I was talking to my friend. Hey, good morning. I was talking to my friend. Did you just restart yourself?

Still rolling. Just a clean start there.

Wait, just do Sean. Hey. Hey. Hey.

Hey.

Smart. Now, Sean says that he got up at 4:00 this morning, went back to bed, and that that's his standard routine.

I guess I remember you telling us about that, but what do you do when you get up at 4:00 that gets you back down?

I read I play games on my computer and anything to get my brain back to sleep.

That's something you haven't been able to stop doing, right? No, for years. You don't sleep through the night.

I mean, if I take something, I do.

Well, what's wrong with that?

I just don't want to do it all the time.

You're so worried about the temple that is your body, right? You don't want to put anything nasty inside there.

Yeah, nothing to mix with the other crap that's already in my belly.

You don't want to screw up the mac and cheese gut by now. Your bamboo shoot healthy body.

Sean, how would you describe your body? Because I'll go first because somebody asked me to describe Sean's body, and right off the top, I said, pigs in a blanket. How would you?

That's what came to- You know what's so funny? I was watching the Bill Maher show the other night, and the guest got on, and Bill said, Gosh, you've lost so much weight. He goes, Yeah, there's nothing worse than a skinny guy with a pot belly. I raised my hand, and Scotty was like, Yep.

No, I don't see you as that. No, me neither. You guys have both a very nice frame.

I could get there.

You have a very nice proportional frame. It's true.

How big you think you could get, Sean?

I wanted to get so big when I was younger. I wanted to get like... I would go to the gym all the time. I'd drink milkshakes. My oldest brother would take me out for burgers, and I would constantly, constantly eat.

I just couldn't gain a pound. It was like what?

Like How did that pan out? Did it give you... Did you get the look you were looking for?

Well, hundreds and hundreds of years ago, that was a sign of power, right? Exactly. A big and huge and a glutton, right? Yeah.

If you were thin, what? You had no power?

Yeah. You were proletariat.

It was a sign of... Yeah, if you were bigger, it was a sign of prosperity.

Well, right.

Here's something that happened to me yesterday. I was at the car wash.

There you were.

I threw my stuff.

You like to ride through? You'd like one of those? No. I do that with the kids every once in a while. Oh, you do for real?

It was fun.

Yeah. It's fun. No, this guy is like, You got to get a car wash.

That's what I call, by the way, Good Clean Fun.

Good Clean Weekend Fun.

No.

When the car wash is good, clean fun.

No, we get the quote. No, you didn't.Thank you.Go ahead. Back to Sean.

Go ahead, Sean. Back to Sean.

I get it handwashed, right? I'm sitting there, oh, look at this.

Hold your jokes. Hold your jokes, Will. God, Look, he's just... Oh, we heard hand. Time for a CJ joke.

Fucking clown.

Go ahead, Sean.

Fuck. I gave my car away for a hand wash.I come sit down, I'm waiting, and I threw my stuff in the trash when you clean your car up before they wash it. All of them consist... There's a lot of near full bottles of water. I was sitting there because I didn't think I was going to be thirsty. 20 minutes later, I'm like, God, I'm thirsty. I'll go back to the trash and pulled out one of the bottled water. God, I hope someone took a picture of that. A woman just stared at me like, There's something wrong with me. I was conflicted. I was like, Do I care what she thinks? Do I not care what she thinks? I cared what she thought. I looked at her, I said, I threw my bottle out prematurely. She said, Oh, my God.

She just got crazier in her eyes.

She goes, Aren't you afraid it's dirty? I said, No, it wasn't touching anything bad. She just glared at me.

You're in a conversation. Yeah. Wait, that was the end of That was the whole thing.

She just ended up staring me and I drank it. Would you ever do that? Yeah.

Fuck, man, I don't even know where to attack that story. Every part of it is just open for assassination.

Wait, so was your water bottle slang already filled with a bottle? Why didn't you just put that thing right in your little water bottle purse and just go sit down and wait for your car to be done? You've got one of those, right?

No, because I threw them out thinking, Oh, I don't need them. But there was a little water left in them. Then sitting there, I was like, Oh, I'm thirsty, actually. So I went back into the trash. I love it.

You don't want to use a glass bottle that's reusable? How fucking dare you?

Or a metal.

Sure. Let me just tell you something. I need to get a water bottle.

That is, to me, The height of privilege.

Will is opening up a plastic water ball right on. Okay. The height of- A visual joke for our radio audience. It's not fair.

Well, anyway, enough about that.

Are we getting to the guess?

No, you don't want to do another hour on that?

Will, what did you get into last night?

Last night, I got into nothing much. It was pretty chill. It was kids. It was movie night for the little guys. Every night is movie night.

Did you watch a movie with them?

Yeah, but they- What movie? Last night, we ended up watching the classic Peter Pan. What they'll do is they'll go- We're talking about the little boys, not the big boys. The little boys. They'll go, We want to watch Pinocchio. I'm like, Okay, so you put it on. We put it on in They come in, they call it movie night, 20 minutes before their bedtime. Then they don't really watch. What they really want to do is they want to be flipped on the bed and thrown into the pillows.

Yeah, I get it.

That shit gets them all riled up. Denny will actually go. He'll just look at you and go, Can you throw Can you please? Oh, yeah. Okay.

But doesn't get them all fired up and then they can't go to bed? No.

As it turns out, and you can look it up, as it turns out, that activity, getting thrown around and getting squeezed and stuff, it gets a lot of nervous energy out, and they end up falling asleep. It's been-Oh, really?

Yeah, it's been about- Maybe I need to try that.

Yeah, have Scotty throw you around. No.

Hey, Will, you throw me.

I'll throw you for sure.

Hey, what about, have you ever gotten real close to accidentally really hurting one of your kids doing that. It's like, and trampolines, by the way. Forget it. Yeah, Maple wants one. Honey, no, you're just going to get better and better and better at it, meaning you're going to be flipping yourself higher and higher and doing more revolutions, and then it It doesn't end well.

The trampoline, we have one. We have a little house out on Long Island, New York State.

Long Island, sure. Next to the bowling alley.

We have a trampoline, and now, of course, it's injured. I'm going to say six winters, and it's real rusty. You've seen it. It's always covered in debris. I'm so stupid. I let the kids are like, We're going out. I'm like, Okay. It's going to be a moment. There's going to be somebody come back and go my arms backwards. Yeah, I I can't.

I know. It's just, Go in the pool, kids.

How fun was Sunday? Okay, here, ready? Sunday was super fun. Guys, you may be noticing a pattern with our guests lately. They're a lot cooler than we are. My guest today is no exception. We're getting right into the intro. Before becoming an academy award-winning actor, he made his acting debut alongside his mother in an East Village improv show at age 10. As a teen, he dabbled in breakdancing to impress the girls. Ditto, the breakdancing part. Then he played Head Thug in the '90s 1990's Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie. But I think he's done just a few things since then. We'll have to ask him. It's one of my favorite actors of all time, Sam Rockwell.

Oh, Sam, he's all healed up.

What's up, guys?

It's all better. I'm so sorry you had to wait a really long time for that.

No, that was amazing. That was fantastic.

Listener, our guest today had an illness. What, a few weeks ago? I did. Yes.

I did. I had some neurovirus or something, whatever makes lots of poop come out of you.

You had to pull the handbrake day off.

I did.

What he did was- I had a temperature.

He doesn't know that it's a surprise guest situation. He texted each one of us individually, or at least me, and said, Hey, man. Jason. I think it started with just a picture of a thermometer. Sam, we're going to let you talk in a second. But, listener, you need to know that Sam, one of his things that he's he's very famous for is sending pictures of really life-scarring images. I thought, What could this thermometer be? It must be a rectal thermometer coming from Sam. I didn't really respond. Then a couple of days later, he said something like, Listen, man, I'm still sick. I'm not going to be able to make it. I'm like, Hey, Sam, I think you meant to send this to somebody else who might be waiting for you to show up somewhere, and he should just know you sent it to the wrong person. He's like, Was I not supposed to be on your podcast today?

I'm like, Oh, So you were a surprise.

Will didn't know, and Jason didn't know when you were going to come on, so it's fine. That's right. Still a surprise to all of us. Hey, guys. It's so good to see you, Sam. Thank you for being here today.It's so good to see you. This is so cool. Good to see you guys, man. That's one of my favorites. Are you doing the same Jason Bateman thing because of a part? Were you growing all this facial hair?

I am. I'm doing something in April where I look like...

Yeah, me too. April 15th. I got it. You grew up, man.

What if it was the same You grow a man's beard.

Yeah, it was the same part. You grow a man's beard.

Mine's-well, how long has that been? How long you got on that?

About six years. No.

This is about-You might need some hair and makeup.

You might need to go into the trailer. But my guy is supposed to be a real loser and is incapable of-Well, you got that part, but get to the beard.

Yeah, I got another month left.

Anyway, Samy, thanks for being here. Tell me, I want to get into all of it, but I want to know about the breakdancing thing when you... Yeah. That was bad breakdancing. But I remember years ago, I saw you do the splits on Saturday Night Live. I was like, Is that really him? Was that really you?

Yeah, I did. I tore my hamstrung Doing it during Full For Love, actually, eight times a week.

Wow. Wow. Full For Love is great.

It was a bit in the play. Yeah. You got to be warm.

You did the full-on splits?

It's a cheat. I don't know if it's the Risky business or the James Brown, but you're like- Oh, yeah. Careful. Yeah, careful. It's not quite the split- splits.

Well, have you always been able to do that? You always been a bit of a dancer?

I messed around. I remember watching James Brown and watching Michael Jackson. It was a way to meet girls when I was 12. I guess I watched Risky Business and tried to imitate that.

But then the great limited series that you did with the Fosse. Fosse Bird. Yeah. You don't just train for that. You need to be somewhat gifted before you even consider taking that part on. You know what you're doing on the dance floor, yeah?

Well, thanks. But that was the first formal training I did, I think, on that thing.

How much dancing you do in these days, man?

Hey, cool it, bro.

I'm just want to know.

Hey, man, we did G-force, man. Cool it.

I know. It's true.

Wait, you guys were in G-force together? Yeah.

What a cast, by the way.

What a cast, Zack.

Galvanadkiss, Bill Nighy.

Bill Nighy, that's right. That's right.

So Sam, when you were a kid, San Francisco, right? I love San Francisco. Yeah. In the city or just in the Bay Area? In the city proper, yeah. Moved all the time. Wow. And your parents were both actors, too?

Yeah. My father was a union rep for the supermarket Clerks and the printers. We lived We lived everywhere. Filmore, Tenderloin, Castro. I met Harvey Milk when I was eight years old.

No way.

He was getting into unions and stuff.

That's wild.

Yeah, my dad was a big union guy. Couldn't cross a picket line.

Do you think that San Francisco had more of an artistic community or as much of an artistic community as New York? Or was it different? Or what's the difference?

It wasn't as cool. I wanted to go to the Fame School. I went to I was in a small school of the arts in San Francisco. I went to high school with Margaret Chow, Ayesha Tyler. Me and Ayesha dated for a while. We were in a terrible improvisational troupe called Batwing Lubricant. It was not bad. We did bad improv. We performed at the Other Cafe, which is a famous place.

Wow. What age are we at now when the acting bug starts to take hold?

Well, I was 10. I dabbled with it, and then I was busy getting stone and trying to meet girls, and then I didn't take acting very seriously. It was a rough school, McAteer, but we had the Soda Kids within that, about 500 of them within the 2000. Juvenile Hall was across the street. It was like a mixture of kids from the Mission. There were rich kids coming in for the School of the Arts. I was dating I'm a dancer. It was around 16. I was dabbling in it, but I didn't take it seriously.

When did it get serious? Did you move out of there? Did you go to New York?

I got a movie when I was 18, and then I moved to New York. I didn't really get... I do toothpaste commercials and shit like that. Then I studied with William Esper when I was 23. Sure. I did two years with him. Then I met my acting coach there, Terry Knickerbacher, and studied Meisner.

Wow. Now, Why was the move to New York instead of Los Angeles? Shorter drive, more opportunity?

Yeah, I guess my mom lived there. I thought that was the place to go. I romanticized being a struggling actor because I'd seen my mom do it.

And a free place to stay, maybe.

And a free place to stay for a money.

But I love that story you told in your acceptance speech when you won your Oscar. Sorry, I just hold it because we're going to put applause in. Use mine. For sure. But, dude, so you win an Oscar. You tell that great story about going to the movies with your dad, and I loved the way. I'm just going, I literally just remember it because it was so impactful that your dad would take you to school, and he'd lie to the school saying that you had to do some shit or somebody died.

Yeah, then my grandmother passed away. Again, it's pretty morbid, isn't it?

That's so good.

That's so great. He's fucking the best, man.

I was in music camp when I was a kid, and I sent a letter to my mom saying, Can you please come pick me up? Please just tell him grandpa died. Please just tell him grandpa and you have to pick me up. She never did.

She never did, yeah.

And did you love it? Did you love getting pulled out of school, going to the movies, or did you want to stay in school and hang out with your buddies?

No, I loved it. The school I was in at the time, I think I was getting beat up a lot. It was a rough school.

I know you were in fight. I read you were in a lot of fights, the white supremacist.

Yeah, but I didn't win any of the fights. I was getting my ass kicked. When my dad took me out, I was like, Yeah, let's get the hell out of here. And then, thank God, grandma was alive. And then we went But we went to the opening day of Rocky. Oh, God. Really? Nobody had heard of it.

My dad took me to all those movies during that time, too. They were so good. All those movies that none of my friends were seeing. But my friends weren't going in to see the Werner Hertzog documentary or any movies with subtitles. No.

I remember my mom would take me, too. I was like her movie pal. I remember her taking me to see, was it Missing? The one with Sissy Spasik and Jack Yeah, and Jack Lament. Yeah, about the people going missing in Chile. I was 11. How old were you when you saw that? Eleven. Pretty heavy.

Sure.

Couldn't see for months. I saw the Deer Hunter when I was 10. I saw a taxi driver when I was eight.

Exactly, right? It got you excited about movies, but it makes you grow up quick.

But there's something there. Okay, but there is something there messaging-wise, which is like, you don't want to take your kids to just see something that's got gratuitous violence or language or whatever. But if it's great filmmaking and it's a great filmmaking, and it's a great story, and it's great art, then there's value in that.

The violence needs to be done cinematically.

Yeah, but I mean, people enjoy the other thing. I was on a plane once. I saw a guy watch Fast and Furious movies with the sound off. I'm just saying, so there's something for everybody.

That is when you've had the full lobotomy. That's when they took it all out. They just scraped it clean.

Wait, Sam, I also read you hurt your hands or something. Was that from fighting?

No, it was a car accident. Yeah. What?

Wait, is that fully extended?

Oh, wait, do it again.

Can you not... Oh, yeah, you can straighten them out.

Oh, look at that. Wow. The ginger. What happened?

The Ginger is a little tweaked. You see it in the green mile for a second. It works for that character.

But I usually- He has a tweak tip of what the FU thing.

They were all crushed. Four of them were crushed. What happened?

I flipped a Jeep Cherokee on Sunset and La Brea. Just fucking got into a squat. You just flipped it or you were in it.

That's right.

I'm fucking strong.

Use your legs.

I started the Royce really early.

That'd be so good if you were driving around, then you just see Rockwell, and you're like, Is he flipping a fucking car?

Wait, Sunset and La Brea, that sounds like you were upset at the fat burger there on the corner when you're not getting you.

I hit the lead a little… After it rains, when it gets oily in LA, the roads, and I hit the lead fast. I was trying to impress a girl, and she kept going. I took a left turn, and I got into a skin, I got out of the skin, and it just went… But those models, I think, tended to flip pretty easily.

They're tippers.

Wait, a model, you're talking about the car or the girl? The Cherokee. Walk me back. You're trying to impress a girl at the stoplight that you don't know.

I'm trying to do like an American graffiti, hit the lead thing. Sure. But then I took a left and I got into a skid. Then I got out of the skid, but then I hit the curb and I went...

Fuck me. Do you miss driving being in New York?

No, I don't miss driving at all. Not at all? No, I drive in movies.

That's like a video game. Yeah, that's true. I once had to drive in a movie, and the scene was I was driving a car that was going the wrong way on a freeway. What they did was they built one of these on top of the car where they have a stunt driver up there with a wheel that is steering the car so that he or she can make all the correct turns. They're not relying on an actor to go left, go right in coordination with the cars coming at you going left and right that they've worked out. It was the most horrific thing I've ever been through where I'm speeding the wrong way.

Because you're not in control.

You're not in control. Yeah, and I'm not in control, but looking as if I am, I'm turning my wheel, but there's a dude up on top of the roof in a little tiny built pod Just a couple of hours earlier.

That doesn't sound great to me. That sounds cut.

No, but it worked.

If you have control issues, especially.

I want to race cars. Does anybody else want to race car? I'm not even kidding. Do you really want to race cars? I do want to just try it once. You know, guys, for my birthday, that's what I want. I'm not kidding.

Do you really? I can set that up. Yeah, we can go to Willow Springs. I'm not kidding.

Jason fucking won. We've talked about Jason's won that thing three times. I know. I want to try.

You've raced cars, Jason?

I mean, in a celebrity race. But then I did have two-What car is that?

No, you flipped a car in a real race in the Pocanos.

Yeah, exactly. It was professional for two races, and then got upside down and said, Okay, I'm good. I'll go back to the celeb stuff.

Fassbender is doing that, right?

But he's doing the real, real, real.

He races like BMWs and shit across Europe. Yeah.

Wow. That's insane. Sam, I want to get back to you. I don't need to do that. I want to get back to you when you're at the beginning. I do it on Broadway.

Sure.

I do it on the boards.

I can't wait to just talk theater and all that.

Yeah, Sam, anything ever funny ever happened on stage? Anyone ever forget a line?

I've never seen Sean skip over I want to get to Broadway. I've never seen him go like, We'll get to that.

Can we talk about this little show that Sean did at the Tabasco?

Oh, the Tabasco.

Was he not just spicy as hell in there?

You're very nice to come, Sam. It meant a lot to me. It meant a lot.

But seriously, listen, I go on about all you guys and like a rest of the development, I go on about Ozark, Identity Jason hears me say Identity Theft one more time, he's going to punch me in the face. That was the movie.

I was driving the wrong way down. Was that the movie?

Was it?

Yeah.

But I'd seen you in a play before. I didn't realize that you're a fucking assassin.

I know. No.

I mean, what the fuck?

What was that? Do you think that's why we were all so knocked out? Because we just thought it wasn't going to be good at all. Here we are, boy, we're sitting here, we're going to watch a train right here.

You said, When we went and saw the opening night, we're all there and we're fucking like… Jason, right as this current comes down, Jason turns me a tears in his eyes and he goes, Podcast is over.

When the play was over and He had just gained mountains of respect in Will and I's mind, and we're already very high. But to see you do that, the level you did it, and I'm crying, and the curtain comes down after the curtain call. I did. I turned to Will. I said, Well, the fucking podcast is ruined now. It's ruined.

Now you got to double down on the Bust as Chops.

Yeah, for sure.

I mean, there's nothing-That's very nice.

Shut up, Sean.

Hey, Sean. Sean, can I ask Can I ask you a question for real? Can I be real now that we're on this subject? Do you have any good theater stories?

We will be right back.

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It's interesting. This Sunday, Jason, Will, and I are all going to a friend's house because it's this person's birthday. We all struggled to figure out what to get this person, and we all chipped in a little bit, each of us, and got this person something very, very, very special. We can't wait to give it to her. Don't worry if you haven't found a gift yet for your special someone, Macy's Gift Finder has amazing gifts at any price from lux to under $25. Whether you're shopping for the tech guru, sports fan, or chef in your life, Macy's has something for everyone. They have your favorite brands like Ralph Lauren, Coach, Nike, and more. They even have Godiva. Don't forget to grab a little something for yourself. Pick up a new fragrance or something to spruce up your beauty regimen. Plus, get 25% to 40% off underwear and lingerie from Calvin Klein, Gap, and more top brands. Some exclusions may apply. Everything I mentioned and more is on Macy's macys. Com/giftfinder. That's macys. Com/giftfinder. Smartlist gets support from Audible. Get closer to the best you. Audible lets you enjoy all your audio entertainment in one app. You'll always find the best of what you love or something new to discover.

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All right, back to the show.

You know what? I'm going to tell you something, and then Sam, I want one ready, locked and loaded. So get ready because you're off theater.

Don't fucking threaten me with a great story.

But listen, I just sent Will this thing that stretches out your calf because if you stretch out your calves and your hands, you release your your lower back because Will has been having lower back stuff. I got that during Good Night Oscar because I started getting plantar fasciitis. My feet start hurting. It was so bad during a couple I was literally shuffling along like I was 95 years old. I was in so much pain doing the show. Two days later, Will, I used that thing I sent you. It was gone.

Sean, so Sean sent me- Did you ever get the boot? No, it's that thing that rocks to stretch your calves, right? You put your foot on it and then just...

It's just- Yeah, and you were sleeping it, right? You sleep in it.

No, you just stand on it. No, you just stand on it and you just seesaw. My son Abel, I mean, my son Danny, who's almost... He's like three and a half.

It looks Okay, that's something else. Oh, that's advanced.

So these guys, I've been having this issue with my ham string, and then it became like a sciatic nerve thing. I'm going to be fucking going to see this guy. We're not going to mention Tarek again. This would be four in a row. We're going to mention Dr.

Tarek. Tarek is great. You know Tarek? Have you seen Duran, the Israeli magician?

No, but do you know Tarek?

Wait, you get to watch magic tricks?

Okay, so Tarek is the fuck. I've been going to Tarek. I've been living in his office for the last two weeks.

Tarek, he's got a great elbow. Duran is also great.

I don't know Duran. Tarek has an unbelievable elbow. When he gets it there, forget it. Anyway, so Sean on Sunday night, we're at dinner with our friends, and he goes, I'm going to get you this thing, this rocking thing. It comes the next day, Monday. I do it yesterday. By yesterday afternoon, I feel infinitely better.

Really? That's really good.

Dude, it's the fucking-Oh, really good.

It's unreal. You got to shut your hands and your calves, and you're good to go.

Yeah, you've been screwed up for a few weeks on that. I have.

That's great. Indeed, I have.

It starts with the feet. Yeah.

It starts with the feet. Sam, so hand injuries from the car. Any injuries from Broadway?

Hamstream. Well, I've had tendinosis, two calves from other stuff. That's about it. Shoulders are creaky.

You name it. How old are you now, Sam?

I'm 77. No, I'm 55.

Right. So we're all about the same age. You look great. You look fantastic. You look great. Thanks. You guys look great. Things start to ache a little bit, right? I don't feel like I deserve the knee the tweaking or the hip tweaking because we all stay in pretty good shape. We exercise and stuff, but the car does break down.

It does break down. It's really annoying.

But so, Sam, talk to me about the, quote, well 1994 Miller Light commercial. Oh, my God. Is that when you knew? Okay, I got this big commercial. It pays really well. Maybe I can quit all my other jobs. And what were those other jobs?

Well, I worked in a lot of restaurants, Barback, Busboy. I delivered burritos. I heard you, Ruffalo, when he was bartending. It was a similar time around when I was 28, 29. I started working more as an actor. Started doing movies and Both of, yeah. Delivering burritos on a bicycle was my last job.

No shit. Who do you go furthest back with? Of the actor buddies that you still have, do you go back furthest with Crute Up or Mark?

Well, yeah, Crudup and Thoreau and I were together during 9/11, and we knew Phil, and very happy for Jeffrey Wright and Paul Giamani and Ruffalo.

For Tracy, that's Philip Seymour Hoffmann.

Philip Seymour Hoffman. Yes, let's listen.

We don't really mention, as you probably know, we don't really like to mention Thoreau on this podcast.

We'll just cut that out. He's funny, you should say that. We'll go back, we'll trim that out.

He's persona non-g around here. Yeah. Well-oh, he's got a message for us?

He told me to give you a message. He said, You could ask Arnett this, question from a listener in New York named Justin T. Will, when you buy buttoned-down shirts, do you take them to someone to remove the top five buttons, or do you just buy them pre-removed? Also wondering, what's your night time? Let me get this right. Decaluj routine. Love the show. Keep up the good work.

Oh, my God. That's so true.

That's Rich. Coming from a guy that removes his sleeves. I didn't realize you don't usually button.

You don't have any buttons. Is that true?

Yes, it's true. What do you call it? Is that called a Bird-Rentals? You mean you go like that?

I do. If I'm wearing a button shirt, I do a lot of this. Why?

Because you think you're doing people's favor. You got to give people a favor?

You got to give people what they want. You got to give people what they want. You have to understand that we are always transmitting and receiving. I'm putting out and I'm also receiving. I feel from the world they want to get more skin. Samy knows what I'm talking Oh, my God.

You got to do it.

All right, Samy. Lawn dogs.

Yes. Talk about skin. Yeah, lots of skin on that.

I know, right? Wait, so you received critical acclaim, and your performance was incredible. Thank you. Yeah, I love that movie.

Those were the days I had abs.

I've not heard of lawn dogs. Lawn dogs?

You got to see it. It's so good.

Yeah, I get naked. I think I've seen it. I was in good shape back then.

That was fun.

Is that the thing you think opened the doors for you, the porn?

Yeah, I think so. I think that was one of them. It did Safe Men with Paul Giamani, Ruffalo, Dinklage.

I was going to say Safe Men, that Hamburg, right? Isn't that Hamburg?

You know Safe Men? Yeah. It's a little gem, I think.

I knew some of those guys because those guys who produced it, I think they were the same dudes who made my buddy Steps movie that I did.

Anyway, great guys. Then Box of Moonlight was those three.

Box of Moonlight. Yeah.

Helped me get... Then Galaxy Quest and Green Miles.

I want to talk about Galaxy Quest. It's one of my favorite movies.

I love it so much. I saw Safemen. I really love Safe Men, by the way, and I knew a lot of those dudes. But then when you did fucking Galaxy Quest, Rockwell, you absolutely destroyed You destroyed it. Yeah, incredible.

You destroyed it. Incredible. Thanks, guys. I auditioned for the Enrico calling Tony part. Oh, yeah. It's still waiting to hear.

You're not right for it.

I know I'm not right for it.

Well, they agreed, but I'm just saying that you're not right.

Wait, this is from your character, Guy Fliegman, right? Yes. He was so fucking great. Fuck. It was like a pick me energy. This is from Scotty, okay? Oh, boy. Scotty said the whole bit about you not wanting to be sent down first, your character, whenever you go to a planet. Those characters always died. That was a reference to Star… You probably know this, Star Trek and the red shirts. Yes. They're expendables. But a lot of people don't know that. I didn't know that. That in Star Trek, whenever Spock and Kirk would come to a planet, That's right. They would always send these guys down first, and they would always die.

It was such a funny-I just stole my performance from Bill Paxton in Aliens.

Hey, Sean, just wet in out. I just want to see if I can see the make out the Mountain Dew on your desk if it's possible. The fucking monster energy.

And the Star Trek cosplay outfit.

No, but it was. You know what, though? It is true. That was the first time somebody made that joke on screen. Your fucking delivery, Samy. It's just un fucking real. Dude, Every time-We lucked out with that movie. Sam, you're one of those guys, and I talk about this from time to time on the podcast. You're one of those people. It doesn't matter what you're doing.

It never sucks.

It could be the worst. You never suck. You could be in the worst movie, the worst play, the worst TV. You're always unbelievable because you're so committed. Let me ask you about that. I fucking love that about you. I know.

I love that, too. Do you ever feel like... I was going to say the same thing. Do you ever feel like movie to movie? Obviously, you never know what you got or what you're in or what you have. Can you You feel it by now at this point in your career as you're going day one, week one, month one, month two? You know what? I think I'm in a piece of shit, or I think this is working, or I think this is really working. Because I said when I did Good Night Oscar, we had an invited dress. We had an invited dress rehearsal with a bunch of kids who didn't get any of the references because it takes place in the '50s. It was crickets, the whole play. I came home to Scotty, I said, I'm in a piece of shit. I'm in a piece of shit.

It's always scary, isn't it?

Yeah, it's scary. And the next night was great.

That's a great thing. So what is your brum around that? How do you feel?

Well, first of all, thank you. Right back at all three of you guys. But I think you always think it's fucking Hamlet, right? I mean, you think it's Citizen Kane. When you're working on it. And then at a certain point, you realize maybe it's not.

And then- Starts to take on water.

Yeah. And then you're like, oh, yeah. And then you're like, oh, shit, this could be bad.

I remember Baldwin once said to me, Alec once says to me, he never intend to make a bad movie. You agree to do it something, and You're making this movie with people and they go, Hey, we're going to go over here. And you go, Great. I can't wait. I'm excited to go over here. And then you start making it, and all of a sudden you start going the other direction. You go, Hey, I thought we were going over there. And they're like, No, we're going over here.

Yeah. Sometimes it comes from watching another performance or a decision a director makes or just the general vibe on the set from the crew or whatever, and you could start to smell it. You just can't get... There's nothing you can do about it because you're only doing one little piece of it. It's a team.

Does it take away the energy? Do you start depleting yourself of the same chutzpa you entered in? I don't think you do.

You're I don't always deliver, though.

Well, I think if you sign up and you get talked, I think when you get talked into something, and I won't mention any names, but when you get talked into something, that's when it's bad. You know what I mean? You try to do a fixer proper thing on it.

Right. But you have, Willy, you said that he fully commits, and that's certainly part of why he's so great. But I've seen a lot of crappy actors fully commit to a crappy performance that doesn't fix it. I mean, he's fully committing to a performance that's coming from a guy with great taste. There's somehow that you have the ability to keep one eye on yourself and judge whether the choice you're making sucks or not. You're staying away from sucky choices with the way in which you play characters.

Sean, do you make a lot of sucky choices in your life? Have you made a lot of sucky choices?

Ignore that, Sam. No, just ignore it.

You want to make God laugh telling your It's your plans, right? So you just never know. You never know.

But you have good taste. Did that come from... Did you get it from mom or dad or from watching a bunch of great stuff?

Again, I think it's just more ego, to be frank. I think it's more like just wanting to have a big part of it, have a reason to get up there.

And doing something that you're going to want to watch.

It doesn't mean that it It has to be a lead role. It can be a supporting role. Yeah, that you're going to want to be a part of.

Do you watch your stuff? Are you one of those actors that can't watch it?

If it's good, it's like a home movie. If it comes on, Seven Psychopaths came on. I love that experience. It was really great.

Yeah, I hear Martin McDonald is just about the best guy in the world to work with.

He's the best man. Chris Walkin, I'd done a play with him, and then we did the movie and Colin and Woody. It was just a really nice time. We had a great time. Isn't it like a home movie, right? When you see it's either a bad experience or a good experience.

But what about on set? Will you watch playback to help in calibrating your performance, or do you like to stay in the dark?

Only if it's mainly for the canvas or if I'm... A lot of times, just to get maybe a tone, and then I stay away from it. A lot of times I'm noticing, if I do look at it, I'm under, or I used to be over the top, but I'm I'm noticing it's actually I need more, and then I need to contain it.

I would say tell the director to bring the camera closer instead of you reaching out. If they can't see it, they got to get closer.

You stay small. Or bring your own. Where one of those GoPros turned back on yourself.

When you say to see the canvas, to see the canvas and the tone, are those two different things? Do you mean sometimes that you actually look at it and go like... Because when you're in it, you don't have a sense of the bigger picture. Then when you get to see it, you go, Oh, okay. In terms of staging and what effect it is.

I guess I'm talking about stakes. I'm talking about stakes. Interesting. Crued up is one of the people I've gone to beyond my acting coach or my friend Chris Messina, who I'll go to... I've gone to a lot of friends for help, Stanley Tucci, lots of people. But Crued up is He's particularly- Bad. Yes, he's rough, man.

Sorry, I cut you off.

Yeah. Yeah. He's got to go back to NYU.

Yeah. Self-graduate. He's hard to look at.

He is tough to look at. He's tough to look at.

No, what are you going to say he's particularly helpful?

Yeah, he's very articulate about acting. I went to him with American Buffalo. I was like, I was losing my saliva, literally. I couldn't get through the speech. I went, I said, Man, I need your help, I can't get through this fucking thing. He came over and he really helped me. He really broke it down for me. He was really smart.

What was it? Sorry. To the extent- What's the key to keeping your mouth nice and I'm lubricated. Who's this for? Who's that question for?

Very good question. Sorry, Sam, I was looking at you.

Very good question.

Voice warmups, Sean. Voice warmups, right? Yes, very good. They say, Bites your tongue, but I do a voice warmup, 20 minutes link later warmup.

Also, isn't it wild when you're doing a live-Pee a lot, free a little water. Yes, that's good. When you're doing a live play that you've created this character and this world through weeks of rehearsals, then you get up on your feet, so you created this piece of art, and you think people will know your choices. For your speech, for example, you're like, Well, I can't change it. This is how it's supposed to go. But people don't know that. You're like, Well, I don't want to change. But you're like, Hey, buddy, you could take the biggest pause in the world in the middle of a monolog, drink a glass of water. You can add anything. Nobody knows how it's supposed to go. But in your mind, you're like, No, I'm compromising the role. I'm compromising the part. That's the thing I always bump up against.

I once saw John Malkovich do Burn This.

Oh, yeah, me too. I saw that.

What about that opening monolog as he comes in after fucking He's trying to get a parking spot out in front of the goddamn building, and he's fixing his hair in the mirror, and he stops in the middle of a sentence, not at a punctuation, but middle of a sentence for at least a minute while he's fucking with his hair and then picks right back up on his monolog another minute or two talking. I just couldn't believe the balls. I was a young actor watching this. I was like, Oh, fuck. That's incredible what this guy does.Incredible.He's one of my favorites.

That performance was unbelievable. It's unbelievable.

Anyway, I added two glasses of water in the scene. I'm like, I think my character should drink water now.

Yeah, no. Absolutely. I had a six-page monolog. I had the director. I said, Can I have a water found? He said, No. Oh, really? I said, Well, can I have it? He said, Get a lifesaver. I was in a park. I was like, All right.

Now, I'll ask you a real hacky question here that there is no answer for, but I'll ask anyway. You prefer doing theater over camera work?

No, I mean, it's totally different. I think it's just the gym, and it's really scary, and it's like going to the gym, and it informs your film work, I think. But it helps. Chris Walkin does that monolog in Pulp Fiction. I think it's because he did Hamlet, he did Rose Tattoo, Stanley Kowalski.

But would you not agree that if you do a stage-level performance in front of the camera, you'd be doing too much? Oh, yeah, for sure.

Definitely. But interesting. Talk about that idea. It's like going to the gym for for film work.

Well, it's just obviously you can't scream. You can't do a stage performance, especially the ones I've done because they're big. In front of a camera, that would not work. But I think all you got to do is turn the volume down, I guess. Maybe that's not as simple as it sounds.

It was calibrating.

Do you enjoy the bigger movement, or do you enjoy getting super small and letting the camera find the little stuff?

I prefer being small, even on stage. I don't want to get big on stage, in fact. I think that's the trick, but I've never done a musical, so I don't know. That's a whole other thing. But I think keeping it real and still being loud and still being able to hit the back row with your voice is a trick. Phil Hoffman taught me a lot about that. It sounds name-dropy, but he also is somebody who... He directed me in a play, and he was very... But no, but listener doesn't want to hear about process.

Well, so I think it's going to be interesting. Yeah, I'm sure they do. They'll listen to whatever. They have to listen to whatever the fuck we tell them.

Really? You know what I mean?

By the way, the podcast, it's free, and they can not listen. If they want.

Yeah, man, what the fuck?

I love hearing you talk about this shit. I do, too.

Well, Phil, you guys know him.

Yeah, of course. I'm envious that you guys knew him, and I didn't. But now tell me about, do you like doing... I love that whenever you're doing a lead role in a film, because I want more of you at all times. But oftentimes, the lead role is not as spicy or as fun as some of the secondary or tertiary roles. Do you have a preference?

Yeah. I think that's something... I mean, Here we go with the name drop shit. But Clooney, I think- George Clooney.

George Clooney taught me a little bit- I don't know. Clooney is not a name drop here.

But Clooney taught me a lot because I come in with all these props and all these...

I'd be smacking it up.

Well, you were the lead in his first film.

I was the lead in the film, and he's like, Hey, man, we can't do Boze of the Clown every scene. We got to like... That was the note? He didn't say that. But I was like, Zéro Mostel in there. I mean, by the way, one of the great actors is Zéro Mostel. But he said, Too many props, and let's just keep it. You're the lead guy, you got to keep it simple. I learned a lot from him about that. It's true because it's a canvas, so you're not necessarily the color red all the time. Kevin Costner in Dances with Wolves, they got other people providing those colors.

Yeah, you got to really suss that out when you read the script and you talk about it and you develop it and you show up, you're like, Where do I fit?

Sometimes you have to be a blank canvas, right? If you're the lead in a certain way, you have to be able to let other colors. Jason, obviously, has been a blank canvas to me for so many years. He's been this off-white mayonnaise eggshell color.

I think Jason's performance in Identity Theft is great.

There we go.

Now, you love Identity Theft. Let's walk through Identity Thief.

Identity Thief. Identity Thief.

Let's show a clip. We'll just show a real quick clip.

Let's go to clip. He's pretty amazing.

I love that fucking movie. By the way, I will say I love Identity Theft as well. I've told Jason before. It's a fucking great Identity Thief.

It's really good, man.

Identity Thief. But the other one I like a lot, even more than what I saw recently, and I've told him, is Game Night. Have you seen fucking Game Night?

I love Game Night. That's a good movie. Jason is-Sami, have you not seen Game Night?

I need to see that. I need to watch that.

Oh, my God. It's so good. It's so funny. Jason is Jason is- He's so good in that.

Jason is-And he knows how to play stakes, right? Dude. And still be like…

Dude, it is a- I love that movie. That movie holds up to multiple viewings.

It's fucking- That's one of my favorite. By the way, Game Night is one of the last great… I haven't seen a great film comedy since Game Night.

Game Night.

I'm not even kidding.

It's going to be your new identity thief. It's going to be your great job with that. Now, Sam, you have not seen it yet, right?

I haven't seen it, no. So good.

It's not bad. It's Rachel McGadams.

I've seen Morrible Bosses. I've seen the one- Jesse Plemons. You're Pissen the Pawn.

Oh, yeah. The Old Magic Pond with Ryan. You know who's really funny in that movie?

Billy Magnuson.

Yeah, that guy's a real talent.

He is hilarious. Yeah, he is hilarious.

He is a really good dude. I've seen him in a great thing. And Sharon Horgan's in it, too.

Sharon Horgan is amazing. Kyle Chandler, from Friday Night Lights. How great is Kyle?

Fucking Sam's with us. Let's talk about all this.

Game night. I'm on it.

We'll be right back. Our thanks to Liquid IV for supporting Smartless. When it's time to start another big week, celebrate Hydration Monday With Liquid IV, with Liquid IV. With three times the electrolytes of the leading sports drink, plus eight vitamins and nutrients, Liquid IV is there to kick off your week right. All you need is one stick of Liquid IV and 16 ounces of water to boost your hydration. You know what, guys? It's really easy to forget your hydration. When you wake up in the morning, you're running around and you're going from this place to that place, driving here, doing that. Maybe you're forgetting to eat even. With as busy as your schedule is, you have to remember to hydrate. And liquid IV makes it so easy. For me, sometimes I'll take a stick of Liquid IV, put it in the 16 ounces of water, and put that bottle of water next to my bed. So in the morning, it's the first thing I do, so I stay hydrated all day long. My schedule is pretty busy on the weekends, especially because I push all my social events a lot to the weekends, and so I'm running around extra crazy on the weekends, and that's when I forget to hydrate.

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Heartless. Now, back to the show.

Wait, Sam, I- You guys haven't said anything about my T-shirt.

What does it say?

I was trying to read it. I couldn't see it, and I wasn't- It's bad.

Sorry, that's That's a dead frame.

I am serious, and don't call me-Wait, he's wearing tan pants.

For a second, I thought he was shirt cocky, that he just had his shirt.

Wait, Sam, what does the shirt say?

Shirt cocky is a real-It's an airplane shirt.

It's airplane. It says, I'm serious and don't call me Shirley. Don't call me Shirley.

Oh, yeah, that's great.

That's a great C.

They should redo that movie, right? Not because it needs to be read, but just because there's a whole new generation or three or four now that haven't seen it. Will's upset.

I'm I'm against the reboots. I'm against the reboots altogether.

Just have them watch the old one, right?

I watched the old one, and maybe it's not as quick or it doesn't cut as fast, but it's good. It's got value. And then let's do some new stuff. Let's create stuff now that people 20 years will say, Let's reboot. You know what I mean? There's so much of the same shit. No, let me go on a fucking tirade.

Wait, Sam.

By the way, guess who Sam worked with a couple of years ago? You guys are going to blow both of your minds. Who?

Leslie Nielson.

No, it's a friend of the show. It's one of the great names of the show. It's one of the all Time references of the show.

Kareem Abilja Bar.

He comes up on the show all the time. I talk about him all the time. Chappie? Chappie. Mark Chappell, who wrote See How They Run. Chappie is one of my best pals, and he's my corredor.

He's great. Must be giving Will at least $10,000 every time his name is mentioned.

Chappie comes up a lot on the... He's a recurring on the show. Again, get the scissors out, guys.

Sean, drive the interview. We're not cutting Chappie out.

Great scripts, the other one.

Yeah, so Moon. When you did Moon, I loved Moon. I mean, it was just you. God bless you. I loved that movie so much.

That Duncan Jones knows how to direct, huh?

I know. Go back and talk about... I know we It's okay. You can talk about process. That's why we're here. Okay.

I don't want to bore the hell out of- Because I'm fascinated how you...

What was it like day to day? Did you like the process of being the only person in the movie?

Yeah. What was it like? Tracy, this is a movie where he's the only guy in it, and he's stuck on a spaceship. It's stunning.

It's incredible. It's a really good movie.

Thank you. Thanks, guys. My acting coach, the first thing he says, Watch buddy movies. He said, Watch Midnight Cowboy, I watched, and I stole a lot from Midnight Cowboy. Then Rachel Weis just did a reboot of Dead Ringer's, which is fucking amazing what she did. I was watching the Jeremy Irons one. That was the best version of that trick I had seen. I listened to the DVD commentary. There's a very noisy camera called the motion control camera that's used for that gag to get two people in one frame. It's a very weird process that I could go into, but Give us a little bit. Well, it was a lot about timing. The sound guy would put the previous take, the master, on my iPod. While I was going to hair and makeup for the other one, I would listen to it. The ping-pong scene would be a timing thing. When I went back to the other clone-So you're acting against yourself? Acting against yourself. I would listen to the sounds. If he dropped the handle of the paddle like that, the other clone would retract because he's coming towards him. So I'd have to listen for that.

I know how many beats you have to wait before you speak.

Yeah. And he was saying, Doug was like, Don't adlib, don't adlib. But you could adlib if you fit it in the window. The timing, you could change the line, but it has to be that time.

I wonder if today, technologically, it would be less anticredit. It's got to be.

Tom Hardy did a good job with it, too. But it's tricky.

It's tricky, and it's a lot of work. And talk about paying attention, you have to pay attention in a scene as it is. But now you really got to pay because you're also trying to pick up on timing another thing. Did it scratch an itch in in a way that you didn't know? Was it satisfying on a certain- Absolutely.

If you're a Narcissist and a Closet of a Director, you have control of the scene, obviously, for obvious reasons. Jeremy Arnds talked about contrasting energies. One twin in Dead Riggers was aggressive, and Rachel Weis did the same thing very well. One was more timid. That was the trick, was having contrasting energies. One One was a clown and one was more together. Yeah, you can control the scene. In fact, we'd have two rehearsals. The AD would go, Hey, okay, go to hair and make a man. So, Mick, we got to do the other rehearsal. We got to do the other one. So you'd rehearse twice before you went. Oh, wow.

You'd rehearse both sides before. Yeah.

Then I had a body double guy who was also an actor.

Then the other line was coming to you through an earwig.

Yeah, an earwig. Sometimes you'd be looking at a tennis ball. Sometimes the actor who looks like you from the back.

That's a contemplative, melancholy, dramatic movie. Yes. Again, another brain dead question, but do you have a preference about drama versus comedy?

It's funny you say that because it was a little too serious. I said we got to get some jokes in the beginning because it was so dark. It was like Edgar Allan Poe. We got some jokes in because we were lose the audience because he gets so depressing.

Yeah, but then there's the risk of setting the wrong tone for that which is going to come. That's true. There's a balance there. I remember I was super precious and annoying and overly sensitive about any- A dinner the other night? Any humor going into Ozark, the writers had these great moments of levity in the first season.

Where did you find the compromise, eventually?

Well, once we I established that this Jason Bateman show is not going to be a comedy. Once the audience knew that after the first season, I felt more comfortable about making it.

Serious question. After asking them to erase all that, did you watch it once you got to post, were you like, Fuck, I wish there was a moment there? Did you miss it a little bit? I don't mean a goofy thing, but it was a little bit of contrast.

I was too paranoid about it being taken seriously in the first year that I didn't worry about that. But the second year, I was like, yeah. Anyway, sorry to talk about fucking me again. It's fucking great. Sam, what do we got to do to have you working- See where you beat the guy up in the car is fucking just fucking great.

What You earned that. You earned that. You fucking earned it.

How do we get you working 12 months a year so I, as a Sam Rockwell fan, can have more to enjoy? That's a great-Yes. It's I think I have to use your balancing theater and film. I got to go to New York to see you sometimes, which I'm coming. I'm coming this weekend for seven months, so get ready. Okay. We're going to do some hanging.

It's a road. We're all waiting.

Wait, Sam, we're talking about all these prep things for roles in different movies. Do you have a thing that you first do when you either walk on a set or prepare for a character? Do you have a go-to, any superstition thing like we do in theater?

No, it all comes out of fear, trying to memorize the script and panic. Then you go see my coach, Tara Knickerbacher, where I go. Sometimes you have time to do research, sometimes you don't. You might have the luxury of a few months, and then you would do research, like three billboards or something. I did research, but you don't always have the time to do that. You're just like, All right, I'm an arms dealer. Okay, I'm going to watch a Bill Burry in Kingpin. That's it. That's my research.

Yeah, exactly.

But are you like Billy? Because Billy talks about it, and you guys know. Billy likes to spend time with the dialog for weeks. Yeah.

Because you see the one man No, he did Jesus Christ. It's a lot of dialog.

No, I missed it. But are you good at learning your lines? Are you quick with that? No.

Terrible. I need time. Really? I need a lot of time. Yeah.

I need a lot of time. Have you always been terrible?

I mean, I tape the monotone. That's a Meisner thing, but I tape them and I run them with a reader, an actor. I think Billy does a similar thing. Billy is smarter than me, though. He knows how to... He really breaks his shit down. My partner does, too, Leslie. Her script is really organized. Mine looks like a kindergarten wrote on.

I'm always fearful that if I really, really work on it, and I do a bunch of research and all that stuff, then I'll end up acting. That all of that is to do the greatest acting job ever as a- But come on, Jason, you do work. But that's my own bullshit. You put work in. I do put a lot of work into it, but there's a list of techniques and homework stuff that I used to do when I was a kid, I went to acting classes and stuff like that. I found that I was so proud of the work that I had done that I was hell-bent on making sure the audience saw that work.

I understand that. I don't like backstory. That's the thing I don't really care I don't think that's useless. Interesting.

But it's important for some actors. Everyone's got a different thing.

It doesn't work for me. I think it depends. It depends if it makes an imprint on you. You can get an adlib from somebody, a real person.

Do you ever get a... I was going to actually, Sean, get into the difference with you, Sam, as well about then when you're working on stage, then you have the luxury of time to work on that, and you understand You have a facility with the dialog because you've been working on it for months. But before I get into that, have you ever had the thing where I've had a couple of times where a member of the crew will go, well, between takes, and go, Hey, you know what I thought it'd be really funny if you said? I go, What's that now? Pitching me a joke or a different way to say a joke.

I'm like, What up? It's not bad sometimes.

They go, I just thought it'd be really funny if you said this. I'm like, Oh, yeah? Okay, man. Well, I thought it'd be really funny if you moved the fucking C stand over there.

What if it's a good idea, you dick?

No, I'm kidding. I'm being a fuck. Actually, it should be. I'm just saying that just to be funny. The truth is, I've actually had some pretty good pitches before from like, sound dudes. There was a boom operator that I knew this guy Tom, who was really fucking funny. Jay, do you remember that dude Tom?

Yeah.

He was super funny. Every once in a while between takes, he'd go like, Hey, you know what? Blah, blah, blah. I Fuck, that's fucking great. And I'd use it. Thank you.

Give him a little wink while he's holding it.

What if an actor does it? What if another actor does it? And then you're like, Fuck, that's a fight.

I'm always like best whatever. If it works, it works.

I don't mind that. I never mind a line reading from a director either because you're always going to make it your own.

No, but you know what? There is that thing, and I will not say who this is, but there are things before where an actor might say to you like, Hey, you know what would be really great? Say this in rehearsal, and they'll it to the director as you're doing a rehearsal. At that point, you go like, Everybody's waiting for me to do his pitch.

That he said out loud to the director.

You do it, and then they laugh. I see. Isn't that amazing? And you're so embarrassed.

Well, that brings me to my thing about directing is I was thinking, Jason, I don't know what you do with actors, but I feel like you're really good with actors. But I don't know when a director screams a direction When you cross a long distance over the crew, it's telling the whole crew that the rabbit's going to come out of the hat before it does. Then you're like, Hey, man, there's a lot of pressure to take the rabbit out of the hat. You know what I mean? Right.

Then you end up That you end up adjusting your reading to make it surprising for the crew when it's not really the reading that would be right for the audience at home.

I want a conspiracy with the director. I want a secret.

Yeah, a secret. Yeah, whispering.

Sam, what do you do when all of this is... When we're not talking about this and you're not doing this, what do you do?

What's the hobby? What would our listeners be excited to learn that you do?

Well, somebody, I think maybe Thoreau just told me, potato chips are not a protein, which is- Wow, that's weird.

Alarming. That's weird.

I was during the pandemic, I got into some potato chips. No, I overwork out and then I over eat blah, blah, blah. I'm compulsive.

What's your exercise of choice? Are you a jogger?

Everything. I might hit hot yoga or I might with weights, or I got the soul cycle here, hit the mids, that shit.

That's all to facilitate your snacking. All to facilitate, yes. That's why I work out.

A little IPA, a little potato chips, some chocolate. Well, you do a little bit of boxing, right? You do a little bit of- Not me.

Thro got me into doing the soul cycle of boxing. Oh, yeah.

My friend does that. Fight camp, right?

Yeah, my friend does that. By the way, got me in shape. But now my son, what's interesting is my son, my oldest son, who's Archie. Because I started doing that, he got into it because of Thro, through somebody else. Anyway, he starts to fight. Now he's fighting with a real guy in a gym every weekend, which is crazy. Oh, he's sparring. Your son's sparring? He's sparring, and he's really getting into it. He's way better than me. Shit, don't be careful. I know.

I'm very excited to see Argyll. Should I be?

Yes. I saw the trailer. It looks incredible, and I love Matthew Vaughn.

It's really fun.

That looks like a blast to shoot a movie like that.

I'm very jealous. A whole movie about a sweater.

Yeah, It starts with the idea, then the knitting, and then someone wears it. Walk me through it.

You just gave away the ending. That's right.

No, it's a lot of fun. You guys, your heads, the top of your heads.

Do you like doing all the action stuff and the stunts and things like that? Did you get hurt at all?

You No, we had an amazing stunt team.

He's agile, dude. He's fucking looking at me.

He's agile. But you got to do the start of the stunt and the end of the stunt. You got to do a little bit of the kung fu fighting.

Yeah, that's right.

And you had fun with that.

I like it. It's fun. I like it, the fake stylized violence. But I had an amazing stunt double. Every time I would do something, I thought I was going fast, and then I'd watch him, and then I looked like I was in slow motion.

Is this a stunt double you've worked with before?

He's amazing. No, he's a prodigy. His name is Greg Ali. He's like a Jackie Chan. He's from Northern England. He's a gymnast. He's a double for Spider-Man. He's 26. He was 24 when he did mine. Wow.

Did he get hurt?

He did get hurt on another thing, but he's fine. Okay.

It's fine. Have you ever gotten hurt or hurt somebody doing a scene?

No. Tim Roth and I hid each other, clipped each other in a rain machine doing a fight, but it was fine. Nothing serious.

Was it on holiday or during a shoot?

I broke my toe talking to my agent in my house once. You know what I mean?

I once sprained my finger getting into a Tesla.

Yeah.

You know what? Sam, we took up way too much of your time.

Wait, I want to ask you about Oscar, though. How did you get ready for that? How did you do that? What was your research for that?

I took a G5 to New York, and then an Escalade from Teterborough to the Upper West Side, I think.

You really But you nailed that guy. I mean, that's a lot of behavior, man. That's a lot of... It's a whole thing with the imitating. Forget about the piano.

It's a long, long story, and it took about 20 years.

Does it involve scooping up bagels from Zabar's and filling them with peanut butter?

By the way, Sam- It's endless. It's endless, Sean. Call me on a side. Side zoom me. I'll tell you the story. All right, we'll side-zoom. But really quick, I did put on a few pounds, and I said this story on here before. One of the reviews in Chicago, where we opened it, said, Sean's going to be great on Broadway, but he needs to kill the fat suit and the plastic wig, both my body and my hair.

Yeah, you weren't wearing a wig or a fat suit. Is that right? No, Sean.

But anyway, thanks for asking, Sam. That's very sweet. But we didn't even get to be handing in Spokane or billboards, which you won the Oscar for, which I fucking You blew my mind. You blew my mind in that. There's so much to talk to.

I will say there are very few people... There are a lot of people... No, sorry, that's not true. I will say a lot of people are deserving of Oscars all the time, every year, but to see you win an Oscar was so You deserve 10 of them. So fucking cool. I love you guys. Because you're so fucking deserving, dude. You're so talented.

You're just bursting with talent. Really quick, when I was doing... God bless you. You were doing Behanding in Spokane while I was doing Promises Promises. I went downstairs to the basement to get my hair Haircut from a woman named, I think her name is Carmel. I walked down getting ready for my weekly or two bi weekly haircut. There you are sitting in the chair. I was like, Holy shit, that's fucking Sam Rock. What's he doing here? I'm like, Why did he come here to get his hair cut? I just thought that was the coolest thing in the world. I was gefawing.

I couldn't believe it. Listener, if you're not in the entertainment industry, you need to know that this guy is the guy everybody That he wants to work with, be friends with. It's true. He does constantly the best performances. It's just catnip for actors. The fact that we're able to even call ourselves friends with him is enormous. You deserve multiple statues, and I want more. I can't wait to hang out with you.

You need to get a Thalberg right now. You need to get a full… We're going to give the smart list Thalberg.

Let's do that. Listen, I love you guys. I love this podcast. I'm a true fan. I know the terminology. Anyway, I love you guys.

Love you too, Sam. Thanks for being here today.

Love you. Can't wait to see you soon. The beard looks fantastic. Yeah. Thanks, guys.

You look amazing. You look amazing. Thanks for doing this, dude.

Dude, thank you for having me. Thank you for having me. Let's give Throke endless shit.

Oh, yeah, please. I mean, you can't hurt him more than he hurts himself. Let's be honest.

All right, big fat love.

All right. Big fat love. Thanks, guys. See you, buddy.

Peace out.

Bye, buddy. Thanks a lot. Peace out.

Bye, Sam. Thank you.

Bye. Oh, Sam the Rock.

Shani, great.

I love him so much. He's such a good guy, too.

He's just the greatest. You know, you want to Well, I sound like a broken record, but I truly do.

But when you go like, when you were saying, you go through all of it when I was researching him and knowing he was coming on today, you go through all of his films and his projects, you're like, Bam, Bam, Bam, bam, hit after hit. If they weren't a massive hit, he was great. Like you said, he was great in it. It's the result of dedicating your life like he has to a craft or an art or anything.

He also is just like, no matter what part he's playing, even if it's just the lead, that's just the straight guy, he'll find a way to give that character some quirks, something interesting. There's a little bit of like, sparkle to-Color, those are shades. It's easy to overdo that and overplay a character because it might not be written in the character, but he finds the right spots to do it.

I was going to say I've always used, John Goodman is my example of the person who's amazing in everything he does, no matter what the thing is over time. Different volumes, different tones, traumas, comedies. Sam's in that same category and always good. He's in that like, drama, comedies, things. Like you say, Jay, just adds color, has a little something, brings a little sparkle.

It's the career that you wish I had. Of course.

But I want him to be cast in leads as well as just like the- Well, he is. Well, but it's not as often as they… It should be. He and I have talked about this. There's a certain an average type of look and person and presence that studios feel comfortable with putting as the lead. They don't want anybody too definitive or specific.

Well, that's because they're worried about... Because they think, they're always trying to anticipate what they think audiences, and they think about economics. They're like, what is the thing, the prototypical?

Or physical types.

Yeah, but he can play something-He's handsome as fuck.completely normal and level and just at the moments where it's appropriate for the lead to-But he's almost too interesting in a way.

I mean, that is a compliment, not too weird. He's got so much personality. He's super smart. He's super fucking cool. He's magnetic on screen. We joked about Chappie. You should see how they run. It's a really good movie. He's so interesting in that. He's the lead, he's the detective who's got all this shit going on. You're like, Fuck, man, this guy, he always brings it. Always brings it.

By the way, Iron Man 2. We didn't talk about Iron Man 2.

Written byIt was written by...

The Justin Thoreau.

Justin Thoreau, that's right.

Yeah.

He wrote so hard. That's when the first time the sleeves came off because he was writing. It smoked him off.

Yeah, it was. It was a fire, right?

It was a fire.

You got a fucking fire.

It was a wrist fire that worked his way up his arms there.

Hey, Will, I don't know what you're doing later, but are you open to throwing me? Sure. Can you just throw me, please?

Sure, man.

You You want to be careful, though. You don't want to break your arm. If you do break your arm, you want to break it around the forearm. You don't want to break it up near the bias.

Smart.

Smartless.

Smartless is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Bennett Barbeco, Michael Grant-Terry, and Rob Armjarff. Smartless. If you like SmartLess, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wundry Plus in the WNDYRI app or on Apple podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wndyri. Com/survey.

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Ava's ambitions take hold and her small town values break in hopes of becoming the first scholarship student to make The List. Bishop Gray's all-covited academic top 10, curated by the headmaster himself. But after realizing she has no chance at The List on her own, she reluctantly accepts an invitation to a secret underground society that pulls the strings on campus life and academic success. If she bends to their will, she'll have everything she's ever dreamed of. But at what cost? Academy takes you into the world of a cutthroat private school where power, money, and sex collide in a game of life and death.

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