I saw a movie recently that I cannot stop thinking about. No, not Dune 2. I'm talking about the zone of interest. It's about the Nazi who ran the Auschwitz Concentration Camp during World War II. He and his family live literally right outside the camp in a beautiful house. They have a pristine garden and a pool for the kids. But on the other side of their garden walls, unspeakable horrors are unfolding. And yet this family just goes about their lives. Now, while you do hear what's going on at the camp, you don't see any of it. All the horror is off-screen. It's genocide as white noise. And that's actually been one of the criticisms of the film, that there are no Jewish characters at all. Now, that very well may have been the director's intent, but it does raise some familiar questions. Who has right to tell a Holocaust story? Why do so many of them focus on Jewish pain rather than Jewish resilience? Why not make a movie about ordinary Jewish life? Well, as Hollywood gathers for the Academy Awards, a group of Jewish Hollywood figures are asking, Why are we not a bigger part of the industry's diversity push?

My guest this week is CNN Entertainment Correspondent, Elizabeth Wagmeister. We're going to talk about what Hollywood's Complicated history with anti-Semitism can tell us about diversity and inclusion on and off screen. From CNN, this is One Thing. I'm David Ryan. Elizabeth, earlier this year, you did some reporting on a letter that was sent to the Academy of Motion, Picture, Arts, and Sciences, which is the titular Academy of the Academy Awards. Tell me about it.

Yes. This was an open letter that was signed by around 300 figures in Hollywood, including actors, directors, producers, agents, screenwriters, and so forth. Some of the biggest names from this list were David Schwimmer, of course, from Friends, also the co-creator of Friends, Marta Kaufman, Tiffany Hadish, Deborah Messing, the list goes on and on. What these figures are calling out the Academy for is they are saying that Jews are not included in the academy's inclusion and Diversity Standards. Now, let me explain what those standards are. They're calling it the Academy Award Whiteouts. There's not much diversity, and that is what the #OscarsSoWhite is all about. When the #OscarsSoWhite went viral back in 2015, that's what first really put the Academy on notice for their total lack of diversity. Spike Lee, an Honorary Academy Award winner, took to Instagram in part, How is it possible for the second consecutive year, all 20 contenders under the actor category are white? For many committees, the question has been less, Who are you wearing? And more, Who do you stand with? The reason why that hashtag was born is because all 20 actors across all of the acting categories were all white.

I still cannot believe that, Elizabeth. Honestly, that is so crazy.

I remember the day that those nominations were announced, and I couldn't believe it then, and I still can't believe it now. This is not ancient history. This was 2015. You realize if they nominated Host, I wouldn't even get this job.

Should I be watching Neil Patrick Harris right now?

To their credit, the Academy has made great efforts to increase the diversity among their voting body. Back in 2020, as part of the Academy's new diversity efforts, they unveiled a new set of standards that require films to submit data on inclusion for the crew and everyone working on the film in order to be considered for best picture at the Academy Awards. Now, these initiatives were unveiled in 2020, but the upcoming Oscars this year in 2024, of course, are the first year that these standards go into effect. Within those initiatives, the Academy outlined what they referred to as underrepresented groups. And part of those underrepresented groups included women, LGBTQ+, people with cognitive or physical disabilities, as well as racial or ethnic groups. The racial and ethnic groups that were outlined in the academy standards are Asian, Hispanic, Black, Indigenous, Middle Eastern, Native Hawaiian, or other Pacific Islander. But what this letter in particular is saying is that Jewish people were omitted from those groups. In the aftermath of October seventh, when we know that anti-Semitism is spiking in America and around the world, these signatories are saying that this adds to the growing anti-Semitism.

You listed a ton of underrepresented groups that I think would sound familiar to a lot of people, but Jews, maybe not so. Hanging all over this is this dark stereotype, right, that Jews control Hollywood. They're in Hollywood. And this group is saying, You guys have that wrong.

Absolutely. That is what this group is saying. And I actually spoke to the individual who organized this open letter. Her name is Allison Josephs, and she is the founder of the advocacy group called Jew in the City. And here is what she told me, David. She said, Jews are a very misunderstood group, which means that while other communities have benefited from diversity, inclusion, and authentic storytelling, Jews have been left out. Jews have historically stood with other marginalized groups, but unfortunately have not stood up for themselves. But this letter shows that something is changing. Now, it It tends to be seen if this will move the needle because the academy has not responded to this letter. I did reach out to them. They declined to comment. This was weeks and weeks ago, and here we are on Oscar Sunday, and still no comment in response from the academy.

Elizabeth, for this group, what exactly are they taking issue with? Is it Jewish people not getting opportunities to play Jewish characters? Is it something deeper? What does this frustration actually look like?

There have been a lot of people who, over the years in Hollywood, have called out the industry for saying that Jews are essentially only represented in Holocaust-centric movies. Our little girl is looking more and more like Winston Churchill every day. It's a big Yalta head, but that's not a reason to leave, right? Now, over the years, we have seen various versions of Jewish representation. Something that comes to mind is the marvelous Mrs. Maisel, which shows a lot of Jewish culture. Esther's not gone. Ignore him.. Touch my belly. It's a mitzvah. Maybe later.

He got.

He really got. Now, of course, that is just one sector that's very specific to a certain time period in New York. So there's criticism about how Jews are represented on screen, but also who should play Jewish people. Again, this is not something that is specific to only Jewish people. If summer doesn't sing in you, then nothing sings in If nothing sings in you, then you can't make music. But most recently, we're talking about the Oscars, right? Bradley Cooper was at the center of controversy for his film, Maestro. The Nose. For The Nose, exactly. But Hollywood does have a long, complicated history when it comes to Jewish representation and inclusion. This goes back decades and decades, David, all the way back to the people who built Hollywood in the early 1920s, and they were afraid of being outed as Jews. When the Academy Museum of Motion Pictures opened a few years ago, they received a lot of praise for showing all the contributions of women and artists of color and people from all sorts of background and the contributions that they made to the film industry. But the one group that was absent in this opening of the museum was these Jewish immigrants who were known, again, as founding fathers of the Hollywood studio system.

And now It is our thrill and honor to present the Screen Actors Guild Life Achievement Award to the incredible, the indomitable Barbara Streisand.

This actually just came up this award season in 2024. Barbra Streisand, she took the stage at the SAG Awards last month, where she was honored with a big Lifetime Achievement Award.

What an idea. Moving pictures on a screen. And I can't help but think back to the people who built this industry.

And she noted that the founding fathers, as they're known, of Hollywood, who helped establish Warner Brothers, MGM, and Paramount, they were all Jews.

They were all fleeing the prejudice they faced in Eastern Europe simply because of their religion. They were dreamers, too, like all of us here tonight. And now I dream of a world where such prejudice is a thing of the past.

So it sounds like this group that wrote this letter that we started talking about, they're They're not just necessarily thinking about that they maybe want more specific roles played by certain people, but that there is this history that has been sanded off of Hollywood, and there are dangers to forgetting some of that stuff.

That's exactly what they are saying. They're saying that, especially in the aftermath of the events of October seventh, they're saying that by Hollywood in the academy, Leaving Jews out, that it is adding to these dangerous levels anti-Semitism.

But beyond what's outlined at the academy museum or these inclusion and diversity requirements for the Academy Awards, is that stuff doing anything to actually push the industry forward in terms of getting underrepresented groups, underrepresented people into positions where they can succeed and have flourishing careers? Where is Hollywood at in terms of that actual progress just who is up on stage at an award show?

It's a really good question because covering the entertainment industry, I often get some comments from people saying, Why should we care about what celebrities say? But the truth is that Hollywood is a prism through which a lot of people can see their lives. So when Hollywood does something, there can be a trickle-down effect on other industries. But where do we really see the results? With the academy in terms of diversity, we've seen results there with a wider voting body. We've also seen changes in the studio system, in the agency system, where there are more women in power. But there was just a study that came out about female directors and female representation in films, and the numbers are staggering. It's at an all-time low for the past decade. So it feels like it is one step forward in a few steps back.

Right. Barbie is just one movie and doesn't necessarily represent where the industry is at on a whole.

Absolutely.

So since it's Oscar Sunday, Elizabeth, can I get some hot take predictions from you? And I'm talking a hot take because I know Oppenheimer is probably going to win Best Picture and a bunch of other awards. But give me a prediction that's going to blow my socks off that people listening on Monday or Tuesday can listen back and say, Wow, she was really smart.

Okay. Well, that scares me because my... But here's what I will say. I do think that this Oscars will be fairly predictable. I do think Oppenheimer will win best picture, best director, best actor, best supporting actor. But when it comes to the best actress category, Lily Gladstone from Killers of the Flower Moon has been the shoe-in since the beginning of awards However, I think there's a good chance that Emma Stone wins. Of course, if Lily Gladstone won, she would become the first Indigenous woman to win in this category. So that would be a major history-making moment. Emma Stone has already won an Oscar. It doesn't mean that she doesn't deserve another one, but I think that that could be the upset of the night.

Well, there you go. And for anybody listening on Monday or later in the week, they can look back and say, Hey, they were really smart. And if it's the opposite, I don't know if we want to hear No, this is what they're going to say.

They're going to say, She was wrong.

Thank you, Elizabeth.

Thank you.

One Thing is a production of CNN Audio. This episode was produced by Paula Ortiz and me, David Reind. Our senior producer is Faz Jamil. Our supervising producer is Greg Peppers. Matt Dempsey is our production manager. Dan Dizula is our technical director, and Steve Ligtai is the executive producer of CNN Audio. We get support from Haley Thomas, Alex Manasari, Robert Mathers, John Dianora, Lenny Steinhart, Jamis Andres, Nicole Pessereau, and Lisa Namarau. Special thanks to Jason Kraverick and Katie Hinman. Just one thing, I asked you guys last week for some ratings and reviews on Apple Podcasts, and wow, did you guys deliver? I see you, Backmode 93, Fantom Cupcake, Jenny Mess, Sue's Muck. Keep it coming, you guys. Thank We'll be back next week.