Hi, my name is Carole Burnet, and I feel so much love for Conan O'Brien. Fall is here, hear the yell, back to school, ring the bell, brand new shoes, walking loose, climb the fence, books and pens. I can tell that we are going to be friends.

A Hey, Konan here. I just gave a short exhale before we started, and it made Matt laugh. Welcome to Konan O'Brien Needs a Friend. This is, what was they would say? Probably in the 1890s, a corcher. We've got a Corker today. I'm joined by my pal, Sona.

Hi.

There's an insect. What's that? Flying on this tree. Okay, let me explain where we are. Settle down. We're not in the woods in Brazil. We are in a very nice hotel suite, which we booked because our very special guest is Carol Burnet. She's here. She's doing a junket. Definitely, we don't move for anybody. They come to us. But when it's Carol Burnet, we packed up our shit when we got here as fast as we could. We got a room full of insects. Then we're in this room, and Sona, you have not been able to focus yet.

It's so close.

I don't fear an insect. It's just so close to your Yeah, what's probably attracted to the hairspray. Okay. A lot of it. Do you see it? Yeah. Yeah, there's bugs. There are these two. I don't want to now say the name of the hotel. It's a very fancy hotel. I don't want to denigrate them in any way. But there are bugs swarming around these Beautiful. Sorry. Beautiful plants, tall plants. I'm worried because Carol Burnet is going to be here, and we'll probably have to spray the place before she gets in. We're pretending we didn't do the interview already? I don't know. Oh, okay. I just go with what you set up. I like to lay out realities, and Matt knows to go along. We did it already. Maybe she brought those bugs in. I saw her release a vial of bugs at one point. Do you think? Yeah. It was incredible. I'm sorry. I tried to say, Oh, we have, Carol. I tried to build an old show business, some suspense, like, Carol Burnet's coming. This is going to be exciting. Then immediately, Sonia, you went, What do you mean? We already talked to her, and there's bugs here.

Well, you just completely deflated our Bounty Castle. I know. I'm sorry. I am sorry. No, you're not. You love I'm sorry.

I really didn't.

I don't know if I should feel bad because you're lying, and I needed to- It's just lying with the soft. Don't do it here. Well, I can't wait till she gets here because it'll be nice for you to meet her. Okay. Because you didn't already. I will say this, which is unusual. Gourley, you are always a smartly dressed fellow. Sona, and do not take this personally, but you have very casual attire. You own one jacket. I believe it belonged to Dr. Zaya, I guess, on Planet of the Apes. It's a well-worn leather coat that you've had, I guess you found it in a bin somewhere a long time ago. But anyway, you're not someone who dresses up a lot. You look fantastic today. You went all out for Carol Burnet. I really respect her, her, and I want to look good for her. Usually, most of the time when we're recording, there's no reason I should look good because I don't care about what other people like you think about me. Wait a minute. No, but I'm saying- I'm sorry. I really did. I mean, there are similarities I have with Carol Burnet. We are both inspirations to women.

No. Red hair and it stops there, I think. No, it doesn't stop with red hair. Many women got into comedy because they thought I was a woman. No, no, no. They were inspired that I got the late night show in '93. Then later on, they figured out I wasn't, but by then it was too late. So yes. But I did dress up for her. Also, I dressed up for the hotel because it's It's a very nice hotel, except for the bugs. Yeah, I know. I'm sorry.

That distracted me.

Then I drove up here and my car is really dirty and there's a leak in it. The inside of my car is… It smells a little moldy. Can I say something? Let me ask you a question. You said there's a leak in your car. Not that your car is leaking, which would mean oil, any freeze, break fluid. What is leaking in your car? I think we have a sunroof and I think water is coming into the car from the sunroof and it rained a lot. Do you close the sunroof? We do. It's closed. You have a mildooy car that's full of trash? Yes. You brought the insects in. I think I did. I think they followed me. That's incredible. Of course, because they could nest in your hair. Your hair is... I'm out. First the hard cheese, then the hair.

Why am I in the clothes? Why am I here?

Listen, I made a joke about hairspray. I'm not wearing hairspray, but you do use various waxes, oils, bombs. Yes? You are using hairspray. No, that's not hairspray. What is it? I don't want to say.

Okay. Why?

It's old mayonnaise. It's a great trick that You brought the insects. I learned it from Daneke. You get mayonnaise, you let it cure in the sun for a couple of weeks. And once the smell has gone and it's hardened, you put it in your hair and it gives it great volume. Okay. And then I did that, and then mistakenly, I let my son eat it. But six weeks later, he was out of the hospital. Oh my God. These stories- This is so stupid. I'm so stupid. I can't wait to meet Carol Burnet. Yes, a true comedy legend who knows what she's doing and doesn't just babble about- Thank God we did this after because if we did this truly before, I don't think we would have felt worthy. I still don't. No, I know. But I'm going to stick with my reality. The reality is we already did the interview with Carol Burnet, and it's fantastic. But I'm sticking with my old show business reality, which is that she hasn't entered the room yet. There are no bugs. Your hair looks fantastic. My hair is amazing. This is the reality I'm sticking with. You're a good assistant.

I We're thrilled and we're excited, and we hear her footsteps coming down the hall right now. She's coming right now. We better get this. I hear her. Listen.

No, what is she on a horse?

You know this is on video, too.

What is she coming here with?

She's walking, but someone put horses shoes on her, which is just... I don't know why they did that. Oh, she's probably doing a bit, or maybe it's the new fashion. Here she comes. No, that's bad. The door is opening. That's the horse whinning? Whatever you like. You like it being horse whinning or door opening? Oh, that's what it was? I thought it was door opening. Okay, I wasn't sure. No, horse whinning is... I'm a horse. That's a horse. Okay. Did the horse open the door? No. This is the horse. I'm a horse. She's standing right there. Hold on, Carol. I'm going to finish with this bit in a minute. Carol, just calm down a minute. No, no, Carol, stand still. Okay. Wow. Oh, Jesus. Yes, I don't know. Her voice changed rapidly. Just stand still. And then the door opened. I'm a door. The door said, I'm a door? And all my sound effects, the sound effect ends up saying what it is. There's no confusion. Anyway, enough screwing around because you've just heard some solid C plus comedy. Let's get to the ultimate master. My guest today is a comedy legend who hosted the Carol Burnet show for 11 Seasons.

Now you can see her in the Apple TV+ series, Palm Royale. It says, I'm honored. Carol Burnet, welcome.

I really do adore you. I think you're so terrific.

Well, I can't handle that. I don't know if you could see it, but my soul just left my body because I have to tell you something, and we have met before. Oh, I'll never forget the first time you came on the show, my parents called me and said, How did you get Carol Burnet? Because you are in the stratosphere. I'm sure you hear this all the time. But when I was a boy growing up in Brooklyn, Massachusetts, on Saturday nights, we would all huddle in our living room, and there was one heat vent that had the heat coming out of it, and we would fight to see who got to sit on the heat vent. We would watch that amazing night of television. That That's Saturday Night lineup. That Saturday Night lineup, which was absolutely- All in the family.

Yeah. Mash, Mary Tyler Moore, Bob Newhart, and us.

You'd watch it, and it was just this fireworks display. Then my feeling about it was always that the biggest... They always save that huge firework for the end. You would come on, and we would all sit there and watch it. I've interviewed you several times. I have bumped into you in different places. I've stalked you. I've been escorted out of your home, dressed as the gardener. But I'm driving here today, and my assistant had to drive me today. I said, You need to drive me because I just need to think about the fact that I'm going to be seeing Carol Burnet again. One of the first things I wanted to talk about that we explore a lot on this podcast, we talk a lot about comedy, and we talk a lot about where does it come from? There's this common belief that it has to come from you need some tragedy. You, of course, had some sadness as a child. You went through a lot.

Well, you know what? Sadness, whatever. I actually had a happy childhood for the most part. My parents, there was a problem, but I knew I was loved. They were alcoholics. I was raised by my grandmother. We were poor, but everybody in the neighborhood was. I Our rent was, get this, a dollar a day. Thirty dollars a month was our rent, and sometimes we barely made that. But we did save our pennies. My grandmother and I, we lived a block north of Hollywood Boulevard, That's right. We moved out from Texas.

You were in Texas, and then you moved with your grandmother and your living.

We were living in this apartment building. My mother lived down the hall, and my grandmother and I were in one room, and with a pull-down Murphy bed, and I slept on the couch. But we would go to, as I said, we'd save our pennies, and we'd see maybe four movies a week, which would be double features. So that would be eight movies a week, second run. The Movies were my salvation.

Really?

My fantasy was I would go not see Mickey Rudy and Judy Garland, these wonderful MGM musicals where they would say, We're going to put on a show. Hey, let's put on a show. We're going to put on a show in the barn, and then it's going to go to Broadway. So everything was always upbeat. The bad guys got their just desserts. Nothing, when I was growing up in the '40s, was cynical. I just had this naive, optimistic quality. I think it came from the movies that everything was going to work out okay.

It's what they imprinted on you, too, I think, because clearly you were such a shapeshifter in your comedy and all those amazing sketches in your different performances and movies. I believe if at an early age, you see a wide variety of ways that you can be funny, and you're young, it imprints on you.

Well, I didn't know I could be funny. I was a nerd in school.

I wouldn't know anything about that. You're going to have to help me because that was an incredible jock and a real leading man material.

That's why we connect.

That's why it's exactly I have a little nerd clubhouse you can join going.

I thought I would be a journalist because I was an editor of school papers and stuff like that. It never occurred to me to be a performer at all. I wanted to go to UCLA to major in journalism, but we couldn't afford it. It was funny. I saw myself on campus. I knew it was going to happen. I just didn't know how. We lived in this one room and it faced the lobby, and there was a pigeon hole mailboxes for each apartment or for each room. Ours was there, and I'd look out every morning to see if we had a letter in our little slot. This one morning, there was a letter, and I... Oh, but first, guess what the tuition was that we couldn't afford to go to UCLA.

This is going to break my heart because I'm going to have two kids in college. This is going to break my heart. Tell me what the tuition was.

Guess. 1951.

Was it $1,000? $2,000? What was it?

$43 Oh, my God.

Okay, I need an ATM machine and a time machine.

$43. But we couldn't afford it because our rent was... You know what I'm saying? Sure. Anyway, now I get this letter and I bring it back in my room, and it's typewritten to Carol Burnet, 6434 Yucca Street, Hollywood.

Oh my God, look at you.

Okay. With a little three-cent stamp on it. I opened it up, and there was a $50 bill. To this day, I do not know where that came from, but that was my entrance to UCLA.

That's like an angel story.

Exactly. I got to go to UCLA, but they did not have a major in journalism. I could take a course and join the Daily Brewing newspaper. I got the catalog and I'm looking through, and it said, Theater Arts, English, Theater Arts, Theater, Theater Arts, Film, Theater Arts. I said, Theater Arts, English? I love to write. I thought, Well, I'll major in that and take the playwriting courses and all of that. But when you were a freshman in theater arts, whether you wanted to direct or write or whatever, you had to take an acting course, you had to take scenery building, you had to take costumes, so forth, so on. So I'm a freshman, and I had to take an acting course. I was terrified. I had to get up and do a little scene or something. I remember the scene where it would be a hillbilly woman. I'm from Texas and Arkansas, so that came easily. I went out and I read this scene and everybody laughed where they should, and I liked that feeling. Yes. Then after I'd done that, then some of the kids asked me if I'd be in a couple of one acts that they wrote.

They'd put on. Pretty soon, I starting to do that and getting that response, which I had never dreamed I would ever get. Because had there been a major in journalism, I wouldn't be here talking to you now about all of this.

Well, you screwed up. If this is the big prize you get at the end of this incredible story, you made a mistake. I can relate very much to it because I loved comedy and watched comedy. I was a nerd, went to a very good school because I was a grind. I worked very hard and thought, Well, I considered journalism. I thought, I'll just do some serious work. Maybe I'll get into the law, and then found my way. How did you do? There was a magazine at Harvard called The Harvard Lampoon, and I just heard that there were... I didn't even know what it was. I went and I heard it was very competitive, and they're mean, and they cut people out. I just started writing because I'd always loved writing funny things, and it was like falling off a log. I did it. They said, Who is this guy? That led to me performing. That led to me being a comedy writer first. But the thing that imprinted on me when I was young, I would say, to my influence, is when I was very young was Bob Newhart, yourself, and that amazing Carol Burnet show, and Warner Brothers' cartoons.

I think you can take those three, and no offense to Bob, but if I had to, he can drop out, and it'll be Warner Brothers Cartoons and you. I know Bob well enough to be able to say that. But that's all the comedy class you need in timing and just the joy of performing comedy. That was in me somewhere. I had just watching you do your thing. It wasn't just the sketches. You did something that was very unusual at the time, question and answer. You did a Q&A segment on the Carol Burnet show, and I remembered that It blew my mind that you could stand out there in front of people, not hide behind a character, and talk to people. You'd see real people in the audience ask you questions. I maintain, and I've said this before to people, human beings have this crazy ability to know when something is organic. They know when it's rehearsed, and they know when it's spontaneous. I don't know why we know, but we do. I would watch those segments and you be funny in the moment in front of back then, half the country is watching. I thought, where did that come from?

The guts to do that on CBS, one of the most watched shows on television, that walking without a net on a tightrope.

Well, what happened was when we were going to do the show, the executive producer, Bob Banner said, Carol, instead of having a comic come out and warm up the studio audience, You should come out as yourself before you get into all those sketches with your fat suits and blacked-out teeth and fright wigs and all of that so that they get to know you and just open it up to Q&A And I said, I don't think I can do that. I mean, I'd be too frightened. I'd be afraid that they wouldn't ask anything or that if they did, I wouldn't have a good answer. And he said, Well, we'll put some plants in the audience. I said, No, if we're going to do it, and if I can have egg on my face, at least they'll know it's real.

You can't fake that.

Got to be real. So then I said, Okay, we'll do the first four shows, four weeks. If it's terrible, it's goodbye. We won't do it anymore. I went out there. First show, I was terrified. Some people did ask a question or two. But if you look at the first episode, it was really goofy. It wasn't that good. But then it aird, and then the next week, some people would come, and they were ready to ask questions and ready. And then I started to get into the groove and love it. And it became one of my favorite things to do. And it was great because I would do maybe about 15 minutes, and then we'd do the show. If the show was long, we'd only have maybe five minutes of Q&A, or for the short, we would have do the whole 15 minutes. But some of the stuff that we did, people were just wonderful. There was this one woman, she looked like B. Arthur when B. Did Maud. Yes.

Imposing a little fierce. Yeah.

She got up, she raised her hand, I called on her, and she said, I want to come up and sing. I said, Come on up. She was up there like that, and I said, What's your name? I remember she said, Terry McCann. I said, So what do you want to sing, Terry? And we had a 28-piece orchestra over there. She looked at the band and she said, You made me love you in the key of G. You made me love you. The audience was laughing and she went, Okay, okay, okay. Then she started, You made me love you. I didn't want to. She was good. Now, I came in and I started to join with her. So we were whaling away. And really, because I knew the song, she knew the song, and the audience was clapping. And then comes to where we're going to end it, right? I had a different way that I thought it should end from what she is. I went, You made me love you. I wanted that. She had a different way. So after all this whaling, clapping, and everything, it was petered out. She looked at me and she said, You screwed it up.

I love that it's the Carol Burnet show, and she's whatever she is. Millie O'Sullivan is telling you, You screwed up. Maybe it was It was actually B. Arthur. It was B. Arthur in a wig.

Well, you know what? Later on, I heard from some of her relatives, about maybe five years ago, she died at the age 100, and they played this at her memorial. I was thinking about when you just said you had a 28-piece orchestra, and I was thinking about it because I want to get this straight.

The show that you did, which ran on CBS from 1967 to 1978, it won 25 Emmys. Why? It could not exist today. That world doesn't exist anymore. You had a 28-piece orchestra, and you had 65 to 70 costumes a week.

If you do the math in 11 years, I can't do math. Bob Macky designed over 17,000 costumes. Jesus.

But I mean, it was a time when, I don't think we'll see that again, where you had a large portion of the country watching. That meant because of the advertising power and the star power of the people that would come by. It worked out. It was very different. What's happening now to variety is it just is getting... You have that feeling every now and then you'll pick up a magazine at the newsstand and it weighs next to nothing because everything's online. It's a magazine that's a famous magazine. It's been around forever and it's glossy, but it's like 15 pages long. I think that's what's happening in a lot of talk and variety, too, is it's unimaginable to have.

Also, when we were casting and everything, and I was fortunate enough to get Harvey, who was brilliant. Tim didn't come on the show as a regular till the ninth season.

You know, it's so funny. Most people don't know that. Harvey Corman always knew, and I was lucky enough to have him on the show, and he came on and lay on the couch like it was a psychiatrist couch. He was wearing a safari jacket, and I was crying. I was laughing so hard. Then Tim, we were lucky enough to have him on a bunch of times. But you think of Tim as always being there, ninth season.

Yeah, but we had him on as a regular guest quite often, but he was doing other shows. He did. He had a Tim Conway Variety Hour at one point. But nothing that he ever did lasted more than 13 weeks. He even had his license plate 13 weeks. But one of my favorite Conway stories is he did a film a comedy called Rango, and it was filmed where he was this inept cowboy. Tim needs an audience where he can just go. So they're filming, and it was not good. It was not good. He was hornswackled. He couldn't do what he usually did.

He's in a vacuum because he's on a film set.

Now they're on location. This guy from ABC is going to come and tell Tim that the show is canceled. But Tim didn't know it yet. He's in his motorhome, and he's changing for the next scene and whatever. There's a knock on the thing. The guy who came in from ABC was very nervous. It was like he was an underling. He said, Hi. He said, Oh, Mr. I'm Warren Tart. I'm from ABC. Tim said, Yes, hi. He said, Well, stop doing this.

Stop doing this? Stop doing this.

Stop doing this. That's how they canceled it.

I was told, Stop doing this many times, and I never listened. I think that's the magic is you just don't listen.

But also, when you talk about back then, no network today would let me hire Vicky Lawrence. She was right out of high school. She was 18 years old. I'd seen her in a contest that she won, and we were looking for a gal that would play an occasional sketch as my kid's sister, and she looked a lot like me, and we hired her on the spot. Today, no network would let me do that. No experience. Story.

Well, you had a degree of power. I mean, you clearly knew what you were doing, and you could say, This is going to work. I always thought Lyle Wagner was an amazing choice because you wouldn't think, You've got everything you need. You don't need this handsome fellow there. But then you used him so well, and he was terrific.

He grew as a comedian. Yes.

But I mean, a lot of it is, I think your show had such a deep bench of comedic ability. You could do anything. I also think it represented a time when people had a common reference point. I think now there's so much media and people are so fractured that it's very hard to parody one thing and everybody knows what you're talking about. So there was an era where you could do... So many of your parodies of famous movies were movies that we all knew, like Gone with the Wind. Today, I it's a different time. It's hard for everyone to agree on one thing that they've seen and know all the nuances and know all the little bits, like when you're taking the curtains out of the window to me, Oh, I just saw it in the window. That's a famous line. I don't know if you could have a home run like that today.

I don't know, but there were times when we would do take offs on movies that weren't that well known, but they were funny in their own right. If you knew it, it was twice as funny. I remember we did one. There was a movie that Joan Fonteyn was in called Born to be Bad, and it was bad.

Truths in advertising.

I forget what we called it, something to be evil or whatever. I was doing a takeoff on that character, and it was very funny. People who didn't know it, it was still a funny sketch. As opposed to a parody. And those who did know it got it doubly.

I didn't want to embarrass you, but I'm going to embarrass you because the achievements, all the Emmys, Tony's, Grammys, seven golden Globes, Presidential Medal of Freedom. I was reading your achievements and I started to laugh because it's comedically amazing. And I'm halfway through the list. Mark Twain Prize for American Humor, Screen Actors' Guild, Lifetime Achievement. There's a Golden Globe the word named after you. What's interesting is I get the impression that doesn't affect you, that you're still Carol Burnet, and you're going to give it your all, and you still have that humility and cherry optimism, but it hasn't gone to your head in any way, because if I had one of those, I'd be an absolute madman.

I don't know. I'm just grateful.

I wanted to ask you about Lucille Ball because obviously, growing up, even though the show had long been gone, it was running constantly in reruns, I Love Lucy, and that was the format for the modern sitcom that has endured for 50, 60 years. I know that she was very kind to you. She saw you as, Hey, this kid has something. I like her. How did she reach out to you?

Or how did you meet her? I was doing the Broadway show called Once Up on a Mattress. We had just opened the night before, and the second night, there was a lot of buzz I could hear in the audience, and Lucy was in the audience the second night. I remember I peaked through the curtain, and I saw this big shock of red hair, and there she was. I was more nervous that night than I was opening the night before because she was in the... Of course, yeah. Anyway, it went okay. I had this funky little dressing room off Broadway. She knocked on the door after the show and came in. I had this couch and I had a spring coming up. She was going to say... I said, Look out. She said, I see it.

Is it my first rodeo?

Anyway, we visited for about a half hour, and she said... She called me Kid because she was 22 years older. She said, If you ever need me for anything, give me a call. About four or five years later, I was going to I did a few things, and then CBS was going to give me a special, a one-hour variety thing, if I could get a major guest star. So the producer said, Call Lucy. I said, I don't want to bother her. He said, All she can do is say, I'd love to, but I can't. I'm busy. Got her on the phone, called her office. She came up, Hey, kids, you're doing great. What's happening? I was just, blah. I said, Lucy, I'm doing... I know you're busy. She said, When do you want me? And we did the show together. Then when I got my variety show, and then I did several guest appearances on her later shows, the Lucille Ball show, and when she played Lucy Carmichael. That's right.

With Gail Gordon.

Right. Then when I got my show, she came on. We traded on and off. Oh, wow. This one time, she's on my show, and we to have a dinner break before the orchestra rehearsal. She and I went over to the Farmer's Market to have a little... We were in the Chinese restaurant there, and she's knocking back a couple of whiskey sours.

Please tell me it's the morning.

No, it was a night time.

Okay.

At that time, of course, my husband, Joe Hamilton, was executive of producing our show. She now was not with Desi. She said, You know, kid, it's great that you got Joe to handle a lot of stuff for you because when I was married to the Cuban- Like he's a cigar. She said, He did everything. Desi did everything. He took care of the scripts. He took care of the lighting, the camera work. He's the one who invented the three cameras. Yes.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's a genius.

Yeah. Yeah. And she said, When I came into the Monday morning, the table read, everything was perfect because he had seen to it. And all I had to do is be crazy Lucy. Fine. So then we got a divorce. Now I'm going to do the Lucy Karma, whatever it was. I came in, No, Desi, and we read the script, and she said, It was awful. Kid, it stank. And I thought, Oh, God, what am I going to do? Desi's not here. She called for lunch, and she said, She went back to her office. She said, I've got to be strong. I've got to be... I got to confront this the way Desi would. She said, So I knew what I had to do. Went back to the table read, and I told them in no uncertain terms how I felt about the script, how we had to fix it. She said, and kid, and she took an L. And that's when they put the S on the end of my last name.

Now, she sent you, I think, flowers every day on your birthday.

On my birthday, in this one birthday, I got up in the morning and turned on the Today Show. She had passed away on my birthday. And that afternoon, I got flowers that said, Happy birthday, kid. We had a great bond.

You're doing this project now, Parmeroyal, which I had the privilege. They let me see a sneak peek of two episodes. I got to talk to Kristen Wig yesterday for a long time about it. It is amazing to me that your work has reached so many generations of people. Just in this room, I'm 60. Matt, you're? Fifty. Fifty. Forty-one. Forty-one. Let's just say 40. Round it out. Okay, but I'm 41. But okay, I'll say 40. But I rounded it down.

But these two were apoplectic, nervous about we're going to come in and be in the same room as Carol Burnet.

Oh, my God. Our wrap sign for this is I do an earlub tug to Eduardo, and that's how he likes the wrap sign. He's been doing that since the day we started this podcast five years ago. He's been doing it, and I think you should file suit.

Is it longer than the other Mine is a millimeter longer. You tugged it longer? Yeah, it was measured once.

By some pervert in the park? Yeah.

Well, I've been going up to shorten it.

Okay. It's so I mean, I remembered you coming on the show.

Yeah, it was for my grandmother.

For your grandmother, and you did it on the show. And again, I had one of those moments where I thought, this can't be happening. I can't be here with Carol Burnet while she's tugging on her earlobe. That's the same earlobe. And then you think, dude, relax. You've got to just be in the moment. But this is a bunch of generations of people who are just astounded to be in a room with you and so grateful for all this amazing work you've done. But also talking to Kristen Wigg She's there just everyone's... Your work has, and I don't think that used to be the case. I sometimes think that people used to do their work, and then because times were different, they wouldn't rerun shows or they wouldn't be seen again. But your work has been seen, and now, thanks to just the internet and your legacy, everyone's very aware of this crazily rich fabric of work you have.

It's wonderful. I get fan mail now from 10-year-olds, teenagers who We're on like, Shout and YouTube and MeTV and all of that. So people are seeing it, and it's a thrill for me. I have recently just stopped doing it, but for about 25 years, I went around the country doing Q&A live. That's right. Just a few short years ago, I would get audiences that range from five years old to 100. It was wild. So this one time, there was this little boy in the second row, and he raised his hand, and I called on him, and I said, What's your name? He said, Andrew. I said, How old are you, Andrew? He said, Nine. I said, You know who I am? Him without missing a beat, he said, Surprisingly, yes.

What's it like? I mean, it was so funny, too. I don't want to give anything away. No spoiler alerts. But in the first episode, we're meeting all the different... I mean, it's an incredible cast you have on Pammeroyal.

Oh, wow. Yeah.

Just looking at Allison Janne. Laura Dern. Laura Dern. Just this powerhouse cast. I'm watching the show and I'm thinking, Well, I know Carol's in here somewhere, but I don't see her yet. Why isn't she with the other ladies? Then there's this reveal of your character. You are in a coma. I just thought, but you're still doing a little something in your coma. I was like, Only Carol Burnet can lie in a coma and kill it. I mean, you're the only one that can do it. Then I was in. I was like, I want to see because I know there's no keeping Carol Burnet on this hospital bed. She's coming out of this coma, and I'm down for it. I want to see all of this. But it feels to me like you haven't lost this sense of joy of working with people and just the doing of it.

I'm just thrilled because now I've got some new best girlfriends, Kristen, Allison, Laura Dern, I mean, it's just... So now we've bonded, and it keeps me young to be able to be in. In fact, Allison and I, we wordle.

A lot of friendships end that way. Tell me. If you're not careful. We wordle. That may be the most intimate relationship of this modern era is if you're wordling with someone.

And even connections. Do you know that one? Yeah. Yes. Allison and I are into connections and wordling. We love it.

How are you with your out in the world and people approach you? Do you enjoy that? Sure. Yeah. I always did, too. I have friends who are lovely people who are very well known, and they just... You'd never know it because they appear like extroverts. They're comedians, but they're very shy and they don't like it. I just always felt very lucky that, and I sense that we're similar in some ways. I enjoy it. I'll talk to anybody.

Yeah, right. As long as they're nice and not too pushy or anything like that. Yeah, and I enjoy it. I remember when my grandmother and I would go to Hollywood premieres on Hollywood Boulevard, I was maybe nine or 10 years old. We'd hang over the ropes to see all the movie stars coming in to go to the movie. I I remember one of my favorite movie stars was Linda Darnell. She was so beautiful, and she was in Texas. At one point, she was walking by us to get into the theater, and my grandmother, who was not shy, said, Linda, Linda, This little girl just loves you. Give her your autograph. She looked at me and she said, What's your name, Sweetheart? Oh, wow. I said, Carol. She said, Okay. She took her time. I never forgot that. It meant the world to me. You never know how much you might be helping somebody by responding to them and being kind. It's so important.

I've had the experience, and we've talked about it over the years. Years ago of being in a restaurant and someone waiting on me, and then later on, they're a huge movie star, and they remember it. They were waiting a table, and I was a couple of years into my show, and they waited on me, and I always say, Was I... They always to tell me, No, you were very nice, and you did some bits with me, and then you kept doing bits, and we had to leave. So goddamn needy, Cohnen. But I always thought, you just never... I mean, you should be nice because it's the right thing to do. Exactly. For its own. But if you're not- But you're paying it forward. Yeah, paying it forward.

Because the person you're being nice to will then remember that and maybe be nice to the next person that comes to them. Yeah.

It's funny to me because it's often people now every time a woman gets a late night talk show, they talk about this woman's in late night and it's breaking a barrier. I always think, yes, that's great and it's important, but I always try and remember that you, Mary Tyler Moore, Lucile Ball, were smashing these barriers 60 years ago. It's absolutely stunning. We need to remember that because I I think you guys- Well, CBS didn't want me to do it. They didn't want you to do the show?

No, they didn't want me to do a variety show. I had a weird contract that I'd signed a few years before with CBS that if I, Carol, wanted to do a variety show or long, or a comedy variety show. Cbs would have to put it on for 30 shows, whether they wanted to or not. That was some agent.

I could have used him in 1993. So When the time came, I pushed that button and got one of the vice presidents of CBS on the phone.

I said, I think I want to push that button. That's what we call it. He said, What button? He forgot about it. I said, You know where I get to do 30? Oh, let me get back to you. He said, So he called the next day. It's sure he got a bunch of lawyers to find out about that contract. He said, Yeah, I see that, Carol. But you know, Comedy Variety is a man's game. He said, It's Cesar, it's Jackie Gleason, it's Milton Burwell, now it's Dean Martin.

Dean Martin, yeah.

He said, It's not for you, gals. He said, We've got this sitcom we'd love you to do called Here's Agnes.

That is the perfect bad pitch sitcom. And by the way, I'd like to bank that now. I will put up the money, Carol, if you'll do The Agnes Show.

Well, I think it's safe to say you proved them wrong. I think so, yeah. At least we got 30 shows out of it, and we wound up having 276, so we did okay.

This question just occurred to me, but it must have been interesting the next morning after the Carol Burnet show I know that everyone else in my house would be talking about it the next morning. We'd be talking about all the things that we saw and what made us laugh. One of six kids. We're all packed together in this house. We're all about six months apart. I don't know how my mom did that. It's the Irish thing. But we would be talking about because we loved your show. I'm curious, as Carol Burnet, you must have been hearing from people the next day people on the street or just people in your life? Was there- From the get-go, people were pleased with what...

Now, we didn't score every week by any means, but we had a pretty good average. And the first few years, like first two or three or four years, I was more goofy like I had been on the Gary Moore show, which is why they wanted me to have Lyle so that I could swoon over Lyle. And after that, I thought, wait a minute, I'm married and I've got children. Let's not do that anymore. That's when we started giving Lyle more to do other than for me to go gaga over. And then we started getting more, I don't know, a little bit serious when we did the family show, where Eunice and Mama and Ed and some of those were... You look up dysfunction in the dictionary and you'd find that sketch.

It would get very dark. I remember thinking, it got to me in a good way. I remember very well when your character went on The Gong Show. The Gong Show. It's all played for comedy, and then you get gonged and the camera just stays on your face.

It gets smaller and smaller and smaller.

Smaller, smaller, smaller. You're thinking, is there going to be some reprieve or some laugh? And there wasn't. I remember that to this second, how powerful that was. It gave me the idea that it doesn't always have to be funny. I don't know. It's one of those memories I have from television.

Some people hated it.

Of course they did.

It made them uncomfortable. Then after it had aird a few times, I was getting a manicure, and the manicurist was Russian. She I said, You know that family you do? That's just like my family in Russia. So people identified.

But you know what's interesting, too? You were playing this real dysfunctional family, and then that is most comedy now, the comedy of discomfort and dysfunction. So what you were, not initially, but what you were playing with a little bit was something that now is derigour. It's all comedy, I feel.

But you didn't see stuff like that on a variety show.

You did not.

That was different. And what's really funny was we only thought we were going to do it one time. So they had written for me to be Mama, and we were going to have a guest star be Eunice. But Eunice spoke to me because my mother had a lot of dreams that never came true. I said, I think I want to play Eunice. Then we were going to hire an older woman to play Mama. Bob Macky, our costume designer, said, I'll let Vicky do it. We'll just take off her eyelashes and put her in a fat suit and put a wig on her, and that's it.

She was so young at the time, playing- Twenty-four.

Yeah, hilarious. Twenty-four years old. We hired her when she was 18 to be my sister, and she wound up being my mother.

The business will do that to you.

But I mean, she nailed it. She nailed it. Like she talked, she said, I learned comedy in front of 30 million people every week. It was like she to school, but everybody was watching her. Yeah. And Harvey was great with her. He helped her with her props, told her, he said, Don't just wait for your cue to tell you you've got to listen when people are talking. I mean, he was a master at giving her acting classes, and she sure... She was like a sponge.

Well, I did make a promise, which is we have so many terrific people on this show, and sometimes they say, Oh, I can hang around for all day. But you, and this is a real testament to you, Carol, your day is packed. You are out promoting Pam Royale. You are working as hard right now as anybody I know. I don't want to monopolize your time. I want to let you go. But I do want to tell you that getting to know you just a little bit is one of the most meaningful things to me in show business. I'm serious. I'm serious. The fact that you were always so good at what you did, and I got the sense watching you through the TV. They say, Don't meet your heroes, but I always got the sense through the TV, through the Q&A's. This is a nice woman who's real and she's connected. Oh, thank you. Then I got to know you and you're as amazing a person as I could have hoped for. So thank you for improving my childhood and adulthood immeasurably.

Let's do this again.

No woman has ever said that to me. Love you and just have an amazing day and let's do it again. Okay. I like this. We're in a different environment. I love our home base. It's incredible. I love our little studio. It's very comfortable, wonderful location. But we are today at this incredible hotel. I have very fond memories of this hotel because I used to live back when I was writing on The Simpson. I lived about, I don't know, a block and a half from here. We're standing here at this hotel. You could hit my apartment with a tennis ball, but I think you'd need... I couldn't do it. I think you'd need a pneumatic cannon. But still, it's close, but not close enough. You can't say you could hit it with a tennis ball. If you had a cannon of some kind- I don't think people take that literally. Well, I just wanted to be clear. I'm always worrying about the legal. If I said you could hit it with a tennis ball, I'm worried some listeners are going to say, Oh, if Konan was at the Four Seasons on Doheny, he could hit his old apartment on Wetherly with a tennis ball.

And then I'm challenged to do it, and I can't do it. I just want to say, please don't sue me for that. You think you can get sued for that? It's a crazy country. You can get sued for anything. I don't think you could get sued for that. You'll see it's coming. Also, if someone says, I bet that's not true, you could just be like, Yeah, it is, but then not actually try to do it. Okay. All right. Well, anyway, you didn't help here. I took us down a bad alley, and then you said, Let's go further down the alley and then drive in circles. I have fond memories of living here. It was the early '90s. I was writing for the Simpsons. This is a pretty ritzy area. So were you living that large back then? Well, I had already been working in television at that point. I got started in '85, and then I worked on Saturday Night Live, and then I came out here for The Simpson. So I had done okay at that point. I had just purchased a brand new 1992 Ford Taurus, which when you see someone driving a new 92 Ford Taurus in 1992, you know they've got bank.

That's the Toyota Camry of Fords. Yes, it is. Which was the Dodge Neon of Camries. Anyway, I was living in this neighborhood, and I remember my mom came to visit me, and she didn't know anything about the Simpsons or didn't watch it. I didn't think it was a big deal, but I remember she came out and visited, and I said, I know a good place for brunch, and just walked her like a block and a half to this Four Seasons, which has the most amazing brunch. I told her, You'll probably see a celebrity. We did not. But I kept telling her that just random people were celebrities. You did lie. I did lie. Yeah, okay. I said, That guy over there is Tony Curtis, and the guy had already left the room. She just saw the back of a shoe. She was excited. I don't know. I just a nice time here. I was a single guy living the life. What was Bachelor Konan like? Single Konan? Bachelor Konan of that era. What was he getting up to? Man, '91 Bachelor, '92. '92 Bachelor Konan. Oh, my God, ladies, look out. Look out. Look out, ladies.

It's '92 Bachelor Konan. Oh, my God. Now, I know now we're in an era we're saying, Look out, ladies. Probably not the way to No, I was a kindly gentleman, but I did okay for myself because I'd started to fill out a little bit. I had been way too skinny for years and my skin had cleared up. It was a little more... I had a little more confidence. I had a credit card. Oh, sick. Yeah. I was cash in my pocket. They were all like, ladies would be like, Hey, I like this guy. Then I'd say, Yeah, and when do you see my car? Then the four tourists would come out, and then I'd have a hard time finding them. They would take off. I saw one woman I got behind a hedge. You still have your Ford Taurus? I still have the Ford Taurus. Are you serious? Yeah, it became a thing because on the late night show, guests would talk about their Lamborghini or whatever, and they thought that because, oh, Renault has a lot of cars, let's find out what Konan drives. I would say, truthfully, I have a 1992 Ford Taurus.

It's an essay show that's super high output. It looks like a Taurus that you'd pick up your kids at soccer practice with, but it's actually got a stick shift inside.

Yeah, that guy fucks.

People's lives up.

Did you drive that cross country to New York?

No, I had it shipped. You didn't want it- An aristocrat. Yeah. I didn't want it to be damaged, so I had it put on the roof of another Ford Taurus. Yeah, but I brought it out here. When I bought it, I did not drive stick. I bought it completely on faith. Then my brother Neil, I bought it in Massachusetts. My brother Neil took me to a supermarket parking and taught me how to drive stick. Then I brought it to LA and went right into LA traffic, grinding gears like crazy, but got good at it, and then pulled up at the Simpson lot in a Ford Taurus. I think they knew then there's a badass in town who definitely fucks. He was born down in a Ford Taurus. It's got a stick shift. The gears that grind. But I lived in this neighborhood and it was really nice. I had a good time. I enjoyed it. I loved working in that Simpson's writing room and loved it. This is the hotel where I met Jeff Ross for the first time. I thought you were going to say where you lost your virginity. Where I lost my virginity?

Yeah. Well, that's true. Four years ago. Yeah. With the help of my wife. But yeah, I met Jeff Ross here because I was being considered for the late night job, and Lauren said, You should go meet with this guy, Jeff Ross. We met about 15 feet from where I am right now, which I could hit with a tennis ball. Okay. Back to the tennis ball. I'm sorry. A tennis ball that went through walls. Okay. Anyway, that's my story. So this brings up a lot of nice memories. This hotel, this area. I like getting out of the studio once in a while. It creates a new vibe. You do have a swagger about you today that makes me feel like you're back in your prime. Because I'm telling you, I'm channeling 1992 single, Konan, and I look at him. Here he comes. That guy likes to meet people and try and buy them dinner. He has dinner.Credit card.He has a credit card. I've had it for years. $1,000 limit. I've only gone over twice. I like coming to these fancy places because then I I know that you can buy us lunch at. I'm going to take you out for a nice lunch.

Is that right? You know what? You, too. You know what? I'll tell you, Matt, you don't know this. It's 2:15 in the afternoon. If there's one thing I know about Sona, she's having wine with her mom. I'll join you on that. Are you kidding?

Yeah. Let's wind it up.Hey.

And David's driving. Well, he's driving you. He drove me. Yeah, but we drove ourselves. I drove in a mildew car. You're going to be wine drunk driving in a mildew car. You're going to be pulled over by the police, not for your swerving, but because of the odor of your car. No. Toxic output. All right. Peace out, Tupac. Konan O'Brien needs a friend. With Konan O'Brien, Sonam Ofsessian, and Matt Gourley. Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sacks, nick Leow, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at EarWolf. Theme song by the White Stripes. Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino. Take it away, Jimmy. Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair, and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples. Engineering and Mixing by Eduardo Perez and Brenda Burns. Additional production support by Mars Melnick. Talent Booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Brit Kohn. You can rate and review this show on Apple podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Konan? Call the Team Coco Hotline at 669-587-2847 and leave a message. It, too, could be featured on a future episode.

And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Konan O'Brien Needs a Friend wherever fine podcast fine podcasts are downloaded.