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Animated Sabrina was only arrested on April 24th, 2005, Vladimir Putin gave his annual speech to the Russian Federal Assembly, a packed house of politicians, judges, priests and power brokers.


I'll let names that you can name. He made a remarkable statement, one that opened a window into his world view and the events that would unfold over the next 15 years.


Yeah, but to me, it was a Gourriel cybersquatter user will accomplish a geopolitical catastrophe.


Vicha Putin called the collapse of the Soviet Union the greatest political disaster of the 20th century, which is really saying something. The Russian autocrat had long thought that American political warfare led by the CIA had destroyed the Soviet empire. In fact, he believed that American political warfare had been far bigger, bolder and more powerful than it really was. And he was equally convinced America was still sabotaging Russia in the 21st century long after the end of the Cold War.


Putin wanted revenge. He revived the Cold War operations of the KGB. He started challenging the United States and its allies, working to undermine and weaken them without actually going war. But the old ways of espionage and sabotage weren't good enough for Putin. He wanted new weapons with which to conduct a new kind of political warfare, and he found those weapons on the Internet. Putin has long argued that the United States controls the Internet. He once told a group of journalists in St.


Petersburg that the web was created by American intelligence.


It's just the bull in a proud absolutely everything goes through servers located in the U.S. Everything is monitored that you know, that it all began initially when the Internet first appeared as a special CIA project. And this is the way it is developing the rest.


For the record, that's a lie. But the Internet was lawless terrain. Nothing was forbidden. And Putin saw it as a new frontier for political warfare, which by definition includes all the means at our nation's command, short of war, to project its power in the world, Putin would make cyber espionage and cyber warfare his secret arsenal. They were the perfect weapons for sneak attacks, and he set out to build the strongest cyber army the world had ever known.


Putin launched the world's first cyber attack by one nation against another. On April 27th, 2007, his target was the former Soviet Republic of Estonia. Midnight Moscow time, millions of signals sent from a swarm of networked computers hijacked from around the world suddenly launched a cyber attack aimed to knock down the entire country. Estonia was the first casualty on the new battlefield of political warfare, but it would not be the last. A few years later, in 2014, Russia used its new weapons to take down Ukraine, the biggest country in Europe, and monkeywrench its presidential election.


And these attacks were test runs for a bigger battle, the one we're living with today.


I'm Tim Warner and this is World. On today's episode, we're talking about how Russia has waged political warfare in the 21st century using the Internet instead of spies soldiers to strike against its foes.


Estonia is one of Russia's next door neighbors, its capital, Tallinn, is 200 miles west of Putin's hometown, St. Petersburg. The country has long lived under the shadow of the Kremlin. In fact, Russia has controlled Estonia for 250 of the last three hundred years, their brutal occupation during World War Two was marked by murder, rape and forced labor. The Russians held the country captive until after the end of the Cold War. The Red Army's troops didn't leave until 1994, and hundreds of Russian civilians remain the Kremlin's influence still Lou.


The next year in 1995, the Estonians found a way to liberate themselves from that influence. They started to create a new kind of society, a society built on the foundations of the Internet.


Everything was wired, the lives of everyday Estonians depend on the Internet from a banking, e-commerce, e-commerce, the ID cards to voting, more than three quarters of Estonians file their tax returns on the Internet.


Estonia was the first country whose political and social architectures were framed by an Internet infrastructure. It quickly became the most technologically sophisticated nation on Earth. By the year 2000, every school was connected to the Internet. Wi-Fi was free and ever present drivers could pay parking meters on their cell phones.


Have you ever used Skype? It was created by Estonian software. 2003, Estonia was a country where you could do everything online, well, almost everything.


Well, there are three things you can't do. You can't get married online. You have to show up both at the same time. And you can't get divorced either online. So you have to face that person again.


That's Toomas Hendrik Ylvis. He was elected president of Estonia in 2006 after campaigning for years to create the connectivity that made his country unique.


And then finally, and this is, I guess, important for you American readers, is that we don't allow anonymous shell companies.


And if you want to do a transfer of property and you're a company, for example, that a member of the board has to show up, I mean, the first two are kind of trivial because who the hell gets married online?


But but the last one is actually crucial for the United States. I mean, when you have the consiglieri of the biggest Mafioso in Russia, Semion Mogilevich, and he has his guys buying apartments through anonymous shell companies in Trump Tower. Yeah, I mean, it's kind of worrisome.


Ylvis had helped ensure that Estonia put everything online government, banking, finance, insurance, communications, broadcast and print media, not to mention elections. The Kremlin wasn't happy with Estonia's wird democracy. They also weren't happy with the fact that Estonia had just become one of the newest members of the NATO military alliance led by the United States House.


Fifty five years ago, the representatives of 12 nations gathered here in Washington to sign the North Atlantic Treaty, which established the most successful military alliance in history. Today, we proudly welcome Estonia, Latvia.


Lithuania, Romania, Putin saw the expansion of NATO to include former Soviet republics as an aggressive act of political warfare, and it fueled his desire to push back. And that explains the battle of the bronze soldier. The bronze soldier was a Russian war monument in the center of town, a memorial erected in 1947 in honor of troops killed in World War Two four years, big crowds of Russians would gather at the bronze soldier, get drunk and tear down Estonian flags.


For the Russians, that statue was a symbol of wartime sacrifice that had come to represent wounded Russian pride. But for the Estonians, the bronze soldier was a reminder of the brutal Soviet occupation, and so in 2007, President Ylvis decided to move the bronze soldier from its pedestal in the capital to military cemetery as an affirmation of Estonian pride and independence.


He said it led to a pitched battle, a huge crowd of demonstrators that were protesting this plan to move the statue. Now, the idea was that we would not tear down this statue. We would move it. So it would no longer be a place to have these these disturbing demonstrations that would block traffic and harm people and provoke people. The idea was to move it and the and the remains underneath it to a military cemetery a mile and a half away.


And that's a military cemetery where you have basically buried soldiers from all kinds of armies that have invaded us, not to mention people from the Estonian side.


After President Ylvis announced he would take the bronze soldier off its pedestal, an angry mob of Russians ran riot and talent in Moscow. Putin supporters laid siege to the Estonian embassy and forced to shut down Russia pro Kremlin demonstrators outside the Estonian embassy in Moscow.


The protesters still angry about Estonia's removal of a Soviet war memorial from downtown Tallinn. The Estonian ambassador in Moscow says she's been threatened and the Russians are not moving very quickly to do something about it.


The European Union is leaning on primary. Organizers of the demonstration were filmed meeting with people from the Russian embassy who are clearly spies or are you or KGB or FSB.


We knew they were in constant communication and the demonstrations seem to be rather well organized. And so when the statue was removed and then transported, a huge riot took place. I mean, smashing windows and looting, the usual kind of stuff that takes place and riots.


I was transported out of the capital by my security detail because they said we don't think it's good for you to be here because in fact, the presidential residence or palace is not really a palace. But that's not nothing around it. I mean, you can walk up to the door, you can walk up to the window and smash it. And if you want, because we're a very open society. And then Estonia's strength, its connectedness suddenly became its weakness.


Early in the 21st century, as the United States waged bloody battles in Iraq, Russia was preparing for a new kind of war. Estonia would be its first target. I talked about this with Marilyn Musgrave. She served as president, Ylvis national security adviser, and later she became the director of NATO's Cooperative Cyber Defense Center murder in March 2004. Estonia joins the NATO military alliance and that pissed Putin often. It it sure did.


Yes. The Baltic states joining both NATO and the EU was a bullet to beat for the Kremlin.


What did he do about it?


What was happening in Estonia was sort of this war of shadows, the war of shadows, meaning that there were there was secret financing by the Kremlin, the various non-governmental organizations of Russian speakers who tried to undermine the government. And what started occurring was a massive cyber attack against various public and private Web pages in Estonia.


The initial attack began on April 27, 2007, actually started within hours. All of Estonia's computer systems, from the police department to newspapers were under attack. It lasted for over three weeks. Internet sites that normally get a thousand hits a day were suddenly getting hundreds of thousands of hits per second. The whole country festoon was being electronically jammed.


It was a de dos attack and denial of service attack against the Web pages of the Ministry of Defense, the prime minister, the president, the government, but also against the banks and all major media outlets.


The attack came in the midst of the battle of the bronze soldier as Russians were rioting in the capital of Estonia. President Elias's security detail told him to evacuate to a safe location.


So they transported me to my farm in the countryside. And then when I woke up the next day, I was I went to look at the websites, you know, the news, what's happening. And I couldn't get into them, I should say, as background, is that I worked in college as a programmer, so I know how to deal with these things. So I did the usual. I said, OK, well, that newspaper shut down.


That's interesting. That newspaper shut down. My website is down. The Prime Minister's website is down. Meanwhile, the Financial Times is fine. A New York Times is fine.


I mean, outside websites were functioning perfectly at all of the crucial Estonian websites were down.


I called my I.T. guy and then talked to the security people.


I mean, people in charge of digital security like what is going on? And they said, well, we're being attacked.


When the attack came, Merly Major was in Ukraine as her country's NATO liaison. She tried to find out what was going on back home, but it was impossible.


Everything was knocked out so the government didn't realize it was going down at first and they just thought there was a minor problem with the government press page. But soon enough, they discovered that in addition to the protests and and looting in the city center, there was a more serious problem as the whole country that was so dependent on its online services was suddenly sort of cut off from the rest of the world, literally. And it was cut off because the Estonian computer emergency response team to survive under the stress of a tax cut the country off from the Internet on April 30th.


Things escalated. A barrage of coordinated attacks struck Estonia. Malevolent systems flooded the nation's bandwidth.


Russian blogs gave detailed instructions on how to attack and overload Estonia's websites. The hackers were using so-called botnet. That's when an unauthorized user takes control over hundreds, thousands or up to a million computers. By remote control, the effect can be crippling.


The attacks crashed the government, banks, businesses, telecommunications and the media. Estonians couldn't use cash machines, pay their bills or see the news. What made it even more insidious was that by hijacking computers around the world, the Kremlin made it look like the attack was coming from 75 different countries, including Vietnam, Germany and the United States. But in reality, it came from Russia. Today, we talk a lot about attributing cyber attacks back at the day, there was not much thinking about it.


There was not much preparation for it. And I think the prime concern was to survive rather than a tribute. So more or less, you can argue that that attack was not technically attributed to Russia. However, of course, all the facts speak for itself. And when the Estonian computer emergency response team contacted various their colleagues abroad asking them to shut down the botnet, there was only one country that didn't respond that there was Russian.


This was the first time one nation waged cyber war against another. And as President Ylvis explained, the concept was so new it was hard for the world to truly grasp its significance.


They did not attack anyone physically. It was not kinetic warfare. It was something that at the time NATO couldn't wrap its head around. I mean, now it would designate that as an act of war. But in two thousand and seven, this was just unheard of. It was kind of like, you know, an alien has arrived aliens, whereas, you know, the Estonians come in and say, look, we have this thing. And they just said, what?


No way were you to write a history of cyber war. And some people have cyber war begins on the twenty seventh twenty eighth of April of 2007.


And President Hoover, was this an act of war under the laws of war?


Well, this has been a constant sort of question since 2007, is when do you say that it has become a real war? Do you need to have people killed?


Do you need basic infrastructure or critical infrastructure taken down if you have an attack that doesn't kill anyone directly but turns off the electricity to New York? Well, that sounds pretty warfare. Like if you have an attack that against New York that on a Friday afternoon turns all of the traffic lights red. That sounds pretty close to warfare is even better. Let's have an attack on a Friday afternoon that turns all traffic lights green.


That's a real mess, right?


I mean, we have to go beyond the traditional understanding of kinetic warfare.


If you take out an electrical system, as was done in the Iraq war by firing a a missile in there, that shortens everything out, that's an act of warfare that takes down the electrical system. If you go into the electrical system of a country and fry it so it doesn't work, but you do it through digital means. I mean, we're looking at what is the end result?


It's the same all across Europe and all across the world as we're speaking, our democracy is under attack and it's happening as we speak in Belarus. It's happening in Poland. It's happening in the Czech Republic. It's happening in Hungary. And I feel like democracy is under attack in America. Why is this happening? It's cheap and easy or is it is a very expensive, costly undertaking. Now, if you want to defeat the West, the liberal democracies or institutions, including the European Union and NATO, I mean, why do you want to invade?


You don't need to invade the US or France or or the U.K. You can just change the government to one that's to your liking and you can do it very cheaply.


Just a couple of hundred million dollars. I mean, that's you know, I wouldn't even get to I mean, that's a couple of hundred million dollars would get you a one jet fighter these days.


Maybe maybe we'll cheapen. The attack on Estonia was the first of its kind, but it wasn't the last.


Seven years later, the Russians began waging cyber war on Ukraine. We'll hear more about those attacks and their significance for Russia's war on American democracy after this break. Putin's next target was Ukraine, the largest nation in Europe, it borders Russia to the east, the warm waters of the oil rich Black Sea to its south, and for NATO allies to its west. The imprint of seven decades as a Soviet republic laid deep in Ukraine's soil. A statue of Lenin still stood on one end of the main street of the capital, Kiev and Putin believe that Ukraine had always belonged to Russia, as Putin told one TV interviewer, that just Ukrainians have a mentality.


We are the same people.


The president of Ukraine was Putin's ally, the immensely corrupt Viktor Yanukovich, he owed his election to the equally crooked political consultant, Paul Manafort. Later, Donald Trump's campaign manager and now a federal prisoner. Yanukovych had built a 250 million dollar mansion north of Kiev with marble staircases and golden toilets and a zoo stocked with peacocks and wild boars, all with funds stolen from his nation's treasury on November 28, 2013. Under immense pressure from Putin, Yanukovych pulled Ukraine out of an agreement to join the European Union that set off huge protests in the capital.


And the protesters marched in the name of democracy. They tore down Lenin statue. 100000 people gathered in the town square. Yanukovych told his security forces to open fire this morning, ABC News cameras captured brutal scenes, protesters gunned down by security forces, fellow activists running to their aid coming under fire themselves. Snipers lurking in windows on rooftops. Last night, they killed 100 people over the course of three days, but the protests continue and they succeeded.


Jubilation on the streets of the Ukrainian capital as protesters took control of Kiev and President Viktor Yanukovych was impeached for the second time in a decade.


Ukraine has ousted its president, sending shockwaves from Washington to Moscow and dealing a massive blow to Vladimir Putin's Russia. Jubilation in an evacuation overseen by Putin.


Yanukovych fled to Russia and then Russia decided to strike back.


Russian troops smashed their way into Ukraine's Crimea air base, backed by armored vehicles, gunfire and stun grenades. Special Forces supported by pro-Russian militia stormed the Belbek compound near Sevastopol on Saturday.


On February 27, 2014. Putin launched a hydra headed assault.


First, he seized the Crimean Peninsula, the strategically vital and coveted by the Roman Empire, the Nazis and the Soviets.


Earlier on Saturday, several hundred unarmed protesters also took control of Ukraine's naval base in western Crimea as pro-Russian militia seized Ukrainian navy ships.


Russian soldiers who weren't wearing uniforms took over government buildings in Crimea. They used cyber war weapons to separate from the rest of Ukraine. They cut off the national telecommunications company. They knocked out mobile, landline and Internet access. Their cyber attacks brought down the websites of Ukraine's government, TV stations and news outlets. Russia quickly annexed Crimea, placing it once again under Moscow's control.


Fireworks exploded over Moscow tonight, celebrating the return of Crimea to Russia. It's Russia's first expansion since World War Two.


Later, in 2014, Russia continued cyberwar when the Ukrainians held a national election to choose a new president. Russian hackers went to work. It was perhaps the most brazen attempt ever to manipulate an election. The United States should have been paying closer attention. Kenneth GEERS spent 20 years as a cyber warrior in the American military, the Pentagon sent him to Estonia when the Russians attacked in 2007, and he stayed for four years working with President Ylvis and with the NATO Cyber Security Center.


He was teaching cyber security in Ukraine when the Russians attacked in 2014. Today, he's a senior fellow at the Cyber Statecraft Initiative of the Atlantic Council, cyber or computer network operations.


Our politics by other means, it's an extension of power and almost no to cyber attacks look alike. And that's what makes defense so hard, it's hard to predict the next one. The difference between Estonia in 2007 and Ukraine 2014 could hardly be more pronounced, more clear or more interesting.


The events in Estonia were distributed denial of service attacks that targeted a wide range of government and business, but basically knocking websites offline. Ukraine was at a whole higher level. There were attacks in the diplomatic sphere that were very propaganda, even strategic sort of decision making, focused computer network operations to try and drive a wedge between the EU and the United States. For example, on the military battlefield, Special Forces operations seized telecommunications centers, physically cut cables, commandeered satellites, and not only took the Ukrainian government offline, but as I talked to my students, they saw propaganda in every social media bubble.


Every time I asked that question in the classroom, every hand went up. Ukraine's central bank, post office, Kiev's airport and even Chernobyl's nuclear monitoring system have been infected. Ukrainian government said they're working hard to get to the bottom of who's behind this attack, with some pointing at Russia and efforts to destabilize the country in 2014.


Basically, you couldn't turn a rock over and Ukraine without finding some evidence of attack. Electronic billboards were changed, you know, toward propaganda. Smart televisions had changed programming. It was really an all out effort that we hadn't seen before.


You know, it didn't look like die hard, but basically in every economic domain, you could find evidence of malware, evidence of computer network operation that in some way was intended to alter the nature of the conflict and toward Russia's favor.


What the Russians were doing to Ukraine went far beyond what they did to Estonia. They published forged Ukrainian government documents detailing a secret fascist government agenda, exactly what the KGB. Department of Disinformation did to the United States during the Cold War. The Russians stole and manipulated information from government officials. Exactly what they were about to do to the Democratic Party in America. And then on May 25th, 2014, they hacked the Ukrainian election itself.


The day before the Ukrainian presidential election results were announced, a hacker group calling themselves Cyber Beckert infiltrated Ukraine's central election computer systems cyber Becket's aim to feed into the Russian myth that Ukraine had fallen to a fascist coup.


So let's make this clear. Ukraine is having an election to replace the president who has massacred protesters and fled to Russia. Russian hackers break in to Ukraine's central election commission on the night of the election. They're already there. They disable part of the network. And just before the polls close, they post on the commission's website that a fringe pro Putin candidate had won the election. And that news goes around the world.


That evening, Russian Channel one at a bulletin declaring Mr. Yarosh the winner, quoting these exact percentages. But.


So that is exactly what happened. And the United States should have seen this as a warning of what was to come in 2016. And it was all there for us to see in 2014 and Ukraine. These are experiments in cyberspace to see if you can get away with it, to what extent they work, because international norms in cyberspace have yet to be established and everyone just tries to stay below the radar of retaliation. Know all nations are undertaking cyber espionage, but it falls below what military lawyers call the use of force.


And nobody dies in a cyber attack. And so we don't know how to defend against them.


So the Russian military intelligence malware team that attacks the Ukraine election has been given the name Fancy Bear. And that name, fancy bell rings a bell, doesn't it? Yes, of course, we should have put two and two together from 2014 and see that the same group could well target the United States. And that happened.


Isn't Fancy Bear the same outfit that attacked the Democratic National Committee and unleashed stolen emails and documents in the 2016 U.S. election? That is correct. So we should have seen it coming. We should have absolutely seen it coming.


Ukraine joining the EU and NATO allying itself with the West, even the very idea of democracy.


The Kremlin has a strong interest in undermining and so fancy bear. Yeah, for sure. It has targeted the election in Ukraine in 2014 as well as the DNC in 2016.


And it didn't stop there, did it?


So we know with both the political hack targeting the Central Election Commission in 2014 as well as the next year, that was a powergrid attack in 2015.


Around Christmas time last weekend, parts of the Ukrainian capital, Kiev, went dark. Russia appears to have figured out how to crash a power grid with a click.


When you look at the forensics, the attacks not not only sophisticated, but they started weeks and even months beforehand.


The hackers sent emails with infected attachments to power company employees, stealing their login credentials and then taking control of the grid systems to cut the circuit breakers at nearly 60 substations. So no, no person or hacker collective could have pulled that off. It's a three letter agency in this case, g you, that is tasked with strategic goals on behalf of Russia.


And it takes a lot of time and a lot of effort and advanced malware to pull off.


Nearly a quarter of a million people lost power in this small Ukrainian city when it was targeted by a suspected Russian attack last December. And so when the electricity grid goes down in 2015 and then in 2016, almost exactly one year later, they're like, you know, it's to some extent it's experimentation with malware to see what can you do with these attacks? And is defense possible? Is attribution possible? Is there going to be any type of retaliation or response?


And it's very, very weak in terms of what the West has done in response to these electricity grid attacks in the United States had better take this turn of events very seriously because what happened in western Ukraine can happen in the United States, no question about it.


Kenneth, let's just make this as clear as possible, the Russians showed that they could knock out the power grid and plunge hundreds of thousands of people in Ukraine into darkness in the dead of winter. And you're telling us they can do that to an American city? What would happen if the electrical grid of a major U.S. city without so its hospitals, its schools, its your workplace and everything depends on electricity, so your computer, your cell phone, all of these things, nothing works without electrical power.


So in a sense, it's the ultimate attack on a target population or nation. And so if you target, for example, you know, the electricity grid in Kansas City with enough preparation so that you don't just turn off the system, but then after that, you destroy the computers and the computer networks and infrastructure as well. In other words, you delete all of the data. You can make it so that it's very hard to reinstall the operating system and the applications.


Then all of a sudden it's much, much harder to get back on your feet. In Ukraine, they restarted the power in just hours, but an attack in the US could leave people without electricity for days or even weeks, according to experts, because America's advanced automated grid would be much harder to fix.


So it's possible to do this kind of attack. The question is, is, you know, whether a country would want to. The United States has already said that we would respond with a nuclear attack to a cyber attack if it crossed a certain threshold.


The 9/11 attacks were an unexpected blow from an unexpected direction, and so. Were the attacks on our democracy in 2016, so when 2016 happened. One could argue that it wasn't a surprise that we were caught flat footed because of the audacity of the attack. I mean, it was literally a direct attack on democracy in America, and it could be that our imagination failed us.


The United States, when it looks at its its own security, we have the Atlantic and Pacific Ocean on either side, and that's protected us historically from foreign armies. But in the age of cyber attacks, essentially we have seen and there's no better example than 2016 that we are really vulnerable. We'll talk about how vulnerable we really are after the break. On July 17th, 2014, Malaysian Airlines Flight MH 17 took off from Amsterdam. It was 33000 feet above Ukraine when it was struck by a Russian missile, not an accident or a disaster, but an act of terrorism.


Those were the words of the Ukrainian president today after a flight with 298 people on board was apparently shot down over his country.


That missile system was carried across the border from the Russian city of Kursk into rebel held separatist territory in eastern Ukraine. They're even naming the brigade.


They say it was the Russian fifty third anti aircraft brigade that carried it across Russian soldiers and pro-Russian separatists occupying eastern Ukraine that shot down the plane. They killed all 298 people on board. Two thirds of the dead were Dutch. It was the deadliest attack on a civilian plane in history. Putin insisted Russia had nothing to do with the attack instead of owning up to it. The Kremlin put a conspiracy theory out on the Internet, claiming that the CIA had put dead bodies inside a plane and then shot it down to create propaganda against Russia.


In response to the killing, the Dutch intelligence service mounted a secret operation against Putin's Internet Army.


Its all starts in the summer of 2014 when a hacker employed by Dutch intelligence service IFAD gains access to the computer network of a university building close to Moscow's Red Square. It's the building from where the infamous Russian hacker group Cozy Bear attacks governments and companies all over the world.


The Dutch and the Dutch put the Russian spies under surveillance. The Russians never knew. In a remarkable feat of espionage, the Dutch could literally see the Russian cyber war group launching its attacks.


They have not only dug themselves into the computer network being used, they even have access to their security camera.


That's how they observe that members of the Russian Secret Service are involved with the hacks.


First, the Dutch detected attacks on their own country earlier this year.


They say Russian agents tried to disrupt the Dutch investigation into the downing of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 over Ukraine in 2014. And on top of that, they were trying to hack into the Netherlands based Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons.


And then they saw the Russians mounting a plot against America. They alerted the National Security Agency that the Russians were rooting around in the unclassified computer systems of the State Department. The Russians could see the emails of the secretary of state, a woman, Putin LOV. Hillary Clinton, but no one realized what the Russians were really up to. They were laying the groundwork, preparing the battlefield for an attack on the 2016 election and on American democracy itself. And that's the next episode of Worland.


One is presented by Caden's 13 Jigsaw Productions and Prologue Projects, the show is written by me. Tim Weiner and produced by No Mossbank, Andrew Parsons and Leon NEFA with editorial support from Madison White. The story is based on my book, The Folly and the Glory America, Russia and Political Warfare. One is executive produced by Chris Corcoran, Alex Gibney, Stephen Fisher, Stacey ofMan, Richard Borrello, Joey Mara and John Schmitt.