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[00:00:01]

This is a news laundry podcast and you're listening to and I'll have the ungrazed up Lagon or News laundry up now the cabinet shortly. Welcome to another episode of And they'll have to where we risk our lives and come to office to record the finest audio quality. Because as those of you who have been listened to often and Awesome and Hybris on my podcast can tell that the Zoome recordings aren't quite as high in audio quality as Hafter recordings, and that because after we come to office and record on mikes and equipment that have been purchased by money given to us by subscribers, so Wildheart is free for the next few weeks, you should know many people have contributed and made sure that news only survives free of ads, free of any Sakari advertising or pushing any other ads for the corporate or Sakari agenda.

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So I urge you, if you are Movahed horse to pay to keep news free, because then the public pays, the public is served and advertisers pay, advertisers served. And we shall be having a long show on this sometime in the near future. On that note today, before we get into the headlines, which I will read for us, let me introduce the panel we have in the office, Raymond Paul and Manisha Pondy, hello.

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Hi. We have joining us from Bombay, my uncle. My uncle. Hey, what's up? What's up?

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Those of you who don't know my language, I'm sure the very few of I shall introduce him once with all his grand.

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He is the first film critic to actually win that. I'm not going to award for excellence in journalism. So we have other than me, everyone here is a I'm not going to journalism award winner and see the irony.

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I am the boss. The what's wrong with journalism?

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That's that's journalism. That's that's why we are where we are. Exactly. Which is we're in shit.

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OK, fine. On that optimistic note with my wonderful supportive colleagues, my uncle is the first film critic to win that I'm not going to go out. Facts, journalism. His last book, Name, Place Animal Thing was a critically acclaimed Amazon top title.

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He's got a podcast called Sit with Hitlist, and it's won several awards. And Shaker was the founding editorial team of Mumbai Mirror and has been the national culture editor with Hindustan Times. He's currently the entertainment head at midday, where you can follow his writings and his weekly column, M. S Word.

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And when I say Chicago Tribune, Chicago Thymine, Manchaca Sumai or Chicago or Chicago, that's right. Before Monisha gives us the headlines at How are things that I saw today. The top story in the morning bulletin was the ridiculous rain in Bombay like it's the most single day rain in August ever.

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Bombay has recorded for the six on the road. One party only has come down onto the road.

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Well, here's the thing, right? If you don't step out of your hole and nobody is nobody at this, I know anything doesn't matter. There could be a hailstorm, cyclone, anything. If it was a regular day, I think we would have been quite screwed because clearly with this plus traffic and traffic can get quite during the monsoon can become quite a thing. So it would have been a pretty big catastrophe of sorts. But right now it really doesn't matter.

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And I mean, I'm in my home and I'm going to be like this for the next few months and I've been like this. But if I think by doing it, thank you for having me. I'm really happy to be on this podcast for a couple of reasons. One, I completely forgot last night I thought this was going to be a live video, which meant that I wake up in the morning and take a shower. And then I did.

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I thought about breakfast and I can do both. I mean, I have to get money, but I'm having breakfast. I can talk to you because audio, it's it's perfect. I think we should do more podcasts. Yes, we absolutely.

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Because we have been pushing podcasts as long as I am. But just one quick question. Like the last time when Bomba was inundated, the water actually entered homes, you know, the low lying areas. So what you're saying is this time it's not that bad. It's not like water in their homes. The streets are flooded, but it hasn't like it's not like in Delhi and you guys have got swept away.

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And all that hasn't happened in Bombay, you know, so it's like it's like the floods in Bihar floods, you know, it's going to happen every year. Also, people who live in the slums are almost like anticipating this. They will never be the casualty in a real sense. And they know how to protect themselves from a rain of this sort, which is actually an annual feature. There's nothing you're deeply worrying from a point of view, all the numbers and, you know, the maximum number of numbers in terms of millimeters and stuff.

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But I don't think anyone personally would have been affected from a from a physical point of view. Of course, they'd be water coming into slums and they'd be low lying areas, which would be impossible to wade through, something that we do every year. But beyond that, I don't think anyone would be personally affected if they were inside. Right.

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So, Manisha, before we discuss the whole bunch of things that actually happened, can you give us what all the world has faced?

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Yes, the Sessions and Rajput case is still in the headlines. Surprise, surprise, and lots of new twists and turns. Most recently, the Senate has approved Bihar government's request for a CBI probe into Suzanne's death and the Eddie has summoned. Chakrabarty for questioning on Friday, which is tomorrow. Well, Prasad Yadav has been moved to Arem is Detector's Bangalore, Ahmed covid-19 Führer's. Meanwhile, we've had a slew of politicians who've been detected with over Tomica damage done by Estrada riposted.

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So that so that there was one more, I think, politician yuppy. He recovered but died and died. So, yeah, OK.

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Pakistan, meanwhile, has unveiled a new political map that shows Kashmir as part of its territory, even negative state they've gone.

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Let's just since we are doing fiction.

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Let's go live in terrible, terrible images came in from Beirut of a blast that killed at least 135 people. I'm sure the death toll would probably increase because the visuals from that site are just horrific. Five thousand people have been injured. Meanwhile, back in India, we had the Bhoomi bujon at idea by Prime Minister Narendra Modi that got wall to wall coverage for two straight days. India has recorded the highest single spike with fifty two thousand five hundred nine cases and crossed the one point nine million mark on covid uncovered.

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And meanwhile, W.H said that India's testing rate is still low compared to other countries contempt of court case against Foshan Bhushan over tweets criticizing the judiciary. He's refused to apologize and the matter was heard yesterday in the Delhi riots. Police questioned you, Professor Bullrun, until five US. They've seized his phone. This was pretty shocking. And meanwhile, there were news leaks of tired Hussein apparently admitting to his role in the Delhi riots. You should read the news report on this.

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We've explained why this was an old piece of news, recycled, possibly because the Delhi police has been getting a lot of flak in the Delhi High Court in UPA. Journalist has been booked for unverified post online. He said something about the administration's mishandling of covid-19 UK has decided to issue a coin to honor Mahatma Gandhi.

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And India and China have completed fifth round of military level talks on August 3rd. And there's been no resolution yet and it's not in the news at all.

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Yeah, and with the winter approaching, I don't think anyone's moving back. I think everyone stays where they were after.

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The squeakiest has also been case in itself. The company faces a lawsuit for sacking employees based on caste in America.

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All right. So before we discuss all the rest, let's start with, you know, news coming out of Bombay. And since my uncle was a part of the TMR dispatches, which you can check out actually on the media ramble channel, which this year the media Ramblas at this event and not a physical event, which we did on coverage of showbiz and entertainment. Just a couple of pulse announcements. One is a we have an a project up. Those of you who contributed to the Delhi riots and Ellsinore project, you must have seen.

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So now we have four stories up and there'll be more coming. Like I said, we not gonna give up on this coverage. We will. We have dedicated two reporters.

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Just this is going to be unending. It will go on for any other artist.

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And the kind of stories that you may have read on news laundry, I wish Legacy Media took that up rather than speculating on what happened to Sushant based purely on whims, where here there is evidence, there are people who are giving specific statements, but yet you will only see legacy media screaming on nonissues to check that out.

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So we have another Nasra project up, which is on custodial deaths in India, which is a serious problem. It was sparked off by PJ Raja and his son Bannocks as brutal killing in Tamil Nadu. And we are going to be dedicating, starting next week, another two reporters solely to this, the kind of custodial deaths that happened around the country. We have already come halfway to the Denilson mark, I think just over two legs. Many of you have contributed and we've made it just over Aurillac.

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So it would be great if you guys can top that Nelson project up. So thank you for that. And like I've said earlier, the next three to four 1/2 days will be free. But I hope that doesn't mean you guys don't contribute, because while you may pay to gain access to the Hafter behind the paywall, your contributions power, the journalism that we do and will have. That may be something that you enjoy listening to. It is the ground reports that really make news laundry irrelevant.

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So thank you and thank you to the team, which never gets the voice that the three of us do, which is Snigdha, that they are her Sulla and all the panelists who come. All these people may have thought it is. So it's just not the three of us sitting and shooting the breeze. So do contribute to news, laundry and pay to keep ministry with that very long announcement. My uncle, I thank you for your patience. I would like to discuss two things to begin with with you, and then I hope you will stay on for the rest of the discussion that we have.

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This will be about an hour and a half or two.

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Today is Thursday and it is 12 14 the afternoon. You've seen the kind of coverage that Sasha Johnson Rajputs, you know, suicide got on now, should I say alleged, you said because not all sorts of theories are floating around. You were on another show. So two specific questions. One, is this the first time in your pretty lustrous career of covering showbiz that this has become a political issue of this nature? And to what prompted you to go on or not show and.

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You could tell everybody about the piece you wrote that you like or not, but he's a problem to answer your first question, absolutely. To the best of my memory, I cannot recall anything that's come close to a toxic mix of everything that's wrong with this country, the state of news media, the state of Indian politics, the infighting between various factions of Indian politics, then the state of also show business in a certain way, the fact that they are the softest targets you can ever come across with a huge following.

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And all of this encompassed in rumormongering, a social media hooking up stories to everything which would be in the realm of gossip and facts and regular people demanding accountability from each other as if anyone owes anyone anything. Why not ask any questions to public officials? So everything that I think could possibly be wrong with this country that drive no discussions, we bring it up in any case, somehow just integrates into the socializing case. So, yeah, I've not seen anything like this before.

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Why do I get on another show? I think I had a pretty good reason for the longest. Is one the fact that he hasn't been as rabid as he seems now? It was and it's been, I would say, a gradual descent, but it's been a descent over over a period time for sure. And now it's reached a point where I don't even think anyone should be on the show purely because you can't you can't even go yourself. And the Hill's allegations against people who are sitting there who have nothing at all besides the fact that he is he's only talking to people who are not in that room, who are not there to defend themselves.

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And he's holding allegations, but they can't say a word back to them in any case. So ideally speaking, that's something that I I sent a message to the guys at the show said if because he has a core audience, he has a base, as it were, I don't think they'll mind him just talking to him and people who see the same thing and who agree with each other would be as good a show, even in terms of ratings as what he's attempting to do, but pretending that if people who were opposed to him and going after them, but not letting them speak at all.

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So there's no question of that being a debate because by its very nature, it's supposed to be equal time allotted to both sides. But a lot of times I've had fun on his show over all over yours purely because he takes certain positions, which a lot of people in the media agree with, which is to do with censorship and which is to do with modern policing. He goes after those elements and he considers himself what he me. So as a socially liberal person, which which is great, because when he goes out there of like, let's take a look at an issue like Permalink, which is also a really toxic mix of politics and entertainment, a lot like so trancing, but not not this bad because there weren't that many innuendos and it didn't involve death of a real person.

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Of course, I think there was somebody who killed himself at some point there, like, for instance, he would take up a liberal positions on censorship and he'll certainly take one on moral policing. So I've enjoyed those aspects of his monologue and participate in them, because if you're on his side, then it's OK. It's a breeze because you are winning that so-called debate to begin with.

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OK, now, when it comes to the actual case, Officer Sean singled out for the reporting angle, was the reportage around it, scrutinizing it for its authenticity of the suicide? Was the media in the news media.

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And I'm talking about midday on the Mumbai Metro or other such papers. How did they cover this issue? And is there any, in your experience as a reporter, a reason to scrutinize it with an investigative kind of mindset that there is foul play?

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Like where does that come from? Why do you think that has become a narrative and legacy media and that's not restricted to one or two channels? Several channels are doing that.

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So here's the thing about London. I had a word with the top cop and he tells me and he feels that the Mumbai police was essentially investigating favouritism in Bollywood, which is a good thing for a city police to investigate. But they were taking essentially taking cues from television news and social media, both of which feed off each other. And that's where it was headed. And that's where Mumbai police got it all wrong, which was not the case with if you if you examine the newspapers in the city, whether it's a mirror or it's a midday, it was being reported.

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It's just the way you would report any other crime story in terms of the information that we have based on the information that one has, a few things remain even now. Indisputable is the fact that it's suicide purely because even the family that is disputed as the family, the poor family had to actually go and file a case and partner largely because they had given up. Please were busy following me every night who was busy lambasting Mumbai police, on the other hand, he has his own issues going on with police.

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That's another matter altogether. And so they say you got a name. They're called the names in this kind of code. Call them over to the police station. Really old people as well. It was a pretty old man by himself. And then guys like until 11. Sadly, your son Salma was the casting director. Yes. So. So while all that was going on, the family decided we've had enough of this. And so they had to go to the police because what they had and what they were doing in terms of their own investigation, revealing something totally is right.

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And even then, these people and lastly, this little investigation, this private investigation, as it were, if you can call it that, is led by this gentleman called OPC, who is a San Francisco Rajputs brother in law, that four sisters, one of them is married and is married to, who is now recently been appointed the commissioner of police in Florida. So he was doing a lot of the groundwork in terms of speaking to the pillars, in terms of getting the financial documents in place and stuff like that, and even the complaint that the file was a complaint of abatement to suicide.

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So even the family is not disputing that fact, at least at this point. And they say. Right, they're not. Yeah, yeah. So I don't know where that but the material of, you know, involving all the craziness, control and it ends of the one on social media is coming from. But so far as we know, based on everything, it is still suicide unless proven otherwise. Now that CBI has a case, I'm very curious to know how they're going to go ahead with the investigation.

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Are they going to take the route police did? Are they going to take the Mumbai police was up to, you know, hanging around in various directions, finding out what I think where all these theories come from on social media that one can imagine just people.

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But the fact that WhatsApp messages are taken seriously on television channels is the problem. But, you know, money and romance, if you can come in, money runs.

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You've done a lot of police investigations in the sense, not as an investigator, but as a reporter in a case like this. I mean, a few years ago, sitting here on a half day used to love that. All the noise that they make, it's just noise. It has no real world consequences. I've changed my mind. I think television media does have real world consequences. Like many shows pointing out, that is an EDDINE as it's questioning real Chakravarty.

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I think that's awful.

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Yeah, the Eddie, which clearly has lots of other things to do, has decided to step into this case and investigate why was make up and how much was to make up, what for and who bought it.

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I mean and this is purely because of the noise that we see on television. So how incompetent the police will look. It's like this leads to the other intelligence said that they can do all investigation they want.

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But generally abutments, as you said, is very difficult to prove in this case. Since he was alone in his room, it is close to impossible. So you can make all the noise you want. It's going to come to not be of use.

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I think the first time and we discussed his death and after you had laughed off because somebody was demanding the CBI enquiry and we all of us had lost loved it, that is why safieh so I, I even at that time I wrote, I felt that an actor of his teacher who was so successful and he committed suicide. So definitely everybody wants the answer, know why did he do it. So the why of it. But anyway I mean what the why of it.

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Not the what. Because what is already. Yes. I mean that is enough evidence to suggest what happened.

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Right. So what happened? And yes, they were I think three or four people present in the house and this room was on.

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Exactly.

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So there is no way anyone claiming and also now, not even when the case goes to the CBI, what can Sibiya SCBA is just going to reconstruct the entire crime scenario. So the reconstruction begins, you know, the three the four days or five days in advance or maybe maybe ten days or 15 days. So they are going to look into his phone calls. They're going to look into his finances. If the money was transferred or whom he was, that becomes a precedence then any death, no matter what reasons.

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And people I mean, your entire chapter will open up.

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No, I tell you what, in this, the Eddie's coming up coming, you know, for this completely, you know, or confirms it that the case has become political. Right. Because the Eddie never comes into the picture, you know, of in a case like this. I mean, all my life, whenever we did stories on the CBI and all these investigating agencies, so we have invariably we have seen that this the CBI takes up the case.

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And after the CBI enquiry, CBI investigation or the chargesheet, Eddie comes into the picture just to find out if there if at all and if there is any fear of.

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But now we see that for everything you do just comes in and sibiya just Amethi, unless you deliver the money to a political journalist, that limits me a couple of days earlier saying that he thinks that this will last the Libyan elections and this is going to be something that's going to be brought up till the Bihar election. So clearly, it's political. But I mean, the kind of reporting we thought she divvies that the sort of reporting we saw then was abysmal.

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This is in two hundred, the kind of stuff that we are seeing. And more recently with regard to what these NGOs, the kind of stuff that people have said, and it's amazing that there are women and Cosulich under the microscope in Africa leading the sort of reportage where you like Wishnie Wash Michali, our PRK educator you must keep as a culture verratti.

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It's so I mean, it is so.

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And if, you know, hope fashion shoots with an offshore account and, you know, just giving that whole vampyres kind of whatever the family may think, it's still an allegation you can't now start portraying.

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And I mean, just by the way, two weeks ago we were being told what a scientific brayne was, how you read, you know, books and astrophysics and stuff like that. And suddenly now he's this guy. Apparently you wish me well. Get out of college to give me control, Magath.

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So, I mean, it's been really, really, really. And they've also on she wasn't a manager, but a former manager who apparently worked with him for one one movie or something. They've also brought on her to side out. And the parents are begging. I mean, they've put out two appeals to the media saying that please don't bring her kids out. We know what it was. We don't want to go through this stuff of reliving everything.

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So please stop calling it rape. Murder.

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I mean, they're all just all sorts of stuff. They're saying you're not even listening to them. I mean, apart from the media, there's another there's another very curious angle to this, which is the public curiosity. If you look at Instagram and this I've been noticing for the past one month at least, I mean, from the moment he's died, one I think a lot of people since Ishant themselves, I think everyone, just everyone who's not had a good in life kind of looks at this case and has his own angst that they're taking out.

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And there's also this like right from day one, they've been so many Instagram accounts that they've made of Sushant on guitar. And they were also a very popular TV screen couple.

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They like the Roger Ross and Rachel of attackable, basically, and they were dating each other. And I guess the breakup happened.

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And but they've been so many Instagram accounts that have been pushing this thing that had he been with her, he would not have committed suicide. And and really horrible memes of CHAKRABORTY also in that key, don't leave a girl, you know, don't leave a girl like that with her. Nice. You know, Pavitra picture for a girl like this because she may be wanting you for your money and all that. So fine media. I remember doing this like my uncle said, he has had run ins with the Mumbai police.

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They've been investigating and the police. So he's just taking it on, taking them on for, you know, his own personal reasons and other journalists. What he because I don't understand people like why are you spending so much time on Instagram making these Meems hating on Rhia and then this kind of obsession with guitar and Sushant? It's all really it could make for a fascinating sociological study. Well, sociological.

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It's like it in the you know, jilted lovers have come out. It was just unbelievable. I think you put up in this case is a wortmann to death.

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That is all you need to investigate.

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But now it's going into all sorts of. But I think I think misery is a is a ripe market, whether it is for God, men, for yoga gurus or anybody else and television.

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I discovered that, too. Before I come back to my junk on on what's happening in Mumbai right now, I had one question from two Mandu.

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Yeah, go ahead. I want to ask you, I mean, you are you're in Bombay and you're reporting on the industry. What is the kind of conversations that are happening in the industry, whether it's actors, directors or producers? Like because you haven't heard anything from them? No reactions. I think obviously everyone wants to stick by it because I think they just don't want any attention. But I mean, one of the kind of stuff that you're hearing, how are they viewing this?

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I'm scared they are going to add to this question that we see that if you criticize Salman Khan, I mean, his Twitter army is almost as as much as the BJP, Twitter Army and people like Shah Rukh Zamunda online, they're very powerful. How come they they don't use that power to push back at all? So here's a thing.

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Right? And that's the sense I'm getting based on social media, is that while there is a public curiosity and and it's a little reality television drama for each person was basically locked up in their homes and thinking about their own lives and reflecting it upon seeing whatever it is that's going on around them. That is a massive toll on me at work as well. And I would like to believe this is a way to allow me. I tell you, what happened in this particular case was around the same time, about a month ago.

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I think about a month or maybe twenty days ago is when I opened my dear, on Twitter and I was in one of these channels. But they were asking for CBI position. I didn't. And it was. I mean, which was. Is he going to argue for argue that there should not be a deeper investigation into the case? So that's what I was saying, like it should be and that it should be outside of politics and all those things.

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Now, these guys thought that maybe I'm part of that whatever group that they are. I decided they started bombarding my dorm with a tweet, CBI position three three three 13 p.m. All of you, last time you guys got it right. So there was a concerted campaign that I've been taking screenshots of that because I had no idea until that point that there is another force at work together. And my conjecture is that that force has also been against Bollywood to what you would extend.

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The debt is a large religion. Let me, if I can call them that, that genuinely believes that that Bollywood is Islamic. They have a problem with cousins being the top stars and stuff like that. These things used to be said privately, but not so privately back in the 90s, early 90s. In any case, to see some front pages. You see all these things being talked about, reticulation as they knew it, and all kinds of all kinds of religion like narrative, which otherwise has not been part of the discourse in the film industry.

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Even a Toyota Arjan with the Toyota Shaquille became a. Are you back exactly on a limb, Don. Right.

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Right. And it became really bad in the early 90s, in any case, with the rights as a backdrop. But by and large, they've always they always had this this religion led a troll army has always had some sort of like has always seen Bollywood as it as an area to target. And they've been they've been at it for the past five to six years. If you do this and I know a lot of people keep talking about all these Bollywood guys and why don't they just speak up and, you know, what is your take on the government as it what they generally cannot?

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Because I get it.

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They can't do that. Yeah, of course they discuss. But I'm just wondering at an online level, if, like I remember sometime back I had tweeted something about Salman Khan case and it come up for, you know, ruling or I think the that former tourism minister of Rajasthan was at some party or something or the other. And the way they come at you is like the BJP, the online army is I'm not saying take on the government, but when are not sits there and says things that which you pointed out in that show.

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And I highly recommend people watch that Dhamar dispatches at my unk. You know the kind of thing he says murder gang. And all she said was that their online social media army can definitely is big enough to counter the narrative, is it not, as an undercurrent to horror and alea, but at least was so popular?

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Why wouldn't she want to put out a counternarrative on social media which speaks on that no matter how scared are they even I mean, they have an online presence, which is huger than our numbers.

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I don't know what it would be like to wake up every morning and have, say, about twenty thousand people saying that you are on your personal Instagram or your personal Twitter while you have lots of followers. It reached a point where Coranderrk had to practically quit Twitter. Right? I mean, he's he's unfollowed every single person. And I think these things have taken a toll on your on your mental health. And that's not what your job is. I can understand a politician being attacked all day because that's really their job to like constantly being narrative's and destroy the past ones and and sort of find yourself in the middle of it and become relevant as a result.

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But these guys want to make films. They're in the in the job of looking for a great script and an amazing location or some amazing talents to work with and somehow continue making the movies. I think a lot of the times, and at least in this case, they try to remain quiet because it may not be what their mental health, you know, they they probably they're waiting for help to freeze over. And certainly I think Whittle is going to suffer as a result because they have such lax policies in terms of and also very selective policies on who goes after a woman, what is OK and what is not going to drive away these people because they don't know any any of any of the followers on anything.

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Right. And especially when, you know, it has a religious overtones. So the Salvation Army is perhaps even to some extent, the shadow economy. But Manami for sure, his supporters, I think they're on the back foot because it's taken a serious religious overtone. And you know how the Hindu bigot is like on Twitter. I mean, there's just that totally unhinged and unstoppable and they're coordinated. And in this case, they actually got together position because what they wanted to was Sushant, the CBI, because I have screenshot.

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But you you missed a trick that you should have infiltrated that group and done an investigative piece of how they off.

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It's like I know they're coming from London. My only thing was I don't know. It's also these guys were all holed up in our homes and I didn't know what they wanted to get into that toxic culture. It would all be easy to infiltrate because they invited me. All I needed was accepting that I was not seeing everything. All I can see is the comments that people are making in terms of, OK, guys, look, let's all get real solid within the.

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You know, that kind of shit, but if I had become part of them, I know how long they would have had me without finding out that I'm not one of them. But it would have been. But I don't know, man. I think it's just getting to me, this whole toxicity of of online trolls to a point where maybe it's one of those phone anymore. It's not I don't know to what extent it's worth engaging with because we all know what's going on.

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It's kind of out in the open its whole investigation.

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No, he's right. And the kind of stuff that's been said about paranoia, honestly, I mean, it's true that he must be really I mean, about his sexuality, about his children, the kind of abuses hurled at him every every. I mean, if you see the time and even on Instagram, which is supposed to be like a happy, happy platform, it can actually take a lot of. So I can imagine.

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I mean, I can and then to be blamed for some months, you said, is anyway. And it's a very big allegation face, you know, and then from like 50000 people who think you are the reason why someone killed themselves, it can really, really wreck.

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You were totally agree with you. So I'll move on to the next subject. I had a couple of emails, you know, to read out before that one announcement, like, you know, the Hafter is free for the next three or four weeks. So I do urge you guys to continue to subscribe. But meanwhile, it's a good time to share afterwards, you know, four or five of your friends or relatives, those who have not been able to, you know, consume half that because it has been behind a paywall the next four or five weeks are good weeks to introduce them to it.

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And then if they like it, you know, probably if you put it behind the paywall, some of them will come back with us behind the paywall.

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So if you are consuming it for free and you don't want to subscribe, what you can do for us is definitely share it further with more people. So thank you for that already. If you're doing it now, a couple of emails. Enough that I want to get it to. I would like since my uncle said that the kind of loony people that are on Twitter will hell check out the television panels and you'll see people like Sajida Tambra, who when I had just finished school and I was in college, she was like I tweeted, she would make some of the modern day bigots look like Nelson Mandela.

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She is she wasn't invited. And she was actually on a panel right when she was on. Some chat shows are not stuck with Druid Savannah.

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So she was actually on a panel being given the respectability that I can't even imagine her getting, you know, twenty, twenty five years ago. But this email is from Detroit. Guys, your responses to why you can't pronounce don't want to make an effort to pronounce the name properly reeks of privilege. While the issue brought up by the subscriber may be small, but your response falls on the same spectrum of behavior many of us face on a daily basis when interacting with people with more systemic privilege.

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As an Indian girl who grew up internationally in predominantly white communities, I grew up having my name butchered left, right and center. Even when I made the effort to correct the people, they made zero efforts. Many coined nicknames for me without my consent, and I went along with it just to fit in because that is all a teenager wants. But that experience made me feel like my existence was inconvenient, like I was causing pain to others. As a result, I became quieter, trying to be invisible through my school and college years.

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Your subscriber made an effort to correct you your response for not being able to pronounce names correctly because you don't know.

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And that stuff was microaggression. When you don't make any effort to get a city or state's name right. Intentionally or unintentionally, you are also working to make that place. And its people are little invisible, all because it doesn't fit into your convenient worldview, like your take on mental health. I recommend you update your perspective on micro aggressions. Just because you have Tamil doesn't make doesn't mean you don't have racist tendencies. I personally believe we are all tribalist, racist, sexist and racist simply because we have been raised into a system that encourages that kind of discrimination.

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And therefore it is imperative we each, especially the educated, privileged ones who have made who have no excuse for ignorance, try our best to root out systemic discrimination, read up, be better. So thank you for that email and thank you for your support.

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Thoroughly appreciate people like you who actually subscribe and keep news independent. I will politely disagree with most of your mail just because someone disagrees with another. It's not microaggression. A world where everybody has to agree with the other is not a world free of microaggression.

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I think that's a world free of any sort of viewpoints that may be dissimilar. I get what you're saying about growing up. International people are pronouncing your name. I think that is not unique to any one community or nationality or ethnicity. Like you're saying that I conveniently use that I'm half Tamil and that means I can't be racist towards Tamils. I agree that's not necessarily true. But just so you know, the Tamil side of my family used to say I've been Undun.

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They're going to say I've been on them. I didn't ever accuse them of being racist or trying to make me invisible. I do think there is such a thing as being overwork or oversensitive. You may disagree with me, but that doesn't mean there's microaggression. That just means you disagree with me, just like I disagree with you. And if you call everything racism and sexism, then nothing is racism and sexism. I've said that before. So that's my view of the panel.

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And I think not being able to pronounce because I'm not familiar with the language is different from me picking on someone. I mean, those are two different things, I may not know how to pronounce a French name or, I don't know, Swiss name or Thomond name, but it's very different from from me, from making fun of someone's name. So, I mean, I don't think the two things are the same. And obviously, we can't correctly pronounce all the, you know, names and all the many different languages out there.

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I mean, that's a different thing.

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I agree. One can try, but I mean, people who try harder maybe are more diligent and more efficient and maybe more sensitive, but someone who doesn't is not racist. I think one should be careful how you throw around words like racist and fastest. It's, in my view, a bit irresponsible to throw those around words around loosely because then you kind of lose sight of calling it out when you really see it. I don't know your view.

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So my wife is Telugu, her village name. I'm not able to. After 30 years, I'm not able to pronounce it even today. So if I say something, it looks for me short. I don't think I am because I salute you.

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Vegetating very sad in. And she's she's a German.

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She's really not.

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They set up got I feel like I mean vegetal, which are the first thing, I think the only thing that I dislike when people think of Sardars but literally literally you don't look at that.

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You don't get the. But then this letter is from Richar.

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Rejas, a letter as little long. So I may not read the whole thing, but the basic cruxes. Heindl of that the Harper's letter has been the most debated discussion in liberal circles, especially among journalists. But there has been a flawed framing of the part of those railing against being cancelled. They have been allowed to define what being council is and everyone has gone along with it. J.K. Rowling's books haven't been cancelled. Her platform on which she which she speaks, such as Twitter with her millions of followers, haven't been taken away from her.

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She's only really going to be uninvited from some of the most respected platforms, such as New York Times or Harvard University, which is a direct consequence of her not being able to correct her stance even when confronted with overwhelming evidence in opposition to her views. At what point does free speech guarantee you will foot in every door and no consequences for that which you speak? Free speech absolutists also need to reckon with the fact that anti trans speech reduces the free speech rights of trans people that ability to speak from the adopt agenda.

[00:37:24]

It infringes upon their right to speak with authority and not assumed as mentally ill or someone to feel. I've grown up on Harry Potter around the world and escape during my sensitive teenage years. The books have truly helped me a lot. I would still recommend those books and her writing, but at some point I have to accept that she isn't an authority on everything. And her inability to reckon with new evidence and accept that she might be wrong leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

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Last I checked, she has fourteen point three million followers on Twitter and I don't think she's been cancelled.

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Very wise also had propagated extreme Zionist Zionism to the extent that she labels anyone who is critical of the Israeli government as anti-Semitic. I would argue that she has been reductive and has pointed fingers at anyone exercising their free speech when it's against someone.

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She believes the Israeli policy towards Palestine leaves a lot of space for fair criticism. She has also not been canceled policy. She just isn't at the level of other New York Times opinion columnists if she's getting harassed within deselect channels. And that might be a different issue. But she will most definitely get hired by a new liberal website soon. And to summarise, the framing of free speech users have been extremely flawed about defining what cancellation really means. It often means not getting unfettered access to the highest quality liberal outlets and all social media circles.

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And then you've just ended with I really like listening to have that provides a wonderful context for all the news which is sometimes missing from other news sources. I like you all. It's difficult to pick a favorite, but I've grown to appreciate maharajahs points of view more and more over the last few months that I've been a subscriber. So thank you, Richard. Thank you for your support. Thank you for subscription and thank you for this very well articulated mail, some of which I agree with and some I don't.

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But I've said my piece, so thanks. Appreciate it.

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Now, if we could, we have a bunch of other mail readers out a little later.

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If we could just quickly talk about yesterday's and they because I've read before you move on to the first news item, I have to say, being a distant observer of the bunch of emails, these two emails that you read so far, I mean, I'm quite astounded by the quality of emails you get unless you actually get it written by your staff.

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And even if you consider your dream of writing, if more intelligent than us, it's interesting you should say this, you know, because I subscribe to the right and I have said often that, you know, my views on gender were very buma because I was male, female, all boys boarding. So I just had that, you know, the use of the word pansy was normal when I was growing up. So my subscribers have actually kind of made.

[00:39:58]

Be more evolved on gender, because I have said some pretty remarkably stupid things on this show, and so I actually get more from them than they get from me on my own, on wisdom, them strong. But, you know, we had a newsletter, subscribers meet when we were hosting a conference in Boston a couple of years ago as a mother and I were there saying about twenty five thirty showed up and each of them introduced themselves. Yeah, you're right.

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We have wonderful subscribers and I'm extremely grateful of them and proud of them.

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But like Rich, do you usually get subscribers like e mails of the sort, which would be what I have begun to believe is the new liberal, as it were, which is almost in a certain way very different from this liberalism that we grew up on, but is almost mimicking the extreme extremist views of the right wing on certain stances that take where it is, especially on free speech and casual culture. Is that is that a core demographic in terms of the kind of people who follow news laundry, or is this an exception?

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Was imminent exception in that regard?

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Actually, interesting you say that I highly recommend you listen to the last two 1/2 days. We have a bunch of kids. You know, I had discussed something which I wasn't aware of called safety ism.

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I discovered it after this whole batebi is you know, I hope I'm pronouncing a name correctly, but it is the best I can do. She resigned from The New York Times.

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So there's this concept called safety ism, which is stated as a liberal kind of principle that you can't say anything that triggers or makes me uncomfortable or kind of makes me feel I'm in a toxic work environment or toxic domestic environment. So you have to tiptoe around these people and some people very rudely call them snowflakes because you have to tiptoe around every issue. So on that and there is like this whole letter that was written by the likes of Salman Rushdie and Rowling and many other writers were there of that generation, called it out as Ganzel culture, which is, I guess, a part of leftism.

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And there has been they have insisted that safety is inviolate. Claims to uphold liberal values represents everything that as opposed to liberal values, which is not wanting to engage with or being exposed to views that they disagree with. And we got a lot of meals around that. But interestingly, we got emails from both sides. So there were lots of people who actually called me out that I'm just being an insensitive prick. But there was several males who kind of said, no, we do think that this is going too far and that if you can't even speak your mind, then what kind of liberalism is it?

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So there's no one type, at least on this issue as far as New Zealand subscribers are concerned?

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Yeah, we've had a very interesting because I keep following especially, you know, this is really coming from the younger lot, the ones who feel that their liberalism is not just being challenged, but actually being trounced by the right. And how do you then respond? Should the response be how it's been for the previous generation, guys like us who thought that we should engage with all kinds of ideas in a newspaper like New York Times should and should get from all kinds of thoughts.

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But then when you bring in the element of and it's become a cliche, I'm sure it's coming from a from a certain space that one needs to study a little product. Isn't the words that triggered everything, you know, on Twitter, everything becomes a trigger and everyone's got it and everything is toxic. You know, these three distinct cliches, I don't know. I mean, it's coming from a young and I might just change discourse from the other end in due course.

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I don't know. I'm sure I'll check out those two podcasts because I'm interested to know where this is headed.

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I know we had some wonderful emails that came in on that, so I highly recommend you.

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Yes. And you do? Yeah. We'll send you the links and we'll also we haven't actually we're going to be doing a series called Analysis. And then we have a podcast where news laundry subscribers can debate with each other or can debate with someone from the news on the team. And we're going to have a series on safety ism. So that should be coming up soon. Moving on to the coverage for the last two days, the bricklaying ceremony, our in-house Brahmin privileged elite, Panditji, will tell us whatever it's called.

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It's wrong. Yeah, it's vice. That's wrong. You are so well, I thought you were going to take.

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Is she. She will tell you. Tell us what happened.

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Not you'll tell us what the actual term is. It's not a matter of being not true.

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We've worked too hard. We thought I saw someone giving the police who got paid eukaryote hogy pivo Korea hoggett like there was a there was a real on this on the whole thing. But, but yeah.

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Just let do amazing tactics of people that are so there was wall to wall coverage.

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I was shocked at it. I actually have mixed feelings on it.

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I don't think it is purely a media creation. I think there is a huge feeling across the country and it would be a mistake for liberals to think that this is just a fringe thing. I think it is a thing that a lot of people feel about the temple being there. And I don't think one needs to call out all of them as bigots for feeling that way. I think it's legitimate to feel if your dearest state doesn't have a temple dedicated to him at his birthplace, even whether you think that's historical or not.

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But the. Political messaging around this, I have always said, is worrying, and I think we've got to a stage of no return and I see this having thought it through, this is not a casual comment. I think India has entered into a phase where you will need a Bapu like figure to bring it back to the founding principles of what we will. What is the coverage like, Manisha?

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And if you could follow the harrowing I mean, after like a week of social enterprise, put them through the week of RAM. So it was really you had, I think every angle, of course, that we can all sang Budgens, every angle greeted, you know, the Jeshurun was all over all news channels. You had lots of D'Anna with the Saluda Tambra. And I remember I mean, his exact words were the key ajab I admitted on his speeches it made George Patiala Mickey good day talking about more than I said.

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He said that while he said he's not Jewish. So I think the fact that the demolition happened is just forgotten and it's not even forgotten. And most of them actually all AnCo said that it's not been implying the Castleview who were shot, Catholics who went up and, you know, brought the dome down. So it was almost a celebration or Giacomino naked, adds Katamari. And so it was almost a celebration. I mean, of course, of the temple coming, but also a negation of the fact that that was a crime that happened and a celebration of the fact that it did happen.

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I mean, Koiki Baraki look blanky massive keratoconus temple so you wouldn't go there when it was brought down.

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What was the composition of people there like? Now I see a lot of people who are not necessarily political in nature, but are happy. Of course, this also has a lot to do with feeling happy about something. So, you know, you just join in the celebrations. That was it. All political people back then. And do you see any difference in what was the mood of the nation back then and today?

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The mood of the nation. I was there for seven days. It happened on 6th. I reached down 3rd and I stayed there till death. OK, so the mood over there was really frenzy. You had over to like Conserver.

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And they weren't just political workers. They were regular people who are Kado based people, mostly the RSS Kado when we HP says BHP, Hannah Montana, Shiv Sena. So all these people were there. So so their, their mood was very frenzied. But I still remember the reporting that we had done at that time when I said we don't I mean all people, all reporters across the newspaper, it was quite balanced. It was it wasn't taking sides like it is now.

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Now, like it is in the papers to have like, huge full page of freedom.

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And it's basically a celebration.

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It was nothing of that sort at that time. It was the dawn. How it was brought down was reported. In fact, I used to work with Peckford at that time and I had a very good source. And I was the only reporter on 5th of 5th of December, nineteen ninety two. I was the one who reported that how they're going to bring it to where these people are going to come and have seen my source. What?

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No, not the practice practice that Orissa's was doing it.

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So those pictures had come, many people had come up with this picture. So you are linking them. Those pictures with demolition on 6th is not the right way of getting the story. These people who had come, they were not part of that crowd. They are going to come on the same night through Saraiva. And this information had come from a military intelligence source from your regiment. I can say. Now, the regiment at that time when I was summoned by LeBron Commission, I did not tell them the president writes this.

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I said they asked me my source and this source, this was the central I'm in military intelligence, which was feeding all this information to the central government. And that way of giving us similar right to say at that time, the center said that we could not judge it, that it can go to that extent was wrong because they had the full information.

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They had full information because I got it from their own source.

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So I think what they're smart, outplayed politically back then may have reaped political dividends then, but in the long term, it's completely destroyed.

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The Congress and the BJP has run away with this narrative in a way which he could not have imagined opening the lock.

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They are mostly I mean, the Congress, the favorite game is just remain inactive on the issues which they cannot address to. Right. So that's what they did on your day.

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Also, they were enacted, I think not only I mean, one thing that struck you and news and especially I wonder what do Muslims feel when they watch news, if they watch news? I mean, if I was the most eminent, I just wouldn't watch television news. But I mean, each channel also had, you know, some Muslim panelists, maybe some. From the board, and not only was it the, you know, Kushima nanny cam all but a lot of the anchors also porking Muslims to take it up, to show up almost to get them to say that.

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Hi, baby. Very happy Ramiz Sunday. That was literally the purpose of what a lot of anchors were trying to do.

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We had a few TV channels and not only TV, I think was the ITV. ITV was there. And I remember the reporter who was standing with me on the rooftop and his camera was taken away. OK, so when the entire thing started on six, so so are even these people.

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They reported it very young. It wasn't like this, but it wasn't like this at all. But the tradition was different, although the channels they were videocassettes.

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Eyewitness, ITV eyewitness has a fantastic documentary. So they were there were a whole bunch of that, my uncle in Bombay. I mean, I'm a part of groups which are very non-political groups. These groups have only been made to wish happy birthday plans, celebrations, planned parties. These groups have never fought. There's no I mean, we have a principle of no political post on that group. In the last two days, I have seen fights break out on such groups at someone's engeström.

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And so I do think we've gone that. So what I understand because of covid, I guess one doesn't get a feel of on the ground like I saw in delisa markets or dressed up welcoming Lorem politically. This was a huge issue for the ships in the 80s and 90s. Not so much for the Democrats. Shiv Sena is the Bombay media, at least the local media, as celebratory as the Delhi media and the media is. And do you see this as just a little, you know, two days of celebration and tamasha, or do you think it has changed India like never before?

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Well, I think in that sense, I would like to believe that Bombay media, especially news and news from the point of view of print, actually has a pretty wide spectrum. Right. From what times of India for one of its work is is a liberal paper even on on issues like this on most occasions. And then you have the other end, which would be a somewhat like paper. And I think papers also which which are essentially media, which are the papers which take a similar stand, the papers in particular because of the readership that they essentially cater to, which are essentially community papers.

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But whenever there is a they tend to report religion as culture and that is really where it is. I think we should be OK. I feel even in WhatsApp groups, whether even even when we disagree with the person within the Jeshurun, because I don't think it should be that the fact that we allow that salutation to be taken over by political parties where the problem began with anyway, if this person believes there's simply wants and if I like them already in India and that one is going to make a big difference to his religiosity, I think we should appreciate that a little remain at that level rather than take him on on subjects that he may not have thought of otherwise.

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I think Ram Temple, the way it was reported, also was done as a cultural a story across which I'm surprised if I was the head of Sunstar Channel, I would be taking over this this this event as my own. You know, I would make that as my big, big a proper entertainment show, as it were, and get the genuine and rather Pauwels and and alcoholic's and the parts of the world, including a concert happening in my studio, rather than having to listen to what is not exactly a single.

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And she's trying our best because in her head, that is, you know, she's trying to appeal to her viewer and the part of the columns and news channels is the problem. Right? If there was one side of it, it would be perfect. So I think this is news.

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The news had called on that Woodvale and it's the catcalled.

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And I mean, if I was a Sony TV, I would make a proper real shot of it and turn it into the entertainment that it has been for a large part of Indian masses anyway, because culture is how we entertain ourselves. And if you look at our hotel, for instance, of London, I was there last year for a story and which was a cultural story effectively about how Yogi Adenhart has made these trucks, these trailers that show on a regular day on a regular weekday, they show the dominant Sardars Rahmi to the day next to you as well.

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And in the evening, people can walk in and watch any episode from any point to any point is just always this with your guardedness picture, because then you know that it's sponsored. I don't know what it's by yuppie government or does he use BGB resources? For instance, this particular Boomi Putin was a BGP event. It was not a government event. They made it clear so that at least the action of the separation of and Montreal, as it were, remains.

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Right. So I think if we just treat it as as the culture slash entertainment story, it is, I think it's perfectly fine. And that's what I think. Entertainment channels should have done with this with this massive event, rather than having to leave the leave it to these complete amateurs on bigger channels and even news channels.

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I mean, I just think while I understand the author of a lot of people in law drama and he should have his dwelling place, I think a few people are realizing this. I mean, I know a few personally, because as the fire comes closer to your home, you kind of realize, oh, shit, what have I been backing for so long? But from the speech to what young pages Vesuvio has said, and there's been one other BJP politician from Yuppy who has said they just said that Hindus should have all resources and control of governance and economic resources because if you don't have it, you know, they'll take all this away from us.

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So that is actually a narrative which I think will not stop with this. Those who thought that this was just about at asked really bitterly disappointed. This will not stop here, like the famous slogan made famous and it was Yetto Hockey, Hematology, Buckie, her ivory.

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And like I said, I think we need a Bubu level leader to undo this damage. We have gone down a road where many suckers are going down, happily jumping until the Pied Piper will make them all plunge down the mountain. And before you know it, some Tripura chief minister will say Sardars and jobs don't have brains. I said, go get them. Then there's a Bengalese at this, then get them until all will have to be Odyssey's YMCA bucks are nothing.

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The BJP politics does not surprise me. I mean, they have been on temple and abrogation of 374.

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But does it surprise you that people think that this is.

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It is not because you see, the thing is that did not surprise me. What was the surprising fact is that after coming into power, they are using I mean, they have made it a part of a larger narrative to ensure that all in the words come to them, to ensure that people do not think along caste lines.

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I should think more like a first. He should think that is a Hindu when it comes to casting the vote so that that this is going to be, you know, of that larger narrative and in which they are going to subdue the importance of all the institutions like Judiciary. I mean, everything is now contributing to just one single narrative to polarize this country. I think that that has surprised me.

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One more thing that it firmly mocked yesterday was a complete failure of secularists, as it were, right from the beginning. The opposition to that. I mean, it's been such a spectacular failure, this whole episode. And he has a site where the Supreme Court has said that it was a criminal conspiracy. There was a criminal act. There's a CBI inquiry ongoing that hasn't moved at all before any of the guys were punished. You have a booming position, which is to it is basically triumphalism.

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And I understand like I've been in and said that I know people myself who the last night and it at least is from the cowbird. If you know, people from Yupi deprivation track and even it's been a long standing aspiration for people. And the question of whether there was a temple there or not that's been long lost. I think most Hindus, at least I mean I can speak of, not India, believe that there was a temple there which was brought down the area, the BJP having spread that narrative.

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The question then was whether it's going to be a reconciliation of we are looking at mosque and temple politics or what is going to be triumphalism and I think triumphalism completely. One, this was not just about a temple forum, but this was also to show the Muslims their place. This was also those who are not Hindus.

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They pleased to know that a country for Hindus, first as students, even in the classrooms, we were told, you know, about secularism, the two way of interpreting it. One is the Western way where the state is not associating with any religion, complete divorce between religion and state. And the second is equal respect for all religion. So where does India fall? OK, that's what we used to study. But I think the BJP has done both and and they are trying to redefine and redefine because secularism is still part of, you know, the Constitution.

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Let's see for how long I want to be. I say that also as people love. Yes. Yes, I think I do.

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Yeah, right. And the Supreme Court, if I'm not mistaken, to knock a secularism out of the Constitution in the preamble, obviously. No, it's the one that reported a week ago something I don't know if someone actually did file such a case.

[00:59:36]

I mean, I remember reading it, but I don't think the Supreme Court has anything pending like this right now. I mean, there was some what I think I think the Supreme Court actually dismissed it or some dismiss it. There was a court.

[00:59:47]

Yes, you're right. Someone had said that was taken out, but it was dismissed a while ago. Yeah.

[00:59:51]

The only reconciliation that seems to have happened, which every other TV news just went ballistic with, it was Modisane. Instead of Shriram, which was read into quite a bit beyond the real realm, is actually the traditional. This is the Malad assertion. I mean, Jeshurun was this was the political, social, political assertion.

[01:00:10]

And this is the Malow part of it. And where I think I think more or less to me, the Modi has declared India Hindu nation and the rest of the communities, you know, they have to live and respect this, you know, sense of indignation, basically.

[01:00:28]

Did you I think I think all for all this is for all practical reasons, this has happened despite our Constitution.

[01:00:36]

But what is what is being said? I mean, just here, I'm like in terms of just the semantics of it.

[01:00:43]

JCA Exito. So when you used to love actually he was a child, he couldn't be married. Yeah.

[01:00:50]

But I think to just go from Eugena you always play sitar before and that gender equality hearing is this supposed to be a jazeerah is something which you know have been very people rever these people.

[01:01:06]

People worship serum. But Shriram this started in 1990. It was a political riluzole like I mean, I've written a piece on it on a blog long ago. I mean, when I was growing up, you know, not Jeshurun, but Rangeela or Omron was a very normal family. Mulheron but that is how he would actually greet us each time he used to come to the house. And it was a very normal everyday Selim's USA. So it was it was never just freedom.

[01:01:35]

But I can just quote songsmith, this anchor on NDTV, he was trying to do this balancing of, you know, wanting to show that I'm also in the TAPI game, but I'm not like the rest. So he came up with that. He's from there and he says when he was growing up, there wasn't a lot of Scarfe policy that on me, which I see that I'm Sitaram Sitaram written on it. He said, no, you don't get it now.

[01:01:57]

It's Jeshurun. I just try to ask some shopkeepers. They had some old stock like Vison dismayed. He says they haven't done it consciously, but now the Sitaram, he's not sold the Jeshurun, not his soul. So that's a political slogan. But so that that was I learned something new from the. I just thought the way news and channels have buckled is truly depressing.

[01:02:17]

And I can see my gli. I mean, I don't think it is without reason.

[01:02:22]

There's huge pressure. Like when I was telling you the kind of things that I said on this WhatsApp chat I was on that has some Muslims, but it was the Hindus who kind of pushed back because even those Muslims did not really have the guts to respond to that chat, even though what was being said is very offensive to them. I think that's what we've got.

[01:02:38]

So people feel compelled. But when it comes to the prime minister's speech, I don't think there's anything mellow in it. People can keep reading into the Seetharaman dissent. Gaurav, haven't the wannabe commando wannabe Sanskrit teacher wannabe pundit doing Ivens wannabee everything except doing his job as a reporter was giving us all this semantics on how Jazeerah is the mellowing and this is a change of narrative and cut before the master stroke.

[01:03:04]

No idea the reason why I couldn't watch him for that long. But when they went on the break, the bumper of the string that all channels had created for going in and coming out to break the slogan investing was James Shriram Lagarto Gunshop electoral slogan Chiappe. They took up the post production team later by Agent Beluga. At least make sure the bumper doesn't make me look like a fool.

[01:03:25]

Khorosan is a creation of time. He has worked with me nineties ok 1998. He was my reporter in inexpressive was completely, he was a, he was the defence correspondent that he was completely before. Before that he was the city correspondent. He was a different guy.

[01:03:42]

I did. This narrative has changed a lot. But I'm going to model modest body language. I think that is something that was even more evident in how he was marching, the way he walks, the contempt and disdain with which he looks at him and people like you get it. They're not. You get his name.

[01:03:59]

He bungled his name. You say he's. Yeah, it's not something. No, no, this is the review is nice.

[01:04:06]

But I mean, the disdain he has is so evident that they're yorgi, not literally Natcore the Oscar, but Leonardo Da Vinci Code enchilada, Da Vinci. That's OK. That's maybe him not being able to pronounce that, which is fine. I mean, I'm not saying he's he doesn't like the Leonardo, but I just think he understands how big he is.

[01:04:28]

And nobody but nobody even within his party can expect to be treated with respect to Doris's pardon on the very high pedestrian, he called himself Samarrai Omari of some kind of level of North Korean reporting that happened yesterday.

[01:04:43]

I'll tell you, connectivities, when Angka he's in there with, you know, ramyun in front of it and just being like a meter by. So she says, you know, he did this whole shebang in front of the room, just little.

[01:04:55]

So she she like. Did you need this prime minister? Angela Corey, obviously liberal leader and so on, is the Bahraini ramlal letter he rajwant as the likin when he said Anika Noni Joga committed beyond the level of this anchor who's, you know, giving Mortez so much motive to something like this, thinking on behalf of Moodies.

[01:05:20]

You know, I was just like, these are all India Muslim Personal Law Board. They have said today I in this statement read that under the Sharia law, we know that this must be what existed here. So for us the most, it will remain in that place. And now they have said it today.

[01:05:40]

So now this is the Muslim law that says all Indian Muslim personal law because there's no law keeping an eye on him.

[01:05:48]

And what I feel now so I do not blame if if the Muslims, you know, they raise themselves as a monolithic community and they start and they become and they become, then, you know, also I think the messaging, which nobody had actually the guts to discuss because everyone was falling into the same narrative, was that why was this chosen for the day?

[01:06:10]

Which abrogation of Article 370 was the day of martyrdom for Kashmir?

[01:06:15]

Is this the answer? It is not by chance. Absolutely the message. And like I said, if people still want to pretend that this is where it stops and nothing else happened, I welcome to I think they want to own stock, but I, I just find it disturbing.

[01:06:29]

But I think I will be living through very interesting times in my life, which I never thought I would.

[01:06:34]

Interesting I, I feel a dread. I feel lucky sometimes when I look at my parents usually, you know, you don't have to.

[01:06:40]

I don't really know. I'm happy. I was I was the first time in my life I've been a very rabid in their field and I'm pretty nativist. I have been. But now, I mean, for the first and last two years, I felt like I don't know I don't know if I want to see what's happening to me as a professional.

[01:06:58]

I was pretty happy to you know, I was with the Indian Express, but then I had a I started seeing the bad time. I'm very happy that I'm not in jail. I'm glad.

[01:07:09]

I mean, at least someone is interesting, too. I don't know if I just feel it's going to be really tiring times. And especially when you see the media capture, it's it is impossible to fight this with move.

[01:07:20]

Before we move to the next subject of my uncle, any additional thoughts on this issue?

[01:07:25]

Yeah, well, I mean, I sort of agree with all of you because, I mean, we've all had friends in Pakistan and they said the same thing about what happened with the US, Pakistan back in 79 and how a country totally opposite which which had a certain life and a certain culture and a certain way of a certain worldview, completely became an unrecognizable country almost overnight with the Islamisation of Pakistan. You know, we tend to see Pakistan as the way it is, and that is always the way it was.

[01:07:52]

But that's really not the case. I mean, they were done in by us, by a government, and of course, they were by liturgically. You see the same story here about Iran and you need people from there, especially the generation in there in the 50s and the 60s. Now, the Iran that it grew up in is very different from the Iran, the Islamize, the Islamization of Iran. Of course, there was a comic book around it.

[01:08:15]

Right. That award winning. It's a lovely or graphic novel. I forget what it's called Persepolis. Yes, correct. I mean, that's a fabulous idea. I mean, of course, the same graphic novel has been done in the film. And, yeah, it talks about just that Europe, which is which is with the shopping on the sacking of the Shah of Iran and how that so I don't know if you guys have been, but, you know, it's a it's a fascinating country to visit.

[01:08:36]

Until recently, Indians could go without a visa. Of course, that's not the case anymore because we fucked up our relationship with Iran as well. But you see people who are so different from the government, the mostly the people I met in Tehran are all as one sixth of the country is in Tehran to begin with. They're all atheists. The young people are all it is. They don't give a shit about religion, but their government is so different from the people on the ground.

[01:08:59]

And I have a feeling with a lot of people, especially in urban quarters and with technology, even the religious will merge with the urban centers eventually, I think will become very different from the kind of government we have, if that's the rupee taking, because that's really what happened for sure. And and that's where we are at this point.

[01:09:18]

Fact, I was just crazy, Manisha, today about how long this will last. I said there'll be another festive, festive air when the temple gets completed, which will be just around election time. And for a country and I can't disagree.

[01:09:32]

She says eventually people get sick of it. They'll want jobs, they'll want some growth. They'll want some real. I said no. When people are so miserable, it takes very little to make them happy. Just like cricket mad Pakistan happy.

[01:09:43]

I remember, you know, when I think it was 92, only when they won the World Cup, Imran Khan and Imran Khan announced his retirement, I guess, without taking the permission.

[01:09:53]

And when he went back and I had that dinner or lunch for them, he said I. I would urge Imran Khan to reconsider his retirement announcement. Of course, Imran Khan would not have the guts to the Nicaea matter.

[01:10:03]

But that's about all the material I've got along the way. So Imran Khan reversed his decision, but for the longest time, Pakistan was just happy beating Indian cricket.

[01:10:18]

You know, when that generation was had a cricket with me, so they did not give a shit that their country was going to the ships when they beat India. They were thrilled. We are fine. Our country is not much smarter. It can be going to the shits every two years. There'll be some celebration and people will be they will become what cricket was to Pakistan.

[01:10:40]

They will make return to India and successfully.

[01:10:42]

I still have a lot of faith in Indian waters, though. I do think that even though a lot of people are devotional and RAM is important to them or Hinduism is more important. And I do think that we've tasted a certain kind of progress, which is hinged on jobs, good education. I don't think we want to come back from that. I do think that people will want that and will want to get better before I move to the next.

[01:11:05]

Just a couple of other announcements. We have a couple of e-mails. And I could please remind you to subscribe to news, laundry and pay to keep your street, tell your friends relatives. We have a bunch of interesting panel discussions coming up. We have some reports coming up. We have something else in our project. So check out Newser.com and pay to keep news free, please.

[01:11:24]

I urge you, can I just add one point to this discussion? I was actually checking out this image on today, and it is of this guy on a road and maybe we can put it as a link so that people can also see it. He's sitting on a divider. It's flooded both sides and he's crying. And the caption says, I should sing, what if I ever been deposed? Vegetable window, open the shop for the first time in four months on Wednesday, but was forced to shut it because of flooding bursts into tears at Circle as he walked back to his house.

[01:11:51]

And Kurla, now, this is yesterday when the Ramadan celebrations are happening and this guy is crying on the road like this. So, I mean, I do think when things like this happen and when people see that there's no material change in their life, Ram Temple can't keep them happy, you know, forever.

[01:12:05]

I mean, I think it's interesting to read a few books on the Gujarat riots.

[01:12:09]

The people who were rioters were actually the affluent, just drove into the car with their cars, looted malls and came out. But the ones who did the real damage were actually the the most deprived of society.

[01:12:20]

Yeah, it becomes a battle of resources, the same thing in partition. So a lot of it was simply and also they feel empowered.

[01:12:27]

It's a bit like a dangerous cocktail, I hope that Monisha is saying is right. But I also feel that what you're saying.

[01:12:37]

Yeah, but but my uncle I've experienced this in Bombay, for example, scenic view, but not to that level, but through the year, the people who live in the slum and squalor, I will say this, that I realised much as I hate it, when I actually went and lived in Bombay for you, I realised why he became what he became. Because when you used to walk, I was very walking. Lower Parel, like the slums are pretty much spilling onto the road, like in Delhi.

[01:13:01]

The slums still have some rivasi from the road. You see, you can go into a slum and there's I'm not saying they have alicorn, but in Bombay, every passer by is looking into a slum in Delhi slum. Only your neighbour is looking into the house. And then I had a first hand experience of knowing someone who had a problem with the household help. They were really nasty to her. And they you know, this is a big Bollywood name and the Hill police station would not file.

[01:13:29]

And if I had because how dare a maid file a complaint against that star and that maid went to Shiv Sena and that started the whole family were bumbling and compensating her and saying sorry, because Paltalk Riesman said, you provide justice or we will drag your house in your lovely policial. So I it hit me that Viag ballcock reemerged because the police failed. Having said that, Bombay was still a city for the affluent.

[01:13:58]

And when I was there for initiatory in a car in the middle of the hall here, taking it the way they bang your car and look at you defiantly fucka, you have the balls to step out of your car and question me. They will bang your car. They will kick your car.

[01:14:12]

It is the one day where you cannot and say, how dare you fucking touch my car because are fucking shit scared. And while it had it was a one day thing in Bombay, I think Modi will make it a normal thing. You do what you do. Do you see that? My uncle.

[01:14:26]

Oh, so here's the thing of a regional party like Shiv Sena, which is a strongly Cordoba's party, which has his office, practically every neighborhood and neighborhoods within neighborhoods, they almost become like the touch point for people on a daily basis. And something I don't think we appreciate enough in the sense of these guys. If the people in a slum, if they face a problem, they know who to go to. It could well be the corporator that they go to is usually a cynical parado.

[01:14:56]

And this is a village. And a bond that they've built over yours and then it gets paid off during an election, I think that is that is that really explains to a huge extent the power that Shiv Sena wields in the city. And despite nonperformance of the nonperformance, especially when it comes to the municipal corporation, and you see that in your TV news every year of what happens in the floods, they still keep getting voted in back because, you know, there is some which is what you'll notice about so many of these local politicians that they constantly keep in touch with their with their base.

[01:15:30]

And that explains their victory. And in terms of whether they'll be I mean, what are you suggesting? But on some level, also civil war, isn't it that anybody will go beat up anyway? I have a feeling that the government gets all its resources and all power also from the big corporates. And I think I doubt that they would want the laws to suddenly storm the Bastille, as it were. It would not be it would not be something that a big business would be very happy with either.

[01:15:57]

I mean, what you said is interesting, although I have spoken about often in the past, I won't call it civil war, but what I am saying is reeks of anarchy. But it has been my thesis for a while that we are already at some level of functioning anarchy.

[01:16:13]

The only thing is what is anarchy? And there is no rule of law. So I think the question of whose anarchy is anarchy and who's anarchy is order is different. For example, I think the Sanjeev on the case where he ran over five cops and got away with it, and then later there was a retrial.

[01:16:31]

But not nothing significant happened was anarchy that happened in Delhi. So do a lot of tension. But what happens in police stations around the country, what is happening in Delhi today where the police is just arresting people with with no significant evidence and accusing them of is anarchy. Only thing is the anarchy in our society has been anarchy in the favor of those who have the resources and access. So we don't call it anarchy. If let's say, rather than me being able to drive over someone and get away with it, if that person could come into my house, kill me and leave, there is all anarchy.

[01:17:09]

But the fact that the other thing is happening for the longest time, we don't call it anarchy. So and I don't think anarchy is an event or a black and white between order and anarchy, there is a long spectrum. Indian governance is closer to the anarchy end of things than to the other end of things is what I think. So whoever can threaten the other will get his or her way. It's pretty much that simple. And sometimes you use the law, sometimes you use the mob.

[01:17:34]

A couple of emails. This one is from Rahul Gandhi. It is really heartening to see you people discuss significant topics and have thought with such candor. I lost all hope in Indian media and then I found you. You are really the last glimmer of hope for independent media.

[01:17:46]

I like up in my head Arjun romancer, but Monisha is my favorite, especially off.

[01:17:51]

Good choice. Good choice after her vociferous defense of opening of liquor shops during the lockdown. Yeah, because Manisha always covers the most important things, as you can see, because, you know, when the public face the vagaries of what I said, some people drink milk, some people drink beer.

[01:18:09]

Yes, essential service maharajahs.

[01:18:12]

Analysis of cost as defining feature of our site is bang on, as reported by The Economist on July 25th, out of the eighty nine highest ranked civil servants in central government, just four are not upper class Hindus. Two thirds of the Supreme Court judges. Thirty one judges are.

[01:18:26]

More than half of all state governors are upper class Hindus. Out of 121 people in senior jobs, such as editors in mainstream Hindi and English press, all but fifteen are upper crust and not a single one is Dalit. Regarding the debate about subjectivity in journalism, I believe that journalism is not about objectivity, but rather moral clarity. I want to ask whether subscription based model of media is also not open to bias, as people belonging to a particular ideology would stop subscribing to the find the coverage.

[01:18:51]

Not according to that test. Further, not many would be willing to subscribe if they have become habitual free news. So how can you make this model sustainable and independent at the same time? Rahul Gandhi Rahul have actually written a piece called Opposition News Laundry. You're absolutely right. There is no such thing as objectivity. Everything is subjective. It may be subjective around political ideology. Religion, economics are just what I choose to find interesting. So I would recommend you read that.

[01:19:18]

I'm not saying subscription driven platforms are the most efficient or the most free of bias. I think they are the most free of influence of corporations and governments, which are the biggest influence of media. So it's the next best thing. Just like democracy sucks, but it's the best we got. Similarly, subscriptions suck, but it's the best we got.

[01:19:39]

Any other news subscriptions? I got ads.

[01:19:42]

Now he's saying that even that is not free of bias. I agree with him, but there is no such thing as objectivity. Unless you're done with math. Everything is subjective.

[01:19:50]

So then the above says Last week, Swathi made some fantastic points in her email. I was too tired of the topic of discussion being. Weakness and whatnot, at some point, you can't change people's minds. All I will add is that clarifying the religious beliefs of a minority child is not only the right and polite thing to do, not doing so can leave you vulnerable to legal suits. In fact, I said that in the US, especially in New York, you are legally required someone to actually go out and do shit because they there was some famous case where a kid refused to sing the national anthem and they were penalized and the case went all the way to the Supreme Court.

[01:20:24]

So your label Naxalites. So point taken. What you are saying is that even if there was an overly walke teacher, what the teacher is doing is legally correct and it should be actually lauded rather than made fun of. Point taken, although I do think it's a bit much, but I get what you're saying from a legal point of view, Zaal says nice words added up in London to justify what to you is call-out culture when you do it to another Artosis and it's Ganzel culture when a bunch of bread beaters and No-Name Twitter handles do it to billionaire J.K. Rowling or New York Times columnist Barry Wise, I know that you will try to explain again what the difference between these two type of critique is.

[01:21:00]

But just imagine if I was employed by NDTV and then quit over his colleagues making fun of him on the TV channel. Would you go off to the sensitive safety seeking and the TV reports of bullying are now already doubling down enough for being a bumbling idiot? That's basically it. May I suggest you take a breath and first try to understand that the Stallworth's of publishing were whining in the Harper's letter about a bunch of nobody anonymous Twitter accounts who ironically termed the critic cancelling because Twitter take credit was the only means available to them to find solidarity, arguably a bit like what nuisance tries to do every week to the public and with even the same amount of real world effect, nothing.

[01:21:38]

When famous authors of mediocre children's books get to unabashedly spew their bigotry against already marginalized jaunts, people to the millions of followers on a slow snowflake reporter goes after the actual job of Palestinian professors and us. That's real council culture. Grow thicker skin. Please sign.

[01:21:56]

So Sahil again, I will say I don't understand is isn't he. But you know, you said you were. I didn't agree with that.

[01:22:05]

Yeah. Yeah. So that's what I mean. I think sergel in his enthusiasm of arguing style. I invite you for a debate on analysis and then I think you have lots of things and you're under the misconception that I don't have thick skin. So let's talk about this broad. I have absolutely no problem with people calling me out. And I have read many emails on Hafter doing exactly that, some of them not so polite. But I honestly don't give a rat's ass because I and I've explained this earlier, when you're dealing with notices from the Ironweed ministry and, you know, RBI notices to media houses, which I have got bothof email doesn't rock your world.

[01:22:42]

The second thing is, like Maneesha said, I actually was not batting for Barry Weiss. I thought what she was doing was just whining about something that is absolutely understandable. So you've got my position wrong on that. So I think you've just clubbed a bunch of arguments and attributed them to me, which is not what I had done. I do have a problem with safety and council culture, but I don't think it is all bad.

[01:23:06]

But my view on Barry Weiss and J.K. Rowling are very different. I actually again, you have attributed stuff that I haven't said that to justify what many show I do, too, are no, not assesses Kholoud culture, but what they do is Ganzel culture.

[01:23:21]

Is it relating to the advertising with that? So please go read. I have said that, in fact, I explained in the last podcast, it is always subjective, but it is based on what your current value system and society are. And I will explain again, although I would recommend you go back and listen to the last week's podcast. Samangan on television say that if a woman is not fair, don't marry her. Don't marry her unless she gives the hedge.

[01:23:47]

If a girl child is born in your house, treated differently from the boy, and I will call that person out and urge sponsors and brands not to advertise because what that person is saying is reprehensible and disgusting. You can call it council culture and you can call it whatever culture you want. I think that aligns with the state of the human condition we are in today where such values of saying that this person should not be given the same rights as me because that person is black, for example, a channel is welcome to say that.

[01:24:16]

And I will happily call out the channel. But if someone saying that me telling a Sardar joke is the same as that and therefore protocol out on guns and culture, then that is subjective. That is your view. But yes, you're right, both are technically the same. But Ganzel culture and Kholoud culture are not mathematical theorems. They are based on the prevailing values which are usually liberal values. So I welcome you for a discussion on this, on analysis and I'll happily make time when convenient to you.

[01:24:50]

Let's discuss this, but do attribute things to me that I have actually said that would actually help.

[01:24:57]

Manisha, you have any views on this or any views on this? Well, again, I think you feel OK could be repeating ourselves now. There is this one mile from unroot now. Must have been under pressure on Munmorah and on and love to listen to how it's like a group of friends chatting over recent happenings in the last half dozen regional or English language stopped because this is why I write you guys and it has several languages and everyone loves to speak in the regional language.

[01:25:20]

We have a sense of emotional connect with our regional language and it should be taught in school and even and used even as a medium to teach as it is easy to comprehend and explain things in regional languages.

[01:25:31]

Boxing Indian schools in English or regional medium is stupid, as at least an English medium teaches connected in a mixed language. Hinglish for me. Let the books be in English. However, I do emphasize on teaching English from Class one as it is an important tool to unify. India substitutes the need for learning all regional languages and one one must also learn some other Indian languages. But I guess this is a dream because not without Sanskrit and Hindi would be forced to learn Hindi and to be forced to learn Hindi.

[01:25:58]

Good point on the roads and I don't think there's been a lot of research. I went back after a discussion last week. There's been a lot of research on the fact that medium of instruction in reading the language actually helps children learn concepts better. You tend to grasp them faster and you tend to grasp them for a longer time and better if it's taught in your reading language.

[01:26:17]

Right. And I have one more male, I'll read it right at the end of the family. But the last issue I'd like to discuss and then we can come with our recommendations. I want to discuss this whole Supreme Court on contempt. So we did discuss this briefly, but President Bush and gave his response recently and before we why, by the way, it's just come that another actor has a television actor died.

[01:26:42]

But you said, yeah. And I'll tell you exactly who this person is. My uncle. Do you know? Um, no.

[01:26:48]

I've been with you guys pretty much for an hour. I've not seen anything right before that. I'm just not checked.

[01:26:54]

I'll just tell you the name Samid Sharma, television actor.

[01:26:58]

It's a pretty common name. I know a film director with that name don't want I don't know.

[01:27:02]

In fact, this person has acted in Kahaani. Carkeek Uki stars because that's a massive show. Jury duty is Arcanum.

[01:27:11]

Do you see Popolo? I mean, these were clearly. They were.

[01:27:16]

Yes, I think so. Mushroomhead come to big Moscoso possible.

[01:27:20]

I will check. But this has just actually popped up right now as we were recording. So, um, President Bush actually gave up and Mr Darvon Rajeev Dhawan is the lawyer who is representing us at the end of the chandelier, but it was also part of his team.

[01:27:35]

I'll just check on that. But they have said that commenting on the chief justice is not a contempt of court. And the person and he said in this letter, he expresses regret that he suggested that he wasn't wearing a helmet, the chief justice, but he has not apologized. And very interesting what I just checked the lawyer who said they said that when you have a case like that, you, Ducky's and three other Sandover 370, Article 370, and then you get a larger portion of the Rajya Sabha seat, it is not unusual for the Supreme Court respect or something like that.

[01:28:08]

I was like, OK, these guys have dug their heels in for a fight and very good they have. Because otherwise, even Arundhati Roy, I like her a lot. I don't always agree with because I think she goes too far in the republic of one kind of notion's. She also apologized when the contempt was slapped on her during the ruling. And and a lot of people I don't and I don't hold it against them because you don't want your life to come to a standstill.

[01:28:31]

But I had apologized. Pretty much everyone apologized. Sometimes I have to apologize.

[01:28:37]

I when she does that whole thing during my injuries. But these guys have got their heels in because I think now it's they realize it's it's a serious battle. So let me start with you, Monk. What is your view? Ah, have you been following this case? But on this whole contempt of court, how scared are people of the court? Clearly, very, because I was watching a discussion. And who was this person? Very outspoken.

[01:28:59]

Then suddenly who could they said that. Are you saying that the court's decision is it this was, I think on NDTV only on the underarmed and Brumidi. I was saying that the. No, no, that's not what I'm saying at that's not what I'm saying at all. And suddenly the person backtracked.

[01:29:13]

I was like, dude, this is like what the army is to Pakistan, that you will criticize politicians, criticize the Supreme Court, will not criticize the army. India's becoming will criticize the BJP government. But you cannot say a thing to the Supreme Court.

[01:29:25]

It's got to that stage. And I think that's that's pretty sad. My your views on this as well.

[01:29:31]

I mean, I think we've all grown up in India where the world's contempt court, like, just makes us out, doesn't it? And you know that this shit is real because if they are the final authority when it comes to finding you guilty of anything or not, and if they are pissed off and ready to go, there is no other Dornoch in that sense. But I'm quite happy to say, I mean, not that he needs any testimonial from from guys like me.

[01:29:55]

I mean. Said from the from his followers and his admirers over the years, I mean, what President Bush has done and also some people like my former boss, can't believe I saw him take the same tweet of the transition and put it on his Twitter handle. So there is I think now it's reached a point where a lot of people believe it's the is Armageddon, it's the final fight. I mean, you cannot keep quiet anymore because it's not about this.

[01:30:19]

One particular instance is going to be instances of instances. And it's best that you put up a fight now and or keep quiet for the rest of your life. But I think that's what is become I mean, in terms of the rulings the Supreme Court has given them over the past few years, they've been quite shocking. I mean, we used to always look up the Supreme Court, OK, these are politicians. They do like they do the game, but eventually these guys will sort it out.

[01:30:41]

But but even that line up to a lot of people and we see it expressed all day online at least, and even in regular conversation, that seems to be getting blurred day by day. And then, of course, the thing was was altogether astounding in terms of the calls. You can just about see how big is that for a person to come across as having sold their soul, having been chief justice of Supreme Court? I mean, it seems improbable.

[01:31:08]

A huge.

[01:31:08]

Was the propriety of that right? Anything.

[01:31:12]

Wendy Sherman, you need to add from last week on this, you think this time, I think is in the mood for a fight to the I'm very glad that, you know, this entire episode has brought into sharp focus on the act of judges, Supreme Court judges. So and also certain things that President Bush has clarified, like his his interview to Tehelka, which is part of the contempt with President Bush and is saying that what do you mean by corruption?

[01:31:42]

Corruption is not just monetary corruption. Corruption is how you your conduct in the court.

[01:31:49]

You know how he said all this in his response?

[01:31:51]

He said in his response. So he defined corruption. So I said I said corruption in that sense. Huh. So I regret if you thought it was only a monetary corruption, but I do not apologize for this. So so he brought in that focus and the the way he spoke.

[01:32:11]

I mean, you have just quoted him on obstruction with these kind of documents. And I think I think he'll also be soon.

[01:32:19]

Basically, all the lawyers who are against it will be condemned because that's what everybody is expecting.

[01:32:26]

But but I think somebody had to do it right here with you.

[01:32:31]

Yes, Manisha, I think you have covered most of what is to be said. All right.

[01:32:37]

So before we wind up and ask for everyone's recommendations, I just would like to speak about the daily rights probe. I do read our reports on the sudden news that went round of the hearings and has admitted to everything. And he has said that Omar Khalid is my accomplice.

[01:32:54]

It is actually an old piece of information the police had put out, and it is rather mysterious how suddenly it was registered as new news.

[01:33:00]

Also, this is not admissible in court because it's a confession to the police. Yeah, it's apparently in civilian court.

[01:33:06]

So do check that out. And, you know, a journalist was actually booked online for an unverified post in Yuppy. And I'm finding a lot of people get booked because of something that they post online. But you can say anything you want on television news channels and you don't get booked for that.

[01:33:21]

So I think it's safe to say some shit are an studio and something millions of people and there would be no consequences.

[01:33:27]

But if you post something to your followers, you can say shit even on Twitter, as if it is favorable to the right existing government.

[01:33:36]

So I think that is truly the stage live in.

[01:33:40]

So, guys, please keep your recommendations handy. I just read this last email from Sally Sily. Sorry, Sally.

[01:33:45]

Sally says hi and I really appreciate what you guys do and so glad to have discovered you. I'm writing in reference to the discussion on the importance of education in English. I believe it is that language that connects most of the world. If more digital, no English would have been difficult for him to be best friends with Trump. On the other hand, if education is given only in these languages, it becomes difficult for students to cope when they go to colleges as they struggle to understand even basic concepts.

[01:34:10]

These students then have to rely on English classes or even English movies. I understand the need of teaching regional languages and believe that everyone should know how to read and write at least one language. English is also the language we use while communicating with fellow Indians, where knowing Hindi is not a priority.

[01:34:25]

If someone wants to go abroad to study or work, speaking English goes a long way. I can go on and on importance, but it might get too long. Also, my request to and not to stop analysing all situations with respect to the Newsworld that are hundreds of other industries people work in where the rules and ethics would be different. It's not always black and white. Same logic might not be applicable anywhere. Sily is referring to my Newstrike story right sily.

[01:34:48]

I was a bit unsure about whether that applies elsewhere. I might not have articulate my thoughts properly, but I hope you get my point. I also want to mention that I joined. He was lonely because of that London, but now Monisha has become my favorite happy subscriber. Oh, good heart and soul.

[01:35:05]

On that note, do check out our other podcasts, do recommend that to others, share it with others. We are available on our podcast platforms and with another urge to pay to keep news free.

[01:35:17]

So before we wind up, let's have the recommendations made. You want to go first?

[01:35:22]

Well, since we're talking about this particular week and also with respect to news, since on news laundry, I'll be very honest with you, I was quite hungrily, almost greedily waiting to read everything. I could find it amazing. He passed away this week. And I think of a character like him, a man like him lends himself to incredible anecdotes. I have to also say that I was slightly disappointed. There were no great pieces. I came across a few good ones.

[01:35:47]

I think we sang. We did one which was decent. There's one. But if I'm not mistaken, with the news X, who wrote a pretty decent piece as well as one by a beat reporter, again, if I'm not mistaken, which was in the print, but I haven't come across it before. I tend to read a little more on the one on news.

[01:36:06]

Again, try try the one on news, one about and then I'd like know what it will do.

[01:36:10]

We'll do surveys. I get I get a recommendation at the same time. Second, because I, I mean because I review every week. The one I review this week was Bandits. Bandits. That's the new series that's dropped on Amazon Prime video, which I think is very original. I compared to a lot of Indian stuff I watched lately purely because are two things. One is I'm becoming tired. I don't know about you guys. I've become quite tired of watching the DC versions of dystopia and deaths and drugs is just one after the other that they've all come during this time.

[01:36:42]

You don't want to sleep when the whole world itself looks so dark. The last thing you want to see is also darkness within your screen. That's what was the case. I love them all for a lot, but I look and I love the idea also to a huge extent, even erotic earlier, which was this Norrish DOCA murder mystery that came out on Netflix last week. But Bundesbank's is so different from all that we've sort of sampled online. It's about Indian classical music in classical music.

[01:37:10]

It's a young rom com. It's about music and it's about love. It's a very light. You know, it leaves a very light in the head as a sort of channeling is inner on the show, I find to be very original, very unique. Indian ten part series. Forty minutes. That's a lot of time spent on that particular show. But you don't have a binge. I don't think it's a this show, but definitely one of the best lighthearted entertainment Indian entertainment that I've seen since Punggye, which I thought was the best thing I saw happen during lockdown.

[01:37:41]

Not the best I think, but I was still the best. But yeah, I would heavily recommend bandits, bandits, new new cars like the leads, a new aniseed I think could carry the old the old hands on this show. And that's a really fine job. Keeps you hooked and there's great music. I thought the music would have been much better, but there is another thing that I would recommend, not because I've seen it, but because now the whole world to talk about it is the spoon called a disciple that's become India's first Indian people to be in the competition section at any top film festival and in the top European film festivals being bullied and Venice, it's competing now.

[01:38:19]

Adventism is the same guy I'm unable to go to before this. And that's also going to study classical music. And what they've done there is actually use real life musicians as actors on a show about classical music, which is not the case with this band. It's because here you have actors and they suddenly break into these clubs with some really weird because they're singing voices. Nothing like the speaking voice. But I guess you don't have a choice because you can't expect those those performers to be ridiculous to some actually looking forward to disciple.

[01:38:48]

But but that is take a while.

[01:38:50]

And I think until then you have been disbanded since you've been covering culture and entertainment and cinema for so long. We have a podcast called Often and also Mountain Mantrap, which is also actually hosted by yours truly. Do check it out. And like I would like to know what you think. Yeah, but thanks for that recommendation. Thank you. Three things, Poterba.

[01:39:11]

I had written a beautiful article on this the day before and in an express basically saying that the is no longer there. You're very passionate piece one must read. Second is apparently not. Tagore had come out with the poem one hundred and twenty years ago, mean more or less prophetic about what happened yesterday in there. So apparently Telegraaf has taken a cue from that point. So that poem one should read, the link will be built.

[01:39:45]

All the links to a recommendation below that have to be better.

[01:39:47]

And this third is I saw one on Netflix. This is a brilliant it's a two seasons, five episodes each. Season one is the buildup, but this is about how the IRS came into being so good an issue, a piece in NDTV Bay on in the right used to head.

[01:40:09]

It's a really good piece on Social Gingrich, but I just wanted to actually quickly read a part of it, if you'll allow me. The piece is called What's at Stake for Hollywood Elitists. Hassan's Incredible Scheiße. He says people identifying in Sushant their struggles with the personal glass ceilings. Many would have faced it in their careers where those more proficient in English with better facility, with a fork and knife, managed to leapfrog into positions of authority even when they were less capable.

[01:40:32]

In others, it feeds their private myths about themselves, about being left out because of their social origins and not because they're not good at what they do. So Jansing Rajputs demise builds upon and then amplifies this grievance politics the dominant sense of being wronged. He really links this world with rightwing populism and how this is actually another sign of fascism. I think you should read. I think it's one of the more perceptive pieces that have come out.

[01:40:54]

So I'm glad you've written a perceptive piece, because I'm going to I have two recommendations, and one of them is for how shallow the thinking is in this case. The first piece is what is actually I discovered and I highly recommend everybody on this podcast read more about her and I relisting because I did not know who she was. Actually, before I.

[01:41:14]

I was just listening to this podcast and one of the headlines was that the Somali rights activist, Dr. Hawa Abdi, has died. I didn't know who Dr. Abdi was. She was a Somalian elite, but financially very well off. And when the Somalia shit hit the fan, all the rich people left the country and kind of settled wherever they could. She stayed on in Somalia and actually worked to kind of do the best she could for the people there who did not have the choice to run.

[01:41:42]

And she was nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize, whatever it means. But she never got it. I think I'm shocked she didn't get it. And why I recommend this is because someone of this stature is what India needs. And very famously in the middle of the civil war with these militants and these factions and warlords and Islamists are killing each other. They attacked her hospital and she did not flee. She stood her ground and the the militants actually withdrew.

[01:42:07]

And later they apologized for having attacked her.

[01:42:11]

That is the kind of moral authority she had among locals. So I actually discovered her through the Sparkassen. I read a few pieces on her and I would recommend you just Google her name, which is Dr. Hawa Abdi, and read the pieces. You can read some of the ones on BBC and all, but read the ones that appeared in some African newspapers and news portals. And there are people like this still. And I think India needs one such that is one piece.

[01:42:37]

And the second piece I would like to recommend is another print, which is spectacular. In its shallow analysis, it's called Secularism Gave Up Language of religion. I audioboom Epogen. As a result of that, it's by the king of shallow analysis. His name is again, rather. I think this piece again demonstrates his poor understanding of basic politics, which is why the whole thing that it's such a big loss to OP. I have always maintained it was never and his post facto not at all yet knowing very little analysis.

[01:43:09]

So do read it.

[01:43:10]

If anything, I'd say he's spot on. He at least used to be part of that. I think he like the potato Arlequin and also even post facto. It's very shallow. And I think this essay kind of demonstrates that being able to construct an English articulately and being such a wonderful articulation of shallow ideas is what makes television popular. It is. He is the thinking man.

[01:43:36]

So he'll say it, in my view, and do read this piece to see why I'm saying that.

[01:43:40]

On that note, thanks much for joining us. Appreciate it so much. Stay safe. Thank you.

[01:43:45]

So things in Bombay get better. I love ya, Pop. We'll have you down for the middle of next year when it is an ongoing event. But this year it is going to be it is lonely. It's called out online. So join us for that.

[01:43:57]

I'll leave you with this song to all our worshippers who worship everything holy.

[01:44:02]

We need this sentiment today more than ever before going on the song of the diva Baba Glazunov the other day.

[01:44:15]

But today, Makaha campaign. What they're up about here. Wanting to learn how to be a billionaire. To be a billionaire, I'm on a pair of and. But it might be was the guard the. All the news laundry podcasts are available on Stitcher, iTunes and any other podcast platforms, please subscribe to News Laundry.

[01:44:57]

Help us keep news independence.

[01:45:00]

You've got all our podcast on news, pop culture, current affairs and sport. Visit Newsround, the dot com. Follow us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram and subscribe to our YouTube channel.