Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from a Colorado studio, this is the Dave Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and. I'm Chris Hogan, I'm hosting along with me this hour is Dr. John Boloney, and we are very excited to be able to talk to you and about the questions that you have. So here's the deal. Call us. Kelly is standing by, ready to take your call. The number to dial is eight eight eight eight two five five two two five.
Again, that's triple eight eight two five five two two five. We're very excited to be able to talk to you. And the question that's on your mind. John, you are ticking off your own John Deloney show.
We are in it, brother. Chris, you have become official.
You're going to have new episodes every Monday, Wednesday and Friday. That's right. On and on YouTube. And you can hunt down the show anywhere that you listen to a podcast. You're going to get real talk on life relationships as well as mental health challenge.
That's right. We're taking live calls it. It's a it's a good time. And that is very cool. And they'll listen. If you're out there and you're feeling the chaos and the clutter of life and the emotions that it can bring, maybe even battling some depression or even disconnection, it's a time for you to be able to get some clarity, get some guidance. It takes a real man and real woman to reach out for help. And it's good to have those conversations so you can call or email.
John, I want to give you the number. The number to dial is eight four four six nine three three two, not one. That's eight four four six nine three three two nine one. Or you can email ask John at Ramsey Solutions dot com. Very excited for the new show. No, we've kicked it off today. It launched and you've got to be pretty pumped up too.
I'm excited man from a guy who has only listened to two or three podcasts. Pretty much. Not really, but almost. Yeah, it's weird having a podcast. I hope everyone will subscribe to it. I'm not super certain what that even means, but they that's what we need to do, is get on the Internet and subscribe to the YouTube and the podcast.
Well, I definitely want to check it out as well. You can let you all know. You can check out my show as well. The Chris Hogan Show get connected. You can go to Chris Hogan 360 dot com to learn more about it. All right. We're ready to take your calls. We've got Tom on the line and Tom from Indianapolis. How can we help you? Yes, thanks, gentlemen, I appreciate you taking time to take the phone call.
Sure. I have a pretty unique situation and I need some advice, I think, at this point. So I have a daughter who is she's 11 years old right now and she's been through 16 different surgeries over the last decade. And she's and she's got everything from closed syndrome to stage four Realm's cancer. She's relapsed three times. We tried everything from chemo to radiation. So we're kind of at a place where we're out of options. And so she's in clinical trials right now, right up here.
And we've been battling with this for like basically over a decade. And so the the issue is that it's cause obviously a lot of issues financially impacting us over the last ten years and also has caused me to reset life, in a sense, a wife who stepped out on me a few years ago. And so I had to reset life there. And then we had a lot of debt. So that occurred because of the medical situation. Things like that has been ongoing.
I'm remarried today and we've been married for about over a year now. And and so it's that part of life where we're restarting life again. And so I've been through the Dave Ramsey program in the past and but I have always been challenged because of this particular situation. And so on one hand, it's like we I'm familiar with a lot of steps, but it's just daunting because things that are somewhat normal, like the beans and rice diet. Right.
And not going on vacation did not, you know, doing certain things I'm challenged with where is that balance in this kind of situation? Because, I mean, when we're told by her oncologist that we're not really like we're not really sure if she's going to make it to Christmas or her next birthday. We're told that every day, like year after year. And it's just like, good grief, like how do you how do you not, you know, take do those kinds of things like where you can't really plan for the future in a sense, OK.
Yeah, I'm speechless on that, first and foremost, you're talking to to make forget all the money stuff for a second, you're talking to a couple of dads, too, and so a couple of folks who have two of our hearts running around outside of our bodies also.
And so on behalf of dads everywhere, I want to tell you that this sucks. This is not the way it's supposed to be.
And I hate that you're going through this man and you bring up 100 good points.
Starting with the hardest one is how do you how do you even wrap your head around tomorrow when a doctor looks at looks you in the eye and says this may be it, today may be at the next day and maybe maybe at the next day or so, first and foremost, until you tell.
I'm sorry, man. And our thoughts and our prayers are with you and with your family, with your new marriage and with that baby girl of yours.
Well, Tom, I think my friends. Yeah, my heart goes out to you. And I think first and foremost, what you have to do is to almost reset for yourself. Nobody should ever have to process and hear the information. You've had to hear and hear that information from doctors at any point. But I think as you talk about moving forward in your life and resetting, I think it is a matter of really acknowledging and looking at what it is you're going to do, what your new normal going to look like.
And I think that's a matter of taking some things day to day, but at the same time being able to give yourself some things to look forward to. You have spent the last eight to 10 years kind of on hold and in this pattern. And I think, you know, it's going to be important for you to be able to reach out, get connected probably with a therapist, to be able to process your emotions and what it is you're feeling.
And as far as the the the individual side of being around some guys where you can be a man, you can be a dad whose heart hurts and figuring out kind of what's next. And it might be a matter of doing some marriage counseling with your new wife to be able to unpack and look at some of the old scars and things so we don't let old hurt do new harm to your new day. And I think those are things that as you talk about them and you're upfront and open, it gives you an opportunity to begin to process some things that seem unfathomable.
Right. So I'll even go one step further. The last 10 years, Tom, your life hasn't been on hold.
It's been in hell. It has been absolute hell. And to call it anything less than that is to not do justice to the situation. You, your ex-wife, your new wife and your baby girl are going through and the other kids you've got involved.
I think the harsh reality and I commit to to always tell them the truth. So the the harsh reality you have, Tom, is that the doctors are telling you that your baby girl is not going to be with you much longer.
And so there is a financial reality to that. There's a relational reality to that. And so, as Chris said, surround yourself with a money professional, surround yourself with a marriage professional, and surround yourself with a community of people that you can be whole with it you can grieve with and you can flat be broken with, because for the last decade you've walked around, you've been the muscle and the iron in the steel, and that's going to crack in half if you don't have a group of people that you can let that out.
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Hello, everyone. This is the Dave Ramsey Show, XO Good them hosting along with me is John Boloney and we are excited to take your calls. I want to let you know, I know there are been a lot of things going on this year. Your emergency fund may be getting low, but I want you to hear me loud and clear. No matter what happens, do not catch out your 401k. Yes, the government passed the stimulus bill earlier this year that lowered the 401k withdrawal penalties, got rid of it.
But I want you to hear me. Do not take money out of your 401k. Your forward K is not there for emergencies, is not there to pay off debt. It's not even there to help your kids get through college. It's there for one reason and one reason only. And that's for your future. The only time you should even think about touching for one key is to avoid a bankruptcy or foreclosure. Let me repeat, the only time you would consider starting your 401k with an early withdrawal is to avoid a bankruptcy or a foreclosure.
And that's only after you've exhausted your emergency fund as well as other options. Otherwise, tighten up your budget, pause the baby steps, take care of the four walls, find some part time work, but don't trade in your future for for some quick money. And if you've already withdrawn money from your 401k an opt out, some people call in on my show. But Chris Okonjo and tell me so well, it's time to turn it around and say never again, never again.
Like cash out my 401k for a temporary emergency and it's not too late for you to change your future. Your first step is to find someone that will hold you accountable and guide you in long term investing. You need someone like a smart Vesterbro to go to Dave Ramsey dot com slash Smart Vestor and we'll help you find a financial advisor in your area today. Again, that's Dave Ramsey, dot com slash smart investor. You've got a great opportunity to be able to locate someone that can guide you.
You can also find him at my website. Krischan 360 dot com click on the dream team button. Get someone in your corner that you can have a conversation with about your dreams, your goals, and to help guide you. It's so vital and so very important. All right. We're going back to the phones. We've got Caitlin on the line in California. Caitlin, how can we help you?
Hi. Thank you for taking my call. I have a financial question where I'm going to be forced into my dad, my husband and I, we were really good. We kind of didn't. We did baby step one. And we were doing baby steps for a while. But we kind of because of everything going on, we both stood up our emergency funds to about three months versus just the thousand. And so we are now in a position, though, unfortunately, I will have to be going into a surgery and get medical expenses and my insurance does not cover it because I need a specialty doctor.
So I'm going. I'm looking. We're looking at about between 10 to upwards of 20000, maybe a little bit more medical debt. And so the only debt that we actually possess now is on 12000 in personal loans in the sense where we had credit card debt and we started to fix it. We put in a consolidation with a very low rate to be able to mitigate interest. And we've been good on that. Don't have credit card debt now. And we have about 3000 left on our car, which is only like one hundred and fifty dollar monthly payment.
And it's actually paid off until May. So we've been pretty good. And so my question is we have this three month emergency fund, which is about twelve thousand dollars. And so we're kind of juggling. Do we just keep going on the medical debt or do we liquidate potentially our emergency fund, but we still have debt anyway after we liquidate. So we don't know how to balance that.
Caitlin, I'm sorry to hear about the surgery. Obviously, when you start to get into medical and health issues, there's a lot involved emotionally, psychologically. So my prayers are with you as well as your health. Tell me this. What's your all's household income? So our household this year, we probably will break maybe one hundred thousand dollars. I just had to leave my job. No, we should break more than that, probably around 120 human cells so it can fluctuate.
OK, but I was making sexy, but I just lost my job because of my health. And I just I it wasn't a good fit. So I left my job and but he he has a job that's able to cover basically our basics, you know, a roof over our head and a minimal debt payment.
But you are able from a health standpoint, you are able to work.
Yeah, I'm looking at new jobs, so I don't anticipate for I am perfectly qualified, I will have a new job within the month. I'm not worried about that. And so I guess we're projected to do about 120 gross and maybe take home 70 of that.
OK, so what's your question? You want to know, should you use your emergency fund to be able to pay for the surgery? I would say no, because you want to keep that cushion right. And you're not going to be able to have it outright. Is your husband's job stable? It is they like you will have it. It is the influx of like how much money comes in per month. I think the Wellman's, he's doing a lot better now.
I think the Romans are about thirty five hundred take and his last month was really good. Almost 6000 take home. So just without. I had the steady job and without that you know we wanted that emergency fund for if anything goes wrong and to pay for like the beginning appointments of this medical office because it's like seven hundred dollars per consultation or appointment. OK.
You were kind of hoping for that. Do you have any children? No, and we don't plan on, OK, you don't have a future expense. OK, and how long will it take for you to recoup from this surgery? Have you heard?
So it's going to be like depending on depending on what they do, it can take anywhere from a couple of weeks to a month. How ever I should be up and walking after a couple of weeks. It just might like I'm in for right now and probably after the surgery, I have to go once or twice a week for physical therapy. OK.
And you guys are coming. Are you on your husband's insurance?
No. So we actually both have individual plans because I needed a very good health insurance. So I pay five hundred dollars a month. And then he also he pays five hundred dollars a month for health insurance.
Well, it's not very good if you if you paid extra for it. They take care of your health and it didn't cover that. You need it.
It is good. But they don't have the specialist at that hospital. And for what I have, you have to have that particular like a very good specialist to go in to basically cut you open.
You take all my co-pays or ten bucks.
Have you talked to them about a surgery cash option? And this constantly well, we're at. Yeah, and I've heard of of surgeries being done at 50 percent at 35 percent off the cost, a tremendous discount.
If you walk in and they will push you around and they'll say, well, you know, say I want to speak to the hospital administrator and say, I want a cash option, I'll give you a a check in writing.
They'll tell you with the cash option would be and you may be surprised at how long you can get the cost of the surgery. Doesn't hurt to ask. Doesn't hurt to ask. It really doesn't.
I used to do that when I didn't have insurance. I haven't talked to this yet.
There's not a chance in the world I wouldn't have that conversation. All the current the worst I can tell you is no. The best they can tell you is yeah. Will knock ten grand off if you pass up. Right.
And even if katleen if even if you hear. No I would still only hear. Not yet. That's right. That's, that's the the thing there. But you know, prayers go out to you with this in talking about it, obviously you're not dealing with something that is an elective surgery. It is necessary. I want to send you to Dave Ramsey about comps. You can get connected to one of our insurance LPs just so they're able to thumb through.
Look at this and understand what it is you're doing. And the best option in approaching this, whatever you're talking about, dealing with your health, obviously, we're not trying to belabor anything or put anything off the mindset around. It is going to be, obviously, if you have to take on this debt to get the surgery, what the mindset of attacking to get it out of your life. But you're going to have to to to to be living as you're recuperating two months to two weeks to a month.
So, you know, you want to go into this with your eyes wide open. Please get with that insurance help so you can see all the duct tape, make sure all the I's are dotted, T's are crossed, and you could feel clear about your path. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. A business owners and anyone who has to talk with customers often listen up. You are the backbone of this freaking economy. And just by staying open to serve your community, you're providing hope to your customers.
That's why my friends at podium want to do something special for you. They're offering you the opportunity to text your customer base for free. So sign up at Podium Dotcom now and join our crusade to communicate, connect and spread hope. That's podium dot com.
Everyone, you are listening to The Dave Ramsey Show, I'm Chris Hogan and hosts along with me this hour standalone as we take your questions on life and money. Want you to know we are excited to talk with you as always. And again, want to remind you, if you are in the area to come by, we'd love to be able to see you here. As we do the show, we've got Baker Street Cafe over there. Miss Melissa is willing to help you and give you some of the baked goods that she's got.
We've got our obviously the bookstore over there where you can peruse and see the books and things that we have going on, but we'd love to be able to see you. And just it's so exciting to see people live on the debt free stage celebrating their momentum and their focus. And just want you to know you can come by and do the tour and walk around at any point in time. We'd love to see you. All right. We'll get back to the phones.
We've got William on the line in Fort Collins, Colorado. William, how are you?
Good. How are you doing in person? My call today. Oh, buddy. We are focused and not finished. Finish what's on your mind.
Awesome. So I just have a quick question about my investing. I'm currently on baby steps for also trying to slowly save for a down payment on a house. Mm hmm. My question is, once I reach my six thousand dollar max as far as investing my 15 percent income, should I just keep the rest of that into mutual funds or is there something else that I can be or is recommended to be investing into as far as retirement goes? Or should I be putting that towards saving for that down payment on a house once they reach that 6000 amax?
OK, so here are a couple of things that we do, William. So in talking about this, we talk about the home down payment as baby step three B, so that's after you get your fully funded emergency fund. What you would do is then focus on the home down payment. Once you get that in place, then you could move to investing. So it sounds like you were already investing on baby step for. Yes, sir. OK, so in that mindset, as you look at this, it would be a matter of you determining, all right, what's the range of home that I'm looking to do, run a minimum down payment of 10 percent?
I'd prefer to have 20. So you get avoid PMI, which is private mortgage insurance. But you looking at that and understanding, OK, how much, you know, would that 10 percent look like? And so you could pause the investing to get to that or, you know, it's your call, but it's clearer and more simply just to get to that number and have it just over in the money market account. OK. OK, makes sense.
Yeah, of get that down payment, think that it is quicker than it would if I were to come back. Right.
And then here's the thing, William. People have told me, well, Chris, it might be five years before I look to buy. Well, if that's the case, then maybe you look at putting it in a growth stock mutual fund, you know, if it's going to be there for five years or more. But if it's the likelihood of you buying a home in less than five years, I wouldn't invest it. I would just sit it over in the money market account, let it sit there.
You know, it's there. There's no risk being taken with it and you can get to it when you get ready. But that's kind of the mindset around that in that flow and in that system. And so for people that are new out there, when we talk about baby steps, that's our road. That's our roadmap. That's the recipe for how you can get to from being eyeballs up to the eyeballs in debt to some freedom and amazing giving.
Baby step one is saving a thousand dollars, baby. Step two is where you list out your debt, pay it off of the debt snowball. Smallest to biggest. We're going to attack and get some momentum, baby. Step three is where you have the fully funded emergency fund of three to six months of expenses sitting in a money market account and then baby step for five and six. You're going to do these all at the same time. Baby step four is investing 15 percent of your income, baby.
Step five is saving for college, baby step six, paying off the house early and then baby step seven, building wealth and doing the greatest thing you could ever do with money that's give. And so if you're out there and you're sick and tired of being sick and tired, I want to encourage you to get plugged in to this roadmap, to this process. It will help you change the game. You can go to Dave Ramsey Dotcom. We've got Ramsey Plus, which is an incredible opportunity for you to get plugged in, to get community tools as well as tracker.
All you have to do is text the word trial to three three seven eight, nine. Hear me text the word trial to three three seven, eight, nine. And you can get jump started over there into Ramsey. Plus right now, tools tracking as well as community and connection. I'm telling you people, it's a game changer and it'll help you turn things around. All right, let's get to the phones. We got Morris on the line in San Diego.
Marissa, how are you? I'm good, how are you? Oh, focus and not finish what's on your mind? I was wondering, I'm currently active duty and I was wondering about buying a home, using the VA loan. This is renting and using the housing allowance to pay off that.
OK, so how long have you served? Five and a half years, I know. Wow, thank you for your service. What branch are you in? I'm in the Navy, OK, and and do you know how much longer are you thinking about serving? I actually am getting out next July. OK, so next July.
And so are you looking to buy in California, Colorado, where you think it? Yes, around the area. OK, as you get out, do you know what you're going to be doing? Gone to school full time and I should still be receiving the housing allowance. OK, so you're going to go to school full time. Here's the mindset around it. As you look at this, I want you to be very careful, OK? I mentioned a couple of things.
The rates I know VA loans are set up to be able to help our veterans. And, you know, I acknowledge it. But I'm going to tell you, rates a conventional loan is going to be better than a VA loan, the interest rate wise. And it's not going to have some of the loopholes and fees associated with it. But I don't want you to buy it until you're ready to buy.
OK, and so what I mean by that is, are you planning to be are you staying in the California area? Yes. OK, and how long do you plan to be in that area after you get out of the military? So my husband will be attending grad school and we he'll be in school for the next three years. OK, so and I'm assuming I'll get done with school in the next year or so. Probably the next five at the least.
OK. All right.
So look at it. That and do you all have any other debt that you owe? We bought a car last year, and then we just have his student loan debt now. OK, how much student loan debt does he have?
At the end of grad school, he should have about 60, OK? OK. And is he in the military as well? No, he's OK. All right, so here's the deal, I tell people, Marissa, you want to buy a home when the time is right. People will tell me what, Chris, the market is doing this or interest rates don't care. Don't care. What I worry about is your positioning, meaning are you ready?
Because if you buy one before it's time, it's more of a curse than it is a blessing. That's right. It adds stress to your situation. So I would want you guys to get out of debt, build up a fully funded emergency fund event, save for the home down payment. And you know, John, it sounds like a broken record, but the recipe works.
And it's so tempting to be in the military and to think you're doing something patriotic, to think, man, this is the easiest path.
And what a conventional loan does is it puts a hurdle in front of you. You shouldn't get into a house unless you've got that 10 percent down, that 20 percent down.
And it feels good to just be able to slide on in there. But also, you find yourself with realtor fees are upside down in your own house.
That's a scary place to be right now. It really is.
Save the money. Do it the slow right way. There's no shortcuts. And I know there's all these programs out there. There's no shortcuts. Just do it the right way.
Yeah. And listen, for people that are out there that are renting it, renting allows you to time. It allows you time to either save up money to recoup, regroup. It's not a negative. And so, you know, you got to be clear about where it is you're going and what you're doing, especially in the California market where, my goodness, they charge you for air out there. It's crazy.
And I rented it some I rented the last few years. That's two and a half years I've been renting. So it's it's a part of life. I got two little kids and they had a great life. Yeah. My wife had a great I mean, we all did great.
And so there's just seasons we're in. Slow down, save your money, do it the right way. There's no shortcuts that the tortoise always wins.
Yeah. Actually, here's what I want you to do. I want you guys to get over into Ramsey Plus and text the word trial to three three, seven, eight, nine. I actually forget that. Let's give it to him, Chris.
Or that. Let's give let's. Good call. Let's have let's give Marissa this. Give it to him. Let's give it to like a year of RAMSI.
Plus. Good job. I'll get your debit card before we go. That's right. That's OK. But no, I think that's a great idea. A risk I want you and your husband to plug in. Every dollar will help you guys on from the budgeting side of it. But being able to look and get together on it. And again, thank you for your service to our country, but I want you guys to get on a game plan that's going to lead you to a destination worth traveling.
And you can do this and we're glad to help. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Hello, everyone. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. I'm Chris. Then hosting with me is John Delany. We're excited to take your questions as well as your calls. Just want to remind everybody that John has got launched his first ever, the Dr. John Delany's show, new episodes every Monday, Wednesday and Friday on YouTube. And anywhere that you listen and podcasts, you can find him at John Deloney on social media.
I want to encourage you to not only get plugged in with him, but also call it, if you've got questions, relationship issues, things that are on your own mind that are that as you deal with family or co-workers, it's a great opportunity to be able to have an outlet to reach out, to communicate about what's on your mind and get some guidance. Right. The worst thing we can do is to isolate and to compartmentalize. We need to open up, get the right kind of guidance, get people around you that care about you.
You need to call and check in on the show. All right. Let's get back to the phones. We've got oh, let's see here. We've got some special guests on the line. I got Thomas and Marissa. How are you? Well, how are you doing? Oh, we're doing great. It's great to be able to hear you guys tell me where you're calling from. Eagle, Colorado, Denver, Colorado, now, you guys are just on here because you have a question, you actually aren't here to make a statement and a celebration, just a debt free call, correct?
Me, we are having a terrible time here and you guys, can you guys get closer to the phone? Yep, OK, they're good. Marissa, can you get closer? Yep, yep, that's right. So tell us, how much debt did you guys pay off? So 100 and 7000 is nine hundred and seven thousand dollars in 12 months. Oh, 20 and 20, OK, 28 months. What was the hundred and 7000? What kind of debt was that?
We had 81000 in school and 26000 of Carlia. Wow. OK, what's the student loans? Was it both of you? One of you tell us. That was both of us then, the car loans was both of us as well. OK, so what happened?
What caused you guys to get serious about attacking debt and not just letting it hang around?
Well, you know, the thing was, when I was little, you know, I used to work for Dave Ramsey's name on Ramsey and the truck when I was riding with my dad. Right. And, you know, a co-worker told us a little bit about his debt free journey and he actually gave us the book Total Money Makeover. Huh?
And, you know, I ended up reading it one night, probably one of the most I've read and in one day and decide to go from there. OK.
Thomas Amaris, a bootleg and total money makeover, paying it off.
And this morning he said, we're going to eat. I knew that it was the real deal. Yes.
You guys got serious about this. So what was the biggest sacrifice, Marissa, you all made in this journey? I think the biggest sacrifice was just really prioritizing what we wanted to do. You know, we had to say no to, you know, going out as much and some trips here and there, but we really prioritize that throughout the two years. That is good.
Thomas, what about for you? What was your biggest sacrifice? Yeah, I think the biggest sacrifice was just, you know, I loved seeing, like our savings account. So I think your sacrifice was just, you know, we're in this for the long run here. We can sacrifice a couple of things here. And they're going out and on a few trips here and there. Right. For the long run for both of us, for our marriage and just for our long term financial journey.
That is fantastic. What was you all's household income. So we started off at about 140000, OK? That time I took a pay cut and dropped down to about 110000 household income. OK. And then we ended around 200000 towards the end.
Wow. OK, so you guys did a little bit of a roller coaster there, but you attacked it. You got intentional. Who were your biggest cheerleaders throughout this process?
Cheerleader's was definitely my co-worker, Josh, the sadness to Josh, but also family and friends. We had a lot of friends from our church group supporting us as well. That's fantastic. While we're seeing the pictures of you guys, I'm so proud of you, so I want you to do it. Let's go. Yes, I want to count it down. I want to hear a debt free scream. We've got Thomas Morissa in Denver, Colorado, had paid off over a hundred and seven thousand dollars.
Income range fluctuation from 140 to 110 to then. Now 200000 eliminated student loan debt, eliminated two cars. Thomas, MRSA, count it down. Let's hear a debt free scream.
You're free. Wow.
Oh, great job, you guys. I'm going to tell you something. I'm hearing that that never, ever gets old because what you have are people that were committed and focused and intentional on making sacrifices to make some great things happen.
And here's the thing. I don't know why it works this way, but it always seems to work this way. When you're making sacrifices, you may see in your debt free journey, you may see your income dip. You may see see your your relationships get rattled him. But he dropped, what, forty thousand dollars and then suddenly finds it. Serj another seventy. Right. His marriage is great. His kids are going to come into the world and never know six figure shackles.
Oh yeah. Oh I like the way you put that. They're never going to know. They're going to have to do parents who are free as a bird who are investing in them with their time and their energy and their money.
Well and typically people will think oh my gosh, it's not possible. They can't do it. Yes, you can. And it's just a matter of zeroing in and being committed to it, not just making a one time decision, but it actually becomes a daily decision. You have to keep yourself motivated. I love it.
I love it. I love it. I'm proud of you guys, Thomas. I'm really proud.
Well, have done a fantastic job. Well, I want to share the scripture with you today. This is from Titus 2007. Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works and in your teaching, show integrity and dignity. The quote is from Donald again. And leadership is an action, not a position that is absolutely powerful.
As you look at this, we talk about leadership. We help businesses all around the country. We've got the NRA leadership brand. If you are a leader or a manager or someone that's trying to grow as an owner, want to remind you to get plugged into that brand so you can start to see and understand what it is to do and the exact steps to be able to take. You don't have to lead alone. And it's important to understand what you can do to get some guidance.
Chris, just taking this moment for a shout out what somebody who taught you leadership who's who is somebody who's leaned into your life and taught you how to be.
Without a doubt, I would say Coach Kevin Donnelly was my head coaching and football. Yeah. Which was an amazing man, just to be able to see how he not only connected with us, his team members, but watching him interact with his coaches. He empowered people. He believed in you. And it was amazing just to see how he could connect with everybody because he had a genuine care for people. He just.
What about you, man? I've got so many, including my dad and several of my bosses. One that pops into mine is Randall DeMent. Another one pops in mind, us, Jean-Noel Thompson, guys who, like you said, we're both great husbands and they were great dads in their own right. But then they leaned over and said, I'm going to invest in you, John, inside and outside of the workplace.
And they quietly pulled me aside, held me accountable, said, hey, that's really a stupid way to say that. Right. And or that's not what leadership looks like. Leadership is the hard, hard stuff behind closed doors and nobody's watching.
And those the investments those men put in my life, man, I could just go on Christmas and Jim Stewart, I could go on for days and days and days. Steve leaned into me and and taught me what leadership looks like.
Dude, you and me both as I start thinking. The coaches, Ernie Horning, Dave Campbell, Bruce Owens, Bill Cronon. I mean, you can just go on and on, but it's awesome when people take the time to invest in you. And that might be a conversation. It could be having a cup of coffee. So I want to encourage you out there. One of the things to do is whenever you kind of feel like things are tough for you, make sure you take an outward look, find some people to invest and find some people they you can mentor up or down.
It doesn't matter the age or the stage. It's just about the heart. Well, listen, I want to thank producer James Childs, associate producer Kelly Daniel. I want to thank all of you America for tuning in. I want to thank Dr. John Delaney for hanging out with me. It was good to hang out with you and also with you, man. Thanks, Chris. Absolutely. And until next time, remember, stay up, stay focused, stay positive.
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