It.

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Dan this is the Dan Levator show with the Stu Guts podcast. Were you guys moved? We didn't talk about this the other day right after the Grammys because the killer Mike thing was something that was more pop culture type candy and I missed what was, I thought, a genuinely moving moment during a time, I think we can all agree, awards ceremony shows, silly. They're not as relevant as they used to be. They're not America gathering around the television to celebrate all silliness.

Really. I would think that award shows are like one of the last bastions of community viewing, along with live sports.

And perhaps there they are somewhere they haven't died smaller, quite like everything else, but they're still vital for moments like.

These when Will Smith slaps Chris Rock. Yes.

And Tracy Chapman performs for the first time in many years and introduces a new generation to an artist who hasn't performed very much, singing an impossibly sad song so well and produced well by television because the reveal is on her hands and her face very slow with the light and you realize by the chords she's announced herself. And people recognize a tune that they associate with a time, with a woman, with an icon. And then the music hits and you are seeing in the performance, recreated for a new generation by a modern artist the genuine awe that he has performing next to Tracy Chapman because he knows the credentials of what's next to him, the pain of that song, who made it great, why it's great. And he knows he's a borrower and he can't believe that he gets to perform this with her because it's an honor, because she makes music that makes you cry and made a whole bunch of people cry Monday and they didn't even know why they were crying.

Luke Combs covered the song fast car earlier this year, which is why it was performed at the Grammys with Tracy Chapman. And he has spoken about how much honor he felt in being able to cover the song to begin with because it then became a number one hit on country radio now without so many people from previous, or rather, so many young people who don't know it from previous generations. And so to be able to have this moment with her, you can see the look on his face in the background as she's singing. There's a couple of still shots that are circling on social media where the awe that he has for this human being and the audience didn't react like that to anybody.

For the rest of me, you and I can be pretty cynical. I was genuinely surprised that I got moved by a moment as cynical as I am during an award show. And it was just because it's just looking at it and then hearing the music hit me in the chest, realizing who she is and remembering the pain in that song.

That's nostalgia, though, right? That's the nostalgia of you remembering 1993, hearing that song for the first or whenever it came out.

Well, feeling it more than hearing it.

But it's also analog, right? Like, there's an analog aspect to that performance. The guitar, Tracy Chapman herself. The premise of the song is about an earlier time, and so there was the juxtaposition of this is a viral moment that is about an antiviral concept and that, I think, hit people somewhere inside of them that had been sort of, like, spackled over by just, like, the online world we live in. It felt nice to be reminded of how things used to feel, just how music can move.

You can move people no matter what.

Their difference is also just people discovering that there was a source material to this. That's something that's of a bygone era, almost pre Internet. You hear a p. Diddy and a family song, you're like, wow, this is such a great beat. And then as you get older, because the Internet wasn't exactly around when you first experienced it, you realize it samples, and you go back into time and you realize, wow, the Beastie boys, all they did was sample these songs and make a better song out of an original source material. Stuff that I had no idea about going back and listening some daft punk samples, some Kanye samples. That's kind of what people are experiencing with Tracy Chapman in that she's also been away from the. For so long.

That's the other analog aspect of it, right? Is that someone like that, who has stardom at that age, so young, is then fed into this attention economy. And we know her. We've been seeing too much of her and the withholding of her until this moment that was not promoted with any advanced warning is part of that analog surprise.

And she hasn't been on tour since 2009. She's not doing things like they use publicly, but it was also the presentation of some of these things. I remember one of the most moving bits of television I've ever seen is stairway to heaven, performed by heart and a church choir that just blows the nipples off of Led Zeppelin when they're watching it. So the music of it is obviously beautiful, but the televised production was also beautiful. And Tracy Chapman, the way that was unveiled as a surprise, where it's first her hands, and then it's the chords that are introducing her, it's the way her hands are lit, and then you don't see her face immediately either. And then when you do, she's smiling like she's smiling, and it's a huge moment for her. That should be pressurized. No, I'm going to sing this sad song in front of everybody, and I'm going to move them. I know.

Slight callbacks to how she was initially introduced because she was born out of this music video era. And if you remember fast Car's music video, they did as much as they could to disguise her appearance. So a little bit of a callback there. But then you go back and you see, oh, she's beaming. She's happy now. And you contrast that with how the record label decided to introduce her.

She's beaming because, oh, my God, she.

Got that money as cap just went through the roof.

Oh, my God. All these white people are rediscovering this song, and this time they've got an actual white person singing it, and they're just loving it. And I'm getting paid.

I'm getting rich.

And good for her.

We should say tracy Chapman is a black woman.

Yes.

And so part of the other thing that made people feel nice in ways that are both superficial and also very deep is that she represented this thing that communally. People who ostensibly disagree on things or are not the same, like, gathered around and it was like, oh, the country people love this. But also, there's a post racial aspect, weirdly, even though this happened 30 years ago, that we're just reviving now, the.

Post racial aspect is Luke Combs. Is his name Luke Combs?

Luke Combs, yeah.

Luke Holmes actually saying, hey, I got this song from this black person over here. As opposed to the Elvis, like, hey, thank you very much, and give me all that.

Like the original crime. I like when masses discover something people might have missed it when they were doing the immemorium tribute. Rodriguez got thrown up on the screen. And some people may not be familiar with the story. If you're not, check out the documentary searching for Sugar man because there was this music artist that was immense. Unbeknownst to him abroad in Africa. Just huge. Biggest recording artist in that country. And because much of it happened pre Internet, he went his entire life being forgotten until he goes back to Africa and has this hero's welcome. I was actually informed of something that is going on in St. Lucia, where it's one of the last bastions of outlaw country. That outlaw country is huge.

What is outlaw country?

Like the old Willie Nelson type of renegade country, not pop country. Real sad, depressing. Lonesome music is immense on my mind.

That's outlaw country. Outlaw country makes it sound like it's, hey, the hell with you. We're taking the country back. Yeah, try that in a small town. That sounds like outlaw country. Not. You were always on my mind.

Well, Terry, you know, Terry Bradshaw has a country, and I think one of the songs in the country album is the last word in lonesome is me.

Terry Bradshaw.

That's a perfect country song.

That's awesome.

Yes. I think that's a. Terry Bradshaw has gone, like, on a tour talking about depression. Is that what you think? Outlaw country is just sad. It's not renegade. It's just.

No, I'm the opposite. I'm saying, how is outlaw country not renegade music? Outlaw country. I'm outlaw country, and I'm sad in my feelings all the time. Doesn't really.

But that's right mean. Terry Bradshaw was and is sad and in his feelings all the time and is considered one of the most honest, iconic. Man, we talk about these quarterbacks playing games between Romo and Acman and Brady to compete. Bradshaw beat them all. Bradshaw has been on television at the center of that shit for 30 years.

He ain't making no 350 mil, though.

He also did not write the song. For what it's worth, it was written by Roger Miller in 1965.

Get out of here, you fraud.

Trying to take out of your nerd. No, it's a fast car moment.

Get your loneliness out of here.

All right. When you say get out of here, nerd, can you explain to me. I really regret not getting to this story earlier this week because Diana Rousini.

From the athletic the description of outlaw country is fiercely independent. The outlaws abandoned, lush orchestration stripped the music to its country core and added a rock sensibility to the sound video.

Go ahead and put up on the screen, please. Terry Bradshaw's let me see the track. Album. Yes, the album cover. Go ahead and put it on the screen. Because that didn't feel like Outlaw. It felt like a lot of sad songs.

I'm so lonesome I could cry absence slowly making plans.

Okay, so far, I'm very worried about what Terry's about to do.

A world I can't live in four walls. The last word in lonesome is me, which is a bar, but it's not his. Less and less. Here comes my baby back again. Okay. Burning bridges. That didn't turn out.

And on a downslope there.

Yeah. There's a little optimism on both sides. Right. Side a is like making plans and side b is like baby back again. And then afterwards, a world I can't live in.

Can I celebrate for a moment the career Terry Bradshaw has had?

Seriously, I didn't know about that album at all.

I didn't know about that.

But how about the tour? How about that? He tours doing music. He tours doing music and singing about depression. And he did a documentary about it. And he's one of the lead voices on television around quarterback voices.

In the last 30 years, did he make 350 mil?

I don't know how much he made, just for inflation.

So you think he's deeply underpaid at Fox? Probably right. They've been the number one pregame show and halftime show for 30 straight years. So probably.

There's actually another song in Terry's album.

Take these chains from my heart. It was hidden by our lower third on the video.

Oh, take these chains from my heart.

His cover of I'm so lonesome I could cry reached the top 20 on the Billboard's country chart in 1976. So he also only took the song ten years later, which isn't so bad. That's actually less distance than Luke combs.

To Tracy Chapman, the bicentennial.

You guys don't want to marvel at Terry Bradshaw's career with me.

That sure saw his ass. And failure to launch. That was nice.

That's true.

That's when he gave him an option of socks and he said, give me the medium.

That's right. That story is too long to tell here. But you guys don't want to celebrate Terry Bradshaw with me during. I mean, I guess he was Brady before. Brady? He won five Super Bowls. He won five. What do you mean? He wasn't Brady before. Have you seen the stats?

He like dues three times a game.

He won five Super Bowls. Now, those teams never had any free agents. They all just came back the next year and kicked your ass again. That was a harder time. Nobody could change teams.

Apparently it was because I'm so lonely.

That was the great leader. Winner of our time, folks.

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I gotta be careful here.

What did I just do there? Let me start again.

Stu guts.

He's the closer.

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This is Sidan Levitar show with the Stu God.

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Without getting into a meandering conversation about why it is we're going to Las Vegas and many of us are already there, and all of us will be by the end of the week. What I wish to explain to the audience in the event it escaped your attention is that this is the last week of Mike's career as our executive producer and we are going out with a bang.

Is that the dread that he's been feeling?

I don't know. I don't know. He has been feeling a dread all week, and I imagine there's been some dread around company building at every turn. And here, as a last act, is his punctuation as executive producer. Let's throw two live events in the entertainment capital of the United States during the Super bowl. Let's see if we can draw a crowd. There are going to be a lot of people there. Can we make a big noise? It will either be a spectacular success or a spectacular failure. He's worried about the age of his hosts, because Pablo, I just saw him in the studio a second ago. He fell to his knees. This is his last week on the job. He shouldn't care anymore. He fell to his knees screaming at a television set because the microphone is too close to Stugats's face on Radio row. And he's talking into the microphone in a way that's up the audio, and there's no one there to help him except Billy, who's sitting right next to him with another microphone that's too close to his face as well. And so Mike Ryan, his last week on the job, is not being able to control the sound from Vegas, where his aging radio host, Billy Gill included, don't know where to put a microphone.

Where the kids are putting the microphones these days.

Where are they putting them?

So Mike's going a bit crazy.

We're broadcasting from stadium swim at circa, and there were a lot of concerns. There's wind. It's cold out there. It's going to be breezy. There's noise pollution. So even though my hosts are very comfortable with desktop mics, we decided we're going to go with headphones and just outlined, look, I understand your concerns about the wind, but my host is at an age now where occasionally a guttural noise will come out of his body is unavoidable. And the only way to mitigate that is by the host pulling himself away from the microphone at the table. And Sugas is just generally disgusting. So I'd like the ability to pull ourselves away from the microphone. You can't do that.

If this is not the punctuation you wanted. The punctuation you wanted was, I've made a musical. Good night, everybody. I'm going to leave here.

That was the original plan. And then witty it all up. I don't resent the kid. He chases dreams. He's killing it. That's amazing for him. Screwed me.

You had the perfect. He did. He really did. He had the perfect protege, groomed from 14 years old to be a weird robot that would serve the company's needs, and then he ran off to chase his own dreams. Asshole. Asshole.

Yeah, I am happy for him, but it took a minute to get there.

Well, you're still not happy for him, because this week is filled with dread for you. And I ask you guys, I ask.

You guys, I don't think it's all professional. The dread.

It might be the flight.

I mean, it should change after my flight got hit by lightning that one time.

Oh, I forgot about that dude, I.

Wish I had been on that flight when everyone.

Yeah, you would have been like, it's okay.

I would have been all right. We don't go out like this because.

Yeah, you prophecy turbulence has gotten a lot worse as the planet's heating up. Yeah, there's a correlation between clean air turbulence and global warming, dog.

I'm calling bullshit on that one.

Look it up.

I mean, that's not bullshit. I said it. No, but I said this in front of Mike recently and he looked at me like I'm a horror monger. But no. One of the effects of climate change in the future will be that planes will have more difficulty flying.

And I've had so much turbulence since finding out that revelation. I mean, it doesn't matter the distance, it doesn't like, I'm just doomed to get bad turbulence. I was flying back from Europe one time and I was on a plane where everybody's head hit the ceilings. It was just really scary. Even though my daughter got a crazy kick out of it and I'm a little scared of flying now because of it.

I fully believe in climate change, let me make that clear. But I would say that we could add up everybody's flight time over the last twelve months here, the six people here versus me, and I might be double what you guys have logged. There ain't no way in hell. Turbulence is a lot worse now or whatever. That's just not.

I mean, there's all sorts of articles that support this. This is not just like some.

He's got the credentials.

Like he's telling you, telling you turbulence was never as much of an issue.

But you're talking about nerds of the computer.

He's talking about what he's done.

Hand in the dirt.

Hand in the dirt.

Hand in the dirt.

Plane in the sky.

Yeah, lightning hitting planes. I'm telling you it's been bad.

I mean, slept through that.

There's like five lightning strikes on a plane.

He slept through. Probably. I probably missed it. Maybe it did happen. I wish I was awake.

Flight patterns being changed is where your line is on believing that climate change is going to start Google. It's going to make new normals.

Yeah, you learn your stuff from Google? I learned my stuff from experience. I'm out there, me and the pilots.

And the flight, in those skies in.

The sky, patrolling, letting everybody know, hey, you know what? Climate change bad, really happening also.

Turbulence. The show, doing the reporting, the general election, all of this stuff, it's just all coming to a head and it's left me feeling dread.

Does it mean it'll have to come to you from the wings?

This is not the way to go into a party fueled by alcohol and music in Vegas.

It's just I'm not going to be on that much alcohol.

Tony. I am. Tony. He's okay.

It would have been the perfect time for.

It would have been a good time for that guitar right there. I am. And then Roy appears. But thank you. That doesn't help anybody. You fueling liquor on Mike's dread and him looking at me and being like, you going to rescue us, old guy who doesn't know how to hold the microphone correctly in the wind because it's going to be 18 miles an hour winds and I'm just going to get blown off the stage on behalf of Mike because it's going to be too cold. It's going to be too cold.

How cold is it right now in Vegas?

If you look at the low, the day that we're out there, it's a low of 37, but a high in the think around the time.

No, but you guys won't be out there when it's 30 something. That's in the middle of the.

No, but we will be on a rooftop. So the wind is a factor.

It will be chilly, it will be windy, but it's not going to be 30.

But I've been to stadium swin during the winter. I saw Skyler Thompson start a postseason game. It was very cold. Heat lamps everywhere. They're prepared.

Yeah, man.

Circa. I love pants on the beach. I love wearing a light jacket. 50 degrees. I live in New York. That's spring.

Oh, but forgive me on being an amateur here I thought 50 degrees, it matters if it's five mile an hour winds or 20 miles an hour winds.

That all of a sudden those winds are whipping off a Sierra Nevada.

Like in the desert on a bridge here. Yeah.

Which is also why I'm worried about the turbulence, because flying into Vegas is always a turbulent experience because of the.

I mean, surely you would agree with that, right? Because I've experienced that many times flying just California to Vegas that is more turbulent because how mountainous the regions are.

But isn't turbulence also just like the topography of the road, so to speak, that the plane is driving on? Like turbulence isn't actually.

But now there's clean air turbulence because of global warming where there's just no way to know.

I'll tell you. I don't know. Get on a plane with me twice a week every week for the last year. Then you'll know.

Yeah, I understand.

You're bravado, but you haven't been there where the turbulence hits that house.

My thing on a plane is when it gets super turbulent, I'm like, is this unusual turbulence? All I do is try to lock eyes with the flight attendant and see how they're reacting.

Boom.

If they're afraid, I'm afraid. If they're just, like, zoned out, I'm not worried.

Well, I'm a veteran of the turbulence game, and, yes, I look at the flight attendants, and much to my chagrin, they're also nervous about it. Thank you.

Pain thresholds for air turbulence. I would imagine that the flight attendants are more. They've got a higher threshold than anybody. If they're scared, you need to be scared.

You know how I reassure myself is I'm constantly googling, even though I know the answer. No plane has crashed because of turbulence, which I don't believe for a second.

I was literally just about to bring that up. No plane has ever crashed because of turbulence, ever.

Right.

So here you go. It goes. Pilots, when you talk about that, being able to not worry or whatever, right? Number one is pilots. Number two, the flight attendants. Number three, Amino Hassan.

Really?

Yeah.

That's who you.

Look, Amin's trying to project confidence for. No, but I believe.

I believe that your confidence is real and bulletproof.

You're Dan Levitard. You're sitting here to see there's a lot of turbulence. Oh, my God. This doesn't feel real. I can't see the pilots. The door is closed. What about the flight attendant? He's around the corner. I can't really see. Where's the mean? He's right there. He's cool.

If something tragic were to happen to us on our flight to Las Vegas.

Come on, man.

This audio is going to be dissected for years.

Of course. And you know what they're going to say. Amin offered to be on the flight to make you guys feel better, and Mike dismissed him with all the bravado of someone who learned everything from Google University, the college of YouTube, as opposed to listening to me. Well, I came from the school of hard knocks.

This does make Amin also the worst person to consult when there's turbulence, because Amin firmly believes he cannot die on an airplane. And so, as the plane is descending, about to crash into the earth, Amin is saying to himself, I dream something different.

No.

I'm sorry to introduce this to your guys. It's the last thing that you want to hear before you board a flight. That one guy's scared to death, that nightmare.

Well, this portending feeling of doom that you speak of, what Amin is saying here, and forgive me, because you say you come from the school of hard knocks or hard flights. Are you talking about. Is there a difference between other flights in your life before american flights? Because I know when I have flown on small planes in Africa and I've been very scared.

I've been in little planes, puddle Jumpers. I've been in the wide body. I've been in every type of plane other than the Concord. That was my dream. Never got to do it. But you know what I hear they're bringing it back. And when they do, guess who's flying. Amino hat.

You're saying you're the bravest traveler. You should have given him the guitar there. He was looking for the guitar. Roy, he was looking at you for the guitar. You've got to bring the guitar.

I'm not looking at Roy. I was looking at someone in the back. I was looking at Lewis. Lewis is like, gotta look at the camera. I'm like, okay, here we go. And I looked at the camera.

Yes.

I'm not the one playing it.

No, but your timing was terrible on that.

Like my timing or Lewis's timing as I stared at a camera and there was just silence.

Okay, but you and Lewis are doing a joke that you're only telling that you and Lewis were doing a joke there with the music, and nobody told us Lewis was playing. And so it just got played whenever Lewis wanted because Mike's in control of the music, not Lewis.

No, I've seated that.

No, see, I'm telling you, this is.

What it's going to be like.

Dan, really loosening the reins is that last week is Ep.

Mike's doing a garage sale. Like my man Bud. What's his name? Coach Bud Grant. Just like, hey, who wants this?

I can't tell you how heartbreaking it is to me that Mike has a feeling of dread before all of this, which is meant to be a company party.

A company party that David Sampson is not invited to.

The best kind of company party.

I mean, if you want to call the biggest broadcast of our professional lives, given our current standing in the industry, a party, go right ahead.

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Dan.

The Dan Lebatard show with stugats is brought to you by Bear Aspirin, the official sponsor of fans hearts, Don Levitard.

Oh, I think Larry Fitzgerald's on the green right there.

Stugats. That's Alfonso Rivera. How do you think that Larry Fitzgerald.

To be fair. All right, whatever.

Alfonso Ribeiro has a great ass.

This is the Dan Levatar show with the Stukats. I just caught somebody in racism. Yeah, you caught somebody in racism. It's golf related. There's this course that I've been wanting to play at for a while, and we're trying to get a big golf group trip going, and we have someone in charge of it. His name is Santiago, chief. And so he put in an email, and we're just a couple weeks removed from getting all the avails that we wanted. And the weekend that we were looking for was booked up. Okay, let's pivot to another weekend. That weekend is booked. Huh. Interesting. I know this place is in demand. All right. Gee, a man. Just ask them. Tell you what. Tell us when you're open, and we'll make it work for that weekend. The response was, we're booked up from January 1, 2024, to December 31, 2024. Okay. All right, cool. Hey, my buddy, Steph, do me a favor. Change your name and call on the phone and put on a very gringo voice and see what comes back.

So a Mike Ryan exclusive investigation. You're sending a friend of yours is private detective to sniff out racism?

It didn't check out. And also, I've had this long theory for a famous golf major that I never win the raffle to because I put my real name. This is a sordid history with this golf major, and I've long since believed that me submitting my name is held against me when they do this raffle. I have no way of proving it.

Other than none of my other latino friends have ever gone to this.

But white names, no issue. So my friend does the voice, calls the same exact rep. What was the name he used?

Hunter?

Jason.

Oh, Jason used Jason.

That's a good one.

Hunter's a good one.

It's my brother's name.

Tons of avails. Wow. Tons of avails. Did you know that golf has some racist elements to it.

No, not until this exclusive investigation brought to you by Mike and the glee with which you came out. You should come out with that guitar. I just caught someone in racism and have it have a musical flair so we can have some fun with you catching people in racism, I'm telling you.

How is there not something to that? Santiago Chi. You're like racist against Asians and Hispanics.

I was going to say, is he peruvian? This is why I make my uber name, Paul.

Really?

Wow. It's a type of casual racism that I think people run into in certain aspects of life.

Pablo's worried about hispanic racism, aren't you? By name, I mean.

All racism concerns me, Dan.

Well, but in this particular case in.

New York, mostly being confused for one of you.

But wait a minute. Aren't mean. We all have latin names that were made English by our parents. I was supposed to be Gonzalo or Luis. I think Mike was Miguel. I don't know.

No. I was born Michael Ryan Ruiz because of my dad was born Miguel. And to help, it was a different time.

But Billy is Billy because Guillermo is a disguise.

I'mike Ryan professionally and have only recently reintroduced my last name into the fold because of racism I felt in the industry.

Yeah, these are whimpering little.

That's a great Lewis. I don't mean to tell you when to do your job, but racism in the industry is a great place for a guitar rip.

We can't get the timing right between video and the guitar and the music and mean and societal points.

I'll never forget the look that my program director gave me when he was looking at a pay stub and he saw my real last name.

Yes. I love this. Never announced that it's racism. Just implied. And then the guitar riff brings it home.

Yeah, I mean, I told you why I did that because it goes back to my acting roots and this is further into the 90s where I didn't really speak Spanish. I understand Spanish, but my name as a professional actor model was my real name, Michael Ryan Ruiz. And I could only get spanish language work despite not knowing Spanish. I didn't get offered any english speaking roles. I wasn't offered the opportunity to even audition for these things. So I told myself after I got out of that game, in the next professional setting that I'm in, I'm going to go by Mike Ryan professionally because my last name, I just came from a place where it was held against me. And I'm really proud of the work that shows like this did because we have the Dan Lebatard show, even though that name is not overly Hispanic. You are overly hispanic in presentation.

No, he's not.

He's vibrant. Miami.

But no, not him. The show is. The show looks the way it does because it's trying to compensate for the fact that Dan doesn't present his.

Father named Gonzalo on Deus with you.

That's why his dad was on it, because they didn't believe this is supposed to be a diverse show. It's another white guy bring his dad out.

I'm proud of our show's track record, and I do think our show made it.

I mean, yes. Exploited my father for the accent. Yes. That's what we did. They under index with Latinos. Yes. Have to get the cartoonish spanish accent and make a mockery of our language for the paycheck. I'd never sell out.

Jeremy just whispered, it's like me.

Well, Jeremy. Jeremy Lewis timing a little bit off. Jeremy, help me with this, because I believe that for all of the conversations we've had around here, serious and otherwise, this week of Mike Ryan's last week as executive producer, Whittingham got farted out the side door to his dream job. Jeremy, step into the place and hear edit a million things and write songs and get good at it very fast. Your voice has been neglected around here, as I believe that we have everyone here, less Taylor Swift actual knowledge combined than you do by yourself. You are an untapped authority here and have been for weeks. We've been talking about Taylor Swift and Kelsey, and you have more connections to all of this. You love this music. You love this story. You love all of it. And we haven't given you any time to be the nation's foremost sports expert on this one subject. In your wheelhouse. We have denied you the opening to do your job well.

Yeah.

Similar to Bruce Springsteen with older sports writers, Taylor Swift really exists amongst this generation of sports media in a way that is making me not the only authority. You got Gojo. You got plenty of other people. But around this show, I agree with you. I mean, all of you combined in.

Terms of, well, what if we missed? Then get us downloaded as quickly as you can on all the things that you cover better than others because you know the subject matter better than the rest of us.

What I would say that's most important that's happened this week is that now there's a new album coming for Taylor Swift, the tortured poets department. And this is potentially a slight at her ex, Joe Alwin, who had a group chat with some other fellow actors, I believe, called the tortured Man Club. So people are really rolling with that. And this is coming out on April 19. But what Taylor Swift did, that was genius going into the Grammys is she turned her midnight's profile picture black and white. Now, why did she do that, Dan? Everyone thought it was because reputation. Taylor's version was going to be announced at the Grammys, but then she surprised everyone by announcing not a redo of an old album that would be coming out now as Taylor's version, but a brand new album to take down her ex, announced the same week as she's going to be going to the Super bowl for her new bow. Travis. Kelsey. I mean, it is so.

She always wins.

She always wins. Taylor Swift always wins. The marketing behind her and everything that she does, it's really the best business we have, going where every single move takes her entire fan base, looking for Easter eggs and clues, and yet still she seems to be outdoing them. It really is an amazing case study, which is why so many different universities now have classes on her.

I am fascinated by it because anytime someone talks about Taylor Swift the way that Jeremy did, and you could project this out throughout her fan base, it's in the minutiae. It has such a culty aspect to it. I'm not unfamiliar with Taylor Swift. I've heard every single one of her albums. She's been around since 2006, and yet there is such a mystique about her, a cult of personality about her that has birthed this entire unique subculture that I'm being informed of something new about someone that has been under a microscope for close to 20 years.

Taylor Swift is who LeBron thinks he is.

That's exactly right.

Like, little clues. Prodigious, constantly working behind the scenes, up to stuff, businessman, business tycoon, cringey millennial.

And, yeah, absolutely cringey millennial passive aggressiveness.

Constantly making fun of her exes without explicitly saying it.

Taylor Swift is also. LeBron has graduated to dad status, though, within this pop culture realm. Right. Taylor Swift is cooler at this point than LeBron. Correct. Like, just with young.

Even. Even I. It pains me to say that, but yes.

Well, and the thing with Taylor Swift and the reason it gets so culty is because at the very beginning of her career was sort of the beginning of Instagram and the Tumblr era, and she was on social media, legitimately interacting with her fans one on one, getting into Instagram comments before it became everything that social media is now. Which is why they gain this insane connection to her, where they feel like not only is she writing about the type of experiences that we go through, but also she's interacting with us and making us feel like she's our friend. And that part of it. There hasn't really been another artist in the social media era to be able to actually connect with their fans this way.

Kevin Durant.

I think he just resents you at this point. Jeez.

It feels personal that his timing I cut you off. Oh, no. That the random guitar riff can't be timed properly with your jokes to support you, that it only undercuts you.

By the way, I do get how the Taylor Swift stuff is off putting. I understand it, because everyone is being treated like, oh, you boomer. You don't know about this. I'm like, I don't. She's been around forever. How do I not know about Taylor? And then someone proves to me how little I actually know about Taylor Swift. So to be made to feel like that, I can understand how someone is knocking over their french dip because Taylor Swift's on the tv for 23 seconds. It's because you're being made to feel stupid in a way.

You mean you don't know that she unfollowed Joe Allen on April 19 of last year, which is why she's possibly releasing the album on April 19 of this year.

Mike brother, I have no idea who Joe Allen is.

Joe Allen.

What?

Her ex boyfriend.

I've been trying to figure out what Joel Allen.

A-L-W-Y-N. You're showing your age.

You're all showing your age. Joelen, who's Joel Allen? I don't know who he is either, but it's not because I have any fluency in this language.

Joawan.

The Dan Lebatard show with Stu guts is presented by one eight hundredflowers.com draftkings official flowers for valentines Don Lebatard.

Earlier in the show, the question was asked, what would Stu got do with one invisible day? Stu gotts one day where he could be invisible. We decided that during banking hours, he would choose a weekday. He would rob all the banks in the universe from eight to five, and then at night, he would alter sporting event results by being an invisible man in games he had bet on.

This is the Dan Levitar show with the Stu guts.

Juju has a way of cutting through shit. Juju has said some things to me that have been revelatory because he is perpetually speaking the truth, no matter whether it hurts you or not. And one of the things that he said is that he thought that we sounded unspeakably lame. And I think he was directing it at you and me, Pablo, specifically. That checks out for getting on our high horse. I mean, do you know what this is about?

No. Unspeakably lame, though, is a hilarious term.

Well, look, turns out it wasn't quite so unspeakable for old Juju gotti.

Well, but Juju Gotti had criticism in general of how out of touch you and I were and are sounding like scolds. Like scolds, journalistic scolds, by telling Cameron it is what it is, podcast for telling them that they shouldn't be platforming OJ Simpson for feeling like it's not the right thing to do, to.

Objection. I don't think anyone actually.

So this is what happened. I said that it is what it is, is my guiltiest pleasure. I click on every video they post. I find myself laughing. That's all true. At the same time, Dan, it just feels obvious to me that if you remember who OJ Simpson is, there would be a pang of conundrum, a conflict about whether this should be happening so easily and freely and comically. And I say that as someone who has many questions about what OJ's life is like now. And I guess for Juju, this is not a thing that he spends a second of time being conflicted.

Think, first of all, I don't think OJ can be platformed. I don't think anyone's like, you know what, you're good, or what did he do? He seems like a lovely old man. Everyone knows OJ's story. And the whole bit is that this show, that is a rebellious show, this is a show that operates outside the purview of mainstream America. How outlaw are you? Real outlaw. Not like that bullshit outlaw country shit you guys are talking about the other time. So outlaw that we're going to take the most radioactive man still to this day in America and put him on and ask him about football, which is what they usually do. And then in the last episode, they asked him something that was not football. That made me go fall.

Okay. And made me laugh the same way. Because it's television, it's great. And also, I felt immediately guilt about laughing that way. How often does that one, does that one ever get you? Or do you just laugh because I felt guilt about what I was laughing at?

Yeah, Borat, for real now. At least that's what I'm supposed to say.

Let me see my wife. Let me see. Let me see from it is what.

It is shut up.

The thing that made us laugh, even though it shouldn't have made us laugh, but it did.

Said men shouldn't open up to women because they'll use it against them. He said whenever something go down, they're going to throw it back in your face. Do y'all agree? OJ first?

OJ first. When you say open up to women, I don't know what he's talking about. Is he talking about confessing? No, man, don't confess. I think you're right. Don't say nothing. It was your line, eyes. So leave me out of the confession. Oh, no confession. Y'all gotta leave me out of this. Molly's episode. Say that no confession. I feel immediate remorse laughing at that. That's real.

Oh, my God. This is what's funny about it, right? What's funny is OJ answered the question sincerely about the question, the setup, it was kind of cut off at the beginning. Is that Shaq on his podcast says, don't open up to women because they'll use it against you, stat. Baby does an amazing job of saying, you first, OJ. You could tell the look in her eyes. She's like, I'm going right at OJ for this. OJ answers the question sincerely, like, yeah, and don't say you never confess anything to a woman. Like, oh, yeah, I was out with the fellas or whatever. That's how he's answering it. Cam and Mace are dying laughing because he said no confession. And they know exactly what they're laughing at. And you could tell OJ's face like, oh, crap, I just stepped in doo doo.

Just like, you don't think he did that on purpose?

I thought he did that on the.

Way that he delivered. Are you talking about confessing? I thought he caught it.

Then I thought that his emphasis on confess was trying to be funny about, like, this is the part that's conflicting. Well, you know that man, that. That man gutted two people with a knife.

Well, he didn't gut. Yeah, that's inaccurate. He allegedly took a knife to one of their throats very severely, to the point of near decapitation.

You would see my discomfort.

Yeah, I watched that and I'm like, that's their place. That's cool. That's fine. I see the value in it. It's certainly shocking. And greatest artists of our time sometimes just do things just to shock you, to disarm. Not. It's not for us. I'm not jealous of it. It's just not a point that I'm ever willing to cross.

There is comedy in the idea of O. J. Simpson is being invited onto the sports show and ends up being OJ in ways that the hosts were not prepared for. That, to me, is intrinsically comedic. The comedy is limited by a general sense that I have this, again, conundrum in the back of my head, that to live in a society of laws and rules and norms means that I shouldn't laugh when the same guy who's saying the thing that he shouldn't be saying is the guy who we all believe literally killed people.

Let me ask you guys this. As we break down and get into it, are we laughing with him or are we laughing at him? I'm laughing at him.

Oh, man.

Okay, this is a great distinction. But at the same time, when Dan is pointing out and we're trying to define the intent, he's also the guy who wrote the book if I did it.

Yeah.

And the question applies there too. Is this something that he's doing to troll people or is he doing this?

Because I go back to this and I don't know if we have time to replay it, but you can tell the moment he realizes what he said, because what he did was that you don't confess anything. What he was doing there was he was doing the old man never the thing that. Not to make the comparisons, but when your father says, hey, I gamble my money, I give the money to my mistress, your dad doesn't really have a mistress, but it's a thing that old men like to do to be funny, like, oh, look at you.

Don't think that he was purposefully using the verb confess.

Play it again. Play it again. I'll tell you why. Because you could see the moment he realizes how they're taking it and he says, don't bring me into that, is what he says, but play it again, please.

Said men shouldn't open because they'll use it against them. He said whenever something go down, they're going to throw it back in your face. Do y'all agree? OJ first.

OJ first. When you say open up the women. I don't know what he's talking about. He's talking about confessing.

No, keep playing, keep playing, keep playing. Pause it there.

Ron Ross refusing to admit he's.

No, no.

First of all, the stock web does not fit.

You guys got to let it run. Because the part when he goes like that, when he does that confarising thing, he's doing the old bad. You mean like calling her like you cheated on her? That's what he's doing now. Let it run. Let it run. So he's laughing about what?

He thinks he meant a joke. Don't say nothing. They start laughing with the lion eyes.

He's talking about, like, talking to a woman. Watch.

Yeah. Now you got to leave me out of this.

You got to leave me out of this one. As he shakes his head, that's the moment when he sees their reaction. Like, oh, my God, I said that. You got to leave me out of this one, man.

I took that lean in to, like, you mean the murder I committed? That's kind of how I took.

No, he's doing the old man, like, never tell the women that with your lying eyes that I've been cheating on her.

The thing about being the person who is tempted to scold, and I don't want to scold. Right. Like, none of us enjoy that.

Who are you scolding?

Well, I feel like there's a wide lane to say murder. Not my favorite.

Right. But this is the thing, Mike, is that you need someone to say that. And it's sort of like, do I have to be the guy? That's the exercise that I do.

I want to enjoy this like everybody else.

Wait, am I going to have to be the person who's like, by the way, I watched this documentary about OJ Simpson, and Ezra Edelman showed the murder photos, and I haven't forgotten those. And it's just like, at the same time, what's the statue of limitations on something?

Is there someone in America right now who says, OJ Simpson? That guy's great on it is what it is. And it's like, was he famous for anything else?

Yeah, a bunch of people.

Really?

You think people are the people that are just discovering Tracy Chapman? The people that are just discovering OJ Simpson, what he did, what I kind of feel naked gun.

OJ's up there with like, what's my man that shot Lincoln?

It was more than 20 years ago. A generation wasn't. No, it's not. A generation can be removed from OJ Simpson.

Top five murderers.

Should we invite a John Wilkes Booth impersonator as a guest onto the Dan Lebatard show?

This is another bad idea.

Hello, Twitter world.

It's me, John Wilkes Booth.

The OJ clips are kind of like where I felt like, oh, I might be a nihilist now because I see them, I'm like, that's for other people, not for me. Whatever, I'll move on. I don't feel that passionately about it.

You feel like you've just been. I think Mike has felt numbed by the last ten years in America. Just slapped across the face by raising a child in this America. How about that?

What is for me anymore?

Okay. Just nihilist. Defeated.

Yeah, I'm passionate about a couple things. Love my daughters. Love my family. Love my canes.

Love your wife.

My wife.

It's not allowed anymore. It doesn't hold up. It doesn't hold up.

Where do you put magnet when you.

Say Babra boost in my country?

Come on.

That was funny.

My roommate in college was from Kazakhstan. Oh, this must have been prime bore.

You had to pretend like it wasn't funny.

That guy did not enjoy.

I mean, come on. My wife, obviously not gwanish.

Yurchekovich Batuberbeka from Almaty, Kazakhstan.

Of course.

I want to apologize to you.

It's deeply offensive.

It's nothing like what Kazakhstan is actually like.

That's the funniest.

So my guy, Kunai Kuannish, is like, basically chinese Russian presenting.

Yes.

And Borat is deeply offensive.

Somebody was funny.

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