Welcome to South Beach Sessions. I am very excited that this man is in studio with me. I have known him since he is 17 years old, since he was drafted. I was at his mother's house. His sister was making eggs, and he was just a young man trying to figure it out. He is now one of, if not the best in the athletes in the history of South Florida, one of the best baseball players ever, and a media tycoon and a business tycoon. You laugh at media tycoon, but I don't know a lot of people that got to work, especially after having some controversy at both ESPN and Fox at the same time. I don't think there's a lot of precedent for that. Thank you for being here with us, Alex.

Thank you. I thank Jimmy Patera at ESPN and Eric Shanks at Fox for making that happen. Rob Manfred was very helpful, and I've enjoyed my time with both.

I want to. This is what I aspire to. I don't know if we're going to get there or not, but I would like to have the most honest conversation I've ever had with you, and I've done magazine stories on you, and we've talked a lot over the years. But I know that you're very good at this. You're very good at the charm of television, at how you present. Sometimes it can be a thicket to get in there near the soul of Alex Rodriguez because you know how to share only what you want to share. That's what I'm aspiring to. How do you think we're going to do?

I think we're going to do well because we've known each other almost 30 years. Actually, 30 years, probably more now. Gosh, we're getting old, Dan. But two things I'm really bad at where I need your help, and we've talked about this over the years, is I'm a great audio listener, and that's how I learn. I love podcasts. I can't wait to see more of what you're doing. But I'm not a good writer, and I'm not a good reader. You're one of the best writers on the planet. When we're offline, I want you to give me some tips on how to become a better writer.

Writing is tough. It's tough. Writing is hard. It's lonely. It is a skillset. I mean, you've done. So is hitting a baseball, but writing is a tough one. I think the most failed class in American colleges is in-When did you know you were an exceptional writer? Well, in high school, it was the first thing that teachers told me I was good at of anything. In fact, I would say that That's the first time anyone told me I was good at anything because my father, who I was always trying to make proud, was very reluctant with his praise, like a lot of Latin fathers. You know some of this, Raphael Palmero, Jose Dade Konseiko, pushed very hard by fathers who were very demanding. You, and I'd like to talk biographically at the beginnings of your life, estranged from your father, but what can you tell me about the earliest parts of childhood that you remember? What are the landmarks for you before we get to some of your-Yeah, it's interesting.

You talk about your father, and I really like your father and respect him a lot. I really miss the show. He was awesome. But I think with me, having an absent father. My father left when I was 10. I'll start there, and then I'll go back to when I was born in New York. Dad left at 10 and left home in Westchester. I'll never forget our address, 8250 Southwest 12 Terrace, just a few blocks away from my elementary Everglades Elementary, and where I went to school with Javi Gomez, who now works for us as a Chief League at Arod Corp, and JD Urteaga, who just became the manager head coach for the baseball team at the University of Miami, which I'm just thrilled for him. That, for me, as an athlete and as a human being, was a gift and a curse, pops leaving. One, I think the curse is, obviously, you miss dad, you miss the kick in the ass, you miss the mentorship from a father, and just the guidance of just someone who loves you infinitely, I guess. The gift was that I didn't have a crutch to lean on. I remember a lot of my teammates all had their parents They will give them, I remember they give them hot dogs in the middle of the game, chips, nachos.

Sometimes we'll get pizza in the fourth inning, and I was starving. I didn't have anyone to come give me any food. I had to do it my own. But going back, I was born in New York in 1975. Both of my parents, Lourdes and Victor. Victor has passed now almost 10 years ago. Both Dominicans, immigrants. I was born in New York. At the age of four, things started getting a little bit rough in New York City. We came to Dominican Republic for four years. Then once I started getting into the third or fourth grade, mom thought it would be a good idea to get to Miami. I've been here ever since. Ever since I was nine years old, where I landed at the Boys & Girls Club.

What was your life like in the Dominican? Or is that too your earliest memories on stuff on what you had and what you didn't have, what love felt like, all that stuff. Where are the early places that you associate with maybe happy childhood? Was it a happy childhood?

Yeah, I think it was very happy. I think because the main theme in my life was sports. Even though we were humble financially, I always had big dreams, and those dreams revolved around sports. It didn't matter what color you were, what language you spoke. It matters if you can contribute to a team. I just like that. It was like, Okay, this is great for my self-esteem. If I can actually have a good attitude and be a good player and help us win, there's always going to be a spot for me. That was great. But yeah, I think I was a happy child. Yeah.

Your mother, you were telling me before we started here, is now 88, vibrant, drinks you onto the table. You cannot keep up with her. What was the imprinting left by your mother and your sister in raising you in a house that didn't have male leadership?

Yeah, it was interesting. My first eight years of my life, the first four were in New York, the next four were in Dominican. I had a pretty good framing of how things were in New York and Dominican. They were completely different. We lived in an apartment in New York where my father had a shoe store in our apartment, and every woman within three or four miles would come to buy shoes from my father. I've had so many people over the years say, Hey, I used to buy shoes from your father, which is neat.

You lived behind it, didn't you?

We lived at 183 in Amsterdam, a block away from Yeshiva University. That's when my dream started thinking. I had two dreams as a 10-year-old boy. As I used to watch the games after my father was done selling shoes all day, my dad would smoke two packs of cigarettes a day, Dan, and he would drink about 24 beers every day, and complete alcoholic. But I never saw him scream. I never heard him curse. I never heard him raise his voice. My mother, on the other hand, is where I got my grit and my toughness from. Chancleta. Big time. Quick story on my mom. Across the hallway from our apartment in New York, I was probably four, I remember there was a big-time drug dealer that lived right across who was tough as nails and Everybody feared him, and you did not want to get in the crosshairs with this gentleman. He did something where they did something that was a little bit disrespectful to my sister. I don't think it was a huge deal, but it was probably like they intimidated her or they raised their voice. My mom gets home from work, and she hears us at dinner.

Around nine o'clock at night, she goes banging on this guy's door. Now I'm thinking, I'm four. I'm thinking, We're all dead. I mean, this guy's going to come with a machine gun and just take us all out. He goes, If I ever see you pointing at him, if I ever hear you talk to any one of my kids, especially my only daughter, you and I, Mister, are going to have a problem. I'm thinking, Okay, we're dead. At least I have a father. My mom's dead. He literally backed off and said, You know what, Mrs. Lourdes, apologies. My fault. Don't ever happen again. I'll give you one better. If anyone messes with your family, they're going to have to deal with me. That was the start of my mom having conviction and holding her ground.

For For those who don't know Spanish, when I said chanclet, then he said big time. I was talking about Hispanic mothers who throw flip flops as a way of discipline. Did you need much discipline? Were you a good kid? Were you unruly?

I was a good kid, Dan. Early on, now fast forward to when we were 12 and dad left at 10, I remember going to Publix in Kendall. The Publix is right there, 137th and around I remember going, my mom at that time had two jobs. She was a secretary in the morning and served tables at night at Land America, right in front of Tamiami. I think it was 97th Square Way, and they had the best biste empanizado. Oh, my God. With rice and beans and maduros. It was incredible. I remember going to Publix, and we were at the check-in line where we were paying, and I saw some funny money. I go, Wow, the only time I've seen that is like monopoly. It was like red. I said, Mommy, okay, so what is that? She was embarrassed to tell me. Of course, it was government money. It was at that time when I was 12 where I said, Okay, you know what? I'm the youngest of three, and I got to get my ass in gear because I got to help out mom. Mom was not a young mom. She was an elderly mom and was working way too hard.

That was the first time then that I had a little reality. Talk about the gift and the curse of not having dad around. That I knew I needed to be a good kid. That meant three things. One, I had to be a good student to be able to get a scholarship to Columbus or Westminster Christian. Number two, I had to be a good player to contribute to earn that scholarship. Three, I had to be a good kid. My friend's parents thought I was a good enough kid to have them around their kids, and that way I can get a ride home because I wasn't 16 yet and I didn't drive. Those are the things that started from that Publix event.

When you talk about government money, I almost associate you word association with money as almost the smells like money, looks like money, makes money. Money was something important to you. I don't know whether it was validating to you at all. I do remember the specifics of Kevin Garnett signs the biggest contract in sports, 126 million, and you sign for exactly double that, not a penny less. Exactly double the biggest contract in the history of sports. What is your relationship with money? Were there any insecurities there early on with money?

It's funny because I think that was a Scott Borish production. I didn't know at the time, but I'm sure the 2X above Kevin Garnett, the irony of the Minnesota Timberwolves, and the double. I'm sure that was a Scott Borish production. I never asked them, but I'm sure there's something there. One of my favorite interviews, Dan, that I've ever seen, and I've always been a big fan of your writing first. People don't realize you're one of the best writers around because your media career has been so good and so fun and center with ESPN and others, was the I interviewed with Pat Reilly, and Pat Reilly is a great friend and one of my great mentors who I have so much respect for Pat and Chris Reilly. Both of them have been great to me over the years. You said something to him about, Don't let the fancy suits kid you, you're a New York street baller, right?

A connectedy tough guy. He was, yes, it's all packaging, Armani packaging. I've been meaning to ask you actually this question. I'll let you finish a second. But at one point, I heard that you and he were the only two people anywhere to be found in either America or sports who can walk into any Armaning place and take whatever they want without much issue in terms of your fame. Armaning wanted you decked out in Armaning.

There's some truth to that. It wasn't exactly get whatever you want, but we had, I think, a massive discount, which we kept very quiet for a long time because Mr. Armaning did not want that word to get out. I'm very grateful for that. My relationship with Money Den is one that one of my great passions in life is financial literacy. Because one of the things that I see a lot of my colleagues in sports and even acting and people in Hollywood that is not their strong suit is financial literacy because they haven't spent a lot of time doing it. Just like writing or speaking, reps is paramount. I knew the financial literacy was my way out of that funny money that I saw and witnessed when I was a 12-year-old boy at Publix. I think at the beginning, there was some imposter syndrome. Obviously, I didn't go to a fancy school. I don't have my MBA. Ironically, now I'm going in my sixth year of teaching the number one class at Stanford Business School, which is called strategic pivoting, which is another story. But I think education is power. I think a lot of times, I don't know where it comes from, but people try to code finances so much that they make it much harder than what it really is.

I think baseball does the same thing with all these acronyms. Really, at the end of the day, instead of saying a five cap, I'm going to buy this five cap, this beautiful building we're in, instead of just saying is a 5% return. If you put $100, you need $5 back. It's so much easier. One of the things that I want to do is really democratize investing financial literacy is the only way that we can really empower our future and ensure that we have a good life after sports.

Strict Strategic pivoting is what? What is the class?

Yeah, you've done one, Dan. I've done one. I've gone from strategic pivoting from professional baseball to media to business. You've done it from being an employee at ESPN to now being a media mogul yourself and working with John Skipper and you have this great, I wish you would have came to me because I would have loved to invest with you. The pivot for you probably wasn't as scary today because you're north of 45 years old. But if you did this pivot at 25, it would be daunting and scary. A lot of kids that come from these great universities, they have so many options. A lot of people are pivoting from politics to business, from business to education, from education to social work. We teach them how to make that pivot, how to signal to the community why you're changing. Because a lot of times, we assume that everybody knows why Dan Lebertard went from ESPN to his own media company. You got to go out and signal to the community, this why we're changing and why. That way, they don't make up their own mind or assume that something bad happened, perhaps. We walk you through all those processes.

You mentioned financial literacy. As an observer of you from afar, I have not asked you this, but I have always thought that you were somebody that because you were so great at baseball and were not able to go to college, that you had a little bit of, I don't know if imposter syndrome is too strong, but an insecurity about, I want to put my name on the University of Miami, and I want to donate big because I want people to know that I'm educated, that I'm not someone to be trifled with just because I had to go work on baseball and couldn't work on my studies. How much of that is there?

I think a lot. I think Pashua sindra was not too strong, Dan. I think the two institutions that made an enormous impact in my life were the University of Miami and the Boys and Girls Club. I sit on both boards at the national level. Part of why I wanted to give not only... A lot of people can write a check, but the thousands of hours that I've put to give back to the Boys & Girls Club, including a board meeting for a couple of hours this week.

They raised you, right? The Boys and girls, they saved you. One could say, Well, saved might be too strong because you had love at home, but you found family there.

Yeah, but at home, everybody was busy working, trying to pay the rent. The rent, when we got here, was $550 Our landlord was called Alberto, a Cuban man, very nice man. It was a four bedroom. He lived in one and we lived in the other three rooms. A lot of my my grit, my determination, my motivation comes from, I remember how it feels to not have the 5:50 to pay that rent every 30th day, the first of the month. I think a lot of it came from that.

Did you know when you were growing up exactly what you wanted? Because when I talk about the thicket that is getting closer to you, when you were younger, and I don't know how much this has changed over the years, but when you were younger, I feel like even when you were winning MVPs younger, that you were searching for how it is to behave as a professional icon so that people would like you, that you would ask Michael Jordan a bunch of questions about, How do I do this? He would tell you, touch riders on the knee, call them by their name. You asked a ton of questions of people because you wanted to be perceived a certain way. I thought you were trying to find your voice, and sometimes that got you called a phony or whatever because people thought you were insincere because you were trying too hard to be liked.

I think it's all accurate. Dan, I think therapy has completely changed my life. I've been in therapy for 12 years now. I know you had an awful death in your family, which condolence this to you and your entire family. I can't even imagine how that feels. I don't know you've been dealing with a lot. I lost my therapist a couple of years ago, and he died out of nowhere. He had a heart attack, and that was an enormous blow to me. Because he's been such a source for me. Dan, what happened was, a lot of people forget. You don't, of course, because you were there. But I was one of three people in the history of the game to be in the big league at the age of 18. Myself, Tona Larouhsa, and one other that I I can't recall his name right now. I was 18 years old. I looked like I was 28, but I had the emotional maturity of a 12-year-old. A boy. While all I did was my 10,000 hours like the outlier in baseball, I fell behind emotionally. I fell behind with my education. Remember, I have this big vacancy because pops left at the age of 10.

It wasn't to some of my trials and tribulations I got older and dealing with Dr. David, with some of issues, unpacking what happened when I was 10, 11, 12 years old, and rewiring my brain that I did not need to search anymore. The big aha moment was what God made in me was enough, whether you like it or not. Dan, what I was doing, and you probably remember this because you knew me personally, and then you saw what I projected, and there was a delta there that was pretty big. Today, what you see here, we're just having the conversation. I'm not changing changing, right? And that came through years and years of therapy.

I don't know that there is... I do therapy as well. I've done a ton of it. I've had a lot of recent breakthroughs just because the pain has caused a great deal of growth, because sometimes you don't learn things until you're hurting. I don't know what led you to therapy, but I would imagine you being wanting to be liked a whole lot and then having everything fall apart in front of people. I would imagine that didn't help. Everything that was happening to you publicly with steroids. But if I could have one thing that I'm always searching for in therapy that I know will make me happier, but I always struggle with is how I can be lighter on myself, how I could be more forgiving with myself. I struggle with that because I had a father who didn't do pleasure, and I was always trying to please him. The little boy in me also didn't grow up very much because he was just trying to please a man who didn't do pleasure, and then I was never good enough. I just in my own head Sure. I'm never good enough.

Makes total sense.

Where are your breakthroughs that aren't too personal? Some of the things, I don't know what led you there. I was presumptuous.

When I got suspended in the year, I sat out the entire 2014 season, and about 15 of us got suspended. I was hoping that we all got the same suspension for around 50 games a show, and I ended up getting 162 an entire season. While I was really, really, really bummed at that time, it was a blessing in the skies because it was the first time since I was 15 years old when I walked into Westminster Christian as a rising sophomore, where Rich Hoffman looked at me and said, You're going to have a good year this year as a sophomore. Then you're going to go play in the Junior Olympic teams as a rising junior, and you're going to be the number one junior in the country. Then the next year, you're going to be the number one pick as a senior. Then I literally looked at as a pool was in my left and the baseball field was in front of me in Westminster Christian campus. I looked behind me and I go, Coach Hoffman, are you talking to me? I just got cut from Columbus where they didn't want me to play baseball.

They wanted me to play basketball.

This is the number one school in Miami. This is a powerhouse of all powerhouses. If he's telling you this, this is the amateur coach in our region who you'd most want to hear it from?

This is Duke Basketball, and this is Coach K talking to me if you're playing basketball. It meant so much to me. Again, that was five years after dad left me at the age of 10. I'm saying, Okay, if Coach When your Hoffman believes in me, like your teacher told you that you were a great writer in high school, I said, Okay, those words sound good to me. I'm going to do everything in my power from now on to make sure that you're right. That was one of the biggest breakthrough. Then the entire year, going back to the suspension of 2014, I had the entire year to actually turn the lens inward and start doing some work on me and what happened to me.

What was that like? Because you do have it there. Okay. Oh, boy. Yeah, That was hard. This is where the good stuff is, though. You're telling me you don't regret it, and I get that. I will. This is the worst pain I've known, what I'm presently in. But I know, and I felt it more and more recently, and I've never understood it until feeling it, that there is absolutely growth on the other side of pain. But most people don't choose fear and pain, and you didn't choose it. You chose the part that got you in trouble, but you didn't want it ever seen. Now the specifics, Alex, because this I felt for you here. Someone who cares this much about how he's perceived always looks great, smells great, gives off great. Now, publicly, it unravels, and now you're left with the shame of that. How long were you in this space, and how long was it before you arrived at something that felt like, I'm grateful for that?

Yeah, it took a couple of years of intense hard work. I would go to Evergreen, Colorado, where Dr. David lived. You arrive on Sunday afternoon, and Monday at 9:00 AM, you're going, and that goes Monday through Thursday, 9:00 to 5:00 PM. No lunch break, hardly a bathroom break. It's just hard core, intense working where The scar tissue was incredible. The pain was torturous. But I started getting back to a point where I started to forgive some of my actions and started liking the person in the mirror. Dr. David said something to me in the early days where we would look at each other sometimes, Dan, for three hours and I say a word to each other. It was like, Can we curse on this thing? I would say inside, I want to say him, but I'm like, Fuck off. Why do you want to know so much? Why are you It's been so tough. Honestly, in one way, Dan, when I look at my career, my mistakes probably is going to cause me the Hall of Fame. But in the other side of that, I'm a much happier human being. I am a better father.

I'm a better partner. I'm a better son and brother, and hopefully someone that can open doors for people with black and brown skin like myself. I sit on many boards where I'm the only person of color in Latin. It's my job to leave that door open and let others in and create opportunities for others.

Why did you do that therapy that intensely? Was somebody worried about you? Were you going a little bit crazy? Was it like, Alex, you need to go. This doesn't have to be like not once a week. You need to go immerse yourself and you need to be introspective. You haven't been introspective enough.

Yeah, I just knew that the mistakes I was making, I was imploding for no reason. I had hundreds of millions of dollars guaranteed to me. I didn't need to make a mistake. In my career, I probably averaged north of 40 home runs, north of 120 RBIs over 23 years. In the fence that I served an entire season, I didn't hit 45 home runs or driving I had 6 home runs, and I drove in 14 runs. It was a horrific mistake with no reason to do it. That's why I said, Okay, you know what? Not only am I destroy my baseball career and any legacy that's left of it, I'm going to screw up my life. I have two young daughters, so it sucks that I have to ruin this legacy, but I'm certainly not going to ruin my life and the ability to be a father to two young daughters that need me. I certainly don't want to be Victor Rodriguez that walked out of 10 and was not a factor in my life. I needed to save this part of my world.

You know that you're happy now because you like yourself more. How much self-loathing have you done where you don't like yourself and some of the damage you may have done in relationships because you don't know yourself well enough and because you don't know why you're doing certain things that you do?

Yeah, I think you come to a place, Dan, that you look back at the mistakes and the things you did in your 20s and early 30s, and you cringe. You're like, What the fuck am I doing? What is this? You go through so much temptation, though, Alex.

How's a boy going to get all the things that you got and not fall into all manner of holes if you're arriving at the major league as a boy?

Yeah. I think part of the therapy was unpacking all of that and searching. Then you come to a conclusion. I'm trying to be something that I'm not, and people don't like me anyways. I might as well be exactly who I am, and people are not going to like you anyways. It's one of those things that you get with age and you do get some wisdom. Then I think about my grandma who's passed now over 15, 20 years ago. All the little things she told me, you know what? She's undefeated. She's never been wrong. All these things, little things. Wisdoms. If it hasn't happened by midnight, it's probably not going to happen. Get your butt home. All these little things, it's just wisdom is incredible.

What have you learned about love in all of its forms with your family, with your children, with relationships, friendships?

I think love is It's so important. Love is patience, is key. There's no form of love, and we were talking about love and grief and missing, that can compare to the love that I feel for my daughters. Now I understand why my mother feels the way she does about me and my two siblings. But I think the biggest thing, Dan, when I wake up in the mornings now, I have two prayers. One, is to make the ego smaller and to enhance self-awareness. Those are the two things-You've really done some learning, dude. That got me in a lot of trouble. My ego was a bit out of control, and sometimes very out of control. Then my self-awareness was at zero.

But you needed ego, too. You're in a competitive world. Your ego gets fed, it gets rewarded. Ego brought you great things, but not happiness.

Right. Look, pre and post-suspension, when I think about happiness, they're completely different. Then, it was never like I mistreated people. I wasn't driving around in Ferrari and trying to be that guy, but it's just subtle things that the ego gets a little bit out of control. Before my suspension, I looked at winning as big contracts, maybe have a nice car, home runs, winning, and then there are championships. I was When I think about how winning looks post my suspension, it's being a present father, it's being a good partner, it's creating opportunities, it's paying it forward to the University of Miami and the Boys and Girls Club. But never did I think that at the age of 48, I'll be mentoring over 50 athletes. Today, Dan, we can all get to each other so quickly, whether it's through Twitter or Instagram or LinkedIn or someone that you have They'll come and they'll email you. What I'm so proud of is that there's men and women out there that are doing great things that have the confidence to reach out to me for help, just like I reached out to Magic Johnson. If it wasn't for Magic Johnson and the meeting that I had with him 25 years ago where he laid out his plan, we met for over three hours.

Nine pages of notes. Business, how he transferred and pivoted, the strategic pivot, from his Laker days with Pat Reilly in Showtime to the boardroom. If it wasn't for him showing me and the proximity to Magic, here's a man of color who had a Hall of Fame basketball career, who's now a Hall of Fame business person. I said, Boy, if Magic can do Why can't I?

Is there anything in there when you say, I win now looking back or I cringe looking back? Is there anything that flashes on you where like, Why was I such a fool? What was the matter with me? Anything in particular that you're thinking of there?

Yeah. Anything to do with that whole biogenesis mess. I remember us talking. I'm like, How the fuck did I end up in this mess? I have no one to blame but myself. But those are the subtle things that you just slip a little bit. And once you slip a little bit, then there's no coming back. I mean, that was the most painful time of my life. Humiliation, embarrassment, letting people down, starting with my mother and my daughters and my brother and my sister. I'm like, What am I doing? And you have to surround yourself with great people. You are an average of the five people you surround yourself with. As I think about my life today, my circle is so tight, and you just can't get in it. When you see the great ones, the Pat Reilly's, the Jordans, John Woodens, Coach K, whoever, they have a very, very tight circle.

Who helped you the most when you were in the most pain?

Dr. David.

How about loved ones?

My daughters, I would say Cynthia, who is the mother of my kids. We were together for 13 years. I was married to her for five. Cynthia has a background in psychology, has a master's in it. She's still my greatest friend and biggest supporter, and I am hers.

I always thought you guys had a super supportive relationship in and out of. I can't even imagine the stress test that that whole experience was for her as she knew you when. She knew you before all the child. In fact, as I recall, and forgive me if I'm overstepping here because I don't know what the relationship was, but I do feel like she was taking care of you in a lot of ways. Just that you were not yet grown up. You had to concentrate on being great. She was just, from afar, super supportive of what it is you were building.

It was funny because we were together in our early 20s, and just looking back at now, we're way better friends than we were a married couple. I wouldn't say it was anything really bad that happened. It just we were better friends, and we made a decision to be co-parents and good friends and give an opportunity for us to meet somebody else. Now she's met an incredible guy, Angel, also Dominican. They have a young daughter, Cami, who's seven. We're all like the braided bunch. We travel together, we spend holidays together, and it's just a beautiful thing. I wish other broken couples that are co-parents can have this type of cohesiveness. Then when I look at my life, it's like an oxymoron. There's so many things that I've done poorly. Then there's other things that I look at with my relationship with the community, giving back to the Boys and Girls Club, University of Miami. I've been on that board when Donna Shalela put me there almost 20 years ago. The father that I am today is just weird and is strange. It's a lot to unpack.

You also don't want to be the dad you had, right?

No, that was my number one motivation. Sometimes, the best example is seeing someone that you want to do exact opposite of what he's done.

Because of the damage you know was done there? But what do you think of when you think of, I don't want to be those things? Beyond being present or not getting the 24 beers and two packs of cigarettes a day, what are the things that you're proudest of making sure, I am not going to be that because that If he left scars on me. I would not want to leave on anybody.

I would say there was a few things that my dad did well that I learned from. I mean, we do have commonalities around baseball and business. He was really good with numbers. He always wore a suit and tie to sell shoes. I see myself with some of the characteristics that I admired about him. But I'm now convinced at the age of 48, father of two daughters, one who's freshman in the musical theater program at the University of Michigan, who's thrilled to be there, and my sophomore, Ella, who's at Gulliver. I'm not sure, Dan, and I'm going to present the question back to you, is I am now convinced that it is almost impossible to maximize your potential as a human being without a present father and without intense therapy because I was lost without one, and I found my way with Dr. David. What are your thoughts there?

I mean, that's super interesting. I turned my boss into father figures, trying to get the, how do I please this person? I would say it's part of why it is that I became successful because I was trying to reach a bar that was never going to be reached with my father in a way that was going to feel like pleasure to me, and so I would try to please bosses. But my father was sumamente present, but my mother was propping up my father. My father went to work and came home, and she propped up the idea of, We have this figure in our house who is the one to be followed, because that's pretty Latin. It's pretty stereotypically Latin. She helped create for me something to try and please, but what led me to therapy. This one was a bit of a mind bleep. My father, over the years, has had a couple of Just a couple of things that have happened, one of which many years ago, this is the first time I ended up in therapy. My father had a breakdown, and when he was on a cruise, I'll tell you when he had the breakdown.

He has the breakdown. He loses his job at 57. In his past, he was rejected by his own mother. The losing of the job comes in at 57. Work is all that matters in our lives comes in one day, and all of the stuff that was on his desk is in a garbage can. You're done. Whatever your identity is or was, out of here. He has a breakdown. We're going to visit him at a place where there are human beings clucking like chickens and stuff. As we get there, my mother passes out in his arms, and at Right then, me as a Hispanic, I'm going to say, boy, but I was early 30s, but I'm not grown up yet. I'm like, Oh, I got to go look at some things. I haven't grown up. Both of those things were helpful to me, but I didn't get to those places. I had to do all sorts of things before I got there, and I had to be pushed into it. I don't know if I would have ever chosen therapy on my own, if I was just skipping through life blissfully ignorant. I don't know if you would have chosen it if you'd simply kept hitting home runs and there was no shame, and you might not have ever gotten to happier.

You might have gotten to the Hall of Fame with nobody knowing anything about anything, but the learning would have been lost in it because I don't know that you would have... I don't know how many people choose betterment just for the hell of it when they've already arrived at what they think success looks like.

No, that's good. I mean, that's why one of my favorite books is Good as the enemy of great. From Good to Great. From from good to great. The first line in the book is Good as the enemy of great. I do believe that. I think the irony about therapy is that when you have an inflated ego and you have a very little self-awareness, you have what is called the blind spot. The blind spot does not allow you to think that you actually need help because the ego is just like the sun, it's too bright on you. When you don't have self-awareness, you have very little vision, this peripheral that can help you. That's why you need really great people around you to say, Hey, buddy, you know what? You do need help. When I think about as a kid, I believe that you're a byproduct of some of the things that you have, and you're a byproduct of some of the things you lack. As an example, my dad left at the age of 10. Therefore, for whatever reason, I gravitated to powerful men that were older. From age 10 to 25, I had three coaches, which is crazy.

I had Gael, Eddie Rodriguez, the Boys and Girls Club. He's been there now for over 40 years. All the players, Tartuffe, they all went through there, Pomero, Conceico. Then he handed me over at 15 to Coach Hoffman. Then Coach Hoffman handed me to Lou Panela to the age of my wife until I left for Texas. Then in the business community, I've had mentors like Magic Johnson, and Pat Reilly and Warren Buffet. But that's always been a common theme for me to have this really good people to help me educate.

If I were to ask you, when and how do the girls, your daughters, move you the most? What are the instances in which Aarod will be made a blubbering mess because he's just filled with love and gratitude because that Because his daughters give him the greatest feelings known to man, that are the closest thing to God someone can feel on earth if one doesn't believe in God.

Well, I think I do believe in God. Even though I'm not very religious, I'm spiritual, and I always keep that private with my own involvement. I think my daughters, just when I see them, even though they grew up much differently than I grew up, obviously, with a lot of blessings, that both their feet are grounded, that we've done this thing that we started in COVID called our Breakfast Club on Sundays, which is from 8:30 to 10:00, 90 minutes, no phones, no iPads, just old-school conversation. Same thing at dinner every night, one conversation, and practicing listening, empathy, compassion, listening more than you talk. Then obviously, anything that they accomplish, not so much on... But just the way you treat people and the way they comport themselves. To me, that's when I... I'm for sure I'm the proudest. I can't even think about it. My daughter just graduated from ransom last year, and it was a hot mess. Then I dropped her off then in Ann Arbor, and I'm dropping her off in her dorm room. Now, remember, I never went to college, and I'm helping her pack.

And have insecurities about never gone to college. Now, the daughter you raised, the daughter fucked up Alex raised, is now walking into Ann Arbor, one of the greatest colleges and institutions, musical theater program.

Dan, I've never done laundry in my life. I'm in the dorm room, folding things, putting it in the washing machine, which I'm ashamed to say I've never done that or dryer. It was just so much fun. I posted it on Instagram and had a lot of fun with it. Then I have Ella, which makes me think, boy, I only have three years before she goes out into the world. She already thinks dad is very, very uncool and not funny. When they used to think dad was funny all my jokes with land, they don't even look up at me anymore.

What was it like? I had this conversation with Marcellus Wiley recently about how he looked into the eyes of his children and he thought he could be better for them. You mentioned something about whatever the shame felt like around your family. What was happening there with them that Daddy's fallen apart? Daddy feels terrible because he's brought shame upon... He's brought shame.

Yeah. I mean, one of the days that it really hit me, Dan, is we were at the time living in Miami Beach in Lagos Island, and the suspension just went public.

Five dollars, that's something. Five dollar fine. Four? That's $10. That coughing in the microphone. We have a fine. Oh, yeah. We have a fine. I don't know if you still carry cash or not, or everything's caught.

I don't, but I'm used to fines, so I can pay it. I'll laugh. The couple of days before, they had just announced my suspension for 162 games. It was myself, my two daughters, and Denise, who helped me I raised my daughters and Cynthia as our nanny for 15 years. She's an incredible woman. She's part of our family from Jamaica. Denden, we call her. I remember waking up before them, I was having a little coffee, and I usually have the New York Times, the Hérald, Post, Wall Street Journal. I have all the papers set up at my breakfast table. Then TV, I usually watch CNBC. All of a sudden, I look at all the papers, and every one of them, not in the back page, I'm on the front page. Ava suspended for 162. What an embarrassment. He's a pariah. Everything you can mention. I said, Denden, put these things away. Throw them away before the girls get up. Then I said, Let's just put on the TV. Cnbc was talking about I said, Change that. At the time, it was Matt Lauer, and it was Charlie Rose, and it was all these guys are not on TV anymore.

They're talking about it. I said, Well, turn that off, too. I would go wake them up, and I was like, Holy smokes. Had to turn off the TV, put all the papers away. Then I realized that I needed to be forthright with them, appropriate for their age, obviously. I remember sitting down in my office and coming clean and just saying, Daddy made a mistake. When you make mistakes, there's consequences. I'm serving the longest suspension in Major League Baseball history for PEDUs. Cynthia was with me, and I said, Cynthia, I'm going to probably break down somewhere in the third ending of this conversation. Do you mind if I hand it over to you and then I'll close? That was going to be Mariano, right? The start and the closer. I needed the middle ending. Sure enough, in the bottom of the I started breaking down, Cynthia takes over. I said, Cynthia, they're going to be listening to me, but they're going to be looking at you. We need to be aligned here because I need your help. I need your support here. The reason why I found Dan that was so important, and this came from Dr.

David, he said, You've been bullshitting your whole life, and you have to stop that cycle. You have to be forthright with your daughters. That's really important. I think if you do that right today, as a result, later on, when it's time for them to be honest with you, hopefully, they can reciprocate. It was a tough moment, and I'm so happy that I did it.

Bullshitted your entire life, how? Bullshitting yourself?

No, I just surrounded in a house where nobody told me the truth. Part of it was because they probably didn't want to put the weight on me that we didn't have the rent money that was due in three days or that my father wasn't the hero that I thought he was or my brother and sister probably faking it till they made it. It was a short-term fix, but I don't think it's sustainable for the health, the mental health, the development of a young person. In this case, my two daughters, I thought through Dr. David's help that I've been extremely honest with them, even through the toughest moments in the darkest hours.

I will move on to other subject matter, but is there a feeling that you think of that represents Rock Bottom more than that one? Because you painted a pretty vivid picture of running around your house trying to hide things from your children. Is there anything that you look at in there that compares to that? The reason I ask you the question about what rock bottom looks like is because I want to also talk about what the ascent looks like and the other things learned in there. Because if the gift is that you're happier and you love yourself more and you're self-confident, then you'd almost go back and choose it if you can do it in some ways. If you're grateful for it. You know what I mean? If there's no other way to learn some of the things that needed to be learned other than suffering the maximum pain, they're worth learning.

Yeah. I I don't think, Dan, I would draw it up this way. It's been nine, almost 10 years since my suspension, but I think a decade removed from that and all the work that I did A little before that, and to this day with my therapy, I think I've done a pretty decent job of learning some very painful lessons and then applying them over the last 10 years I'm very, very proud of that. I'm also proud of how I fathered my girls, my relationship with Cynthia. I have an incredible partner in my life who we've been dating for over a year now. Her name is Jack. She's a former nurse and is now in the world of health and wellness. She has two daughters. We have over 500 people that work at A Rod Corp, own a professional NBA team. I'm living the American dream, Dan. I come from the very bottom and it's just remarkable. And I really think that none of this happens without me falling on my face and having those dark days.

It's a hell of a strategic pivot, though, because there aren't a lot of stories in the history of American media or athletics where you can go from famous to infamous to then you're still employable and you're still someone that people want to be associated that the pariah stuff is temporary, that it fades.

Well, I think it's a lesson for, hopefully, a lot of people that are listening, that you don't have to be defined by your biggest mistakes. I mean, how you come back matters, too. I would actually say how you come back is most important, and not to give up. I mean, you're talking about a guy that... We talked about the resiliency of a guy like Pat Reilly. I'm a pretty resilient guy, too, and pretty gritty. But I got to tell you, in my darker hour, there were many times that I thought about tapping out. Oh, really? And giving up, and giving up. And I never thought the word give up would be anywhere near synonymous with me. But it was dark, and I was ashamed, and I felt that the only thing that mattered in my life growing up was to be a Major League baseball player and be part of this incredible institution. To think I was pariah 101 to the league, it was heartbreaking. I was confused in how I got myself there. But what was most important is that I took full accountability and have no one to blame but myself.

What do you regard in your baseball career as the happiest time? The best year, the best six months, the time that you were? Because it doesn't sound like any one of those years might be as happy as your best year now if you're slogging through it, trying to figure what happy looks like.

Yeah, I think I would say two. I would say when I got the call from George Steinbrenner that he wanted me to join his Yankee team and to come team up with Derek Jeter, Agreen very quickly that I would move in the prime of my career.

As the better shortstop.

Why? Just one thing- I'm saying that for you.

You don't have to say, but you were the better shortstop by the metrics, and you moved to third base. You went to third base because he's the captain, and it was his team.

I think Derek would be the first one to tell you that if he came to Texas, he would have moved to third. Respect is something that I believe in. I gave him my word that I was going to play third base and third base only. I just said, made it very clear. I said, If there's ever a conversation about me going back to Shortstop, I'm going to go back to Texas because I wanted to honor Derek, and I didn't want any drama around the position. I went over and worked really hard at third base and became a suitable third baseman. I think George calling me over, Steinbrunner. Then obviously, 2009, bringing the World Championship back to New York for the 27th World Championship in one of the most franchises.

After struggling in postseason, in pressurized postseason. Sure. After year after year, you're one of the best players in baseball, and now people are accusing you of mental frailty because baseball is hard, and sometimes people hit 200 in a 14-game sample.

Dan, I don't see it that way. Again, this is where I think having some space from that time. The truth is, when you're one of the best hitters in in the lineup, you get circled, and they come at you with everything they have. Sometimes the best thing you can do in the World Series, I think Gary Sheffield did a nice job of this, and Barry Bonds did, too, you got to just take your walks. Once I realized that it wasn't about me and it was about we, and it wasn't about what my stats were, but I would literally drive to every playoff game with Andy Pettit because he was my neighbor in Westchester. He would help me out, and he was this time a four-time World champion. He pitched game 6, which was a game 6 that we won. He pitched great game and handed the bottom of Mariano against the Philly's, and Victorino made the last out, Grombada Kano, Titek Shera, the Yankees, a World Champ for the 27th time, as Joe Buck said. It was incredible because it was like a master class from one of the greatest champions that I've ever met in Andy Pettit, where he would talk to me about hitting, pitch selection, what the opposition was thinking as they were facing me.

Then I would reverse it, and he would ask me, Okay, what do I have to do to beat the Angels, to beat the twins, and ultimately to beat the Phillies. And Dan, it was some of the most enjoyable hour conversations, driving to the ballpark, no phones, just old-school conversations. And he really helped me become a champion.

What do you regard as the most honest, accurate appraisal that you can make of the relationship with Derek Jeter? It's a long time. It's complicated. I don't know what can be known or what can't be known. But when I ask you honest and accurate that can be said publicly, what happened there?

Well, I would just say that right now we're in a great place. He asked me to go to dinner about a year ago, almost today, when his documentary came out, and we went to have drinks right near our home in South Miami. We sat down for a couple of hours and had some drinks and talked about a lot of great things. But our history is rich and goes back a long time. We met when I was 16, and he was 17. We met at Mark Light Stadium, and he had signed with the University of Michigan. I had signed with the University of Miami, so we had a lot of commonalities. That's where his agent, Casey Close, who still his agent, was trying to talk to me before I chose Scott Boris. In that 30-plus year history, we've had some ups and we've had some downs. I think the media was obsessed with our relationship in New York. It was a very meaty story in negativity cells and big names sell, and the Yankees sell, and the controversy around the position sells. It was a mega media story. He did a nice job of super disciplined.

I wasn't as disciplined. It created some noise. But through it all, what I remember is great player he was, good teammate. We won a Championship together, and now we're teammates again at Fox doing playoffs and World Series every year.

Were you at all surprised that that phone call came, that he wanted to just have dinner and drinks? Is it something that's unusual, or is it Because this plays out publicly. There's so much vanity. There's so much insecurity. I don't even know if you're a documentary. Well, if he's got a documentary, I got to have a documentary because I had a pretty good career, too. I don't know how much competition there is between you, and I don't know what your issues are with the media. I'm curious what you think is the worst thing about sports media because we can be parasitic.

Yeah. I think his documentary was fun. It was good to watch. But in many ways, Up and to the right, there was a lot of celebration. Mine is going to be a lot of volatility, so completely different.

More interesting. No, no, no. No. No.

No.

Volatility, for sure. I'm saying more interesting. If negativity sells, I'm going to say, if volatility is better than just up and to the right all the time.

Well, yeah. I think it's interesting. When I was at my first couple of years at Fox, then I got a much better understanding how the media works. In '15 and '16, I was still playing while I was with Fox. I said, Holy smokes. I wish, and this is an advice that I would give to all athletes that are listening, especially the young ones, I wish I would have done a media internship with Fox for a couple of years when I was in high school to then reverse engineer and understand how the media works. I played because I was an infant when it came to dealing with the I just came out of Westminster Christian. A few months later, after my high school prom, I was at Fenway Park as an 18-year-old when I should have been a freshman at the University of Miami playing quarterback and shortstop. I was facing Roger Clemens completely over my skis. My knees were shaken. It was the first time I saw an upper deck. We had 400 people at Westminster max, right? It was a lot of growth. It was like turbocharge, and I just was not ready for that.

I don't know if any 18-year-old could be ready for Maybe LeBron. I mean, he did a great job. Kobe, these are all guys that I'm friends with. Tiger Woods came out early. But I think all of us that came out early, there is one common theme. We had some ups and we had some downs.

What came with money that you weren't expecting?

Freedom, eyeballs, jealousy, anxiety. Bill?

Why anxiety?

Why anxiety? Because, again, from the age of 10 to 17, when I became a millionaire and the Mariners made me the number one pick in the country, and my mother and my sister, Susie, negotiated a $1.35 million contract. I didn't have lessons in life on how to distribute, how to help out my family, who gets what, what to save, what to spend, what to invest in. This is a new territory for me. I was training to be a baseball player, and I was barely keeping up with that. If you think about it, most people, if they're lucky enough to make a million dollars, usually it happens with a college degree, after marriage, kids, maturity, and usually you're in the other side of 40. Here I am at 17 with, Here's a million dollars, here's fame, here's expectations, and then you got to go deal with it.

Jealousy, what did that bring? What does that look like? What is happening that is making you feel that jealousy goes before anxiety on something that money brought?

I just think the higher you go on the flag poll, the more people are taking a look at your back-end. There's more chatter, there's more conversation. You have to be careful, spend a little bit more low-key. Things that you're not prepped for it. You saw it. You came to be a star very early on, and you have a much different perspective today than when you were in your-Oh, I didn't know anything.

No, I didn't know. I didn't know anything.

We're going and learning at the same time, right? We're trying to do the best we can.

Generally, we're good people. But and what you're doing, though, requires your obsessive compulsive attention in a way that so lopsided that other parts of you atrophy. I don't even know how functioning and balanced a human being you can be and great at sports the way that it took as much work as it did to be as great as you were at that sport.

A hundred %. I mean, the obsession has to be off the charts. Usually, when you look at the great ones that have done great things, you have to be obsessive. You have to work on it 24/7. You're thinking about it. It affects your sleep. You got to wake up and work out. You got to keep producing. It's just this whole thing about work balance. I've never seen one at the highest level be really good at that, too. Maybe that comes later on in life, but I remember my conversation with Kobe conversation with Tiger, Jordan, Magic, LeBron. We've all had this drive that in many ways is probably not the healthiest approach.

Warren Buffett, or does he have something? I mean, he's older, so does he have something that more resembles balance? Has he arrived at something that's different than that?

Warren Buffett is the most obsessive and most focused smartest and simple thinker that I've ever met. He's a perfect example with Warren Buffett. He's a perfect example of the most obsessive, relentless, focused, unwavered delivering conviction to what he wanted to do. His father would drop him off when he lived in Omaha as a young child. By the age of 11, he would drop him off every Saturday and Sunday in the library. He would spend all day there. And when Warren read every financial book in the library by the age of 11, made his first investment around the age of 12, and has been obsessed ever since. And you do this, and Warren does this, I believe he's the greatest, smartest financial mind alive. He's in his 90s. He still goes to work five days a week. He said, My only adjustment, I used to read nine hours a day. Now I'm able to read three to four hours. Now he studies a lot on YouTube. But he's kept it simple, and he's kept it simple. That's exactly what Jordan and others have done in their space.

I'm going to let you go in a moment here. I have a gift for you. I have had Metalark Media spare no expense in this gift that I'm to give you. But I know because it's important to you to pass along your wisdoms, I asked you if there was anything that you wanted to make sure that people knew about and that you were promoting, and I was surprised to hear that gum disease. I thought that there were 500 employees, A-Rod Corp. I thought it would be something else, but you wanted to talk about gum disease because you want people to know something perhaps that you didn't know that you now know?

Yeah, this is crazy. First of all, I'm so proud to partner up with Aura Pharma. We've been partners now for over a year. In one of my visits to the dentists, I found out I had gum disease. Of course, the first thing you think is like, Oh, my God, gum disease. It sounds terrible. The good news, I caught it early and it's treatable. Then I started digging in and finding out that over 65 million Americans have gum disease. Then I realized that it's even more prevalent in our communities, Black and Brown communities.

Where are you advising people to go beyond their local dentist to get help here and information?

Well, you can go to arestaind. Com for more information.

Arestaind. Correct.

Com, and go see your local doctor.

You have perfect tea. I mean, your smile. You get away with a lot on television because you have that smile and it's curly, and everybody loves looking at Aarod. Let me not waste any more of your time here. I do appreciate, as always, that you made the time. I have not seen this gif, so I'm going to now know this for the first time. Let's see what they've gotten us here. Come on, man. This doesn't look anything like him. This doesn't look anything like him. Here you go. Oh, my gosh. This is the It's ridiculous.

I mean, first of all, I wish I had that body. And second, I wish I was so handsome. That looks nothing like in a face.

It could not look any less like you. But it is rumored and reported that you had one of these like By the way, let me say that.

This is actually really funny because you don't know how many times in my career I had to answer that I had something like this above my bed. It's so infamous as a story, and I almost don't deny it anymore, but I think it's actually funny.

You can now have it over your bed.

Now I can make it a reality.

Alex, it really has been a joy to watch your growth almost as much as it has been to watch your play. It's very cool to see you feeling this confident, this confident for real. I don't want to ask you whether you care what others think anymore, but it seems like you're caring a hell of a lot less what others think.

Thank you. I think even more important than confidence, I think I'm in a happy place, and I'm content where my life is, and really excited to continue to give back and continue to help people in need. That's really one of my greatest passions, and continue to talk about financial literacy across, especially our community and minority communities that need a lot of help.Thank.

You, buddy.Thank you.

Proud of you as well.