Hi, everyone.

It's Kelsey McKinney and Alex Sujong Loughlin.

From Normal Gossip, the podcast where we.

Anonymize real gossip and tell it back to you.

And I'm Caitlin Pierce from Hang Up, a reality dating show with no rings attached.

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That's Radiotopia FM. Donate thank you so much for your support. Hi, and welcome to Normal Gossip. I'm Kelsey McKinney. In each episode of this podcast, we're going to bring you an anonymous morsel of gossip from the real world. I am so excited to have with me today Amanda Montel. Amanda Montel is a writer and linguist from Baltimore. She is the author of the acclaimed books Word Slut and Cultish and the forthcoming The Age of Magical Overthinking. Along with hosting the podcast. Sounds like a cult. Her writing has appeared in the New York Times, Marie Claire, Cosmopolitan and more. She holds a degree in linguistics from NYU and lives in Los Angeles with her partner, Plants and Pets. You can find her on Instagram at at. Amanda Montel. Amanda, welcome.

Oh, my God. It's been too long.

It's been, what, a week since we.

Were on a zoom together. Yeah. And that was already too long because the life that I spent without knowing you wow. Wasn't.

Okay, Amanda, can you tell me start me off with the classic first question. Tell me what your relationship with gossip is.

Yeah. Oh, my God. Well, my relationship with gossip is actually a little bit OOH because I did write about it exche in my first book awards.

You sure fucking did.

So, yeah, I would say there are a lot of negative connotations associated with gossip. I don't love the concept of shit talking for truly no reason because something called I'm sure you've heard of it, spontaneous trait transference, occurs where you start to take on the qualities of the person you're shit talking in the eyes of your interlocutor. So I try to avoid it. But I do love in general purposeful gossip for the purposes of trading information, establishing in group values. And if there are some casualties in the spirit of doing that and if.

People think you're a little bit of a bitch, who's to say whether that's.

Well, that's just their misogyny. You know what I mean?

Exactly. I heard that you brought a gossip for me. Is that true?

Oh, my God.

It is. Oh, my God. Can I have it?

Yeah, of course. This is my favorite story to tell. And if I may, it's please a piece of gossip that reflects actually, like, really well on everyone in the story except me. And I think that that still counts as gossip. Gossip. It does have to be salty, right? Like, it can be flattering.

I don't think so. Yeah.

So I worked as a beauty editor for a very long time, and I interviewed a lot of celebrities about their beauty routines. And I very smugly determined that that had made me impervious to being starstruck.

I have this bias about myself, too, and it's because I've never felt starstruck. And I think if you've never felt starstruck, it's easy to be like, I'm actually built different.

Yeah. This is what happened at some point last year, it was 2022, I attended a dinner and a movie at home party. Very casual get together at the home of kind of like a famous director.

Okay, famous. I live in Los Angeles.

Yeah, exactly. I live in La. So it comes up. It comes up. And so I show up to this party. I'm feeling very chill. I'm wearing, literally, leggings. I look full millennial cringe. I'm just like, it's a casual event, and everyone's, like, putting together a little dinner plate for themselves sitting at the table. I'm like, great chill vibes. I put together a plate for myself. I sit at this fairly small glass table. I look up and my organs shut down because who is right across from me but the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, daniel Radcliffe.

Oh, no. Alex is going to have a conniption fit when she hears this.

He's six inches from me. He's six inches from me. And I loved Harry Potter growing up. Okay? I'm not like a Potter head, so to speak.

I also think Daniel Radcliffe is a particularly jarring celebrity to be confronted with because he's so famous, but also does not read the same way as some of these famous people. Right. Like, he doesn't read as structured, as serious know all of these things. So you're like, he could maybe be my friend, right?

Totally. And also, we're size compatible. I have a bias for people who are as short as.

Your size compatible. Daniel Radcliffe has seated himself in front of also glass table. Makes this complicated because if your hands are sweaty, you can't hide them like you're in trouble.

I know. And also, glass tables don't absorb any sound. So Rickety well, of course. He's so fucking nice. And he just looks up and he's like, hi, I'm Dan. And I was laughed. I don't think I said my name. I don't think I said my name. And I looked away. I looked into my food. I was, like, eating cauliflower very quietly, just, like, not in my body. Like, not knowing what to do. So now it's time to put our plates in the sink and go watch the movie.

Okay.

This is a liturgy that I understand. Dinner is over. We go to watch movie now. Yeah. Classic. But I'm not I'm not you and.

Daniel Radcliffe going on your little date fully.

Like, everyone else in the room completely disappeared. It was like, sorry. A little sound effect for the okay. Okay. And I like, pick up my plate, and I notice that Dan okay, first name, nickname basis. Dan.

He introduced himself as Dan.

Dan. Dan. So he is now standing in the kitchen with his plus one, speaking to a fellow guest who I guess was better at keeping her shit together than me because it seemed like they had just met for the first time and were now engaged in normal conversation, which I was incapable of doing. Now there's a problem because they are standing between the kitchen island and the cabinet, and I need to throw your.

Yeah, you need to get rid of your plate.

Yeah. I need to walk by. So a normal person under normal circumstances would walk by and say, like, oh, excuse me.

So sorry. Excuse me.

Yeah, hey, sorry. Like, just need to get to the sink or whatever.

What did you say, Amanda?

But I walked by and I first of all burst out in a jingle. No. I don't know why. My brain was like, Sing what you're going to say. I walk by. I'm like, nervous. Retelling this story.

I can tell.

Oh, fuck. Okay. I walk by and I go, boop boop boop boop. Potter me. Hi. I said Potter.

Potter me.

Potter me.

No.

Yes. I didn't just say, oh, pardon me. Sorry. I walked by and I burst into song. And I think what actually happened, too, was that my brain scrambled all the data that it's gathered about Daniel Radcliffe. We know he's Harry Potter, and I have seen him on Broadway twice.

So you know that he can't yes. You know he sings.

Yes, I know he sings. So I burst out into song. Much like characters in a musical, nothing.

Makes you more relatable to someone than embodying their career. Question mark.

I truly like single white female him. I effectively stripped off his skin and.

Wore it I'm dying.

By reflecting his entire IMDb page back to him. I went up BOP, BOP. Excuse me. Pardon me. And it was kind of British. And it was kind of British, too. Yeah, it was fucking British, too.

You were just like, are there any shovels around here I could dig myself a grave with?

No, honestly, the sink at this Hollywood director's house was so large, I genuinely considered crawling into it.

Just die in there.

I was like, fuck me. Yeah. So I said, boop, boop, boop. Excuse me, potter me in a British accent, no less. And then I walked into the kitchen, put my plate in the sink, face palmed. You know when you make like, a very sort of farcical slapstick gesture in real life, I face palmed. I was like, fuck, fuck, fuck. I will never come back from you know, I really do hope to cross paths with him again someday to further redeem myself. And also just because I really like dim.

Yeah, I guess if you know, Daniel Gradcliffe, simply we'll just send this to him. Here you go. Do you remember this, Dan?

Do you remember this? Do you remember? I hope not, but I guess I can't be that ashamed if I'm sharing it with the normal gossip crowd.

That's so true. We thank you for your vulnerability and honesty.

Thank you so much. It's really hard out here to be vulnerable.

This story is taking place, like, pre COVID. We're talking, like, mid 2010s fancy by Iggy Azalea at the top of the charts. It's that era of the world.

Holy shit. Okay, so this is not, like, the.

Best era of time to graduate from college. There are no jobs on the market, and our friend of a friend, Adele, knows that intimately. She gets this hourly wage, boring job that doesn't pay her enough, and she's.

Like, I'm going to lose my fucking sure, sure.

When you begin doing this, you often create a fantasy life for yourself in the future that you can obsess over. For some people, that is grad school. For Adele, it is Europe. And she's like, if I could just move to Europe, I could have anything I want.

I still believe that.

Yeah, exactly. And she's like, I don't have the money to just go over there. You know, there are people after college who just go to Europe somehow and are there for months. She's like, I can't do but, like, that's what I want, is to be in Europe. Do you have any ideas for how she could be in Europe?

Woofing.

Okay.

Do they woof there? Do they woof?

I'm sure they do.

Yeah. You can work on a farm and be put up for free. So that is one option I can think of. Like a sort of no, you can't do an exchange anymore. By the time you've graduated, escorting this.

Great idea, what you're doing, this kind of iterative process is what Adele is doing every single day when she gets home from work. Right. Like, what are the ways that I could go to Europe? So one day she has a particularly bad day at her shift. She has, like, two glasses of wine, she's googling on her computer, move to Europe, american Europe, grad school. Move to Europe. Visa find European spouse.

How? Well, now, all of a sudden, she's, like, rearranging her sentences like, yoda.

Yes. She falls asleep on the couch. Googling. She wakes up in the morning and her computer is open to a website. On the website is a beautiful young woman holding a kid on her hip. Behind her, the most beautiful couple Adele has ever seen in her entire life. Underneath them is the tagline, simply safely, directly.

Okay.

And a button that says, Find your pair family today.

Oh, duh duh. Fucking duh. Because so many of my friends established themselves in Los Angeles by nannying for the wealthy.

Oh, yes, it's a pretty good option in some ways. But what do you think about pairing as an option for our Girlina Adele?

Okay, I admittedly do not fully understand the difference between nannying pairing. I'm not sure what you're truly signing your name in the Devil's book for.

Okay, sure. So the big difference, nannies do not live with you generally, right? Nannies live somewhere else. Opairs usually live with you. And in the international pair situation, you can get visas for pairs, which you can't necessarily do for nannies. Do I understand the exact legal requirements of this? No. Adele fucks around on this website for a little while. She's like, I don't really love children, but I'm indifferent to them. Like, I have a younger sister. Maybe this would be fine. She's like, Would it be crazy to make a profile? She's like, Nah, I'll do it anyway. I'll just do it as a bit. When she makes a profile, you specify things like where you're from, what your gender identity is, what countries you want to pair in, and the start dates and how long you can stay. So Adele makes a profile and kind of the way this works is like, people are searching for each other, so you can search for families and families can search for you and then you can message each other. She's like, what countries do I want to go to? Checks every single country in Western Europe except Austria because she didn't like The Sound of Music.

So she's like, These are the countries I would like to go to. She begins scrolling. When you pick a family, you can see things about what they are searching for. Like, do they want you to do housework? Do their children have special needs? Do they have pets? Do they smoke? Right. All these things. It's like for Adele, it is essentially fulfilling the emotional requirement that some people use petfinder.com for you're. Just like, oh, cute, look at this potential life.

I could have it's escapism.

I am now going to share something with you.

Oh, wow. Multimedia presentation.

Can you see this?

Oh, yes, I can. Okay.

Can you please describe to the listener what it is that you're seeing?

I am seeing what looks to be a stock image of a white blonde woman who looks like she auditioned to be in the movie Get Out and her husband, who looks like he is really into celery juice. He's a white man as well with a hairline that's still doing the most great. They are holding children whose bodies suggest the ages of one and a half and four. But their faces are blocked out, so my data is limited. Respect the blocking out of the faces. But again, it looks like a stock photo. I've never seen a genuine photo of a family that is lit or posed this way. And then the listing is for a family of two children, one and six. What does that fucking mean?

Their ages?

Oh, they're one and six. So my guesses were wrong. Well, one of my guesses was right. Oh, that's a small six year old, very height compatible with me. Okay. They live in Germany, but their nationality is Canadian and German. I'm going to guess that the wife is German. That's what I'm looking at there. The duration stay is twelve months. And should I read the ad?

You can read the ad? Yes.

Okay. So it says dear opair, hello potential opairs. We are looking to complete our family with a creative, thoughtful, English speaking pair. Our ideal pair is genuine patient, led by her heart and possesses an entrepreneurial spirit. She should have a passion for cleaning, organizing and young children. This doesn't seem like the right fit for Adele, by the way, just because no, not that I'm suggesting that Adele is not creative and thoughtful, and I'm pretty sure she's an English speaker, but I don't know about the patient and passion for young children parts because she wants her life to fucking start already and she doesn't even really like kids. So I don't know. I don't know about this. They say our son will be your main responsibility, but his sister will sometimes be around. It is our hope. Sometimes be around? Where else will she be? It is our hope. Me 36, my husband 40. To find someone who can support the whole household in all our seasons, rhythms and endeavors. I wonder what kind of rhythms they're referring to.

Who can know? Do you have any takeaways from this listing? Any feelings or words that scare you?

Yeah, so first of all I get a little scared whenever people refer to phases of their life as seasons because it feels very new age evangelical. That language is fully in the dialect of contemporary evangelicalism. It's giving. Like this is on my heart. This is the season for testifying. I don't fucking know. I don't speak it. Exactly.

You're doing a good interpretation.

Thank you.

My nitpicky thing about this listing is the phrase complete our family.

Oh, complete our family. Oh my god. I totally missed it because it was so early.

Because I'm like, you're hiring someone, right? People who work for you are inherently not family.

Oh my god. I was so distracted by the rest of totally that I forgot about the first line. Complete our family is demonic. That is like inexcusable complete our family it sounds like the completion process, which is a teal swan cult thing. That's scary. I'm scared. Yeah. Complete our family. I'm totally scared.

On the left side of this page that you're looking at, there are two sections. It's like what we're searching for and related info. Can you just scan that really quickly and see if there's anything in there that you don't like?

I mean, they love smoking, which, like in Europe, a siggy from time to time. Classic. I can't knock it. I can't knock it. They want someone who's obsessed with cleaning, but they smoke around their kids. The household probably smells a little it sounds tough to clean. Okay. The left side. Housework required. We've had opairs before. I'm so unfamiliar with the Opair industrial complex that I think you've done a great job. Yeah. I don't even know what red flags to look for necessarily, but I am not as scared as you were during my Daniel Radcliffe story, but I'm starting to feel a chill.

Okay, great. Her only qualm with this is that it starts in like two weeks.

Okay, quick turnaround.

It's a quick turnaround, but her pro is she's like, I've always wanted to go to Oktoberfest.

Sure. Germany. That sounds like a blast.

What do you think? Do you think she should reach out? How are you feeling?

No, I think again, Adele, it's like no shade, but when you're very internally motivated by your own sense of adventure, your own wanderlust. Oh, God, what a cringey word. I've never used that word in my entire life until this now. But if you're motivated by a void, you need to fill. And for her, it feels like boredom, listlessness, lack of purpose, and someone's kids are involved and you're kind of just like, I want to go to Oktoberfest and I want to go right now. It's feeling like a bad know.

Those are all great points. Adele is not going to heed any of them. She is ignoring all of your good points. She's like, well, what if I just message them and we just see how it goes?

Okay, this is how I am with tattoos, by the way. I have a lot of tattoos, and the reason for that is because I get a little bug in my head and I'm like, what if I just drove past the tattoo place and like, I saw a mistake. Yeah. And then without a doubt, the end of the day rolls around and I have a fucking seashell tattooed on myself.

Yeah. I also have that exact same brain disease, which is, I think nice for us. Adele messages them and she's like getting info about what they're going to do, what they're going to pay, what her life would be like there. And she finds out that she'll make more money per week than her current hourly job.

Okay.

So she's like, okay, little more money. She finds out that they'll provide her a bedroom with like an ensuite bathroom and food.

Love that. I love food, and I love a convenient toilet.

She will do her opair job for, like, 20 hours a week and tidy up and stuff. Adele, she's never had, like, a real full time job. She has no sense of work life balance. So she's like, this seems fine. She learns that she'll only be in charge of the older child because the baby has its own pair.

Whoa.

And she's like, okay, great.

I love these parents are just like, we're going to hire some we're going to hire some young people to take care of our individual babies individually, and we're just going to go off and.

Smoke some young Americans. Let's get some young Americans in here. What could go wrong?

Yeah.

The mom, we're going to call her Camille. Camille tells her on the phone that she has a burgeoning yoga business and that if Adele wants to make any extra money, she is welcome to help out with that. So there's, like a second optional revenue stream.

Oh, God, no.

No.

This is really bad.

What is it about the yoga that has turned you?

No, it's because if you're a German white lady who wants to start a cold, you're going to fill it with yoga and babies, period. No, that's really bad.

If you're Adele and you are colorblind, so you can't see any red flags, is there anything here that you would think to check? Like, anything you want to do while you're on the phone with this woman?

So what would I do to don't? I'm at a lot. I would get fucked. I would get fucked by this lady.

Camille adele has one smart thought, and her smart thought is, can I speak to the previous pair?

Oh, genius. Genius.

Camille is like, absolutely. She gives her the number of a Canadian pair that this family had when they lived in Canada, and the Canadian opair speaks really highly of this family.

Okay.

Adele's like, hey now. Hey now. This is what dreams are made of. Like, let's go. Do people warn her that this might be bad? Yes. Do people tell her that care is very hard and she has no experience doing it also? Yes. She does not care. She is like, it is my dream to go to Europe. It is my dream to post about being in Europe.

Oh, no. It's giving Emily in Paris meets Parasite.

Yes, exactly. She's like, I'm doing this for the plot. And if the plot turns out to be a slasher, like, whatever, I do.

Admire that, and I do a lot of shit in life for the plot. I cannot lie. I love a delusional self narrativeization. Yes. I do not like that there are children involved. That's the only thing is, like, that collateral damage could be really ugly.

I will promise you up top, this is a happy podcast, not a sad podcast. So no children will be hurt.

Okay, great. Point. No, like prerequisite. They're fine. What if?

Hi, I'm author Lindy West. And I'm Democracy policy expert Megan Hatcher. Mays we're?

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Text me back.

Every week, we're going to dig into important news.

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Course, news about our lives, and maybe try to make you laugh even when the world gets you down. Text me back is a production of KUOW Seattle's, NPR news station. New episodes come out every Thursday wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, we're going to start with week one. Before we move on, are you hearing any alarm bells with me saying week one?

Yeah, because now I'm thinking that there will only be some weeks, no months.

Okay, week one. Adele arrives in Germany. She is picked up by this beautiful family at the airport. They are all very tall. They are all very beautiful.

Oh, no, I wouldn't do well. I would not do well.

You need size compatibility. Famous.

Exactly.

She gets to this house. They show her her room. It's beautiful, right? It's European. It has Italian plaster walls. It has a linen comforter. It has linen sheets. But downstairs, the house is, like, incredibly esthetic, but dirty. Kids toys everywhere. Sippy cups everywhere. Every cabinet in the kitchen is open.

Okay, so now this family is suggesting we love a facade.

There are mountains of dishes in the sink, and also parts of this house are under construction. So there is, like, in in the doorways, and there's, like, particulate dust everywhere.

Oh, no.

Camille and her husband, we're going to call him Florian. They say that this is because this house is a rental while their real house is being renovated.

Oh, God. Once we start talking about real house, fake house, it's like, what else is real and fake?

It's Sunday. This family is like on Sunday, we all have family dinner. They're like, be downstairs at 1930.

Complete our family at 1930.

Adele comes down at 630. They're like, Ma'am, you're an hour early. And she's like, AHA, I'm starving. My bad. She goes back upstairs.

Okay, she's hungry. She wants a pretzel.

She's hungry. She comes down at the right time. It's beautiful, right? Like, they have this table all landscaped out. It's candle lit. They have, like, a nice bottle of Riesling. Everything is lovely, except the kids are, like, trying to wreck shit. They're throwing unpainted wooden toys all over the place.

Oh, no, Montessori gone wrong.

The older one is, like, running in circles. And Adele is freaking out because she's, like, in a weird spot. She's like, I want to prove to the parents that I can manage them. But also the parents are here, so.

I don't want to over step on their yeah, yeah.

So she's just kind of ha ha sit down to the kids, and because she's like a new person, they do which magic. Congratulations to her.

Right.

They sit down for dinner, and she's like, okay, it's me, Camille, Florian, the two kids where's the baby's nanny?

Yeah.

So she's like, will the other pair join us for dinner?

They're like, she's shackled in the basement.

Camille and Florian are like, listen, you're part of this family now, and we want to be honest with you.

Oh, God.

The other pair, she had a personal emergency, and she had to uh huh. They're like, don't worry. If you want, you can help with the baby, and we'll pay you.

No, the bait and bit unsee.

Or if you don't want to help with the like, Camille works for herself, and she can find a way to make it work.

Okay. I know the right thing to do, which would be to set a boundary and have a polite conversation about what was discussed. Yes, but I'm a pushover in these scenarios, so I would be yeah.

Adele is like, of course I'll help with the she's like she's also in the back of her head, like, this is extra money, right? Like, I'm here anyway. Extra money that'll give me more stuff that I can do my little activities and take photos and whatever. They're like, great. They have this whole lovely dinner. It's beautiful. They pour her glass of the fancy riesling. She's like, this is the life I want. I wish I were them. After dinner, Florian's, like, starting to do the dishes, and she's like, oh, let me help you. She brings them over there, and he's, no, no, I've got it.

Okay.

A thing that I just would like you to know in general, is that pairs in many families are not allowed to be alone with husbands.

Yeah, I mean, that only makes perfect sense.

Yes.

Jude Law. Exactly.

But Adele's like, this is great for me. I don't have to do any dishes. She goes upstairs. She goes to sleep. The next morning, they show her where everything is. They're like, here are the cleaning supplies. Here's the kids bags, here's what they need. And they leave her for the day. Adele's like, why would I clean? I'm going to take the kids to school. I'm going to drop them off. I'm going to wander around. Like, these people clearly don't have a high standard for cleanliness, and I'm not very good at cleaning, so she's like.

Not my oh, maybe they deserve each other.

Adele in this family, she picks up the kids from school, and she is like, what do kids need to do? Let's see. I'll take them to the museum. There's, like, a little kid event. The kids are learning about art. One of the kids is like, I'm hungry. I need a snack. And she's like, okay, we can get you a snack. And you know how museums have those little cafes?

Of course. I love those. Yeah.

She takes them to the little cafe. She gets, like, six euro cookie to share everyone's. Happy. Adele's like, I'm doing a great job. They come home. She brings the kids home. They're playing. She decides she'll clean a little. She tidies up a little. And while she's doing this, she notices that one area of the living room is a mess.

Full of knives.

No, it's a mess. The opposite. It's so clean.

Okay. Is that where she shoots her Vlogs?

Yes. The kids are like, we're not allowed to go over there. Mommy works over there.

Oh, my fucking Lord. Oh, my fucking Lord. Mommy works over there. Oh, I'm sad. I'm sad.

Adele's like, okay, so I'll make sure not to make that area messy. Camille arrives home. The kids are so happy to see her. She's like, how was your day? What did you do? The kids are like, we went to the museum. She's like, that's so great. What else did you do? And they're like, we had a cookie. And Camille is like, Adele, can I speak to you in the kitchen?

Oh, fuck.

The children have never had sugar before.

What?

So this mom is like, you have polluted their bodies with refined sugar, and.

The death penalty now will befall you. Yeah.

Adele is like, I didn't know that. And Camille is like, oh, did you not read the binder?

Oh, my fucking also, I can't get over. Sorry. And again, I love a sleepy on a night in Europe. No judgment, but the kids can't have sugar. But our lungs are full of carcinogens. Doesn't make sense.

Listen, a lot of things that people do, they don't make sense.

I know. It's like the whole stereotype in La. Where people spend $16 on the Haley Bieber smoothie right before they do a line of coke.

Yes, exactly. And Camille's like, there's a giant binder in your room with all the info on the kids. Did you think that you were just going to do whatever you wanted with them? And she's like, OOH, I did think that. My bad.

Oh, my god.

She's like, I'll read the binder. I promise. And Camille's like, okay. So she goes upstairs, she reads the binder. And then so much of the binder is so picky. Like, it's like, no sugar. Sure. But it's also like rules about how to speak to them. Words not to use. Yeah, it's like they should never see your phone screen. Never say no to them, only redirect them. Right? Like all of these parenting things.

Yes.

Adele is 22 years old, so she's like, yeah, got it.

Right? Oh, fuck. Oh, God. Oh, no. How many weeks? How many weeks?

We're on day three. Day three. Things go great. She gets up. She takes the kids to their little things. She goes and gets them. She takes them to the park. She follows the rules in the binder. After they eat their snack, she's like, I'm going to clean up all this stuff. I'm going to clean up all the dishes in the sink. I'm going to clean up all their snack stuff. She puts all the dirty food on the plates into the sink. The problem is that Adele has put a lot of food into the sink, and this is a German house with 16th century plumbing. There are no garbage disposals here.

It's a cultural problem. Got it.

So she has put a bunch of food into the sink, which is now not draining and is still not draining when Florian gets home from work.

Oh, are they going to fuck?

No. Thank God. That was like, no, the opposite of that. He's fucking pissed. He's like, Why would you put garbage down the like, obviously, there's no garbage here. What are you doing? He has to call a plumber. He's, like, very stressed about this. He's like, this is going to be so expensive to fix. And Adele, in her head, is like, I don't understand what the real problem is here. I'm sorry for backing up this, but in her head, she's like, you have an pair. You live in this huge house.

Like, how much of an expense could this really be for you?

Yeah, exactly. This drama concludes. She goes to sleep on Friday. She wakes up, and Camila's like, hey, do you want to go to the yoga class? I'm going to lead. Florian can take care of the kids if you want to come with me.

No. Oh, no. Zebetan's speech. Zebethen speech.

Do you want to go to the yoga class?

Never. Ever.

Why?

Because she's going to do a spell. She's going to do an evil spell.

Adele is like, I want to go. I'm going to this yoga class. It seems way more fun than hanging out with these kids. They drive to this fancy, fancy park. Camille is wearing, like, a white athleisure two piece outfit.

All white. Oh, no.

Everyone who rolls up is wearing white. They all have yoga mats that cost, like, $250.

Yeah, no, it's midsummer. It's midsummer, but German.

Adele is wearing a college T shirt and leggings that are, like, kind of transparent. And she's like, I do not look like I belong here.

Oh, no. Her laby are going to be seen when they arrive.

Camille is like, do you want to hear some hot gossip? And Adele's like, yeah, of course. And Camille then reveals that several of the other pairs are sleeping with various parents.

Oh, yeah, sorry. I scrambled that story when you first told it to me. I changed it to what I wanted to hear, which is that all these yoga moms are fucking.

I wish I wish this is where this was going.

Damn it.

No. She's like, don't sleep with my husband. And Adele is like, OMG, I would never do that. Like, no offense. Camille then is like, oh, my God, I'm so glad you're like, I'm so glad we're bonding. This is so great. We're gossiping, you're here with me. We're about to start my yoga class. She's like, can you take photos? And Adele's, like on my iPhone. And Camille's like, yeah, let me log you in. And she takes Adele's phone, and she goes to her Instagram, and she logs Adele into her account. And Adele looks in, and she's like, oh, that is a lot of.

Lots momfluencer and lots of followers. Yeah.

And Adele is like, okay. So she takes her photos. She's running around. She's like, this is kind of fun. She's like, this is way more fun than hanging out with these kids. I'm just taking these photos. I'm in a yoga class. Everyone here is hot. I'm in, like, a weird white Athleisure cult. Like, sure, whatever. She shows Camille the photos at the end of the yoga, and Camille is like, these are so good. You're a natural talent.

Do you want to be my mom fluencer second banana?

Basically, she posts one of Adele's photos.

To the grid, tens of thousands of.

Likes, and Adele's like, look at me.

Of course her brain chemistry is popping off.

It is now the end of week one. How do you feel?

I feel scammed. I feel ill. I feel like Adele is the perfect victim for this family. She is the exact breed of vulnerable, but also a little pick me, and that positions her perfectly to be this mom fluencer's little victim. I don't necessarily feel super bad for her. Yeah. I'm excited to see what happens.

Week two, Adele begins her own Instagram account. Like a little travel insta.

Sure. Emily in Paris every day.

She's taking pictures.

Adele in Dusseldorf.

Yeah, she's taking pictures. She's posting them. She's writing little captions every day. She's gaining followers. She's like, this is going great.

Yeah.

Her day off is supposed to be Wednesday, and she's like, okay, I'm going to go downtown. I'm going to go to these sites. I'm going to take my photo. But Tuesday night, Florian is like, hey, I know tomorrow is your day off, but you took last Friday off to go with Camille to yoga, so you didn't make it to 20 hours, so you can work tomorrow. Right. And Adele's like, I did not really realize that yoga was optional.

Right.

And I did work the whole time.

Yeah, okay. All right. Yes.

I'm seeing the subtle manipulation, but she's like, fine, whatever. I can take the kids with me to see the weird church. It'll be fine.

Sure.

She does this. She works Wednesday. Do you like this decision?

No, I don't like it at all because it's a slippery little slope. It starts with, oh, actually, you spent your day off doing yoga photography, but you still need to meet your quota, and who knows where it could go from there? Yeah.

Thursday morning, Camille is like, you did such a good job with the photos at yoga on Friday. Like, everyone loves them. I've been posting them this week. They're getting so many likes. Adele in her head is like, I know, because I've been checking. Camille is like, I was wondering if you would be willing to take more photos of the kids.

EW.

And Adele's like, oh, my God, I would love to.

EW. EW.

So she's taking photos of the kids. She's uploading them to, like, a shared drive. Camille is posting these photos at the end of every day with captions about how much she loves being a mother.

Oh, gross.

What do you want to do?

Want to I want to go hang out with Daniel Radcliffe and forget about this entire universe. I mean, the whole time, it's like the fakery and the fuckery of the pristine corner of the house while your kids are playing in squalor and exploiting their likeness. It's very ugly. Yeah.

And luckily, the level of Camille Florian bad is, like, tradwife influencer. They love their kids that are nice to yeah. But they also are like, what if you took cuter photos of them? Like, make sure that they look cute.

Yeah. You can't throw anyone in jail for exactly.

Not wanting to post ugly photos of your kid. That's actually good parenting.

I know. It's like, protect the children. Hashtag save them.

Yeah. On Friday of this week of week two, camille offers her to go to yoga again on her day off.

Now we're skeptical. Now we're skeptical.

She's like, come with me. I have a new sponsor, new brand to promote. I need photos.

Okay.

Con it's work, right? Pros. You do maybe get some swag samples, and you get to watch Camille work and see how she poses.

Yeah. You're shadowing.

What do you want to, um at.

This point, anthropologically, I want to go again for the plot. For the plot.

The brand that Camille is newly sponsored by is some natural deodorant. And so Adele is taking all these photos of her applying deodorant in the park, and she's like, wow, this is so beautiful. I love my work. Adele does get samples of the deodorant, and she's like, not the swag I was hoping for. Right? I was hoping for something a little bit more expensive than natural deodorant. But she's like, it is nice, and I like it. So she's like, things are kind of working out.

She'll smell delish while she potentially crashes and burns. I know there's no violence in the story. I think maybe I just want there to be.

She watches Camille pose, and then over the weekend, when she goes to her little things and has strangers take her photo, she poses the way Camille poses, and she gains a bunch of followers.

Okay. Pop wonder. It's literally like Walt Whitman and Oscar Wilde. Yes.

She is amped. She's like, things are going great. I'm gaining followers really rapidly. I look hot in all these photos, and it's almost October fest.

Oh, my God. It's not even October fest yet.

Not even yet.

Jesus Christ.

She's like, things are going to be huge for me personally.

Yeah.

Sunday at family dinner, camille is like, thank you so much for taking photos this week. We got so many brand deals, and Adele stands up for herself. She's like, I think I'm having a really great time. I love taking photos of you, but I do think that I should be paid for the photo work.

Okay.

And Florian is like, we can absolutely discuss that, but we also need to discuss the plumber. He does not want to pay her extra until she has paid off the plumbing bill. Adele is like, I do not think that this is fair. She's like, I don't want to pay the plumbing. Like, the pipes are old. I didn't know. I'm sorry that I'm from America, but I don't think that this is fair. And Florian is you know, there's another thing, which is that part of your job is to clean, and you aren't cleaning anything.

Okay?

He's like, we're going to have to hire a cleaner to do your job, and that costs money too.

So you're going to pay for our cleaner, basically.

I think he's using it more as an excuse to not pay her for the photos, which is like, okay, we're.

In some really fucked up negotiations right now, is the point. Yeah.

And Adele is like, It is true that I'm not cleaning. She's like, it's so hard. I hate it. The kids are messy. I don't want to she's like and Camille just crops the mess out. So, like, what does it matter if.

A mess falls in the woods and the influencers followers aren't there to see it? Is it even a mess?

It's not exactly. At dinner that night, they do not pour her any wine. She doesn't get to have any.

Nor Eastling was a bad nanny.

It is now week three. The house is a wreck. So bad that even Adele notices it. And she's like, wow, I should probably do something about that. But she does not. That night, Florian and Camille are like, we need to talk to you. And she's like, in her head, I am certain this is about the fact that it is so messy. And they're, no, no, this isn't about it being messy. They're like this coming weekend is Oktoberfest. And Adele's like oh, yeah, I know. I'm like, So, no, no, you don't want to be like, it's all tourists. It's always a mess. We always leave. We're going to the Alps this weekend.

Oh, no.

And she's like, you can buy your own ski.

Pass.

And you can ski too. You can come with us.

You can buy your own ski. Fuck off, Camille.

Adele is like, no, thanks. I'm going to Oktoberfest. Like, I've got my little dress, my little durndle. I'm ready. And Camille and Florian are no. No. Going to the Alps is a work trip. If you want a vacation, you need to make other plans.

Devastating for Adele.

What do you do here?

I don't know. I mean, we make plans. God laughs. I think Adele probably didn't put the proper measures in place to secure her October Fest fantasy, so I don't know. I mean, if it's me, genuinely, I'm starting to plan to cut my losses and head back to the US of A and sort of, like, take it on the chin, restrategize how to get back to Europe under better circumstances.

Adele is, like, putting her foot down. She's like, the only thing I want is to go to Oktoberfest? She's like, I won't be going to the Alps. And Camille and Florian are like, we can't make you come. But they're, like, clearly pissed and clearly want to make her go, right? She doesn't know what to do. She goes to get the kids from school, she takes them to the park and she can't hold it together, right? She's, like, crying because she's like, I want to go to October Fest so bad, all I want to do is drink beer out of a glass boot and kiss a tall man. Like, leave me alone. Relatable one of the other pairs, one of the ones that Camille had pointed out as, like, being a bad pair, comes over and is like, you're Camille and Florian's opair, right? And Adele's like yeah. And she's like, Are you? Like, I know they can be hard on people. And Adele's like, what do you mean? And this random pair is like I mean, her last pair didn't even make it two weeks. Like, that's not a good sign.

Whoa. It's very like Emily Gilmore's maids.

Yes. And she's like, Why did the other pair only last two weeks? And this girl's like, I don't like, she didn't never talk to us. Camille does a really good job of making sure that her pairs never talked to anyone else. Adele is like, well, while I have you here, I'm having a bit of a situation. She's like, they want me to go to the outs this weekend. I don't want to go. She's, like, trying to take me away from this thing I really want to do. And the other pair is like, well, do you have a contract? And she's like, yeah, of course I have a contract. And the other pair is like, Go look at your contract.

A classic lesson to learn.

A classic lesson to learn. So Adele goes home and looks at her contract and it explicitly states that she has to be given a month's notice for required travel.

Fact checked.

So she's like, I am bringing this contract to Camille. And she goes to Camille and she's like, my contract actually says that I have to be given, like, a month's notice and so I can't go with you to the Alps and actually, I will be staying here, thank you. And Camille is like, oh, my God, thank you for showing this to me. I also have something I need to share with you. And she brings up an Excel spreadsheet where she has kept tallies of every expense Adele has allegedly cost them. So it is not only the plumber and the cleaner. It is also the wine and the yoga class. And this total is, like, €285.

Stop that right now. That is demonic. What in fuck?

What do you do? You're 22.

No, if I'm 22, I'm probably going to call my mom. I'm probably going to Skype my mom. If I'm 22, I'm going to skype my mom.

Adele is like, I can't pay this back. I don't have any money. And Camila is like, we can take it out of your pay. And she's like, there's a huge opportunity. They make a lot of money by coming to the Alps with us. And Adele is like, no.

Oh, my God. It's like, low key blackmail.

Yes. And to her credit, she stays. Like, she posts all weekend about Oktoberfest. The family goes away. She's like, good ridden. Good luck.

Yeah, no, she's investing in her influencer potential.

Her numbers are rocketing up.

Okay.

Do you know what a Stein holding competition is?

Oh, can I guess?

Yeah.

Does it have something to do with beer and being upside down?

It has something to do with beer, not upside down. They fill up those giant liter glass Steins, and then you just hold it straight out away from your body for as long as possible, and whoever holds it the longest wins.

Oh.

So she enters herself in the Stein Holding competition. Does she win? No. But she does get a video of herself dropping the Stein and all of the beer splashing up into her face. And this video does extremely well on socials.

Wow. Oh, my God. I should take some marketing tips from Adele.

Oktoberfest distracted her from her terrible home life with her terrible work.

Great.

She followed her gut. The night before Camille and Florian return, they message her and are like, we heard that you were talking to the other pairs at the Park Whisper Network.

Okay.

Adele's like, yeah, I was. And Camille's like, oh, did you get any gossip updates? And Adele's like, oh, no, sadly, I was just, like, asking to borrow. Uh huh. And Camille's like oh, yeah.

Okay.

That makes sense. Thanks. And she's like, okay, great. But this weird text conversation after Oktoberfest reminds her of what the other pair said about the pair before her. Of course, if you wanted to know what happened to that girl, what do you do?

I mean, I would probably get back in touch with this pair and see if she had her info.

Exactly. She goes back to the park the next day. She's like, do you have the intel for this pair? And all the other pairs are like, we don't have her phone number. She was here so briefly, the only thing we know is her first name. Okay, what do you want to do you've got only a first name?

I mean, if there is an office at Shay, Camille and Florian or oh, my God, me, like, dating myself. I would see if I could look at Camille's phone. I'm like, Is there an office? Is there a filing cabinet? No, I would see if I could look at her phone.

Adele tries all of this. She tries the office, she tries the phone. She tries, like, searching the first name of people who follow Camille on Instagram, right? This kind of thing. She finds nothing. Finally, she's like, let me just go back to the Opair site. She goes back to the Opair site. She creates a fake family account. She finds several people with the same first name and the same qualifications that she had, and she messages all of them.

Brilliant, very smart, investigative. Okay?

Two days later, one of them messages her back.

Holy shit.

She's like, can we talk on the phone, SIS? Nanny calls her and is, yeah, yeah. I had an awful experience working for them. I'm the one that started Camille's yoga account. I'm the one that did the bookkeeping. I did the Pinterest board with the esthetics. And then when I asked for extra, they said no.

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

She's like, so I quit.

And love I love a ghostwriting tale. Actually, one of my first the first byline I was ever proud of in my entire life was a piece from Marie Claire about the women who ghostwrite for pennies for influencers. And back then, when this piece came out, it was, like, shocking that influencers did not run their own accounts or write their own blog. I know an innocent. Yeah. Wow.

And this is shocking for Adele. She's like, I didn't know that anyone ghost wrote these influencer accounts until I was taking these photos. I didn't realize other people were taking the photos. But she's like, I don't really have enough to indict this couple yet. I'm like, trapped in this weird indentured servitude. So she just kind of goes about her day, waiting to figure out what to do. But that evening, Camille is like, hey, on Wednesday, I know it's your day off, and I know you're going to be downtown and taking photos, but could you stop by the post office for me and pick up some sponsor goods for me? And Adele's? Like, yeah, of like, I'm happy to pick it up. What is it? And she's like, It's six boxes of sports knives, drinks. It's six boxes of knives.

It's liquid dev.

Yeah, basically. And this, adele is like, that is so heavy. This is not, like, run by the post office and pick up a natural deodorant. This is six boxes of heavy sports no.

Oh, no.

She decides this is it. Like, this is the last straw. She'sick of this. She's like europe's not what I wanted. I'm making so little money.

Right?

But the problem is she can't leave the family and not leave Germany. Like, her visa is a work visa.

Sure.

So do you want to go home? And if, like, how do you get out of like, how do you explain to Camille and Florian?

I would fake the death of a family member.

Okay, great plan.

Love it. Germany's a little scary. Germany's not like Southern Europe where they'll.

Kind of like where they're like, who are you? Stay forever. Have a child, help our birth.

Like, fudge. I would fudge my stay a little bit. Like, there's some wiggle room there. Visa wise, I would try to get, like, a good week long vacation out of it and then pop on back to the US of A and restrategize. That's what I would do.

What Adele does is she books a ticket home. She waits for a day that Camille and Florian are totally in charge of the kids, and then she ghosts the country of Germany.

She ghosts germany. Oh, I fucking love that.

She gets on the plane. She's like, I'm going home. Fuck these people. She's looking at her Instagram, and she realizes she still has access to Camille's account. Do you sabotage her.

Subtly?

Adele does not subtly sabotage her. She clicks new post.

Oh, my God.

She scrolls through the photos on her phone of the house. She picks some of the kitchen being a disaster, the kids in the messy bedroom. She edits all of this into Camille's preferred esthetic.

Yes.

She captions it. Life is messier than we pretend.

Oh, I love that. Oh, that is good.

She hits post, turns her phone on. Airplane mode, takes off.

That is divine. Well done, Adele. I have to give you props.

We are almost at the end. How do you feel? Whose side are you on?

Oh, well, now I'm on the antihero side because, well, certainly by default, I'm on Adele's side. I feel like her behavior is a little more excusable just due to youthful hubris, if nothing else. And I gotta love a clever revenge plot. So we stand.

She lands. Her phone is blowing up, obviously. She has six missed calls from Camille. She has a bunch of texts. She's like, I feel vindicated. I did it.

Yes.

She opens Instagram on her phone. The post has gone mega viral.

Of course.

Everyone loves it. They're like, oh, my God, you're so vulnerable.

Oh, my God. Literally, that was my exact next thought. I was about to be like, this is going to do wonders for her brand.

Yes. Everyone is like, you're so vulnerable. You're so brave. Thank you for sharing, Camille. Every single day that week is posting more photos of the mess and being like, I just wanted to shine a light on the everyday struggles of working mothers.

I would watch A, the founder style biopic about the rise of this woman's brand accident. It's like the accidental invention of the sandwich. You know what I mean?

Exactly. Just rock it to the sky. Do you have any final feelings? Before I give you my final updates.

Thank you so much for sharing this with me. This was the perfect story for me to hear because I thought it was going to go really south, but it went really east, and then it went back really west, and it's actually kind of a wholesome story about expectations.

Yeah. The updates I have for you are that Adele saw what it takes to be an influencer and decided, I do not want that.

That's an important lesson to learn in 2013.

Yeah. And so after a couple of years in the US. She established a little career and found a way to move back to Europe. So she's living in Europe happily. Congratulations.

Oh, my God. A growth narrative.

A growth narrative. The final update I have on Camille and Florian is that they run a psychedelic meditation retreat in the Alps.

That doesn't surprise me. One tiny little fucking bit.

Where you gather mushrooms and make tea to heal your inner child.

No.

Now I want to go.

I want to go.

This meditation retreat does not offer childcare.

Oh, sure. That tracks. I feel like everyone benefited from this. Hijinks, everyone.

Everyone can win sometimes.

Yeah. And that, if anything, disproves. Zero sum bias.

Wow, look at that loop. Amanda, thank you so much for coming on the show. It was a delight to have you. Oh, God.

It was an honor and a pleasure. I never want to leave. I never want to leave.

Thank you for listening to normal gossip. If you have a gossip story to share with us, email us at normalgosip@defector.com. Or you can leave us a voicemail at 2679 gossip. If you love this podcast and want us to keep making it, become a friend or a friend of a friend@supportnormalgossip.com. You can follow the show on Instagram and TikTok at Normalgosip. You can follow Kelsey on all social media at McKinney. Kelsey. This podcast was produced by Alex Sujong Loughlin. Justin Ellis is defectors projects editor. Jasper Wang and Sean Coon are defectors business guys. Tom Lay is our editor in chief. Jay Cole Vieira is our associate producer. Abigail Siegel is our intern. Dan McQuade runs our merch store, which you can find at Normalgosip Store. Para Jacobi designed our show Art. Thank you to Catherine Chu for your help on this episode. Thanks to the rest of the Defector staff, defector Media is a collectively owned subscriber based media company. Normal Gossip is a proud member of Radiotopia. Normal Gossip is hosted by Kelsey McKinney.

I'm Madison Cambor, and remember, you did not hear this from me.

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