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Hey everybody, it's me, Josh. And for this week's Why ask Selex. I've chosen whatever happened to acid rain from back in 2012. It's the story of one of those really neat, rare times when humanity came together and said, no, no more. We're going to actually save the planet this time. Let's hope we can do this again. In the meantime, sit back and enjoy. Welcome to Step, you should know a production of pirate radio's HowStuffWorks.

Hey, and welcome to the podcast, I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles Chuck Bryant, and we're doing this again. We're bringing the science, this time for once in our lives.

Acid rain. Yeah, falling down from the acid cloud. That's how it goes. It's not how. Acid Rain by John Dega. That guy so great. We watch it again the other day just by chance. And I hadn't seen it in a couple of years. And it still just feels like Chad said our friend. It's hard to believe that that voice comes out of that guy.

Yeah.

And he's got a new one like mother economy. Really good. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah, he's a good guy. Um, I don't know with chocolate roundabout, but there's a good call out. I would be very interested to hear everyone's interpretation of what chocolate rain means.

Good luck to you. That to um.

Let's see. Chuck, do you remember back in the 80s. Mm hmm. Hearing about two things. Two terrifying environmental things. One, the ozone layer, specifically the hole in the ozone layer. Yeah. And to acid rain.

Yeah. Throw in apartheid. And that is the 80s. Yeah. I'm not going to play Sin City. No. Yeah that's the pretty much. Also don't forget cocaine, Ronald Reagan jelly beans and the 80s. Yeah.

And Magnum. Sure. But he kind of transcends the 80s really if you ask me.

He's just a man of all time. Yeah. Never gets old.

The weird thing is this, since I guess maybe the mid 90s or whatever, you don't hear about any of those things except for Magnum any longer. Yeah.

Because of of course, global warming took over and everyone's afraid we're going to melt now. And so they said, well, we don't need to worry about acid rain anymore. We fix that problem. Right.

I think there's a perception that, you know, acid rain was fixed and taken care of. And astoundingly, in a lot of ways it has been.

Yeah, they've come a long way, baby.

Those only or, by the way, has not been, as a matter of fact, another one opened up in the Antarctic now. And we have to. But that's that's another topic of discussion.

Yeah. Acid rain. Let's get back to it, though, is a very it's a nice success story and a lot of ways. And it came from a comprehensive understanding of a problem and a comprehensive will to address it.

That's right. That's how you take care of stuff. There is still a long way to go, though.

Yeah. You always bringing me back down to Earth.

I'm not completely fixed, but it is good. It's heartwarming to know that you can see a problem and and reduce something like acid rain. Precisely.

So, Chuck, what is acid rain? Acid rain, Josh is a trans boundary issue, which means even though it just occurs in the mainly occurs in the northern hemisphere, it still is going to cross over and affect the rest of the world.

And the reason that's worth mentioning is because for many years, up until the 1980s, they thought it was a very local problem. Yeah. And then they realized, oh, no, it's not. And everybody kind of got on board with fixing it. That's right.

But like you said, Northern Hemisphere, it occurs mostly there because we're the dirtiest, more industrial, most polluting.

Yeah.

So specifically what it is, is. Rain with acid in it, literally emissions of sulfur dioxide, S02 nitrogen oxides and from things like cars and factories, power plants, all those nasty things, lightning strikes, volcanoes, the natural ones.

Yeah, they will actually react with water vapor in the atmosphere and turn into acid, sulfuric and nitric acid. Yeah.

And they can fall in the form of wet rain, snow, sleet, fog, or they can be deposited as particulates and gases.

Right. That's dry acid rain.

Well, the whole dry things called acid deposition. Yeah. Because it can be wet or dry. Right.

And it's being deposited exactly on the earth. Yeah. That's what that word is. It's branch from deposit isn't it. I think so, yeah. It didn't even occur to me. Um and so you so bravo.

Unexplained unexplainably acid rain for Bravo. Sarah Daoudi who wrote this. Yeah. She did a very good job on this. And when you can't just be like, well this, this rain seems a little hinky, so we're going to say that that's acid rain. They actually know there's a there's a very strict definition of what constitutes acid rain. And they use the scale, the determinant, good old scale. So the scale is the spectrum between highly acidic and highly basic.

Right. And acid rain obviously falls toward the acidic side of the scale. And in the middle of the scale is pure water. And that's at a seven point zero.

It's not zero. It's entirely neutral. It's neither basic nor acidic.

Yeah, I just find it interesting that it's a scale of zero to 14 with seven being in the middle seventh in the middle of zero to 14.

Yeah, but I mean it just for me, I would say zero is neutral and anything above would be I got negative, but whatever.

In the grand tradition of civilization established by the Romans, though, the scale starts at one rather than zero. Sure. But yeah, I see what you're saying.

Actually, it says you hit a 14 in here. I like the fact.

I think it goes from one to fourteen. Well, then Sarah got it wrong.

Um. In the graph here says one to 14, I wonder, um, but back to its seventh in the middle either way. Six, seven, eight. Yeah.

So it would start at zero, I guess.

OK, so the the more acidic is the lower numbers than the more basic is the higher numbers. Right.

Yeah. The thing is, is rain isn't neutral.

No, normal rain still is slightly acidic and it hits about five point six on the scale. Right. So why. Well, it combines with carbon dioxide in the atmosphere to form a slightly acidic carbonic acid deposition.

Yeah. Which is branched from the word deposit. That's right.

So so acid rain is something like five point three to four point o as far as acidity goes. Right. Four point three to five.

OK, um, yeah, there's a big difference. Um. And it's something like what the acidity between orange juice and black coffee. Yeah, which Sarah is keen to point out, which is a bit of a misnomer. While that's true, you can't say, well, like, dislike coffee. And that's not going to throw coffee when you're grass and it's not going to kill it.

See, I, I my hat was off to her for saying like, well we're going to be like orange juice is fine. SRAW is fine because if you think about it, if it rained orange juice all the time. Yeah.

It probably has the same impact. Be awesome.

Just like all the cup out the window each morning, I'd be like, oh, it's with pulp today.

The problem with acid rain, though, Josh, even though it is. Has the acidity of a coffee or an orange juice, it can wreck small parts of an ecosystem. And as we all know, if small parts of an ecosystem, there's a domino effect that occurs that spreads throughout an ecosystem, one of the most valuable things on the planet is something like plankton.

Yeah, plankton is high currents. It's like honey buns in prison. But for them here, you know, pretty much. And when plankton, which is very, very sensitive to changes in, um, especially when it becomes more acidic and plankton dies and small and vertebrates die. Yeah. Then yeah, it starves out the larger animals, fish and frogs. And then we start to get hungry, especially the French who had frog legs, e.g. acid rain is a huge problem in France.

That's right. And eventually it's just mass hysteria. Pretty much cats and dogs living together can really from different strokes end up with green hair.

That's right.

There are a couple of programs that monitor this in the U.S., the National Atmospheric Deposition Program. And they handled the wet deposition and the Clean Air Status and Trends Network handled the dry. And what they're looking for is trying to determine the critical load, which is how much an ecosystem can take before it starts saying, man, I'm breaking down. You're killing me with this stuff.

Right. Um, and the scale is determined by the concentration of hydrogen ions, right? Yeah. In a substance, that's what makes it either acidic or basic. Right.

So what these programs are doing is measuring the concentration of hydrogen ions to determine acidity.

And they say, oh, well, this is this is too much science. I would just walk out and be like, look at these. This plankton is not looking very healthy. This is acidic. I don't even need to measure this stuff.

You can just spot unhappy plankton pretty much nice. It's not how you want. You know what to look for. Sure.

I'll teach you something. It's not hard when you've met Happy Plankton. Your life will never be the same. The difference is like night and day.

So surface waters are where acid rain is going to hit you most initially from precipitation. And you don't really think about this. You think it well, it rains in a lake. What an in a river. What it does is it rains on the ground. And although sure. It rains on the water surface, it's also going to run through soil to get to water. Right.

One of the purposes of soil, one of the functions it provides is buffering water that percolates through it toward ground water, toward bodies of water. And what's buffering me?

Well, it has the ability to neutralize acids. Yeah.

And then also, yeah, I think it brings everything more toward purified water or neutral.

Right. Yeah.

But I think specifically with a lot of like the the minerals that are in the soil like say calcium, they counteract acidic, um, rain, acidic water to bring it more toward neutral. Right. Right. The problem is, is when the soil is buffering, capacity is overloaded, there's just too much for it to handle. A lot of that unutilized acid gets passed along into the body of water and then you start to have those big problems with the little unhappy plankton.

Yeah, it's almost like a water filter that's past its date. You know, it just can't filter anymore.

Nice analogy. Thank you. Hey, friends, want to talk to you about Blue Moon beer, the beer that was created during the 1995 baseball season at the Sandlot Brewery, Crisfield, Denver, Colorado.

Yeah, the person who founded Blue Moon, the original Brew Master, was inspired by the flavorful Belgian, which he enjoyed while studying brewing in Brussels, which makes sense. And so he made this amazing beer crafted from Valencia orange peel for a subtle sweetness, a little bit of coriander and oats to give it a smooth, creamy finish. That's right. It's unfiltered. It's well crafted. It's got the twist of flavor, very full flavor. And it's really unlike any other beer that you're going to taste.

That's right. As somebody who tasted it when they first made it said a beer that's good. Only comes around once in a blue moon. But that doesn't mean that you can only enjoy it once in a blue moon. And in fact, you can have blue moon delivered by going to get that blue moon beer dotcom and finding delivery options near you, right, Chuck?

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That's what I ask about the stuff you should know.

So we've talked about what happens where the French end up with a lot of big problems in coastal areas.

Nitrogen, remember, we have what is it, sulfuric acid and what acid? What for acid rain. Yeah, nitric acid. Yeah. OK, so nitric acid is based on nitrogen. Nitrogen has a really interesting impact on coastal waters where when it's deposited it supports algae blooms.

Yeah, lots, because algae love nitrogen and when algae blooms take place, algae starts to die eventually and they sustain bacteria, specifically aerobic bacteria that flourishes itself and sucks up all the oxygen in the water, starving fish, shellfish plants, and eventually leading to, at the very least, a strain, if not a collapse on coastal ecosystems.

So too much acid rain will increase algae. Increased algae means increased dying algae and increased dying algae means increased bacteria. And they rob fishes of their oxygen.

Yeah, that's a domino effect.

One of the things I love about acid rain is just how elegantly understandable it is.

It is very basic and simple. I love it. It's not basic acidic. Yeah. It's, um.

So we're not done with the soil too, by the way. No, no. In addition to I guess, decreasing its buffering capacity or overloading its buffering capacity, um, acid rain has the terrible habit of drawing aluminum out of the soil.

Yeah. It's normally locked in the soil. Acid rain draws it out, which means that tree roots can suck it up and that's poison to them. That's a toxin.

Yeah. And Sarah makes a good point here. It's not like a it's not a situation.

Where are you going to find a rainforest has leveled all the sudden because of acid rain or you're going to find a lake or river that looks nasty and decaying and disgusting. Water might actually look cleaner. Yeah.

And then ironic it is. It's ironic and beautiful.

And what it's going to do to your forest is it's going to stunt its growth and over time it's going to have an effect.

Yeah. Like you're going to have bald trees. Mm. Because in addition to the toxins coming out in the soil on low lying areas from acid rain and it also degrading helpful minerals, like we said, like calcium and other things that trees also use.

Yeah. In higher elevations there, acid rain turns into acid fog that is added.

That's crazy to me that I'm going to say at this time.

That is a great band name, acid fog.

Yeah, but so just imagine like trees bathing in that all the time. Yeah. It strips their leaves and basically makes them chilly.

Yeah. And that's why when you see mountains in the Appalachian Mountains that have bald peaks, it's not because trees can't grow up there. They could grow up there if they weren't sucking in and being surrounded by acid clouds, acid, folic acid. Yeah, that's nuts.

Just it doesn't have to be rainin, right? Yeah. You know, it's just in particulates in the air. Yeah. Crazy.

And that that kind of leads to how it affects us because we are not nearly as sensitive to these kind of changes.

With acid that acid rain brings right now, it's not going to burn, you know, you can swim in the lake, you're an acid lake and you will be fine.

But an acidic lake, let's say. And yeah, because it's just about battery acid. Yeah.

So you couldn't swim in a battery acid like that terrible blow, but you could swimming in acidic lake as far as acid rain is concerned, um, the problem comes with that dry deposition, the sulfuric acid, nitric oxide or nitric acids combined in low lying areas with ozone. Yeah.

Voices and create smog. Yeah.

Which is bad for your respiratory system.

Ground level maybe. Yeah. It can also do things like if you've ever seen an old building that is or a monument that's got these little smooth grooves that could be acid corrosion for like years and years to wear away stone. It'll, it's no friend to your car paint job that's for sure.

Which I mean if you're in your car, that's a big deal.

Yeah. That tree sap pollen, bird droppings and acid rain are the former enemies of your of your auto paint. They're considered corrosive environmental fallout.

And friend of Makow. Yeah, Makow loves this stuff. Yeah.

Um, so the idea about acid rain, consider this, that stone statue you're just describing that takes a long time. Sure. A lot of orange juice. Rain has to fall on that thing. Yeah. For it to become pockmarked and weathered prematurely. Right. And it's had actually plenty of time to do that statue of Edward James Olmos.

You'd be like Spitting Image. So sorry.

Um, so the man who got me without so uncool.

The reason the reason it's had a lot of we've had a long time or that that statue is weathered over a very long time, is because we've had acid rain for quite some time ever since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution, I think. Yeah, pretty much because remember, they thought it was very localized problem. And the reason they thought it was local was because it had such quick rapid effects.

But the acid rain, I don't know who coined the term acid fog, but acid rain was coined by an Englishman named Robert Angus Smith back in 1872. Yeah. And it was the monuments that made him say, what in the heck is going on here?

And there weren't a lot of people back then. Like I was thinking when I read this, like, man, it would have been great if during the boom of Ingenuity and Industrial Revolution, there were just as many people concerned with the impact it might have, but it just couldn't work that way. It's almost like they just had to do their thing and then leave us to figure out how to fix it, how to clean up the mess.

Sort of. I don't know if those things to do things could have evolved. I simultaneously I think you're on to something.

I mean, maybe we wouldn't have, um. I don't know, the iPhone, maybe. Who knows, maybe we would.

I don't know, maybe we'd be better off. Yeah, a lot better off. Maybe we would have more stuff, maybe it would have changed the way of thinking rather than just get get get you know have been get but also how is this going to affect other people.

So Smith was a a man alone in early ecologists, we'll say.

Yeah. Yeah, it's a good for him. Man, you've been coming up with some great, like off the cuff creative solutions.

Well, that's not a solution. If we had a time machine, it would be sure. OK, yeah, the Wayback Machine is in the shop, so. Yeah. Did you know the original Mr. Potato Head was an actual potato? Did you know that all tequila's are miskell, but not all mescal? There's tequila. Did you know some goats climb trees? Did you know there really was a Jones family that everyone in New York was trying to keep up with or that Pablo Picasso was a child prodigy who could draw before he could talk?

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That's just not at all. Right.

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That's what I want to ask, because you should know, uh, so scientists did determine by what the 70s, 1970s that acid rain was a problem and it was transboundary. It's not just local. And so then in 1980, thankfully, the Acid Deposition Act said, you know what, we're going to do this for 10 years and we're going to see what's going on 10 years later in 1990. And they said, yep, it's a big problem.

Yeah. So we need to do something about it.

And they did very quickly. Congress took the already established Clean Air Act and added sulfur dioxide and nitrous oxide. Nitrogen oxide, right. Yeah. To the list of like most wanted reduction people materials. Yeah.

And this was in 1995 with the Clean Air Act and the acid rain program. Right.

So it's 1995. This is when everything really starts to come into effect. Yeah, right.

And it I guess at least as far as sulfur dioxide emissions went, it was wildly successful. Yeah. Compared to 1980 levels in 2010, the the sulfur dioxide emissions have been reduced by 50 percent.

That's good. That's astounding. It is. That is astounding because consider this, that's not from hitting this since 1980. That's hitting 119 since 1995. We already got it back down to 50 percent. Yeah, down 50 percent in 17 years. That's amazing. And the way they did that is through a cap and trade scheme. I kind of like the old cap and trade. It makes a lot of sense. Cap and trade. Basically what they say is we're going to set a cap for how much CO2 that your power plant can create to limit.

But they set the cap and they says, you know what, you've got these allowances, though. If you come under, you get these credits and you can actually sell those to other companies that are in need. And it just I don't know some about it makes sense to me.

It makes a lot of sense. And then over time, you decrease the amount that that people are allowed to emit.

And when you're cutting it into these allowances, those allowances by by virtue of the scarcity of them, sure become more valuable.

Yeah, it really incentivizes you to do something about it for your company. Exactly.

So that worked really well for nitrous oxide or for sodium. Sulphur dioxide. Yeah. And what are we even talking about here?

That's why I say S02 and with nitrogen oxides, they didn't institute a cap and trade until 2003, so it was lagging a little bit. But it too is something of a success story. They they reduced it from 27 million tonnes in 1980 to sixteen point three million tonnes in 2008. That's pretty good. Yeah. And so this has had a discernible effect on the environment.

You're apparently, uh, let's see, the acidic lakes, the number of acidic lakes throughout the country. Have reduced dramatically. There are 70 percent fewer acidic lakes and streams in Wisconsin and Michigan than there were in 1984. A third of the bodies of water that were acidic in the early 90s in the Adirondacks and the northern Appalachians are now not considered acidic at all. That's awesome. So there have been like huge strides made.

Other places there have not been. And also you found this really good little kind of overview about acid rain and what happened to it by Nina Rastogi from Slate. Yeah, that's whose stuff I'm quoting right now.

So there have been huge strides, but there's still, like you said originally, a long way to go.

Yeah, the National Acidic Precipitation Assessment Program said that another another 40 to 80 percent is what we need to hit to really restore these ecosystems. Yeah, and I think we're we're headed there.

It sounds like it. Yeah.

Like we'll check in in 10 years and follow up on this. Who am I kidding? We could well do it for us in 10 years.

Well, no, we will. Well, it'll be our comeback special. OK, whatever happened to whatever happened to acid rain? Great.

But Chuck, I think that this is a really valuable lesson if you have a non polarized international initiative to take care of a problem. And you can shout down business interests and just say, no, this is what you're doing and here's how you're going to do it. Yeah, you can make things happen.

Yeah, I guess no one was saying acid rain doesn't exist. Acid rain is really not bad. Right?

It was pretty much non polarizing except for big business and also where any jobs lost by this cap and trade scheme was an industry hurt by this cap and trade scheme. I would wager probably not.

Do you think? I would wager not a bet. They're still in business. They're just doing it with clean coal and wet scrubbers and. Yeah, all the other good stuff. Yeah, it's interesting.

And I'm not even an environmentalist. I hate the environment. I'm just fascinated by this stuff.

It's not true.

Well, if you want to learn more about acid rain or acid fog, you can type either of those words into the search bar at HowStuffWorks dot com. And that will bring up this very interesting article by Sarah Daudi. And I said acid fog, which means it's time for listen to me.

I'm going to call this MIT nerd alert. I got a very nasty email from an MIT student, and it turns out I'm going to read this on the air and make fun of you and said, OK. And she went, oh, yeah. And here's some other stuff you can make fun of me about. Hi, Josh and Chuck and Jerry. I love your recent episode on how language evolved. But as an MIT senior graduating in a month, which is probably like right now, actually I felt it my duty to make a very important correction to your intro.

We are called the MIT engineers, not the MIT eggheads. I think I call them Egghead. I'm sure you did indeed. Our unofficial school song is the MIT Engineers Drinking Song, which includes many nerdy jokes, some of the expense of that small liberal arts school up the river, Harvard. Additionally, our mascot is Tim the Beaver. Tim being Inmet spelled backwards.

So clever because beavers are nature's engineers. In fact, every class has a special ring called the Brass Rat, which depicts a beaver on a bezzle. DTL, what is that? Samso doesn't even know that we would not make it at MIT, I suppose. Now, supposedly it's one of the most recognizable rings in the world. Oh man. I started listening to the podcast during long, long hours in lab and grateful. I am grateful to you guys for entertaining me during my past four years at MIT.

At MIT, we refer to everything by no, including majors in buildings, linguistics. The field of Mr. Chomsky is called Course 24, the inimitable Mr. Chomsky. Noam, I believe. Oh yeah.

And is housed in a pretty crazy looking building. A building thirty two, a.k.a. this data center. Sorry to ramble on. I'm very proud of my soon to be alma mater and P.S. I thought of one more really geeky thing you might want to make fun of regarding Emmet's mascot, The Humble Beaver. One of our cheers for football games is called The Beaver Cheer, and I will do that right now. I'm a beaver. You're a beaver. We are beavers.

Oh, and when we get together, we do the beaver call E to the you d you slash the x e to the x d x cosine secant tangent sine three point one four one five nine integral radical MUTV.

These are smart things I don't understand.

Uh slip stick slide rule amitay go tech. I feel like you just issued some sort of orders that only like three people understand and now they're carrying out some sort of terrible mission. Yeah. Like the nuclear suitcase is like heating up right now. The bomb inside. Yeah. Yeah. I can't even say you're beever cheer. That's how dumb I am. It's OK. Who's it from.

Uh, Laura. Thanks a lot Laura. That was a good one. So let's see, Chuck. Oh, what are we going to ask for. Um, is that the B.

Oh what is Chocolate Rain. Me. Yeah. We want to know. Chocolate rain means also if you're Taison Day and you listen to this, if you tell us what it means, that would hold a lot of water to be great. That'd be pretty special.

You can tweet to us Taison Day or otherwise at CSK podcast. You can also visit us on Facebook. Right. Facebook dot com slash stuff you should know. Yes.

Or you can send us an email to Stuff podcast at HowStuffWorks dot com. Stuff you should know is a production of radios HowStuffWorks for more podcasts, My Heart Radio is the radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

Nearly 600 years after the invention of the printing press, the most important book in the history of the world has arrived, there might be overstating things, stuff you should know, an incomplete compendium of mostly interesting things.

It will change your life forever.

Well, that's not necessarily true.

Most scientists agree that stuff you should know an incomplete compendium of mostly interesting things is proof that time travel is possible because that is the only way to explain how a book this impressive was possibly made. Why? Why stuff you should know. An incomplete compendium of mostly interesting things will regrow hair, whiten your teeth and improve your love life.

That's just not at all. Right.

Well, the love life part, maybe if you find someone who thinks smart is sexy stuff, you should know an incomplete compendium of mostly interesting things available for preorder. Now at stuff you should know Dotcom. Now, that is true.

Did you know the original Mr. Potato Head was an actual potato? Did you know that all tequila's are Mesko, but not all mesoscale is tequila? Did you know some goats climb trees? Did you know there really was a Jones family that everyone in New York was trying to keep up with or that Pablo Picasso was a child prodigy who could draw before he could talk? You will stuff you should know. An incomplete compendium of mostly interesting things. Preorder now.

It's stuff you should know dotcom or wherever books are sold.