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From the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the car rental studios, it's the Dave Ramsey Show where dad is dumb. Cash is king and the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Anthony O'Neal Ramsey, personality number one, best selling author, is my co-host. Today here on the air, open phones at eight eight two five five two two five. That's eight eight two five five two two five.


Heather is going to start us off this hour in Knoxville, whether it is Heather's in Knoxville.


How are you, Heather? Hi there. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. How can we help? Well, I am a small business owner.


I'm actually an artist who works from home. I had a lot of credit card debt and then I received a small business loan. And so I was I saw one of your shows passed when I accepted or no, I guess it was earlier and it was like a no, no, don't do that. So can you. Can you explain that? It's a three point seventy five percent, 30 year. I do plan on my my goal is to pay it off sooner.


But can you help me with this? But, you know, I basically use a loan to pay off the credit card debt, OK, which was very high interest.


So you just moved your credit card debt to the small business loan. Correct. And so your credit card debt was 18 or whatever, and now you've got like you were like 29.


Now, you know, you got a four percent loan and it was how much money? About well, it was well, for that loan, it was about 19000.


OK, and how much were your payments if you added up all your credit card payments back before you moved them?


Yeah, 400 bucks a month. How much are you paying on the on the small business loan?


Oh, I'm sorry I said that wrong. Four hundred dollars, almost four hundred dollars would just interest. OK, so the actual payments were I don't have that number in front of me. Probably, probably about a thousand dollars. Yeah. Yeah you're right. And how much have you been paying on the small business loan.


Well, I just got it weeks ago, so, yeah, I guess the first part, it will be one hundred and five dollars. You got to know how long ago. Start with just a couple of weeks ago. OK. All right. It's going to be one hundred and forty five dollars, which will set in one year from now, which I hope to pay off early.


And did you say it's over 30 years or three years? Yeah.


Thirty nineteen thousand dollars. OK, yes, let me point out to you what the problem is. Yeah, please, OK, you did save on the interest rate. Yes, that's wonderful. The problem is you feel like you did something well.


And what ends up happening is now you're going to pay 105 dollars a month payment instead of paying a thousand dollars a month. Right. If you paid a thousand dollars a month, you'd be done in 19 months. But 99 percent of the people don't do that right, because they fall into the psychological trap of a debt con solid loan. That's basically what this is. You've got conned thinking that the lower interest rate was your problem when reality your problem was not interest.


Your problem was you had a nineteen thousand dollar problem and you try to solve that by borrowing your way out of it. So now you're there, though. I'm not going to beat you up for where you are today, but you ask me what the problem with it is. The problem with it is it doesn't get people out of debt because they don't change their behaviors. Matter of fact, they do change them, but they change them negatively, meaning you end up paying less on your dad instead of more.


If the net result of this was people would pay fifteen hundred a month instead of a thousand a month, but they don't, as you can well imagine, they pay what is asked and nothing more.


And your lifestyle goes up 800 bucks a month. And you know all this. I got to buy this and all. I needed to do this and now and I'll get around to it later. I got 30 years.


Yeah, yeah, yeah. Heather So let's talk about this. Where you at now? I mean, you you hear you've got 30 years. You're not I probably don't actually think.


Well, I was about to say that you're not taking 30 years now. I just want you to go back to paying what you were paying. And once you put more. Yeah. Go back to doing like that. Fifteen hundred dollars a month. Two thousand dollars. Why you make what your household income.


OK, it's well, I'm self-employed. I'm an artist. I know. What what do you make. You know, I make enough just to cover the rent and I mean I'm sorry. The mortgage and the bills and feed and all that and then so I guess. You know, I have to take in at least about four, four to five grand a month. So to get to get my 45 for yeah, 45, yeah, OK, yeah, that's fair.


So would you agree, Heather, that maybe you need to pick up something else on the side? Pardon me. Would you agree that you need to get some extra income coming in? Well, I honestly, I don't I don't know how to do that. I mean, I'm, you know, 53, not even a high school education. I'm an artist for a living. And this is what I do. I don't know anything else.


Can you do more art? Honestly, that's that's me working a lot.


Yeah. OK, well, we may need to raise your prices because the bottom line is, is that you need to pay 19000 off in one year. Yeah, that's where that's what you need. I'm out and that's about six hundred bucks a month. Yeah. And that means you're going to tighten your budget and raise your income. And but I think you were looking for me to say that this is all OK. I'm not going to be mad at you for doing it, but it's not OK because it gives you permission to stay in debt longer rather than get out of debt faster.


And that's what the banking institution was from her.


They want you to be there and they should be they want you to be owned by them the rest of their life.


And I'm estimating, Dave, 19000 of the three point seventy five interest rate over 35 years is, what, about twenty twenty eight thousand twenty five?


It's just it's just you. She she wasn't planning to do that. Yeah, but people don't plan that. So I was about to say. Yeah. So she wasn't planning to but she probably would have.


Jane is in Rochester, Minnesota. Hi, Jane.


How are you. Hi there, Dave. I'm just great. Just hoping to have a chat with you for a few minutes. We've got a daughter going through a divorce. You have three children and I'm going for two years now. And a lawyer costs, of course, have an astronomical. But we're at a point now which is going into finally the financial negotiations very soon. So we're kind of looking, you know, to give her some advice going forward.


She enrolled in nursing school. She'll be graduating from nursing school in the next next spring. So hopefully employable by June of next year. I'm going to go immediately on for her BSN. So that will be a good income at that point in time. Up until then, they have relatively nothing. So they have they're in a home. She wants to leave that home for a lot of different reasons. But in the interim, between this period now, when the divorce becomes final, hopefully by the end of this year and when she graduates now in the spring, we just want to kind of give her some insight as to what steps she might be able to take to get her credit online, get going with that.


And, you know, a long range look, she has three children, so she needs to get into a home at some point. And what what would you suggest now? The main thing we have to do is take care of her. And we call that the four walls, food, shelter, clothing, transportation and utilities. And then, as you wisely pointed out, get the career track going. I'm not really worried about her credit. I want her to take care of her and the kids and finish education, get this income coming in and credit will solve itself way down the list of things.


Obviously, we want to clear the debts and build an emergency fund as fast as we can. Finding the right pair of sunglasses on a budget is difficult.


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Know yourself. Know your money. It's a great new book. Amy is with us from Flint, Michigan. Hi, Amy. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show.


Hi, Dave. Hi, you. How great. How can we help? So earlier today, I was in a meeting for work and they started off good news with, oh, this is happening with our company. And also we were just acquired from a large Fortune 500 company. However, our division is looking to possibly dissolve. And I I'm still in the midst of baby step two. So, I mean, the likelihood of us losing our job, they basically told us today to start looking for something else.


Whoa. And and I. I have a house and. But I'm still paying for that part of my baby steps and. Understand? Yeah, I don't blame you. What a horrible day. I'm sorry. And you're single. Yeah, I have had a roommate to help with the bills, but. OK, yeah, you stop everything and start piling up cash. Yeah, so what do you make? Right now, it was thirty six thousand years.


Mm hmm. What do you do? I was doing medical billing. But we haven't been able to do most of it from home, so I've been kind of at a standstill for work and I was kind of worried that something like this would happen. But, you know, you always say, what's the possibility? And I always thought it was more like 10 percent instead of 95 percent. OK. Wow, all right, now it's there, though, so we stop everything, we pile up cash as high as you can pilot and you are in job search mode 100 percent starting today.


Ready, set, go.


Yeah. And you'll get another job, 36000 jobs. You can come by that.


Yeah. Yeah. Have you started the process already, Amy? I have to apply with some, but since they're working from home, I've found that I had a lot of issues. So that's something that I'm also dealing with, too, and that I'm going to have to fork out some money for, you know, paying my deductible for that and different things.


So then, yeah, again again, though, you push all of that out as far as you can push it out, because what you're dealing with is today.


Yeah. Today you got new information. Yes. OK, and so the information you got today says don't write checks for anything that you don't have to.


You're in a war zone mode.


You just went to war starting today and you're piling up cash, piling up, piling up cash, piling up cash.


You go to Ken Coleman Dotcom and you download all of his stuff on how to do a resume, on how to do an interview. I'm going to give you a copy of his book, The Proximity Principle, to help you with getting started on this job process. And it may be the best thing that ever happened to you right now. That doesn't sound good, but how many times has it happened to you? Like, it's happened to me that when crap like this comes, I look back five years later and I go, man, I'm really glad I got knocked out of that because I ended up with a good thing.


Yeah, yeah.


Probably too many times. Yeah. And it's like you're losing a five hundred thirty six thousand dollars your job, you're losing a little 36000 to your job. I know it's what you got. I'm not picking on you. I'm not shaming you. But it's an opportunity to move up for you. Absolutely. Are you in a budget already.


Yes, I've been doing every dollar. Good, good. Recently.


So I want to do exactly what David said and what you just go look at your budget to day. Soon as you hang up the phone, sit down and start cutting off any extra any extra stuff subscriptions. I mean, the extra stuff that you have in their stat cash at the same time, you are downloading his resume update so you can get a better job.


Yeah, I want you to delay the whole thing as long as you can delay it without putting your health at risk. DeLay anything you can't. Yes. Without putting it at risk.


Right. And then you start seeing how much cash can I pile up? How much cash can a pile up? Because cash gives you patience.


And and then you start thinking about two things. One is, what is my long term career and how am I going to land that job? And that might be making sixty k. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And and then the other thing you think is whose house can I clean for twenty five dollars an hour or whose dog can I walk or what other stuff can I do. Stopgap just to pile up cash to go into full on emergency create money mode.


She's in Flint, Michigan Dave. She can do Uber, she knew Uber. She can deliver groceries. I mean they're hiring instantly. Yeah.


You start out by nightfall. Yeah. And so you're going to start doing a whole bunch of stuff and just anything you can do to create an income that's legal and moral and anything that you can do to pile up cash and pay as little out the door as you can pay until you land the new job.


Yes. And as you walk away with the medical billing in your rearview mirror, that's going to be a really nice day. And you're going to move on to the next thing.


You're going to be great. Hold on. I'm going to Kelly pick up. We'll get you a copy of Ken Coleman's book, The Proximity Principle number one bestselling book on the proven strategy that will lead you to the career you love.


Download all of the all the all the tools on his website, Ken Coleman, Dotcom, his stuff on building a resume, his stuff on getting in the door and then his stuff. I'm doing interviews. It's all downloadable stuff on his site is absolutely world class. It will help you land the job that you need to solve this problem. I'm sorry you had a horrible day, honey. And the only thing I'm sure about horrible days is tomorrow is not going to be as bad and the next day will be a little better and the next day will be a little better.


And a month from now, you may be smiling. You just never know. I kind of think you're going to be you are a person who develops a plan and executes it.


Our Question of the Day is from Blind's dot com. Find out why Blind's dot com is the number one online retailer of custom window coverings. You get free samples, free shipping, and with a new promos every month, you save even more. Use the promo code, Ramsey.


Anthony, our question, Sean, in Ohio visits Dave Ramsey com to ask My wife and I are in baby steps four in seven. We paid off our house last year to knock out step six. We are expecting our first child in November. So we have so we had a question about step five that we hope you can help us with rather than spread contributions to our children's 529 over several years. Would it be a good idea to contribute substantially to their 529 over just the next couple of years, allowing the maximum amount of time for the investment to grow and minimizing the amount of initial investment needed to reach our goal?


Love it. That's a good question. I mean, I'm saying start the 529 and just just put as much money as you possibly can. Max it out. Yeah.


Run the numbers with your smart Vesterbro and figure out what the number is when you quit. Yeah. When you got enough and you stop.


Yep. And that's what we did. And once we got enough in there we just stopped and that box just checked and we don't think about college anymore.


Yeah. And I like your plan. I love the plan. Thinking about your kids early on. It's just beautiful. Yeah. That's a fact. You know, and you can chunk in most 529 plans if you find one when you're picking a 529, always pick the one that allows you to control the options. It doesn't move options around for you. They're not fixed and they've got good mutual funds that you can pick from in there. That's what you're looking for.


And then that way, if that changes the market shifts on your whatever, then you can decide I'm not going to stay in that mutual fund and and that kind of thing.


But most of those 529 is allow you to put 10K a year away. You do that for about three years. The first three years you get that thirty will probably grow to more than you need. And that's, you know, but sit down, run the calculations with your smart Vesterbro and they'll help you figure that out. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. During these crazy times, the best advice I can give you is control the controllable. Let's start looking at major expenses like your monthly rent or your house payment.


Folks, mortgage interest rates are so low, now is the time to invest in your future. In just 10 minutes, my friends at Churchill Mortgage can share ways to save you serious cash through a smarter mortgage plan to speak to a specialist call triple eight, loan 200 or go to Churchill Mortgage Dotcom. This is a paid advertisement in MLS ID one five nine one in the as consumer access dog equal housing lender 1749 Mallory Lane Suite 100 Brentwood, Tennessee three seven zero two seven.


Anthony O'Neal Ramsey personality is my co-host on the air today, one of our favorite things to do is debt free screams. Our next favorite thing to do is a debt free scream from the debt free stage in the lobby of Ramsey Solutions.


But our favorite thing of all to do, yes, is a debt free scream from the debt free stage in the Ramsey lobby with one of our own Ramsey team members. Yes, that's what we're doing right now on Jodi Norquist, Norco. Lúcio is with me. I can't I'm sorry, Jodi. I know this, but I can't say it is with us and been with us about a year and a half, right?


Yes, sir. And it works on the NRA leadership team. Correct. And your husband, Mike. That's right. Mike, welcome.


Good to have you. Got you and your dad, Frank. Like, how much did you pay off, a little over 100, 57000. Oh, and how long did this take? Well, we paid off our house, so nine years.


And that's where people are weird people. It's Ramsey, another paid for house. That's awesome. What's his house worth?


About 325.


Something like that. Kind of hard to tell around there. I love it. Well, congratulations. How long did that take again? Nine years and ten, nine years.


So the normal process that's about right. Takes usually seven to 10 right in there. That's right. Where you are. Perfect. Well done. So tell us the story, because kind of the end of the story. You're coming to work here 18 months ago, huh? That's right. And you've been already working on this a long time. Tell us the story, how this all happened.


Well, I think that we we met you and heard about FPU in 2005, and we had 60000 dollars in consumer debt at that point and went through FPU. We wrote our check to the church and literally prayed that that check would bounce because we were so in the hole.


Oh, and so we went through the class and I was kind of like, I don't really want to do this. I was driving a really expensive car. I really liked my car. And I'm like, I deserve this car because I work really hard. And I think on lesson three, you said if you can't pay cash for it, you you don't deserve it.


And I felt him like looking at me and I was like, oh, yeah, I get rid of charity. We got to know what kind of car was. I had an Audi titty.


It was a limited edition six, the only May 2011. It was not this bad girl. Go fast, you know, like that. Yeah, girl, go fast. Wow. I had one of those cars for a little while that they had run out from under you.


I love it, but we had debt off in 17 months and we were going to call in. You did the calls on Fridays? We were going to call in, but we just went back to work. We were so busy working that we never did our debt free scream then. So we fled FPU several times since then. And then we bought this house and we're like, we're getting this thing paid years. You still have the Audy? No, no.


We have to pay for cars that are much older now.


Mike, what do you do for a living? I work at Costco. OK, very cool.


Yeah. Nice, good way to go, you guys. You paid your house.


I know. It's and it's hard to leave home. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. I appreciate that. It's been really nice. We had to say no to a lot of things and we've got friends that are, you know, out having a good old time. But we wanted the house paid off because you always say the people of God do for God if they're debt free. And so that's what we have been focusing on. Yeah.


So thank you. It's been a huge blessing to go through your program a couple of times. It's been it's really been amazing. Well, thank you and thanks for leading financial.


And we're getting ready to leave at the end of this month.


And thanks, Jody, for all the help in the work you do with the coaching team. Done an honorary leadership. I know they treasure you. Yeah. So absolutely incredible. You. Gosh, thank you.


How's how's it feel? It feels weird. And I have a pain. Yeah. Sometimes I, I don't know, sometimes I, it's just you go about your day to day, you don't think about it. But when I do we talked about it the other day. When I think about it it just blows me away. It's like I never grown up, never really thought this I could be in this position, you know, it's just not something that I ever thought about doing.


But, you know, we with the Lord's help and I go with you, the FPU and getting on a budget and doing all that stuff, man, this is it's a reality. It's kind of hard to believe sometimes, but yeah, it's amazing.


I'm curious if you could go back to your how long have you been married? Twenty one years. Cool. Great. I was about to say, if you can go back to twenty years ago when you first got married, what would you tell your younger selves going into marriage that you wish you would have known then trust in the Lord always put him first.


Yeah, absolutely.


And get on a stinking budget. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's good too. Yeah, that's good. It works.


And it's been a lot, it's taken a lot to get to this point, but yeah, it's all been worth it.


Trust in the Lord and get honest thinking. But I like this. This is a book title. Yeah. Yeah. Book Title II, The Faith and the work side.


Well it is because you work like it all depends on you. You pray like it all depends on. Yeah. Yeah that's right. And what's next. Absolutely fabulous.


Well we're going to the beach to celebrate our anniversary. Yeah. Which beach. I can't tell.


You know he says that it's capes on blocks in Florida. He just doesn't want anybody to know about it.


Oh you don't you don't wanna spread it around it back. You don't want to make it famous, too, like we did. Seventeen million people, Jody. See, what you did is terrible. So, Jody, no, it's great because now we can we can give like nobody else. It's amazing. We're so incredibly grateful for that.


We're going to focus on retirement to start building wealth and just keep going.


Yeah, keep going every day. Millionaires before you know it at this rate. Very, very well done. I'm sure you've already got a copy of Chris Hogan's book, but we'll give you another one and you can give it away from, you know, it's everyday millionaires because that's the track your own.


Well, the whole military leadership team is out here not working and cheering for the.


We've got to get them back to work and and a whole bunch of customer care team as well hanging out, and they all love you, Jody. We do. We're so honored to have you on the team for the last 18 months. And Mike, we thank you guys for leading financial peace university and for setting a standard setting example that you can pay off your home and you should pay off your home.


And then when you do, you live like no one else.


Later you get to go to the beach and then, yeah, baby is right. This is as it should be. Very, very, very well done. All right. Here it is, Jodie and Mike. A hundred and fifty seven thousand dollars paid off house and everything in it in nine years.


Count it down.


Let Sarah Ramsey solutions debt free scream three to one where dad?


And the crowd goes wild. And that gives me Pondy, that just gives me what I'm telling you, it's it doesn't matter the income, it doesn't matter the age, it doesn't matter married or single.


It doesn't matter what you've been through or what your journey is, what your story is. You get to determine a certain portion of your future. Yeah. And if you don't do that with intentionality, it will drift away like the other like the portion that you don't have control over. Absolutely. And so I can't control what this might mean to you or not. I can't control whether somebody is fair to you or not. I can't control, you know, the mean old toxic boss.


I can't control sexism. I can't control racism. I can't control. But I can control what I can control.


Yeah. And they got after it. Yeah.


And they get their house paid for and that puts them in a position to go to the beach and not even that day, but just wake up on the first of the month and have peace. I don't have a mortgage payment, I don't have nothing but just utility bills and a cell phone bill. And insurance like that is just so much freedom and so much money. Yes, it's a lot of money that is.


And you start to realize then for the first time this idea that the rituals over the poor and the borrower is slave slave lender. And, you know, sometimes you don't realize you're a slave until you're free. Yeah. And when you're free, you go, dadgum, I was a slave. Yeah, I was stuck. I mean, people own me. I had to make different choices than I normally would have made because they were in my life.


They be in that stupid bank. Yeah. And I will get the stupid but bank out of my life and we'll get to stupid but mortgage company out of my stupid book car fleece out of my life. We'll get rid of Sallie dadgum Navigant stupid stuff. And I'm just stupid out of my life. I'm tired of being a slave.


And when people decide that magical things happen, man, listen, so does. I'm so proud of them.


I'm me too. Well, well done. Very well done. Jody and my well done.


This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Our scripture the day James 516, therefore, confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you might be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective.


Renee Brown says a leader is someone who holds her or himself accountable for finding the potential in people and processes. Pam is with us in Cincinnati. Hi, Pam. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Heidi, thanks so much for taking my call. My honor, how can we help? Well, I am 60 years old. I'm a teacher. I cannot officially retire in time 65. But this school year, right about a week before the school year started, I was advised by my health care professional that I should not return to the school due to the cold situation and some underlying issues that I have unable to work.


I was working five job. I work a retail job on the side. I do copyediting get on the side. I do a lot of stuff on the side. But with this big chunk of income gone, my husband, who also works, wanted to take a loan out on his thrift savings plan. He was in the government thing and I don't I definitely don't want him to do that. I made that mistake years and years ago, and I I'm on board with you, but I don't have another option.


And that the thing is, there's a lot of things I can just rip up, like my copyediting business and stuff with those will take a little bit of time to build case.


And he's just panicking. He's very scared, absolutely. So what does he make? He makes about well, I can tell you, you say he makes about 45 a year and you all can make.


Well, not with the house, but we have at this point and we have a lot of debt and how much?


What do you what is the debt on? We've got credit cards, student loans, and another big loan that we had taken out. What is the other big thing is that it was we definitely had to do some house repairs. They don't have any car payments. Well, we have six thousand dollars left on my car. OK, what do you own your home? We owe about two hundred five thousand. Mm hmm. And what can you make with what you're with your situation right now?


Well, I mean, I really think I can ramp it up and make it. I mean, I figured out mathematically that I only need to bring in 30000 dollars a year for us to be OK and not just, you know, so and that's what's paying down debt and getting moving forward. But the problem is just this month, like these next couple of months, where where the everything not I haven't built up everything. We don't just navigate those couple.


But I thought about doing Dorda. I mean, because I'm a scrapper, I'll do whatever I have to do. But it's not OK to be in the classroom, but it's OK to do Dornbusch.


Yeah, well, the environment of the school, because schools are notoriously not well ventilated. I teach choir and so the singing of the Arab both in a room, in a crowded environment. That's what he was most concerned about. That door, that's probably isn't. Well, see, I'm not really in contact with anybody, OK? I'm think, OK, I don't care. Well, I mean, can your husband what can your husband pick up some extra?


So all we got to do is do this for 60 or 90 days till your other stuff kicks in. Right?


Right. Yeah, well, yeah. So I get the other stuff built up and he already does. He, he works all the overtime he can right now at his present job and that pretty much whipsaws.


But because he's working every day of the week and that's that and that's same 40 grand after overtime and everything. No, I think with the overtime now that he's doing that, that'll probably bring us bit more than that. Yeah, yeah. So now he's bringing home about fifteen thousand twice a week or not thousand fifteen hundred twice a week. Yeah. I'm looking at extra jobs, especially for the next 60 to 90 days. I'm with you. I like Jordache.


I also like maybe even those newbies. But let me ask you another question. What can you do as far as in a small business from home to generate some income? Yeah, you're a music teacher.


That's what you start doing, piano lessons or something?


Yeah, I do already. I already do lessons. And I that's one of the things I could build up to. I didn't have to do a lot because I was busy teaching school and the kids, a bunch of them are going back to school.


So they could probably you could probably add some kids on piano. Easier than you can at door dash. Yeah, right.


And that's true. And it's just going to take time to build that up. It's not much that doesn't happen that much. And I'll tell you this much. I had a vocal coach not for singing, but for speaking. And she did that all along. And so maybe you can take your your opportunities online and generate money. There are websites out there that you can actually put your information on and they will they will actually push you out there some more.


So you have some options here to go ahead and get some extra income without touching the tab.


Yeah, I'm not touching it. I'm going to make it. Yeah, I would rather get behind on a couple of bills than borrow on the TSB, and I don't think you're going to have to because I think some type budgeting, lots of ingenuity on extra job things for you and hubby.


The overtime he's already working and you got to tighten this budget down, tighten this budget down, tighten this budget down, cut the cable off, all that kind of crap. And let's just go to work. And then and then as you get your income up from some of these different areas, you may end up making more than you did in the classroom when it's all over. And sadly, they may have lost a really good teacher in the process.


That's really sad. I'm sorry you guys are facing this, but you're a scrapper. I can tell by talking to you and I think you're going to make sure you don't do just fine. Tune to perfectly.


Rochelle is with us. Rachelle's in Chicago. Hi, Rochelle. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Hello, thanks for taking the call. I am 50 years old, a probation officer, I make 50. You have one hundred and eighty two institutions. Good Lord, 32000 in collections. I have no savings. And I'm trying to figure out, should I give up my dreams of getting help?


How do you get. Safety may sound so young. Five zero, yeah, hundred and 82000, what's your degree in? I have my bachelor's is in criminal justice and I have a master MBA with a concentration in human resources. What do you make in a year or so? I only make 50, 50 years and you're 50 years old. OK, so you're dramatically underemployed, giving your education. Yes. Yeah, yeah, so you have a career path problem, for one thing.


No, I'm not giving up a dream of winning period. And if part of the definition of winning is buying a house, I'm not giving up that dream. But one of the things we ask ourselves when we're setting goals around here is what has to be true. That's not true now.


Yeah. In order to get there.


OK, so we have one hundred and eighty two thousand thirty two of which is already screwed up. Yeah. Right. In collections. And so we've got this ridiculously expensive degree and now we got to use it. Yeah. So what has to be true is your income has to come up. That's what has to be true. And then as it comes up, we're going to put you on a tight budget where you have no life for a couple of years and you clean this whole freakin mess up.


And by the time you're 60, you're 100 percent debt free in your own house.


Yeah, yeah, yeah. And here's the thing. We're so you have to tell yourself I'm not going to give up, OK? So stop asking yourself, am I giving up on my dreams? No, you're not giving up on your dreams. What you're doing is you're just preparing yourself for your dreams right now. It may seem like it's late because it's you are fifty, but that's not late. It's not late at all, you know. So what I'll go ahead and do is use your dream to fuel the fire where you are right now.


But you have to really get hard. You don't have any time to play.


You have an MBA, right? Yes. And you live in Chicago.


Yes. Yeah, you need to be making double what you're making, right? Exactly, exactly. Or would you even consider moving? Yeah, if you can't land something, you need to move.


Yeah, but the point is that that you have overpaid for the degree and then under utilized the degree. Yeah. In creating incomes that make sense. That makes sense and that's caused you to feel overwhelmed and it feels like a crap beat out of you, right? Exactly, yeah, like you're stuck. Yeah, and so we're about to unstick this, get some dynamite lighted.


Rochelle, what did you go to school? Got to ask that question.


I'm a school guy, but I want to know why. I went to Aurora University in Aurora, Illinois, and I got both degrees to think like, OK, hang on.


We're going to send you a copy of Ken Colman's book Proximity Principle to help you get going. And you call us back and we'll talk to you any time we're going to be your biggest cheerleaders. You're going to make it. But it's an income issue.


Anthony, good job. OK, thank you. Thank you, America. That puts us our The Dave Ramsey Show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial piece, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace. Christ Jesus.


This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Once again, you made The Dave Ramsey Show, one of the top four most popular podcast last year's. To get your daily dose of motivation and inspiration from the Ramsey network, subscribe or follow today wherever you listen to podcast. Money isn't the only thing we talk about around here, get life changing advice on your career from my good friend and career expert Ken Coleman. Oh, my Ken Coleman show.


According to a recent Gallup poll, nearly 70 percent of Americans are disengaged at work. If you dread going into work every Monday morning and you're just trying to make it to the weekend, the Ken Coleman show is for you. Everyone has a sweet spot. Your sweet spot is at the intersection of your greatest talent and greatest passion. We will help you discover what it is you were born to do, and then we'll help you create a plan to make your dream job a reality.


You matter and you have what it takes. Join the conversation on the Ken Coleman show. Hear more from the Ramsey network, including the Ken Coleman Show, wherever you listen to podcast.


Hey, it's James, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. This episode is over, but check the episode notes for links to products and services you've heard about during this episode. Thanks for listening.