Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is the Ramsey Show. It's where we help you win in your life, specifically win with your money, winning in your work, and winning in your relationships. The phone number for you to get coached up today is 888-825. I'm Ken Coleman, our Ramsey personality, and I'm joined by another Ramsey personality, the fabulous Jade Warshaw, joins me this hour. Together, we are going to help you. Jade is our money expert. I'll chime in if she decides to let me, maybe, Rachel, yesterday, let me say a few things. It's always exciting. I'm the work guy. In other words, when David said for decades that your income is your greatest Wealth Building tool. I want to help you win at work. When you're winning at work, you're making more money. When you're making more money, we get through the baby steps faster and live the life we want to live. How can I help in those areas? We team up. Jade weighs in on that as well. Let's get to it. Melanie is going to start us off in the Big Apple, New York City. Melanie, how can we help today?

Hi. Thank you guys all for that you do. Sorry, I'm really nervous. You're doing great. I'm listening to the show every day for the past six months, and I've paid off $10,000 in debt, cut off all the cards, sold stuff, do my side hustle, work over time. I check the Every Dollar app every day. I'm on track to being debt-free by 30th birthday this August, which is a huge goal and accomplishment for me.

That's awesome.

I do have a paid-off Jeep that I've driven to the ground for the past 11 years.

I've already put $2,000 into repairs since I started being Ramsey this October.

The entire bottom carriage is rotting and the oil is leaking into the engine, which would cost thousands of dollars to fix, and it still wouldn't be guaranteed that more issues wouldn't come up. I'm still gung-ho with the baby steps, preach them to my friends and family, but now I'm faced with the decision to continue dumping money into the theater or taking out a car loan on a new to me car that will last me another 10 years.

No, not car loan.

No, no.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, are to keep the Jeep or to temporarily pause the baby steps, stack up some cash, and buy yourself a junker in cash. That's your options, right?

Those are definitely options that I keep on ruminating, but just logically and realistically to go from this beater that I've already put so much money into to then going into another beater just logically and realistically doesn't make sense to Where do you live? I live in North Jersey.

North Jersey. How far do you commute every day?

My commute's not far, but I do need a car to get around.

I just asked you, how far is your commute?

It's a five-minute commute.

Wait a sec. Okay. Okay.

I would like to throw that option back to Jade. That's a legit option. Yes.

Here's the thing. I want you to see where I'm coming Where I'm coming from, eliminating the option of debt is I'm simply trying to honor all of the work that you just laid out that you've done. You laid out beautifully all the sacrifice you've made, how diligent you've been, how much you've done in order to get yourself to the place you are now. I want to honor that by not saying yes to you going back into debt. That's where I'm coming from. Now, here's the thing. All vehicles are not created equal. You may have had a lemon before. That doesn't your next car is going to be a lemon. I've only drive used cars with 100,000 plus miles on them. I think, I mean, recently, I haven't had any Lemons. I don't want you to think that just because your car has now gotten too old to keep that if you were to buy another used car in cash, that it would automatically be in that same frame of vehicle. Does that make sense? I get it. It can be easy to think that, but it's simply not the case. So your Jeep right now, is it a Jeep Liberty, Jeep Wrangler?

What car is it? Because I used to have a Jeep Liberty, and that's not the car that you want to go the difference. It's a Liberty. I'm just going to be honest. That car has a lot of special features. That's not the car that you want to go the distance. I'm looking for, give me a Honda Civic. You know what I'm saying?

What's your locale? I'm going to pull up while she's talking. I'm going to pull up some used cars. I'm going to help you out. What would I put in? Used cars for sale under 5,000 in?

Wayne.

Wayne, New Jersey?

Yeah. Wayne, New Jersey. We're going to help you look. This is Ken's specialty. But truly, we need a Nissan, we need a Honda. We need one of those brands. Those are the brands that are going to go the distance with mileage. The Jeep, unless it's a Wrangler, it's probably not going to cut it.

First of all, I'm not knocking Jeep. They should never buy a high miles Jeep.

They do not have a good record. That's what I'm saying. That's not the one. Of course.

My struggle, and I've also thought about this, of getting a $5,000 beater or whatever, I would still have to take a personal loan, and that would be at a much higher interest rate as opposed to taking out a car loan for- No, you don't.

Why do you feel like you have to take out a loan? Let's go through the numbers right quick. You said you're going to be debt-free by August. How much margin are you putting every single month onto your debt?

A thousand or more every month.

Closer to 2,000 or closer to 1,500?

1,500. Okay.

If you're putting 1,500, what would it look like if we said, Okay, this is an emergency. We're going to go in and we're going to save two months. We're going to temporarily pause the baby steps for three months and do 15,000, and then another 15,000, and we're going to put 4,500 onto this next car? What would that look like? And then you don't owe anybody anything. You're just buying a four... You're driving a $4,500 car temporarily until you pay off your debt. That pushes your debt date from August, September, to up to November or December. And that's just part of it. I don't want you to view that as some a failure or some a loss. These are the things that are part of walking the baby steps that most people encounter at some point. And it's not a negative step backwards. This is part of it. I mean, I did that. We had to stop and buy another vehicle. It's funny because we had a Jeep Liberty, and that thing just didn't keep going for us.

I'm just going to give you three options here, Melanie, real quick, because by the way- I can't hear you guys anymore. What's that?

Did you say you can't hear us anymore? Did we lose her?

I think she said, I can't talk to you.

I can't hear you guys anymore. No, she said she can't hear us. Okay. Melanie, can you hear us? We're going to have the guys in the booth are going to fix us. Hello, Melody.

Nothing. That's a shame.

Well, let's see if they can- While we're waiting, let me just pay this off, okay?

That Jade, you're right. I punched in on cars. Com, just one of the services. We got a 2012 Nissan Versa. I'm going to put her on hold until we figure it out. We got a 2012 Nissan Versa for $4,999. If you walk in with cash, I'll guarantee you can walk out of there with maybe get 3,800 on that. If I walked in with cash.

I don't think so, Ken. Cash doesn't do what it used to do. Why?

Why are you got to disagree with me?

I'm just saying they want you to finance. I don't want to give her out of- She's got cash.

She's got cash, so $4,999. All right. We got a Buick Lucerne, $4,900. We've got a Pontiac G6 for $4,400. All these less than 120,000 miles. Go with that, Nissan. My point is, it's doable, and she could walk for two or three months By the way, five minutes. Come on. Where there's a will, there's a way. This is The Ramsey Show. Here's a quick math refresher.

There are only 24 hours in a day, so your business needs to streamline tasks that are time-suckers and focus on activities that make money.

To reduce headaches as they scale, smart businesses use NetSuite by Oracle, the number one cloud financial system.

Netsuite helps you improve efficiency by bringing all your major business processes into one platform.

Join the more than 37,000 smart businesses like Ramsey Solutions that have done the math and graduated to NetSuite. Right now, you can download NetSuite's KPI checklist absolutely free at netsuite.

Com/ramsey.

That's netsuite.

Com/ramsey.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. So excited that you are with us. I'm Ken Colman. Jade Warshaw joins me. We are here for you. 828-825-5225. 828-825-5225. They want me to talk about the new book, and it is available for presale. It's called Find the Work You're Wired to do. It has an assessment with it, the get clear assessment. Both of these tools work together. What does the assessment do? The assessment... Oh, it's right there on the screen. There you go. I don't have to do that. I don't have to show anybody. The assessment helps me answer the question, who am I and what could I do? And then the book with it helps me figure out where I can do it and how. So these are important questions. Who am I? What do I want to do? Where can I do it? And how do I get there? And so the book takes about 45 minutes to read. It's a companion to the assessment results to have a professional purpose statement. So this is about self-awareness, which gives you confidence to do the thing you're wired to do, and that's where you have the chance to make the most money.

So you can pre-order it right now, ramsbysolutions. Com/store. I'm excited because when you pre-order it, we're not giving you a bunch of other stuff. You're going to get the e-book with an assessment code, you're going to get the audio book with an assessment code, and the hard copy with an assessment code. So three books, three codes, all one price. I think it's too good a deal, but I'm not in charge. I Just do what they say. It's called Find the Work You're Wired to Do. This is if you want to max out your income. You can get it now. It comes out May seventh. You can pre-order it now wherever books are sold or ramseysolutions. Com/store. All right, to Salt Lake City, Utah, is where we're going next. Carson joins us. Carson, how can we help today?

Hi. I am a young realtor, and I was just curious on how do I make the most of my money to prepare me for my future?

How do you make the most of your money?

Yes. To prepare me for my future.

All right. Jade, take it away.

I think the crux of that is always going to start with the budget. Are you a budgeter? Do you have a budget? Yes. Okay. Are you using an every dollar budget?

I am not currently, but I am about to get it.

Okay, I would. Matter of fact, we won't let you leave this call until you get it. With Every Dollar Budget is great. It helps you create daily habits, which is a big part of budgeting. A lot of people set their budget and then forget about it. It's like, Well, I did my budget for the year, Ken. They're not thinking about the fact that every month holds something different. Your goals are constantly changing. You're accomplishing goals. It's time to move on to the next. Every dollar will help you with that. That's thing one is the budget. Thing two is the way you make the most of your money is you know where you're going with your money. You have a clear direction. And so the next point would be, Okay, well, let's look at what our goals are. Where are we currently in this moment and where do we to get to. Let's talk a little bit about that. Tell us a little bit about your finances. Do you have debt? Are you trying to buy a house? Tell us what you're trying to accomplish.

I'm debt-free, and I've just been trying to save up for a home in the future and any of my business expenses.

Okay. First off, we want to keep the business expenses a little bit separate from the personal expenses. I would always advise that if you're doing your small business or you're contracting in that way. Do you have any money saved?

Yes, I do. How much? I have a few thousand.

Like, 2000 or 8000?

2000. Okay. Just for personal savings. But then I have 5,000 set aside for an emergency fund.

Okay. So we've got $7,000 saved. Would you call that three or six months, or how many months of expenses is that for you?

Six months. Okay.

Let's group all that together. The way we would teach it is we save three to six months of expenses, and that is our emergency fund. We only touch it if there's an emergency. Tickets to Taylor Swift would not be considered an emergency.

Quick question. $7,000 equals six months of your expenses, Carson?

Yes, because I'm just a young kid. So it's just for me- How old are you? I just turned 19 the other day.

Okay, you're living at home? Yes. Okay. All right.

Just getting started.

I was like, Okay, I want to make sure I understand the full range of this phone call. Okay, so you're starting out. Okay, very good. I'm sorry, Jade.

No, keep digging. This is gold, Ken.

Yeah. Well, you're going to explain the baby steps and all that you have and the investing part of this. But you stepping out early on and learning the power of investing. I know you love your investment calculator. I know you love to demo that. I do. I think you need to set him free and show him what it could be. Because as a real estate professional, how much have you made so far as a real estate agent?

I'm about to make clothes on my first deal.

Very good. Very good. Very first home. What do you stand to make on that house?

It should be upwards in probably 20,000 to 50,000 because I sell ranches.

Come on, Carson.

That's awesome.

Come on, man. That's awesome stuff.

Okay, so 19 years old.

So now play with that number, Jade.

All right, listen. 20 to 50. I'm going to dig a little bit because I want to know more. So you start doing real estate. You closed your first deal. Was this like you went out and grinded and you got the offer? Was this family that was like, Hey, we're selling this land. Let's use cousin because he's trying to start out. Tell us more about this deal and tell us if you feel like you've got a lot of irons in the fire.

This is just from my broker mentoring me and helping me. I was just able to hop in it and just had a burning desire and just went and grinded to find some deals, and they helped me along the way.

That's awesome. With any type of profession that's got the irregular income, it is important, A, that on the business side of things, that you're keeping that money separate, you're making sure that your business has savings, you're making sure that you personally have savings, and figuring out early on, Okay, what does it cost me to do business on a monthly basis? What does it It costs me to advertise, to print out flyers, to drive people around town? All of those things. I want you to start keeping track of what it costs you because those are your business expenses, and you need to keep some of that money in your business in order to make it run. Then on the other side, you can start looking at, Okay, how much of this do I get to pay myself? How much am I keeping? Because it is a regular, I love having almost... Aside from your 3-6 months, I love in an irregular income just having almost an extra month's worth. It's almost like you're a month ahead all the time.

Yeah, I agree with that. I agree. I would start investing now. Let's say that he makes 40,000. Let's split the difference. You said between 20 and 50. Let's call it 35,000, Jade.

Okay.

Walking through, based on what you just said, what he would do, a sample, if he clears 35,000.

Okay, so let's say you clear 35,000. Let's say that you are taking out your taxes, so you need to make sure that you're estimating your quarterly amounts. And so what I would say is 25 to 30% of what you make always set it aside for taxes. So that's thing one. Then after that, you can look at it and go, Okay, what am I paying myself out of this? Let's say you pay yourself 15,000, right? And now you're going, Okay, I need to invest 15% of my income. That's your income. Investing 15%, you can work with one of our smart investor pros, but essentially, that's what you're doing. If you don't have, Carson, set up where you can invest, whether it's you could start with a Roth IRA, but eventually you're going to want to do something through your business, whether it's a CEP or a simple 401k, something like that, where you're able to really take advantage of all that you could be contributing on a yearly basis, just as if you worked for a company that was offering you a retirement plan. That's what we're looking to do. That's what Ken is getting at.

Every time you sell a house, every time you get paid, you are taking out your quarterly estimates because you're an independent contractor, you're paying yourself, and then you're paying 15%, you're contributing 15% to investing. And that's the step you're in. If you ever get to the point where you say, You know what? I am ready to move out on my own. I'm ready to purchase a property of my own, and it's time for me to save for a down payment. Then if you wanted to, you could pause that 15% that you're investing and put all of your financial efforts to saving your down payment, especially if you think that it's going to take you more than... If We can do it quickly. If it's going to take you more than two years, I probably wouldn't pause it. But that's what we're looking at. He's got a lot to focus on. It's very exciting.

19 closing on his first ranch. I got to tell you, I like this ranch business. That could get really good if you look at his growth over the next 10, 15 years, money he's going to be able to make. Great job. Thank you so much, Carson, for the call. We're excited about your future. All right, we're going to take a quick break, but we'll be right back. She's Jade Warshaw. I'm Ken This is The Ramsey Show. This episode is sponsored by Better Health. Hey, if you're like me at this time of the year, all of the school plays and meetings and invites from everywhere have completely drained your social battery. Or maybe you're like some of my friends who are bursting with energy so much that everyone may be telling you to just chill out a little. If you're having trouble navigating mismatched energy levels, boundaries, or finding people to do life with, it might be time to talk to a therapist. Therapy can be a place to open up with someone who's been trained to listen and walk alongside you and help you find paths through the chaos of mismatched energy levels and more.

If you're thinking of starting therapy, try Betterhelp. Betterhelp is completely online and flexible enough to fit your schedule. Just fill out a short questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapist at any time for no extra cost. Find your social sweet spot with Betterhelp. Visit betterhelp. Com/delonie today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P. Com/delonie. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is with me, and we are here for you, 888-825-5225, taking your money questions and your work-related questions. You're a professional. If you're not winning or you're looking to maybe switch gears, start something, take those questions as well today. All right, Jennifer is going to join us now in Trenton, New Jersey. Jennifer, how can we help?

Hi, David. Hi, Ken. My husband and I are in disagreement about the 15 versus 30-year mortgage. He feels that if we just throw the same amount at it, then 30 years is fine, but it's even not obligated by that higher payment because it is a higher payment for less amount of time. I'm all Ramsey and let's go, 15.

How long has this discussion been happening?

Well, probably at least a month. We're looking at buying a new home. We currently are in a home, and we're going to sell it and then purchase a new home. That's where the talk has come from because I'm just like, I really just want to bang it out as quick as possible.

Can I ask a question? Sure. Obviously, if you have a 15-year mortgage the mortgage is higher. You're paying more per month, which in many cases could cause you to have to get a less expensive house so that you can afford it. Is that playing any role in this, or are you saying, no matter what, here's the house we want, or here's what we want to spend, the only caveat is whether we do it on a 15-year or a 30? I'm just curious. Is it that your husband wants more house for the money?

We have a realistic house amount that we're not going to go over for our income. So I think we can afford it the 15 year because, like I said, it's like 350. We're trying to stay at 350. Okay. 350,000. And I don't think it would be down the tire. I think he's thinking he wants to be able to take vacations and do this, that, and the other. Got it. Which we'll still be able to do. That we'll just have less play money.

Well, I think that... Here's the first parameter, and I mean, I'm going to give you my opinion on this, but the first parameter that you guys have to agree with is that the mortgage is going to be no more than 25% of your take home pay after taxes. That's the first thing. If you do that, then you will have money for the other things, saving for vacations and having a good time and having a good life. It's when you creep beyond the 25, 30% range that it starts to get tighter and tighter and tighter. And then it's like, Oh, my goodness. So that's the first thing to agree on. The second part of this that I would say is you guys have to be aligned on what your goals are for your life. Because here's what I know. If you say to yourself, We want to pay off this house, and if we have a 15-year mortgage, we're going to do that faster. It's just baked in, right? It's 15 years less. Then why would you say, Well, we'll get a 30-year and treat it like a 15-year? Then you're already saying, I plan to not do this.

I plan to give myself the freedom to say no some months and not pay that extra payment. The moment you do that is the moment when you start slip, sliding. Before you know, you've been paying for a house for 30 years. Right. I agree with you.

Well, the issue here, though, is you're saying Things like, I think we should, and I think this needs to be more of a conversation with real numbers. You guys need to get down and get spreadsheeted out, or if you write it down, that's the way you guys do it. But you have got to cast a vision for him because he's just not comfortable. You've already, I think, really nailed what's going on. He wants some more margin. You're going, I don't need as much margin as he does. This is a relationship issue, not a money issue. We got to solve the relationship part, then the money will take care of itself. You guys got to sit down and run these numbers out as best you can with the 15 year and the 30 and begin to walk through the stuff that he wants margin for, the stuff that you don't care about, he cares about. That's where this comes down to. You two getting on the same page as to this is how it's going to affect our life. This will be our reality if we do a 15-year and him getting comfortable with that, that's where you've got to get him.

You're not going to convince him. You're going to have to walk with him. Does that make sense?

Yeah, it does.

How old are you guys?

I am 47, and he is 60.

Okay. This is the argument right here. Does he want to be paying off a home when he's 90? No. I didn't think so. And I know you don't want to be paying off a home when you're 77.

That's not good enough argument. But if she said- He's worried about margin.

He's worried about margin. But if he's worried about margin, like I said, the first thing is the 25%, and that's where you've got to go and do your homework and find out. If we do this same deal at a 15-year fixed-rate mortgage, what percentage of our take home is that going to make our payment? Because to Ken's point, you haven't been able to say yes or no on that. If he's concerned with margin, my guess is that the 15 year would take you over that amount. That's my guess. I don't know for sure, but just based off of some of what you've said. So that's thing one. But then thing two is, okay, now let's meet in the middle and go, okay, that means we need to find a less expensive house because I don't know the rest of the picture. I mean, I could dig a little deeper. It might be a can of worms, but do you guys have other debt?

No. That's why I think he thinks the 30 years is fine, because we paid off $60,000 worth of debt in 17 months. We were gazelle intent. We have no debt.

Okay, that's awesome. Why are you selling the current house and buying something else?

It's too big. It's too big.

Okay, it's too big. So how much are you going to make on the sale of that house?

Hopefully, $400,000.

You're buying- Wait a second.

You said you were going to stay in the $450 range. If you're going to make $400, why not pay cash?

We totally could.

Well, then why are we having the last five-minute conversation? It doesn't make any sense. I'm not trying to be unkind, but- Just saying. We would have said immediately, there is no 15-year, 30-year conversation. If you walk away with $400, after you pay your realtor's fee, you probably are darn close to having the exact amount to pay it off. Then you're really vacationing. What are we missing, Stephanie?

I still owe on the current mortgage.

No, but Jay just asked you, what will you walk away with in the sale of the current house?

Oh, no. Okay, I misunderstood.

That's okay.

We currently owe about 180.

Okay.

And it's worth- We sold it for 400.

Okay.

Well, that's 220 gross. Right. And then we got to pay the realtor.

Yeah.

So you still have a massive down payment.

I think you're fine. Let's say you put 180 down on this next house. That's almost half. Okay.

So if you run the numbers on a 15-year on that amount of money?

That would be very affordable. I still think he's like- But here's the problem.

You're operating in assumptions assumptions. This entire call has been assumption-based. We're not getting on you. We're coaching you to say, you've got to sit down and actually on a computer go, All right, let's look at whatever the 350 minus 180 is. I'm not that good at math that quick, but we put that number in, the difference, and we see what the current 15-year mortgage rate is, and it will spit out a number for you. Then you sit down with your husband and go, Hey, babe, a 15-year mortgage on this balance is this much per month. You got to be dealing in reality, not concepts. Right now, I love that you're all in on Ramsey. But until you start putting real numbers next to our theories and our philosophies, he's not going to get on board.

Listen, I'm going to try to type it in for you right now.

I was hoping you were doing that. I'm doing it.

I was stalling with my lecture. Keep stalling. Listen, you're putting 51% down. Fifteen, you're fixed. Let's say the rate is, this is saying 6.5. I feel like it's going to be closer to seven. So I'm going to change that. So this is saying that if you were to do this, and it's estimating some taxes and insurance in here, it's saying that your total would be $2,074 a month. So only You know what percentage of your take home pay that is. It's estimating 321 for property taxes, 125 for home insurance. And by the way, I'm on ramsey solutions. Com using the home payment mortgage calculator. That's all I'm doing. You need to get clear, as Ken Coleman would say, and get these numbers. This is what you're presenting because- Help the hubs get clear. You do not want to retire with a home payment, okay? I know you know that, but the key is making your husband understand that.

Stephanie, thanks for the call. Do what we tell you to do. It's going to be a much easier conversation. This is The Ramsey Show. If current times have shown us anything, it's that the least expected events can and will happen, and we have to deal with it. That's why everyone Anyone who has a family counting on them needs term life insurance. For over 25 years, the only insurance company I've recommended is Xander Insurance. Not only because they search all of the top term life plans to find you the best rates, but over the years, they have constantly changed and updated their systems to make the whole process simpler and easier to get the protection needed.

You can now apply with a completely touchless experience with everything being done either over the phone or the internet.

They also have plans with super competitive rates that don't require an exam, allowing you to skip a step and get the coverage you need faster. Go to zander. Com or call 800-356-4282. Great rate rates, and a simple process mean there's no excuse to not get this done, people. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. Glad you're with us today. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw joins me. Phone number is 888-825. 5225. Let's go to Chad Anuga, Tennessee. Bo is there. Bo, how can we help?

Hey, guys. My family owns a construction company. We do Earthmoving. I just graduated last year, and I did one semester of school. I dropped out, and I'm just so torn on going back to school or just keep doing working. I didn't know what you all thought about that.

Sure. What made you drop out?

I don't know. I just sat down with my mom and dad, and they just I didn't think I would really need the degree. I was doing Civil Engineering, so it was pretty difficult for me.

Okay. Mom and dad were in support. We all sat down and said, Maybe it's not for me. You agreed, they agreed. Is that what I'm hearing?

Yeah. My dad owns the company, so he was more like, You don't really need the degree. I think mom was more play it safe, go to school. But I just listened to my dad, to be honest.

Now, is the plan at this point, and you're only 19, is the plan to work for the company and eventually take over, or just you've got a job now and we're going to see how it plays out?

The plan would eventually be for me to take over the company maybe four or five years down the road.

Well, then I would not get any education that is not tied to something that will specifically make you better at running your family company one day. If you and dad both come to the conclusion that you don't need a degree at a traditional school, and you just need the school of hard knocks, and your dad teaching you and bringing you along, then no, I would never darken the door of college at all in this scenario. By the way, my general philosophy is when people ask me this is, I think it's two questions on the degree. Degree or no degree. The Shakespeare thing, is this the question? That's the question. It's, is a degree the only way to do what I want to do, or is a degree It's the best way to do what I want to do? It feels like a really hard no for both of those questions for you. It's consistent with what I've said for anybody in any field.

I was torn because I eventually want to get into developing land. What I was studying was a Civil Engineer degree, and that would give me the ability to basically make plans where I could eventually develop the land into a subdivision or commercial homes, stuff like that.

Sure. Well, wasn't that what you were pursuing, and it was too hard?

Yeah, I don't know. I think he really just wanted me to… Because he's been doing it for 40, 50 years, and I think he just wants to take a lesser role and give it to me.

I understand, but it looks like you're flip-flopping on me on the phone here. It was like, Hey, I sat down and talked to dad. It was hard. I didn't like it. We agreed I didn't need it. Now you're going, Well, I was leaning towards it. I think you can learn how to develop land without ever going to a classroom and getting a Civil Engineering degree. I think that. I I think you know that. Yeah. So has your dad done it?

No, he went to school. He didn't finish his dad. He was the one who started the company. He got a stick, and he had to come back home.

Do you guys know people locally that develop land?

Yeah. That was basically the other thing. I would just buy the piece of land and basically contract out the Civil engineering part.

That, but isn't it possible, Bo, at the young age that you're at, that you begin to hang out with and spend time with these friends of your dad or friends of your family that are really successful developers. And couldn't you pick up a lot of information from them over time?

Yeah, you're correct.

So I just don't think school is the play for you. But here's the great news. If that changes and the answers to those questions become yes, then go back. But right now, you need to learn how to run this business. And the best way for you to learn how to run this business is to be working with dad day in, day out. I don't want to ever throw some potential negative thing out there, but the bottom line is none of us have a promise tomorrow. If I was in your shoes and I was the eventual owner, I would not waste any time. I'd be learning Everything I could. I'd become a human sponge around your dad. You're going to develop your own management style. You're going to develop your own systems, and now is the best time to learn. No, I wouldn't go back to school now. Make sense?

Okay. All right, man.

Thank you so much. Yeah, I appreciate the call. So good. Stephanie is now joining us in Atlanta, Georgia. Stephanie, how can we help?

Hey there. My husband wants to retire next year and has talked about pulling out his 401(k) to pay off our house. Uh-oh.

Okay, well, let's talk about it. How old's your husband?

He He just turned 60.

Okay. How old are you?

I will be 44 next month. Okay.

Do you guys combine your… Is your money combined? Yes?

Yeah. I mean, we split expenses. We keep separate counts Yeah, his money is my money, my money is his.

Okay, I'm going with you on that. You're saying he wants to pull from your collective retirement and pay off the mortgage. Can you tell me collectively how much money you guys have in your nest egg at this point?

I was trying to get a number from him. I think it's probably about 500,000 combined in 401(k)s.

Any other money?

We have a rainy day fund. It's about six months of living expenses.

Okay, so you got your emergency fund. How much will it take to pay off the mortgage?

A hundred and thirty.

A hundred and thirty. Okay. Essentially, my thought here is this is going to double in seven years. If he never touched it, it would be a million in seven years. He'd be 67 and you'd be 53. If he pays 180 towards his mortgage, same thing is going to take place. You said 180? Sorry.

One thirty. One thirty. One thirty. Okay.

I think what he's trying to do, and you can correct me, I think what he's trying to do is clear all debt so that he can be at peace. Mm-hmm. Okay. Then my next question is before, I'm not saying yes or no yet. I'm just trying to get the information. Then my next question is, are you going to continue to work? And if so, what's your income?

I will continue to work, and I make about 100K a year with a I got a bonus in August.

Okay, so you're going to continue working. What will he… His retirement, tell me about that. Is he military? Is it just this 401k? Tell me more about his retirement and what he thinks he's going to draw.

He will pull a pension. Okay. If he takes the full pension, that's $900 a month, approximately, I believe. He will do something, whether it be working at Home Depot. He'll get a job for a while until he starts collecting Social Security, and I don't know what that amount is. Okay.

I feel like, looking at the numbers and looking at what you talked about, I don't think that he has to do this. I think that if you guys buckle down, you can have this paid off in the next 2-3 years if you guys go crazy. If you say that, Hey, he's getting this $900. I'm working. I get $100,000 plus bonuses, plus he's going to be doing something. I got to believe that between all of that, you guys can find, I don't know, almost $200,000. How much are your bonuses?

It ranges Between 5% and 7%.

Okay, so is that fair enough? Think about that.

It could be a lifestyle change, but I mean, that's- How much?

How much of a lifestyle change?

It's a reasonable option. We like to travel.

Yeah, But what's your mortgage payment?

1,200.

1,200. How much would you guys put extra into that, Jade? What's the number you're suggesting they put over and above that?

Well, I think it's up to them because this is about intentionality.

If he's working at Home Depot, what do you think he's going to pull?

I don't know, but he's been putting an extra 200 to 400, and I believe for the past several months.

200 to 400 in what?

Into the mortgage to try and pay it off early. We're already starting to do that.

Yeah, but it's not all of a sudden this big pinch. My point is, if he's working plus he's pulling a pension, it's not like it's going to be. What's his current income?

I believe he's around 70.

Let's look at it like this. Can you guys live off of your income? Yes. Okay. If he says, I'm not doing the job I was doing, so I'm essentially retiring from that job, but I'm going to make it a point to make $43,000 a year. If he does that and we take all of his money and throw it at the mortgage, you'll be done in three years.

You're working. It's not like you guys are traveling all the time. You only get so much vacation. I I think you guys are saving up for the vacation. You're doing that. To Jade's point, you're piling everything on the house. Here's the deal. That 401k, as Jade said, is going to double, and he's only 60. Then you got Social Security. If you wait until 70, I would just sit on that. I would not use it to pay off the house. We're both in agreement on that. I wouldn't. You're going to win big. Good stuff. Good hour, Jade Warshaw. Thank you very much. James Childs, our fearless leader in the Mary Band of People Behind the Glass. They keep us on the air. Thank you. This is Ramsey Show. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is the Ramsey Show, where we help you win in your life. We want you to win in your money, win at work, and win with your relationships. Triple 825-5225. It's a phone number. That's 888-825-5225. Jade Warshaw is with me. I'm Ken Coleman, and we are together for you this hour. Jade will lead off on your money questions, and I'm here to help you at work and you're winning with your income.

How do I make more income? I want to get promoted. I want to start something. I'm here to help with those questions because we want you to increase that income. Let's go to Hayden, who starts us off this hour in Denver, Colorado. Hayden, how can we help?

Hey, guys. I'm 18 right now. I'm attending a state college. I'm racking up about 40,000 in student loans a year. I've always wanted to be a veterinarian, which would be another 250,000 I have about $500,000 student debt. So I have about $500,000 student loans at the end of this. I started changing my thinking towards opening up my own dog grooming business. Start-up cost would be about $40,000. I could maybe make up to $50,000 a year. I was wondering what you guys would think about me dropping out.

Well, I'm not your dad, but I would drop out once I knew if I should drop out. Just because we feel a pivot going away from veterinary, and I'd want to walk through all the different options. I think you've got a love of pets. That's probably driving this veterinarian choice. Is that fair? Yeah, that's for sure. Then now you went, Man, I'm staring at that mountain of debt, which, by the way, just a quick commentary, Jade, it just pisses me off for this young man, for him, that that's the barrier to get in to be a vet. That's crazy. It's It's a racket. It's an absolute racket, and it's sad. It's really sad. But that's a whole separate phone call. You started thinking, All right, what else can I do with animals? And the dog grooming thing is presented itself. Why is it $40,000 in the startup cost? What are you paying 40 grand for to be a dog groom?

It would be supplies, maybe a van to drive around and do it, and just overall bills and stuff.

Can I suggest that you do two things in the near future before you drop out? Number one, I want you to actually go spend some time, coffee or a lunch with, I'd like to see two dog groomers at minimum, and dog groomers that aren't starving. I mean this. Dog groomers who have some margin and they're making enough money, and you can, by asking just questions, How much do you What are your revenues? Somebody will share that with you. I would do some homework on that. I'd want to talk to a minimum of two and learn everything there is about the actual business. That's the homework assignment one. Homework assignment two is to actually dig into with them and just looking at the one ads, what basic qualifications do you need to get hired as an actual dog groom? You may not believe this or not, Jade, but we take our beloved dog, our golden Doodle, Ellis. You know how fabulously handsome he is. We take him to PetSmart. It's in some fancy place, and they do a great job. Give him a little shampoo, give him a little trim, and he's a handsome fellow. I would start going, What's the barrier for entry?

Just to become a dog groomer and learn the skill of actually dog grooming, test it out, do I like this? Would I want to do this in the long term? Because I would want you to get paid by somebody else to do it before you ever launch your own business. For heaven's sakes, buying a van that you may end up living in down by the river if the grooming doesn't work out.

Look, I saw a groomer the other day in his van. Somehow the dog had got loose, and he was chasing the dog through the neighborhood, trying to get whoever We're not getting our first pet back. My contribution to this conversation is probably, take it for what you will, but I almost wonder if there's a way, because just because you can't be a veterinarian right now doesn't mean sometime down the line, you can't pay your way through this education. To Ken's point, I'm wondering, you're shadowing these groomers, and maybe you decide, yes, I love being a dog groomer. On down the line, you start that business and you start making some money. It's in your mind that a percentage of what I make it goes into my veterinary fund and my education fund. It's just because your dream is deferred doesn't mean that it has to be completely denied. I do want to put that out there. You're just being smart right now and realizing, I can't afford this right now. It doesn't mean that it can never happen. I love that.

Hayden, questions about that?

No, for sure. That was some great advice.

Yeah. Go get paid, man. Go get paid to groom dogs or work with animals. Hey, Here's the other thing. One other homework assignment. You live in the Denver, Colorado area. A lot of outdoor animals opportunities. I'd be looking at just what are some other things that I never thought of where I could make decent money? Maybe you could make, and I'm making this up, Hayden, But maybe you can make north of $20 an hour. Taking care of horses on a ranch. Horses, yes. Just get in the animal game. There are a lot of different ways to make money at your age, by the way, because entry level is wide open. They need people. I'd get in the game of just helping animals, caring for animals, and just learn a lot, stack cash to Jade's point, because maybe you look up 10 years from now and you found another way that's not By the way, on that point, too, while I'm adding things- Add more, Ken.

Dig in.

Are you telling me, Hayden, and I don't know, is every veterinary school in this great country, 250 grand?

I'm going to do some Google right now.

I love when you get on the Google. I do. What do you know, Hayden? Is every veterinary school that expensive?

Very near to that.

What a racket. Yeah. No, it's What a racket. That's a shame, man. 250 grand. Well, here's the deal. Do the math on how long it would take you to save up 250 grand, realistically. Run some different numbers. I do like the idea of where there's a will, there's a way. Ten years from now, maybe you got all that cash stacked up. But in the meantime, we've already given you advice on what we would do. Jade, I got to tell you, I'm going to go on a mini-rant here, and I'd love for you to weigh in. Do it. Do you think Because I know you have no problem shooting me straight. Do you think that I might be right, that it is a racket that they're charging that much? Does it really cost these veterinary schools or colleges? Does it really cost them that much that they have to charge a quarter million dollars to train someone? I don't buy that for a second.

I think these folks just care about profit.

I think so, too. Because animal lovers are some special people with big hearts. I think they're ripping people off.

100% they are. Okay. What did you find? We're going through the top 10 cheapest vet schools. Number 10, Virginia, Maryland Regional College. Resident four-year tuition, 100,067. $629. Number 9, Texas A&M. Resident four-year tuition, $9,000. Let's see. $929. So it might require him moving, getting a residence.

So they are less than 250.

Yeah. They're out there. You just got to live in the right place, live there to get your residency. All right.

Well, that's a lot more doable, Hayden.

Washington State University, 102,000. Does it get any cheaper than that? University of Illinois, 97,000.

We're getting cheaper as we go. I like it. I thought there might be some options. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back, America. You are listening to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is with me, and the phone number is 825-5225. 825-5225. Today's question of the day comes from Jeff in Pennsylvania. I'm 32, and my girlfriend and I are expecting our first child looking forward to a wedding next year. Financially, we're in a good position, but I've fallen out of love with my career. I have about 60,000 in savings and 190,000 in stocks and IRA. My only debt is 138,000 on the house, and my girlfriend has 25,000 in student loans. My current My salary is 200,000 a year, but I'm miserable and burned out. With the baby on the way, leaving work and taking a pay cut is terrifying for me. I feel like I need to take a few weeks or months to let my mind heal and get back to feeling like myself, but can I afford to do so? A lot going on here, Jade. I would take a couple of weeks or maybe a full week to get clear.

I don't think your mind will necessarily heal in that amount of time, depending on what's going on with this burnout. But I do think it's hard to make a decision like this to make a large pivot when you're burned out. It's like you've got to get, if it's two days, three days or a full week, Jade, I'd like to see him get to a place where he can fully identify what's causing the burnout. So a couple of questions. Is it stress? If it's stress, what's causing the stress or who's causing the stress? How much of it is he has some control over versus he doesn't have any control. We've got to dig into what's going on with the burnout. I think the answer is he's fallen out of love because I actually agree with that. I mean, that's really at the heart of what I teach. I think that one of the causes of burnout is no juice, no passion for the work. If that's the case, we've got to figure out first, Jade, well, what do I love and what's it going to take to get there? We got a baby on the way, and we got income.

I want him to sit still and say, All right, I'm grateful for the money I make now. We got to switch our mindset. I'm grateful for what I have. I now know, Okay, I just don't love the work. Before I even make any moves, we want to make a strategic move to something that I do love, and we got to figure out, A, what that is, B, what does it take to get qualified, if I'm not qualified, how much that's going to cost and how long that will take. That takes some maturity But that's how we bridge that change. But right now, we got a baby on the way, and there's some financial stuff there, so we don't want interruption in income. So I would say, no, he cannot afford to.

Yeah, not yet. Otherwise, he's running from something without running to something. I love that. I think that's a very dangerous position because you're desperate at that point. You're acting out of desperation. I would love, and I'm just going to throw this out here for us to come back later, but what do you think makes somebody lose their juiciness? When you enter something, you're excited to be there, and what makes that go away?

Well, it's a good question. Assuming you had it initially. Let's say at some point you loved the work. We see this a lot with teachers that'll call my show. What changed for them is they didn't lose, in this case, the juice for instructing. They still love teaching and instructing. They just don't like where they're doing it because the environment is toxic. You can absolutely love the work you do, but hate the place that you do it. That That creates confusion because what happens is, and I'm glad you asked me this, you keep going into a place that is unhealthy and you love the work. Eventually, the unhealthiness makes you question the love. But you never lost the love of the work. You just can't even focus on the love.

You can't see the forest for the tree at that point.

Because it sucks so bad to be there. I think if I had that love initially... Now, a lot of times people think they had love for it, and it was just like. You know what I mean? Because it's like if we take it back to relationships.

It's the idea of it that they like. 100%.

Or they really like this person. But When things happen and when the rubber meets the road, you're like, I don't like them so much right now. If you don't love them, you won't stay. That's so weird. But there are a lot of days where I know I'm only speaking for Stacey, but where Stacey does not like me. A lot of days.

No comment.

Well, no, you know it's true.

I do know it's true.

It's almost 26 years. You don't get here without love.

I know that's right.

Because there are a lot of days where there's not like.

That's a fact. Come on and talk about real things, King Coleman.

I'm trying to keep it real.

You are.

Now, I've never not liked Stacey. I've loved her every day. I just want to put that out there.

That's a lie. That's a lie.

There it is. I'm so glad you said that. Oh, I tried to get through I tried to navigate that. Did I do okay?

You did good. You're right. The point is, you can be infatuated with work. Then, like you said, when the real stuff starts hitting, it's like you make that choice. Just like in marriage, I am choosing every day to love this person, right? That's right. Man, that's a good analogy, Ken.

That's just real. By the way, in the work, and we'll wrap this up, in the workplace, you've got to be okay saying, I never really loved this. I'm not ashamed to admit it, but a lot of people will stay in a role in a career that is sucking the life right out of them.

Yeah, because they invested time and money.

They're afraid to say, Hey, I chose a college, I chose a major, I chose this company, and I've been lying to myself for a decade or longer. That's okay to say, Look, it's not for me. Life is too short to not do work you love.

Listen, luckily, God works all these things together. From one marriage thing to another.

How about this one? Darryl has got a question. I feel like we're going to stay in this area. Darryl in Lubic, Texas. What's going on? How can we help? Oh, pretty good. How are you all? We're doing well. What's happening today?

Oh, nothing. I was just got a question. How do I get my wife to be on board with the baby steps, and how do I approach it?

Oh, man, that is such a loaded question. We get it all the time. Tell me, let's diagnose this a little bit. Have you talked to her at all about the baby steps? If so, tell us how she reacted.

She said she gets annoyed and rolls her eyes and walks off.

Uh-oh. Wow. The roll the eyes and the walk off, Jay.

Okay. Have you been able to identify which part of it is getting stuck in her cry? Is it the budgeting part? Is it the we have to pause investing to pay off the debt part. Do you know which part of it really just grinds her gears?

It's mostly just… I mean, I'm trying to pay off debt. And then long story short, I take care of my niece and nephew, and it's just really overwhelming. I'm always on the road for a month or two months at a time, so I know she's a single parent, and it's overwhelming for her. When I talk about this, when I'm on the road, she doesn't want to talk about money, period.

So she thinks that if you guys go down this path, a lot of the bulk of their responsibility is going to fall on her because you're off on the road, you've got the niece and nephew that's also part of the mix, and she's just like, I don't want to put anything else on my plate. Does that cover it?

Basically.

Okay. Listen, I can sympathize with that. I think right here we're talking about right now, all this is to her is you having heard something on the radio or you having heard something on a podcast, and you're running back and telling her, I found this thing, and I think we ought to do it. She's like, Oh, my gosh. We already have this and that. I think you nailed it.

You know what it is? It's one more hard thing, and she's going, Bro, I can't do one more hard thing. Yeah, I feel that. She's trying to keep her nose above water, it feels like.

Does that sound right?

Pretty much. I know Dave always says, Don't shove it down her throat. But I don't try to shove it down her throat. I say, Hey, this morning, I have, what is it called, Mortgage Life Insurance on my house, and Dave doesn't recommend having that. So I'm like, Hey, when I get back home, I'm going to cancel that. And she's just like,.

Well, that's the problem. Just do it. That's the problem. She sees... That's security. Whenever you say the word insurance, mortgage, all those are security things. And when you run home and like, Honey, I'm going to cancel it. She's like, What? You're canceling it. Maybe lead out with, Hey, I learned that the insurance that we have is super expensive, and there's a cheaper one out there. Here's what it is. You show it to her and you explain, Hey, if we do this term life policy, it's going to be a lot better, and da, da, da, da, da. Then I'm going to put this in place, and once that's in place, we can let the other one go. A lot of this is how you talk about it. We're going to make sure that you get set up with Financial Peace University. You and your wife do this together. That way, Darryl, you're not the one having to deliver all the news. Dave and the personalities will do it for you.

What do you think? Can we get him a session with one of our financial coaches as our gift just to let that coach be that middle person? I love it. All right, so let's give him a financial coaching session as well. That's going to really help ease you in with your wife on this. But you're a good man. Hang in there. Take it slow. She's got a lot going on. This is the Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show, Ken Coleman and Jade Warshaw, helping you through this hour, 888-825-225, 888-825-5225. Michelle is joining us now in Jacksonville, Florida. Michelle, how can we help?

Well, I have an adult son who's in a situation where he has a house with his girlfriend, and they have a good interest rate and a really good payment. They broke up, and so she wants him to refinance the house in his name, and he has bad credit. I put $40,000 down on the house for them, and he wants me to either help him to get the house by cosigning for it or for me just to buy it outright, and then he rents from me. But I've been helping him his whole life, and he's like 35, and I I just don't know. I'm a widow, and I don't know when to say… I guess he has a history of mental illness and a substance abuse, so I'm guilty feeling. You're scared. Guilty feeling like I should… Yes, I'm scared. No, let's listen. He finally got a good job. We He does a really good job, but he can't manage his money.

Yeah. Don't buy this house for him.

Do not put yourself in this situation. But I also understand you're scared, but I think this is the moment where he's looking to you for direction anyway. If he's got a really good job. You're just going to sit down with him and be okay to let him know why you're not doing it and what his real options are. These two young people are on the… Well, they're not even that young, for heaven's sakes. They're on the home. Both of their names are on the home?

Both of their names are on the deed, but only his girlfriend's name is on the loan. She's suing him to force him to refinance the house or move out, and he doesn't have the credit to refinance it.

Well, then it's a really clear decision. He moves out. I'm just so scared this is his only chance in life to own a house. It might be his one chance.

No, no, no, no, no, He could ever own a home.

Well, he makes about 60,000 a year, and they each pay half of the mortgage payment, so they each pay 750. He says he can't afford child support. They have a child together. He can't afford a mortgage payment. He can't afford a new car. His car is about to die on the side of the road. He wants me to cosign for a car, too. No. Credit card is max, no money in savings. But I don't want him to be homeless and on the side of the road with no car. I just have fears. I get it. He I'm not here to allay my fears.

Well, there's so many other options, though. You're choosing options that put burden on you. You called because, quite frankly, you're exhausted at the idea of doing this. The very idea of doing this is exhausting, and it's probably equal part's scary. The only reason you're even considering this and not saying hard pass immediately is because you're worried about your boys had a lot of struggles and you feel like… But I got to tell you, I think this is a blessing in disguise. He's got a new job, A good paying job. Sounds like there might be some growth opportunity. They break up. He needs to get out of this house because it's the only shot he's got to be able to afford the child support because he doesn't have any shot on that. The judge is going to decide that.

But he says that rent is higher than his mortgage payment.

Not if he's sharing. No, not if he's renting with one or two other guys that are single. Believe me, there's plenty of those in Jacksonville, Florida. This is where you can mama him in the sense of showing him adult options and saying, One of the options that you don't have is me. Here are the other options.

Yeah. He's even down to saying he can't afford to move the stuff out of his house or afford a rental, like a storage unit.

I wish he was on the phone because this guy needs a good sip of grown-up juice.

Did you say that you put the $40,000 down for this house that the girlfriend basically has the right of ownership to?

Well, they each have a 50-50 ownership share. He was living at my house in the basement paying no rent, and he had trashed my basement because he was on substances at that time. I honestly just wanted him out. For my peace of mind, I put down $40,000 It was in 2022.

You're not getting that money back.

That was to give him an affordable payment. No. He held that over my head and said, I hate to see you lose your 40,000. Let's refinance this together.

Now he's piss me off. I felt a little bad for him. But now this is a kid who's manipulating you. You know why he's doing it? No. Because it works.

Yeah, it always does work. I operate on guilt a lot.

Today's the day. Yeah. 35-year-old boy needs to understand it's time to be a 35-year-old man. The best way he's going to do that is you have to look at him and go. By the way, I'd be okay being really raw and sharing your emotion. Share with him why you've done this in the past because of guilt. Now you've got to earn this and go, I can't do it anymore. I can't. It's not good for me, and it's not for you. I know deep down, you don't want me to hurt me. I don't know, Jade. I don't have anything but tough love here.

What are you- I have nothing but tough love. I'm holding my tongue. My son is young, and you're further along in life than I am. There's part of me that just wants to wallop this dude. But I also understand that there's motherly love here. I can understand that there's this pool that you probably have to want to get involved, but I also feel like you got to just let this guy do what he's going to do, and all you can do is pray.

You know what he needs, Michelle? I'm going to tell you the one thing I think you can and should do in this situation. We already told you what not to do. I think he needs belief from mama, not help.

That is probably something I've never really offered. That's true, because I'm always operating on fear and guilt.

By the way, you have Listen to me, Michelle. I say this with a father's heart, and I say this from my own experience. He needs belief. No more help. You need to sit down with him and tell him what he should do and show him that he can do it. Then you need to walk away. Okay. Thanks for taking my call. I think you need to be his number one cheerleader.

I love that, Ken. Oh, that's so good. It's so good. It's tough.

It's so hard because we want to help our kids. My goodness. I mean, it's just so hard. I get it. I truly get it. But at this point, and that's the rub, right? He's 35. He's not a boy.

I honestly think when it comes to this house, I think they just need to sell it. I was going to get whatever the profit is, give it back to mama. She's the one that put the money down to begin with.

I was going to ask you, but see, you get the girlfriend involved and her name's on it, so she gets all the dough.

She's on Yeah, they need to get a lawyer involved. This is what happens. He's broke. Yeah, but mama does. Mama's already... If she wants her money back, if she cares anything, she might not care. She might be like, I wash my hands in this situation. I'm out. But if she's like, Man, I'd love to get my 40,000 back. I'd love to talk to somebody to see how this happens.

I just don't want her racking up 10 grand in legal fees, and that doesn't take long. But I like what you're saying. But I think this is the get out of jail free card for this guy. I wish we had him on the phone and say, I know you guys broke up, and that sucks. I know you got a kid.

But the girlfriend's going to want his name off the deed. I'm not exactly sure what the process for that, the best process for that would be.

But this is a chance for him to start over. Yeah. Meaning he's already got the breakup. 100%. He's got a good job. Yeah. But I don't buy this rent. It's so expensive. He's manipulating there.

He's manipulating- He's got child support staring him in the face, Jay. He's got a lot. He needs to make more than 60,000. He's just got to get his life together. Yeah, he's going to grow up. My guy's got a lot to get together.

By the way, Jade, I'm going to give it to you. We got about a minute and a half. I think this is a great time for new listeners and viewers that come in all the time. I want you to tell them why this call is Exhibit A on why we shouldn't buy a house with somebody we're not married to.

Go ahead. Because there's no clear rights. Like I said, with this, it's like, okay, both their names on the deed, one names on the title, mom put the money down. There's such a tangled web here, and it's going to take a lot to untangle. That's why I said If I was mom and I wanted to see about this, it's like, now you got to involve a lawyer in a different way. There's no clear division of assets. This is just what is known as a hot steaming pile, Ken. That's what this is. It's not good.

Don't play house.

Don't play house. I haven't heard that in a long time. That's what this is. I know, but that's how I know your dad's a preacher.

100%. That's true. I can't get it. You can take You take a preacher's kid out of the church. You take the church out of the preacher's kid, right? You can't. But that's what happened here. We love each other. Let's go in and do this house, and now look at it.

You know what? They would benefit from some counseling, too. They really would. The two of them, mom and son together, mom on her own son.

I just saw flashes of a reality show where you're coming in and telling these two, get your all this stuff fixed and just love each other and get married and get this nonsense over with.

I'm not a counselor, but I can send them to better help, and they can help them out. I'll just mama them.

I think you I'm not going to be a matchmaker. You think I could? Sit down and be quiet. Let Jay fix this.

Sit down. Act like you got some home training.

This is the Ramsey Show.

Hey, guys, are you ready for The Secret to help you reach those money goals that you've been dreaming about. It's simple. You got to get on a budget. With our budgeting app, EveryDollar, you'll get intentional with your money and build the habits that will make those dreams a reality. And we'll be with you every step of the way. From your first budget to that retirement home on the beach, download EveryDollar for free on the App Store or Google Play. Remember, today, download every dollar for free on the App Store or Google Play today.

All right. Are you in the Baby Step 4 range? Really close to finishing Baby Step 3 or you're in Baby Step 4. Maybe you're past that, but you'd like to just learn from Dave Ramsey himself on how he invest, then you're going to love this new event. It's coming up. It's called Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials. At this event, Dave is going to do a deep dive into his investing strategy, and for the first time ever, share his personal playbook, including how he buys real estate. I know this is always a hot topic, Jade, on TikTok and Instagram, all these people given how to buy real estate and get rich. Dave does it very differently, and he's going to be sharing that. This is a two-night virtual event happening May 21 and 22. You can watch it anywhere. You've got a device or a computer. You'll learn maximize your 401k in mutual funds. Dave's personal strategy, as I mentioned, for real estate, and then investing trends to follow and which ones to avoid. It's a $249 ticket. You can sign up at ramsey solutions. Com/events. That's ramsey solutions. Com/events. It's Dave Ramsey's Investing Essentials. I think our buddy George Campbell is going to have a cameo as well.

That's right. A camel cameo, I like to call it. That's always an extra bonus. All right, let's go to Birmingham, Alabama, where Katherine is waiting for us, Katherine. How can we help today?

Hey, good afternoon. I just had a quick question for you guys. My husband and I are anticipating a good quantity of inheritance to come in in a few months or so, possibly. But we just want to have a plan for this money if it does come through. We're currently in the middle of Baby Step 4. My husband is I'm investing 10% in retirement, and I'm working on getting my 401k set up right now with my newer workplace. We're debt-free. We have our larger emergency fund saved up, but our question is, would you all recommend throwing 100% of this cash toward our mortgage, which is about, I guess we owe maybe like 260 at this point, 275. I know that's bad. I don't know the exact number. But would you guys throw at 100% of the mortgage, or would you all recommend investing in the home itself to do some addition in the attic space? So adding a bedroom, adding a bathroom. We currently live in a three-bed, two-bath. So our home's worth about $340,000, but we're looking at a large return on our investment if we were to add that bedroom and add that additional bathroom.

How much money do you think that is coming your way? I also want to know, you said it may or may not, so I want to know more. It's contingent on…

It's a family property that my in-law's own, and it's potentially about to be purchased. If the home gets purchased, then it gets split between the grandkids, which I'm married to one of. It would be between 20 and 30,000 is what we're expected to receive. So that would be about what we would be looking at if the home sold. And we just want to have a plan if it does. We don't want to get this chunk of cash and not have a plan.

100%, I like that way of thinking. Baby steps-wise, you said baby step four. Obviously, I want you to be at the point where you're investing 15%, not 10. And then four, five, and six, it's simultaneous. I do want you being intentional about putting extra towards the mortgage, kids college. But it's not to say that every windfall you get, all of it must go on the mortgage. You can look at this and go, Okay, what's a fair split here? Do we want to put half of it on the mortgage, and do we want to use half to do some additions? Is it enough If we do half, is it enough to complete the addition? Do we only want to put 10% of this on the mortgage? You guys have some freedom here. How much is it going to cost to do what you say you want to do to the house?

I I haven't gotten estimates yet, but my dad works in construction, and so he's familiar with roundabout pricing. He's like, I really feel like your attic space is already suitable to finish out. So he thinks that it can be done for around 20 to 30 for what we're wanting.

So it would take all of it? Yeah. I mean, here's the thing. If you're already putting... Let's say you called and you said, Jade, listen, we're investing 15 % We pay an extra mortgage payment every month, or we pay whatever X amount of dollars extra to our mortgage every month, and we're getting this extra $30,000. I would love, we've been wanting to do this addition. It's the perfect amount of money. I would not be mad at that. I would love to see that you're putting some additional regularly towards your mortgage, or you have a rhythm, whether it's once a quarter, whatever your rhythm is that you're paying extra towards your mortgage. I'd love to see that you're doing that as a caveat to just dumping this whole thing on it, dumping the whole thing into additions. Okay. Yeah. I like that. That's me. But don't lose sleep over it. I'm not going to come haunt you if you don't. On this, I'm not going to come haunt you. There's some things I will show up in your dreams, but not on this one. I like that.

The Ghost of Jade. Don't take out a heel of. Man, I'm a little scared. I'm not going to lie to you. I'm a little scared. Justin is up next in Rochester, New York. Justin, how can we help?

Hey, how are you doing? Good. The point that I'm at is I went through divorce a couple of years ago, and things are still doing pretty good financially, but I'm very concerned with the... Just that everything ends up on my shoulders, and I have two young girls that I have shared custody of, and I want to keep everything great for them, keep the house with their head. I have money in cash and savings, but I'm worried that I'm just keeping too much I'm not much of it liquid, and I'm afraid to do anything with it, and I don't feel like I have good quality of life because I'm sitting on this cash, and I'm like, I think I need to get this stuff out and working for me. But I'm just concerned, too, because as I look at my finances for long term, I don't see it growing as much as I want it to. I'm just nervous to put this money out there to work for me. I'm really opposed to the idea of borrowing against home equity and things like that. But How old are you? I have a lot of resources. I'm 42.

We've got about two minutes, so we're going to ask really fast questions so that Jade can give you some advice here. Do you have any debt at all? Just a mortgage. Just the mortgage. How much cash have you stacked?

I got about 84k in cash, not investments, just in checking and savings.

Are you investing anything, like a 401k or anything up to this point?

Yeah, I have about 200K in a 401k, 21k in a Roth, 42k in 5.

Is it a regular rhythm like you're doing? What percentage a month?

I think right now my 401k is at 7%, and the reason for that is because I got HCE capped. I think the HCE cap, that's a highly compensated employee cap, where they basically just said, Hey, you can't put any more in your 401k. We're knocking you down to 7%. What do you earn? That was around the time that I went 140k.

Interesting. Okay.

Yeah. I'm right around the threshold. Every year, I have to wonder, Am I going to get HCE capped again?

You called because you feel like this 80,000 you've put away. It's just all fear because you got the two girls and you're just being safe, you're good dad, and you'd like to do more with that 80 grand. Is that right?

Yeah, I think I'm probably doing the wrong thing by having it sit there. I don't know if I try to start bumping my 401k or put a bulk against her. I think it's wrong for me to sit on that money.

I would agree with that to a certain extent. We would suggest having 3-6 months of expenses saved. For you, what's six months of expenses? Because for you, I would do six months. You've got two girls, single dad. What's six months of expenses for you?

Probably at least 30k, I would say.

Okay. So you got 50. So we're going to make to the other 54. If you're getting capped, you've got your 401k over there with your business, you can do 7%, that's great. You should also be doing a Roth IRA. I want to make sure that we're getting you at least to 15%, whether it's a mix of your 401k Roth IRA. Even if you go over to a brokerage or an HSA, those are all really good places for you to go one after another. Then as far as this 54,000 is concerned, I would get with a Smart Vesta Pro because when you're out in the market, then you've got a lot of different funds that you can choose from, and they're going to help you know which funds are best. But yeah, get Get it into a brokerage. Get it somewhere where it is gaining a return for you because sitting in your checking account, that ain't it.

No. Love it. Good stuff, Jade. Thanks again for the call, Justin. You're a good dad. You're a good dude. You're doing really well. All right, that's going to do it for this hour. Thank you, Jade Warshaw. Thanks to James Childs and our team for keeping us on the air. This is your show, America. This is The Ramsey Show. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, this is The Ramsey Show, where we help you win in your life, specifically with your money, in your work, and with your relationships. 888-825-5225 is the phone number. It's a toll free. We'd love for you to jump in and talk with Jade Warshaw and me, I should say, proper grammar, and me, Ken Coleman. 888-825-5225. Let's go to Jackson, Mississippi, to kick this hour off. Angie is there. Angie, how can we help? Hey, how are you all doing? We are having a blast. What's going on with you today?

So my husband and I are trying to figure out if we should pay off our mortgage. I'm 36 and he's 37, and we just started trying to have a baby last month. And so we're not really sure. It could happen soon. It could take a while since I'm a little older. It's in God's hands. So we don't know if we should go ahead and pay the mortgage off now or if we should keep the money that we have in our non-retirement account and save it for the baby, and if we run into any potential issues, having a conceiving. What do you have in your non-retirement?

What money do you have saved beyond your emergency fund?

In a non-retirement investment, we have about $22,000 or about $23,000. The amount we owe on our house is $32,800.

Wow.

And so if we took the investments out and put that towards the house, we could probably have the house paid off, I would say, in about two months. But if we did not take the investments out, it would probably take us 8-10 months to pay it off.

Okay. Right now, we're throwing...

Or go ahead.

No, I was just going to say you're 37. I was pregnant at that age as well. My question for you is, have you been given Has anybody told you that there's a reason to believe that you might have trouble conceiving?

No. Okay.

Then I'm going to- I heard that when you're older, that you might have issues, or it might take longer. But no one has said, Because of this reason, you could have fertility issues. No one has said that to you? No. Okay. Then I'm operating as though you are a healthy female and everything is looking good and you have no reason to believe that this is going to be a problem. You're just out here like anybody else trying to trying to start a family. If there's no other debt, if you've got 3-6 months of expenses saved, if you guys are currently investing 15%, and this is non-retirement savings above and beyond your emergency fund, I'm totally fine with you guys taking this money and being mortgage debt-free in the next two months. I think that's awesome. Awesome. Yeah, that's exciting.

That's what we're looking forward to. I think, too, the money that we're putting towards the mortgage, we could stockpile afterwards as well.

A hundred %. So fast. I mean, what are you paying right now towards your mortgage?

The mortgage is 1,500, but we're throwing an extra 2,000 to 2,500.

Oh, man. You're going to stack that up in no time. An extra 2,500 dollars a month plus whatever else you have laying around. Yeah, you're going to stack that up in no time. That's exciting. I'm happy for you.

Thank you. Would you all happen to have a time for a question on career?

Sure. Let's get it.

Sure.

Sure. Go ahead. What are we going to say? No?

Currently, I'm a project manager for an engineering firm, and it can be quite demanding and stressful. I've lost my, I guess, love for it. It's just a struggle going to work every day. I don't know, as we start building a family, if this is something that I want to continue doing. I make good money, and we're able to get to a point right now, we're about to pay off the house. I'm just trying to figure out, do I stick with it right now until baby comes and just keep saving and keep saving and then potentially look into making a shift or- Is it the work or is it the place? It's not the place. I love working with clients, with project teams, and the interaction I like learning. It's just the deadline-driven demand. Okay.

This is fun. Let's keep going on this. What would you remove from your day-to-day if we could, if we could just for fun, go, All right, I have the power to remove this type of work, and then I would be really, really at peace and be really fulfilled and happy. Would it be just the deadlines or is there other things?

I would say mainly the deadlines and maybe customer demand. Yeah, that's probably the most of it. If I could take away having to deal with budget and schedule, Then I think I would love still working with project teams, building people up. Okay.

I have a suggestion. Working. Do you think you're fairly valued with your current leadership if Jade and I came to your place of work and you weren't there and we said, Hey, what do you guys think of Angie? What do you think they'd tell us?

I think I'm valued. They tell me a lot that I'm one of the key people that they want to try to keep and build up and leadership and things like that.

Here's what I'm going to suggest. I'm going to suggest that you go in and you basically tell them in your way, and you're very sweet and you're very kind. I just don't think you come across as entitled at all. You just seem so grounded. I would say, Hey, here's where I'm at. We just started trying for a baby, and I want to be here. I'm very much considering working, if this is true. But you don't know when the baby is going to come, and you said that earlier, and you're right. But I think it would be to your advantage physically in trying to have a baby if you didn't have this extra stress. We just know this is a fact. This isn't my opinion. The stress has all kinds of effects on the body. There's already desire to be a mom, and that's a pressure that's on you guys in this season. I would try to remove the pressure by sitting down and saying, Hey, is there a way to remove this and this from my role and me focus more on this stuff over here? Is that possible? Would you be willing to sit with me and try to figure out a way to remove some of this stuff off my plate?

I'll pick up some of the other customer stuff if it's not so much the high demand pressure situation. I think it's worth having a conversation. I don't think they're going to kick you out of the office and make you leave if you just have that conversation. Do you?

No, I don't think they will. I just think with the line of business and what we do, like contracting engineering firm, that it's- It may not be possible.

You're right. Okay, great. Then that's good information. Here's the deal. The question is, can you find a project management role that's more suited to you? What would it hurt to kick the tires and be looking right now? To your point, you may not get pregnant for a year. You may not get pregnant for two years. We don't know. To the extent that you can remove some stress in that part of your life, I would recommend it. It hurts you not at all to look, Angie. You know what you're looking for. You and I just went through the little quick exercise. You know what the perfect job description is, or at least a much better job description than the current one you have. Go look for it. Project managers are in high demand. If you can get a better setting, I would absolutely make the move while you're trying. Let's remove that extra stress. I think that's a great move. I would not, though, make that move and sacrifice much income at all, because that income is really great right now. Let's see if we can find something that's a better fit for you, emotionally and mentally.

Why not? That's a win-win situation. Hey, we're excited for you. Open Baby comes soon, you guys are crushing it. This is the Ramsey Show. All right, let's cut to the chase. It's easy to get discouraged about crazy house prices and interest rates. But when you have the right real estate agent to help you buy and sell the right way, you'll have confidence to make smart decisions.

Ramsey trusted agents aren't just experts who guide you through buying or selling.

They're someone you can trust to have your back from the first call to closing day.

Find a Ramsey trusted agent near you at ramseysolutions. Com/agent.

Ramsey solutions.

Com/agent.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. Jade Warshaw and Ken Coleman with you this hour, 888-825-5225. So excited that you're with us. I don't know if you know this or not, folks, but April is National Financial Literacy Month. Of course, that's a big deal to us because the entire month of April, teachers and students in classrooms across America are taking time to talk about the importance of good money management. To celebrate, we've got one of our Rockstar Foundations in Personal Finance. That's a curriculum that we have created here at Ramsey and is in schools all across the nation. We've got one of the teachers who teaches it Chris is joining us today. This is exciting. He is at Katie High School in Katie, Texas. Chris, how are you?

And it's she.

I'm doing great. How are you doing, Jake?

I apologize. That's okay. I guess I should read my notes. That's on me. It's okay. I saw the Chris. Sorry about that. I'm so glad you're with us. Tell us how long you've been at Katie High School.

I've been at Katie High School about eight years now.

Oh, wow. Fantastic. How long have you been teaching the Foundations in Personal Finance?

I have been teaching it for about 15 years now.

It's really cool. What grades are your students in?

Ninth, 10th, 11th, and 12th.

Very, very cool. That's the older kids.

Are they open to it? What's their attitude in this day and age?

Well, I would say the ones that are working have really plugged into it right away. But I have a lot of students that don't work. But I think the information is still good them because anyone that I talk to and tell them what I teach, they're like, I wish I had had that class when I was going to high school. So I think the seed is being planted, and they're at least getting the information before they actually get a job. But the ones that have a job, the most exciting thing to me is that they tell me, Ms. Davis, my savings account's a lot bigger now. They ask questions about how they can invest. And so it's just exciting to see that they are getting this before they start their lives and their careers.

So Where do you find… There's always a little bit of pushback area. Where do you find where they have the hardest time getting their head around? Is it this debt concept? Tell us more. What are the points that they embrace and the points that they're like, I don't know, Ms. Katie, you might need to go a little deeper for us.

I think the budgeting. I think for them, budgeting is foreign to them. I keep stressing to them that if it's in your budget, you can put in your budget that you're going to spend money, but you always need to have that savings component and have it mapped out so that you know, just like Dave says, where every dollar is going.

That, I think, is probably the hardest thing for them to do.

You've been teaching this curriculum for 15 years, you told us, is that correct? Yes, that's correct. And eight where you are currently. I'm curious if any former students, if you've stayed in touch, or maybe they've come back by the school or schools that you've taught them in and shared how they're doing financially and how much your instruction through this course has played a role in that. Curious if you've got any fun stories.

Yeah. In fact, I ran into a student at a restaurant, local restaurant. He's like, I don't know if you remember me, but I had you, and he mentioned the high school that we used to be at because I was at another high school before. He just said, I'll never be able to thank you enough for teaching me that you have to save your money and you don't need a credit card. That was nice because, again, they're getting bombarded with, You need a credit card and you need a credit score. Just teaching them that, no, you don't need a credit card, and you don't need to worry about a credit score if you do things right.

That's good. I would imagine a lot of the students probably are taking the information home, right? They're taking it home to their parents, even. Do you hear anything about that?

Well, in fact, this one young man, he had told me that his dad and he were going to get a house and they were going to rent it out, so they were going to start with rental property. He was asking me about what I thought about that. I thought, That's a great idea. I said, That's income that you're going to start earning. Him and his dad were going to be working on it together. But basically, the main question I get at this age is, How do I invest? Where do I start? How do I start saving? The ones that are really interested want to start right now.

Yeah, that's cool.

Just as an educator who's actually been on the front lines with this particular curriculum, I just want to know what your thoughts are that we're seeing so many states now adopting our curriculum, and it's being required for high school students. It feels like this is something we should have been teaching for a long, long time. What do you think about the value of this in general?

Well, and that's one of the reasons I enjoy teaching it, because I feel like I've taught different subjects throughout the years, and you always tell them, You're going to need to know this, you're going to need to know this.

But I can honestly say that this is going to make a huge in your life learning this now.

So true. I love history, Jade. But Chris, I got to tell you, I've always loved history. But even I can't remember everything I learned in history class. But this stuff, you don't forget this stuff because it's just a part of your everyday life.

It's not the Pythagorean theorem.

I can't even spell that, much less remember what it was.

I've taught math, and I would tell them, Oh, you're going to need to know this, knowing that no, they really weren't.

But this time it's for real. This time it's for real.

This time it's for real. Well, Chris, You are a rock star, and you really represent so many teachers across the country that care deeply. I know it's getting tougher and tougher to be a teacher. I know it's hard, and the environment's not always the best. I love the fact that you've been teaching as long as you have, and certainly we're grateful that you're a part of this movement in teaching our foundations and personal finance. On behalf of Jade and I and our entire team, we want you to know we really appreciate you.

Well, I appreciate you all. Like I said, this has just been a blessing to be able to teach this to my students and make a difference in their life. I may not see it right now, but I know down the road, that seed has been planted.

That's right. That's so good. Thank you for being with us. We know you got a lot going on. I want to mention for any teachers that are listening, and quite frankly, anybody that knows a teacher, if you're listening right now, be sure to let them know about our Ramsey Teacher Appreciation Giveaway. This is sponsored by Ramsey Education. One teacher who enters will win a 5,000 $3,000 vacation, and two more teachers will each win a $3,000 vacation. All you got to do is go to ramseysolutions. Com/teacher. That's our main website, ramseysolutions. Com. It's at konglimes. Com/teacher2enter. Again, if you're a teacher, please do this. If you know a teacher, tell them about it, because what a fun thing this is. Again, a $5,000 vacation. These are men and women who are, let's just be underpaid. They are so invaluable. They are instructing the greatest resource this country has, and that's our next generation. So please spread the word and check that out. It's always fun to do this. Do you have a teacher? I just always love when we get to talk to these teachers because I always think of my favorite teachers, the ones that I would want to go back to and say, Hey, you know what?

You really made an impact in my life. You got a favorite teacher?

Let me think about this. Okay, so Mr.

Walling- Or a coach.

Oh, yeah.

Because you were in the same idea.

Ms. Grogan was my volleyball coach in middle school and high school. Okay. Ms. Grogan. Ms. Grogan, she was great.

Have you stayed in touch with her?

Not really. Sorry. Don't look at me like that.

You know what? I apologize to you. If you felt there was any judgment, that was not my point.

I felt a little bit.

No, but can I tell you this? I was a little surprised because you went on to play at the next level. I'm surprised you haven't done a drop-in on Ms. Grogan.

They did a drop-in on me. They She came to a couple of the games, which was cool. She brought the team, which was pretty great.

Why was she one of your favorites?

She just was really great. She had a good balance of love and toughness. You know what I mean? She really just... I don't know.

She's a great human being. She was tough, but you knew she was tough because she cared about you.

Yeah, she cared for us, and she was a great coach. I enjoyed playing for her. Then Louis Walling was my theater and show choir teacher. He He was the first person that introduced me to Broadway. I remember we listened to Les Mis in his class, and I was like, This is amazing.

Did you ever perform in Les Mis? Did you do a production of it at school?

No, I didn't. You didn't. I didn't. But it was the first time that I… I didn't grow up with Broadway, so that was my first introduction to that. I was like, This is really cool.

Very fun. Love that. Got to love the music teachers, by the way. Yeah. Great.

I love it. Then Mr. Crawford was the first person who ever mentioned investing. Mr. Crawford? Yeah, he was a music teacher, but he told us all about if we invested, what we could have.

He introduced you to Broadway and investing.

Well, this is a different guy. Okay.

I'm trying to keep up. I'm trying to keep up. I was going to mention a few. I'm judging you, Ken. I was going to mention a few, but Jay took up all the time. I'm sorry. I can't even share my teachers. I'm sorry. Next segment. No, hey, we love you teachers. Fun stuff. All right, quick break. We'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show.

Do you listen to The Ramsey Show for motivation?

You want to know what's even more motivating? Attending a Ramsey event, the ultimate motivational experience that's fully focused on helping you eliminate money stress. Join us for the total money makeover weekend on May 10th and 11th in Nashville, and leave money stress at the door for good.

Podcast listeners use the code 50 off to save $50 on standard-level tickets.

Get yours at ramseysolutions.

Com/events.

Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. If you need help budgeting You need our budgeting app, EveryDollar. It helps you manage money the Ramsey way. Everydollar works wherever and however you need it to, iOS, Android, or online. You can start EveryDollar for free if you'd like to right now, and it'll help you figure out, Hey, where am I? Where is my money? Where is it going? Get organized, personalize your budget, and stop overspending so you can save. If you're brand new to Every Dollar, we'll show you a long-term financial roadmap. Track your networth, debt-free date, retirement date, baby step progress, and so much more. You could download the free app for iOS and Android, or go to everydollar. Com. Ken Coleman, Jade Warshaw with you this hour, 888-825-5225. Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania is where we're going now, and Will is there. Will, how can we help?

Hi, guys. How are you?

Good. What's up?

As a 23-year-old who's been working for about a year now, is it, one, realistic, and two, is it wise to be able to pay for a wedding and then also afford a house within the next year.

Well, it depends on your income. Yeah.

We got to know some numbers. If it's realistic. Tell us.

Gross, I'm at about 55,000 net around 36. I have about $40,000 in student loans, just under $40,000. I've already paid off about $20,000 of that. No car payment. I have a company vehicle, so no gas or car payment.

Okay. Anything else?

I just got engaged this past weekend. My fiancee, she grosses about $60,000 in net, I'd say 35 to 40,000.

Did you pay cash for the ring?

Yes.

Great. When you guys get together, she'll be making 60,000. When you guys get married, she'll be making 60,000. You'll be netting 36,000. You've got 40,000 in student loans. Does she have any other debt? No. Okay, so no debt from her. The The question you asked is, within a year, is it realistic for you to… Basically, within the year, you would have to pay off the $40,000 of debt, save up 3-6 months of expenses, save up a down payment to be able to get the house, and your cash flowing a wedding. There's a few more variables. Is anybody else helping pay for the wedding? Is there a family involved or anything like that?

Her parents are paying a little bit, yes.

How much is the wedding budget?

I'd say between 20 and 30. I'd say 25,000.

Okay. If you say they're paying a little bit. What have you guys determined that that is?

I'd say around 10,000.

Okay. You guys are on the hook for 15,000 for the wedding? Correct. Yeah. Okay. I think that the first thing here is we've got to map this out. I'm not going to lie, just looking at these numbers right off the bat, I'm going to go with no. Yeah, me too. Simply because you're netting 36,000 and Then your student loans alone are $40,000. That math automatically doesn't math. Your fiancé is not going to reach over and pay your student loans until you guys are married. That's out of the question. The only other piece of this is just putting your priorities in order and just saying, Okay, what needs to happen first? First things first. When is the wedding? Then that's going to we back out of it from there and say, Okay, the wedding. Have you guys set a date?

Yeah, May 17th of 2025.

2025, May. So now we back out of that and go, Okay, if we're aiming to spend $15,000 on that wedding, how much do we have to save each month in order to make that happen? Because a lot of the stuff you're paying for up front, so you got to get going on this right now. So that would be priority number one. And then, priority number two would be, and if I have extra money, I'm throwing it extra to pay off my debt. So I think those are the two things that you focus on, because honestly, Me buying a house, even if you didn't have this debt, and even if you told me the wedding was going to be fully funded by parents, I would still tell you, you don't need to buy a house within the first year of marriage. You just need to chill out, get to know each other, rent, or do that thing. I want to lift that off your shoulders. Ken?

I couldn't agree more. I wouldn't add anything. Jade's right. Just take your time. There's this big rush, and I understand it's cultural. You think everybody's doing it. But, man, just learning how to be married is hard enough. And figuring out maybe where you guys want to live. Enjoy the stress, a stress-free environment of just renting and not having to take care of anything except each other. I like that. Just relax and stack some cash. You guys are so young, and you're going to be okay. Here's the point. You're not wasting any time at all. I love that advice. Ricky is in Stanford, Connecticut. Ricky, how can we help?

Hi. Pleasure speaking with you guys. I listen to you guys all the time, watch all the YouTube videos. I just have a question on, do I Should I be gazelle intense on paying back the more obligation that I have for my mother's parent plus loan the same way I'm approaching my personal subsidized loans?

Can you Can you be specific with the numbers?

Yeah. I have 28,000 under my name, which I'm planning on paying off within 18 months. Then there's 57,000 under my mother's name that has so far accrued, I don't know, $10,000 of interest since I've been in school. Well, I'm out of school now, but when I was in school, plus the pause, and then now we are here today.

Well, what was the agreement? When you were taking out these loans, was the agreement Mom said, Hey, I want to do this for you, and this is my contribution. I'm signing these loans, and I'll pay for them? Or was the idea, Hey, you can't take these out in your name, so I'll take them out in my name, but you need to pay them?

The latter. Okay. I was planning on putting 1,500 towards what's under my name, so the 28,000 that's under mine. I was planning on doing 1,500 a month. That's what every dollar has allowed me to see now. Okay, great. The 57,000, the minimum payment on that one is like 250 after it was a dumb decision, consolidating for the safe plan because parent plus loans did not automatically qualify for it. So back in November, when I wasn't in this mindset, I made the decision with my mom to consolidate them so could qualify for it. So I could pay less per month.

Okay. Well, you're here now. So now you've got this $250 minimum, which if I were in your shoes, you're working a debt snowball here. I'm assuming that the student loans are the only thing in your debt snowball. When you do that, you do. You pay the minimum on everything else except the debt that you're focusing on. The debt you're focusing on, all the money goes onto it, anything extra that you can find. Yeah, it makes sense. The 28,000 Can you focus on that one first? Put as much of it as you can. You said it'll knock it out in 18 months. That's great. Then, yeah, to answer your question, you take that same intensity, and then when it's time to focus on the $57,000 debt, you go hard in the paint the same way.

Yeah, I'm on that train 100%. I struggle with the fact that I'm 27 now, and I see other friends buying houses, getting married and stuff.

Okay. Well, they may be broke, too.

And even if they're not, hold up. Even if they're not, even if they're doing fine, you made a choice in life. That's right. And I teach my kids all the time. You're responsible for you. So you decided, Hey, I'm going to get this education. I'm going to take out these loans. And when You decided that, you simultaneously decided, and I'm going to spend the next however many years of my life after I graduate, cleaning it up and paying them back. So you can't compare your life to someone else's life because your choices are different.

Right.

Hey, I just want to add to that because she crushed it. You could struggle all you want to about it, but it's still your reality. Instead of grousing about it and grumbling about it and overth it, do something about it and get on the other side of this deal.

How long will it How would you say you would pay off the 57,000?

After my 28, I would say if I'm planning on doing the 28 within 18 months, I would probably do the 57. I don't know because rent is It's going to be different within a year or two.

My point is, even if it takes you three years, you have spent four years on this thing. And when you look at your whole life, four years is just a little drop in the bucket, bud. It's going to be worth it for you to knock these out and get them behind you. My guess is it's going to take less because your income is going to go up.

I agree. He's 27 now. You're a young whipper snapper. You got this. You're going to be fine. You're going to be very wealthy, by the way, if you follow the baby steps like Jay just laid out for you. Good stuff. All right, quick break. We'll be right back. This is The Ramsey Show. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show. I'm Ken Coleman. Jade Warshaw is alongside. The phone number is 888-825. 5:2-2-5. Our scripture of the day comes from Deuteronomy 28:12. The Lord will open to you his good treasure, the heavens, to give the rain to your land in its season and to bless all the work of your hand. You shall lend to many nations, but you shall not borrow. Our quote of the day from Thomas Jefferson, I'm a great believer in luck, and I find the harder I work, the more I have of it. Good stuff there. All right, to Toronto, Canada, we go. Sahil is with us. How can we help?

Hi, Ken. Hi, Jay. Thank you for taking my call. Sure. I purchased the Total Money Makeover book, and I want to say thank you very much for that. It has totally transformed my life and how I handle money. I want to get in 10, and I'm on baby stuff on number 2, and I'm going to pay off my debt and then get my degree. But the issue is I check at nearby stores, like Subway grocery stores, and they said, We're not hiring. We already have thousands of business. I needed your advice on, should I get a security guard or a forklift license, or should I try Uber or Instacart? Which one will be more lucrative?

Well, I don't know, and I don't think Jade knows the answer to that because we're not familiar with what those are paying in Toronto, but I would go with the one that pays the most right now because of the reason why we're getting it. It's just all about cash here. It's not about great fit other than if I've got the talent to do it. For instance, if the forklift driver, I'm guessing that one pays the most, but do you know?

Yes, I did check with some warehouses, and they said that minimum, they pay 20, and with the experience, they'll pay more. Then if I were to pick up week-end shift and there's extra money, like bonus pay for that.

What's the cost to get the license?

Somewhere between 100 to 300. If I were to learn the most common for a clip, the counterbalance, they said it's 100. If I were to learn all seven, then it's like 300.

You'd have to compare the numbers because in Toronto, I don't know what people are earning driving Uber. What can you make?

Did you run the numbers on Uber?

Yes. I mean, I did research online, and majority of the reviews are that they don't make even minimum wage. But if they then they drive at night, then they say they make some money, but they still say that we aren't here in the car, it's not worth it. That's what I'm looking for. That's your answer.

That's the easy answer. I'd rather drive someone else's forklift than drive my car and put wear and tear on it. I think that's a pretty decent skill to have. It seems like you can get over time as well. Yes.

And that's what I'm hoping for, that I can do evenings and weekends. And I put my study on hold because I really want to pay it off. And again, I know that this one will, even when I'm in school, because after reading the book, it makes more sense that I want to cash flow the study. I want to pay cash for it. Yes.

Come on, man. Yes.

Because I was thinking to get student loan, but not anymore. My mind just… I woke up in the morning and there was a paradigm shift. It just like, I'm like, That's great. Nice.

Yeah. I don't want to borrow money.

So, Hill, you just gave me…

Jay, you're fired up, aren't you?

Yeah, it's great. Yeah. I'm like, even more case, I'm going to save up cash. Even if I have to move away from Toronto, I'm buying in cash, going for a cheaper house. Wow. This guy gets it. That was the reason. Because the book made me so frugal, I'm even thinking about spending $100. But back in the days, I wouldn't think at all to spend $100. That's why I called them. I'm like, Okay, I'm going to check that I'm making the right decision because I'm careful with every single penny now. Then I was like, Yeah.

You got it. Listen, choose the one that makes you the most cash because you know what to do with it. We're not worried about you. You got a clear focus. So love that. Let's go to Palm Beach, Florida, next, where Charles joins us. Charles, how can we help?

I guess it's a little similar to… I currently make around $16 an hour. I'm 20. I don't have any debt. I have a I have a little bit of an emergency fund, but I don't feel like it's enough for what I want to do with my life.

What do you want to do with your life?

I want to be more successful. I want to be less reliant on people. I live with my mom. I know that that's not something I should be ashamed of right now, but I don't think there's anywhere for me to go at my company. I'm a barista, and we've talked about management and stuff, but I just don't want to rely on that. Even that wouldn't be making that much. I want to go through a program to become an aircraft mechanic. It's about an hour and a half commute, so I don't think I would be able to work through it, or at least not as much as I would want to. I would have to do a student loan.

Why? I don't think so. How much is the aircraft mechanic school all in?

It's about 50,000, and it's a year and a half. A year and a half. Growing up, my mom's company offered to pay for school, but right when I got around 13, 14, they pulled that. That's why there was no- Okay.

All right. Well, let's just play this out real quick, okay? It's going to cost you 50,000 all in, and you said it's an hour and a half commute. Is it a five day a week, four day a week program? How many hours?

Five days a week. It's five days a week? They said 6-8 hours a day.

6-8 hours a day. That's a pretty big all in deal. But you said you had a little bit of savings. How much do you have in savings?

I have a thousand for an emergency fund, and in my Roth IRA, I had about 10,000. Ten,000?

I can't touch that. No, we wouldn't want you to. That's not why we do Roth. Okay. You're living with mom and you're making, what did you say, 16 an hour?

Just about, yeah.

You're how old?

I'm 20.

Yeah. I got to tell you, have you just thought about doing the basic math on 50,000 and just say, All right, over the course of a year, could I put away two grand, three grand a month because I'm living with mom and I don't have any responsibility?

I would think about starting early next year, and I would be able to save up, I think maybe 10 by then. But I would need- No.

You keep saying you need loans. No, you don't. You need some patience. Here's why. I'm going to challenge you. You're 19. If you saved two grand a month for two years, that gets you to the $48,000. It gets you two grand shy. Okay? Come on, man. Two grand a month. Here's my challenge, Jade. What does Charles need to do to save two grand a month? By the time he's 21, he's able to pay cash for the aircraft mechanics school.

He's already doing it. He lives at home.

I know. I think it's already there.

It's already there. Tell me, what else do you have to spend money on besides… You don't have a car note. You are not paying rent, I'm assuming, unless you're paying mom a little something, something. No.

I pay for the house taxes every year.

The taxes? How much is that per year?

It's like $3,000.

Okay, that's something. That's one paycheck. Less than $300 a month. Yeah. What I would do in your shoes, Ken is exactly right. Before taxes, you're 2,500 a month. Why can't we work more and make this happen fast? You're doing the barista thing. Are you working 40 hours a week?

Yeah, I try to. The way the overtime works is they don't want us to touch over time.

Not over time. I just want to know, are you working 40 hours a week?

It ends up that it's a little over 35 because of the way they schedule it.

You need a new job or two jobs or three jobs. You're 19, bro. You want to be successful and make money? Go do it now. Not wait for it.

In your position, I want you with two jobs. I want you with a nice full-time one where you're working 40 hours a week, more than $16 an hour if you can pull it, and then a nice full side hustle on next to that so that you can stack away this money as quickly as possible. You're in a good position. I love that you're at home with your mom in this situation because it's going to allow you to save up more money and you have the margin you need to really make this happen. And Ken is right. On a bad day, this takes two years. So on a good day- I bring home about 2,000 a month.

Yeah, but you're missing what she's telling you. You have no expenses. You live with your mom.

This just means you're not going to Sonic. You're not going to- Maybe not partying.

Yeah.

Bro. I don't do any of that.

Then you have the money.

Then go make more money and save more money. And before you know it, you've saved up the 50 grand to not have debt.

And in the meantime, Ken, what can he do to determine if this is really the path he wants to?

I'd be hanging out with mechanics, car mechanics, aircraft mechanics. You don't have to drive an hour and a half to hang out with some old bird. He's been doing it 40 years. His knuckles are all beat up. Let's find out if we really want to do this, because $50,000 and the time it takes to save that is joke. So let's figure this thing out. Hang on, I'm going to give you my new book in the assessment, Find the Work You're Wired to Do. This will help as well. Thanks for the call, young man. Please don't do the debt. Jade Warshaw, always awesome to be with you, my friend. Great show. Thanks to James Childs, our fearless leader, and You, America, this is The Ramsey Show. Hey, folks. Dave here. You want to hear even more life-changing content from Ramsey? Download the Ramsey Network app so you can catch all your favorite shows all in one place, like the Ramsey Show, Smart Money Happy Hour, and the Dr.

John Deloney Show.

You'll get real talk about life, relationships, money, and your career. Plus, the app lets you browse by topic like debt, business, or selling your home. Get the content you want whenever and wherever you want to listen. Download the Ramsey Network app today.