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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the car rental studios. It's the Dave Ramsey Show where dad is dumb. Cash is king and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. My co-host today, Anthony O'Neal Ramsey, personality number one, best selling author and host of The Table, a very popular YouTube show that we have now just also started putting out as a podcast two weeks ago. And I actually listen to about half of today's podcast on my walk this morning.


And the table is a thing where you guys come together and you bring different people to the table for discussions on different topics. Yeah, and you're a good interviewer. Oh, man. Learning of the best from Kencho. Me. Yeah.


Yeah, I can spend a little training just working. I mean, you're good. I was listening this morning. You're pulling ideas and probing deeper out of the panel. You've got the panel you had today is on Black History Month. Yes, sir. And actually that's how the whole thing started, didn't it?


It is. It is. It started last year of just really just for all the racial blowup. Yes. And thankfully, it did happen before that. But just really having a conversation, just understanding you were having a conversation before everybody started telling us to have a conversation.


Yes, I really was. And I'm grateful. You know, this this week's podcast is just really just asking some questions. Just really get in the minds of other young African-Americans, the older African-Americans and pastors and young millennial millionaires from Michigan and Pastor Weston. And so just a great conversation. The last week they we had Matthew McConaughey, and that was a great interview because I was kind of like celebrity stoked for there for a little bit, you know, because one of my favorite movies is Lincoln Lawyer.


So they have him. And then followed by this week with the Black History Panel. I'm just grateful to have the podcast.


It's a different discussion.


You can ask the exact same questions of the exact same group at that table on racial issues a year later and get completely different answers now. Absolutely. There's a different level of. I don't know, people have spent more time thinking about it, thoughtfulness. Yeah, different level of anger. Yes, a different level of pride. Yeah, yeah, yeah.


You know, I was thinking that when I was listening to it walking this morning because last year was so. Yeah. They were so open handed and so amazing. And these guys are so articulate this morning. They're very it's a very good panel you put together. Very good. Very good. And here's the thing, you know is six different people with six different opinions and age group and age groups.


18 year old up to probably, I guess, Minyon Mingyong opinions, what, in her 50s, probably late 40s, late 40s, late 40s and so. No, you're right, Dave. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Young 50s. I'm sorry, but she's she's brilliant. And even here's the thing. Some of the things on there, I was like, we could talk more about this, but, you know, I really want to give everyone that just the space to say what they were thinking.


What they were feeling is very real, a little real, very real. And that's the whole point of the podcast, because we don't just talk about racial stuff. I want to be sure that's very clear.


Well, yeah, this week is Black History Month. So you're covering it. But that's how I got the whole thing got started. Then you've done everything. I mean, you've had everybody on on all kinds of subjects. Yes. Dating. Yes. Relationships, success, money.


Yeah. You know, obviously we cover money. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.


And I think at this podcast they've got to have a real relevant and relatable conversation around relationships, finances and success. That's the main part for me. I want to help young people, not just young people, but all people really get the true mindset on how to really become wealthy, how to build true wealth and how to build healthy relationships. That's the main goal of of the show.


Yeah. You know, and certainly the racial discussion fits into that. It does it without a doubt. That's for and I got to say, I mean, I was gonna say this ad on Ayers, I think you and our team for even supporting me and allow me to do that, because it's a conversation that needs to be had and off. Er you and I have some good healthy conversations and and I just love that we can do that here and put that out there to just really bring love and hope to both blacks, whites, Hispanics, Jews, you name it.


Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Well that's what supposed to be. Yes sir.


I mean and it just you kind of got to work at it. Yeah. Because you've got to work past your own junk. Yeah. You know, and your own background. Your own upbringing. Yeah everybody does. Yeah. And because you got your own thing you came out of and that means that you know, you don't know those other people that other church are actually saved.


They're going to heaven too. Right. We thought only our bunch was going though.


And then you got to work your way through. You found out. Oh my goodness. People over there with that.


Branda Yeah. They're and they're going to heaven to who knew. Yeah. You know, and so, yeah, it's it's very interesting to get into, into and so it's called the table and you can watch it on YouTube.


I recommend watching it, but I consume a lot of stuff as a podcast because I'm moving so much. And so I love the fact we've got everything on podcast now and again.


It started at this time last year and you're going to find a vast array of subjects being discussed by by some people who will challenge you. Yeah, whatever the subject is, they change. You might not agree. Yeah, they challenge. And if you if you agree with everything you listen to, you know, you need get out more, though.


That's true, Dave.


I mean, one of my goals here is piss people off and I'm good at it. Well, we all we all are. But, you know, at day one thing I learned on this panel was that there is a difference between that younger generation in that older generation and how we think. And you will see that in the panel, that the younger people were thinking a little different about the racial issues. Yeah, OK. Then passed a lesson and Minyon and and I got to watch him kind of educate the younger people on why they change their thinking and that I was very pleased to see that.


And it just helped me know what I need to be doing more often on my show.


What was always one of the things you notice that you said they the older generation would be what they would be more what not blaming, just to be transparent, not blaming white people, OK, and not saying I was not the part I listen to Manang.


Of course, minorities are uber successful. Yes. Million dollar. Yes. Organization has grown from nothing has grown a business. One of the best cupcakes in the world is literally made here in Tennessee by her right menu on French wine. You need to look her up. She's a she's an incredible entrepreneur and she bootstrapped that thing completely. So she does not allow you to make excuses based on the color of your skin. Absolutely. You can't blame it on nobody else.


It's your fault. Cannot. And she brings that she godmamma you. She she really did love her. And she she says now, we can't say that we cannot we can't play the victim. And she really wasn't true or not. Exactly. There's no it doesn't benefit you. I heard her talking that through. That was very interesting. And I love that.


And I hope that younger people see it in. They're challenged by it because it's a conversation they needed to be had. Yeah, and I'm just grateful to have it.


Well, and it's it's you know, it's eye opening to you get to hear a different tone and a different look. So check it out, guys. It's challenging you. That's what we're here for. We want you to think about things and grow and be better.


If you're the same person next year you are. This year we failed our goals mess with you and one hundred percent of growth is uncomfortable.


Yeah, me too. You know, me too. The only growth it's not uncomfortable is getting fat. That's the only one. The rest of them are uncomfortable. And so, you know, the rest have everything else we do. You know, if I'm going to lose weight, if I will get in better shape, if I'm going to, you know, have a better spiritual walk, have better race relations, if I'm going to understand what some I've been through that I hadn't been through on either side of any equation, if I'm going to get out of debt, it's going to be uncomfortable.


Yes, it's an uncomfortable process. And we're here to walk with you through that discomfort because we want you to win. Very cool. The Table with Anthony O'Neal podcast, YouTube. Any way you want to consume it, you need to check it out. And particularly this week's episode. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Not only do I.D. thieves commit crimes related to financial fraud, but now we have to deal with home title fraud, thieves are using your personal information to take ownership of your home so they can take out loans and you end up with a pile of debt and foreclosure notices.


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Folks, 20, 20 was absolutely nuts, you're 20, 20 taxes may be a bit more complicated because of it. First off, if you do have unemployment, keep in mind this is taxable. Unemployment checks are taxable income. Another big thing to keep in mind is remote working. If you left your resident state to work remotely from another state, you might have income tax in that state.


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No spaces two three seven eighty nine. Anthony ONeil Ramsha personality is my co-host today. AJ is in Bloomington, Illinois. Hi A.J.. How are you.


Hey, great. How's it going? Better than we deserve. What's up?


Yeah, well, I just wanted to say God is good and he's listening. That's all I want to say. I'm 51 years old and seven days and lost my job two weeks ago. And so I've got two kids in college. I was 100 percent invested in my 401k and my Roth IRA. I got some debt. This so laid myself out and prayed this morning and was gone through YouTube and hit reset. That came up as a little tab on the thing over there when I was looking at investing stuff.


So I lost your research program and I'm like, Oh, I think I'm going to call the program and see if I can get through and see what he thinks about what's going on with me. So. And you guys. Sorry, I am. That's amazing.


Yeah, that's just. Oh God, no. He's there and he's listening to me and I'm a little humbled, but I'm also scared out of my mind to go to probably tell by my voice. Me too. So so as I said so I worked for twelve years, I was a hundred percent invested and I had a three year annual rate of return of around eleven point five five. I'm coming back. So I basically had about three hundred and twelve thousand dollars total for retirement.


But I also have about one hundred thousand dollars worth of debt that, you know, with this research thing, I'm really starting to think I've got fifteen good years left. How do I want to spend know. I mean, so I'm thinking even though it's painful to take a hit to, to take one hundred and twenty grand out of the four one Kay Roth IRA to get rid of all the debt and try to move forward in something that I can be happy with and excited about, I guess.


What did you used to make. Well, it's fluctuated, I'm in the auto industry, I was in sales starting out. I mean, what do you make last year?


What do you make last year? Eighty nine thousand, that's a pretty typical year. That's about average what you doing something about finance and insurance. OK, good.


And so it's not like a car dealer. Exactly. Right now.


OK. Did you ever sell cars? I did not.


And that's actually did better when I was a salesperson than I did. That's what I was thinking about. But there was a there was a reason why I dropped back. My son going to college is one of the colleges up in upstate New York that needs based and to try to help out. No, I thought maybe take a step back and try something new to get myself a little bit more versed in the rest of the car industry and learn it all, you know what I mean?


And so I took a step backwards and went backwards in pay and I had things under control. But you know what he did with everything else? Yeah, well, exactly right. Then called it happened. And sales are down by 40 percent across the board. And so changes get made. And so are you.


Hey, are you are you looking are you saying that you're retiring? As far as I know? No. He's looking for another job right now.


Of course, that's why I'm in the middle of looking for another job. But I mean, my biggest question is, I know I just got this. Like you said, I just want to say no and I want to be able to, you know, when I get to the point, be able to be that guy that CNN, you know, in a line. And if somebody needs help, I mean, I'll pay for it.


You know, you're a good man. Yeah. Let me tell you what I heard. OK. This. Losing this job hurt you emotionally. And you're still trying to get your feet back under you.


It's still real fresh and you're still trying to feel like you again right now. And we tell folks not to cash out retirement, to pay off debt unless it's to avoid bankruptcy or foreclosure, because you're going to give the government too much money and you're eating it up. It would feel really good right now while you're hurting. And trying to get your get your feet moving again to have no debt, and I can understand how you'd gravitate towards that and I want you to be out of debt.


I mean, you watched this what we do, we teach people how to get out of debt.


I think you're going to get another job and I think you're going to be making one hundred and twenty a year. And I think if you paid thirty, ah, forty thousand dollars a year, you're going to be debt free in two years and some change without messing up your retirement plan. Yeah, OK, but right now, while you're still trying to get your breath after you got throat punched. It's hard to believe that, but I can sit on the outside of your pain and look at you and go, this is a guy consistently made in the six figure range and can pretty much do it on recall.


I mean, the biggest problem with the auto industry is not that cars aren't selling, it's that they are selling and they're not making them.


Yes. Yeah. You can't get inventory. No, that's the problem they've got.


I mean, everybody I know in that world, the boat world, the the recreational vehicle world, the car world, they can't get inventory and stuff. So they've had record sales, but they can't get that. And so that's why sales are off 40 percent. It's not because nobody buys thinking car. They're buying them off. You can't keep them. And the buddies that I've got that own car dealerships are they had some some of them had the best year of their lives last year till they ran out of cars.




And so I think you're going to you're a guy that is the groove in your brain. The rhythm of your life is right around the six figure mark.


And I think if you turn the heat up on that just a little bit, because you've got a really big exciting why is I want to be out of this debt so I'm not vulnerable. The next time somebody comes along, tries to pull crap like this, I'll be a little bit more independent from a financial standpoint. I'll be that third pig. And I think that's where you're headed. So the answer to your question, sir, is. I understand you're hurting, don't use that part to make this decision, do not cash this out.


Get back on your feet, get moving, go to Ken Coleman Dotcom, get Ken Coleman stuff that we've got on career. Start feeding your spirit again. I'm talking to a guy who has the ability in the next 90 days to land one hundred twenty thousand dollars a year type position.


I agree. Don't you think?


I absolutely do do, Dave. The key word here is patience. Just just patience and believing by believing patience. And don't respond off of your emotions right now.


When somebody calls you baby ugly, it's hard. And I think they're ugly for a few minutes when they look at you and go, you're not worthy to throw a punch. You're out of here. I'll knock the crap out of you. It's hard to it's hard to get right back on your feet.


But the thing I know about guys that are wired like you, A.J., because I grew up in sales my whole life I've been in it is I know a guy who can move stuff around like that and can cause a transaction to occur at a level where they're making 100 hundred, 120.


Once you've ridden that bike, you know how to ride it. Yep. And I will be shocked if you're not back on that bike soon as long as you believe that you can still ride the bike. Yeah. Now, if you think I'll never be able to do it again, then you guess what? You'll never do it again.


But I'm telling you, I'm listening to you. I'm hearing I'm talking to a guy that I think can make that kind of money. Go to Ken Coleman, Dotcom, download a bunch of his stuff. Hold on. One of Kelly give you a copy of his book, The Proximity Principle. Your biggest crisis is a career crisis and the emotional effects of getting fired. And that's once you get past those, you're going to solve your debt problem in no time.


This is the Dave Ramsey Show.


And Ali and. Welcome back to the Day Ramsey show, Anthony L.M. and Dave Ramsey here, Anthony are my co-host, Ramsey personality number one, best selling author, open phones, a triple eight eight two five five two two five.


Robin is with us from Dallas, Texas. Hey, Robin, how are you?


I'm doing well. Thank you for taking my call, Dave and Anthony. Our pleasure. How can we help? OK, well, I'm twenty six. I'm a teacher. I'm going this is my last year of teaching and when to go through a career change. So I just want to know what I should do with my money in my pension, the state pension and my four three D. I don't think of where three things are invested very well because when I signed up for them, I just wanted the financial planners out of my classroom.


So I just said yes to a bunch of stuff. I didn't know what was going on. OK, Anthony. Yeah, yeah, so Robin, here's what I would suggest for you, since you're transitioning to a new job, correct? Yes. Yeah. So what I would suggest is get with a financial adviser and let's talk about rolling that over to like a Roth IRA.


OK. Should I do that before I go to school first? So try and be a nurse practitioners. Should I do that before I go to school or one time as a one time as a nurse or an MP?


Yeah, I would just roll it to a traditional IRA and not a Roth. You don't want to activate the taxes on it. OK, so I'll disagree with Anthony on that part. But the the idea of rolling it and it doesn't matter, but it's better to go ahead and do it as soon as you leave and that way it's done. So go to Dave Ramsey Dotcom, click smart faster and it will drop down a list of the smart VESTER pros, the people in the investment business that we recommend.


And you're not trying to get them out of your classroom.


As a matter of fact, you're trying to go to their classroom, OK?


And you're trying to go that direction, sit down with them and they'll help you do a direct transfer rollover. All right.


Hons is with us from Miami, Florida. It says on my screen, you are debt free hands. Congratulations.


Who pay so much. What a pleasure to speak to both of you. You guys are amazing individuals. Thank you.


How much have you paid off? Fifty two thousand dollars in 2003 dollars. And how long did this take this? One year, six months and twenty five days, if not hours.


And your range of income. During that time my income went from twenty five thousand up to seventy five. That's nice.


I love it. What do you do for a living? Well, I used to be a part time adult education teacher and then I received a promotion to a similar department. They can be full time. And then I took on a part time teaching position within the same adult education. And then there were also some side gigs. I also work as a jujitsu instructor, so I had to it I was selling items on offer of anything that I could sell and get my hands on.


I was getting rid of them.


Well, I don't know what kind of debt was the 52000. This was Navigant and Sallie Mae. She got evicted, as you guys say. Yeah, they were all Haliday on auto loans for credit card. This one was close. It was a C discover. It was Capital One. And then there was Stephanie Tire plus five. Wow. Way to go.


What happened to you one year and six months and two days ago? We've got you on this journey. Well, really, what started is is actually my girlfriend's mom, she recommended Dave Ramsey and I never really had a plan for my money. It was just kind of a I knew that one day I would figure it out. And then she mentioned to check out this guy, Dave Ramsey, and I read it into you. Then I was hooked to the first day I put on the podcast on my phone anywhere I would go.


I would never listen to music. I would just listen to your lovely voices.


Yeah. How old are you, man, if you don't mind me asking? Well, actually, I just turned twenty nine in 29.


So tell me, why does a 29 year old want financial freedom. Like what what's what's really driving you. What an excellent question, really, what's driving me is that, you know, I was brought up in a household where credit cards were OK, and actually my first credit card was a it wasn't that I wanted to get those kind of one of those. Well, you should get one because you should build credit because you want to eventually, you know, establish yourself as having a good credit score.


So I was going off that idea. But it's for it's more for my future. Back in October, my girlfriend, I found out that we were going to be expecting June 6th so that from that moment that changed my life and it wasn't about me anymore. It isn't about me. It's about the baby's future and her and I. Yeah. And, you know, it's a little emotional, but that's that's just my drive. And I don't it's not that I have a bad upbringing, but I just want to make sure that future generations of her and I are in the best possible position and they don't go with the norm and they know that there is a better way to do it.


And it's structured. It works. It works when times are bad and it definitely works when times are good. So what would you say?


What was the hardest thing throughout this journey? So we clearly understand your why now, you know, because you got to be a soon to be father. But throughout this almost two year journey, what would you say was the hardest process, the hardest thing to do?


The hardest thing to do, I would say the first three months was just establishing that budget, I was never on a budget and it was you know, it wasn't that I was living paycheck to paycheck because I was living with my parents, but establishing that budget in the first three months and just really getting the hang of, all right, I need to pay the minimum on these and then I can put as much as I can possibly on the smallest debt and tackle it.


And it was just I provided a structure for the night for me and it really changed the way I looked at life.


Wow. Wow. Way to go, man, very proud of you. Excellent job. You're going to make a great daddy, great husband.


Thank you. I love it. I love it. When are you and your girlfriend getting married?


At the. We are. That's OK. I expected it. We are actually working. We're working the baby steps and that not not financially. But today we are actually completing our move in. We are we are moving in together. And, you know, we're just we're building towards that any time soon. She's actually next to me now, so I want to keep that right. Oh, yeah.


OK. All right. So keep it on the down low right now and we'll let it slide. Good for you. Well, way to go, Horns. Very, very proud of you. Congratulations. Very well done. How's it feel now that you're there?


Oh, it's liberating. I just you know, six months ago, I once I was that free. I was a little shocked. I mean, I was like I knew that I would get here one day, but being there now gave me way more control of my money. And as you say all the time, your greatest wealth building tool is your income. And they got to the point where I was able to save four thousand dollars. I purchased in cash Invisalign and actually got a fifteen hundred dollar discount simply because I was paying in cash.


And now anywhere I go, if I can pay in cash, I'll say, hey, if I think cash can I get a discount? And it typically results in a couple of hundred dollars off, but it's been the best thing for the best. Well done.


Well, we got a copy of Kris Hogan's book for you every day. Millionaires want that to be the next chapter in you and your new wife and your new baby's future, that's for sure.


Millionaire next door, baby. Here we go every day. Millionaires just for you. All right, Hohns.


Fifty two thousand dollars paid off in one year and six months. Make it twenty five and scrapping has gone up to 75 counted down. Let's hear a debt free scream.


All right guys. Move those years a little bit far away from that falls now three to one break.


And yes you are, sir. I like hockey. Yes, you are. Well done. Yes, I like that. I like that.


Having a reason to go through that much pain is necessary. Yes.


You have to have something you want on the other side. That's called a better life. Yes. In his case, something he wants to he wants to change his family tree for the new baby. Yeah, that's about as noble a calling as you can get. Yeah. And changes everything when you have a big Y, it really does.


If you. Why does it make you cry? Dave, I tell people this all the time. The price of commitment will.


Now one of the two is going to get you baby. That's how it works. Anthony O'Neal Ramsey personality is my co-host today. This is The Dave Ramsey Show. Our Scripture of the day, Matthew, six twenty six, look at the birds of the air, they neither sew nor reap nor gather into barns, and yet your Heavenly Father feeds them, are you not, of more value than they? Mark Twain said the secret of getting ahead is getting started.


Every time I read that scripture about the birds of the air, God feeds them.


I always think of Yeah, but he doesn't throw the worms in the nest of God to get up. The early bird still gets the worm. Yes, God puts that worm out there. If the bird dies to see it, get them. Giddy up, baby. Yeah. Get up. Get after it. You got to hustle. You got to grind man. You got a busted. You got to make your dreams come true.


And and then God has the opportunity to bless all of that action. Yes. That you're putting out. There are all that sewing that you're doing. You will reap because of his sunshine, his rain and because of you having planted seeds. There's the magic of the two working together. The mystery of the two working together.


Yeah. Oh, oh. So people day that one of the greatest miracles that can ever happen to us is us doing what we need to be doing.


Yeah, well, I mean, people that wait on God to do everything, end up doing nothing and people that think that God isn't there end up working really, really hard with minimal results.


You're right. It's completely inefficient methodology in both cases. Absolutely. This is the overly religious, the over saved, as our friend Michael says, and then on the other side, the underside.


So, yeah, you don't think God's there or you think he's no one's gonna do it for you. Like somehow Grandpa found out. Sugar candy. Come on, Dave. All right. Angel is with us. Angel is in Dallas, Texas. Hi, Angel. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show.


Hi, Dave. How are you doing today? Better than I deserve. How can Anthony no help. Oh, Anthony, hi.


How are you doing here? I'm doing well. Thanks for asking also.


So me, my husband, step four and six. You guys are so awesome. I'm super excited. So I'm filling out my four one case with my first check, but I will be doing it with my company. Doesn't have a match, but I can do fifteen percent with the last one k my husband, he has a government job and they have a little one a and the most he can do for a traditional after take contribution is ten percent.


So my question for him is, is that they have an additional like four for fifty seven B that they have a 401k but they also have a 401k don't they know they don't.


They only have a 401k add on and then they have the add on that as of four fifty seven B but that's pre-tax. So I'm wondering what I should do with him. Am I okay with me having my wife for one K with no match doing the whole fifteen percent and with him it's an after tax made eighteen percent, but that's the best we can do. But then you have this reduced this additional four fifty said let's, let's, let's stop and pound back.


OK, quit trying to do his and yours.


Let's do ours. Yes. OK, so what is your household income.


Oh, gosh, we bring like that one thirty one thirty a year before that's take home or that's gross. No, that's gross.


OK, so we want 15 percent. Of that, OK, yes, total and then the efficient, the most efficient way to get to 15 percent of that, we need that exact total.


Yeah, and so let's see, fifteen thousand and thirty is forty five hundred and so nineteen five.


So let's call it twenty thousand dollars. You need to get to twenty thousand dollars. Yeah.


OK, now so what I want to do then is I want to as fast as I can. Get to that 20 thousand most efficient. I can now the best thing is to get a match. Neither one of you have a match available, right?


But is his government does they give him 12 percent on the money? Even if he doesn't put money in it, that is correct. OK, so that's not a match, right? I think it's that either he gets that either way. Yes, sir. OK, so we're not going to count that. That's just wonderful. That's just good money, OK? Yes. And you don't need to do something to get a match. So no match.


The next best thing, as you've correctly identified, is Roth. He does not have a Roth. You do. But we're trying to get to twenty thousand dollars worth a Roth now. Yeah, now you can do six. He can do six. That's twelve on individuals. And then what do you make?


I'm five, OK, and so we might just load your 401k up and to individual Roth IRA is up to get to our twenty thousand dollars.


Oh I said your Roth at work.


His Roth I would rather do. Let's do two individuals. That's 12000. So I want to put 8000 into your 401k give or take. So you know you can figure that out exactly how you want.


But, but and we'll probably do nothing at his work.


Right. OK, OK.


Because they think the Roth individuals and the Roth at your work are both better than anything offered at his work.


OK, now makes sense.


And he's got he's got marital rights to your stuff. You got marital rights to his stuff. So it's not like I mean in the event of a divorce or death, you know, on death, you've got the beneficiaries. You name goes right straight to him. He goes straight to you. Either way, in the event of a divorce, if it's all in your name at your work, he's going to get half of it. So you're protected from those kinds of things, those worst case scenarios.


So it's match first, Roth second, then traditional and get to your number and establish what your number is first.


And I like how you said that to Dave because she was saying, hey, I'm a 15 percent of my income into my Roth. But what you said is like, hey, check this out. That 15 percent is going to be above the max of a Roth, which is six thousand. Yeah. And then you take the rest of your 15 percent and put that into a Roth IRA. You know, and I think a lot of people get confused, but I well, she's doing a 15 percent when they look at the math overall to get to the twenty thousand.


That's really going to break that down to the listeners listening, because I remember when I first started out investing, I was like, well, I'm a pilot, you know, 10 percent. Then I notice when one time it went down because I had had reached my limit. Yeah. And I couldn't invest it. Yeah, but she didn't. In her case, if she puts 8000 in and does two individuals, that gets us to twenty thousand.


So that's like was it six hundred and fifty bucks a month. Yep. Something like that gets her there into her 401k and then do the two individuals with the smart pro and that gets us to 20 grand. Yes. And that's your 15 percent. And then let him get his non-match, 12 percent over there that the government's given him right in that aftertax 401k, which is great. Yeah, I will definitely take free money. I always take free money.


Free money is always a good thing, but we don't have to do anything over there match and we don't do the 457 until way down the list of things to do.


Let me ask this question, Dave, from your evening. Teach me something on this. So for younger people now who, let's say, have a high deductible plan like me and you have the HSA involved with it, would you still advise to do the 401k go into your Roth IRA and instead and say we have some more to invest? Are you cool with us going into the HSA after you've maxed out everything else, if that's what it takes to get there?


OK, so like you got a nineteen five max. Yes. On your 401k. Yeah. So let's say you're a high income earner. Right.


And you do that and then you do six thousand in your Roth IRA, even if it's a back door. Right. As a single. Yes. OK, then you could go load that HSA up.


That's another way of getting some money hidden. I like me, I'm in Baby Steps seven and so I'm max out anything I can. Yeah, I use my HSA as an investment vehicle because I don't use it for medical gotcha and I just load it up.




And so I have every year since George W.. Wow.


I mean no George Herbert. OK, no, no I think no double you put the HSA in place. OK, ok. OK, so since he was in office a bazillion years ago, his first term then that, that was the thing I every year since then I have.


Wow. And so my and it's all in mutual funds. Yeah.


So my HSA is several hundred thousand dollars because I haven't had to use it for medical knock on wood.


But any medical we've had we just paid out of pocket so as not to disturb what is essentially another investment vehicle. Absolutely. And the company we've got that we endorse on the air is the company we use here that my personal is in health equity. OK, the company here, you hear their ads running here on the air and you know, they've got a mutual fund option for your HSA once you get further down the road. But that's after you're maxing out every everything for whatever reason, either because you're a high income earner or your baby.


Step seven. Yes, OK, either one. You don't you don't. You don't start with the HSA is an investment vehicle, though. It needs to be used for health stuff early in your process. So good stuff, Anthony. Good show today. Hey, thank you, Dave. Thanks for having me. James Childs and Kelly Daniel in the booth. Great job as always. I am Dave Ramsey. Your host will be back with you before you know it.


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