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Simply save dotcom slash Rogen. Go there and make sure that they know we sent you my friends. My guest today is one of the greatest boxers to ever put on a pair of gloves. He was a huge hero of mine when I was a young man. I'm a gigantic fan of his. It was a huge honor to have him here in the Jerry studio and he is going to be fighting. Mike Tyson at age 50, won multiple division world champion.

Should have been a gold medals in the Olympics, but they fucked him.

He is the great and powerful Roy Jones Jr., German past the Joe Rogan experience, trained by Joe Rogan podcast by Night All Day, Roy Jones Junior.

Ladies and gentlemen, that my brother. How you doing? Honored to have you in here. I've been a fan forever.

I noticed. And I was going to tell you that I am very happy to be here for you and for me because I've been a fan of yours as well. But I always love the support that you give me. You've always supported me. Since day one, you've been one of the best people I could hear talk about me since day one. So I just want to say thank you, Mayor, for the support of being a brother. Thank you, sir.

Thank you.

My my pleasure that we brothers now you know for sure I've been a fan forever, like from way back in the day, you know. You know your song. You almost forgot.

I forget shit. I remember all of it, man. I remember when your fights were basically executions.

There was this there was some years, man, where you would just like, see how is this guy going to survive and how long.

And you you had there was a time in your career when you were at your peak, were you had devised this style that was so different than anyone else's very few jabs. You would throw a lead hook and no one knew how to prepare for it because there was no sparring partners that could emulate it. Your speed was off the charts. Your movement was off the charts. I think to this day you're the only person can't be box history that won a full round without having a single punch scored on them.

And they say I'm not the best defensive fighter ever. Listen, that's that's No. One. I mean, maybe Willie Pep might have done that back in the day before you.

But yes, come PAYBOX era, nobody has ever gone to complete. Well, would I get a punch? You see him.

He ain't the best pop or he's the best and least defensive fighter. And we know about offense, but I don't argue and I just listen to what people say.

No, there was a time where I always said, like people would say, oh, but he didn't fight anybody. I like the fuck he didn't. They just couldn't. They couldn't compete. That's all it was.

You fought world champions like the song say, I just make them look like nobody.

Yeah, I almost forgot you had such a strange style, man. How did you devise that style?

Honestly, man, if it was a lot. My father was a fighter who was trained by of in the I think some part of the armed services. In a way my father learned a lot, but he also learned a lot of things not to do. So by learning those things, he was able to give me a very good foundation with that foundation. My father had roosters fighting roosters when I was young, so I would watch the Roosters all the time because roosters develop a pecking order and people always talk about no fighting animals.

Did they develop a pecking order on their own anyway? They're going to do that anyway. So I would always watch them to figure out what May one, the king of the pecking or what made him better than the rest. And when I learned what that was, it was a few things I figured out once I would figure them out. I start emulating, emulating those things in my boxer style.

So from fighting chickens. Yes. What was the thing that you noticed?

Well, first of all, the one that used was on top. He knew a courtesy of the era of confidence that he was going to be with.

So when he fight, he do a lot more fakin, lot more feinting. Never let him know when he coming up with a dagos, a state powerful, a state state the whole day. And it's like anytime you wanted to see anybody, he did the same thing. He used the same thing, same things. And he often would do things that other chickens just didn't know what to do. But that's God given man and teach him that God gave me.

So if you learn his characteristics, watch out.

Watch how you kill yourself all day long. The wait here to see if he wasn't around others the way he got rid of when others came around.

People say people used to think that I was very egotistical. I've never been an egotistical person. But what I was a highly confident person. I'm God's game of hmm.

If you give me another one around, guess what? I'm going to defend my turf.

That's a funny thing to say to a world champion fighters, one of the greatest of all time. You're egotistical. I mean, listen, if you're not confident, you don't get to that place, never, ever impossible.

Like no one like you have to have a belief in yourself. There's no other way.

If you don't, who's going to believe in you? Yeah, nobody.

Yeah. I was a fan back when you got fucked over in the Olympics, man. God damn. Did they ruin that? That was terrible. That was one of the worst Olympic decisions I've ever seen in my life. Maybe the worst. It was so bad.

But it was in Korea, right? Yeah, it was in Seoul, South Korea. In the Korean fighter. Yeah. God damn. That was ridiculous. It was one of those fights where you like. Well, he got the gold medal clear and then you see the decision. Your jaw drops, you know. Like what? Is this hurt the sport of boxing, especially amateur boxing? You heard it because when you can take a kid 19 years old, he defeats his rival clearly.

And you, Robin, it really eliminates the integrity of their sport. Yeah. And you still don't go back and fix it. Nobody to this day has come back and tried to fix it. They gave me Olympic orders.

They gave me the back Walker Cup, which is for the best boxer at the Olympics, where this contradiction, this contradiction, how is the best boxer here now winning a gold medal?

Yeah, it was it was bad. But it also was in one way, it made people really root for you. It was a blessing in disguise. And I understood that the second day. I think about that whole first day. But second, they were I didn't cry, too, after I went to the back and asked the interpreter to ask him if he really thought he beat me because he said yes, they he didn't know it, but he was going to get nothing.

But he said, no, I know I didn't win, but it wasn't my fault. It was the judges. I shook his hand and I left. I never had never another bad feeling towards him because he he didn't do it for me. You're right for sure. I understand what it's.

But then I also realized that not only were the judges, not necessarily they ought to be blamed, but what God did was take their negative and turn into a positive and look it now.

It was a big tautly. You remember when you began your career, there was a big talk of your career, how you got fucked over in the Olympics.

It was not a it wasn't a question. Not at all. There was no debate. There's no I never saw a single person who made an argument that he won.

It was all you. And so that when you began your career, you had a lot of people rooting for you.

Yes. And that was a beautiful thing, that that's the blessing, above all for me, because to me, it was God's way of making me not put my life on Idol, but turned me up. Oh, yeah. I had no clue what he was doing.

But that's why you just trust in God. Look, we do it now. Yeah.

I remember when you fought James Tony, and that was a big fight because James Toney was in his prime and you were in your prime. And again, you caught him with that Lipan left hook man, that crazy left hook and dropped him. When you when you beat James Toney like that, I think a lot of people had to go, whoa, like, he can do this to an elite top of the food chain world champion.

That's what makes a real superior athlete. Not that you could do it to guys who are beneath you, where you can do it, the guys who are supposed to be your equal or above you. That's when you're really doing it.

Now, people maybe people don't know, but you had been active and you fought up until about well, like two years in twenty.

Eighteen. Yeah. So you decided you're done or were you 100 percent done or you just it 100 percent done. 100 percent. Tell me walk me through this call. How do you get this call to fight Mike Tyson.

Well, one of his guys, a team, calls McGee and tells McGee my my partner to tell me to call. So I call Azeem Isaiah and says, hey, Mike wants to come back.

He wants to do an exhibition, but he wants you to be his DanceSport. Me? Yeah, I said, OK, well, let's see if we can work out. I said, yeah, we got a lot of different situations going on, but they want to do it on different format and they want to do it in a way that you and Michael are taking care of and everything is good. Well, that didn't have to be necessarily the case work, but me being Roy Jones and us being in covid, I'm like, you know what, six weeks this right around the corner.

He gave me a fight and I can get rid of it. I'm pretty sure I can get a little bit more ready than he can because he's been inactive a lot longer than I had. Yeah. So six weeks. I know Mike Tyson, he's big is hickies to Mike Tyson and he still can punch. But six weeks is no way he can get prepared for this. So I say, you know what, I take it.

And I just thought, well, lo and behold, something happens and they change.

Now, why did they change? What was the did they give a reason? They said something about marketing. They told me something about marketing. But I don't really believe much of what was said. I mean, I just can't believe, you know, because we had a September 12th data before football season. I thought basketball may have started, but. People at home with nothing to do, and that's why I was like, you know what, I want him when I was in my prime.

So why not take him now? I mean, 12 in six weeks, that's easy. And they said, well, we got more attention than we expected to get. And this happened. And that happened.

So we want to move, man. So I was thinking about it and doing it to my guy. He posted something about the new date on my site. And when he did that, he was like, well, that means that you admitted that you agreed to it. I didn't. But OK, that's how it goes. I'll be that guy. You know, I'll back out of nothing that comes out of Mike Tyson because he's Mike Tyson. It's just that I know that in six weeks he had no chance to deal yesterday in 12 weeks where he make it live here, have a better chance to deal with me.

But his chance is still going to be rough. But it could be better than it would have been six, six weeks. He didn't have a chance.

Now, during the time where you were off, were you working out when you could still staying fit because you always stayed slim? You look good.

I have to work out because I train a lot of guys. And when you train guys for me, I like to not only just teach them, I also give them an example. The best example is the best that I think did what they what I'm teaching them and I teach them what I learned and what my style was. So I like to be able to demonstrate by example, lead by example.

So do you have young guys that fight in your style? They are trying to satisfy the master.

And really I don't really necessary to teach them to fight like me. My style is not necessarily just me, but I style means that you know how to counter everything, you know, offense, you know, defense, you know, footwork, you know, everything. Every aspect of boxing is what my style is now. The craziness. That's your individual person, your DNA. Would that what you do with it?

What I do with you, I try to make guys comfortable and to give them every opportunity to execute another guy's mistakes. If I can make you do that and have you prepared, always prepare for the next move then that's my style.

Hmm. Your style required extreme physical attributes, though, you know, that's a well, physical attributes.

It does require extreme attributes. But when you come and watch one of my classes, like I got to apprentice over in Sweden, I got an apprentice over in South Africa, got a few apprentices that I've been teaching. I got one out of Washington State. And when I teach them, they understand that, yeah, people blame more athleticism, but it's not all athleticism. It's a lot more knowledge to it than people ever would begin to understand.

You understand me? So, yeah, people say, oh, he's a super athlete, no, take me back.

Yeah. I can go visually or verbally, walk it to every knockout that I got in or every set up to knock out before it happens. Sometimes rounds before happen. Sometimes I want to have a quick acting. Exactly what happened, exactly what I saw and what I did. What I did is that physical attributes.

There's no way it could be just that. It's impossible, you know, that there's a lot of freak athletes. Of course.

Of course, you had freak athleticism as well as like an insane, comprehensive understanding of boxing. That's what that's what makes a great right. Yeah.

You got to have insane comprehension. But what I do have the freak, the freak, the freakiness about me is my hands beat because how can I still be this face?

At 51 years old, I was watching you hit the pads. Holy cow. I'd be looking to I'd be saying, whoa, that.

Yeah, I mean, double, triple, quadruple left. Hands up, up, up, up, up, up, up. Somehow. Yeah, it's crazy. We just talk about the fifty. What. I know it's not fifty one like in the day. No not in the day. Fifty one was done. Oh with one.

Oh it's different today with the new training methods and understanding of the human body and supplements like people are different but you are always different too. I always tell people like you had crazy biceps but small triceps like you were built to throw hooks.

Exactly.

It's like if you look at your body when you were in your prime, you know, it's still like to show people that anywhere in the world, that's ridiculous. The right thing like the hook true you're ever left is way bigger than your pants phrase.

Tell the best hook in the game.

Yeah, that's not man, that's a serious imbalance right now.

When you train young guys, what do you what do you when you're you're showing them your style, do you try to get them left hook heavy the way you are or do you just let them do whatever their style is and just teach them what you know about boxing?

I take whatever you get, whatever your best attributes are, and we work from there. I am not God. I can not reinvent the wheel. If you me, I can invent some stuff, but not the wheel. The wheels I would have me like it is. You can't reinvent the wheel. So what I do is whatever God has given you, we try to take that and take that to the next level.

Now you get. This phone call, you just immediately start training and when you immediately start training, how you ramping up for a fight like that?

You know, is like I heard Mike say something about his dog training. He was in the bay for a week. Yeah, I went to be here for a week because I was going a lot already, but I was also a person for a couple of days.

Did you you mean did it feel good to say, oh, wow, I got a big fight coming up. I got a go back. I was excited. Yeah. Because as Mike Tyson so it's like in most cases you say, yes, I got a big fight on the road coming, you know, but this time I was like, you know what, you better get in a little shake because you are going with Mike Tyson. Yeah.

You know, I don't know what Mike Tyson might come in and do you know if you've got two ears, but yeah. Yo, you know what he might do. So what you better do is get in shape and be prepared for whatever Mike whichever Mike shows up. Yeah.

When I read that it was going to be an exhibition, they were going to try and knock each others out. I went the fuck out of here.

I mean, you think about it. Oh, it's exhibition. But we got to have our gloves. But it's exhibition. Exhibition, no headgear, exhibition judges. I mean, it's still Mike Tyson and exhibition. Mike Tyson who not Corey Sanders down in the first round of an exhibition back in 2004. Correct. So what is your definition of an exhibition? Because going in the ring with Mike Tyson has nothing exhibitionists about it.

No, he doesn't have that in them. When you watch him spar, his smoking was nothing exhibitionistic about it. Yeah, there were fights. Sparring was fights. Everything he does is a fight. Yeah, he's.

Now, you said that he was always kind of on your radar, even when you were the heavyweight champ, when you beat John Ruiz, he was on the other person, I would have thought, as a heavyweight, really, because he was the youngest heavyweight champ ever.

And to be honest, I probably was the lightest. Who I started lighter than anybody. Only junior middleweight to ever win heavyweight title, so I was the smallest guy ever come up with a heavyweight title.

How much did you weigh when you fought Ruiz? 200, 200. Wow. And so did you think when you were getting ready to fight, what do you walk around at right now?

Now I'm heavier than I was then. Really? Yeah. Now walking out I 220. Sometimes 220. I've been up to 220.

So do you feel good at 220 or would you like to be lighter.

I met about 210 this year. I want to be right there have passed. There were still a lot of mobility, not too much weight on these knees. So I feel pretty good at 210. So I think I will stay around this area.

That's not much different than him because when he was in his prime, he was about 215. I mean, he was a light heavyweight, you know, for a lighter rather heavyweight, a light explosive, heavy.

Yeah, super super explosive here.

So it's like size doesn't really matter what, Mike.

I mean, it mattered because I knew I was going to push a little bit the whole with Mike sized Mike's.

Would it matter now when you decided to go up and fight Ruys for the heavyweight title? Did you think that was one and done? Or did you think once I win that title, maybe I'll defend it a few times? Like, what was your thoughts getting ready for that fight?

So as you know me, I'm a man of my word. I try to be. And I said, I want to go do what Bob Fitzsimmons did.

But I was going to add a little bit to it because I was also supernaturally champion, which was a division that wasn't around when Bob Fitzsimmons did this in 1896. Well, about this time of day, it was he wanted middleweight title, the light heavyweight title, the heavyweight title, and then he recaptured the light heavyweight title. Hmm. That's a big segment of the whole thing, recapturing the light heavyweight title. So if I go up and do what I did when the heavyweight title and don't recapture the light heavyweight title, I can't look you in my in your eyes and say, I deal with Bob Fitzsimmons because I did write a report of what he did.

But the hardest part is to come back from heavyweight and recapture that light heavyweight title. That's why I came back and did it. But before I departed the heavyweight division, I would have thought Mike Tyson, because of what I told you earlier, he was the youngest heavyweight champ of all time. To me, he was one of the most explosive, entertaining guys you want to see because you never know what he's going to do. And it's the same reason I'm going in with him right now, because he's explosive, entertaining, and you never know what he's going to do.

I mean, both of you were in that Nas song. You know that song. Yeah. The new Mike Tyson. Roy Jones. Yeah, that's a line. Exactly. Yeah. I mean, very similar in that regard that you both were so dominant over your divisions when you were in your prime that those fights were like executions. Of course. Why didn't that fight take place back then?

Because nobody ever saw me coming to a heavyweight back then. And by the time I did it, he was already on the way out of boxing. Yeah, it had departed. So people say I think they say someone told him that I was awful for me in fight Mike Tyson. No, I wasn't. If I was over for me, we've been fighting. I mean, I tell people today, like, they always talk about what's going on with the zone and all these fighters.

Listen, man, if I was in today's tour and I was Roy Jones, Sam Jones, I am if they told me Roy will pay to me per fight for fire fights, we get to pick the opponent, as a matter of fact, doing well by picking opponent. Y'all call me Tim. What? They don't fight well, we don't fight it.

And I don't care who is. Just tell me who wins the fight and what we don't need to be. I believe it. I mean, that's who I thought was right. When they talk about I would have thought I know if they would ask me for me and if I would just say, yeah, I would have done where we were. That's how bad I want to fight them back then.

People love to talk, though. Yeah. They say stupid shit. Yes, it makes sense. But that's just that people need something to talk about.

I know, but I'm just say I'd be willing to clear it up because I was not money to fight my back then I would have been if I would have out of what might be. I wanted to fight my he's already out of. But I was like, no, I'm not giving you out opportunity. I'm first of all, I'm a small guy coming up to the heavyweight division. I don't belong up here anyway. I just want to do what Bob Fitzsimmons did approve.

I could do or see if I could do it, cause Shuai Robson try to win a light heavyweight title and he passed out. Yeah. So he didn't win it. So of course we always want to try or challenge ourself. I want to see what it's got. Woodroofe, you can't win the heavyweight title and I really that good as good as I think I am. Maybe I am. Let's find out. How difficult was it to get from 200 pounds to go all the way back down to 175?

That was the hardest thing I ever did in my life. Twenty five pounds of muscle. Yeah. Put on my makeup. That's the difference.

Because if you look at you when you fart ruys, there was nothing to be lost. Twenty five pounds of pure muscle to that first fight. I want all your heart. We talk, yeah, pure heart that's killing people, and I have people even text me and call me and tell me, you know, I was a fan, I liked you, but like you a whole lot more now because I realize what you really are. I never knew you had that big of a heart.

That was a big transition for you. I mean, and maybe a bad transition to go from heavyweight down to light heavyweight again, because you could see physically you weren't the same because of that week. You were struggling. And that was the talk of all the commentators who were like, what is what is happening to his body that he's going from 200 pounds, ripped down to 175 and then competing.

I mean, you must have cut an extreme amount of weight for the weight. And that was this the day before Wayans or the day of, oh, day before.

But it didn't matter because I had pulled so much muscle off. So you could you can't put that back. Right. You know, I mean, so I couldn't put that back. But that was what was so ironic about that, is that as weak as I was. He still couldn't get me out because my mind said I got to do a puppet. Timothy did. I mean, so because my mouth locked on something, you can't keep me out of my mind, locked in.

I was weak as I probably ever have been. My man said, no, we're going to get this and I get it.

And then you wind farm again. Yeah, I probably shouldn't have called my body hadn't came back yet. And I and I didn't have nothing metal to get out the door call people say, oh he Hardtalk I ask you to fight. Nobut so I wouldn't be fighting against you one but I had nothing to gain so it hard.

So he calls us got lucky. It's called good but hey it's boxing. You know, for me though that first win was one of the most impressive wins in my career because it's the first time I have had to win a fight with strictly my heart.

Because your body just wasn't provided, wasn't there. Now when you were walking around after the ruys fight, like what did you what did you weigh when you started cutting down for the top two or three, two or three? And how did you do it? Like what did what kind of were you doing? Crazy cardio. Like what were you doing to try to lose all that weight?

Crazy cardio is the only way I ever did it all the way I ever did. I run to some power three times a day of the week there. Yep. That's all we ever lost.

One of our suits, the whole daughter. Dan, what kind of impact must I have had on your body? Well, that's what people fail to realize. Now, Hicky is talk about how we couldn't make way that we couldn't, man. Don't tell me that of an old school. Don't tell me that this new school stuff, you couldn't lose a pound. Don't tell me, man. When I was amateur, well, amateur, my dad made me go down to 147 for the eastern Olympic trials.

I felt that. And I made 147. I fought that night. I got I got out the fight. I'm going to get this gear. I was the one hundred and sixty five pounds I had to fight the next day I won for. So I had to make it the next morning. Wait a minute. Ran all night. Seven thirty, the next morning, I got Arruda to one forty eight and a half. And I say I can't go no more, Madeley, why you can't lose money, you lose their power.

No, people have to know because it hit me. It was God talking to me. I know God talk to me. How are you going to do this every night? And for me, you know, it's going to be cold, you know, rain. You're not going to know where to go and that you're not going you might not even be allowed to go out or in an area you are. So if you make the Olympics this week, how are you going make weight even though you have a 147 to 165?

Yeah, that's a big jump.

Then back down to one four, eight and a half. Oh, and you tell me y'all can't lose power to power.

Get out. So was that when you made a decision to go up? Yeah, I was already up. He made me come down, you know. How old were you then? Seventeen. Oh, so your body's just starting to get it to you feel now. Eighteen. That's yeah.

It's I think one of the big problems with me as opposed to boxing is there's a very limited number of weight classes. Yes. I think there's a lot of fighters that ruin their body, cutting too much weight and going down.

I hear about these guys. Sometimes they get so dehydrated, they pass out. I had to happen to me before, you know. Yeah. So I understand. I know how it goes, but there's a science to it and there's a limit that you should do it, too. But you got to know the science and know the limit to how far you can go.

You don't ration it out, then it's better for you.

Yeah, there's a lot of guys that are very good at it, but ultimately the damage that it does, particularly to your kidneys, it's just it's not worth it.

I wish Mae had more weight classes. I don't know if boxing is the right number because, like, there's a lot in boxing. You know, sometimes it's like forty seven. Fifty four. Sixty, sixty eight like it. There's so many weight classes. Yeah. But there's a good argument that that's better. You look at boxing, there's so many super fights that can be hard to because there's champions that are so close to each other. Yeah.

A few pounds here or there is better because it gives a lot more people the opportunity to become to become world champions. But at the same time, like you said, it could have been done eight week classes. Only the strong will survive to get a collage of some of these people champions, they get cut out real quick.

So do you think it would be better that way?

I know it would be the way I want to hide it from mean fallout from dreaming we ought to have. We always had a winning strategy midway because my dad wouldn't let me type one, and I knew I was outgrowing class. So I thought I would fight Giovinco Rossi early because if I can fight Rossi now, make it tighter because I'm going to be stated this week. No way. And he didn't let me do it, but I would have had time off from 54 already, have we?

Wow. That would have been unprecedented, of course, what made you go from 68 to 75?

I ran out of competition. I always just went to where the competition was or at that beat. James thought. Pazienza I think they need to give me the best deal. But Tony Thorntons and Nawaat contended that really the world didn't know that the world knew which was Luxembourger Geotech guy, Reggie Johnson type guy. Right. So I went say I lived there where I would sit in the fire to make bigger, better fights. Those guys were all bigger than me, too.

But I went where I had to go to make fights.

So like people often, I mean, this guy got used to Coach G, I can think of is able to achieve, said it should have worked a long time ago and tried and rewards on eight pounds. Right. But think she he's too learn to do that. We find 68 now.

Yeah.

You Sammy Canelo went from 54 to 75. So how you tell me he didn't say oh you did against ball might a ball ever.

Gaetane turned into a hard and fast joint Jamestown's career before me and went to Griffin did it so knocked out McCrorie you feel me so you Temmuz a bomb. Yeah but I find it odd but like you say, look at us now getting knocked out.

Dunkirk Dr. Curtis. Right. Yeah. That Dunkerque knocked out made me so sad.

I was a giant Darkthrone fan and I was rooting for him. I got my shoes on him rent runnin around like three miles and I came home and I said I am never investing that much in a fighter again because it was like I lost because I remember he caught him with that left hook to the body and the left chin and. Oh, no. And see, Donald laid out on the canvas.

I was like, fuck, because when Donald knocked out McCrorie when when Donald knocked out Milton McCrorie I remember thinking like damn like he is so fast you know he was, he was the cobra you know.

What was it. The Cobra. Oh he was so fast. And then when he got Kayode like that I was like I can't believe this is happening. I had to go running.

I know it was bad before for able to set I for a ball. No I mean. So it was an animal. Yeah.

To me, you know, Covered Hopkins, you've got a, you know, an animal, but you cover up what you're not doing because the trilogy was good. We say it was one more week that know came to him. I mean to me out of opportunity. Yeah. If he'd won, he'd become one of the panther.

You can't say John Ruiz, the greatest heavyweight of all time, but he was no bum.

No, he wasn't. He'd be. Hold it. Yeah, exactly. Not go into it now. Right hand with two or three people qualified. Holyfield that. Yeah. He's one up. He's a tough guy. Yeah, of course. He was a very tough guy.

It's just you had the style to beat him.

He just couldn't compete with your speed and your fluidity and your understanding of distance. Yeah. You just controlled that fight.

I try to teach guys every up, every way, every aspect of boxing so that you understand some guys because you're tall, you're going to have a fight close. Sometime, because they are guys that realize you're tall and they know they got to get close to you to win, that's their best opportunities. Hagler Hearns. So you've got to get close. Yeah. Look ahead with the. Yeah.

Took him up on her, try to track her, knows how to fight close to day. He's not in a condition to fight close for a long time because that's not what he trains doing.

Well, Haggler had a ridiculous chance. It was ridiculous. Granat ridiculous. Granat. Yeah, yeah.

It was one guy knocked him down but it was a bullshit knocked out of the entire career. Yeah. Who was it that knocked him down.

I'm trying to remember the name. I don't, I don't remember the do.

Juan role, Dan, was it amigo wondering what might have been one role there and then Haggler eventually stopped? Yeah, I know. I heard of the Araminta pasta. Oh yeah. I was I was I was sitting here because those days were the real days of boxing. Oh, yeah. I was one champion. Maybe too close to one champ. You knew who the champ was at every week.

I remember when they started at an IBF, WBA. And how many champs are you going to see?

My my point, though, is here's my problem. I don't have a problem. You have a more champs, but why not make every champ had to fight one another to find out who is the champ? Right. When I was like, have I had seven of the eight known available bills and of I didn't have the eighth one because I wouldn't go on to Germany to take all my seven bills for that one built. And they robbed me because I got robbed in Seoul, Korea.

So I learned my lesson. I can't go way over there to fight Dariusz and I'm the man right now. He needs to come see me. Yeah. If you're offering by me to come see me, he turned it down. So what does that tell you? You don't want to smoke.

But if I could have got it. If I could have got it, I had every bill alive because that's where. So I feel like any fighter that is aspiring to be champ or is champ, if you don't want everybody in your weight class, you don't think you're the best.

Yeah, it should be. If you can't someone a world champion, they really should fight the other world champions. If you're going to have a bunch of different sanctioning bodies, they should if they're available, they should have to fight it every year.

The East it with the NBA, they put a championship every year, the AFC, NFC in football every year, the American League National League every year.

So it's like, come on, baby, at some point we got to put somewhere. Y'all got to show me who the real man. Yes. And that's what I want to do. That's what I had. I was seven that I knew. And I care what you could to put in it, let on them if they were known, believed that you can call me. Tell me y'all got a president. I need that.

Yeah. It was simpler times back in the day for me. It was one champion and in each week last.

But you got to also understand that a lot of this stuff happens because of promoters. I'm sure because I was doing my own thing, I could do what I wanted to do when I got rich. Yeah, I tell ya. Called me. Yeah. And they hardly get a fight over what you just call me a either call me or get a bill. I don't care what bill it is. It could be the national Wal Mart bill. I have.

I won't do it. Yeah.

When you go back to the Haggler days, like how many Beltz were there, it was only one or two. Then maybe I won't be a day, I think.

Yeah, yeah. You know, when I watch the other day Haggler versus Mugabe, that was again, that was a good fight. Mugabe was good. Well, in PBS, he was up ahead with him.

There's a time in the fight where he hits Hagger with an uppercut. Yeah. Snaps Haggar's head back and Haggler just right back at him right back. Like it was nothing like I didn't even work.

Haglof was in my dynomite. Doesn't that I learn things from as a kid. And what I learned from Haggler was consistency. He wore the same maroon white trunks and the same Marvin Hagler every time. Yeah. Yeah. If you had guess what. Going to get Hegner. Yeah, yeah.

He was orquesta so disciplined too. So discipline. Yes. I think he was training from a stop at Hamshire. I forget who is training for but was when I was a kid I was living in Boston and I was, I was watching this thing. They had him on the news where Hagler was running down the Cape Cape Cod in the wintertime, run in the sand dunes, screaming war. Mm hmm. And I got chills. I got goosebumps just watching, like, just the discipline that man had.

He was never out of shape.

He sucked this about the whole training camp. Oh, yeah. Every day.

Every day. Every day. He just had what a mind he had. I mean, he just was so it was just so fierce, you know, as a champion.

But once again, see what I liked about people like Marvin. He was so consistent that not one time did not make weight. Right. He went, want to meet you. He wasn't going down to meet you. Right. Meet him at 160 sixty. He offered health care. What your name is. Yeah, 160.

Come on. Yeah. And I love the fact that when he fought Sugar Ray and I kind of gave it to him. I mean I have to watch it at the top. I'd have to watch it again now as an adult. But I remember when I watched it back then, I thought he won the fight and he just said, that's it, I'm done. Never came back, went to Italy, started making movies. You ever watch some of those movies?

I know watching, but I see him every now and then and they're hilarious. He's still in good shape. He looks pretty good. He talks great.

Yeah. I mean, he has no problems at all. None whatsoever, which is amazing. Yeah. It's beautiful to see someone get out clean of course.

And have a new life after. Yes. Yes. But for me, for Marvin I thought if I looked at it as an adult too, I thought the fight should have been called a draw, at least at best. And. I understood why Sugar wanted because sugar paint a picture before the fight. I'm not even supposed to be in here. Right, right. You know, damn thing he did. He's going to get two points for Hegel and he was going to get one.

Yeah, because sugar paint a picture to the public that I'm not even supposed to be in here with this most.

It's always a problem judging underdogs, right? If you mean so, that's that's why. And the fans, he also knows how to play with the crowd. Yeah. So Sugar use his brain and got the decision that night. But if you look at the actuality of the fight, it was a draw or you could have gave the hagood. But because he was champ. Yeah, but I was looking at it as an adult, I would have probably scored a draw.

But both of them put on an immaculate fight that like it was a beautiful fight for me because sugar came back and like I said, he painted that picture like I shouldn't even be in here. And he was really phenomenal for what he had been all five years. So he made it look like I'm defeating. And everything he did, he did it to such a high level that it made it look like he did pick up.

When you were coming up, did you watch a lot of films of of the greats? Well, I only watched a few guys, and I could tell you a lot of the guys I watched one was I used to watch Salvador Sanchez every opportunity I got because to me, he was the best offensive medic of all.

What a tragedy. That guy died so young.

Yes, because my dream fight this why this is why I get so pissed off about fights not having like right now I'm mad because Coldfoot and Spens aren't getting the opportunity to fight. Another one of my dream fights was Sabio PetroSA versus Salvador Sanchez, both of the featherweight champs.

One but two steps between the two featherweight champs, the best at the division. I want to see them lock up, see who wins, because I love both of them. I love PetroSA because of his Bollo punches and because of his knowledge and say he's real smart, but do it against the ring. Right.

But Salvador has so much offense. I wanted to know how was he going to keep Salvado off of him with the it. Yeah. And then Salvador unfortunately was killed in a car wreck and that, that, that just blew my makeup right away. That was my big fight, probably besides her. That was my other mega mega fight.

To me, the original horns is an all time. Yeah, just an all time. Yeah.

When Angelo Dundee's in the corner wanted to blow in a kid and he goes out and wins stops.

God damn that was epic. Oh that was epic.

Especially because Hearn's at 147 could hit people and knocked him into another fucking dimension.

What not to her credit he could do that one sixty. He didn't want to derail him.

He did it to derail the effort to do it to a better three. Yeah. Oh no. That they knocked away and now it's the one day he's he faceplant to my cold cold.

He had that snap because he had that wide torso, shoulders been weisburd talk that punches there.

But to show you how much how much mental it is, sure. We would take the punch line. Nobody else. Yeah. Yeah. That's a step in the script. I think she drops a few times. And second, Mike, but the first position we took, all he took, it cost him because they had such a beef.

Mm hmm. That was his right. Yeah.

Well, he had known that this was the fight that he had to win for greatness, you know, and it was it was so much I mean, it's hard for people to imagine how big Sugar Ray Leonard was.

Like people don't know the sport of boxing when he was the Olympic champion.

And he was I mean, was it he did seven up commercials, some Sprite, Sprite, and he was huge.

And this was when boxing was on ABC.

NBC Sports. Yep.

I mean, people don't know there was no cable back then. It was giant. He was America's superstar. Yes, he was. And Tommy Hearns was an assassin.

Killer, assassin. Killer. Yeah.

The two of them getting together was one of those who knows fights.

You know, it's like you get them occasionally today.

You know, I see this what hurts me about the Olympics right now, but that they did it to me to lose the integrity. See, I follow them from the Olympics. I follow Howard Davis Jr from your left. If you I mean, these guys were incredible to me because they set a precedent for me. They made me want to go represent my country one day at the Olympics, the entire pro and do like they did and become somebody.

Yes, they draw me a blueprint to follow you, me, Muhammad Ali, all them. George Foreman. They draw us a blueprint to follow their Olympic blueprint, mishandled because that was the epitome of the Olympics with the highest level of amateur sports. If you can get there, get there and represent your country, you're doing something. If you're me, you're on your way and then you have robbed me.

Well, remember, that was like the doorstep to professional stardom.

That's why I say Meldrick Taylor now Whittaker, Evander Holyfield. The one class they had a remarkable. Yes, they had a heck of a class, Leo Randolph. Yes. What a class.

Even even a guy from my area, Jackson was on that team and everybody was following that when those guys left the Olympics and when they were on the podium with their medals.

And then they went on to their pro careers on that team, he was going to say, OK, well, another great team. But watching those guys leave the Olympics and go on to superstardom, that was what you wanted to see.

That's what our that's what the normal trajectory was.

You look at you go from the Olympics to superstardom and now it's like we don't even have to know who all made it to the Olympics.

No one knows anymore, you know, but also, like the Olympics have gotten. I don't know if you ever saw that movie Icarus. Did you ever see them? I don't watch many movies. So a documentary that Brian Fogel did on the Olympics, it's a crazy documentary.

And the documentary starts out where he's a cyclist and he wanted to do this race and do the race clean and then get someone to show him how to dope and then do the race doped and see what the difference was.

So he does the race clean and then he employs this Russian cat who was responsible for Olympic doping in Russia. And they show he shows them how to do it. Now, along the way, they find out that there was something at the Sochi Olympics where a lot of the athletes had they had done something where they had built a hole in the wall and they had taken the dirty piss, snuck it through the hole in the wall and replaced it with clean piss.

They figure out how to work it.

So all these athletes that were supposedly clean were on steroids. And so it happened in the end. So you see that and you realize like.

What happened to you? What happened in the Beijing Olympics? It's so politicized, it's it's become such a big thing for the country that they're willing to do all kinds of shenanigans to bribe judges. Like if those judges that ruled it against you weren't bribed, I would be stunned.

Of course they had to be. They had to be. There's no way. I mean, someone told them to do that.

There's no other way that makes any sense now as well.

But it's you know, it's a problem anyway, that amateur sports like one of the things that drives me crazy about the Olympics is how much money it brings in. But the athletes don't get any money. None, none, zero to like college sports.

A lot like college sports, a lot like college sports and college sports. Even worse, maybe.

Right, because you can't even they can't even say, hey, we're going to hook you up in an apartment and nothing.

You can't say nothing. Nothing.

Yeah. Meanwhile, they're making billions. Yes. It's dirty.

It's ridiculous. It's really dirty. I mean, I don't know how they should distribute the money, but they should distribute the money somehow. I mean, come on, you want a top athlete to come to a school that's going to add to school credibility. Then why did he have to not be able to make money off of it?

Yeah, and if someone wins the Olympics, if they dedicate years of their life for this one goal and they win, they should make some fucking money.

Now he is a man and got robbed and they got nothing for it. Yes, I got robbed twice. You got double robbed, literally. I got robbed twice and all the people that put that on, they all made a shitload of money. Yeah, and they do it right now. They're making money off of it right now, of course. And what are they going to do with the Olympics now with no audience? Because that's a it's a weird thing now with the UFC.

It's a weird thing now with boxing. This these fights with no crowd are very strange.

It's very strange to me. I don't know how. I mean, the crowd meant so much to me. That is like that's why when they move to fight, I would like you know what? I don't know, I'll give him a chance to go get even more ready now when he's the bigger guy and we got a little crowd. So I came look over there and see somebody saying, yes, go get him, champ.

Set me up, you know?

I mean, so you have one heightmap, at least a few of you. Yeah, yeah.

I got to have a few of us sometimes just the least little thing can get that thing going.

When you were fighting, did you ever look into out? Really. I want to I want to know that you're enjoying yourself. If I'm not giving you something to make you enjoy yourself, then wasting your time, I shouldn't be out there. That's how I feel. If I'm boxing for you, that's worth anything. If I'm doing something for you and I'm not making you excited or happy that you're doing it, then I'm wasting your time.

Hmm. Yeah, well, at the end of the day, it is entertainment. Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

So if I entertaining you and waste your time, there was a certain time in your career where you had to do other shit to entertain, to like you. You thought you played a basketball basketball game and then fought that night. Yeah. Who's ever done that before? Nobody. Nobody. Nobody.

I mean, that was part of the thing you had to do to entertain because you were so dominant. You had to get people to pay attention in different ways because they're just destroying people.

You want to make them feel like there's an op. There's a chance that you give this guy a chance. Yeah. So if I paint a basketball game, gives him a chance. Right. Because, you know, you guys usually play basketball. Julich shouldn't be rested like they should be in a twelve round title fight. Right after the fight, this guy went on to win the Super Bowl, had a hit of three three years. Who was that against?

Eric Lucas' from Canada.

OK, hit it for three years.

But it's a didn't fight. No, this guy after that game fight. He went and won the WBC super middleweight title and here for three years, it's funny that it still bothers you that people say he didn't fight.

We're done with a bottle of just if are back with some Tagert items to augment with a regular Joe Rogan. Shoshana.

I mean, do you remember when Jordan was was it was it was it Hall of Fame or was it when the is when he got up there and he's just talking shit about all the writers talk shit about it over the years.

It's funny, but I think that for all the greats, like there has to be something that's that's pissing you off, something that you're fighting against, it can't there's no way you can have peace of mind and still have the drive to succeed and to conquer the way the all time greats do.

The all time greats have to have a chip on their shoulder. Yeah, if you don't have a chip on your shoulder, then you're not going to be able to reach the heights or take the measures that it takes to become an all time great. Yeah. Me, I had two chips. They robbed me at the Olympics and I had a father that I separated from that I know in my heart didn't really want me to succeed without him. So those were my chips.

And because I had those chips, I can't lose because if I lose, he win games, you understand me?

So in my prime, if I lose, he wins because he said I can't do it at home. And in my life, the way I was taught when I was brought up, I got nothing against my dad. I don't know. He's got so much to me. God prepares you to get me to a certain level.

But God took those roosters. God took a guy named Charlie Kemble, and you would know Charlie Campbell because he was a boxer back in the amateur boxer. But God showed me so much to Charlie Campbell that to this day I still speak to Charlie Campbell, because without Charlie Campbell, I might have never gotten to be Wall Street. Really. Charlie Campbell taught me so much about charisma. That my father could never have taught me. That it was unbelievable.

To calm will be all my father's fighters as amateurs, that will be his weakness. Easily, almost every time because he had charisma. Now they were better than him. But he had charisma. He beat them with their charisma, Halliburton with charisma, because he believed in himself, he had confidence.

He knew how to do stuff that made me love watching him. Yesterday, he wasn't the best puncher. He didn't have the best boxing skills, but his emotions, he breathed everything he did, even though he was tapping, he had sharp breath with just to me and to me after, wow, he'd beaten these guys, the almighty. So they learn. They learn, but they can't have that kind of charisma because my dad won't allow them to beat them people.

He won't allow them to perform with that kind of confidence just in me.

So I need to learn how to work he doing because back in Iowa, he doing to what we doing now, I guess.

How do you incorporate it? Well, I thought doing stuff he did a little bit of it.

I figured out what it really was. Yes, there was still some Gretton some in the morning.

He did. Why are you fighting to show that you have birth control? I when you hear Brusic who try to do stuff like the boxing match that has pushed for nearly as effective when nearly as effective as the sound world, but he kept on being in tune with the sound, so it made him look way better than he really was. And he won the fight against these guys because these guys don't know how to do that.

So after copping some of it, not all of it, but I thought to an end to my stuff when I met him, it became here for all the kids in the area, really?

What was.

Somebody can't teach me and he be my dad if I. And to me, these guys are older than me.

I'm 12. They 17. He beaten them, so they ought to be better at what we're doing than I got the older and bigger than me, right?

He'd be new. No, I got to get that. So I got it.

So was it also like you obviously had animosity with your father? There was there was this so you were looking for other ways to do it, too?

No, I had to find other ways. Guy had talked to me in other ways. I've got to speak to him about the ways here. Here's the real deal. Where people do understand there's nothing against my father is just kind of our destiny, right? When our line is this way, I tell people that nature is also a Bible, right? When a lion get a certain age data, kick him out, he got to go. You've got to get your own private, because this is my part and it's kind of how my father worked.

So it's like at a young age, I knew I was going to have to go because just the way things shaped up, you understand me. So me growing up, watching, even these guys watching before me, I watched all of them get to the age. But my dad would never I would never allow them to be as confident and as charismatic as Charlie Campbell was because he didn't allow it, because he was his boss.

He's the boss.

He was in control of everything, but he ain't got to fight nobody. So then after the 76 Olympics, God gave me a second confirmation how Davis Jr. won the Powerball. I mean, he was the best bet at the Olympics.

But he probably was the only one of them gold medalist, they didn't become world champion. Hmm. Why? Because it did. It made him wait too long. So he waited so long that when he finally found Jim, what, he couldn't beat Jim Webb because in Howard Davis, the fire, his dad, his dad, the fire is still there. But guess what? He didn't get a fight, right? How does he understand me? That was my second confirmation that when I get old enough, I got to go.

Yeah, you understand. So it's was like I thought, I understand. And like I said, nature has always been my Bible. So people always say why you love animals, why you love chicken. That's where I learned God's teachings from, because God made those animals. And people can't change against me.

You can do them. But when you knew them, you changed to a whole nother animal.

Right. And to me, society, sometimes that's what they're trying to do. If they try to. Numerous. Yes. So dangerous we don't fight back.

Well, that's a giant thing with men today. This from 20. That's what toxic masculinity and all that bullshit. This war I'm trying to they try to mentally neuter.

Yes. When they knew it. When you knew a horse, he becomes. Blending, he again, he won't he'll fight back no more, he don't care anymore. So it's like if you neuroma, he becomes nothing. He don't care anymore. He won't fight back. He and then, of course, he ain't got no what God gave you took it up. You fear me. And to me, that's. Emotionally, mentally, what they try to do without doing that.

So that was a problem to me. And my father also had people say, well, why are you so against what's going on? Well, to me, that's what he was trying to. But what I learned is that it's going to take you down that road to go to hell. When I was a kid. Right. We want squirrelled. Squirrel, there will be some squirrel that will have a penis, but no balls. Because others call bit their balls of the dead, the daddy did it, it did happen, yes, about anywhere from 10 to 25 females.

Every time one of them have a little babies, he goes nuts, had all the meals because he wants no competition.

But you got what you got. No, I get it. So this shows me.

He can't do it physically, but this week, doing what's new to all these other guys are talking about. For me, they can't be held accountable because they're getting tired of cameras instead.

Yeah, he better than them hearing stronger than he beat a better bunch of them.

But in his mind, he's a stud mom and they're mad.

They're gearings. My dad has made them. So he meant to beat them down so low that they had no real fight back in them because they got to be second to my father first. I can't be that guy. You're going to rule the world.

You never seen a getting rude word inbreeding. You understand me. You understand me. Now you see some fast gearings because they just fast, naturally, but they're not going through the past because once you cut the ball that he's no more man. Yeah, you feel me. So it's like I'd be saying, you know, it's like nothing personal against Nabarlek. You do what you want to. But for me, I couldn't be world champion if I let my father make me getting mentally and emotionally damaged so I could not stay there and become again like I watched them do before me and expect to be Jones that, you know, today, it just couldn't happen.

That's a difficult balance with some trainers, right. Because some trainers were fighters and they're tough guys. Yep.

And they don't want to let the other guy surpassed them. Yeah.

That's a lot of one of the reasons why a lot of fighters don't make good trainers, and that's why a lot of father son relationship don't work as a fighter because the father won't let the son grow up. And in order to stop it from growing up, you got to almost turn him into a kid. Yeah. So he'll go for anything in that fight. You bet.

Yeah. It usually works out in a weird way. It's very rare that a father son fight coach combination works.

Lomachenko, they do a good job. Yeah. Yeah. Well his dad is an unusual cat. Yeah. His dad told him you're going to just dance for two years. Like what? I think it might have been more than two years. It is God's gift.

Yeah. Well I like lot like Joe idea was would give to these guys. Never boxed but they made world champions. I thought they knew they seen as something and they knew what it took to get in there.

The fact that he told his son to take up Ukrainian dancing. And then you look at Lomachenko footwork, it's off the charts.

So God gave him a vision before us, got to where he was going. He showed him way, way before he gave my father the same vision, just that my father's personality wouldn't allow him to enjoy the fruits of that vision.

Did you ever resolve it with your father? No, never. No. Is he still alive? Oh, yeah. Wow. He talked at all? No. Damn, that's got to be weird for him.

No, no. We have him. We understand he's a lion and I'm a lion. I understand. But when I saw Roy Jones Jr..

Yeah. He went when you're a boxing trainer and your son is one of the greatest of all time and he doesn't talk to you, that's got to fuck with you.

Well, he don't talk to you because you don't want to talk to him. Right. So it's not like he don't he wouldn't talk to me if you want to talk to him, but you don't want to talk to him, so you don't talk to him. You're not going to change. You don't talk to you. Why would he?

I couldn't. Me personally, as a father, I couldn't I couldn't handle that.

I couldn't handle with none of my kids why they may raise my kids without raising me. All my kids. We talk my kids can talk to me about anything. I'm as I'm like you as a father. I couldn't handle that either. But sometimes there are sacrifices.

But sometimes a guy like you has to come out of a situation like that. You have to fight your way through the struggle of being dominated by your father to become your own man. And then that's one of the reasons why you're such a bad motherfucker. If I didn't beat that, I never made them boxing.

No. Sean O'Grady is telling me all the time he did one thing that never could do, I suppose that show that you can walk away. Say, I thought, God help me. This would be great. So I had to walk away and look where I am now. Indeed. Indeed.

What does it feel like after like you've already you're already at all time. Great. You're already Hall of Famer and now you're getting back into the ring again.

Like, what does that feel like? Is it exciting?

Because it is a new feeling right now. I got to I'm here. I got to tell them I've got to go to Roy Jones. I just saw that come to get a shirt like Augie Firestone, that compromise that, you know, I must have forgot to be. Exactly.

So it's like for me, it's a whole new game. Now, you got to do a bit more promoting stuff. You got to try to do a little bit more media work. I come to you because you always supported me. You've been is one of the people that ever known as far as being a Roy Jones person.

I would calm you if I were doing nothing but having a Mike Tyson fight for us to talk about. Yeah. What better time to come see you for me. So they always I've been trying to get him. I said I want to wait till we got something interesting to really talk about.

Oh yeah. Cause we good people. You are good people. So I want something big when I came in and that gets them. So having this Mike Tyson fight, it has its advantages. Although I tell you the timing is always a disadvantage, but it does have its advantages because now we get to have a great conversation first with me.

If I listen. I appreciate it. I'm happy to talk to you any time, any place to feel.

What is it like, though, when you see like now Holyfield's thinking about coming back? He's training hard. Oscar de la Hoya, who that could be a fight for you, too. Like if you decide to keep going with this, that's someone who's more your size as well. Yeah, he's more of my size.

But he look at me like I look at him like he's you know, he's to be well, he fought some middleweights ready for Bernard.

That's not saying that. That's not as you see that that's that's that's quite a middle way.

So, I mean, yeah. Well, you know, they look different than me and they're they're different than Mike. It's like when you look at it, the true fact is that. If you ask people and you can put the highlights up right now, say look at this guy, this guy, this guy, this guy at the time who they all look at again, they go look at Mike Tyson again, Roy Jones again, and they go look at Roy Jones again for his career.

Don't look so much crazy stuff that you know how in the world not only do like you say, it's a basketball game for fight. Met them in a man, bring them to the ring.

He got me Radio City Music Hall.

Come where Jones got so much stuff that he can win a debate if you Mike Tyson probably. Right. I had caught my attention, got some knock out the unbelievable damage.

So is that that's the two most entertaining guys over the last two decades. Without question. Without a question.

Well, you said you learned that move when you put your hands behind your back. Would you not go when you put your hands behind your back?

Now, James. Oh, no, no, no. You are you're right. You knocked him out.

You said you learned that from rooster truth to this, right? That's right. Who else learned shit from Rooster just for what there is to me.

But you've got to understand this Tuesday bit more today. I'm also being on a kung fu movies. Sort of come from movies.

Already got tiger star cranes down. All his ditto delivered all these different things.

So I say, you know, I love Rooster, so let me see if I can incorporate the roosters in the master arms of boxing.

Hmm. Do you think this is one and done? Do you think this Tyson fight is one and done? Does it depend on the outcome or you just have to focus on the fight right now and then decide what else is going on afterwards?

It really depends on how it goes because, you know, I'm like this man. I think Mike is awesome person. And I know Mike has had its ups and downs in the world.

I know Mike is really know he he is much younger than me. So you don't know what, Mike, you don't get right against him. So an exhibition you are prepared for the best you can prepare for and know anything can happen, Mike, to rebel and cut you on purpose. Anything can happen. You don't know. And you try to get him back and he may stop it before you get him back. Then they say, well, you and do a real fight here.

Yeah. I wonder if I might keep it here if that happened. Like, it just hit me before already got played out, I'll just say.

Yeah, because you don't do just anything. I ain't getting it back if you. So I like that if you don't come from.

So now if we go we have a straight up when this time is good.

You know I'm cool that I may be the end that we might, we might turn out like I want everything to be great, you understand me. So maybe a great opportunity.

We be both may put up great performances and we might call it a day. We might be too tired to talk about it.

Oh, we. Oh yeah, that may happen too. But it all really probably depend on the outcome of this. Damn me. Because when you smaller guy and you finally got it, you know, is over here today and over there tomorrow, then you just got to prepare yourself for whatever because you don't know what he made coming in. Do you understand me. So I got to be ready. I mean, I feel safe with these earmuffs on called, you know, let me keep my back to you that you.

Okay, that's the thing about Mike.

You don't know Grace. You don't know while you're famous. You don't know what he might do.

I think he's a different human now. You know, he was he's I've talked to him twice on the podcast. I talked to him once. It was about ten months ago and once just a couple of weeks ago. And he's two different people from those two times.

I'm saying that's just a month. So to Matt, we do in ten days. Well, ten months ago, he was smoking weed. He wouldn't even work out. He said he couldn't work out because he didn't want to reignite his ego. And then he said his wife called him fat.

And then he started work and he said, I got on the treadmill, started doing it for fifteen minutes. Next thing you know, it's two hours. And then he's obsessed again.

And that's ego has been reading this. He says to him, and so now it's of war reignited his ego.

So but they call it an exhibition.

OK, yeah. So anyway, he looks shredded.

Oh, he is shredded. He should go and he's good. He's he's doing right. The ankle DBS ain't playing me so to start doing the right thing. But like I said, everything go good then you know I will have to do it twice. But if it don't go like I want to and they say yeah I will do a real one and give me some tenuousness, go for you tens and would you do ten rounds?

Not ten or twelve. Ten or twelve. I won't move. I can't. I won't. I want to see they got me doing a two minute. Well no that's a two minute run.

That's to his advantage. To everything. To his mean. That's to his advantage to. Why did you agree to it.

I would say at this point the fans are so excited about it, I, I wouldn't want to pull pull the rug from under the fans denatures to me.

Right. Yeah. I mean it's not really worth I'm here so I'm going to these two hours is that I might to figure out a little bit. I might work a little faster than I expected to. Yeah.

Two minute rounds is a different tone, different kind of rhythm. Told a different kind of rhythm.

So yeah, it's weird that they decided to do it that way. Do you think they decided to do that because the September 12th date was only six weeks for him to prepare?

No, they just had this they just decided this last week. Really? I had a chance to phone me back about a week, so it was originally three minute rounds, I thought I guess I read the memo like I said, wow, I it just it changes so much on me.

Me, I mean I mean, I think the WBC came in and say they want to put up some kind of title or something, so they want to put it back to me around it, say something about that or say and shabbiest thing. You fight how Fati they were after the fight and they feel like that's a safety measure. But what they don't realize is that you keep it fresh, that only you keep my first and more dangerous.

That is for me. Yeah. So I get my unfairest quick so we can get out of the danger zone.

But Jablin with Chavez senior, he, he and Orsi I think for a true a true exhibition with headgear and big gloves.

Right. But they say they were so exhausted afterwards that they felt like that is what could inhibit somebody.

Help, huh. Well, how much do they train for it? I don't know. They're making it two different things, so I don't know why. And they could it like I'm telling him, no, that's not right for me because I'm a smaller guy at my best. The best thing best. CAPPOTELLI Right. The longer he goes, the more he wears, the better my chances are. No, you keep him strong first, the more dangerous it is for me.

But so they didn't discuss this beforehand is not a part of the contract.

They just contact you and said they're dropping it down to the commissioner, dropping it down to mineral's. You can pull out permission to do what they say they're you drop down to minimal. You can pull up or you can fight.

This is the commission's idea. Well, I guess they said they're busy, came in and said it along with the commission.

So I don't know if the commissioner told us that because they're busy talking to commission. So maybe this they.

But my point is, that's not good for me. That's good for him.

Again, if you're the big mayor, you have to give him everything you want.

Yeah, I want it to be three minutes. I want to be steaming around. Is safe. Is safe for me. The three minute round.

Yeah. It's just better. It's boxing. It's traditional. It's what it's always been. Guess what do. What are they going to do? Eternal light bickell. When I don't mean bad things happen. You heard I heard you and they turn their lights back on slowly but surely, they turn their lights back on and say, I want to be this person with a shark on to me like this. I thought so. That means trouble. Listen, I'm excited about this fight no matter what, but now more excited about it.

This is going to be a gigantic fight, too.

I mean, I've heard so many people talk about it that are just casual boxing fans that are excited.

I was cool in the beginning, but like I say once, you can only keep morale so much, then the hook comes up. So I see myself turning green.

Well, you always said that that is like two dudes inside of you, right? This Roy Jones Jr. is RJ and they're starting to wake him up. Well, who was R.J. he wanted to be left with?

When did you realize there was like a second person? I've been to it my whole life. Yeah, I've been doing my whole life. I always try to suppress that person because that person will end up in somebody's penitentiary somewhere.

You'll watch him because he really think about or caring about what nobody thinks.

So is this do you think that this you develop this as a way of just just always been inside of you? Or is this how you dealt with certain situations in your life where you had to, like, shut off parts of who you are? I think all real men have it, they just don't know what happened to it, but it never had been pushed to that measure, which is why I say society tried to make us gelding's, because in a man like you, you got two kids, somebody some to your kid and you thought.

Are they coming up against him? I do so as always there, just that you try to keep it suppressed. So I try to keep suppressed, but won't kick me so much. Then he comes home, and once he's to come and guess what, he's like a pit bull, he has no off switch.

Who was it that you fought? You fought this dude, Jack guy shorter guy first. That's right. That's right. Yeah. The second fight, RJ came out. Yes. Yes. That was an annihilation, of course. Yeah. You just hunt them down. Of course. That's who he is. Yeah. So he can just talk. Hegel's words can destroy.

You can destroy. So the first fight would have been the first fight. He got injured. No, I hit him. He went down one knee, but I was short. Right. So I couldn't do down. So I tapped him again and I thought, oh that's right.

That's right. Refuses to accept McGeehan.

He looked at everything that was on crashed on his face. That that's OK.

OK, I take that disqualification, but now it's a little bit harder for me when you do. They give him the title for. That's right.

That's my first loss. If it weren't for that loss, I probably still wouldn't have a loss today. But my first loss. Hmm.

So now rather Olympics. Here I go again. So you know how I feel that, right? Yeah. Now, to get robbed twice or three times. We talked about the Olympic Committee, Robert, also Narborough. Rob Dritan. Yeah.

That's about to get attacked. How many times is RJ come out and five just at want to just one time.

It's crazy talk. Talk crazy me out there. I'm not. You get my title. Why you down face down limit how you can't talk to me like that. And if you left me alone it wouldn't have came up. If you just left alone ago to second fight I would have had to beat him but I wouldn't have beat him like that because. I'm not there, do I try to suppress that part that you feel me, but when they start talking now, you make me be a person I don't want to be.

And I know I'm glad we're friends now. We don't you know, we ain't got no beef no more. We cool. We should shake hands.

He understands and I understand what it's like at that time. You can't talk. When you took my belt while he was face down, you will talk about me too.

No, no. You have always showed great sportsmanship and also control. I remember when you tried to get the referee to stop the Pazienza fine. You were like you looked at the referee like, come on, stop.

He done what you want me to do to the referee wouldn't stop it. And then you just finished it real quick, OK? Yeah. Yeah, it was devastating. But that was an excellent example of you being a good sportsman.

Of course. I don't I don't I'm not that I hurt people. Yeah. That's what I try to tell people not to hurt people.

When you in general, McClellan, General McClellan, who was at the time a destroyer, you know, I mean, he was he was the man that people thought of as being like a great challenger for you. And then he had that fight with Nigel and wound up getting, you know, brain injury and just devastated and was never the same again. How much did that affect you? Because a guy who was your peer, who was a man that many people thought was going to be a rival to you and you guys were eventually gonna have a big super fight?

Yeah. How bad did that affect?

You left me pretty bad, because being that news-journal, we were friends and he did he want me to split the season over me?

And so he was one up and out looking to get that one back, which I got it a bit back when I thought with my shoe in the gym, but I still want it all organized, get back. So I was definitely looking to fight him down the road. But when I if happened, when I saw that fight was happening, I was the only person that said that he wouldn't win that fight. Our only person and people called me the next day and said, how did you know he was not going?

I said, because. He's good, he's a very strong puncher, but putting is all that Nigel really has, she does not believe in boxing skills and I just don't care about boxing skills. Is just what you say is a dog destroy you. You go on to his country, you go in his backyard and you will fight him just like he fights. That's not a good recipe if you have me. And just what I think will be I think it's going to be quite that bad.

I think he's going to end his career. But I thought that he was going to end up losing to Nigel because of the fact that he will fight the wrong fight.

He would fight the style which Nigel Shine's only started, Nigel, because when when he knocked Nigel down the first round, 99 percent of fighters would have been done. Yeah. When he set up through the ropes, it looked like it was over. And that's what Gerard was doing.

And everybody was destroying everybody destroying.

He was what a punter he was and what a classic Cronk style fighter he is.

Tall, long dude, serious power, super, hyper aggressive, both hands. But Nigel Bent fucking take it. You know, he almost had a comeback recently. Yeah. He had some shoulder injuries sidelined the bad part about it.

And that's what we said. We're missing right now. If it was in today's society, Nigel never recovered from that first round like that, because today, with no crowd, he'd hit nothing urgent back home.

But with that crowd here at home, if he get if he has breath in him, he better get up and get his er back in the ring.

Yeah. Yeah, he did. Just didn't survive. But the crowd made him do it. Yeah.

And then when he started taking it to Gerald, I mean that was a crazy Gerald just emptied his gas tank trying to take him out. And there was also another guy who cut a tremendous amount of weight.

Of course, I mean he big for was huge. He probably should have gone up to the light heavyweight even before that. Probably. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And that's what most people thought was going to happen. Oh, yeah. That was that's to me one of the great tragedies of boxing, because it's very rare that an elite top of the food chain world champion, his prime is cut down like that.

It's really only been a couple instances where it puts people on notice, again as to why Fighters X to get paid properly every time they go in the ring, especially against another elite fighter.

Yeah, because tomorrow is not promised. Nobody when you couldn't ring anything can happen at any time. Nobody suspected that that would be Joe McClelland's last fight ever. Yeah, you understand me? No, nobody suspected.

It means to say out there with the guy, the heavyweight that happened to up in New York, he fought the Cuban guy might whatever his name was, I can't remember his last name, but nobody ever suspected that that would be the heavyweight.

Let's remember that. Yeah, I know. I know the fuck you talking about. I can't remember the name. Yeah. Same situation. Yeah.

It's like you never know boxing. You have to take every fight. That's what people say. Well, why do you say to me, you don't know, you know, you get hit by someone like Mike Tyson.

Anything can happen to you. Right. Mike Tyson is not just an ordinary punch. Right. He's one of those guys that could do just that to you. So you should know what you going into a you should be ready for that because this is Mike. Yeah. You understand me. Stamina for me.

I would give them I fight for a living. I feel just like a game would I be to adapt death MassPike? So if you want me to sweat down my hair, I ain't tripping at all because I know that death is a probability. You fear me. So, yeah, that could happen to anybody. And I know it could happen to me more. Going in there with somebody as dangerous as a Mike Tyson problem with me is why I love what I love what I do, what I do because I love boxing.

So if I got in that box and my dad had me, you understand me? What is that the way you'd like to go? Well, I mean, with two other way. I'd rather go with it like a grandpa on the porch if I wish. But if I went that way, I'm not mad at it.

I understand because I know that when I thought it was right, I don't let people get hurt in this. Some people don't make it out of this alive. So if that's how you got to go. You got to know that, but if you hate that game, if you ain't that committed to what you're doing, then you shouldn't be talking about boxing because that's what boxing is.

Yeah, that's a great philosophy to have to go into combat because nobody gets out alive in this life. Can leave some way, but believe it, and you want to talk about a man who's been dedicated to a craft in a sport, I mean, your whole life has been dedicated to his craft and sport. And because of that, you are universally recognized as one of the all time best.

And I can't imagine what it is who were when you all see this goal is to have me go. Yeah, there's a legacy that you've left, no matter what happens, no one can ever take that away from you. Yep, you've accomplished some crazy shit.

Thank you, brother. It is what it is. Right? That's your era, too, man.

I mean, there's so many so many amazing fighters of your era. I mean, you really came up and I mean, boxing is in a good place now. There's a lot of exciting champions and a lot of exciting fights to be made. But I mean, your era was one of the golden areas of boxing.

Yeah, well, you know what? They are the only thing. Like I said, what hurts me now is like I'd be one wanting to see the best fighter fight the best fighters. Like, right now, a good fight. This step is to go fight tanks, but fight, fight Lomachenko battle fight a really good fight. Yeah, you got a stay. But the guy, his opponent hasn't been proven yet to have him on Lopez, but I think he's a really good prospect.

And you if he does get into this fight, it could be really interesting. Yet at the same time, this tell us if it's too early for him because he still has time to grow. He's been he's young. He's a good looking, very good looking prospect. The guy takes pride in it. Just forgive me. I don't know names. I'll remember the name that we have. But he's a pretty good fighter, too, and I don't know that he can to take things power because tanks, one of these guys comes way down a week or two.

So he'll be big. All right. But if he's that big old fight night, it makes it very difficult to take those hammers.

I don't think they those when he throws them. So it's going to be a good fight, too. I can't wait to see that. But I hope that they will pass on tap. And I'm looking forward to. But I still say that right now. The best fight out there. Besides what, Mike? Is Crawford versus. I guess I agree. Yeah, I just amazed not making that happen. I don't know. I'm amazed Spence came out of that car accident unfazed.

So you lost that car flip like that, like Jesus Christ.

God had to be with him. Something was with him, that's for sure. That had to be weird. It had to be something, you know.

And Terence Crawford to me, is one of the most interesting champions alive today, beast mode.

He think like he didn't like me personally. I would think if you want to come and get. I love how he switches stances to.

Yes. I mean, he fights as good from Orthodox as. Yep. And when he decides to switch it up on guys, you see the look on their face when they get confused, like he'll fight two or three rounds one way and then switch it up.

Yeah. And like Hackett used to do that, he actually was a fantastic switch.

One of the best had seen the tape. Crawford. Yeah, yeah.

And Crawford just he's got a mind for the sport. It's like this. You could see when he's putting it on a guy, you know, he just he he's his game as they come.

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So those of us that want to see I have some interesting guys. I got a guy because you make you mom.

I really want to see him. I would want to see him with one of the childhood brothers first.

Mm hmm. And when we get there, I think that would be a very good competitive fight.

You're training. Yes. EUBANKS Yes. And that shows where he's at.

And I think that one of their fight to I can I think I think he's good enough that it's like you can't down a champ. You can't just say, oh, he'll be yeah, I don't do that in boxing because that's not my thing. But we do want to fight the champ, which right now, I think the champ middleweight is a Japanese guy and we need to fight him to fight out, get us a real title. Then we should fight to try to have a unification title.

I fired me then he should fight Canelo to find out who demand weekly is Connel going to stay at sixty eight or is he going to go back and forth between 60 and 75?

I think Canellos going to go with the money fireteam, which is more, you know, just kind of freelance or all been I would signify identified a sixty. I think that's comfortable for him. It's kind of a it kind of reminds me of what I kind of just dominate the area, you understand me? So you get lucky enough to come get high enough in the area.

Here, take he's an interesting cat because like what he's learned from like particularly the Floyd Mayweather Jr. fight. If you watch the way he moves now, like his head movement is so much better than it ever was before, it's beautiful. His defensive skills are so much better than they've ever been before.

Yeah, but to me, that's not the thing that he needed to learn because you have to look at the path to teach you about the future. So if you look at history, who you see, the champ is sincere and God bless today Roger Mayweather. But who you beat Roger because he started chasing Roger at the weekend. He didn't wait and try to outfox Roger because he's never going to outbox Roger. Right. But he's not chasing Roger at the we chased Roger all night.

He ran Roger complete Raggett that he would beat Roger.

Julio did that to everybody. Yeah, but M.G. Taylor. Yeah, but what I'm saying is that the way to beat a guy who's a better boxer. So if you notice, then why don't you think another way to chase Floyd from round one. Right. You don't get injured out boxer Floyd Mayweather.

I mean, think about it now. That's true. You go out and try to out, shoot somebody, go out, shoot labor.

No, I'm not doing that right. No, I'm not that stupid. Larry does best, right? No, I understand.

I think he was a little overwhelmed, you know, because that was a big fight for him, his first real super fight. And he's in there with Floyd, who's a defensive wizard.

Yeah, but you've been you've been pro since she was fifteen. Yeah. So you probably got a little bit more experience in Florida as well. Professional boxing gold. So if you really think about it. You don't outbox the box, didn't Floyd make him suck a lot of weight, too? I think he made him get down like 52 or whatever, but he became during it like I think it was 16 pounds heavier than floor. So if you 16 pounds heavier than him, that tells you that you've got to use the 16 pounds, try to use it against him if you can.

Not saying that he will be flock. Florida's a smart Lord knows how to you change. That's a good thing about Pflugerville. Also, isn't a fighter who knows how to make adjustments, but for your best, for your optimal chances. Yeah, you got to go get some help from round one like Madonna did with Madonna. Didn't flow the first fight. Mm hmm. Yeah. Gave them all kind of problem if I could stay on it. Yeah.

And he got the punch of that.

Canelo you know, he's not as big as Lewis, but my dad was a wild man.

You don't matter. You did. That's the only strategy. That's the only chance commitment. And you're not going to outbox me with it.

Right. Come on. You had to risk losing. That's what I'm saying.

He wasn't at that point, wasn't ready for that. So to say that he's a better fighter. We can say that, but he's far too slow because the older you get, the better you're supposed to get.

Right, but we can't say he's a better fighter until we see him against a guy like Floyd or see him the cause.

I guess he had the same problem with Hitler. OK, yeah. DeLara as he hit the floor because Arizona Delaware is a boxer. Right. So they fight that fight was a fight that some people thought could win either way.

Yeah, I thought maybe one of me. So that don't mean you got better than me, that you were facing different types of competition. Because until you do that and have that style, then we can say you got better. Yeah.

Now he's a great fighter and he brought me here in my top three because I like I love Canal. I think another one the best out there. Yeah, but we can't say we always say he got better after a floor fight. I'm not going to say that necessarily. He got better because he's going to get there anyway because he was going to grow up. What he did, he was when he grew up, most people when they grew up, they get smaller.

So they have to get better.

But I don't think the fluff made it better because he still didn't show me they made in this year just to come back and beat Florida or Florida. Even better fight it for me, because if he'd have Passionflower, he's never going to outbox Floyd.

Hmm. Yeah. Styles make fights. Yeah. What did you win? You stand by the Kovalyov.

I know. I know. I was Kovalev took the fight at a time I thought was bad for him because he took it rather one of the other fights. And it's like to me.

I don't think Kovalev took the fight with the intent to win it. I think he felt like I get a chance. If I can, I'll get good when I take. You think so? I feel like I don't think I see real Kovalev.

I mean, you try to Bartonella me and move, can you? But not the way we can talk to him. It where he told me was the first time.

Yeah, because that we had to beat me with and he turned Kovalev, the question turned to a boxer, I think, and Kovalev, the words always been that he drinks too much.

I hear that. But what I'm saying is, Kovalev, your nickname is to Crusher, right. Why would you let a guy coming up two weight classes make you elevate a diva from where you normally are. You normally called the question. Now you're going to go to the box all of a sudden for a guy to come up to weight classes?

No says no.

I mean, I love Kabulov to death to that. That's my that's my boy. You know, I was there, but I just felt like he fought the whole fight against Karno.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if he was physically capable of fighting any other fight. Well, but like I said, I think he's to me as durable as he used to be.

I agree with that too. But to me, you must fight. The right game plan or you've lost before the fight starts, right? Yeah, true. Well, you're a fantastic commentator, minus one of the things that we really bummed out when HBO died.

I can't believe they took away boxing.

I don't know why HBO did that. I just don't understand where.

And what they told me was that they don't like the fact they are not going to do something. And B, no, they can't be number one, doing. And so I got to I can I can kind of understand it. So what put them into number two? Well, I'm not saying they want to be best.

It was a disaster. I don't know. It was just I have no money and ESPN plus I don't really know if they want to be number one. I don't know so.

Well, I mean, I don't know, man. Between you and with Jim Lampley, Max Kellerman, Max Kellerman, who was fantastic.

You guys did a nice job. It was fun stuff. The commentary team was unparalleled. The best of the best ever. That's what I'm saying.

But like I said, I just feel like maybe they were used to having the champions and because the league champs became dispersed, maybe that was I don't know. But to me, I feel like I can say I feel like. The. Just wanted to be or maybe people that bottom up this, I don't know, I don't know either, but it's a sad state of affairs.

It hurt me. I tell you that it still hurts me to this day. I mean, they have been in boxing for how many years is the 30 plus years? It still hurts me to this day.

And it's amazing that no one has brought that team back like Max Kellerman to this day is not doing boxing commentary that I'm aware of. You do it all.

ESPN does he he doesn't look go. But who's it? Where's Jim Lampley? I don't know.

But they got those two guys or two of the best guys you can work with. And Jim Lampley has a memory that is unparalleled to anybody I've ever met in my life. This guy can look at two people. One time I remember that whole damn page. I almost work for it. I believe it. I mean, I had never seen it like it in my life.

No, he is as good a play by play commentator as has ever lived. Yes, sir. He's phenomenal.

HBO was pretty awesome as an organization because, you know, it's like I built my career there, HBO, and then to be able to be that commentator career that was so fabulous for me. So they were really I mean, it hurt me bad that they got out of boxing because that was like, man, that was really the kingpin of boxing.

Yeah, no, there were there were uncrowned I mean, undoubtedly the ones who wore the crown. Now, do you do any commentary now?

No, I can't. To my contracts over my contracts now over to December. Oh yeah. So after December I could do other here. Are you talking to anybody about doing that? I hope you do.

And I haven't spoke to nobody about it. Yeah. I'm sure at the fans will start speaking to people, but I haven't spoken to anybody yet.

So how did you get involved with Russia? How did you become a Russian citizen? When I read that, I was like, what is happening with Roy? What are you doing, man? I do so much.

My partner got a movie coming out right in that call for Kings, me and Mike Tyson in that movie, too. But I do so much. So I was over at Russia doing fights, doing stuff, and I never realized how big I was in Russia. Just going over there in Russia is like, I'm right of nineteen nineties. Really. Yeah. When I go somewhere it's all hail the king. That's how much know that's how much they love boxing.

Wow, so to go to Russia and to see that you loved that much, I hate to call you as bad as I hate the cold to be revered that much. It's almost like I tell people. I always want to be somewhere that I want to. And if possible, but what is the big key and I'll wait till I tell my kids, don't date a girl, that you won't be good at once, you treat you better. Smart words right there.

So that's very important.

Loves and appreciates me. Hmm. And the US appreciates and love me too.

And get it wrong. No naps in the population in Russia knows me, really? Yes, so it's like when I said you should become a part of us, too, is that it's not to say, oh, I don't like you know, it's not like that. It's like, why can't we all get along? Why can't we? What's the problem?

Well, one of the things I was going to say is that you haven't really taken any grief publicly about being a dual citizen that I've ever seen.

No, but there are several Russians. There are dual citizens. So why would you give me grief when you are giving them grief? True.

I mean, is it we I would talk about the racism stuff. Is it I got grief. What could it be? Because there are several Russians over here in this country right now. Today, they have dual citizenship. So I can. Well, that's what I'm saying. So so how did it come up, did they. They just walked up to me a gobble up to gobble up to me and said, hey, they love you so much.

You should look at becoming a citizen here, too. I was like, wow, it's not a bad idea.

I never thought in my life they would be possible to become a Russian citizen and an American citizen. I said, well, that can't be a bad thing.

And people forget that we fought together in World War Two. Yes. So is that we're not really enemies. We enemies. Sometimes politics try to make us enemies, but we're really not enemies.

And if we're all children of God, why are we enemies or how can we really be so?

Do you split time in Russia? So how much time of the year do you spend there? How you can go about being about six months a year, really? So you do hit that cold? Yeah, I do.

I hate it, but I hate it. And my fighters and I meant to mention that I have several fighters all over the world to have a Russian heavyweight. I have a Swedish middleweight. I have a Swedish coach. I got the fighters in South Africa. I got pirates everywhere. And then I got a team here. I got Andrew Green of Telemachus Ewbank, Kevin Newman, political shady, Morsi, Akram. I got a lot of good MacWilliams Junior.

I got a good stable of young fighters up and coming. Brian Perello, I think his last name is Bryant at a really good day. The Great Haggler Junior, really good stable to follow them, trying to work on bringing up Fernando. And I'm trying to get them to understand my thought process in boxing because they understand my thought process. They are going to head ahead of the curve. They understand my thought process. Right. They're not going away, but you know them.

So it's like you have to understand the thought process in order to really pursue a career doing it.

Mãe, anything is different about your thought process. My thought process is some of it is already understood before I go and. You understand me, so it's like saying things that you do, you know, you have dos and don'ts before you go into gaming stores, like when I come out to fight, if you got a bad jab, you only at night you would not win tonight because you're not competing with a bad chair, not because it's the first punch you learn in boxing.

If your jab is bad, you're not. Be sure you understand me. If you can't block this hook, you're not being rude is that those things are still up for grabs, though? I don't care who you are.

If you're jambia and you ain't going Black Hook, you ain't going to beat. So do you think like four young fighters?

Well, first of all, it's got to be an amazing opportunity to train with an all time great period to get into your head and to for you to explain to them how you approach situations, how you approach fights, how you approach stepping into that ring, how you approach dismantling opponents. That's got to rub off on young kids.

Yeah, it does. That's why I try to some kids get it, some kids don't. But my goal is to try to get it to all of them.

I get it in all of them hit them at least thinking in the right direction, because if I can make them think in the right direction, no gossip about me, I got to make them think in the right direction.

Folks see, most guys what content you understand me content is. I got a guy, one of my guys. I will go off and on about James work and he works hard everybody everywhere. But I got to teach him that it's not about how hard you work, it's how much you work.

Hard is different because you're working hard, but that's more, you know, getting the work and you can overtrain you all the training and you're like, you know better because, you know, working is right. So, so many boxers have now gone to. Basically, strength conditioning, so my friend Tom Yankalilla has started a channel. And Tommy Akello has a channel. His thing is he teaches boxing, this is a YouTube channel. Yeah. How do you say his name?

Tom Yankele. How do you spell that? Well, Ketel. OK, and his thing, he has a thing where he's taught to teach because he realizes there's not a lot of coaches left in boxing, so he's teaching boxing the right Wiedner, he has them.

And with that being said, he's going to help give back to people, because if you just go on YouTube and look him up, you'll see him. But he got a lot of stuff on me on that right now. There you go. Is that good?

I've seen so he's those those little flippy pads. Those are like they're different, right? Yes. What do you like about those?

Well, I can because they don't hurt your hands. If you're a big puncher like I am, you can get your hands on one of the guys holding hands. They hurt your hand. But he gives a lot of knowledge. He teaches a lot. He teaches the sport the right way. You understand me. So I like people like him because he doing this thing the way it's supposed to be done. Hmm, hmmm, well, the beautiful opportunity that people have now to learn shit on YouTube that just was not available before you could spend day after day after day watching YouTube videos and instructions and and watching old fights to match, of course, old faces.

Some of the best knowledge you're going to get. Yeah, but having somebody like him is also teaching. It helps you a whole lot.

I of all the old finers one that really stands out to you, that you you enjoyed watching Shuey, Robson, Powderhorn while I watched most.

But my favorite part of all time is Muhammad Ali, Muhammad Ali, Muhammad Ali Schueler and Salvador Sanchez would be my second and third Muhammad Ali Srila several senses. And you can mix them in a kind of way because I got my top three qualities from those three. Would you get it from Muhammad Ali, how to be a showman and how to have class inside and outside of the. And how to outthink the opponent with your mind before you beat him with your fists?

Hmm. No one played better mind games than him. Exactly. And he was doing it back. We know what he did. Sonny Liston fight when they literally almost not going to let him fight.

He was crazy.

Like your heart, your blood pressure is off the charts.

But every time he did, every time because he's got so hyped before he fall. Yeah, I know.

But he was what a unique human being. He was about as unique as it gets. I always to point to people to I say, if you look at Muhammad Ali, you got to look at Muhammad Ali before they made him take three years off. You watch the Cleveland big Katt Williams fight. I'm like, am I a fucking heavyweight that moves like that, that now?

Not with that kind of speed now that kind of footwork. I mean, come on, the two footwork precision everything a little fast in the middle way.

Literally, literally, no bullshit, literally faster than a middle and a full-blown heavyweight with length and reach powerful and everything couldn't deal with. And then also as a human being outside of the ring, I mean, a cultural force, just a. I remember when I was a kid, my parents weren't boxing fans at all. But when Muhammad Ali was making that comeback fight against Leon Spinks, he lost the springs the first time and then the second time they're fighting again.

My parents watched it like we want to see him win the title back. And it wasn't my parents were hippies, right? They weren't boxing fans. But he stood for more than boxing. He stood for what's good in the world. He stood for rejecting evil. He stood for it. There's a man who gave up his career, didn't want to fight in Vietnam because he thought the war was wrong. And people understand.

But that's the second reason I accepted the Russian citizenship, because Muhammad Ali showed me that we live here as one. We shouldn't live as individuals. We should live as one. Everybody should be respected, looked upon equal. You understand me. And because the Russians did it, that's why I accepted what they gave me, because they looked at me as equal. Not that I'm an athlete, not them. A box, not that I'm black, but that I'm equal and that they love what I did.

They love what I stood for, and they would love to invite me to be a part of their culture as well as the United States.

That's a beautiful way to look at it. Yeah, that is, you talk about a country that has a great history of combat sports. Oh, my God. Between wrestling, me boxing. I mean, as so many of these up and coming boxers now that also are these great fighters that happen to be Russian, where everything is clear overnight because because in that people can now see things differently.

And, you know, you can learn like I say, you can look at this. You can watch old fights over and over and learn what your favorite fighter did or what his attributes were or what you like about him, what made him great. That's what I used to look for. What made people great. Like you understand this. I got my love fighter jet from Mustafa Muhammad back when he was eighty.

Gregory Oh wow. Wow. Speaks exactly right. Wow. That's why I got my level of from it.

Is Gregory also known Mustafa became a great trainer to you better but yeah. Wow. That's old school man.

Yes sir. And I got my defense. Mean I could go a whole round I getting hit from with Benitez. Oh best defense if I had put it up I think to have a believe he was pretty special.

Well you got to throw Pernell Whitaker in that.

Well he's a good defensive too. But he wasn't a defense. Those guys were. Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. There's I mean, there's so many greats to study and learn little bits and pieces from. I mean, that was one of the big things that Mike Tyson did. Of course, you know, there's just been, of course, a giant chunk of his use watching.

And this, you know, and that's what people understand about my mike is very well versed in boxing. He knows what the hell he's doing. He knows how to solve a puzzle in a boxing ring.

Yeah, more so than anything else in life. He knows how to solve any water he needs solved in a boxing ring. People don't give him enough credit for it.

No, they don't. I mean, Mike Tyson is a he's a fascinating human being. And his mind is you.

He has things that he focuses on and that's where you find out who he is.

You know, when you talk to him about the things he focuses on because he knows a lot about things, that he focuses. Exactly a lot more than you ever, ever expect.

Yeah, he's he's intense when he when he talks to you about the things that are interesting and important to him, you see that intensity. That's where it all comes out. Yeah.

Now, you're 51 now. Yep. What is the difference between training at fifty one then training a thirty one effort to win.

You need one or two more days to recover, then you need a third world stuff that hurts.

It hurts a little bit longer at fifty one than it did. I thought it was doing things differently.

Yeah. You got to do things differently. You have to take days off a little bit more frequently. You would have wanted to back when you were thirty one.

Well I didn't want to, I didn't eat on days off all that at fifty one.

At about two or three days you might say, OK, hold up a minute because if you don't then Niassa ok, you might want to go but I ain't going to today. Right. So are you using any technology in terms of, like heart rate monitors to know you're just going by feel I'm old school, you know, in school, you know?

Yeah, I do. I go by. I feel. I feel. I get today. I don't feel it today. We can get it tomorrow.

Are you using any new school recovery methods like like I use in sauna or use an ice pond as well.

I, I do like ice. I did a couple little things. I try one thing that made me stop doing a thing called protect I think. And they said I got to stop because I've got something that didn't work.

So, um, what does that protect is a thing like the give me use for my needs basically and it's supposed to help get the cordless back in my knees.

Oh, so it wasn't working.

It was working. But they said there are things that may not pass the test. If you take a test or you get stopped, you can't do that anymore. So I couldn't do it, but I really enjoyed it because it made me feel a lot better. But they say you got to be careful not cause I guess some something on there. I mean, that's some forbidden things.

So it's called protect your car, protect see. What is that? OK, I'm I'm curious about that because my knees are all fucked up. Yeah.

So, you know, I've got a couple of people that can help you out. You need to because there's another lady D'Aloisio, Dr. Deborah. She can really help bring these out too. She's also she's the one who gave me the shot to protect, but she has a lot of product that she uses. That thing here is made pasties. So, um, I don't know. I'm not take it this Tablo cause I tried this and they said the doctor told me that I can't do it again, so I got to stop.

Now, what kind of testing are they doing for this fight? They say they do a regular fight testing. So just like they would do in a normal fight, we're going to get tested as though we are regular athletes, as though we're fighting a regular sanctioned fight. But as I admit to my husband's father. Yes.

So you can't be on any testosterone replacement, no growth hormones, no peptides, no. No nothing. Just 21 years of life.

Yeah. If you ain't got it and I'm 51 years I lived it. Too bad you ain't getting it.

Well, it certainly helps if you had it and never lost it right now.

We were talking about that before we got here. Like you never stop moving now. Never stop moving. That's a good thing for me. Yeah.

It's when we were we were kids and we looked at fifty one year olds.

We thought they were super old grandfather. Yeah. They were dead.

They were great thrown turpel-lafond lightning speed and I don't think they want. No, not a fifty one.

Yeah. So just the days off that's the only thing that's different.

That's what I. Well I don't go long when I train.

What's, what's a typical session for a typical session is now we're at 13, 12, maybe 15 miles Max used to be 16 to 24 miles. That's like 12 to 15 max. And some of those are low impact, lousy because you don't want to overdo it to too much tear tendons in your arm.

Again, miss your hands up again. You don't wanna mess nothing up with a fight does not happen.

So now do you have a person who's making your schedule or do you do everything yourself? I do a little bit of myself. I got a few people to help out know my wife helps out, but she's doing her thing with this. She wore your brand as well, so she wore it. I am. She worried that come May she asked us which you gave your wife to stuff. Yes. Thank you. So, yeah, if you can put it up.

I am. She worried that coat.

So she helps you with your schedule to help.

We put my sketches together and she trains with us every day. Really. Wow. So far. But yeah we do it right here. Yeah. That is.

Oh that's what we try to embrace every challenge as a strong confident woman you are. Yeah. Yeah.

Now what about when you were briefly talking about strength and conditioning.

Do you do strength and conditioning like you see a lot of these fighters are doing like circuit training, high intensity, you know, like kettle bells.

Yeah, I do a little bit of that, but I don't make that vital part of my workout. I get up and do it in the mornings like three or four days a week. Mm hmm. I got a friend and Leaf usually brings his gal when we go to work. We do it at three or four days a week and we don't make that a priority because. I'm not a weightlifter. I'm not a football player. I'm a boxer, right.

So boxing skills still have to be the priority. You want to be in shape, too, but don't mistake fitness over boxing skills. Some people now prefer fitness, right? Oh, boxing skill. But we want to get to his boxing skills and a little bit of fitness. He can beat you.

Yeah. The most important thing is efficiency and skill. Yeah. How did that happen? Where this this thing got confused that way?

Well, I think what really happened is a lot of the foreigners started picking up a little bit of our boxing skills, too, and they were always super fit, but they didn't have boxing skills that they had Internet. They need boxing skills so they can pick up one or two little tricks, put it with their conditioning and you can get beat because they can do this all night.

Well, when you see a guy who's, like, super strong, super fit and dominates people with that, it tempts people in that way.

That's the way like Arter bitter beef is exactly right.

Superstrong.

My book is a tank Achilles heel. I love watching that guy fight, but he's been down twice to do. Yes. Yes.

I mean, he gets awards. Yeah. Yeah. He gets in wars.

But that fucking guy is sick and destroyed.

Well, it's one of the strongest powerful punches I ever seen ever. I mean, I'm a giant fan of his and I love watching his fights because that's what you're going to get. You're going to get sick and destroy every fight.

See, the problem is in our country, we don't we are not open minded enough to be able to see good fights no matter what race they are, because if you think about it a little, be off and be able to meet.

People will be willing to temper Temeraire type fight right now. Right.

I mean, because there is a motherfucker, hey, he's so jacked. Guys can't freakin punch and they both can fight it.

Yeah, it's well I just think people maybe don't have the understanding and appreciation of boxing as a whole as they used to back in your day.

It would be more closed minded and so. Well, it's just it's unfortunate because he's I think he's like 37 now. So he's you know, he's getting to the later stages of his life.

He's in his prime still. But he's like the the outside edge is how old he 35 about.

So but still, you know, really from 35 on is when unless you're Bernard Hopkins fucking that guy again and again.

But that guy speaks to discipline and boxing skill. Right of me. That's what led Bernard Hopkins to be here. That's right. Because the boxing skills not not not just the strength conditioning, but boxing skills along with the conditioning.

I remember back when I was the executioner, when he fought Felix Trinidad, people were already counting him out. They were like, he's too old. And you think about he knocked out Felix Trinidad. I want to say he was like 36 back then. And that was just the beginning. That was just the beginning. I mean, he went on to have this incredible career post thirty six and he won't tell anybody the truth ever, but he can call Pensacola before he did it.

Ask me what should he do now because he didn't want to fight get to in a sense, but it wasn't with the money that he wanted. So I told him, listen, you could be all those small guys go down one fight and there are still holds. It will be your name and you get somewhere. And he did exactly that. He I know he won't ever tell them the truth.

I told them, but I did. And I ain't got no reason to lie to you.

I did like I told. I was afraid that if he just took five years of his life and dedicated it back to boxing, he'd beat the majority of the heavyweight after day because the ones that are on top mentally, he can beat he's he's mentally better than most.

But he got to dedicate yourself to the sport and we see it right now.

Well, it's funny that, you know, when you talk to Tyson, you're his father told him to not take the first Deontay Wilder fight. He said you're not ready. He said you haven't fully recovered physically from all the years of drinking and abuse he's put on his body. He just you know, after he beat Vladimir Klitschko and won the title, you know, he kind of went crazy for a while and was open about that, about his issues with alcoholism and and mental illness.

But his father was like, you haven't come back yet. You're not all the way back. Right. So they have that fight. Fight ends in a draw, crazy fight. And then the rematch. Jesus Christ.

It was like seeing him take it to Deontay Wilder. You want to talk about a hard puncher? Deontay Wilder is one of the freakiest punches I've ever seen in my life.

Frankie. Yeah, freekeh powerful with the right hand, especially. Yeah.

Freegate when he knocked out Ortiz with that right hand to the forehead, just flat lined them is like sitting there like that in the fuck just happened.

He just crazy power but.

Tyson Fury, boxing skill, his boxing skill and the fact that he started training with Sugar Hill croc fighter before that Cuong trainer and had that super aggressive, in-your-face style and just really used those boxing skills and got super aggressive in the rematch and had Deontae on the back heel, the main thing.

And when you're not as powerful as a Deontae, you have to think of other ways to do it. And the fact that when they fight Tyson Fury say they have Klitschko, they're not punching down. Right. Straight ahead, they get a punch up. Right. That takes a lot of power away from those good right hand punches.

So if you have a good Joe Frazier type George Foreman type Hook or Kinlaw and take hook, then you're going to be in trouble if you get a punch up here, right. The hook is the deadly appeal, but the right hand going up here takes a little bit off of it. This is the law of gravity. If you don't know that is something.

I was just amazed that he got up. And after the 12th round, the first fight was to pull.

I was, too. I truly was.

When you know what a crusher Déanta is and the fact he went right hand and then left hook on the way down and then went like this because it's like it's over.

And that's what really shocked him the most, that put him in a state of shock for fury to come off that floor. Yeah.

Come at what he did and come back and win the rest of the round. He never had nobody read to him before in his life, I guarantee. No guarantee.

I couldn't believe he did it guaranteed.

Never had nobody in his life to do him like Tyson did that in his life.

I think that's one of the greatest comebacks ever in a round without a quest to have him flat.

Like I thought it was over. Yeah, I remember watching at home. I watched. I'm on the front of my bed going, oh, 12th round, stopped him in the 12th round and Deontae 209 pounds for that fire, which is crazy.

Yeah, I mean about as light as anyone who's ever fought for the title and been a title, been a title holder. And then also you think about how many fights he won because he won all those fights by killing someone.

But that hurt him though because he never had to box. So now he don't know how to box and go that way. I mean, this week, Grion knows how to go this way, but he never had to go that way. Right. And that hurt him when he met somebody that can fight going both ways. So the first day, Tyson, you for like this second weight has a feel for what I did straightfoward. Yeah. Yeah.

Would you what advice would you give Deontae like if he came to you if he's listening to this, because I've heard that Floyd is interested in training him. But if he came to you, what advice would you give to him.

Well we go back to learning how to use our jab at developing our left hand because once we developed the left hand right hand I would lift. We don't need to operate with developing that left hand. We developed a left hand, make it become a weapon before the right. Here now has to be the left hand we ate right to it. We are stop.

Hmm. So that you would concentrate on left. Right away. Right away. How much time would you give him if you said like if we have all the time in the world it's up to you to pick when the next fight is. How much time would you like to see him spend working on something like that?

Six months. Six months. Six months and nobody would beat them again. They have a hard time beat them again, I say, but it take them six months.

Would you want him? What would you want him to do with his footwork? Because one of the things about Deontae is he throws everything into his punches and sometimes and that's what we would change.

Well, folks on the left hand, more on the left hand right now you don't think is a killer. He throws a jab. We looking to kill the right. Right. We've got become do got to make him diverse. You got to be the left or the right and you got to make everything used as a unit. He got me use everything of it. If you use everything as a unit and it's not good for him. So to focus on one punch kind of takes everything else out to getting that one passed on.

What are we going to do now?

Now, in his struggles with backing up and moving back, what would you have him do with that? Would you have him concentrate on cutting angles? And we know how to fix that, too.

But that's part of that job, right? You know how we use the left hand, the left hand goal, allow us to go whatever direction, whatever we need to. But the left hand is most important, left hand and feet as defense.

Now, do you ever reach out to fighters like you see a fighter like that have a loss? No, not after all I've had I've tried to reach out to was. I forget the guys in L.A. with a NAS was about to fight Lomachenko because I know it'll be a good fight and I was gonna reach out to him, but he had to transfer. I didn't even reach out to him. But I would if he would act, I would have accepted that, because that's a hot fight for him to fight.

And I know Lenore's is a good guy, but he had a chance to win the fight. But the way they train in the fight took all of it away. Mhm. Yeah.

It's, it's interesting because you as a multiple division world champion, but also a commentator, when you were doing it for HBO, you could point out little things right away.

Yeah. Did you ever have fighters come up to you.

And thank you for thank me. Tell me what I told them. Told me what I said. They need to get better hit Timmy. I made him a better fighter. They listen to the county and saw the mistakes that they were making so I can look at a guy and break them down right away.

That's also got to be crazy for a fighter to be fighting.

And I mean, I know there's a giant amount of them that were huge Roy Jones junior fans. And now they're looking over and you're talking about them while they're fighting. That's got to be a trip.

My guy guy Andrew. I think it's Andrew Murphy in the actual Andrew last name. But Andrew, he always says they say, I'm so amazed that I'm here taking instructions from you.

Yeah. Yeah, Brian says it, too. So this is the always they're happy to to be there. So I got another kid named Work Twelve guy from Mobile, Alabama. So and Wailin Whalum, my next door neighbor. Fifteen years old. He's going to be a banger, too.

So but they love taking instruction from me and I enjoy myself with it.

Well, it's obvious that you enjoy it. And for them, that's first of all, it's an amazing honor for them. But also it's got to be so motivational.

Yeah, you know, it is. And I think for them to really see me still getting active at one that is like, wow, he still does it like that.

So now we understand what he's saying because how can we be slower to him? He can do and we can't do it that fast.

So we got problems. Yes. Y'all got major issues that get up. Yes.

Let's go.

Well, it's just beautiful to see how much energy and enthusiasm you have. And that's that's really what life's all about, right?

It is about having energy, being a positive force in the world and just helping other people. You know, you do that. You're doing the right thing if you're not doing it and you almost wasting time because why did God give you life? You're not going next person.

Beautiful. I love it. Roy Blount, Jr., November 28th. I'm going to be watching. I think I'm going to be there. I want to go out there. I think about, oh, I think I'm not allowed to go if I just have to take covid test. And I could sit. I would appreciate that.

I would love for you to be there. Taught me a YouTube channel too soon.

So you'll look up and let me know what that is and I will promote that for you. I know. And I'll be back on his old. Let's do it. Thank you, sir.

Thank you very much. Thank you. Roy Jones, junior year. Thank you, friends, for tuning in to the show and thank you to simply safe head on over to simply safe dotcom slash Rogan and get a free HD camera for listeners of this podcast that's scmp isaf e simply safe dotcom slash Rogen. Go there and make sure that they know that we sent you. We're also brought to you by the motherfucking cash out. That's right. The number one app in finance in the known universe, the very best application for finance, the best the world's ever known.

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