Happy New Year to everybody from us here at Smart Lists every week, you already know the drill. We one of us brings a guest and the other two don't know. And everybody's surprised when we talk to them and then basically just trying to get to us, making fun of Beethoven. Anyway, smart list. You're listening to it. Let's go to. Smart. You want to do a snap so we can start chatting? I think our guest is already ready to rock.

Good, let's do it start. Have fun. Roland is safe.

We were already rolling. We better have been rolling on that, Rob. Yes. I don't think we we can't afford to clear. I was just going to say that's a wham song is. No, that's Band-Aid. Band-Aid.

Do they know it's Christmas? They know it's Christmas.

Time is a so if it wasn't wham in it, George Michael and Andrew Ridgeley was not invited. It was not. How do you know.

But Mejor was in it. Bono is in it.

Bob Dylan was in it. Who just sold his records. Bob Dylan was not in it because he was. He did the American one. Oh no. That was. Yeah. So that was Live Aid, right?

That was no, that was Band Aid, which was the precursor to Live Aid. That was when they did the Christmas song. That was that was put together by Bob Geldoff. Bob Geldof, Sir Bob Geldof to you. Sorry, name the band. The Bob Geldof was in five, four, three, Pink Floyd, Boomtown Rats.

God, when did you become such a music dork?

Boomtown Rats biggest hit. Tell me why I don't like Mondays. Tell me why I don't like what is their album drop.

Well, it already dropped and then it smashed the drums and smashed over.

So there was live aid. Right, which was the Quincy Jones. No. Wrong again. Wrong again.

Band Aid was the first one was do they know it's Christmas? Then the Americans did that with Quincy Jones. Put it together. We are the people. We are the world. Bruce Springsteen famously showed up beach.

I'm brand new to the planet. That was the Constitution.

That was a little earlier. That was a little early. That's a great song. The Constitution is a great song. Oh, that's jazz. Sure. Is it fusion fusion.

But then they did. I watched Live Aid. And here's another great fact about Live Aid. It was both the American and the English version were opened by anybody.

No. Phil Collins opened the one in London, then he got on the Concorde, flew to Philly and opened the one in Philadelphia. Hmm. What do you mean open? It was the opening act. Oh. But needed the Concorde to make that curtain to make up the time.

Yeah. Yeah. Hey, why didn't they stop making the Concorde?

It was always my dream as a kid to get out of that thing. And you get over to London.

I'd like to know from what I understand the operator, it kind of like brains operate those huge flagship stores. They don't make any money, like on 57th Street or Fifth Avenue. They don't make any money, but they're good for the brand. That's kind of what the Concorde was like.

A fire hose is smart. Did you take a smart pill this morning or are you back on Coke? Listen. Shut up. Do you not want answers as Christ, I did fly on it twice. It was quite nice. You did? Yeah. That thing was. What was it like going to the sonic boom? You know, it actually pulsed. There was like this like little pulse every like thirty seconds. Is it like accelerated and went through these speeds.

And I didn't have descended at a really steep, steep angle I guess, because I had to keep up that speed as long as they could before they came down. I don't know.

But I guess that was like a dream of mine to do that as a kid.

That's cool. Let me tell you what a dream is. Is is our is our next guest or will I see you're pulling up something else to Borris with or is it about looking up the Concorde crash?

A few people did it, just a few, but anyway. Huh. Oh look at that. Not just I never said just a few. He's so reading.

Can we carry on. Yeah. Can we just have something to tighten up in the edit. Yeah. Well still there. I'm still here. I'm right here. Just go on. This is what Coke does to you. I, I'm looking at you can start to just obsess over something.

What are you a coke expert. Jesus, look at this guy. We brought a Coke expert.

OK guys. OK, yeah. Tighten up guy. Let me pull up my notes. Oh jeez.

Yeah, I do a little bit of research when I invite somebody to pretend that you know what you're talking about. No, I don't want to trick anybody. All right. Now, listen, this week's guest is a little something different for us.

While, yes, he is an actor, he hasn't always been one. OK, started out as a political science major. He then became a young cop in training. He then became a motorcycle vagabond. He then broke into Hollywood, playing beloved characters such as Zordon Dalton sniggered and Walter Wayson, an amateur pedicurist. He has only one real eyebrow and three fake fingers. Man It's Brian Xavier Cranston, the.

I didn't know a lot of that, but when three finger, what are you talking about, three big fingers, look how real they all look right there. He didn't just I believed you. I believed you when you said three fake fingers. I only have to fake fingers. He fibbed about. How are you going? Oh, my gosh. It's so nice to see you, Bryan Cranston.

How are you, man?

Yeah, I'm OK. I'm I'm doing well. I'm excited to be on this show, and I can't think of three more smart little guys. Thank you.

Between the three of us, we can get one good thought together right off the bat. Brian, I want to say, first of all, we're so gosh, honored to have you here, Jason. What an incredible guest. This is a classy guest here.

We don't know each other well, but we've met many times over the years in the here's in theirs. And, you know, you're one of those guys. You're such I don't want to embarrass you. You're such an incredibly talented guy. And I mean that because you can and have done it all. You're super funny. You're a super great actor, and you've done it kind of seemingly you've just kind of done what you wanted. Does that does that resonate with you?

Do you feel like you've done kind of what you wanted?

I was waiting for the third thing, the incredibly handsome part, I guess, that goes without saying, OK, OK, come on.

He put that in the chat window, did you not? You didn't read that. You put it in there. It's creepy. When he started, he starts texting you in the middle of the interview. But but I mean but I do mean that you are handsome.

Sorry, did I mention that? No, but I do mean that you you really have done so many different things. You have so many different years and it's so admirable. And do you again, go back to my question. Do you feel like you've done it the way you wanted to do it on your terms?

Hey, well, all of us began somewhere.

And when you first start out as an actor, I mean, you just so you know, short answers, Brian, short answers.

Some of us are pricks and some of us are really nice people. Good.

Are you go you know, you just learn to say yes right away because you want to pay rent and pay for your pictures and resumes in those days and classes and stuff.

And if you get lucky like we all have, one job begets another, begets another, and all of a sudden you you're in a position where you kind of have actually a little say so in your in your destiny. And, you know, that's that's a really lucky break for any actor.

I think so, too, because a lot of people don't like the word luck. I think I completely believe that a lot of it is luck, but luck. There's some somebody there's a smart saying that I don't have right now, but it's Bushrod.

Feel free to book. Yes, you guys will probably straighten me out. It's something about like luck comes to those who are prepared, something like that when opportunity meets preparation. Yeah. Yeah. Luck of. Yeah.

Oh man. That's amazing. I'm going to get that printed on some plates.

Yes. And then break. We get so much cover with our title, you know we can just be as dumb or I can as I really am with Smart List. Now Brian, in the incredible research that I've done for this interview, I did stumble upon sort of a kindred experience with our upbringing. A, you grew up in Canoga Park and I was just up the street in Woodland Hills. But B, you had a father. I don't know if he's still with us.

Mine is. But that was also in the industry and had something short of overnight success. And I'm wondering how that affected your your commitment to your career, to your ambition. Did it give you rocket fuel or did it did it worry you?

It gave me great pause, actually, because my father, led by the ideal that he was destined to become a star, and when he didn't become a star, it really destroyed him.

And through extension, it destroyed the family.

And my whole family just blew up. When I was about 11 years old, 12 years old, went to live with my grandparents. We were foreclosed on on our house.

And so this little house in Canoga Park where my mom and dad, you know, raised my brother and myself and my little sister, which was home and which was a sanctuary for us all of a sudden was nonexistent with a big red sticker on the door, foreclosure bank owned, get out.

You know, it was like a scarlet letter. How old were you about? I was eleven. Yeah. And, you know, my dad always was working, wasn't working. He had a job. He didn't have a job. He had a good year. Bad year. I remember one year we we got a pretty new car and then the following year we got rid of that car and got a really old car. And then one year we.

Put in a built in swimming pool, which was fantastic, the next year, I remember my mother saying we couldn't afford the chemicals to swim. So it turned out to be less this pond of God, of mosquitoes.

And everything you're saying is exactly painting Breaking Bad chemicals.

So that didn't drive you to study a career that is a bit more of a meritocracy as opposed to something that is left up to the decision of a sometimes unpredictable audience?

Yeah, it did. Well, my dad was gone. I didn't see him for at least 10, 11 years. And so with that vacuum, I kind of got attached to the idea of law enforcement, because in those days, I don't know if you're old enough to remember you. I'm old and all of you, but not by much.

They used to have career days at high schools and they used to take over the gym and have military and firemen and the gas company and everybody represented. And one of those was the LAPD. And so I thought, wow, that's an image of a masculine man. And so that looks like the right thing to do and they're in control. So I started kind of wondering about that. I became a police explorer and I did really well out of 116 16 year olds all throughout Los Angeles.

I graduated first in the class.

Wow. So that told me, well, this is what you should do then, right? Very pragmatic. So I got involved in and I went to Valley Junior College to start studying because we had no money. And then I was going to transfer to UCLA with this police science degree and then go into the LAPD. That was my whole plan. Second year of Valley College. My counselor says you need some elective courses. So I took oh, acting.

I did some of that when I was a kid. My dad was an actor and I did a couple of commercials and things like that. That sounds like fun. Let's do that. And the first class I got into was a black box theater and the teacher who is, you know, over this whole thing, teaching these young kids. So he's handing out these scenes you to read this. And depending on who you were standing next to, that's who your reading partner with you to read this, you to read this.

You do read this go.

And I looked down at the page very nervous and it said a couple is making out on a park bench.

Oh, my God.

I looked up and I saw the girl I was supposed to read with and she was really cute.

And I thought, oh, my God Almighty. Oh, my God, I'm 19 years old. You tell me that's your wife. I'm going to freak out.

It's not my wife. It's your wife. Jason, what is your wife?

We'll be right back after these messages. She was amazing. Oh, she was amazing.

I agree to guys, by the way. It should be noted that that Jason so nervous. He has career day on the set of Ozark once a week.

I mean, this is how nervous he is, OK? I don't trust employment in this business.

Wait, Brian, I want to know, like, family questions.

So how does your mom raise you? Where did your dad go when you guys finally reconnected?

What was that like? It's kind of sad. My my mom started drinking and married four times and had numerous boyfriends. She was kind of like Blanche Dubois and put all her attention and effort and energy into the attention of men. Right. And my dad remarried and went off and I don't know, they were drinking a lot and probably doing some drugs and it was very unstable. So we just stayed away for a long time. And you were with your grandparents at this time?

I was with my grandparents for a year. Then I went back and my brother and I lived with our our mother again. But there was bad influence. And so by the time I was sixteen, I was pretty much on my own and trying to figure things out.

I mean, the obvious question is, why are you not, you know, holding up liquor stores right now or incarcerated or I mean, why why are you so high functioning? Because I'm out on parole. Why do you why are you so balanced? You know, you strike me as a very kind man. That's probably a really decent on set and probably a great family man yourself. I mean, is it just because you had an opposite model to look at?

And basically I'm just going to go left where everything else went, right? Yeah, that's it. Yeah. It's like, OK, so that example didn't work and neither did that one. Right. So don't do either one of those things. Right. And yeah, you know, it's not the thing I would wish on anyone else and I wouldn't give that to my daughter. I've been married now for 31 years and we have a 27 year old daughter and life is good.

And yeah, just what you said is right is like you learn from your parents, hopefully it's good things and sometimes it's the opposite of. And so you have to just kind of forge your own way. Can I just say as the sort of the outlier to these kinds of backgrounds, the three of you, what sort of what I've noticed is the three of you have stories that are not dissimilar in the sense that you had moments in your younger life.

There was a lot of sort of trauma and familial trauma, et cetera, and all three of you guys. And Brian, I'm just sort of just finding this out. All three of you guys kind of went the other way. And I think that that's really interesting. Jason, you have gone since the day I've known you.

You've always sort of sought out having a really firm, solid family life in a home life. And you settle down once you kind of got to a certain age and you sort that out.

And Sean, you, too. You have a in the circus, you and you still sort of are.

Let's be let's be fair, you know, but you also have you know, and all three of you guys, it's funny to to see three guys who had a lot of adversity at a young age dealing with problems and issues that aren't necessarily appropriate for 11 year olds or 12 year olds.

It's a lot to take on.

And don't sell yourself short either. You know, you know, you you will grow up in a house where you never had to fold any clothes at all. You know how to fold a shirt and run a load of wash. Now, right in the last couple of years, you look at you, you can load a dishwasher now because it was always taken care of by the magic people.

Price point it is every morning you just show up. How did these get folded, Mama?

That's that is listen, let me just tell you something. When I was at boarding school and I don't want to get into a hung back and forth with you, Bateman. Smart List is sponsored by Better Help Online Counseling, you know, the New Year can be a really funky, weird time for people.

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All right, back to the show, I'm fascinated with what happens in a child's brain that makes certain kids turn on and become self-aware and know to make those opposite decisions that were presented to them in a negative form.

Why or why do some kids go left, like Jason said, instead of right or vice versa? Why is that?

Yeah, it's because it also speaks to the sort of nature versus nurture thing. You know, if if if it is nature, then I am prewired to repeat some of the same challenges that my parents went through.

And if it's nurture, I'm also perhaps predestined to go those directions because this is the kind of parenting that I'm getting now. Having said all that, I had great moments of parenting from both of my parents, but thankfully I had, you know, somewhat of an ability to kind of cherry pick the best moments of their parenting and eliminate some of the things that they probably would admittedly do a little bit differently today.

But, Brian, when you were 11, did this is not a typical conversation on our show. This is probably about as heavy as we've ever been. Jesus Christ, Cranston. Yeah, you really killed our vibe, right?

We're going to get into his tequila company in a minute here. Yeah. Yeah, that's good. It's going to be good.

By the way, this is a great story. So he didn't turn to the booze and stuff. He just actually started a booze company. He was like, I'm going to just monetize this.

But when you were 11, did you know that?

Did you did you recognize that, hey, shit, this is tough or did you just kind of roll with the punches at the time? Well, you know, that's a tough age 11, 12, when you're just starting to look outward thinking that your foundation is all set. This is Mom, Dad or God. Now what's out there? And all of a sudden the rug is pulled out and everything that you thought was solid is not. So it caved me in.

I became an introvert for many years, all through middle school and high school. There's probably a half a dozen people that remember who I was in high school because I was just sucked up against the wall. I didn't have any confidence. I didn't have a safety net in anything. So I would just observe. Now, consequently, I think that actually helped me in later years because I was just watching everything right.

But somehow you managed to avoid the booze and the usually that that pushes people into alcohol because they're so reserved and looking for a way to to open up.

Yeah, I think it's also that sense of.

I don't want to be out of control, I you know, there's a certain amount of of safety in in staying in control, and I think that's what what did it for me is that I saw my parents, you know, I was going to say, what is the what is your fear from growing up like that that you don't want to what you know, that that what did that make you become because of everything being out of control?

One of your fears is not being in control.

And it's also looking at people, you know, doing something that perhaps you don't want to do when you get older. And I wonder how that affects, like comedy versus drama for you. If you're like me, you don't really make a huge distinction between the two because neither one of us are usually cast is like the real crazy comedy guy or the real dangerous drama guy. We kind of play kind of the the guy in the middle that's either getting chased by the scary guy or reacting to, you know, the idiot like Will Arnett or Sean Hayes.

Right.

Hey, listen, I first of all, I take offense for Brian on this because I remember there were plenty of episodes of Malcolm in the Middle where Brian was a fucking idiot.

Thank you. Well, you're welcome, man. I got your back. Such a good show. So.

So do you really care about comedy versus drama or you just kind of looking for the other parts of the package?

You know, I care about if I've been doing too much of one, I care about going into the other, you know, and I don't want to be known as any one thing. I want to keep challenging myself. I want to keep trying new things and discover if I'm any good at it. But at the very least, you know, I just don't want to be pigeonholed. So when when Malcolm in the Middle ended after seven years, I was offered two pilots to play a sweet, goofy dad.

And I immediately, of course, it was no because I would be derivative of myself if I went right into something else.

You just can't because that's the danger, though, right? Is like in the perfect scenario, the thing that you're doing becomes a huge success. But with that comes being pigeonholed as that, because now that's a very high profile thing like Malcolm in the Middle was high, but they're.

Oh, but but fortunately for you, you had a pre-existing relationship with Vince Gilligan. So he was able to kind of look past that and throw Breaking Bad your way. Yeah, it was unbelievable. You know, my episode of X Files was just an actor needing a job and going out and doing it.

And and then nine years later, I get this call after Malcolm finished. And Sean, this this speaks to the luck factor. Fox said, keep the sets up. We might do an eighth season of Malcolm in the Middle. And everybody's like, yeah, that'll be great.

In April, late April and early May, they called when the up fronts are going on, they said no, we had a very good pilot season. Thank you, guys. You did well and you're on your own.

So we thought at the four asked about later that month, I get the call to go see a guy named Vince Gilligan. Do you remember him from X Files? Kind of. And he wants to see you about this new project called Breaking Bad. And I read it and I thought, oh, my God, this is amazing. I met with him. He says, I want to turn Mr Chips into Scarface. And I think you're you're the guy to do it.

And I know that AMC and Sony both said, wait, no, wait, wait, wait. Walter White can't be that goofy dad from Malcolm in the middle. Please, please. Let's see others. Let's you know, and he was my champion and I needed that good fortune to have someone in my corner to say, no, no, no, he's an actor. That's what he was doing then. And this is what and so he copied off is episode that he wrote and produced on X Files and sent it to the people at Sony and AMC and and said, look, this is when I met him.

So now you tell me, do you think he can do.

Wow. Yeah. And also the in on that show is that, you know, you don't start at the beginning of it as how you end in it. You start as a very unassuming sort of passive type of almost Malcolm in the middle type of character was. So that part of it is a huge fit. And hopefully, I guess they did see that that might be a nice, smooth transition point and therefore you would be perfect.

Yeah. Now, what was interesting and the luck factor comes in is that we shot the pilot February and March of 07. Had we got that eighth season of Malcolm in the Middle, I would not have been available to shoot that pilot someone else. Isn't that amazing?

Yeah. You know, this isn't an industry where Brian is going to say something. You can't just cut our guest. Oh, no.

I was just going to say that it is absolutely my belief, I dogmatically believe this, that a career in our business cannot be fully realized without a healthy dose of luck sprinkled throughout. I totally agree. Sure.

But I was going to say is an. Kind of interesting that when you start getting recognition for your amazing work and and fame kind of just happens upon you, your feeling is like, well, I don't understand. I've always been here doing my thing. And it seems like everyone around you kind of changes. And we all know that recognition on a wide scale is always a good thing because it helps getting your next gig. But what was your feeling like when Breaking Bad?

Because you weren't not famous because of Malcolm in the Middle, but Breaking Bad just made you hugely successful and famous. So what was that feeling like? Did you feel like finally I got the thing that I've been after or you kind of like it?

Try not to buy into the critics, no matter how positive or negative, you just kind of keep your head in the game.

I think getting back to the beginning of the conversation, I just learned to take my ability to apply the work ethic. Just keep your head down and go to work. Yeah. If someone taps you on the shoulder and says, hey, we want to give you a job, though. Oh, great. If someone taps you on the shoulder and says we want to nominate you for some. Oh wow. Really? Oh, that's fantastic. But you never, ever look to take a job because you think it's going to get you nominated for something.

Yeah. Jason. Well, I know John well.

And now, Brian, this is this is the other thing I have to admit to you now that we're sitting here talking to each other, I was really, really late to that Breaking Bad game.

And I we've not we've met each other passing through the business over the over the years. You've always been so kind. And I've always looked up to you as one of the most talented people in the business and somebody you haven't seen Breaking Bad. You've got to see it.

So I just watched it like a year ago, two years ago.

And so this is really kind of crazy for me to meet to see you right now again. Oh, that's like holy shit.

So it's much fresher in my mind than from the notes, though.

Brian was come to know, you know, so locked at the pictures. Lost definitely little thing. Yeah. Yeah. Not a big deal.

Honestly, honestly not. It's just a slight adjustment.

I actually want to know, when you were making that show, did you feel that storytelling kind of that satisfaction making it because the writing was so strong?

I mean, the performances were off the hook.

But did you feel that sense of like every time you got a script going, like, yes, yeah.

Yeah. As we know, it's all about the strength of the writing. If if it's there, then you can elevate that and really embrace it. But if it's not there, there's there's not much you can do. That pilot script was audacious.

You know, he's what he's wanted.

He told me and he said, I want to change the lead character from a good guy to a bad guy. And I thought that's never been done. Yeah.

You know, even Tony Soprano was who he was and Vic Mackey and all these characters that came before.

But to actually change a character and go without knowing how many seasons you guys were going to get, were there conversations with Vince about how you were going to calibrate that arc based on not knowing whether it was going to be a three season arc or a six season arc for that to land the plane where that character goes? He didn't really know what kind of angle he could put the pitch at right now. That's the good thing about Vince Gilligan's anxiety, is that he said, well, I don't know if they're going to let me do this, but we'll just give it a try.

They'll probably cancel us within the first six episodes. I know they will. They're not going to let us do what I want to do. But what the hell? We'll just give it a try and just try.

And and the actors are the ones with the anxiety and insecure. Yeah. You know, media people always ask us, did you know your show Will and Grace are arrested or Ozzy? Did you know that was going to be a hit? And of course, we don't. You just react to something. You respond to the writing in the character and you give it your best shot. You hope. And then it turned out to be the way it turned out.

It's like, oh, my God.

Yeah. You know, Brian, not of course, I have to ask this question because we're talking about the thing that really just catapulted your career. And I'm sorry for asking it, but do you ever feel a sense of having to match it or top it?

I mean, obviously you probably ignore that because you're a great person and you're a super smart person and your head is in the game and you're a great actor.

But does any part of you inside just go, oh, my God, this next job? I actually have to it has to be as big as Breaking Bad. At least.

You know, when we were about to close out our production in 2013, I had that for sure. I thought, oh, the bar is so high I'll never be able to find. It's got to be something, you know.

And I was offered the movie Godzilla and I turned it down. You didn't think you could play a lizard?

I think you've got incredible range from. Yes, you got to be nice for yourself. Yeah.

And I said, I don't know, that's that's not going to work. And I turned it down twice and then I started. Thinking about it, and I realized, well, wait a minute, am I being snooty about this is this is not in nowhere the same realm as a Breaking Bad?

It's a completely different genre. It's a and I loved Godzilla when I was a kid. Yeah. And this is a good role. And you know what? Maybe that's exactly what I should do. Is something so different. Right, that it can't be really measured in the same way.

And plus those two passes taught you a little something about negotiating, too, and you a little bit.

A little bit. A little hard to get. Yeah. Yeah. The feet. And it filled a lot of gaps that filled a lot of gaps, I'm sure, to write to you.

Are you how do you cope with downtime. Are you always like I got to work. I kind of work.

I you know, that syndrome of saying yes as a beginning actor has is hard to turn that bus around, you know? So just naturally, I love to act. It's a it's really a passion of mine. I've been doing it for 40 years and it's so much fun. So when it stops being fun is when I when I retire. Yeah. Brian, I am.

You've had good luck because and also because you're very talented. But I feel the same way.

I'm very not precious about doing stuff and I've made a ton of what could from the outside to be looked at as blunders. But I also don't give a shit because in the world life is so long and so and they're all just experiences.

And I'm not I don't feel worse as a person today because I've done some things that didn't go where I never I never set out to do things that were crowd.

I think you also have a great deal of faith that you're not going to suck in it. The product might be something maybe less than what you would want it to be. But I think we all know that we don't have control over four corners of a product. You can only do your part as well as you can. You and you. Truly, it is to me that you look at the rest of the package, who else is involved? What's what's it kind of going for?

And the actual part itself or the the prospects of success or financial growth or any is sort of second to what the whole thing is going to be or what you hope it can be. Is that is that something that is that how you kind of factor things, Brian, or is it is it more about the part itself?

It's about the money. The it's good for you.

Finally know, the moment that I stop thinking about money is the moment I've started making more than I ever thought I would invest in my life. And it's never really been about that. As a matter of fact, I had an epiphany in one of the rounds being a working actor all through the days of those shows.

In the 80s, I was doing every guest star on every show murder she wrote in Matlock and this and that and chips and, you know, you name it and all that stuff.

And I kept going into an audition thinking I was there to get a job. And then I finally realized, oh, this is the wrong way to go in. You have to go in to do a job, not to get a job. So if you walk into an office and you don't want anything from them, you're there to give them something. Your energy completely changes. Yeah, you're you're come in there with confidence and you leave them with your work, with you worked on it and you did the audition and you walk away.

And from that point on, I've never stopped the best.

Yeah, that is great advice for young actors because I battled that a ton. You know, you you try to find that that healthy indifference walking into to a job. But, man, it's so hard when you were somewhat savvy about what the prospects of this particular project could be. It's it's tough to turn that off.

Did you feel that pressure, Jason, when you were young, like because you did you were a big breadwinner for your family. Did that ever come into it? Well, you're going into an audition.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was it was difficult to find that the thing that that Brian's talking about, where it's this I'm just going to prepare this scene, this audition and just kind of do it the way I want to do it. And if they like that, then they can have that. But I'm not going to try to to hit this invisible target and try to guess what they want because I so badly need the job. That's that's a it's a it's a it's very lucky if you can get to that place.

If Brian is talking about and, you know, it's not too dissimilar from, you know, growing up and trying to, you know, attract somebody to you, you know, in school, like, you know, if you can find that sort of that's sexy indifference and, you know, that kind of playing hard to get, even if it's not manipulative, if it's if it's sincere indifference where you don't need this relationship, then you just become really attractive.

But that's a tough line to because that's a manufactured indifference.

Well, no, I mean, I think that's why I'm obsessed with Jason Bateman. He won't let me in if you've got your room clean upstairs. Right. If you've if you've got your stuff together, then you are somewhat self-reliant. In a lot of things in life, right, and you you kind of rightsize a lot of things and and you don't press at least that's my own thing, I, I try to apply that to as much as I can.

Mm hmm. He's the man with manufactured indifference.

Please welcome Jason Bateman and we will be right back.

Sean, I feel like people are shoving in my face all the time, their stories about food, about how important it is to get a good night's sleep. Yes, but I just know for certain people like you, my friend, because we talk about this all the time, that getting a good night's sleep is not easy. Yeah, no. It's something I've been struggling with for years and years and years. You know, the news I worry a lot about like personal things.

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Brian, because you're such a good, wonderful soul and you're kind and you're gentle and you are just an all around great guy and everybody knows this about you in the business. And on top of that, you're extraordinarily talented. I want to know what makes you mad, what made what pisses you off at work or just in life with people. Well, I don't you know, if if you are the number one on the call sheet, I try to set a tone, I take my cash whether I'm doing a play or doing a film or whatever, and I say, all right, here's here's what I think.

I think we're the luckiest bastards in the world. So I think that we should be on time and I think we should all be prepared and come in with ideas and let's be able to feel free to have artistic frustration. But let's leave all the drama out of it. Let's go. Let's have fun. Let's go to work and go home. And if we can do that, it's great.

I get in my car with the other kazmin, this fucking guy with this rule, and it's like, know your stuff. Yeah.

And, you know, know your work and be kind. Be respectful. And I truly know.

How do you deal with somebody who isn't that. Well, I pull him aside, yeah, and I said, what, you know, basically, what's the problem? Is there a problem? Can I help you with solving this as a reason that you're not on time? Got you're a good guy.

You're such a good guy. And I talk to you for a second. Just don't you want to put me aside?

Yeah. Yeah. What do you usually find that those people are usually afflicted with a lack of experience, a sense of entitlement insecurity? It's usually fear, right. I found that bad behavior usually comes from people that just don't don't feel comfortable. And then and then you you probably take that on as as number one and you make them feel a bit better.

Yeah, well, it's both, you know, it's the right thing to do as a as a person, but it's also the right thing to do for your production. You know, if incrementally, if every guest star comes onto your show and they feel comfortable they're going to perform better. Yeah. And if they perform better, the show is going to be better and everything is lifted. Everybody has a better time.

So, you know, that thing you talk about that kind of leadership on on set in that kind of there are so much I learned a lot from this guy, from Jason when we were doing arrested and guys let him finish early on season one.

This is a true story. And I don't know if you remember this and you did it very sort of gently. I remember thinking I had nowhere to go, but I remember being, like, saying to the first lady, like, what time are you rapping tonight? You know, the worst thing you can do. And and Jason and I were going to see him.

He looked at me and he goes, we got you for the whole day. Right?

And and it really and it really it really affected me in my place. And I understood in that moment, I got all of it.

I got the subtlety and the not so subtlety of it.

And it changed the way my entire behavior on sets for ever. I was influenced by Tom Hanks, Jim Garner, Dick Van Dyke, these these people who especially Tom, I've done several things for different projects with him. And and his comportment is just right where you want it to be. He's fun and he keeps it light. He absolutely knows his stuff. And everybody coming in better as well, you know, so you're playing, but you're playing within the context of the show.

And then he wraps early. Everybody goes home and it's like, that was a fun day. I can't wait for tomorrow.

Yeah. I've always told him I want to get a bracelet. Made sense, Ph.D.. What would Tom Hanks do? Yeah, yeah, yeah. He would fix a lot.

Brian, what would people be most shocked to learn that you're great at? I put in my 10000 hours, thank you to Malcolm Gladwell of loading the dishwasher. I am an excellent loader of a dish. Wow.

You know, I do literally struggle with that. I don't know what to do with the bowls because the bowls will take up a great deal of space unnecessarily. And if you stack them too much, you're not going to get a lot of water through there to clean that up. So I'm tempted sometimes to put it up on the on the cup rack, but then there's not enough room for that. How do you fight that temptation? Yeah, I just so at that point I just start breaking them.

You know, you don't need to clean ones that are broken. So that's a little look. Yes. I just break them and then and then my wife says, forget it, you can't load the dishwasher.

And when I say, OK, well, that was your plan. Yeah. The whole petulant, really evil genius. Yeah.

What's a dishwasher?

Very nice. So, Brian. So no no sports. No, you're not a closet opera singer or painter or a green thumb.

I have been known to play the drums a little bit. Oh, really? I used to run marathons. Oh really? Wow. Yep. I was a marathon runner.

Did you ever do the Boston? Because you got to do a sub for never did Boston. You go to sub for our time. Right, to get in there. Yeah. And I did all four of my registered times or all under four hours. No. Where were you.

Of course. Now why. Why, why did you stop. Why did you stop. Did your trick knee act up or something.

Because it's hard now. I'll tell you why I did it. I was on a soap opera in 1984. Which one?

You do have an incredible jawline loving. Oh yes. There's was a show called Loving on ABC and I was working in New York and I was one of the young knuckleheads, you know, in the soap opera days.

It was like you're either good person or bad person. And I was a good person and and I was on for two years.

And lo and behold, right before the end of the year, I was thinking, wow, this has been a great two years, but I think I'm going to move on and do something else. And I get called in the office and they fire me. Wow. It's like they didn't pick up my contract. And of course, it's like someone dumping you that, you know, you were going to dump and then they'd get a chance to do it first you go.

No, no, no, no.

Wait, wait, wait, wait. No, we can make this work. I mean, I quit.

So I was I was so despondent and felt so sorry for myself.

And a day that was on a Friday and then Saturday mopped around and on a Sunday, I said, get out of this. Grab a bunch of film, of course, real film in those days. And I grab my camera, my camera bag. And I said, I'm going to go out and I'm just going to shoot all day long and just do something creative. And I walk into Central Park and I go, What's all this? Oh, my God, is that it's that marathon.

Oh, is more than that.

I'm not going to be able to take pictures.

And I said, well, the first picture I took was of these two extremely fat cops in uniform. And you're like, what? I could have been yes, their bellies were touching each other, but they were six feet apart and and with a sign runners this way, runners that went out on a pretty good picture. So I started taking pictures and I stayed there for five and a half hours. And I watch this and I'm watching the sea of Humanity run.

I'm at the finish line at Tavern on the Green and I'm watching. And I said I heard myself say I could never do this. And then I stopped. Then I went, why couldn't I do that? I don't know if I can do that. Why would I say I can't do it? Yeah. The next year I was in that race. Wow. You wow. I well, I think had I not been fired, it wouldn't have happened.

Yeah.

Brian then have you always had that in you? Because this kind of goes back to what we started with, which is you were dealt kind of a crappy hand and you made the most of it. And there's another example, and I identify with that because I don't spend a lot of time just the way that I'm made up. And I wonder if that's the way you are that you had a Saturday to lick your wounds. And by Sunday, you said, get out of it and let's turn this thing around.

And I understand that. I feel like I'm really lucky. Do you feel you recognize that that's something that you're just born with?

Yeah, I've never been a I've never been a worrier.

And I think if your stability is rocked early on, like, again, wouldn't wish it, but I was more cautious and desiring, even as a late teen into my 20s of setting a foundation that felt more grounded to me. Otherwise I wouldn't be able to exist. Right. So I had to find something that a way of life that felt that I can stand tall on my own two feet without feeling like something's going to be taken again for me.

So it's just developing it from the beginning. Yeah, it's good.

Brian, you have been so, so kind with your time today, sir. You you certainly have set that solid base. It seems you were reaping all the rewards of all of those good decisions and going left instead of right, and and we're all the richer for it with everything that you're you're given us. So keep going. Please keep giving us more stuff, comedy, drama, whatever you got. Stage, screen. We'll take it all.

Yeah, thanks. And, you know, I just want to say, all in all sincerity, I have appreciated the three of you and your talents immensely. And I cannot wait to see everything you guys do. I do wait because I haven't seen anything you do.

But yeah, you you Brian, you are you're one of the all time great, good vibe guys you have. I swear to God you've got the best vibe and that's the highest compliment, I think that you could pay somebody and you're just such a solid, great vibe, dude. So thanks man. I love you Bri. Love everything you do.

Thanks, guys. Thank you for doing this, buddy. You bet. Right. So much. Great. Rest of the day. Take care. Bye now. Bye. You know, I would love to work on one of his sets. He just seemed like such a great, steady, calm leader that just would probably know no nonsense and lots lots of good work.

Did you guys watch Breaking Bad when it came out? Like I was there as I just watched it a year ago?

Yeah, same here.

I was pretty late to it as well as late, and then I motored through it. So great. One of the greatest shows of all time. Oh, my God. Incredible.

Well, I mean it along with with BoJack is consistently in the top five of all shows ever made. I would say that if will if even if you weren't on this, I'm always stunned. I mean, it's hard for Wisconsin.

BoJack Horseman. BoJack Horseman. Yeah, well, they get it there, too.

I think they do. OK, it's not gonna turn me into him. Oh, God. There he is. That sounds like a fucking.

Give us a little BoJack, will you give yourself some fucking BoJack. Oh, that is.

There it is.

No, listen, he's great, though.

I've always I used to run into him like on TV, you know, junket things with when he was on Malcolm in the Middle. I was on Will and Grace and always, always, always.

The guy is always the same, always so kind and always has a smile.

Yep. Always has such a great attitude and I meant it. He's just got such a great vibe. He's the guy that you want to talk to.

That's why, by the way, that's that's why he works. Not only is he incredibly talented, but everybody wants to be around nice people.

Yeah. I do think you need a bank of goodwill in this business because you are going to strike out a bunch of times. And if you've got a bunch of baggage behind you and some people hate you, they can't wait for you to get a couple of failures.

And it's like, okay, well, he's out. Why do you keep eroding your bank? Why do you do this chipping away at it?

Because it's just it's too big. Well, you know, Sean, you've got a very good reputation, too.

It should be known people really like you. All right. That's true. Everybody really likes you. That's very nice.

Any time I talk to people because people are starting to listen to this Martellus more than the one. Listen, I just found out I think we have we might have two listeners. We work hang out.

Yeah. Because we have Wisconsin. We had Wisconsin. Well, you've got a pretty good reputation. You both do. But it's but it has been taking water as.

Yes. Taking water. You know why. It's because you know what it is, is because people are so intimidated by my plastic surgery.

I think that's what it is. Right.

It makes them feel insecure, can't take how taught my neck. And so they just choose to hate you and say thank me for it. And they hate because they say it's affected my voice.

And I'm like, you know what, Jason? Great guest today. Hilarious, awesome, sweet, kind, talented guy.

And we didn't even get to his mescal company dorsum. But I know he's going with Aaron.

Paul Oh, really? Oh, really. He's your guest.

And now I'm doing not to mention the show he's got coming up on Showtime called Your Honor. I believe. I believe it is. Well, and it's not about a judge. It's not about a judge. It's not about a judge. No, no.

I hear it's very you know what Jason said when I asked him where he asked me where Amanda, his wife, was, and I said, Your Honor. So, Jason, what a great guest we are.

He he was very, very generous to say yes to this. We're happy to have him. We didn't get to a lot. He's slinging booze. He's a big Dodger fan. Yeah, well, he's only got two fake fingers, not three. That was news. Super good guy.

Super great guy. Thanks, Jason, for bringing him on. No, no. You're welcome. Make bail by buying smart. Smart.