and they're married within six months again, because I copied and pasted that they have four kids over the next 10 years.

And Ray keeps up his fucking passion of illegal shit.

He's sentenced to a year in jail for stealing horses from a neighbor's farm. And then the family's like, let's get the fuck out of here. They're onto us. And they moved to Missouri and he was immediately arrested for cattle left again. Like the second he gets here, he's like, sorry, you guys eat. I'm just real quick, I there's just a couple cows I see across the street that seem like they don't have an owner. Right.

OK, so he keeps doing this from 1953 to 1966, and they moved from town to town stealing livestock and fucking writing bad checks and doing it again and again, it's totally his thing because before the Internet or phones or whatever, it was just kind of like it would be you'd hear tell of somebody that stole the cow, right? Basically, yeah. But then that guy would show up and be like, OK, you know, the horse you need to borrow the horse for an hour.

Like, don't they know like one has a freckle the horses have and they're like, that's Bob's horse. Yeah. Well, usually I think it's branding. That's what I branded. That makes way more serious than any kind of. But no, Bob's horse has shorter bangs. It's not it's not Bob's horse now. I mean, I'm like branding a fucking great. Yeah. Shit, right.

During the summer of 1966, the Copeland family go back to Missouri where Ray and Fay successfully purchased a small farm with 40 acres of land in Mooresville, population 130. Now, that's not a good number for stealing stuff. No, I know right now I'm new to a big city. Yeah, blend in. Damn, dude, for real. It it takes a job at a glove making company.

I thought you'd like that. I kept that in for you. I thought you said love making company. Oh, you didn't know there was a job.

It's a company comprised of the worst word in the English language.

We make this word that everyone hates saying no gloves.

Well, you mean gloves? Gloves. Yeah, I might be going deaf. OK, it's a chance. OK, good enough. So Rasam popular with neighbors. They call him a bitter elderly man, you know.

Wow, what a slam. I know you bigger elderly man. They think he's abusive, of course, to and her children.

A real binyon snappy or call the owner of a local cafe. Those of you supposed to be buying these in a cafe, is he thinking of a giant turtle? Oh, I'm sorry, you said a giant turtle. Oh, you're asking me about Ray. Oh, yeah, he's fine. He well, he's got a hard shell. Oh, no, wait, no, baby. And Snoopy, do you want to. I think I don't think you guys have turned against him enough because I already yelled at waitress's bimbo fuck you.

And he would try to run over dogs in the street. I knew it. I knew you guys and I can be on my side after that. That's so terrible. It makes me laugh. This is where.

OK, so now Ray's like I'm older, snappier.

I'm ready to start actually scheming. Oh, so there's a photo of the old timey now so we can see what they fucking really look like.

Like, oh well because they were like cute before they looked like a country couple. Country singing Come on now. Now her right eye is sliding off of her face. And he is not the man I used to know whatsoever. I don't even recognize you. I mean, Bidi and he kind of fucking looks like a turtle. You'd be like you'd be like, sir, do you know how to get to the courthouse? Get away from me. You know, it's like, what?

Why I like it.

So I didn't even say anything. I like it.

I arlanda right. OK, so now they're like scam time. So instead of just stealing. So he was doing this thing where he would go to cattle auctions, buy the horse, write a bad check, take the horse and then they'd be like, give us the fuckin horse back you idiot. Yeah. And so that didn't work. So instead he was like, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to get hitchhikers and hobos and bring them to the cattle auctions and make them buy the horses and then take it.

Has he ever thought of just getting a job? It's so much easier to be a mailman. He could be a fuckin hat salesman or he can be a dentist.

OK, so that didn't work, blah, blah, blah. But then he was like, oh, here's a better idea. A better idea. I'm going to pick up these drifters and hitchhikers. I'm going to say to them, I'll pay you money. You stay in my house and you I'm going to help you open a bank account and get your shit together and you're going to buy these cow for me. So you'd open bank accounts for them and then they would go write the bad checks.

And by the time they pick up without those hitchhikers and drifters were gone. So they didn't know it was from Ray, even though he always did that. I don't know. OK, listen, a long time ago. Yeah, OK. He was a little slower back then, right?

He got away with it a bunch stealing a total of 32000 dollars with phony bank accounts of bad checks. Wow.

Until one of his victims, Gerald Perkins, is interrogated and exposes Ray's crime. Ray's arrested, sent to jail. Barbancourt When he's released from prison, he does the thing where he's like, well, now I just can't leave any witnesses.

Oh, yeah. So so then he would he would do all the shit.

And then after that he would kill them with a single shot to the back of the skull with a 22 caliber Marlin Bolt action rifle once the livestock had been purchased and sold off. That's a nice game. Wow. Yeah.

Just like they'd be like I'm back from the auction service walking into the corral, like all at their house. Yeah, I think at the house they would do that or a back, you know, at the barn. In the barn. Jesus Christ.

So this went on for just how long. Oh please. For weeks.

Twenty, you know what I mean, 20 years until nineteen eighty nine, but sorry, so because no brag, but I was in the fourth grade and I showed up at the fair.

Thank you. It's one of my proudest accomplishments, and I guess he would go to different auction places then, right, because these players, they're getting ripped off, even though it's random people like the the hobo that just took a shower and had his hat replaced or whatever.

I mean, they're not nobody's catching on for that long shares.

They're disappearing, too. But they were drifters. They didn't have family looking for them. So. Right. Kind of that perfect thing. And then and OK.

So then in 89, a 57 year old drifter named James McCormick is like, hey, guys, I was just a little shot and killed by those old timey, like innocent looking old people you have over here, Fenway, Koechlin. And they were like we were we thought he was up to something no good because they were like kind of on to him at this point with the forging sweet.

This guy escaped. Escaped. I think they pulled a gun on him and he fucking skedaddled. Wow.

Yeah. Not it startled is the perfect word, is the word, since this whole thing is like a weird handicap cartoon, for chrissake.

So they knew Ray's history, so they got enough evidence to get a search warrant for his farm. So they search his farm for like a week and they don't find anything. And then they're like, doesn't he own another farm? And so they go search that farm and they didn't find anything.

Just kidding. They a week long search, OK, turns up three bodies on a nearby farm in Ludlow. Three corpses were buried in the barn and shallow graves. They'd all been shot in the head with a 22. They were identified as Jimmy Dale Harvey. He's 27, Paul Power, he's 21. And John Freeman, 27. All transients who had last been seen working for Copeland. So young, too, I know. And later, investigators uncovered another corpse in the same bar.

Wayne Warner, who's a drifter who spent his last months, moments with Ray Copeland. And the final body was Dennis Murphy, 27. Another went to Copeland's Business Associates, whose remains are found in a well on another farm, were also found in the Copeland home.

With these two, it was a list of 24 names of farm helpers, and the list is written by Faye.

And they find the right of the rifle used to shoot the men and five of the murder victims that they had written had X's next to them.

And it's each one who had been killed while she just fucking text them out well, so she could keep track.

I mean, look, listen, she's a business lady, so why were they people that they were going to kill?

I think people that had worked for them at some point, OK, the Xs were the people that they had killed. So the five murder victims on X's next to him, as did seven more people who were never found.

Wo seven plus five is 12. Yeah. And I'm like, who's like, you know, who lives there right now? Go dig in your backyard. It's not oh my God, it's got to be McMansion at this point. Right. Dig, dig, dig. Money isn't really disturbing.

OK, most disturbing piece of evidence that showed that Faye was in on the whole thing is that she had made a handmade quilt out of the dead victim's clothes.

No fame. Faye, I wanted to be on your side. I wanted to be on your side, and that's the gift for the hometown. And you have to put it on your bed, I know, isn't that just disgusting? I know it's insane. These people are there because they have three farms. You can buy pulp material, you cheap bastards. All right. So creepy. Yeah, OK, so weird. It's a Adine with a face.

Offered a deal if she would help find the additional bodies. But she was like, I don't even know he was killing anyone.

Oh yeah. They were arraigned on five counts of murder on November 1st, 1990.

Faye, who's 69 at this point, goes on trial, says that Ray committed the murders without her knowledge and that she had suffered from battered women syndrome. But there's all the evidence against her, like her fucking handwritten list with her handwritten X's and the quilts, you know. Right.

And in 1990, she sentenced to death by lethal injection for four of the murders and life without prison for the fifth. So she's like the oldest woman ever to be convicted or to be sent to death. Shit. But wait. On March seven, 1991, 76 year old Ray went to trial. He's found guilty of all five murders sentenced to death as well. He tried to plead insanity, but everyone was like, bullshit, dude.

There's like you can't plead insanity when you've been committing crimes for ninety two years, like, consistently, you clearly got over it at some point if you ever were.

Yeah. And then apparently after that, after he got convicted, he never asked about Feighan, he never fucking inquired as to how his wife was doing.

He was using her for 60 years I guess so down by bidi snappy motherfucker.

So although they were both convicted to Ray died in 1993 of natural causes while waiting to be executed and in 1999 phase. So all of these women's groups, you know, argued about the battered women's syndrome, which is like we don't really know. Fair enough. Fair enough. I don't know. Yeah, we don't you don't know, you don't something terrible things were happening on that farm for sure. So her sentence was commuted to life in prison and she she was no longer a threat.

In 2002, she suffered a stroke. So she is paroled. She was paroled and moved to a nursing home in her hometown of Harrison, Arkansas, where she died of natural causes in 2003 at the age of 83. Wow.

And there's a photo of the five guys that we know where the victims, you know, and that is your fucking friends, Ray.

And one wow, that's intense. Old people farm stuff, all people killing. Also farm stuff, you know, like that's why all farms are like at the end of a long road, set back away from people. Let's change things. So farms have to be right next to each other, close to the road and next to each other. All the houses have to be real close. And then you can just let your your animals get to do what they want back behind.

Could we show you guys a photo of this? Oh, yes.

Before we because we're so we're so in love with ourselves for picking this this prize for the hometown.

Can we have a still of what it is.

That's the village. OK, that's the linnet. This gorgeous jewelry box valued at over twenty years that there's been. It's a box, it's full of candy. He wrote some shit, an amazing, OK, fun. OK, who's not you can't be drunk, has a quick hometown. And I think it's you're picking because you've been on a roll. Get up here quick. Sorry, there has been. So go to this and I pick people in the middle of the aisle.

I always do that. Yesterday I picked a pregnant girl in the middle of the aisle and we didn't realize she was pregnant and goes, hurry up. I was like, pick up the pace. She's rolling down the aisle. And I was just like one lady up. Right now. I'm like, Oh, hi. Cry, cry for help. Hi, it's OK, everybody is right now, it's here for Brooke. Don't knock, clap, because you didn't get picked, OK?

Where are you from? I'm from a little town called Sedalia. It's like. They all came tonight randomly, somebody from Cedella sitting right next to me. Suddenly a strong tweet like murder. Good.

OK, so long story short, I live halfway between Kansas City and think this is actually a story from St. Louis. OK, the day happening right now. Have you guys heard of Pam Hupp? We just did it last night.

They hope to do it. Do it. OK, well, if you guys don't know about Pam, have you guys seen this fucking crazy? Crazy. This woman worked in insurance, basically had a lot of shady shit going on whenever she worked, became friends with this woman, kind of lost touch with her until this woman gets diagnosed with cancer. All of a sudden, Pam wants to be best friends with her again. Pam drives back and forth from chemo, is really, really clingy with her, gets me the beneficiary of her life insurance instead of her husband.

They mail the certified letter before it even gets delivered. Her friend gets murdered. So Pam basically pins it on her husband. This is all alleged. She hasn't been convicted yet yet. But anyways, she picked a night that her husband was always gone, stabbed her a whole bunch of times. Husband goes to jail, spends a couple of years in jail, stabs her 55 50, buyside lots and lots of times. Anyways, her husband had an alibi the whole time.

No evidence against him. He gets out of jail. In the meantime, she gets all this life insurance money does not give it to the daughters, which is what she was allegedly supposed to do with it. They asked her, why haven't you given this money to the daughters? Oh, well, because my mom just died of Alzheimer's and I'm very busy with that. Mom and I have Alzheimer's. Mom took a whole bunch of Ambien, took it on her own and got tripped off of her balcony.

But the rails on her balcony are broken.

And the people who investigated it said that a normal sized woman could never have broken through those. So she gets found on the ground outside there. My view the day before, whenever Pam brought her mom back to the rest home where she lives, she goes, My mom's really, really tired. She's not going to be down for dinner or breakfast. Don't worry about her. Don't check. Don't check. She's fine. That's what everyone says about their elderly parents.

Please, please don't try. I'm paying for mine. So anyways, it gets ruled just accidental, not anything suspicious going on with that. Time goes by, the husband gets out of jail, then all of a sudden they get a 911 call that Pam has been the victim of a home invasion. Somebody had gotten into her car, held a knife to her throat. She ran inside the chaser. Inside, she unloaded a clip, killed them with a handgun.

Yeah, all the stuff keeps happening to this woman.

So anyways, it turns out to be a disabled man that lives in a local area and they believe that she told him that she worked for a television program like Dateline and wanted to pay him a thousand dollars to be in a reenactment. He has nine hundred dollars of cash in his pocket when they find his body sequential bills. She also has one hundred dollar bill on her that is in sequence. So that that happens all the time. So that's just no big deal.

And then also they were like, wait a second, I think we got a 911 call recently where a woman said that a creepy ass lady picked her up in an SUV saying that she wanted to pay her a thousand dollars to be in a reenactment for Dateline.

She stayed sexy and didn't get murdered out of the car, but they reviewed traffic footage and it was perhaps SUVs that pulled the woman in. So they keep postponing her trial. She hasn't been on trial yet, but she's 100 percent guilty. She got it allegedly, right? Yes, totally guilty. I think that I think you can earn that, you know. He's just so much that was awesome, so good. Oh, my God. Amazing.

You guys don't jump her and take that. I know you guys, this has been truly such a perfect show.

You have been an amazing, amazing audience. Thank you so much. So much fun. We're so lucky that we get to do this as a job. We can't believe it. It's all because of you guys. It's such a it's a very it's a very strange sensation to start this podcast in George's apartment with her and I talking casually and usually very inaccurately about true crime. And to have it explode in this way and to have you guys, you just come and be this community that you are turning yourselves into.

It is an amazing thing to be a part of. Thank you so much for doing this with us.

I know. It's amazing. Yes. Thank you. So stay sexy and.