Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. I'm Dave Ramsey, your host. Jade Washaw Ramsey, personality, best selling author of the book money's not a math problem. She's my co host today as we answer your questions at 888-825-5225 Liddell is with us in Memphis. Hi, Liddell. How are you?

How you doing today, Mister Ramsey?

Better than I deserve. How can we help, sir?

Just got a quick question. Recently, just got my car repossessed. Yes, sir. And I'm trying to see what's my next course of action. Been watching you guys for a while. I'm just trying to see my next course of action. How can I come back from that? Pretty much.

Wow. So you just woke up and it was gone out of the driveway?

No, sir. I actually seen them when they actually pulled it.

Okay. All right. That is a. An emotional experience, isn't it?

Yes, sir.

Feels. It feels like somebody stealing something.

Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

Yeah, I think that's why these repo guys get so much crap off of the customer. It's because they're, like, slipping up in your driveway, taking your stuff out of your driveway.

It's.

It's dangerous. It's. Wow. I'm sorry, man. So how much was the car payment?

The car payment was about $584.

Mm hmm. How much did you owe on the car?

It was about three, maybe three grand on it. I definitely went over maybe a hundred days on it.

Just $3,000 is all you owed?

Yes, sir.

Oh, wow.

And what was the car worth?

From what my documents I'm looking at, I believe in the range of about 2020 grand or something like that.

Oh, so you had bought this car, almost paid it off, or put a bunch down. So what happened that you were not able to make the payment? Tell us what happened in your situation.

Really just, you know, just really negligence on me. And just when I lost my job in November, which was my main means of really my means of employment, that I. So that I could pay the bill, but I lost that job in November of 2023. And just from there, just covering my other stuff and, you know, and just really just neglecting the deal almost, I.

Would say how long ago this happened.

It was. They pulled it like. Like a week. Like a week or two ago.

Okay. Have you talked to them about paying it off and picking it up?

Yes, I have. And they had told me that I would have to pay the full amount the $3,000, the 3000 plus, you know, what's. What's the car owed on the car? Which was, I think the amount they told me was like 21 if I wanted to recover.

Oh, you're saying. So I see.

So you didn't owe $3,000. You were behind 3000?

Yes, sir.

You owe 21 in the car's worth 20.

It was. It was. It was at, like 18 before they added the fees and.

Yeah, yeah. But you owe as much as it's worth.

Yes, sir.

Okay.

Got it.

Oh, man. Are you back to work or you doing anything? What are you driving in the last two weeks?

Nothing right now. Because I just. I didn't have anything.

Yeah.

Pretty much saved up to. For another means.

Are you single?

I'm trying to. Yes, sir.

Okay. All right. So, what, you've been sitting at home for two weeks? How you getting around?

Well, I really just been applying for jobs and if anything came up, I could, like, uber or something like that at the moment.

But what are you doing for work and what are you earning currently?

I was working at GameStop. That was, like, my last recent job, but I just recently wasn't even there anymore. I only was working for, like, two days a week. You know, something like this by choice.

Or because they didn't have the hours.

Just in the other hours, I would say I just came in on the job.

Okay.

What about now? I'm not working at all.

Listen, if I'm you. You know, I do think that everybody kind of has an ideal work situation in their mind of something that they're shooting for. And sometimes you can hold off thinking, I'm just gonna hold off until I get the job that I want. But in your case, you can't afford. You literally can't afford to do that for many reasons. Your self confidence and, you know, you need cash. Like, there's many reasons to take any job until you get the job. And one of those things is self confidence. The more you sit at home, the more you're gonna feel some type of way about yourself and what you're able to accomplish. But if you go out and get any job and take the first job, number one, it puts a little money back in your pocket. Gives you a little boost of feeling good about yourself.

Like, do you have a friend that works construction, Liddell?

No, sir. Not that I know. I have friends that work, like the railroad companies and stuff like that. Maybe.

Yeah. Call him and ask him if they'll put you on and he can give you a ride to work for two weeks till you can get a check and get you a $1000 car. Yes, sir. Your car that got repoed, we'll circle back to that is the least of your problems right now. I'm more worried about you eating and paying rent and keeping the lights on and getting your life back on track than in that stupid car. It's kind of good that that car's gone because it was a reel hanging over your head problem. So here, I'll cycle. I'll go ahead and give you the full answer on the car so you know what you're looking at. But let's focus 99% of your efforts on finding a ride to work and getting some kind of work going 50, 60, 70 hours a week right now. Go crazy, man, and make you some quick, easy money somewhere. Just, just working like a maniac and bum rides off of friends for two weeks and then go get you or catch an Uber, whatever you got to do, but, but go. Then go get you a thousand or $1,500 car and pay cash for it.

Okay? Is that a plan?

Yes.

The other car, we're just gonna let them have it.

Okay.

And then here's what's gonna happen. They're gonna sell it on a repo lot. You owe 21 with all the fees. They're gonna sell it for 1214 thousand. Okay. That's gonna be six months from now maybe. And then they're gonna come knocking on the door. Not literally, but they're gonna send you notes and start threatening you that you owe them the difference. It's called the deficit, 21 minus whatever they sell it for. Let's call it 14. So you owe them seven. Okay. When they do that, they will settle that for about $0.20 on the dollar. So you probably could settle that old bad debt, that deficit on the repo for somewhere around 1500 bucks when it comes to you. Okay? I'm not going to be far off. It might be a thousand, it might be 2000, but it's somewhere in that range. It's not. You're not going to owe them $10,000. They're going to come at you for seven to $10,000, but you can settle that for pennies on the dollar. You understand what I'm saying?

Yes, sir.

But in the meantime, obviously, and that's probably going to be a year before you hear from them on that, okay? So we're going to put that repo, as nasty as it is in the back of your mind and try to get to work and get your current life straightened out as fast as you possibly can here. I think that's what's going to matter, is what Jade said, because the way you feel about yourself and the sense of desperation, the knot in your stomach and not in your throat, I've been there, man. It's no fun. It's terrorizing, terrifying. And so, yeah, I want you to get some cash coming in that place, then go get you a little beat up car that's reliable and get your life started back. And then pile up some cash to get ready for when they come at you later on. This is the Ramsey show.

Hey, guys, it's Rachel Cruz here to tell you about a faith based alternative to health insurance that can make healthcare more affordable. Christian healthcare ministries. CHM allows members to share each other's healthcare costs. And it's as easy as one, two, three. Step one, choose the healthcare provider you want. Step two, submit your eligible bills. And step three, get reimbursed. CHM members take care of your eligible medical bills. With no network and the freedom to choose your healthcare provider, CHM is the best option for christians who want to take care of their families and help other believers. Find out more@chministries.org. Budget. That's chministries.org budget.

Jay Washaw Ramsey, personality, is my co host today. Thank you for joining us, America. We're glad you are here. Open phones at 888-825-5225 Jay is with us in New York City. Hi, Jay. How are you?

Hi, Jay.

I mean, sorry.

Hi, Dave.

Hi, Jade.

How you doing? Good.

Good, man. Good to have you. How can we help?

Well, so just give you a little background story. I like more than four years removed from college, graduated the engineering degree, working out here in New York as a GC and yeah, moved out my parents house mainly because of taking your advice, you know, wanted to set out in the world and, you know, make sure, you know, I'm not freeloading. Right. So my question today is, in doing that, I don't know if I prematurely bought a property. I ended up buying a one bedroom a few years after running my first place. And now I've been getting hit with increases on, like, maintenance and HOA payments and just been hit with an assessment. And so I'm just wondering how I can cash flow this assessment that's kind of been set before me a couple days ago. The amount's like 16,000.

For what?

So I think in New York we're doing a. Most buildings do like a local law eleven, like, facade restoration for, like, older buildings because I bought a pre war. And so that's kind of what they, we owe, like the contractor, I think, or the building does like 600,000. And they're saying our maintenance payments aren't enough to compensate that.

So before they hired the contractor, they did not get this approved by the HOA because, I mean, if you hire the contractor for money you don't have and you're running the HOA, then you got to know that you're getting ready to slap the occupants with an assessment. You had no notice of this before now.

Yeah. So, I mean, when I bought the place, I, you know, I did my due diligence, tried to ask about, you know, the finances of the building because it looked like this work was underway even when I bought it two years ago. And, you know, when I was in the process of doing that, I wasn't notified that this was like a potential. And, you know, I raised the red flag. You know, I listened to your advice occasionally on like, high hoas, low hoas, and I raised the red flag because it did seem pretty high, but, you know, kind of shopping around, it seemed. Yeah.

What do you mean lower end?

98,000.

Okay, what's the, what's the unit worth today.

Based off like the last, probably like 150.

Okay, and what do you owe on it?

I put like 25 down. I owe like 100,000.

Okay, so you. But you haven't had it. You haven't actually looked at comparable sales lately. Where'd you get the 150?

I assumed based off what the actual value was when I got it two years ago.

Yeah, that ain't going to do with the value today. I mean, it could be worth. It could be worth 250 and you wouldn't know it based on that.

No.

Yeah. You need it. You need to do some research and find out what they're actually could sell for today because it sounds like it might be a good idea to sell it because everything you've described about this has not been fun.

Yeah.

All I've heard, every, every mention of this was, well, I probably bought something I shouldn't have bought. Well, it's a problem. Well, I thought there's a thing on the front end and bunch of hoa fee increases and then they hit me with the assessment. And every single time your voice is just talking about. Your voice just sounds whipped. I mean, you sound like God, man, I'm just. This thing's awful. It's, it's, it's consuming a lot of your calories, isn't it?

It is. I've also, like, been renovating the place, kind of getting it up to 21st century, because, you know, I'm in. I'm in the GC world, so I've been kind of using my resources there.

How much does it take to finish it, to get. To get it ready to put on the market and sell it?

Well, I want to renovate the kitchen next, so.

No, I don't want you to renovate the kitchen next. What, is it torn up right now?

No.

Okay. So you could put it on the market today?

Yeah.

What's wrong with showing it?

I. There's a stipulation here. Like, when I sell it, there's, like, a flip tax, they like to call it, where I think a certain percentage of the sale goes back to the building.

What percentage?

I guess I would say around, like, 40% is in my head right now.

Oh, bull crap.

That's crazy.

Yeah, that didn't happen. No, you're. You're confused, okay? You need to dig in and find out what's really going on here. You got all these demons running around your head, and you. None of them got a name. So you need. You need to get some clarity on some of the information. There's not a 40% kickback to the building when you sell a condo or a co op in New York City. I mean, it's just not now. They probably gonna get the 16K out of the closing from the assessment to be able to do the transfer, but you at least got rid of the problem then. So I think you need to do some investigation. It doesn't sound like you want to sell it. Cause when I brought it up, you're like, huh? So I don't know. I can't tell with you.

But he also didn't say how much money he's put in so far.

Yeah, it doesn't matter to me. It sounds like there's nothing here that's fun. It's a pre war building. It's all screwed up. They're redoing the facade. He said, I'm redo the kitchen. Redo, redo, redo, redo, redo, redo. And extra fees. Extra fees, extra fees, extra fees, extra fees. This thing sounds like a money pit. So, I mean, you do what you want to do, man, but I got to tell you, all, real estate is not a good deal. Real estate as a category is a good idea. But there's some serious dogs in the. In the pound here, and this one sounds like it could be. Could be on the list. So it's either that or you start scratching together money, pay the 16 and then scratch together the money and do the kitchen. But you don't do the kitchen. Do you take care of the 16? But after you do the catch and the 16, you're still going to face the 40% kickback if that's really there. I don't think it is. I think you're confused. And after you do that, then there's going to be something else. And it sounds like this hoa is poorly run, so expect other increases and other situations to come at you here because you bought into a mess, it sounds like.

So either live with the expectation that this is a constant flow of money or get out. Do one of the two. Do one of the two, but you can't live there and then act like you're surprised anymore. There's nothing here that's surprising anymore. The pattern is established.

Absolutely. I'd get out instantly. And if he doesn't make any money off of it, then it's a lesson learned.

Yep. Our question of the day comes from Caitlin in Ark or Caitlin in Arkansas.

She says, I'm a divorced mom to two boys and my ex doesn't provide any help financially. I work from home and earn about $40,000 a year and have the proceeds from the sale of our home in an Hysa, from which I draw about 15,000 a year. My only debt is 16,000 on my car and my payment is $260 a month. I could earn more if I got a job outside of the home, but with childcare for kids, it would end up being a wash. I have 50,000 in savings and that earns me about 3000 a year. The kids need clothes and shoes and all their activities add up so quickly. I don't want them to be able, I don't want them to not be able to pursue their interest. Between rent, a few streaming services, food, car payments and insurance, I just can't make it all work without drawing regularly from the house money which I need to keep for security and comfort. How do single parents budget? That's a good question. Number one, single moms are superheroes and single dads are superheroes. I don't know how you guys do it. I'd be asking about child support.

Number one. Yeah, that's my first question. Why isn't this guy paying?

He's got kids. Have a judge help him with his attitude on that.

And number two, looking for something that you can do part time from home while you're home with the kids.

In addition to this, and kids activities are not necessary for life, even if they think they are. Mm hmm. So that's way down on the list. After. It's interesting you put those before your food, car payment, and so forth. So I would pick up the everydollar budget and get started on a detailed type budget, and I think you're gonna find some money. This is the Ramsey show. Listen, everyone needs id theft protection. It doesn't matter your age, how much money you have, or where you live. We all worked too hard to build our personal and financial reputations to have some thief rip them to shreds. Trust me, it's an absolute, absolute nightmare if you become a victim. But wasting money on overhyped, expensive plans doesn't make sense either. That's where Xander's id theft plan comes in. They've bundled together the services you need at pricing that can't be beat. Whether you're looking for monitoring, that includes your home title, VPN encryption, unlimited recovery services, or stolen funds protection, you'll get that and more at great value while dealing with people you can trust. I've seen these guys in action, which is why I have Xander's plan for my family and our entire team.

Go to zander.com or call 803 564282 to get protected, save money, and stay ahead of the identity theft nightmare. Jade Washaw Ramsey personality is my co host today. Open phones at triple 8825-5225 Stephen is with us in Dallas. Hi, Stephen. Welcome to the Ramsey show. Hi.

Thank you for taking my call.

Sure. What's up?

So my wife and I are getting ready to go through a life transition. My wife is a teacher, and she's wanting to stay home next year to be with our almost one year old. And so we're just. We're both really excited. We're just trying to figure out what we can do to kind of prepare ourselves for it. A little bit of background. We took a little bit of some financial course when we did marriage prep through our church, but it didn't really go in depth in finances. And so after that, I kind of took the reins of finances, and we're new listeners, so after a couple episodes, I realized, oh, it shouldn't be me doing all of this. And then we talked about it. We both want to get on the same page with our finances and get out of debt and kind of get ready. So we're just trying to figure out what we can do.

So do you have an every dollar budget?

We do not.

Okay.

That's step one, and we'll make sure we get you hooked up with the information you need on that. But what I would start with is I'd open up my everydollar budget, and if I know it's going to just be your income, I'm going to start doing the budget with just your income and see where you land, and that's going to give you a picture of what life is going to be like with one income. That's step one.

Okay.

And so what do you earn right now?

Joint, we're at about 110 myself. I'm at about 67.

Okay.

What's she doing?

You said she's a teacher, didn't you?

Yes, she's a teacher.

Yeah. Okay.

Okay.

So she's the other 57, basically.

Yeah.

Okay. And so then my next question is, what baby step are you guys on?

So we just started looking at that, and we haven't started the baby step, so we're still in conversation about it. But we have in debt right now, we're about 31,000 in debt. We have about 41,000 in savings. So we're talking about just using what we have in savings to wipe out our debt, and then we'll be debt free.

Okay, that's great. I would go with that plan. I mean, that is our plan. So you guys need to talk about that and get on board with the same plan. But if you're asking for our advice, it is that. I'd say take that 41,000, clear out the debt. That leaves you 10,000 left, and add whatever you need to that to call it six months of expenses. If you're going down to one income, I would definitely, you know, we say save up three to six months. In your case, there's one income, you've got a new baby. I'm saving up six months of expenses between now and when you're making this transition. And that would be my plan. And then, of course, you have to look and see, okay, what does this mean, looking at the budget? What does this mean for us? Because life is going to change. You're living on half of what you were living on, which is a big deal.

Right?

Are you homeowners?

So we are actually in the process of selling our house. When we found out we were pregnant, we kind of fell into the trap of, oh, yeah, we need to go buy a house. And we definitely overbought. So we got a good deal on our rental that we're really happy with. We're wanting to kind of settle in here, and then once we get finances a little bit more situated and we're both on the same page and relook at the housing market again.

What are you going to make on the sale? Anything?

We're not sure yet. We're hoping to break even and just kind of clear the note. But with our, we had a meeting with our realtor yesterday, and, yeah, that's kind of the best hope we have right now.

Steven, you're making really good, big decisions to be able to hit the big goal of her being at home. So, you know, you're looking for more information. You looked online, you talked to us, you're gathering up, you looked at, you're considering talking about paying off the debt. You're learning to work together. You put the house on the market because we can't afford it on my salary. And you be at home because this doesn't work. The math doesn't work. So you're doing all the right things. You're making all the right moves. There's a lot of wisdom in every move I see you making. So keep all of that up and we'll have Christian pick up. We'll get you signed up for the everydollar premium, folks. That's our world class budgeting app. It helps you manage money the Ramsey way. It's iOS Android online. Smartdollar is free if you want to start it out that way, and you can immediately see where you stand. Get organized. Personalize your budget. Stop overspending. Save more money. If you wanted to connect to your bank and drop your, like, your debit card stuff directly into your budget, it's very smooth and very easy.

There's a small charge for that, and that's the everydollar premium process. So if you're new, we're going to give you a long term financial roadmap in every dollar. Track your net worth, track your debt free date, track your retirement date, your baby step progress. And we're going to proactively coach you through this. So it's an app on iOS, an app on Android or desktop at every go get it for free. We're going to give it to you, Stephen, and guys, help you guys hit that goal of your wife being at home with the babies, which is where you're wanting to be, and we want to help you get there. That's your goal. That's what this does. So what it amounts to is this, okay, budget is a cuss word. People use the budget like it's a cuss word. Like, I don't want to be on a budget because budget, as Rachel says, budget people aren't fun, but is a punishment.

That's what I used to think.

But for an adult, that puts what numbers they want to put on their budget. The budget's not telling them what to do. They're telling their budget what to do to accomplish goals that matter more than their short term Friday night feelings. And so all a budget is, is you're doing your money on purpose. That's all it is. And so John Maxwell says, a budget is people telling their money what to do instead of wondering where it went. That's all it is. And, you know, you get to decide if you want your budget to be punishment. You can decide that. If you want your budget to have a lot of wiggle room, you can decide that. You write down what numbers you want to write down. But what we found is, is that people, when they start writing it down, they go, eh, that's kind of stupid. I don't need to do that. And you start making judgment calls as soon as you're writing it down. You know, I got it, we got it. We gotta back off on that. That's ridiculous. When you actually look at the numbers, the numbers will yell at you and tell you to straighten your act up, you know, and so I don't have to tell you all that stuff.

And the budget doesn't tell you anything. It's like when you were four years old and you're fighting with your sister. Not the boss of me. Remember that? You're not the boss of me. Well, the budget is not the boss of you. You're the boss of the budget until you get it built. And you're building it to be the boss of you. But you're the boss of the boss. So you're good. Everything's good. So check it out. Every dollar, it'll get you going. All the correlation of all the data we have of 30 years of doing this, 10 million people going through financial peace university, the ones that do a zero based budget, every dollar has an assignment before the month begins and agree on it with your spouse are the ones that achieve their financial goals. No one accidentally wins the Super bowl. Winning is not an accident. It's a series of intentional acts. And that's what this is.

Win win. Hey, if you want to check out the premium version, you can put in everydollar.com jade and I'll give you $15 off a premium.

I still need a slash. You've got a slash still.

How did that happen?

I don't know. We have a jade slash. We need a Dave slash. How much? How much should my slash be?

Worth.

Ooh.

I'm gonna go with should it be more or less.

I think you're totally.

Your name is before the slash.

My name's before the slash.

Thank you.

That's right.

Ramsay solutions. Okay, funny. All right, so Jade has a slash after my name. There we go. My ego is. Feels better now.

Feeling better now.

I think I'm going to survive now. Yeah. So, Jade, you've been doing these webinars, you and George and Rachel, a lot on the, on building out your every dollar budget. What's the question you're getting in the comments? Because we take questions live during the webinars. What are you all getting the most about putting together? Is it still people feel like the budget is bossing them around?

Not really. We kind of identified four main questions, and the first one is, how do I even get started? A lot of people are feeling the tension of, I don't feel like I make enough money to make a budget. And you kind of spoke to that, which is, yeah, let the numbers talk and tell you what you need to do. Because for some of us, if it.

Feels that way, might need an extra.

Job, you need an extra job.

Or some of us just need to pull back on the lifestyle that we've had, and that's what's eating up all your money. And so kind of walking people through the zero based budget and how you're giving each dollar an assignment and be open to what the numbers tell you.

There we go. That's how that works. This is the Ramsey show.

This episode is sponsored by Betterhelp. Hey, if you're like me, at this time of the year, all of the school plays and meetings and invites from everywhere have completely drained your social battery. Or maybe you're like some of my friends who are bursting with energy so much that everyone may be telling you to just chill out a little. If you're having trouble navigating mismatched energy levels, boundaries, or finding people to do life with, it might be time to talk to a therapist. Therapy can be a place to open up with someone who's been trained to listen and walk alongside you and help you find paths through the chaos of mismatched energy levels and more. If you're thinking of starting therapy, try Betterhelp. Betterhelp is completely online and flexible enough to fit your schedule. Just fill out a short questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapist at any time for no extra cost. Find your social sweet spot with betterhelp. Visit betterhelp.com deloney today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp h dash e dash p.com deloney.

Jade Washall Ramsey personality is my co host today. Thanks for being with us, America. Luke is in columbus, Ohio. Hi, Luke. Welcome to the show.

Hello.

Hi.

How are you?

Better than I deserve. How can we help?

So I can kind of use a unique situation here. 22 years old, household income of 90,000. We inherited six acres of land and decided to build a house on it. We don't have any debt. We have not taken any loans on the house. I've built it so far, where you got the roof, walls, and siding, and almost done with utilities. But our goal is that I pay for all the bills, and then my wife, she pays for all the materials for the house. My question is, should I take what's of my income after the bills and throw it towards the house or put it towards retirement?

Okay. You're trying to build a house out of your pocket, and so far you have. But you and your wife have separate finances.

Uh, well, we work together for finances, but not really.

Just, uh, not really.

Okay.

You've delegated part of it to her and part of it to you. You don't have one pile, so you need one pile of money. Her money, your money is our money. One big pile out of that pile. What is our first goal? I would assume it's to finish the house, isn't it?

Yes, sir.

So what does it take to finish the house, money wise, how much money?

We're looking at probably about ten grand left. We got drywall, insulation, and paint.

Okay. How long, if you pile all your money, you and your wife, our money, in one pile, how long does it take you to come up with ten grand?

Well, probably month or two.

Yeah. Okay. So let's finish the house, and then you may need to make sure you have an emergency fund of three to six months of expenses, and then take 15% of your household income, our income, and start that towards retirement. That's baby step four. But you're gonna be living in a paid for house. That's nice.

Awesome.

You got this acreage, and you built the house. You got a lot of sweat in it, and you're gonna have a bunch of equity, right?

Oh, yeah, for sure.

What's this finished product going to be worth? Acreage and house total?

We're hoping for 250.

Good. Very cool. And you said you're 26? 22. 22.

Wow.

Okay. Wow. And your household income, if we put both of your money in one pile, is how much a year?

90,000.

How much?

90,000.

90,000. That's the two of you combined. Okay, good.

I make 62. She makes 28.

Okay, cool. Perfect. Yeah. So let's take 15% of 90,000 after we get the emergency fund in place and you're sitting on $250,000 house, you're going to be millionaires before you're 30.

Whoo.

That's exciting, not fun.

I hope they take your advice and put their money in one pile.

Well, that's the thing. Yeah, so there's. Yeah, there's just so much data that says when you do that, that your higher probability of winning at marriage, winning at relationship, winning at everything. And let's circle back and say this, nothing to do with Luke's call, but just this, because we get so much bull crap on social media about telling people, put their money together. You should be independent. No, you shouldn't be independent if you're married. That's a dumb butt idea. This is how your marriage doesn't work, because you're so strung out on you that you're worthless as a spouse. So that. That's the problem. So, no, you don't need to be independent. You need to be one. The preacher said. And now you are one. One. Uno, unity, all in one. And so if we know, and we do know that, the data tells us in America today, the number one cause of divorce is money fights and money problems. The number one solution to that is learning to dream together and put our money together and handle our problems and our challenges and our opportunities and our dreams together. That is the solution. Where you don't have money problems, cause divorce.

If we have the solution to the number one cause of divorce, why are you arguing with us? That's just dumb. Because people out there are dumb, and we will always have a show for that reason. So there it is. Not all people out there are dumb, but enough of them are dumb. But we will always have this show.

Are they dumb, Dave, or do they do dumb things?

They're ignorant. Ignorant's different than dumb.

That's good.

Ignorant is.

I don't know how. There's things I'm ignorant of, by the way. I don't know how. I used to know. When I was a young redneck, I used to know how to work on a car, but now a car looks like a spaceship when I open the hood. And so I can't even. I don't know if I could jump the thing and get a jumper cable on it nowadays without blowing it up. So, you know, so but the dad is there. I don't know how to work on that car. I doesn't mean I'm dumb. It means I'm ignorant. I don't know how to do that. But then don't argue with experts when you're ignorant because it makes you look dumb.

I'll take that, dude.

I'll take that. Wow. And Luke was doing none of that. Luke's a sharp young guy at 22, man. He's got it going on, doesn't he?

Yeah.

Oh, most definitely. I don't even. I was nowhere near that, so.

Yeah, I don't even want to talk about it. Jason was in Raleigh, North Carolina. Hi, Jason. How are you? Hey, guys.

How are y'all? Can you hear me okay?

Yes. What's up?

Hey, I just got a quick question for you. I'll give you a quick, quick rundown on my situation. I'm trying to decide if I should sell my house. I live about an hour outside of the Carolina Metros right now. I'm planning to make a move this summer. I'm self employed. I sell real estate. And so on my new market, I'm going to have to kind of start from the ground up. I'm near the end of baby step two. If this move wasn't happening, I'd be done probably by June or July, maybe August. The flip side. So the question is based, where are.

You going to live when you move?

I'm going to rent.

Okay. And so your question is whether to keep your house or not?

Yeah.

No, just sell.

Yeah.

You don't need to be a renter and be a landlord. That's bass ackwards.

That was risky, Dave. That was very risky.

That's what I needed to know. Yeah.

I mean, really think about it. That's backwards. You don't want to do that.

So.

No, you need to get. You're in the real estate business. You're going to get plenty of opportunities to own a property and live in a house that you pay cash for and. Or buy it and then get it paid off as quick as you can. Hanging onto this boat anchor that represents your former life out in the burbs when you're moving into the metro and having to deal with that while you're trying to learn to sell real estate and trying to get your business moving.

Nah.

Yeah.

That's where my mind was, and I thought that was right. I just wanted to make sure.

Yeah, you were. You're right on track, man. You're right on track. So there you go. Here's the thing. It's interesting. Real estate is such an emotional topic because it has these two strange elements to it. Strange element number one is it is an excellent way to build wealth when you do it right as a part of your long term plan.

Right.

That give then gets confused with, it's always smart, no matter what.

That's a good point, Dave.

And it's not sometimes real estate, doing a real estate deal in the wrong situation in your life could be not, you know, in Jason's. It's just. It's just a bad idea. But in other people's, it's even way over into the stupid zone.

Yeah, for sure.

And so real estate is. It's weird. It is. Because it's a blessing when you do it right that gives everybody permission to do it even wrong, and it becomes a curse.

Yeah. And I think also, the other thing that I think we're fighting now is so many people had properties that they locked in at a better interest rate, and so then when life moves them, they feel like, yeah, it's a good deal. Maybe I shouldn't get rid of it. Even though I'm moving, I should keep it. It's like this weird to it.

It's like. Because real estate is good. I can't. Everything I do with it is going to be smart.

Right. It just falls in line and it's.

Like, no, it's not going to be smart. You know, it's not smart. The only way that you know, there's a good time to cut real estate loose, there's a good time for it to not be there. And buying. Buying real estate you can't afford. Buying a house you can't afford. We had that earlier in the hour.

That's right.

So we got to sell the house as mom wants to come home and not be a teacher and be a full time mom. That's cool. But we got to sell the house. We bought a house we can't afford. See, it's not a blessing anymore.

That's right.

It's a curse.

It's a problem.

Yes.

So doing it wrong or keeping it wrong or. Because real estate's good. It's not always good. Yeah, because. And it's not that real estate is actually, real estate is always good. It's the life situation you're in doesn't match up with owning real estate. Right then.

Yeah.

And so it's not always good to keep your old house and rent it. Matter of fact, it seldom is.

Yeah.

Very seldom. This is the Ramsey show, live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions. It's the Ramsey show. We help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. I'm Dave Ramsey. Your host, Jade Washaw Ramsay, personality number one best selling author of the Ramsey Quikrete. Money is not a math problem. The real reason you're broke and what to do about it. She's my co host today. The phone number is triple 8825-5225 Renee is in Nashville. Hi, Renee. How are you?

I am doing better than I deserve, Dave. How are you?

Better than I deserve. How can I help.

You?

I'm really glad that you took my call and. Hi, Jade. I have a lot of plans, too.

Yes.

So my thing is that I'm needing some clarification on how to get a mortgage through Churchill mortgage with a manual underwriting and everything, without having a credit score. So, background, I will be debt free in August. I have 75, 77,500 left to pay off on my consumer debt out of $22,074.75. And it will be done in August, be done with baby step three before January 25. And I will be starting to pay my house off. And by my calculations, I will have the house paid off in two years. So 2027, the house will be paid off. I want to move. I hate my house. I hate everything about it, including the location. I should have never bought the house. And it was actually a curse to me in the beginning because I did not have my three to six month emergency fund saved up. And Murphy came in a big, huge storm.

Everything.

I had to replace so many things in the house. And I know better now. I know I will make a profit when I sell the house, but I'm probably going to have to get a mortgage, considering I don't know what the market is going to be doing.

What will you, when you sell the house, what will you come away with?

I don't know. Maybe about 2000, $200,000 maybe.

And then what would you want to purchase the next house for? What? What's your range?

It's two years from now.

Yeah, this is about two and a half years from now, maybe three, because I really want to renovate because I would be embarrassed to sell this off to anybody.

So you've got it. You've got a little journey here. You've got a little timeline in front of you. So your biggest fear is, is this true, Jade and Dave, can you actually buy a house with a zero credit score when the time comes? Is that your question?

Yes. And I have been listening to George Campbell's book, by the way, please tell him he did an amazing job on the audiobook. Absolutely love it.

We agree.

And in the book, he said that he bought a house with zero. With zero credit score, and interest rate that he got was the same interest rate that somebody with a perfect score credit score would get.

That's right. Same here, by the way.

Okay.

And on a 15 year fixed rate, which tends to get you a better interest rate as well. So it's all true. It's absolutely all true. Just know, you know, if you're doing zero credit score manual underwriting, I mean, there's. There's limitations. You can't just borrow to the moon and back, you know? Right. So, you know, going in with some cash and then adding, you know, whatever you're going to add to that, that's great. And I think it's one of those things. I'll be honest with you. When I entered the baby steps, Renee, there were a couple of things that I pushed back. It was like my logic just hadn't caught up yet. It was very hard for me to accept that you can actually buy a car in cash. And it was very hard for me. I remember being like, dave, don't let me down, because I'm about to have zero credit score, and I want to know that this works. And there is part of that that you just walk through the process, and even though you've heard everybody say it and say it and say it until you experience it for yourself, then you go, oh, my gosh, this really does work.

This is real.

People do this. That's what scares me, is not having a credit score. I'm never buying. I'm never getting credit cards again.

See, here's the thing. Here's the thing, okay? When you say out loud, what scares me is not having a credit score, what you're really saying is, I'm worried that I won't have a good life without debt.

Okay?

It's the same thing. Because there's only one thing the credit score is used for, and that's getting debt. So I'm worried I can't have a good life without debt. That's what you say when you're saying, I'm worried about not having a credit score. Now, what you do need to do, on a technical basis, is make sure you don't have any open accounts, even with zero balances. So if you've got old credit cards that are still open but zero balances, you need to close the account completely, because an open account, dinging that crib, ringing the bell over at the credit bureau is going to keep your score there, even if it's a zero balance. So you need to close all debt accounts completely down, including the 7501. As soon as it's gone, you need to make sure it's closed. And then they. It takes them about a quarter, maybe two quarters, to notify the credit bureau that they're. That the account no longer exists. And when you have no active credit accounts of any kind, about six months later, typically your credit score, it becomes indeterminable or zero. And that is the goal. And what I decided, because I didn't have a choice, you had a choice because I went broke, was that the great FICO is not worthy of my adoration.

The great FICO is not worthy of my worship. And I don't need to bring the great phyco God offerings of interest and other stupid things to have a good life. Don't worship at false idols, because this is a false idol. It does not provide you. It's not an indication you're good with money, it's not an indication of your net worth, it's not an indication of your income. 100% of the variables in the algorithm that create a FICO score have to do with your interaction with debt.

That's right. How much debt you have, what kinds of debt you have, what percentage of the debt available to you that you're using.

It's all about what you've been playing kissy face with the bank. That's what it is. And so when you, so you could get a million dollar inheritance, it doesn't change your FICO score one dime. You could get a million dollar raise at work. It doesn't change a FICO score one dime. So the point is, it is not a measure of financial health. It is a measure of how much you've been playing kissy face with the bank, how much debt you love. That's an I love debt score. And I love debt thoroughly, is what an 800 score says. It says, I have paid them so much interest because I just love banks. I think they're awesome and I want to give them my money. That's what an 800 score says.

That's right.

It's an I. It's a Hallmark card to the banking industry district. Instead, I want to give them a salute. This is the Ramsey show. Jade Washall, Ramsey personality, is my co host today. Trying to think now. It's been probably two years ago. My buddy's over at the daily Wire, called me and said, hey, wanna have dinner? A buddy of ours named Vivek Ramaswamy is in town, and you need to know this guy. And I'm like, okay, if you say I need to know him, we'll go have dinner. So we all got together, had a lengthy dinner, had a great conversation. Next thing I look up, the guy's running for president. But you did come on the show before that, after that, and talk about your book, Woke capitalism, right?

Yeah, woke Inc. Was my first book.

Woke Inc. Yep. Well, Kink. Yeah, that was it. And because you were working on a whole movement in the hedge fund world and in the mutual fund world to offset some of the woke stuff that's happening on Wall street. But then I look up and you're out there making a very interesting run. We had some email interactions, just personally back and forth while you're out there doing that stuff. That's got to be quite an adventure to be out there bumping heads with Nikki. I know Nikki, too. She sat here, too. And with, of course, President Trump and everybody else and all the different players that were involved. It was very interesting.

It was eye opening. And I think the thing I learned from traveling this country, Dave, is that we're taught to believe that we're divided. And that's what I thought going into this race. I'd say my most positive learning coming out of it is that if you actually talk to human beings, from New York to California to the midwest, as.

Opposed to talking heads.

Yeah. As opposed to digital impressions of human beings, if you talk to actual human beings, 80% of us in this country share the same values in common right now. And I think half the 20% that we think are on the other side are people who are younger than me, who never learned those values in the first place, who I think will come along believing in free speech, meritocracy, the pursuit of excellence, the rule of law, just basic rules of the road that regardless of race or political affiliation, for that matter, Democrat or Republican, even 80 plus percent of us in this country, I think, still are united around certain basic principles. And I don't say that in some cheesy kind of way. It was, I think, a surprise to me. You go into this from the world of cable news and digital and social media, creating the artifact of division that I don't see actually existing in real american homes and interactions. So the question is, how do we call the bluff on that division? I tried to do some of calling a lot of bluffs on the campaign of the media and of, I think, a lot of government dishonesty that's left this country worse off.

But I'm hopefully proud of what we began, and we're going to continue it in other ways.

One of the things I've talked about from stage in our events for many years, and it always gets a cheer, regardless of political affiliation, is the idea that if you can get out of debt and get on a plan and increase your generosity, the things you can do. And I can show some examples of when an entire community does this. How many St. Jude hospitals we can build with, how many foster children get a home. When we the people start taking care of we the people, it becomes very inspiring. And the beautiful part about it is the byproduct of that is it puts the government out of business.

It does. And the beauty of this country is we're the best country known to man to at least give people that opportunity. And every one of us has our own unique God given gift, right? And I think that this is a country we use a word like merit. I use that word a lot. But what does it mean? I think it's living as part of a system where everybody can achieve the maximum of their God given potential without any government or any system standing in your way. And that's what got us this far, 250 years into this country. It's what allowed me to live the american dream that I have, and a system, I want to pass it on.

A system can be a negative system.

Oh, absolutely.

Racism, sexism, those are some systems. And so without any system, not just a bureaucratic system. Right.

Yes, exactly. Exactly. And that's the beauty of this country. And, you know, I'm an entrepreneur by background. Politics was new to me. I learned a lot about politics. Not all of it was positive.

Most of it, I would say, was.

Left me, I would say a little more cynical, but a little bit more informed on the other side of it. I'm an entrepreneur by background. I start companies. And so that's part of what I've gone back to in the meantime is the world of entrepreneurship and driving change through the private sector in changing this country for the better and meeting the needs of. I think, for example, you talked about woke capitalism. One of the companies I had started before I ran for president was a company called strive that competes directly against Blackrock and State street and vanguard. By standing for actual corporate purpose, companies should do what allows them to be most valuable, not pushing somebody else's social agenda. That's part of how we drive change in this country, too, is it's not just going to be done through the government, but through our educational system through the private sector as well. I think people can drive a lot of positive change, too, and I'm trying to do that.

In the meantime, Vivek Ramaswamy is with us. Jade Washaw is my co host. Jade.

Yeah, I want to know. So one of your ten truths that you talk about is the idea that capitalism can lift people out of poverty. A lot of people would push back hard against that. They feel like capitalism is one of the things that's keeping them trapped. So talk about that a little bit.

Yeah, sure.

And I want to distinguish between crony capitalism, which is a perversion of the real thing, and actual true capitalism.

That's a good distinction.

And it's important, right, because many people who are earnestly frustrated with what they see as an oppressive system of capitalism isn't really the real thing. It's this version where companies, through lobbying and other forms of non competitive measures, are using the force of government to create barriers that stop them from achieving their dreams. You see this in the pharmaceutical sector. I mean, a lot of the lobbying results in less competition, which contributes to high prescription drug pricing. So when people say, I can't afford to buy my medicines, well, part of what they're having frustration with isn't capitalism, but the capture of a healthcare system that isn't working as efficiently as it should. You see, in the health insurance marketplace, a lot of health insurers are not really, not a lot of health insurance brokers aren't really serving up the right plans for their actual clients to select.

But that's the.

The product of crony capitalism, which is a perversion of the real system. My first distinction is I might share your same frustration. I probably do. Companies should not use the government as a lobbying instrument to block competition. Now, on the flip side, look at actual free market capitalism. The only way you're able to get ahead as an entrepreneur or as a business is if you're providing something of value, of greater value to the person who's paying for it, than it takes it, costing you to provide it. And that's fundamentally an other regarding activity. So if you're actually providing something of inherent value to somebody else, that is what's lifted people up from poverty. It's why us stock market returns have outpaced european stock market returns for decades. Because their model of capitalism is to have capitalists try to take care of social issues. Whereas the US model of capitalism is one that says when companies are creating products and services that serve people and stay true to that mission, that actually creates wealth for everybody.

Real capitalism is where profit is. The applause your customers give you exactly. For having served them well. It's beautiful. It's that simple. And so, you know, money or the making of money when it's done in service of human beings.

I haven't heard that line. I'm gonna take that, though.

I like that.

It just, when it's an act of service, one of our core values is here. If we help enough people at Ramsey, we don't have to worry about money. That's one of our core values. 14 core values on the wall. That's when I'm on the wall all through the building here. And so our job is to make sure that we are a blessing, and then we can't keep the blessings from flowing at us.

It's actually interesting you mentioned that. It's even one of the pieces of advice I give to young people. So you're talking about the customer side. Even if you talk about the labor market or the job side of it, young person can't find a job. Here's my advice, too. Show up somewhere and volunteer to work there. Make yourself so valuable and indispensable such that when it comes time for you to find another opportunity to move on, they won't let you leave. They're going to actually pay you what you actually deserve. And so it goes, whether you're an employee looking for a job, business, selling a product, I love that. Bathe, do the right thing.

Bathe, smile, have some energy, bring it, add value. And you can't. They won't. They'll do anything to.

They're not going to let you go.

They're not going to let you go.

And that is cap, to me, that's capitalism is actually, you provide something of value to somebody else, either as a worker or, or as a company or whatever it is, without the cronyism in government, the corruption that you see of lobbying the government to be able to mess with that competition. That's true capitalism. That lifts us up.

There's such a distinction there that you speak about, and I agree with you. Why do you think it gets grouped together when we can see it so distinctly different?

Yeah, well, I'll be candid on this. I think that the republican party has assumed the mantle of standing for capitalism. But much of the republican party has been corrupted by some of the same forces of crony capitalism, subsidies or favoritism or corporate welfare, such that somebody else earnestly saying, okay, you guys stand for capitalism, but you got the bailouts in 2008. That happened in a republican administration.

Yep.

The republican president, republican treasury secretary, bailed out institutions that took on way more debt than they needed to, way more leverage.

You're not hearing. That's what they did. I gotta go, brother. Vivek Ramsay. Check him out at Vivek G. Ramaswamy, at Instagram and at X. Be sure and check him out. Thanks for stopping by, my friend.

Thank you.

Good seeing you guys.

Jade Washaw Ramsey, personality, is my co host today. Thank you for joining us, America. Patrick is with us in Little Rock. Hi, Patrick. Welcome to the Ramsey show.

Hey. Thank you, Dave. And thank you, Jade. I am really honored to call you guys today. This has been a long time thing that I've wanted to do is call in and ask for some advice. Of course, there's many times I needed to do that earlier, probably, but I'm kind of in a little bit of a situation just recently. Let me back up a little bit. My daughter, two years ago, she was born with a very rare genetic disorder called trisomy 13. She was very medically challenged for a long time. We were not able to work. I was not able to work like I needed to. And my wife was a stay at home mom, obviously, she was very to the point where it was really bad because she had to constantly be suctioned and things like that, and in and out of the hospital pretty much, I would say, 80% of the time. And then, you know, they told her. They told us that, you know, we had two to four days, maybe with her at most, and that was two something years ago. And she. She lived a long two plus years up until recently.

And she passed just January.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Thank you. God, though, is so good, and his grace is so good. Two days before she passed, we found out we were expecting another baby. And so God. God really knew what he was doing, because if that, you know, it's just the timing of everything that just gives glory to God, I think. But anyways, so we are in a situation right now, and I. Emotionally, we are obviously not where we should be. We are having a lot of issues and stuff, and work is. It's something we have to still do and still continue to go on. Before she passed, though, I had started. I've been a paint contractor for probably about 13 years, and I've been wanting to get out of that for about three years of that time and do something different. I started on the side business, doing, like, excavation and stuff like that. And that is taking off. Starting to take off. It's a little slow at first. But I don't. I didn't go out and get a bunch of debt.

And then how much did you make in March?

So in March we made about $2,000, which it's just a side thing right now.

So it's not just a side thing. What's your main gig?

My main gig is still painting and I also do like, like construction work and stuff on.

So how much did you make? How much you make total in March?

My income, not including my wife's, was probably about 3500.

What does your wife about 35.

She makes 2500 a month.

And what's your question, Patrick?

So my question is she is pregnant, obviously, and we are. I'm wanting to know if I should just go out and get a full time job and not worry about what I'm doing part time. Both of my businesses are basically part time. I guess I should say it like that.

Can you get enough business, you have the emotional energy, with all you've been through to get enough business to stay busy and make a living?

I believe I do. I honestly.

So you can go from 3500 to 4500 and by the end, the year be at 5500 a month average.

That's what I'm hoping for.

If you believe you could do that, why would you. If you think you can do that, why would you go get a job?

That's exactly. But I've been battling this because I don't know, like, I want someone to just tell me, hey, that's stupid. You should. You got a baby coming. Because my wife is going to be quitting. When?

Well, if you can make more and more and more money, that's good. If a baby's coming.

I know. Well, and I was. That's, that's exactly what I'm thinking too. But I have heard that it's not good sometimes to run with a side venture and not knowing what it's going to do. Honestly, I want to do that full time.

Well, you're combining the side one with your main one. Your main gig was the painting. You were making, you know, x off of that and then you added the excavation to it. And to be fair, in your own words, you haven't really had the time or resource or energy or emotional energy to put 100% into this. And so now you're, you're gonna start being able to do that.

And I think with all these are construction.

Yeah.

You're in the construction business. You do excavation, you do painting and you do some other construction work, right?

Yes, sir.

Yeah, just go do a whole bunch of it, man, one wild card I did not mention.

I didn't have enough time to, because my mind wasn't to the screener. But one thing that is the wild card in our cases. We're actually our house where we live at. We are actually living in a camper right now. Not, not permanently, just temporarily until we get our house built. We are building a house right now.

Jesus.

And yes, yes, and I know what you say about building a house and I, we did it wrong, but we're, we're almost to the end of it and we're gonna, we're gonna be happy with the result. But we're, if I could have, in retrospect, gone.

That doesn't change the answer about your business. No, I mean, if you're, if you're making 3500 towards 4500 towards 5500 in your construction business, that's going to assist in a new baby coming, that's going to assist in finishing the house, that's going to assist in you running your, running your life. If you go take a job making $3,000 a month period and you got a job, you're not going to make as much as if you go run this business well. But the honest question you have to do is you have to quit getting distracted by 63,000 things if you're over working on a stupid house instead of earning money to feed your family. See, that's a distraction. And so that house may slow way down while you speed this business up. Because, Patrick, if you've got the emotional energy with the tragedy you all have been through to go get after it on this business, you need to completely focus on making, stacking cash, making a big old pile of money. And if you all need to go rent an apartment and get out of the trailer because you had a pregnant wife, that's not a bad thing.

And then take an extra year to finish a stupid house, I'm fine. The house is the least of my worries. You growing this career, took care of your family is the number one job. And if you don't have the emotional bandwidth to do that and get out of that trailer with a pregnant wife, camping trailer, by the way, then, then you do need to go take a job. So. But the job is going to be less money than you could make if you can pull it together for the business.

I think so too. I think he just needs to add a couple more services on there and just get after it. Do whatever work you can do.

Take everything. Take everything and go and make a profit on all of it. And go and make a profit and go and go and go. And you can clean up and decide what, I don't want to do that kind of thing anymore later. But right now, you're doing it. Swinging a hammer, swinging a brush, you know, digging a hole. Whatever it is you're doing, get it done and do a bunch of it all the time and charge a lot and smile and smile and go make you some money. There is nothing wrong with that. All you're doing is taking care of people's problems. But, you know, job one is baby and wife. Job two is to grow your business to take care of them. Doodling with a stupid but construction house is way down the list of things you got to be worrying about right now. So if that thing sits, nothing for a little while, I'm okay with that. But you don't, you know, you don't need to be over there working at night when you could be working at night making money for your family. So right now, you don't have the time, you don't have the bandwidth to be swinging a hammer on that job.

You gotta swing a hammer on somebody else's job. It's giving you money. So that's what we're gonna focus on, is making money. And you, the good news is you're in a business that you just, soon as you start putting the word out and you just tell people, and you just go get another one, then go get another one. Then go get another one. You're gonna make a lot of money.

That's right. Oh, yeah. People always need something done.

Yeah.

People always need some handiwork done. Whether it's put me some bathroom tiles in, change out my bathtub, there's always something that's going on.

Always. Always. This is the Ramsey show. Here's the thing about investing advice. You can find it just about anywhere. But that doesn't mean it'll always help you with your personal goals. Here's another option. Check in with a smart vestor pro. These financial advisors can review your plan or help create one, one that's personalized to you. To find a smartvestor pro in your area, go to ramseysolutions.com smartvestor. Go to ramseysolutions.com smartvestor.

Ramsey Solutions is a paid, non client promoter of participating pros. Learn more@ramseysolutions.com smartvestor.

Jade Washall, Ramsey Personality, is my co host today. You do not have to lose sleep worrying about your money anymore. We want you to come to the Ramsey campus for the total money makeover weekend on May 10 and 11th. And we're going to show you how to get control of your life. How would it feel to know that you were going to be out of debt so that you could become wealthy, so that you could become outrageously generous? How would that feel? What would that do for your relationships, for your hope? It's what we do. And we're going to do that Friday afternoon, all day Saturday, May 10 and 11th, the total money makeover weekend. Not only how to get out of debt, but how to become an investor and how to be generous, how to work with your spouse. Ken Coleman's going to be speaking on increasing your income. Doctor John Deloney on increasing your peace. Jade Washaw will be speaking. George Camel, Rachel Cruz, and me. And so all of us, all the Ramsey personalities are going to be here. We're going to have lots of Q and A's. It's going to be very experiential.

And you're going to laugh, you're going to cry, and you're going to come away knowing you can do this. Bring your spouse that's reluctant. They will leave crazier than you are. Bring your friend who thinks you're crazy, and they will leave really crazy doing this stuff. It's going to be a lot of fun. Jade, I'm excited about this.

I'm excited, too. I can't wait.

Our platinum plus tickets are already sold out. You can still get a platinum ticket, a vip ticket, or a general admissions ticket@ramseysolutions.com. Events suggest you get them now. May 10 and 11th is coming up really, really fast. It's here on the campus at the Ramsey event Center. I'm excited to get to do a total money makeover event right here in our own backyard. Excited that a bunch of you are coming from all over the place to be here. You do not want to miss this event. It is life changing. Grayson is with us in Nebraska. Hi, Grayson. How are you?

Hi. Good. How are you?

Better than I deserve. How can I help?

Hi. So my husband and I have been looking at our financial goals, and it's just looking like it's going to take a long time to get over some humps. And so my question is basically, do I need to be patient or should we make changes?

Well, tell us the timeline so we can chime in.

So, I don't know the timeline exactly, but right now we have about $8,500 in our savings account, which is a little bit over our three month savings.

Okay.

And we're wanting to save for a house. We're renting right now, and I'm a stay at home mom. My husband makes 5075 right now. It's going to go up to 65 soon.

Okay. And so you're trying to save for a down payment for a house. That's the goal.

Right. And we are not investing yet, so we also want to start doing that. I'm 23. He's also 23.

So what percentage down are you trying to get to?

What's the goal now? 20% for 15 year fixed? Yeah, that's the ideal.

Okay. And so what does that mean for you on the.

How much money?

How much money do you need?

I guess I don't know for sure how much money we need because of, like, house prices fluctuating. We don't know exactly what kind of house we're going to want, but.

So how is it that, you know, if you're off track or impatient? I mean, you don't, you don't have your. If you have a target and a date and you don't think you're gonna hit that target and date, then you can ask you, you know, there's a hump. There's a problem. But right now, you're just. Right now you've just got a general idea. We'd like to get a house someday.

Oh, okay. Well, I'd like to get into a house quickly, but it seems like it's.

What is quickly, I guess, in the.

Next, like, three years.

Okay. And so how much can you save a year?

A year? I don't know, but I know monthly we save about 700.

Okay, that's 8400 a year. In three years, you'll have 24,000.

Okay.

You just need to do a little bit. You need to dig down and do some research on this and really get your head around the numbers. And then, okay, to Dave's point, you'll have 24,000. Go over and do the. How much home can I afford? Calculator on ramsaysolutions.com. And then you're going to be able to plug in the numbers, look at real estate in your area, look at what 20% of a down payment would be, and put it. Put real weight to these numbers and see what's actually possible. And then you can look at that and go, okay, if 24,000 doesn't get it, what do I need to save? And then you can actually have a real target.

Yeah. What have I got to pick up as a side job while I'm working, while I'm at home with the babies? And what can he do to pick up his income? Also above 65, so we can do more than 8400. And because if he made an extra $10,000 a year on the side, then for three years, that's another 30,000 instead of 20,000 down. We're now talking about 50,000.

That changes the game.

So that's, that's how you start backing into this and figuring out if you're impatient or not. If you told me you wanted 50,000 by the end of this year to buy a house, you make $65,000 a year and you don't have any money, then I would say, yeah, you're impatient, unrealistic. There's not any math in your story that's going to take you there. Right, but that's not what you're saying. And so you're three years. If you're 23, you're gonna be, you're gonna be 26. That's not a bad timeline. I kind of like that timeline. If it takes one more year, so what? Not the end of the world. We've at least are aiming at something. We've got a game plan, and we're talking this through. Yeah, but, but all good financial goals have a longer time horizon, meaning bad financial goals are leads you to doing nothing but partying. Thank God it's Friday. Oh, God, it's Monday. Long term financial goals are thinking the way you're thinking. Okay, where am I going to be when I'm 26? Where am I going to be when I'm 23? Now, what have I got to do to get to those things that we're not doing now?

What must be true that's not true now. To hit that desired future, as Henry Cloud says, and then, you know, then you're gonna be there. But I don't hear anything that's completely in dreamland or la la land here. I think this is all doable. You'd probably just got to think through, you know what other if we want to do this in two years or three years and we want price x, if we want a $250,000 house, then, no, you're not gonna be ready at 24,000.

You know, I think, to your point, Dave, you're right. There usually is an extended timeline, and I think people kind of get weirded out thinking, oh, my gosh, I'm gonna have to be disciplined for this amount of time.

You'll be disciplined the rest of your life.

Yeah, it's easy to be disciplined for.

And you don't have to. It's just if you want the house, that's what you have.

That's right.

If you don't get the house, you don't want the house, then you don't have to be disciplined.

That's right. But it's not going to be.

This is how you get things, is you make the money behave, and so that's what you're facing. Grayson, I think you're in better shape, maybe, than your emotions feel like you are. But I think it'll help the emotions if you lay down a detailed plan of exactly a, where we want to go, and b, how are we going to get there, and what are the steps to get there, and then what have we got to do different that we're not doing now to accelerate that plan? And you can start to have those discussions around that. That makes a lot of sense. So. Good question, by the way. So here's an interesting thing. There's a lot of squawking and carrying on that Gen Z can't buy a house.

Mm hmm.

It's impossible. Well, it is. If you make $57,000 a year and you live in San Francisco 100% and you're 23, you're not gonna buy a house there.

Yeah.

That.

That is impossible.

Yeah, that's. So you can't. But. So. But does that mean you can't buy a house? No. You can live in Omaha, Nebraska, and you know what? $200,000 to buy in Omaha. Nice house. A nice house with some cornfields in the back. Guaranteed. Guaranteed. There's some cornfields in the back, but. Yeah, the old corn Huskers.

Right.

So. But, I mean, it's. And probably some pheasants, but, yeah, the. So. But the point is that you've got to say, okay, my income, my dreams, and my location, all three have to be aligned.

That's right.

And so, when I started the show 30 years ago, the idea of living in Manhattan, downtown New York City, if you made $60,000 a year, and $60,000 a year 30 years ago is a lot of money. It was impossible. You couldn't do it. You're kidding. You can't live in 60. You can't. Couldn't do it. And you can't do it now, either. So, you know, it has to do with lining up your dreams with your realities instead of just wishing things were different. And Grayson's doing just that. That's why she's going to win. This is the Ramsey show, live from the headquarters of Ramsey solutions. It's the Ramsey show, where we help people build wealth, do work that they love, and create actual amazing relationships. Jade Washaw, number one best selling author of the Ramsey quick read and, of course, Ramsey personality. She's my co host today. The phone number is triple 888-25-5225 James is in Cleveland, Ohio. Hi, James. How are you? I'm all right.

And yourself?

Better than I deserve. What's up?

Hi. So a little bit of backstory. I'm a couple years out of college, and I've been working at a large public accounting firm since then. And I guess I am kind of at a point in my time doing that where I've decided that I might be looking to do something else because I don't get a lot of fulfillment out of it. And I guess I just have a hard time deciding, you know, how do I decide when to do that? And also, I guess, what career path to pursue, you know, because, I mean, I. An attraction to, like, you know, a management area. I have a minor in business management, you know, along with my degree, and I'm also for contacts. I've passed the CPA exam, so I have that for what it's worth. But it's just, I don't know where to go from there and.

Okay, so you went to an extreme amount of trouble to become an accountant.

Yes.

Okay. And you've discovered that the version of accounting that you do in a public accounting firm is not fun for you.

Yeah, I'd say that's accurate.

Yeah. So what is it? Because it occurs to me that possibly it is not that you hate accounting, it's that you hate accounting. There.

I suppose. I guess I was kind of afraid to try and move into another role just because.

What kind of other role?

So some other roles I've looked at are, I guess we call them in the industry. We call them industry positions. So you don't work in public, you work for a company. Like, I've looked at this hospital position that has accounting positions within various levels and a few other places, and they just haven't panned out. Like, you know, I've applied and I know that's not the best way to get into a position like that, but it just. It hasn't panned out for me thus far. So I.

That doesn't mean it's not what you want to do. Just haven't found the job, is all.

Yeah.

I don't think you know exactly what you want to do.

I think I'm, what I'm suggesting is there's a possibility you are not disillusioned with the accounting field. You are disillusioned with being an accountant in a public accounting firm, which is pretty much a grind.

Mm hmm. Yeah, for sure.

I mean, you're two years out of school, you said.

Yeah.

Yeah. So they're there dumping everything and his brother on your desk.

You're.

You're just in a, you know, you're just a widget machine right now, right?

It's about right.

Yeah. Well, no wonder it's not fun. But that doesn't mean accounting isn't fun for you.

I suppose.

I guess you sure have done a lot of it for somebody who hates it.

I mean, what would your ideal, if you, if you had your ideal scenario as an accountant, what would it be? And then work backwards from that.

My ideal scenario, and I'll tell you what it is here in a second, isn't something that I think exists in public accounting anymore. Just because change as an industry, that's fine. More of an industry.

Okay.

It'd be more of, like, an industry position, but so it's, I guess, more like the nuts and bolts of accounting. Like, you know, explaining, I guess, transactions and, you know, how they affect financial statements to people as they need it.

Because, like the accounting people do at Ramsey all day long. Yeah. They said they sit with the business units and they talk about how to do the business and tell them what the accounting is telling, you know, here. Here's the tea leaves. The tea leaves in the accounting reports are telling you in the business unit, this, this, and this, and what other. What other KPI's? What other things can we do to assist you to make your business run better? It's. It, you know, it's a live, breathing thing when you do accounting in a place like ours. Exactly.

And it's just, I don't feel like that's exists in the public scenario.

So don't do it anymore. So go get one of those.

Okay.

But it doesn't mean you have to go become a guitar player.

Yeah.

Or you have to get a degree in art.

Yeah.

You know, which would be like the other side of the spectrum from your brain. Yeah.

The other side, I guess. And this would be like a whole heck of a pivot, so to speak. But it would be, you know, if I'm just that fed up with it moving into, I guess, again, management or even crazy or a trade. But, like, I guess it doesn't sound like.

See, accounting is. Here's an interesting number for you, okay, of the CEO's of Fortune 500 companies, over 60% of them have an accounting degree, and most of them from public universities, by the way, not from muckity muck universities. So the accounting degree is very functional because in order to get an accounting degree, you have to learn business. Otherwise, accounting doesn't even make sense. And so you're qualified to walk in to business settings and create. I mean, you're probably inexperienced in business and so you've got some, probably got to get some calluses, but you have the ability to go create some serious business acumen over the next decade and maybe be a CFO somewhere, that kind of thing. And so that's, that's what I'm saying it. And that's really not that big a pivot. It's using your education and your natural bent and your skill set just to apply it in a different place that has more life to it than the widget machine you're stuck in.

Yeah.

So I don't, I don't blame you. I mean, what, what, I think what you're doing would make me want to, I mean, I couldn't stand it, so. But I couldn't stand just generally doing accounting all day anyway because I'm not detail enough, but because I'm not that. So here's what I want you to do. I'm going to send you Ken Coleman's get clear career assessment and his new book, find the work you're wired to do. Okay. And the book explains how. It explains how the career assessment works. But I think the career assessment, just from talking to you, I might be wrong. It's a very, very good tool, by the way, we've sold almost a hundred thousand of them and we've now put them in this book. So, folks, when you buy the book, find the work you're wired to do. It comes with the career assessment, a code to take the career assessment on our website. And it's, it really gives you insight. So I think it's going to help you a ton, James. And, and I think it's going. My opinion is, and I, you could call me back and tell me I'm crazy later.

Yeah.

It might tell you something else. It may tell you to be an artist, but I think it's going to tell you you're doing the right thing in the wrong place.

All right. Well, I, I hope that it gives me some direction. I really appreciate that information. Those thoughts.

Sure. I'll send that to you. You hang on. And the team will pick up and we will get you signed up just for that. So, um. But I get the sense that James is not doesn't suddenly hate numbers.

I don't think so. There's many applications that you can do the same skill set. Yeah, I'm a version of that.

Yeah, that's true. That's true. We never would have thought the lady on the cruise ship stage is going to end up a Ramsay personality. But both of them have microphones.

The same skill set.

This is the Ramsey show. Do you listen to the Ramsey show for motivation? You want to know what's even more motivating? Attending a Ramsey event, the ultimate motivational experience that's fully focused on helping you eliminate money stress. Join us for the total money makeover weekend on May 10 and 11th in Nashville and leave money stress at the door for good podcast listeners. Use the code 50 off to save $50 on standard level tickets. Get yours at ramsey solutions.com events. Jade, Wash all Ramsey personality is my co host today. Thank you for joining us. We're glad you're here. Hey. Rachel Cruze's second kids book, I'm glad for where I am, is available today. It is book launch day. That's right. Rachel has an exceptional gift of storytelling that both parents and kids enjoy. These illustrations bring the adventure to life. It's the perfect gift for kids. I'm glad for what I have. The first book was about contentment versus entitlement. I'm glad for where I am teaches you about gratitude, particularly about home. And I'm glad for what I have. And I'm glad for where I am. Or both. In our store. You can order your copy@ramsaysolutions.com store and Rachel's going to be out and about tomorrow.

She'll be in Phoenix signing books. And on April 17 in Los Angeles the next day, April 18 and Dallas April 20. The following week in Atlanta on April 27. So do a little story time. Read the books. Read the book and bring the kiddos out and get the books signed. These books are the first one to hit the children's number one bestseller list. Number one on the best children's best seller list. I'm trying to get that right out of my mouth. And this one will, too. They are. They're fabulous. I've already been reading them to the grandkids. Of course, I've got an inside track on this. And so the grandbabies love it. The Ramsay grandbabies endorse Rachel's book. I'm just saying. So good stuff. And the book is, I'm glad for where I am. And if you can teach kiddos gratitude, you can teach them contentment in a world gone crazy. Grateful people. Content people are peaceful, highly attractive people. And that's what you want your kids to grow up to be. Yeah. This is the Ramsey show. Jade Washaw is my co host. Aaron is in Des Moines. Hi, Aaron. Welcome to the Ramsey show.

Hey, thanks for having me.

Sure. What's up?

I am. So I just have a couple of questions for you. I'm around $785,000 in debt, and I have an idea of how to tackle it. But my wife is on board with my idea. So I just want to get your advice on how to tackle this and what you would do in my situation.

Is that including a house, it is.

So it's a primary that I owe 450 on, and I have a secondary house that we move. It was our primary. So we're still within that window of capital gains we were to sell. But I owe 192 on that one.

What's it worth?

It's worth about 325.

Okay, and what's the 450? The house, you owe 450. What's it worth?

Around 490. We just bought it less than a year ago, so it hasn't.

All right. And so you've got 200, 650, which leaves 135 in other debt. What is that?

Yeah. So two of them are vehicles. About 40,000 of it is our vehicles. One for me and one for my wife. About 15,000 is personal debt. Six of it's a credit card, and nine of it is a personal loan and 29,000 on a student loan.

You guys are seriously broke. What do y'all make?

Yeah, we are combined. So my wife is a stay at home mom, but I make my base out of my w. Two is 175,000, and I have about 20,000 in gross rental income from that first property.

Okay, so you make about 200 a year?

Yes. Okay.

All right. And why can't y'all live on that?

Well, I think it's lifestyle increase because it's, you know, less than. A little less than a year ago, my salary doubled, and we just kind of went crazy.

So what is it? What is it you're wanting to do that your wife is not in tune with?

So I'm wanting to sell that. That rental property before the capital gains becomes an issue. Use that to clear out all of our consumer debt and then just start tackling our primary mortgage with the snowball.

Why doesn't she want to do that?

Well, it's next to some relatives or our primary homes. Next is some relatives we're kind of using.

Who are the some relatives? Her parents?

No, they're my brother and his wife and they're pretty close, or his wife and her. Pretty close.

So that means you have to own a rental property next door.

That's kind of where I'm at with this whole thing.

Well, what does she say? What is that the reason?

It's a safety net, really? Because this isn't. We just picked up.

How is it a safety net? You guys are freaking broke.

Yeah. That's really what I'm trying to get across here is just, you know, it's.

Has she seen the numbers? Have you laid out the way you just laid it out with us? Have, have you sat and said, look, honey, here's where we're at? Have you guys done that?

You know, we, we have. Her and I both come from traditional backgrounds of living on consumer debt with our, our families. And her idea of never being in debt is just said it's not possible to do. And, you know, after you're finding, well.

It'S pretty possible if you sell the rental house. Of course it's possible. It's just you don't want to do it.

One of the crutches is that two and a half percent interest rate that we have on that thing. And it's just.

Yeah.

Which is such a blessing. Y'all are freaking starving to death making $200,000 and spending like you're in Congress.

I think.

I think you have a pretty serious level of denial going on inside your household here that I'm a lot more upset about than you are.

Yeah, well, that's the thing. We grew together. We went from having nothing to having.

Nothing to having a negative network. Yeah, yeah.

No, you're exactly right.

And making more money than you ever made in your life. And you're more broke than you ever been in your life because you want to own a rental property next door to your brother in law. No, thanks.

We talked about this earlier about the idea that real estate's not always a good thing.

It's not a good thing. And this is not. Well, no, what's going on here is there is zero control on spending in this house. And that's what's really going on. That's the core of this is that, okay, now we're going to admit we bought cars we can't afford. We've been taking vacations we couldn't afford, and we've been buying crap on Amazon that we can't afford. And so we got credit card debt and personal loans coming out our ears and two car payments and we make $200,000 a year. So I. Aaron, I don't think this is a financial problem. I think this is a denial problem. And I think the two of you need to sit down and you need probably. If I'm in your situation, I'm gonna go. Honey, look, I can't live like this. This is ridiculous. I'm working my butt off. And we're going backward because you won't sit down and look and deal with our spending, our overspending. And I'm willing to work on it. I'm willing to do the sacrificing to win. I am not willing to live like this just because your parents live broke and your brother in law lives broke and everybody else lives broke.

Paycheck to paycheck, making $200,000 a year. I don't want to live like that. I'm not going to live like that. So we're getting ready to do something different around here. And, you know, that's how it's going to sound at our house. And so. And if we can't come to some kind of agreement where we start acting like adults and living on less than we make and making adult decisions about our future, then we've got real serious marriage issues. And we need to sit down with a marriage counselor.

Yeah, I mean, I just. I'm detecting that at least the wife sounds like she's got these status symbols in place. Oh, we make $200,000. We need to be able to show everybody that we're making this money. And it's with the cars and the. Being able to buy what you want on the credit cards and having the second rental property. And how. How will it look to other people if we start to downsize and we start to cut back in areas? And it shows. And I think people are very afraid of those changes showing.

You really got to watch out calling this show when Jade's here because she'll just read your mail. You just nailed that. That's exactly what's going on.

It's. Yeah, she really cares about what people.

And here's the thing. You're gonna be broke your whole life. You're gonna work your whole life and be broke when you do that.

Not.

Not just Aaron, but anybody who's following this plan. Because if you. One of the benefits of going broke is when I went broke, is I lost my need to make you people happy. If you. You know what I drove today? A really nice car. You know why I drove? It's cuz what I wanna drive. I don't care if any of you know I've got it or see it. I enjoy driving the freaky car. It's none of your dad gum business. I used to when I was an immature little twit, drove a car because I wanted people to see me driving that car. There's a lot of difference, and one will make you broke and one will make you rich.

Not caring what people think is a superpower.

Phew, man. It's right next to common sense. It's like the whole council of superpowers right there. This is the Ramsey show.

Hey, friends, it's Ken Coleman, and I've got some big news. The get clear career assessment is now paired with my new book, find the work you're wired to do. Every book comes with access to the assessment so you can discover who you are and how you're wired.

Then I'm going to show you how.

To use your results to get specific in your job search and find the work you enjoy. Preorder, find the work you're wired to do@ramsaysolutions.com. Store and get the audiobook and the ebook free. Go to ramsaysolutions.com store.

Jade, Wash. All Ramsey personality is my co host today. Thanks for being with us, America. Open phones at 888-25-5225 Carmen is in Clarksville. Hi, Carmen. How are you?

I'm great. Thank you for taking my call.

Sure. What's up?

We just have a quick question. We are going to be selling a rental property that we own in a different state than where we currently reside. And we're going to be getting a pretty decent size net profit off of that.

Cool.

How much you don't mind?

We think between like 200 and 250 based off current estimations. Yeah, we're pretty excited about that. And we were just curious what the Ramsey principal thing to do with it would be.

Well, what baby step are you on?

So I'm terrible about keeping track. I think it's like five, six, and seven. So we have, sorry, four, five, and six. Okay. We have no debt except the house that we'll be selling has a mortgage. Still, our primary home we're living in currently has a mortgage, but no debt outside of that.

What's the balance on your mortgage that.

We currently live in? Our primary home?

Yes.

About 300, 2325.

Okay.

But, like, through a wrench and things, this home will not be a long term play for us. My husband is active duty military, and we will be leaving this house in probably like one to three years, which kind of made me more cautious of putting that money toward this property and wondering if there might be a better play with it since it's more short term.

What's your interest rate?

It's pretty high. 5675. We've only been here just about two years, so we bought peak price, peak interest rate.

Okay.

So what is the risk making 5% on your money by putting it on your mortgage?

I guess nothing. Yes. There is no risk there, because, I.

Mean, when you sell the house, you're gonna get the money back, right?

Yeah. We'll be looking at, like, moving back to where our families are from.

Yeah. You would sell?

I didn't know if. Yes.

So you and the house. The house is worth. The house is worth about what now?

Probably what we paid, if we're lucky. Probably still. 335. 345.

Okay. And so when you sell it, if it's worth 400 in two years or 450, you're gonna get 450 minus selling expenses? If it's paid off by then.

Yes.

And you take that half million and go start your next life after military. Okay. Thanks for your service, Bob. I think I would, yeah. Now, is there any. I mean, are either of you driving a drunk car? Is there a kid getting ready to go to college? Is there a little bit of light renovation? Is there something we need to do while we're in baby steps? 456 that with some of this money and not put it all on the house? Emergency funds. Good. Right?

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we both drive older, paid for cars, but that are well cared for and well maintained, so we don't.

So you don't think in the next 1214 months you're gonna be buying a car?

Oh, no.

Okay. All right.

And our kids are young, five and eight. So our kids are little aside, a.

Little bit each month for college.

We are not much because they will each be getting half of my husband's GI bill. He's not using it for himself. He's using military tuition assistance. So half of their college will be paid for already.

On the next move. I said post military. On the next move, will he be retiring or I'll just be another move move?

No, it will hopefully be retiring. It'll either be standard retirement or medical retirement, depending on the timeline.

Okay. All right. Okay. Because he's. He's approaching his 20 year then, correct? Yeah.

He's at, like, 16 and a half now, so.

Yeah. You'd like to ride that out, get that 20 year coin? For sure.

That's the goal? We are. You're hoping.

Yeah. That's cool. Well, thank you again. Thank you again for your service and for your no nonsense, no nonsense assessment of this.

So.

So I'm probably going to set a little bit of this aside. Not a ton, for just enjoyment.

Okay.

Like, y'all take a trip or you buy yourself something that y'all have been wanting a little bit of a splurge. Not a $50,000 splurge, but a five or a ten. Okay. And then I'm gonna throw the rest of it at the mortgage, if it's me. And then I'm gonna start going, hey, that mortgage is now in reach. Let's start thinking about in our budget, finishing that puppy off.

Yeah, I think that's going to serve as a big motivator because now you.

Can kind of see the end of the finish line. And it's easier to run when you see the end. Carrie's with us in Eugene, Oregon. Hi, Carrie, how are you?

Hi. Thank you for taking my call.

Sure. What's up?

Well, I am about to change jobs temporarily and I'm trying to decide do I move my 180K from my current four hundred one k to my new employer? Never roll it into an IRA.

Never. Always roll it to an IRA. Because you've got 8000 mutual funds to choose from. Literally.

Exactly.

And your current four hundred one k at your new job is going to have twelve or 14.

Exactly. So part two of that question is four hundred one k at the new job knowing that I'm only going to be there two to three years while I finish my master's program. Do I do the employer match?

Yes.

Or do I bump it up to max contributions?

Well, I max it if you. Are you out of debt?

Yeah, we have, my husband and I make really good money. We have a house loan. And other than that, we're debt free. Great cars, all the good stuff. Paying for college cash.

But way to go.

I don't know whether I should 100% a lot of things to you. Well, I mean, before we got married, we completed your course because we wanted to do this. Right.

Yeah. I mean, you're going up to 15% and you're starting with your match. It sounds like you might make more than a Roth ira. Am I right?

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah. Yeah.

Max it out. Max what? You can out. And then you can do that if.

You got a Roth. Four hundred and one k at the new place.

Yeah. Is it.

So, so is that what I should do then?

Yes.

Yes.

Take Roth everything that you can. And on the new stuff. Not that. Not the rollover. The rollover is traditional to traditional. Okay. The 180. Because I don't want that to become taxable right now. But, yeah, I'd max out that Roth. And especially if you can get it with a match. Yeah. You're just going to end up with an extra pile of money there that you move when you leave that job.

Yeah. So when I move that, leave that job, my career will most likely be self employed. And so that's where I'm trying to kind of get that Ira established because I think that's where my best retirement is going to be, if I've understood correctly.

I'm sorry. Your best retirement is where you can, you can do all kinds of stuff when you're self employed.

My IRA.

Okay, well, maybe your rollover IRA, you won't be adding anything to, you'll be opening a new one when you're self employed, but you can be in the same mutual funds with the same broker. Get a smartvestor pro to help you do all this. Just click@ramsaysolutions.com find the smartvestor Pro in your area. Sit down. They'll help you arrange all this stuff. So what you're going to end up with is the zero 401k rolling over to an IRA. You're going to open a new Roth 401K with a match, we hope, at the new place. When you leave there, you're going to roll it to a Roth. So you'll have those two accounts with account numbers on them.

That's right.

And then when you're self employed, you can start doing traditional romming. You can do regular roths, and you can either do a sep or a simple IRA for your self employed company, whichever one you want to do. And you can look at all of that at that time. But yeah, you can do all kinds of stuff when you're self employed to do the same exact, have the same approach as. Your only difference is if you match, you match yourself.

That's right.

That's the only difference. Other than that, you're in great shape, Carrie, you're doing really good stuff.

Very good.

She's killing it.

Yeah. Asking the right questions.

Yeah. Moving in the right way. So here's the thing. Always, when you leave your company, folks always roll your four hundred one k to an IRA, not to the new companies 401K because you have more options. You're sitting with your smartvestor pro. You've got an account. You're now managing your wealth away from work.

Right. And it's a transfer, direct transfer. It's not you pulling it out and.

Then putting it into rollover.

It's a direct transfer rollover. That's a good point.

Yeah.

And so what Jade is talking about is make sure the money is sent straight to the mutual fund, not to your house, because they don't. You don't want them withholding on it. Put the whole thing in there. And that's the route to go. This is the Ramsay show, our scripture of the day. Philippians one six. God, who began the good work within you will continue his work until it is finally finished. John Wooden said, what is right is more important than who is right. Ooh, that'll work. Todd is with us. Todd's in Philadelphia. Hi, Todd. How are you?

Hi. I'm doing well. How are you?

Better than I deserve. What's up?

So I got a question on what to do with some proceeds from a life insurance policy. My. This is from my late wife's estate. And I got a bunch of money. I put it in a CD last year to kind of hide it from myself. And the CDs maturing in May, I'm trying to figure out if I should use it to pay off the mortgage or to save it. Use it for my kids education or something else for my children.

Wow. So she's been gone since maybe since May?

Yes.

I'm sorry. What happened?

I'm sorry. Since. Since June. Since June?

Yeah. What happened? I'm sorry.

She had leukemia. It happened very, very quickly.

How old was she?

53 years old.

Wow. And how much money's in there, Todd?

There's 180,000 left.

Okay. All right. And what are your options? What are you considering doing with the money?

So I have 145,000 left on the mortgage. If I could pay it off and be done with it, and that's the only debt I have. Another is to say, keep it. My youngest is still in high school and put him through college. I might need that. I might not, you know, do something with it for that. For the kids somehow.

Yeah. What. What do you make?

What do I make? About 200? Yeah.

All right. So if I understand you have 180, you owe 145. So if you paid off the mortgage, you have 35 left. Plus you make 200 a year to get the youngest through college.

Yes. And I have a good big save one, too. I just don't know how much this is going to cost. Right. So.

Well, I do. It's going to cost $35,000, plus whatever you can come up with out of your budget. That's what it's going to cost. That's where he's going to go to school. You're going to go to school. We can afford to go to.

That would be nice.

Yeah, no, it's not nice. It's what we're going to do. It's my money, so. Okay, so how this works. If you want my money, you're going to go where I want you to go to school. So, I mean, we'll talk about it and we can pick a school, but we're probably going to a state school, which is fine, by the way.

Yeah, I get it. The situation is difficult.

Hey, Todd, your phone is awfully muffled. Can you speak directly into it? I'm having trouble hearing you.

Yes, I'm sorry.

Thank you.

Okay. Yeah. You're saying didn't do that with our daughter? We kind of let her pick her place, but I recognize her. The situation is different now.

Yeah. So is she out of school?

She has one more year, but I can handle that. I already have something for that.

And how old is the youngest? What year of high school?

He's 16 years old. Junior.

Okay, so he's got senior while he's finishing up his junior. While your daughter's finishing up her senior year of college.

I know they're both junior. So one in high school, one in college.

Okay, so they're both gonna be seniors at the same time, then. So you're not gonna really get a break. You're gonna go from one to the other.

No. No, I'm not. You're correct.

Okay, I'm catching on. Okay. And how expensive was her school?

It's 80 a year and no aid.

Okay.

And you cash flowed all that?

We did.

Wow.

We did. My wife, Sharon, handled all the finances. She did a wonderful job.

Okay, well, I mean, if you make 200 a year and you don't have any debts, including a mortgage, you can probably pull off just about whatever you want, however you want to prioritize your personal cash flow towards your youngest college, that'll be up to you. Plus or -35,000 do you have any other money saved?

Yes, I do. I do.

How much?

Probably about, let's say, 3300 and 5360.

And that's not retirement savings, right?

It is not retirement savings.

Okay, so junior can go to school wherever he wants. If you're willing to part with some of that money, you can.

Yes.

Okay, so that's a value judgment you make. It's a decision you make. So knowing that we have all of that, that further ensures that we're going to pay off the house.

Yeah, I'm thinking that way. And I kind of. I figured you would. You guys were going to say that.

But you got $500,000. Yes, your $500,000. You only owe 140 on your house, so it's a no brainer. Pay it off.

Okay. I think that's a good idea. I'm being lean in that way.

Yeah. And. And here's the thing. You've been through a terrible time, and what is hard to anticipate until you've been there, not because I've been there, is that it has nothing. It's not even in the same category as your. The stuff you went through with your wife. But paying off the house is going to be. Is going to give you a. You're physically going to feel peaceful from getting rid of that mortgage because extra. Because extra weight. Just. Even though it's not that much compared to what you make, because you've been through so much, and y'all have had so much pain and grief, and now when that is cleared, there's a cleanliness to that. In the spirit, you're gonna feel it, I promise. I think you're gonna be sitting on the back porch, having a cup of coffee, and you're gonna be going, wow, I did not see that coming.

Yeah. I haven't had that in a while.

Yeah, yeah. And just, you know, you take your shoes off, walk through the backyard, the grass feels different when you own it, when it's paid for. And it's particularly highlighted in a highly emotionally charged situation, like what they've been through there.

I would imagine it gives a sense of closure. You started this journey with someone, and that included buying a home, and this is the place that we live. And I think that. I would imagine that paying it off would give a sense of closure.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And it does. And here's the thing. He said, his wife Sharon's good with money. I can imagine that she's in heaven, smiling. The house is being paid off.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. She want him to have ultimate peace. As much peace as you can have here on earth.

Exactly. And in that situation, that's the way to go. Andre is in Seattle. Hey, Andre, what's up?

Hi, mister Ramsey. Had a quick question for you.

Okay.

Kind of get the feeling, and I know what you're gonna say, but wanted to confirm, I think I'm broke, but kind of an interesting situation. So, anyway, I have about 205,000 ish of bad debt, not including mortgages. And about 64 of that, 65 is cars. 55 I owe as a personal loan to my father in law. And another 64 something on credit cards. And about 24.

I don't want to be rude, but I'm really short on time. Real quick, what's your question?

Quick question. So my accountant is saying that I need to rent out the current place I live right now, at least two months out of the year. So you can do a cost degradation study and save me about 20 grand a year for next year's taxes.

My question is, you need a new account.

Do I buy it?

Oh, yeah. When a tax advisors start giving you economic bad financial advice just to save on taxes, that means you need to fire them. And so, yeah, you need a new accountant. You need to. You need to sell that house, dude. You're so deep in debt, you can't breathe. I think I'm broke. And my accountant is telling me to be in the rental business.

Terrible.

Ding, ding, ding, ding.

20,000.

Yeah, get into it. Get it. Get, get smiles. So, folks, that 100% of the time, I see people do something solely for tax reasons and don't, and they ignore the economic and the personal finance implications of it. It's always a bad move because I hate taxes as bad as anybody else, but I don't want trade dollars for quarters. And a lot of the tax advice is, you're getting a write off and you're trading dollars for quarters. Meanwhile, the guy can't breathe. He's got $200,000 in debt and this stupid account saying, keep a rental property. God, that's dumb. Yeah, get a new CPA that puts this hour of the Ramsey show in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace. Christ Jesus.

Hey, guys, I'm Rachel.

And I'm George.

And you've probably heard our voices before on the Ramsey show.

And do we have a surprise for you.

Yep, we have our very own show, smart money happy hour, where we talk about pop culture, current events, and, of course, money. George, it's a great show. And what else do we talk about?

So much, Rachel.

Not enough.

And yet too much. We talk about guilt tipping, because tipping is out of control, and I won't stand for it anymore, which is why I'm sitting.

I'm glad you were taking such a stand.

And we also talk about something else I'm passionate about.

Disney adults.

Oh, George, why is it a thing?

Listen, some adults still find the magic.

Sure.

We also talk about toxic money traits and girl math.

And if you don't know what those.

Are, you have to listen to the podcast.

Yeah, there's a lot there, you guys. It's pretty fun.

We keep you relevant is what I'm trying to say.

We help you out.

So pull up a chair to the happy hour you wish your friends were having. We promise you won't regret it. And if you don't have friends, we'll be your friends.

We will. We're great friends.

So make sure to check it out on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or the Ramsey Network app.