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[00:00:00]

Everyone continues to panic over covid, the media pretend universal mail in voting is a great idea and Trump doesn't know their disastrous interview. I'm Ben Shapiro. This is The Ben Shapiro Show. Today's show is sponsored by Expressive Stand Up for Your Digital Rights, Take Action and Express dot com segment. Now, there is a real gap that has emerged. In reality, it's a rift in the space time continuum. See, there's reality on the one hand, and this reality basically says that it's bad, it's risky.

[00:00:32]

We should be careful. Also, it says that despite reopening in Texas, Arizona and Florida and despite the fact that there were increased hospitalizations and some increased deaths, that that number has started to go down again. These data suggest that things are not looking bad in places like New York and New Jersey, that despite an increase in cases in Massachusetts, you're not seeing an overwhelming wave of death, that in fact, this is a virus that we are learning how to deal with, that the treatments are getting better, that people are generally being more careful, and that while we should be risk averse, we should also acknowledge that it's time to get back to something resembling ordinary life.

[00:01:05]

That doesn't mean go into extraordinarily risky circumstances, doesn't mean don't wear a mask. It does mean that this notion we're going to lock down forever is very silly. Right. That would be the accurate way of putting reality. Then there is the hair on fire. Media are the politicians and that is we are all going to die. You you personally are going to die of covid. Sure. You're 20 years old and you've never had a health issue in your entire life.

[00:01:24]

You will probably die of covid not only you, all of your friends, everyone will probably die of covid. That is the only rationale I can come up with for the way the politicians are currently acting. Here's the thing. People want government to do all the things people have. This perverse notion that government can save you from all the bad things that happen in the universe. Now, government does have a role when it comes to global pandemics and ensuring, for example, that people cannot enter from countries that the pandemic is is extraordinarily prevalent.

[00:01:52]

And the government does have a role when it comes to enforcing public health. But the problem is the government is a blunt force instrument. This is true in every area of life. Government is not exact. Government is fairly ridiculous. And when government tries to be fairly exact, it tends to fail. So let me give you an example. So over the weekend, my sister in law got married. The restrictions that were put on the wedding were ones that were going to be voluntarily undertaken anyway.

[00:02:14]

It was an outdoor wedding as opposed to an indoor wedding. Everybody was socially just inside. Everybody was wearing masks in the little bridal gifts that you get when you register for the wedding. There was hand sanitizers. Everybody was hand sanitizing the restrictions that were placed on the wedding by the state of California where things like you can't have a dance floor. I'm not kidding. So it has to be outdoors and you can't have a dance floor because there's a dance floor.

[00:02:35]

People might dance, whereas if there's just an open field, nobody will dance. Which, of course, is ridiculous because people have been dancing for centuries without dance floors. And there are restrictions that said things like, well, you know, you just have to make sure that there are there are shields around everybody who is talking to one another. You have to have the Plexiglas shields, which is totally fine. Everybody is doing that except they are also outdoors and your social distancing.

[00:02:58]

In other words, government does not have the capacity to actually do any of the stuff right. The government is a blunt force instrument. Sometimes you need a blunt force instrument. The problem is most blunt force instruments of the government is lockdown's the lockdown's are button. And basically, when people say government do something, politicians just smash the button like a small toddler. You smash the button and it doesn't matter whether smashing the button is merited. It doesn't really matter whether there are actually countervailing problems with smashing the button.

[00:03:25]

Government actors have now been incentivized to smash the button at the first available opportunity, which is actually quite bad because, for example, there are significant problems with smashing the button and doing it over and over and over again. For example, The New York Times reports today. That the pandemic that really we should be worried about is the tuberculosis pandemic not getting, The New York Times has an article today about the tuberculosis pandemic saying people are not getting vaccinated.

[00:03:51]

There's a study out today suggesting that everybody being locked in their homes has actually resulted in people having weaker immune systems, which makes perfect sense that this is actually the case during polio. People who are upper income, we're actually getting polio. We're getting seriously affected by polio at a higher rate than people, lower income because people lower income had their kids out playing in the streets and that was building up their immune system. According to The New York Times, it begins with a mild fever malaise, followed by a painful cough and shortness of breath.

[00:04:15]

The infection prospers and crowds spreading to people in close reach. Containing an outbreak requires contact tracing, as well as isolation and treatment of the sick for weeks or months. This insidious disease has touched every part of the globe. It is tuberculosis, the biggest infectious disease killer worldwide, claiming one point five million lives each year. Until this year, TB and its deadly allies, HIV and malaria, were on the run. Yet now, as the covid pandemic spreads across the world, consuming global health resources, these perennially neglected adversaries are making a comeback.

[00:04:42]

Pedro Alonzo, director of the Global Malaria Program, says covid-19 risks derailing all our efforts and taking us back to where we were 20 years ago. It's not just that scientific attention has been diverted from these other much more deadly diseases in terms of global cost. It covid-19 has today killed something like, I believe, three quarters of a million people in a variety of countries that 700000 people in a variety of countries. Tuberculosis every year kills one point five million people.

[00:05:08]

Obviously, we've done a pretty good job in the United States attempting tuberculosis in a way we have not done with covid-19. But there are costs to shuttering everything in the world. The lockdown's have raised insurmountable barriers to patients who have to travel to obtain diagnoses or drugs, according to interviews with two dozen public health officials, doctors and patients worldwide, fear of covid and the shuttering of clinics have kept away many patients struggling with HIV, TB and malaria. About 80 percent of tuberculosis, HIV and malaria programs have reported disruptions in service.

[00:05:37]

In other words, lockdowns have consequences, guys, and this ridiculous notion that can lock down endlessly and it has no consequences, either economic or health related consequences. You won't see an uptick in deaths of despair. You won't see an uptick in other childhood diseases becoming much more prevalent because kids are not going in to get vaccinated. It's just not true that we have done the stupidest possible thing you can do in public policy, which is single factor analysis.

[00:05:58]

Single factor analysis is where you just say the worst thing in the world is getting infected from covid. What can we do to stop getting infected with covid? And so just match that government button. And as we'll see, this leads to some incredibly dumb policy like the policy we are currently seeing in New York. We'll get to that in just one second. First, let us talk about the fact that hiring can be complicated. So you really do have to take advantage of places that make it a lot easier to hire.

[00:06:20]

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[00:07:12]

So we're going to have to go over to zip recruiter Dotcom. They'll try to recruit for free and go to a hypocrite dot com daily wire that a zip recruiter Dotcom dayI Elai Irey zip recruiter dotcom daily wired. Go check him out right now and make the smartest hiring decision. OK, so as I say, we are now living in this alternative reality where reality says that things are not great, but they are also not the end of the world.

[00:07:36]

And this alternative reality, the political alternative reality, where we ignore all data, we ignore actual hard data in favor of overblown headlines that don't actually convey a lot of information. We just go to the most ridiculous version of the headline. You'll remember a few months ago there were all these headlines coming out of New York, children suddenly being infected with covid and having terrible, terrible reactions. Kawasaki Syndrome reactions. And nobody ever asked how many people wasn't it was like 80 and one of those affects permanent?

[00:08:03]

No, but this led the news for literally a week and led the news. Right. The the gap is really bad and that gap is getting worse. The gap between information and simply political coverage is getting worse and worse, which is the reason why, for example, there's a woman over at MSNBC who just quit an MSNBC producer who just quit. And she wrote a letter basically saying the reason she's quitting is because cable news is bad for everybody.

[00:08:29]

She wrote a scathing letter saying that they blocked diversity of opinion over at MSNBC. And not only do they block diversity of opinion, they also avoid actually reporting good information in order to do segments that are likely to draw eyeballs. So all the incentive structures are wrong. Our politicians are incentivized to smash the lock down button in order to avoid blame. Our media figures are incentivized to panic at every available opportunity or alternatively, to blithely dismiss the thing is not a problem at all.

[00:08:54]

And you don't get any good information. You still have. We are now. Let's say we lock down in March, the March, April, May, June, July. We are now in month six of lockdown. OK, and you still don't know much more about this thing than you did originally, because the coverage here is just garbage. It's just garbage. And some of the scientists haven't done a poor job of conveying their findings. But it is not just that.

[00:09:15]

It is also that everybody is incentivized wrong. So perfect example of this. Bill de Blasio yesterday announced that outdoor dining will be will be the norm in New York through next year, through next year. How the hell does he know? He says open restaurants will return next summer, starting June 1st. Twenty, twenty one next summer, not even like January. Twenty twenty one, June at twenty twenty one. OK, now I know I've got my calendar here.

[00:09:43]

I've been reliably informed that today is August 4th. So he is talking about ten months of extensions to no indoor, no indoor dining in New York. What is the data that supports this, seriously? What's the data? I get that indoor dining is more likely to spread covid the now drilling is I've gone to restaurants and done outdoor dining. And when given the option to eat indoors, I eat outdoors.

[00:10:05]

I get it, I'm on board. But we don't know where things are going to be in June 20 21. We have no idea where things are going be in January 20, 21. We don't know where things are going to be October twenty twenty. The notion that you're going to shut down all of New York City, I mean, you know, many bodegas are going to go out of business because of the fifteen thousand small restaurants. I've already gone out of business in the United States in the past six months and then coming back.

[00:10:26]

And he's going to ban basically like there's not a lot of outdoor dining in New York. I hate to tell you, not a lot of space in New York is one of the big problems in New York City. So here's Bill de Blasio, idiot, communist groundhog, murderer or mayor of New York, this big, weird Frankenstein of a woman saying that open restaurants will return next summer, June twenty twenty one. As we'll see in a moment, this is patently crazy.

[00:10:47]

Here's Bill de Blasio being a crazy person.

[00:10:50]

These restaurants will be back again next year on the street, as we've seen tremendous success starting June 1st next year. And I want to say it now because I want people and communities to look forward and see that we're going to keep coming back strong. I want the folks who own the restaurants to know that they're going to have that additional revenue going forward. The folks who work in the restaurants know that whatever else we have to, whether we have seen that this experiment worked.

[00:11:17]

So expect to see that wonderful outdoor dining back next year. We may even extend it further earlier in the spring, but we'll start with June 1st from now.

[00:11:28]

OK, so we're going to shut down. He's saying we're going to shut down all the New York basically for four months and months and months and years and years and years. Here's the latest data from New York. Here's the latest data from New York in the latest data from New York. Let's look at some of these charts. OK, so here are some charts, daily testing in New York. Again, here's the positivity rate, the positivity rate.

[00:11:49]

So in April, the positivity rate on tests in New York City was in excess of 70 percent is from my friend David Bonson. In positivity rate was in excess of 70 percent. It has been less than two percent since June 16th. It is currently at less than one percent. The positivity rate in New York City. OK, how about some more charts? OK, we have this one is the total number of cases in Manhattan, OK, in New York City there are over 6000 daily cases a day in April.

[00:12:14]

And by the way, that is wildly undercounting because the testing simply was not available. And so there are a lot of people who are getting this and suffering with it who are not being tested positively. On Monday, there were 57 cases. Fifty seven cases in all of Manhattan, in all of Manhattan. Hey, let's look at hospitalisations in New York City and hospitalizations in New York City, OK, 15 total covid hospitalizations. And this has been the case for months, four months since the beginning of June.

[00:12:45]

You've been talking significantly under one hundred hospitalizations for covered in New York City. We are now down to 15. And the mortalities just don't exist in New York, OK, thank God mortalities are just gone. There are many days of zero mortality that is always less than 10. It has been less than 10 for weeks. You are now more likely to be shot in New York City than you are to die from covid in New York City on a daily basis.

[00:13:07]

Hey, that is not an exaggeration. That is a reality. You're more likely today to be shot in New York City than you are to die of covid in New York City. So when Bill de Blasio announces things like the schools are only going to open under certain conditions and we're going to do it like two days a week, and then we're going to shift students in and out and we're going to shut down all the restaurants. We're going to make sure that nobody dies indoors.

[00:13:28]

Like I have a question. By what metric would you actually be able to reopen anything? And the answer is that by no metric, because by that the politics of the situation have completely taken over. This is on sanity. Again, you can be cautious and you can be and you can be smart and you can be risk averse. You don't have to be an idiot. But this is idiotic. In lockdown. Policies like this are idiotic. Meanwhile, over in L.A., we are similarly deploying the LAPD, we won't shut down complete riots in the middle of L.A. streets so long as you are shouting George Floyd at the time.

[00:13:58]

But we'll make sure that LAPD is deployed to ensure that if somebody has a private party in a mansion on a hilltop with a bunch of 20 year olds that the cops show up to break it up. Because the last thing we want is a bunch of 20 year olds getting killed and being fine. That's the last thing we want. And by the way, if you're 20, that's what happens. You get covered and you're fine. And I'm noticing that there haven't been a lot of calls about racial profiling here.

[00:14:19]

OK, this is tape from the mansion is just I don't see any a lot of white faces here, OK? It is very disproportionately minority party. OK, no claims of racial profiling here. The cops are fine, apparently, to go to mansions and break up mansion parties with a bunch of 20 year olds, even if those 20 year olds are people of color. Right. But if they actually go and they stop people from breaking storefronts on Melrose Boulevard, that's a completely different story.

[00:14:44]

So LAPD responded to a party at a mansion. And again, you can see from the video, these are not 70 year old black people, right?

[00:14:49]

These are 20 year olds are in a pool. This is what we've come to is what we've come to. This seem like intelligent policy to you think seriously, does it? Because I'm just wondering how under what circumstances this intelligent policy to you know, it's not the fault of the cops. Cops are bad except when they're breaking up pool parties where there's zero risk of harm to 20 year olds, then the cops are good. Yeah, you know, it feels like what we really should be doing right now is looking at the fact that everything is trending the right way in places like Texas and Arizona and maybe even California.

[00:15:20]

California seems to have peaked at this point. And we should be saying, oh, look, there's there's light at the end of the tunnel. And then it turns out that thanks to the media and thanks to our politicians, that's just a train coming on the other end of the tunnel. When a second we're going get to our stupid politicians on a national level, going at each other over over covid and all the rest, none of us giving us any sense of confidence because that's what we do, where everything is stupid.

[00:15:41]

We'll get to that in just one second. First, let me ask you something. If there was someone out there who kept a log of every single thing you did every minute of the day, like Santa Claus, the naughty and nice list, except not bringing you presents, but instead monetizing your data when that creep me out. Well, what if I told you that that's what happens when you go online. Your Internet provider, AT&T, Comcast is allowed to store logs of every Web site you've ever visited and can legally sell this data to anyone.

[00:16:02]

That's why I always use Express VPN, Express VPN reroutes your Internet connection through their secure servers so your Internet provider can't see or log what you do online. Now, some of you might be wondering, well, if I'm routing all my data through a VPN, doesn't that just mean the VPN can see what I'm doing and log my data instead? You would be right to think about that. Many of PNS claim to have no logs policy but have been caught logging customer activity express VPN as the VPN.

[00:16:24]

I trust these trusted server technology. They were the first major VPN provider to engineer all of their VPN servers to run in RAM, which makes it impossible for their VPN servers to store any data, including logs of any express VPN customer. You have to take my or express VPN word for it, express VPN and so confident in their no logs claim. They even had one of the biggest insurance firms. PricewaterhouseCoopers audit their technology. It's a good idea to protect yourself from all sorts of bad actors online.

[00:16:47]

Express VPN allows you to do this visit ExpressJet VPN dot com slash been right this moment. Find out how you can get three months for free. That's express as VPN dot coms. Latchman Express a VPN dotcom. Egemen go check them out right now. OK, so if you thought OK, well at least, maybe there are some experts who are going to give us some sort of good information here and we can trust the experts. I am amazed to see how many politicians.

[00:17:10]

Here's the way it works. If Trump says something bad about Foushee, then he's very mean and he's saying something bad about an expert. If Nancy Pelosi rips on Deborah Berk's, then she's very good. So over the last several days, for some odd reason, Nancy Pelosi has decided that Deborah Berk's is the enemy, not a female. Solidarity happening here. So yesterday, Nancy Pelosi slammed Dr. Deborah Barak, who's been doing her best under trying circumstances at best.

[00:17:30]

Here she was yesterday.

[00:17:32]

And they said, well, we'll bring a scientist to say that. I said, you know, it's not Dr. Brooks because I don't have confidence in anyone who stands there while the president says swallow Lysol and it's going to kill your virus, will kill you and you won't have the virus anymore. I have confidence somebody when the president says it's a hoax, it's magic, it's going to go like the magic. It's a miracle and all of those things.

[00:17:57]

OK, so I have I have a question. What does she expect Burks to do, like go up and physically tackle Trump? I love the math here. The math is Trump's doing a bad job. Therefore, we need all of his advisors to quit. And if you stand there and you try to give him good advice, that means that you're bad. Then Andrew Cuomo got in the act. He started slamming Brooks, too. So that was that was great.

[00:18:14]

Here's the governor of New York who completely blew it. His state is number one in terms of deaths. It is not close. And and here he was slamming Dr. No Burks. Yeah, look, I think the federal officials, the White House, Dr. Burgess, the secretary, they're sending the exact wrong message. They've learned nothing in six months. They're saying the same thing they said about the economic reopening. Just do it. Just do it.

[00:18:38]

It will be fine. And what's really frustrating is we're replicating the mistake with schools that we made with the reopening. It is the exact same point. And the White House is saying the exact same thing.

[00:18:53]

OK, there's a problem. OK, he's he's such an idiot. He's such an idiot. First of all, Burke's never said just do it. Second of all, the notion that the reopenings are the cause of the vast spikes, that doesn't actually match up on the timeline. The protests look much more like the cause of the vast spikes than the original reopenings, which happened in May. The uptick happened in July. It's a two month gap. And then beyond that, him suggesting that schools are just like every other element of society when it comes to reopening is belied by the actual data, which demonstrates that schools have not been vectors of transmission in nearly any country they have been tried even in Israel.

[00:19:24]

It is not clear why exactly the schools became a vector for transmission. The best polling data right now is that the schools were being seeded with people who already had covered. When they went to school. They weren't clean. They were just walking in with covid already. OK, so Berk's fought back against that. She said she has tremendous respect for Pelosi, but the criticism was uncalled for. And then she suggested that things are still pretty bad, which prompted Trump to hit her.

[00:19:45]

So, you know, definitely what instills confidence in our system of public health is when public health experts like Burk's are ripped by the left and then ripped by Trump in response to responding to the left. And then everybody doesn't know what the hell anybody is talking about. And nobody can trust any of the data because no data is being presented in the first place. Do you feel more secure? The great irony of this whole situation is government has never exercised more power in my lifetime than they are currently exercising over American life and abroad.

[00:20:10]

And yet there is going to be an entire group of people who suggest that the answer to all of this is to give government more power, which is patently insane. Have you seen the people who run our government, their absolute freaking morons have the combined IQ of a piece of bread. I mean, their total dolts. I mean this like on all sides I'm talking about like this is not is not a partisan point. The people who are in charge of your life are some of the dumbest people I have ever seen in my entire life.

[00:20:33]

They don't know what in the hell they are talking about and they are not presenting good data that you can make good decisions based on. And they're not making decisions that make any sense is all crazy. Talking here is Berk's trying to do her best kind of clapping back slightly and Nancy Pelosi and then being slapped around by Trump. This is just I'm sorry, this is all crazy. And if you feel sanguine about any of this or if you think Joe Biden is going to solve any of this, that will doddering moron, none of us are going to solve any of the train is coming down the tunnel, guys.

[00:20:58]

That ain't the light. That's a train. I have tremendous respect for the speaker and I suspect for her long dedication to the American people, and I think it was unfortunate that New York Times wrote this article without speaking to me. This was not a Pollyanna view. I have never been called Pollyannish or non-scientific or non data driven. And I will stake my 40 year career on those fundamental principles of utilizing data to really implement better programs to save more lives.

[00:21:32]

OK, and this prompted Trump to basically say, well, we should be Pollyannish. It's like, OK, so Trump then tweeted out so crazy.

[00:21:40]

Nancy Pelosi said horrible things about Dr. Deborah Beck's going after her because she was too positive on the very good job we are doing and combating the China virus, including vaccines and therapeutics. In order to counter Nancy, Debre took the bait and hit us. Pathetic. So now vouching and like the two people who are out front and he brought them out front, now he's ripping them. Do you feel more safe and secure today? I mean, that's that's really going be the question.

[00:22:02]

And if you're Joe Biden, all you have to do is sit in that basement, be dead. That's all you have to do. It's the easiest thing in the world. All you have to do is sit in the basement and just be not alive. People are saying right now, why doesn't Joe Biden get out there and do interviews, because why in the hell would he seriously? Why would he? I mean, the media are playing cover for crappy Democrats across the country, from Bill de Blasio to Andrew Cuomo to Gavin Newsom, they're doing a horrible job.

[00:22:23]

The Democrats, it doesn't matter. The media will cover for them. The media will cover for Nancy Pelosi when she rips on Debra Burks and then Trump will jump in with both feet. And just instead of him saying Nancy Pelosi should respect public officials like Deborah Brooks who are doing their best, and Nancy Pelosi doesn't know what the hell she's talking about. Instead, he jumps in and he's an expert like this is you wonder why people are feeling a little bit disappointed right now, why people are feeling a little bit confused.

[00:22:46]

The reason they're feeling a little bit confused is because nobody knows what the hell is going on and nobody is giving them any good, solid information to make them feel like there is a plan in any of this. And that goes for all sides. Now, again, I think the media play a lot of this up. I think the media have an interest in the chaos. I think the media like the chaos. I think the media have engaged in panic porn.

[00:23:02]

If I have to see another story about an individual anecdotal story of somebody who got covid, all I can say is that is the biggest waste of space in a newspaper. I can think of anecdotal stories about people who got killed that are not useful. Data sets are useful. It is useful for me to know what risk my parents are, and that's what I want to know. I want to know why we are six months into this pandemic and I still don't know what the actual infection fatality rate is for various age groups and by precondition in the United States.

[00:23:28]

How is that possible? That's the only question that needs an answer. And we still don't have that data. What the hell is everybody doing with their time? Instead, it's well, if Rhonda Sanders didn't lock down, then he's a very bad man, but if Andrew Cuomo did lock down, he's a very good man and Donald Trump is bad and Deborah Brooks is good or she's bad, depends on who's ripping her at the time. This is all nonsense.

[00:23:46]

It's absolute nonsense. And here's the thing. The fact that it's all chaotic out there meant that if Donald Trump were a good communicator, he could actually be taking advantage of that. Unfortunately, the president happens to be when it comes to anything that requires any sort of simplistic data analysis, not very good at this. And it's really going to hurt him if you want to see him winning. If you want to see him stave off Joe Biden in the radical left, you need him to do better than he was doing.

[00:24:09]

Which brings us to this interview he did with Jonathan Swan yesterday, which is just like I don't know who's booking his interviews. I swear to God, I don't know who in the comms office is booking these interviews. But like, if you're in the CMS office, you're like, you know what? Sit down with the best interviewer in the business. Jonathans, once one is is a bulldog. I know Jonathan a little bit. He has a long history.

[00:24:26]

John John is a very good reporter. If your answer was put, the president after after going on with Chris Wallace and, you know, having an easy time, sit down with Jonathan Swann. Jonathan's one morphed into John Oliver during this interview through no fault of his own. We're going to get to that in just one second. Again, man, that I love, like a great news day would be nice, but we're just not going to get one.

[00:24:48]

I think we'll get to that in just one second. First, let's talk about the fact it is now a bad time to go to an auto parts store. Rock, auto, dotcom is much easier than walking into a store and someone demanding quick answers to things like is your odyssey in electronics? And then they usually just have to order the part online anyway. Because there are so many types of cars, it's impossible to keep them all stocked. You have access to rock, auto, dotcom at your desk and in your pocket, all the parts that you will ever need available to you with the click of a button rock order.

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Go to rock, auto, dot com right now. See all the parts available for that car truck. Right. Shapiro in there. How did you hear about this box? So they know that we sent you. OK, so all this brings us to the fact that if the media are going to lie about the situation regarding covid, which they have been doing through very misleading headlines and through political coverage, and if Democratic politicians are going to smash that lock down button and shut down entire school district without the data to back it up, if they're going to shut down private schools, they're doing their best to protect students.

[00:26:24]

If Democrats have decided full scale across the country that lockdowns are the only solution, that provides an opening for President Trump to be the informational source. Right. And this is what you would normally expect from the president. And I've said for a long time, people have asked me to grade Trump a thousand times. What I usually say is I break it down into three categories. One is legislative policy, one is executive policy, and one is rhetoric.

[00:26:43]

When it comes to executive policy, I think the president has been an A minus B plus president when it comes to legislative policy. I think on judicial nominees, he's gotten basically an A minus. I think on everything else it's been like a C plus because you get a tax cut. That's basically what every Republican president does. And then when it comes to rhetoric, I think he has been absolutely awful in a variety of ways. I think that he's given like five good speeches all off teleprompter.

[00:27:02]

But one of your jobs as president is to be able to communicate not only a sense of stability to the American public in a time of great chaos, but also you have to be able to, in a very basic way, wade through the data. When people say that Ronald Reagan was a great president, they don't mean because he had great spending policy. They mean because he was able to communicate with the American public and to shift people's minds in how they thought about politics.

[00:27:24]

Donald Trump does not have the capacity, and it is a problem in a time when people are living in justifiably great fear and some unjustifiably great fear, thanks to the predations of a of a vastly polarized media. So yesterday, Trump sits down with Jonathan Swann of Axios, where he did this, I guess, a week ago, and the video finally broke yesterday. It is just a bleep show. I mean, it's a bleep show. It is bad.

[00:27:46]

It is a bad look for the president. He he it was the worst of him on display. Swann is the kind of person who is not going to let you get away with sort of pat answers that Trump usually gets away with. Swann is the kind of interviewer who went when Trump says things like many people have said, rather, that the Black Swan will say which people? And then Trump was and many people say, no, no, I want to.

[00:28:05]

Which people and what did they say? Which is a completely fair question. I said there was a lot of that in this interview and it was not a good look for Trump. And I had some of his typical kind of Trump and foibles, you know, things that won't hurt him but are not great. So he was asked about John Lewis, for example. This clip was going around yesterday. I was asked about the late congressperson who, again, was a very, very liberal Democrat.

[00:28:25]

I disagreed with John Lewis on a wide variety of policies, but his early, his early, his early action in the civil rights movement is thoroughly heroic to John. If anyone asks Trump a perfectly predictable question about Lewis, because this was recorded last week and Lewis just died and Trump proceeds to basically say he didn't like John Lewis because Lewis didn't go to his inauguration. It's worth noting Lewis did not go to George W. Bush's inauguration. Bush gave a speech at his funeral.

[00:28:49]

OK, but here is Trump. Looking petty, is this a good look? No, it's going to hurt him, not really, but it's a good look. No, it's not. John Lewis is lying in state in the US Capitol. How do you think history will remember John Lewis? I don't know. I really don't know. I don't know. I don't know. John Lewis. He chose not to come to my inauguration. He chose I don't I never met John Lewis.

[00:29:14]

Actually, I don't believe I'm. What? OK, so that's a terrible answer. That's number one, a terrible answer that he didn't come to my inauguration. And that's the sole axis along with you along let you judge somebody's entire body of work. That seems wrong. Okay, but that wasn't the real bad point. The real bad point is in a time of lack of understanding of covid and how bad things are, you actually have to have some fluency with the fact.

[00:29:37]

Again, as I mentioned, when he was in this interview with Chris Wallace a couple of weeks ago, he pointed out that the United States actually has not performed all that badly in terms of covid. There are plenty of other countries, including the UK and France, that have performed significantly worse in terms of deaths per million. The United States has ramped up testing beyond any other country by a long shot. The United States is also a federalist system.

[00:29:56]

And the great failures of the United States generally happened very early on in New York, New Jersey, Connecticut. They represent something like 35 to 40 percent of all deaths across the United States. And there are plenty of things that can be said. The notion that Trump was not early enough on masks, the conventional wisdom is still divided on masks is the truth. Virtually everybody in northern Europe does not wear a mask. They're not even mask mandates in countries like Sweden and countries like Finland and countries like Holland.

[00:30:21]

But they don't exist is that there's plenty of stuff for Trump to say here when he's asked about what have you guys done? What Trump could say is the federal government's job is basically a couple of things. One, trying to achieve a vaccine to try to shut down foreign travel. And three, trying to ensure that everybody has the resources they need. Otherwise, it's on the governors to determine what needs to be shut down and what needs to remain open.

[00:30:38]

And so if there's a local failure, blaming that on the federal government is a mistake. Have I gotten everything right rhetorically? No. But I think as information changed, I changed some of the things I was saying. This is not all that difficult. Instead, you get this, which I mean, I'm sorry, this is just a Saturday Night Live sketches. Jonathan Swan asking about the deaths in the United States from covid and Trump basically just shuffling through papers, handing him a sheaf of charts and then just being like, look at this chart.

[00:31:01]

Antoine's like, I'm looking at the chart and we'll just play the clip. Oh, you're doing death as a proportion of cases.

[00:31:07]

I'm talking about death as a proportion of population. That's where the US is really bad. Well, much worse than South Korea, Germany, etc..

[00:31:14]

Can't you can't do that. Why do they have to go by? You have to go by where? Look, here is the United States. You have to go by the cases. The case. Why not as a proportion of population? Somebody what it says is when you have somebody that has where there's a case. Oh, okay.

[00:31:31]

The people that live from those cases, it's surely a relevant statistic to say if the US has X population and X percentage of death of that population versus real by the cases we look at South Korea, for example.

[00:31:43]

Fifty one million population, 300 deaths.

[00:31:46]

It's like it's crazy that I do it. No, you think they're faking their statistics?

[00:31:52]

South Korea, an advanced country because they have a very good relationship with the country, but you don't know that.

[00:31:57]

And they have spikes like Germany. Lo, here's one right here. United States. You take a number of cases. Look, we last many well, first, I don't know what the first.

[00:32:12]

Yeah, man. OK, so a few problems here. Again, what he could like, there's so many things to say when someone says, OK, South Korea has a very low number of cases. First of all, they didn't they didn't take China's protestations that the virus wasn't dangerous seriously. Right. They ignored China, too. They were never seated with a heavy number of cases. Three, they were infected with the Asian Asian strain of the virus as opposed to the European strain of the virus.

[00:32:37]

There are a thousand things you could say about South Korea. And when he talked about Germany, Germany was not heavily seeded with the virus. Germany also has seen a worse economic downturn than the United States in the last quarter. So why don't you look at France? Why don't you look at the UK when you look at Spain, when you look at Italy and I look at it again, there are a thousand things Trump could say here, but Trump doesn't have the fluency and some of that's the fault of his team that needs to inform him.

[00:32:58]

And some of that is the fact that you don't take you don't take interviews where you don't bother to do the prep, not with somebody like. So does this does any of this make it more likely that Trump is going to win election? Right now, Joe Biden is just sitting there grinning to himself because he can be, as that is, he wants to be. That's going to be the title of Joe Biden's next autobiography, that is I want to be and just be like a corpse and be like a barely animate corpse being being rolled around on a gurney, not to any debates, not being a VP.

[00:33:26]

And as long as Trump says stuff like that, as long as it contains rules, man, for stuff like that, it ain't going to be good just.

[00:33:34]

There's such an opening here for president capable of conveying information to the public, and this is why when Trump was doing the early pressors uncovered, it was actually quite useful. It was quite good. He was on point, but this was not the venue for him. And that is that is really going to hurt him now. Again, he's operating in a context in which the media hate his guts, in which people are trying to tear him down, in which they're frankly lying about the performance of the federal government.

[00:33:55]

Again, they keep saying the federal government failed. Every single Democratic governor said, we ask for translators who got ventilators. We asked for testing. They ramped up the testing. We ask for PPE. They ramped up the PPE. Democratic governors from Wittmer to Cuomo to Newsom have all said this. And the media don't report that because it doesn't go along with the narrative that this is all Trump's fault. But Trump has to be better on defense, he has to be better at defending himself and saying South Korea is lying about its stats, ain't going to cut it.

[00:34:20]

Meanwhile, Democrats are taking advantage of the situation in order to promote universal mail and voting again. It is amazing. The media are just I keep harping on the media because this is a time when you would have to have faith in your institutions to bring you actual relevant information. But the media are so in the tank for the Democrats and for every Democratic platform position that they're just willing to ignore all available data. We'll get to that in just one second.

[00:34:40]

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Literati dotcoms. Go check them out. Fantastic service. Now we're going to get to more of everything in just one moment. Democrats continuing to claim that universal mail and voting is the solution and the media echoing that despite the fact that the data show this not only isn't the solution a serious problem and get to that in a second. But first, if you're not yet a daily wire all access member, you are missing out getting all access to our most exclusive membership here, featuring behind the scenes access to us, the podcast host, as well as writers and special guests.

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You are listening to the largest, fastest growing conservative podcast and radio show in the nation. All right, so let's talk about mail and voting, so the Democrats are now pushing voting by mail and the suggestion is, again, antiscience. The suggestion is just as with schools that keep saying the schools must remain closed, they must remain closed. First of all, let me make clear, I think there are a lot of teachers out there. I got some e-mails on this yesterday.

[00:38:03]

I think a lot of teachers who want to teach a lot of young, healthy teachers who want to teach and understand how essential they are in the lives of children and are treating themselves as essential workers in the same way that essential workers treated themselves as essential workers. And we keep hearing teachers are essential workers. Yes, the essential workers worked during the pandemic. Essential workers went to work. Teachers are essential enough. They should also be going to work just as cops want to work, just as firefighters want to work.

[00:38:26]

And let's be real about this. Teachers are generally at less risk than our firefighters or cops or even Amazon workers, in all likelihood, because they're dealing less with adults and more with children.

[00:38:38]

So that is one area in which the media have just been utterly irresponsible in their coverage of the data. Another area we keep hearing that we need to vote by mail, and if people have to wait in line to vote, this is going to cause massive spikes in covered the evidence. Just aren't there. It ain't isn't it the same media that will tell you that you can protest in the streets with millions of other people with no mask and breathe all over each other while shouting and be safe as long as you are saying social justice, warrior things is telling us that if you stand in line four feet behind another person and then you go and vote, that you're going to die of covid.

[00:39:08]

OK, there's one problem is not true. It is simply not true. According to the CDC. After after nineteen thousand people voted in person in Milwaukee April 7th, which was the middle of the spike. Fourteen tested positive for the virus, 14 out of 19000. According to the CDC report from Milwaukee, there were no spikes in cases anywhere else in the state due to the election either, according to Elizabeth Goosestep, spokesperson for the Wisconsin Department of Health Services.

[00:39:37]

Seventy one people who tested covid-19 positive throughout the state after April 9th and develop symptoms before April 20 first reported they voted in person or worked the polls on Election Day, but several of those people reported other possible exposures as well. So it's not accurate to say that the 71 cases were the result of in-person voting because some of those infections probably came from other sources. A total of four hundred thirteen thousand people voted in person statewide in Wisconsin April seven, although a much smaller number of Wisconsinites participated in protest marches following the killing of George Floyd.

[00:40:06]

Wisconsin officials are aware of 28 confirmed cases reported attending a protest rally during early June during the two weeks before getting covid-19. So the notion that voting in Wisconsin was like a great threat to public health, it just was not true. It just was not true. But that doesn't matter. Democrats are pushing mail and voting. Why? Because Democrats love mail and voting mail and voting combined with ballot harvesting gives them advantage in many different districts. If you remember back to the 2010 election, the early reports in the night, you go back and watch our coverage.

[00:40:34]

We live we live streamed in the early reports. Is that Democrat where the Democrats would have a good night, but it wasn't to be a wave. Then over the course of the next 10 or 15 days, a bunch of late breaking votes came in from California thanks to ballot harvesting and seven different congressional districts that had been Republican flip to Democrats. And it became a wave that was because of ballot harvesting. Ballot harvesting. Is this idiotic? And what should be illegal practice where you have third parties come and pick up your ballot for you that are not impartial.

[00:40:59]

So the Democratic Party sends out a person to pick up your ballot from you, which basically means that the better funded the party is, the more ballots they're going to be able to pick up. They're going to ignore everybody else who didn't get the ballot oftentime, but they make sure that your ballot gets in. Also, if you hand them a blank ballot, they are a Democratic operative. And by the way, you've seen the same thing even in even in I think there's a district in North Carolina where something similar happened.

[00:41:22]

Voter fraud. Is everything OK? Is it to pretend that it does not exist and the possibility does not exist? Counters a significant number of cases in which it's pretty clear that it has had a significant impact on America's future. Most obviously, when Al Franken basically stole a Senate seat from Norm Coleman in Minnesota after 350 ballots were discovered going for Al Franken in a car like a month after the election. In any case, Nancy Pelosi says that voting by mail is a health issue.

[00:41:46]

Again, there's not evidence, there's not evidence that if you stand in line and socially distance to vote that you have somehow. Raise your risk dramatically of contracting the disease. Here is Nancy Pelosi basically lying here right now.

[00:42:00]

Even more important, because it is a health issue, people should not have to choose between jeopardizing their health with a coronavirus and being able to exercise their right to vote.

[00:42:11]

OK, so again, you are not being asked to jeopardize your right to vote. You can request an absentee ballot. But the idea of universal mail in balloting because of the pandemic, if you want confusion, you want sanity, definitely pursue this. The post office is terrible. Everybody understands the post office is garbage and its job when it comes to ensuring that things get there on time. How many times have they lost things in the mail? Like a lot, right?

[00:42:34]

How many times? Like if you move to a different state, you'll probably still be forwarded a ballot from your home state. And that is the thing that will happen. Can you imagine I'll take months to tabulate how these votes are going to go. The House Oversight Committee, according to the AP, has invited the new postmaster general to appear at a September hearing to examine operational changes at the Postal Service. That are causing delays in mail deliveries across the country.

[00:42:58]

The plan imposed by Lewis Dejoy, Republican fundraiser who took over the top job at the Postal Service in June, eliminates overtime for hundreds of thousands of postal workers and orders the mail be kept until the next day if postal distribution centers are running late. Representative Carolyn Maloney, New York Democrat, said the September 17th hearing will focus on the need for on-time mail delivery during the ongoing pandemic and upcoming election. Now, can you just imagine how bad this is going to be, so Chuck Schumer, the Senate minority leader, he says the mail delivery must be timely.

[00:43:27]

I mean, has he lived in the United States with the post office for any prolonged period of time? Stuff gets lost in the mail really, really regularly and is not supremely timely, which is why FedEx FedEx exists here. Here's Chuck Schumer basically tacitly acknowledging that the post office is not going to be able to do this.

[00:43:44]

We Democrats. I believe strongly that we have to have free and fair elections, that the mail must be delivered in a timely way because so many more people are going to vote by mail. So many more polling places need to be set up because of Kovik. Can't be close together.

[00:44:01]

OK, again, if you think the post office is going to solve this problem, good luck to you. Mike Pence pointed out yesterday that if you can, you can still apply for an absentee ballot if you want, but mail in universal mail and is ripe for fraud. This is obviously true. Jimmy Carter had basically suggested something like this 20 years ago. Here's the vice president yesterday. Let's be clear, though, Laura.

[00:44:20]

Absentee balloting is perfectly acceptable. You have to apply for an absentee ballot. Signatures are checked. It's confirmed. It has a long tradition. And we want to encourage any American that is not able to go to the polling place for any reason to apply for an absentee ballot today. But this universal mail in voting where you're going to see it, literally ballots showered all across the state. Yeah, it just it is ripe for fraud. And we are headed straight to the courts to put a stop to it.

[00:44:55]

And then definitely what would be best for the country is if we have a contested election in which we don't know the result for a month and nobody has confidence in the results. And yet Democrats seem pretty sanguine about this. James Clyburn, representative, South Carolina, says, listen, there'll be some fraud with almost anything like nearly anything. There'll be fraud. I mean, like so who cares? The president of the United States expressing his opinion about mail and voting.

[00:45:19]

It's not the fax. The state of Washington has been doing this forever and they have found that there's almost no flow you will have in almost anything.

[00:45:32]

You fraud in almost anything is not an excuse for making it easier to commit fraud. My favorite part of this is Joe Biden from his basement claiming that Trump is going to try to claim the election is rigged. OK, we've now had several, what, four years of Democrats claiming the 2016 election was rigged. So it'll be great. Everybody will have no confidence in our public health system because we have no idea what's going on. We will have no confidence in our electoral system because we have no idea how people are voting.

[00:45:55]

It can take a month to figure this thing out. Everything's going to go great, guys. It's all going to be fine. Don't worry. Everything is good. Everything is good. Meanwhile, if you want to make sure that we have no confidence in what happens going forward, the media coverage of particular ugly police incidents is not going to is not going to make anybody in the United States more sanguine. I've been warning for months, by the way, to take an example.

[00:46:17]

I've been warning for months that the George Floyd prosecution, the prosecution of the officers in the George Floyd case is likely to go sideways. If you want to see Officer Derek Schavan go to jail, then probably they should have filed for an assault charge. And he knelt on George Floyd's neck for eight minutes. You can say that he was negligent. You could try to make a third degree homicide claim. They're instead going for a first degree homicide claim, I believe a second and second degree homicide.

[00:46:39]

Second degree homicide, I think is what they are going for, which requires like an actual willingness to kill somebody. There is no evidence like the evidence on that is extraordinarily scanty. You might be able to go for negligent homicide. The tape demonstrates, however, that none of these guys thought that they were killing George Floyd or even thought they were being negligent about killing George Floyd. So, yes, the reason this comes up is because yesterday The Daily Mail leaked more of the tape from the George Floyd arrest, like the minutes leading up to the the eight minute tape that we've all seen in that horrible tape of Derek Chavan kneeling on George Floyd's neck.

[00:47:12]

OK, media should have covered this responsibly from the beginning by including all the details, because maybe that would have led to a non overcharge. And there are a few things in the minutes leading up to George Floyd that the situation we've all seen with Derek Chavan, with his knee and George wasn't there a bunch of things in the minutes leading up that cut against the homicide case against Derek Chavan? OK, so just to sum these up, one, the police, when they arrest George Floyd, they tried to talk to him.

[00:47:39]

They tried to be nice to him. And it is for many long minutes. Second, there were other people in the car which I was not aware of. I didn't realize Floyd wasn't in the car loan. And those other people didn't resist the cops. They didn't resist arrest. And they're fine. But they're standing off to the side talking to the talking to the police, and they are completely fine. Third, you'll hear in these clips that George Floyd is begging, begging not to be put in the car.

[00:48:02]

He says you'd rather be on the ground than in the car. And he's saying, I cannot breathe before he is even on the ground. Now, this does not mesh with the original state autopsy report, which suggested that the cause of death was not asphyxiation. The problem with a homicide cases, you have to prove proximate cause. You have to prove that the cops actually caused his death. But it seems a lot more like at best, stress exacerbated an already bad medical situation when they arrived, he was not lucid.

[00:48:27]

When they arrived, he was already acting wild and claiming he could not breathe. The reason I'm bringing this up is not to say that you should be allowed to kneel on somebody's neck for eight minutes. The reason I'm saying this is because when the media do not cover these cases and include all of the fact pattern, what you end up with is a belief that these guys will definitely end up in jail. And then it turns out that the fact pattern is a little more complicated and they may very well get off.

[00:48:49]

So if you like the riots last time around, wait until the officers are acquitted because of the prosecutorial overcharge brought by AG Keith Ellison in Minnesota. Here's a little bit of the tape that was released yesterday. The media are not covering this tape because, again, it cuts against a lot of the case that's being made, namely that the officers knew that Floyd was dying and disregarded everything. Again, he was claiming he could not breathe when he was sitting in the car in which suggests that when he claimed you couldn't breathe lying on the ground, they were going to take that with exactly the same level of seriousness.

[00:49:15]

And here's here's a little bit of the tape. Oh, this is oh, man, I'm sorry. Let me see the other half. They both had shot the same way. Oh, OK. Well, what I say, let me see your hands and put your hands up.

[00:49:38]

OK, so he doesn't put his hands on the wheel and he does that once he does, the officer with his gun drawn puts the gun back down. What is basically begging the officers in this tape, Minitel to face away? Floyd is begging the officers, I don't want to be heard. They're saying we're not going to hurt you. Everything is fine. And everything was fine until he resisted arrest, which does not justify the actions of the officers.

[00:49:59]

But it makes it much more difficult to claim premeditated murder, which is what they're trying to claim basically.

[00:50:04]

OK, then he says he doesn't want get in the car, he says, and they're saying to him, we'll open the window for you. I'm saying we'll open the window for you. We'll make sure that you can breathe. And these are not the actions of officers who deeply do not care about George Floyd, at least up to the point where he's on the ground right now actively resisting arrest. Here's a little bit more of the tape. Please correct me if I ask you, please follow me, please, will you stay with me, ma'am?

[00:50:32]

Thank you. OK, OK, we're going to have a couple, but they're saying they'll stay with him, the windows down for him going to that. He says, I already have covered them. I'm not that guy over the phone. He's already claiming that he's going to die before he even gets in the car a claustrophobia. And because he was in fact, high on fentanyl, according to the autopsy reports.

[00:50:57]

Again, the point here is not the officers did the right thing. That's not the point at all. The point is the media's irresponsible coverage of situations like this is going to lead to revelations in the jury trial that may end up with the acquittal of the officers. So you should be made aware of this before you actually get to trial. The media instead largely ignored this yesterday, which suggests that they are going to cover this in the same way they covered the Michael Brown trial.

[00:51:17]

They're going to suggest that Michael Brown was wrongly shot even when the evidence went the other way, and then the officer ended up being exonerated. Now, in this case, George Floyd should not have been treated that way by the officers. An assault charge is probably more justifiable on the grounds that have been put forward. So this is. You know, again, wonderful, wonderful job by it, by the media all around here. Wonderful job by the media.

[00:51:40]

OK, we'll be back here later today with two additional hours of content. We'll also see you here tonight for an all access live. In the meantime, go pick up a copy of my book, How to Destroy America in Three Easy Steps. We'll catch you in a little bit. I'm Ben Shapiro. This is The Ben Shapiro Show. If you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to subscribe, and if you want to help spread the word, please give us a five star review and tell your friends to subscribe to.

[00:52:05]

We're available on Apple podcast Spotify and wherever you listen to podcasts, also, be sure to check out the other daily WYO podcasts, including the Andrew Clavon Show, The Michael Moore Show and The Matt Walsh Show. Thanks for listening. The Ben Shapiro Show is produced by Kolten has executive producer Jeremy Boring, supervising producer Matthias Glover and Robert Sterling, assistant director Pavel White, Norske technical producer Austin Stevens, playback and Media operated by Nick Shihan, associate producer Katie M'Naghten, edited by Adam Savitz.

[00:52:33]

Audio is mixed by Mike Kuromiya. Hair and makeup is by Nico Geneva. The Ben Shapiro Show is a daily wire production copyright daily. Twenty twenty.

[00:52:41]

President Trump appeals to the silent majority. Joe Biden's handlers want him to ditch the debates and the Minneapolis Police Department release body cam footage of George Floyd will get into all of it. Check it out on the Michael Knoll Show.