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Coming up, we're going to talk to Joe House late night after a dramatic Lakers loss to Portland, talking about the first 48 hours. We're calling it the bubble overreactions because we're ready to overreact left and right. Everything we saw in there and then Triple H.


Yeah, one of the most famous WWE performers of the last 30 years. He's coming on as well to talk about what's going on with their business during the pandemic and a whole bunch of other things. First, our friends from Pearl Jam.


All right, we're taping this super late on Tuesday night. We're waiting for the end of the Lakers Blazers game, we were assuming we might have something to talk about after that game house. An amazing two days, eight basketball games, one after the other all day here on the West Coast, starting at like 10 or 11 o'clock. Six of the games were really good. And then it culminated with an oh oh oh.


The Blazers take a what I think lead over the Lakers. Oh my God house. I'm dying to overreact. I cannot wait to overreact. Yes. Two days of basketball. Yeah. Whatever we do, let's not overreact and have. Oh no, no, let's totally overreact. Let's do this. I'll die and overreact. Maybe. All right.


Let's start with the Blazers because that just happened. So you and I both like the Lakers in this series. The Blazers won us a lot of money in the bubble. We love them.


I watched every Blazers game. I still love them. I still love them. And it was weird rooting against them. It was like rooting against an ex-girlfriend. But that's right. We just thought they have no answer for LeBron. They have no answer for that. For Davis, they have five guys. So, OK, so it's not going to happen. And then you watch the game. The big guys that Portland has were actually like a pretty nice match up against the Lakers, they were able to play Whiteside and Nurkic at the same time in a couple stretches.


And I don't know, they they defended LeBron, OK. They whatever was going on with Davis, I didn't fully understand it, he didn't really look like himself until the second half, but all of their weaknesses never really fermented and got used against him. The pace was slower. The points were, you know, headed toward the 90s. I think it ended up like a hundred ninety three, something like that. But at the more I watched, I was like, the Lakers actually might be in trouble here.


What did you think?


So you just hit on on like three of the four key points. The pace was a Lakers pace. The style of play was a Laker style of play. The they had the match ups that they wanted in place. The key component you mentioned it was Anthony Davis. Where was Anthony Davis? Why is he catching the ball outside the three point line and holding it for one beat for to beat now would dribble now a pass. He looked lost had they not run an offense.


With Anthony Davis catching the ball and initiating from the perimeter, it looked like it was a first time experiment tonight. Put him down in the post and let him do his work well with LeBron. That's the whole point of those two together.


Well, here's the thing. They look bad in the in the bubble for them offensively. They sure did. Milwaukee also didn't look like the same Milwaukee we saw in the regular season. And we're like, oh, when the playoffs start, they'll get going, but the playoffs starts. You're in a bubble. You don't have the fans. You're not getting the lift from being at home. All the advantages you get as far as the top seed. And they thought they had all the same problems tonight that we worried about.


I didn't worry about I was embracing it because I hate the Lakers. But you look at like Caldwell Pope. Twenty nine minutes for nine Caruso, who they desperately need without Rondo and Bradley. Twenty nine minutes, one four six Dion waiters who looked promising the bubbles place one minute. And then Davis, as you mentioned, was eight for twenty four. And I think one of the reasons and one of the reasons we like the Lakers so much before the pandemic was they were so big, they had so much size, they could overpower teams, all that stuff.


Well, guess what, they they couldn't really overpower this Blazers team that had some big dudes. From a rebounding standpoint, it was they were plus five. But, you know, Davis and LeBron had to win around the rim. They got stuffed a couple of times. They they weren't getting the same offensive boards that they usually get from from I guess they had seventeen offensive boards. That's pretty good. But but the Lakers were all set up.


They played the bully ball style that they needed to play. They are up six points with seven minutes and twenty seconds left in the fourth quarter. Eighty seven. Eighty one. So that's exactly the kind of point total that you want in the fourth quarter if you're the Lakers playing Portland, by the way, ended up scoring seventy sixty four points after the first quarter. They had thirty six points in the first quarter and sixty four through the remainder of the game.


So the Lakers were able to impose their defensive will impose their style of play. But they they they lost all their offensive advantage in the last seven minutes of the game by they brought Kentavious off the bench again, inexplicably. I mean, here's part of the challenge I have. They need a who's who are you going to play here and play Davis It's Kuzma Get Kuzma off Kuzma needs to be starting the games get let him touch the ball seven times at the beginning of the game Build his confidence and then get him off.


He's their third best player. It's not really a mystery at this point with this composition or team. The Lakers he fourteen Danny Green who started out cold he finished with ten. But you know if the Blazers I'm looking at that game and I'm thinking we didn't play that well. We we shot 39 percent, we only made 13 threes, we had a typical four two from Hazony, the worst player in the league, we had only two for eight from Gary Trent, who's just starting to cool off, crashed back to Earth a little bit.


And then our guy Gabriel, who nobody ever heard of until a week ago, 60 Minutes to four to is only three for eleven. Nurkic was four for eleven. Like I didn't even really feel like they played well Lillard was only nine for twenty one Got to the line a couple of times but you know he made a couple long ones but he didn't have like those crazy Damian Lillard stretches that he was having during the bubble.


So if I'm Portland I'm leaving this game and I'm like this is pretty good for us because I mean the adjustments for the Lakers are going to be to get rid of their centers and play Davis at the five more and try to spread it out with more shooting and try to because they were getting killed in transition, stuff like that. But if they're taking out the centers and playing Davis at five, that wears him down. There's just there's some good things in play here for Portland, is my point.


Well, to me, the single biggest determining factor was Portland, having played playoff basketball now for eight games, right. Yeah Lillard did not score in the second half of this game until there was about, you know, six or seven minutes left in the fourth quarter. He didn't score in the third quarter. But the poise of Portland Gary Trent, you mentioned that he didn't make he made a huge three. Melo made a huge three day, made two huge threes.


McCollum made two gigantic baskets. They just were poised all the way through. And the Lakers with with ninety seconds left in the game, in the game, still very much hanging in the balance, started taking these rushed off balance disorganize threes. They didn't try and foul at all to create the, you know, lengthen the game. But it really looked like a team, you know, playing in October. In November. Right. Just getting used to each other.


Well, maybe that's the point of the bubble, right? Because they don't know who they are. That's it. I'm with you. And this is why I like Miami so much. We bet you and I bet before the playoffs, we bet on Miami in the clips of forty to one and I don't know as the final come finals.


Yeah, I want teams for four rounds. You know who they are. Davis and LeBron know who they are. Kuzma is fine but if, if like and I agree with what you said they need him to come through is their third guy, he has no experience and that's his first playoff game he ever played in. And you go on down the line. I just don't trust some of their guys. I don't trust Caruso. I don't trust Caldwell Pope.


By the way, I'm not even sure those guys would crack the Celtics. That main rotation right now.


You think like you think about that one in that Celtics thing. We're talking Lakers. Get that Celtics got in the ass with either of those guys.


Play for the bucks. Oh, yes, they would they would definitely play for the Clippers. No, I don't know. Come on, I. I'm so mad at us that we abandoned the Blazers after how well they treated us in the bubble. They were like a blackjack dealer that hooked us up for an entire night and just gave us 20 ones and double downs and gave us kings. And we're winning. We're tipping them. They're just going to separate ours.


And then we see them at the craps table and we're like, we're betting, don't come against you.


The guys like what happened was what happened. We're friends.


I'm so that we have to we have to go back and and and go against it. So I think there's going to be a huge overreaction, overcorrection, what's wrong with the Lakers? But the great thing about bubble basketball is there's so many games that last eight hours. Yes. And it's not like you can hear the home crowd get nervous or anything like that. And I do think, like Milwaukie mentioned it today, one of the guys in Milwaukee, I think it was George Hill, mentioned how after the game that it was just weird, like they had played all year for the one seed.


They thought they would have this home court advantage that would give them a lift. And now they're just in this bubble and they really have no advantage at all other than the prompts and the voice saying it seems like it's tough. And on the one hand, you're like, all right, that's an excuse. Like, get over it. You have the best team. The other hand, you're like, well, all that's doing is evening out. All of these different seeds, right?


You have a one seed versus an eight seed, but ultimately, who fucking cares?


You're playing in a in a gym in the history of the league. Has there ever been an instance where the two eight seeds in the first playoff games of the series beat the one seed? Well, you know what it's like.


It's like hockey. The shit happens in hockey all the time. And hockey is a place where home ice advantage just doesn't matter at all. Teams can go and win a game seven wherever they don't care. They're just skating around. And I wonder if the bubble playoffs, if this is turned into hockey. So if I'm a fan, the Blazers, because I don't think the lower seed can win a series without winning game one. And that's why the poison gas injection was so devastating last night, is that Dallas has to beat them four to six times that realistic?


If you're trying to pull off an upset, you have to win game one. And that's the history of all of these upsets. Nobody's like, oh, yeah, I remember that time we lost game one and then we pulled off an upset. Very rarely happens.


You get to set the tone in that first game. You see, you don't know this. You're your wizards, bullets. You know, you haven't really had any good playoff memories in 40 or so.


I'm just telling you, from my own necessary from my experience, what I will say this. Did you watch the TNT Crooge? You watch Charles Barkley tonight?


Well, he was saying it was a must win for the Lakers before the game. I mean, he was not only did he say that, he said if Portland won this game tonight, the Portland's going to sweep the series.


Yeah, but that's when he's doing the crazy part right now. But he also called Kyle Kuzma Karl which was spectacular Oh coverages Karl Karl Kuzma It's fine with me it works.


I mean here's here's why there won't be a sweep. There's going to be a game where there's going to be like a sixty to ten free throw advantage going to get it today where he committed three fouls of the same possession.


Ended up at the light. I was like oh all right they're going to make sure the Lakers with this but you know. It's a I don't like what I've seen from them. They do not look like the team from the first week of March when they took care of business that weekend, we were like, oh, this is the best team in the league. I do not feel like they're the best team in the league. And guess what? That was almost six months ago.


It's like it's like half a year. It's so much can change.


There's a lot of pressure on the L.A. brain trust because what we saw out of Anthony Davis standing out there outside the three point line, repeatedly catching the ball and holding it or tentatively taking he was awful, taking threes. It was like the best defense that the Blazers played was letting Anthony Davis have the ball outside the three point line and letting continue his Caldwell pope shoot every time he touched the ball. That was their best defense tonight.


Yeah, Kentavious, you're open for a reason, as Jalen Rose would say I. I heard this dialogue a couple of times and a couple of different places about people talking about and we both really like and appreciate Davis and I think we properly evaluate him as one of the best players in the league. But people are wondering, is this the best teammate LeBron has ever had? To me, that's so offensive to Dwayne Wade. All I'm saying is Anthony Davis make a round three before we're saying you were a better LeBron teammate all the time than Dwayne Wade.


In 2011, Wade and LeBron were two of the three best guys in the league. And if that game two in the finals doesn't flip and then Dirk just starts playing out of his mind and Jason Terry makes it and flips that series in Dallas ends up winning. Stop, we'd would have had two in six years, he ended up winning two more anyway. Come on. Well, wait, wait, wait.


Don't do the whole sports talk radio thing. Who who is it that's saying I it over and over again? I mean, where is in L.A.? People are saying in L.A., who are the people who are saying stuff? People are saying it is it's patently absurd. By the way, I'm Horsburgh, where I'm where I didn't read the whole thing and I'm just going to throw somebody under the bus.


Oh, no, I'm just saying that they're not going to throw under the bus. I just want to remind everybody, Anthony Davis is a free agent after the season.


Oh, OK. Good. I like where you're going with that. Things don't go good. Hey, speaking of Dwayne Wade told Miami team. I loved what they did today because I thought Indiana actually was had a good game plan, did all the stuff they wanted to do in that game. And my aim is just really good, guess what, when when you're making threes and you're doing that slash kick stuff and it never ends and you always have three shooters out there and you always have two guys who can create, it's just too hard to keep up with, especially Indiana.


Lost a little depot early, but there you go.


I mean, I'm glad you said that's the point, right? Like, they don't they don't have the bonus. They don't have depot. And notwithstanding that, I thought they were super competitive. I was so impressed with Indiana. But but ultimately, you and I both love Miami and do what we saw out of them today validates our point of view on why we think they have the recipe for long term success in the East.


They, you know, didn't even I wouldn't even say they played like that. Great. Today they're only thirteen for thirty five from three. Thirty seven percent. Pretty good. No, Butler was really good. Yeah, Dragoljub is really good, but they're roll guys who normally you know, out of Herot, out of Oleynik, Duncan Robinson, maybe Crowder, they'll usually get two of those guys go and the only guy we got on today was Hero who.


It just fucking kills me over and over again because of what happened to the Celtics. They lose the coin flip that due to be playing for us. But I, I there were a couple of teams that I thought just took care of business in these first 48 hours. They were one of them. I love to it hard and did hard man. Hey, by the way, for everyone saying OK was OK, this is the big upset pick. I'm still the best player in the series.


Settle down. And he did his whole thing. And then and then yesterday I thought Tatum took care of business. I'd like to Toronto didn't get the nets, but I thought Tatum played such a good game and I want to get to the Celtics a little bit later, but then even the Clippers, the poor Zangas thing, whatever, I still think the Clippers probably win that game. But I like that they they were awesome initially. Took a huge haymaker from the wolves that there was 48, 18, run, whatever, and then just kind of figured it out and they have some real mismatches, like the Paul George thing is just a huge patch for for Dallas.


But still, you know, the teams that took care of business versus the Milwaukee Lakers, it's kind of jarring. I don't feel like it's just like, oh, that's an aberration.


Milwaukee's looked like that for a while. And the Lakers thing, I can't say I'm shocked, even though we bet on them tonight. Right.


We've been sort of postulating, wondering aloud, musing, you know, what kind of impact is is the bubble going to have to these teams that are sort of, you know, had to put the brakes on back in March?


Are they able to do they have a switch to flip? And for both Milwaukee and L.A.? I think we anticipated seeing the switch today. And there wasn't no switch. There was no switch to flip. It's tough when when you don't have the three point shooting. Because I think. There's so many teams that could just make 18 to 20 threes in a game. And get it. We saw it over and over again in the bubble, these teams that would have like one hundred and twenty five hundred and thirty points, and even a team like the Nets could have these streaks where they could have like a sixty five, seventy point half.


And with the Lakers, it really has to be more, you know, Botibol Ball plus them kind of crossing their fingers that some of these flimsy role players can come through at LeBron.


Statistically, what did he finished with, like a 23, 17 and 16? What it was them losing when he has a game like that?


Yeah, an incredible triple double. I wonder. So, Roselyn, I talked about this week in Africa, LeBron was alluding to issues with the bubble. And I was wondering like, what's he talking about? Is is he not happy in the bubble? Is he worried about some things he's seen with the Lakers, like what's going on?


But I'll be interested to see how he handles the next 48 hours, because I do sometimes I go on Twitter and do like the weird tweet where you don't know who is tweeting and shit like that. Maybe he'll do that tomorrow.


I want to ask you this question, and I think it's related to what you're getting at here. The teams that most impressed us over the last forty eight hours are the teams. And we said a little bit ago, who know who they are. They have their identity. They play to their strengths. And the coaches definitely have a role in that. Right. There's some kind of stability, institutional support, whatever, however you want to characterize it.


All the jokes about playoff bud coming out and all of the Twitter pictures and Instagram pictures of confused Bud face were hilarious, but like playoff bud just doesn't instill the whole ton of confidence. Whatever's going on with the Lakers, with, you know, three and a half, you know, head coaches where, you know, Vogels, the head coach, a name. But is he really the head coach? Anthony Davis catching the ball again and again and again outside the three point line.


Confuse the hell out of me. They used.


What would you what would you do offensively if you were then that you feel like they're not doing high, low, high, low, high, low.


Get Anthony Davis the ball down near the basket. Let him come out on the on the corners. He can escape from down low to create room for LeBron. But get Anthony Davis the ball, let him cook. Who's going to stop him? Let him go up against Hassan Whiteside and fouled at that bum out in the first half of the game.


Well, Whiteside's audition for a Lakers contract, it's going fantastic.


I would say what? Fifty eight percent chance is on the Lakers. Next year, Midway Thwaite had its typical garbage Dweik game, I mean, he continues to be one of my least favorite players in a long time. What did he have tonight? He had 15 minutes, five hours, what's the plus minus four points, five rebounds, plus seven plus minus five fouls, and it seemed like there's a couple of times when it seemed like he was about to get in a fight with Whiteside, which I think would have been trouble for the Internet.


Trying to figure out who to root for in that phone call would have been.


But that that's you know, it it could have been effective, right. Like because Whiteside had five blocks like he was he was down there shutting down the paint on drives coming from the top in in a curiously similar way that Marcus Morris really affected the outcome of that Clippers Dallas game by getting under, you know, Lucas skin and he got under Czinger skin, do you think? LeBron has texted Avery Bradley and said, this is what I'm this is what I'm what I'm saying to you now, right?


This institutional stability, just like the chemistry we've been able to see. And it's a cute under these circumstances, Toronto looked awesome, you know, earlier, right.


Miami stuck to their identity. The Clippers, they they handle their business. That game should have been something different because they should not have been kicked out.


But go back to Toronto, though, because this was there were a couple of teams in the '99 lockout that stayed in shape and practice with each other and had a huge advantage heading in this season.


I remember San Antonio is one of them and ended up winning the title. And it does seem like the Toronto team, you can kind of see who's on the same page. Conversely, Philly, who I want to talk about after the break, Philly looks like nobody they haven't even had a practice yet to teach somebody how to throw an entry pass to bid. And just I was shocked by the announcers during the Sixers game last night. And then even our our buddy Jaylen and the halftime show and people like Embiid you got to let him cook.


It's like they were giving the ball he kept losing it. How many turnovers can the guy have. He had I think he was credited for five or six but it felt like he had like eight or nine and the Celtics were just when you'd have the ball they would send a second guy diving kind of at his legs to try to tip the ball, touched the ball, whatever, force him to make a dumb pass, which he did a few times.


And I don't know, he just looked he didn't look like he was totally in shape. He decided not to guard types at all in threes. I don't know if that was strategy or he was just trying to conserve energy. But to hear him being praised for that game, Brett Brown finally said after the game, like somebody is, I do need to get Joel the ball more. It's like we did. He kept losing it like he is like, yeah, he kept turning the ball over.


That's a problem for us. And so that was one thing. And then the other thing is they just don't know how to set him up, because once they lost Simmons, Simmons was the only guy that team had who could create a shot from somebody else who's creating a shot for somebody else in that team they may have got.


No, that's that's that's the problem. It's a design problem. They they they spent their money on Tobias Harris and Al Horford and just said, we're going to roll the dice with Ben Simmons. We think he can be somebody different. We're going to try him, you know, to see if his growth, his development with our franchise is going to produce a different kind of skill than something that he's shown before, which is a table setter. He's at his best running downhill.


He's great at pace. He's great at finishing on the fast break that is not compatible with Joel Embiid. We've only been talking about it for two full fucking seasons now we keep watching it. I mean everybody's the poor Sixers fans are ready to to you know, throw Brett Brown, put them inside the Ben Franklin bell and ring it till till whatever. Hold on, let's take a break because I want to talk about that series.


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All right. We're talking six or Celltex, and we'll get to Heyward's injury in a second. The Sixers that was lined up for them in game one, they every time it seemed like the Celltex are going to blow the game open. The Sixers would make some crazy three with a hand in somebody's face and they just kind of kept hanging around, hanging around. They turn the ball over a shitload of times. Didn't matter. Tatum and Brown were the only guys playing well in the Celtics.


Then Heyward gets hurt. And there was a moment in that game where it's like, oh, my God, Phil is going to steal this and they just couldn't get it done. And I you and I thought Brett Brown should have been gone last year, but it just does not seem like a team that I would say is running on all cylinders. And I mean, it's not really fair.


Right. And we talked about it when Simmons got hurt earlier in this bubble scenario. Well, you know, it's fair. Start libel and make sure he's on the court every minute with Tatum. I hate giving away that secret, but guess what? You have to stop Jayson Tatum, especially now that Heyward's out. Theorbo has to play every minute Tatum's out there. If you're not doing that, then you deserve to get fired. If you're playing Horford and Embiid together at the start of the game you're doing the Celtics a favor because Tatum or Brown or whoever Horford has to guard that scenario.


They have a huge advantage offensively.


He's not going be able to guard them. You put five ball out there, at least Tatum has to work for his points you know. And that's. I couldn't believe he didn't realize that. And then finally he ended in crunch time. He ended up with Theorbo. But I would assume like their best line up would be. Horford on the bench Unfortunately for Horford And he's so timid Diable you play Richardson, you play Shake Builtin and you play you play Harris and that's who you.


If you're going to beat the Celtics that's got to be the lineup.


The biggest advantage that the Sixers have with the lineup that they have is Embiid and he didn't touch the ball in the Post Bureau within inside the free throw line in the last seven minutes. I think they said he touched it once or maybe zero to. I don't know what the stat was but because you know why.


Because it was too hard. The Celtics were making him work to get the ball and he didn't want to put in the work.


He just did in the fact. All right, I watch the game. You watched it.


You did that make a guy whose life depended on it in the second half or it's like I got to get the ball.


No, it's a it's a scheme thing, though, right? You we said it, you know, two minutes ago. Who's the guy that's setting the table that can get him the ball in the best position for him to be successful. Now, your point is absolutely well taken. He when are we going to see from the basket he needs to get down there and start putting people in the torture chamber and we keep begging for him to do it.


It's game winning time. You can go steal a game one in these circumstances, even with your depleted lineup, you had the opportunity sitting there in the fourth quarter and, you know, you just basically out schemed yourself right all the way out where he was.


There is one possession where the Celtics just put Smart on him to fuck with them.


I mean, that's fine. I like that matchup.


Smart that you had. Go post them up. All right. So Heyward's out. Hayward did not play well in that game, for the record. And my my friend tonight, a lot of text complaining about Hayward yesterday. I mean, he had six terrible place, just terrible. And it was like, oh, man. Right. The bubble. Hayward is like, oh, baby, oh, here, baby. And then it's like, oh, yeah.


OK, here's the it's like Dr. Jekyll, Mr. Hyde. Then he hurts his ankle and there's this minute of panic where it's like, oh fuck, with that same ankle. And I'm frantically googling to see what ankle he broke in to that and say, oh, thank God it was the left ankle, but it didn't seem great. Now he's out. For four weeks, this Celtics team was a seven man team. The starters plus Marcus Smart Kanter off the bench Wannamaker as the eighth man who is you know the more he plays the more nervous you just are.


I'm sure you've had guys like that in the Wizards Bullets over the years and then this weird Robert Williams Grant Williams depending on the game, the matchup you throw them out there, keep your fingers crossed something terrible happens. Well now Heyward's out and you lose thirty two minutes with Hayward. Smart's going to get some of them. Unfortunately, Wanamaker's is going to get some of them and then they kind of have to cross their fingers. I think with semiannually or Michael Green, because if you get in a situation where Jaelynn or Tatum get in foul trouble, they don't have another swing now other than smart to defend like a Tobias Harris type.


So they had this guy, Jim, Michael Green, do you know those guys when you watch your team every every week and you get attached to these dudes and you wish they played more? So this guy was Michael Green. He's super athletic swing guy. He could shoot threes. He really gives a shit. He tries and he just never really totally got a chance. And when they witnessed that I was texting a couple something friends, I was like, I think it's time.


Can we see it? Can we say hello to Michael? But it also tells you where I'm at with my favorite team, where I'm sending text, wandering off to Michael Green is going to get run. This is not where I wanted to be in the playoffs. Yes.


Well, we talked about, I don't know, ten days ago, two weeks ago. And you were pretty honest with yourself about what the prospects for the Celtics team look like.


Well, that because mostly because of Kemba, who did not look great yesterday, but yesterday.


I mean, is he Lin he's not full Kemba he needs three for Kemba. But here's the thing you ain't you ain't in Toronto so this is right. Isn't that where you would get the matchup that would come next.


I thought we, I thought we had a real chance to beat them if, if the team was healthy. OK, because we've just like that there's a bubble game and granted that weren't high stakes for Toronto, but we just match up pretty well with them, OK?


It's and they're always when when when we play them, the games are always like really good games and really intense and good back and forth to great coaches, all that stuff. But now Heyward's out for weeks.


And then, you know, the other piece of it is just I have that I don't ever remember Boston having an athlete like Hayward that was more snakebit, where it's like, you know, the fucking guy got hurt in the first half of his first game after he had signed one hundred twenty million dollar contract. He is one of the most gruesome injuries, not his fault in the history of the league. And since then, it's just been like one setback after another.


He was you and I were together for my birthday watching the game when he got hurt.


And I was just finished telling you how awesome he was playing and then he got hurt. Yeah. And it's just like one thing after another. I feel like we need to have an exorcism with them or something.


You might literally have to exorcise him. You might have to, you know, treat him a change of scenery.


He's going to be on the team next year because he'll be opting into his oh, he's concerti three bucks, isn't it?


The scenario for the Scouts is if Tatum just does what he did yesterday for seven weeks with Jalen as the sidekick and then Kemba doing more than what he did in those seven weeks he needs. Do you need to get a hyperbaric chamber for Kemba and just let him go in there every night sleep and you know get extra oxygen. Maybe he needs to, you need to seek the doctor in from Germany for some. Yeah.


Rich please. Let's go. Let's get him in. Where's that dude from. Germany.


Yeah. We need some PRB doctor.


But Dr. Gunther Pitstop. What was it, PCP? No, Naficy, platelet rich plasma. Doctor, could you please come to me and fix Kim Beazley? Because the other thing it was it just offence? You know, he had a couple of moments, but he is pretty up and down offensively. But defensively he was not good and it's not going to hurt them in this Philly series. But when they get to the next round, when they have to guard, VanVleet and Lowry is just not going to be able to do it.


And that's right Marcus. For as great as he is as a defender, he's really kind of better off defending bigger guys like it's the little waterbus. Guys are never great for him. He's always had issues, you know, to some degree with those guys. He's not like lights out. I'm sure I'm taking these guys out the way like a Pat Beverley would. He's always been better with taller guys. Yeah, but but yeah, it's a bummer, because I do think I think that Sixers series could have ended early.


Now, I'm not so sure. I don't want to give Embiid any life because if he ever figures this out for a second, God only knows how this series plays out. Thank God nobody can throw him an entry pass. I'm so glad they don't have TJ McConnell.


Can you imagine even he would be such a help to them just for twenty minutes a game. He would just be able to get and be the ball. Exactly. The table setter that they need. Yeah, they could use that. They could have used all season long. Sixers fans are furious, by the way, that they let him go.


Didn't they have Trey Burke?


Not that he's a table setter, but did they have him earlier this year? I don't know. You're good.


You're not going to get me to be able to say anything nice about him. He was in Washington. I thought he didn't belong in the league.


He was half decent in Dallas. Quickly, the the weirdo series, Utah versus Denver, because that game is going to be happening probably by the time people hear this. But you have on the one hand, Denver exactly what we thought with Porter Jr. Once it got to the playoffs, they couldn't hide him defensively. Utah was just speaking about destroying them. But then you had this random Jamal Murray, another Jekyll Hyde guy. He's awesome. Game two, he could have eight points, Utah's not getting fifty 57 for Michigan, it just feels like a series that's going to go seven, right.


Can we, um, look at, um, see if I can get those right now? Can we get that series back up a little bit? Can we bet on Denver in seven. Is it too late series exact results. Can we better know how they're not up. There's those odds are are not up at the at this time of night series. Exact results. Well, we have. So Utah is plus four. Eighty five. To win the series, I got to say, that's that's too high.


I think they could still come back pretty easily. I like some of the matchups for them in this series. And, you know, the Porter junior thing, he'll have one or two good games in the series.


But ultimately, I just think defensively it's too risky to play him for long periods of time. So I still feel like that goes seven.


Yeah. Denver's two man game of Jokic and Murray is still pretty darn good.


Yeah but you're saying that because we just came off a good memory game you're going to be texting me in game two and he's two for nine and you're like what the fuck happened to Jabalpur in this game. That's what it is. That's his. I just mean the symbiosis of those two. True it is. They're very they're very complementary, that's all. And it's a shame. I mean, Utah now, Conley apparently is going to be able to be back by mid series.


So that's another reason why picking it, you know, making thinking is going to go seven has some some good logit legs. I was really glad I was at the hospital and my kids were born, just for the record. I understand where you. That's not well or is anybody criticizing him for that? No, no, no. I just I always try to put myself in position, the athlete. And if it was like round three, like let's say it's like the series is two to two and it's like your wife's having a baby.


And it's like at some point the stakes have to be at a point where you would seriously consider it. And I don't I don't think there's any scenario unless it was the finals for me, it was the finals.


Not not even the finals. Fuck that. Are you kidding me? The birth of your child, whatever your profession, who gives a shit what? Going to be a sick kid, whatever. Sick.


You know where the line is the night the ninth kid, that's where they say, OK, I've had eight. I was there for the first date that night. That's where I draw the line. I'm going to go to the finals this year. Third kid.


Yeah. I mean, I want to be there for all of the kids.


Well, that's how I felt. But I didn't know if I was a professional athlete and I had limited chances to win a title.


What the what the stakes would have to be for me to seriously consider. Plus, you're also dealing with from from the wife of a lifetime of a lifetime.


I mean, you're age. They're bringing you were to the fucking hospital room for second kid. Yeah, that's right. Me the eighth ninth kid at that point. Maybe it gets you know, but when you have like the just the first couple handful, come on, you've got to be and it's only a few days. It's not like you miss the whole series.


Let's bring in Phil Rivers. Phil. Kid number eight, did you have to be there? Oh, yeah, I. It's funny because. I do think there's probably been guys over the years who probably said, fuck it and just stayed with the team, right? I mean, I'm sure we could find guys like that. There are I'm sure there's stuff they wouldn't write stories about it. But yeah. Anyway, Mike, they hurry back because I think that Sarah is going to get the Mavs are plus eight fifty the Netzer plus thirty five hundred the seventy Sixers.


I don't really understand this are six to one which seems high, I mean which seems high because I actually think that series. I'm not sold on the Celtics like being in the runaway driver's seat now that Heyward's gone, right. Among six to one, the Sixers are six to one underdogs.


I mean, I need them to be double digit underdogs before it catches my gambling interest.


All right. So we don't have a blazer's line yet. Maybe we do, though. Hold on.


Let me refresh. Now, we still don't I don't care what happens, I'm betting on the Blazers. I don't care what the very first moment a line comes up for them in this series. I'm betting them I don't give a shit. This is the overreaction podcast. We owe it to the Blazers out of loyalty for what they did for us through the first eight games of the of the bubble, the commitment that they showed, how serious they took this whole thing.


They grabbed the opportunity we owe the soccer moms in Portland, Bill Simmons, we love them. I have a Muraki point I forgot to mention, I think they're playing too many guys. I actually think they overdid it at the trade deadline and they added Marvin Williams, who's the other guy, they added they added two guys at the deadline. OK, Korver right a little before the deadline but looking at the box score tonight and I felt this way watching the game to.


They played 10 guys. I just in the playoffs, I'm good with eight, nine Macs, I don't need ten, I think ten makes sense to me in the regular season. But when I'm in that, like the Blazers played eight guys tonight, they're like our best eight. We're going to win with these guys. And two days later, we're going to play our guys again. They played. They played 10 in Lopez, only played two minutes, but.


You know, Wes Matthews, Connington Defense, DiCenzo, Marvin Williams, like, why don't you just kind of just figure out who your best three out of those guys were? I don't get it, but this is like a weird coach bud thing may look to be fair. It could be the case that their approach to this series was still to do some experiment because experiments play in Orlando. Yeah. Yes.


And because they really were so lackluster, so flaccid in the entire bubble experience that I don't know if it's well, I'm not even going to make the joke I wanted to make there.


Well, you know what? You know what the flaccid joke.


Did it remind you of that weird Atlanta, Indiana series that you're impera and teach a pitcher, A.J., whatever his name was, and his playing center twenty five feet from the hoop, pulling Hibbert out and completely fucking up that Indiana defense member and went seven games because Orlando is like, hey, Booch.


Pull up, pull their centers out and shoot some threes, he shot eight threes. I mean, he made some to it made five.


But Gary Clark. Four for 12, four, four, 12 from three. He took no two point shots. They took 41 threes at all. And it's like I think they're just like bombing threes. It's a great game. We're pulling their centers out and we're basically going to fuck with the bucks. We're not going to let you do what you normally like to do. And it worked.


And also they used the the Toronto playbook from last year's playoffs in the fourth quarter. Just pack the paint and dare the freak to to try try and drive in and create shots. You know, he started settling for those jumpers. Again, those those low percentage inside the three point line, low efficiency, you know, sort of medium length to long, great lengths to because he didn't have any room to go, you know, drive into the lane.


Toronto did that to great success last year in Rio. The league pays attention when a team is able to shut down an MVP.


What are you looking forward to most? For the game to lose, wow, what's your agenda? I'm going to read you some lines just the way your appetite. This is great. Toronto Nets. We don't care. Uta. Is getting four and a half points against Denver. The Sixers are only getting four and a half points against the Celtics, which again is a six to one underdog. But you're getting four and a half points in game two and then Dallas is getting six and eight points.


The under for over under for that game is to third and a half. I can't wait until you lose money on it one way or the other.


God, I can't. I'm just not going to I can't talk about it. They say they combined for thirty four points in the third quarter. The third quarter was among the worst quarters of basketball I've watched in twenty twenty the third quarter between the Clippers and Dallas. Now, the zinger getting kicked out contributed to that, but it was awful. They were taking terrible. Both teams were taking terrible shots. Neither team looked like they gave a shit. Twenty was a twenty one to thirteen quarter that the Clippers won.


I'm trying to I like Kitamura, I think I just think that series goes seven, I don't think Denver has anyone on the team, Tigard Mitchell. I don't think he's going to score fifty seven a game, but I think he can get wherever he wants.


I'm going to join you on that one. Let's, let's, let's come up with a parlay. I like that one. That's a good start. I'm going to join you on Utah.


I probably do them with. With Houston in game two, well, I mean, the Houston that we saw tonight is unstoppable, right? Like that, that version of them where all of their guys are super comfortable, they're all getting to their spots. Eric Gordon was a force to be. It was the very best version of Eric Gordon. It's to Eric Gordon that Houston needs to make the deep run. Keywell certainly if he's this effective, tide them over until Westbrook is back.


If Westbrook is able to come back that this version of Houston is unstoppable, but they're not going to shoot this well through the entirety of the playoffs. And so the question is, you know, when they run into some adversity. But I don't. What can Oklahoma City do? Because they they got pretty good games out of Steven Adams and Gallo. I mean, they they both are they're big guys. Had pretty good games, but they they went with a three guard lineup.


Oklahoma City did. And I don't think it worked at all. Well, they're missing.


Daudt Do you ever think we'd say that they need to come back? That's their hard and guy. I mean, I've said it a couple of times, different circumstances, but we need some Dorret, apparently. Last but not least, we're going to give our thoughts about the college kids going back to campus, including some kids that are old school Holy Cross, are again in trouble. But we decided we talk to our lawyers and we decided there's no possible way we could talk about this without coming off like complete assholes and shitheads and Dumarsais.


So we're just going to avoid it completely. I think that's I think that's the right decision. I mean, we tried it three different ways and we sounded worse each time. So let's just, you know, wish everybody the best. I stay safe, everybody. I will say that we were on an email with a third person, and I said that if this was 1999, 2000, I would have tried to get covered out of the way the first couple of weeks at school so we could have been playing pickup basketball by October.


And House agreed. I mean, it's it's possible I can't just flatly rule it out, it's because we wouldn't we would have thought because we were idiots who made terrible decisions, we're going to get this anyway. Let's just get it out of the way.


That that is how dumb we were. I'd like to say stupid and I've grown. And now I understand the public health implications. But, you know, living inside that kind of insular environment. Right. And you don't expect that you're going to come into contact necessarily with any sort of vulnerable class. Right. You don't think that you're going to if you're not attending classes with folks that are older than you, you're not going to see your family, so you're not going to endanger your parents.


Like the risk reward analysis just gets a little too complicated for for a teenager, you know, an 18 year old, 19 year old, a 20 year old, at least from our era. I'll just talk about us. I'm not talking about kids of today. It's got to be about this. And here's why we bring this up. College kids, we were there once. We were as dumb as you are now. Make good choices, just put put that extra extra two minutes of thought into your choices, because we certainly did it back in the day we did.


We would have made terrible choices right now in college in terms of safety. Behavior, all that stuff, so we're just we're giving you the be careful out there. Yeah, that's all due. Do the best you can. This will be in our rearview mirror at some point, probably, hopefully, God willing. And then sometime in the next six months, it'll be in our rearview mirror. We can all go back and have great parties on Karros Street and incredible parties at the White House and all the rest of it.


I mean, I know it's tough for the lacrosse kids to not have. You know, the awesome football team and the three and twenty six basketball team potentially not playing on such a factor because I think be good at sports again. Well, the good news is there is no sports for Holy Cross to be bad. And I guess that's bad news that goodness. Go anyway. House. Enjoy. Enjoy the rest of the round one, Bubba. Good to see you.


Thanks for staying up late for us. I can't wait.


I'm always here for you, buddy. All right.


See you. We're going to bring in Triple H in one second. First, everyone knows about the risks of driving drunk and getting the crash. People can get hurt or killed. But let's take a moment to look at some surprising statistics.


Almost 29 people in that states die every day in alcohol impaired vehicle crashes. That's one person every 50 minutes. Even though drunk driving fatalities have fallen by a third in the last three decades, drunk driving crashes still claim more than 10000 lives each year. What a shame. Drunk driving can have a big impact on your wallet, too. You can get arrested, incur huge legal expenses. You can even possibly lose your job.


All right. So how do you prevent drunk driving? Playing a safe ride home before you start drinking, designate a sober driver or call a taxi. And if someone, you know, has been drinking, take their keys and arrange for them to get a sober ride home, there's no excuse for driving drunk, none. We all know the consequences of driving drunk. One thing's for sure you're wrong. If you think it's no big deal, drive sober or get pulled over.


And before we get to driblets, want to mention the rewash Caddyshack went up Monday. That was a really fun one to do 40 year anniversary. And then we have another movie coming on on Wednesday night that I'm not going to give away. But you can't stream it anywhere, so it doesn't matter. And it was the first one we've ever done that we could not find any streamer at all. Stay tuned for that one. I will say it is a classic.


All right. Without further ado, here is.


All right. It's not the first time he's been on the podcast. We did one way back when I think of my office at Grantland, back when you were you were just breaking a business. You'd only been in 18, 19 years at that point. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't have a full twenty five yet, but yeah. It's good to see you again. Summer coming summer coming Sunday. You guys have been in the throes of you're really the first ones to try to figure out how to have events without fans.


What have you learned over the last five months?


Yeah, I think we were the first. I mean, it's a funny thing as the I remember being in the performance center for an episode of Integrity.


We were. Because of a scheduling conflict out of out of the arena at full scale and we were doing an episode of integrity out of the performance center, we were all set up to shoot in there and we're going in. And I was going in on a Tuesday. And as I called Vince to say late that night, to say seemingly with all this pandemic talk going on, maybe we should leave all this stuff up in the air just in case.


Right. And he was like, maybe it might be smart. I don't know, you know, look into it and see what the cost to be and all that stuff to leave everything up in there and get back to me. So next day, by the time afternoon time came, he was calling me saying, I don't care what it costs, leave all this stuff up in there. We might be headed that way by the end of the night.


You know, we did our show in their live that Wednesday with fans. By the time we were done, the NBA had shut down. We knew the trucks were headed to think they were going to Detroit at that time. They were turning around and coming to Florida and we could do stuff on a closed set. We were going to have no fans, it looked like. And, you know, that was really the start of it. We never shut down.


We stayed running the whole time, taking as much precaution as we could, you know, following guidelines and everything. Obviously, the health and welfare of our town comes first. But, yeah, we we never, never really shut down. There was a few shows in there that were partially prerecorded content and all that. But and now here we are. You know, as you saw today, they'll be putting up. An insane spectacle of a set that we are calling the Thunderdome inside the Amway Center in Orlando, and we'll be taking a residency up in there for the foreseeable future.


It'll start Friday night smackdown and and continue from there. But it'll be a spectacle. And then we're going to have virtual fans for virtual fans of the fans live. But on screen. Yeah, real time coming in. I know. I know the NBA is doing something similar. We'll have a lot more than that. It'll be a full a large arena. So we'll have a lot more to fill in. And it should be spectacular. I've seen it in renderings, but this company, whenever I see something in red renderings that I think looks spectacular, when you see it in person, you're blown away.


So I can't imagine this is going to be any different when it's done.


Yeah, when I was watching the NBA bubble basketball and seeing some of the stuff they did, you know, they had some tricks. They if they had had some time to really assess what might work, adding some virtual fans, adding some noise, stuff like that. And I remember thinking in the first couple days, I was like, I wonder if the WWE is working on the completely blown out version of this. And then I had Thunderdome thing.


I was like, oh yeah, here's that. Here's the blown out version of this. Yeah, well, you don't want to do I think in a way is nobody really knew where this was going to go. So you start to work on things. You do some shows with nobody in there, but nobody really understands how long this is going to last or how long it'll be till we could do anything. Then we were working on closed sets with our quite a few of our developmental talent for the performance.


And we weren't on it to get in crowds and they could be a part of it all, tested and kept separate from everybody else. And but the whole time we were working on a solution like this, if it lasted longer, what could we do? How could we make it bigger? You know, WWE is we're kind of in a way, when you think about it, the first interactive sports for fans. And I don't just mean by being a participant or broadcaster, being a participant, but just sitting there, being a viewer and watching it, you know, the way the booth bring your signs, actively participate in the show and that active participation sells and changes the outcome of things as it's moving forward.


You know, maybe not the final outcome, but how performers interact and and all of that. Everything is designed not just to win the game. Everything is designed to get reactions. And without those fans there, it's a different product. It really is. And since moment one, we've been trying to figure out a way to get our fans back engaged because they are what WWE is truly at its core. Get them back engaged, get them back being a part of it in a way that was safe for everybody to do.


And we we think we've got it got a good place on it. So we'll see Friday night on Smackdown, this week on Smackdown. And then for the foreseeable future, we're picking up a residency there. So that will be our home for the foreseeable future.


Look, we knew the fans were important and we knew they were as big of a character as any actual character you had. I don't think I fully realized how important they were until you had no fans and even like the entrances and just the guys coming out in the way, they would feed off the reaction, good or bad or just during a match, all that stuff to just remove. It was really odd, really surreal to watch. I had trouble with that because it was almost like watching somebody dance, but not but they didn't have a partner anymore.


And they're kind of doing all the dance moves, but there's no partner to play off of.


And I don't know how you guys did it to stand up comic with no one in the window. Yeah, right. Is hitting is hitting his jokes, making himself looking around. Right. Everybody is just on him. Yeah. It, it, it was surreal. And I tell you, you know, for me my hat's off to our performers. Anybody that's doing this because it's not it's not an easy task to go there and do what we do, especially if you've been doing it a lot of years, one either a lot of years from the standpoint of what I can go out there and get my way through this.


But the physicality hurts a lot more when there's nobody there making noise and you don't have that adrenaline. Right. On the flipside of that, if you only been doing this for a few years and everything we tell you is about fan reaction to working towards fan reaction and listening and hearing that crowd to affect your psychology and with things are going if you're going down a path and it's not working, fans will let you know go down this path instead. Right.


That's everything we teach them. And then all of a sudden that all goes away and they really go out there and do it, go have a good time. And they're still in the habit of of doing it. But there's no fans there. And yeah, you know, I think for you guys, the decision makers trying to decide who should get a push, who doing great. You know, you're relying so much on fan reactions. And if the crowds 100 percent somebody that you love, it's like, oh, maybe this isn't working.


And now you have no idea if something's working except for the Internet.


One hundred percent. And so you you base almost all the reactions that that we have as a company are based on how crowd is reacting. And sometimes that might be hard for people to get. But it's it's based on a lot of factors. Right. Crowd reaction, ticket sales, merchandise sales, all those things factor into how how you're using utilizing talent and the directions that you're headed in with them. Right. Short term and long term. And all of that all of a sudden goes away because now you have merch sales, but it's different.


It's based on online sales, not in arena or whatever. You don't have ticket sales anymore. You don't have crowd reaction or noise. And you mentioned it yourself, social media. But social media is very tricky because it is heavily depending. Yeah, depending on the platform, you know, negative algorithms and some platforms are much stronger than others. So things that resonate, you know, something bad happens. It trends immediately. Something good happens. It doesn't even get out there because it's the way the algorithms work.


Excuse the negativity, which doesn't help you. You're only here to send somebody soxer if somebody is not doing well. But nobody's going on Twitter gone. And I really like that match. I really appreciate the effort of those two guys. It's that happened. I yeah, I have said this since the beginning, like in some manner. The the the Internet makes our jobs more difficult, especially with talent, because as a talent you can go online and selectively pick who you want to listen to and don't want to listen to.


So there are certain places and people and you know, look, in this business, everybody wants to talk about reactions or it's all opinion, right? That's all it is. Five star rating opinion. That's all it is. It's just an opinion. There's nobody like if you if you're in the UFC, someone can go. This guy sucks, but he knocks everybody out. Now, he don't talk. Too bad. You know, it is what it is.


And there's a definitive answer. This is a subjective business where there's opinions and they all matter. But you can selectively find your opinions. So if you're a talent, you just selectively go through the Internet and everybody's saying how great you are. I do the greatest thing. Well, I don't understand why about the guy or the girl, by the way.


I don't think this is also a problem in the media business. But think about I think about now it is like if you're going to selectively look for reactions on the Internet, you're in trouble. But think about like the rise of DC's mid nineties if you had no fans. How would you have known you're doing well, other than we wouldn't want you to get fired, but we would go and we would got fired because what was saving us is the reaction of the fans when we would come back and get told to do that again.


And you're out of here. But the crowd was going crazy. So when we did it together, they went double crazy. It was hard to come back and have them go through like they kind of got to go with it. You get the reaction that you're looking to get.


Well, in some cases, like like Bray Wyatt, who I would say is probably your hottest guy right now. The no fans in a weird way is is helpful in some ways for him because this stuff that he's doing is so out there. He kind of does need fans for some it.


Yeah. Look, I thought there's been a lot of things that have been done that have been groundbreaking to me a little bit in some manner out of necessity for WWE anyway. It's not that they've never been done before or whatever, but like the Bray Wyatt Firefly Funhouse at Wrestle Mania was like some crazy mind trip, right. To imagine that crazy mind trip playing on a tron inside of a sold out eighty thousand seat stadium with nothing happening in the arena, just a stadium where you would have got tragically booed out of the building.


They wouldn't have been the ability to even try something like that. It's allowed us to get go into different places, some successful, some not judge what you can out of that. But you also see some performers to meet, the performers that can really connect emotionally with themself to deliver things and understand that the how and the why. Those are the characters that have really excelled and don't necessarily need that fan reaction. Randy Orton doesn't need that fan reaction.


Randy can get inside his own head and deliver something that you just give you chills. Right. Drew MacIntire, people like that, that can connect on a different level. But I think we've seen a lot of performers do that and and connect at different levels than they maybe would have if they would have had, you know, solely been looking for that. Ten thousand people arena reaction.


You know, you've I mean, this has been probably the craziest two year stretch in WWE history, right? Because you had a real competitor for the first time in 20 years. A.W. you had behind the scenes stuff like your your CFO left and a whole bunch of things going there. You had two huge deals that you did. You blew out Smackdown on Fox. You had a whole bunch of TV money coming in. You're awesome in this whole streaming universe now where you guys were so ahead of the game with the WWE Network and now you look at all this streamer, the evolution of competition on that end.


But you could also end up potentially teaming up with one of those people you just hired, Nick. Nick Cannon from CAA, used to NCAA sports, which is now Vince is right hand guy. And there's just all these balls moving all over the place. What what's what do you think is the most important thing for you guys these next five years?


Oh. Well, there's a lot of things, obviously, we have to continue to put out the best product possible. So, again, in this moment of when you look at arenas that are empty and talk about how important the crowd is, the most important thing we have is making sure that there's a wealth of talent coming in the door and that we have are delivering something that our fans are are enjoying. And that's an ebb and flow. But we have to stay on top of that for sure.


After that, I think it's just the growth potential. And we've talked about and I think you see this to me, the growth potential of what this company can be and become as a content company as much as a wrestling company, right? Yeah, as a media company and as as everything else, when you look at the rest of the world to expand into those markets, that because of geography in the past, you've only been able to go in there for a one off or something and come back to do television, not be able to dedicate time and effort to the market.


So localizing in those places becomes very big, you know, sometimes. Especially in the US tend to think about just the US, but when you start to look outside of the US, you look at India as just a potential alone of the amount of people, one point five billion people there. And we're the second biggest sport in India outside of cricket, which is cricket is like a religion. So the opportunities for us there, what we're firmly planted there and everything else, we have a long, long, you know, twenty five plus year track record in that market.


But we can get in there much deeper and create opportunities in a way that we never have been able to before because of technology and everything else. I like that you have a competitor because I think competition is good and fresh and strong. They beat you in the 18 to 30 for a beat, I think Ras.


The last week, but this is what happened in the mid 90s, right where the debris was a little bit of a crossroads that we see that got momentum for a year. And it led to the most creative three year stretch in the history of the company opinion.


Yeah, I mean, to me, that's the thing. When you look back over this and I'm not going to belittle anybody anything, that's not the intent. But when you look back at the track record of a company that can shift, pivot and move, it might take time that it doesn't happen on a Thursday. You know what I'm saying? It just it takes time, effort, and there's a lot of pieces to move. But a company that historically over and over again has recreated itself, reinvented itself, stayed relevant to the next wave as it was coming in and and shifting with that and being able to ebb and flow.


It is the strength of this company. Its people will talk about hard work and anybody that can outwork Vince McMahon, God bless him. I've never seen anybody. He's worn out more people and than I can count. Trust me, you know, it's what we do. And I would put my money on this so that people ask me a lot of times, did I ever contemplate leaving in in the in the money I was to go someplace else.


I said I'd been there and I'd been here the way I met Vince and saw that level of passion, dedication and everything else. There was no way this guy is losing. No. I mean, no, absolutely no way. And, you know, it's it's inspiring. He really is. And he will pivot and shift and he will put the people around him that he needs to pivot and shift and and it will work. But you talked about it before.


And I think it's a funny thing. I remember coming to your studio that day, as you said, when I was a youngster, and it started very young that we were walking to the elevator. And I don't know if you remember it, you said to me offline, where do you see the company in in 15 years or 20 years, I believe is the number that you used. And I said I said you were asking in relationship to the wrestling business.


And I said, Bill, with Disney right in 20 years where Disney and you were like, wow, that's a lofty goal. I said, we're a media company that is more akin to Disney instead of a mouse at its core, we have a wrestling ring and it's core. And the content and the availability to do all those things are there.


And I believe you see that now more clearly, or at least I do more clearly, that now that I could see that even at the Dubbo's reminds me of the NBA and even like sat there, a couple of things that are so dependent on having the the big ticket stars and it ebbs and flows. Right. Look at the late 90s. You guys are just loaded. You just had a lot of major, major stars at the same time. And I think that's the biggest reason people remember it.


So finally, I did the same thing happened in the beginning of the 2010s when ASTM Steampunk was on the rise. Daniel Bryan, you just said you had a shitload of stars on the same place and you've had you've had some stars get older age out. You've had some stars either get hurt or Becky, which is case she gets pregnant. How do you build the next generation for this decade? And who is in your opinion? So you continue to do what you do.


You continue to put talent out there. You continue to build the stars the same way that we always have and you keep your balls out there. But again, it's not it's not it doesn't happen overnight. Doesn't happen on a dime. Sometimes it's not the person that you think you know, you mentioned the late 90s and the amazing plethora of talent here. But if you would have gone back a few years prior to that, you would have been and taken a couple of the stars that were on the on the top then and moved them to the side, which happened.


You would have said, oh, my God, this company has nothing, right? Nothing. And then you flip forward when stone cold Steve Austin was brought into the company, he wasn't brought in as the guy. This is the guy that's going to save the company. When I was right up until the time that it happened that people were going to get the rock, certainly when he came in the door, a lot of a lot of potential and open that that first that first run wasn't what he or anybody else thought it was going to be.


And there was a lot of people that were like, well, he's done and, you know, Foley and you can go on and on from that time frame. And then they just become. Yeah, I think if you'd gone shortly before that, when Nash and all and all these people were leaving Brett, and if you would have said, who's the who's the next one?


I don't know if you to that group of people, but in a way that was good that the door open for the next group of people because a bunch of people left. And sometimes it's like playing time at a basketball team, us. And it's like I'm starting to get shots now and it can happen. I do. Used to say it all the time, and I think sometimes it was perceived as a knock, but to me, one of the best things that Hogan ever did was leave.


And I don't mean that as the knock to him. It just there's a comfort level and a focus there. By the way, he's. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, I'm sure for the people. Listen, in the podcast, I have I have every wrestling glass from this area to see, you know, junkyard dog, Roddy Piper, Big John, stud Andre. And these are the best players ever. And while it's still early, that's Rockstar Money.


And I'm sure you're right, this is like real glass. So when it breaks, it's like a real danger. They they were messing around in the mid eighties anyway. If you throw it down, it makes the glass break sound and then you get a free stone cold. Steve Austin and I'd be a good Democrat. Yeah.


So, you know, like, look, you can't you can't you can't get into a new relationship until you end the one you're in sometimes. And that is I feel like and it's a process. It's just what it is. But I would put my money on this company every day.


They wanted to give a quick shout out to our fan dual contest that we're having right now. It is called The Ultimate Hoops Ringer. Every day there's playoff games five, our entry fee per contest. And if you win a contest, you get a ticket to the leaderboard series there in the NBA Finals, where all the winners will compete for a share of fifty cash ringer's swag. And even to be deemed the sole survivor of the ultimate hoops ringer, here's what you do, learn more.


Enter at Fandor dotcom slash hoops ringer. You have to enter before the first game each day. Age and location restrictions do apply back to Triple H. Can I give you like two nitpicks?


Sure. Why is Ross still three hours? Other than money, is that the only reason it's just a money decision? Yeah, and I think I think that yeah. Yes, I was going to make a joke that I've been Vince loves that challenge, which he does, and that it's harder on everybody else. So he's like, yes, three hours. Yeah. You know, if I was your consigliere and you're like, Bill, give us a couple ideas, like make right to ours, make it a Philharmonia.


Make it you give it. Give me your best two hours, Bill.


If you said three hours to two hours was your best idea, I would then I wouldn't need you as my my consigliere. That's true. I don't that's a pretty obvious one. Yeah.


Well, what. But why not. When can it happen. Boy, that's a that's above my if I Decision-Making level. But you know it is. Look, I can I can say this to you and as much as people watch it and go, jeez, I wish it was two hours three, it is exponentially harder to write a third hour of television. I mean, I can't even explain to you how difficult that is. I can tell it's hard to get three hours, even with commercials, it's still like two hours and 20 minutes standing like three hour movies.


I'll be honest with you.


So one thing that I think is fascinating about the last five years, wrestling has always reflected whatever is going on in the real world with storylines and things like that. You go back to the 70s, 80s, 90s, people like the iron chic, the Nicholai Volkoff. It was always like whatever it was kind of going out with America, you could kind of see it a little bit in wrestling, even like Bruno Sammartino, like the working class guy.


This is our guy kind of represented these things. Why hasn't that? We tried to tap into just how crazy the last four or five years has been in America with any plots. Is it like too much of a stay away? Too scary. I think that there are moments so in all those other moments in time. The uniqueness of the world right now is this Cadzow culture. Yeah, except I believe in that no matter what you do, if you if you stray too far, you run the risk of alienating half of the people that are out there, maybe more.


So I think you have to be much more calculated than you could be with something in the past. You know, you could you could do an angle in the past and try to try to maintain a line and go too far with that line and get some, you know, backlash and pull it and it goes away. Now, today it's different. And I think you just have to be careful with all of that. And I think you see that every single day from every single celebrity news person spreads figure across the board.


It's very easy to put yourself in a position on anything where people go, that's it, I'm done. And are they? I don't know. But I think it requires much more thought. I also think in the short attention span theater in the world, if you said to me some of the the things that are the most relevant in the last five years, I bet you could pick up quite a number of them that in that five years span went from this was the belief and it's relevant to the exact opposite is now the belief.


And that's relevant, right? It's almost difficult to really latch on to a moment in time because that moment in time is intense. But it's brief. Two weeks later, it's gone and people aren't talking about it anymore. And it seems like the biggest thing that that's all anybody was talking about it. It's a it's a unique time in the world, and I have a feeling it's only going to get more unique. Well, this was somebody who never shied away from those times where it's like, oh, this is happening.


Screw it. Let's try to do some sort of angle or create some character that this time around he said, I'm staying away, which is uncharacteristic for him.


He's always taking calculated risks. Yeah, I don't think Vince is not just a throw caution to the wind. I'm just going to go crazy and just do this unless we absolutely, really believes in it. You know, they're all calculated risks. Here's the here's the risk I want to take. Here's what could happen. If it goes badly, I'm willing to take that gamble and I'll take the shot at it, you know, and and when you are.


I don't want this to make it sound like we're a cautious company because but when you have more to lose and more on the line and more people that you're responsible for, more families, more more opportunities, bigger companies, bigger growth opportunities for you, even just small shifts like going from Fox USA cable to Fox broadcast and the level of scrutiny and everything else that comes along with that. It's a different ballgame and it's there different rules and and things that you have to abide by.


It's the calculated risk. You have to you have to wait a lot more and you have to be willing to if you're going to take the gamble, you have to make sure that you have the right gamble happening. Then you're willing to take to the downside if it goes that way. I think in the past, when the Dabdoub crossed lines with some of the stuff that was always a wink wink thing. And now I don't know if that wink wink thing even exists, and to your point, I'm not sure you could do it.


Like I even some this stuff down the lines you guys try to push in the late 90s. Yeah, in twenty. I just think people react differently to some of that stuff.


I think there are TV shows that were made five, 10 years ago that you couldn't make today. Yeah, the people wouldn't half the jokes in them. People would not allow you to make people's sensitivity levels of things. It's not a joke. It's you know, it's a very a very sensitive time. And people have to be cautious about what they do. And you're trying to be entertaining and draw a line and push the envelope. But you can only do it so much because the risk is very severe.


I think maybe the answer is you have the most Wolke Resler possible who's just constantly offended by everybody else, that's just to give me another look where he was just upset that tries he comes out every second to promote complaining about something.


It's just trying to cancel the rest of the roster.


Yeah. Eventually he'll eventually he'll be the champion because everybody else can cancel. Can you walk me through Vince McMahon at this stage of his life? What's he like? Is the battery starting to wear down? Is he still throwing a hundred miles an hour? Is he how many hours sleep? Like what's going on with him? He is a machine. You know, it's hard sometimes when you talk about it, people go like, well, that can't be good for him.


He's getting older and all of us feel like we have it. It doesn't bother him. And he's you know, he he. Probably, I guess, given the circumstances, he's probably sleeping more than he ever has just because of the speed of the travel. Right, yeah. And the way things are. So it's a lot less than it used to be. But he is still I don't know that he missed a day of the office. And it's a funny thing because it's just who he is.


He's at the office every single day when no one was there. Right. That's what he does. And, you know, but he still trains every day. You know, if you go to the office and, you know, you go downstairs at 1:00 or 2:00 in the morning, he probably in their train and chases just a machine. But that's what keeps him going. You know, he eats incredibly well. He just you know, he's a very routine and disciplined person.


So is his diet is on his you know, all those things are there. And, you know, it's hard, I think, for people to understand when people are driven to do something. This is his passion. Still to this day. He's the most passionate person about this that I know what he will do it if he doesn't get up thinking, oh, I got to go to work today and I'm going to make all these calls. I got to do all the stuff.


I got to sit with this and do that like he gets. I'm looking forward to doing it. You know, it's it's the all these years later, it's still he's dating the new girl in a way like it's still like you can't wait to get up and get on the phone and do the stuff go. And then he just it's inspiring. It really is. Do you think that you still get there and still have that passion for everything?


Do you think, like, you know, forty five years from now when he dies and they say it's like when Secretariat died and they did the autopsy and they realized Secretariat had a heart that was twice the size of a normal horse heart, and they were like, oh, that's why this was what happens with Vince. Do they find out, like he just didn't have blood or like, what are they going to find out? FLER Flare used to joke all the time.


We still say to this day that he's he saw this special I don't remember what it was on, but some documentary special on these people that have this particular gene where they never get sick, they don't get, you know, diseases, they can abuse their themselves, whatever, physically, not eat well, not work out, not anything. And they just live long lives. And right up until the time they die at one hundred plus years old, they're they're still just going.


And we used to say old time, he's got the gene, rich got the gene and it's why he's been able to survive. Everything is and they still ran and he's still reclear. And if anybody has a gene that is something that when he passed, which I'm convinced most of us will be gone before he does that, I think they'll find something like that. Like he had some kind of crazy kidney and endurance thing. Like it's a funny thing to do.


Some of my kids have it, like where they're just like my oldest daughter can be like up all night and just go in. And I'm like, good Lord, she has her grandfather's stamina. It's insane. What's grandfather Vince like?


He's awesome. They love him, you know. You know, he's busy and he's he works all the time. But when there's a bench is a funny guy that when. He will work and do all the thing, but when it comes down to it, if he needs to be there for something, for somebody family wise or anything else, he is the guy that is right there. He's there for the things that they need to do. He's there for their events and their moments, whether it's by phone or whether they're in video or whether they're in person or whatever.


He's there and he's great and you have to have a good time with them. And it's funny when when with family stuff. He's a lot of an observer. So he he likes to sit and watch them do things and and, you know, that kids do and that's his last. But they love him and they love having him around and he loves being around them. So it's also your relationship with them.


It's got to be one of the most unique relationships of any two men right where you grow up in the WWE, he's your boss, you're battling him early. You become one of the biggest stars in one of the foundations. But now you're married to his daughter now. Now he's the grandfather of your kids. But now you're behind the scenes and he's your boss and you're just navigating, like, basically every piece of events at the same time. I don't imagine there's a lot of people that have another person in their life like that.


Now, I would imagine it's unique. You know, anybody if you ever read books on it or see shows on it or anything else. Family business is difficult, right? Because it's it's not you don't walk away from it and you don't you know, you don't hang up the phone or you don't leave the office and go home and it's done and you forget about it. And it's it's twenty four, seven of your life and it's every component of it and it affects every component of it.


So it's very unique and very difficult. And there's there's a lot of factors. And even, you know, how, how you react in business to each other because it's family and you can treat your family different than you would treat everybody else. And there's just so many components to it, you know, that it's it's difficult, but it's at the same point in time. While it's difficult, it's wonderful. And we. You know, we all shared the same passion for doing this.


Yeah, I think it's the greatest form of entertainment and are so passionate about doing it and being a part of it and seeing it grow for the next generation, whether that be my kids or anybody else. You know, you just wanted to continue and to be everything that it can be. And we're all hell bent on doing that. So at some point, while it's difficult, you're all working for the same cause and you know that. What's the biggest argument you've ever had with them?


Was that when you wrestling, was there ever a time when you guys stop talking?


Probably not to do the Katie Vick angle or, you know. I think for both of us, we kind of get over that. You know, we've had moments, you, us, a lot of testosterone between the two of you. Yeah.


And you have moments when you have things that happen and come up and whatever, but then you get past it and you get over it and look out for me. The other thing, too, is for me, that while it's all business, if if it meant the difference between my kids having their grandfather in their life and not and that was the call and I step away. If it became that big of a problem, I would walk because it's not worth that at the end of the day.


But, you know, it's it's a unique family. Business is tough, but it's awesome. It really is. I wouldn't change a thing. Well, I got to tell you how you've affected my family about. Let's say two years ago, my son became enamored with Walter Mitty and specifically the chess slaps and be in the kitchen like, I don't know, making coffee or something. And then he all of a sudden you hear the Walter music and I'm like, oh, no, where is he?


And then my son would fly to know her trying to chess slap bass. And this has been the last two years of my life of him. It's almost like the Pink Panther and the Pink Panther, like an attack. That dude, my son with the Walter theme and he's really kind of mastered the chess slaps like they hurt and he's smaller and he can go up and you can't get him back because it's hard to just slap down. So screw you, Walter, is my point.


Plus, it just looks bad you run around. I just slapped in the face of that. And let me just tell you something else. That to me is the guys everybody always would say, oh, my God, when big show would drop, you would have to be the worst thing ever. And I would say no, because Hanso big right to me it was different. It always the guys that hurt worse for me with the guys, the little hands, their hands are hard, they chop hard and they.


Yeah, yeah. And there's a smaller surface there and it just would crack it like, you know. So I'm imagining his hands are ginormous. Yeah. So he probably is. It's probably a lot more painful than a normal job, but at least I'll give you that anyway. So it doesn't it really explaining that a child is dropping.


Well I, I think I told you this one in the family, so I have like six months left. I think before he could he might be able to beat me in a fight because he's like five, three and a half and he stick like his future wrestler kind of body. And I'm just he's kind of looking at me now and I can see he's kind of sizing me up like there's a moment when there's going to be the play wrestle, where he's going to be like, I think I can take them.


So, yeah, I don't know, I'm just going to enjoy these last six months. But the slaps hurt and there's been a big shift in the Simmons house. He has this whole library of WWE moves. He studied since was age four. And I'm just I'm I'm behind the eight ball on this.


Let me know when you need him to come to the performance centers. I run around a little bit to get him off of you. He's he's ready.


He came a couple of years ago. You know, it's. Yeah, he's ready.


I know he did. He had a blast. But, you know, the physicality side of it, if I can wear him out of the performance center, maybe he will be. Yeah, that's true. How is the performance center been hurt the last five months? Have you still been able to work with your guys the same way?


And ladies know that's been the craziest part is we really haven't been able to get in there. We've tried to keep the environment as pristine as possible. You know, next year you're still shot with our partners, run smack down, shot out of the performance center. We flipped it to a studio, so. Yeah, and you have to have it to work out with them at all. Know every every square inch of it has been, you know, used for television.


Plus the other side of that is just medically like, you know, we were operating on a close set with essential personnel, but the training side of it was, you know, it's not necessarily essential. So we're trying to limit that. And we just started back. We have a secondary facility. We just started back training. You know, it even even though we had to put together the medical protocols that everybody has to go through on a day to day basis to even get in the ring and train and do strength and conditioning work and everything else.


It's very, very stringent. You know, now we're getting the performance center back because of the physical know that will start debuting this Friday on FOX.


How many how many matches for you this year? Right now, zero zero.


You're unofficially retired because you're not retired because you're definitely a wrestler. Maybe once a year at some point.


I just feel like there's a moment where you wear Talgo like I'm retired and then you're not like I'd rather just not say it. And if the right opportunity comes up and everybody believes is right and I feel like I can do it without it falling apart, me or the match, then OK, I would consider it. I'm not at a point yet where I would say like absolutely not under any circumstances, Brian. Not that far off. But the thing for me that's good is I'm.


I'm so transitioned over and satisfied with the other aspects of my career, my life and everything else, like I get as much fun and excitement out of watching others do it and succeed at it. So, you know, I always will use this analogy that for me and for me in a way and even main roles are watching the guys and the girls because they all come through there. But it's it's the difference between as exciting as your own career is than watching your kids succeed at something.


It's a different level of passion and excitement and the pride that you feel. So while it was exhilarating for you, I've been there, done that side of it. Now, for me, the other side is almost better. And I almost prefer the, you know, the helping them guide whatever aspects we can to that and giving them those opportunities to go out there and shine. And then, you know, one of the coolest things about doing is getting to do with my best friends, unsubsidised gorilla position side by side, which I'd like to get a little kids jumping up and down because you know, something that we help somebody with or we're watching them succeed or that lightbulb go off for the first time, or they have that that level of success that they only dreamed about watching people, because you know what I mean to you, to watching them succeed at that dream is is incredible.


And to me at this point, if if no if the opportunity doesn't come again for me to step into the ring, I get asked that a lot. I would it wouldn't bother me. I wouldn't be like, oh, man, I missed those last few years. I should have done it when I could have.


You know why I went to those parties that year and a half ago? Yeah. Yeah, I was. I was in the front row with my insane son. Yeah. And you guys beat the shit out of each other. Yeah. I mean, it was that one of those it was like I was deep in the air, but we'll take it easy on him. You know, he has a wrestler of I was like you guys were like killing each other and I was actually worried for both of you.


It is one of those things where, like you, I think you either have to do it or you don't. Right. And it was obvious that day. Yeah. And I think we both went in there with that mentality. We just have to do it. They wanted to make sure it was going to be his last one. You know, this was him coming to me and saying, this is what I'd like to do. This is how I'd like to do it.


And OK, you know, for him. And so I just wanted to hold up my end of the bargain on it and make sure that he had the out that he was looking for. And he did. And it was very successful and I was happy with that. But you kind of got to just go do it. And if you were at the place where you really can't commit to it anymore, when we were in evolution every single night, we'd be in some small town somewhere and I'd watch Flare, throw somebody out to the floor and then throw him out there and have them back, drop them on the floor, suplex them on the floor.


And I would every night to get lucky, but I would just stop doing that. Like, you don't need to do it. You don't need to do it. But in his mind, he still wanted to prove that he could do it and take those things and do those things. It was like a proof point for him. For me, it's not necessarily a proof point, but it's like you're going to do it. If that's what I would have done, then that's what I got to do it.


I just don't want to be able to go out there and do it.


You know, this is fun. Congrats on the Thunderdome. It was good to see you. Good luck with Summerson. Some are saying weeks ago.


Don't forget. Don't forget also some excellent on Sunday, but Saturday night and next take over. Thirty of you act like, I don't know, the next take over Saturday night. Come on. I know you do. But you didn't bring it up to promote it. You had their hand and window it myself. So now I got to talk about it with Terracross deeply, one of the biggest matches we've ever done in the next. And he tried to go to time and it's going to be a spectacular night.


People should miss it. It'll be there's going to be one for the books. Congrats. Good to see you. Talk to you soon.


Good to see you too, man. I look forward to do it again. We've got to do it in a quicker cadence this time. Yeah. One hundred percent. Thanks. Thanks, man. Tell your son. Hey, take a job for me.


All right.


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