Transcribe your podcast
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You are listening to the Darren Wilson Show, I'm Darren, I spent the last 20 years devoted to improving health, protecting the environment and finding ways to live a more sustainable life. In this podcast, I have honest conversations with people that inspire me. I hope that through their knowledge and unique perspectives, they'll inspire you, too. We talk about all kinds of topics from amping up your diets and improving your well-being to the mind blowing stories behind the human experience and the people that are striving to save us and our incredible planet.

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We've investigated some of life's fatal conveniences. You know, those things that we are told might be good for us, but totally aren't. So here's to making better choices and the small tweaks in your life that amount to big changes for you and the people around you and the planet. Let's do this. This is my show, The Darren Olean Show. Everybody, welcome to the show. Thanks for tuning in. Thanks for your time. Make sure you subscribe.

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And something on my heart today is your voice, my voice, your voice, the truth. And it's important more than ever. We're getting censored all over the place. We're getting dominated by major media of what thought patterns should be in your head, whose voices are important. And I believe that we're being squeezed out of our own authentic need to communicate our truth. So that's why today I'm really focused on the authenticity of speaking up for what you believe in, what I believe in, and finding your voice.

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This is more important than ever and finding your unique voice. I started this podcast because, yes, I've written a book Down to Earth, did great all of these things. But ultimately, I'm always seeking to be clear in myself and then communicate that to the world. And there is literally nothing better that I find in a broad perspective than to doing a podcast. And I resisted it literally for 10 years. 10 years. I resisted I too much.

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It's too big of a deal. I don't have the time. I don't have the time. But ultimately my heart sings and my voice is free because it's only you and me and my microphone and what I'm choosing to say into this microphone. And thank you for listening for my unique sliver into this world with my guests. So there is one way that you can explore this possibility. Maybe you have a podcast and you're kind of moving along and you're not really sure or you're thinking about doing a podcast of your own.

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And there's no better time than to explore that possibility. And dare I say, just do it if you're thinking about it. So there is an incredible event. We are podcast starting next week. I'm speaking with a list of amazing entrepreneurial legends and more details in the show notes. And there is a code, a great code of twenty percent off. So just go to we are podcast dot com backslash, Daryn, and explore this from every person that I'm speaking with and is on.

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These panels have jumped into the ring of finding their own voice in this unique way. And podcasts are becoming one of the greatest long form communicative devices of our time. And you can put your hat in the ring hell, put your feet in the ring and put your voice out in the air for others to hear and to be impacted by because you are unique and you have a voice and there is no better person than to share a uniqueness and a person that jumped all in because he was dying.

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So Adam Sudd, my guest today, you will walk away being absolutely blown away by a story by the inspiration that he generated out of a severe addiction, multiple addictions, chronic pain, chronic disease, mental health disorders. Adam tried killing himself. Thank God he was not successful. He was well over three hundred and fifty pounds. He went into rehab, drug overdoses. This guy has gone through it. And I'm telling you, this man is an incredible human being because it was all about him finding out his uniqueness of who he actually was.

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And so he became this plant based addict. He took all of that bad addiction and turned it into his health. So he dropped half of his weight.

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He started a nonprofit plant based for positive change and is dedicated to actually a. Advancing the research of diet and mental health addiction and this guy, I'm telling you, you just can't help but to support him and support his mission because we all can relate to mental health challenges. So Adam's focusing on programs that reverse insulin resistance and also using low fat, whole food plant based nutrition from a peer reviewed scientific support of nature. So I am super stoked to have Adam on this plant based journey, to have him on this podcast as a powerful recovery brother using plants as medicine, using clarity of self as the divine and acknowledging the divine nature of who he actually is.

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So big shout out a big air. Clap to my next guest. Please enjoy, Adam said. Yeah, man, welcome. Thank you for coming on here. I'm stoked the more I've read about what you're doing because it hits on so many different aspects. I have a father, so no one will get in. I lost a father to addiction. Obviously, the plant based lifestyle and the tremendous things that you've overcome in your life. I'm just I'm blown away.

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So you said you're excited to talk to you. Well, I'm I'm I'm I might be more excited to talk to you because. Because also what I've seen is and what I'm getting to know and I want to unpack with you is the proliferation of what you're doing to advance research, advance research into recovery and also just move forward in a sensible way of people taking care of themselves. So so, dude, where to go and welcome, man.

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Thank you so much. It's it's an I can tell you, it's an it's a tremendous pleasure for me to be here. I've been a fan of yours for years. I've known Rich role. I found out about you through Rich and I've just been following you ever since. So this is like I'm telling you, this is I'm really grateful.

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Right on. Well well, Rich and I salute you because that's that's what we like to do. I actually just recorded my fourth podcast with them a couple of days ago. Whatever, whatever that's going to be coming out. So we had a two hour dive in into that. But I'm excited for people to understand what you've overcome and what you're actually doing from the from the things that you've overcome into.

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So so, yeah, for everyone I know a little bit because of what I read. But why don't you unpack a bit. Where you've come from and what you did to him to get to the new vantage point of your life.

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Yeah, well, so, you know, it really my my whole journey, like everybody's journey starts at the beginning. And I'm a seventh generation Texan, so I grew up in I was born in Houston, you know, burgers and barbecue. I'm also Jewish. I grew up with bagels and blitz's.

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Right. So not the not the the most health centered lifestyle. But, you know, I mean, is the diet of the culture, both cultures. And so when you're a kid, you just sort of accept what your parents want. You pay your parents or your caretakers. So of course, you're not going to you wouldn't question what they put in front of you. And they're not doing anything without the best of intentions. And I played sports growing up.

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My dad taught me how to play basketball and baseball and football, and my mom was really big and inspiring my imagination. And I had I had this overwhelming sense of this developing disconnection to myself. And it started when I was really young. I kept receiving these messages and it wasn't with ill intention from my parents that there were going to be conditions upon which I could and could not accept myself completely.

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One one situation I remember was being in my parents room. I think it was 10 years old. Summer in Texas, you run around outside and this was the eighties with no shoes, no shirt. You spend a whole day outside. And so I come in and my parents, they asked me, why aren't I already had love handles?

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I'm ten. I don't even know what love handles are. Right. So I don't know how I got them. And when I asked them what a weird question from your parents. Right.

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It was and and then I asked them what it was. They explained it to me. I look at my dad and my dad. He's been a runner his whole life and a basketball player. But he had what I thought they were talking. I said, well, that has them. They said, well, he's forty, you shouldn't have them yet. And boom, immediately, like, I came into that to that space as a ten year old child, completely accepting of myself without judgment and without question, completely accepting myself the rest of the world.

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And my acceptance was not dependent upon the opinion of others.

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And in that instant, it completely changed all of it because I damn shame shame entered the it entered my story because I was presented with a narrative by people whose acceptance was everything that you have to be this or we won't accept. You know, that's not what they were saying. But it was a narrative that was presented to me. And I bought into it because I was terrified. I was terrified that I didn't know what was going on. I don't know how it happened.

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I don't know what's wrong with me and I don't know how to fix it. So I have to be I have to be wary and I have to be constantly on high alert. Like, what are going to be the cues that the world is going to give me that tell me when I am and am not acceptable? And that followed me for the rest of my life. I remember being 12 years old and getting diagnosed with ADHD and having a doctor saying to me, you know, here's something about you that doesn't work right.

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And this isn't what he said word for word. But this is what I heard because I was looking at the world through this lens of the narrative of am I acceptable, constantly aware of it. And so here I was presented another opportunity to buy into a bullshit story that like there's something about you that's broken and that the world finds unacceptable. But this time I was presented with a solution. I was presented with a medication with Ritalin at the time and essentially gave me the opportunity to say, as long as I take this, no one's ever going to know how broken I am because I will appear to be what everyone else needs me to be so that I can be acceptable.

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And it really set in to this into my into my life, this this constant understanding that when I saw something about myself that I was ashamed of or that other people were ashamed of or didn't seem to fit in with the goings on of the world around me, there was going to be a substance outside of myself that I could find, I could use and I could fix these broken parts of me that I knew. I felt that I had. This is confidence that I was going to discover more broken parts of myself.

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And we moved to Austin, Texas, right before I started high school.

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So now I was late to start puberty. So I was an awkward kid. I don't know anybody and is a big football school in Texas where it's very quick ish. And my prescription for Ritalin had been changed to Adderall.

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And once the kids at the school found out that I had a prescription to Adderall and Adderall is just another stimulant based medication used to treat ADHD. And it's essentially it's a medically pure amphetamine. That's what the stuff is. All of a sudden, I got invited to parties. All of a sudden people wanted me around. And I didn't understand at the time that it was also a recreational drug. I hadn't discovered that yet. But man, what felt so good was feeling like I was of value to other people, that I had something that other people wanted around them, that I could be that person, that when I showed up, everyone got excited and I bought into it because I needed it.

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Like my ego was weak and it needed validation from the outside world because I wasn't getting it for myself, because I had lost that belief that it's possible to get it from inside. And I can remember the first time that I used Adderall as a recreational drug. It was like it was like the world wrapped its arms around me, gave me this big hug and said, no matter what I got you, because all of a sudden I had unbelievable confidence.

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I could talk to anybody about anything that they were talking about. And it was immediately interesting to me. And I had boundless energy. I was slightly overweight as a freshman in high school, and Adderall, like I mentioned, is an amphetamine. So I didn't want to eat any more. All of a sudden I could lose weight with ease. And that that helped me look like the person I thought everyone wanted me to look like. I didn't have very good study habits.

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And so my dad and I were getting into constant arguments all the time.

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When I'm on Adderall that's taking care of it seems like every single broken part of me was immediately fixed by taking this pill. And I wasn't I wasn't so much addicted to the substance as I was the result of it. Like what it seemed to do for me, it seemed to magically fix everything that was wrong with me. And the more that I took of it, the more it seemed to make me the person I thought I needed to be for the world, not for myself, but for the world.

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And it worked. It worked so well. My relationship, my dad got better. I lost weight. I had friends, I had girlfriends. I got a scholarship to the college that I wanted to go to. And everything seemed to be working exactly as I've always hoped it would be. My life finally seemed to make sense in a meaningful way. And in college, things started to take a turn because more was now never enough. Never enough was a constant reoccurring concern in my life.

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Like how much do I have left? How long will it last? Where will I get more? How much will it cost? Where am I going to get the money to pay for it? There was like this constant mathematical equation of how much, where, what, when, why all these things. And I was constantly calculating over and over again. It was exhausting. And so the rest of my life, these other meaningful aspects of living right, treating my body with respect, having a meaningful connection with my purpose in life, having a meaningful connection with my family and friends, having a meaningful connection with the natural world around me, they just seem to sever they just seem to fall away into the background as the substance.

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My connection to the substance became more and more and more overwhelming. And so I dropped out of college. I moved back to Austin, Texas, because I knew the dealers, I knew the doctors that I could scam. And I started doctor shopping where you have multiple doctors prescribing the same medication without knowing about each other. And it's a felony. I was forging prescriptions. I was buying and selling drugs on the street. I was scamming and stealing from my parents.

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I mean, I would treat I would do anything to anybody, no matter what happened to them, as long as I was able to get what I needed for me, because that's the only thing I cared about was how do I get this substance, because life is too painful without it. And I started to isolate. And I was using so much so fast that I would run out. And there would be like a week of that would go by where I didn't know where I was going to get anymore and.

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Showing up authentically in the world that I was living in was excruciatingly painful, and so I found that fast food was an amazing substitute for me to sort of numb myself up and just like sort of coast through those days until I could get my next fix. And when I say that I was struggling with with junk food, I mean, I get up every single day, I go to a place called Torture's Tacos. I would get three potato egg and cheese breakfast tacos.

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And I go to McDonald's, get to super size double quarter pounder meals, and I go to Whataburger, get that extra large honey barbecue chicken sandwich meal for dinner. I get an extra large pizza from Papa John's with beef on top and a side of the chicken strips.

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Then at 3:00 in the morning, I go back to Whataburger or three of their breakfast on a bun sandwiches with sausage, and I probably drink anywhere from 15 to 20 sodas in a day. And I would do that for about six days straight until I could get a hold of more Adderall. I would eat Adderall and I end up using opiates as well. And the average prescription for Adderall is about 10 milligrams a day. I was doing a minimum of four hundred and fifty milligrams and a maximum of a thousand milligrams a day for six days straight.

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And I became increasingly isolated. I ended up living like a hoarder. I mean, I never throw anything away. I buy windows were boarded up because I didn't want people seeing inside my apartment and my dad at this really, really awful time. I my dad came to me and he offered me the opportunity to attend a seven day retreat hosted by a man named Rip Esselstyn. And Rip Esselstyn is the executive producer of the film. The Game Changers also wrote The Engine to Diet.

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He's in forks over knives. And I didn't know who he was. I didn't care who he was. I want to learn anything about a plant based diet. I just knew that if I said yes to my dad, I could convince him to keep giving me money. So I went. I was high when I went had drugs on me.

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My appearance was so disruptive to rip in the staff and some of the participants that they were considering having me removed from the program. And I'm really glad that they didn't. I don't know if I'd be alive if they did, but I still went to every lecture and I listen to everything that was being said and it seemed to make sense. It seemed to connect these dots about how if I were to adopt a plant based diet, I could not just reverse disease, but I could gain the greatest health I've ever had in my life that I was I had the ability to take charge of my life.

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And at the same time, it also spoke to a core value of mine. I grew up very connected to nature through my grandmother. And so the opportunity to be healthy and kind at the same time spoke to me. And I really wish I could say to you that that was it. That was the learning moment. That was that I was that was it. And I listened. I learned and I implemented. But what I simply wasn't ready to give up what was allowing me to escape a life that was just too painful a place to be.

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And about a year later, I was it was August. Twenty first of twenty twelve. And I would come home from shopping at a store called Casual Male XL is the only place I could go where I could buy pants with a 50 inch waist. And when I was outside, I would look at people and I would notice them staring at me, or at least I would believe they were staring at me. And I would start to imagine them saying and thinking these awful things about me.

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And I would go home and I would go right into the bathroom and I'd stand in front of the mirror and I'd look at this person that I didn't recognize and I certainly didn't love. And I would start saying every one of those things that I heard that I believe people were saying about me.

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And every time I said one of them, I would just hit myself as hard as I could over and over and over again until I collapsed on the floor, swollen red, crying. I had this intention. That if I could just hate myself enough and if I could just hate my life enough, then maybe that would be enough for me to want to change my life. But it just it further disconnected me from what everything about living was. And I remember calling my twin brother, who I've been very close with for my entire life, and I told I didn't know what was going on.

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And I've never been like this before and I don't want him to worry. I don't think anything's going to happen. But I just want to tell him that I love him. And that night. Living hurt too much. You know, there's a there's a feeling when tomorrow seems impossible. Eventually, today is going to be impossible. I believe that everything that was wrong about myself in my life was going to be worse tomorrow. And in that moment, it was the worst it had ever been.

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And I said, you know what, I can't do this anymore, and I grabbed a handful of opiates, a handful of amphetamines, I just threw them down my throat and I attempted suicide by overdose. And I had I had been on the edge of overdosing several times, so I know what it felt like and this was a lot different, and I tried to stand up my entire right side of my body cramp like I was stabbed in the side.

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And all of a sudden I just get really lightheaded and everything starts to fade. And slowly black just starts to come in from the sides. And I have this profound realization that this is the last moment I'm ever going to see in my life. And it's in a quarter like apartment with everything and everyone that's ever mattered to me, Don.

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And I'm going to tell you that the feeling of dying and I don't mean the physical feeling, yeah, that was bad, but the feeling that this was my last moment. I've never had anything like that in my life. And I collapsed onto the floor. Miraculously, a few hours later, I wake up in a puddle of my own vomit in a pile of fast food garbage surrounded by empty pill bottles alone in the dark. And I have this unbelievable feeling of relief because I believe that I had just tried to end my life.

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And so I was confused by the feeling of relief or if my attempt was to end my life, why am I relieved? And it asked me to consider the truth of my life that a suicide attempt is not an attempt to end someone's life and attempt to end someone's pain.

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And that the reason why I was feeling relief is because there was something about myself in my life that was so meaningful that even with all the pain I was having, I still wanted to be a part of it all. I still wanted to be here for one more day. And I said, this is too great of an opportunity, I picked up the phone, I called my dad and I asked for help. I checked into rehab or within seventy two hours, I was diagnosed with type two diabetes, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, erectile dysfunction, bipolar disorder, suicidal depression, obsessive compulsive personality disorder, anxiety disorder, sleep disorder and attention deficit disorder.

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And as you can imagine, they put me on a cabinets worth of medication for life. And for the second time in my life, I was offered the opportunity to believe a story that all of this was just part of my genetic hand, I was dealt at birth, that this is who I am. I am an addict. I am a diabetic. I am bipolar. I am all these things. And I was immediately transported back to that retreat with RIP, where I heard luminary doctors and thought leaders say, you know what, more so than your genetics.

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You are the way you interact with the world around you. And that perhaps and most likely the reason why I was experiencing these things is because it is exactly what is supposed to be happening, given the way I was living my life and that there is absolutely nothing wrong with me. And I told myself for the first time, that's the story I'm going to buy into. That I'm going to practice remembering the person I had always been before the world told me something else before the world or something or somebody else told me some story about who I was supposed to be and believed it.

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And so I said, you know what, I don't really understand the whole psychology aspect yet, but I do know how to I do know a method to reverse these diseases. And so that's what I'm going to do. And I checked out of rehab. After thirty seven days, I moved into a sober living facility and in the sober billeting facility, the house manager, he stocks the food based on the residents recommendations. This was in Santa Monica. And this is where I wanted to adopt a plant based diet, so I walk up to the house manager whose last name is literally Hamburger, and asked him if he would buy me oatmeal and kale, the black beans.

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It is amazing that my plant based journey started with a hamburger, but the best ever.

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And he he looked at me and he said that this is what you want to do.

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We want to support you. I get up every single day and I would walk to the cabinet to open it up and there would be the oatmeal that I asked for and there were the Fruity Pebbles. And I get really pissed because I knew that here I am standing here knowing if I choose the Fruity Pebbles is going to continue to fuel the disease processes that are making my life unbearable. I also know that if I choose the oatmeal, it's going to start to create the life that I want to live.

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It's going to help reconnect me to those meaningful bonds of myself, the world, all of it. So why in the world what I knowing these two things still want a Fruity Pebbles. I didn't understand why this couldn't simply be a matter of intellect and will why I couldn't just know what to do, want to do it. End of story. And then I read a book by an evolutionary psychologist named Doug Lyle called The Pleasure Trap, or talks about the biological mechanism of compulsion, how any time we engage in any behavior that creates a dopamine response, it's outside the bounds of the normal human experience.

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It compels us to continue that behavior because our body believes it's biologically beneficial. Essentially, what it was saying was the reason why I knew what to do to be happy and healthy and still didn't want to do it was because my body was doing exactly what it was supposed to do, given how I'd been living my life, given the environment I created for myself.

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And I just simply had to be comfortable being uncomfortable until my dopamine receptors reset and then it wouldn't be a chore and eventually I'd get up and I would actually look forward to it.

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And from the outside, looking in, a person would say, oh, it's obvious why he wants to do this, because he's overweight, he has diabetes, heart disease, and nearly died from substance abuse. And that's true that that was happening. But I told myself I was done trying to hate my way out of a bad situation. For the first time in my life. I wanted to give myself permission to love myself into a positive situation. Yeah, I was diabetic at heart disease.

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I was obese, had all these things, and I didn't want any of them.

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Why not? What was it about my life that I loved enough that I was willing to do these things because I believe that fear and hatred or great fear and anger, all those things are great, great motivators because they highlight a meaningful bond in your life that's being threatened and it allows you to see what is truly meaningful or meaningful to you at that time in your life.

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And you can connect to it. You can create behaviors that allow you to fully connect to it even more. And that's what I was doing. I was going to love myself into a positive lifestyle. And within three months, my diabetes, my heart disease, my erectile dysfunction were completely reversed. Within 10 months, I had lost over one hundred pounds. Within a year, I was off of every single medication. I was put on a rehab, including the antidepressants, the mood stabilizers, the sleeping medications, the anxiety medications, ADHD medications.

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I had learned that more so than caring about what was the matter with me. I needed to care about what mattered to me and let that be the catalyst that moved me one step forward every single day. And I'm eight years sober next month. I have never been happier or healthier in my life. And the thing is, like I mentioned before, I didn't become this person. This is the person that has been waiting for me since the day I was born to remember that this is how I authentically move through the world.

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And once I accepted that my past you know what? I didn't know what I was doing, but I was still doing the best that I could given what I was dealing with. I was able to, like, finally look at that person, that inner self and say, I forgive you. Forgive me for not knowing how to honor you every single day because I didn't know any better. And I'm going to connect to you every single day with self-love, keres of food, self-love, practices of movement, self-love, practices of being in nature and treating people with compassion and treating myself with compassion.

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And the minute I did that, it was like, I can hear this voice inside of me say, I've been waiting my whole life for this. So that's that's it in a nutshell.

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That was if everyone just heard. Those were the most beautiful stories I've heard in a very long time. First off, I just want to say I'm so very grateful for you sharing the story and and equal, if not more important to that. I am grateful for you choosing your life and choosing who you are, because now we're going to hear what you're doing with that. So for years, maybe all, most of my life, people have been asking me what kind of foods you eat, what kind of exercises do do, what kind of water should I drink, all of these things and so much more we put into a 21 day program.

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So that can take you through a theme every day of knowledge, action, and then eating this delicious meals, working out, getting support, anchoring in these new habits. So you can do what? So that you can kick ass. So you have the energy, the vitality to live the kind of life that you really want. That's what it's all about. So all in this app, we have grocery lists, we have education about real hydration and what greater oxygenation and the balance of organization.

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All of these things we are diving into as you're heading down this hero's journey of implementation into a new life to give you the kind of life that you actually want. So join my tribe. All you have to do is go to one to one tribe, dotcom, sign up and you get three free days. Join me on this hero's journey. Join the tribe. You know, it's very clear in your story, in your arc of your story that that when your parents said this to you about those love handles and just clearly put you in this world of like, I don't even look at the world this way.

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And now all of a sudden I'm trying to wrestle with the world that you've just placed on me and then through your process of diagnosis and everything else, like, OK, now here's a pill. And that's going to now that's filling the void that was created by you are not a nothingness. And now that hole is just empty and you just keep filling it up and it can never be filled.

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That can it's unsustainable. And I just want people to understand that, you know, that that is what we're all dealing with in some capacity.

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Yeah. And I'll say, you know, for me, shame in my parents have been my biggest heroes in my journey. They they showed up with love and compassion when I needed it the most. And I don't I don't need them. I don't need an apology from them because they weren't doing anything inherently wrong. They were there was how they chose to show their love for me. My shame existed because at that moment I believe that they were unlovable parts of me.

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The reason why I overcame that shame is because I realized those were parts I forgot I knew how to love. And just like with all human emotion, we're taught in this culture that some are good and some are bad, right, that love, joy, excitement, willingly feel them willingly, feel them all you want. Anger, anxiety, fear, thickset.

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But what if every single emotion in the entire breadth of human emotion is equally meaningful and equally valuable? What if all of them are a signal that is a rising in you to tell you something about how you're moving through the world and how to be your true self? What if they're not your enemy that you have to fight? What if they're your constant companion? What if they are there for you every single day and so accepting that narrative about feelings, because I would get up every single day and I would have four months into recovery and I'd have temptations and urges and cravings and I'd be like, whoa, what am I doing wrong?

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And I had a great conversation with my therapist and he gave me the permission to consider that maybe I'm not doing anything wrong. Is it possible to live as a human and not experience anger, frustration, anxiety, urges, temptations and cravings? Absolutely not. But is it possible to experience those things and be okay with it, to willingly accept them and allow them to exist in you as a companion in your day so that you have these conversations with yourself that guide you towards your truest way of living rather than a confrontation with yourself that keeps you locked?

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And that was huge for me and everybody has the ability to do that. It's not easy. It doesn't happen overnight. But that was the genesis. That was what I needed to understand, was that these feelings aren't going anywhere.

[00:36:29]

Because they're a part of me and they're healthy and they're meaningful, they make sense, just like happiness and joy makes sense. Fear and anger and frustration, anxiety, they make sense. They arise for a reason. Maybe I should be listening to them instead of fighting them or trying to fix them. Yeah.

[00:36:44]

And thinking that you're wrong for having them and thinking that your foundation for your existence is wrong. So everything coming out of that is just wrong. So. So I'm broken. So therefore I have to listen to someone else. I have to believe in this medication. It's getting me through this very uncomfortable moment to moment to moment life because your foundation of who you are, who set up incorrectly, like you bought into it and you divorced the part of yourself that was perfect as you're as you are.

[00:37:23]

But in that.

[00:37:24]

But I love what you said because people have this idea that you all of a sudden will get to this place where we you are devoid of all of the emotion and pain and suffering that is a part of this discourse, corrective journey, this ability to bump up against shame and bump up against anger and bump up against joy and happiness and and all of that stuff. And so the the beauty that you shared in your life is you can't sit there and say, I wish I never went through this.

[00:38:05]

In fact, your gift of going through it is part of the greatest gift ever.

[00:38:14]

Absolutely. And and so anyway, so I want to get into this because I love. The fact of how you've taken this. Journey, and you've applied it in a bigger version of you. So tell me a little bit about that journey. So once you've got out of rehab, you're feeling good. Like what what then happened? That I really want to understand the the flower, the blossoms that started to come and present these other projects.

[00:38:54]

So it's really interesting. About a year out of getting out of rehab, I tried to go back into the industry that I was working in and really found out that it wasn't anything I was passionate about. It was really a drug fueled passion. And so I decided I was going to go do something entirely selfless to try to discover what it is that lit me up. And I went and lived in an orphanage in Nepal. And I was of service to these orphans Monday through Friday.

[00:39:23]

And then on the weekends, I would go and hike and spend time in nature, do yoga, all that sort of stuff. And it sounds really cliche, but I was in the middle of a yoga session, a solo session with this with this yoga. And he asked me to project five years. And I never given myself permission to do that because I was at the time, like, I only need to do is take care of seven days.

[00:39:43]

I take care of seven days and then reset. That's all I need to worry about, because I got only at the time when I got out of rehab, I was thirty seven days sober. The rest of my life was impossible. Seven days made sense and I was like, fine, I'll do this. And I saw this opportunity, this idea is like, well, wait a minute, OK, so here I was, two years out of rehab, the healthiest had ever been, medication free, fully connected to my true self.

[00:40:11]

And I had made so many friends in recovery who at the same time, the same amount of time had passed the same treatment. Essentially, there are more medications, whether on the same medications, the higher dosages they've been diagnosed with, chronic diseases or other chronic diseases have gotten worse. Not all of them, but a good number of them. What what's the X Factor here, and I look at what I did and I said, well, I made nutrition a core fundamental value, as well as mindfulness and self practice a fundamental value.

[00:40:47]

That was the one thing that separated me from the rest. What? There's got to be some research out there. That's talks about this, and so I went back to my place and I looked online and sure enough, nothing. There's never been a single study ever done, not one controlled trial ever to investigate the effects of nutrition and early addiction recovery outcomes. And I remember writing in my journal that night how excited I was to discover this and that at this point in time, I'm not prepared to do this research study, but I will.

[00:41:19]

And no joke five years to the month after that. I had decided that. I had built the relationships that I needed to build, I had gone back and studied nutrition, I had been working in clinics and in treatment centers and health care centers long enough. And the first thing I needed to do was find a treatment center that would be willing to run the study. That was very difficult and five years to the month. A treatment center in Austin, Texas, where I was living said we want to give you full control of this study, do it on the population.

[00:41:55]

As long as they willingly accept into the treatments, into the into the study, they can you can run in our population. And I immediately started to contact people in order to do the study. And I knew by my very, very dear friend Tarakan, who was who had just started her PhD work at Northern Arizona University.

[00:42:15]

And her whole focus was something called Psychosocial Health, which is a multidisciplinary PhD in sociology, psychology and nutrition, specifically plant based nutrition. And so I contacted her because she and I have shared a very similar view on self-love, food and recovery. And of course, she said, well, you know, I don't know if I can do this, let me run it by the FDS. And then 12 hours later, they call back and say, yes, we absolutely want to do it.

[00:42:40]

We want to do it exactly the way you want to do it. And we want you to own the study rights just so long as you form a nonprofit that will fund the study. And I was like, all right. Well, I had no idea I'd ever form a nonprofit, but here we go. So I. I found a nonprofit called Plant Base for positive change. We started to design the study. And what we're doing is we are effectively investigating the effect of different dietary protocols on different outcomes, measurable in early addiction recovery.

[00:43:12]

So early addiction recovery is defined by the first twenty four hours after leaving detox through six months. And because we're looking at early addiction recovery outcomes, sobriety isn't one of them. What we're looking at is how does food.

[00:43:28]

Food education, as well as movement and mindfulness. Affect various outcomes of measuring recovery. So we're looking at, yes, various blood biomarkers, like a full lipid panel, high sensitivity, C reactive protein, which is a measurement for inflammation, omega three, which is a measurement that can indicate deficiencies in brain function. We're looking at various vitamin levels, but we're also looking at validated scales of measuring anxiety, depression, self compassion, resilience, spiritual healing, mania and others.

[00:44:05]

And it's also a microbiome study. So we're also looking at how changes in your gut health, the microbiome, this four to six pounds of bacteria that exist within your gut, that that that do functions for you that your body can't do for itself, one of which is the creation of nutrients and molecules that do cross the blood brain barrier that help with the creation of of different neurotransmitters. We're going to look at how all these relate to changes in those validated scales of the mental and psychological health outcomes.

[00:44:38]

And I started to consult with some amazing people, two of which are doctors Deen and Aisha Shirzai. They are the authors of the Alzheimer's Solution, which is, in my opinion, the most comprehensive work I've ever seen on the effects of lifestyle and cognitive longevity. They are the leading thought leaders. They are yet when it comes to cognitive longevity and I had met them at a conference and I went up and asked them if they had any research that I could see.

[00:45:06]

And they gladly they sent me a Google drive full of all of their stuff. And we formed a friendship. And I remember calling them. I said, really appreciate that you're consulting, but I'd be willing to offer you a position as our MDs on the study and gladly pay you. And they said we're going to do it. But only on one condition. I said was that you're not going to pay us a dime. They said it's too important and they're just the most wonderful people.

[00:45:32]

So we have doctors, Dean and Isiah shares. I have completing the study and we have Dr. Frank Cusumano, who is a microbiome specialist. We're using Columbia's wing laboratory to run the sequencing.

[00:45:45]

And it's been an unbelievable journey just to get it was a year and a half of work to get it started. And the study is now seven months in and how long we'll finish at the end of this year. So it's a one year study. And the amazing thing is I can't share specific numbers, but what I can say is that there's two diets that are being studied that control diet is a standard Western diet with slightly elevated.

[00:46:11]

So it is meat, eggs and dairy, but it's a removal of processed foods and the removal of a lot of the inflammatory oils and various other caffeinated beverages.

[00:46:20]

Right. So I think a healthier version of the standard American diet. Exactly. Which is great for the study because you're eliminating some of those reactive constituents for that's going to react to. Many of you who follow me know I've spent most of my life searching for the healthiest foods on the planet. If you look hard enough, there are a few unknown, extraordinary foods around the world that people still don't know about. And a few years ago, I came across my favorite superfood discovery of all time verrucas nuts.

[00:47:06]

When I first tasted them, my eyes lit up. The taste alone just absolutely blew me away. But after sending them to the lab, which I do and getting all the tests, I realized they're the healthiest nuts on the planet like no other nut even compares. They have like an unusually high amount of fiber and they're off the charts in super high antioxidants and have fewer calories than any other nut. Like it's jam packed with micronutrients. But they're not just good for you.

[00:47:41]

They're really good for the planet. Most other nuts require millions of gallons of irrigated water, but verruca trees require no artificial irrigation. Brewskis are truly good for you, good for the planet. And good for the world community. It's a win all the way around, I really think you'll love them. So I'm giving all of my listeners 15 percent off by going to Barracas Dotcom backslash, Daryn. That's B a r u k a s dot com backslash, Daryn.

[00:48:22]

D a r i and I know you will enjoy. And then the treatment diet is an entirely plant based diet that is oil free and no added sugar. And we're also doing nutrition education for both groups. So the control group will get standard áder nutrition education and the treatment group will get plant based nutrition education because we want individuals to have the self efficacy that's gained from knowing what they're doing for their body. And what we discovered is that in every single measurable outcome, the plant based group is doing better.

[00:49:07]

In every single measurable outcome and what I love so much about the fact that this isn't a sobriety study, that we're looking at things that every single human on earth will have to do at some point in their life, which is to face those parts of themselves in the lives that are no longer serving them, have the ability and the fortitude to face it, move through it with grace and create a greater way of living that's more in alignment with their true self.

[00:49:34]

What I love about the studying it on addiction recovery population is that people in addiction recovery are forced to do the work today because tomorrow is a lot less promised than the average individual. And it also adds to the credibility that what we need to start treating is not dependency, because addiction recovery model today is a very dependency based model. Right. Someone comes into recovery and they're addicted to heroin. We'll say to them, your problem is heroin, your problem is heroin.

[00:50:04]

So let us take that heroin away from you. Let us start to investigate why you started using heroin. But please understand your problem is heroin, and it always will be. Get yourself in a program that makes you admit to this broken fact of yourself that you will always have a problem with heroin and then go about your life. That's a that's that's a crude excellent explanation. But it is to some degree. And what we believe and what I have come to believe is that the problem, the substance is a symptom.

[00:50:32]

It's the symptom of being just profoundly disconnected from every meaningful bond in your life. There's a great author out there named Johann Hari, who wrote a book called Chasing the Scream and another one called Lost Connections. And I love what he says about addiction. He said addiction at its core is about not wanting to be present in your life because your life has become too painful a place to be Daryn. If I were to take you now to offer you.

[00:51:01]

A substance or destructive foods, and you were to eat it, it would cause you a Doberman response, that Dobermann response would compel you to do that behavior again, because you have done so much work on yourself, because you have created such a meaningful life for yourself, where you have bonds and connections that you want to show up for. The likelihood that you will say yes when offered again is low. If I were to take it to an individual who is completely separated from meaningful bonds of living and offered them again after one one time, the likelihood that they would say yes is higher.

[00:51:34]

So is the substance the problem or is how we're living the problem? I would say that 80 percent of the issue is really how we're living with ourselves and how we're living with the world around us, not to discount that 20 that other 20 percent, but we have to address what it is to be meaningfully alive as a human first or the rest doesn't work to that is that is so much of.

[00:52:00]

What I believe, but you just said it in a way that is so powerful because I think in our world we want to reduce it down to like, what's the fix? Which then further creates more issues, too, because, number one, you're also looking at in that old model, we're like, we'll take this away. And more likely, because you have all these other disorders, we're going to give you more of these medications. So, again, we're going to further support you're not OK and then they're going to support you're not OK by you admitting you're not OK to all of these disorders.

[00:52:39]

What the hell is that? Right.

[00:52:43]

It's a daily it's a daily acceptance of a narrative that is not true. And I'm not I'm not against medication. Like I was put on a ton of medication when I checked into rehab. And a lot of it served a purpose. But I made sure that I addressed the rest of my life so that at a very there would be a point that would arise where I no longer needed the medication. And I think that medication in that way serves a purpose, we say, look, right now, right now, you're completely dysregulated.

[00:53:09]

Your life makes no sense to you in any meaningful way in your future. You don't understand. We're going to give you some medications to sort of stabilize the situation and then help you address the underlying causes of how to reconnect to those meaningful bonds that were severed for whatever reasons years ago.

[00:53:27]

And because those meaningful bonds are severed, life is too painful. And drugs or food or sex or gambling has become an amazing opportunity for you to escape that pain. That pain exists not because you're not on drugs. That pain exists because you disconnected from what it is to be meaningfully alive.

[00:53:45]

Yeah, and I think I think you're you're spot on in the sense that there's there's an application for some of these protocols. So we don't want up there. We don't want to minimize that, but we don't want to stop there. And so much of our American Medical Association and and all of these things and addictive protocols stop there. And that's why I just want to applaud you. Number one, you have a high class group. It's like there's a funny little moment here because the sures days I reached out to for the show, I wanted to dig into their research because they found unbiassed.

[00:54:22]

Their research was one of the most powerful things you can do for Alzheimer's. Dementia was the right that was based on their based on the research. So and they're incredibly good at scouring research as you as brilliant.

[00:54:36]

I mean, they have two young teenage kids who are in college. So, I mean, like, they're they're the most wonderful, brilliant family I've ever met. They're incredible.

[00:54:47]

I think they have three days between the two of them to. It's unreal. Yeah. Yeah. So we're not talking any slouches there, but so. Yeah, from that perspective, I think I think what you're doing is so great and the fact that, you know, I find this so interesting that you had that epiphany that there was no studies based on what you were talking about. And so, yeah, you have a great story. And there's all these elements to it, too.

[00:55:18]

And and people could listen to your story and just kind of easily blow that off and. Oh, that doesn't apply to me. That's him. But it doesn't apply to me. But what you're doing is you're you're validating it and verifying it in a deeper level through science, through rigor and through. And even beyond that, you're saying like, yes, in the addiction sense, we intimately need the nutrients, the vitality and the and the spokes of the wheel, it's not just one spoke.

[00:55:56]

It's many different aspects to absolutely complete what people believe is atrophied or broken in their life to to raise up those levels of purpose and nutrients and clarity of self that is just so lacking and start to eliminate and address the anger, the shame that that that was so even going back to my father that was refrigerated and carried out. From an idea that was never true to begin with, but was aligned and agreed to on some level as a child, as a as a being, trying to figure out life.

[00:56:48]

It's a weird existence already. And so to the fact is that all of our pain.

[00:56:58]

Comes down to the story that is a lie. I know I honestly believe most of the things I've struggled with in life started the day the world presented me with an opportunity to believe that I needed to be something other than myself in order to be accepted. And I believed it. That's where it all started. And so this idea that we have to become the person we want to be is ridiculous. We're not becoming anything we're remembering. Recovery is a practice of remembering that we've always been everything we've ever needed to be at every single moment in my life, at every single moment in everybody's life.

[00:57:33]

You've always been enough. You've always been worthy. You've always possessed everything you've ever needed to be to live your truest self. Somebody told you differently and you believe them. That's it. That's what I truly believe. And the research that I'm doing right now, it's called the infinite study is is not just that I want to bring light to this, but I've lost 10 friends to suicide and overdose. And these were not just people I knew. These were friends.

[00:58:01]

These were people that I loved and I missed every single day. And I want I want so badly for people who are going through this to know that I don't think the recovery process is broken. I just think it's incomplete. And I want to offer these people just a single extra piece to this puzzle so the road doesn't look as scary. Know there's a little more light on the road ahead of them. And for people who know somebody who's struggling, the best thing you can do to that person, for that person is not try to fix what's going on with them.

[00:58:38]

You know, I know that for me, when I was struggling, when I was in pain, I didn't want answers as much as I wanted someone to sit with me. I wanted someone to come to me and say, I love you. No matter what and if you want me to sit here with you, I will because I love you, that's what any of us can do right now, especially right now with what's going on. You call your friends and you just say, hey.

[00:59:03]

Can I sit with you today? Can I do you want some company? More so than anything, someone who's struggling just wants to know that they have not been forgotten by the world. They want to know that there's somebody out there who sees them as a meaningful part of their life. And when you offer them that opportunity to see that truth, it softens their world and they may ask you to stay a little bit longer and they may ask you for help, they might not.

[00:59:31]

But that day will be different because of your actions. It's flashing me back to the last moments when I was with my father. Everyone was judging him and his life about the stupid shit he was doing, he was doing some crazy shit and this was a brilliant, brilliant guy and an incredible human.

[00:59:59]

And I decided if I'm going to be with them, which is. Limited because I wasn't even living in the same town. I'm just going to accept. Where he's at and just be going to love him anyways, and he's shaking and he's drinking and the first time ever because he was sober for 30 years and he actually so for the people that well, we don't have a video, but the scar on my chin, you see that little scar on my chin.

[01:00:29]

Yeah. So my father did that. He didn't mean to, but he is drunk and he did that to me.

[01:00:35]

So my dad shut the door, he slammed the door and I was sitting facing into the garage and it threw me into a sea of his drink, empty beer bottles, and it cut my chin open at four years old. And that was the moment my father got sober the first time. And the the thing that I realized when seeing and sitting with them, it was hard to do. Without a doubt. You're sitting with someone who's your dad and he's I've never seen him drink.

[01:01:11]

So he's shaking. He's in and out of ten rehabs and he's drinking in front of me. And I just had to accept him. And I'm glad I did because it I didn't see him again. And those moments that you get to be with anybody, whether they're drinking alcohol or doing behavior, that's not good for them. I know that judging them and and being shameful and being abusive is not going to create change for them. It never will ever.

[01:01:53]

They have more shame than you could possibly imagine already.

[01:01:57]

That's exactly what I was thinking, that negative consequences have never asked anybody to change their life. I mean, what negative concept? People who struggle with substance abuse, with addiction, we've experienced more negative consequences in our life than the average person may ever know. We've experienced more shame, more humiliation. If that was enough to change us, we have done it already. We have done it the first time we experienced it.

[01:02:21]

Love knowing that there's somebody waiting for them outside those doors of rehab. When they're done, who's going to welcome them back into their home with loving arms and say, we loved you even when you were using and we're so glad you're back. That is what gets people to change. That is what gives people the confidence that there's a world that has never forgotten them and has wanted them to be a part of it since the day they showed up.

[01:02:46]

Well, it's it's it's it's treating them.

[01:02:50]

It's it's acting and treating them as a complete being, just like we bought into this idea that we're not in some form or fashion. So if we just show up with everybody else, then everyone's got a point of view. Everyone struggling people are doing weird shit right now with this crazy world. And what if we just love them? They're clearly working through their own projected idea of the world and if we love them and accept them. Then at least they're not defensive and fighting and even maybe digging their heels in even more, and and if you love them, there's nothing to bounce off of anymore.

[01:03:34]

There's no more fight. And and everyone's fighting. Everyone's invited. Everyone's well year to believe in this or you believe in that. You either believe in yourself or you don't. Yeah. So why don't you tell people about when the study will be out, how people can support you? Because I know you have this go fund me going on right now. And so I want people to understand that you're supporting.

[01:04:01]

This research that has never been done, that is showing tremendously powerful information about holistically looking at how to change biochemistry in a very powerful way without medication and reductionism and also the window we're seeing this this change, this shift happened in three to ten weeks.

[01:04:30]

So the study will be completed in December and then will probably be another year before we release the manuscript, because we have to do the microbiome sequencing and we have to do all the data analysis and everything like that. So probably another six months to a year before the study, the final study is released. And what's great is that this is a first of its kind study. It's never, ever been done before is so even the control is a first of its kind of research study.

[01:04:55]

So expect seven to 10 research papers coming out of this thing. You can support it by there is a go fund me link where we're asking for donations to help support the cost for the microbiome sequencing because microbiome sequencing is really expensive. Yeah. So it'll be in the show notes. You can follow me at plant based addict. And then I have a website called Plant Base for Positive Change Dog. You can also donate there, if you like, just to support the non-profit, because we are doing we are going to get into doing further research in the plant based world as well.

[01:05:29]

And honestly, I mean, you have is such it is such an honor for me to come on to your show and share this with you, because you're a person who I have looked to as a example of the type of life I want to live and the way that I want to show up compassionately for the world. And I've read your book. I've been following you for years. And so to be here on the show, to share my story with you, to share my passion with you, this is something I'm never going to forget.

[01:05:58]

And I just I'm so humbled by you. And I just want to thank you so much for not just allowing me on the show, but for being that example for me.

[01:06:05]

Well, thank you. And and if this isn't a testament for two people living their life powerfully, then I don't know what is, because you get to resonate and and magnetize your life and creating more of birds of a feather flock together.

[01:06:28]

And and and so it's it's a two way street, my friend. This is I'm just grateful and I'm so touched by your story. And I'm I love I'm a very actionable person. So the fact that you have a place where people can support that's going directly to research, I'm going to contribute. So I dare anyone to to also do that. So I want to I want to continue this and support you. And let's get that number up and let's continue this research and let's bring in more and more information and opportunities for what we can do, because opening your mouth is very important as it relates to whether you're going to feel good or not feel good and to get more attention in this world is necessary so that the conversations that we're not having in this world when we're faced with sicknesses is sickening.

[01:07:33]

And actually, we need to understand that what we're doing affects us right now and and into the future. So eating well and sleeping well and good water and good relationships and a lot of love and a lot of purpose is is medication that we need right now more than ever.

[01:07:56]

And dude inspired myself. I'm stoked. And let's let's just keep this relationship going and let's change the world a little bit at a time.

[01:08:08]

Man, I'm with you on it. One hundred percent. Right, dude, thanks for the what a fantastic episode.

[01:08:17]

So tell me, what is one thing you got out of today's conversation? If this episode struck a chord with you and you want to dive a little deeper into my other conversations with incredible guests, you can head over to my website, Derrinallum Dotcom, for more episodes and in-depth articles. Keep diving, my friends. Keep diving. This episode is produced by my team at Must Amplify, an audio marketing company that specializes in giving a voice to a brand and making sure the right people hear it.

[01:09:05]

If you would like or are thinking about doing a podcast or even would like a strategy session to add your voice to your brand in a powerful way. Go to w w w dot must amplify dot com backslash. Darren that's w w w must amplify dot com backslash Darren.