Hi, everybody, welcome to Sofia with an F. I am joined by one of my good friends now, Paige Larenz is I use your last name. Yes, you got it right. OK, thank you. I just have to start off by saying you are stunning. Stunning. Are you a model? Be honest. Oh, I have a lot to say about that.

I'm not. But I actually like a lifestyle model, which is basically like you're you're pretty enough to like being got shit, but like you're not that great. You're cute, you're cute. Like you're not doing high end fashion. We might be in, like, target.

Well, I mean, I feel like that's even better. Honestly, guys, Paige, she is drop dead gorgeous. I want to ask you about your diet and exercise routine, but I feel like that's not what we're here to talk about. For those of you who don't know, Paige has been in a ton of headlines recently for previously dating Armie Hammer. And we will get into that in a little bit.

But for right now, I want to talk about you. So you I'm going to laugh. You're a content creator. Yes.

I literally made her say that's not how you do it together.

I was going to say, do you want me to introduce you as an influencer? And she was like, absolutely fucking not.

Please, you do that influencer bad, right? Podcast creator. Sounds like sophisticated. No, it does do podcasting.

When I tell people like I'm a podcast or I kind of want to die like there's no good name for YouTube or might be words like I hated YouTube before you started YouTube. Like I was like, these people are so crazy, like, right. No, no, not one of them. So, like, I try to get people to meet me before I tell them I'm on YouTube. Right. And then I'm like, oh, by the way, by the way, you're like, do they like to have, like, crazy mannerisms the whole time?

It's a totally different, like, art form for sure. I don't think of myself as a normal. You do. I tried. And you're not like a normal girl. Like also you too. I've seen your YouTube before and you're not like, whoa. And there's not like a bunch of quick cuts and stuff. I love your YouTube videos, by the way, but what I love more is her Instagram is so fucking amazing and is statically just badass, beautiful, artistic.

And I remember I literally took a screenshot of your Instagram profile and sent it to my team and I was like, make my Instagram look like this or like you're done.

So if you move back to New York, like, I will help you. Oh, I'm moving back to New York. And I was about to ask you, like, how much would I have to pay you to, like, run my Instagram, but, like, will probably be on Instagram account.

It's like influencers in the wild, like us with a tripod show industry out on the street. We hurry and take the big jacket off because it's winter. We're like wearing nothing and then put it back on. OK, so you guys should follow her. It's OK. Page Llorens, right?

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It's worth it. You're not new to being in the headlines, you dated a professional athlete. Yeah, I do like athletes. Like there is something about them that is intriguing.

Like I always say, it's like a caveman kind of thing, like, oh, that makes sense. Yeah.

Like, I love like a whole man. Like I want like man. Right. Like they're like this stereotype of like what a manly man is for sure. I get that you are a professional athlete too, right.

Yeah. So I used to downhill ski race, which is like the most random fucking thing. I think it's so dope.

Yeah, it's fun. You're from Utah, so you're like, yeah I know. Yeah. For sure. Yeah.

But like I definitely as an athlete I am into athlete which totally makes sense.

Yeah. And like I just feel like I know what it takes. Like I think it's hot when someone's like tries really hard and was passionate about anything. Think that's more what I'm into the athletes like a little bit. But I think it's just like being really passionate about something and working really hard at something I think is the hardest thing about guys like super into something.

I feel like men feel the same way about women. They want to date a girl that's like that as well.

You know, totally. I totally agree. I just think it's like hot.

It is hot. One hundred percent. So you dated this athlete and then you guys broke up like three public breakups.

It's tough because I'm like a twenty two year old who's like, I don't know, like I'm a little bit of like a firecracker in that way. Like, I'm like I'm definitely like I'm impulsive, like I post and like I'll I'll be very opinionated and always online.

So it's like I need that public breakup. I did not know that you were only twenty two. I'm shocked right now. Shocked. There was the first thing that came out about my ex and I was like, this chick looks like she's forty four at times with my hair.

Brunette gray. Dude that is fucking hilarious. OK, so you guys, you had three breakups that were like in the press type thing and then you fuck like red and then you decided because you were living with him. Yes. And then you decided to within like five days up and move.

So literally he did something that wasn't cute. And then I had like basically packed up my shit and in five days moved to L.A. shit. And had you ever lived in L.A.?

No. So I'd only been like twice. Once. The second time was me moving there. I tend to be like very impulsive about things, but I have an idea needs to get done right away. The issue is, is that my parents know that about me. So they might give me advice. They know at the end of the day that I'm going to do what I want.

Oh, I like really admire that because I'm the opposite, really. I have to ask ten people for their advice. I have to weigh the pros and cons of every scenario, make the list, make the pros and cons list.

It's like a twenty four hour rule, like give yourself a four hour shopping online. It's like leave it in your car and then come does it. Wait. That's so good. I mean I overdo it. We're like I get paralyzed and like I just won't even end up making a decision. So it's like we need to hang out so we can balance. Yes that's exactly we need to do. So you moved to L.A. and you hated it.

I despise L.A. I mean, for a lot of reasons what we can talk about, but like not it. I mean, this is my thing also where you want to vacation is not necessarily where you want to live. I don't believe stereotypes, people, places. I will go to a place I meet a person, give them the benefit of the doubt and then make the cradle. And you like L.A. fits the stereotype. Exactly.

It's not L.A. versus New York, but there's something about L.A. and I think the stereotype is that people are literally there for one thing and one thing only, and it's like to get famous and that they tend to be fake, which is so corny. And of course, there's people that don't fall into that. But there's a lot of fucking people who do.

Oh, people who don't hang out with you unless you can offer them something like. Yeah, just like weird, weird shit. That's a great way to put it.

Like superficial moved there because I was like, oh, I'll be able to create more content, I'll be able to take more photos. And I ended up being like so much less motivated and didn't want to do anything because everyone's just chilling all the time. Like in New York, if you don't get up, you'll hear people walking on the street being like, OK, yeah, people are going to their desk job at 6:00 in the morning. Get up and go get like, move your ass.

Yeah, that's kind of part of being a creative. I feel like you probably have this to like living in a city you make your own schedule. So I think that in New York, it's much easier to be structured and have that schedule and feel motivated and have people around you. You, because you're hanging out with a lot of successful people in other aspects of workspaces like business, like whatever art or whatever, it just pushes you to want to be the best version of yourself.

I feel that there is an energy in New York where you just feel compelled to, like, get your shit done, to keep working to like you want to achieve something bigger. And I could see in L.A. how there's not that same kind of mentality. It's not I mean, I've had a lot of people also be like, you need to go to L.A. That's where the content is. And like the people and the connections. And I'm like, I just don't want to I'd rather be happy in New York totally.

But also if you if you kill it in New York, that's like Weizsäcker, I think. I mean, we could go into that, but we might piss people off. But I totally agree. So you move to L.A. and how long were you there before you decided to move back to work for like five months.

Quickstop quick pit stop.

I quit connecting flight. I usually like to get because I moved to New York from Utah. So like you can imagine, like the culture shock, although I didn't even have it that bad. But I always like to tell people if you're moving to a new city to give it at least a year to two years before you make a decision. However, I feel like your circumstances are very different.

Different. So you were dating Army, right?

I'm sorry for everyone who doesn't know who Armie Hammer is. He is a heartthrob movie star. He was in The Social Network. He was in the movie Call Me By Your Name. He was recently pulled out of the series that Jay is supposed to do. So he's like he's an A-list celeb. He's big time.

Yeah. So I was dating Army basically immediately when I showed up. Oh, we were chatting like after my ex and I broke up. We started chatting, like right away. So he had followed me January 2013 and we still been like he wasn't publicly divorced yet.

So I wasn't going to message him. I felt like it was a little bit weird. Like I'm not the type of girl ever to mess with a guy who has a girlfriend or married. Like, that's just not I don't think that's cool. Like, I think that's wack as fuck. So, yeah, I like music. Oh, he's obviously hot, but like, I'm not going to do anything about this. It was always kind of in the back of my mind.

A little bit, of course. Yeah. When I was moving, I mean, like reconnected and like right away sort of hanging out like the second day I had showed up to L.A. I like he was at my Airbnb, like literally every single. Yeah. We spent every single day together almost until I lost.

So you guys are hanging out right off the bat. And I'm I am going to go ahead and assume, since you just got out of a breakup, you were probably like a somewhat vulnerable position or spot.

I was like excited but terrified to be in L.A. I did not know anyone such a vulnerable position and just looking for something to, like, take over my world and like, just dropped me. Right. Just like exactly what he kind of did. But like and we can get into this in a way that was actually like really fucked up and yeah. Almost like he knew that and like, used it. Oh yeah.

That's really important to point out. I'm not going to put words in your mouth, but it it's almost like he he saw that. And I'm sure you expressed it to him and he kind of capitalized on it totally. Let's get into that a little bit. So how did your relationship with Army become a public thing?

So we were seeing each other and like after dating a hockey player, I know that if you follow someone, if they call you back, if you're engaging with them on social media, the fans will pick up immediately. So we were hanging out and we weren't following each other, whatever. And then we started to get serious and then we started following each other, just like actually based on the fact like we were wanting to see each other shit instead of being like, whatever you got to really care.

We're like, we're going to follow each other and we're not going to post anything about each other. That was pretty like he's has two children and like an ex wife I respect. And I didn't want to be like the fucking twenty two year old girlfriend being like, right. Waiting in my line. Like, that's just not what I wanted at all. People have like seen us together. Like in the desert. Like in Joshua Tree. Yeah.

We were, we were, we were in like basically Joshua Tree tall as do. He's pretty distinctive looking so people would see us together. And there have been like some spottings. And then I posted a photo of this really cool like design, like it was really well designed building in the desert by this design firm. And then people just put this together.

Right. Well, and I mean, like, I've dealt with this same thing, too. And it's like you could have posted a picture of a toilet seat and they would put the pieces together and be like this hotel they got here this date like it's wild. It's actually impressive, like Tim. Why are these people like the FBI, the FBI and CIA, the FBI needs to hire these people? One hundred percent do. They're like screenshots, zooming in, like all types of shit.

So, OK, so people caught on that. You guys were together. And it almost seems like I don't know if he really wanted it to be public, but he either kind of wanted it to be public and kind of wanted attention or he's really sloppy. OK, let me interrupt you one. You sloppiest, but OK. But he also does kind of like enjoy the attention a little bit. I mean, this man follows like bondage shibari hashtags.

Oh, he does. Yeah.

Also follows like super serious, like bondage, like whatever accounts which is fine like that. Right. I did my research before, like I thought that it was just like he had like some some kings. Right. Yeah.

Like nothing dangerous, nothing crazy. But I wrote I think this whole situation is a really good illustration for how the BDM and non formative like sexual practice community or just like that space can be a mask for like how I like men can seriously hurt women. Yes. Sexual pleasure and like inflict fantasies. Yeah.

So that OK, that is such an interesting point. Let's just go ahead and dive into the sex if we can before we do. I think I just need to give some people a trigger warning that are listening. This is going to be a sensitive subject material. We're going to get explicit about BDM rape, fantasy, cannibalism and all of the above. So if you are sensitive to that, I would turn this off right now. But Page, I let's go into I think that's so interesting.

Yeah.

I think it is really important to talk about especially young girls. I know you have a big, like young girl following. I think this is a really important thing. It is sex education and education. All this is super important.

I went to a private Catholic school. We didn't we were not taught anything about sex, not even safe sex.

I mean, I went to like a fucking weird ass boarding school in the middle of Vermont where we were all naked the whole time. And like this this never came up. Right.

So let's back up two seconds. You and Ami started dating and would he tell you things like, you're my girlfriend, we're exclusive. Would he get jealous of you? Like, what was like what were you?

This was a really interesting part of our relationship. So it started like obviously we I just got out of relationship. He's going through a divorce. It was like, no, we're very open and everything. And he was the one who kind of first introduced me to an open relationship. And like it's called being like polyamorous.

Yes. You have like your primary and then you have like other people that you can sleep with. And I was just cool with that. I was like down whatever. But we both made a choice. He was like, I'm not seeing anyone else. You would hope that I'm not OK. He's not seeing anyone else. But he was like, but it's a choice. So this is the thing about like an open relationship that I actually kind of think is cool.

It's like you're choosing to be with that person. It's not an obligation. Oh, I do like that. Yeah. So it's never like, oh, you're obligated. So it was a choice. And we both made a choice that we weren't going to be sleeping with other people, which I don't even know if that's true now. Yeah, I went to Thanksgiving with his family. Like, see, I didn't know that we were fully dating.

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I think we should start by saying you and I are both extremely sex positive and all of these conversations we're going to have, we are not shaming at all. I personally love roleplay and kinky things here and there. So that's not what we're doing. But like you said, it's it's really important that we talk about this particular relationship that you had. Right.

Because I think the fine line is very interesting. Dangerous part about this. Exactly. I was so down like I was down to, like the adventure. I was down to try do things. I'm always like, I'll try anything twice because I jumped. Important to try everything to see what you like when you're in a safe space. Yes. Because you'll never figure out fully what satisfies you fully what you like. I definitely want to make sure people know that I'm not shaming and that, no, these things were consensual.

But I think that consent is really complicated. So I think that's an important thing to touch on. Yeah.

And we will definitely be touching on that. Thank you for saying that.

So let's I guess let's dive into the sex. And was it can you explain your first sexual experience? Was it kinky right off the bat? Yeah.

Yeah. So we were at my Airbnb, two friends over. My friend was in town and then one other girl that I knew in L.A., we were just hanging out like I thought he was super funny, super charming. We were drinking and he started like grabbing my feet. And that's like I'm not like a feet person, like a good thing for me. It was kind of hot. I was like, OK.

Like, it was touching my feet, like, really sexually. And I was like, OK, interesting. Like, I kind of knew we were going to hook up, but like right.

First thing. And then he basically like after a few hours pulled me into the back room and like pushed me on the bed and was like before we had sex, before we had made out, said, you can either call me or Daddy right away.

Yeah. And I actually asked him, like after I was like, how do you know that I was going to be cool with that? Or like he was like I could just sniff it out.

And I was like, oh, you're like, is it that obvious? Like, tell me what you know. OK, that's such an interesting point, because I've hooked up with dudes that right away. They're like, call me this, like call me your dad or whatever. And I do it with confidence.

But like, I appreciate the assertiveness. And that's why people are like, oh, why did you dump them earlier? Like, whatever you saw these red flags that it's like there was like I mean, he's obviously really charming and made me feel like I was on top of the world, which is like part of the manipulation page.

We were talking like the other day and you said something that really stood out to me and you said, I have never been complimented in the way that Armie Hammer, like, would compliment me. And it was almost creepy where I couldn't tell if he was acting or not.

Yeah. So when we were all hanging out, even before we slept together, the way that he spoke and acted was like it was a movie like very real, very like always just like you knew what to say, like it was planned.

Right. And the things you would say to me were like, you are like you are like you can do whatever you want in the world. I've never seen a woman's body built like this, like just things that made me feel after coming out of a relationship, I was extremely insecure, like literally thought I was like the biggest ugly piece of shit. Yeah. Literally made me feel like it wasn't just like, oh, you're baby. Like, no.

It was like the way that you worded these things to me made me feel like I was on top of the fucking world. It's like he built me up so high. Right. That was like part of why I allowed him and I wanted to please him like to the max, like I was saying yesterday, like I literally would have allowed him shave my head. I'm not like I'm laughing because I get it. I know it's funny, but no, totally.

But it's terrifying because that's when content gets complicated, because I was so entranced by him. I was so into him and I wanted to feel wanted. I wanted to feel like this girl that he had, like, put me up to be I wanted to be like a cool girl. Yeah. I wanted to leave him. And then I ended up doing things that now like I like these things, they get to like physical mental trauma.

I mean, I just didn't even think I don't know, like I just said, yes, everything. Because I wanted to please them inflicting these, like, scary criminal fantasies on me. Because obviously like this we can talk about this. But it went way beyond, like, normal stuff. Yes. Why so this behavior, this shit is like a smokescreen for him, like wanting to abuse women.

So it started with him being kinky and being like, call me sir or daddy. And then did it escalate like, OK, did you guys ever have, like, vanilla for lack of a better term, sex? No, no, no. We never really had. It was always like role playing or something like there always had to be like a factor to like the SEC, which also made me feel like he needed that to turn on.

Right. Which is which is OK. But it definitely does raise some red flags a little bit.

Was it to the point like he couldn't even get hard? He always got hard, but it was like, oh, well, there are sometimes if we had sex a few times that day, like, you definitely need an intense role play to like get got it. Yeah. Like it was always something. Definitely always something. That's how he introduced me to it was like because I, I'm from Connecticut like I like both our parents are doctors like very New England, like New England, Connecticut family like very traditional.

He knew that about me right away. And so he always is like trying to ease the into things like he was like, I think you have this in you like I'm going to pull it out of you like stuff like that. And then he manipulative as fuck. Yeah. Yeah. Like this was meant for me. Maybe like this would kill me and all like my trauma and all this stuff. And he made me watch this movie called The Secretary, which is like an old film on a relationship and basically how she had like all these self-harm issues and she was working for this guy.

And it was very and then he started spanking her. I'm like inflicting pain on her. And it killed her whole life and they got married and like, how it can heal woman and how can make them feel more powerful, which I think in some situations it totally can do. Yeah, it was like grooming me for what he was going to do. After that night, he started introducing me to what is called high protocol. I show up at a certain time if I'm late, like I don't get let in my hands and knees wander like tons of rules.

I mean, also, he did send me tape boards. It's like I do say to people what I'm telling the story, like you did send me some words you did, like try to do it right. In some ways I felt like right.

Or he pretended he pretended to try. So high protocol. Did he come up with that name or is that like a thing?

So it's like a date rape, inflicting pain on the woman.

OK, safety patterns all over me, the completely tied up like knife play like all of that shit.

OK, can we are you comfortable we dive into it. Yeah. So because I think you like do what. The message I'm trying to convey like a disservice if I'm not just completely honest about what happened because I feel like people can't learn from it if I'm not getting the whole truth.

Yeah. And I obviously it's it's completely up to you always. But I agree with that. It's kind of like if we really want to teach women this, like we have to be explicit and clear about what we're talking about, you know, so this high protocol. So you would just be waiting for him in lingerie. For how long would you wait for him?

So, like, I had to be outside of his door. I'd like my hands and knees for like a few minutes. And then he would come and get me and call me, which basically like he had like a color ceremony to that, like a color and would like walk on like a leash when this was all, like, weird for me to honestly, like, this is not my norm. Like, this was way out of my comfort zone and was just like literally doing it to please him.

Like to be completely honest, I enjoy being colored and walking in on my hands and knees, but like, I just wanted to satisfy him and make him happy. And that's like one of my love languages is like active service. I'm just going to be like doing things like these and but like. Yeah, so I'd show up and like I'd be right on time, like very, very strict in a spouse setting. I had to be calm dodgers or I would get like punished like, you know, there's a lot that's like a very typical protocol.

Right. I mean, I've I've actually done and this was like completely consensually, which is sounds like it was for you to at this point, I've had a guy walking around on a leash till he was kind of into that. And I thought it was fun. I mean, is it necessarily my thing? Like, did it turn me on? No, but it was like a fun thing. I'm the same as you like, try everything once.

Totally. So totally right.

So that was kind of one of the instances. And then when I did like the did he have a rape fantasy or rape fetish type thing? Yes, for sure.

He was really into the idea of like him breaking into my apartment and tying me up and be having no say. He would say things like, I want to take things in your apartment and like, fuck you with them and like, shit like that.

OK, yeah.

Honestly, the more research I've done and this is like a very important part of this journey for me is like researching everything and getting the information. And then this is actually like much rape is a much more common beyond than people think.

But like this is where I kind of come into an issue and like this is where hindsight is. Twenty twenty. I read to a lot of things and I participated in a lot of things and I didn't see notable articles. I didn't necessarily say yes to everything, but I didn't no. Any man who's fantasizing about raping, crushing a woman's bones, fighting a piece there. Eating the ribs like fucking a female's like limp body is like dangerous. Is it like a danger to all women?

One hundred percent.

Yeah, I think the rape fantasy thing, even women fantasize about that, too.

But you just added this whole other layer crushing the bones. What did you say before that? Eating flesh, eating flashlight, biting a chunk out of your skin, like just basically consuming, like in like running.

So this is where for me it the BDM is a little bit it's it's obviously still there. That's the predominant thing. But then he had this whole other layer to him, which is cannibalism. Yes. Which sounds crazy to say, but it is.

And he asked me, like I've talked about this, like this is not new news, but like you asked me to remove my ribs and eat them.

And you tell us about that like he wanted you like how did you even say that to you?

He would be like, I want to find a doctor in L.A. like a like a concierge doctor or someone who will do it because there's like he was like, oh, there's definitely someone who will do it to remove the ribs that I don't need, like my bottom ones. And he has a smoker at his house to smoke them and eat them.

And he said that to you, like honestly point blank multiple times. And did you think he was kidding at first or what the fuck?

Yeah, I'm like so self-deprecating and like dark humor. So what do you want to make it into? Like a necklace? But then, like, I realized it wasn't a joke. I don't know. I just like put it in a box and like, shoved it away. Like, I just did not think anything twice, but I liked him so much. But when all of the Dems first came out, which like I have to give a big shout out to like the first girl who came out, I don't know her full name, but like it's House of Abby on Instagram and like she basically started this whole movement.

I've seen the. Yeah. And like basically I'm saying I'm one hundred percent accountable, like all of these things, everything just sort of clicking for me where I was like, oh my God. Like he asked like pieces of my skin like. Yes, like eat my ribs. And like, I knew that was fucking weird, but like I never thought of it is like a predator who's like a cannibal who could like, you know, I knew.

But like, I also felt like scared, like I wasn't going to come out and expose, like Armie Hammer, like, ruined his career, like his two children.

Know, that makes complete and total sense.

Yeah. But like it took other people coming out for me to be like, this is the right thing. And like, if you don't come out, then there will be other victims to this day. Yeah, it's it's crazy. And that's something that I fucking bothers me so much with these types of things. When one woman comes out and then other women follow and people try to say, oh, why are you coming out now? Why don't you come out earlier like all of these things?

And it's like because it's terrifying. And I needed to know. Yeah. And I needed this one woman showed me the strength and the courage and I wanted to support her also.

And also, it's like feeling like you have support is so huge, like feeling like you. If people love your back, like a lot of courage to start a movement like that, especially a law in the public eye. And also I have had like a little bit of a messy past with my relationship. So I never felt comfortable. I always felt like people were going to look at like the worst of the situation.

And like, yeah, I mean, it's like no one actually knows me. Right.

Also, like in my future relationships, like we we can talk about this like he carve like an A and to me it's like that's going to haunt me into your skin, into my skin.

And how did he do that with a knife, which is something we can talk about, like he was really into knife fight. And basically he was a like really far one night and like I was tied up and like did that. But like, that's this is going to hurt. That's scary to me for a long time. And, like, it's more to me to like to make this into a positive thing and to make this into like a sex education thing and for people to, like, learn from my story and protect other women.

But it's not like an easy thing to come out and just, like, exploit yourself like that in that school, like, really intimate way. Yeah, right. Yeah, it's tough. And also it's really triggering for a lot of people when other people make fun of people for coming out, like it's like a graduation where people do that. It really, really is. And I just have to applaud you because that takes so much courage and so much strength to do that.

I mean, beyond. So let's talk about knife play then for a second. Yeah. So how does that work? Like I that's one thing I really have never played around with before. Right.

So he's really into knives. Like a lot of guys. I collect knives or you're into meat and hunting and all of that.

Like I like it kind of goes hand in hand a little man and he was into the meat stuff. Yeah. Supreme's like meat, bones, like veins, blood like all of it super into it. Almost like he was like demonic. And I'm not like I don't know, like I'm not like a spook like. But like I mean, just from the couple of things you just said, it's like that he sounds like a monster. Yeah, yeah.

So he was into Nici which made me, like, really, really uncomfortable, like probably the most uncomfortable about out of everything he would like, stick like a knife in the floor, like by my head and like put the blade all over my body. And like one time he was doing that and it's like, OK, where am I? Where he was talking to himself. He was like, where am I going to put my initials? Oh, my God.

And then he was like, stand over my body and decided where he was going to put it and basically, like, put it right above my vagina as basically branding me. Mm hmm. Yeah. And I honestly don't fully remember that night.

Like, I honestly blacked out. Blocked it out. Yeah. Like, it's really funny how your brain does that to protect you. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

That happened. And that was definitely like the scariest I, I don't feel like you knew what he he didn't know what he was doing, like he was just like letting himself go into this dark place like. Right. I don't know. Yeah. It was really, really scary.

I mean I'm just any time that I've done this roleplay thing and I've had even a guy tie me up, even just that can be a little tiny bit scary because you have then one hundred percent giving yourself over to their power for sure.

Another part of this is like. Emotionally and physically, you can be just as traumatized by consensual sex, even if you don't know what at the time, like your body doesn't differentiate with what's happening to you. So your brain I'm agreeing to this like it's fine, it's hot, it's fine. Like your body and like the trauma that it's in your body, it doesn't sometimes correlate. So like rape trauma from being tied up and consensually rape like three months later and have that really, really affect you.

Oh my God, that is so interesting. And that makes so much sense. It's like you can be consenting with your words and maybe even your mind. But when your body when you're waking up with bruises, with pain, with cuts, whatever, it can be a totally different thing.

Also, I know that when I'm in a sexual space because I'm a very sexual person, but like I will agree and do things that like I wouldn't necessarily do like in my day to day.

Mm hmm.

Which is something that I needed to educate myself on and I needed to learn. And I think that, like, the best thing you can do for yourself as a woman is learning how to say no and getting the confidence to feel that way. And I honestly can be honest myself and know like I can work on that and I can work on that, too.

Yeah. And I'm I'm six years older than you and like, even I can work on that.

It needs to be in the conversation, like the general sex conversation. And it's not. Yes, it's not at all. So the you said it earlier this thing with consent. And it's almost like even if you consent to something later on, you cannot consent to it anymore. Right. So you're telling him before this, like sex act, I consent. And then if it starts to scare you, you should. And you absolutely. You can say, I don't feel comfortable with this and I don't like this.

Yeah. I feel and I'm scared. And I think that's that's what I didn't do. And now I'm dealing with the aftermath of that.

Did he care about your sexual pleasure at all? You having an orgasm at all?

Yes, he did. But it wasn't in the high protocol sense. It was more about pain and it was more about him inflicting pain on me. Like he got really turned on when you saw I was in like three months of pain. Well, during the sex, though, like he did, he did like take care of me and like, I mean, ate me out and everything. It wasn't like just completely ravenous. Like he was like that.

But in the high protocol setting, it's like a completely different space. Like, I don't even categorize that as like sex. Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. But you did tell me once he was like making a girl orgasm makes me feel like Superman or something.

Like because like what.

Just like a like a normal guy thing. Like yeah totally. Yeah. Like complete control. Like you're like making this girl feel this way and it's like your orgasm. He was like tell me it's my orgasm. Like it's like you really want to up over all of it.

How did you leave off. Like when did you finally end things.

So I went to Thanksgiving with him, with his family and like that was one of the most normal things that we had done. And it made me honest. It gave me a lot of ease because I was like, OK, this is normal. Like I'm going to be doing this. Family is mother's very Christian and very sweet. So it's like another interesting thing, like I really don't want to drag this family into like I know because I like how he had, like, demons and like all these things, I think they were like kind of not in the dark about like this.

There's something wrong. Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

So that was like a very normal thing. And it made me really happy, like as a traditional person, like meeting the family is like a big deal for me. And I was a relief actually. Yeah, it was a relief. And I was like, OK, this is like normal, like we're normal. I kind of try to convince myself that this was all normal. And then after that, he was just like always up to some weird shit, like telling me like rules of who I couldn't and couldn't see that I didn't.

He didn't want any other guys in my bed, but would be like being weird on Instagram and like just like I also just always felt sick to my stomach, like I but I was just like always feeling icky, like there's no other way for me to describe it than like feeling icky all the fucking time, like starting to feel insecure. So I doubt myself, I like negative self thoughts, like not feel confident, not feel confident about posting photos.

And that's my job, like my livelihood is posting and I enjoy that. And I just didn't like not only was it tough because I didn't feel like myself, but also this relationship was making me feel like literally I didn't even know who I was like out of body x rays. So I just texted and basically, which was like kind of lame of me, like I'm never really one to like and things over, like I think a phone call and in person is much more mature and way better.

But I mean, it's not like scared, but I think looking back like I was a little bit, but like basically just texted him was like, I can't do this. Like, this is really making me feel sick to my stomach. And he was like, I mean, you. A little bit of a fight, and then we just kind of fizzled out and then they replaced me instantly, like always another girl, like it's not hard for him to find another girl.

There was a girl right before me. And that's also the part of why I want to bring this public is because there's a lot of women, plenty other girls in the next two months that come forward.

Yeah, yeah. And once again, Paige, like you really are an incredible, incredible woman to be coming forward today.

By the way, I really appreciate that. And thank you for giving her a platform to talk about it. Of course, like your girls trucks do. And I just think it's a really important conversation out with your friends and like just like talk about it and like, yeah, there probably some girls listening who have been through some shit that they didn't really want to do. And it's not your fault. And it's OK to feel like paying for that.

And no one fucking talks about these things and we need to remove that taboo or else like especially young women don't know.

I'm like talk about sex all the time. I have no issue with it. And these are just never things that I thought I would go through.

Encounter even you like you're like you you talk a lot about sex on your podcast and like, yeah, this is something that's like very new, which is like even so like it's not in the conversation totally.

And I had a really toxic relationship. I won't say to Ami's extent, but like I woke up with bruises and there was a lot of role playing stuff that I didn't love. And not feeling that you brought up that you felt really icky. I remember feeling like that, too, because it wasn't until months, maybe even years later, that I realized how fucked up it was when I was happy that it's like fully set in for me, like the like shit that I'm going to have to deal with.

It probably hasn't. Right. And it can take years, like, it can totally take years. But getting ahead of it is really important. It is. And knowing are you knowing that you might have that trauma later and being able to deal with it appropriately instead of like diving into other vulnerable positions. Ritual vitamins, if I'm going to be drinking, drugging and the like, I need to take care of my body and every other way that I can.

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Thank you so much for sharing your story with me, Page. I want to change directions and I want to get into listener questions and advice. And you're in for a fucking tree because my listeners have been writing in some wild Aushev. Are you ready? Yes.

The questions are OK. Yes. OK, first question. Help. What are your tips for shaving down there? No matter what razor I use, what shaving cream or what direction I go, I got really bad razor burn every single time it's getting in the way of me being able to wear certain bathing suits and feel attractive. Also, what are your thoughts on stretchmarks and do you have any tips? I don't feel confident when they're visible. Please help.

OK, I just want to start off by saying I got my bikini line lizzard it's the best decision I've ever made in my life. B I think the thing with stretch marks and feel free to jump in whenever.

Yeah. You know once you go I definitely want to chime in. OK, do it.

OK, well first of all, yes, I think getting laser hair removal is a great option because ultimately even if you're getting bikini waxes or shaving, you're going to get razor bumps and it's always going to grow back. And if you're spending like 80 dollars on a year, like a Brazilian wax, that adds up over time.

Wait, that's such a good point. Yeah, so that's what I think about that. But also, I use this single ten skin and it's like basically rubbing alcohol and it completely gets rid of razor burn, really my skin and skin.

OK, you will not get razor, but like when I have to shave or like I don't have time to get like a wax or like my laser or whatever. I use tan skin and it's like total.

Where do you where can you get to like Wal-Mart.

Amazon, where you can get it all order and you can get on Amazon.

OK, that's fucking amazing. OK, so those are two options right there, I think as far as the stretch marks go. Every woman has those, but I get it. It's like she feels super, you know, not confident about them.

Obviously there is this treatment. I'm not a doctor, so I give anyone gets this done and like, fucked up shit happens. Like, you can't come for me, you can't come for me. But it's called car boxey therapy. And they literally, like, inject oxygen into your skin somehow. One of my friends got this done. It helped her stretch marks. I've never seen something worked that well.

So I used to lift a lot because I was a skier and like I still have stretch marks on my ass because, like, I literally had a fucking dumper. Like I literally had a huge ass, like overnight.

Like, I just spit out my water.

It's like this is my thing because like, I wear, like, thong bikinis. So they're still there. So I start to wonder at the point where, like, they're white. So they're like Purple First and then they turn white. Yes. I'll often wear fake tan or something that helps me feel confident with it. But also if you're just like confident as fuck about it and you're like, this is my ass and it's hot and like, what the fuck ever.

I do not care. They don't give a fuck. No.

If you don't make it weird, then it's not weird. Like that's my view on life in general. Even if you don't feel confident, if you're acting confident, like it will like manifesto, swear to God.

I completely agree with that. And I think stretchmarks are similar to cellulite. Like dudes don't give a fuck like they really at the end of the day, don't they.

Do they can literally fuck off. Thank you. OK, exactly. So that solves. OK, next question to this fucking question. OK, I've been hooking up with this guy. They were talking about this dying. OK, so I've been hooking up with this guy over the past few months. The sex is great and we've gotten pretty comfortable with each other. The only problem is I don't know his fucking name. I met him on Tinder, which moved to Instagram, where he has a screen name and I can't find his Tinder account on the app anymore.

His Hulu profile says his name is Max. I'm not sure if it's his real name because I tried asking, so what are your friends call you?

And he said, Eddie does it. He doesn't look like life. No, he doesn't look like either one. How do I find out what his name is without being a total bitch? OK, this is the funniest thing I've ever read. Snapchat, right?

OK, well, that's a good point. You should try adding him on everything. What's your Facebook gives me all platform like yours do LinkedIn and Facebook. You're not using like a screen name type thing, like it's your fucking name. So I think that's like the first thing. The second thing. And this is what I always do when I forget someone's name is I'll say I want to put it in my phone or something. How do you spell it then?

I was thinking. What if his name is like, Mark, you are so stupid. She's like, is it with a Sikh or with an excuse? Like, can you spell that for me?

The AWB, he's like, no, no, no.

But I'm pretty upset, honestly. Like, if anything like the relationship ends because he has a name like this, a good story. So whatever like whoever wrote this, then like you have a good story regardless.

Dude, it's so fucking funny. Like I also think another thing she can do is look for pieces of mail or a fucking birthday card in his room or in his house.

But of course, even a spectrum bill like, yes, dude, ask him how much he's paying for utilities. And you can see the bill on Internet service. You go through his mail. That's so fucking funny.

I mean, I can go into, like, FBI mode. So I feel like this wouldn't be an issue for me. I literally know, like people's cousins, like after I saw them, like on Facebook, like suddenly like a dark hole. I know every name so I can relate to that. But like, yeah, I know I'm the exact same way. Dude, I will start for seven hours straight. OK, moving on. Next question.

Hey Zofia with a motherfucking f love the new and improved show this weekend. I was sleeping over my boyfriend's house. We each had a bottle of wine and by the end of the night I was ready to pass out. My phone was charging on his nightstand and I woke up in the middle of the night and I'm almost 100 percent certain I caught him looking through my phone. I remember putting it on the charger and when I woke up, it was unplugged.

He didn't find anything, obviously, but this is not the first time it's happened. I've told him off before because he went through personal conversations with me and my best friend. I haven't said anything yet because I don't know if I should be plotting or what. What do you suggest? I do help.

I think it's definitely fucking weird. It's definitely weird behavior. I think just sitting down and being honest about it. And if you can't be honest with you, then there's just going to be toxic shit in the relationship. Like I always say, your relationship start to the lie. That's like setting a precedent for the whole relationship.

I completely agree. I also think that he really should not be looking through the phone unless she's done something to make him think that she's up to it until proven guilty.

Just don't. Yeah, giving people the benefit of the doubt is super important. It is.

I mean, I had a guy that I dated and he looked through my phone within the first month or two of dating and it freaked me out. It was weird.

It's just like icky, like it's just insecure behavior that will lead to other things. Like the insecure ones are the ones that cheat, like the guy just accident and are not looking to your phone are the ones who are loyal to you. I totally agree with that.

Yeah. Just keep an eye on it. I mean, also, I'm the type of person that it doesn't matter how fucked up I am and how drunk I am. My phone, I will fall asleep with it in my bra. You no, I literally longbox I will wake up with an imprint of my cell phone on my stomach because I was like, no fucking way.

So I'm going to have access to this card. But probably honestly, you buy these fucking black dudes, go through your shit like I know we're all just traumatized.

We're all yeah, I'm traumatized, girl.

I would absolutely bring it up to him and let him know, like, it's not cool for sure. OK, last question. Hey, so I have been in a friends with benefits situation for a few years now. Long story short, we live in different states. Neither one of us are looking for a long distance relationship, but we see each other pretty regularly. Last week I went to visit him and asked to be tied up. We had talked about this previously.

Turns out he's into some BDM shit. This sex was so hot and I loved it. But I knew to all of this our comfort level is insane and I want to explore it a little bit more. But I'm not sure how to navigate this situation. Do you have any advice for a beginner sub Elwell sub meaning submissive? I know we need to have a conversation about boundaries and whatnot, but is there anything else you think I should keep in mind before jumping in love?

You OK?

Super cool that she is like trying to acquire knowledge about this before she gets into it, because that's something that I didn't do. So I props to her even like asking the question and like taking a step and being like, is this really what I want to do? So I think that and I think that what can be confusing to people, especially about my story and me coming out with this, is like personally I am more submissive naturally. And I like like I'm very adventurous, like I like some of it's really hot and really fun.

It can change and get dangerous really fast. Yeah, I think that as long as he's a good dom and like he's taking care of you and you feel safe and he's not being, like, just weird behavior. Mm hmm. I mean, my situation is so extreme and like how extreme army took it, not just because there are probably so many men in it. And just because he's an actor, like whatever. There are other guys, right?

Yeah. I make sure he's being, like, responsible.

Yeah. I will say, I think that if you are leaving this actual experience and something doesn't sit right with you or something feels off, I think that could absolutely be a red flag because I dated a guy and we tried a lot of shit and and shit. And for the most part, I would leave this sexual experience and I'd be like, oh, I loved that. That was so fun. But there were moments, especially towards the end, where I did not like how it made me feel.

And I remember there were moments where I was genuinely scared during it. When you're feeling genuinely scared, I think that is a red flag.

One hundred percent. And I think that anthem is tricky that way, especially as women like we want to be down, like we want to be down for whatever and just make sure going into it that you are competent enough and your self-esteem is high enough where when it gets weird, you can be like, absolutely fucking not, because I can personally, I was not like my self-esteem was not high enough. I was really vulnerable and I honestly did not say no even when it got really fucking weird.

Thank you. That's really smart is if you're going to try these things, make sure that you are in a headspace and you are confident enough to say no, that's a huge one. Great point.

OK, thank you so much, Paige. This was so much fucking fun, so fun. We gave these people really great advice and I want to have you on again, so you'll absolutely be coming back. You guys need to follow her on Instagram page. Llorens, I'm going to tag you your YouTube. I fucking love that as well.

And do you watch what you do? But I like I love you and I'm like, I don't think anyone watches the like, oh I thought you were in the car with your mom going to Starbucks. I was like, I would love to wait. So you need to start. You do like when you move to New York, we're going full fucking we're going to talking every day. We really are. And I would love to have you back on so we can talk about other things, too.

Yeah. OK, Paige, thank you so much. OK, I love you. So love you. Bye.