Hello, listener, this is Jason Bateman, along with Will Arnett and Sean Hayes for the podcast called Smart List. That's a place you're looking for. You found it. Congratulations. It's not a real high concept podcast. One person invited guests. The other two don't know who that guest is. And then we chat.

Here we go, Swaby. Smart, smart list is presented by AutoZone, America's number one battery destination. Make a donation to St. Jude the next time you visit AutoZone as part of the St. Jude thanks and giving campaign going on all November and December. Jason, do you have dogs? I don't remember. I have two dogs, both sort of cat size, so I'm not I don't let them out that much.

So you're who does let the dogs out? Oh, God. Wait, wait, wait.

Let him answer the God damn this thing has been. This is a question.

I have a Brussels griffon that's kind of like that dog. Sounds like a not as good as it gets. Verdell, that goes down the trash chute that Jack Nicholson puts on. His name is Woody. And then there is a French bulldog named Hank. And that's that's my dude.

And do you have any references sort of post Ninety-Six or is that just you like to stay in that?

No, I don't think oh, actually, yes. The the Brussels Griffon was featured in a commercial a year ago. I don't remember what it was like a Darth Vader type of thing. Oh, man, what a story.

You really know how to spin your actual dog or that type of dog.

None of that type of dog.

You're not you're not training your dog, Verd, for film and TV right now.

No, but I'll bet you it's pretty lucrative. I think those animal trainers, what they make, but I'll bet it's not a little I made a kids movie with a lot of dogs in it, Natasha Leone and I did.

And. That's the name of it, show dogs, show dogs. Wait. Oh, really? That find a theater or was it mostly on the television?

We'll save that for another show. Go ahead. I feel like we're cutting you off, Sean. Robert Bennett, are you leaving or are you staying on?

Yeah, we're staying on because we want to snap check from our guest when they sit down in one minute. Oh, great God. I don't get the hell out of your way. Oh, I didn't know.

OK, I don't mind looking at you two while we're doing this. I prefer it. Nice. Thank you.

Stand by for one second. Surprise guest without saying anything verbally, if you could snap or clap for us if you're there.

Awesome. We are golden. Beautiful. Wow.

That's some extensive big hands, guys. What a special episode this is. Our guest today happens to have an album coming out December 18th. I've listened to it over and over again. I love every track on it. I can't wait to talk about it. The name of the album is McCartney three.

What's the name of the guy is Paul McCartney.

Paul McCartney one. Look at that. Hello. No, I guys want. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Wait a second. This is so cool. He looks so much like Paul McCartney. No, I told that all the time. But he sounds like himself. Wait, Sean Hayes.

Yeah. I'm sorry, sir. Yes, sir. Paul McCartney will get to you in one second. Sean, how did you do this? How did you make this? How the hell is going on?

Well, I'm telling you, Paul and I, we were in a pub throwing them back because we're both we're going to get the real story.

We're going to get the real story soon. What an honor.

Sean, keep quiet for a second. What an honor. What? I was just so humbled that you said yes to this. Well, I'm glad you're humbled.

Yes, sir. I like people to be humbled and a little bit frightened.

I'm a little bit frightened. It is it is a tremendous honor to have you here.

We you probably don't remember, but we met briefly a couple of times, very briefly. Not surprised years ago.

But it's on a yacht. Was it on a yacht? No, it was on a yacht, wasn't it? I've met everyone briefly.

Exactly.

Paul, we're so flattered you're here today and thank you. It's really kind of surreal to be looking at you and talking to you because I've been a fan like the rest of the entire world forever. But there's a billion questions I want to ask you. But where does one start with Quest? I know there's like a billion questions, the one I've always wanted to ask you for a very, very, very long time. And I'll just start right out.

How are you so fit? I myself fit. I don't think I am. Of course, you look better than I did 20 years ago.

You look great. You've always looked great. This is a nice show. I like you because you work out every day.

You know what I do a little bit. Yeah, but. And I'm vegetarian, so maybe that's got something to do with, I don't know, vegetarian.

You can get sneaky fat having a bunch of a bunch of pasta and a bunch.

Right. What is it that is truly cheese. Good.

Yeah. You say you do a little bit of work out. What is that. Is that a cardio thing? Do you push weight.

Just what do I do? I have a very definite routine. I don't have a trainer. It's just me. I get on the mat and I do a bunch of stuff. They're like like me.

So go write this down. You know, I've got to writing it down, rolling on the thing on the river, you know, rolling on a roller right now. Do a bit of that and then I do a bit of legs akimbo.

Yeah, sure, sure. And then I move on to a cross trainer elliptical and then I do. I mean, you know, I'm doing like five or ten minutes of these. Not a huge workout, but it's good. I like it. I'm going to do a bit of running and then I, I end with my favorite bit, particularly if I'm in the gym, because sometimes it's like a home gym. But if I'm in a gym and all the big guys, I've got big weights on the tool and all the big stuff.

At the end I do a headstand. And they come over in a very impressive man, right? I go know, thank you, but it's just it's not are you're going to say and I end with a birthday cake, which would be OK.

But I think this is going to be controversial. I think that that Sir Paul McCartney United should put out an exercise video together. It would be very good because we could really do that. Yeah, that'd be great. I think that people would like that. I would like it.

I'd watch it. You would watch it. Learn from it.

That would be. Yeah, that would be entertaining. He would he would spot you or you would spot him. Or would you just be snacking on stuff while he's doing it?

Sounds like he's in better shape than I am. So I think definitely I would be difficult.

Paul, first of all, where are you right now? I'm in New York, OK?

And you're in your place in New York.

New York? I'm actually in my office in New York. OK, do you spend most of your time in New York? No, I'm between America and England. Pretty much.

You have a preference. Careful here in England. Yeah, I don't care. I'm English.

Yeah. Yeah. But the thing is that I'm married to an American girl, Nancy. And so people say, you know, how much time do you spend in the countries? I used to say half and half, but now I say half and half.

Oh, nice. Well done.

That's that's what it is. I read that you spend most of your quarantine time soccer, writing more music and yen to me, like, you know, I've never met you. I'm in all of you, just like everybody else is.

And you think of like I saw you and Stephen Colbert once that you separate your fame from you, that you that in your head, you're just I just go work out and I'm nobody.

But then there is this famous person that you remove yourself from. Yeah, right. And that that you kind of like. Oh, I kind of like that. That guy's music kind of interesting.

And it's you know, it's true. It is weird. You know, I think it's it's a safety measure.

I think, you know, I know I'm very famous, but I don't want to walk around like I'm very famous. I like that bit that I had when I grew up. Right. I'm just going on a bus and just being, you know, there's one good thing about the virus is everyone's got masks.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. For anyone with the famous faces.

But no, I do separate him from me. Yeah. So me, I don't like to take pictures when people say, can I have a picture because everyone's got a camera in the world.

Yeah. And so I say I'm sorry I don't do pictures. Yeah. A line I got from watching Alec Baldwin once we have this little thing with Alec and a couple of mates and it's called the Yoga Boys, um, we do yoga together and like, we're terrible. I don't want to tangle with you guys anyway.

So, yeah, we're sitting around afterwards talking and we're having a bite to eat outdoors. Someone comes up to Alex could have autograph support and he looks without Alec. Look, I'm sorry, I don't do pictures. I held it. I just thought, that's the line. Yeah, I'm sorry.

I sort of feel like I have to say, look, you know, I'm happy to talk to you. Sit down. We talk because I like because I'm still me, right. The minute I put my arm around her, you put your arm around me. I feel like the monkey in Central Park. Yeah. Come and have a picture taken with the monkey, you know, and I don't like that it it puts me off.

I love that you talk about this so openly, this idea of you being this this person that you are. And there's this sort of humility to that you attribute that to where you grew up in Liverpool and your family and those kind of ideas that you've had from a young age then that you've never let go of. In a way. Yeah, I think so.

You know, I was very lucky with my family, uncles and aunties, cousins and all of that. There were like millions of them. My dad had seven in his family and my mom had two brothers. And so anyway, the minute they all start reproducing and produce a big, big family and it was great. They were so wonderful and wise and funny and optimistic, I really don't remember anything bad about it. So I grew up thinking that's how everyone's life is.

We're all we've all got lovely uncles. And, you know, when I met John, it turned out not to be true. He had a terrible upbringing. His dad left home when he was three. His mother got run over and killed outside of his aunt's place. It's a terrible story, but. Yes, I do attribute that to my family upbringing, and it is something I want to hold on to and that instinct to hold on to that that connection, that real human quality that we are all sort of one.

And and it seems like you've got a real sort of love of people. Do your your level of fame and notoriety. Does it sometimes sadden you that other people who are just meeting you for the first time might have trouble or difficulty connecting with you on that level? And do you then take it upon yourself to sort of try to put them at ease so you can have that kind of please see me as as as Paul and not as Paul McCartney. Let's let's talk.

Let's connect.

That's why. Yeah, I do. I do that, you know, because I can't really sort of sit down and go listen to this.

Let it go. You know, we can't do that so. Well, you can. You know, I can. I suppose other people are very interesting. Yeah. People are really interested. And, you know, you ask them a question that you might think is quite boring. Sometimes they've got quite amazing stories. And I like the I was always very curious about that. When I was a kid, I used to take a bus and just go for a few stops and get off and sit on a bench and just watch people and talk to people.

I got arrested for what you did.

So, Jason, a regular person is just so we can try to put it in context for Jason. You're a regular person is somebody who did not grow up in show business. Right?

So they play golf. Boy, this might take a minute call, like on the subject of fame, just because you made me think of something.

Have you found do you ever find yourself you especially measuring time and your life by certain milestones or events such as like the release of albums or concerts or whatever, and then therefore, does that make the past feel like it's not that far away?

Yeah, to some extent. Do I think. I think so, yeah. So you know, I know Sergeant Pepper was 1967, whereas most dates I don't remember, but I just happened to know what went on that year. And so, yeah, I would, I would do that. But I'm the world's worst remember of Beatle history. It's iconic, I think. Well, it's always going to be someone who knows. So I'll just ask was when we came to America all that well and where am I right now?

Yeah, but what's incredible about that is that you could quite honestly, you could ask anybody if you went to a restaurant, you could tap someone on the shoulder and they could probably tell you that day.

And that's what's so incredible, like this size in the weight of that legacy.

Does it ever I don't even know how to ask this question. Does it does that does it ever feel really heavy in that way? Does it feel like a burden?

It doesn't actually cause this phenomenon happened a long time ago. It's like this isn't new for me. This is like talk about the sixties, even this was going on. But I just remember thinking, OK, now you're becoming very famous. So if you don't want the trappings of that, you should stop now and just say, thanks, guys. I don't know what to do, though. I would have kind of had to get out of music, and I love that too much.

So I carried on. And so you get more and more famous etceteras. I do. However, sometimes just when I'm being me, the person I grew up with, because this is still the same and I still, you know, I'm still the same, but yeah, yeah, yeah.

And you're the only one that's been there for all of it, all those steps.

So, yeah. You know, but I do sometimes think, wow, God in heaven. I mean, bloody hell, I'm a singer songwriter. How did that happen.

Yeah.

Yeah it's crazy but it makes sense because you started I mean I read somewhere that you wrote when I'm 64. Well before you met John. Is that true?

Yeah. When I was sixteen you were sixteen. Writing about a sixty four year old, by the way, who was the 64 year old you were writing about everyone a year before their retirement.

Yeah, 65 was when you retired. 64 was everyone.

So you've been writing about you've been a singer songwriter your whole life, not your whole career, your whole life. Like even before you probably knew you were going to do it. You've been this.

Yeah, well, my dad was the family pianist. So, you know, I was reading like about people like Gershwin and Harold Arlen and they said every house had a piano. That was the way things were those days. And my dad, we had a. And he played he played great, you played all the old sort of Chicago and all of that, you know, did you ever study classical music that he or you. I didn't know.

No, neither of us did. And I'd say, ask him to teach me. You'd say no, you got to learn properly. But I didn't like the little smelly old lady.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, well, he got a deal on her. There was a more expensive teacher. He just he couldn't use or he was. Yeah, yeah.

No, I told her no. Already shown time to record some photos. These are so fun, I love this. Why don't you give it a read and familiarize yourself with the script?

OK, I just I will wait for Jason. Is that what you mean? Yeah. I'm going to check where he is.

Just run through it once while he's going to tell me, I don't know, like how important it is to change your wiper blades before winter weather comes in. Something like that. And then I'll say, oh, Jason Wipers lasts forever. All you need to get through the winter is an ice scraper in your dreams, you know, with a little more energy, please. And then he'll be dismissive about my idea, like showing dreams won't clean your windshield.

You need bosz and vision wipers if you're really going to see clearly on the road. And then I'll say something funny, like, I don't see anyone name clearly on the road.

Jason, that was Jason's voice. A good one. We sound similar.

Then he'll throw in some technical detail like Sean, don't be ridiculous portion vision wipers have no focus rubber technology with the clear 365 rubber coating, which makes them totally awesome.

Yeah, yeah. I'm going to be like, oh, but what if I can't change my wipers?

Which is dumb because I totally can.

But he'll say, you know, oh no problem. Will help you out at AutoZone and then we'll say get in the zone AutoZone. Cool, great. Which is waiting. And Jason, still what's happening? Is he shooting something is not working out.

I just got a text from him. He's golfing, so he's not going to make it. It looks like.

Wow, must be nice. So I guess we'll just do it later then. I mean you have what you need.

Let me see. Just give me that last line just by myself without Jason. Why not man. You're in the zone.

OK, well get wipers from AutoZone then before winter or every four to six months, parts products advice and more at AutoZone and AutoZone dotcom. Get on the zone AutoZone. Sean, I got to say, I'm a little nervous heading into the holiday season, but don't worry. Well, Blue Apron is here to help you stress less whether you're, you know, inside with the cold weather or too busy planning for the holidays or just kind of tired of figuring out what's for dinner every night of the week.

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You won't be surprised to know that. I also tried the cheesy chicken and pesto spaghetti squash because. Yeah, because I love spaghetti squash because it just makes me feel like I'm having like a full meal.

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You know, when I first opened that box, yeah, I felt like I was stepping into a different world. Amazing. I just felt like it was like the Holy Grail, like light was coming up.

How gorgeous are those boxes? Beautiful. Yeah, they're incredible. And the knives, they're they're so gorgeous and they're like they look like they were like beautifully crafted from.

You almost don't want to use them. Right. Like they look like pieces of art. I mean, when I first used the knife, I cut through an apple and it was like slicing through water.

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So, Sir Paul, one more question about your your emotional and mental health that seems so, so clear to me, was it always that way in the sense that with all the incredible fortune and success and an assumed happiness throughout your life, all these incredible stages up to and including today, do you feel that you were always in the right condition mentally, emotionally, to appreciate all of that? It seems like you've you seem like the kind of guy keeps keep your room clean upstairs so that you can appreciate the fame, money, all the complications that might come with that if you don't have your room tidy and it can be somewhat destructive.

And a lot of people don't handle that well. But it seems like you're an incredibly healthy man, emotionally and spiritually, mentally, as have you been able to enjoy all this incredible life you seem to have had.

Yeah, I think, you know, by and large, I tell you this family of mine and I really do attribute it to them both, Jack. All right, Sean. Yeah. So, you know, come. And what about your Uncle Joe singing all the time? You know, that you so many of these characters and they all just come out of World War Two. Hmm. You know, I was born in 1942, which actually was in the war, and they all come out of it and they were all so lovely.

I'm positive that I always just thought, well, that's the way you should be.

So, you know, that's that's my kind of guiding thought, is, hey, you know, it's OK, really.

We get fidge moments, but basically it's OK. The future is going to be good. You know, it's not always easy to think that, particularly these days. But, you know, covid, you know, I was talking about this the other day and saying it is like the war for my parents when my parents go and have me in a war when it was raining bombs on Liverpool, I couldn't have been too optimistic that they were going to win.

Right. You know, because it wasn't. But, yeah, I just think this is another war. This is something instead of like HIV or SARS or avian flu that tended to happen to other people. Right. We are all going through this one together, which equates to, in my mind, to war. Yeah, yeah.

And I would say that, you know, this idea that you've made it this far and kept it, as Jason said, so straight upstairs and you attribute it to your family, I think that we can relate to that. The three of us have very close relationships to our families as well. It's something that we I think that we share in in this time, in this covid time, I agree with you, this is now more than ever.

We really need each other, not just our families, but our friends. It's so important because it can be so isolating and and that could be devastating.

And to keep the positivity going during quarantine and isolation is, you know, is rough. But, you know, creative types find a way and you found a way, just like the rest of us. We're doing a podcast. You're wrote an album like Normal People do, I guess. I don't know. But to you, I mean, you've written over a thousand.

It has to be over a thousand songs, probably more. Do you even know how many you've written?

I don't count, no. It's like I don't know what year it was or how many there were. I've been told I wrote just short of three hundred with John. Wow, that's crazy.

That's just shy of my 400. But do you ever get out on stage and start performing what you've done 400, 400 yet with Jordan.

With John which just different John. Different John down the street. Yeah, different John.

So do you ever get out on stage and start performing one of your thousand songs and then get lost because you're thinking of the other 900? I mean, like do lyrics ever get crossed or whatever? Oh yeah.

Yeah, I do quite a lot. That's why I have a teleprompter. Oh.

You can probably just ask the audience to help you with the line. Yeah. Yeah that's right. No I do that kind of thing. You know it sometimes. I don't know you guys when you're performing. I don't know if it happens to you, but I'll be kind of doing a song let's say like Eleanor Rigby or something. Yeah. And I'm on autopilot and I'm starting to think, oh what am I going to have dinner like.

Oh yeah. OK, well it's all right. Yeah. Maybe, maybe you won't have the soup but maybe you choose to, you know, go for the main course and I go stop. Yeah. Because I'm singing in. You know, I've separated myself not only from pole unfamous for a couple of bits of my head are going in different places and yes, so sometimes that breaks down and I forget the song. You remember this whole idea of totally.

I did Broadway a few times, and when you do eight shows a week for a year, you completely check out.

In the one time I checked out right in the middle, Tony Goldwyn was on stage. He's a great actor. He was. And I turned to him and I go out of nowhere. I just go, what was I what am I saying?

I was like, well, yeah, but those thousand songs like to you and I kind of ask I'm the one who kind of asked a lot of guests this question, which is like, do you still have that fire in your belly to keep writing and keep creating these great iconic songs that just seem endless inside of you?

Or do you feel pressure to keep doing that?

No, I it's like a hobby. Yeah. Really, it's I'm very lucky. So, you know, I'll go home and pick up my guitar while I'm watching TV. Yeah. And just tinker around and toss something, you know, it really is something that still entrenches me. This that's what I say before. I'm a singer songwriter. I'm seriously amazed by that. Yeah. So yeah. You know, I maybe I'm amazed. I don't know, maybe I'm immune.

Did you see the James Corden. Maybe I'm a bit. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. What do you think of that.

OK, I love that. I'm not a good singer. He's a great singer isn't he. A great singer. He patted me, I rang him up. I said James. I said, listen, that's great. I said I'd be so jealous if I hadn't written it. Yeah.

Did you, did you go, did you do something with James or am I misremembering where you went to Liverpool. Yeah, no, we did carpool karaoke. Yeah. Yes. That was like a big moment, right. You went back there and everybody kind of flooded in.

And I loved when you actually signed the Penny Lane sign and so you just went up and signed it.

Or, you know, the worst thing about all of that was I didn't want to do it because they said, you know, be great. James wants you to do carpool.

So and I just thought, no, no, Adele's doing it. Stevie Wonder's done it. It was so good. I'm going to go and do it and be clapping. So I just sort of said, no, guys, listen, thanks, but I don't think I'll do it. And right up until the minute we got in the car, I was still pitching, which is like me, but I was still sort of oh God. In fact, I turned to James when I was taking a makeup on and I said, James, you know, one of the great things about being in the Beatles was at this kind of moment, George would probably, you know, look at every single beautiful who we're doing this for.

Yeah, I said, I miss that. Yeah. Yeah. And his producer, Ben, was very funny. And that's funny. That's funny. I get in the car and so we got it. But no, I really enjoyed it. It was great. And I'd never been in my old house since I left.

By the way, who was that woman in there in the house.

Ah, you know, she's the keeper of the house. Oh, she is not a housekeeper. She's it's a national trust thing. So it's like a museum. Oh, she's oh she's like the museum curator must have blown her mind to meet you.

Well, I think it pretty much did. But the thing was, she charged us, Sir Peter Jones, we're just leaving. And she said, well, that's five pounds, which I said, know this is my house. Yeah.

You get out, you know, and then the whole thing ended with you in that bar, surprising everybody in the pub and the curtains open and everybody's like, holy shit, that's Makani.

And then you just started playing and everybody was like, floored. What what an incredible treat for everybody there. That was incredible.

It's great. I mean, I say it was great for us, too, you know, because, I mean, not that pub we were in where we did that stunt is one I've stood with my family, with these uncles, with a pint. And I had all the history with it. So it was pretty amazing. Just wandering around Liverpool. Yeah. Because I was now the tour guide. We did this. I mean, know. Yeah, but I do that anyway.

When I go back to Liverpool, I do that anyway. When they do like it or not, you take him around and I take him past this old house I used to live in, but I never used to go in. I used to think it's going to be so disappointed and it's going to be scary or something. I thought, just leave it, don't go in. You're not easy. So I would sit outside a house with my best, whoever it was.

That's the House seat up the window. Well, that was my bedroom. And this is way you get through the markets also on some old guy comes walking up. He looks to me, he goes, Yeah, he did.

You still look like he was sick of it, like he did it a million times.

Just to let you know what it reminds me, you're obviously so iconic and so many people have done impressions of you over the years. And our collectively, our good friend Peter Séraphin, which he was from Liverpool originally, has done an impression of you for years, is a very funny guy who lives in London now, a very funny comedian.

First of all, what is that like throughout for the last years and years and years, people have done impressions of you. Is it annoying? A and B, who was there? Anyone who did it? You went like, yeah, that was pretty good. Was there one that stuck out?

It's not annoying because, you know, they're talking about me and that's OK. So that's not annoying. You know, that's good. But I don't think they quite get it. What are they missing? What Americans have got to sort of. Oh, hello. Yeah. Oh, how are you doing? Jimmy Fallon's pretty good. Oh yeah. Yeah, he does a pretty good one, but generally it's not quite, you know, for my voice changed.

I look at old interviews with the Beatles. How much more Liverpool, you know, was very much. Oh yeah. Well, now I've lived out of Liverpool much more than I have lived in Liverpool. So your voice changes, you know. So I have a quick question about touring. Jason and I are more homebodies.

I think it's safe to say and will kind of probably the more adventure seeker traveler when you guys say that's true.

I'm definitely a homebody. I don't know how much he adventures or seeks for purposes of this question.

I'll roll with it. Yeah, go ahead.

I mean, I toured with Kenny Rogers and wandered off the bus after the third city tour.

So but when you toured, don't ask him what it was. Paul, do not. I played an album.

It was it was humiliating. It comes. So when you toured as much as you have for as long as you have you ever you ever miss that kind of home base feeling like do you ever get.

Because it was tough out there, right, Sean? Yeah, well, God, it was so hard. You got to take off the elf suit after every show.

The Elf on the bus. Yeah. Kenny and he was such a nice guy.

It was like for you to fall. I we can relate, right. Yeah. But do you ever get depressed living out of hotels and never feeling settled and all that like constantly touring all these years.

I'm actually not too bad with that. I know what you mean. A lot of people don't like that. I actually quite like it because I've been doing it forever and instead of making me change it, it's just something I do and I'm kind of used to it. I like the room service. Yeah, I was walking down the corridor in the Four Seasons in L.A. and I got this feeling like I like this. I like this.

What do you do about getting to sleep with all the different time zone changes? You have a trick for for adapting to different times. Drugs.

Yeah, nice. We got it. Oh, nice. Oh come on. I no actually I'm very lucky in that respect. I just get tired during the day. Yeah I know. I'll meet people you know, in the evening who said, gosh, I'm really tired. And I said great, keep it up and go to bed. Yeah. You know, I love that. So yeah. No I get tired especially after the show and we do have to have a sort of warm down period.

Jason has been doing a warm down since he was thirty.

Yeah, but what about your ears. What about touring with all that loud music just constantly over the decades in your heart. Is it done anything. Yeah. Except what you say?

No, that's the only problem. It does go for you hearing, unfortunately. But I love it. I love it. When I was a kid in Liverpool, the idea of taking an electric guitar and plugging it in was like I heard about it now. And it's kind of thrilling, you know, and I still get that through. And I'm surprised because I'm sure I should be jaded. It should have worn off, but it doesn't. You know, I love it.

I called my studio making this album you're talking about, and I plug in the guitar and I'm still trying to learn how to play it, although I have I'm getting better. How many weeks a year would you ideally be on the road nowadays?

This year I was supposed to be touring about twelve gigs in Europe and then Glastonbury Festival, so I'm kind of looking forward to that. And I suppose I would have gone out this time, possibly somewhere with better weather. Yeah. So, you know, you go down to South America or somewhere and I quite like it.

So like a third of the year, half of the year on average, maybe, maybe go for something, you know, be quite good. But I certain periods when I want to be home. But, you know, I've been doing it long enough to be able to say to my promoter, OK, and of. April, first couple of weeks in May, going to be in England because that's when the blue balls come out. Yeah, I guess it's no nothing like it.

What about the holidays? You'd like to be home around the holidays or or just spring is the part that you really protect?

No, I like Christmas. We're always home. To do the Thanksgiving now. Not married in America, huh? Yeah, we do that.

What's the family look like nowadays? How wide is it? How many what's the family gathering usually number out to nowadays?

It would be. I've got eight grandkids. Well, that's great. Yeah. You pay for that at the moment. So bad.

Yeah. So hopefully you'll be with them, their moms and the husbands. The rest of my kids or my wife.

Yeah. You enjoy providing the that kind of sane guidance that you got from your family when you were a young kid. I mean, now nowadays I would imagine it's it's it's almost more complicated than it was back then, given technology and culture and all that stuff. Are you do you like playing that role, passing on that that sanity?

Yeah, I kind of do, yeah. But it's not super proactive. I leave that to their parents because you get the grand interrupting, you know.

You know we got a dad. Yeah. Yes, you're right. It's OK.

You know, leave this to us. Right. And I know that's my cue.

You know, maybe you could call my mother and tell her that that would be a great message for her to receive to let me parent my kids if you're listening.

But yes, by the way, that's going to be that's going to be on a loop from.

Well, that's I will support. Let me take you back to you. I mean, the very reverential Jason, what you're supposed to say, sir, aren't you? You don't have to. OK, all right.

I'm I car boy. He dropped that pretty quick.

If you if you let let's go back to you grabbing the guitar. You're watching television and you're starting to to figure out a new song or something like the lyrics. Do you have someone or some group in mind when you when you write a song? And if so, does that change or you writing for you most of the time?

Well, I'm writing for me, but you're right. I often have someone in my mind who I'm kind of imitating new style. I'm imitating. And it's a great trick because it never turns out like them. You do your version of I can be doing Big Bill Broonzy. Right. And it's nothing like him. Believe me, it all on this album, I've got a track that was inspired by I was reading a book on a Big Bill Broonzy and yeah.

And I started noodling on the piano and started going like my mama. I'm going from all bluesy. I'm sound just like him, but I didn't. Oh yeah. I do use that as a trick. I like to do that. When I was writing Lovin Winding Road, I thought I was Ray Charles.

Wow. But I wasn't. Wow.

Turns out. But but he later recorded some songs of mine and he was Ray Charles. Well yeah. So you know, that was that's like my that must have been a thrill in a way. Yeah. Yeah man.

You know. Yeah. I mean, you know, we grew up with these guys and like we're totally in all a record. Like what did I say when, you know, it was one of Ray's first things. Yeah. You know how I used to do that in Hamburg? That was one of our big numbers, what I say to what I say. And then I would get the whoa oh oh oh oh.

I would end up under the table purposely.

SHOWBIZ did you guys ever have you went to Hamburg? Of course. And that's that was kind of the last step before you'd already had some success in Liverpool, of course. Then you went to Hamburg. And that's a very you know, people know that story. And then right after that, you really broke on the international stage and in the end became the Beatles that we know today.

Was there a moment once you looked back sort of in that next year after you'd really broken through? Did you have a moment or many moments where you guys looked at each other and said, wow, can you fucking believe what's going on?

You know, do you remember that?

Yeah, I think most of you know, that was because we'd been completely anonymous and we went to Hamburg where we were still anonymous, but we kind of learned how to build a crowd.

We were stuck in this bar called the Indras, which is German for India, and nobody ever came in there. And so we were just on the stage singing, you know, and then you see a couple of students would look in and the main thing they'd look at the. And then they leave because they thought it was too expensive, so we had to learn to pull them in. And it was a great lesson, so, you know, we see the students go, OK.

We were dancing in the street tonight.

Come on. Hey, not everybody like that.

Two of them. You know, we learned that. We learned and gradually, I must say, boasting that place filled up, man.

Yeah, I'm a word of mouth got around that we were quite a good little group. And, you know, this is going back so far. And we used to say to each other, do you know how long ago it was? The war was like 15 years ago.

And we're over there like playing are to actually kind of go, yeah, we won, right?

Yeah, yeah. Yes, exactly.

Well, it was great, you know, and we played Germany now, amazed at the kids, how cool they are, you know. But yeah. Then we would be interrupted at ten o'clock. A policeman would come on the stage and we want to you would be interested to know they go to the mike and says yes, it's violence or firemen houseflies. Patala bitta all your conflicts onto Artinian. This is a club for lesson. So it's like it's ten o'clock you know, if you haven't got your passport with you and you're under 18, get out.

Wow.

So I was kind of use a different world now. We were, we were kids. We were like, you know, 18.

So that was real German. You learn German back then and you remember I know a bit of German Germany. I screwed up there.

But I do know I've been in Germany convincing to me, yeah, we were none the wiser because I learned in school me and George were the only two learned in school. Yeah, we do.

Is there an artist, an art figure, either alive or maybe even dead before you were even born, that you are so sort of in awe of humbled by enamored by that present company excluded, obviously.

So me just that that you assume or hope perhaps would have the same effect over you that you assume you have over others, if that makes any sense.

You know, no Elvis.

Yeah, I love Elvis and he really was huge for us. And we ended up meeting, which is, you know, that's a zany moment because I do have to kind of think. Did I really? Yeah, you did. Yeah, I really met Elvis and was was cool. Yeah, he was really cool.

And he lived up to our expectations, you know, where you guys had a level of fame, where he was sort of talking to you as a peer, as a colleague, or were you guys still just coming up?

At that point, you said, hey, kids, we were the kids on the block who were going to wipe him off the block. Yeah. Which was kind of very embarrassing because we didn't want to do that. We loved him so much. So he would be the one. Dylan, I love Bob Dylan. I love him. You know, what about today?

Like, there's so many pop acts these days, you know, with an emphasis on the package rather than the quality of the music and the musicianship. Yeah, almost kind of trying to manufacture what the Beatles, you know, were authentically.

So do you do you listen to anybody today?

Is there there an actual artist are like a boy band or group that you listen to because of that true artistry?

Yeah. I mean, you know, for me, it's not really because of the music like it is for the fans to for me it's like. Yeah, just seen some young kids go through what we went through. Beats. Yeah. The Korean cars. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I like watching them see what's going on and yeah I think they're good, you know. I guess I couldn't sing one of the songs but I like that.

And there are some people who are not just manufactured like Taylor Swift. She's a true singer songwriter.

She's like, pretty cool. She's the real deal. I met up with her recently.

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I have a question about songwriting. It's OK if I can geek out for a second about music. Did you ever study music theory, by the way?

No. Wow.

I missed the whole thing about just before you question the whole thing about all the groups out of Liverpool, not one of them. Well, unless you were a sax player, then you had to learn a bit of music, but none of us knew anything. You know, all the guys groups I was talking to Jeff Lynne about it. They said we just made it all up, didn't we? Right. Right. And that's what it was.

We just, you know, told each other the chords and made, you know. So, no, no, none of us studied yet.

And they didn't they didn't need to go to school like some music nerd. They had it in there. I was a music nerd. You can't manufacture it from a book. You know what I'm going to get?

I'm going ask for my money back then I call it no. Then maybe you're not even aware you do this, but I'm like hyperaware that about tempo and time signatures and phrasing like some of your most iconic melodies.

Well, for example, like like I Love You is like various surface, like I to three for love you.

You know, it's very straightforward. It's on the beat. Nothing syncopated at all or anything. But then like one of my all time favorite songs in the history of the World is No More Lonely Nights.

And you do like two beats a measure than four beats, a measure than two beats and then four beats.

And then you keep four beat like it's crazy, brilliant and bizarre at the same time. It's like in the world of Broadway, it's Sondheim, you know what I mean? Like like if the phrase is and if it takes a couple of years to turn your tears to laughter and if it takes a couple of years, it's four beats.

Turn your tears to and that's to laughter is three as four beats again.

Which is so bizarre. So do you doing this consciously or are you doing.

No, I just waste everyone's time explaining that. I love that you've analyzed it that much. No idea what you're talking about. It just sounded good to you.

And so you kept it going that way, right. Is that a question like do you write that then? That's the greatest answer I could have hoped for. This is one of the greatest moments of my life.

I write the melodies and the lyrics and then you just whatever without thinking and then you build the foundation underneath it.

Yeah, there's no theory behind it at all. We'll cut all that out. And so.

No, no, no, no. We're going to replay it on a loop. And sometimes it's music first and lyrics second and vice versa. Set way that you went about things or no. Yeah. I mean the best is when you get the two together and you just discovered you, Melody, and you've got some words and you just follow that trail and you just carry on with a thought and then you subvert it maybe for the middle or whatever.

I mean, I've got tricks, but they're not musically notated. I wouldn't know about that, but I know we were good at it.

Yeah, it's nobody was doing it. You would have like crazy like the song would just change. Like in Bohemian Rhapsody by Queen had sections.

You guys invented that. Yeah, I know. It's a great take and I think, you know, very proud that knowing nothing of more of a musical, I mean, I have got a little bit of a theory, but I never want to put people off who would like you, obviously, because I think that is great, too.

It's not as great, but yeah, it's not quite as great no matter what he's just said.

It's not as great as I'm asking you the question. There's no question, Shuni, you don't need to ask him.

He's already said it's not as great know.

But, you know, the thing is, when when you're just thinking it instead of reading it, there's something very good about that. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. It's just in you. Yeah. And you're not taking it off a page. It just feels like, yeah. This is good, this sounds OK. Right. And so you just sort of keep going.

Yeah. Till you've got it.

And then you try and remember you say that writing music you sort of considered somewhat of a hobby. Aside from that, what is your current hobby? Are you do you do you fill your day doing anything that people will be surprised to learn any sort of gardening or golf or driving fast and breaking laws?

Horse riding. Really? Yeah. Yeah, I like the horse. Yeah. You can go deep on that. Right. The sneaky specific subtle artistry to all of that. Yeah.

Yeah. I love it. Yeah. And again I never, I never had. Listen, Linda was a very good horse rider and so when we married she'd never had her own horse.

So I was able to get her own horse and, you know, so she just would show me and I would fall off a lot. Yeah, but I was younger then. Sure. Still fall off, but just a bit, but yeah, so I just developed a love of it and do you know what kind of things she'd say to kind of help me with it would be it's just a great big poppy that allows you to sit on his back.

Once you think of a horse like that, it's much better. All right.

Speaking of better things, McCartney three. You say three, right? Three. Yeah, yeah.

That's your new album. And I listen to every track way more than once. I absolutely love it. Some of my favorite. I love all of them, but some of my favorite tracks are Seize the Day. The Kiss of Venus and Winter Bird is probably my favorite one. Thank you. You know, it's super somber.

Kind of reminds me of, you know. Older Paul McCartney songs, but it's just beautiful, and I can't believe you just spit these songs out like it's nothing during quarantine. It's crazy.

You had a bunch of these songs. I heard you say that you correct me if I'm wrong, that you had been working on them for a while or they've been kind of. Yeah. In your head for a while.

Yeah. Is that right? Yeah. I've got a studio 20 minutes away from where I live, so I like to drive over and go to work. Some people have a studio at home, but I'm not that keen on that. Yeah, because you never go to work or never come home.

I'm in my studio at home right now. Oh yeah. Yeah. Music studio. No, no, no. Voice. Voice studio. Oh yeah. Right.

Well that makes sense but so. Yeah. Studio on some days I'll just say OK, let's make something up and freedom is very nice so I'll make something up and then sometimes they don't get finished by the end of the day and then maybe the next day I've got to do something else. So there were a couple of tracks like that and there were a couple of tracks that I'd written fully. So I finished the ones that were unfinished and then started and finished the next one and just went through them all just thinking, well, this is good.

You know, this is like spring cleaning. This is nice. I've got them all and they're all going to be finished now. I'll be nice, but like after about ten of them I finished, I thought should probably be an album and and it was corny. I love it. I absolutely love them.

And just to remind you guys, the album comes out December 18th and it's called McCartney three.

I'm gonna let you go because we've taken way too much of your time and oh, no, I want to stay.

I come over. But wait.

I want to know if you had to pick your favorite song you've ever written.

Oh, you know how I that's that's always a very difficult question. Yeah. And I always answer yesterday, but it's a very difficult question because in the next minute I'll go longer on the road. And then actually the other one I had here, there and everywhere. Yeah, I'll say that blackbird, you know, like Blackbird, it kind of changes. And, you know, really I often say to people, look, I can't choose because it's like choosing one of my babies.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You write a lot of songs with the word bird in them. Yeah, yeah. Blackbird. Yeah I do. Bird bird stuff.

I'm an ornithologist. Which is your favorite child.

This is a good question. This is a good question. Easy. That's easy. We're going to hold onto it.

It's just us that is it's a sore point in the family is one of them keeps saying I'm the golden child.

Right. I said, well no, it's very difficult. I love you.

But, you know, it just occurs to me as you as you sort of start to list off all your songs. And it reminds me of I think everybody has very vivid memories of the first time they heard a Beatles song and and who it was who introduced them to your music. And I remember it was an old tapes that my my parents had. And I remember my parents playing the Beatles for me the first time in just those when I think about it.

And sometimes when I when I listen to a Beatles song, it reminds me of. Memories of my parents. Here we go of those great times, here come the waterworks. I'm going to try to cry. I cannot cry and cry.

So why are you doing, boy? So that's why I do voiceovers. And Ricky Gervaise always says he said to me recently, he said he says, I don't know why you bother working out. Nobody ever sees you.

But and he's not wrong. But but this connection, your music, the connection and how it connects us to the people who are important in our lives. And I realize how much that is. I'm one of billions of people who have had that experience.

It's what an incredible I don't know. I don't even know how to describe it. What an incredible thing to be part of people's emotional connections to the people in their lives as a part of us, as a human being.

I guess it's not even a question. I know it's more of a thank you and how incredibly profound that is.

You know, it is something I really appreciate because, you know, being a family man, I see that in my audience member doing a thing in South America, a big audience. But Newsfront, who is very good looking man, a beard talk head man, and he had his arm around this beautiful girl, long talk. And I was doing Laribee, which, you know, is kind of emotional for me because it was to do with my mother and stuff.

And I just see her looking up at her dad. And it was like, oh, my God, it's choke me. It was difficult to get through the song because it's suddenly the significance of that, that my little song that I never even studied for. You know, it's just come out of the blue and, my God, it had this effect and they're having this really bonding moment. So it is something I'm very proud of and appreciate, you know, that that happens with people.

I do have to pinch myself, though, because it's like, are you really that guy?

Not just that, because, you know, I'm so busy trying to keep myself separate from him. Hmm. So I can be normal who you are.

And you have you have shared that part of you with with us for this hour. Thank you in our listener for that and all the music through your life with all the millions and millions of people that that have found a connection with it. So I just can't thank you enough for all of that. Truly, truly humbled to have spent this time with you. Thank you. Very, very same.

Same, same. Thank you. So thanks, guys. I mean, I've really enjoyed this. You know, this is a fun hour for me, so thanks very much for the compliments. Yes. We love you.

Yeah. Truly, truly. Thank you very, very much for doing this. Have a great rest of the day.

Cheers. Thanks. My God, John, wow, how about that, you know, can I just say one of my favorite things was watching Jason at the beginning and he was so calm and he had so much stuff that he wanted to do and stuff that he was talking about.

And then when you revealed this Paul McCartney, just the contrast between the two Jasons, he talks about the two balls, the contrast when he's like, holy fuck, I'd like to think there's a four or five days I meet you, by the way.

But I thought for sure you were kidding. I mean, who would you ladies and gentlemen, Paul McCartney. I was like, well, yeah, like who did your book, right? Isn't that crazy? And then he revealed that he was actually there. I've just one day you'll tell me how this all came to.

Well, how about the fact that we got to kind of like what Will was saying at the end, which is, you know, there are no words like, you know, everybody puts them on a pedestal and rightfully so.

But how about we in our lifetime got to speak to him?

Yeah, not a lot of people get that time, you know, and not just meet him and get the picture that you can show like which he doesn't do.

But the idea that we got to talk to him in and, you know, and ask questions and have him give really thoughtful answers.

Yeah. That'll be one of these things that you'll be able to tell your grandkids.

And for all of us that we're listening to this, I just find it really just amazing that we're able to get a perspective from somebody in such a rarified space. I'm not saying he's in for better or worse than anybody else listening to this, but the unique experience that he's had in his life, I mean, he's better.

I'm sorry. He's better. I'm sure there's there's a gazillion things that we could have and should have asked him. But I know I'm and I'm I'm glad that we got at least a window into, you know, what his human perspective is behind sort of the celebrity sort of veneer that we all assume that he's wrapped in.

Yeah, I mean, and isn't it wild that somehow every human on the planet, it feels like we come out of our mother's womb is born knowing all the lyrics to all the songs like I can't explain how I know all the words, I just do and I know all the songs. I said it was a cassette.

I think it was an eight track that my that my mom had in her in her old car. Yeah.

I had an eight track of a Wings album. Yeah. It's just like crazy. And so when you think about it, I can remember what those covers look like.

I can remember that feeling of being in that room or in the car or being with my parents and what that relationship was. It's all associated with that with the Beatles. And when you hear it, any time you hear that song Sensorially, you get that same.

And how long do you think it takes after talking about somebody so iconic to switch your brain back to looking at us to it?

It's OK for me. Yeah. I just ah, been looking at it.

I just love that he when he doesn't know what you're talking about with the baby in question.

By the way, that was a baby question.

He was a baby question and then he answered it with I don't know what you're talking about, it's usually what I get. But I got to tell you, was it are you like me in that you're an incredibly comforted by sort of this confirmation? Because I kind of heard this or maybe even seen this from his other interviews. But the comment that he's so human that there's this person that has been through what he has been through, accomplish what he has accomplished.

But at the end of the day, he's he seems most proud of most intent on spends most of his time each day being just Paul. And then that's really important to him. And without that, he probably wouldn't be able to appreciate all the things that he's been through to the extent that he has, of course.

And maybe you can use that like. I don't know. I don't know. I'm asking both you, but maybe Jason, for example, you could use that as a way to becoming a normal person. Do you think that's possible?

Hurtful landing to that plan I saw coming, by the way, I'd be remiss if I didn't say bye bye.

I can always feel it coming smart.

Smart las.