Hi, my name is Bruce Springsteen. And I feel ecstatic about being Conan O'Brien's friend. I can and we are going to. Hey there and welcome to Conan O'Brien needs a friend, I'm going to say this is this is a big one. Usually during this beginning chat, I don't often discuss the guest, but there's no way around it today. It's Bruce Springsteen. Yes. It's such a just a joy to get to talk to him. I've had the pleasure of speaking to him a bunch of times over the years when he made appearances on my show and bumping into him in different situations.

But, man, I just I love that he's on the podcast and we're going to have this deep dive conversation. I'm really looking forward to it. So I know that you are relatively new to America. Does Bruce Springsteen mean a lot to, you know, that's new to America? I was born here, but my parents were not. And I remember I was going through their records recently and they were all, you know, Armenian music and business and one American album record that they had.

And it was born in the USA and it was the first American record they bought when they came to the States. Did your father try to use that album cover as proof that he was born in the USA to get past the border guards? You think my daddy hold it up and go. I am citizen look born in USA and they're like, Sir, that is an album by Bruce Springsteen. It's an iconic album. That was my dad. That was the impression you just did that.

My dad and I really have just been informed by Springsteen's people that he's cancelled the interviews I'm playing and I don't blame him.

I didn't appreciate that comment. Listen, you used to do an impression of my dad where you take a dinner napkin and put it under your nose and pretend it was his mustache. Prove I've done that. Prove it. I have a photo of that damage. Yes. Why do I always let you take photos of me when I'm doing inappropriate? You post for it. So anyway, my point is and let's get back to the point, not that I would put, as you say, a dinner napkin under my nose rolled up in a specific way to make it look like an oversized mustache, to look like your father's crazy mustache, great mustache.

He has a good mustache, a real man's mustache. I could not grow that mustache. You could not know. I know I grow a nice beard, but my mustache is lacking. Would your father agree to go to a hospital and do a stash transplant where they take some of his mustache hairs and implant them into me? It's just so much work. I've done so much for you that I think your dad owes me a mustache implant anyway. I think we've drifted.

You would look like such a perv with a mustache or a well-to-do pornographer. What I would like to say so that to keep us back on track, this is a star of a caliber that even your parents know who he is. Yes. And knew who he was when they were in Armenia. No, they weren't in Armenia. They were in Turkey. They are Armenian, but they were in Turkey. People listening don't care. Talking about just ah, like go with the flow.

Don't be like, well, now you see they are Armenian, but they were living in Turkey, but then Greece for a while. And of course Istanbul. Yeah. I've just been informed by Springsteen that he's filing a lawsuit. That's OK. I love it. His people of Springsteen people are so professional that they're listening and giving us updates Bruce is doing and they're texting you. Bruce, Bruce. Bruce loves Bruce. He loves Turkey. Both both the country and the the deli meat.

And he is very offended now. So he's launched a suit. Matt, I know that you prefer like polka and stuff like that, but Bruce Springsteen, this is a big deal for you. Yeah. Never liked polka. Oh, yeah. He is a big deal. And this is the boss from day to day. I know you as the boss, but now the boss. Yeah, I think of myself.

I know to be fair to our listeners, I am the boss. No, your girl. Boss, you're a boss. No, no, no, no. He is a boss of some E Street band. Who's the boss? You are a boss. Yes. Of some people he is the boss, but nobody. I actually don't think I'm the boss of you, so. No, and I'm not the boss of Gawley. In fact, I'm hard pressed to find anybody who works technically for me, who thinks of me as a boss.

Yeah, right. I don't have that boss thing like, oh, here comes the boss. Yeah. People aren't going like Here comes the boss, because that's superseded by Oh, here comes Conan the man. Yeah. No, like, we don't know what you're going to do and we know we're in for something harrowing. It's not true. I think I'm a swell fella. Any regular listener of this podcast knows me to be gentle as a lamb, you know, in The Devil Wears Prada when she's walking in and everyone changes their shoes and and their change, their posture.

When Meryl Streep, Meryl Streep walks in and everyone's getting really nervous. If I'm watching TV and I'm leaning back in my chair and you're walking in, I do not do anything different. Yes, I love you. Started that with when I'm at work and I'm watching TV and leaning back in his chair, meaning you're really not working. You happen to be at work, but you're binge watching something from Netflix. Yes. Oh, yes. What I mean is I I'm not terrified enough to be like, oh, I have to make sure he doesn't see me watching terrified or 40, not terrified enough or not terrified at all.

And in fact, quite dismissive of my presence. That might be that's accurate. Yes. There you go. Anyway, to keep things on track. I am just absolutely delighted that Bruce Springsteen's on the on the podcast today. And I don't want us to waste time. I always say that. But then, of course, I do waste time. But we can't today because this is an opportunity that comes but once in a lifetime. Yes, that's true.

I've always had a connection with them because of Max Weinberg as well. Max Weinberg, my drummer and band leader for 16 years in latenight 17 years, I think actually. And Bruce always so kind and always checking in with me and saying, I hope it's OK that I bring in Max back on tour and just just like a call he didn't have to make, but a lovely artist, great guy. So let's do it. I say we do it.

Let's go. Let's do it. But first, a story that goes nowhere.

My guest today, of course, a rock icon who has won 20 Grammy Awards and sold over one hundred and thirty five million albums worldwide, making him one of music's best selling artists of all time. His 20th studio album, Letter to You, which I've listened to many times now, and it is beautiful. It is now out. And the documentary film of the same name capturing the making of the album is available to stream on Apple TV. Plus to say I'm thrilled he's with us today is a pathetically inadequate understatement.

Ladies and gentlemen.

Bruce Springsteen, Bruce, welcome. I am speaking sincerely, first and foremost, being how generous you were with Max Weinberg and allowing us to have his services while he was employed by you. Well, I always appreciated that. Bruce, let's get something straight. I've tried to explain this to you before because you've been very kind to couch it this way. I borrowed your drummer, OK? I would not know who Max Weinberg was. It had not been for the fact that he was the great drummer for the greatest rock band in the world.

And occasionally he'd call me up and say, Conan, we're about to head out on the road. Might I please? What are you talking about? He's yours. He's your guy. You lent him to me for 16 years. For 16 years. You let me have the great mighty Max Weinberg. And boggling isn't that you know, my plan was to start borrowing your guys one by one and moving him over a late night show. And so get Steve get Neil's slowly incorporated until I had the entire E Street Band and tell you, Bruce, they're mine now.

That was my plan. Didn't quite work out. Yeah, it was good. It was a long con. It was going to take me about eight years to one by one, get every single guy. Either way for sixteen years it worked out well. It worked out better than well. And who knew? We also found his comedic streak. It took us a while. It didn't happen overnight. But we found out that when you cut to Max for no reason, when he's not paying attention during a sketch, people thought it was the funniest thing in the world.

I'm just saying you're not maybe using him to his full extent. I don't think we are. Max is funny. I will tell you this, Bruce. The two guys, in my opinion, who work really work the hardest in that band. I'm going to say to you first, I'm going to say it's Mac's second in terms of caloric expenditure during a concert because you burn about I'm going to say conservatively, eight thousand calories. And that could be on an acoustic set where you're sitting on as if you were sitting on a stool and you were just singing old folk songs at a funeral, you would burn eight thousand calories, but Max would have to smoke.

I would see you perform with the E Street Band and get the chance to say hi afterwards. And you were always so gracious Max would be soaking his hands in ice. Yeah, because people don't realize how difficult it is to continue drumming at that caliber as you get older physically. Fifty years in. Yeah, I may have to just switch that. I would in Max most likely burns a few more calories than I do. He has to move his hands, his arms, his legs, his feet all at once without ever stopping.

For three to four hours. I can step back and a short breather as the guys take a solo or something, not Max Flamberg. And then on the other side, I've noticed Steve Van Zandt. Sometimes he I see him. He's making chords, but I think he can sometimes burn about two calories. Occasionally he has to leave his head into a microphone. But other than that, he'll take fifteen minute breaks to adjust headscarves, you know, showing on a caftan or something.

I have to say, let me I have so much to be grateful for. I pride myself on never getting jaded. One is I'm talking to you, which I've had the opportunity to do several times in my career and it is the highest honor. And the other thing I'm very grateful for is I really do love this record letter to you. And I would say the word I would use when I heard it is urgency, because I know you guys recorded it in five days.

Your people were kind enough to let me get a sneak peek at the documentary film that goes with it. This is really a throwback to guys saying we're going to get this done in a shorter period of time as possible because because we're old and we may die soon. So we have got to hustle this day into production right now. OK, did you ever think of calling the album? We we don't have much time. Listen to this shit. We don't have much time left.

Right. Yeah, it is. And I'll give you one of my there's so many tracks I love on this record, but my ultimate test and I didn't even realize it is I've listened to this many times. And today on my way to this interview, I'm on the 405 freeway and I'm listening to Burning Train. Oh. I looked down and I realize I'm going about one hundred and ten, and that is my test. I didn't mean to go that fast, but burning train and there's so many tracks like that and there's so many different flavors and contours on this album.

But Burning Train is you and the E Street Band. Kick out the jams. Yeah, full throttle. Joyous madness is fantastic. All I can say is mission accomplished. Yes. You're not looking at chart position. You're looking at a speeding ticket. That's just about right. And I swear to God that when that song kicks in in the way it builds and it's so anthemic and obviously you've done so much work like that, but you, man, that's your wheelhouse.

I think you have about 15 wheel houses, but that is one of them, which is pure octane. That's all it is. Know, I was thinking about and this is a thought I've had about you over the years, you are a particular case. And I mean, this is the best way. But I wonder what fuels this man. And I don't understand. There is a nuclear rod located in the center of your chest that is singular to you.

I have a theory. I don't know if it's too early in the day for therapy, but I have a theory here. You want to hear it. Illegal drugs know that actually. Legal drugs. Legal drugs. You're talking about Advil? No, here's my theory. My theory is that to be a truly great artist, you need some components, anxiety, especially in your youth. Absolutely. An obsessive nature. Obsessive compulsive, obsessive compulsive nature.

Yes. Plus, a complicated relationship with a parent. Unbelievable. Low self-esteem also helps. Well, OK, so I've got one and you've got four. I've got a low self-esteem. But you. Is there something to an I, I, I think great celebrity autobiographies are extremely rare. And yours, I thought was a beautiful piece of writing. And also I learned so much about your relationship with your father and contrasting that with your mother and your grandmother and thinking and people probably don't want to hear this, but maybe that has to be part of the equation.

Well, I believe that the most successful, obsessive artists, I think the guys that we think of who have something very special eating at them, and that's what makes them interesting to us. There is an undescribable problem at their center that they're constantly sorting, trying to sort out. It's not completely sort out of Bill, but you can find elements of clues that bring you closer to the source as life. And this is how people are using their craft.

This is why you can't take your eyes off them or your ears. And those people have had someone in their life who has told them they are the second coming of Christ and at the same time someone in their life who's told them they are absolutely worthless and they believe them both. And so consequently, you're in the process of trying to retrieve the unconditional love that you experienced by the parent who told you you were holier than thou and trying to prove to your other parent how deeply wrong they were.

So this, I believe, is this is the psychological makeup of most of the most interesting artists, I would say, like a Sinatra era, Brando, Dylan, Hank Williams, all of those people, I believe, have some piece of this in their creative equation. So I think it's essential myself. I think that kind of historical conflict in your family is very, very critical. Then add into it eight years of Catholic education. The furnace is starting to burn.

There are many people that would think, oh, to watch Bruce and the E Street Band record or to watch Bruce work would be just to watch these guys having a ball. That is not true. You said it is both the most important thing in your life and it's only rock and roll and you've got to inhabit both. What is essential as you become an adult is you have to refine the ability to hold two contradictory ideas in your mind at the same time without it driving you crazy.

That is the mark of adulthood. So. There's a lot of things in life, you know, it's like when I when we go out on stage at night, we're out for murder, you know, we are out there to burn it down until you go home smiling and hurting, you know. But at the end of the day, it's rock and roll music. We're not curing cancer, you know? So that's the best we can do, you know?

And so we and so we do it, you know. But keeping those two ideas in your head simultaneously allows you to reach this far into the heavens as your spirit, soul hopes and fears will allow, while at the same time saying, say, and some relatively balanced here on Earth, it's next to impossible combination. I've heard Lincoln Abraham Lincoln was described that way, as they said Marcus, his intelligence was that he could hold two completely contrasting ideas in his head at the same time.

Yeah, I think that added to his his greatness. And I think that is yeah, that's adulthood. I love my kids and occasionally they make me want to jump out a window. I have to contain both of those ideas. If you can acknowledge them, it will bring you some peace. It will quiet your mind, which is something that most artists don't possess. You know, it's not the nature of artists to possess a quiet mind, but but getting some small things like that straight, I, I found it did it did bring some peace into my daily life.

Do you think you've mellowed at all or do you think because you were I guess you might say, yeah, I've mellowed with age and not just age, but the accomplishments that boggle the mind. But maybe at the same time, I don't believe that you've mellowed nearly as much as other people would have mellowed that would have experienced your kind of success. Well, it sort of all depends how you're using the term. I think if you asked my wife, she would say that I have mellowed in some ways that were I think the destructive parts of my character hold less sway over me than they did twenty five years ago.

So that's a good thing. My raw intensity at approaching my work and my job, I haven't mellowed at all. And that's that's the way I like to keep that. Yes. And that's and that's an area where a not mellowing is a good thing. There's other areas, you know, it doesn't work the same way across the boards. There's other areas where you want to life. You better mellow out, my friend, you know, and so make it you know, you're not going to have it if you don't.

But so the problem is when you see people make errors or ruin their lives is they take one thing like, you know, I've got to burn. And then they paint their entire life experience with it. And, yeah, you will burn. You will burn, my friend. You will burn yourself to the ground, you know, and you may have made some great music while you're doing it, but what's that mean to you once your six foot down, you know, like I mean, a whole lot.

So you've got to be able to realise I am going to burn here, my brightest here. I'm going to do a different type of living in order to live my fullest and to be a solid citizen and partner and parent. Important to get those things straight. There's the romance some of us had in our twenties for the rock icons who died at twenty seven. And as I've grown older, I've thought, well, that was just stupid. It would be just beautiful if Jimi Hendrix had lived a full life.

Oh, he had just a name. I mean, you keep going on and on and Janis Joplin and. Sure. You know, what would these people have done? There's no romance at all to me about it anymore. It's just a waste. It's a huge waste. The nature of rock and roll is always contained a death cult. And that may be because of its its genesis in youth culture. When you're young, death and life can feel smushed up against each other.

You're young and you're taking some more physical risks. I mean, I remember taking some physical risks I took when I was young that I would not do now, you know, and I mean, there's a whole host of teenage songs about the car crash dying on the railroad tracks. You had my ring on her finger in her hand. I ran back, you know, I mean, there's just a host of that sort of became a part of rock culture and was.

Romanticized and of course, the listener can afford to be romantic about it, while the actual, you know, hey, if it's your life, it's not much fun for you be making a mistake and choking on your own vomit. No, there's not that much romantic about that. You just talk me out of it, Bruce. I wanted to get some street cred. I've been thinking about it, you know, when you're talking about mellowing, too.

I was talking to a doctor once and he said one of the things that helps men mellow over time is their testosterone levels drop. And I said, well, then I. I think I'm good. I think I'm safe. I think I've been safe since about nineteen eighty one. But that's something to I think there's something to guys that we just, there's a juice running through our bodies that is amazing in some ways and, but gives us stupid ideas like I'll ride that motorcycle without a helmet because who cares.

Nothing can happen to me. Well you know, you still carry a little bit of that with you. Your daddy said to me, do you want to go skiing? Why, why? Why would we ski? We're 70 old down on my ass, break my leg and. Yeah, yeah. Why would I go up the mountain just to come down again. Yeah. Just didn't make sense to me suddenly. You know, I want to ask you about the Castillos because they're an important part of this album.

You looking back, especially on The Last Man Standing when you were growing up in New Jersey, you belonged in Freehold to this group, the biggest deals yet. And this was your band. And when you look at it to be that young, this band lasted through the prime years of the 60s. Yeah, that was a long time for a bunch of teenagers to stay together. It's very rare and it was quite a long time. And I learned an enormous amount of my craft while in that band and deep feelings for it and for that time of my life, you know, but it was rare to stay together that long.

Were you guys was it a cover band primarily? I mean, used to be. Right, no band. And we had a few originals. You remember. What was your go to song like? This is the song we do. That's maybe our best go to cover song. Do you have a memory of what that might have been to blow the roof off the house? We did a hellacious version of them's Van Morrison, Mystic Eyes. Oh my God, that's fantastic.

This is not a very well-known song, but I used to front and play the harmonica and move about like a mad man on Mystic Eyes. You credit your time in the steals, puts you out in front of live audiences in union halls, in VFW, you name it, potluck dinner halls. It puts you out there and do everything. You guys played everything and you learned to play live, which is something maybe that isn't happening as much today for young artists.

Well, you know, there are still people who play great live shows, is great live performers out there that at all at every level in the clubs and theaters and in stadiums and arenas, you know, but it is it a vanishing skill? I don't think it will ever vanish. But it's certainly been you know, it has a lot of competition from the Internet and social media and a variety of other things. But at the end of the day, that act of getting people in a room and a band on stage, which is an act that will never be simulated, is a powerful, powerful experience.

And to feel we don't have him yet, we got to get them or they're starting to come around. Let's really lay it on. Now, that's the kind of muscle that you learned when you were in high school with the steals that I think you've just kept honing and honing and honing it to the point where you were doing for I would think you were. You set the record, I think, four hours and six minutes for a concert. When you think about the Beatles in their live performing days when they were huge mean, I think they would do twenty or twenty five minute shows.

Yeah. You know, that wasn't so bad. I was going to say screw the whole thing up. I playing too fucking long. I know now I have to do it. Well what happens now is that if you do three hours and 15 minutes and then leave, people want their money back. I got Fox, Bruce just walked off after three hours and 15 minutes. We got a babysitter for nine hours. My money back exactly hard. It's hard to put the toothpaste back in the tube.

You know, you can I saw I saw you perform with the E Street Band. I don't remember exactly what year it was. It might have been around two thousand five. I saw you guys before was a great show. And this is something that I've said to many, many people who have asked me what they think it takes. And I've cited you many times. I said I saw Bruce Springsteen and he's got nothing left to prove, but he's got this amazing show.

And at one point during the show, you did a song where you used I'd never seen you do this before. He used a falsetto. It was quite powerful and very good. And so afterwards, because of my Max connection, Max brought me back and his hands. He went to show his hands back on and off and but chatted with me in your dressing room for a second. And I said, I really love that falsetto. And I just seen you completely blow the roof off the place for several hours.

And you said, yeah, I'm really I'm working on that. I've been working on that for a bunch of years. And I thought I would start trying it on this tour and I keep trying to work on it. I don't think I've quite got it right. And I walked out of that room and I thought, he's still trying to get to some place. If you're not trying to get someplace, then you're really just a careerist, you know, and that's fine.

But it just doesn't interest me that much. You know, I want to be a frontiersman, you know, I want to be out on the edges of my own psychological, emotional, spiritual frontier. I want to be working there and I want to work there till the day I die. To me, that's the fulfilling life of pushing forward, always searching, always looking for that next thing that's going to add that small piece to the puzzle that's going to then allow you to go further than that, because as we move forward, our life blossoms and the benefits of that research fall into the laps of our loved ones that are the people we work with and and and into our own lives, into our own lives.

It's it's a rewarding process, you know, and one that I would wish on everyone. And I know people who don't do this at all. And I could name our most prominent exponent at the moment. But why belabor the topic so that one of your Joe Biden attacks? We know, Bruce. We know that you're not I'm not a fan of democracy. Exactly. You got that word out a long time ago. I remember I played behind Roy Orbison in nineteen eighty eight.

Roy was singing like his life depended on it. Yeah. You know, he was singing like he'd never heard those songs ever before and that he was having all of these realizations for the very first time. Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Even with material that he probably saw many, many times before he was approaching it, as if he was out on the frontier of it, as tonight, if I sing these songs beautifully and well, I learned something or gained something that I have not learned or gained from the previous nights when I've done this, that seemed to be a it was a way to avoid just nostalgia, which Roy did by being so purely present.

It was just it was just a good lesson. And I took it to heart and I said, yeah, that's that's all I want to approach my work, you know? And it doesn't seem highfalutin to me. It seems, if anything, it seems grounded to me. You know, it seems like a very grounded approach to take to life on Earth, you know, and we may and we may make the most out of it. I, I know you've talked about it.

And it's one of the things I wonder about in my life, because I'm a huge rock nerd is Chuck Berry and his, you know, one of the greatest poets of the 20th century and maybe one of the most influential musicians who kind of seem to have almost contempt towards his own music, which I didn't understand. I know you played behind him when he used you as you pick a band, but the guy would barely tune up. A lot of people have that, that whatever you want to call it, that characteristic you can find you can find the there's a certain nihilism that does drive us, you know.

I mean, it's in every scene, everyone. And it's in the car with you. It's not good when you put that part of you behind the wheel. You know, it's always going to be in the car. Don't let it drive too much. You know, there may be a creative moment in a safe certain circumstance or something where you can let it loose and interesting questions arise. But I don't want that guy driving my car all the time.

Right. But some people, you know, Chuck was funny. You know, hundreds of years from now, hundreds of years from now, when people want the purest distillation of rock music, they will play Chuck Berry music. You know, it's it's simply a fact. He may be the purest distillation of of of this all. You know, he's it's magnificently blessed, transcendent music of great American genius. And the fact that he personally did not value with that highly, that's his tragedy.

Yeah. I know that you obviously in your early career, very influenced by Dylan, very influenced by by Chuck Berry, one of my favorite songs of yours, you ever of all of them. And I love so many of them. But open all night on Nebraska is one of my absolute I put that song on all the time trying to play along with it. I think it's got some of the best writing and imagery, just, you know, having fried chicken popping our fingers on the Texaco road map.

I think that some of the best writing in rock and roll, I think it's up there with Chuck Berry. And I just it's absolutely gorgeous, evocative imagery. And, well, the song is totally Chuck Berry inspired, you know, and because he was the master of everyday imagery, you know. Nadine, honey, is that you? You know, every time I catch up with you here, Anderson, I turn a corner double back. I saw getting in a coffee colored Cadillac.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Man, I love that song so much. I peed in my Cadillac coffee. I have a nineteen sixty seven white leather interior, coffee colored cabinet. Did you go at the body shop. Guys like Chuck said the song assholes said strictly because of Chuck Berry. So he's a patron saint regardless of how he felt about himself. Yeah, I came up in a moment when rock music was considered worthless. It was considered at best a novelty, at worst, dangerous and dangerous trash to expose your children to an.

No one believed it had any transcendent value whatsoever or that the idea that it might address the spirit in some way was laughable. Now, I grew up at a time when the business went from the single to the album where art was suddenly considered. Rock was suddenly considered to be this great art. Right. And that that did have all the did have the ability to to contain all those qualities. And so that may have affected the perceptions we have.

You know, the moment that you I mean, people ridiculed Elvis. It's amazing that these guys carried on and were simply so good at what they did because the encouragement was either it was purely financial, you know, it's selling, OK, I'm going to keep going, or people performed like like we performed just because they had to, you know, because it was the talent they had. They were good at it and it brought them rewards in the world.

And but but those were very different generations. And I think people then approached and made people approach their music with very different attitudes. Perhaps, you know, though, you know, there's plenty of people who I think Elvis, Elvis, Elvis had regard for his music and in in his own way. And obviously, certainly, Roy. And there's many, many, many others, you know, and Buddy Holly, I think had regard for you.

Of course. Of course. But I think I think we talk about Chuck because Chuck being the greatest genius of rock and roll songwriting and Simmons and seeming to be the most conflicted about its own worth is is is is it as I say, it's it's a bit of I would have I would I would have wished him the piece that would have come with was realizing just how beautifully he did his job, you know, how beautifully he did his job.

And, you know, but but we live different lives, you know, like I say, our minds are not quiet and we do not know. We're all at the end of the day, conflicted souls doing our best to get through the world. I think a lot of people forget that in the nineteen fifties, rock was seen as something to do quickly and then get out of it with some money to move onto the next thing for Elvis, that was movies, but everyone saw it as a fad.

Get your money and get out as fast as you can. You, of course, coming along in the late 60s, rock and pop stars to become legitimized in the 70s. Is this renaissance a beautiful, serious writing about rock music? Yeah. And in the late 60s, you had the you of the birth of the rock critic was on and my manager was one of the pioneers of rock criticism. And they brought a whole different viewpoint towards what music with popular music was capable of doing and what it was capable of addressing.

I was looking at we were born right in the golden age, you know, right sort of at a time when, you know, the 70s you had the birth of the album and then into the 80s where the business itself exploded and suddenly you could play to twenty thousand people. And the technology was there to allow you to do that. You know, the sound systems, sound systems and gained, which really wasn't there in the 70s or the 60s.

But in the 80s, the technology allowed performers to reach a bigger audience live. And there was a golden age of really live playing that was still there. But we've passed out of quite a bit. So it's just interesting time you now, of course, you know, the whole thing can lead to overdoing overblown interpretations of what's essentially entertainment. You know, I always look at it like, yeah, I put my music out and I want people to vacuum the floor to what I want to do their laundry to it.

I want them to go out, see their kids around the park to it and and dance to it. And then. And then and then I try to put something else in there so that there's a little more if you want to dig deeper, you know, that's that's that's sort of my approach. But I was I think I was affected so, so fully by popular music that I just said, I want to do that and I want to do all of that.

What Betty King, she's in this magic moment to me transcends just the popular popular single that was ninety eight cents, JJ Newberry, she brought home and slow dance to it was something more in it. I've always been interested in something more. What would you I think limits. We think that they're our enemy, but they're our friend. And there's the limits of I think. What you call it, the pop song or the rock song, Life in one hundred and eighty seconds or less is something that I've heard you say that this is and the limits of getting your band together and saying we're going to make this record in five days.

We're going to limit ourselves. We are going to put restrictions on ourselves, which will make us even at this stage of our career, push harder. Does that resonate with you? Give me that again. OK, I think you were on the list yesterday, which means you're buying stuff right now, are you? But you're buying stuff online, aren't you? Bruce Springsteen is online shopping. Well, I'm trying to fucking talk about the essence of rock and roll and one hundred and you say you lost me in there somewhere else.

That's my fault that I'm bad at what I do. Let me quickly ask you about guitars, guitars, because one of the things I love that I saw you use in this documentary is you go back and you play your old series. I think it's like Sears Kent, which is a yeah. It's a goofy guitar that has a speaker built into it. And I know they also said that's a Silvertone, that's a Silvertone. OK, you can't have the speaker built into the case, I think.

Right. The the Silvertone had both the guitar with the speaker built into the guitar and a intellectual's. Silvertone also had a guitar with the speaker built into the case. That was a very, very popular item. And I still see guys play them to this day. You know, they're not great, but they're different. And they were relatively sturdy pieces. And and they got you in the game for a relatively small amount of money where you lost me.

I wasn't paying attention. I'm sorry. You can do it to me. I can do it to you. I'm I'm watching a nineteen eighty eight basketball, you know, can I ask you a fan you talk about you wrote this album on a guitar that a fan gave you and let me say why that intrigues me. I would love to give you a guitar just as a token, but that's like bringing coals to Newcastle. I cannot think of a guitar I could give you that would mean anything to you because you have apparently every guitar in the world and the means to get any guitar you want.

What did this fan give you that just grabs your imagination? First of all, every guitar is individual. There are no two guitars that I've ever played that are the same. And so I occasionally am gifted a guitar and I'm always usually fascinated by it and fascinated by what it might do that another one might not do. This guitar was handed to me as I came out of my play on Broadway. The kid was just on the street holding a guitar.

I thought he wanted me to sign it or something. And then he said, No, no, Bruce, Bruce. He was Italian. And this is what I want to give I want to give this to you. So I went over, you know. You sure? Yeah. Yeah, we had it made just for you. OK, so I took the guitar, which wasn't the case, and I just took my hand and I jumped in the car with it.

And I didn't look at it really very much until I got at home. But when I got it home, I realized this was a beautifully made guitar. It was all different types of wood. The wood was gorgeous. It played as good as any guitar that I allowed and sounded as good as any guitar that I own. This just one of the nicest guitars that I have. And I left it in my living room just because I picked it up and play it.

And when it came time I could feel the song starting to just a little bit. I picked it up and over the next six or seven days, most of the songs that are to you came out of it, you know, so it was a really sort of lucky little. Do you do you know who this kid was? I believe his name is Corrado Gambi. Wow. We got to make this guy famous. This guy made the guitar that stole Bruce Springsteen Art Corruptor.

Gambi, I think that's his name. That that's that's what somebody tracked down. So Cerrado, I also play, Cerrado I play. And I could use I could always use another guitar, so I'm sure I'll see him again. Well, I have my last question for you, and this is a quick one and it's stumps me, but you talk about great bands. And people start naming them and many of the great rock bands are British, when you say, OK, but you're limited to America, I think E Street Band, and then I start to have a hard time and I don't know, E Street Band aside, you have a band, an American band in mind that just inspires you that you think is and I'm talking about a real band, not an assembly of session guys, just an American band.

I'm saying there's like in Britain, you've got there's the Beatles. There's the Stones. I mean, it just goes on and on the WHO. There's Led Zeppelin. It doesn't stop in America. It's very hard. The E Street Band feels like an anomaly. Well, I don't think so. I think there's a lot of I mean, if you go back into history, of course, you're going to you're going to have the Beach Boys and The Byrds.

I mean, you know, that's because we go back into history. There's a question. But if you're asking, like today, Arcade Fire is the great bad joke. The killers have one of the best live shows I've I've seen. If you want to go have fun, The Lives of the Killers, that a great, great live show. What's happening out there? It's out there. Yeah. Yeah. There's all kinds of excellent musicians. Foo Fighters play great live.

Pearl Jam. There's lots of good American young American bands out there today. I will put E Street Band at the top, but I think you are right and go there. And I am going to I'm going to wrap this up. I want to say one of the great, great honors to talk to you and I will leave you with this. I have I've got one show business photo in my that hangs in my house, up in my room, in my study.

And it's you and me playing together. You let me play with you on my show, I think in maybe two thousand eight, right? Yes. I have to say, you know, the happiest moment of my life as we were done and I turned and Neil's looked at me and he said, you were in the pocket the whole time. And I stopped and I'm pretty good. I was pretty good. And I it's the happiest I've been in show business.

And you've made me delightfully happy. And I think you've made people around the world, probably three quarters of the world's population, ecstatically happy at one time or another. And I don't I can't think of anyone else who can say that. I think it's and I it's a joy to get to talk to you. It really is. And give my best to the guys and to Patti and to everybody. And thank you for making letter to you, because you didn't have to you've got nothing to prove.

And it's absolutely beautiful. It really is. Thank you so and I appreciate I appreciate your support all these years. You've been a great guy. And, you know, I know we joke about it, but Max had a great run on your show to all of this. Meant a lot to me. And, you know, we got a lot of love for you. So God bless. Thank you. I think we I think I made the difference for you and your career and OK for us.

Take care. Thank you so much. Right. Bye bye. Bye.

We haven't done any voicemail's in a while. Do you want to check in with the people, the listeners? I'll be honest, just some fear involved when I listen.

Every time there always is single time. You know what I am at any time I'm in a bubble. I live like many celebrities in a bubble that nothing can penetrate, where all I hear is you're the best man, you're the best, OK? Which, by the way, couldn't be further further from the truth. I've created a bubble where I'm filled with people who say, you suck, I hate you. I don't know why I made that.

I don't know either. You had a choice and you chose that.

I know. I chose I chose very I chose the wrong way to go. But anyway, it's what I chose and it sort of suits me. Yes, I'm in a bubble where I get nothing but negative criticism. So maybe maybe we'll hear something nice. I don't know.

I think we will. I collected these a while ago, so it's going to be just as much a surprise to me. This will be exciting.

Do you edit out the ones that are like, I'll cue you, man, I hate you, I'll kill you. You hated those out? I do. Well, so you just admit it exists, man. Oh, great job, man. This is the bubble you created. Kohnen Oh my God. I hope you're forwarding them on to the correct authorities.

There we go. OK, I'm going to play one for you. I'm just going to choose these randomly. This will be exciting. Hi, Tony.

And my name is Cutrone and I'm a college student. So as a gay woman, I'd like you to know that the lesbian community stands with you vitalizing community. I'm offering myself to be honest. I'm not sure if all of the like you that much, but I do. So I think that matters. So anyways, I'd like you to hear my personal opinion. I would love it if you could say gay rights on the podcast also. And so I love you too.

So much. Thank you for sacrificing your emotional well-being to be on the podcast.

Oh, my God, Kate, that is fantastic. And yes, gay pride. Yep. Totally down with gay pride. And I clearly, Kate, if you are my only lesbian fan, I am honored. I am truly honored.

I have friends who are lesbians who love you. Oh, OK. So you have more than one. And I think it's because and this is what I got from Kate. Does she she thinks I am a lesbian. No, you're a lesbian icon. Yeah. Yeah. That's I think part of my secret is that I think there are probably many lesbians out there who think that I am a lesbian. Well, can you be a lesbian icon without being Golez?

No, she made it. I think Kate made it very clear that I am thought of as a great lesbian. OK, which I'll take. Yeah, I think I have somewhat gender confusing appearance sometimes.

Oh, yes. What are you talking about. Yes, you do. Well, let's talk about that.

You can sometimes be a little bit more. I can't uh there's there's like there's features in certain angles that are more feminine female. I am very pretty but very attractive face. Very pretty. You face you think you're you think you're pretty. I'm dancing around this so hard. Yeah.

I think of you as gender scrambling. That's bad. That actually makes better sense. I'm gender scrambling.

OK, you know how you like jam a radio transmissions.

Well, the important thing is Kate, I think has brought up a very good point, which is I like to be all things to all people. Yes. So I really do. Uh, and if if and if Kate believes that I am an important part of the lesbian community, I'm down with that. Yep. Yeah. You're the Wonder Bread of sexuality.

You mean I have no nutrients? I definitely have no nutritional value. But you taste good. No, it tastes good for a second and then you feel horrible a little later on when your body realizes it. Just eight, nine pounds of chemicals that have been whipped up into a white bread. By the way, apropos of nothing, one of my clearest memories as a child is we went on a field trip when I was at the Baldwin School. One of the it's an elementary public elementary school in Brookline, Massachusetts.

And they said we're going on a field trip today and they put us on a bus. And we were so excited and they took us to the Wonder Bread factory and we watched giant machines shit out bread, fake bread. You know, you'd think you'd go to a museum. Yeah. Or I mean, we're near right near Boston, but we could have gone into Boston and seen the site of the Boston massacre. We could have seen, you know, we could have seen the US Constitution.

We could have seen Faneuil Hall. We could have seen the old North Church know they took us out to some industrial part of Massachusetts and they showed us the Wonder Bread Factory and then they said, we have a surprise for you. At the end, we each got a paper hat that said Wonder Bread. I know. And I swear to God, mine. They dissolved instantly when we went outside, made out of wonder. It was made out of Wonder Bread.

I think that was it was made out of. And to this day, I'm like, well, how is that educational? I think it was teaching us about disappointment. Oh, come on. It's an American institution. Wonder Bread. It is. I like, you know, if I didn't care about my health, I would eat it all the time. I don't think we just lost them as a sponsor. All right. So I got on a little digression there about Wonder Bread, but I do want to say, Kate.

Yes. Gay pride. Yes. Thank you for listening. And you're wrong. I think I am not toxic for my coworkers here.

But yeah, what she said that you're sacrificing your emotional well-being by being with me. Yeah, that's right. Not true. That's true.

So, yes, Kate, to wrap up, I'm very proud to have you as a fan. You seem like a very cool, funny person. And, you know, talk me up on campus, tell your friends, hey, Conan, he's the bee's knees cut.

Conan O'Brien needs a friend with Sunim Obsession. And Conan O'Brien has himself produced by me, Matt Cawley, executive produced by Adam Sex, Joanna Solotaroff and Jeff Ross at Team Coco and Collin Anderson and Chris Bannon at Airwolf. Theme song by the White Stripes. Incidental Music by Jimmy Luisito. Our supervising producer is Aaron Belayer and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples. The show is engineered by Will Beckton. You can rate and review the show on Apple podcast and you might find your review featured on a future episode.

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