This is the down labor part, sure, we've still got Sparkasse. So, guys, sports topic, and it's a Cleveland Browns sports topic, I'm proud of myself because I haven't been able to talk so much about the team that's won a playoff game for the first time since I was seven years old. That's because there has been no room. But I would like to start the hour with a sports topic. And it's not about like this amazing chance that one of the three biggest upsets in NFL history that the Cleveland Browns are on the precipice of.

I hope it's the Kareem Hunt angle. You knew one sportswriter would probably take it to the the way of a path of redemption. What a redemption story for Kareem Hunt. Just because you just happened that not be in trouble. So we know during a pandemic over the last 10 months, Kareem Hunt, who was an all pro, I believe, with Kansas City, was a top of the line, running back physically assaults a woman who was harassing him.

Not that that's a rationalization. That was just the video that comes out. And you have Kareem Hunt, a perennial pro bowler, become available in an open market. Now, I'm happy he's a Cleveland Browns because the production is good. I felt conflicted about it at the time, but I knew I'd be celebrating touchdowns. If it wasn't the Cleveland Browns, someone else would have been given the opportunity. We now have Kareem Hunt playing his former team, the Kansas City Chiefs.

I want to talk about the incident and I'm really not interested in the road to redemption. What I do find really interesting is exploring where Kareem Hunt was a year ago, because it's not at the front of your mind. What do you think about Kareem Hunt? You think about that video. You think about why he left Kansas City and why John Dorsey ended up getting him a year ago. If you'd remember, Kansas City Chiefs, obviously in the Super Bowl, one of the storylines of that week that was not pushed to the top of the Web pages was Kareem Hunt got pulled over in Ohio.

And Kareem Hunt didn't get arrested for this. I don't I don't believe. But he was sobbing and clearly going through some shit at the time. Self medicating, probably not reckless to say Kareem Hunt was sobbing, telling an officer after he got pulled over, I was supposed to be playing in the Super Bowl. That's supposed to be me. The Kansas City Chiefs go on to win a Super Bowl. Kareem Hunt stays out of trouble, has a good year, and now Kareem hunts.

Cleveland Browns are playing Patrick Mahomes, who congratulated him on Twitter during his performance last week. And the Kansas City Chiefs. We don't know what's going on in Kareem, Hunt said. We don't know too much about that incident because media availability hasn't been going on. I would love to explore what was going on in that moment of pain and self reflection if that truly motivated them, if it just so happens to be a pandemic, why he stayed out of trouble, the sadness in the fact that football players self medicate and they can put up this wall, that we can't really explore that to the point that, look, Marvin Harrison found himself in the situation.

Not that this is a true analogy that I'm trying to make. Everyone said, nor should you say his name, right.

Harvin, Marat Safin, Harvin Merrison was a guy that everyone assumed was a good guy because he was just quiet production meetings quie with the media professional, show up every day. And then when he's out of football, you find out, wow, there's this whole backstory.

And I think because Kareem Hunt has just been quiet, hasn't been in trouble over the last few months, and we don't know too much about him, we're going to start writing redemption stories, which you should not do. You should not do that. We should explore talk about what was going on in that man's head in that instance, not the horrible incident that got him kicked from the Kansas City Chiefs. The fact that he was apparently self medicating, sad, depressed, sad that he was with the Cleveland Browns, even though that's his hometown team, knowing that he could have had the glory of a Super Bowl.

I'd like to actually explore some of that, because we are now actually for the first time in the machismo of sports, taking a look at what is happening with mental health and mental illness and talking about it openly in a way that has never been true for the gladiator sports. There has not been a lot of introspection. There's not a lot of, well, what's going on with my brain chemistry. There weren't even enough scientific facts to gods for these guys to know what they were doing to their brain chemistry with their religions and everything else.

So I don't believe you can't say that we have discussed mental health well in the sports arena, even with Kevin Love telling you that he suffers from depression, when what is happening with Delante West is he goes homeless and Mark Cuban has to rush in to save him from just total mental bipolar breakdown that ruins the life and the sanity of a man who was good at basketball and made a lot of money.

But athletes have tried to talk about it, as you just pointed out, with Kevin Love. I just it's one of those things where people they struggle to talk about, they struggle to to admit that they're going through some of that stuff and then that conversation becomes difficult.

OK, well, this is what happens in sports, though, and I understand why Mike is tiptoeing around some of the landmines here, because obviously and this should go without saying, Kareem Hunt is not a victim here. Kareem Hunt, we're being talked about this story. We're being talked about, talking about because of him. He's at the center of it because of something, because someone else being a victim. And it was horrible. And he became sort of a poster child for the idea that you can be great at sports.

And if you do this, you're gone in the mid to time when the NFL is decided, OK, now we care about this. We're going to totally care about this, even though our Washington football team, you know, has sexual harassment rampant, we're going to care about domestic abuse, even though we never have cared about domestic abuse. Let's push that over there and say, of course, obviously wrong. This does not make this is not all of who Kareem Hunt is.

It's one thing that happened. And that's the thing we know. We don't know all the millions of other things that he might be. He's not a martyr here. But the next step on this, when your career and everything that you have cared about comes undone because you're in the middle of that movement, you're a tough guy and everything else, but you're in the middle of that, whatever that was. And we don't know what happened between them.

It sounds like it was pretty awful. And obviously and it goes without saying, do not beat women. There aren't any excuses for it.

Just don't do that through a kick, I believe. What, you pregnant? I think that was a that was a wonderful bonus detail, I thought, because I understood why he got clubbed for that, because we all understand that that's wrong. But now your life sort of feels like it's unraveling. You are someone who has been not looked at as human because you're a football player.

You're another you're confusing it with Tyreek Hill, the pregnancy. OK, well, it becomes hard sometimes. John Dorsey. Right. It's interesting. These two teams have ties to John Dorsey and John Dorsey, who's probably going to get a job this offseason, is in demand because in the divisional round you have the Browns and the Chiefs and he had a large amount of say in building those teams.

He would take chances on Characteris Kareem Hunt was in the hotel lobby, I believe, and he did kick some. One, but she was not OK, but so thank you for the clarifications, my larger point is this man plays an unspeakably violent game. This is a man's man, tough guy. I mean, you guys saw everything. You guys saw Titans. Ravens, right. You enjoyed that game the same way I did where it felt like, oh, my God, these guys are really good at this.

And if somebody loses, that's OK. And then at the end of it all, the masculinity is spilling all over the field because the Ravens are dancing on the emblem and masturbating and pooping on the emblem. And you saw what they did. Right, because that was a game. I didn't see the master. It was all of that. It was a game. All of it was a game of two dogs fighting. And we all saw the masculinity of the sport there.

Yes, a defensive struggle. Thank you, Stuart. That's another way to say it instead of the way that I said it.

But just to be clear, no one was masturbating, and I'm not clear on that.

I think we did deserve more clarity on it. I'm just saying, symbolically, somebody was masturbating on the emblem and others found it disrespectful. And then they argued about Francesa said Francesa did actually say this. Hey, the Ravens were the better team, but that was classless.

Oh, you know, he's still working that angle, 40 years of that stuff. Now, the it was I saw myself.

I wanted to tweet something out, but I'm like, people are going to read into this. I just hate the Ravens.

Wait a minute. It's the height of football. We're still doing this Francesa princess. We're still doing this. It's the height of football, a violent sport. The Ravens were great, but I thought they were classless because they danced on the speaking of that game, was anybody listening with the sound on?

Because everyone on my timeline and I heard the audio and it sounds like you said it. Did Lewis Riddick say that shit is electric? Was that on Nickelodeon? No, that's on ESPN.

No, no, I know. But there was no there was an effort during the game on Nickelodeon that no way you go. And Eagles son Naproxen was fantastic in that in that game, by the way, there was an F bomb that the mikes picked up there on Nickelodeon. But Lewis Riddick, while calling the game and talking about Lamar Jackson, it seems as though from the clip that I've seen, says that shit is electric. That's great.

And just it came out of him because he's got the enthusiasm. Certainly can't play the sound.

But can you guys listen to it in private and can you guys. I heard what you're talking about. I heard that same clip and he definitely said, shit, that is great.

That is a new kind of broadcasting right there. Do you think he got called into an office or anything? I don't think he meant to do it. I think you got to know Lamar Jackson will do that to you. It is electric. It is electric, is electric. Who would dispute this? You got me thinking that way because you had Raven shitting on the Titans emblem.

I was like, well, that was masturbating and masturbating and shit to get back to what it is that Mike saying those two got. So you're Kareem Hunt and that's the sport you play and you're a tough guy. And here everything that happens in terms of you working toward your dreams because you've thrown it away by doing the wrong thing, makes you sob in a car. And yes, Mike, that's what I remember about that video. He seemed a combination of grief stricken, sort of despondent and also lubed up on whatever it is that he was using to to medicate whatever that pain was.

Who knows what was going on inside that guy. And and I'm with Mike on this. If you could get honesty instead of one of these mythological just sort of and it's a redemption story and he's back in sports. And to get like really the the deep darkness of the grief. Peter, where were you in there in the in that moment? Where were you in terms of feeling like you had ruined your life?

And more importantly, where are you now? Because you were pretty quiet after your suspension and everyone thought you were clean. And I remember it all my timeline. I'm like, well, this makes sense. But it came as a surprise. Just because you didn't hear anything around Kareem Hunt. I'm worried about Kareem Hunt. Now, are you still dealing with that sadness that drove you no pun intended to apparently self medicate and sob to an officer because you weren't playing in a Super Bowl?

Is it an actual redemption story? The problem with that is Kareem Hunt probably has no idea where he was at that moment, probably unless he's done some reflection and spoken with therapist. He probably has no idea why you think that that's just a shell of a man.

You think that that what was inside there? Sobbing I'm not understanding what you're saying. You think that Kareem Hunt, if you tell him where were you in that moment, I think look out.

I think he's sobbing because he's confused. I don't know how I got to a point where I could do stuff like this. I think I think for for mentally ill people, from what I've read and Kevin Love did a great job, you will self medicate, OK? It all that medication stops working and then you have to go seek something that's stronger and something that's better to get you back to a place where you feel somewhat normal. And so I'm not certain Kareem Hunt knows exactly what's going on inside his brain.

It's not certain he knew exactly what was going on in that moment.

OK, so correct me if I'm wrong, guys, you guys are listening to this. And does this feel as we talk about it, as apologists? As it sounds to me in my ears, because many people listening to this, I'm assuming that they would just say. Oh, that Kareem Hunt, oh, you did the wrong thing. Get the hell out of the sport. And he did. He had to get out of the sport for a while and he didn't win a championship with his friends because of that.

But you can hear anybody listening to this to God saying, oh, give me a break. What's all this humanizing of Kareem Hunt? How about you treat the woman like a human and not do things to a woman that shouldn't be done physically?

Well, I think we all agree with that. We're sympathetic to to the woman. And I think, you know, you said it pretty clearly like, hey, keep your hands off women. Don't beat them, don't do it. But I also think there is not enough we don't know enough about mental illness and there's not enough sensitivity around mental illness to know, hey, Kareem Hunt, do that because there's something going on in his brain that, you know, what did you do that thing?

OK, you're linking the two things. Yes. You're linking the mental illness to the the I'm not ruling it out.

That's that's what I'm not doing. I'm not ruling it out.

It should be said that, again, he wasn't arrested for this all. He ended up being was cited for speeding. But we're all making those logical leaps because the car smoked marijuana. There was an open container of vodka in there. There were plenty of stuff taken out of the car that the officer asked Kareem Hunt and Kareem Hunt is like, if I if I get tested, I haven't failed any of the tests. The officer let him go and you watch that video.

And at that time in America, you're like, how the hell did Kareem Hunt drive away from this? Because it seemed scary. And where you didn't have a concern for Kareem Hunt because you just assume because he's quiet, he was doing all right, all of a sudden you're wondering what the hell is going on.

So how do you feel about him in your uniform going after the biggest game in the history of your franchise or in your lifetime?

Same conflict, but I scream louder when the games mean more. He was awesome against Pittsburgh. This is the best running game, I think, in the league when you have a full healthy offensive line. Those two backs, Nick Chubb is incredible, obviously. But to be able to go to Kareem Hunt as a backup, it's insane because of what happened in Kansas City, the Cleveland Browns find themselves playing Kansas City. Nick Chubb was gone for a large chunk of the season.

I mean, we were bailing water, but we survived in large part, thanks said that incident in a Cleveland area hotel room that got him on the Browns. But I'm still wondering, is this guy OK?

Aren't fans selfish that way, though? We've all rooted for guys like bad guy, like Cubs fans rooting for, oh, this chapel, but I mean to help them win their first World Series. But what Mike is pleading for there, you're saying yes to gods. Of course you're right. But the reason I'm guessing that Mike finds that interesting is because fandom, that's all that connects it fandom. These aren't real emotional relationships. You get what you want from your athletes and it makes you feel good.

And when they disappoint you, you yell at them and you scream at them. But Mike, who loves the Cleveland Browns, is asking from the middle of a moral conflict. He's asking, hey, am I allowed to wonder about this guy's humanity? Am I allowed to wonder if this guy is OK? Is art or or do I have to stand back and just keep keep lashing him with you're the bad guy. This isn't a redemption story. You're a character problem.

You're not allowed to sob boo hoo guy in your car, get your shit together, get out on the football field, make millions of dollars carrying a ball. And then there's the undercurrent of everything that's happening in this country right now, where you also get an added boy, get out, get back out there, boy, and just carry the football and just shut up about your pain.

It's complicated because we're talking around and we're not there's no answer to it, which means it's not good sports talk radio. It probably makes for a worse column. It's a lot easier to do with Tony Gross. He didn't credit to the Cleveland beat writers because most of them were like, I have no idea how to talk about this. It's just Kareem Hunt. He's playing his former team. We don't know Kareem Hunt, but Tony Grosz's doing the easy thing was like, wow, what a redemption story.

Just because Kareem Hunt is quiet. And what I'm telling you is he was quiet for last season, too. And then he gets pulled over sobbing to an officer because Damian Williams is putting up a performance in the Super Bowl and not him.

Yeah, but Kareem Hunt does something. Mike, I'm going to I'm not questioning your sincerity, but fan's sincerity in general when they say, hey, I want to stop and think about whether this moral conundrum, should I be rooting for this guy? Is he OK? I don't think most fans care. They only care that Kareem Hunt makes them feel good and gives the Browns a better chance of winning a Super Bowl. And that's it.

I think if all fans if I'm bothered by anything in this, because I have the moral conundrum, same as I always have, and I'm just thinking about it more because we're in the playoffs and the and Browns fever. I bought so much merchandise. It's frickin crazy. My my Browns are playing Patrick Mahomes in the Kansas City Chiefs. And if they win, they're one game from a super. What's the point? Spread more than I touched ten and a half, by the way.

Take the over on that. Fifty six and a half.

What happened to just happy to be here. I am happy to be here. But you know, I don't think the Kansas City Chiefs can stop the Cleveland Browns running game. Certainly. No, that's the way they're going to be. What's the weather's fine for the race, but not when you're up three in the fourth quarter.

You lose that game. Tell me how happy you are just to be here. We. The sealers, I'm good, let's let's let's back up just happy to be there. You told me I'm good.

I want to backtrack for a second to tell you a story about half an merrison, because this was something that happened to me. I fell into that trap. Right. If you have followed this is so long ago. These are old man journalism tales. We've got to get imaging for that. Like, this is the the musty stuff. Right? When I'm writing columns for ESPN the magazine about somebody like Marvin Harrison's excellence. And why can't this guy and I find fancy myself, the WOAK sportswriter, the enlightened guy, the apologists on behalf of the black athlete.

And now I'm writing a column in my 20s for ESPN the magazine. And I want to talk about Harben Harrison's excellence. And that's all I want to talk about, the end in a world gone mad, where Terrell Owens wants everyone's attention with a Sharpie in his sock, Harvin Merrison just quietly goes about his job. And I'm just going to ignore the part about him being possibly a quiet killer. And I'm just going to talk about his football excellence.

And we're going to write a column about that the Colts decline. I mean, it was just going to be a puff piece. It was just going to be feeding the mythology of this. I was going to write like tapestries around him and he wasn't saying anything. I was just going to write here he is. I mean, could you remember Harvin Merrison skinny, just beautifully quiet and elegant in a way that normally that kind of excellence, what we give it is we toss it bouquets and write poetry about it.

Oh, and look, he doesn't say anything. Therefore he's humble or he's a killer. Hmm. Or we have to be careful.

I know you got to watch like this Kilsyth I'm talking about here. You should be careful. All right.

Well, hold on a second, because I got in trouble with Bomani Jones a long time ago about this because we turned all of that into a joke. And I haven't said his actual name. Harvin. Merrison. Yeah, it's someone you guys told me to be afraid of, even though he's skinny. He's he was like not he is not a menace by any standard in the NFL.

You know, you always have to be careful with the guys who are just a little too quiet.

And what are they hiding?

When the Harvard Merrison stuff came out after his career was over, I thought of one very strange headline that I saw on NFL dotcom.

And this might have been like the keyword NFL search days when Harvard Merrison was at a Pro Bowl and a fan approached him and he grabbed him by the throat. And it was just like a violent flash. I was like, huh?

Well, it doesn't seem hard, right? Try Harvard, Harvard, Harvard. You're good at that. You're just excellent all the time. You quietly catch mistaken identity. It was Hines Ward that wasn't there.

I thought there were reports. Can you just can you just Google real quick students, if you don't mind, Harben Marrison, the real name, and Philadelphia and just gunshots in a wall, I'm afraid.

The type. The real name. Yeah.

I mean, serious. And you just do those all those things I said and figure out a creative way to get girls should figure it out.

If you put Harvin marrison hiding, a lot of people Google it that way.

OK, Harvin marrison and gunshot and Philadelphia because I don't again you were speaking of a mythology here. We're not speaking of a real person. We've not spoken this person's name, but I'm pretty sure he played NFL games strap. I'm pretty sure that that was something like the last Boy Scout we just didn't notice. Yeah, that we just didn't notice that at any given point somebody could have died.

All right. So I've I've typed all that in Harvin marrison, gun shots, Philadelphia.

You want to take a minute to to read it? We can give you a break. And Roy, wasn't ESPN story the first one that. Yes.

Roy, what's for brunch? What are you having for brunch? My corporate mike is back because we need to do the show. And this is now going to be our governor. Mike, whenever we wander too far afield because we're doing a 20 minute segment instead of a five minute segment, you're just going to look like a dog running against an electrical fence. You're going to hit me with something, asking somebody what's for lunch.

I wanted a sports segment and I just wanted to explore, which allowed us to be reckless, but I did not want to explore Harvin Merrison. I want to explore what's for brunch.

Roy Yeah. So it's up in the air right now because I have to go immediately after we do this today. So it might be some sort of fast food chain today. Don't really know who, but it's nothing like fast food today.

You have to redo what today. Roy, you didn't seem like you were at all prepared for that question. Look, this is a dog eat dog world around here right now. Roy, we're executives are climbing over each other trying to get to the top of this mountain. You didn't have nothing there. Like, what do you mean you want to redo? I did. I misunderstood you.

I didn't say I wanted to redo. I said it was up in the air. I don't know what I'm going to eat today because I have to leave Royce playing it safe. He doesn't want to say which brand is going to eat out because he doesn't know who is a competitor or potential sponsors. But Roy, I just say this. Everyone right now is a potential sponsor, so feel free to name drop my friend Roy.

Is that what happened there, that you didn't want to name a sponsor because you are ever vigilant over the last 15 years of making sure. Oh, by the way, meet, ladies and gentlemen, our sponsorship to. Partment, that's Roy Bellamy, he's now in charge of of sponsors, is that what just happened there, Roy, that you were afraid to say a brand name just because for 15 years you've been electrocuted if a wrong brand gets out there?

That's exactly right. Then and I can tell you this right now, I can name any brand in the world and we could go out to that brand right now.

But I'm just going to play it safe and see who's going to come over with the money. And right now, it could be anybody.

I have a question for Roy, because Roy is really good at giving you, like, random ads for things to do and feel free to tell me this is a horrible idea because it probably is worth it to, you know, like, could you name if we give you a brand who their spokesperson is also like going back historically, like if we were to say, like, where's the beef? Could you tell us who that person is?

That we can tell you that for sure. No, no, I can't tell you. The name of the person that's so old is an old lady. That's kind of similar.

I Clare Bell. Clare, good Lord. Roy, I don't know.

I think that's a cow for like a milk company. Clarabelle that cow.

No, this is a long story. Yeah, I thought it was Dave Thomas.

There's another side of it, by the way. Potatoes are coming back to Taco Bell. Oh, they are. Yeah.

They went away. They removed all potato based items from their menu for a little bit and they brought back potato pie. But why did they take them away? What's the point of anything Mexican with potatoes is wonderful. Why did why were there not potatoes at Taco Bell?

I'm on it. What do you want to know about? I'm afraid to talk about, yes. I'd rather go there. I mean, what do you want to know?

Well, it's because last year they had to shift how the drive through works because a pandemic. So it seemed as though this decision on potatoes and remember, there was a potato shortage during the beginning of the pandemic. So maybe that forced Taco Bell's hand.

But I'm happy to report for your brunch needs potatoes are back at Taco Bell.

Can we bring back those spicy fries? Aren't they? I love those commercials that look like movies.

Look at the smile on his face.

Why did that, Roy? Why do you seem so happy this? Well, it's because of the camera money, isn't it? We're getting a totally different Roy. Roy is totally joy.

I mean, you just go straight into your cat every day. Is it the light that is when you do them?

Of course it's the best. Oh, yeah, absolutely. My pockets are getting fat right now. It's all right.

Roy, how how can you get better at the cameos? What can we do in order for Roy to get maximum mileage out of. Because Billy's gone to costumes and Chris has gotten to overexuberance. That basically. Chris, that's your character, right? You're going you're going for so much energy.

That's why I'm envious of Billy, because he can do it and nail it without just like without just being very low energy.

Billy, do you have any advice for the crew? Is the clear cameo artistic leader so far in terms of getting a lot of applause? Because you're doing you're doing little acting there in character ad lib. Do you have any advice for the group on how to do these properly beyond saying, hey, guys, how about you just do them at all?

Oh, is this good news, Dan? False false alarm in my building. Got this awesome false alarm.

I didn't know I had that speaker there, but, hey, you know, nice to be honest. Yes.

OK, hold on, Morgan. Well, I know you're on a cruise. Is it Spanish?

Because you are partially destroyed because it sounds like your your your chateau in Paris right now.

Sounds like a captain's message early in the morning. It sounds like you're in French now, although it sounds like it's a pirate ship.

It's what it sounds like. It sounds like it's the echo of. Well, let's see, Billy, do you think that that is something that happens in a lot of countries, a fire alarm that has three different a lot of cities.

Someone's banging on something said, Billy, what's going on at your house? That just seemed it was very quiet moments ago.

I heard off in the distance an alarm. And I thought that it may be like, you know, another building or something. But apparently it was it was my building. But good news, false alarm. So we're all good. What are we talking about here?

Any advice, any advice for the group on what I got to do once on how to be good at Cameo?

I don't know how I became the advice person, but I'd be happy to give Chris Oroya Saigon's or anyone advice. Just feel free. Book my cameo. I'll give you all the advice that you want.

I have already learned. I've already learned from Billy. You just take something that they give you and you just ramble for forty five seconds on it.

It makes the cameo seem longer and makes your, your, your underestimating the artfulness that Billy is applying to remaining in deadpan character. It's not that's hard to just ramble. I think you you think it comes naturally to Billy right up until. Yeah. Ask him to do it. Have you not been. Doing the show with him for eight years, he gives you a lot of rambow when you don't want it, when you want Rambo, you get four words and a smile.

I've been doing. Yeah, there it is. What do you mean? Four words in a smile.

Try that academy. What do you mean, Billy? Billy being Billy. Billy being maximum yammering. Billy. That's hard work.

I mean, Billy, how long your cameos I'm averaging and now I got people starting to complain they're too long. That is of course what I do theirs. But a minor like averaging it like two minutes per capita.

How did you end up being bad at this? I thought you were going to crush all of this.

Oh, I am crushing it. I mean, people love my cameos. I'm wearing the same shirt. I do it for the same office. I mean, it's a delight. I've got to start getting high for that.

Are you you're going to start getting high for the promised us the exclusive rights to you getting high on air. Now you're going to give it away on Cameo. Yeah. Where are we going to do that?

I'm not giving it away there. He's getting paid. One hundred and fifty dollars. Exactly. I'm not getting paid anything here.

Are you going to make it stewpot it or not? Listen, I have put some feelers out there listening to you, by the way, and by feelers. I just threw it out there. Cannabis world. I am I am available. I am free and I am available.

Are you going to be able to turn that into an ask? Are you going to is stupidity going to become something that just is are you going to have product placement or are you going to do it creatively?

I'm telling you right now, OK, we have a CEO in charge. I have felt his power OK. I felt what it's like to be on a phone call with him with sales. I am not doing anything.

He's got some presents man over a picture of him makes him look like a mafioso.

It's unbelievable. OK, and so I'm not I'm not selling another thing. I'm not missing another cameo. I don't want to do anything until that man says it's OK. OK, well, I am not I'm not even putting draft kings on this.

All right. So, Mike, help me out with some of the stuff here as we as we spin out a little bit and we close out the show for the day because this is getting harder and harder to do because a whole lot of stuff is bouncing off of us as we do it.

I just don't know the rules, that's all. Like, if I if I had a rule book that before, I think you break it, if you knew the rules. I think our history here suggests that there's been a lot of I mean, these stories are true. Like if I take you right to the recesses of everything that we've done around here to get to this very point when we're we're starting a media company and it's like a hugely exciting time to do it.

And it's got stupidity. And it's a vital thing that people like outside of our world and inside of our world. And we're going to build something now over the course of this free period time when we're also making shows for us.

I'll have Dan Patrick on this week on stupidity. Talk about life after ESPN. From a sales standpoint, I would love to paint it like a NASCAR. I just don't know if I'm allowed to. So I have to take your sensibilities into account here, which I didn't do the first week, but I promised it to Mike. Well, you let Mike and we're you tracking spy. That showed us that. And it surprised me when I was listening.

I felt I had all the sales inventory and I thought I was mine to sell. I love traffic. They've supported us since day one. Go for it. I think. I think Dan overthinks commercial sponsorship when it comes to podcast too much. People just sort of accept it. I think more people are concerned that we don't have sponsors.

OK, hold on a second. Just let's end the show here, because I want people to see what's happening with us. I just want you to stop bleeding me. And I mean, I know you listen, you have no reason to believe me, none of you. But I'm telling you, I am doing this because I want my money.

No, no, no, no. Well, well, that's helpful. That's what you want the money.

I did. I thought I had all the inventory. One hundred percent. I like.

I just just you're the most honest relationship I have because everything that comes out of your mouth is a lie. At least, you know, just like you're just wasting words and time when you're saying I'm man I care for Dan when it comes is OK.

Well, but can I saw in letting everybody in on the warts and all stuff on a night where Stewardson I had a back and forth because look man, this is an emotional time for us and that and all of us are just sort of wrecked by what's going on in the country, combined with combined with the fact that, you know, our, you know, our loved ones and the virus keeps getting closer and closer. And there's a lot of fear.

And we're all in a in a in an unbelievably stressful time. I don't know. I think we're sitting right now trying to make you laugh all around about cameo and free agency, trying to take you away from all of the bullshit going on in America. I think that we are sitting in the middle of the most stressful time any of us have ever known as a country. We're sitting right in the middle of it now where none of us are really sure, hey, nothing's going to happen at the inauguration, right?

Like nothing. We're going to be able to protect ourselves and freedom and all that stuff because. This hasn't gotten quite so messy with with all this Frankenstein monster has wrought in terms of showing America its true self, that the underbelly because we can we can blame him all we want for being, you know, an orange racist turd and stuff. But all he did was maximize the power and profit in tapping in to how we hate each other and turned it into something all in front of us at the same time that we could see is like, oh, wait a minute.

So you don't believe in freedom at all? And you're going to accuse me of not believing in freedom just because you're sitting here physically and actually attacking freedom in a way that kills a police officer and bust his skull with a fire extinguisher while, you know, waving blue lives matter flags and not having the sense of smarts to even see the irony in that the funny that you've brought to this tragedy by being such a reckless group of oafs that you graffiti this place and you had some sort of plan.

But whatever the plan was, it got dangerously close to like, you know, kidnapping the vice president of the United States. And we all feel hugely unsafe. Yeah, well, think about it.

You just had to ask that in the form of a question. Nothing's going to happen, right? Transfer of power. We never even thought about it. It just someone got elected and that guy became that person became president.

I said, I want to be doing a radio show around that. Right. As this is all a long way of saying, OK, as you go on this journey with us, as you see in real time being, stewards, fighting, and I mean saying, hey, I jumped ship and where's the money negotiation? As Dan tells you, what's for brunch?

And Lou is freaking out. Yes. And that there's always been a sales tension around here for 20 years, for 20 years, to God knows that this has been my greatest frustration, that the I would say that the the one place in my ESPN career where John Skipper said no to me is that I was one of the last remaining journalists in print journalism wasn't doing.

You can just say that. You can edit that sentence there.

One of the last remaining journalists in and doing live spots and doing advertising. I didn't want to do it, but in order to get to ESPN, it's a compromise I had to make. I did not want to make it, but I had to make it in order for all of us to get to ESPN a long time ago. And now the story comes full circle. And John Skipper comes over here to work with us in a way that's going to help us build a company.

But for 20 years to God knows that my greatest frustration is that the advertising in this game has been terrible. It's always live sports, boring, no creativity.

You mean in radio. And it's this game is different. This is podcast.

OK, but you understand what I'm saying. I come from radio. I'm doing a radio show right now. I'm not doing a podcast. I'm doing what we've always done around here. A radio show.

Yeah, but you're doing a podcast. I know I'm not. We don't have to have a voice on first rate.

I know. I know. You know, and we always refer to it as radio. And what I feel like we're doing, I've always referred to as a radio show. But you're coming with radio baggage and podcast is a different animal altogether.

But we're making that shift in real time, Mike. Yeah, but Dan, I think what Mike's trying to say is we can get creative with the ads. We could drop the ads in in a way that you would never even know that they're being done. You never hear it on radio ads would legitimately get in the way of us doing our show. It would be part of the framework of the show. You would have to talk to a cashier sound and you got to go to a spot, you do a transition, and then you would sit as you try to collect your thoughts from talking all day more, talking about commercial products for five minutes, and then you would have to reset with a spot at the start.

It's totally different with podcasts. We do our show. We could have a million sponsors on this podcast right now. Your workflow would not be altered one bit and the audience either sits through them.

Actually, I'm surprised. The math is most people actually sit through podcast spots, but for those that don't, they got the fast forward button and it's in one ear out the other and they just keep going until the Seagate's picks up. It is a totally different deal.

Mike, safe to say that we could paint it like a NASCAR and Dan would never even know that. We would not know. You're giving me an idea.

There it is. And that is the sales tension that has always existed around everything that we're doing. And that is where it is that we head off for the day. I don't know when we're doing I've become Greg Cody. I don't know what kind of show we're doing. What is it? A podcast? Is it a radio show? These lights are very bright in here. Actually, they're not bright enough.

I've got no idea how to turn these things on or off. I just know it's going to have nine presenting sponsors.

Now, I know that Billy wanted to talk about a pigeon today, and I've been trying to get to it all show. And I don't understand why he so badly wants to talk about a pigeon. But we've been so self-involved and we have been so just overwhelmed by everything happening around here that Billy I'm sorry I didn't have a chance to get to your pigeon story.

What happened with a pigeon? We can choose the next time we come back. Next podcast, the next post game post game show.

Find out about Billies pigeon story.

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