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[00:00:00]

Hey. Pardon my take, listeners. You can find every episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube. Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music.

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Hey. It's PFT here. Peloton has exactly what you need to stay on track with your fitness goals no matter where you're at in life. Personally, trying to squeeze fitness into my schedule hasn't always been easy, but Peloton makes it possible with all kinds of classes that you can jump into. Whether you're a new parent, coming off an injury, training for something big, or just straight up busy, there's there's always something to keep you moving.

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See you on the leaderboard.

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On today's part of my take, we've got an awesome, awesome 2 for for the people. We got Steve Young, hall of famer. Incredible interview with him. First time on, we've been trying to get him on for a really long time. And then we have a great interview with head coach Kenny Dillingham from the Arizona State Sun Devils.

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Really fun talking to him, talking about the college football playoff, winning the big 12, maybe PFT trying out for kicker next year. We're gonna talk some Monday night football. We're gonna talk some college football. We got hot seat cool throne. We got guys on chicks, and it's all brought to you you by our friends at DraftKings.

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Welcome to Pardon My Take presented by DraftKings. DraftKings offering a warm welcome to new players with $100 instantly in casino credits with just a $10 wager, plus everyone can get in on the action with a holiday reward every week. So sign up with code take because the holiday cheer is here only on the DraftKings Casino. Today is Wednesday, December 11th in PFT.

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I kinda wanna believe in the Bengals again. Let's go. Ja'Marr Chase is so goddamn good. It's actually insane to watch. And I know the Cowboys are bad, and I know the Bengals are bad.

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But I don't like, Ja'Marr Chase, what he's doing this year, and every single play, he feels like he's open. Even if he's not open, Joe Burrow's gonna throw it to him, and then he will get open. That was it's too little too late for the Bengals, but even still watching them and watching their offense. And, obviously, we had the Leon Lett play by the Cowboys, which was peak Cowboys and Mike McCarthy giving us our his patented stare up at the, jumbotron being like, how can I reverse what just happened?

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I have a suggestion for Mike McCarthy because this happens to him a lot. Something bad happens. You know something bad has just happened in the game as head coach. He forces himself to watch the replay of that bad thing over and over and just sit in that pain. Yeah.

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Mike, you gotta you gotta stop doing that.

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You gotta stop subjecting yourself to just trauma repeatedly over and over again. If something bad happens, find yell at somebody, which

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he did do last night. Mike McCarthy was he I I don't think that this is is this Mike McCarthy's best coaching job?

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It might be. He also assaulted a cameraman.

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He did assault a cameraman.

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But you you're right. Like, it's it I I will for forever. Like, I could be on my deathbed, and I'll be and someone will be like, hey. Describe Mike McCarthy staring at a play that he wants to wheel into, reversing, and it's like seared in my brain. It's that same dumb look where he looks up, and he's like, if I stare at this jumbotron long enough with my fat chins, I can get everything to change, and it never changes.

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And Dallas was the worst place for him to go because they have a giant screen hanging directly above the field. If it was anywhere else, you're just gonna see him staring off into the distance. Yeah. But, yeah, with this, it it's something that we see all the time from him. That was a weird way to end the game, and, Joe Burrow said at best, like, it's about time that 1 of these broke in our favor.

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Yeah. He finally got a bounce.

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And McCarthy talked about what happened after the play. He said that, the crowd actually had a lot to

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do with it. So the punt

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was blocked. Mhmm. And then, I I don't know. How do you pronounce the guy's name?

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I I don't know.

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I'd yeah. He just came off injured reserve. And I'm gonna I'm gonna butcher it if I try to do it. But he heard the crowd, and the crowd was excited because the punt was blocked. And he saw the ball in front of him, and it was just 1 of those moments.

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Grab ball. He called it a vice moment where he was stuck in a vice. Yeah. Seeball tried to grab ball. It didn't work out for him.

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But, yeah, I guess it's nice to see the Bengals win a a game as, you know, after that. They've lost so many games where they played good enough to beat almost any other team

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Right.

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If their defense wasn't so bad. Right. In this 1, they didn't play exceptionally well, but they they managed to figure out a way to win at the end. And, yeah, don't take anything away from from Chase Young and Joe because what they're doing is just crazy.

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It's crazy. It always works. It's crazy. And, I know the Bengals have virtually no chance of can we pull up the the, playoff predictor? I mean, I think it's, like, 10% chance or something.

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They'd have to run the table. The 1 good news for them is they do play the Broncos, in a couple weeks and Broncos are the 7 seed right now. But I think they would need I think they would have to win out. I think the Colts will have to beat the or the Colts would have to beat the Broncos and the Colts would have to lose out and the Broncos would also have to lose out. So it's, what is it, 3%?

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3%. So not even close to 10%. But it would just be it's fun. I just want them to have a chance in week 18. I don't think they're gonna get it, but it's there there's so much fun to watch and Joe Burrow's having an all time year.

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And, you just sit there and you look at it. It's torture for Bengals fans because they can look at every game and be like, man, if we had just gotten 1 bounce. If they if they had 6 wins right now, if they were 67, they would have a legitimate chance of of running the table and making the playoffs, but just 1 bounce didn't go their way until last night.

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I do like the headline that they put on ESPN afterwards. Gaff hurts cowboys playoff hopes. Yeah. That's 1 way to look at it.

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That was that they were in the playoffs?

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Yeah. Okay. They they had hopes of being there.

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They had hopes. They had hopes. I wanna talk real

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quick about the Simpsons broadcast. Yeah. Because I am, I'm a Simpsons freak. I love the Simpsons. I think seasons, like, 3 through 8 are maybe some of the best television to ever be written and produced.

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Okay.

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I did watch the first half of the Simpsons broadcast last night. And I don't know why it took me so long to remember this. The Simpsons are a 1000000 times better in 2 d. Yeah. The Simpsons in 3 d, not that fun.

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Yeah. I still watched it because it just made me think about being a kid watching the Simpsons again.

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I I tried. It was so far behind. It wasn't very far behind. It it's just too it was too it's hard to watch a game, knowing that, like, you're 2 minutes behind. It's it's actually torturous being like, oh, I I wonder what happened.

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I already could know what happened if I was watching the real broadcast. So I watched I actually watched with my son for, like, maybe 10 minutes. He was a little confused because he doesn't know who the Simpsons are.

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That's the other thing. It's, like, the Simpsons I I feel like our demographic

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Yes.

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That's when the Simpsons was gold. They've been on TV forever, but I don't feel like kids are growing up watching Simpsons right now. Even allowed to watch the Simpsons.

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Oh, really?

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Yeah. It was, like, not a it was not like a kid show. Yeah.

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If Yeah. I mean, it was kinda bad boy stuff.

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If Hank had watched I

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wasn't allowed to watch married with children.

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Yeah. That was that would come on after the Simpsons. Yeah.

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Yeah. Yeah.

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If Hank had grown up watching the Simpsons, he would be a real shit head today.

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Yeah.

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He'd be, like, sarcastic and I hate her and have a

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smart mouth. Simpsons road rage, though, 3 d game, elite game.

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Yes.

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Yeah. It's like Simpsons GTA.

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Oh, yeah. But I think that if they had made all the players different characters on the Simpsons, that would have been a little bit better. But I I sort of figured out after, like, the second drive, whenever a player got on the field as, like, a Simpsons character There was good to do that. Homer was was Cooper Rush, and he was like, here we go, which they should have said. It was a key that that guy was gonna do some great.

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Like, Ralph Wiggum does not have that type of lateral quickness. No. He doesn't have that dog in a way. Put in at wide receiver, you know he's about to break the game over.

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Yeah. Who and I saw Lisa made that catch, for a touchdown.

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Yeah. Lisa did a little tiptoe down the sidelines.

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Yeah. That was sick. She Leo Lisa did the Chase Brown part.

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She did the Chase Young. She did not jump into the big Salvation Army pot at the end. Yes. The sex cauldron.

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That was cool.

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But, yeah, Ralph Wiggum I give Ralph Wiggum he's my, he's my Gruden grinder.

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Okay. Nice. Yeah. I I I'm I'm happy they tried. I don't know.

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You just can't be that far behind.

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Yeah. I watched, like, 1, maybe 1 drive. Not even.

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Just can't can't be that far behind.

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We just need a time when they do 1 of these alternate broadcast where they're cartoons, and there's something, like, crazy and violent that happens on the field.

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Like You need a Miles Garrett.

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You need a Miles Garrett. You need a malice at the Palace. You need a fight between the 2 teams. Pepper spray. We don't root yeah.

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Pepper spray would be great. We don't root for injuries, but seeing how they would deal with, like, Homer Simpson having a a compound fracture.

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DeMar Hamlin? Yeah. DeMar

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Hamlin. Any game?

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Pray pray pray prayers for Moe Szyslak? Yeah.

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In the South Park game that they do, when they substitute Kenny in for DeMar Hamlin Yeah. You know something bad about that.

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It's gonna get really bad. What were you gonna say, Max? Did you try to watch it?

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I did. Some of the plays, you couldn't even see what was going on.

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I know.

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Like, the the camera angles were crazy. They they did 1, like, drone view that was literally looked like you're watching from outer space. You couldn't see a single thing that was

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Yeah.

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I think that happens when something goes wrong with the technology, and they have, like, the far end zone camera where you can't see anything.

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Yeah. I

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think that's what that was. But, yeah, there were a few of those in the first half.

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They need to sack up and just do it with no like, that's just the main broadcast.

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Yeah. Where it's like, this is the only way you can watch football tonight. I I I actually would respect that because you wouldn't know there was a delay. Gotcha. That would be it.

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Have Joe Buck and Troy Aikman seriously calling the game. Yeah.

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That was so fun. Oh, I

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mean, no. They gotta get Al Michaels doing that game.

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Yeah. Sweet. So, Max, you watch? You're you're a Monday night guy.

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I watched some of it. Okay.

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What'd you think?

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I didn't like it.

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Okay. That was that was

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the review.

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Take. Put put put it out there. That's the review. Okay. So just to clean up on week 14, it does feel we're we're down the homestretch.

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Everyone's done with their buys. Everyone's ready to go 4 games left. It feels like the playoff picture is pretty clear in that we know there's, like, a handful of teams that are still in it, and there's, the in the hunt stuff is they gotta clean it up at this point because I think I mean, the cowboys, the Bears being

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Those are patriots graphic.

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Were were they were in the hunt? Yes. They have they've been eliminated now.

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That's that's patronizing. Yeah.

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That's unbelievable.

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But, technically, in the NFC, I think I think 15 out of the 16 teams are still not eliminated, which is can we just we need a a different elimination tag where it's like you're you're not technically eliminated, but, dude, get get a fucking grip. Yeah. Code blue. Every everyone from the saints on down. Saints, cowboys, bears, panthers, just just be like, hey.

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I know technically not, but you're you're brain dead if you're actually thinking this.

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The panthers still being in the hunt is just wild.

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No 1 wants to play them.

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No 1 wants to play Panthers right now.

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No 1 wants to play them. Well, that's because the NFC South is always the NFC South keeps everyone in the hunt for as long as possible.

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Yeah. That that in the hunt graphic, man. I used to love that in the hunt graphic until I realized what it was doing to me.

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Yeah. Now you're now you're now you're out of the in the hunt. You're

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I'm eating.

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You're in it. You're in the you're in it.

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For now. All the way in it. Base bet.

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So there was 1 thing story we should probably talk about NFL before we talk a little college football. What what's this gonna be? This is gonna be Brandon Graham Mhmm. From the Philadelphia Eagles going on a radio show, on Monday and essentially saying that Jalen Hurts and AJ Brown don't fuck with each other. They don't like each other.

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They're not friends. No. They used to fuck with each

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other. Used to be friends. They used to be friends.

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Ain't friends anymore. And now they're now they're just teammates.

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That's not

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what he said.

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In paradise. Is that

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what he said?

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What did he say?

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He said that they used to be friends before being teammates. They were friends before the, like, the draft. And then when you become teammates, things can get a little bit dicey. And he made assumptions after watching that video without knowing anything, and that's what he said after the fact that no 1 else is picking up on that on that part of his statement.

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Oh, you're saying no one's picking up on the the part of the statement where after he said what he said and everyone was like, oh, this sounds bad, he then did a retraction. We shouldn't we shouldn't note that retraction where he was like

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Yeah.

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Oh, I stepped in it. I maybe shouldn't have said this?

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No. He was just making assumptions. He doesn't know anything, and he was just making assumptions just like everyone else was watching the video.

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So so Brandon Graham watching he doesn't have any further context to this than you or I would have watching the Eagles play on television.

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Nope. He's just a fan. That's what he said.

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It was great too because then t o got involved with Donovan McNamara. Yeah. Yeah. He's just like peak Philadelphia.

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Yeah. Say it to me to my face. Don't say it through the media.

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We actually should just play the the video I sent you, Max, now. I don't know if you guys saw this, but this is I I actually think that this might might be a sign that the eagles are ready to go on a Super Bowl run because they're, what, 11 and 2, and they've won how many games in a row, Max? 8 games in a row, 9 games in

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a row?

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9 games in a row.

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9 games in a row. Everything's going well. They now have, players talking about players old players talking about old players, and this was this was after I think this is a crossing broad guys. They did a good job with this.

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Pagan. He's a good he does a good job.

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Yeah. So shout out to him. Great video. This is after the Eagles have won their 9th game in a row. He interviewed people coming out of the link.

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And this is I saw this video, and I was like, this could not sum up the Philadelphia Eagle fan base more, and I wouldn't have it any other way. So go ahead. Play the video.

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Carolina Panthers suck. I don't know why we're struggling with Carolina. They suck. They want 2 in 15 months. Suck.

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Push in a fucking kill deck. That's like Hulu we won.

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Whoo. Jalen Hertz is not the answer.

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That sounds like Max.

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We have a number 1 defense running back. Jalen Hurts is not the answer.

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I would never say that.

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Time win. Harst balling out. Psych.

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He didn't do anything.

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Maybe he's

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getting a quarterback.

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Maybe he

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drafts

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like Jackson Dart Miller.

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Oh, it's Brown not getting enough touches. Like, clue EJ Brown, man. I would not let Nick Suriari come to the game within the first half because then he couldn't call the first set of plays. He can let Callen Moore just run Saquon Barkley the entire time, and we would win the game within the first half. We gotta run the ball.

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I don't know what we're doing. Why second of what? Run the freaking football.

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What

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would you do differently if you coach?

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I would give Saquon the ball every time, and I would pass AJ Brown when he opens.

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Is that easy mixarianni?

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The Eagles should've won by more. I'm disappointed.

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12 and

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a half point favorites? You gotta smack

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these dudes.

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They're just jerking around. Jerking around. Jerking around. Stop jerking around. And beat the teams you need to beat.

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Still Super Bowl hooves? Oh, absolutely. At the end of the day, they're all fucking delusional.

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We go to the ball. Big picture, sweet.

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Go birds, baby.

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Never in doubt.

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Miss, it's

[00:17:11]

hard to win in this league. True or false?

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So true. It's hard to win in this league. True or false?

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It's true. But a win

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is a win, isn't it?

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Win's always a win.

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It's the last night of the eras tour, so I'm looking forward to getting home and live streaming that. But the birds are great. Go birds, Taylors and Eagles fan. Go birds.

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I mean, that's just there are 9 wins. Could you imagine what I'd be saying if I was an 11 and 2 team, if the birds were 11 and 2 and 9 wins in a row? Like, having people be like, yeah. Jalen Hurts is not the guy. We need Jalen Milrow or Jackson.

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Jackson Dart was a great 1. Yeah. That's suck. Max, as a as an Eagles fan, what would your reaction be if the Eagles team booed you guys? Oh, reverse might need to turn it around.

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Yeah. Well, I mean, that that would just turn into a disaster.

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It'd be a boo off.

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In theory in theory, I would appreciate it, and I would understand it. Yeah. But in reality, it would be a disaster. I don't know. People would get showing I mean, it would basically, like, when Nick Sirianni started yelling at the fans.

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But it might it might end up, like, resulting in good things. No. We can go Philly story of all time. Like, the Eagles start booing you guys, you boo them back, and then they just don't stop winning.

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No. No. No. Because then that would be civil war. You can't have civil you can't have civil war.

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Divided. Yeah. It it has to be a 1 way street. I'm sorry. It has to be a 1 way street.

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So what what's the official statement on, on AJ Brown and Jalen Hurts not getting along?

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Not being

[00:18:42]

friends at all? Good question.

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They are friends.

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No. They used to be friends.

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They used

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to be friends. They if

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I were

[00:18:49]

to say, hey. Big Cat and I used to be friends, then I've started doing the podcast, and it would be like, that doesn't sound good. Beams just started looking for a job.

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Yeah. Everyone would be like, what do you mean used to be friends? You don't say used to be friends for someone that you're friends with.

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No. They it just means that they were friends before they were teammates, and the and the it got lost in translation.

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Mitch had had they do saying, like, I used to do drugs. I still do them, but I used to also.

[00:19:11]

Yeah. No. You used to be friends is not a good thing to say about someone.

[00:19:16]

Like, I used to date this chick. Would you say that about your girlfriend?

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They literally did this handshake last week. They did they did the the Fresh Prince handshake.

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Oh, wow. Okay. So, like,

[00:19:26]

they had a bad week. Sometimes sometimes memes comes into the office on a on a day of work and wants to kill PFT.

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Mhmm. They're coworkers, not friends.

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They're also

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But wait. And, also, memes and and PFT definitely used to be friends. Friends. Yeah. Like, you could absolutely say that about that.

[00:19:43]

We used

[00:19:44]

to be friends before the lottery. Yeah.

[00:19:45]

Yeah. No. And then, you know, sometimes in the in, like, the workplace, things get heated.

[00:19:51]

Mhmm. At some point, we

[00:19:52]

might be But

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at the

[00:19:52]

at the end of

[00:19:52]

the day. Still friends.

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I don't know about PFT.

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We might be friends again at some point. Yeah. That's up to memes.

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It was just very funny, like, the whole, like, t o then going after time.

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The t o thing was crazy. Do we read the t o tweet?

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No. Find it. It it's just oh, you guys are 11 and 2.

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I know. I know. It's I don't know. Philly Media

[00:20:13]

Tough place to play.

[00:20:14]

It's a tough place to play.

[00:20:16]

That was just the

[00:20:17]

fans. That wasn't really the media.

[00:20:19]

Tough place Brandon

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Graham literally went on Oh, I thought Philly Sports Talk radio.

[00:20:23]

Yeah. So why did that's the other thing. Like, if you're Brandon Graham, you probably know that there's certain things that you shouldn't say because it will cause a shit storm in Philly, and he went ahead and said them anyways. That that's what tells me that there might be something to it.

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Wait. What do you think would cause a shit storm? Saying, like, Jalen Hertz and AJ Brown used to be friends? Yeah. Oh.

[00:20:44]

Whatever.

[00:20:45]

Alright. Tio said, so Don McNabb on AJ Brown's, potential frustrations. He said with Jalen Hurts, it's 2 grown men. If you go got an issue, you come to me. Let's not go through the media because now it blows up.

[00:21:00]

And now what you said is out there in front of everybody. And then t o then came over the top and said, now this is interesting is coming from you. Not how I interpret it, but funny thing is I agree with you on the idea if you have an issue with someone that you go to them and not the media. But here's the thing, I never had an issue with you, but it's known that you had an issue with me. So maybe you should've taken your advice here.

[00:21:24]

Oh, yeah. And we might have won Super Bowl 39, but that's another story for another day. Just my 2¢. You gave yours. I'm giving mine.

[00:21:33]

Hey, Freddie Mitchell. Thanks for sharing.

[00:21:35]

That's my favorite part. He's absolutely nuts. Saying, like, yeah. Freddie Mitchell texted this to me, so I had to speak on it. And then Fred x is the first reply saying popcorn activated.

[00:21:45]

No. Debbie, there's no place like Philly. It's just so funny. You just can't even you you got you got you got simultaneously, simultaneous wide receiver QB beefs going on. Old ones and new ones.

[00:21:59]

You're basically like, hey. This this summer, we're gonna do top gun and top gun 2. We're gonna play it in the same theater. That's what you guys are doing

[00:22:05]

right now. But that was real beef. T. Owen McNabb was real beef. AJ Brown and Jalen Hurts is not real beef.

[00:22:12]

Like At the time, though, do you think people were saying that's real beef?

[00:22:17]

Maybe. A also AJ Brown just has to be in the touchdown score this week.

[00:22:22]

Oh, okay. That's conviction.

[00:22:24]

Has to be in the touchdown score. That, like, you know that they're gonna find a way to feed them the ball.

[00:22:29]

I agree. I agree. I agree. Hank, are you loving this? Oh, yeah.

[00:22:35]

What are your thoughts, Hank?

[00:22:36]

I mean, that's Boston was kinda the same way. Like, it's just kinda good sports town, degenerate sports town, angry sports town. Yeah.

[00:22:44]

Used to be beef.

[00:22:46]

Yeah. Like, there's just never Used

[00:22:47]

to be friends.

[00:22:48]

You're never you're never gonna be happy.

[00:22:49]

Tom Brady also wasn't best friends with all his receivers.

[00:22:52]

Although, him and Julian I don't wanna say that. Him and Julian drove to practice together, like, every day.

[00:22:56]

But He literally

[00:22:57]

let Antonio Brown live in his house.

[00:22:59]

Yeah. Good boy.

[00:23:00]

Not all of them.

[00:23:03]

Alright. I think he I think he was.

[00:23:04]

Yeah. Pretty much everyone except what? Like, Aaron Hernandez?

[00:23:07]

Yep. Aaron Hernandez was a great player for the Patriots.

[00:23:11]

And they used to be friends, probably.

[00:23:13]

Yeah.

[00:23:14]

Yeah. And then what happened? Okay. Anything else from week 14? I'm excited for some for for the stretch run of football.

[00:23:24]

Yeah. I'm ready to go. I'm ready for playoffs. I was saying that on Sunday nights. Like, we're at the point of the season where there's a lot of games that just mean nothing, and I want playoff football here.

[00:23:35]

I'm ready to get the playoff. I'm ready to get the tournament started.

[00:23:37]

It's the best, and the playoff simulator is really rounding to form now. When when they put it out, like, week 12, there's too many things that you have to click to get your scenarios going.

[00:23:46]

So it it I I know you're a big playoff simulator guy. How many games do you have to win to feel very safe? 2?

[00:23:53]

I think 3.

[00:23:54]

I feel like you guys if you won 2, you should be

[00:23:56]

I'm afraid I'm afraid of the Rams slash Seahawks.

[00:24:01]

But they all have to play each other too.

[00:24:02]

I know. But I I I would feel comfortable if we won 3.

[00:24:05]

And you have saints?

[00:24:07]

We got saints. Ben DeNucci just signed

[00:24:09]

Okay.

[00:24:10]

For the Saints. So I'm gonna have to kill him. Then we've got, Eagles? Eagles, Falcons, Cowboys. I think he

[00:24:19]

gets 2 wins. Yep. I think 3, but I think he'll be okay with 2.

[00:24:24]

Saints is a must win.

[00:24:25]

Saints is a must win. Saints is a must win.

[00:24:27]

Must win this weekend.

[00:24:28]

Marshawn Lattimore revenge game. Yeah. Because you don't wanna come down to the last 3 with the Eagles, Falcons, and Cowboys.

[00:24:34]

And the Falcons are fighting for that that game.

[00:24:37]

Yeah. Although they might not be at that point.

[00:24:39]

Hank, how how many games do we need to win for you to feel, very scared about your bet?

[00:24:46]

If you beat the Saints, it's pretty much over.

[00:24:49]

Oh, so you they're just 1 win according to your calculations.

[00:24:53]

We get in with 9 wins?

[00:24:55]

No. But I don't think you're gonna lose 3 straight. They literally just did. I

[00:25:00]

hope not. Right? Yeah. Well, that was that was a hard schedule.

[00:25:04]

That was a hard schedule. I think they're I think 2 I think if you get 2 wins, it's gonna be hard. Because if you get 2 wins, the the Rams will have to run the table essentially. Yeah. So

[00:25:18]

I would feel I would feel great with 3 wins.

[00:25:20]

Yeah. Yeah. If you win if you're in 3, then they actually do have to run the table. They have to win all 3 all 4 games. Okay.

[00:25:27]

Let's do a little college football, then we'll get to hot sea cool throne. We're brought to you by our friends at Diamonds Direct. Alright, guys. Listen up. This year, you stop procrastinating on that holiday shopping list.

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Get it done, and your significant other will love it. We also brought to you, by ourselves. Pardon my cheesesteak. Football is in full gear. Order pardon my cheesesteak now for your game day meal or late night eats and the best play call you can make with classic cheesesteaks, chipotle cheesesteaks, chicken cheesesteaks, buffalo chicken cheesesteaks, and many, many more.

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[00:27:03]

We have our Heisman finalists, Ash and Genti, Boise State, Cam Ward, Miami, Dylan Gabriel, Oregon, I think, Voting has already been done, so we don't

[00:27:14]

even have to say

[00:27:15]

anything. Yeah. So 1 guy I would've liked to see is Cam Scataboe.

[00:27:19]

Yep. He would've been a nice addition to that group. But

[00:27:21]

besides that, I

[00:27:22]

think those are are 4 worthy guys.

[00:27:26]

I think Shador might have had a case. Yeah. But yeah. I mean, it's those are those are the 4 that I kind of expected. Mhmm.

[00:27:34]

It was funny. The graphic that they put out there had, Cam Ward listed as 42,000 yards.

[00:27:41]

That would be a record.

[00:27:42]

That would be very hard to to to to beat.

[00:27:44]

I know his defense is bad, but

[00:27:46]

I mean, 42,000 yards.

[00:27:48]

Now Cam Ward did have an outstanding season. Yeah. And and the defense was a a huge liability for him. So some of those wins that were, like, you know, down to the wire where it could've gone either way, that's all because Cam Ward was so good throughout those entire games.

[00:28:01]

Yes. So, we'll find out on Saturday night who wins the Heisman. But, yeah, they're all all are incredible, college football players, all worthy of the award, all deserving of the award.

[00:28:13]

If it were up to me, I would split it. Yeah. I think it would be a 4 way tie if it were up to me.

[00:28:18]

Honestly, with the votes already being in, I'll say it right now. If I had to vote today after the votes are in, I'd probably vote Ash and Gente.

[00:28:24]

I go Cam Ward. But, yeah, Gente Cam Ward, Gente Yeah. And then I go 100 third.

[00:28:28]

But the votes are already in. Yep. So there's nothing that could be done at this point. They're already in. When you

[00:28:32]

fill out a Heisman vote, is that done all online? I don't know, actually.

[00:28:37]

I feel like that Heisman's 1 of those awards. They make you mail a mail.

[00:28:40]

Mailing ballots? Yeah. That's an issue for me.

[00:28:42]

Yeah. No. It might be online. Verification. Yeah.

[00:28:45]

It might be online. But so we have the college football playoff. We have all the bowls. We talked about it briefly on on Sunday. But, the more I think about it, the more they really I'm not mad, but it's so clear they need to figure out how to fix this so that, the buy system is makes more sense.

[00:29:03]

Yeah. They they wanted to put a big emphasis on winning your conference, which I understand. Well, I get it. And with the with the idea that traditionally in the past, there have been 4 conferences that had elite teams that ended up winning those.

[00:29:15]

Right.

[00:29:16]

But they didn't think about the scenario where it's like, okay, if we if we have Boise State, they get to buy, how would that impact the rest of the schedule?

[00:29:24]

Right. And I get it too because it's a moneymaker and that's all that it matters. They didn't wanna, you know, devalue the conference championships, which there was still an incredible Saturday and obviously, Clemson getting hitting a walk off, field goal to get in was awesome. Get rid of the conference championships. If you're gonna do it this way, get rid of the conference championships and just have the playoffs start that weekend.

[00:29:46]

Yeah. Like, have it be the 1st weekend of December, have it be 16 teams or whatever it is, 14 teams, have the 1st round be that weekend,

[00:29:54]

and let's just get it going. The committee kinda boxed themselves in by talking about conference championships not being a factor in eliminating a team. Right. If SMU had gotten blown out

[00:30:03]

Right.

[00:30:03]

Do you think that they would have been out? I do. I think they probably would have been too if it was, like, a 30 point loss.

[00:30:08]

Yeah.

[00:30:09]

I think it's a liability for teams. Yeah. So, yeah, I don't know. They'll they'll probably never get rid of the conference championships just because, you're right, it makes a lot of money.

[00:30:17]

It makes a lot of money, but I think it would I think it would if you expand the playoff, then you get the money there. Yeah.

[00:30:23]

I mean, the way that

[00:30:23]

they 64 teams.

[00:30:25]

Top 4 teams. Not 64 teams.

[00:30:26]

Top 4 teams get a buy.

[00:30:28]

Top 4 teams should get a buy because as it stands right now, and I Boise's good. I think Boise could beat anyone. I think Arizona State could beat anyone. We're gonna talk to Kenny Dillingham in a minute. But it just it's when I look at the bracket, the thing that keeps sticking out is, like, Oregon had by far and away the best season in college football.

[00:30:47]

They did not lose a game. They played in a power 5 con power 4 conference. They got tested, in big time games, and they passed every test. And they are the 1 seed rightfully so, and their matchup potentially is gonna be Ohio State or Tennessee in the first round, which that doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

[00:31:08]

No. It doesn't. It doesn't. It did it ended up rewarding Penn State for losing championship game.

[00:31:13]

Yeah. And and and by the way, Penn State and Notre Dame in that bottom part of the bracket with Georgia now having Carson Beck out probably for the rest of the year, that's they're live. Mhmm.

[00:31:25]

Those teams are live. Where's Penn State now at 650?

[00:31:30]

That was on Sunday. I can look at. I might have

[00:31:33]

There's live as live could be.

[00:31:34]

Might have to wet the beak on that.

[00:31:36]

But it's big game James, and he can't win a big game.

[00:31:39]

That's fair.

[00:31:40]

Yeah. He's he's, what, o and 12, I think, for his top 5 teams.

[00:31:45]

1 thing that I've really loved, though, is, is the crying about out of conference scheduling that's happened. Happened. Yes. And it's been it's been continuing.

[00:31:52]

He beat Ohio State once.

[00:31:54]

He did beat Ohio State once, but were they

[00:31:55]

ranked block

[00:31:56]

field goal.

[00:31:56]

Were they ranked top 5?

[00:31:58]

I believe so.

[00:32:01]

Double check that.

[00:32:02]

Does this count as big game, Max?

[00:32:08]

Penn State, Ohio State. SMU?

[00:32:11]

Yeah. Does Penn State SMU count as a big game?

[00:32:15]

I would say No. Yeah. Penn State upset's number 2 Ohio.

[00:32:19]

Okay. So he's 1 1. He's 1 1. No. I would say I think I think he's he's safe.

[00:32:26]

SMU doesn't count as a big game.

[00:32:27]

Not a big game Yeah.

[00:32:28]

For Penn State.

[00:32:29]

It's it's a big game.

[00:32:31]

Oh, it is a big game. That's bad.

[00:32:35]

I don't know.

[00:32:36]

No. I I don't think it's a big game.

[00:32:37]

But then you're not looking at it then you're not look look taking the game seriously, and you gotta take the game seriously. It's a big No.

[00:32:42]

I think you gotta take the game not seriously.

[00:32:44]

Big game, then big game James.

[00:32:45]

True. Are they allowed to do a whiteout?

[00:32:47]

They are doing a whiteout.

[00:32:49]

Oh, is it noon? It's 10 noon. Love it.

[00:32:52]

I I love this conversation because we're essentially having the can't win or can't lose must win conversation just in completely different terms.

[00:32:59]

Yes. Yes.

[00:33:00]

You gotta figure out if it's a big game, though, prior to kickoff.

[00:33:03]

But I don't know. You don't want it to be a big game. Right?

[00:33:06]

No. You don't want it to be a big game.

[00:33:07]

So yeah. No.

[00:33:08]

Yeah. You you want SMU to come out in, Purdue's uniforms?

[00:33:12]

I mean, SMU, it's gonna be, like, 15 degrees in State College.

[00:33:16]

Oh, wow. Yeah. That's big.

[00:33:18]

I mean, that's big.

[00:33:19]

Not sure for that weather. They're Not not built. But, yeah, the

[00:33:21]

the crying about about out of conference scheduling from the SEC has been very funny because I don't think any of these coaches have realized that if you don't schedule good out of conference teams, guess what? That means that there's going to be other teams from other conferences

[00:33:35]

that don't have SEC out of conference games on

[00:33:35]

their conferences that don't have SEC out of conference games on their schedule. Right. Right. And going back to, like,

[00:33:40]

Alabama's schedule, you lost

[00:33:42]

to Vanderbilt Mhmm. In your conference. You lost Oklahoma

[00:33:46]

in your conference. So that's

[00:33:46]

not really what it gets down to, but it's driving it's driving people insane. There was a an op ed that was written in, al.com, alabama.com. And it was, should Alabama join the ACC? Oh. Let's have the conversation.

[00:34:07]

I had I I I like this because I had, someone replying to me the other day that said that LSU should just join the Sun Belt. Yeah. So same feeling. Yeah.

[00:34:14]

Yeah. So if if LSU joined the Sun Belt, they would probably win the Sun Belt. Well, Well, maybe not. Bryan Cali

[00:34:20]

would find a way to lose. Yeah.

[00:34:21]

But if Alabama joined the ACC, he would probably win the s the ACC Mhmm. And then, ensure himself of a buy in in the, college football playoff. This person says if South Carolina had been the ACC, would have made the playoffs this year. If Alabama had been in the big 12, they would have been in as well. The same would have been true for Mississippi if they had been in the mountain west.

[00:34:42]

Mhmm. That would be an interesting 1. Yeah. If move Mississippi out to the mountain west. Why go through the meat grinder that is the SEC every week when you can cruise to an automatic bid in to the CFP and any of the other cupcake conferences?

[00:34:55]

The bottom line, and it's an ugly truth to be sure, is that the other conferences outside the SCC and Big 10 are no longer viable as they exist today. The Pac 12 teams figured this out pretty quickly and bolted for the big 10 where Oregon is currently the number 1 team in the country. I like that take that that, the Oregon going to the big 10 Yeah. Is equivalent to Alabama going to the ACC.

[00:35:17]

ACC. Yeah. I mean, it's first of all, I I think the SEC was just not as good this year, and we're we're going off of old SEC. Like, they they're still probably the best conference, but it wasn't like, elite elite to that level. I think

[00:35:31]

they're the deepest conference. Yeah.

[00:35:32]

And but you Alabama was a 18 point favorite against Vanderbilt. They were 21 point favorite against Oklahoma. Like, they they were a flawed football team. I don't know any real Alabama fan could straight face. Like, there's a difference between saying, you wanna be in because it's the team you root for, and you think you might be better than SMU, and I can buy that argument.

[00:35:53]

But you can't sit there and be like, we were not a flawed football team because they were. They that's just what happened during the season. I also think, weirdly, the the entire backlash to, like, net we'll never schedule a strong out of conferencing. Obviously, Wisconsin was down this year. But, like, if Alabama had, let's just say, played Oregon week 1 and beaten them, they might have been in with 3 SEC losses because everyone been like, holy shit.

[00:36:18]

Mhmm. They beat the number 1 tee. You know, like, they they they're out of conference. They they went and proved another 1.

[00:36:23]

But let's just say it was an up year for Wisconsin. Right? 1 of 1 of your good seasons. If you didn't have that game scheduled against Alabama and you had just steamrolled a weaker big 10 schedule if

[00:36:34]

you

[00:36:34]

bounced your way, then that would actually favor you and not the SEC. Right. Because it would mean that you would have 1 less hard game to play.

[00:36:41]

Right. Right. Which I would have been yeah. Right. It would have been, like, Indiana didn't play an SEC team.

[00:36:46]

Right. And they they're in. And they're in.

[00:36:48]

And if

[00:36:48]

they maybe played an SEC team, they would have been out, and Alabama would have been in.

[00:36:52]

And then in the future, if all these SEC athletic directors are like, we're not gonna schedule hard games, like, against Indiana out of conference because there's no there's no reason for us to do that, no benefit, then you might wind up in a scenario where Indiana gets a playoff spot because you didn't schedule them.

[00:37:06]

Right. If Indiana had played South Carolina week 2 Yeah. And lost to South Carolina, Alabama would probably be in.

[00:37:13]

Yeah. See how this works? Yeah. It's like a giant ecosystem.

[00:37:16]

Yeah. Yeah. It is very funny. We also, do are you gonna do Bill Belichick for your hot seat cool throw? Or we wanna talk about it?

[00:37:22]

Because he looks like talk about it.

[00:37:23]

It looks like he's gonna take the North Carolina job Yeah. Which I think he's gonna be successful. And I know that this is probably just because he gave his, pitch on McAfee show on Monday, and I am a sucker for a good pitch. But he essentially was like, we're gonna be an NFL factory where we're just gonna train guys to get to the NFL.

[00:37:42]

He had a 400 page document. A manifesto. A Bible. That's a manifesto. Yeah.

[00:37:46]

Manifesto's work in college football.

[00:37:48]

Yeah. Manifesto's hot right now.

[00:37:50]

Yeah. It is. Very hot. So I I don't know because he's he's on the older side for sure. I don't know how he'll do in terms of recruiting.

[00:37:57]

There's a lot more that goes into it. Once the players get in the door, then I'm sure that he'll be fine.

[00:38:03]

He'll be good.

[00:38:03]

You assume because he kinda went in with the clause that his son gets to take over when he stops that his son will probably do a lot of the recruiting.

[00:38:10]

Right. And I I I really do think that if you are matter of fact

[00:38:14]

He's gonna be the closer. Yeah.

[00:38:15]

If you're a matter of fact to these, both transfer kids and like, I think he'll crush in the transfer portal because if he just says, hey. I'm not gonna try to sell you on, like, this idea that we're gonna we're competing for national titles right away or do I'm gonna get you ready to play football at the National Football League level, and there's no 1 better that knows that than me. That's that's a lot of kids will probably buy in on that because they that's the goal. Like, college football is is is that's the goal now.

[00:38:46]

So Belichick making his son head coach in waiting. Hank, I know that you were a big fan when LeBron James got his son drafted by the Lakers.

[00:38:56]

No. But continue. Okay. So what what's what's the difference with this? Coaching is a lot different than playing.

[00:39:04]

Well, you have to

[00:39:04]

be yeah. You definitely have to be qualified Mhmm.

[00:39:06]

Which he is.

[00:39:07]

Has he been a head coach?

[00:39:10]

No. But he's worked his way up the ranks as any head coach that's ever head coached in the history of coaching has.

[00:39:15]

Where did he work his way up the ranks?

[00:39:18]

Right now he's working in Washington. He was, you know, special assistant, then he was, whatever, like, cornerbacks coach, then he was the coordinator. Like, he worked his way up Up to where was it? Position by position.

[00:39:28]

Where did he work his way up there?

[00:39:30]

In New England, but now he's coaching at Washington. Okay. Alright. It's just interesting. Good dad.

[00:39:36]

How many how many coaches, like, did Kyle is Kyle Shanahan? Did he work his way up the ranks? There's there's a million. Their football is, like, the most basketball is different. There's not a lot of examples of nepotism drafts.

[00:39:49]

There's a million examples of nepotism coaching.

[00:39:52]

He's doing a good job of arguing his point. That that that That was actually a really good job arguing your point.

[00:39:55]

That is that is a fair point.

[00:39:57]

Yeah. I would say

[00:39:58]

I would say good dad, though. I'm I was not trying to denigrate Steve.

[00:40:02]

I was saying Belichick. It sounds like you were, though.

[00:40:04]

Good dad.

[00:40:05]

No. Sounds like he does you don't think he

[00:40:06]

did. Yeah. Because it's it's a LeBron, Belichick, Joe Biden great fathers all hooking their sons up.

[00:40:13]

The point was, you know, nepotism shouldn't be able to work when you have to be skilled and and play the actual position. Like, I mean, Steve Kerr's son is a coach. What's his name again?

[00:40:24]

Nicholas.

[00:40:25]

Okay. Yeah. Nicholas Kerr. And, but he like, there's there's guys everywhere. Crazy.

[00:40:31]

It's crazy. It never it never stopped being crazy that he it did they have a conversation

[00:40:37]

at all?

[00:40:39]

Did they when they when they when they burned them, were they like, hey. Like, I know the the naming process. We had, like, a a group of, like, 3 or 4 names. Yeah. We went with the the names we went with.

[00:40:52]

But, like You

[00:40:53]

gotta have a

[00:40:53]

focus group. How did that not how did that pass?

[00:40:56]

When you're telling the person what name to put on the birth certificate.

[00:40:59]

Right. That's

[00:41:00]

that's when you realize.

[00:41:02]

Nicholas. It's Nicholas. But yeah. Hank, I'm really proud of you. Thank you.

[00:41:08]

You argued your point very well. I always do. PFT tried to get you and you didn't get God. No.

[00:41:12]

It never has. We're just having a conversation.

[00:41:14]

Just having a debate. This is how

[00:41:15]

we figure out what we truly believe in. It's the Socratic method.

[00:41:18]

Yeah. Yeah. Socrates. Who do you guys have winning the whole thing in the college football playoff? I got Penn State.

[00:41:24]

Penn State.

[00:41:26]

Penn State will lose to,

[00:41:32]

I guess, Oregon. In the final. Is that possible? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:41:37]

Yeah. No. That is impossible? Yeah. That is possible.

[00:41:39]

No. It is, but I don't know why everyone's picking Benton.

[00:41:42]

So Max would finish 2nd? Max's decision to say

[00:41:44]

it's losing in the championship.

[00:41:45]

I'm just gonna take Oregon.

[00:41:46]

Yeah. I mean, I said Oregon before the season started and Texas.

[00:41:51]

How are you not taking Texas? What do you mean? You are Texas. I'm not Texas. You are Texas.

[00:41:57]

Take Texas.

[00:41:58]

You love Texas.

[00:41:59]

Just take Texas.

[00:42:00]

I I love the city of Austin.

[00:42:02]

Just take Texas.

[00:42:03]

I'm not I'm not, like, a Longhorn fan. Just take Texas.

[00:42:06]

Closeted.

[00:42:07]

I'll take Texas.

[00:42:09]

Okay. I'm gonna I'm gonna take, I'm

[00:42:11]

gonna take You you've never had any bias towards Texas football.

[00:42:14]

I like going to the games, and I like tailgating and drinking beer.

[00:42:17]

That's a that's, like, enough of a reason for you to be not, like, a die hard fan.

[00:42:21]

But, like Yeah. Like, I you're biased. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:42:23]

Not biased. I'm okay.

[00:42:24]

I might be semi closet. I might be semi biased. When when people do horns down, it does not hurt me. It does not affect you.

[00:42:30]

So take Texas.

[00:42:31]

I'm gonna take, I'm gonna take Penn State. Okay.

[00:42:35]

So I have Oregon. You have Penn State. Max has Texas.

[00:42:39]

I've taken Arizona State

[00:42:40]

for it.

[00:42:41]

I love it. I want I don't think it works for college football, but it if it was hockey or college basketball, they're the hottest team. Make a run. Yeah. This is the first time there's ever been a a playoff where it is, like, you know, can a team go on a run?

[00:42:55]

So fuck it. Arizona State.

[00:42:57]

Okay. Make a run. Make a run.

[00:42:58]

Think it applies, but I hope it does.

[00:43:00]

Who cares?

[00:43:00]

I mean, the funniest outcome I still think would be Ohio State.

[00:43:03]

Yeah. For sure. I'm I'm just very interested to see. Like, I I I well, I feel like we'll know within the first half of that first quarter where it's like, are they just a completely dead team, or are they gonna go to the national champions? Mhmm.

[00:43:16]

Indiana would be funny too. Indiana would be great.

[00:43:19]

Indiana would be awesome. Alright. Let's do hot seat, cool throne, and then we'll get to our interviews. We have Steve Young and Arizona state head coach Kenny Dillingham. Hot seat, cool throne brought to you by our friends at Coors Light.

[00:43:31]

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Visit Coors Light.com/take or you can find it pretty much anywhere that sells beer. Celebrate responsibly Coors Brewing Company Golden, Colorado. Okay. Hank, hot seat, cool drum.

[00:44:24]

My hot seat I don't know why I wrote this in my notes. I just wrote fantasy. I don't know what that means.

[00:44:29]

Okay.

[00:44:30]

But the Yankees are also on the hot seat.

[00:44:32]

Oh, I had that.

[00:44:34]

The reason 1 of the reported reasons that he didn't sign with the Yankees is because they didn't offer him a suite for his family and that they once well, is that they kicked out someone from the the VIP lounge, like 1 of his cooks or assistants or something or a family member. Yeah. So the Yankees lost out on a generational talent just because they were disrespectful.

[00:44:53]

How are Yankees fans taking this?

[00:44:56]

They're lashing out.

[00:44:57]

They're it's it's 1 of those moments that we all do this as fans, but

[00:45:02]

when you're completely removed from it, it is so funny

[00:45:02]

to watch because I'm completely removed from it, it is so funny to watch because I've seen it all. Juan So to is a terrible defender. Juan So to is a liability. You're gonna have to move him to DH. He's not 26.

[00:45:13]

He's not 26. That he's gonna be 40 years old making all that money. Actually, it's good that the Yankees didn't get him because now they can use that money to fill a bunch of different holes.

[00:45:25]

Mhmm. That's my favorite 1.

[00:45:27]

It's the best. It's the best to watch because, again, we all do it. Every single time, you'd miss out on a free agent or a draft pick. You're like, I never wanted that guy. That guy stinks, but they just flipped so fast.

[00:45:39]

When it comes to doing the that now we can use all that money to fill these different holes. Yeah. You could've done that. There's no salary cap. Yeah.

[00:45:46]

You could've just gone ahead and spent money on top of money.

[00:45:49]

There also was 1 funny tweet that went semi viral that was made me laugh where someone's like, Juan So to chose, the bag over the over legacy. Yeah. A Yankees fan saying someone chose a

[00:46:00]

bag. Mhmm.

[00:46:01]

It's just it's great to watch, especially the fact that it was the Mets. Also, Hank, there was a report that, like, someone kicked, his family out of a they kicked him out of the sweep, but then also it was, like, batting practice or something. Like, basically Yeah.

[00:46:14]

Like, something in the tunnel or, like, they were they basically like, he had a family member just hanging out, and they were like, you can't be

[00:46:19]

here. Yeah. And then Steve Cohen threw in a suite for him.

[00:46:23]

Yeah. That's classic.

[00:46:23]

Family suite.

[00:46:24]

Cohen said that he he didn't think that he was gonna win either. He thought that he was gonna go to the Yankees until the very, very last second.

[00:46:30]

They had,

[00:46:31]

like, a last minute negotiation. But, yeah, Steven Coe, he wasn't gonna be outspent. No. And so for Yankees fans to be complaining that you can just buy a team now is it is delicious.

[00:46:40]

Yeah. Yeah. The yeah. The, Yankees wouldn't budge on giving Juan So to a sweet Yankee Stadium saying that if they don't do it for Derek Jeter, they're not gonna do it for him.

[00:46:48]

Yeah. They're probably like, well, who do you think is gonna pay for this giant celery to need to sell that sweet to somebody?

[00:46:53]

Right. Exactly. But, yeah. It's it's very funny watching the instant turn by Yankees fans being like, yeah. He actually is I saw 1 Yankee fan just posted all of his, like, fuck ups in right field.

[00:47:07]

Mhmm.

[00:47:07]

And they're like, this is we we didn't want this for the next 15

[00:47:11]

years.

[00:47:11]

Alright. So here here's a story. The Mets have excellent intelligence. They were aware that while So to liked being a Yankee and loved having Aaron Judge protect him in the lineup and lead them all in the clubhouse, he allegedly was upset early in year by an overzealous Yankees security guy who disallowed a family member and his chef slash driver from certain areas. Basically, Mark Wahlberg and,

[00:47:32]

other guys.

[00:47:33]

Yeah. Mhmm.

[00:47:34]

So it was a security guard's fault.

[00:47:36]

Yeah. Also, my other hot seat, NBA cup. I I have been trying not to get mad, but it's kind of bullshit that the Celtics went 31 and aren't in it.

[00:47:45]

Oh, but it's a

[00:47:47]

good thing you're not mad.

[00:47:48]

No. I'm not mad. I will be watching and and betting on it, but it's it is slightly triggering.

[00:47:54]

Yeah. I'm the worst NBA cup gambler of all time. And PFT is p f you you should be the data. I think You should be the data. I

[00:48:02]

think if you're fired break it down, I literally might be the best NBA cup gambler of all time in the history of the world as of right now.

[00:48:10]

As of right now. Yeah. And go check out our picks. We have them on our socials. So follow PFT.

[00:48:16]

Hank, your cool throw.

[00:48:18]

My cool throw is Deshaun Watson. Oh. 0, what's going on? He just posted an Instagram story of him and his girlfriend having a nice looks like they're on a beach, beachside dinner, romantic, classy. Looks like he's, you know, living his best life.

[00:48:32]

Like, good

[00:48:33]

for him.

[00:48:33]

Or is

[00:48:33]

he he's I think it

[00:48:35]

was the ocean. Although, sometimes I think Lake Michigan's the ocean, but it looked like the ocean.

[00:48:39]

I'm gonna guess it wasn't Lake Erie in Cleveland in December.

[00:48:42]

No. And when I say good for him, I mean, I don't care. I hate him.

[00:48:46]

Yeah. He he doesn't seem to care. He's chilling.

[00:48:48]

Yeah. No. He he I saw that. Pasta didn't look that that great. No?

[00:48:55]

No. It looked like just regular like, it didn't look that fancy.

[00:48:58]

Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, he's still got a shitload

[00:49:01]

of money. And a shitload of lawsuits to settle.

[00:49:04]

I think he might have settled all of them.

[00:49:06]

Oh, he did?

[00:49:06]

I think so.

[00:49:07]

There's not any new ones?

[00:49:08]

Not yet. Let give Tony Busby, like, a week.

[00:49:11]

I think it was I think it was basically like a salamander's tail where just 1 would fall off and another 1 would grow on. Grow back? Yeah. Alright. So cool throwing Deshaun Watson.

[00:49:20]

You're a big Deshaun Watson fan.

[00:49:21]

No. But he's on the cool like, he's chilling. He's chilling.

[00:49:24]

He is chilling. He is chilling.

[00:49:26]

That's that's Hank's dream life is being Deshaun Watson.

[00:49:28]

No. Nope. Never said that.

[00:49:31]

PFT, you're hot seat. Cool.

[00:49:32]

My hot seat is reality. Oh. Did you guys see the story about the new supercomputer that just came out? No. Alright.

[00:49:39]

So Google just announced this yesterday. They've invented a new computer. They have a new quantum computing chip. They named it Willow. And it's capable of performing this, like, specific computer computing challenge in less than 5 minutes.

[00:49:54]

Okay.

[00:49:54]

You might be like, okay, 5 what does that even mean? Well, Google says that 1 of the world's current fastest supercomputers would take 10 septillion years to complete that same challenge that Google's chip did in less than 5 minutes. 10 septillion is longer than the age of the universe. Holy shit. So it has this chip that is, like, the next step in quantum computing.

[00:50:18]

Septillion? Septillion. It's a real number.

[00:50:20]

The chip

[00:50:20]

breaks my brain.

[00:50:21]

How many trillions are in a septillion?

[00:50:24]

I don't know. I'm was that 70 I don't know. No idea. These numbers are are impossible to even think about. That's how big they are.

[00:50:32]

So Google infinity bigger than that? Is Google bigger than that? No. Infinity. Infinity is bigger than that.

[00:50:39]

Yeah. I think we're very close

[00:50:42]

to just the world ending. So yeah. Oh, like, the AI supercomputers catching up and then just taking over. So So that's what

[00:50:49]

they talked about. They actually said that, what they're starting to believe now and the fact that they've invented a chip that's this fast, it actually lends credence to the the theory that we are living in 1 of an infinite number of computer simulations right now. And once we reach that singularity where we have, like, crazy quantum computing, then we just start developing more and more universes out of that. Ah. So this might not be real.

[00:51:15]

Holy shit. This podcast might not be real.

[00:51:17]

Wow. Nothing's real.

[00:51:20]

Yeah. Except how bad Spotify is with their interview wrapped.

[00:51:24]

And AJ Brown and Joan Hertz

[00:51:26]

That's a real

[00:51:27]

used used to be being friends.

[00:51:29]

In a different maybe in a different universe.

[00:51:31]

Yeah.

[00:51:32]

They were friends at 1 point.

[00:51:33]

Yeah.

[00:51:34]

My cool throne is shooting your shot. Okay? Friend of the program, Ryan Russillo

[00:51:40]

Mhmm.

[00:51:40]

Went on a podcast and, and discussed an event that he was at several years ago. Mhmm. It was a, a celebrity football game, and it was with the Sports Illustrated swimsuit models. And he talked about the fact that there were all these swimsuit models there. There was 1 girl that was there that was not getting as much attention as the swimsuit model that he felt to be more attainable.

[00:52:02]

Mhmm.

[00:52:02]

That woman was Meghan Markle.

[00:52:04]

Mhmm.

[00:52:05]

And he, shot a shot. Mhmm. He DM'd her. In the picture that that Ryan put up, she looks like she's having a good time. Body language experts.

[00:52:13]

Yeah. Pretty decent green line test right there,

[00:52:16]

I would say. Ryan looks strong.

[00:52:18]

He looks very got a lot of hair.

[00:52:20]

But the hair

[00:52:20]

is the I think

[00:52:21]

that he

[00:52:21]

was bald or so low that it goes differently.

[00:52:23]

But Meghan's Markle's short enough that I don't think she she saw

[00:52:27]

that, you know, he's wearing a bald yarmulke. Well, she does love hairy guys. True. Fact. So, Ryan slid into her DMs and was like, hey.

[00:52:40]

Do you wanna come on my podcast? Mhmm. But in, like,

[00:52:43]

a

[00:52:43]

a flirtatious manner

[00:52:44]

Yeah.

[00:52:45]

And talk football. And she was like, I'm not that big of a sports fan. Well, I think he was like, you wanna come on my podcast and promote your show that's coming out? Yeah. She was like, I don't know sports.

[00:52:52]

And that's how it ended. But then page 6 got their grubby hands on the story, and they put up such an unflattering picture of Versilo. And the headline was, like, former ESPN, podcast host thought that Meghan Markle was attainable. And that picture actually in that headline, not that bad. The picture they used in the story.

[00:53:13]

Yeah. That's that's a bad 1.

[00:53:14]

So it makes it look like

[00:53:15]

I know which 1 they use. They use that 1 every time.

[00:53:18]

Yeah. Makes it look like Ryan thought that Meghan Markle was, like, a super attainable, like, beneath him

[00:53:25]

Yeah. They put that back side by side. I Russell also has told this story, like, a 1000000 times, and I it's funny that it just got picked up. And they did this. Oh, that's the picture.

[00:53:34]

That's the picture right there. That's bullshit. Yeah. Page 6. Fuck you.

[00:53:37]

So they they wrote this article just to put this picture of Ryan up and be like, this guy thought this chick was attainable.

[00:53:44]

Yeah. Then it got community noted. Do you see that?

[00:53:46]

That was yeah. That had to be Russillo.

[00:53:48]

He will. I mean, the Russillo army said Ryan Russillo has said multiple times that this is a joke and never asked Markle out. Yeah. Because he he has told the story before, but, yeah, that's so funny.

[00:53:56]

He invited her on the podcast Yeah. To promote her show. What a good guy.

[00:54:00]

Oh my god. I've heard you. That date Russell is hotter than Meghan Markle. I'll say it. I I think that He is.

[00:54:08]

I think she might be attainable for Ryan right now.

[00:54:10]

Yeah. You know how close No. I think I think Rosil is unattainable for Meghan Markle.

[00:54:15]

You know how close he lives to the beach?

[00:54:17]

Yeah. He's got a boat. He's he's He might not

[00:54:19]

be a

[00:54:19]

boat anymore. He surfs. Yeah. He's got scripts.

[00:54:23]

The total package. He is

[00:54:24]

He's working on them.

[00:54:25]

That man right there, that is a real prince.

[00:54:27]

Yeah. Yeah. He'll treat you right. Mhmm. And when I mean when I say treat you right, means, like, he'll ignore you while he watches Magic Blazers game 38.

[00:54:36]

He's strong. He's so strong. That they fucked fuck you, page 6. Yeah. That was He'll come at our boy like that.

[00:54:42]

It was a dirty move. Yeah. Oh, okay. Work what if it does work out for them?

[00:54:47]

Good. Good.

[00:54:49]

Alright. My hot seat is, Odell Beckham because he and his dad are on the hot seat because, Roma Duinze and his dad have taken over. I don't know if you guys saw, but probably didn't. A Twitter account called blackdicka

[00:55:05]

posted Gotta make sure to pronounce the end of that.

[00:55:07]

Yeah. Blackdicka, posted Rome Adunze would have 1100 yards on any other NFC North team, and James Adunze, Rome's dad said 1500. So that's going well. Everything's going well. I love it's not depressing.

[00:55:23]

I love those Twitter accounts, like the black Adam Schefter. Yeah. Black Skip Bayless.

[00:55:28]

You didn't know we needed a black dick. No. Now you do. We got 1. But, yeah, things are going well.

[00:55:33]

And then we had, that doesn't even look like dick.

[00:55:36]

I think that's just a random fan in it.

[00:55:38]

Who's just in a dick

[00:55:39]

sweater? Yeah.

[00:55:40]

Yeah. I do like the idea, like yeah. Black people,

[00:55:43]

you should you should be allowed to dress up as Mike dick. Yeah.

[00:55:45]

You should have a dick. Mhmm. A big Dikka. And then most most of the time do. My cool throne is, Jalen Brunson because there was a report last night, by Josh Hart that in the second half again of the Knicks Raptors game, Jalen Brunson was screaming, I want dick.

[00:56:07]

I'll take dick. Talking about Grady Dick. Got it. That also got community noted notice that he's lying on my name. Very funny, though.

[00:56:16]

This is what

[00:56:16]

I love about about guys that have been friends for a long time I know. And continue to be friends.

[00:56:21]

Yeah.

[00:56:22]

You can say this type of stuff about your buddy.

[00:56:24]

Yeah. I got dick. I want dick. Also, Karl Anthony Towns, he might be the perfect fit for New York. He had a big shot.

[00:56:30]

He was repping it. Yeah. And the Knicks have been hot. Like, Karl Anthony Towns might be built like that.

[00:56:36]

See, I didn't I didn't think that he would when they made this trade.

[00:56:39]

He might be proving me wrong. He is. He's built like that. Okay. Let's do our interviews.

[00:56:44]

We've got a great interview with Steve Young and then Kenny Dillingham, also awesome, awesome interview. Really cool guy, back to back. Before we do that, we got a couple ads from UPFT.

[00:56:54]

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Order now for game day. Terms, taxes, and fees apply. See app for details. And now here's Steve Young.

[00:58:40]

Okay. We now welcome on a very, very, very special guest. He's a pro football hall of famer, Super Bowl champion, multiple time MVP. It is Steve Young. Steve, thank you for joining us.

[00:58:53]

We really appreciate it. We are children of the nineties, so we we grew up watching you play football. And, we got a bunch of different questions. I I actually wanted to start with, some games we watched yesterday and your team, who kicked the shit out of my team, the bears. Are the 40 niners back, or did they just play the bears?

[00:59:14]

Could they could they make a run here? We're trying to figure it out.

[00:59:19]

I I think if you stand back, to who they were last year fully loaded, and Christian McCaffrey and and Brandon, are you probably, other than George, the most important people on the field and then Trent and not no Trent, it's, you know, it's gonna it's it's hard. Right? They but I think it was gonna get harder anyway. So So I think what's happened is they got punched in the mouth in Green Bay, got punched in the mouth in Buffalo, and and got em and we've got embarrassed. And this is a team, yeah, short of some guys.

[00:59:50]

We get that. But as a group, 50 guys have been at Super Bowls or at championship games, and all of a sudden, people are, you know, treating them like dogs, like like something's you know? And and I think that this is their answer back. Like, hey. We're wounded, but we're not gone.

[01:00:09]

And so when you say, hey. Can they can they clap back and get something done? I think this is a group of people that have proven some real resilience. I mean, there's some some hardy folks. That's why last week, I talked about grit with you know, during the week about them is, like, where's the grit?

[01:00:27]

Mhmm. Where's the where's the natural grit that you guys have had for years? And I think they answered that on Sunday. So I would say to your question, can they clap back and make something happen? They're they're under direct.

[01:00:38]

They gotta win they they gotta go to Miami and win. They gotta win against the Rams who are hot, and they gotta come back back home and beat the Lions. They have to win those games. And so, yeah, it's absolutely possible. It's possible.

[01:00:49]

Hard but possible. Yes.

[01:00:50]

Fundamentally. There's another story in the NFL going right now that I feel like you have some good insight into, and that's Bryce Young. Bryce was he was unceremoniously benched. I don't know if you can be ceremoniously benched, but he was he was definitely cast aside by the Panthers.

[01:01:06]

And I've been ceremoniously benched before.

[01:01:08]

Yeah. So Yeah. Yeah.

[01:01:09]

You can be ceremoniously benched and unceremoniously benched. They're both the same.

[01:01:13]

Yeah. Yeah. So so he was kinda cast aside and, you know, the the bust freeze got thrown around a little bit with Bryce. He's still very early on his career. 2nd year, he gets benched and he comes back and he looks like a completely different quarterback.

[01:01:28]

You had I I don't wanna say similar experience, but you were you were kinda

[01:01:31]

cast It's a arc that you're I know where you're going.

[01:01:33]

You were cast aside by by the by the Bucks early on in your career, and you didn't get

[01:01:36]

a chance. I I I was a lefty. People back then didn't wanna coach a lefty. It freaked out.

[01:01:42]

Yeah. You kinda do look like head coaches.

[01:01:44]

Got the head coaching job, and he looked at me like, bro, I hate lefties, and I I hate scramblers. This is anyone who could run was was, like, weird. Yeah. You should just stand there. Don't go anywhere.

[01:01:57]

And I look. That was prototype. I get it. It's still look. You gotta be a sophisticated passer with football today no matter what.

[01:02:05]

But I always thought it was a bonus, and he thought it was terrible. They ran I mean, he thought I left him a scramble. You're out. I I hate you.

[01:02:13]

Yeah. Lefty's doing a lot.

[01:02:14]

But no. But but but but getting thrown out, like, when you talk about Bryce Young, look. There's there's crappy places to be as a quarterback today. You can go to teams and it just it just sucks being a quarterback there because they they have people running the organization. I'm not speaking about Carolina specifically.

[01:02:30]

I'm talking about there's a there's a number of places where they still don't from ownership on down, don't understand the position's importance and then how to they they tend to look at it from a defensive parse perspective. I'm not gonna coddle a quarterback. I'm not gonna they don't need special treatment. You know? And so it's like the paradigm is wrong.

[01:02:53]

It's not that they need to be coddled or need special treatment. There's expertise to the nature of building a situation, an organization from the ground up to make the job for the quarterback as easy as possible so they can thrive and be great. And if you do that, then you have a chance. And there's, and so for Bryce, it's getting to a place where you can actually show who you are. Look at Sam Darnold's a perfect example.

[01:03:21]

Jets flailing around. Bus goes to Carolina. Oh, show some signs. Let's be honest. He he set up some smoke signals in Carolina when he was there.

[01:03:31]

Like, I can still do this. I don't I don't suck, but you still don't need you need more help. And then he gets to San Francisco. And what does Kyle Shanahan say? I love this guy.

[01:03:40]

This guy's our career arc could be great. And we all kinda said, oh, yeah. What are you talking about? That's crazy. He's nuts.

[01:03:45]

What does he do? Then he goes to Minnesota and now and so, Bryce, unless you look. There's some guys that hit the pro game who have really thrived in in in college, who look prototype Bryce looks through a prototype, probably not big as strong as the prototypes but runs around, makes big plays, like and and, been in the been in the big games. Like, Bryce doesn't know his ceiling. We don't know his ceiling, and there's filters he's got to go through even if he got all of that help.

[01:04:16]

But what you're seeing today in the last few weeks is, hey. Look. I can survive here. And if you can survive, then you can thrive. And so I don't know where this ends up for Bryce, but he's showing me, like like Sam did when he was in Carolina.

[01:04:32]

Like, we're losing, but I I I can figure this out. And and that's a I always say it's called sending me smoke signals. Like like, I'm I'm dying down here, but I'm sending you, something that tells me that you're gonna you you you have a chance to thrive at some point, either either there or somewhere else.

[01:04:49]

Yeah. With with Bryce specifically, things looked real bad for him. Every every snap looked like he was thinking it through. He

[01:04:56]

was lost.

[01:04:57]

It was painful. He was lost.

[01:04:58]

It looked like he was lost.

[01:04:59]

And the fact that he's improved so much from earlier this year as he was going through that and all the public scrutiny that went with it to how he's playing right now actually tells me that he can be even a whole lot better than he is right now.

[01:05:11]

A 100%. 1000%. Max, a 100%. I I I I I can't agree with you more. It's the signal in tough times and tough situation.

[01:05:20]

That team, you know, it's hard in locker rooms. I was in Tampa. I understand losing locker rooms. The players are not losers, but the losing locker room is tough to overcome. And so if you can show signs, smoke signals again, that you can know you know what you're doing and I can figure it out, that is warrior work.

[01:05:39]

Yeah.

[01:05:39]

That is that is Patrick Mahomes does not have to do that work anymore. Right.

[01:05:44]

Yeah.

[01:05:44]

Josh Allen does not have to do that work anymore. But but but in many ways, Bryce is doing that work. Yeah.

[01:05:49]

Yeah. Do do you think in the NFL game, we move on from these guys too quickly? Because you you mentioned Josh Allen. I mean, Josh Allen was not great his rookie year. Probably not I mean, he showed sign the smoke signals somewhere around the halfway point of his 2nd year, and now he's playing the best of any quarterback in the NFL.

[01:06:08]

I mean, that game against the Rams, I know they lost, but he was out of this world good. Do you think as a league, teams and franchises are moving on too quickly from guys and not giving them a chance to to get through those rough patches that they start their career with?

[01:06:24]

The the the problem is is you don't have 32 great places for quarterbacks to make that judgment.

[01:06:29]

Right.

[01:06:30]

You have to glean through. You have to recognize like, if if you're in San Francisco and you're struggling, you got problems.

[01:06:37]

Mhmm.

[01:06:38]

Yes. There couldn't be a better place. Jimmy Grapple takes a team to the Super Bowl here and then can't find a job.

[01:06:43]

Yeah.

[01:06:44]

So, like, there's places where, you know, if you go down and see Sean McVay and struggle at quarterback, the guy that understands an innovative mind and how he calls plays and he understands position, then that's about you. Mhmm.

[01:06:56]

You know

[01:06:57]

what I mean?

[01:06:57]

So if they if the Rams drafted or the 49ers drafted a young quarterback like Trey Lance and can't do it, that's a that's a sign of that's not a that's not a that's not a situation problem. That's a you problem.

[01:07:08]

Mhmm.

[01:07:08]

Right? And so but then there's a lot of places where you go and you can't know that. They're they they they, you know, they they get drafted to young quarterback to try to be great, and it's not a great place for quarterbacks. And it's not necessarily a you problem. And you have to and and I think that I think that people who understand the position, who have built organizations to make sure that they make the quarterback as as profitable as possible have now the the reps to know when somebody is not gonna get there or like Sam Darnold, like, there's something here, and we can we can work with it.

[01:07:43]

And so I I just I think until there's 32 teams like that, we're gonna have to glean through where it is and what it is. Like, if someone gets drafted by the Jets this year and they haven't fixed anything, then, you know, it can't be harder. I mean, I I I feel for Aaron Rodgers because it's so interesting that he's he's he was he was developed in a in a age of more sophistication. The the job that he had 15 years ago is so much harder than it is today. Today's game was Doug Tom Brady describes the flats are open.

[01:08:16]

The the middle of the field's unpatrolled, and no 1 can hit me. Yeah. Like, it's an amazing time to play quarterback. But and Aaron was was, you know, learned the game in a very much more sophisticated, and so he should be dominating. As Tom dominated, as, you know, as Matthew Stafford is dominating.

[01:08:34]

Anyone that's hung around long enough to know in a sophisticated time should be dominating. That's how tough it is in in for the Jets to go be good. Yeah. And, granted, he's lost some mobility and everything else, but that's when you know some place they they've got a they they don't understand the position, and, it makes it super hard.

[01:08:52]

Yeah. So what is it about, San Francisco specifically, that organization and Kyle Shanahan? What makes it easy to play

[01:08:59]

quarterback for him? If you if you track you you track Bill Walsh, to Andy Reid and then you track Andy Reid to and through Mike Shanahan, like, that there's a there's a a way that they look at the world. They look at the they look at the coaching world as abundant. In other words, whatever I know, I want you to know. So they're unafraid to share.

[01:09:20]

Where so many trees of quart of coaches, they don't share anything. Good luck to you, bro. I got my proprietary knowledge, you know, to hell with you. And and it has doesn't have that abundant spirit. So what I'm what what I'm trying to describe you fundamentally is if you're from the Bill Walsh tree, you've been taught to share.

[01:09:39]

Like, I'm open. And then also, I'm because of that, and I seek like, I I I I like abundance in the in the spirit of how I coach. You can have everything I have. Is that because I'm not gonna I'm not staying here. I don't whatever I have today is not what I'm gonna be tomorrow.

[01:09:55]

I'm I'm I reinvent myself. Look at Andy Reid. He's 67 years old Yeah. Freaking reinventing himself every week. Never stuck.

[01:10:04]

Never thinks, oh, I used to do

[01:10:06]

it, and it works great.

[01:10:07]

And I'm just gonna keep calling plays from 2015 because that was when I was great. That's half the league today. But why is San Francisco great? Why Kyle great? It's because he's come from a place of a like, look look what what who's come out of his shop?

[01:10:21]

Mike McDaniel. Like, who's come out of the Shanahan tree, let alone you know what I mean? Like, because they're it's like, have everything I got because I'm not staying here. This week against the Rams, watch Sean and Kyle go at it. They've been saving stuff so that they could like, because they they empty the tank when they play each other.

[01:10:41]

The plays, the the cool stuff they do, and it's a short week, so they're gonna be under real duress to get in all the cool stuff they wanna get in because they're not gonna who you knew me yesterday is not who I'm gonna be tomorrow.

[01:10:51]

Yeah.

[01:10:52]

And I think

[01:10:52]

Andy does that, and that's why it's as a quarterback, you're trusted. I believe that you can I'll call plays that are very aggressive and you protect me. Quarterback, you protect me. It puts a quarterback in a position of great empowerment and believe and, like, faith. And then and then I'm gonna call plays that that make it really easy for you and really hard on defenses.

[01:11:14]

And I and I've seen that from Kyle from the beginning. He he takes the job of quarterback and makes it as easy as possible and as complex as possible for the defense, and then calls plays in combination to just shame them.

[01:11:28]

Yeah.

[01:11:29]

Like, you think you can play that defense and get away with it? I'm gonna pound you. And a lot of guys talk about it on Wednesday. They actually don't call the plays on Sunday.

[01:11:38]

Yeah. Yeah. So alright. So in a coaching perspective, you go from Tampa to San Francisco. What was that like when you sit down with Bill Walsh for the first time?

[01:11:47]

You're like, holy shit. This is totally different. Like, did you have that moment, that eureka moment where it's like, oh, man. This is I I know I'm not brought in as the starter because Joe Montana's here, but, like, everything in my life is gonna be easier when I get my chance.

[01:12:01]

I got you you got the first remember, I I was traded to the Saint Louis Cardinals. Ray Perkins had come in as a head coach, told me he hates lefties and scramblers. You're out of here. Called me and said I was traded to the San Francisco card I mean, the San San Louis Cardinals. I had made a com a relationship with the owner, Hugh Culverhouse.

[01:12:21]

No 1 else really knew him, and I he'd sit over in the corner. I go talk to him. And so he and I were friendly. And I immediately called him. I because he 2 8 months before, we were trying to get, Bo Jackson to come down and and he he at dinner, he goes, this is my quarterback for life.

[01:12:35]

And so I called him. I said, mister Culbrough, she said I was your quarterback for life, and now I'm getting thrown out of town. I'm going you can't send me to Saint Louis. He goes, oh, I'm so sorry, Steve. You got a new coach.

[01:12:43]

Blah blah blah. He goes, but you're right. I told you that I owe you a chance. He nixed the trade just to, to the cardinals. Like, he he went and cut it like, I don't know what you do especially, but he went and, you know, turn you know, and they didn't agree to it.

[01:12:58]

Wow. And then so he called me back and he said, look. I'm gonna give you a week, and I want you to go find a place that you can thrive. And I'm like, he he saved my life. And so then I talked to Bill Walsh, and Bill Walsh's first thing he said to your question, I love the fact that you're left handed.

[01:13:15]

I think it's an advantage. I was like I mean, in college, my office coordinator said he wouldn't coach a lefty.

[01:13:23]

So I

[01:13:23]

was like, I think it's an advantage, and I love that your mobility. We'll we're gonna have to make sure we know where you're going, but your mobility is a superpower.

[01:13:31]

Wow. And I'm like,

[01:13:32]

first thing out of the gate. And then he said, Joe Montana has just had his second back surgery. And I I don't I don't know how he comes back from it. And so I'm like, I don't I hate to hear that, but, man, that's a real opportunity. And so and then the first 2 things happened the first day.

[01:13:50]

The first day we I got to the 49ers, we had a a summer camp, and and Bill Walsh walked in. And he said something that I'll I'll I'll never forget. He said, look. I don't care what play we call. I don't care what defense we run.

[01:14:04]

We're gonna win because we have shared common experiences amongst each other and a a element of love for each other. That's how we're gonna do it. And I was like, did

[01:14:12]

he just what did he just say?

[01:14:16]

And he wrote a book called, the score takes care of itself because of if you live values of because he said, look. We we're gonna be in Green Bay, playing in the back half packers at Lambeau Field. It'll be drizzling rain in 31 degrees. You've never been cold in your life. The winds are gonna be whipping.

[01:14:32]

We'll be down by 4, 3rd and 10, no timeouts with a minute 10 left. And I want you to get in the huddle, and I wanna look across the huddle to people that you have a shared experience with and have some level of affection or some level of of respect like, you know each other. And I was like, this is crazy talk. I've never heard a coach talk like this in my that's this is football.

[01:14:54]

Right.

[01:14:55]

What you talking about? I'm used to coaches with a big stick just hitting you over the head. And so I'm telling you, Bill Walsh gets very he gets a lot of credit, but not nearly as much as he should get at how what the game looks like today.

[01:15:07]

Mhmm.

[01:15:09]

Like, the game that we enjoy today is really off the back of that comp. And I learned it firsthand from the call I got when he told me he loves lefties and scramblers. And, and then when he talked about but then the next thing, we we ended the meeting, we went out for the first practice, and I'd never met Joe Montana, and he came running out. And the first thing I thought is he doesn't look real hurt.

[01:15:29]

He gave you Bill Walsh gave you a nice speech to get you there because he knew you'd be someone.

[01:15:33]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 6 years together.

[01:15:37]

Yeah. How how was that knowing I mean, we you know, obviously, Brady has is gone and they've and the page has been through a couple quarterbacks, but it had to have been a little difficult at or a lot difficult at times to to be with a a living legend and and knowing the fan base wants 1 thing and you're and you're like, hey. I want a shot. I know I could do this. And then have that moment, you know, the the classic clip, the monkey off your back winning the Super Bowl where it's like everything that you thought you could do, you you went out and proved it.

[01:16:08]

I mean, there's a book there. Yeah. It's a lot of chapters. It was the the dynamic is I and I I and Joe would agree. I mean, it's just been awkward from the 1st day.

[01:16:18]

Yeah.

[01:16:19]

1st day I showed up, it was awkward. And I think if, you know, when we see each other, it's we never argued. We never had a crossword of each other. Never they never had an argue I mean, we just didn't. But it was always awkward.

[01:16:32]

And I don't think it was never not awkward.

[01:16:34]

Yeah.

[01:16:35]

And the day when he was traded to the Chiefs, it was it remained awkward. When I got there and when when when we when, you know, Bill would Bill was crazy. He would Joe Montana won 2 Super Bowls. He'd drive the team down in the Superdome, and then he'd go, go in and run this play. And I'd run-in, and Joe would go out, run off the flip.

[01:16:53]

Like, I was it was a crazy time, and it was all of that. And the fans, it was they were being whiplashed, and it was hard. And, of course, I was gonna lose every conversation. In fact, I'll just 1 little thing I'll tell you. In 1991, the goal 4 had broken out in the Middle East.

[01:17:08]

And, on the front page of the Samson's New Chronicle, and the headline, because at the time, I was playing and things weren't going perfectly. And I think the whole Barry and really any 49er fan in the world was like, where's who need Joe? And I remember thinking to myself, well, he didn't you guys know he lost the game. Like, no. That's impossible.

[01:17:30]

He threw it in complete pass. I I promise you. Like, no. We don't remember that. Yeah.

[01:17:34]

On the page of the Chronicle was the Gulf War. It's Steve Young's fault. That's a joke. You know what I mean? It was like a and I think that that tells you how it was going for me.

[01:17:46]

Yeah. And it's I mean, it's I I love the honesty because I think a lot of times you know, we've had this conversation before where a veteran is in there and then a rookie gets drafted and the veteran will be honest and be like, hey. I'm not here to help him. And, like, everyone be like, oh my god. How could he say that?

[01:18:01]

Your teammates. But that's kind of the the reality of it. Like, you you've got a job and someone's trying to take your job, and there's that element in every locker room.

[01:18:11]

And and and and, you know, and Bill create I mean, I I think Joe and I both feel that we're looking back on the relationship we have with Bill Walsh, it was love hate because, you know, he he said, I put you guys together to get the best out of both of you. Mhmm. Joe hated to hear that, and I guess I hated to hear that too. Like, but yet, he was the king. Joe was the king, and I was I was a freaking pauper.

[01:18:37]

Right? And so I I the the the the power dynamics were not good

[01:18:41]

for me.

[01:18:42]

Yeah. Yeah. Also the fact that his name was Joe Montana. That's just Yeah. That's the starting quarterback.

[01:18:47]

That. Yeah.

[01:18:48]

What I could've what I could've done with that.

[01:18:50]

Yeah. If if you guys if your names were different, then I think the fans would be like, yeah. Put Joe in. Yeah. Joe Montana.

[01:18:56]

That's what he's champion. Yeah. But that I mean, that Super Bowl I mean, you got you guys killed the chargers. That had to be that 1 clip that I I feel like I've seen it a 1000000 times, the monkey off the back. Like, that feeling had to have just been the greatest feeling in the world given everything that had transpired

[01:19:14]

the years before. I I I somewhat regret that moment because it reflects something I would have said 2 or 3 years before because I'd I'd, I'll it's a longer story. I met a guy named Steve Covey on a plane once in the depths of my career trying to replace Joe, and and I dug a hole of depression and anxiety and victimization. And, like, I was I was struggling. And he kinda showed me, you know, a a a way you know, a perspective that said basically that the 40 niners was the greatest platform for iterating to see how good you can get as anything he's ever seen in his life.

[01:19:51]

And I was like, well, no. That can't be because what I'm just describing to you is this place sucks. And he's like, no. This is the greatest chance you've ever had to see how good you can get. Are you afraid to see how good you can get?

[01:20:02]

I'm like, no. I'm not afraid. Well, then go about be about it. Like, quit and I and I and I was proven at the at the time that I I was in the bottom of of a hole that I had dug, that I had victimized myself and made all the excuses and everything else. And so I think that the 2 or 3 years before that Super Bowl, I had come to a place of perspective to recognize that it really wasn't about him.

[01:20:27]

Mhmm.

[01:20:28]

It was really about, like, go about this is the greatest platform in history for a quarterback to see how good they are. Go go be about it. I remember playing the pack like, the Dallas Cowboys soon after and seeing Troy Aikman in warm ups. And I ran up to him, and I was like, Troy, I'm so glad you're here. I'm in this quest to see how good I could get, and I can only find out against the best.

[01:20:45]

And you guys are the best, so I'm so glad I can't wait to play, you know. Like, Troy, look at me like freaking weirdo. Like, you're a weirdo. But I was about it. I I was about it.

[01:20:56]

And so by the time I did it at the Super Bowl, it was almost it was it it felt little bit like I I I was like, what do I wanna say? It was, it was it was it was cheap at that point. It was more of a thing to do just because it was

[01:21:13]

It's for the cameras. Because, yeah, you'd already won a couple MVPs. Yeah.

[01:21:16]

Performative, but everyone sees it as a moment.

[01:21:18]

You know

[01:21:19]

what I mean? But I I had that moment 2 or 3 years before. It's just what I

[01:21:22]

Right. Do you

[01:21:23]

feel a little bit

[01:21:24]

bad about what you did to the chargers? Kinda ran it up on them.

[01:21:27]

I mean, honestly, you when someone if someone's going up like, think about the old days when they had someone and, they had the the shackles behind them and the chain with their legs, and they're going up to get guillotine. You know, the and the the crowd would in the in the town square, the crowd would gather, and then the guy's gonna come and get his head cut off. Right? Mhmm. It's like, even if you're a charger fan and you're about to see me get my head cut off, you might say, oh, I'm okay with losing because I did I didn't see a guy get his head cut off.

[01:21:56]

You know what I mean? Like, you know, like, there's there's no there was 1 less death in the world today. So, I mean, you know, I can't imagine anyone felt bad about that day for me.

[01:22:05]

No. Yeah. Probably not. Probably not. It's interesting.

[01:22:08]

So you you sat next to the so that Steve Covey guy, that's the 7 Habits of Highly Effective Habit.

[01:22:14]

Right? Yes.

[01:22:15]

And you just happened to sit next to him on a plane.

[01:22:17]

What are you? Like, are you a savant? What do you got? You got everything in your pocket?

[01:22:21]

I've read a lot of book covers in my life. And, but that's, like, that is the perfect person for you to sit next to on a plate

[01:22:29]

at that time in your life. That story is that has has a longer I tried to tell it as fast as I could. But he took the moments like, he was he looked like Yoni. He was bald and shorter and kind of curmudgeonly and had a long finger. And he looked at me right in the eye and goes, I think you're afraid to see how good you can get.

[01:22:44]

And I go I totally understand that because people, human beings are that that that scares people.

[01:22:49]

Yeah. But

[01:22:50]

Like, I'm not afraid. He goes, then go be about it, man. And I mean, I my life changed right there on a freaking Delta flight from Salt Lake City to San Jose, California. As I went home, I had flown home after practice on Monday just to get out of town because the goal 4 was the goal 4 was my fault. Like, I had to try to get out of town.

[01:23:08]

That's And I went to see my brother who was, at the University of Utah Medical School, and I walked around with him telling him all my problems. He goes, Bro, I got 3 kids and I'm broke in medical school. Like, what the hell? What are you what are you talking about? I got another than my brother.

[01:23:23]

I headed home, headed back to practice on a Tuesday night and sat down next to Stephen Covey.

[01:23:28]

Wow.

[01:23:28]

That's like, that shallow hell when he meets Tony Robbins on the elevator. That's what happened to you in real life, like, at the perfect time in your life. Who initiated that coverage? Could he tell that you were down in the dumps? He's

[01:23:38]

like Yeah. No. I remember he he he we he he was a he was he was from Utah. So he was, like, he was somebody I knew, and I knew his kids actually a little bit. So it's like it was a familial thing.

[01:23:51]

I'd understood him, but I never really sat and talked to him forever in my life. And I sat down and he says, oh, Steve. Nice to meet you. Great. Wonderful.

[01:23:58]

And I'm like, how are you doing? And I just I I was at a place where if you ask me how I'm doing, you're getting a half an hour of I'm gonna spew out everything because I'm I'm at the I'm in the pit, man. Mhmm. And that's what I did. And he listened to all of it and basically said, wow.

[01:24:16]

I'll tell you, if you want a little bit more, he said, look. You know what, Steve? I hear it all. Man, it is sounds really hard. Can I ask you a couple questions?

[01:24:24]

He said, tell me about your owner, Eddie DeBartolo. I'm like, man, that guy's amazing. He sees players and owners as partners. It's it's he goes, yeah. I heard about him.

[01:24:32]

I really wanna meet him. He sounds like an amazing guy. Tell me what your coach, Bill Walsh, and of course, blah blah blah blah blah. He goes, yeah. I really wanna meet him too.

[01:24:40]

He's a guy that feels like he can has a he has a lot to give to the world. You know? I'm like, yeah. No question. And then he asked me 1 last question, Steve.

[01:24:48]

Is Joe Montana on the team? Is he there? And if you needed to go ask him for advice, could you do it? I'm like, well, yeah. That's the whole problem as he's sitting down the sidelines hurt, and I I I I he goes, yeah.

[01:25:00]

But if you need a mentorship, could you go ask him? I'm like, yeah. I could. And then he said, man, I I've been around a long time. I listen listen.

[01:25:07]

My 7 Habits book, this is what I do. I look for companies, platforms where people have a they they perform. They give people a chance to iterate and see how good they can get. And, and I just try to, you know, amplify their stories so that people can read about it and and help their own lives. And I gotta be honest with you.

[01:25:27]

As I travel the world, this is the greatest, best platform in that I've ever seen for somebody who's set up to go see how good they could get.

[01:25:38]

Yeah. And I was

[01:25:39]

I remember when he said it, I was like, wait. Didn't you just tell I just told you a half an hour of of crap. Like, what are you what are you trying to turn this on me? And he turned it on my head in a way that just I freaking changed my life big time.

[01:25:51]

That's nice. Incredible. I would've

[01:25:53]

I would've just shut up and then, put on put in a bet against you guys the next week if you just unloaded that on me. He actually helped you.

[01:25:59]

He changed your life. Well, no. I and then I remember getting off the plane Tuesday night thinking, I gotta get to work, man, and I've been so I've been bitching and boneless so much. I might get fired. You know, Wednesday morning is when you get fired.

[01:26:12]

Right? And so I ran down that day thinking, please don't fire me. Please don't fire me. I feel like I've got a new lease on life. And you you talk about that's 1991 and that's towards the end of the season.

[01:26:23]

In 1992, I'm the MVP of the league. I'm always saying that because Steve Covey gave the perspective, you know, shifted by access to see that I wasn't in a big pit of neglect and victimization. Like like, stop. Stop. And so I I'm I owe him a great debt.

[01:26:42]

I didn't mean to talk about all this today.

[01:26:43]

But No. That's really cool. Yeah. I mean, it's it's an incredible story that, like, a happenstance just on a on a plane can change your entire outlook.

[01:26:54]

Everything. It changed. And when I said I ran up to Detroit when I ran up to him, said that to him. Like, that's what I I'm about it.

[01:27:02]

Like,

[01:27:02]

you're if you're great, I'm about playing you, man, because I gotta find out.

[01:27:06]

Yeah.

[01:27:06]

Because I gotta figure out and and and I remember Mike Shannon came in in 1992 as a new offensive coordinator, for the 40 niners. And I remember talking to him about this at length, and he's like, man, that's inspiring. Let's let's be about it. Like, he went all in. And so we just the 2 of us for 3 years until he freaking committed treason and left for the Broncos, the 3 years we were together, I mean, I put it up against anything, anywhere, anytime.

[01:27:35]

Yeah. And your numbers were insane. We're speaking of Mike Shanahan, was there I I remember there was a rumor that in when John Elway retired, there was a chance you were gonna come out of retirement and and go play for Mike Shannon?

[01:27:47]

I wasn't I'm not on retirement. I was

[01:27:49]

You're still on the niners.

[01:27:51]

Yeah. Season. 90 80 99 season. And so Mike was and, yeah. No.

[01:27:56]

I spent some time in Denver, and we were we were ready to we were thinking about it.

[01:28:02]

Was it close?

[01:28:02]

He was all he was all in. He was all in, and I just I don't know. I I'm my wife says that's 1 of the things I you know, because we were newly married at the time, and she regrets not, like, pushing me harder to do it. I I was I was kinda emotionally cooked in some ways. Like, you get towards the end, you're like, what am I doing?

[01:28:23]

And I and I just need I I would I I I should've jumped in. I I would've played 2,000 to maybe 2 or 3 years. 2,000, 2001, 2002, 2003 would have been the years I played in Denver if I would have done it.

[01:28:35]

Yeah. Wow. That's a real, like, what if. Yeah. What if moment.

[01:28:38]

Yeah. Could could the Broncos have won another

[01:28:40]

Do you

[01:28:41]

think you wanna win another Super Bowl?

[01:28:43]

Why not? Let's go.

[01:28:45]

Yeah. I mean,

[01:28:46]

those are good teams.

[01:28:47]

With Mike and I, I mean, the 2 of us I mean, if history was anything like we had before, it was good stuff.

[01:28:53]

Yeah. I got kind of a tough question for you here. Can you tell me which loss was worse for you? Which Brett Favre?

[01:29:01]

2 championship game.

[01:29:03]

I I

[01:29:04]

was gonna say,

[01:29:05]

out

[01:29:05]

of all the Brett Favre losses, is it the, consecutive playoff losses, or is it

[01:29:10]

because

[01:29:10]

losing the role in something about Mary Jones?

[01:29:12]

Were different because, the championship game we played in Green Bay, my rib was out, and I only played, like, 3 plays. So I I don't worry. That was that 1. And then the loss at home in 95, we just couldn't run the football. Like, we just, you know, they we had Gilbert and Reggie White for our line was super hard.

[01:29:32]

Like, it was just it wasn't as I don't know why. It wasn't as painful. It was more it felt more competitive. When I think about the 92 championship game, I throw up on my mouth. Like, I really struggle with that 1.

[01:29:42]

That was a total screw up, and I the regret I have about that game is is heavy.

[01:29:47]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, we have a bone to pick with you. You are not gonna remember this at all.

[01:29:53]

You're not gonna remember this at all, but I still have to bring it up. In 2000

[01:29:58]

You really have to?

[01:29:59]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. Here it is.

[01:30:01]

This is gonna be funny. It's kind of a full circle moment because you probably have no idea what I'm about to say. In 2020, you were on, I believe, PTI and maybe lightly, but kind of criticizing Joe Burrow for doing an interview tipsy. We were the ones who did the interview with him, and we were the drunk guys.

[01:30:19]

I know. No. I think I I think you remember me a little bit

[01:30:22]

of you

[01:30:23]

were smoking cigar at LSU, and I regret I actually regret that interview for me. Like, what am I what am I I I was like, what are the kids gonna start smoking cigars? Like, stop, Steve. Relax. You're excited?

[01:30:34]

But it was actually it was at you said something about, like, he's doing an interview tipsy. I wanted on the record. We were actually fully hammered Yeah. When we interviewed him. We interviewed him, like, 6 hours after he won the national championship game.

[01:30:46]

It's 1 of the my favorite moments that we've had in this history of this podcast. We've been doing it for 9 years, but we were we were fucking hammered.

[01:30:54]

I wouldn't be interviewed.

[01:30:55]

But I can't tell him that. I I I guarantee you I have his PTI that I was having fun with it because it was funny to me. Like, I think I enjoyed the fact that I was watching you guys and going, what what are we doing?

[01:31:07]

Yeah. It was I mean, it was I mean, it was like a thrill of a lifetime. We got to interview the national champion, Heisman.

[01:31:14]

How come how come, hammered you got to interview a guy right after the champ as national championship?

[01:31:20]

Like He didn't know they were gonna be hammered, but we we'd known Joe for a while. Yeah.

[01:31:24]

And we

[01:31:24]

knew and and coach O. Yeah.

[01:31:26]

They become good friends of ours.

[01:31:27]

And Ohio.

[01:31:28]

Yeah. We we so we stayed out we stayed out late, after they won the national championship, and then we we had friends in the program who were like, hey. We'll come to your hotel. We can set everything up in the lobby or, you know, a room. We'll interview you before you gotta get on the busses.

[01:31:43]

So Joe and coach o came down. Coach o was sober, but Joe had he just won a national title. It was, like, 8 in the morning, and we had been on Bourbon Street all night. So we did the interview just very drunk, and it was, I mean, it was 1 of the funniest interviews we've done.

[01:31:56]

Think we were

[01:31:57]

I missed my PTA times because PTA times because it was, there there guys are great great questions, and it's always fun. So, yeah, I'm sure we're laughing about you guys.

[01:32:07]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we we oh, I think we also got them in trouble because I think that's when Joe admitted that Odell was handing out cash.

[01:32:14]

Yeah. Because they were like, you're about to leave LSU, so

[01:32:17]

it doesn't really matter

[01:32:18]

now. That was real money.

[01:32:19]

Right? Yeah. I got plenty of money too in my pocket.

[01:32:22]

So Yeah. Yeah.

[01:32:23]

You gotta You

[01:32:24]

know what? You guys you guys took down a lot in 1 nice job.

[01:32:28]

Yeah. That was the first time that college players have taken money.

[01:32:31]

Yeah. Yeah. We were doing some good interviewing.

[01:32:33]

Yeah. We should do all our interviews drunk.

[01:32:35]

Yeah. We really should. It's actually

[01:32:37]

not it's a pretty good pretty good hack for if you're starting a podcast. Just get hammered and badger people the questions. Yeah. I got a question for you about the modern day, quarterback play in the NFL Yeah. Namely the slide.

[01:32:49]

So, I don't know why, but just in the last 2 years, I feel like I've been I've been watching quarterbacks slide to protect themselves. And I've been thinking more and more, the slide isn't really that safe of a play at all for quarterbacks because it puts your head so close to the ground where if you get hit on a slide, you're likely to bounce your head.

[01:33:08]

Close to it puts your head on a pedestal, right, at the level of people's knees and and and and, like, you basically are saying and and you and by sliding, you're opening yourself up. Right? It's like, oh, hit me in the face.

[01:33:22]

Yeah.

[01:33:22]

That that's what the the slide and I think the slide the game look. The game changed when they changed the rules. It's now a Canadian sized field, essentially, is what we've done is we've expanded the space because defenders can't launch their bodies. The space has come in the last 6 or 7 years. That's put the prototype is now like, it's my game.

[01:33:43]

My pro I'm you know, all the people tell me you scramble. You you know, you're weird. You're odd. Now I like this is my mainstream.

[01:33:50]

Yeah.

[01:33:50]

And so game's changing, and the slide needs to change because it's actually it can be weaponized by a quarterback. You're seeing Patrick Mahomes, not the slide particularly, but the go out of bounds fake and then come back or the, you know, pump fakes or all the stuff that they're doing to abuse defenses. Defenses are really under duress from the NFL by making all the rule change for safety. And so it feels like, the slide I never slid. I if I if you can get a quote, I mean, any quip of me sliding, it'd be a mistake if I did.

[01:34:24]

Because I always felt like just what you just said, it's dangerous. You get yourself hit in the face. And, and, plus, referees always reduce where you slid. Like, whenever I would I guess I have slid because I know I've done it, and they and then also it was for a first down, and then now I'm a half a yard behind. I'm like, what are you talking about?

[01:34:46]

Like, I I slid to make the first down. And they're like, no. You slid back. That's what I learned sliding. The the the mentality of it is they don't give you the yard, so forget it.

[01:34:55]

I'm not gonna do it anymore.

[01:34:57]

Mhmm.

[01:34:57]

Do you guys tell me does your mom live with you? What is going on

[01:35:00]

about it? Max. Max just came in to to change the,

[01:35:03]

He doesn't care. He doesn't care.

[01:35:04]

Yeah. He didn't care at all. He just walked right before the camera. That was crazy. Care.

[01:35:08]

But but freaking boring story. I don't need to No. That was nuts. Story. Like like, I fell asleep and forgot you guys were alive.

[01:35:14]

Yeah. Max, do

[01:35:15]

you have any questions? Live. Look. Let's go with the slide. You gotta get I you gotta change the slide.

[01:35:20]

I just

[01:35:21]

wanna make sure you're on. Your mic's not on. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:35:23]

Yeah. Yeah. It's streaming into the dead mic, bro. Yeah.

[01:35:26]

I mean, imagine if you had slid on that. I I for some reason, it popped up. I I love the old accounts where they just pop up old, highlights, that 49 yard run against the Vikings. Oh, yeah. Game winning touchdown run.

[01:35:38]

Yeah. Like, that would have been ruined if you had tried to if you tried to save yourself and slid somewhere on that run.

[01:35:42]

No. But I think the game it's unfair for defenses today because you've gotten Lamar Jackson out there sliding. You know, you guys these guys are I mean, these are super super capable people, so they they put themselves in a bind. So what happened with Shazir is that he's they're taught to go when someone slides, that you go to hit them, to take them down because they're such a threat today because their prototype is to come out of and, you know, start gaining those free yards out there, but then just fly over the top of them. Go to hit them, and if they slide, just fly over the top.

[01:36:12]

But

[01:36:12]

that's even hard to do. So I I I think I don't know. I think sliding's to make it to make sliding safe for quarterbacks is impossible, so get rid of it.

[01:36:24]

Yeah. I

[01:36:25]

don't I don't mind that take at all. Yeah. Because, like, it's impossible for for a defender to to to stop.

[01:36:30]

Worse and worse as the more mobile, more dynamic of a runner coming out of the pocket the quarterback is, the less this the slide was invented for people who couldn't run.

[01:36:41]

Mhmm. Yeah.

[01:36:42]

Right? You're now out of your element. You're in a very dangerous you're out in the jungle now in a without any weapons. And you're like, how can we get you to safety? Right.

[01:36:51]

So the slide was put was for people who didn't know what they were doing out there. They were it was out of their out of their That's just not the case anymore.

[01:36:59]

Yeah. So the slide is

[01:37:00]

the the actuals the rule for the slide is is for a time that's gone now. The prototype is not, the pocket. You know, you have to you have to be a sophisticated passer to do the job, but the idea that nobody can go get those yards with their legs, those days are over. So the slide is the slide is is not is not part of the game today. Shouldn't it?

[01:37:17]

The, 1 thing about the modern game, obviously, the offenses have been you you mentioned it. Like, it's very easy to play offense now. Everything's open. Wide receivers are incredible. I do think we get to a point where we forget about how special Jerry Rice was.

[01:37:33]

Can you tell us, maybe our younger audience, like, what made Jerry Rice so damn good? Because we get to a point where, yeah, there's guys that are I mean, Jabbar Chase, Justin Jefferson, some of these guys are doing incredible things. Jerry Rice was doing that every single year for a decade and a half.

[01:37:49]

No room. Yeah. With no space. With no like, that's the thing. The game was you had to that you had to you had to make spaces on offense.

[01:37:57]

There was no people are launching all over the place. Defenders are flying. You couldn't run slip screens. You couldn't there were no cheap yards. Now people say, oh, you ran a lot of slants for cheap yards, but, tactically, we we out you know, we we were we were we're quicker to the punch in some ways.

[01:38:14]

But it wasn't like, you know, the game was not the game today, so you make a great point. Jerry Rice, every once in a while, you run into somebody like Michael Jordan who is supreme talent with supreme work ethic. Like like, blue collar over my dead body every day. It's you know? And and I think there's and I think in in a person's psyche, what happens is there's a fear that even though I'm amazing at something, I have this fear that I can't get rid of that I'm gonna someone's gonna take my job.

[01:38:49]

And I swear to you, I think Michael Jordan was driven by that even though it's like he's the greatest ever. And Jerry Rice was driven by the same thing. Until he the day he retired, he thought someone was gonna take his job.

[01:39:00]

Mhmm. Yeah.

[01:39:00]

And so he he lived in a state of, I'm not gonna say fear because it's a wrong word, but, anxiety that that I need to go to work. And so I'll give you 1 quick story. We won the Super Bowl against the chargers, come home, do the parade down Market Street. The busses pick everyone up up from the Market Street, go down to the facility in Santa Clara, drop everyone off. The coach makes a speech because he just won the Super Bowl.

[01:39:27]

Hey. See you later. See you then first OTA in in April, and, you know, goodbye. So everybody is like it's like a derby. Like, you get out of there.

[01:39:37]

Everyone's gone. So the next day, no one's no one's gonna go to no one's gonna go down there tomorrow. Right? But I'm single. I got nothing to do.

[01:39:45]

I'm gonna go down and clean up my locker. I don't know. So I go down there, nobody's there. And I'm and the doors are locked, but I know there's a 24 hour guard that's there all the time. So I'm banging on the door, banging on the roof, finally comes.

[01:39:57]

You're like, bro, what are you doing here? I'm like, I don't know. I cleaned the locker. I wanna, you know, have some big hot tub. I don't wanna do something.

[01:40:03]

And I go out to the fields, you know, the 49 facility is still there, same thing. Go out the back of the locker room, there's the fields. And I look out, and freaking Jerry Rice is out back in the corner. And I can hardly see that it's him at first. I'm like, who's that freaking crazy man out there in the corner running?

[01:40:18]

He's like running routes against air, and then he's acting like he's catching the ball. And I'm like, that's Jerry. Holy shit. And I'm like, bro. Like, take a day off, man.

[01:40:30]

And and a couple of things went through my mind. First was, is that Gerry? I said, yes. And the second thing is question I asked myself is, am I supposed to go up there and throw it

[01:40:38]

to him?

[01:40:39]

Because, like like, man, I don't wanna go throw it to him. And I can't remember if I did or didn't. I I I wanna believe I went out there and at least tried. But but that's when people say, who who's Jerry Rice? Jerry Rice is the guy when no 1 like, he he must have had a key.

[01:40:56]

Yeah.

[01:40:57]

Because the

[01:40:57]

the the the guard didn't know he's back there. He go, hey. Jerry Rice is back there. He's like, yes. What the hell?

[01:41:03]

You know? I'm like, yeah. He must have no 1 Jerry had a key.

[01:41:07]

That's crazy.

[01:41:08]

To the to the to the gate, and he was gonna go do the work. Wow. And, and so that's Jerry Rice. And so put the numbers of Jerry Rice up there, and look at even today when the game is wide open. Jerry Rice is all his records should be under duress.

[01:41:25]

Right? They should be being lapped in today's game. Mhmm. And you can't get close to him. Yeah.

[01:41:32]

You cannot get close to him.

[01:41:33]

Did he

[01:41:33]

make it hard as a quarterback when he would give the ball back to you and it'd be all sticky? No.

[01:41:39]

It wasn't that. You guys don't don't believe the hype now. Come on. That was the that was pre that was pre 1985. That was that was a stick em era.

[01:41:48]

Now the gloves that they have today

[01:41:50]

Yeah.

[01:41:51]

Are much tackier than anything that we had when we were playing with in the eighties nineties. Much tackier.

[01:41:57]

Yeah. The

[01:41:57]

idea that you can go back behind and grab a ball with 1 hand like Odell does, those those gloves aren't much tackier than they are than they were back in the day.

[01:42:08]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, you were talking earlier about sending smoke signals, quarterbacks that send smoke signals. Maybe they're not in the best position right now, but you see something and you're like, okay.

[01:42:19]

I'm gonna keep my eye on you. You're still alright. You're still alive. What quarterbacks are out there right now? And we'll move on from from Bryce Young because I think he sent up a few of those.

[01:42:27]

But, what quarterbacks right now do you see that might not they might not be playing that great right now, but you see something that you wanna keep your eye on.

[01:42:35]

I see it in Caleb. Now, look, I don't know how the ceiling is, and you gotta go through some filters like I told you. But you gotta get into a spot where you can get some help. What I didn't like about Caleb's game yesterday is in the first half, like, you're look. Clearly, under duress, things are really going south fast.

[01:42:51]

Get out, man, and start like, make plays. Like, we're not going down this way.

[01:42:56]

Mhmm.

[01:42:56]

And so what I didn't like about his game yesterday is he just kinda sat there looking for the 3rd guy waiting for someone to come open. Like, no. Get out. Go. Make something happen.

[01:43:04]

Refuse to go down that way. So there's still learning that he's gonna have, but I early there's some things I've seen this year that I feel like I would wanna invest in Caleb for sure. I don't think it's fair to say CJ Stroud anymore because I think we've seen it. Now we just gotta get it developed and get him all the help that he needs and everything else. So I I really feel that he's he's in a great spot.

[01:43:27]

Help me go around the league. I'm just thinking, what does Sam Darnold's gonna I mean, what do what do the Vikings do?

[01:43:35]

That's what we were saying. We we had a whole discussion about it on, our podcast comes out Monday Monday, Wednesday, Friday.

[01:43:41]

You're insane to not sign a guy that's doing that for you.

[01:43:45]

Right. He's playing as well

[01:43:46]

as you could expect. But what do you do? What do you do? I mean, you know this situation what? Like, what do you do with J.

[01:43:51]

J.

[01:43:51]

And Mark? Like Like, I would be Bill Walsh and say, look. Awkward, but let's let's go. But you know who will benefit? The Vikings.

[01:44:00]

Right. Right.

[01:44:01]

We don't know which 1 of you will benefit more or less, but right now, the Vikings will benefit.

[01:44:07]

Yeah. And and

[01:44:08]

as long as you don't have a toxic personality, which I know JJ is not and I know Sam's not. Like, you know, Joe and I were not toxic personalities. We weren't gonna inflame things in the locker room. It wasn't gonna be worse because of the awkwardness. Now that can happen.

[01:44:22]

You don't want that. But I would be unafraid, especially with my history. Like, bro, 2 of you, let's just let's go.

[01:44:29]

Yeah. I mean, iron sharpens iron. You're gonna get you're right. The Vikings

[01:44:32]

will be the biggest issue. JJ for free for a few years.

[01:44:35]

Right.

[01:44:36]

So, you know, I I don't know. I just when someone's playing great football in the NFL today and you know that he you know, over and over again as as Sam has shown this year, I just I believe that this is the truth of Sam Darnold. He will grow from here. He's he's gonna be like Josh Allen. Like, he can run.

[01:44:55]

He can move. He can do all the things that you need from a prototype quarterback today to get out and get those free yards, and, I would not let I Sam Darnold go at all. Yeah. And if and if I would and and and and I don't care who you have at quarterback other than maybe Patrick or Josh, I would say bring him in. If you can get him at a price that works, make it awkward, man.

[01:45:20]

If they're gonna let him go, do do not and if I was Sam, I am not going back to 1 of those places that doesn't take care of that doesn't understand the quarter acquisition.

[01:45:31]

Yeah. I

[01:45:33]

so I will go compete to go to 1 of those places that does.

[01:45:37]

Yeah. Yeah. Because, I mean, you don't Kevin O'Connell's an incredible coach, and then you also have Justin Jefferson. Like, don't walk away from that.

[01:45:44]

Well, you have to dynamite me out of a place like that.

[01:45:47]

Yeah. Yep. Alright. Well, I had 1 last question, Steve. This has been so much fun.

[01:45:51]

We we really love having you on, and we'll definitely do it again.

[01:45:54]

Max fell asleep, but other than that, we're super excited.

[01:45:57]

Yeah. Well, he's got ADD. We we've I've thought this has been incredible. My last question is a Rhoback question rhoback.compromocodeake.20% off your first purchase, q zips, polos, hoodies, joggers, shorts, roeback.compromocodeake. So you mentioned all the way at the beginning of the interview, being on, like, a losing team with the Bucks and and having that in the locker room.

[01:46:18]

We're at that point of the NFL calendar, December, where there's some teams that it's clear, it's over, they're not in the playoffs, they've got 2 or 3 wins. How do those teams get off the mat and play this game every single Sunday? Like, is it just are are guys just playing for themselves, or what is it like in that locker room when you're trying to do the prep all week and then get there and be like, we know we're probably not gonna win?

[01:46:43]

Football is weird and different because the job is to go ram into other people, and it's unusual. You know? It's as a team game, look, there's UFC, there's boxing, there's other things that, you know, that's part of that's the game. But the game in football is I gotta go get people to ram into other people. And, honestly, it's not natural.

[01:47:02]

And so for the human condition, I don't care how tough you are. It's not natural to just go, like, I can't wait to go ram into somebody.

[01:47:09]

Right.

[01:47:09]

And so in football, when things were when when when you have a sense of of 1, right, and we're we're we're accountable and we're we're work together and we've got each other's back and, you know, over my dead body and, like, we're then that natural incentive comes. It, like, it it comes out of people. Like, it comes out of the locker room. Like, you can feel it. Feel in warm ups.

[01:47:32]

Like, I swear I can watch a good team warm up, and I can feel the level of this over my dead body feeling, the sense of commitment to go ram into somebody this week. I'm I'm ready. And so when you start losing and then you're out of it, then it's tough because naturally, even tough veterans of the NFL human to get is like, I really don't wanna ram anybody this week. Like, I'd rather not. And so it it it makes it super hard more than any other sport that when things are you know, you're out of the playoffs, you're, you know, you're just, you know, running out the clock of the season.

[01:48:10]

When you have to go hit people, it makes it that much harder to get them to go do it. And so as a coach, you know, a lot of coach use threats and because they're under if they're out of it too, they're probably a little under duress as well. So losing locker room that's out of the playoffs is actually kind of a dangerous place to hang out.

[01:48:29]

Mhmm.

[01:48:30]

Because you go to play and not everybody's committed, you just get yourself hurt. Right? And so in that way, you you just you pray that the you you're in a locker room like the 40 niners this last week and go, hey. Look. No way.

[01:48:45]

And then there's just leadership in there and there's a commitment to it and we're not gonna go down that way. It's probably a little bit of a DNA thing that they've had for a while. But the teams that have lost for a long time and it's part of their culture and their dynamic now, it is brutal when you get out of the playoffs. And now you you have to go figure out how to go play and and and and show who you are. Like, the idea that I'm gonna go play quarterback on a losing team that's out of the playoffs.

[01:49:07]

How do I let's say I'm all in 100%. Well, I need 5 linemen who are all in a 100%. I'm not gonna say they're not. But human nature says, I really don't wanna ram in anybody this week. So you know?

[01:49:19]

And so I'm not gonna be tip of the spear, you know, ready. It's hard. I I I I feel for teams that are in that mode all the time. I saw it in Tampa Bay for 1 season. I was there for 1 full season.

[01:49:33]

And there were no losers on the team, but it was a losing place. Right. And it was impossible to change. I mean, some of the toughest human beings I ever met, James Wilder, I don't know if you remember that name before, running back. I mean, tough I mean, passages.

[01:49:47]

These guys are it was all all years I played. Some of the toughest people I knew were down there. But the culture and the and the feeling, you just couldn't get over it. And, and it gets it's infectious. It's infecting.

[01:50:00]

And, I feel bad for teams that can't get out of it. And I and and teams that are constantly in it, I blame ownership.

[01:50:06]

Mhmm.

[01:50:07]

You could and unfortunately, in this league, you can't because equity ownership is not gonna change. You can't people don't really talk about it because they can't feel like they can't change it. They can get the coach fired. They can get the general manager fired. They can get the quarterback fired.

[01:50:21]

So people, that's where they talk. They can't get the owner fired. But the problem, 99% chance is the owner. How do we hold the owner accountable? How do we do that as a as a city, as a fan base, as a I mean, there we need to be thinking about how we help ownership be accountable.

[01:50:39]

Yeah. Yeah.

[01:50:40]

Because it would make the team if they could build that accountability and answer to it, it would help the team. And so I don't know how to you guys figure out how to how do we how do we figure out

[01:50:51]

an airplane with a banner behind it Yeah. In the stadium.

[01:50:53]

Listen. You're you're you're preaching to me because the Bears ownership is not serious about winning football games, and it's it's very frustrating as a

[01:51:01]

fan. Well, if you feel that way, and then you then it really doesn't matter who is the general manager, who is the coaches, who's the quarterback. Like, you can't overcome apathy.

[01:51:12]

Mhmm.

[01:51:12]

Yeah. That's

[01:51:13]

what you guys are saying. If you guys are saying that Chicago bear ownership is apathetic, then, you guys gotta you gotta figure out how to address it.

[01:51:22]

Yeah. Yes.

[01:51:22]

You know? The 1 thing that they pay attention to is is the bottom line. When the money starts getting messed up, then they start looking at it. Like, I was a I was a Commanders Redskins football team fan, and, I worked 25 years on getting Gan Snyder fired. Nothing was ever gonna happen until he started losing money and his his corporate partners started pulling their sponsorships.

[01:51:44]

And then he got caught. All the stuff with the investigations, to personal conduct was 1 thing. But when he got caught taking money from the other owners, that's when it was like, okay. Now it's time to get this guy out. So the only thing these guys listen to is money.

[01:51:58]

That's what will make them act.

[01:52:00]

I don't know. I don't know. I I don't know. I just know that the league would be would be an even better league. We're a great league right now.

[01:52:07]

We're in better league if we could figure out a way to hold the ultimate equity owners accountable.

[01:52:12]

Yeah. Mhmm. Agreed. Agreed.

[01:52:14]

I I had 1 last last thing because I read this about you today. I did not know this, but you never took a snap under center in your entire NFL career.

[01:52:23]

No. In the shot Excuse me.

[01:52:24]

In the shot, you were always under center. You never took a snap in

[01:52:26]

the air.

[01:52:27]

When I the year I was in the USFL, the Express, that's all I did was a shotgun. I loved it. And it's building but Bill wasn't believing it. He didn't believe the timing could be. It wasn't until John Elway and Mike Shanahan used the same offense in 98 and showed, no.

[01:52:41]

No. It doesn't matter. And I remember when John was doing it from the shotgun, I'm like, frack. Why would like, it doesn't matter. And and from the shotgun, it's just such a better spot to be, to play quarterback.

[01:52:54]

And so yeah. No. I never in the NFL, I never played 1 snap of shotgun, which is

[01:52:58]

That's crazy. That's such

[01:53:00]

a bummer. You had to just get into your center's butt every play.

[01:53:03]

Yeah. Poor me, man. Poor me. What it could've been.

[01:53:09]

Alright. Well, Steve, thank you so so much. We really enjoyed this. And and like I said, we're we're gonna have you back on. You have to come back on legally now.

[01:53:16]

Mhmm. Right. You're you're a

[01:53:17]

recurring guest. I gotta tell you, my dad's nickname is Grit.

[01:53:20]

Okay. Nice.

[01:53:21]

Grit Young. I see the sign behind you.

[01:53:23]

Yes.

[01:53:23]

And and Angela Duckworth wrote the book, Grit.

[01:53:25]

Yes.

[01:53:26]

And,

[01:53:27]

and he's in the book, which is weird.

[01:53:30]

That's it is.

[01:53:31]

And if you're serious about grit, then I'm in.

[01:53:33]

Yeah. We do we do a grit week.

[01:53:35]

If it's just a sign No.

[01:53:37]

No. No.

[01:53:37]

If it's just a cheap sign that Max walks by, it's on, and I'm not gonna I'm not coming back.

[01:53:43]

No. We do Grit week every year. Yeah.

[01:53:44]

We do Grit week.

[01:53:45]

True. You guys are about it, then I'm about it.

[01:53:47]

Yeah. We are. We are. We do a Grit week where we travel around to different training camps and, you know, do interviews out of a van, so we're about it for sure.

[01:53:55]

I love that.

[01:53:56]

Yeah. As gritty as a podcaster can get. Not as grit not that gritty, but we we we push the limits for grit for podcasters.

[01:54:03]

I like it.

[01:54:04]

Yeah. Alright. Thanks so much. Conversation.

[01:54:06]

You guys got a lot of good therapy for me. I appreciate the time.

[01:54:08]

Yeah. Absolutely. Appreciate it. Take care, Steve.

[01:54:11]

See you, boys. Take care. Steve Young is brought to you by our good friends over at BlueChew. BlueChew is an online service that delivers the same active ingredients as Viagra, Cialis, and Levitra, but as a fraction of the cost and in a chewable form. The process is simple.

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Visit bluechu.com for more details and important safety information, and we thank Bluechu for sponsoring this pod. Part of my take is sponsored by BetterHelp. How do you stay cozy during the winter months? For some, wrapping up a blanket with a mug of hot chocolate or watching a movie with family is the best way to spend this month of December. Therapy is a great way to bring yourself some comfort that never goes away even when the season changes.

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I've personally benefited from therapy in the past. During a time of loss, therapy helped me get through my emotions and get back to work and be productive and feel better about myself. If you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try. It's entirely online, designed to be convenient, flexible, and suited to your schedule. Just fill out a brief questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time for no additional charge.

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Find comfort this December with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.com/pmt today. Get 10% off your 1st month. That's betterhelp.com/pmt. And now here's Arizona State coach Kenny Dillingham.

[01:56:22]

Okay. We now welcome on a very, very, very special guest. He is, the big 12 champ. It is coach Kenny Dillingham from the Arizona State Football Program. Coach, first of all, thanks for joining us.

[01:56:38]

And second, congrats because you might have 1 of the best stories in college football right now. You guys were picked to be last in the big 12. You win the big 12. You get a buy in the college football playoff. We're sitting here on Tuesday.

[01:56:53]

Has it all set in yet that this is just like an incredible, ride in just a hell of a season?

[01:56:59]

Yeah. It is. And, the fun part is it's not over. Like, we're still rolling. You know?

[01:57:04]

That's the best part is, we got, like, 3 and a half more weeks before we play again. But, yeah. And to think it all started when, well, the coach Dugan's became the OC at Florida State the same time I became the OC at Florida State. It's just ironic that, it all led to this moment.

[01:57:21]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that was how I first, linked up to you with you as I took the job as Doug's at Florida State, and then you hit me up and you're like, hey. Don't don't let me down here because this is you're playing as me right now.

[01:57:33]

Yes. And we've talked ever since, but this is I I mean, that that big 12 championship game was incredible because you guys did it in a fashion that was just a blowout fashion. And I do have to ask though in that game, and we I wanna talk about Cam Scatterboats because he's so much fun to watch. There was that clip where he threw the ball, panicking in the backfield, and they flashed to your face, and I've never seen a coach more like, holy fuck. What just happened?

[01:58:01]

Why did he do that? What was going through your head in that moment?

[01:58:05]

Well, so Cam is actually 1 of the smartest kids in our team. So I'm gonna preface it with that. Alright? And we toss him the ball. The play didn't work.

[01:58:14]

Horrible play call by me. Not good. Right? And he starts running around backwards. We were on a 3 yard line.

[01:58:19]

He then realized he was stuck, and he was 20 yards back. And he's so intelligent. He said, woah. I'm out of the pocket. I can throw the ball away.

[01:58:28]

So he made a decision in a split second. Instead of losing 20 yards, I wanna throw the ball away. And I knew, like, as it was going, I'm like, this dude's gonna throw the ball away. Like, I know Scott. He's gonna throw the ball away.

[01:58:41]

And then when he did it, and the ball almost got picked off, it was 1 of the moments that I was like, is this real life, or is this an alternative reality?

[01:58:50]

Mhmm.

[01:58:50]

Right? I was, like, in a state of what the hell is going on right now.

[01:58:56]

Yeah. It's actually a really smart play. Yeah. When you think about it, yeah, it it might have taken a couple years off your life. But I always say when a running back has a ball in the backfield, they're gonna get bottled up, throw the ball, get it out of bounds.

[01:59:07]

Yeah. I mean and we had a guy in the area. He actually came to the sideline, and above him and our quarterback are so competitive. Our quarterback had a bootleg off of the play, off the toss, and he boots out opposite. He goes, where were you?

[01:59:19]

You were supposed to be over there. Yeah. That was good.

[01:59:21]

That was good.

[01:59:22]

Was he had a plan

[01:59:24]

to throw it back for

[01:59:25]

a touchdown after running backwards for 18 yards to our quarterback? And, that's just that. You know? He's such so such an aware player. That's what makes him unique and different is he he's super intelligent.

[01:59:37]

He plays as hard as you can possibly play.

[01:59:39]

He's so fun to watch. He's he's 1 of the my favorite guys in college football to watch with the ball in his hands. Do you find yourself calling running plays just because you wanna watch him run with a football?

[01:59:50]

Yeah. I mean, we definitely want it. I mean, I get on the headset. I don't call the plays. Coach Arroyo does, but I get on the headset because that's my background.

[01:59:57]

I said hand it to Scott. I don't care what you do. Just hand it to him or get it to him as as many times as you can here. Or I wanna see Scott touch it twice in a row. I'll definitely make comments like that.

[02:00:07]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would just do it not because it's necessary for, like, the situation of the game, just because I, as a a person on the sideline, want to watch him running with the football.

[02:00:17]

Yeah. I don't we don't make too many of those decisions. Just, you know, we mainly try to win. That's usually our our main purpose for decision making.

[02:00:26]

That's why you're you and I'm me. Yeah.

[02:00:27]

Yeah. Yeah. So, the other 1 yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[02:00:31]

Yeah. I don't wanna trade. No. The other 1 we gotta talk about is, the ending of the BYU game. Now this is where you basically were coach Doug's, me playing video games where I had big time clock management issues.

[02:00:45]

I did stupid things all the time. Do you know now that, like, we're a few weeks removed from that and you're in the playoff and you're comfortably big 12 champs, do you realize how fucking stupid you were in that moment?

[02:00:57]

Yeah. That was a mistake. I I I openly said it, I think in my press conference on Monday. Like, 100%. You know, when we do an average play takes 4 to 5 seconds.

[02:01:08]

So and then a throwaway play takes 8 seconds. So when you do the math, yes. Does the little book that tells you to run around run around and throw it away tell you the game's gonna end? Yes. But does common sense tell you to go ahead at the score?

[02:01:22]

Yes. So a 100% hindsight. Let's just turn around. Let's hand it to that dude who should be at the Heisman Trophy Ceremony, and, let's save the drama for another day. Yeah.

[02:01:32]

But it it made for a great ending.

[02:01:34]

It did. It did.

[02:01:35]

It was it was literally I was watching it live being like, this guy's fucking playing Madden right now. Like, what is he doing? And then and then having that scene of you with the ref, and there was some guy standing behind you that was making me laugh so hard. This, like, diehard Arizona state fan who beat basically, instantly became your hype man, who looked like he was just repeating everything you were saying. It was why I love college football.

[02:01:58]

It's just a scene you can't get in the NFL. And, yeah, we learned learned the lesson to, maybe just run the ball next time.

[02:02:05]

Yeah. Should've just probably handed the sky.

[02:02:08]

Yeah. And, you know, as as an Arizona State student, how hard it was gonna be to get all those guys off the field. Like, once the student section gets on the field, that's gonna that's a big cleanup job that you have to undertake there.

[02:02:20]

That's what was going through my mind was I'm getting pushed in the back. I'm getting hugged by random people and, like, mosh put it in there. And then I'm being told there's still time. Then my wife's out there, and we're hugging. She's giving me a kiss.

[02:02:33]

Congrats. And then we have donors on the field. The guy that you're talking about is 1 of our top donors.

[02:02:38]

That's awesome.

[02:02:38]

And, he's came out on the field with my wife. And it was just you talk about chaos. I mean but you know what? This this season's been so crazy that why why not? Why not give add to it?

[02:02:51]

Yeah. Like, why not why not embrace it all, embrace embrace the chaos?

[02:02:55]

And I I feel like you had maybe this is just the point of the football season where everything blends together. But didn't you have a game that was almost similar where you were out on the field and the game was over? Was that earlier in the season? Like, the same thing happened. Yeah.

[02:03:08]

Yeah.

[02:03:08]

Yeah. I've never had a second added in my career. My of I I coached Pop Warner. So if there's ever a time for a second to be added on a clock, you'd think it would Pop Warner officials. And it's happened twice in our first, 11 games this year.

[02:03:24]

We had a second added to the game, which gave the team the other ball. Yeah. The ball again. So it was, very interesting.

[02:03:32]

Yeah. We might need to work on our last second situational football. That might be something to circle this off season.

[02:03:37]

I agree. There's a there's a lot more than that to work on. I got I got a lot of problems.

[02:03:42]

Yeah. So you guys are in a great spot now. As Big Cat mentioned, you were picked last, in in your conference. How often do you repeat that? How often do you still let the team know, hey.

[02:03:52]

You were picked last. Like, that's that's really bad. The expectations were so low on you that you're actually last, and look at all you've accomplished. Do you still do you still use that as motivation, like, constantly with the team now?

[02:04:05]

Yeah. It's more we're we're still not like, people don't believe our we're good. Right? We're we weren't even picked high in the in the last CFP rankings. People are saying, hey.

[02:04:15]

These teams that get to play us have the shorter, easier path. So our guys see all that. They read all that. You know, regardless of what they've accomplished on the last 12 or 12 weeks or 13 weeks now, they, I mean, they still have the chip on their shoulder because people still doubt them. And that's why we're where we're at is because we have a lot of people who were at these blue blood programs that chose to come out here, live in paradise, live in 60 5 degrees and sunny in December, jump in the pool maybe, take a little dip, right, and walk down Palm Tree Lane at Arizona State and compete for championships at the same time.

[02:04:48]

I mean, I don't know about you, but that sounds like a good time.

[02:04:51]

You're recruiting us right now.

[02:04:52]

It sounds good. Yeah. Yeah. So there's probably a couple, I don't know, like, let's say, 230 pound, I'd say juniors in high school. They're linebackers.

[02:05:03]

Maybe they've got, like, the start of a mullet going on right now, and they're trying to figure out where they wanna go to school, maybe 3 star recruits. What would you say to those guys?

[02:05:12]

I would say, you get to come out here and live in paradise. You get to play championship football. You don't have to go in the snow and hit people in 25 degrees. Yes. Does it get hot in the summer?

[02:05:25]

Yeah. Keep your butt inside. Right? Get in the pool. Alright?

[02:05:30]

The pool's not bad. Right? It's a good spot. And be around good people. We have really good people on our staff, and we we have a saying here.

[02:05:37]

Be a good person, make good decisions. And the last 1, have more fun working harder than they were in the country. You wanna have a lot of fun working your ass off? This is spot for you.

[02:05:48]

Yeah. And and I gotta give you credit because I love your your breath of fresh air when it comes to college football and the way you've attacked this is awesome. The 1 thing that that that's crazy that I I haven't seen any other coaches do, the transfer portal sucks. You're losing guys. It's just part of the business.

[02:06:04]

But you're out there, quote, tweeting a guy who's transferring being like, he's awesome. Someone pick him up. Is that like I mean, that's an intentional strategy by you, but, like, it seems very genuine that you're like, hey. Look. I understand how this is gonna work.

[02:06:18]

We're gonna lose guys every year. I'm not gonna shit talk them. I'm not gonna, you know, tell them make them feel bad for making a decision for themselves. I'm here to still support them. It's awesome.

[02:06:27]

Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, like, I know it's a business. I get all of it. Trust me. I'm in it.

[02:06:33]

Right? So I understand it. But college sports is supposed to be to help the kids. Like, that's still the root of what it's supposed to be. And if there's a guy who's not playing for us, who wants to go play college football, why should I be upset?

[02:06:49]

Like, I shouldn't be upset. I'll just be like, you're right. You're not gonna play for us right now or maybe you're behind somebody on the depth chart or maybe you're really good and you wanna go your dream school. Right? Maybe this isn't your dream school.

[02:07:02]

Why would I be mad at a kid for wanting to be do what's best for him? Coaches do it all the time. Mhmm. I've moved around. Assistant coaches move around.

[02:07:10]

What a double standard that would be for me if I don't support the players and their career aspirations like I support coaches and like I did in my career. So I root for them. I try to help them. I let them give my number to other college coaches for them to call me. I wanna see them successful.

[02:07:26]

And bottom line and I really think if you're good to people, people are gonna be good to give back.

[02:07:31]

Yeah.

[02:07:31]

I I really believe that.

[02:07:33]

Yeah. It's a great message.

[02:07:34]

And you can fight against the rules all you want. A lot of coaches do. They're very resistant to it, or you can realize, hey. This is the situation that we're in. What's the best way that we can deal with it?

[02:07:43]

This is the new reality. And if you support guys that are looking to transfer somewhere else, high school recruiters gonna see that and think to themselves, that's a good guy. That's a guy that I would wanna play for.

[02:07:54]

Yeah. I I would hope. Like I said, I just believe like I said earlier, our number 1 thing on our board when we recruit people, for our coaches, like, our number 1 thing is be a good person. Like, that's not very hard to do.

[02:08:07]

Mhmm.

[02:08:07]

Like, when you really truly think about it, it's not hard to just treat people right. Yeah. And if you do that, good things are gonna happen for you. I I just believe it. So I I do think, I do think that's part of it.

[02:08:20]

It's just being a good person. Yeah. Not rocket science.

[02:08:24]

Yeah. Yeah.

[02:08:24]

Go to rocket surgery. Yeah. You know? Either.

[02:08:27]

Alright. So I got a question for you. So our like I said, we we first got linked up when I took your job as Florida State offensive coordinator as Doug's, but I actually have longer history with you, which always for everything in my life, it it goes back to a bet. You coach Bo Nix his his freshman year. I I it took me a long time to become a bow lever.

[02:08:50]

I'm recently a bow lever. It's been about, like, a month now that I've been a bow lever. Part of the reason why it took me so long was I remember specifically betting Oregon against Auburn his first game, and I was like, who the fuck is this guy? And you guys won that game. But you coach Bo Nix.

[02:09:05]

Are you surprised at all about the success he's having in the NFL? Like, what type of guy is he? Because you were you were with, like, unfiltered, uncut Bo Nix freshman year where he was doing crazy ass shit. Now he's he's balling out in the NFL. Has any of this surprised you at all?

[02:09:22]

Not at all. So I coached Bo as a true freshman. He had a pretty good season as true freshman. SCC newcomer of the year. And then he transferred to play for me at Oregon.

[02:09:31]

That was a big reason he went up to Oregon. And, Poe has always been competitive and special and accurate and has moxie and intelligent. Like, he's the dude that has enough dog in him that's it makes some people uncomfortable. Like, oh, woah. He's gonna say something back to you?

[02:09:49]

Yeah.

[02:09:49]

Like, in a good way. Like, in a competitive way. Like, why do you like that call? Well, what do have you thought about doing it like this? And some people don't like because some people, this is what you do.

[02:09:59]

Go do it. Don't don't give your opinion. I'm the opposite. I'm not the I've never been the smartest dude in the room, and I never will be. You know what I am?

[02:10:06]

I'm smart enough to listen to people, And I was smart enough when I went to Oregon to listen to Bone X when he said I wanna run I want this guy to run

[02:10:13]

the route like this.

[02:10:14]

I'm like, okay. Go tell him. You're the 1 throwing it, not me. Like, I'm over there standing with my hands in my pockets like I hope this works.

[02:10:21]

Right.

[02:10:21]

So I have 0 doubt in my mind, that he was gonna be successful. He has it. And I'm excited to watch him play, you know, for many years to come because I think he's gonna be 1 of the next great Bronco quarterbacks.

[02:10:34]

I like that. There's so much dog he makes people uncomfortable. You

[02:10:36]

know what he you know who he makes uncomfortable? If you got too much dog, he makes cats uncomfortable. Yeah. He makes non dogs uncomfortable. Yeah.

[02:10:43]

Brings it

[02:10:43]

out of them.

[02:10:44]

Yeah.

[02:10:44]

So are you after. When you watch him when you watch me in the NFL and he's not he hasn't turned the ball over in, like, a month, are you like, what the hell, man? What is Sean Payton telling you that that I didn't tell you?

[02:10:55]

No. I mean, he did that at, Oregon. I mean, he had 1 of the highest completion percentage in the country. He really didn't turn the ball over at Oregon for us, when we got there. So it's he's kind of doing what exactly what he did his last 2 years in college.

[02:11:09]

The problem was he's so efficient as a passer. You know, people wanted him to throw it deep more. You know? And there was a narrative about him going into the draft. And the funny thing about narratives is you guys know a narrative can be created about anything.

[02:11:22]

It doesn't really matter. People can make it out of thin air. They can find a stat and create it. And there are some narratives about him going into the draft that led to him in the it was the best thing that ever happened to him because it put him in a position to be drafted by the Broncos with Sean Payton.

[02:11:37]

Yeah. So

[02:11:38]

that narrative of being I he doesn't throw a deep or take chances was the best thing that could ever happen in his career because it got him with a really good football coach.

[02:11:44]

Yeah. You you really had, like, the full Bo Nix experience because Auburn Bo Nix was chaotic, and it was nuts, and it was awesome, and it was just like, I always just think about though that game again against LSU, in Baton Rouge. And then in Oregon, yeah, he he like, it was just touchdowns and no interceptions, and he was so efficient. So you you saw it all. You you you're the you're a Bo Nix Whisperer.

[02:12:08]

I don't know about Whisperer. I wouldn't be I will say this. I can guarantee I would not be the head coach at Arizona State without Bo Nix.

[02:12:15]

Yeah.

[02:12:16]

Without Jordan Kravis. You know, I can promise you that because they're both really good players. The kid we have right now, Sam Levitt, he's a very similar player to Bone X. He's got that swagger, the blonde hair, the runaround, ultra competitive. I mean, they're very it's it's like I'm living, I'm, like, reliving the Bo Nix experience with with this new guy, Sam Levitt.

[02:12:39]

And it's it's super exciting. I mean, now he's a big 12 champ as a freshman. So, I've been blessed to be around some good quarterbacks.

[02:12:45]

Yeah. So so looking at the college football playoff, I don't want you to get ahead of yourself because you obviously like I I love the spot you guys are in and the fact that no 1 thinks that, you know, they look at Boise. They look at Arizona State. They're like, oh, that's a cake walk for Clemson and Texas and all that stuff. But if you're able to win a game and Oregon wins a game, you go up against Dan Lanning, who knows the other 1 better?

[02:13:06]

Do you think you know Dan Lanning better than Dan Lanning knows you?

[02:13:10]

I think we know each other the same. I mean, I go we Dan and I go back to when I was a high school coach and he was a GA at Arizona State. And then we link back up at Memphis where he was the linebacker's coach, now he's the quarterback's coach. And coaches play a game called, like, who's got the pen last, where we go in and we pop ball. He draws up what he would do.

[02:13:30]

I draw up what I would do, and then he draws up what he would do. We go back and forth for hours or some coaches, if you love ball. Right? And that was the guy I did that with. And me and Ham would go back and forth for hours at Memphis and at Oregon.

[02:13:44]

Just who's got the pen last? What would you do here? What would you do here? So I think we both know each other, fairly well. Obviously, he's got that place rock and rolling.

[02:13:53]

I mean, I got my I got my Oregon duck helmet up there. I don't know if you guys can see it. It's barely off the screen, but, you know, I got a lot of respect for him.

[02:14:00]

Yeah. Yeah. So have you obviously have to start looking ahead a little bit in terms of just who you're going to be playing because you don't know yet. So how much prep work are you doing for each team right now?

[02:14:10]

We're breaking them down. We're not watching them yet just because we don't know who we're playing. We're really focusing on ourselves. Like, we're watching all of our games and saying, okay. What tendencies have we created that we can break?

[02:14:21]

So we're really gonna focus on our own self scout and fixing our own problems first, and then we'll get in here in another week to the really the opponent prep.

[02:14:29]

Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. I always think about the self scouting thing. And, again, we're we're dumb.

[02:14:33]

We're not, you know, we're not true, like, exes knows football guys. And I always think about how other coaches would see things that I do on film, and then I'd have to, like, play three-dimensional chess to, like, change something that I think that they've noticed on film, and then I would get myself totally out of my own game plan. So how much do that as opposed to, like, playing to your strengths? Do you know what you do well? And we're gonna continue doing those things that we do well.

[02:14:58]

Well, I'll create a parallel here. So I play video games, fully aware. It's really not that much different. You've you've played a guy who runs 3 plays in Madden or NCAA over and over again. Right?

[02:15:10]

Me.

[02:15:10]

Yeah. The same 3 plays every single time Yeah. And you physically can't stop it.

[02:15:14]

It is the most frustrating thing

[02:15:16]

on the planet. K? There's that philosophy. And then you run the guy who calls run, run, run, play action, run, run, run, play action screen, and it's frustrating. Right?

[02:15:26]

And we're more of the run, run, run, play action screen, the schemed up than we are. We're gonna run the same 3 plays over and over again. You can't stop it. Those philosophies carry over to real life even though nobody wants to ever compare things to a video game. There are some parallels.

[02:15:41]

It's more of a train of thought and a belief system. So for us, it's more it's not that we're not gonna do what we do. It's more can we do it a different way. Instead of doing it out of, you know, instead of running 4 verticals, can we motion to 4 verticals this week? Can we align the back on the other side?

[02:15:59]

Can we motion somebody? Can we shift? It's more doing the same things, but looking like it's different. I would say it's, you know, dressing it up. A little salad dressing on it.

[02:16:09]

Still salad, but still a little bit different.

[02:16:11]

So do do you have shark wheel in the playbook?

[02:16:16]

Shark wheel is probably the biggest cheat code in a video game ever created.

[02:16:20]

Yes.

[02:16:21]

It does not work in real life like it would work in the, in the video games, for sure.

[02:16:27]

But you should maybe maybe just have it in there for what you know, maybe if you get to national championship, you gotta surprise someone, shark wheel will work.

[02:16:34]

It probably will. You know what does work in real life and in the video game is mesh. 2 by

[02:16:39]

2 Yeah.

[02:16:40]

Mesh with the tailback wheel.

[02:16:42]

Yep.

[02:16:42]

That plays that plays still unstoppable. Video games, real life, most common third down play in football, 3rd medium play in football is that play, which is always run-in video games too, and people say video games aren't real.

[02:16:55]

Yeah. Yeah. The Yeah. The wheel route just in general is a great concept. I feel like it's especially in college, it's always open.

[02:17:01]

Yeah.

[02:17:01]

You get the running back going full speed against a linebacker in space, and it's like, hey. It's gonna be open.

[02:17:06]

No doubt.

[02:17:07]

Yeah. So your start was very interesting. I I don't know if this is true, but you got injured your senior year in high school and immediately went to coaching. So it was like that. It was just you knew that you had to be a football coach.

[02:17:20]

And the minute you because you hear all the time, like, guys will go play, you know, division 2 college. They'll play they'll go all the way to the end of their football career and then start coaching. The end of your football career was senior year in high school. You're like, alright. Ready to coach.

[02:17:33]

Let's go.

[02:17:34]

Yeah. So I tore my ACL the spring of my junior year, tried to play my senior year without my ACL. Problem is I'm 59. I'm unathletic. You know?

[02:17:47]

I'm overweight. And I was never really a good player. And that's not a good combination to already be not a good player and not have an ACL. My high school coach was like, hey, bud. You may wanna do this.

[02:17:59]

If you like football, start coaching. And so my high school coach is actually our special teams coordinator right now, Charlie Riggle. So he's like, hey, bud. Let's just start this coaching thing. You're already not very good.

[02:18:10]

This APL is gonna make you worse.

[02:18:12]

Oh, sweet.

[02:18:12]

So I started.

[02:18:13]

That that's awesome. So your high school coach is now on your staff. That's fucking cool.

[02:18:17]

Yeah. He is our special teams coordinator, assistant head coach.

[02:18:20]

That's that's awesome. It's also it is a really great excuse if you weren't very good to begin with because when you hear, like, oh, he tore his ACL, so he couldn't play football, everyone automatically assumes he must have been a great football player. Bad injury luck. So you can you can play into that. You're being a little bit too honest with us, I think.

[02:18:37]

Yeah. I was not a great player. I mean and I wish I could say bad injury luck since that ACL. I've torn my left patella tendon playing hoops, playing morning hoops, and my right patella tendon playing morning hoops. So I don't I was just not a very good athlete.

[02:18:55]

I have my I have a 2a half year old boy. I I pray and I think he's got my wife's genes. He was the athlete of the family. She was like an Olympic hopeful gymnast. So I really hope he's got her genes.

[02:19:06]

Yeah. Wait. So back to your high school coach, has there been moments where you guys been sitting late in meetings, especially now, like, maybe even this week where it's like, this guy was your coach in high school, and now he's on your staff, and you're going to the college football playoff. That's that's a really cool, like, pinch yourself moment. Has he said that to you?

[02:19:25]

Oh, yeah. We definitely our staff is filled with people who love Arizona State. I mean, our running backs coach coach high school in the valley, forever. Our in the the valley is Phoenix area. Right?

[02:19:38]

Our our tight ends coach is born and raised in Arizona, went to Arizona State. Our 1 of our d line coaches went to Arizona State. Our linebackers coaches from 15 minutes from Arizona State. Our defensive coordinators from 30 minutes from Arizona State campus. Like, we have so many people that are passionate about this place that we look at each other, and we had a saying.

[02:19:58]

I mean, we were predicted to win 4 wins. So when we were going to get our 5th win, we would look at each other and say, we can just get this 1.

[02:20:05]

And then we won 5.

[02:20:06]

And then we're like, if we can just get this 1. No. That's sick. If we can just get this 1. And 11 wins later, pick 12 champs.

[02:20:14]

We're looking at each other into this next week if we can just get this 1. 0. Yeah. See how long the ride goes.

[02:20:20]

I I love that. Imagine a team just going if we can just get this 1 all the way to a national title.

[02:20:25]

Yeah. You could do it. For sure. Yeah. It's been a hell of a season, and and the conference that you play in seems like it's more chaotic than any other conference in the country.

[02:20:34]

What is it about the big 12 that just lends itself to these these crazy games?

[02:20:39]

Well, 1, we play 9 conference games. So we play more conference games than some of the other leagues. Right? So you and then 2, the it's just every team is so close to each other from a talent perspective. So, I mean, there's not really the bottom of the league.

[02:20:54]

Traditionally, there's not a true I mean, though, we were supposed to be the bottom, but there's not really the bottom of the league, and consistent powerhouses. So every week that you play, I mean, you could win or lose the football game. I mean, because it's so competitive. So you beat each other up, and then everybody has 2 losses by the end of it. Like, when you go through the 9 games to survive at 81 is very, very rare.

[02:21:16]

So we beat each other up. And, and then the environments, I think it's an underrated thing. The environments in the big 12 going on the road to Stillwater. Going up to we didn't go to Boulder this year with coach prime. Right?

[02:21:28]

Those are I mean, going to Utah, going to BYU. They'll coming to Arizona State, you guys saw our crowd. Those are real environments.

[02:21:35]

Mhmm.

[02:21:35]

So

[02:21:36]

not only do you have to play good teams, you're not, like, going on the road to 25 1,000 fans, you know, who leave at halftime. You're going on the road to people throwing tortillas on the field like they do at Texas Tech.

[02:21:47]

Yeah. Yeah. San Marcos, tough place

[02:21:49]

to go.

[02:21:49]

Yeah. So I know that you walked this back a little, but there was a point in the season where you you were you were down to do open tryouts for for kickers. And I I hit you up right away, and I was like, I got a kicker. And he's sitting right next to me.

[02:22:03]

I started stretching. I I told him.

[02:22:04]

I was like, hey. There's a chance you might have to go down there. So now I know you you you figured that out. I don't know if PFT has, eligibility left, but would you still be open for PFT trying out just getting a maybe a private tryout in the spring sometime just to see what he's got.

[02:22:21]

We could do a private tryout. I feel our guys have done a phenomenal job. I mean, I should've never said that. I openly apologize. Like I said, sometimes some things have to be handled behind closed doors.

[02:22:33]

But, 100%, if you wanna come out and, you know, you wanna see what you got, I would love for you to come out and embarrass yourself. I think that'd be awesome. Oh, wow. That'd be exciting.

[02:22:44]

This is like this

[02:22:44]

is like when testing you.

[02:22:46]

This is

[02:22:46]

like when you got picked last, coach. Now I'm I'm making this personal. If I can just make 1 field goal,

[02:22:51]

then I'll be okay.

[02:22:53]

He okay. So when Big Cat told me that, I did try out for the XFL, went, 3 for 5 from 37 yards. So I started stretching, got in the squat rack a little bit. I do have eligibility left. I looked it up.

[02:23:05]

I could I could enroll in ASU Law School, and I I could be on the roster. Like, obviously, I wouldn't get in the game, but you don't have a limit. I could just be on the roster and just just show up for games as like the the 7th string kicker. Right?

[02:23:19]

I mean, in today's day and age with NIL, you know, you may be able to NIL yourself through pardon my take

[02:23:28]

to

[02:23:29]

become our 4th string kicker.

[02:23:30]

Yeah.

[02:23:31]

Like that, there there could be a play there.

[02:23:33]

I mean,

[02:23:33]

there's an opportunity.

[02:23:34]

And you

[02:23:34]

know what?

[02:23:35]

I let I wanna take on the mantra of of what you speak about at ASU and and any NIL money that I make through being the 4th string kicker. I'm gonna distribute that to the rest of the kickers on the team.

[02:23:45]

I think that's a great idea. I think that's an absolutely phenomenal idea.

[02:23:49]

And I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna match. Begett's gonna match.

[02:23:52]

Oh, we'll see. Hot damn. Yeah. We're we're rolling now.

[02:23:56]

Now we're putting it with this grease.

[02:23:58]

Yeah.

[02:23:58]

Listen. I can I can can still make a 35 yard field goal consistently, I think? I haven't kicked in, like, a year. But you you give me, like, 3 months to get in shape and to start working on it, I'm gonna be I'm gonna be lights out from 40 in.

[02:24:09]

Yeah. Consistency. That's what you need. He's just trying to test you.

[02:24:13]

So I

[02:24:14]

I actually did have I have 1 last question. This is he's trying to test you because I know how how coach Dillingham is. Rhoback question, rhoback.com, promo code take. 20% off your first purchase. Q zips, polos, hoodies, joggers, shorts.

[02:24:26]

Roeback.compromocode take. Go right now and buy it. My last question, and I I know what you're doing to PFT because I I know you pretty well, in just reading everything and talking to you. You you just like guys who wanna compete. So you have a ping pong table, that you you basically have the rule that if you beat someone in ping pong and they don't wanna play again, you're like, that guy's not for me.

[02:24:51]

So how much how much of that is, like, real where it's like, you know, if we play a video game and you don't wanna play again, I don't really want you around because I want you to have that dog where you're like, I gotta win a game.

[02:25:02]

Yeah. It's not I mean, I say that jokingly, but it's somewhat like it's it's not 100% true. I just wanna see somebody who's, like, passionate about it. Like, we're doing something. We're competing in something.

[02:25:15]

Like, if I beat you and you're like, oh, what's the next thing that we're doing on our visit? Right. That doesn't I I don't connect with people like that. Like, I grew up the youngest of 4 where I got my butt beat beat and everything. And, like, I would hate it.

[02:25:32]

And I'd be like, play again. Play again. I want people that, like, wanna be the very best and that are wired in a way that I don't care if they're playing tiddlywinks. They wanna win. I don't even know what a tiddlywink is.

[02:25:44]

Yeah.

[02:25:44]

But I I've heard

[02:25:45]

the saying before, and they wanna win in it. And whether it's bathes, whether it's chess, whether it's NCAA, I want people that it pisses them off to lose. Yeah. Yeah. It bothers them.

[02:25:55]

It's uncomfortable.

[02:25:57]

Yeah. I like that. Love that mantra. So, is there anybody else on your team that you wanna shout out, like an unsung leader of the program? Because we spend a lot of time talking about the running back, the quarterback.

[02:26:06]

But is there a guy on the team that's, like, the heartbeat of the team that's kinda operating behind the scenes?

[02:26:13]

Yeah. 1 of those guys would be Xavier and Alford, our starting safety, who was first team all conference. He started his career at Texas, transferred from Texas, went to USC. You know, didn't work out there. Transfer from USC, shows up at Arizona State.

[02:26:27]

The NCAA deemed him ineligible for transferring twice as before the rules changed. So then he practiced for a year and a half without playing here, and now he's first team all conference. The what he's put the work he's put in, he's the guy who gives our pregame speeches. If you ever watched any of our videos, I don't give pregame speeches. I'm horrible at it.

[02:26:47]

But he's good at it. So he's the 1 who gives the the pregame speeches to the guys. He's definitely 1 of those guys.

[02:26:52]

I love it. Love it. Alright. We're we're rooting for you guys. Yeah.

[02:26:56]

I mean, this is, it's why I love college sports, this type of story, and and and someone who's got the passion that you've got especially for Arizona State. Don't let Pete Frisco back on the bandwagon, by the way. He's a friend of ours. He's gonna say that he's he never left. He definitely left the bandwagon.

[02:27:13]

So we're we're we'll gatekeep the bandwagon for you when it comes exclusively to just Pete Frisco.

[02:27:20]

That sounds good. Okay. Alright. Alright.

[02:27:22]

Thanks so much, coach. We really appreciate it, man. See you, coach.

[02:27:26]

I appreciate it. Go devils.

[02:27:29]

Coach d was brought to you by Hey Dude. We're bringing the holiday magic with a twist of Hey Dude style, comfort, and stoke to make this season unforgettable. Welcome to the Hey Dude holiday season where giving the gift of go to kicks is the ultimate way to spread cheer. No 1 does the holidays like Hey Dude. Whether you're a die hard fan or a first timer, no 1 does festive offerings like Hey Dude.

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[02:28:10]

I'm wearing the boots right now. I've been rocking the boots all week. I was walking through the kitchen at Barstow Sports Day, got pulled aside by, like, 3 people. They're like, yo. PFT, are you matching?

[02:28:21]

Did you match your boots with your shirt? I did not. I just got very, very lucky when I got dressed this morning, but they're great, great boots. I've been wearing them all week. Perfect for the wintertime.

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[02:28:42]

Okay, Hank. Guys on chicks.

[02:28:46]

Michigan fan here, and I am buzzing from Saturday. What? Michigan fan here, and I am buzzing from Saturday.

[02:28:55]

Is this Is this correct?

[02:28:56]

Yeah. Yeah.

[02:28:57]

This is Yeah. Okay.

[02:28:58]

Maybe they

[02:28:59]

were just busting from

[02:29:00]

oh, okay.

[02:29:01]

I've been dating my boyfriend for 4 months.

[02:29:06]

Wait. Is this still the Michigan fan?

[02:29:07]

Nope. Okay. Maybe. I've been dating my boyfriend for 4 months. We We're in our late twenties, and he absolutely loves basketball.

[02:29:16]

Recently, he joined a league where 2 teams play. The Unks usually crash.

[02:29:19]

Usually happens?

[02:29:20]

As it sounds, a bunch of middle aged men play against recently graduated high schoolers. The Unks and have this is written incorrectly. The UNX and have an x d 1 football player and always win. And my husband takes great pride each week. He makes fake newspaper articles and AI generated podcast glorifying himself for himself for his performances.

[02:29:40]

He recently said he's considering going to an open NBA tryout because he dropped a triple double against a team of 18 year olds. Should I be honest and tell him he isn't good enough, or should I let him let try and live his dreams?

[02:29:49]

I love this idea for a league where it's just 2 teams, and you only have 1 team that you play against, and you play against them all the time. It's like it's like gangs.

[02:29:58]

Yeah. It's Harlem, Globetrotters, and the Washington generals.

[02:30:01]

Yeah. No. I think, guys gotta have a hobby. He's creating an alternate universe for himself.

[02:30:06]

That's a normal thing to do with, like, fantasy football and and, you know, rec leagues and stuff. See, someone always takes it seriously, but that's not a bad thing.

[02:30:15]

Also, what were you gonna say, Max?

[02:30:16]

I I want I want us to put out this graphic of, like, that he's that he's joining it.

[02:30:21]

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[02:30:23]

I want I want to fulfill us to fulfill this guy's dream.

[02:30:25]

Yes. Send us

[02:30:26]

Yes.

[02:30:26]

Send us a recap, and we'll talk about it. It's a national

[02:30:29]

sports podcast. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[02:30:30]

We'll talk about it. Also, judging from this, blurb that the girl wrote in, nothing better nothing better than playing intramural rec sports, whatever it is, and having, like, a true insane athlete on your team. Because that's really what it sounds like. He's just good because he's got a d 1 football player on his team. But when you, like, when you get in those situations, you're like, we have a true ringer, and there's just no way we can lose.

[02:30:59]

Best feeling in the world.

[02:31:00]

Mhmm.

[02:31:01]

I I do love when

[02:31:02]

you scrambled golfs when you have a scratch golfer.

[02:31:04]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, when you took all the money from me at your club with that guy Yeah. Who's a p j pro.

[02:31:10]

Shout out to Kurt.

[02:31:11]

That was

[02:31:11]

Shout out

[02:31:11]

to Kurt.

[02:31:12]

Yeah. I love what he's doing, though. I love that he's creating, like, this entire thing, entire narrative story lines about his team. You'd rather have a guy like that than a guy that just doesn't do anything.

[02:31:22]

Yeah. Yeah.

[02:31:24]

Hello, big cat PFT, hanky wanky, and crybaby max. Mhmm. That was mean. My husband I forgot about that tweet. My husband dips and constantly leaves his spitters around the house.

[02:31:35]

He tells me don't throw them away until they are full. I think this is absolutely gross, but he thinks it's better than making a new 1 every day and then proceeds to say it's good for the environment. They get their food.

[02:31:44]

What do

[02:31:44]

I even say back to that?

[02:31:45]

Yeah. He's right. Although it is gross.

[02:31:47]

Spitters are fucking gross.

[02:31:49]

Discussing habit. I remember when we first started working, out of the New York office, and it was a time when there were no Lucy's, there were no nicotine pouches. Like, everybody in that office dipped constantly.

[02:32:01]

And every Mountain Dew bottles.

[02:32:03]

No. I so No caps on them. The Mountain Dews are different because they're, like, they're green, so they're little tinted. But people walking around with, like, Pepsi bottles and water bottles Mhmm. That were just filled to the brim with dip spit Mhmm.

[02:32:15]

Everybody all the time. That was that was gross looking back on it.

[02:32:19]

It's it's, because yeah. I mean, I'm I'm a loosey guy, but it you know, back in the day, having tip you can't have a bottle after it gets, like, a quarter full. You gotta throw it out. Because then you're spitting and it's splashing back. It's gross.

[02:32:36]

Can we

[02:32:36]

bring like, fill 1 up? That's just disgusting.

[02:32:38]

Can we bring back the spittoon that they had in cartoons where you would, like, spit into it from across the room and make that nice satisfying ding?

[02:32:45]

Yeah. Shout out to this guy for looking out for the environment, though. What a great spin zone.

[02:32:50]

Everyone in this room has accidentally tasted their spit.

[02:32:53]

Right? Yeah. I mean, I

[02:32:54]

I only went to call it for a year, but in my college days and when I lived in in Boston, my my roommates dipped, and I didn't. And the the number of times, like, waking up and drinking being hungover and taking a sip of something and it being dip spit, like, there's truly No worse. Nothing worse with a hangover.

[02:33:11]

Yeah. I lived in a basement hall house,

[02:33:13]

which was Drinking dip spit. Yeah.

[02:33:14]

There was just dip everywhere. Everywhere. Everywhere.

[02:33:19]

I'm

[02:33:19]

a guy, but think this question is pertinent. Every time my wife comes home after running errands, going to the gym, etcetera, she asked me if I jacked off while she was gone. How can I get her to stop asking me besides saying yes and having a weird conversation every time? I also don't want to lie to her, but the answer is usually

[02:33:37]

good. I was gonna say, he's definitely jerking off. So yeah. What Yeah.

[02:33:41]

I think I think this guy's confused because she just 100% has your number.

[02:33:47]

Yeah.

[02:33:47]

And she and you you have a tell. There's something where she comes back, and she knows maybe don't do a good enough job cleaning up. That's why she's asking you all the time. If you stop jacking off, I bet you she'd stop asking. Maybe turn

[02:33:59]

off the porn before she gets back. Yeah. That'd be funny if she just kept on walking into him blasting porn.

[02:34:05]

Yeah. Or or she, like, goes on the computer and autocorrect just pops up. Also, yeah, just don't jerk off

[02:34:11]

a couple times. Say no, and she'll probably stop asking. If you keep saying yes

[02:34:15]

Maybe you can get some.

[02:34:16]

Yeah.

[02:34:16]

Mhmm.

[02:34:17]

Yeah. Just be like, no. I was saving it for you. Girls love hearing that.

[02:34:20]

Yeah. You're probably you're probably you're fucking up because she's coming back. She might be horny. And she's asking

[02:34:28]

gym. Yeah.

[02:34:29]

She's asking you if you jacked off because she wants to bang. Yeah. And when you That's a great point. When you don't immediately respond with let's go bone, then she's like, he jacked off.

[02:34:38]

Yeah. He must jacked off.

[02:34:40]

This was a tweet. I don't know. I it it got it went pretty viral on Twitter, from Tory tweeted, my sister asked for a pod wreck for a 6 hour drive.

[02:34:50]

This this isn't got this

[02:34:52]

isn't guys on Obviously,

[02:34:53]

Tory listened to part of my take. This is her review, and this is from Lex. So this is chicks.

[02:34:58]

Okay.

[02:34:58]

Yeah. Max from hashtag PMT is so fucking annoying when he sucks off the Eagles constantly. So that was Lex's review.

[02:35:07]

I think that was on Friday's episode, so it was after his lion's rant, which did make no sense, but we have to let him just do what he wants. That was it was natural. He was doing it off air too.

[02:35:18]

That was just, like, immediate aftermath of a game that didn't go your way.

[02:35:22]

Correct. So I do think that people forget sometimes that, like, we will record a right after a game, and that is the dumbest time for us. Like, the dumbest time for our brains is immediately after a game and having 0 time to process what we watch.

[02:35:39]

Yeah. You know what? The the best way to do it is to watch another game and then go ahead and talk about the game before the last

[02:35:45]

game that you saw. But we can't we're we're not able to process. No.

[02:35:49]

Very normal. Do we want to. No. And, also, I don't think podcast would be as good if we

[02:35:52]

did that.

[02:35:53]

Do you wanna sit there and listen to somebody that you agree with all the time?

[02:35:55]

If we're just like, yeah. Actually, looking over my notes, you know, they should've gone no. I just wanna be like, hey. Dumb coach, stupid interception. That's home games.

[02:36:06]

So stupid

[02:36:07]

at home games.

[02:36:08]

They play all their games.

[02:36:08]

Bang. This podcast done.

[02:36:10]

If you

[02:36:10]

if you want somebody that gets it right, like, listen to Malcolm Gladwell or talk to her.

[02:36:15]

Yeah. We ain't ever gonna get it right, and we take pride in that. But, yeah, Lex was it Lex? We heard your we heard your I

[02:36:23]

understand.

[02:36:23]

I understand.

[02:36:24]

Loud and clear.

[02:36:24]

Because we take criticism, you know, valid criticism. We take it seriously. So we will make steps to make sure that Lex feels like her needs have been met.

[02:36:33]

And for the fans, just so you know, at home, Max and Hank are actually very aware. They'll oftentimes like, it was probably every, like, once a month for each of them will finish the show, and they'll just be like, I talk too much.

[02:36:47]

Oh, yeah.

[02:36:49]

Oh, that oh, that Friday, I was thinking I was like, that was

[02:36:51]

a big

[02:36:52]

talk too much. I mean, Max has to

[02:36:53]

do it now for the, you know, the the 5 or 6 years when I was editing the podcast. I would be listening back and then hear myself talk and then get mad and be, like, why?

[02:37:03]

Do you ever edit yourself out now? Oh, yeah. Oh my god.

[02:37:05]

In the beginning the first few years, I was editing everything.

[02:37:09]

As soon as I started I just go, like, 4 x speed that you can't even actually hear what I'm

[02:37:14]

I take that. I you guys don't talk too much. I love having multiple voices, like memes. He's been fucking talking all episode. Yep.

[02:37:22]

Do you guys ever get the thing where, like, you you record a podcast, then you go home and you go to sleep? Usually, like, on a Sunday, it'll be late. We'll, you know, try to fall asleep at, like, 12:30, 1 AM. And as you're laying there in bed trying to fall asleep, you just keep saying to yourself, I shouldn't have said that 1 thing. All the time.

[02:37:40]

You know that you're wrong. You know that you are very wrong, and then you just know that you have to wake up the next day and have hundreds of people tell you that you were wrong about the thing that you know that you're wrong.

[02:37:50]

Or, like, I shouldn't have reacted that way all the time. And I'm I think that's actually why we're successful is that we actually are still critical of ourselves because if we if I went home every night and been like, nailed that

[02:38:02]

Yeah.

[02:38:03]

It would probably suck. But yeah. No. I I don't sleep.

[02:38:06]

I edited out, like, a whole thing that we said last episode. About what? We just kept talking about how Tez Watkins from Oregon is a really good receiver. His name is Tez Johnson.

[02:38:15]

Yeah. That's Watkins. That's that's why I just called him Tez. Yeah. We appreciate that.

[02:38:18]

Yeah. Good job, man.

[02:38:20]

Complete denial that anyone even listens to the show and that this is a podcast, and that's how I that's how I live my life.

[02:38:27]

Yeah. No. I I I I know the minute I get something wrong, like, I get in my car on Sunday nights, and I am like, oh, fuck. Then I just have that moment, like, ah, whatever. I they'll, hopefully, be they'll be cool about it.

[02:38:39]

Like, this is my career, but I just tell myself, like, oh, I I was never gonna be, like, you know, and I don't consider myself someone whose opinion matters in sports talk. So, like, it doesn't matter. Yeah. Doesn't matter how dumb you are. Yeah.

[02:38:51]

It does matter, Hank.

[02:38:52]

Alright. Good show, boys. The whole booth is here. Booth, we got anything to say about Luigi? We disavow.

[02:39:01]

I mean, we got a whole booth of Italians.

[02:39:04]

I'm I'm curious to see what what the what the next play is.

[02:39:06]

For Luigi?

[02:39:07]

Yeah. Did you see the YouTube video?

[02:39:09]

What what do you think? Mario's gonna break him out?

[02:39:11]

Was that fake? What?

[02:39:12]

Yes.

[02:39:12]

What do

[02:39:12]

you think is gonna happen the next play?

[02:39:14]

I don't know. He said that there he said it's not over. I saw I saw a TikTok.

[02:39:18]

I'm pretty sure it's over.

[02:39:19]

It was a fake YouTube video. Or, like, it was it

[02:39:23]

wasn't him

[02:39:23]

that made it.

[02:39:24]

It just kinda wild that he got arrested for acting suspiciously in a McDonald's. Hank.

[02:39:27]

Oh, no. Get it. I want it. Hank, need need your thoughts. Can't edit this 1

[02:39:30]

up, buddy. I was gonna

[02:39:31]

say the answer to my question while

[02:39:31]

Hank thinks collects his thoughts, that

[02:39:41]

instant reaction from our Italian booth. Hopefully, Luigi doesn't get an Italian lawyer. Yeah. The lawyer shows up the first day. He's like, did you see a YouTube video?

[02:39:50]

The YouTube I mean, it looked like it would have been interesting if it was if it were real.

[02:39:55]

Okay.

[02:39:56]

But, apparently,

[02:39:57]

it's not. It's not. Hank?

[02:40:00]

I I don't know.

[02:40:00]

You don't wanna give your thoughts, Hank?

[02:40:04]

I just take everything with a grain of salt. I'm not I'm not just gonna believe everything. Totally. There's a lot of things that don't make any sense, and it's basically everything.

[02:40:12]

The media lies to you.

[02:40:14]

You know what's disappointing to the listeners is that we're gonna have a great post show conversation about whatever Hank's thoughts are right now.

[02:40:20]

Yeah. Yeah. But this is where I

[02:40:22]

get actually in my head because it's like, I'm not trying to spew conspiracy theories and then have everyone be well acted

[02:40:28]

for me.

[02:40:28]

Take some time.

[02:40:29]

Because I'm

[02:40:29]

not I'm not informed,

[02:40:31]

but my

[02:40:31]

initial reaction is

[02:40:33]

Friday, let's get a little presentation.

[02:40:35]

I just wonder Who writes down their manifesto as

[02:40:37]

a as a young kid? Ted Kaczynski?

[02:40:39]

Yeah.

[02:40:40]

Right. Old.

[02:40:40]

Pretty famous.

[02:40:41]

Connor

[02:40:41]

Stallion. No. But I'm saying, like, he's a he's a

[02:40:44]

he's a youth. Okay. Youth aren't writing full names. Pages.

[02:40:48]

So you're saying if it was a notes app, that that it would be believable?

[02:40:51]

I

[02:40:51]

don't think if it's 3 pages, that's a manifesto.

[02:40:53]

Hank, you put together, like, presentations for me.

[02:40:56]

And I'm never in person.

[02:40:58]

Okay. For, like, physical copies. Here's what we'll do.

[02:41:00]

And he's way younger than me.

[02:41:02]

I just I wonder if, you know, he was a heartthrob after his picture went out there. Girls were, like, swooning all over him. I wonder if he got to actually, like, enjoy his, like, brief celebrity run.

[02:41:15]

No. Probably not.

[02:41:16]

You don't think anybody you don't think he boned and a girl recognized him and was like He can't.

[02:41:20]

He's gonna be the guy. They only they only recognized him. They arrested him. Well yeah.

[02:41:24]

No. Before that, he was on the run for, like, 4 days. Yeah. But no 1 knew who he was. Somebody knew who he was.

[02:41:33]

Yeah. His full face

[02:41:34]

like, his face up, but, like, no 1 knew he was on the run. Yeah. But

[02:41:37]

you don't think anybody else recognized him? It was like, your your eyebrows look like that guy.

[02:41:42]

Maybe. Yeah. That was the big takeaway. It's like, guys like him, guys like me, guys like Nikki Smokes, we shouldn't be doing that with our eyebrows. Yeah.

[02:41:49]

You just get caught. Jets, Jaguars game preview on Friday will be Hank's conspiracy theory hour. I give you a full hour. Numbers.

[02:42:00]

11. 3. 8. 99.

[02:42:03]

Poked. 17.

[02:42:07]

95. 21.

[02:42:08]

What'd you say, Jack?

[02:42:11]

Jack said 19. 19. Right, Jack? 19 for Jack. 93.

[02:42:17]

Did someone say 93?

[02:42:19]

No 1 said 93. I thought pug did too. You said 99 pug. 90 4 is coming soon. Love you guys.