What is up, click baiters, welcome back to another episode from yours truly, Tatia, Jo and Natasha.

Anyway, I'm sorry, guys, I just want to introduce you guys because clearly we have a lovely OK, good idea.

We have a fun episode for you. We, of course, have some Bachelor Nation breakdown. There's a lot of things swirling up in Bachelor Nation, as you all know. So we're just going to touch on that a little bit more. And we have a really interesting click bait that actually warms the heart from a five year old. And then we have one of the nation's very own, Tammy Lee, coming to join us today. And we just have a lot to ask her.

And she's she's a fun one. I actually do not personally know. Tammy is she is actually friends with our host, Natasha, and I'm looking forward to getting to know her more. She is if she survived, she survived, OK, well, guess what, I'm here for all the vibes, all the positive ones at least I just put on my red diffuser of happiness. So hopefully that just lightens the mood. OK, so going into Bachelor Nation breakdown, as you all know, last week.

Was a heavy one, and to kind of wrap that all up, Chris Harrison is taking a step aside from Bachelor Nation. And I know we all feel some type of way about this, so I will give it to you guys first before I give my opinion. But basically, after all that ensued last week, Chris gave out an apology and thought it's in the nation's best interest, best in his best interests to just kind of take a step aside and.

Learn and educate himself, and, yeah, I appreciate how he related it to his kids. He teaches kids to own up to their actions and he wants to do the same. I, I think it was the right move. Is this goodbye to Chris Harrison forever? I personally don't think so. I do think he's going to come back as the host. I think he's stepping aside for the after Rose Show and the woman tell all. I think we'll see Chris Harrison again.

What do you guys think? Well, I know that they already shot the woman tall, so he was present for that. OK, pretty sure that. But for the after the rose I think is what he mentioned in his apology that he is going to step aside for.

And yeah, I think it was a good call because, again, as we said last week, no one is saying he's the worst person in the world. We're saying you. Said some things that were very inappropriate. He took ownership of that. And on top of taking ownership, what do we do? We also show that we're taking that ownership and putting action behind it. And that action behind it that he did was saying, I'm going to take a step away, which I think is a great idea for a lot of people.

And I know that the women from the season are just they feel very hurt. They released their apology and everything that we know about. And so, yeah, so it it shows it shows that he is remorseful, I think instead of just being like, yeah, well I apologize so people can f off. Basically that was not his sentiment and I think that it was the right move personally.

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Visit Madisen Dash read Dotcom now to find your perfect shade. That's Madisen Dash read dotcom. And I agree with both of you. I think after reading his apology, there's a few things that stuck out to me that I hit my heart a little bit more to know that he actually meant what he was saying. Like there was things that said he said by excusing historical racism, I defended it, which is the absolute truth and the fact that he called that out and owned up to that.

And he acknowledges that means a lot to me. Also, the fact that he said this is not just a moment by him, but a commitment to much greater understanding that I will actively make each day also meant a lot to me just because it isn't just a moment, just like how Black Lives Matter isn't just a trending topic on Instagram. It's a thing that's taking place every single day that we should actively try to. Partake in and better as a whole, entire nation as a whole, entire nation, not just a select few people, not just the people that need to be educated, not just the people, everyone, myself included.

So those two things that really stuck out with me and also the action behind him kind of stepping down and just taking time and just, you know, he he said that he heard the words he was feeling the hurt that he had put out there in the world. And so I think it's a really good thing on his behalf. Another thing that I kind of want to get off my chest is just, look, people make mistakes. And granted, this one was like we already said, that we would claim that it's full of arrogance and it affected a lot of people.

But this is the thing I feel like, you know, we have to allow people to prove us wrong and prove themselves. And I've learned this even in my relationship. I mean, Zachary used to be an addict and he's done a lot of wrong before in a time that I never even knew him. And he needed somebody to give him a second chance in order to prove himself that he wasn't going to lie anymore, that he wasn't going to do drugs anymore, that he wasn't going to do all of the things that he used to do.

And with that, he made a. Insanely different path for himself and now is helping a lot of people because of that second chance and something that I've always been taught is just like you treat people the way they want to be treated. If I fucked up really bad, like I would want somebody to give me the second chance to prove myself. And so I'm not saying that whatever he did or any I'm talking about in a general sense here. So with him, what he did was wrong.

And I'm glad he acknowledged that. But I just think and I don't I'm not a fan of this council culture, but it's just like. Let them put their money where their mouth is, I guess what I'm just trying to say is like I am not excusing any wrong anyone's done. Like there is a lot of hurt behind his actions and Rachel's actions and all the above. But what I'm trying to say is, how are we going to better the world?

How are we going to better ourselves if people don't give us a chance to do that and prove that so. We got our apologies. I appreciate that. Let's just see what comes from them, but let's move forward and. Show me what you got. Do you think it was the right move that he step aside to? Absolutely, I think it was the right move, I mean, I just think that, you know. His words affected a lot of people, myself included.

I mean, it's at the end of the day, I'm not saying you're a terrible frickin person, like I never want to see your face again. What I'm trying to say is like. And I got to ease up like. Give us a minute and I think that by him taking ownership and just not just saying issue an apology and then just going back to work the next day like nothing happened speaks volumes on his behalf. And I think that, you know, he's been doing this show for I don't even know how long I'm gonna throw out a number, 20 years, whatever it is.

Twenty five, I don't know. But for him not to be there on AFAS, it's going to be different. But it also is an action. And I think that we take it for what it is. And yeah, this next little bachelor nation breakdown, I a little some of that you guys, I was actually really devastated to see Abigail go home. That was your girl. That was my girl. I remember in the beginning of my season as we kind of took a guess who we could possibly see ending up with Matt as far as Bachelorette and like I was right.

Just saying, OK, Joe, who's your girl? You know, Joe, who is your girl?

My girl was Sabrina. I said and I said, Bree. And I said, Rachel.

So I said, all three that are in the top three, stop it. You get. I also said she was a good choice, too.

But I also said, Abigail, which might I add Abigail has been a fan favorite. So, yes, you know, with Abigail going home, I think it just kind of puts a lot of things into perspective, like, OK, we started having a couple of fan favorite girls. Now, with them going home, who could possibly be our next bachelorette and her going home, kind of like I was sad pagination was sad, but also kind of hopeful now because she could possibly be a contestant to be the next bachelorette.

I just have a quick, hot take about Abigail that I don't want people to think that I'm like. You yeah, I just have to say that being in New York City and it's so cold all the time, my lips are constantly chapped, whatever, I forget the skin care routine, whatever her lip care routine is, her lips always look amazing. Always. And like, I'm not I'm like, maybe I have a girl crush on her. I don't know.

But her lips always look, like, so moist and like just like, oh, that's my hot take on Avigail.

And I was very sad to see her very uncapped lips go home.

Wait, Joe, have you noticed her lips.

I haven't noticed her lips. I thought Abigail was really sweet. I just in my opinion, after the first couple episodes, I didn't really see a connection there with her and Matt. I didn't think because usually when somebody starts off with the first impression, Rose, or, you know, there's they get so much airtime on the first episode, you think they will last. But it seemed like maybe there wasn't a connection there. Let's let's have a little fun with it.

And who do we think the next bachelorette is going to be? Because it's going to happen pretty soon.

You know, what does The Bachelorette have to say about the yeah, you guys, I'm a little sad, but should we not let her go?

Should we not let her go first? Yeah, OK, guys, people always. This is the beat of the week. All right. Natasha Parker for Bachelorette. I will be The Bachelorette. This every show. You're going to be The Bachelor. I'm going to be just a whole bachelor and bachelorette podcast now. Well, that's I mean, yeah, that's what you imagine. So I keep throwing it out.

All right. This is what we're going to do, OK? This is what we're going to do. Whoever picks the who is the next bachelorette. We're all going to meet up. You know, when covid dies down, we're all going to meet up in New York and that person owes dinner.

OK, how about the winner? The winner gets a bottle of champagne from both of us. Are two people OK? Champagne or wine or something? All right.

I'm going to go and say that I think the next bachelorette is and I'm buying into the spoilers a little bit. I'm going to say the next bachelorette is going to be Katie.

I'm buying into it. When I was between Katie and Michelle, I'm going Katie. I think that's who it is. You're buying into the spoilers. I am. I am.

And I never buy into the spoilers, but I am this time.

I'm pulling for help for Abigail. OK, Abigail, we're going she's doubling down on Abigail. Yes. Yes, I am just I don't care if I mean, I don't I'm not buying into the spoilers. I'm not none of that. I'm just going with who I personally would pick if someone asked me from this season and it would be Michelle hands down. And Michelle's awesome, too. Yeah, she hands down. She just she's a little older than some of the other girls.

She has her career. She seems really sweet. She also is just a badass. You can have a little clip of her at the end of this episode where she was like doing push ups and like being funny and witty and like all that, she had these men on it. So.

Well, listen, at the end of the day, regardless of all these people, if they're not The Bachelorette, we can possibly see them in paradise. Paradise is going to be a dumpster fire. And honestly, I can't wait to watch it. It's going to be really, really good. I think that's enough Bachelor Nation breakdown for the week, I think we can move on. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, let's go right into our Catholic vote of the week.

Click Play of the Week was a really sweet story. There is a five year old who was watching the TV show Flash, where Candice Patton plays Iris Allen West. And she got really excited and said to her mom who tweeted this out. Iris said the five year old said, Iris looks like me, where beautiful. And the mom. The reason how this became click bait is because the mom tweeted it and then Candice saw it. The actress saw it and retweeted it and all the things.

And they were really just going along with this race conversation that we've been having even still in two thousand and twenty one. Now, there are young people who recognize and see things in children. They're not blind. Right? So they are still looking for validation in what they're watching and what they're consuming. And I mean, this girl is five, right? So my question to you guys, I mean, I was I was I felt really good about seeing this because I was the exact same way growing up.

Most of the shows that I watched involve people that look like me, the fresh prince of Bel Air. I mean, I probably wasn't much watching that when I was five. I don't know.

But, um, you know, but just people that looked like myself. So what did you guys watch when you were growing up? Where were those similar things that you look for, people that looked like you? Were you excited?

I would say, you know, as a kid, I watched Nickelodeon, I watched a lot of sports. Um, all the Chicago teams, you know, you grow up in Chicago. Michael Jordan was pretty much everything. Yeah. And yeah, for TV shows, I did. You know, I watched Fresh Prince of Bel Air, I watched Friends, I watch Seinfeld. Those were probably like my main shows.

But yeah, I mean, by that age I was older. I was probably, you know, seventh, eighth grade.

So but yeah, I think it's important to. Be able to look up to somebody, especially somebody in something so big as Hollywood like for me. Yeah, that's why I really liked Ocean's Eleven and Ocean's Twelve, because, you know, I looked at Brad Pitt and George Clooney and I saw a lot of myself. Right. So, you know, I think I think it's I think it's important.

I think it's great. How about you as a kid who today look up to you and I don't really remember too many shows like being super, super young to where there was like an African-American girl that I was like. Yeah, like she looks like me and this resonates with me, I mean, there's things like sister sister that I used to watch that I was hooked on, like Tamara Marie were like and they were so good at everything.

And I wanted to be just like them in the sense of like. I don't know, they were just. They're just so confident in their own and I mean with that, I wanted to twin sister, but they made you want a twin sister, right? Yes, yes, yes. But there is something about them that that I that resonated with me watching them. And I wouldn't miss an episode of that. But I also watched like like Boy Meets World like that didn't really have, like, an African-American figure, things that I remember Fresh Prince of Bel Air, obviously, like how you said Joe and I also used to love Smart Guy.

You see, one of my favorite shows are guys so good, but. I don't know, I think it was at a later age that I started to like really I find myself in like shows and it wasn't like all the time, like I remember Brandi with someone that I used to like, really also look up to. And she also looked like me and I would die if I looked like her.

But other than that, I can't really think of too many people. I mean, you still be in love with Tyra Banks, like, what show was she? And she was she wasn't Prince. She was she was coming. And I think that's the thing. I think that I I found these people because of fresh prints, too, like they always had a lot of guest stars like Stacey Dash, like she was also in Fresh Prince. You mean like a lot of these, like clueless.

Right. But that was again later on in life. I feel like clueless. I didn't really watch. I was like a child. But yeah. So I think that it's so important that we are acknowledging this little five year old saying that she sees herself in an actress because this is kind of like what we've been talking about, you know, making a change in this, like, resonated with me of being the Bachelorette. Like, if I can be that one person that someone could identify with the show that they've never really been able to identify with before.

Like, that means a lot to me, you and me. So we're making waves and slowly. But how do we hold on?

I want to stop right there. How does that make you feel? Because that's that's a that's a pretty powerful, important role.

And I believe that is the case with you. So how does that actually make you feel?

It makes me feel like I cry a lot. Like I remember being on the show. I think I've said this before, but like, I used to get a lot of DM's of people, just even mixed girls in particular, just like saying like I haven't seen, like, someone of my race, like. Being a role like you or on TV that I can actually relate to and like, it means a lot to me. And the Tasha, you you're somebody that lasted pretty long on your show.

And Bachelor has the reputation of being predominantly a white show, especially down to the end of it. So how does that make you feel as far as being a black girl on the show who last that know, what are your top six?

Mm hmm. I mean, yeah, it was great. I of course, that was a great thing about Peter. I didn't ever feel like, oh, this I'm only here because of X, Y and Z. I didn't I never felt that way. But he being it wasn't until after the show that it was like, oh, this is a big deal. I didn't know that at the time. I was just trying to further my relationship with someone.

But afterwards, the messages that I got and even I mean, I talked to Chelsea a lot as well. And Chelsea as well says the same things because she is darker skinned, darker skinned black person as well. That was on the show. So, yeah, it feels great to want people to. Still, that we can still be authentic to ourselves and be able to go far on these on these shows where people think that we I don't know, shouldn't be for some people, I guess.

Yeah, for sure.

Mean, you're that influence for a lot of people out there. Yeah.

And I think that's why it's so important to continue to just represent, you know, and I'm just a person. Right. Like, I understand what people see or don't see, but I'm just a person and this is who I am. And that's the same for everyone. We are more alike than we are different. And that's a big thing that even through all of this, I want people to understand and get. We all want love in our life.

We all want to be happy, whatever that is. People don't want to necessarily fight. So, yeah, we're more we're more similar than than different. We all bleed red.

I mean, I would say like wrapping this up with Candice Patton, who is Irish and the movie I had the opportunity actually to do. I was on a panel for nominees for an NAACP award, and I was amongst so many people like Rosie Perez, Valachi, Candice Patton, Marilyn with how do you say Meryl and Dandrige and I don't know how to say your last name and and listening to Candice talk about how impactful like this role was for her, but also like what she was trying to do with that role to influence little people, like little kids and people.

And then having this come out, it was kind of like a full circle with that. But I just wish I had more of those people like Candice, like a strong individual to look up to. So I think it's really amazing that that's happening.

Yeah. And and when we were talking about shows saved by the bell for me, just because I was that, you know, I was like a turtle growing up, you know, I was the black the darker black girl in the school with the mostly white people so that she really resonated with me. And for so I guess, of course, I was a lot older than five, but that she was at least a turtle was my eiris, if that makes sense.

That's awesome. Basically. Lastly lastly, with with what we're talking here, I just want to ask you guys a question as far as Hollywood and what we're doing now with what's going on in we're, of course, still seeing the strides that Hollywood is trying to make. But the jinns years they are consuming on ticktock on YouTube, on Instagram, and that's where they're getting their their people out of their content. And so they can say, oh, I only want to watch you know, if I'm a person of the Asian community, I can go on tick tock and watch that and consume that.

Or if I'm a person of the black community, I want to only see this so we can basically go into whatever realm we want to go into. If I want to see Pop, I can just watch K Pop all day and they're not they don't have K pop on TV on a regular mainstream TV. Right. So how do you guys feel about the future of Hollywood and where they're going?

Well, that's why I think that's why I think social media overpowers Hollywood now to a sense, because. There's so much out there and so many people now could be a voice, and you don't have to go through the hurdles of what it is to make it in Hollywood and who do you know or whatnot. You literally kind of could just do it on your phone. And that is one hundred percent, in my opinion, the future. I think it's going to keep going that way.

You know, with that, there is a lot of negative stuff on social media. We see it. We're part of it. We feel it. But what? Positive comes out of it, I think is so much more, and I think it's just going to keep growing and growing and I'm excited to see where that ends up. But I think we're still at the very beginning of what social media is. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I think there are people there's there could be young Italian boys that walk to you and say, I want my own pizza sauce one day and they can see that and follow your journey on Instagram.

My fellow Italians, how dare you?

No, no, really.

Seriously, you should never put yourself in a box, as do how you are impacting people could be literally through anything. It could be, you know, whatever it is, it doesn't matter. Just your journey with BATCHELLER has just been incredible. You mean like.

Yeah, fiftieth time. Like you you were on it, but then also at the same time, like I stopped. You were on it. But also like the you know, your journey after that is like what's really inspiring. You mean like the stars? Like I would die to go on to the stars. I would die.

And I mean, so don't I don't you know, it could happen or you don't die like you know, like in most people I went to school with and who I grew up with, like, none of being on TV was never a reality to any one. Right. But it was more like we're going to work for the city. We're going to be city workers, firemen, cops.

Like that was the neighborhood. And where I went to school, that was kind of what the future looks like for everyone. Like I didn't go to college and I have a lot of friends that didn't go to college and it just wasn't a thing. So, yeah, it's interesting. But I think we we I think we could wrap this because I think well, I don't want to. Yeah. Blow on myself here.

So let's come on show. We love you, Joe. It's that time. It's that time of the episode. We have our guest here. You guys will know her from Peter Webber's season of The Bachelor. Her name is Tammy Lee. She was considered a villain on her season. We're going to get a little more into that. We're going to get her take on what's going on in Bachelor Nation and what she plans on doing with, I don't know, maybe the rest of her life.

Let's get deep, everybody. Please welcome Tammy Lee. Tammy, what's up? How are you doing? Hey, guys, how are you? Thank you for having me. Of course, I'm so happy you're here. Cheers, Bill. It's Tammy.

I've actually never met you before.

Well, listen, you were really nice to meet you or whatever they say. How do you say that? Podcast. Email. So have you come on today. Yes.

Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited. I feel like people are going to expect me to say certain things that I'm not going to be saying a thing, so.

OK. Oh, you know what? I was going to go a certain way with it, but what do you think they were expecting? What do you think people are expecting to hear from you? Well, with the whole chaos that's happening right now with patriation, I'm sure it's no secret at this point with the current contestant issues and then the racism issue.

So, yeah, OK, so what is your take on? So we we were actually talking about how Chris Harrison is stepping down. He apologized twice and stepping aside.

OK, stepping aside. I think us as a group on click bait, we do feel like it was the right move and we feel like he did seem genuine about it. So how do you feel? I do think it's a good move for him to just step aside and maybe take that time to educate him on the issues that he quoted to say that weren't issues in 18, which were just barely two years ago. But racism is then a huge issue, imagination.

And I see it from both sides, from production side and from being a contestant on the show. And I think real people on the show, they only give us what the fans want to see in the fans. They preach and they yell and they that they want to see diversity and the franchise to an extent they give them back, but they weren't showing them because the viewers are not reciprocating to the fans. I was talking with the Tasha the other day.

If you can see, like the database of the viewing time between colored contestants or dozens of color and white contestants, they are still prominently shown over the people of color, unfortunately. Now, if you look at numbers as Instagram followers, a lot of contestants of color have tend to have lower followings than the white contestants, unfortunately. So that just tells you what the fans are gravitating towards. So I think that the fans. Tend to hop on a hatred bandwagon and they tend to just yell and scream, but they have the biggest weight of to make a huge difference.

So people are so quick to blame people like the network, the producers, Chris Harrison, and they do have a blame in this part as well. But the fans are ultimately the heavy weighted part of making an ultimate change. I mean, do you agree?

I think it's actually very interesting because I do and I kind of want to dive into this.

Yeah, this is where I actually. OK, so if you look at Rachel Lynsay season, OK, she was the first black bachelor, I'm assuming. Because the show does seem to have a majority white fan base, I think. Her numbers probably weren't as good as Jojo Fletcher 100 percent, and I'm a no person, I've looked into that.

This is what would probably be the issue from a business standpoint is like if the fans who do want to see a change aren't.

Showing up to watch then the show is not going to show people of color, and that's the problem and that's that's the real issue. And it's it's you know, that's what we need to change. We need to change people's acceptance of people in color being leads and people of color. You know, people need to tune in for that.

Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Well, I mean and I think also it goes to show. I think it also goes to show, like what something isn't something is not built overnight, right? It takes time. So the idea that maybe the first person of color bachelorette is not going to get as many numbers, but maybe the second we'll get more and then the third and then the fourth, because we've had so many of the same type, I would say the same type of representation.

Right. So if you did have a person that was maybe Asian and just keep again, bringing these people of color and putting them in a light, but also to think about it in another lens, it's like if you are whoever you see the most on TV, that's how you're going to know the most about. And that's probably who you're going to follow as well. Right. So I think it all is interconnected. You know, my my season, a lot of people message me all the time who like me, who follow me, they're like, I can't believe you don't have more followers.

But also, I wasn't shown that much on my season. So it's like if I were, then maybe I would have more followers. But because people there's a lot of people who are just like, I just don't know who this person is. Right. I don't care.

I'm so interested in listening because I love looking at all parts of it. I try to always step outside of the box and look at the situation from all points of view just to get information as much as I can to form my own opinion and not want everyone else's opinion. Right. Very interesting to see.

Yeah, right. You go ahead.

I wanted to ask you as as a person of color, do you do you think that's why you got the stigma as the villain on your season?

Do you? I've thought about this a lot. I am an aggressive personality, you know, I'm very loud. I'm a New Yorker Gemini, but I can see why the things that I did portray to me portrayed me as a villain. But I feel like it was ten times worse because people aren't familiar with people of color. Speaking out and not being a secondary character, you know, I'm like, look at this season, for example, with Serena, she had the balls to confront Katie, which she had an issue with, which is not allowed to have issues with each other and say sorry.

And now he's getting bullied, saying that she's coming after Katie and like she's almost betrayed because that's the only thing we've seen of her, is that she's this aggressive personality. You know, people the viewers are very uncomfortable with seeing people of color with a more Lauter personality. And that's just my opinion.

I do think, though, anybody that is really aggressive on the show, I do think that anybody is really aggressive. Like if you go back and watch what was the guy that was all steroid it out, Chad Williams, Chad, Chad Johnson. And, you know, and he was a villain.

And, you know, I think. I think the show looks for people with aggressive personalities, but I also don't think that MAKE should make you a villain just because you speak your mind, right? Right.

I agree. Right. Yeah. There's I mean, there's a lot of I say this all the time. People watch the show and sometimes they have no idea what they're watching. And it's like everyone's not going to agree. And I say that all the time. And I just want people to really understand that when you're lying, like on my season I was in shows like my relationship with Peter wasn't shown as much, but when I was down, it was because of my quote unquote aggressive personality than with reality.

We really haven't seen her relationship at all with Matt until we call her Confront Katie. Why is that the only time a person of color is allowed to be on screen? Did you think did you think your relationship with Peter was forming? Like, did you think it was strong?

I didn't think it was as strong, of course, as the other girls, but I did think that it was forming.

And do you think that was there? Was there any point before the two on one that you felt like. I. You know, if if I'm going to have a chance with this person, I have to tell him all these things that I'm feeling, or is there a point where you felt? You had to kind of speak up in order to get his attention, is what I'm trying to say.

Yeah, and I feel like that's what got me in trouble because he thought that I was just sitting on people, which I wasn't. I think that I have a part, as we all did in his love story as well. And that's about telling him what's going on and telling him the type of people that I see and see if he can take that information the way that he wants to, you know, and see.

I think that's interesting perspective because, you know, it wasn't just you on our season who did that. There were other people who also called other people out. And it happens every season. Right. I personally didn't feel that way when I was on the show. I did not think that it was necessary. I was like, if you want to end up with a girl who don't really want to be with you on, you know what I mean?

Like like that's personally how I felt, you know. But how would he know that, you know, he derailed the process. He does not have a lot of time with. All right. You know, as much as we have any other I mean, you made it far. Entertainment had a one on one and you were barely shown.

But I think it's because I did not engage in a lot of the drama. And also our relationship just was in my opinion, it was just a very normal for this type of show relationship. We were not always sucking face every five minutes. We were talking about real things. And for some people watching a TV show that might be boring, I don't know. I wish it was shown more. But at the same time, you know, it seemed like on our season, if you weren't, you know, sucking face or causing drama, there was no in between.

Right.

Do you think that you had a solid relationship with Peter at that point? I definitely do. But again, that's you know, it's hard because you see at the time, while we were filming. Filming, yes, I definitely felt that way. But then when you watch the show back and you see these other relationships, which we don't see right on the show, which is the whole mindfuck of it all, you realize that, yeah, he clearly had a stronger relationship or a stronger connection with someone like a Hannah and or a Madison right now.

That's the one thing, though. You guys I mean, even myself, I don't know. The other relationships are like.

Exactly. Exactly. So you only you only know your relationship.

And so I was in a position to I thought we were filming or forming a really good relationship, which is why I felt the need to tell him all these things. And clearly I was wrong. So I wasn't. If we both felt that relationship was forming enough for me to get Rosens every week, why wasn't I shown? Why wasn't my relationship shown? Why is the only the times when I was argumentative with the other girls? That was when my face was shown.

No, believe me, I hear what you're saying. I hear what you're saying is just like.

But do you think I'm going to play devil's advocate here? Do you think it's because your relationship. When did you go home? Like what? No, like around like 10 top 12 steps. Was top eight out of it myself?

Six weeks.

I mean, do you think because there were eight girls, let's call it eight or seven girls essentially in front of you or whose relationships were stronger or they were just causing more drama in the house? I mean, do you put that in consideration?

My quote unquote drama didn't start until week five, you know, so we had what we let's say, two to five that I was barely shown or my relationship was barely shown at that point, you know?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I think that's the call of action that we just I think that's the call of action that you're talking about. Right. Like, if we are going to actually see change and we're going to things are going to change, showing people people's relationship of no matter what their what, their ethnicity, whatever, no matter where they're from or what their nationality is, it's it's important you are going to be shown as long as the lead is correct in his journey with you, because, again, we have no idea about the other relationships.

But there are times where I mean, let's take a look for this season, for example, like where did Abigail go? And then all of a sudden she showed up and then she got sent home. I think she had a first impression, Rose. Right with that.

Look, I will tell you right now, like being a and giving a first impression of somebody. And then all said, and I'm not being shown on television very much because it didn't progress anywhere. Yeah. And everything else is moving forward.

And a dead guy, it could have been any ethnicity could have been brought up. But like I'm telling you, it was kind of like a unit. I mean, yeah, there's so much more going on it there's just so much more going on that I feel like it is hard, regardless of the fact that it is hard to show absolutely everything. But I think, like what I want to know is because I really like to hear your insight.

I think you have really good you know, I like your views, but with Harrison stepping aside, with Chris stepping aside and people are really looking to the franchise to do more and and move forward and try to keep saying, like, what do you hope for for the show moving forward? Like, what would you like to see with this in particular? Well, I would love to see a woman actually take the lead along with Chris Harrison, I think that The Bachelor or Bachelorette, just having someone to confide in their relationship or their journey with, it's only Chris Harrison.

And sometimes you don't relate well with someone who is not the same. I mean, it's like I would love to talk to you about my my dating life, you know, in the past. And I don't know, I like you and all.

Like, I don't know how to talk to you about, like, my relationship, knowing what you know now and seeing kind of where the show's going. And it does kind of seem like it is progressing. Would you go on, Paradice. I would definitely consider it, I think I believe the process works. The reason why that I went on the show in the first place is because I work so much that my entire life. If I were to date, it would have to be in a position where I would have to leave my job on the back burner and focus on my relationship.

So I think I would be a great opportunity for that and I'm open to it if that happens to me.

I want to know, do you have any advice for any of the girls on that season? The ones that are left or just in general, I mean, I think I would do the once before the I deal with hey, I talked to Kit. She said that she's getting so much hate because of what happened with Heather.

You know, like I actually talked to a lot of your guys who got cyber bullied because they just don't know how to handle it. No one is prepared to handle what it's like. Nobody, you know. And I would say I'm a pretty strong person and personality, but it comes to a point where the hate is a lot and it really just drains you as a person. And I think my best advice is that you have to take with a grain of salt, both positive and negative.

These people don't know you personally. You really can't eat up the compliments because that just leads to you eating up the hate and they're just going to hurt more.

Yeah, yeah. It's yeah, it's a really hard thing to get used to. I mean, I still do with it, but it's just like. You cannot give all your energy to these people that literally don't actually know you. They think they know they have expectations for you, for who you should be, but it's not you. So. So I think that why people hate me so much is because they didn't get to see my full story of who I am as a person, because and then that's why me, quote unquote, being mean to these other girls looked more abrupt.

Like I said, I wasn't shown. And I would love for whatever comes next after this for more of my story to be shown, because there's a lot of aspects to us as humans that tell stories of why the reason that the way that we are, you know, I don't I hope I don't think people hate you.

I think, like. Well, you know, these people honestly, most of these people that talk like that, in my opinion, would never say it to your face, never. And sometimes I'm guilty of it, too. We're just on our phones and we're staring at our phones and we consume it so much that it feels like it's real.

But that's what you just got to step outside into the real world and buy your friends and your family. And then you're like, oh, OK.

That shit is just I just push that to the side or at least try.

Yeah, I like to call them the one percenters. They just scream really loud. But honestly, it's like not even that many people. It's kind of like twenty five people that make me think you're an amazing check your bad ass. You are successful, you're sweet, you're kind. You're helping other people. You're awesome, you know that. You know what you're doing, right? You know what you're doing. People don't know. I will say, Joe and when I had Tammy on the Tea Room, like so many people messaged me and was like, I'm so glad that I could see her on the tea room.

I had her and Kelsey kind of like back to back, I think. And they were like seeing Kelsey, like, just chill and see Tammy. Just chill is so great because my perception of them after watching them on the show was really bad.

And I was like, see, but they could oh, she oh, I remember what I remember watching you.

I think it was it was either the reunion, whatever, I get the names messed up reunion show or whatever.

But I, I thought you I was like, all right. This girl standing up for herself.

Good for her. Yeah. Yeah. And that's a guy you know, you're also a guy because standing up for herself to women means she's tearing other women down, which I guess is not the case. Right. She's standing up for herself. So, yeah, it's fucked up.

What I hated about like people who are like women empowerment. You're terrible guys. Like I'm asking people down and standing up for myself. I'm not going to let people talk to me that way no matter what, you know. And I think women empowerment isn't about telling you you're pretty and you're so gorgeous. It's about helping you strive for your career fight in a male dominated world. That's what women felt, right?

Yeah. And even in every season, there's this whole mean girls thing and they all put labels on everything, right? People put labels on everything. I mean, you know, people called us mean girls. I or we had our even you you were like, what? We have this clique. I'm like, I just prefer to protect my energy and worry about my man and only talk to the people who are in our room. That was it.

Like that was literally my mindset. If if five other people were in our room, those are the people I probably would have talked to, you know what I'm saying? Like, I was very simple and people took it way all like way out of the out of out of off top.

It's like, no, you know what I mean from what I've seen is like the fact that you actually didn't let them steamroll you and you stood up like that's always going to come off as like kind of like she's loud and aggressive in that regard. But but what else are you supposed to do if you fucking stand up for yourself? What's it going to do it? Yeah, I don't know. I don't see that as a negative at all. But people like to like, you know.

But my question is, did you gravitate towards those who are quieter and like, for me, I would be very timid and quiet and like. But I just decided one day that people are not going to step over all over me anymore or take advantage of me. So I'm just not where I want to be a voice for people, especially Asian people who are quiet and timid to say anything. Right. And you did you yell or do any of that kind of stuff?

No. I think I said it looks like you got I look personally I because I remember I'm going to go watch back now.

I'm going to I remember I remember that there was yelling like I me. I found that very unattractive, like because like the other girls to me just seemed like they took the easy way out and they all ganged up on you and it was like, ha ha.

And that's exactly what happened, because they all said the same things, too. It's just like, OK, maybe mine was caught on camera, but or their just and you but everyone's going to be like everyone in this franchise is very. Fake and they just pretend to like each other to make it look like we're all OK and it's not like. We're not like we're not going to all get along with 30 fucking people. Yeah.

We're like the social climb and climb on the hottest thing out there right now on social media and just be friends with them just so they could be in their status, too. And I could care less about that.

And I tried you keeping that mentality and you continue to do you you will be perfectly fine. I'm just telling you right now, I did the same exact thing. Studio, you're going to be fine. All right.

We have to. We have to. I know, but I really like talking to her. I have one more question. So I don't know. What would you do different? That's my last question. Would you do anything different? Yeah. Would you would you do everything the same or would you do anything different from the season with with with Kelsey and McKenna? You know what?

I thought about this a lot, too. And I'm going to say no. And I feel like I would get hit for that. But again, I am an Asian character and I was not going to get so unless I was going to be in the shit, unfortunately. Oh, OK. That's the way I feel. Yeah.

We don't hate you. We think you're awesome. And hopefully you if you get a chance to go back on, you could show your side and show you who you really are. And we wish you nothing but the best. Tammy, thank you so much for coming on today.

Thank you so much, guys. So happy we had the opportunity. Nice meeting you. You know, I think it's so great that we have this platform to bring in so many people at times because like I feel like we see a different side to people. And I think sometimes people really need like an outlet in order to, you know, just bring back people to reality. Because what you see on the show is not always everything I thought is really cool.

And I feel like I do remember her having such a negative connotation, like after the show. And it was really nice to get to know her. And I think she's a really dope person and. Now, I was really happy to have her on. Yeah, I think that that's great we could do that because, yeah, it was interesting to even hear her talk and hear her how she's talking about how about how she just thinks people hate her.

So to let her actually speak out and to keep speaking out after the show I think is important because you're like like you guys, we are all just people and we're just trying to do our best.

So we're not always built for this stuff. I you know, you do one thing wrong on the show, and sometimes people write you off and cancel them just like it's it's it it's hard.

How are you supposed to deal with that?

You know, so it's just a reminder to everyone. Every person is layered. No one is one time. No one is always great. No one's always bad. No at least no one that exists in the world. Right. And so just keep that in mind.

We have our everything you see on the show is not everything that's to them. Yeah. Anyway, that's actually just one tone and way. I just want to say thank you so much to our listeners for joining us for another good episode.

Well, I think it was good, but thank you so much, our listeners, for joining us for another episode of Click Bait, as well as Tami Lee. Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy, busy day to come and join us.

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