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Hello, everybody, and welcome to and that's why we drink, it is a true crime paranormal podcast and it is hosted by Two Beautiful Souls. I'm Christine.


I guess some of the other beautiful soul. Oh, no, sorry, I meant go, but I guess you could say, oh, sorry.


I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Let me take the back. I'm sorry. It's just about three really wonderful, beautiful souls.


I feel like we're where I feel like I can hear the sounds of swerving through traffic in my head. Just trying to get to the end here.


Can you hear my sweat? Just like, oh no. I was wondering if there was a leak in your house because I was just just puddling underneath you.


Well, speaking of a leak, OK, that's a terrible way to take it back. I it back, but that's not what I meant. What I meant was, speaking of there is literally no Segou here that I don't know why I said it like that.


Are you. Well, what's happening? I'm trying to force a conversation. Let's have it.


Oh my God. Why you almost always do. Am I in trouble or is it.


No, I want to tell you about my fluffy coat happily. OK, look, I just like to know before I get into a conversation where I how I should feel, you know? Oh, don't worry.


You would have received a text that said something like Smiley Face. I'd like to talk to you today.


And then you would get an emoji of me running away in a gust of wind.


Oh, my God, no. So I've been obsessed with fluffy things lately. And since it's it's supposed to we're getting an arctic blast here in Cincinnati. And I listen, I don't fucking know, but Google told me and apparently it's going to be in the below zero here.


So I've bought some fluffy stuff and I'm super cozy and fluffy and I'm just, you know, I'm trying to embrace it, live my life.


What is the difference between an arctic blast and a bomb cyclone? You know, I'm glad you asked because I have absolutely no idea.


I thought as much I but you know what it's good to know for those of you who don't know, we once got stuck in a bomb cyclone in Salt Lake City just before the cyclone that I had never failed or not.


Was it Salt Lake City? That's a bomb. Cyclone, that's what it was called. And we were just horrified. And our driver kept saying, oh, it's a bomb cyclone, you know?


And we were like, that was like, we're in an Uber. We don't live here. You can tell we're from California. Right. Well, good luck with your Arctic chill or whatever you just do.


But it sounds like the name of a Mountain Dew drink arctic blast. I think it actually is the name of a beverage.


And it sounds like it would be a really nice like a bright neon Crayola Tuscan artec.


It is. It's a catering flavor. So that's what I'm thinking. You're right. It's a glacier freeze. That's what I have now. Yes. I'm going to have a glacier freeze outside.


And that's why I wear these nice fluffy clothes.


By the end of February, they'll be a glacier freeze near you.


How are you what do you what do you drink and why?


Oh, I'm drinking for a few reasons. Nothing like really necessary. Like nothing, nothing big.


But it's all the little things that just add up and I'm like, oh, I'm so over this.


I'm drinking tea from coffee bean because that fits we because we know the the traumatic story of Starbucks not bringing me one on Fox anymore.


Absolutely. I'm drinking a thirty two ounce because I felt like I deserved it by doing nothing.


But I was like, you know it this is my moment, my moment with the coffee bean, my time to shine.


Why do I drink? Well, I have a personal disappointment and that I have been trying really hard to not bite my nails anymore. And then last night I really went to town on my thumb.


I don't think I knew that you bit your nails.


Oh, that's to other people in my life.


That would be shocking because, I mean, like, I know you do that, but I didn't know it was something you, like, actively cared about. Yeah, no. So ever since I was like a little kid, it's been really bad. Like I used to be like my fingers would be bleeding by the end of the day. But and so I've been like, I'm going to not bite my nails anymore. And it was a really hard habit to break just because I've been doing it my whole life and I've been really, really good for like two and a half months now.


I basically carry nail clippers with me all the time. And then something happened where Alison was showering or I couldn't get to the nail clippers. And there was like one thing I kept getting stuck on my nails, kept catching on things so I couldn't take it.


I couldn't take it. And so last night, I like that my thumb all the way down to the bone, basically, and the bone.


OK, right. Let's not be dramatic. It doesn't feel good. Every time my hand catches the air, I can feel it's oh God. So I'm drinking for that while some drinking. I'm sure there's other reasons there always are, we'll find them along the way, rest assured, but we're going to start today with the nails and see where it takes us. Also, I'm trying this thing. So if you can if you're watching YouTube, you can see like a little situation what is in front of me.


So I was I remember last time or two, two weeks ago where I was like, oh, I'm going to try to start soundproofing and audio treating on my end that way, like it doesn't sound like I'm in a cave because I'm in a big empty room with Trey Songz about me.


So I got this thing and it was I did what I always do and I misjudged the dimensions, if you know what I'm talking about.


One time I wanted to get Christine like a little tiny Hot Wheels tractor, and I basically bought her a real John Deere tractor.


And so I wanted to get Amazon. But you know what? I had that big ass tractor for too long, too, by the way. But so I got this. I was supposed to make a little sound Booth Cube for you. Just put your microphone. And so it's surrounded all on it. On all ends. Oh, yeah. Yeah. But the thing is, like, way bigger than even the table that I set my mic and my laptop.


And I mean, this is the for those of you look and this is the box, it's like, oh Jesus, holy crap, big.


And there was just no way I was going to be able to like finagle it.


So I just took one of the phone panels and I'm trying to like it around my microphone. So as much of my my mic is like is protected as possible, damp, and it's just like a big foam square. So I'm actually using Allison's necklaces to wait. It does with that.


I'm trying to curve the foam thing around my mic and on the bottom I she has like two pound weights and so like I have them like kind of pressed into like it's I really I'm trying to do what I can with what I've got here. But hopefully the audio sounds better this time. At least one side of it is protected.


Sounds good to me, so I don't know anything about it. But anyway, I drink because I have only nine nails and also I am not a professional in terms of sound quality.


Why do you drink, Christine? Oh, thank you for asking.


Well, first of all, I'm drinking this lovely. I received this in my little Warner Brothers gift package.


They mailed me about that Natalie Morales show and it's a little Stumptown cold brew coffee with oatmeal. Corchado And I was like, wow, I can really live my L.A. lifestyle over here and can just say, yeah, and do not.


They don't have that in L.A. They have that in L.A. for sure. Are sorry. They don't have they don't have it outside of L.A..


Oh I don't know. I don't really leave my house here, so I haven't been able to explore very much. There are definitely some coffee shops near here, but I haven't really delved into their wares.


They mostly have those. They're mostly of those pickup windows or you can walk up and but the problem is so I this was in the box and I was like, cute. So I took a couple of days, open the box, saw this and then I read on the back like keep refrigerated.


Well, it certainly hasn't been refrigerated since however long they had it in this box. So I've refrigerated since, but I'm going to drink it. And if it's terrible, I brought my Caronna car cup just in case a car for emergencies because it's not wine time.


Yeah. If you if you fall over finally there's like a potential that I'm not the one that murdered you.


It could have just been my finally unless you've another product, unless you were somehow involved with this Warner Brothers Natalie Morales situation, which I wouldn't put past you unless I work at Stumptown and like injected that that box of coffee alone with something.


But anyway, so it's actually pretty good. Oh, I think it's fine. That's how I wanted it to taste. I think it's fine.


So anyway, that's currently why I drink. It's not wine time yet, so I'm sure I'll be drinking later.


But I have the weirdest reason ever why drink, which is I don't even really know how to start this because.


Oh God, it's just I've been thinking about it nonstop since Bleys told me so I've been with Bleys for probably like, oh God, I don't know, seven or eight years at this point.


A million, many lifetimes. And, you know, you get to a point where you're like, oh, I feel like I know pretty much everything.


Like we know everything about each other. I mean, you know, I love to sprinkle in fun facts every now and then about things that I forgot existed.


Sprinkel and fun facts are peper and information about how he might be murdered one day and he'll never see it. Yeah, it's right.


OK, fine. All right. Maybe I like to aggressively force really, really questionable facts about my past into our relationship.


That's fair.


But look, I don't know if, like, I know Blaze's family really well, like, I know all his friends growing up and stuff. And the other day I was falling asleep. It was like 1:00 in the morning. And all of a sudden I don't know how we got on this topic, but Bleys brought up a teacher of his from elementary school. And I was like, OK, he plays like he was such a weirdo. And I was like, oh, OK.


I don't know. And I was trying to fall asleep. And I was like, oh, why? And Bleys went into this fucking story about this teacher he had where I was like, I thought I was the only one with, like, a really fever dream, like elementary school.


Blaze's tells me, I don't think I've laughed so hard in my whole life. He was telling me about this teacher and then he kind of paused and he's like, oh, and one time he took me to a Beanie Baby auction and I was like, OK, so I turned the lights back on.


This is named Bird Bird. That's true.


My dad literally still has a laundry basket full of Beanie Babies, similar to my gosh.


But he's like, yeah, he took me to. And I was like, wait, what do you mean? And he was like, well, it was a prize.


And I was like, OK, I'm going to turn the lights on and make you tell me this whole story, because I don't like that we're just glossing over it like you're like, I need the lights on so I can look around and make sure that I am in a real environment and not in my own head space. Yeah, yeah.


I'm not lucid dreaming. Right.


So I was like, can you tell me what the hell you're talking about? And at this point, I'm like, fascinated.


And he tells me the story about how his teachers look at this.


Well, one time a teacher started because he said his teacher threw a valentines at and one time his mom had brought all these beautiful homemade Valentines, Pokemon, Valentines, and his teacher just like threw them at him. And I was like, that sounds like a very interesting memory.


But then he's like, yeah. He also took me to a Beanie Baby auction. And I said, What does that mean? Please tell me. And he said, well, it was a prize because I guess if he was like the cool teacher and I guess if you were the citizen of the month, which is what the school called like Student of the month, which I certainly never was.


No, he was like, then you got to go with me. I don't want to say his name with Mr. Blank.


Mr. Smith, let's call Mr. Beanie Baby, man. Really, baby. Mr. Schiefer. I mean, hello, Mr. Mr. Smith.


To the Beanie Baby auction. And I was like, why? And he's like, because he was obsessed with Beanie Babies and he was convinced he was going to become a multimillionaire. So he collected them. And I said, so like, was it a class trip? And he's like, no, he would just take one student at a time. And I was like, OK, this is starting to sound really questionable.


And he goes, Well, his wife was there.


And I was like, his wife was there. And it turns out like Blaise and he's like he phrased it as if it were a recovered memory.


He was like, wow. Yeah. It really was a strange experience. My mom just dropped me off. He drove me to this auction outside of a Christmas tree store. And it was in the parking lot. It was freezing out and they started auctioning off Beanie Babies and his wife was there. It was just me. And at the end, he got to take home a Beanie Baby.


I don't know. The 90s were a weird time because now I know boundaries, no boundaries.


The fact that your mother, who I've hurt, your mother in law, who I've met is like pretty sharp. Oh, yeah. It was just like, oh well, yeah, have fun.


But I know I was like I thought only Renata did shit like that, but so I texted Blace, texted her because he's like, I need you to understand that this was real.


So he included me in a group, Texas parents and his mom was like, yeah, looking back, that was like a really weird time. And Bleys and I were like, you know, as the oldest, I feel like we sacrificed a lot because then our younger siblings don't have to go to Beanie Baby auctions in the cold with their male teacher. Anyway, I just I can't stop thinking about it, that's all.


You know, that's the end. No, that's all I'll ever be. Yeah.


Now, because a lot of people are going to have a lot of opinions. But I that's I want to say I'm surprised after everything you've ever told me, I'm just like another drop in the bucket.


But it's it's weird. It is weird. It's also weird that blaze, the person who I expect the least to be, that's actually stable.


Yeah. The only stable person in our multi relationship dynamic.


The fact that even he was saying it like it was normal is the odd part where usually he would say something like that and be like usually it'd be like, this is weird. But the fact that he was just saying it and then over time was like, huh, why are you turning the lights on? Why do you think this is a beta?


Why are you calling the authorities? Yeah, I think that's lie because I feel like I do that a lot and people are like, Christine, are you hearing what you're saying?


But then I got to be the person who said, Bleys, are you hearing what you're saying? This is so creepy and strange and also what Beanie Baby did you get?


And he was like, that's the worst part. I didn't even get like a cool Beanie Baby.


He gave me, like, some generic one that wasn't ever going to become make me rich and famous, not to make it about me, but it feels a lot like the musk situation where all I wanted was my fucking steak. And then the worst part of it all was at the end, after this really weird experience, I was all alone. Don't even wear blazers. Mom apparently dropped me off. There was no steak at the end, though.


And I mean, after all that, I was like, I bet you never wanted to be a citizen of the month ever again, because what a terrible price, you know.


Yeah, well, at our school it was if you were the winner or not the winner, be like the student of the month or whatever you got. I don't know if people still do this, but when you would have to line up and someone was like the head of the train on was the caboose now OK?


Oh, yeah. I mean, I guess, yeah, like it was like if you became if you were a student of the month, you got to be the caboose, which was at the very back of the line.


And I was like, l l not. Right. Are you sure that's not what they just told you to make you feel better for that one?


Check out, because I certainly didn't deserve Student of the Month. I deserved the caboose. I mean, that's better. I feel like if you're sitting in the month and you're in the front of the line, everyone just like rolls their eyes at you. I guess if you're in the back, maybe you're, like, cooler.


So we used to have actually, I would love to find this video. It's got to be somewhere in my basement. But there was one thing in first grade where every month there was there was only 18 students in the class. But there was this one thing called Special Person of the Month or whatever, and you've got to bring your parents and bring in your favorite toys, bring in like a bunch of your favorite stuff. And like, once every I guess it was a month.


That doesn't make sense because there weren't 18 months of first grade for me.


Chocolate, maybe not everybody got the month.


No, everyone got a chance. Maybe it was like Special Person of the Week. We did that in elementary school where you brought in a poster about your head, about me.


You got to do a presentation on your shows. It was really fun for the day. That's like, ah, I was gonna say, that's our fucking jam, man.


This is officially we've done a special person of four years now. We've called worst ourselves.


It's only the two of us because every month we get to be the special person of the month and bring our parents in.


Yeah, well, it was. And so you would sit up there, your parents would come in and then you would do a presentation yourself and everyone was assigned a question to ask you. So by the end of the experience, everyone had gotten a chance to ask you a question about yourself. You would answer it and you would bring in like your favorite snacks, your favorite toys. You would explain everything. Your parents would tell their favorite stories about you, and then everyone would sing, getting to know you and that special person.


And then and then until the next special person presentation, you were the caboose of every line, every time you went on field trips and shit.


OK, that's sweet. I will see. I didn't really speak English in first grade, so I just showed up with a poster about myself and everyone. I remember we had the same thing. I'm actually getting really upset now a stomachache already because I remember that I brought my poster in and I was trying to talk about myself and they had to do like the questions in the first person ask Why are you so weird?


Oh, and everybody laughed. And so that was my memory of being a person.


That's why they were assigned questions. We all had a popsicle, so we had a Popsicle stick with a question on it. And so the teacher would have had a can of popsicle sticks and you would pull one before the president. I see.


That are not our teachers are a little bit cooler and thought it was hilarious. And someone said, why do you sound so funny? And I was like, fuck off. I wasn't. I just was quiet. And then I cried.


You should have like like said a little German curse on them and I should have hexed them gone on about, you know, what Hecks means in in German know the word, you know, a witch and that means a witch checks out.


I know it's not fun Hecks. Oh, I don't get it. Hecks. Oh my God.


I'm moving on quickly. I had a fun fact and had to turn it into a bad pun. I'm just saying I didn't know that.


But it makes sense because Hexis and which is like they're always the words are always put together. Also another fun fact. Did you know what Pokémon means? Because I just found this up.


Yeah, I found this out once on a podcast actually.


Was it this podcast? Am I saying it again? I'm a time traveler. I forget, though. I like pocket monsters. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's right.


It blew my oh no. It was Pikachu that I learned what it meant. Apparently Piqua is like mouse.


Oh what's true in Japanese.


I think like it's like a mouse sneezing. Am I making that up.


I don't look I just found out what Pokémon means, but it blew me away. I was like, how on earth did I not get there?


Yeah, I knew that because in other languages they're called pocket monsters. Yeah, well. Oh, OK. Pikachu means sparkle mouse noise, which is why he goes like Peka.


That's that's precious and sparkle because like a lightning Pokemon baby.


Yeah. That's probably why that's fun. Anyway, sorry this got off the rails as usual, but welcome to our show. Tells a ghost story or a creepy story. I tell a creepy story that's about murder. So welcome to the show. And I guess shall we begin.


Yeah. Oh, wait. OK, we have an announcement.


We're doing a live show and you always gets mad at me like, oh, Kristine's delaying the show.


But like, when did I get mad about that? You went, oh, because because you were the one ironically talking about how we keep derailing.


And then you're like, well, because neither of us brought up the live show, we're doing well. We are doing a live show February twenty six. It's a virtual live show, ten dollars a ticket. And it's going to be worth having listeners stories submitted. And if you would like your chance at your story being read during the virtual live show, you can send them to us from our couches at Gmail dot com.


Yes, OK. Mm hmm. And what's the link? I don't remember.


Oh, well, do you know? No, but we can we'll post it on our we're going to kind of try to social media blast it so you will you will see the EVA can put it in the chat here.


And if she types it in the chat, then I'll just say it while we're whenever it shows up.


Yes, but yes. If it doesn't show we have and that's why we drink it, it'll be like in our bios on our social media. Oh yeah, it'll be social media and on our website, too. But yeah, we're really excited. We haven't done one in a while. It'll be our first of the year. We're super excited.


The last couple have been really fun and we really like picking, you know, the scariest stories we get. So. Oh OK. Here comes on location live dotcom.


Thanks, Zeba. Here you go. But yes, please come. It'll be fun. We are going to be live reacting to the stories, so we will all be finding out.


You got it. We will be finding out what these stories are about all together.


So, yes, it'll be fun.


It'll be fun. And there's a Q&A like during the intermission and stuff. It'll be lovegood intermission. Yeah. So please come. We're very excited about what day is this come out? Oh no, it's still very early in February. Oh my goodness. OK, never mind them. Not that anything is being announced. Here's what I was going to say. I'm I'm currently working on the new escape room, so sometime sometime in March that's going to be ready.


And I was going to say something about it if this comes out in March. But it absolutely isn't because it is so early. Anyway, be on the lookout for an escape room.


Christine, I used to think of my skin goals as unattainable. I always had some days it was I had really oily skin, some days I'd really dry skin. Some days it was a combination of the worst situations. And it just I felt like I was kind of at a loss. But luckily, we are working with neurology and it's just been such a delight and it's become so easy and part of my routine.


So whether you're trying to take control of acne or if acne isn't your concern and like me, you're worried about fine lines, dark spots, breakouts, clog pores, dry skin.


I'm just adding things now because I have a long list called you will customize a prescription formula with three active ingredients picked just for you to tackle your skin care needs. So, for example, I have a very big fear of my dry skin and wrinkles and fine lines on top of hormonal acne, which seems to be a fun thing that's back in my life.


So I use neurology. It's great they match you with the licensed dermatology provider who gets to know your skin and then they mail it to you and you can use it. And look how beautiful and glowing we are.


And just to say, oh, for the thousandth time, we love a good quiz. And with your allergy, you get to take your own do your own questions for a treatment plan. And it's just a little dash of extra fun, if we like to say so ourselves.


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But see, you are strength to unlock your free 30 day trial psychology dot com for all the details.


Friends don't let friends live with anything less than amazing hair, which is why I yell at Christine every single day that her hair is perfect and she better know about it. And the only reason it's perfect and the only reason my hair is perfect is because we use functional beauty. It's true.


Mean is me about my bald spot and stuff. But now I function in beauty.


And by the way, I smell lovely like pear. Sometimes I buy the peach scent, but the pears also amazing. Just fun fact. I currently smell like peaches.


It's it's a delight. No one else is here, but I can just like time to do a little throwback and I like and I with my own hair as it tosses in the breeze. But you know, you got to do it.


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So like you'll have something unique that's noodle's all the way to the top. And I also like to throw this and you get to pick whatever colors you want. I have black conditioner. This is, I got the most like I don't know, it's, it's delightful is what it is actually. Never buy off the shelf just to be disappointed ever again. Go to function dotcom. Sure. To take your quiz and save 20 percent on your order.


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Here's my story. Let's just let's just try to do this. So here's my story. This is the story of the Betties house and Quitman, Arkansas. Oh, this is also known sometimes as the legend of the dog boy. But I feel like that's leading. That's because my thought is that the dog boy becomes like a main character here. And I feel like, what's the opposite of burying a lead? Like, hmm. Unearthing a little earth.


Yeah, it feels I feel like it makes it sound a lot more spectacular if I go with the dog.


Oh, you're saying like it's a misleading title, misleading and sort of boring.


I don't know yet. But here's a story of the Bettis house featuring the dog boy. So it's in equipment Arkansas, which farm, in fact, was a major trading center until 1870. It's also an important halfway point to get from from Tennessee to Arkansas. It's a big travel area that's heavily populated and especially during the Civil War. It was a place where a lot of folks enlisted for the army. So there's a lot of soldiers in the area.


And Arkansas, I did want to throw in like a little fun, extra paranormal story before I talk about the buddy's house just because it's super quick. But apparently in the same area, there is a vanishing hitchhiker. Everyone knows about where there's I guess the story goes that a man was driving to Little Rock and he saw in the middle of the night this girl sitting on the side of the road and she had like a cut on her eye and her dress looked kind of fucked up.


And he pulled us over to ask if she was OK. And she said she had been in an accident if he could drive her home. And so he gets to the address that she gives him, knocked on the door and like a man opened the door and he said, hey, there's this girl that's in my car. And so she lives here. She's been in an accident. And the guy that lives there will say, like, oh, no, that's my daughter.


She died in an accident years ago. And it's pretty common that she will show up for people in the middle of the night and ask them to be driven home.


That's so spooky. Can you imagine, like, being that family, though, and like, every time the doorbell rings at night, you're like, now I have to talk about my daughter's death again. Like, that must just be so traumatic to every single time have to explain to people like it's not real. She's not alive.


It it's it would also be in like the most silver lining of ways, really comforting to be like, oh yeah, she's still fucking around, she's still hanging, but she's like but she's like still traumatized all the side of the road, you know, like reliving it over and over again.


Yeah. I luckily we don't have to experience that, but I it would be I think it'd be comforting. At least one person would be like, oh yeah, she's still out there, she's still hanging out. So anyway, a lot of people experience this girl. And so nowadays he's like, oh yeah, no, just go back to your car. You'll see if she's not in the car anymore. She's vanished at this point. But so if you see a little girl and you're in your Little Rock, Arkansas, and it's been I might might be a ghost, so I just want to throw that out there.


Well, before I got into the real story or so, Quitman, Arkansas, has the legend of the dog boy. But apparently there's another story called the dog faced boy, which this is not.


Apparently, people mix them not to be confused with dog boy, not to be confused with the famed dog faced boy.


Apparently, of course, very different dog faced boys in Russia, Russia.


Oh, so completely different, not even a little bit nearby. OK, so they they call them dog boy at least nowadays, because folks will say that they see the silhouette of a three hundred pound dog man hybrid with glowing eyes.


Oh, and they call it a cowboy instead of like a three hundred dog man hybrid with glowing eyes.


They say it's just shorter. Just shorter to say dog boy, you know, I guess apparently we'll look out the windows and he will chase people down. There is a few reports that will chase people down trying to bite at your heels like a dog, more dog than man. It makes me wonder which part is dog and which part is man in terms of the hybrid combo here, like, is it a Christine body with a head or as Christine has on its body, both are equally not not great predators.


So I'm not sure which they're both very good at eating popcorn.


That that's what that's about. Where it. Yeah, that's about where the line is drawn.


So the house that folksy Hammon was originally called the Garrett House. I don't know why and I don't know when it changed, but ah, you know, I changed. I don't know why. It was originally called the Garrett House though. And now it is called the Bettas House, which is on sixty five Mulberry Street. And the house was originally built in eighteen ninety in Cleburne, Claiborne County, which is in downtown Quitman. And it's said to have the dog boy and also additional ghosts in the house.


So peppered with extra fun. As I like to say, if I were a real realtor trying to sell this house peppered with extra fun with surprises down the road. So they actually next to this house is a long time neighbor who has helped give a lot of information about the families over time. So most of our info that we can get about the Betty's house has somehow been circulated through this neighbor. So it could really just be like a Desperate Housewives neighbor who just, like, has nothing but time to make up shit.


If this happened to be all real, they're basically like a free archivist for the neighborhood. Oh, I love it. I love it.


So it's up to you what you believe. Maybe you believe in the three hundred pound dog man hybrid. Maybe you believe that the neighbor is bored. It's up to you both.


I believe it's not possible. So when it was known as the Garrett house, the family, the Jackson family lived there, which is why I don't know why it's called it's not called the Jackson House. Interesting. I would have thought the family were the Garretts, but whatever. So the Jackson family lived there when it was the Garrett house and then the Jackson family. The husband's name was Ben Jackson. His wife had died at twenty eight and then their son, who ended up becoming a World War One vet.


He also died at twenty one. I think both of them died in the house. So they're both of their spirits are known to haunt the building now. And I'm assuming there's probably some story out there that, oh, and then Ben Jackson died and now he haunts the house with his wife and son. So there's a family of ghosts.


If you and then their dog, Man Hybrid died and also haunts the house. Yep.


What? You nailed it. Ben actually was a werewolf and now he's a ghost. He's half and half. He's just so I could never find out. So in the nineteen fifties after they died, the Betties family moved in, which is when the house became the pet. His house got it. And this is the nineteen fifties. So Floyd and Aileen Bettis, they moved in and four years into living there, I think they had their son named Gerald.


And some people or some sources also call him like Jarrel or Jurrell. It's like with a J. But the one that people most know is Gerald, like from Arnold. Got it. And so he was born in nineteen fifty four. And I guess right off the bat he was a really difficult kid. Not only did he have issues at school with like having a hard time learning or he was getting bullied or whatever, but according to neighbors, maybe this one very loud neighbor quote, his parents were good people, but Gerald was a brat, vicious and cruel.


Oh, goodness.


OK, that's he was never student of the month, I'll tell you that was he deserved the caboose before anyone except and not the special person.


He definitely deserved no Beanie Babies. Certainly not. Apparently, he had some really weird behaviors, including collecting cats and dogs, which like I don't love the phrasing of that.


So when I heard collecting cats and dogs, I was like, OK, Gerald, you and everyone else in the twenty first century, you're not special.


Like everyone's got a million cats and dogs, which, by the way, is what led him to the name Dog Boy, because apparently it was always dog because he was primarily collecting dogs.


Can we. We clarify, like collecting dogs, like in an OK way or like in a murderous way. What why are you doing that face, because collecting means catching and torturing fuck. So and that's as far as we go there. Just so why not? One neighbor claims that I'm confused about this because I don't know if I mean Gerrold himself, once he was an adult or Gerald's parents did this favor for him or something. But at some point an addition was built onto the house and the rumor circulated that they were building room so they could fit more animals in the house.


OK. All right. That makes sense. Like Christine would build an addition on her house for a million.


Vergos, to be clear, that's like but not for nefarious purposes, right. To be. Well, the nefarious purposes would be. So you would have more souls to drink wine with and watch go someplace else.


Yeah, I just did a lot of attention, just like it would be just for the socializing of it all.


So he he apparently also really liked attention, which like, OK, no surprise. Can't fault him for that. Yeah. And also can't relate. Lowell like in Helliwell. Not at all. Apparently during a family reunion, Gerald once laid across the couch in front of everyone and fed himself grapes, which like sounds like, oh my God, you and I both have done that.


And I don't even I'm not going to ask because I know you asked what I did in my special person presentation, asked me questions about myself now. So this really does sound like it could have been us if we took a really dark turn. Like it's just it's just, yeah, here we are. Talk about me.


I'm going to feed myself grapes and build an addition on my house for my dogs that like that much period, end of story is definitely us for sure. S So unfortunately, eventually the abuse from the animals carried over to his folks. And as he got older, he became he got me. He was in control of his family. So here's a quote I think from the neighbor. He kept his parents virtually imprisoned upstairs. He would feed them only when he decided it was time to eat.


Oh, by the time he was an adult, he was six for three hundred pounds, just like the boy. And Gerald was known for beating up his father and once even threw him out of an upstairs window when he was in his 70s when the dad, God dad was in the seventies. Jeez.


Apparently there was one particular time where Floyd in his 70s got thrown out the window and had to hang onto the ledge until the police showed up, which was the neighbor just like taking notes this whole time, because I'm like, what is this nosy neighbor that makes me think it's a very desperate house.


Oh, just sitting on the porch, drinking my tea, watching him get thrown out the window again. Seriously, just like taking some notes, the upper body strength like I, I am twenty eight and if someone threw me out the window I'd be like guess I'm hitting the ground like a wave on your way down. Yeah. No there's no grabbing on it.


There's no chance I wouldn't even try if I saw a ledge I wouldn't even grab it. I would be like what's the point.


It's just going to, it's just going to leave at the ledge. Just keep going. It's just going to make this process take longer as well. The inevitable. Yeah. So in nineteen eighty one, Floyd, the dad died from quote illness at home, which is pretty vague. But locals say he was probably pushed down the stairs and broke his neck or something along those lines. Oh my God. They assume that Gerald had something to do with this, OK, just because he was getting abused left and right anyway.


And then it was such a vague explanation for his death. So a neighbor said this about Gerald, said that if you had ever seen his eyes, they seemed to glow at night. So this is kind of the beginning of rumors of, oh, he's already known as dog boy. And his eyes seem to glow at night. So. Right. We can see where this is leading. They seem to glow a night. One time he came over here and got onto us because we had trimmed a magnolia tree that overlapped into his backyard.


And when they started cleaning that house up after Floyd died, one of his uncles even came to my house to borrow a gun because he was afraid that his nephew Gerald would get riled up during the chase. So this his whole family's terrified of him and the neighbors know about it. And probably the neighbors were like threatened into silence or suros or something. So he's basically in charge of the neighborhood at this point. So after Floyds death, Gerald's mom, Eilleen, she fell and broke her hip.


So she went to the hospital. And apparently while at the hospital, another neighbor who happened to be a nurse at that hospital could report that she witnessed Gerald visiting her in the hospital and, quote, slapping her around and telling her, I'm going to have you arrested if you tell anyone what I did. Oh.


Oh, Jesus. OK, we never find out what it is that he did, but I think we're assuming it's that he killed Floyd. Is that so? Not long after Aileen was put into an adult protective services, because I guess the girl was able to finally get her help. So she got away from Gerald. And once she was gone, he started he got arrested because he built a grow room in his house. And so he had like a bunch of pot everywhere, got arrested, went to prison.


And in the eighties, while in prison, he died at 34 of a drug overdose and. And his mom was still alive until nineteen ninety five. The niece inherited the house, but soon it was sold to a truck driver named Tony and his wife. OK.


Wow. Whoa. What a what a roller coaster man.


Yeah. So that's that's the history of the bettas house. So big. Tony got the house afterwards. And there is apparently this is precious. There's an organization. I hope it's still around. It probably is. There is an organization, Arkansas, called Central Arkansas Society for Paranormal Research, a.k.a. Casper.


Love that, is that not so fun, so cute, so fun. So cute. Oh, my gosh. Arkansas, if you're listening, I would like to join Casper as an honorary member, you know. And so the founder's name is Karen Schilling. So, Miss Karen, if you're listening. Hi, Miss Karen of Casper.


I'd love to join to Kaspar's. Karen Kaspar's here. So Karen says that the Weavers pretty much right away experienced a lot of activity and she ended up knowing them because Tony and his wife saw an ad for Casper in the paper. Old school, Arkansas love it. And they called Karen for help because they were like, there's too much going on in the house. At first, the Weavers would notice that the lights were turning off. They would go to work, turn the lights off before they left.


And when they came home, every single light was on and soon the activity got stronger.


I hate that it builds like that. That always freaks me out like it's gathering energy over time.


It's just, yeah, it's it's almost like it's trying to see what it can get away with. And then once you're it's not that you're necessarily giving it positive or negative energy, but because you don't seem to care, you're not forcing it out or we can build on itself or sometimes I think what if you're afraid because you're already freaked out by the lights and then it feeds off of that, you know what I mean?


Like feeds off your, like, energy and being afraid.


That's what I would guess. I don't know, though, because this is just all sounds terrible. A little bit of both.


Good. I don't like the things growing out of my skin right now. What do they call back? Goose care.


What do they call all the little all the little hills building on little. So at first, oh, this is a quote from Karen about one of the experiences that we've had one time. This is probably the weirdest, too. And I, I love when I hear something original finally. So I got to give this ghost credit for creativity. One time, pennies floated down the stairwell from the upstairs of the house and the coins stopped and fell to the floor all at once right in front of her pennies.


As I said, someone was so it was holding like two little coins and they were invisible and they got to the bottom of the stairs and the one and just like dropped.


So like freaky like it's like seems harmless, but also is so terrifying.


Well, the freaky part is whether or not an alive or dead person was doing that points. And no matter what is, it happens.


It's just creepy because like, what does it even mean? Yeah. Yeah.


If it were like even if it were something like a like a newspaper or something, it would be like, OK, so maybe there's an invisible ghost, remember, but it's like two random coins floating around together, like a plate gets shoved off the table.


It's like, OK, classic move ghost. But yeah that's such a specific set of items.


I don't know, I wonder if it has to do with like the material of it. Like maybe because it's like maybe if they were copper or something.


Hmm. I don't know, I don't know.


Maybe he's like here's my two cents. I'm and I love puns. Stop it. That's hysterical. That's, that's hysterical. I want that to be the reason actually that it would have something to do with me. But no word. Isn't that how dowsing rods work? Aren't they made of copper or something?


I don't know. I'm no, but I know pennies are made of zinc, so I'm not sure if that's didn't.


They used to be copper until the fifties? Probably. Yeah, probably. I'm asking a lot of questions about things where pennies are definitely a thing, but I think most of the time there's zinc.


Well, I'm asking a lot of information from you about things nobody prepared that I don't have any idea about.


Yeah, I don't know. I'm just answering as if I know. I appreciate the confidence, though. I felt like you knew where this was going all along. So anyway, so the pennies floating around all the stairs, a super creepy and then Tony Big Tony himself is their last name. I'm saying is Weaver. It's actually chocolate baloney. This is one of his experiences. One day I was working on the house and I saw a man looking through the foyer into the living room.


He looked like a World War One soldier, complete with a helmet. He looked so real. And when he walked into my living room, I ran after him, but no one ended up being there. So we think that this World War One soldier is probably the son from the Jackson family who was a World War One. The first family. Right. The first family. So at this point so far, we're thinking like, OK, maybe it's just the Jackson family haunting the place and how Zeeman really process that this could be like the Betties family and Jerrold's.


Right, right, right, right. So Tony also reported this is where Gerald bettas likes to show himself. Tony also started reporting a dog, humanoid creature in the windows. Oh. But he also thought he must be imagining it because he was like that literally makes no fucking sense. Sure. So within six months of living there, activity had. Escalated so much to a point where the Weavers didn't even want to live there anymore. So in two thousand three, they ended up selling the house to eventually, I think actually the neighbor that I've been talking about, the Desperate Housewives.


Yeah, I think she hooked up her nephew with the Weavers and the nephew ended up getting this house, which makes me think that maybe none of this happened at all until all of a sudden that all of a sudden the neighbor was like, oh, my nephew's going to move.


And what if I told them some some silly stories about the houses, scare them out of the house? I would do that. I wonder if my nephew was going to get a house next to me and there was a bunch of families who lived there before that I knew about. I would be like, oh, yeah, I've known about that house for a long time. You don't even want to know what they say.


You're such a jerk. So, I mean, like, for all we know, like twenty three is like when the stories started, I would not do that.


I'd be like, oh sorry nephew. There's no houses anywhere near me and I'm not responsible for you. Please move somewhere far.


So apparently the nephew's name was Quinten White and his wife Stephanie were the two who moved in next to silly old aunt. Neighbor Quynh immediately actually started reporting activity to saying this is also creative. Strange things would happen on a regular basis, like the toilet would flush on its own. No source. So that's fun. Also, he I used youth slang to stay with the times for today for today's listeners. But what he actually said was the commode would flush on its own.


Oh, that's fancy.


You should bring back the word commode. But I did also that where I just kept that from happening before I went back.


That's what I was like. You should have lean into it.


OK, I thought I was about to do like a really old timey accent, but then I remembered I don't know how to do it. Don't do that. Don't do that. I say please the commode and flush on.


That's OK. They also heard chairs dragging through the house and some say that Jerrold's himself was Gerrold like dog boy himself was seen screaming at them to get out. Oh so I wonder if that means like you saw him from afar, like how the previous family said or if now this ghost is getting more comfortable and like truly running up to you and saying get out because earlier he was outside.


Right. And so now they're saying he's inside screaming at them to get out or something like that. It was either he was outside or they were outside and saw him in the windows or but then they also saw, like the World War One vet. So maybe that is who was saying get out. I don't know. But they're seeing a man say, get out of my house and then vanish. OK, so one day Quentin was actually on the phone and he was with he's on the phone with his wife and he heard a crash upstairs.


He went upstairs to a room to check on the noise. And in this room, he happened to have left a bunch of two by fours, like in a pile on the floor. And when he got up there and poltergeist fashion, they were all standing up straight.


No, no, no. That gives me such terrible creeps.


Something about like moving objects into perfect formation is just the worst, just the worst. I also don't like that they were probably scattered across the room. And at some point, let's say, like the ghost stop doing, it's like magic. And all of them, like, clearly can't balance, probably like there. And these all crash at the same time. Oh, how creepy would that be?


Dude, I hate it. I hate it. I hate it. The fact that you know that to keep one's standing up, you need to keep your hand on it. And there's a bunch of them.


It's like, do ghosts have a million hands or you control it from above and then you just decide that you're going to leave the room and all of them come falling down at the same time anyway, no matter what it is, it's fucking creepy.


It's not good because all we know is that he got up there and they were all standing up straight.


But we don't find out how they stopped standing up straight.


Maybe they were just balance so perfectly like how you can it's like, I don't know, a really thin object.


Well, then I was super careful. I would still like to hear the ending where he had to go. Yeah. Bored by board and collected. So I guess somehow they ended up not being that way.


I would imagine it'd be like dominoes around the circle be like fuckin splinters galore.


I would like to think it's something extraordinary that made him interact with the ghost for like they all sit up straight by themselves until, like, he tried to start collecting them. But when he grabbed one, they all collapsed. They all just. Yeah, like it was like watching him.


I don't know. I'm trying to make it scarier than it was, but it was already pretty scary.


Yeah. I don't think is needed, but yeah. So the couple also would wake up every night to the sound of a dog nearby. Howling But nobody I knew had a dog. So I think they were ignoring it for a while. And then probably when they heard the rumor of Dog Boy, they were like bad checks out. Let's let's stick with that story. So Tony tried forever to sell the house like could he lived there for or. No, not Tony.


Yeah. Sorry, Quinson. Or whatever they tried to sell.


I was like, oh, well, I know someone's nephew who actually that. So if you want me to hit them up, I get 10 percent commission. Right.


OK, for sure. Like, you know that you really sold. Because you said that it's just there's peppered in a bunch of surprise layers. That's right. I learned from the School of Realty of a how to phrase. The reality is either it's nature cozy or it's not fucking worth it, that's all. It's not worth it. Or so worth of every house must have cookies. Yeah.


Wait a minute. Wow. You get an A.. Hang on. Thank you. I mean, I've never gotten in one of your courses before.


I can imagine if you were a special person of the month at my reality and you're like, here are cookies. And that's all I needed to do.


You know, what would be the best is that it was just me. But like, you would definitely wait to give me special person a month, like, I wouldn't get it right away. You would wait to decide when I was special.


I'd be like, I'll see you in December. Also, you're the front of the line and the. Yeah, yeah, yeah. True. So they tried to sell the house forever and they fucking couldn't get it together. And I think probably because at this point that one neighbor had got around and spread the rumor that it was haunted. I'd also imagine if you've already been telling people that was haunted and now your nephew lives there. So you have like a real artistic license to be like, no, I have like in it.


Oh, I know, right? So at one point they tried I think Quentin stopped by the house and tried to set down his sunglasses or something on the table while he was there, got angry that nobody was interested in the house. And so he said something. Alonzo like, I'm tired of taking care of this place and his items that he had left there. One missing. Oh, so now thing now it's really fucking with him. Whoa.


Also, as they were trying to sell the house, interested buyers kept saying no because even though they really like the place, once they got there, they felt something was really off. That's not good. So they felt chills. They feel like they're being stared at. They felt anger and hatred. They some of them like lost balance or fell over or felt like they were getting pushed. People on the stairs would get really, really, really fucking sad.


Oh, also, people would hear door slams. They'd hear footsteps. There was problems with electronics. Apparently there was a cat that would just like hiss and vanish, OK?


And then there was also the oppression of the soldier in the hall who would appear so goodbye for that. Goodbye. So there was a lot of reasons for people to be like, thank you, but no thank you.


Yeah, one time actually this is my favorite one again for creativity. This makes me think that it has to be the neighbor spreading rumors because I never get original little tidbits at this point, like every ghost is open and cabinet doors and knocking on the walls and that's it.


Yeah, but I feel like also it's so random and specific that the plywood or the two by fours. Yeah. Like why would you make up that. I mean what was the other original thing.


The fucking Penneys, the pen. And then apparently the recliner in the home would open itself up and expand like someone was sitting in it.


That's really creepy. I don't like that either. It just sounds like a really frugal carpenter lives there, like he's just a frugal carpenter carrying his pennies around, check in on his plywood, sitting on his Barcalounger, showing off his his two cents, literally his two cents. His fucking cat hates you. And so, anyway, that was just another thing that happened where people saw the recliner open up on its own, which I got to be honest, even if that was just like the spring is broken or something, it would terrify me.


It would be that would be bad because that's like, you know, what the person is doing exactly. Like you can see how they would be or what they want you to think they're up to.


That's true, too.


They would be putting on a show for you if I felt like, oh, I've got a ghost that just likes to sit in a chair, I would be more likely to buy the place versus like, oh, they're opening up the recliner. So I think they're sitting there, but they're actually up to something else on the stairs.


Yeah, they're prepping their feet up so that they can sneak past you and put all your wood planks upside down or something. Bingo.


Also, apparently there was one prospective buyer, prospective, like a prospector, a prospector. Someone brought their pet to the house while they were looking.


That's actually smart. I feel like I never I think it's genius.


Bring a child and a child for sure. Well, someone brought their dog and the dog wouldn't even enter the bill. Goodbye. Turn around. That's how you know. And if there's cookies in there, like, then, you know, something's really up. You got to leave.


Here's what you do. You bring a dog and you bring a child in the kitchen area. You leave a big plate of like rotisserie chicken meat for the dog kid. You leave like a bunch of candy. And if neither of them touch any of that food on the counter during your tour of the house, that's a bad fucking sign. They were too uncomfortable to eat their favorite foods. Yeah, I'm just saying, like one on one for my reality class because I'm taking notes.


Don't worry. I know there's pop quiz at the end of the week. Well, you got the cookies thing, so you already hit your you already got your extra credit for the semester. Yes. So the next person to live there, eventually they finally fucking sold this place was a pilot or a former pilot. His name was Ed.


And he's like you say that with such disdain cozily I want him to have like a really cool name is. As you were really into Big Tony, I can love Big Tony, Mr. Mr Chocolate, he had a lot to say. I know. Speaking of Mr. Giacalone, just really taking two topics and taking the widest bridge to them possible. We were talking about Tony Carloni earliest I fucking was I. Another reason this isn't why I drink, but this is why Alesund drinks this week is because I've recently gotten back into the depression phase.


I obsessed with cake boss, which like, oh yeah, I feel like we all at some point we're in love with either cake boss or cheesecakes. Absolutely. And Cake Boss is more fun to me because of how bizarrely like I would love to go to a therapy session with him just to say just like so like bombastic and loud and in your face.


I mean they're like kind of doing like we're a stereotypical like Italian family, like we're like loud and we shout with each other and all that and they're always like mi familia. And so I fucking love it. It's just gets me going. And poor Alison, since I got into this, she I've really not actually seen her this annoyed with me in a long time, but I can't stop pretending I'm the cake boss.


Oh. Oh my God. Stop. And so every time in the last three days Alison does anything, any fucking thing. I'm just like quoting the cake boss and not even realizing God.


What are you shouting? She could do something very wonderful or very terrible. And every time I'm like, Now that's Hoboken style, baby, stop it.


You are very, very annoying.


And that if she doesn't think that that's not Hoboken style, baby, that's not Hoboken style.


Oh, I would probably punch your head. So at last night I was like, something happened. But I feel like the last three days she has wanted to completely twist my head around on my neck and just end my life. And anyway, I was thinking totally chocolatey and in my head every time I kept thinking, like the boss, that's the boss right there, mi familia.


OK, I can't do it anymore. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. That should be Allison for the last three days. Last night I was like, can we watch the boss? And she was like, absolutely. I can literally. No, also can I is there like a way where I can grade you?


I know it's your class, but I actually probably rather grade you this time for a second.


I thought you were going to say, is there a way I can time travel five minutes back into time where I didn't know about this? I'd rather travel five minutes.


I'd rather travel five hours ahead so I can already start forgetting it. But now that's Hoboken style bus stop it. I hate that. I don't know why I hate it, but I hate it. I hate it so very much.


It just fits with everything I do every time you either love it or you hate it.


That's I know that some of our like die hard fans are going to be like, I love it. But like, imagine living with with this behavior in a lot of people.


I do tell Alison a lot. I'm like, do you realize like other people, like, would kill to be sitting next to me here? And that's Hoboken said, oh my God, you're such.


And she's like, you need to get the fuck over yourself.


I'm like, why? I'm the boss.


We talk about, you know, how many people would kill to sit next to me. Every Shults. Oh, my God. Not the boss. I just want I want her to know there are other people out there who would in unison shout, Now, that's Hoboken style baby.


Instead of complaining about it, you know, like someone out there would just I'm putting it out. Do you want me to start reading?


I want to write interviews and see like do a tally of how many people love it and hate it.


That wouldn't be Hoboken style. So I don't know about that. OK, moving on quickly anyway, please.


Quickly. OK, I thought we passed the bar for quickly but yeah. Let's move on. Oh OK.


Sorry I just, I saw thought alone and I was like that's the boss right there. OK, so where are we. Oh yeah. And that's why I said like that just doesn't even.


It's nothing, none of it isn't.


Was like with the amount of serotonin that's been floating through my veins with Italian names lately, I heard Ed and I was like, OK, whatever, just OK, why don't I just turn into Eddie Murphy and we'll do a little doctor, do a little business and then you can realize how much you hate.


You would hate to be next to me.


That would be delightful. Oh, my God. Wait, can you be Eddie Murphy. You and I, I feel like I'm like, oh, I would hate that. And then the second we were in the same apartment, we'd be like, oh, like you.


That would be the fucking worst. Like, I actually got so annoyed, but like, I know full well I would be immediately involved. Like, that's the way you hate Lemon, but still are very involved with Lemon Christie.


And that's why I'm 100 hundred percent ignoring all your weird like you're like side jabs in honor of Alison because I know the same. If it were you you sit in a room though, you may announce it in a room the first half of the night, you would be on her side and be like, you're so fucking annoying. And once, like a couple glasses of wine kicked in, you'd be like, I'm the boss, you better.


Or you would just be sitting there with, like, your empty bottles of wine and me and Alison on either side, you'd be like me, a familiar.


Well, I'm sorry. I tried really hard. I really do. God, if we were roommates, it really would be dastardly. How many weird characters we would have for ourselves?


Oh my God, we would be the fucking. I mean, look at us. We have a fucking podcast. We've got xenon and lemon and all this, but we never stop ourselves.


What's the name, Eikon? No. Oh, Trey Songz. What's wrong with me? Ehsaan is the alien that Elizabeth Clara was dating. Yes, that's correct.


And the one who likes featured my homecoming. Yeah. So we would be like Trey Songz, but probably worse because we would just be shouting in fake Italian accents.


All much worse. Much worse. Much worse. Anyway, I appreciate you trying to defend my girlfriend, but we know I tried. That's Hoboken style, baby.


OK, so you can't stop it.


You're going to go to church later.


You hate it because you're going to fucking do what you are going to finally make their pact. And they don't even explain that.


It has to do with the was it just from now on, whenever belleza something really great or really wonderful, just slip it in and see what happens. But I'm going to try it and see.


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So eventually Ed, he got the house from Tony Takalani and he could only renovate the house at night because at this point so many people knew that the place was haunted, that they were disturbing him all day long. But he could only get shit done at night. Well, OK, great.


You know what? That's not my style. But so this is a quote from that. He said, I don't believe in the paranormal, but since I've been working on this place, I felt very uncomfortable, like someone's watching me.


So even though I love when they're like, I don't believe it, but get this, it's like, come on, you got to like at one point admit that you believe it, right?


It's like you OK, so you don't believe it, but also think you're paranoid about it. And also said one of his experiences when he started seeing things himself, he said, when I pull up in the driveway and I see a man looking down at me from the window, I would never enter that home again.


No, why would you why would you go inside? He is dressed in a brown jacket and a bow tie, like from another time period.


That sounds like Doctor Who, but also or Doctor Doolittle or Dr. Doom. But like, if you truly if you saw a silhouette of a man in your home, why would you then go to do time for bed?


I believe in the paranormal, but sometimes I see this guy in my window, especially, by the way, if you don't believe in the paranormal, because if you don't believe in the paranormal, then you have to think that what you're seeing is a grown woman, that murderer.


Yeah, exactly. That's none of it's good. None of it's Ed doesn't sound like he's the sharpest. So Ed also reported seeing the ghost of Gerald Burroughs, a.k.a. Dog Boy in the house. Apparently he would see Gerald staring at him. And every time he saw Gerald, he would also feel a cold wind on his neck.


That's not Hoboken style. It's certainly not I don't know what it is, but it isn't that.


Here's a quote from him about seeing Gerald. He was this huge, I guess the.


Oh, yes. So he was somewhere around from here to here.


Watch what shitty journalist without me being like. How big is this big. OK, ok, so imagine my arms like stretching as far as possible.


He was this huge and weird looking cat human. So that's interesting that he sees a cat, not a dog. Oh wait.


Maybe he met, he's this, he was this huge that checks out. He was this I'm not sure. So I think that's what I think that's what happened. That was some Amelia Bedelia reading right there. No, I followed right along with you.


I was like, what an idiot shouldn't put a comma after huge. You don't want me to pause. That's you're right. That's the problem. He was this huge, weird looking cat human.


There we go with long brown hair, creepy eyes and great big arms and hands. He walked right in front of me and glared at me. And right after I saw him, he walked through the hall and disappeared. Sometimes I would hear something slam or someone walking across the floor, but I couldn't see anything. And I knew it was him letting me know that they were there.


Oh, God. And letting me know that they like. No, no, no, no, no.


But also this fucking guy. I don't believe in the paranormal series. So what, like a cat dog man is just hanging out in your house and you're like, what, a kooky neighbor.




At that point, it's weirder to believe that that's just a random at some point you're making yourself look worse if you're like, that's just my roommate. I didn't invite in my cat person, my cat man. So in twenty five, that's when I don't know if that was when Casper investigated the house or if that's when Karen is just talking about their investigation. But Karen was the lead researcher with Casper investigating the house at this time. They did two investigations.


The first time they picked up a lot of cold drops and electromagnetic spikes that had no explanation. Karen also said that they were able to track something through the kitchen and one investigator felt something touch them. This is a quote from Karen about the first. Investigation, when we went outside at one point to get some items from a car, we looked up and saw a face peering down at us of the same window. Oh, yeah. All three of the team members witnessed the face in the window, but it was confirmed that nobody was upstairs at the time.


The second investigation, they brought a medium with them who allegedly made contact with Gerald. And the medium says that Gerald cursed them and told them to get out. So that at least confirms or coincides with people saying they've seen someone screaming to get out of the house. Yeah, they also got videos of orbs flying into walls and unexplainable flashes of light. And they got all of those on videotape. But eerily, all of those tapes went missing after the investigation.


What? Yeah, that's bizarre. Also, there was just to finish this off, there is one article. There were very few articles about this, by the way. So just to put it out there, there was only like four sources that we used. But there's an article called the Quitman, Arkansas Ghost Story, and it was written by Barbara Duncan. It was it's an online article and people are still commenting on it, even though it was written back in like twenty ten or something.


And one of the comments from years ago says the stories are true. I grew up in Quitman. My dad went to school with the dog boy. And that house has scared me since the first day that I saw it, before I knew about the legend. They have been maintaining it to sell, I guess, what was at the time when they couldn't sell the house, then they were maintaining it to sell. But no one wants to live in that haunted house.


The lady across the street, the neighbor, could tell you a thing or two about that house.


And next time you go up there, you should bring your dog to see if you even go on the porch and she'll tell you a thing or two, a favor, a lifetime or the entire town history, or about her nephew who's moving in soon.


Two years later, Barbara, the author of the article, commented on the article. Oh, that's fine. They're still checking like years later is like, oh, why does he need to respond to anything?


So Barbara commented on their own article saying that the person who knows the real story of Dog Boy quote would be the next door neighbor who is psychic. Oh, I didn't see that coming.


We hold for the last minutes with who is psychic and knows all about the inhabitants of the house.


She is very interesting is how that ended, which I can can can the least shocking statement of this entire story only a couple of years ago now, people are still responding to either Barbara's comment or to this article in general.


And one person said, quote, Gerald was a mean person. I know of him throwing and hitting, throwing and hitting Floyd, his father. Then he would abuse his mother, Aileen. I've seen her many times with a black eye at our reunions. That is the Internet at a time. Oh, of course, things had to be his way or no way. But I was never afraid of him. He would barely speak. OK, but so even in twenty seventeen that was people are still commenting about how they themselves knew about Gerald and can confirm all of the awful stories about him.


And even if no one can for sure say like how dark his behavior got in that house, no one is surprised that it has at least some negative energy there. So, yeah, anyway, that is the Betty's house featuring the dog. Boy, that was fascinating.


And I know you think like when people are commenting in twenty seventeen, like I knew him.


I feel like that's so rare because when you hear about haunted houses, it's always like three hundred years ago or like you know in the eighteen hundreds this woman and like nobody can say, oh I knew her, she was really fucking weird but like yeah except there's a ghost that people know from real life.


It's very I was just saying this to somebody and I mean there's like those regular tweets and memes that are always coming out about like, oh, how come we never hear about, like a 2007 Britney Britney Spears goes, yeah, but yeah, it's always interesting when people are still around to be able to confirm people that are said to hot places.


And I think that's so interesting and like confirm their behavior in real life.


I also add to the story I also wonder if ghosts from like the seventeen or eighteen hundreds that we all seem to see all the time. I wonder if people gave a shit about them back then, or do you think like in the eighteen hundreds, the ghosts they were talking about were like from the fifteen hundreds and they're like, why don't we ever see any modern eighteen hundreds ghosts and modern.


Maybe you have to go through like a three hundred year purgatory before you can hons again. And that's why we haven't seen any two thousand people yet. You know, like a van.


Yeah. I wonder why don't you ever see a ghost playing the Victrola.


You know I always wonder, you know daily I would say I think about that. Yeah. I don't know. I mean I guess we do see modern day ghost like for when people like when people tell us their personal stories.


But I feel like so far between because you never hear of like no haunted manners. Yeah.


But I feel like that's because it hasn't had enough time to build that repu. I'm sure in like 100 years, all these places that are currently like haunted but not like huge stories might become more famous, I don't know, because, like, an hunter's ghost has had many, many hundreds of years to build up its rep, also build up its energy.


Maybe you get stronger and more noticeable over time or that I don't know. Sometimes I like to get really fucking existential with it and like really like I think I was meant for the stoner community and sometimes with my own thoughts because I'm like, that is a real mindfuck. But I like to include time travel into the afterlife sometimes and think like, what if I'm being haunted by my own ghosts and I don't?


Oh, I think that too. Like people from the future. Yeah, but then I'm like, yeah.


If Future Me had the ability to haunt me and let me know what was up, I would have fucking done it by now.


You'd know it by now. I'd be like, oh you're right, hello.


But I do think about that are like my own guardian angels or when I feel like someone like protecting me, maybe it's like future me looking out to make sure I stay alive long enough to do whatever I need to. Anyway, we could talk about that shit forever and ever.


Oh, and we will. We sure will. We have a show to do. We should start a second podcast where it's like the the after show of. That's why and that's why we drink after dark.


That's we'll shop it will shop it tum tum tum tum. Anyway there's the badass house for you. Love it.


OK, I have a story for you and this is the story of a serial killer and his name is Shawn Vincent Gillis.


OK, so he's not as well known as you would think.


Once you hear the story.


I feel like you're going to be like, that's odd that I don't recognize this person, really.


He's pretty prolific, but I'm going to tell you anyway. So I got a lot of this from the True Crime all the time.


Podcast, also Crime Watch Daily. I posted a helpful video. And as far as like Warnecke content warning, there's brutal violence and sexual assault.


As per usual. As per usual.


Yep. Here we go.


So we are going to Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and the year is 2004. Oh, OK. So this is pretty wild.


Within a ten year period, Louisiana had five active serial killers.


But wait, I know. And then again, within a ten year period, Louisiana had five active serial killers while operating.


And that's not a huge, hugely populated state. I mean, compared to other you know, is there a bigger state?


Is there like like a cultural historical reason? I don't know.


Honestly, I'm not sure because it was so recent that, like, I wonder if anybody's even had the time to properly study it.


Yeah, I was I was trying to think and I was trying to think of like, did something happen in Louisiana that, like, messed with? A lot of people are like really like Katrina.


But that was in twenty six.


So never mind, I, I don't know, I've got to say like hurricanes cause serial killers but like I'm, that is our we're going to die on that hill. That's actually that I heard that from the neighbor down the street from the medicine that she's psychic by the way. So she knows what she's doing. She knows.


Yeah. Yeah. So on February twenty seven, 2004, 43 year old Donna Bennett Johnston was found in a drainage canal south of Louisiana University. She had been murdered, raped and strangled, and her body had been badly mutilated.


Her breasts had been slashed and she had had a butterfly tattoo on her thigh, which had been cut out of her.


Oh, my goodness. Oh, my. Yes. Wow. Rough start. Rough start. Yep.


Times with a task force was established on March 3rd to look into Donna's murder, as well as a few other women who had also lost their lives in a similar fashion. Some of those women had been linked to another serial killer named Derrick Todd Lee, who's a much more famous and well known serial killer. I don't know if you recognize him, but I guess I just run in those circles.


Unfortunately, you definitely I'm sure you're right that they're well known, but I'm just like I like to think of myself as like the grandparent who you're teaching the apps to, but like, I'm just like the clueless one in terms of serial killer knowledge. It's always shocking when people are like, oh, well, you've got to watch this true crime thing or what are your favorite true crime documentaries? And I'm like, I don't watch that stuff. But that's kind of the point of our show, right?


Like is that you are the expert in ghosts and I do the true crime and we tell each other and we don't know about it, you know. I know.


But it's still surprising how many people ask me for, like, true crime suggestions. And I'm like, I got nothing. The whole point of the podcast is Christine educates me in real time. I of, like, cake boss. I'm like, I can tell you what's Hoboken style baby, but that's about it. That's as far as I go. Yeah. Yeah.


Hit me up, folks. I've got all sorts of recommendations for you. I just started watching Dexter for the first time, so that's.


Oh, I saw you post about that. I also I would because of you, I would suggest Crime Watch daily because you mentioned that they post a lot of it's like super duper informative.


So it's like very it's. It's like very and also I'm trying to think of the name of the other one, yeah, but it's very informative. So if you're like looking for, like, serious info, I think the more entertaining, like Night Stalker was really good and terrifying, but also, like, keep you on the edge of your seat type of show. That's a new one on Netflix.


Anyway, just hit me up on the IGY and I'll tell you anyway, they established a task force.


A lot of the women who had been killed in a similar fashion were victims of Derrick Todd Lee, who was like the more well known and actually was named the Baton Rouge serial killer. So when certain cases couldn't be linked to Derrick Todd Lee, who had actually been apprehended the previous year for his own murders, fear started to grow that maybe there was another serial killer on the loose. Maybe they didn't realize at this point that like, yeah, maybe four more, actually, five total.


So their credit, I don't blame them for thinking like there's no way there's five. I mean, it's like I feel bad for them in hindsight when they had no clue how bad it was. Yikes.


Truly. And especially since they were killed in similar ways, it's almost like you'd be like, no, please don't tell me. Like somebody is doing this in almost the same way.


I don't want to know. Please.


Oh, we already got the guy, but yep, it was somebody different. So what ruled Derrick Todd Lee out is that the female victims that they were finding now had DNA underneath her fingernails that did not match to him. But of course, when they put it through the database, it didn't match to anybody who had their DNA in the system.


So eventually, through some supari, which we'll get into on April 28, they found their murderer and his name was Shawn Vincent Gillis. So here's the story of good old Shawn.


Shawn Gillis was born on June 24th, 1962, to Norman and Yvonne Gillis. His father suffered from alcoholism and had several mental illnesses. And this caused like a deep had a deep impact on his relationship with his wife and his son. At one point, he even held a gun to his son's head when he was a young child. So just a lot of trauma in that way.


But Norman put his family's safety first and actually admitted himself into a variety of mental institutions. Wow. And although that was to keep his family safe, it ended up leaving his mother to raise Shawn by herself. And she had a job and, you know, had to raise or had to make money to raise her son.


But also, it's just a lot for for, obviously, a single mom to do.


So despite the tumultuous relationship with his father, Gillis was really close with his mother and his grandparents.


So for all intents and purposes, he had like a pretty decent upbringing, like there wasn't anything.


I mean, obviously there were some traumatic incidents, but like there wasn't anything. It wasn't as traumatic as you see a lot of serial killers like you can see very clearly from.


Right. More or less was an average upbringing comp.. Yeah.


That you wouldn't have been able to look at that kid and go like, oh, something terrible. He was one of the people where in hindsight, everyone's like, I don't I didn't see that coming. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's exactly what it was.


So at 10 years old, Yvonne and Shawn moved to a nearby neighborhood and she worked really hard to get Gillis out of public school and into a Catholic elementary school. And although she really thought the world of him, a lot of the neighbors and his schoolmates thought he was a bully, but that unfortunately wasn't the worst of it.


So Gillis and two of his friends actually became interested in satanic worship.


And that's us on the playground to my right. I know. And it actually is because interestingly enough, they didn't like do it, but they went and watched other people do it, which I feel like would be you. And that's exactly what I want to see what would happen. That's exactly my comfort zone. I'd be like, totally, I'll go hang out with a coven. I don't want to totally be involved in it, but like, I want to be on the bleachers.


If y'all got some of those conjure up, you and I are bringing snacks.


Oh, OK. I would love to be like, actually, can we just consider ourselves not like the PTA of cousins?


OK, say the soccer. I'm the soccer mom. I want to bring the orange slices to keep your eyes and buy orange slices.


You mean gushers and I'll bring a wine bra and we'll be the soccer parents.


But the satanic if your cover needs like sports parents to cheer you on, we're in it. I'm running down. We need jerseys. We're your people. We make a good team.


We make you look better than mine because you're out of my league.


But I mean, like other than that or whatever, it just just.


Yeah, if you happen to be a witch and you're going to like your your weekly meeting soon, pitch it, see what happened.


I'm not saying that that's satanic. I'm not saying that those are the same thing. To be clear.


We're not saying, you know, I just I feel like we happen to be associated with more.


We're more we're comfortable with, like, a healthy witchcraft lifestyle than like we just have a better chance of making it as the PTA members valid.


So I'm switching it over to Cubin. Got it. OK, because, yeah, this was definitely satanic, which I'm sure am. And I would love to go and watch as well, but probably be a little more scared of.


Just out of. Your ignorance, but I would love to be like the PTA who really fucking like the member who educates the shit out of myself. Yeah, yeah. So we would definitely be this person, but they would go they'd watch locals engage in the rituals of satanic worship and they smoke pot together. So that was like the extent of kind of his that and like bullying. He was like not a great kid, but it wasn't anything like truly hurt, like he was it collecting dogs or whatever all other guys doing.


Gerrold He was just S.P.C.A.. Dude, you're just a dad and currently he's just a pot smoking dad. It just, it just, it turns real sour real quick.


It does. It certainly does. So however everything kind of went south as I said the following year when OK, so Sean's father kind of came back into his life when he was 17 and he hadn't been in a hadn't had a relationship with him in a long time since he was a kid. So he and his father became pretty close. But that all kind of turned sour when Sean discovered his dad's collection of photos of naked men in various sexual positions.


And he and his father just kind of went their separate ways and he was no longer interested in a relationship with his dad. After graduating from high school, Sean got a job as a clerk in 7-Eleven stores, and he spent pretty much the rest of his life working as kind of a clerk.


That was sort of his go to job position, clerk, life, clerk, life. You live in that clerk life. You know. You know, we all do.


We all do. He apparently hated it, but that's just what he did. So he said instead of working, he preferred sitting in front of his new computer to watch porn, but not just any old porn.


So he was a very big fan of porn that featured rape, death and dismemberment of women. Yeah. So that was his go to.


And as you can imagine, his obsession with pornography affected his job, his other responsibilities. He would skip work like you would miss an entire shift because he was just addicted to watching this violent porn on his computer. And remember, this was like a while ago, so this in the 90s. So this is like AOL dial up days.


I was going to say, how did he get access to this kind of stuff back then? Oh, I mean I mean, I don't you know, I don't need to know.


But, you know, what they say is that technology is always driven by humans like desire for porn and sex. So like even with VR, the first thing they do is figure out how to turn it into porn and sex.


I mean, KHANKAN So like the second Internet, I don't I wait a minute. Hang on.


I said before, I like well, OK, I what I meant is, like, I'm aware the like one sex sells and two, I'm Alison and I were watching that show upload where like literally we just watched a whole episode about virtual sex. Yeah. And my my mom, when I got the Oculus question, I like, lost my mind, like the technology that my mom was like, I wonder when the sex industry is going to take over.


So they did already.


I look, I read an article about it's fascinating. It's the first thing they do because that's just how humanity what we what we're driven by, I guess.


Anyway, what I said can confirm I did not mean like, oh, I know all about that. We heard about your vanilla lifestyle. Don't worry. Thank you. I felt the need to defend my vanilla ness very quickly. Yeah. Yeah.


But basically he I mean, you know, Internet existed like there were definitely porn sites.


It was just like old school, like you had to you to watch it like a phone line by line as a block. Yeah, exactly. Oh my God. That I sure hated that the lines would.


Oh God. OK, not of porn. To be clear, we're not talking about porn. We're talking about like neopets.


I mean, OK. I mean that clarified when I was a kid when I was a teenager. Yeah. But not the same kind that those guys up to our own. But I do, I do remember the picture having to upload and like oh it was the family computer. So that took a lot of courage. And also like your like, like mom could walk down any second and the computer, the desktop.


I mean really you're waiting for the image to upload to download it.


Oh, it was just the worst experience.


Kids to pull an old person phrase kids these days.


We'll never know how easy they have it with their cell phone, with their cell phone porn, that they can watch porn on their cell phones without any sort of.


I watched my mom interruption. I watched my mom teach my grandpa about cell phone porn, which sounds really weird, but like he was shocked. The technology was like, wow, you could do anything on the Internet.


She was like, I mean, you could literally get your mom is like how your mom's first, always first and always let's discuss the porn part.


She's the common denominator in the fact that sex sells. But my yeah, my my grandpa was like an iPhone first became a thing. He was like, wow, internet. And my mom said something like, I mean, people literally a pawn in their pocket these days. And he was like, oh, they don't have that. And she was like, give me your phone, I'll fucking dot com.


She's like, wait, let me log in. Linda bought into AOL Dotcom. No, but I just remember watching my poor, sweet, innocent grandfather's eyes just completely like flood, just with shock.


And you're always ruining everyone's innocence.


She really wants she really wants people added to her team, I guess.


Man Well, anyway, he really derailed. I'm so. Oh, no, I'm so sorry. It's all good, I'm just saying, yeah, I was old school, but he he spent all his time on the computer watching really fucked up porn to the point that he risked his own job. So in 1992, Sean's mom, Yvonne, took a new job in Atlanta. And when Sean said he didn't want to go with her, he was an adult at this point.


So she left him behind to live on his own. But she continued to pay his mortgage on the house that they had lived in. So he stayed in the house and she moved. And sometime after his mother left, according to neighbors, he began to act pretty strange.


So, for example, some people saw him yelling at the sky, cursing his mother, like out in the street at the sky.


Really bizarre behavior or just the kind of thing where you, like, close your blinds. You know, you're like, oh, OK.


Yeah, but you close them, but you keep. But many of the people, right. You keep your eye through the blinds, you keep the blind close, but the window opens, you can still hear what's happening and your cell phone recording because like I'm going to show em later and we're going to do it.


Yeah. So there were a lot of disturbing events happening after this. He was caught peeping into a female neighbor's house. And when asked what he was doing, he claimed he was looking for his cat, which is, I imagine, some sort of form of clever wordplay.


I'm not sure. But after that, he would bang on people's doors late at night. At one point, he was standing outside banging on garbage cans and the police came. And when they arrested him, he told he asked that police asked, why are you making such a ruckus and banging on these trash cans? And he said, because I don't have a girl.


So he was desperate for, I guess, female affection.


He was he was really leading with that, it seems. I guess. Yeah. I mean, not that this is explaining much of the behavior, but that seems to be his his M.O., his go to his public.


Go to. Yes. His public excuse. Right. So two years later, he met a woman named Terri Lemoigne, who worked as a convenience store clerk, and they met through a mutual friend. And Terri later remembered that her best friend walked in and said, Sean, this is territory, this is Sean. You'll have everything in common. Y'all should get to know each other.


And this best friend reckon they would both get along because of their love of sci fi and Star Trek.


But she didn't quite realize how much they had different, not just how many things they also didn't have. Yeah, exactly. The kind of outranked what they did have in common. And there's only so far you can go with the shared love of Star Trek is what I imagine.


That's what I always I know you say it all the time, actually. It's getting really one day people will listen one day. One day.


So the relationship was actually platonic because as Terry remembers it, Sean didn't believe in sex and had been taught that. Well, to be fair, he went to Catholic school. So like, yeah, we are taught to not believe in sex.


So maybe that's part of it. Shandon believe in sex and had been taught that it was a nasty thing and he shouldn't do it. And again, obviously, there's no saying again, I haven't said this yet, but there's nothing wrong with being in a platonic relationship, of course. But in the context of he was watching like really violent porn pretty much all day, every day. It's just like a telling red flag, I guess. Sure.


So eventually Terry moved into Sean's house with him, the one that his mom paid the mortgage for, and she continued working at the convenience store. He would drive her there, pick her up. They spent a lot of time together.


And when they moved in together, that year was the year that Sean Vincent Gillis killed his first victim.


And to be clear, it was not Donna Bennett Johnston, the one I mentioned earlier with the tattoo. There were many more before her. So his I know it's a start from square one.


His first victim was actually 81 year old. And Brian.


Oh, I know. It's pretty dark. She lived at an assisted living facility across the street from his work in Baton Rouge. And she was an artist musician and enjoyed playing bridge with her friends. And he entered her apartment on March 21st, 1994, via her front door, which in turn left open because she wanted to allow her nurse easy access to her place of substance. That's so sad.


And it's like she's never had a problem. Her nurse comes in and helps her out of the 90s. She plays bridge. She's an artist and like he just waltzes right on in.


It's also really sad when, like, obviously, if anyone is ever attacked, it's I'm not trying to compare situations here, but it is especially awful. But it's someone who is more or less helpless and that like, they keep the door open, they probably are moving around a lot. Or I mean, not to say I like younger people. I feel less bad for anything. It's just like it's just. No, it's just they're more vulnerable.




Like, you know. Yeah, no, I totally get it. And like, you're just taking advantage of the fact that this person is a vulnerable member of society.


He's doing nothing wrong and is like is like just so sweet and like has a great reputation, just ill and is trusting of society and it's just really fucked up.


Yeah. Yeah.


So according to Shaun, he initially only entered her home in an attempt to rape her, but when she screamed, he panicked and. Her throat and then stabbed her around 50 times in the head, genitals and chest. Oh, my God, yes. So the sheer amount of wounds to her head nearly decapitated her, decapitated her. And she was almost disemboweled. How many times he stabbed her?


Wow. That's some fucking anger right there. Really fucking brutal. And he very, very intentionally stabbed her breasts. Genitals. Yeah, like intentionally. So that tells you something.


And this was his first murder. So he had never even done anything like this before. Oh, my God. Wow. So police.


I know it's just a terrible start.


So police at the time had no clue who was responsible for this. And meanwhile, Sean was at home just basically becoming more and more obsessed with violent porn that depicted rape, death, dismemberment. And he even showed Terry, his girlfriend, like the porn he was watching.


And she was like, no, thanks. I'm not interested in that. And on the one hand, it's like, you know, just because someone's interested in something online doesn't mean that they're acting this out right in real life.


But it was definitely a red flag to her of like, OK, I guess let's keep having this platonic relationship because I'm not interested in that kind of sexual behavior.


Sure. Sure.


So she knew that he watched this. And some people say like, well, then how did she not know he was a serial killer? But it's like those don't necessarily equate like there are plenty of people who watch fucked up porn and don't go out and slash 81 year old women to death just because someone is insane and don't say can confirm because.


No, no, no, no, no. But but, you know, yeah. That's definitely that porn exists because someone's into it. Yeah. There's an audience. There's an audience. It doesn't mean that that's something they actually do. Maybe it's just their own mental escape in some way. It's just their thing. Right.


Everyone's got to think it's got a thing. I tell you what. Just ask Linda. Just ask Linda Tripp, tell you she knows at all what she wants at all.


So after the murder of Anne Bryan, Sean wouldn't kill for another five years. So I guess he got his first fix and then waited another half a decade. Interesting. I know.


So on January 4th, 1999, the body of Catherine Hall, age 30, was found murdered and naked at the end of a dark rural road. And according to a documentary on crime watch daily, the most horrifying fact was that she was found on her back in a kind of balletic pose, like ballet, like like kind of dainty ballet.


That's a ballistic pose next to a dead end sign, which was thought to be sort of sixth sense of humor.


Oh, no, not gross. That's fucked up. Yeah.


And one more horrifying detail about the discovery. According to Detective Barry White, he had sex with her after she was dead, which I'd like to insert my own commentary, which is this is called rape not right. He had sex with her, but sure, OK, he raped her after she was dead. A very close examination of her mouth showed that there was a pubic hair with a root ball, just like sounds disgusting, but it's like the the root of the hair.


Right. Right, right. It had the the root ball, which allowed for full DNA testing at least.


But that being said, yes. So they had a DNA sample. Exactly. But unfortunately, he wasn't in the system, so there was no way to kind of tie it back to him. But again, they knew it was not Derrick Todd Lee. So they were like, well, shit, that's somebody different.


Such a it's such a such a small silver lining. But at least at least they got DNA. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yikes.


So another four years later. Well, you'll see, because it seemed like four years later, but it turns out later on he admitted to other murders that occurred within that four year period. But at the time it seemed like another four years later after the discovery of Catherine's body, according to detective. Oh, sorry. No, I'm reading the wrong bullet again.


Look, at least I'm just impressed you can read, so. Oh, thanks.


I've worked really hard in your class. So, you know, that's why my, my and my reality course, all of the manuals are picture books, because I. Oh, right. I wouldn't expect anything else. There are also scratch and sniff which is super fun.


They sure are sure. Oh OK. So anyway, seemingly another four years later the killer struck again.


So on October 9th, 2003, Johnny Mae Williams, a mother of three and an avid baker, was found face down in the woods, decomposing. And it was actually a little boy who found her.


He ran to tell his father. And at first the father said, don't play around. But when the father went over to see what the boy is like, insisting he found, he finds exactly what the boy insisted he found, which is a dead body. And according to the police, Gillis had posed her looking for the shock factor.


So this is so gross. I'm sorry. Her legs had been sliced down the back and the front and she had her arms folded under her. So when she was rolled over, her arms fell out. And her. Hands had been cut off, so they, like, pulled out of the body.


Oh, isn't this just like that's really next level gruesome, I mean, this is like the Dexter show I'm watching, like it's so fucked up and psychologically I want to know, like, what the what the message there is and like what what's causing him to want to go, quote, above and beyond in such a way. Yeah.


And, you know, later he actually wrote a letter. I don't think I have it in my notes. But later he actually wrote a letter to the best friend of one of his victims. And it might have been her, actually. And he said, I don't know what in me like drives the need for this kind of like violence and sadism. Like he literally said, I'm not sure what he recognized it almost like.


I can't figure out why I have this need, this urge.


He's like, I also don't fucking get it. Yeah. He's like, trust me, I don't get it either. It's just it's like it's it feels I mean, I, I'm no fucking expert, but it feels like he wants to stand out and be different to anyone else that's done the stuff. I mean, to, to go that to be that. I don't want to really use that word but to be that extra. Yes. In the opposing and have like the shock value dead inside and then to like plan ahead.


So when they roll over she her hands, you realize really just I mean, it just feels like I want you to fucking remember me. Well, you're this isn't your everyday murder, you know.


Well, you're completely on to something because he did have like a hang up.


He had like an insecurity about Derrick Todd Lee because he was compared to him, but was like always, always wanted to outdo him and was always scared that Derrick Lee was going to outdo him.


I'm pretty sure.


I'm B.D. Wong from Law and Order that I mean, I just if you were beating Wong, I would have a much, much greater obsession with you.


Sorry. And unfortunately, maybe it'll develop over time, but fingers crossed. But I really I that in that moment I was like that psychology degree. No, you fucking hit really on the head. Thanks, Mom, for the for all that college support you gave me.


You got to watch mind Hunter. That's like you got to watch it. I know you don't watch the true crime, but it's so good.


I know. I know.


OK, so in any case, where are you. Right, the hands fell off. So even though our hands were cut off an inspection of the body, a human hair was found on her and they could tell it belonged to a Caucasian male. So it seemed like it was the same person who had struck several years before.


And then he would strike again, thankfully for his final time on February 27, 2004. So now we're back to Donna Bennett Johnston with the tattoo.


OK, so two residents were looking for their dog when they stopped at a bridge and saw what appeared to be a white female lying face down in a ravine, which would later be determined to be only blocks from Shawn Gilliss home.


It was Donna Bennett Johnson Johnston mentioned earlier, and it became apparent to police that this was the act of the same killer of the two previous crimes. And as I mentioned earlier, she had a butterfly tattoo on her leg and the tattoo had been carved out of her leg, which is like sick from the inspection.


Police knew that Donna fought her murder, so they found his DNA under the fingernails of her right arm. And I specify right arm because her left arm was missing.


Oh, wow. It's kind of like each of these crimes. It's like so sadistic, but they're different. Like, he does something different each time, you know?


Yeah. I mean, it's like it's definitely it makes me wonder this is a really sick thing to say. And I'm not trying to sound funny. I really am not. But it sounds like he's almost going for creativity there. Like it's like and I mentioned it earlier in that, like, he wanted to like, stand out. Yet it's almost like he kept having like he was almost in competition with himself. Yeah. Yeah.


It's like trying to be like, OK, I don't want this one. How do I make this one more shocking to the last. I mean. Yeah, more shocking the last. So.


Well, and I also wonder if it's like him trying to figure out his own, like, perversions or his own desires, because I feel like over time he developed this M.O. and like with this with this murder, they later found the left arm at his home and he had been using it to masturbate.


So like for that, he used it only for himself. So I wonder if, like, over time he was like, you know what would be great for me this time or, you know, develop that interest. I was going to say to when, like, the tattoo is missing, I was like, did he save it like that? He said, I don't know because, you know, it's a great shot of murders.


Will they take something from trophy's or. I was even thinking, do you think he goes into each murder knowing already what he's going to do or on the fly, he's like, OK, I'm going to take your arm off? Or did he plan that?


That's a good question, because he left hairs on the body. So he wasn't like super duper character feels impulse and like he left DNA.


Yeah. And but yeah, you wonder if he planned it ahead because with the arm too, that he brought home, he painted the fingernails and like gave it a manicure.


Look, it's just gross. And then he used it to masturbate.


So as to who knows what the fuck was going through his head.


And you're saying BD Wong, are you going to help me? No, I got nothing. Bitty Wong, this is this is the stumper. This is why we do want to take like a. Senior year or something like you mean go to the FBI and get a Ph.D. after after his victory lap, he had a little success.


CIA got it OK after his victory lap. So according to police. OK, wait, let's see, where am I? So they found Donna. Her tattoo was missing. Her arm was missing. So now police have four women who have been murdered and horribly mutilated. And they know it was probably the same person because of the M.O. and geography. And as mentioned before, police are armed with a lot of DNA evidence from under the fingernails. So they when they run the DNA, again, it doesn't match anybody.


It does, however, match the DNA from the other three. So they're determining all four of these victims were killed by the same man.


Got it. So investigators return to the crime scene and they are like looking around to see if anything around where they found the body could give them any sort of clue and they're pressed into the mud was a clue that they almost missed. And it was a tire track.


Wow. OK, I know something. I never I would have stopped right on over that. I would have rolled over with my own car that was driven over the tire track.


Now back to my phone, as will anyone. Yeah. Oh, my God. I don't want to get out of the car.


I'm just going to drive over there. Yeah, exactly. Oh, boy.


So they find this tire track in a cow pasture and it was a Goodyear tire. And thank God they made a cast of the tire and found that it was a very rare tire that was manufactured very briefly, barely a month.


Fuckin lucky. I know. That's, like, so lucky. Exactly. It's not just like some Costco special. You know, I say that because I'm getting new tires next week because my car doesn't know what snow is. Interesting.


OK, it's really good for me and my anxiety.


Make sure you get the most commonly used tires. Yeah, you're right. I can never find you. Also, the person who made the first like like rubber mold of a tire track for a murder case must have felt like a fucking.


Yeah, I'd be like, let me get some my kids doing a what are they called when they put plaster papier mâché favor?


I say, let me get some of that glue and put it in this tire tracks. Can you imagine? Like, I like I like to think that the person who did the first like casting was probably like his dad, like didn't believe in him for his own passion. Yeah. And then he was like, I'm going to change the fucking world. And he solves a murder. Yeah.


He wanted to go to art school. That's such a good point.


I love that to happen. We're going to write a story about it. A movie. Yeah, perfect. We're going to we're we're going to end it. We're like it's the Thanksgiving dinner where he tells his dad, like, what he's been up to at work.


And he's like his dad's so impressed by, like, this case that has been solved. And then he finds out his son calls me dad. Yep. It was me. It was it was me all along. You'll see. They'll all say, you'll see.


They'll all see.


Now, he sounds like he's becoming a murderer. That'll be the second film in the series. That's the spinoff.


And then they and then they use his his own tactics against him to solve. I see.


They're like he loves that plaster. Paris also pretend you heard nothing because this is spoiling the entire film series.


So don't worry, just. Oh, I'm sorry.


Like this. I thought you meant spoiler. No, I'm sorry.


I would have been not only my BD Wong, I'm also a best selling author and you're that psychic neighbor who knows exactly what's about to happen.


I have so many great qualities. This one, you were so disturbingly many different personalities. It's the truth.


So, OK, they find this tire track and it turns out that there are only a couple hundred sets of this particular tire that have been sold in the area. So they have about two hundred people on a list and they're like, go through every one of these people and rule them out until we find the guy.


So the task force goes and talks to everybody who has purchased these tires within the last twelve months. And Sean Gillis is number 26 on the list. Wow.


I know also also very lucky that they were able to he's pretty close to the top, shaved down so much time because they could have had to do that another like seven times or something.


I wonder if it's alphabetical because G is pretty early alphabet.


I wonder. I'm interesting. I'm not sure a lot.


So they ask them to go talk to everybody who bought these tires and get a DNA swab from there, like an oral sample and oral DNA swab from everybody.


So ultimately they interview Shawn. He's one of the people on the list. And sure enough, he's called in to be interviewed. And he was unemployed at the time. And police remember him being very soft spoken, very intelligent. According to officers who interviewed him, he had no criminal history. He came across as a mild mannered science fiction geek and was even wearing a Star Trek USS Enterprise belt buckle at the time.


So, yeah, he was a fucking nurse. I was I got a T-shirt and I was like, OK, I wear t shirts that. Oh, a belt buckle. That's next level fandom. Yeah. Like, you have to go out of your way to find a book for all my fandoms.


I don't I don't have a single belt buckle, so.


Me neither. Yeah. Well you're such fair-weather.


That guy is really he's a committed a committed SIFIs. Hardcore. Yeah.


Yeah. So sure. So blah blah blah. They interview him and they at first they were like OK, I guess technically like he hypothetically got away with it. There's nothing on first impression that was like a huge red flag until he says to officers as he's like getting ready to leave, he tells them that he actually knew Johnny Mae, who was one of the victims, and they were like, oh, oh, let's take out our identity notebooks and write that.


Yeah. Oh, that sounds important.


And he said he used to pay her to clean his house sometimes, which was actually true. And so they were like, that's. Odd, and he even admitted then to being near Donna Johnson's particular crime scene, and when they asked why, he said, Oh, you know, my tire tracks actually might be in that field.


It's like he was almost trying to excuse himself before they could give him a chance. That's yeah, that's what I get the sense of. Like, he was trying to, like, own up to some stuff. That way it looks like he's not shocked and guilty. Yes.


So if they can prove they're his tire tracks, he's already given a, quote, explanation as to why they're there. He's beaten them to the punch. Yeah. Which like, don't say a word, folks.


Like if they're asking these questions, if you didn't do it, if you murdered someone, let's tell everybody by all means. But if you didn't just wait for your damn lawyer, don't say a damn word.


So he admitted that his tire tracks might have been there and they were like, why? And he said, oh, well, you know, I had some beer and needed to go to the bathroom real bad and knew I wasn't going to make it to the house, you know what I'm saying? My bladder was how they put it. Cheech and Chong put it one time.


My eyes are floating. That's how I felt.


So they're sure. Yeah.


So they were basically like, OK, he has weird excuses that he's giving us before we even blame him for anything that he knew but or he knew one of the victims and he may have had tire tracks right near the second body, like the little fishy.


So they're like red flag, red flag, but they can't necessarily keep him because they don't have proof. So they finally got a warrant.


They searched his car and they found blood in the car. And don't worry, he explained it.


I was not worried because he seems like he's really good at explaining things.


Do you have a guess? Like, just take a fucking guess at what he what his excuses for why there was blood in his in his car. I want to say something as simple as like a nosebleed, but you're on the right track of flossing too hard.


But what I would if you ever find blood in my fucking car, it promises it's probably because I was flossing, not even that hard. It just oh, God was just fucking suck. My mouth just exploded at the thought of flossing.


So he told police that his wife had been on her period.


I was OK. I did think and I did not.


I knew I had a feeling you were on the right track with that because it just sounds like the dumbest excuse on the planet. And I met his girlfriend, sorry, not his wife, but he said about a month after we got the car, my girlfriend got her period. She had her period and it just soaked through the front car seat. I mean, it's like I said, it looked like a massacre in that front seat and nice, charming.


Well, I was also like, I feel like that's not good enough. The reason I was going to not say nosebleed is because I can't you just check that so quickly, like matched the DNA.


Oh, yeah. And don't worry, there are more questions before they even check because they said, well, why is there blood all over the back seat and do you have a guess as to how the blood got it.


She was ashamed and threw her underwear in the back.


No, that's a better excuse than he gave, which is that the wind was really strong that day and it blew it blew her air blood out of her vagina and into the back seat.


So so when, first of all, we're just going to ignore defying physics and the like, physics guy went through the wind, through the car from the window, scooped underneath her, and then wasn't strong enough to lift a human body, but definitely wiped her clean like Cinderella.


And a chimney just got rid of it all and it all ended up in the pool.


You're actually on the right track, but you didn't totally get the whole physics of it. So what happened? Let me explain it like Bill Nye would. So what happened is she had her period, you know, it got all over the frenzy and then suddenly the wind picked up. Right. And the gust of wind, you know, she was surfing the red wave, as I like to say, on my baseball cap.


I know. Oh, here it is. Let me put it on real quick to explain. This is my handy dandy period. OK, what's your name?


La Roja. Something surfer Rosa Rojo or surfer Rahho surfing the red wave. So essentially.


Right, she starts bleeding, the wind picks up and it goes out the window and then back into the window it goes, oh, so it's not going OK.


So it's not actually going over the middle console.


Exactly. It's going it's loop de loop around the window. Right.


It's doing like half a figure. Yeah. Yeah. Back into the car because a little semicircle now that's fucking stupid. That's so fucking dumb. She said in that in that moment if I were the cop would have been like turn around.


I would have been like I quit. This is so dumb I can't even hear anymore. I quit the force. Goodbye.


Yeah, I would have been like, just put it the back.


Just walk into jail now please. Yeah. He said that his girlfriend's blood flew out the front window, then flew back into the car to land in the back seat. So the police immediately called for a search warrant of his entire house and they called the crime lab to prioritize processing his DNA swab. The lab worked super fast, and in the time they had to wait for the test results to come back, the police were worried that Gillis might run or might kill again.


So after several excruciating hours waiting, the phone rings and it's a crime lab and they say it's him. So they got him.


So out of being about a but that's Hoboken, baby. Yeah, the boss has spoken. So they call a court judge to get a warrant for the arrest.


And on April 29, 2004, it won twenty twenty and they burst into his house to arrest him. A SWAT team enters to find Gillis in bed with his girlfriend Terri as they enter. Terri's obviously startled, has no idea why a SWAT team is in their house. She begins yelling, what's going on? What's going on? And according to Terri, Sean just looks at her, shrugged his shoulders and says, Sorry, Honey Bunny, good night.


She apparently is a quote from Pulp Fiction, which says, In punk action, which I learned from a true crime all the time because I'm not cool enough to remember that from the movie.


Can you imagine being the second woman, by the way, in history where now she has to be like, yup, I'm the one who's period flies, really? And it even though she's like you said what? That's right. I'm the bloody honey bunny. That's money. Honey, that does sound like Pulp Fiction, but that's what I had in Spanish.


Hang on a second. So then one of the SWAT team says to Terry, didn't you know you're living with a serial killer, which is like, OK, shut up, guy. And she remembers just laughing and saying, boy, do you have the wrong house because she literally didn't believe it. She was like, what are you talking about?


So later, once John had been taken into the police station while still in a state of disbelief that the police were accusing her boyfriend of these heinous crimes, she went in to speak to him and she said, like, Sean, how did you kill three people? And he said, oh, there were eight.


Oh, and so she apparently, like, collapsed on the floor.


And he said, Sorry, Honey Bunny again.


OK, it's like the joke didn't land the first time. It's yeah, nobody got it, but no one got it funny or whatever.




So then Terry was like so shocked because at first she's like, well now I feel like shit because he's murdering these women and I didn't even have a clue, you know. And so in retrospect, she does remember that once she was in the car with him and he had like the car had an awful odor in it and she was like, what does that smell? And he told her he had hit like road kill, like he had hit an animal.


And she went back to bed and he went and cleaned the car. And it turns out later he had been driving her around with one of the bodies in the trunk.


That's just the worst. I mean, I've no personal experience here, but it feels like like hindsight, knowing that you were so close to a really fucking. Yes.


Awful situation and just like like sleeping next to him, you know, the second I found out about that.


But I was driving around in a car with a corpse, I'd be like, aha, well, thank God my therapist is on speed dial because here I go.


Thank God my my menstrual blood can defy gravity because it's because like me, it's about I've got to write it like a magic carpet on the way to Thunder Surfer. Red surfer. Right. Surf it on out of there. Surf the wave out the window, I tell you. Really.


So on another occasion she noticed that he was racking up a lot of miles, like on the odometer, and she wanted to know who he was driving around with, thinking he was cheating on her.


But as police later said, he wasn't cheating. He was hunting and that's how he got all those miles. That's not the word we need to use. It's not a good word. It's not a good word. So, of course, as soon as he's interrogated, like the truth comes spouting out of him like a fountain, he is so proud of his achievements. At one point he even says, I'm sorry, I hurt people, but I would do it again, which is like.


So you're not sorry. OK, cool. You mean I'm sorry, Honey Bunny, I. Yeah, Honey Bunny.


So he didn't so he didn't even show any shame. No. Wow.


I mean he said a couple of times like oh yeah. I feel bad for what. Like I feel bad that I did that but not like I don't think he was even lying.


I think he was just like, oh yeah, that wasn't a great thing to do. But he didn't really care, you know, he was thinking not a cute look. Yeah, exactly.


And I think it's one of those things where it's more like that sucks that I got caught and now I'm in jail. Well, big bummer for the year. Womp, womp. Yeah.


So he also said if anything in my useless life comes out, help the little girls of today not to be the premature corpses of tomorrow, which is like, why don't you help the boys not make the girls premature corpses of tomorrow.


How about we go from that angle, idiot. And so when delving into the four women he was accused of killing, police realize that this is only the tip of the iceberg. When he began naming other victims. So he admitted to the four they had arrested him for and then he admitted to four more. So they were Hardy Moseley Schmidt, who was found in St. James Parish near a bayou on Highway 61 in 1947. Sean Gillis had hit her with his car as she was jogging, as she was jogging through Pollard Estates on her morning run.


OK, I said 1947. I think I meant 1997. Sorry, nineteen.


I was like, how? No, he's also a time traveler. Yeah, I guess so. 1997, he this is what he did. He saw her jogging. He like tracked her like he hunted her for lack of a better word.


Then he fucking drove her down with his car, jumped out. And I'm going to tell you now, which I haven't told you yet, how he murdered them.


Oh, I haven't even thought of that. It's very scary. And it really is going to give me nightmares tonight.


He had industrial strength, zip ties, and he would put them around their neck and take.


No, Christine, that's it. I don't want I'm done. The goodbye empathy.


This is why I couldn't say it up top. I was like, I'd have to, like, gather my strength.


That's OK. Because at first you hear, oh, you killed them with zip ties.


And it's like, OK, but then you think about it and it's like once it's tightened, like you can't even tighten it even you know, even if he fucking regretted it, even if he changed his mind or even if she ran away, like, yeah, it's.


Oh I know. So it's fucking awful. And they were industrial strength so they weren't coming off. Hey guess what, I have a new fucking fear. Thank you. Me too.


I was listening to the True Crime all the time podcast. And I was like, why would you do this?


At 9:00 in the morning, I was driving to the daycare and I was screaming like, how could you put this thought in my I'm like, I'm like making weird like like neck.


I was trying to get my knowledge expanded like like like I know. It's just.


Oh, Christine, that's really it's so the fact that I mean, like in my head in this moment, I still can't even process that that happen to a real person. I'm in my head. It's still being treated as a hey, wouldn't that be terrible if someone actually had to deal with that? Someone has had to deal with that.


Exactly. It's almost like when you watch at least when I watch, like, ducks or whatever, I'm like, OK, or Criminal Minds. And I'm like, this is so heinous. And then I get in my head and start thinking about it. I'm like, OK, it's a TV show, like it's just a TV show. But this is just the worst because you're like, oh no, this actually happened to several people.


It's just I hate this.


And the people that he also targeted, a lot of them were sex workers and he would describe them as people that society wouldn't miss.


And so that's how he kind of decided he was going to victimize people and that's how he often got them into his car.


So just just another guy, in fact. Oh, but yeah. So the zip tie thing is probably the worst thing I've ever really there really is just so, so terrible.


Oh my God, I can't stop thinking about it.


It's like a new fear that's going to keep me up at night that I didn't know I had.


So sorry I had it tonight. Everyone else has to have it. So he picked her up off the side of the road after he hits her with his car, grabs her, puts the zip tie on, tightens it as quickly as we can and puts her puts her in.


This is just the first one on the list.


I'm just describing how he did it. So, yeah, he he hit her with this car, grabbed her, put the town, tossed her in the trunk. Oh. And that's the one that the girlfriend was in the car and smelled something later.


Oh my God. Yeah. Wow.


So Joyce Williams is the second person that they hadn't known about. She had gone missing November 12th, 1999, but her body was found behind a levee in Baton Rouge in January.


Two thousand, according to his confession, Gillis picked her up on Highway 19 and rode around for a while singing along with the songs on the radio. He then brought her to Rossdale Road in Port Allen and killed her with another nylon zip. High before bringing her to his home where he dismembered her, cut off her nipples and ate them. OK, I'm sorry, I don't know what to tell you when it's so bad.


Christine sorry, Christine or Christine holding it like a comfort blanket and holding the sound.


Yeah, I've been so I had a bunch of people. Well, this one's been sitting here. I've been trying to angle the other one, so I like that.


What's up? That's what's been happening. But now this is like an iPad.


I was like, oh, I was like best friends over there.


Know, I've been trying to like, make like a 360 wall around the microphone.


But I see right now it's kind of a comfort.


Now it's just my thunder buddy at this book.


Are you kidding me? OK, well now we know my like my oral fixation and now all I can do is imagine the consistency of.


OK, well, now all I can do that, Tim. Oh, I'm so sorry. You're right. I'm in the wrong. You're right.


Also cutting OK, so cutting off nipples is something I think about a lot. And like just in terms of pain, I know that's so weird, but I, I think about I think about like nipples falling off a body is way more than is probably mentally healthy.


But the fact and I've always it's been like a secret fear in my head. And now that you just said that out loud, I was like, oh, so someone has made that in reality. Oh, certainly. But and then chewed on them like they were little pieces of gum or something that went gulp.


Yeah. He also practiced. That's the thing where I was saying earlier, like he was practicing different things, trying out different things to find he's certainly fucking one.


Yeah. That's something that I'm sorry. Like that's not even Musk experimental though.


Just like that's very much illegal homicidal experimentation. Yes.


But I'm saying like, I never even didn't even cross my stupid little mind until you said someone has chewed on. That's worse than Eddine using the nipples as a as a belt. At least this guy was using them as a fucking movie theater snack. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Take it. Please continue. Its really heinous.


So I'm just going to keep talking because you know this is fun and so truing cannibalism. He tried it out. Why not. The third person was Lillian Robinson who disappeared January of 2000 but was found March of 2000. He had also killed her with the industrial zip tie and then brought her to his home before dumping her into the bayou. And then the fourth one, the last one that they hadn't known about was Marilyn Neville's 38, who was murdered in October 2000.


Gillies picked her up in Lafayette on his way to visit his godchild.


How charming. Oh, yeah, cute. When she got into his car, he reached for zip tie. But this is this is. I'm sorry.


OK, Christine, I hate Christine. Sorry I've never had such a guttural reaction against the story of yours. You had me at nipples. You had me a fuckin zip ties. And now whatever is about, whatever you're about to do to me, I don't like it. OK, he why?


It's just the same sort of OK. He was uptight but she fought him and escaped from the car. He chased her across a field and then hit her with a piece of metal rebar. And before she could get away, he wrapped the zip tie around her and tightened it. So it was like she almost got away. And then at the last second he got that zip tie. And it was like, at that point, you're screwed because even if you run away, you can't get that.


Australia still it's just terrible.


So he brought her to a car wash, laid her on the ground while he cleaned his car.


And yeah, all this fucking little activities like, oh, he was just hum into the rain, like legitimately. It's hanging out of his penis. He put on the ground, took her home, then took a shower with her corpse before bringing her to River Road and leaving her body on top of a levee. And the saddest part was that for four, until he was arrested and admitted to it, not one person had ever reported her missing. That said, it is sad.


And and that was like what he explained was his his goal was he would target sex workers who he believed would be the least, quote unquote, missed by society, which is so sick in its own way. But, yeah, nobody ever reported her missing.




And a lot of these women had children and families, obviously, so and were further traumatized by the media portraying a lot of these women. And not all of them were sex workers, but the ones who were the media obviously like leaned into that, too. And that was extra hard on the children who were like she was a person.


Right. Right. You know. Yeah.


So he also talked police through his ritual as soon as Terrie left for her night shift, which was you let me out on the street, I'll find somebody before sundown.


He would hunt women, kill, mutilate them, and then use their bodies for sexual gratification. He'd look for sex workers, people with drug addictions, anyone who looked helpless or willing to get into his car or not, because then he would just fucking run them or not.


Yeah. Or they would run away and he would drag them back to his car once inside his car. He is a white nylon tie lock like a zip tie. And he said, we're talking two and a half. Feet long, maybe five, so like mega industrial Ziploc. So like giving himself as much line basically as he needs to like to like, really cool it, mother fucker.


And then he said and then I slip it on her head and he explained casually to the police what he'd do once he brought the bodies back to the house, which he had a lot of time because his girlfriend was at work with Donna Johnston. He said he held her, bathed her, held her to himself.


And then he said, you know, no, I don't know, no cannot really and cannot relate.


And then he said, I mean, we were taking a shower. You know, why do you keep saying, you know, he also keeps calling people like Little Bunny or something, so I don't get it. Yeah. And so, like I said, he gave a manicure to the severed hand. And while Terri was at work, he even performed an autopsy on Joyce Williams body on the kitchen floor. Yeah.


You know you know how casual you know, after discovering this, when police sprayed the baseboards of the kitchen floor, the cabinets lit up like a Christmas tree with luminol, you know, blood spatter glasses, computer was analyzed, which obviously had plenty of fun evidence on it as well.


He had taken photos like trophies of his victims bodies when he staged them so that he could take them home as trophies. He even took a picture of the victim in the trunk of his car. And in the photo was his own goddamn license plate on it.


Guy Yeah. Smart. He had 45 digital pictures downloaded to his computer of Johnson's mutilated body alone and on the other.


OK, another thing they found on his computer was a document called DTL, which stood for Derrick Todd Lee.


That was the other serial killer who was active around the same time. And in this document, he would store news and information about Lee's crimes. And he later went on to allege that he feared being outdone by Lee. So he was like tracking him to make sure he could one up him, like doing recon to make sure that.


Yeah, oh, he hasn't he hasn't outsmarted me or out. Disgusted me. Yep. Yep.


Like, I want to be remembered. Like he said in the interrogation, they also broached his upbringing to be like, where does this necrophilia come from? And your obsession with, like raping people after death?


And it turns out he actually had a sexual fascination with his own mother, which seems to be a common fucking thing in these stories. And when asked whether he had ever thought about having sex with his mother, he responded with yes, of course, you know, you know, say, you know.


But, yeah, I had the same thought. Here's what with yes, of course, she's not an unattractive woman, even if you see her and meet her now, I thought if she passed away, you all would find me in bed with her.


Oh, yeah. Oh, my God. And his mother is so alive to hear all this bullshit come out of this.


Isn't that great? Yeah. She's like, wait, what. Oh. And she thought he was like an angel.


And imagine that poor. I don't know if they were roommates or partners or the platonic relationship. Oh his girlfriend. Yeah. They were dating. OK, like imagine that poor woman who now looks back and says like, oh well you definitely have the wrong house. This guy is like nothing like you think he is to then hear things like, oh, so we were platonic the whole time you were thinking about banging your mom and a bunch of corpses.


OK, oh my gosh.


I just at that point be glad he didn't want to have sex with me.


I'd be like, I know I'd be like dodged a bullet for that. But yeah, totally.


Especially when she's like, I'm not interested in this violent photo you're showing me. Don't want to practice with, you know.


Thank you, Sean. Vanessa Gillis stood for trial July 1st, 2008. And while in court, even more evidence emerged. There was a letter, like I was saying earlier, where he wrote to a friend of his final victim, Donna Johnston. And Tammi had been her name was Tammy, and she had been corresponding with Sean while he was in jail. And in his letter, he wrote out a confession of what he had done in detail, and he narrated Donna's murder to her, which is like, oh, can you imagine?


I mean, well, it's so fucking dark.


And he said, your friend died quickly. She was so drunk, it only took about a minute and a half to succumb to unconsciousness and then death and then signed it yours. Oh, so beyond. Sorry, Sean, Vincent Gillis.


So beyond, so beyond. Don't believe you. And also like what. Like what's, what was the goal. There was you know, a friend would like be proud of him early.


Just what was he. Ragbag. Yeah. Like I don't get what the point was because he doesn't sound fucking sorry and it's not like anybody would think, oh, she's going to enjoy this confession. I'm about to write her like she'll feel better. Right. I like twisted. I'm not really sure what the point was, so who knows if he was just trying to, like, fuck around more and get more attention? I'm not sure. But so that letter on top of everything else gave them first degree murder without any shadow of a doubt.


So with the overwhelming evidence, the verdict was undeniable. He was charged with the murders of Catherine Hall, Johnny Mae Williams, Donna Bennett Johnson. He was sentenced to three life terms. And a year prior to the sentence, he also pleaded guilty and was convicted in the killing of 36. Year old Joyce Williams, so to date, he has been charged and convicted of seven of the eight murders, police are still trying to gather more evidence to charge him with Lillian Robinson's murder.


And final note, he's now 58, which surprises me because to me, he feels much older. But now I'm thinking like this was in the 2000. So it's not even that long ago that so many of these stories are like older, you know. Yeah, but yeah.


So he's only 58. He's at Louisiana, Louisiana State Penitentiary. Sometimes this is the best this is the best line. Sometimes he's known as the other Baton Rouge killer.


Oh, boy. What a horrific day. I know. Oh, yeah.


So because their toddler is known as the Baton Rouge serial killer. So he said the other one, which I'm sure just ticks him off to no fucking end.


So as for Terri, she actually still lives in the house, in the house they shared in the house that she moved into. That was his Seans and his parents, his mom's house back in the day. So she still lives there, which is like, all right, you do you, man?


I mean, wow, that would be tough mentally for me. But she's still there.


She still has Gilliss Car, which is named Buffi. So that's let BD Wong handle that one I guess.


OK, I shall I. You froze me in that moment. I was like I got, I got nothing.


Yeah. So Buffi is still there sitting in the backyard rotting away. And that is the story of Shawn Vincent Gillis, the other Baton Rouge serial killer, as I like to call him.


I love that. I love that I gave him a name to give him the satisfaction. Yeah, that's I mean, come on, let's they should also really like the shittiest one or like the one the little one loves or cares about, like what's his name. Unimpressive one. Yeah. Yeah. The boring, unimpressive guy. Wow. The one star rated murderer.


One star serial killer. Well and interestingly enough, in that same letter he actually mentioned to like it was only until ten years ago that I ever felt an urge to harm another person. So who knows what the fuck happened ten years before that, like, made him decide all of a sudden this was his new.




And because until that point, it's not like he had he said he never had fascination with murder growing up. He never had like he never killed anyone or hurt anyone until he was that age. And then he was like, I can't help it. I'm going to do it.


Wow. Well, weird. Hmm. All right. Anyway, great story, I mean, it takes a lot to make me cringe, and it does. I feel pretty.


I mean, as fucked up as it is, I feel pretty honored that, you know, episode two, 09. I gotcha.


All it took was the chewing on nipples. I got instant goose bumps on that one.


Yeah. Actually, I'm getting it now still. So, like, it's nice to know, like, if, like, I don't even I don't even know I. Where are we going with this sentence. I don't know. I froze halfway through and I was like, even I don't know. So thank you for the trauma. I can't wait to call my therapist. Thanks for the trauma. Yeah, well, we'll chop it will sharpen. We'll chop it anyway.


Also, thank you for those who chose to stick around after that you had the option to not listen. So yeah, this is not our fault. You stated jealous of you and I would have I would have turned off the show by now. But thank you for listening to another episode of and that's why we drink. And we appreciate you putting up with that. That was great.


Yes. Because we podcast. Our website is. And that's why you drink dotcom if you want to buy tickets to our live show, A Virtual Absher, which is going to be super fun, go to on location live dotcom and we'll be reading creepy stories that you sent in.


So can't wait and you can send them in to it. Don't send them into our normal website or our normal email address. Send it to us from our couches at Gmail dot com. And that's those will be the stories that are picked from or selected from. Yeah.


And I believe the twenty second is the deadline for that. Yes.


OK, perfect. Hello. Thank you everyone. And hopefully this next time, hopefully this was the most traumatic part of your week. See you next time.


And that's why we drink.