Any moment here now, House Speaker Mike Johnson will face his first major test on the House floor as he pushes his two-part funding bill to keep the federal government running past Friday. But without enough Republican support, Johnson has moved to sidestep them and lean on Democrats to get a bill passed. You might recall that same move cost Kevin McCarthy the Speaker's gavel last month. Johnson has to get a two-thirds majority vote for passage.

When we have a three-vote majority, as we do right now, we don't have the votes to be able to advance that right now. So what we need to do is avoid the government shutdown. Why? Because that would unduly harm the American people. Troops wouldn't be paid. We know all the effects of that. And so we have to avoid that, and we have a responsibility to do it.

Here with us now, Republican Congressman Ken Buck of Colorado. He is also a member of the House Freedom Caucus, which came out against Johnson's funding plan today. All right, sir, thanks for being with us. First off, are you on board with this? I am.

Going to make a decision. It's a game-time decision for me. I have not decided yet whether I'm going to support this or not. This really isn't Mike's fault that he is not... That he is working to maintain spending levels that Republicans didn't vote for a year ago. The reason is that the Appropriations Bills were not brought to the floor in May and June and July in a way that we would be in position to pass them by September 30th. I don't blame Mike for what's going on right now, but I am reluctant to support a spending level that I did not support last year.

Even though you said, I like the latter approach.

I do like the latter approach. I think it's very important that we make sure that we have a group of spending bills that we can pass and send to the Senate and conference and just start the muscle memory of passing Appropriations bills and doing the right thing on spending. I like the latter approach. I don't like the fact that we don't have border requirements in here. I don't like the fact we don't have other spending cuts in this Appropriations or in the CR.

This issue of getting Democratic support and bypassing some Republicans is what some Freedom Caucus members ousted McCarthy for. Not all of them, to be clear, you had broader reasons, but they rebelled when McCarthy relied on Democrats for support in keeping the government running. Are they going to try to oust Johnson for it?

No, I don't believe anybody is interested in vacating the chair again and getting rid of Mike Johnson. I think that Mike has inherited a mess, and he is doing his best to work through that mess. And that mess right now needs to receive a bipartisan solution. I understand all that. Mike is really doing his best to make sure that we do pass Appropriations Bill with.

The Senate. Can I stop you for just one second? Because I want to understand this. If Mike Johnson is doing his best, and it is the same as what Kevin McCarthy did, I mean, is that not Kevin McCarthy's best? If Freedom Caucus members don't out Johnson for relying on Democrats instead of keeping Republicans together, are they irrelevant? He's Speaker, Mike Johnson, because of them, and he is bypassing them on his first major maneuver as Speaker.

Yeah, but he's not. And understand, Mike Johnson and Kevin McCarthy are in a much different position. Kevin started as Speaker in early January. The Appropriations bills weren't brought to the floor until late July. We took an August recess. We got back in September. We passed a few and the CR came about because Kevin McCarthy wanted an omnibus bill. He delayed the Appropriations process so that we would have an omnibus bill. That's not what Mike did. Mike has inherited this mess. He's doing his best to get Appropriations bills passed, and he's working with Democrats to keep the floor open. Completely different story.

Separately, but connected. This alleged kidney punch or hard kidney nudge or knock that congressman, Birchette, says he received from former Speaker Kevin McCarthy today. Burchett, of course, one of the eight in the GOP who ousted McCarthy. Mccarthy is denying his claim. Who do you believe here?

Well, I believe the reporter who was present when Tim was pushed or struck by Kevin McCarthy. It wasn't just Tim's view of what happened, and it wasn't just a crowded situation where Kevin was pushed into Tim. I think the reporter made the eyewitness account. I believe that Kevin, while he was guarded by four police officers, went and did what he did, I guess.

You think he's lying, to be clear?

Kevin McCarthy and lying are like peanut butter and jelly.

Why do you think he's lying? I mean, why do you think in this case, and look, I will grant you this because the NPR reporter who was there said he walks by, and I've been in that hallway. You're right. It is not that narrow that you couldn't avoid a fellow congressman. She said that she saw Bertrandt lunge forward, and clearly he was shocked by what had happened. Is why do you think Kevin McCarthy would do that and then insist, even in the face of having a reporter, having been there and describing what happened, that he's insisting it did?

Yeah. I don't know what goes to the mind of Kevin McCarthy. I know he doesn't want to take responsibility for the financial mess that we're in right now. I know he doesn't want to take responsibility for pushing a congressman who voted against him in the motion to vacate. I think that Kevin McCarthy is obviously very upset still that he is not Speaker. He doesn't hold any leadership position now. He is a rank and file congressman like me, and it's got to be upsetting to him. He took it out in the way he took it out, and now he denies it. I don't know how to explain that to anybody.

Congressman Matt Gates is taking this to ethics. Do you think that's right?

I think this is a family issue that we... That we have a conference at some point we talk about and move on. I don't think that we need to publicize this anymore than it's been publicized.

Then it sounds like you're seeing this from the outside, and it sounds like maybe what you're saying, but I don't want to put words in your mouth, it's so dramatic, this drama. Why are so many of your fellow Republicans having a hard time quitting this drama?

I don't know the answer to that question. Every night I go home and I sing Kumbaya. I have no idea why other people are getting along around this place. It is upsetting that we have member on member pushing. There was an incident over in the Senate also today. I think honestly, we have been here for a long time, a number of weeks in a row. A lot of us haven't been home much to see our families. I think that wears on people, but that's not an excuse for pushing another member.

What was the Senate incident?

Oh, Mark Wayne Mullen, evidently stood up in a committee meeting and challenged somebody in a way that just isn't appropriate in the Senate or the House.

The decorum you're saying is just not normal.

It's not normal. I think there's a lot of folks on both sides of the capital that are really... The stress is wearing on them. I think we need to move on, pass Appropriations bills, do our job, and make sure we keep things in perspective.

All right. Congressman Ken Buck, thank you for taking the time with us today. We do appreciate it.

Thank you.