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Hi, folks, it's Rick Wilson and welcome to The Daily Beast's The New Abnormal. Hi, I'm Molly John Fast, a left wing pundit and editor at large at The Daily Beast.

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I'm also an editor at The Daily Beast, a former Republican political strategist, best selling author and full time troublemaker. We're here to have fun, sharp conversations with some of the smartest people in media, politics, business and science that help make what's happening in the country and the world clearer.

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I'll try to keep Rick to the minimum number of F bombs and try to keep our kids, pets and other wildlife sounds from invading our.

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Ladies and gentlemen, Americans from all walks of life and all corners of this great nation. Welcome to The Daily Beast, the new abnormals very special. Fuck that guy week. Oh, yes, it's the beginning. It's the first day of the Republican National Convention. And we are here sitting in our virtual studio, spread out across the great fruited plain of America with my co-host, Molly John Past, our brilliant editor Jesse Canet, and, of course, the masterful Miles Taylor, the former and now very much ex chief of staff to the Department of Homeland Security, an ex Trump administration official who has gone into the full side of the light and has joined us not only in rejecting Donald Trump, but here this evening Miles.

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Welcome to the show, Rick.

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I'm so glad to be here. And actually, I've never been so flattered to be called someone's ex than I am.

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Seriously, if I get to be counted among his exes for the rest of my life, it'll be something I put at a minimum in my Twitter bio.

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But maybe even on my tombstone, it's a mark of honor. It'll be you and Ivana. Great. Great company. That's right.

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So welcome, Miles, because we're doing the show in a little bit tighter format during our Fucked That Guy week. We're going to launch right into it with the news of the day, which was that the RNC, as predicted, transformed itself into a full blown personality cult with everything but people yelling Collimore and throwing guys into a volcano and shit that might come on night three.

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You know, we're only on night one. I think there's time.

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There were so many highlights. It's I'm sure you've got ones that you want to point out. Aside from the fact that Kimberly Guilfoyle spooked the hell out of Americans, I really think that the winner of the night was the Loch Ness Monster.

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What was that from?

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It was that was Junior.

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Junior had an extended metaphor about the Loch Ness Monster that I followed by the end. But I was still hoping there would be a cameo sort of thing. But we'll get there. The names will start tomorrow.

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Oh, there are the memes. The teams have taken wing, my friend, who they are out and running.

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My question about Kimberly Guilfoyle was it was like a terrifying Eva Peron kind of thing. She was like a robot.

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Eva Peron from the future come to kill us all by screaming at us.

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Miles, you have you were in this administration. Can you talk about being a Republican and watching this?

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I don't even know where you start with this convention in and of itself. I mean, this was this was like a movie flop with sort of a B list production rights, see list actors and delist content. I mean, it's pretty, but like, that's kind of what you come to expect of Trump or. Right. I mean, think about, I think Trump product that was ever hot and the stakes and the university. And this was kind of, you know, the Trump campaign.

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Now, with the exception of his set piece folks, Nikki Haley and Tim Scott, who look in some ways did a decent job. But but other than that, this is just kind of the exclamation point this week on the near death of the party and Donald Trump. But, you know, it began basically on day one before day one during the campaign. Right. I helped out a little bit with the campaign, came in and ultimately wound up, as is Trump's chief of staff over at DHS.

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This has been a slow, slow slide into the total dissolution of the party and the president. So, you know, I think this convention and the sort of cheesy nature of it is indicative of where this whole thing's gone under him. And by the way, he's just vice like grip over the party. I mean, real people who we saw for the past few years had a conscience in the Republican Party are staying mum or like tweeting out Bible verses.

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And like, you know, that's sort of cowardice throughout the party. I think it's been really disheartening to watch. It was certainly was from the inside. So disheartening that that's why last year I had to get the hell out.

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Yeah, I feel your pain, brother, but I think you're right. I mean, look, if you took Nikki Haley or Tim Scott and decontextualized them and put them in the 2012 convention, their speeches would have been perfectly normal and well regarded. But when you put them in the context of the administration that they're supporting every day and in fact the context of the administration, she gladly serve, it comes off looking absurdist. It comes off looking just completely discordant with what we actually know about this administration or what we know about Donald Trump as a person, as a president.

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I mean, I think your point there, it's like a bellus production of something and it's like those Phillipine knockoff movies of The Born or whatever where they were.

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Think of it. It's the Ishtar of conventions. But you kind of didn't you didn't you expect like after Nikki and before Tim Scott, it felt weird that there wasn't a catheter commercial. Right.

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I felt like it was just supposed to happen somewhere in the night in it.

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And it. Didn't that didn't happen either? I do have to say, you know, Michaela, things become such a thing with the president, but really before he was talking about it publicly, I was in a number of meetings with the president where, I don't know, we'd be in there talking a border security issue. Right. Ninety five percent of the time and literally out of goddamn nowhere, he'd be like, you know, who's, like, just my favorite guy.

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He's like the Michel'le guys. Anyone? Do any of you do any of you have those powers? I mean, these are like my early exposures to the president.

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And I'm like, what the actual fuck is happening?

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I know you do it with Trump imitation, and that is a criteria for a return. I'd be I'd be sitting there and I actually remember one of them. I mean, look, and I'm not trying to overblow this. It's not like Trump and I were best buddies watching movies every night in the West Wing.

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But there is a picture of you and him.

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So, so many, many pictures. I mean, when when he said, yeah, I've never met the guy, I was going to do a whole stream of like 30 of them. And just on this and this time. So more than his memory, I'm just worried about his whether or not he's actually even using that my pillow, because I get great sleep on my sleep, you know what's going on.

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But but no, you know, in fact and in that actual specific meeting, as I'm kind of just experiencing first contact with this guy, I had to write that down when he said it. I had to make a note of it. But but when you're in meetings with him, like any other president, you're taking notes because the boss is telling you, look, here's my direction. Here's what we're going to do. And you got Donald Trump hates it when people take notes in the room.

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Right. And so in that meeting, I'm actually right now, he says we got to do this, this, this and this, all of which are probably impossible, illegal, unethical. So we'll have to pay and we'll say we can't do this.

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And he looks over me and he goes, if I could take notes. And I was going, what do I say? I was like, I just I'm just writing down. And he just kind of looked at me. I was like, well, I won't do that. And I just closed my book noted.

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I've actually seen him do that so many times in meetings. And so why the hell are you taking notes? It's like because because I thought it was the administration of a president of the United States, not a fucking mob family. Can you imagine? It's like your ninth grade English teacher is like expecting you to do well in the tests and says, what? Are you fucking taking notes right now?

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Because this is the president keeps telling us what he wants to what he wants to do. That's that was the experience.

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That's unbelievable.

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Well, I think that you've shown more courage about coming out and talking than a lot of people who were senior to you and should have made that jump before. And they've had all these what I think are fairly bullshit compunctions like, oh, I want to show people in SA they're hoping maybe the grown ups will finally triumph. Yeah, I think we all know that there are no grown ups left in the room, but it's true.

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Look, if there's if there's one theme right now, I mean, look, this is just for me personally, I feel like almost all my heroes have died here in Washington, DC, or they're like on hospice care right now. I don't mean in terms of their actual age. I just mean in terms of their moral codes and their consciences. And a lot of that is at the hands of Donald Trump. I mean, look, bottom line is this.

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Everyone who served in this administration, with the exception of a handful of sycophants that are still around the president, understand that he's truly unfit for office. I mean, this was a topic of daily and frequent conversation that people at all levels of the administration, White House cabinet, everybody knows it. If they deny it, it's because they're lying out of fear of him or they're trying not to lose their jobs or both. And that's concerning. And look, you're absolutely right.

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I mean, a lot of really great people that I looked up to have been hesitant to come out. In some cases, I don't buy the excuse that we have a duty to silence towards the president when we leave. I absolutely fundamentally and furiously disagree with that. Right. I think Teddy Roosevelt still has that quote that says, patriotism is not standing by the president and standing by the country. And look, I don't think we should be quoting French generals about how we hold our tongues.

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Now is the time the voters are deciding whether to rehire the president. We're reviewing his CV and we need to make it a very complete CV and explain what we saw. So, I mean, all the joking aside, I mean, that's been very concerning, that more people haven't come out and they feel the same way. But I think you're going to see a few more and steadily we're going to be getting more voices out there, because this really was the universal sentiment.

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And I'm not saying this is like some sort of closet Democrat. I mean, I'm a lifelong Republican, a national security conservative. This is one of. In my career, too, I came into the administration with the full intent of helping the president be a good president, but we realized I think pretty quickly that he was he was truly unfit for the job and incapable of carrying it out on a daily basis. I mean, genuinely, you couldn't go into a meeting with the president and get the one point across that you needed to get across without him doing 20 tangents, becoming irascible, turn red in the face, demanding a Diet Coke is spewing spit.

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I mean, just really it's just something like you just wouldn't expect it. That's not even a B movie know. It's like a bad Seth Rogen skit on SNL that doesn't land. But that turns out every single day it's the man with the finger on the nuclear button. So, yeah, that was concerning. Americans should be spoofed. They should be really spooked about this.

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You know, I always I always tell people you and I will get this more than some people. If you knew how easy and how little friction there is in the actual National Command authority to launch a weapon, you would never sleep again. Of course. Of course.

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When did you know you had to leave? Oh, God. I mean, there were a lot of there were a lot of different points where it got worse and worse and worse. One of the key ones, honestly, one of the key ones was on family separation because it was a disastrous policy making process that led into it.

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Were you in that room with the handwriting? No, it wasn't there in that moment. And actually, when the attorney general announced the zero tolerance policy, I'd actually just become the deputy chief of staff. And so before that, I'd been John Kerry's national security advisor and so had been doing nothing immigration and was not to be doing immigration because everyone who was doing immigration was just suffering daily at the president's unstoppable obsession with building the wall and blocking caravans. But when I took the deputy chief job, look, all issues of the department came under my purview.

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And then obviously the same thing with the chief job. Then once they made the policy decision to do it, I got involved when it came to implementation. And what's not really well known is at the time there was this big delay between Jeff Sessions making a speech in April and saying zero tolerance, where to prosecute everyone at the border. And then for like maybe six weeks, nothing happened and nothing happened because behind the scenes, Secretary Nielsen was like, we don't have the resources to quickly get these people to the places where you're going to prosecute them and back to their kids.

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And it's going to be a disaster of backlog unless you guys throw money and bodies in cars and judges and attorneys and everything that has to do this. The numbers are too big. And she warned and warned and ordered. And then as you guys saw, you know, look, the White House got fed up with it and they said, stop delaying. We're going to take a vote and everyone raise their hands. But the secretary and she said, we're not ready to go.

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And they said, well, we're going to go anyway. And she ended up being right. It was a predictable disaster. Now, it's sad that she ended up getting tagged with it because she went stood at the podium. But frankly, she was the one that tried to put the brakes on it. And then rightfully, we got the president to sign an executive order to end it. But the reason to your question I decided I had to go is pretty much every month after that the president kept saying, I want to restart it and I want to make it ten times as bad.

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Every case with every parent, you've got to rip them apart. And it was just sickening to listen to. And it was clear that he really just this was a man with no humanity whatsoever. So, look, when the bottom line is when when saying no was no longer enough is when we decided it's it's time to get out of Dodge.

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Did you feel there were other moral people in the administration who had the same kind of I mean, the children staff, those videos? I mean, did you just, like, go home? I mean, I can't even imagine what it's even worse than that.

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I mean, like, here's here's the thing. The children, of course. Yes. Know at the end of the day, the kind of rule of thumb down at the border is DHS has seventy two hours under law to make sure children, the child child's back with their parents. And if they aren't in times, the parents being prosecuted for being for crossing illegally, then the child has to go to Health and Human Services because border stations, if you've been to them, they're not places for children.

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Right? They're concrete slabs. That's not OK. And so always the department strives to very quickly reunite children with their parents, just like now, like if Rick got arrested today and has a has a kid, the kids don't get to come to jail. And that happens whenever you get arrested. Same thing at the border. But the goal is to do it real quickly and so the parents can be reunited. But when you then start prosecuting thousands and thousands of people, the system gets clogged and it's a disaster.

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So that happened. But what I was going to say is even worse than that are some of the ideas that the president had for dealing with migrants at the border. So he wanted to name them and tear gassed them and shoot them. And I'm not even being hyperbolic. So like we sat in a meeting one time where the president was well, this was actually several occasions, but where he was talking about what he wanted us how he wanted us to sign the border wall.

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One day the focus was on the spikes. And he was really upset because from the pictures we were showing him of the steel bollards, he said the spikes aren't sharp enough. He said, I want you to go back and run me a cost estimate. How can they be sharper? And we said, well, Mr. President, look, this has been designed by the operators. This is what the operators say they need. They said, yeah, but I want them so sharp that I want it to pierce human flesh so it'll go right through their hands or arms.

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They try to climb it, and this is only like a couple of weeks before then, we had an incident at the border, a caravan was rushing to a border station. And look, when that happened happens and people are actually rushing a border station. You've got to do crowd control, right, because it could be a threat to the officers in that danger. So there was a limited instance where officers had to deploy tear gas because they were worried that some of the people in the caravan were armed and they were storming the gates.

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The president thought not this was an isolated incident. He thought this was a new policy we were instituting where we were just gassing people across the border. So he called up the secretary and said, it's like this is just absolutely amazing. I mean, what you're doing, that you're so this is so tough, the gassing of the migrants, so tough. And I remember we're sitting there, he's on speakerphone. I was like, he has no idea.

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I said he has no idea that this is like a incident isolated and that we didn't order it. I mean, his perception was, oh, the secretary must have ordered let's start gassing them. And then worse than that, as people know, because he later said it publicly, which we tried to get him not to wear the multiple occasions he suggested, why don't we just shoot him? Like, why can't we just shoot them coming towards the border?

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And we had to explain to the president that the rules of engagement don't work that way unless all of these women and children fleeing violence and persecution have AK forty seven s on them. No, they're not an imminent threat. That's how it happens. And then he dialed it back a bit. He's like, OK, I understand you don't want to kill him, but couldn't we just shoot him in the legs to slow them down? This is the president, United States talking here.

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That was a little bit more than alarming, a little bit more than gut wrenching to hear him go down that route. But, look, you can't lie. I mean, he's irreverent and sometimes they would be so outlandish that they would be funny. I mean, those were gut wrenching and disgusting. And obviously, we stood in the way of those proposals and didn't let those things happen. But I mean, I remember when he called us and he wanted to have us do a cost estimate on what it would take to build a moat in front of the wall and what robot alligators in the moat, that is.

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No, that's I mean, you're halfway there.

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So he asked us to do a cost estimate on in addition to the wall, he said, I don't think the wall is enough. I want them to have to be able to go down into a moat. And his point was it doubles the height of the wall. Right, because you have to go then down and then way up. And we were like, this is truly insane. And then he goes further. We're talking to him on the phone and he says, I want you to run the estimate.

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And also, what would it take to put alligators and snakes in the mouth?

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No, he did not. Oh, I'm not absolutely honest to God and to God. He said, how much would it cost us to put alligators and snakes in the moat? And we're sitting there and like, our jaws are on the floor and I'm like doubled over laughing because I'm like, this can't be real. It's got to be a joke. He was dead serious. He fell back again. It's like where my cost estimates are. So what do you do in that situation when you were trying to run a two hundred and fifty thousand person, 60 billion dollar a year department that's responsible for protecting Americans against cyber threats and terrorists and foreign meddling from the Russians and border security?

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And then the president wants you to drop everything and tell him how much it would cost to build a moat. You're in kind of a tough spot because the last thing I want to do is tell one of our agency heads, hey, the president needs you to do cost estimates on boats. And how do you keep snakes alive long enough in the boats to life?

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That's not a thing put. I don't understand. Don't the alligators eat the snakes?

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It's not even a coherent way of thinking about a moat in, like medieval times on the southern border. So, look, all you would do is like, OK, let's have a few people involved in this as possible because it's crazy and clearly we're not going to do it. But can someone please do a back of the envelope on how insanely expensive it is? Because if there's one thing you know about Donald Trump, it's that while he may be, quote, rich, he's also, quote, very cheap.

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So if you go to him with a big dump and you say this is going to be crazy, prohibitively expensive, he'll say, that's absolutely right. We can't do it. That's what we did. We went back to him on the boat. We're like, this is billions and billions and billions to build you a million years ago. And you're saying we won't do it. But of course, he'd bring it up later. That's not how I should spend a full day trying to run this event where we're stopping threats instead, instead of focusing on those two hundred and fifty thousand people, we had to focus way too much on that one person, that audience of one, which, by the way, I think is a good tie back to the convention tonight, because I think the biggest thing about the convention was it was a whole event designed around them talking to that one person.

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I don't feel like that convention was talking to America. They were all talking to an audience of one. I don't think in our lifetimes we've seen such a sycophantic approach to nominating someone to be president.

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I've been going to Republican conventions since I was but a wee lad and no nothing ever even close to this. I was one of the things that I noticed tonight was that the president used the not only used the White House itself as a prop for the political campaign, but a lot of the hostages, the State Department and other agencies worked very hard to free in the last few years. What do you think about that whole thing? It was very discordant for me.

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It was like, aren't you happy I helped you? Yeah.

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I mean, look, a couple of things. First, on the point of using the White House as a setting for the convention. It goes without saying this is wildly inappropriate and corrupt, right, to use the American people's house as a site for a political event, and it's something that in a previous administration I was in the Bush administration towards the end, I don't think anyone would have ever even conceived of something like that happening. Right. But ethics and propriety have gone out the window in this White House.

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That's piece number one. But two, it was the perfect example of the president trying to do something that he thought would seem heroic and beneficial. And he ends up with his foot in his mouth in one particular moment. And I'm sure you guys noticed it is one of the individuals who'd been released was telling the story about how he'd been let out of his Turkish prison, a prison he was in because of Erdogan's oppressive police state that he's created. And within seconds of telling the story of getting out of Turkey, the president in front of this man who's effectively been imprisoned by the Turkish dictator, then lauds Erdogan and basically says Erdogan is a really great man.

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I mean, I couldn't even believe it. Here we are. This whole point of this was to say we free the hostages from autocratic, repressive places around the world and then Trump can't even resist patting one of those dictators on the back. That was pretty nauseating.

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This one last question for you. And you and I both came out of the national security side of this equation originally, although me a much longer time ago. Do you feel like the intelligence community writ large? I mean, the shell shock, some of the folks I've talked to in the last three or four years has been so extraordinary. And they've been so I don't understand why he won't listen. I don't understand why he can't put this past him and understand there are real threats out there.

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Were you I mean, by the time you left, it must have gotten pretty whispering. Must have gotten to be pretty loud, unquestionably.

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I mean, so I did two and a half years in there and from the get go, it was clear that the president was hell bent on waging an all out war against the civil service of the United States. Right. It was the whole government because the whole government was the deep state and you couldn't trust any of them. And they were on every corner. And look, I'll say and our two hundred and fifty thousand person department, I found no indication whatsoever that there was like into various deep state.

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Focused on unseating the president is not a real thing. It's paranoia, it's conspiracy theory. But there was no greater target than the intelligence community. And the reasons to me are very, very obvious of any part of the entire government. The one part that's charged every day with literally speaking truth to power, no matter what they see, is the intelligence community. It's their job to say, here's what's happening, unvarnished, and we're going to give it to you straight so you can address the threat that naturally was the place President Trump gravitated to, to attack because he hates the truth.

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Right? Especially he hates anything that's discordant with his worldview. So the fact that the intelligence community was so often coming to him and telling him things that didn't comport with how he saw the world meant that they were probably going to be excoriated more than others. And it definitely took a toll. I mean, all the way down the line, analysts who I think felt just the morale was in the tank. We were talking about people who risk their lives to tell us about enemies threatening our country at home and abroad.

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These should be the people that are the Patriots. Donald Trump's applauding every day, not the ones who he's deriding in presidential speeches and by the way, then bringing in their leadership into the Oval Office to humiliate them for telling the truth to Congress.

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Do you feel like if Trump loses that, he'll leave? It's a great question. And I hate to speculate because it's such a dangerous thing, because when he speculates, it's dangerous. Right. But my fear is that the president tries to litigate the hell out of the twenty twenty election results if he loses and in the meantime tries to cast it as illegitimate and in doing so inspires nationwide civil unrest. I mean, look, we've seen the country is a tinderbox right now and Trump knows it and he takes advantage of it.

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And if that happens, I think he'll want to try to make it as hard as possible for the electors to certify for Joe Biden. And what will that mean for us? That will create a lot of turmoil and I think further undermine our democratic process. So that's my biggest worry about what he'll do. But here's the last thing I'll say on that point. I'm also worried about what's going to happen before November 3rd on that front, because we have built when we were in the administration, we built this elaborate and robust apparatus to fight back against Russian or any other nation state intervention.

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So believe it or not, since twenty sixteen, we've come a long way. People like Chris Krebs, who runs our cybersecurity agency director at the FBI, Dan Coats, is at DNI. They build a great system. There's all kinds of incredible tools now to deter the bad guys after the bad guys really punish them for interfering in our democracy sanctions, the whole the whole bit. Right. But what the bureaucracy can't plan for is when the commander in chief himself is the one amplifying the misinformation and.

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Siding with the enemy when that happens, what are they going to do? They're going to go after and attack their boss, they're going to counter message him, they're going to sanction the president. So the danger here is if the president falls victim to this misinformation because it's convenient for him, let's say if the Russians are so in discord in the United States, that's favorable towards Trump. So if he really embraces it the full throated way, that apparatus is completely unable to protect this country.

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And then I think we're in a pretty scary position. So I worry about that in October. And I think ultimately, really the only people there are to hold them to account. I mean, the American people are going to have a tough time knowing which way is up and down. It's going to be on Congress and they're going to be out of town. They're going to be campaigning. But it's going to be the responsibility of people, especially in the Republican Party, if the president goes down that route to condemn him and to tell him it's inappropriate.

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So we'll see what happens.

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But I could be doing what I was going to say. You're going to have to talk to them because they're kind of cower.

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It's it's there's a there's a cowardice epidemic sweeping the Republican Party, second only to the coronavirus pandemic, as I like to call profiles in chickenshit.

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The new abnormal is going to release a limited run series of bonus interviews over the next few weeks starting in August, we'll release a new one each Sunday. But listen carefully. Only beast inside members will have access to these. So head over to a new abnormal dot, the Daily Beast dotcom to join. Now your beast inside membership helps support the great reporting at The Beast and podcast like The New Abnormal.

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Thanks. With all of this excitement and having such an incredibly interesting guest, we almost forgot that this week is actually fuck that guy week it is fuck that guy.

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We can, as you know, America, fuck that guy is the only required information on the new abnormal this week. You're getting all the bonus. Fuck that guys you can handle. And so, Molly Rockfest, who is your fuck that guy frigidity.

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I think my fuck that guy has to be Jerry Falwell Jr..

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Jerry Falwell Jr.. Would he be with the kids, those wacky kids on the right call a cock.

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And the thing I'm not getting in this story right. Remember, Falwell tried to beat it beat.

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What are you hearing? Jerry Falwell? We don't have that information yet. Falwell released a sort of Falwell sanctioned story yesterday that said the wife had been cheating on him with the poor boy. Today, the poor boy came out and said, actually, is it still cheating if he asked the poor boy to screw his wife?

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Is it still cheating? If he's paying the poor boy to not say anything?

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Is it still cheating if he has the poor boy there while he's trying to be good servicing his own needs?

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Is it is it is it still cheating? And this is his favorite novel. Is Huckleberry Finn up?

[00:28:36]

My favorite part of this whole story is Diet Coke. My favorite part of this whole story is that Liberty University announced that Jerry Falwell Jr. was was stepping down and Jerry Falwell Jr. said he wasn't you know, he just went out and said, look, let's let the balls fall where they may see I'm going to take a swing at sticking with your job.

[00:28:58]

Oh, you can feel our producer rolling his eyes. If your waitress tried the veal, I'll be for all fucking week.

[00:29:06]

But next week, I'm I'm not even going to touch this. I'm just going to step back and watch.

[00:29:15]

Well played, sir. Well played so well. Anyway, Jerry Falwell is still the president of Liberty University as we record this podcast. We'll stay tuned.

[00:29:26]

Molly, I would like to salute you for providing the most meta and self-referential fuck that guy ever, because you know what? Not only do you just say fuck that guy about Jerry Falwell, but it was because Jerry Falwell said to his wife, fuck that guy.

[00:29:41]

Rick is never going to let this go. I'm never letting it go. It's important that one week in one week I have seen Steve Bannon and Jerry Falwell Jr. crushed beneath the wheels of fate. And I'm loving it. But I will say this. There's a missing element to your fuck that guy. It's Michael Cohen. Yes. Remember, Michael Cohen was a lawyer with three client, client number one, Donald Trump, client number two, Sean Hannity.

[00:30:04]

And Sean Hannity is client number three. Oh, I'm sorry. You're number three is Sean Hannity.

[00:30:09]

These are the numbers right now. Client number two is Jerry Falwell Jr. And Cohen had previously stated that he was helping Falwell with the matter of some embarrassing or incriminating photographs.

[00:30:21]

Yes, the wife and weirdly, not long after Michael Cohen became engaged with Donald Trump excuse me, with Jerry Falwell Jr., suddenly this pillar of moral rectitude, this stalwart of the evangelical movement, this man who speaks to God on a direct hotline every night, managed in a where where people like Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio and other evangelicals, because Marco is not a Catholic, he's an evangelical.

[00:30:44]

We're still in the race. For some reason, Jerry Falwell Jr. chose to endorse a degenerate casino owning comeback, somehow some mysterious mechanism that no mortal man saved. Michael Cohen understands what caused him to endorse Donald Trump. And it was a surprise. I remember talking to evangelicals at the time who some of whom were like very active evangelical political space. People were like, how did that happen?

[00:31:10]

Well, we now know it is worth the worth the reexamination of that question, because I suspect I smell a well oiled rat or a poor boy case.

[00:31:21]

Maybe it may be it may be some sort of suntan product.

[00:31:25]

That's on that note, we'll wrap up this episode of The New Abnormal for The Daily Beast. In future episodes. We'll be talking with smart folks from The Daily Beast and beyond, from media, culture, politics and science to help us understand what's happening to our country and the world.

[00:31:40]

We hope you'll subscribe to us on your favorite podcast app and share the show on social media. We're just getting started and don't want you to miss an episode if you'd like to follow us on Twitter. I'm Molly Chan, Fast and Historic Wealth, and thanks so much for listening. And we'll see you again on the next episode. Isn't it curious that every member of your family has a different voice, that a baby can recognize their mother's voice from inside the womb, that identical twins have the exact same vocal chords but usually don't sound similar, and teenagers can sense the tone of their dad's voice when he says, I'll think about it even over WhatsApp, I'll think about it.

[00:32:25]

Let your family follow their curiosity with unlimited data when you bring everyone's plans together. On Vodafone's multi mobile, Rad's family plan to get a third plan for only 15 euro per month 12 month contract, 15 euro per month max be 10 megabits per second applies when you add rather unlimited SIM only as a third plan with red family. See Vodafone Dorahy for full terms.