Jonathan Reynolds is here with us this morning for Labor Shadow Secretary of State for Business Trade. Good inflation figures this morning.

Welcome. Everyone should welcome a fall in inflation. But I think what we will also be saying, watching at home, is they'll be pointing out they're still worse off, that their prices are still rising, that the tax burden is still high. If you're renewing your fixed rate mortgage in the next few months, you're still going to be paying a lot more, almost certainly, than you were in the past. Of course, I welcome it. We've got to recognize for a lot of people, life is still quite tough. I have to raise a smile listening to the Chancellor on that slot there. If you remember when we were talking about inflation rising, it was nothing to do with the government. Now it's coming back down to some of those pressures recede in the global economy. It's all for them. You wouldn't do that, would you? You were in power. What I would say on that is, why was the UK so uniquely exposed to high inflation? Well, partly our energy system, a lot of exposure to fossil fuel prices. Government's doubling down on that. A lot of workers not able to get back into the workplace. Nhs waiting lists high.

They're still high. The deal we've got with the European Union on things like food and the checks and how we can ease some of those pressures, something we want to do not from the government. I think the Bank of England has done its independent job as we would all want to see, but I am a little bit amused, the Chancellor wants credit for that. But on the substance, of course, everyone wants to see inflation come down.

Some of the stuff that you highlighted there, you're going to inherit if you win the next election. How long is it going to take you to fix it?

Well, first of all, we're not complacent about the election. There's still a lot of time to go before that.

Do you know the most-Oh, do you want to bet that it's not going to be in May?

Some of my colleagues have been caught out by that. What I wouldn't put past this government is having an election that isn't the second of May, but it is still in May or June. But we don't know. On the economy, how fast can a change be made? We're talking about a substantial break with the last 14 years. That will not come overnight. But the ambition we've got on stronger employment rights for working people, We can deliver that to a King's speech. We believe changes to the planning system, building homes and infrastructure, we can deliver that. We believe what we've already been able to say, okay, in terms of the certainty we can give businesses, we want more business investment, higher productivity, higher growth. We've spelled out things like what we'll do on corporation tax and industrial strategy to give people that confidence. We know people will look at it. What we want them to say is, Look, the uncertainty, the chaos of the past is past the UK. Come and look at us again. Come and invest in the UK under a labor government.

Why should my viewers believe you this morning when Sharon Graham, who's the General Secretary of the United Union, is not convinced.

Well, look, first of the thing I'd say is we do need a focus on growth. I know there's some comments there that say that's somehow a mistake. If people don't want to see growth in the economy, they should be delighted with the last 14 years.

Your plans are for the birds, is what she says.

Well, look, if people don't want growth in the economy-This is an organization, a union, that's given you £11 million since 2019. The first thing I'm saying is growth has to be the focus. We're right on that. The other thing I'd say is anyone who posits a tension between the discipline that Rachel Reeve spelled out last night and the big economic transformation people want to see. That's a mistake because you get that investment in public services and a stronger economy through that discipline. I'll give you a really specific example of that. 2021, the projection for this year from the OBR was that we'd be spending about £29 billion a year on debt interest, managing the national debt. What are we spending? Over £80 billion. Imagine I was coming on this program and saying, I'm going to spend £50 billion more on public services. That would be quite a story, wouldn't it? When we're spending more on debt interest because of the lack of discipline from Liz Trust and Quasi Quartang, that is not really a story. Anyone's saying, We want to spend more on public services. You're wrong to have these fiscal rules and the discipline.

I'm afraid I really strongly disagree with that. If you deliver the big exciting stuff people want to see through that proper approach to the national finances. The contrast between what Rachel set out and that big unfunded £46 billion Blackhall commitment from the Chancellor somehow going to abolish national insurance, that's the contrast. I'm We're absolutely certain we're right to go on this.

Well, there's lots of stuff I couldn't pick on that, but I particularly want to ask you about the fact that my viewers at home watching this morning will hear all these figures that you're lobbying about left, right, and center and say, Yeah, but what impact is that going to have on me feeding my kids week after week after week. Then they might go to work and one of their mates say, Oh, the General Secretary of the Unite Union that's given labor £11 million since 2019, Sharon Graham, say the economic growth of labor, their plans are for the birds.

Well, look, I could strongly disagree with that, again, because the policies labor have already published and put forward our industrial strategy, our green prosperity plan.

But if the union doesn't believe you, how can my viewers believe you?

Well, look, I think people will go and give us a hearing based on what we say and do. I think if they look at our plans to build homes, to have an industrial strategy, to have more protection in the workplace. Part of Rachel's speech last night was not just a critique of the conservative government of the last 14 years. It had the humility to say, We look back to the last labor government and think, They didn't have enough of an industrial strategy. They didn't have enough security in the workplace. There are things we want to do differently to the last Labor Government, as well as the last 14 years. But look, I think we should not believe that we can't do better than we have done for the last 14 years. We have some great things as a country. We have, in the past, tackled problems like home building and the lack of business investment. We can have a better deal with the European Union. We can have more security in the workplace. We can have more ambition on net zero that delivers good jobs.

We're almost out of time.

Let's be optimistic about it.

I know that you've got to go. So two very quick questions. Had Ed Davy on the show this morning, he still won't apologize for when he was post office minister, should he?

I think he's got to have the humility to do that. I think everyone involved in this, a lot of different political parties, different postal ministers, has to recognize this wasn't addressed. I think maybe Ed Davy's got a bit more pressure because of the jobs he has taken since he was the postal minister, some connections there to the post office, and I think he met with some of the people. I don't think we should just focus on one person. I think this is a really significant failing, but anyone who's had some involvement with it, I think we'll want to look back and say, Ideally, this would have been done better.

And a thought about if you had relatives who were at the London Treaty at the London Clinic and their personal records were accessed or somebody attempted to access them.

Very, very worrying. I mean, people's personal medical information is incredibly important. I think surely a criminal offense to access that without due permission unlawfully. So there'll be a lot of concern there, and we will need some answers very quickly on that.

Good to see you as always. Thanks very much indeed. Thank you.