Live from the headquarters of Ramsay Solutions, it's the Ramsay show, where we help people with their money, with their work, with their reason for getting up in the morning, and with their relationships. If you want to be on the show, give us a buz at AA 825-5225 we've got opinion on just about anything that's going on. Your life and our promises. We'll sit here with you, walk with you, and we'll figure out what's the next right step. I'm John Deloney, joined by my good friend Rachel Cruz. And we're taking your calls again. Triple 8825-5225 on this special Valentine's day.

Episode, I know the manufacturer. Day of love.

I actually like it. You don't like it?

You like Valentine's day?

Yeah.

Wow.

I would have thought you would have been, like, a skeptic. Like, love is all year round.

I like love.

I do too, but not when it's like a holiday.

Here we go. All right. Really?

Are y'all, like, doing something? You and Sheila going out tonight?

Dude, I got into my car today, and there was, like, a gift in the driver's side of my.

Valentine's day.

No, we love each other.

I know.

What about your house, Rachel, let's go.

We went out to dinner last night.

That's yesterday. Let's go to Emily in Cincinnati, Ohio. What's up, Emily?

Hi there. I'm good. How you doing?

We're figuring it out. Hey, real quick, before the call, are you thumbs up or thumbs down on Valentine's Day?

I think thumbs up.

Yeah.

You know why? Because you're a person with a heart. That sounds cool.

Rachel, I'm a giver. Makes their money. Okay, Emily, we're here for you.

All right, what's up, Emily?

How can we?

Well, my husband and I got married about a year ago. I'd been single for 23 years. My goals were to have my house paid off debt free. I achieved that goal. Had money in the bank. I discussed before we got married, his financial situations, everything was brought out. Basically, he didn't have a house at that point, but he had a car payment, and he paid that off. So that was about $700. And then he said he was helping his daughter with her student loans. She's 36. His son is 33. After we were married, I found out a few months later that he was in debt to his two adult children. $86,000.

Oh, gosh.

And then after the marriage, so that didn't go very well with me. And then I found out that he had racked up about $40,000 in credit card bills because part of the wedding, we just bought a new home. He makes very good money. And then when I heard about the $40,000, that just blew me away.

He didn't tell you about that when you were going through the $86,000?

No.

What a coward.

And he didn't tell me that he was racking up these credit cards. We went on a honeymoon. He lost his job two weeks before our wedding. That was fine. He did put $200,000 down on a house that we did purchase in that time. We've had to move. We just sold the house. But I had sold my house prior to buying this other house.

So how can we help you? There's a lot going on here.

I know.

Give me some direction here. How can we help?

Okay.

I want to know is right now the credit card bills he paid off by turning in his stocks. So now that is a zero balance.

How do you know?

You know what? I don't know.

You don't know? You have a man that you share a home with that you can't trust as far as you can see, and he's so full of crap. His eyes are brown, and he is just running through life, dragging you behind him.

Right. So he did the budget, and after we went over the budget, we had about $900 left to live on, and that's without paying our credit card bills. He makes $170,000 a year.

How do you know that?

Through his paychecks. I did look into that. I said, I need your pay stubs. I want to see what's coming in.

I want you to pull credit reports on everybody in the house tonight.

Well, we did, because we just purchased a house, and his are in the 800. The thing is, his daughter, who is 36, I guess we owe about 36,000 in debt to her bills. They are in her name. He's a co signer.

His son. What was he using that $36,000 for? Emily, when he borrowed from that one daughter? Like, what was that for? Just lifestyle?

No, it was for her student loans. They're for her student loans.

Okay.

And then his son. I found out we owe $55,000 on $55,000 student loans and student loans. And he's 33.

And both were communicated to the adult children that he would pay for them, evidently. Okay.

Yes.

And he says that's true, too. The adult children say that, and he said that.

Well, I'm not talking to the adult kids right now because I'm furious.

Okay.

And the girl, she's a nanny. And claiming that she doesn't make enough money to pay.

Emily, Emily, Emily. Your rage is misguided and it's not helping.

No, I know it's not helping.

Yeah.

You're not addressing the core issue, which is you married a man, and right out of the gate, he lied to you to the tune of over $100,000.

Correct.

On multiple occasions. That's where this conversation has to begin.

Right.

We'll get to the money part. Now, how you pay off money, he's going to have to make a whole bunch more, and you're going to have to sell a bunch of stuff and cut your lifestyle. But beneath that, you don't have a man that you trust. And so you're running around mad at everybody, enraged. How much are you working? What are you doing? All of that is misplaced. All of that is your body trying to cope with the fact that you are connected to somebody that you don't trust. Have you sat down and said, hey, you lied to me? We have to rebuild this whole relationship over.

Oh, yeah, okay. Absolutely. I told him that. And on top of this, let me tell you one more thing. He is a game collector. Board games. And he probably has close to a million dollars in board games.

Well, cool. He could pay his crap off then. That's awesome.

Right? Well, when I asked him. So let me ask you this, I said, he doesn't want to get his kids to pay for their schooling or take on responsibility for it, or he's still paying for his son's $89 phone bill, even to this day. And I said, how about if I get divorced and I get the best lawyer and I take half of your retirement, which he has about $800,000 in, and half of your games?

Well, Emily, but now you're getting in the mud with a pig.

I know. Don't do that.

Be a person of dignity and respect. Stay above it. If you have decided, you know what? I can't be married to a man child like this. But until then, make your choice. But right now, you're just jumping in, you're cannonballing in the mud with them.

Yeah. Yes. And if you want to fight for the marriage at this point, though, financially, I would stay away. I would have a separation. I think that's a very healthy boundary to have at this point. And you guys need to go to marriage therapy. And all of this has to be resolved because to John's point, the trust is completely broken, not just from the money side, but in other aspects, as well. And so until you feel confident that you guys are working as a team, then you can move forward financially. Sorry, Emily.

You need to give him a roadmap of what he can do to earn trust back. Sell games, have hard conversations with his kids. Give him a path back. You need that, and he needs that. This is the Ramsey show.

Hey, guys.

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Welcome back. This is the Ramsay show. Triple 8825-5225 for this very special Valentine's Day episode.

Yeah, and speaking of love, John, the event that we put on that we both loved. Speaking of love that we love so much, the money and marriage getaway, you guys, it is back. We're so excited. So this fall, October 24 through the 26th, John and I will be spending a whole weekend with you guys here in Nashville, focused on your marriage, focused on your money. It's a two and a half day. It's two and a half days full of teaching you when it comes to communication, intimacy and money. And there's going to be lots of q A. We get to answer questions from you guys. That was a great part of the event. I feel like we had a conversation the entire weekend with you all, and we want you to walk away with tools that you need to build that deeper connection when it comes to your marriage, when it comes to your money. And so our platinum tickets are already sold out, but there are a few vip tickets left, which includes a meet and greet with us. And we just want to make sure you guys can get those before they're gone.

So tickets start at $799 at ramsaysolutions.com.

Events, and it's still a bargain for $800 is a lot. But two and a half days for a marriage retreat that we've not got one that's rare. We've not got one. One couple that's written back and said we wish we hadn't done that. It's the opposite. You could just hand out cash in the back of a room, and someone's going to be like, I can't believe that you. And not one person. Totally. It's been so remarkable, so very cool. All right, so during money and marriage, we do lots of direct Q and a, so people leave feeling like, hey, we got our question answered. Or here's the thing we're struggling with, or how do you all handle these things in your own homes? And it was a pretty intimate weekend because we had our spouses out there. We kind of opened the cupboard doors of our own relationships. So here's some questions that didn't get answered that they pulled together for us. Here's one. Let's see here. Pick a number between one and eight.

Oh, gosh, this is so scary. Let's go. Six.

I grew up with very little, and now I have more money than my family ever had. Growing up, controlling it has become an obsession. How can I disconnect from the childhood fear of not having money and focus more on being intentional with it? That's a great question.

Yeah, that is a good question. Yeah. So I would say this fear drives a lot of people. I found this when I was doing research for my book, know yourself, know your money. How much? The childhood idea that if money was a stressful point, and whether that was verbally or emotionally, how many people, I mean, they swing the pendulum so far. The other way of not wanting to be that they are so adamant about it. And so what I think you have to do is you have to almost practice and live out these money habits day in and day out to remind yourself that you're okay. That you're okay. And it's almost like you can tell your head that, but if your actions and your body don't follow, you're not living in that fullness.

Right.

And so, honestly, you've probably created a budget because you're obsessed with controlling your money, which is great, but I would force myself to spend some and to say, I'm okay letting this money go, because as tightly as people hold on to money, sometimes it's hard just to open your hand, right, and spend it and let it go. But I think as you start to live that out and then you practice spending, you'll see, I'm okay. I'm okay because you're spending on a plan, you're being reasonable about it. But until you can actually go through those motions and that becomes part of your rhythm, you're not going to know it because you can know it. In your head all day, but until you actually live it out, you're not.

Going to teach your body that you're okay.

Yes.

There's kind of a behind closed doors quote in counseling, which is the thing that kept you safe as a kid is what ruins your relationships as an adult. Right. If you learned to hide as a kid, it kept you safe from maybe an alcoholic parent. And that makes it really hard to develop intimacy. If every time something gets scary in your house or you get into a fight with your spouse, you hide so very similar. If you develop this sense of control to get you out of a thing, it's that gazelle intensity. Cool. That's the thing that kept you safe. And probably this person worked really hard, has gone to college, has got a great job, has done all these things so that I would not be like them. And then they got there and they realized, oh, that tension's still there. Right. And so, okay, the thing that got you here. Cool, you're safe now. Now you got to, like you said, practice something new. My friend Michael Easter here with comfort crisis. He has a line that I love, and he calls it gear, not stuff. And so him and I have just had some personal conversations, and he's written on this, know, the anxiety of clutter and too much stuff everywhere and just going to buy stuff to buy stuff.

Right.

And so he categorizes stuff and gear. I need this backpack. That's really great. And here's why that's different than, I'm just going to go to the mall and spend some money. So maybe you make yourself a gear list. I do need a pair of pants.

Like utility to the thing you're buying.

They need to be nice because I don't want to buy another pair for five years. Then I'm going to buy a nice pair of pants that's different than, let's just go shopping, right?

Yes.

So maybe make a gear list that you're going to slowly get over the next year. And also, I think generosity helps with this, too. Like, practice opening your hands and letting some money go.

Yeah.

Intentionally. That's awesome. All right, let's go out to Christian in Martinsburg, West Virginia. What's up, Christian?

Hey, guys. I'm doing well. How about you all?

Outstanding, brother. What's up?

Yeah.

So I've got a question for the two of you here. My wife and I purchased a vehicle in 2021 with a loan at a 3.99 interest rate. And we've been making monthly payments all on time of $275 a month. So we've currently got about $7,072 remaining on the loan. And timeline wise, it's looking like we'll be paying it all six months.

Sorry, Christian. $72,000 left?

No, ma'am. $7,072.

Okay. No, you're good. What kind of car did you buy?

No, just a Toyota Highlander for my wife and the kids.

Hey, that's about $70,000 these days. That's not a cheap car.

Well, I work in insurance, so I see those numbers, unfortunately, more and more these days. But part of the reason for my call here is I'm considering just a Ramsay debt reduction strategy. And I've been looking at our finances. We have about $5,900 in a Robin Hood account and about $10,000 in savings. And we're still really trying to build up the emergency fund up. So should we sell the stocks in the Robin Hood account and take some from savings to immediately pay off the loan, even if it means lowering our emergency fund? Or is the monthly car payment low enough where it makes more sense to leave the money in the stock market and have more in the emergency fund?

No, I would cash out the Robin Hood account, that 5900. So, yeah, I would throw 6000 at this, take a little bit from savings. And that's the only debt you guys have, right?

We do have a mortgage, but it's the only other debt that we have.

Yeah, so that's what I would do personally. And then your savings will be down to around 9000 or maybe 8000 after taxes, if you have taxes in that account. But, yeah, that's what I would do. And then take that savings account that you have. That'll have around $8,000. And then build on that to your three to six months of expenses. So it's the Ramsay baby step. So you'd be at baby step three at that point. So that's what I would do.

Okay.

And that gets you guys in a great position. Do you have investments beyond this account? Do you have retirement? Four hundred and one K or a Roth IRA?

Yes, ma'am. We have a Roth IRa that we're contributing to. And then I'm big on trying to help the kids out long term with college. So we've also been making contributions to a smart five two nine account for them.

Good.

Yeah. That's amazing. So great. So I would just keep all of that up. I mean, you guys are right there. But, yeah, I would cash out and pay off that car immediately.

Internalize that. You're going to be debt free in about 45 minutes.

I mean, the idea sounds great. Having nothing but the home to work.

Listen.

What?

A Valentine's Day gift. When you slide across the table, a zero balance on this car. Note for your wife.

How much is the car payment a month?

$275.

Okay, so it's not huge.

Yeah.

But you just got, what's three times 1236?

Yeah.

You got a $3,600 a year raise just now.

No, that makes sense, right?

No resume?

A little bit less than that. $3,500 a year raise just by clicking a few buttons on your computer. And if your boss said, hey, what would you like? You do this and this and this. I'm going to give you a $3,500 raise. You'd be like, all right. Well, here you go. Merry Christmas, man. Happy Valentine's Day.

Thank you guys so much. Really appreciate it. Happy Valentine's Day to you guys too.

Triple 825-5225 this is the Ramsay show. Call us with your relationship challenges. I especially want you to call if you have your spouse with you and you're wondering, is it their fault or is it mine? Rachel and I will solve it for you.

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Welcome back to the Ramsay show. Triple 825-5225 I'm John Deloney, joined by Rachel Cruz. We're taking your calls on money, life, and especially on your dating and marriage relationships. On this special Valentine's Day episode, let's go out to Marissa in Columbus, Ohio. Hey, Marissa. What's up?

Hi, guys. How are you?

We're partying. What are you up to?

Enjoying my day off. It's beautiful here.

Congratulations. That must be nice. Rachel's my boss, and we don't get those very often. What's up?

We work.

Well, hopefully you do get a couple of days off. You guys work hard too. But thanks. My question is. So my husband and I were a little background. We're 32. We live, obviously, outside Columbus. We just bought our forever home like we had. Bought a starter house probably five years ago, fixed it up, sold it in June, bought our forever house moved in. So unfortunately we have a 6.9% or whatever interest rate. Our other house, we had a 15 year, like two and a half percent. So quite a shock adjustment, but in the long run, worth it. So I guess we have no debt. For context, my husband works in it. He makes about 150. I'm a nurse, so I make about 80. And then we have a ten month old daughter. So we're just trying to figure out the best way to pay off this mortgage as quickly as possible while also enjoying ourselves a little bit. We live very well below our means, but just we have a financial advisor and talking with them about saving for our daughter's future and weddings and college and if we have more kids, it's just like making our head spin.

Originally we had talked about, of course, once rates lower again, maybe high fours, low fives, refinancing, but then even that, it's like we would still pay what we're paying now, but at the new lower rate to pay it off quicker. But it's still going to take 15 or plus years to pay it off. So I guess we're just trying to figure out the best way.

How much is left on the mortgage.

We have about 400.

400 left.

Okay. Yeah. So I have about 50 in savings. My husband has about 75. And then we have retirement accounts and stuff. And then with our financial advisor, through other iras and stuff like that, we have about 30. It's just like we had talked about. Maybe if we do refinance, like just putting whatever I make towards the mortgage and living off what my husband makes. But even then, it would still take quite a bit of time. It wouldn't be like a quick couple of year process.

Hey, Rachel, before you walk through the numbers, Marissa, can I ask you a question?

Yeah.

Is this house worth it 100%?

Yeah.

Because you're doing a lot of financial gymnastics. Like you're spending a ton of energy. What about this? What about this? What about that? What if we did this? And so I think it's just important to go stop for a second and say, is this still what we want to do? We love this house. It's our quote unquote forever house. Which, by the way, no such thing as that. But this is a house that we love. But, man, it has taken all the fun out of our life.

Right?

You're still all in on it.

Yeah.

You said you live far below your means, so how much margin do you guys have a month? Would you say that you put into savings?

So I put about 1000 and then an additional 500 a month goes to our financial advisor. My husband puts 500 a month.

And this is like non retirement, correct?

Correct. Yeah, just to whatever we've got. Various investment stuff. And then my husband probably saves an additional 1500 on his end.

Okay, so I'd say here a couple of things. Number one, I keep hearing you say, like, my husband's money, my husband has this, I have that. I would challenge you guys to combine everything because you guys are working towards the same goal, but you're still on two separate roads financially. But if you put everything in one pot, instead of saying, well, I have 50,000 and he has 75,000, together, this is what we have. There's something about that unification that happened when you are unified, that helps this plan go faster. So what we found, Marissa, is that you are trying to do a couple of things and well intentioned things. So I would kind of put some structure around them. Okay, so at this point, you guys have well over a fully funded emergency fund. I would say 50 grand is plenty for you guys. For an emergency fund, you could probably even lower some of that if you wanted. But I would look at that extra 75,000 and just have the conversation, hey, is this something? We would just want to put a chunk of that towards the house. I mean, you're going to knock off almost 100 grand towards the principal in the house if you do that.

That's an option. And then from there, let's invest 15% of our income into retirement. Nothing more, nothing less. Let's put a little bit away for college. I would not worry about wedings and all of that. You're adding in a lot with a ten month old, so I know it's so easy to dream, but that's mudding up kind of what John was saying. It just feels like you're trying to do all these things. It's kind of mudding the waters. So just look at what you really need to do. And so we'll put some money away every year for college, and you can kind of run those numbers and just decide from per household what feels right to you. And then anything above that, I would throw towards the house and throw towards the principal of your mortgage doing that. And then, Marissa, we find that people that follow this plan, they pay their house off in seven years. So it's not a two year process. On average, it's about seven years. And so, as you guys map it out, I mean, you make 230 and you have a $400,000 mortgage. So I'm like, golly, four years.

If you guys just lived on 130 or three years.

Yeah, you could pay it off.

Can I tell you one hard thing, Marissa?

Yeah.

It sounds like you lean a lot on your financial advisor. If you get with the wrong financial advisor, you need to remember that they can be very self serving, and they will talk you into.

That's what kind of figured out huge.

Chunks of your money. You want to get a financial advisor that works for you, not the other way around, and they'll look at you the wrong ones.

Financial advisor. We had definitely kind of, when we were younger, like, took advantage of us. We were newly married and kind of sold us on the whole life versus term life, and we ended up doing both. We had paid $10,000 in, but only we were out $5,000. So we ended up switching to a friend.

Well, follow Rachel's policy. And I want you to know we don't have a financial stake in your success here. We're rooting you on. This is what we would do in our own house. Put 15% away and put the rest towards your house. And your financial advisor may be like, oh, you're so stupid, you're missing out. But 15% aside, you're going to be fine. You're so far ahead of the game with the people we talk to right now. And you owe what on your house? 400.

Yeah, we owe 400. We just moved in in June.

Okay, imagine this.

Six or seven months.

Imagine this. What if you sat down and had a conversation with your husband, and you put 15 from that pile that you call yours, and you put 75 from him, and by the end of this weekend, your mortgage is down to 310 already, right?

Yeah, we've talked about that. Because, like I said, we've obviously both have our own accounts and then, like, a joint account. So we were just talking about that last night. Like, what if we just put so much amount from our nest egg in, but then it's just like, there's almost, like, too much good advice, because then his parents are like, well, you guys should just wait to refinance.

No.

Recap.

No, they're wrong. Listen, here's what I want to be your guide. Solve for freedom. What's the best interest rate? What's the best move that might happen in three months or six months? Hey, by the way, I'm looking to buy a house, and everybody is waiting for these interest rates to drop, and they didn't the other day. Then everybody freaked out, and then the inflation report came out. Dude, everybody's just throwing darts with a blindfold on. I want you guys to change your metric. Solve for freedom. What's the fastest path to our family? Not owing anybody anything. Forget the interest rates. Let's be free. And let's give that kid your new kid. Yeah. Wedding is going to be awesome. To save up for college will be awesome. Let's give their nervous system 18 years of parents who don't owe anybody anything. That's peace. Then that kid can repel off and go do some amazing things that our culture desperately needs young people to get involved with. Right? Let's solve for freedom, not for everybody else's advice. This is the Ramsey show. This episode is sponsored by Betterhelp. Hey, this is Dr. John Deloney. And some people think relationships have to be easy to be right.

Sometimes that can be true. But more often, great relationships get that way because both people put in the work to make them incredible. Therapy can be a place to work through the challenges you face in all of your relationships, whether that's with friends, people at work, your significant other, or even how to get along with yourself. And if you're thinking of starting therapy, try betterhelp. Therapy isn't just for people who've experienced trauma. It's great for building skills so you can become the best version of yourself. Betterhelp is completely online, so it's flexible enough to fit your schedule. Just fill out a short questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. Find the path forward to making all of your relationships incredible. Visit betterhelp.com deloney today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp. He lp.com deloney. Welcome back, triple 825225. This is the Ramsay show. Let's go out to Kimberly in Seattle, Washington. Hey, Kimberly, what's up?

Hey, are you still there?

We're here. How's it going? How can we help?

Good. Well, not good, but maybe you can help me out. Some suggestions. My husband, just like, about a week ago, went to the hospital and was diagnosed with, basically, his liver is shot. It's beyond repair. They gave him maybe a year, year and a half to live.

Oh, my gosh. I'm so sorry.

Yeah. And he struggled with alcohol addiction off and on over the years. And he said, I knew that this was probably going to happen, but when you're addicted, you're addicted, and it's hard to stop something. So anyway, our situation right now is he's working or trying to work because he doesn't feel well. And I've been doing the best I can to do Ramsey stuff without him not being on board, which means not very much. Anyway, I have questions here as to what we should do because this freight train is moving.

Forward.

Do you guys have. We have adult kids who are doing really well.

Okay.

Off on their own. They're amazing. How old are you guys? I just turned 60. He's a few years younger than me.

Three years younger than me. Okay.

Anyway, in fact, I had a hospital bill. I took a grinding job to pay the balance off because of insufficient insurance and just got it done. So here we are with another hurdle. So I'm looking at we do own our own house, but because I haven't had access to the funding I wanted to do to keep up on it. It needs exterior repairs that are fairly expensive, as in roof gutters, some siding, and then paint after that. It's an amazing house. It's in really good condition. But that would have to be done if we were to possibly sell and downsize, if that would be one of the options we should consider. I don't know.

Okay.

We have a lot of stuff sitting around that my other half cannot get rid of anything ever. So getting those options for getting those things sold and how to approach him on that, we'd have to have somebody come and remove.

Kimberly, let me hop in here.

Yes, please.

You've gone directly, and quite honestly, if you've been married to somebody who's struggling with alcohol for a long time, you have been responding to crisis after crisis and thing after thing forever. Right?

Amen.

The way you said this, I want to challenge you on it. Well, now we got another hurdle. This is not just another hurdle.

No, it's big.

This is the stop, right?

Yes.

And so you have been working with somebody for a long time. Everything in this conversation has changed now. And the conversation changes to now we have an hourglass. We have a clock that's ticking. And the doctors clicked it on for us. And so we're not talking about how you feel. If you really like this collection of bottle caps you've been keeping for that ship is over. That ship is sailed out to harbor. We are now creating a life that I'm going to have to inhabit because you're going to be gone.

Yeah.

And that looks like making sure I got a home with four walls on it and I can pay bills. Right. And some of it you're going to. I remember sitting with somebody that I care about deeply, and I was helping them, and their house was full of stuff, and I was trying to help them throw it away. This is several years ago. And I just finally stopped and looked at them and said, I need you to hear me say this. When you die, I'm going to throw all of this away. I can do it now or I can do it when you're gone. And there was a long, long pause and they said, you're going to have to do it when I'm gone. And I said, okay, I'm moving on with my day. I'm not going to spend another second here. I've already made that choice, but I'm not going to fight that in this moment. You see what I'm saying?

He was not even used to that idea yet. It hadn't even been introduced. Right.

Right. So here's what we're doing. We're reverse engineering this thing for the four walls. I hate to live like this, but this is the clock you've been given. I want to go 18 months and start working backwards. What does life look like? And you don't have to do a roof and siding and gutter. You don't have to do all that at the same time. We're going to price each one of those things out. These things that we have to do so we can keep our house. These things that we have to do so we have transportation. You're going to have to have a job if you don't have any.

What's the. What's the financial status? Kimberly? You said you own your home outright, so there's no mortgage or anything on it, correct?

Yeah. Well, in the earlier days, I was working to pay a little extra here and there because I'm the one that doesn't want to be in horrendous debt of any kind, actually. And he used to work a very good job. And part of it was an investment account that was like a retirement. Right. And he got to a point where he wanted to start his own business. He'd always wanted to do this because his family had done it and they had done it poorly and they fought and they divorced. But it still is a dream of.

His cash out the investments.

So over time, yes, he cashed out almost everything. He threw into a business without knowing how to run a. Yeah, yeah, I.

Hear you, Kimberly, you're going to have.

To set that aside because you got emergency in front of.

No, no, you're fine. You're fine. What debt do you guys have any at all? Any consumer debt, credit cards, car loan?

No.

Okay.

We have no debt.

No debt. And how much money?

Taxes and things like that.

Okay. Are you working? Kimberly, do you work?

I was in order to pay off my hospital debt horrendously huge. And I finally got that paid off. But it was very hard. It was just.

How much physically? Okay. So in a great position to work. Okay. What was he making a year?

No. What's he making now?

Yes. Keep you guys.

Crap. I should know this.

No, it's fine. 30,000, 70,000?

Yeah, 30 something.

30 something. Okay. Any investments? Sorry, I know you said he cashed out his to start the business. Do you have any retirement? Okay, so there's no investments, no retirement. And does he have life insurance?

No.

Okay. So what I want you to do, Kimberly, is the silver lining from a financial standpoint. All of this is you guys have no debt. I mean, you don't even have a. In and of itself is like, that's a relief. So what John was saying, the four walls. I want you to go and do a budget, Kimberly, and I want you to stay on the line. And we're going to give you financial peace, university and every dollar premium. Because I want you to start budgeting and I want you to know to the penny.

No, I do have every dollar already.

Oh, you do? Okay.

So to know, thank God for that. That has been like saving my emotional.

I'm so glad, because I think if you have those numbers in front of you, of the things you have to do, you have to keep the lights on, the cell phone bill, your insurance, food, gas in the car. You have all of that. And that's what you're going to have to look at Kimberly and say, okay, I have to at least make this right. When the time comes, I have to at least make this. And then I would not encourage you to sell the house or even to put in a ton of repairs right now, I think you're fine. What I would do, and I wouldn't unless your roof is leaking or something. But for now and then, Kimberly, when the time comes, I want you to grieve. I want you to go through that process and don't make a big financial decision until about six months to a year. And if in two years, three years, you decide to sell the home and downgrade, take some of the equity, you can do that. But don't feel like you have to make these big decisions today. Today. I just want your four walls covered between now and 18 months.

I'm so sorry, though. I'm so sorry.

That's the first hour in the books. We'll be right back on the Ramsey show live from the headquarters. Of Ramsey Solutions. It's the Ramsey show, where we help people with their money, with their work, and with their relationships. This is a special Valentine's Day episode. I'm John Deloney, joined by my good friend Rachel Cruz. And we're taking your calls on just about anything. But especially if you've got a question about your marriage, about somebody you're dating, if you have a question about who's.

Right, we love to take that.

You or them. Rachel and I will solve it for you. Triple 8825-5225 it's triple 825-5225 let's go out to Los Angeles, California, and talk to Madison. Hey, Madison. What's up?

Hi.

My husband and I recently got married. We are debt free and about to finish saving our six month emergency fund. One of our goals is to own a home one day. And we want to start investing, but we don't really know where to start. We want to be good stewards of what the Lord has blessed us with. What advice would you have for us? Should we even have the goal of owning a home right now?

You want to buy a home? Los Angeles.

We live about an hour outside of Los Angeles, so not right in the city.

So if you start saving now, you'll be ready in, like, 2068, probably give or take a month or two.

Madison, how long have you guys been married? We've been married for three months. Okay. Congratulations.

You all are awesome. Congratulations.

How old are you guys? I'm 19 and my husband's 23. Okay, so great. And debt free. Fully funded emergency fund is right around the corner. How much are you guys making a year? Combined? We make 98,000 a year. 98,000? Okay, awesome. And you're just renting right now? Yes. Okay, so good. Yeah, I think owning a home is a great next step. I mean, John was joking that it's going to. Not really joking, but kind of joking. 60 years?

More like 2050.

I know. Have you just priced out for the fun of it? Some houses around your area that you guys are like. That would be a great spot to a great area or type of house. Do you have any idea on price ranges? Yes, we've been looking a little bit. I don't know if we have a price range right now, but I guess we were more wondering, like, investments, because we don't currently have any investments. Should we invest and save for a house at the same time? How should we do that? I don't know. What practically does that look like? Yeah, well, number one, you guys are young, so I want you to take a little bit of this pressure off of any of this. Right. You have time to do both. You have time to save for a house and time for investing. So I want you to just know, okay, we are way ahead of the game. So any of this path that you're going to take, you guys are going to be fine as long as you're consistent with it. So what I would probably do, Madison, is I would open up some retirement accounts.

Do you guys have. Does your employers match at all? Yes, my husband does. Okay. And how much does his employer match up to? I am not sure. Okay. So I would find that out and then together, yeah, this is after you're about to fund your six month emergency fund. So we'll just pretend like that's done and then moving forward. Yeah. I would invest 15% of your income into retirement because you're not super serious about buying a house right this second. If you guys had a house in mind and you were like, we have somewhat of a down payment. We want to save more. We have a goal in twelve months. We want to put this down. If it's very specific like that, then I would say you're totally fine holding off and investing, but it's just the idea of a house right now. So if you're kind of just in that spot, I would go ahead and start funding some retirement for the calendar year. Both of you guys open up Roth Iras, and I would go ahead and fund 15% of your income into retirement and go ahead and just start that process. And then here in the next, I don't know, year, two years again, it's not a rush to go in and buy a house.

Renting is okay, especially since you guys are newly married. Putting any level of that on you, it's a lot. So, yeah, I would kind of look around and just kind of see where you guys want to be and maybe have it a goal by maybe next summer, we're going to start really saving for a down payment towards a house. I mean, I would give yourself about a year and again be looking at prices, be looking at places around, but I would go ahead and make it a goal for this calendar year to fund retirement. And then come 2025, if you want to back off of that 15% a little bit, in order to put more down towards it for a down payment, I would put no less than 5% down on a 15 year fixed rate, with your payment being no more than 25% of your take home pay. It's kind of our formula that we go by. Sure so run those numbers, and then in 2025, if you guys really start seeing. Okay, that's the kind of house we want. This feels reasonable. We can save up and do a 10%, 5%, 15% down payment, take some extra money, and if you have to lower that 15% a little bit during that time, that's okay.

But I wouldn't worry about a house this year. I don't know. For me, it's easier to see life and calendar year sometimes. So just for you guys, you've been married three months, enjoy this year, fund some retirements, and then in 2025, I would start looking and just say, okay, that's where you guys are in the process, but don't feel like you have to rush into anything.

Perfect.

Well, thank you.

Congratulations, Madison. You're way ahead of the game. That's fantastic. Let's go out to Naples, Florida, and talk to Sandy. What's up, Sandy?

Hi, John. Hi, Rachel. How are you today?

So good. What's up?

Well, I have a head versus heart situation. I actually have two, but my main situation is I could be debt free, but in a way, I don't want to give up what I'd have to give up to be that way. So I live in Naples, Florida. It's beautiful. It's warm all year round relative to the Cleveland area, where I came from. And I moved here on a job transfer. I've since left that company, but unfortunately, I was laid off in November of last year. Small severance, which has ended. I'm now living off of my savings. I've done okay. I'm single, 61, and I imagine I'm going to stay single. I don't see that changing. But I bought my condo in 2017 for 169,000, and I owe 122 on it at a rate of 2.89. The only other debt I have is a car at 0%. For 60 months, I owe 10,000. And I have that 10,000 tucked away in a savings, earning four and a quarter. So my condo today is worth about 305,000. I could sell it myself. I have the knowledge and ability to do that. I could probably walk away with about 160.

Where would you go? Back home.

Okay.

Go back home to my Cleveland area. I could pay cash for a very modest home or condo there.

Where do you want to be? You want to be a nap?

I want to be where it's warm.

Yeah. How much do you have in retirement?

So I have in savings, and again, that includes my 10,000 for the car. I have about 34,000. I have 71,000 in two brokerage accounts, and I have 387,000 in my.

Imagine you'll be getting another job to bridge.

Yeah, I don't want to do that. That's the other.

Sandy, you got to get a job versus.

Yeah, you got to get this paid off. You could even throw the 71 at it. Pay off the car today. Pay off the car today. You're going to have to go back for a little bit. Your retirement is great. Your account there. But I would work to pay off that condo. But stay where you want to stay.

Yeah.

Don't sell your condo. Get out of debt. Solve for freedom. This is the Ramsay show. Triple 8825-5225 hey, listen, if you are concerned about the economy and you just see your neighbor pulling into your nice middle class neighborhood in a car that you like, how are you affording that? And you just wish people around you had the wisdom of this show. For no money, you don't have to send any money. All you have to do is like or subscribe the show. It puts the show up into the algorithms, and it kicks it into the feeds of your neighbors, into their podcast feeds, into their YouTube feeds. It just sends the show everywhere. And the more people who subscribe and like, and I know it's a pain in the butt, and I know sometimes you have to log in. It's worth it for everybody. It puts the show in front of more people. And so for everybody, it just doesn't cost anything to help out your neighbor.

And share the podcast, though, too. I mean, I get my crime podcast I listen to from friends, even here at the office. And we'll send each other podcasts that we love. So if you love it or if.

There'S an episode, you think, oh, my mom needs to hear this, send it to her, right? Or a buddy that this marriage sounds like yours. Send it to make sure to tell them that. Be careful with that. But, yeah, that's right. Hey, let's go out to Honolulu and talk to the max. What's up, Max?

Hey, how you doing? Thank you for taking my call.

You bet.

How's Hawaii, Max?

It's nice. Nice. It's.

You're not Max Holloway, are you one of my heroes?

No.

All right, what's up?

All right. I was calling because something happened where my brother kind of holds a lot of anger towards me because he got fired from his job and I had to take it over. And I'm getting ready to move out now, and I'm worried it's going to cause more family disconnect. So I'm just trying to get some help, like, navigating the situation.

Is it a family business?

It's like a financial and family thing, the business? No, it's somebody we know that he worked for.

What is it? What kind of business is it?

It's a pool cleaning job I take home, like, about, like, 50 years, so it's pretty good.

50 a year. And why did he get fired?

He had gone on a trip for an extended leave, and I was covering it for him, and the boss, at the end of it, decided to fire him and offered me the job. Oh, man.

So you did a better job?

I don't know. It was just like, he didn't break a rule. You just out cleaned the pools, and the boss was like, I kind of want you instead.

There were some issues with him, and that was a part of it. I wasn't sure if my brother would even be let back after anyways.

Okay, so what is his beef with you that you weren't right or die? Like, yeah, forget these guys. Is that the beef?

I think what happened was he's just feeling like he lost out on a good opportunity. He did.

He wasn't a good worker, somebody to blame for it.

And it's me. He wants to blame me for it instead of himself. All right. I'm okay with that. The main issue is the money from the job helps financially support my family. I come from, like, a single mom household, and I'm 19. I'm trying to move out and be on my own, which would mean that I wouldn't have the same amount of money for my mom anymore. And I'm worried that's going to create even more of a family disconnect. So I don't really know what to do.

What's your mom do?

She's a cleaner. She works, like, two jobs, cleaning.

Okay, how much does she make?

I'm not sure exactly. I think I went over it with her one time.

Okay. How much difference does she need? How much are you covering the bills in the house?

I'm contributing about. It was about $1,500, but I was paying off some debt on the water bill, and then now it's like, to about $1,300. I pay some of rent, I buy all of our food, and I cover the water.

Does she have other struggles, Max?

No.

Like with addiction or with mental health challenges?

No. Sorry, what was that?

I'm asking, does she have.

No, not with addiction or mental health.

Okay. Why have you become the caretaker of your mom?

I think it's really expensive here. And it's hard to afford to live out here if you aren't making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year.

Exactly.

And the main thing is that my mom, I think she'd be fine her own. But I have two younger sisters and that's where I feel weird leaving. I feel like I'm abandoning them.

How old are they?

They're eleven. They turned eleven yesterday.

Is it at a point where you need to sit down with your mom and have a hard conversation about the financial realities?

So I have about six months ago, and I've been keeping up. I told her six months ago I plan on moving out of March.

Okay.

And she hasn't really done any much action towards figuring out another situation. So I don't know if I should just stay and keep helping so that they can stay in their house or if I should just go on and put my oxygen mask on before theirs.

Man.

Well, I just feel like, max, you've put yourself in a caretaker's role at 19. You know what I mean? And it's heroic, right? In one sense. I mean, you've really stepped up and helped your mom, but this will be your whole life unless something else changes. And I feel like that's unfair to you in your life, in your future family, to feel like you have to be the one to carry this burden. And I understand obviously, why that is, but long term, I just don't think it's fair for you to play this role.

Yeah, I think I've come to a similar conclusion. I just feel like, sure, yeah.

What do you do? Does your mom lose the house with your two little sisters? Right?

Yeah. And then it's like, where do they go? We have family here and I'm sure they could move in with my grandparents or something.

But hold on, hold on. Your mom also plays an integral part of this. If you told me, hey, my mom really struggles with addiction and my mom struggles with some mental or emotional health disorders, then I would tell you, like, man, life handed you a mess and it might be a season, right? It may be that you're going to stay at home for a few years and see these young girls until they get older, right? That's not the case. Your mom's making some choices on a daily basis as to where she's going to work and how much money she's going to make and what she's going to ask of her 19 year old son. And so you're making decisions for an adult and that's not your job. Your job is, unfortunately you've been cast in the role to make sure your eleven year old little sisters have food and water, which is never your job. But here we are. Right? And so, man, you're a man of noble character. But I want you to hear what Rachel is saying. Five years from now, what would be better? For you to have started pool cleaning and also gone to get a couple of community college classes on the side.

And five years from now you've got an associate's degree and now you've got four employees of your own and you're making $200,000 or you're still making $50,000. This guy had to lay you off because business got slow. And now you're making $35,000 and you're in the same bedroom in the same house, except you're 24 years old. Like, if you think on a longer time horizon, what's the best thing you can do for your family? It might be to go spread your wings at fly.

I think so, too. I think I just needed some. Like I didn't not feel like I was crazy or leaving it.

No, you're not crazy.

You're going to feel guilty because it sounds unkind.

You're going to feel guilty.

Yeah, it sounds like, oh, my gosh, I'm abandoning my family. But what I want to relieve you of is that was never supposed to be your role. And like John said, if there was like a dire situation of something, that's another. It's a grown up problem that your mom, who has two daughters at home, should be the one calling the show and saying, I can't pay my bills, what can I do? And looking at her budget and all of that, and I think you can help guide that, Max. But you can't even change the way she handles money either, because you don't have that ability. We don't have the ability to change people.

Here's where I think you can get some peace in this transaction.

Okay?

Number one, you're going to feel guilty. Just know that's coming. Okay, you may have heard me say this on the show, choose guilt over resentment every time. If you just stay there and wither, you're going to resent your mom and that's not fair to her. So choose guilt. The second thing is, come up with a number and sit down and tell your mom for six months, I'm going to send $1,000 home. I'm going to send $750 home and make sure that everybody's clear on when this money is coming and give her a ramp. You'll sleep a little better at night, I think. And it's going to be not just a cut off, but it will be a peaceful departure. I'm sorry, my brother. Let us know if we can help.

Thank you.

This is the Ramsay show triple 825-5225 our question of the day is brought to you by neighborly, your hub for home services. Nothing can ruin your Valentine's Day faster than a plumbing emergency. Honey.

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Today's question comes from Ella in Minnesota.

Ella, Ella, Ella. Umbrella. What's up?

My boyfriend of twelve years listens to you all the time. We have three daughters together, but he doesn't want to get married as he doesn't want us to pay for a wedding or risk paying alimony if we ever split up. He thinks this is in line with the baby steps theory. What do you think? I don't think we've ever said that.

This is the greatest question ever.

I like that she blames it on.

The baby steps and that the baby.

Steps are just a theory that he thinks that.

I think Dave just his head exploded in the other country where he is, right. I think he just like, he was like, I got a bad headache because somebody called the baby steps a theory. I love it. Ella, you need to.

We all aren't basically married. You're playing married. Twelve years together, kids together.

Your boyfriend is a child. And you all need to have a hard conversation because this ends, unfortunately, this ends in a pretty gnarly way. He is married to you. He lives with you. Y'all have three kids. Y'all have created humans together. And he's holding on to just dating. Just dating, dude. Because I don't want to pay, by the way, he would pay alimony. There's a thing called common law marriage and I don't know what the rules are in Minnesota, but he's going to pay. You can't just have three kids and be like nah, bro, I'm out.

Nah, dude.

No, I found somebody else at the bowling alley or wherever this dude hangs out. So, yeah, I don't think this has anything to do with the baby steps. I think this has to do with a man who is playing some kind of weird vocabulary gymnastics in his mind and pretending he's not married. But he really.

It just. It feels like a level of immaturity to me because I'm like, okay, pay for a wedding. You don't really even have to do a wedding. Let's just be.

You're go to the JP.

Like, you're fine. It's more the alimony or whatever it is. But to John's point, yeah, common law.

And in the baby steps, we would tell you, like, get married for multiple reasons, but get married. And so there's not a particular marriage baby step in the baby steps theory. But, yeah, we would recommend that you get married before you start having kids and buy a house together, because, as this man did wisely point out, it makes things real complicated financially if you don't have a plan and there's not business protections on the back end.

Yep, that's right.

Oh, there you go. Ella, umbrella. You need to sit down and say, we're getting married, or else let's go out to Detroit Rock City and talk to Andrew. What's up, Andrew? How are we doing?

Hey, guys, thanks for taking my call today.

You got it, man. Thanks for calling. What's up?

So I guess, long story short, my wife was diagnosed with cancer back in July. Due to that happening, I started going through mental health stuff on my own. Basically had kind of what is a manic episode and maxed out all my credit cards, not really caring what happened. And now I am stuck with regret and $15,000 in credit card debt.

What kind of cancer, ma'am?

It was ovarian cancer. So due to that, we're not able to have natural kids anymore, so we're looking at adoption. And me being $15,000 in debt doesn't help with paying for adoption.

Yeah, but let's do this all in order as a family. You all got hit in the mouth, right?

Yes.

How old are you guys?

We're both 25. I'm about to be 26.

And did you go in for, hey, we want to start a family. And you all had a big, exciting time, and you all planned it out, and then you started trying to have a family, and then she went to the OBGYN and found this out. Is that how that happened?

Exactly. That's exactly how it happened.

Okay, so you have to stop right there for a minute and just grieve this. Everything in your life is different now. The debt. We'll get to the debt, but we have to own this part now. Did she have surgery and she's clear?

Yes. So we just found out a couple of weeks ago. The PEt scan came back good. So now she's just got to keep up with scans.

Excellent.

Thankful for that.

You may have had what someone would classify as a manic episode or however you want to diagnose it. Here's what I want to give you another picture to that. Okay? What if your body was just working perfectly? What if it just went into hyperdrive for a minute and you did some dumb things and now the smoke is clearing and we're back.

Yes.

Right?

Yeah.

So let's don't carry regret moving forward. Let's just pay this stupid fifteen k off and move on. You see what I'm saying? And I'm minimizing it on purpose. You did something dumb. Yeah, you did. Okay, cool. Let's solve this problem and move on. This problem doesn't define you. That moment of cancer doesn't define your wife or your family. You all had these dreams of biological kids. It's not going to happen. So, cool. We're going to go down the adoption. See what I'm saying? We're just going to look at the next thing in front of us. I'm not going to carry old cinder blocks with me. I'm just not going to do it, man. Life's too heavy moving forward to carry old crap with us.

Yep.

How does that sound? Does that sound cheesy and lame or are you hearing what getting it.

I'm hearing what you're saying.

That's awesome.

Yeah. Because there's a level of what John's saying that what you've done in the past, it doesn't have to define you, Andrew. And the thing is, in one, like, you know, there is light because it's not like, oh, gosh, I've struggled with overspending for the last three years and now I've realized I have to face it. It came at a point of crisis and a point of pain. And that's how you chose to cope and to keep yourself alive in that situation, right?

Yeah.

Your body said, numb, numb, numb. And you're like, all right, I'll do that.

Did it this way, right? Yeah. And it. Was it the best thing ever? No. But you may not have had the tools to do otherwise. This is where we're at. And so I think kind of just setting all that down and saying, okay, how do we move forward now? How much do you guys make, Andrew? A year?

Well, she wasn't working throughout the whole thing, so I was bringing in about 45,000 a year.

Okay.

She's getting ready to go back to work, and she brings in around 60.

Okay, great.

What do you do for a living?

I'm a mechanic.

Okay, awesome. And what other debt do you guys have?

We own a house. I think that's like 160.

Okay.

And then she's got some student loans from nursing school.

How much are those?

I want to say around 90,000.

Okay.

I'm not positive, though.

Okay. Yeah. Well, I want you guys to get on the same page on how much you guys owe total. And was there anything with the credit cards that you bought that you're like, hey, I could just turn around and.

Sell a bunch of this stuff or return it.

Yeah, we kind of went down this route. I've already basically sold everything that I could.

Okay. Yeah.

I began paying some of them off.

Okay. And how many cards total was it? Three.

I think it was four or five.

Four.

Or the point, like, all the payments are just, like, piling up per month?

Yep. Okay. So what I would do, Andrew, is I would split all of those up into four to five payments, like, whatever each card is. Look at that. And line them up smallest to largest, and then throw her student loan debt in there, too. And this is your family's snowball debt. Snowball. This is what we're going to pay off and have it all together. And then you guys sit down together and Andrew, I think that there is something, I don't know, this is healthy or unhealthy, so John can correct me, but if I'm your wife and just walk through all of that, you're grieving the fact that you're not going to be a mom. Now, there's a little bit of that financial burden that's there of the 15,000 extra in debt. If I were in her shoes and you came to the table with a plan and said, okay, here's a sample budget, we're going to do this together. But I just ran some quick numbers. We could save this per month. We could be out of debt next amount, and I'm going to work extra. I'm going to put in an extra three nights, two nights Saturday per month.

That's going to bring in this much more so we can get out of debt this much faster. There's something about the pro activeness, Andrew, in you to run some numbers, look at it, and come to her with a plan, not a finished plan, that this is what we're going to do. You're not going to tell her this is what we're going to do, but you're going to say, here's an idea of kind of where we're at. I want your feedback, but seeing the proactiveness from you, I think will give her a level of safety that you want out as bad as you're saying with a plan.

Hang on the line. We're going to send you every dollar app for a year on us, the premium version, and we're going to hook you all up with FPU.

Here's the thing about investing advice. You can find it just about anywhere, but that doesn't mean it'll always help you with your personal goals. Here's another option. Check in with a smartvestor pro. These financial advisors can review your plan or help create one that's personalized to you. To find a Smartvestor pro in your area, go to ramseysolutions.com slash smartvestor. Go to ramseysolutions.com slash smartvestor.

Ramseysolutions is a paid, non client promoter of participating pros. Learn more@ramsaysolutions.com smartvestor. This is the Ramsay show. Welcome back. Triple 825-5225 it's triple 825-5225 let's go out to Fresno, California, and talk to Jason. Hey, Jason. What's up, man?

Hey. I just basically just looking to see if you guys think that I'm in a position to be able to buy a new car or a new to me car. I know that's not usually a good thing to be doing, but I just feel like I'm kind of in a position in my life where I can do that. And I'm wondering if you guys think so, too, or I guess, how much is enough when you're wealth building, at some point, do you go get something that you enjoy because life short?

No, I think it's great. And we love cars around here. I feel like people think we just hate cars and tell people to sell cars all the time, which we do because usually people can't afford them, but we love a good car, so we're not mad at cars. So what's your situation? Do you have any debt?

I do. I have about $140,000 worth of debt on a rental property. But it is cash flow positive every month, and the interest rate is so low on it that I bought it, luckily, in 2020, when interest rates were super low, and I just feel like I've had some advisors in my life that have said that.

Oh, I'm sure.

Sorry. Go ahead.

Totally. How much do you make a year?

Right? Around 400 grand a year.

Nice. Jason, what do you do?

So, this is going to be a weird one, but I actually race cars for a living, and that's another question that I had, because it's such a high risk occupation. If it's not a good idea because of that as well, because any moment I could get hurt or something crazy could happen with that.

Yeah, I know. There's like a Netflix documentary about Formula one racing. I don't know much about racing. Okay. So can I just ask. I'm just curious, is it, like, sponsorship deals that you get? Do you win races and there's cash prizes? Like, how are you making 400 doing this?

Correct?

Yeah. Your second guess there was exactly how it works.

Okay, very cool. That's awesome. How old are you?

I'm 27.

27, okay. That's great.

Jason, do you have a primary residence that's paid off?

I do, yeah.

I do, yeah.

So you have no other debt other than this one rental property?

Yeah, I have another rental property that's paid off as well.

Okay, good for you. Yeah. I would make it a goal to pay this rental off as soon as possible. I think having just paid off properties to your name is amazing. So I would work to pay this off. I mean, I'm okay if you keep it just because of your income is so great. So what kind of car are you looking at? Or what price range?

The price range is probably, like right around 50 grand, which I've got some money saved up. I wouldn't necessarily have to finance or anything like that. I do yearly contribute to a 401, and that's gotten built up fairly decent now. So I feel like I'm in a good place, but I'm always so nervous because I feel like my income could fluctuate depending on circumstances, like I said before, and on top of that, it's like I just never know it wins enough. I drive, basically the car I bought after I graduated from high school. I think it was a rental car. I bought it for 15 grand and I paid cash for that. But I just.

Yeah. How much money do you have just saved? Maybe just in a high yield savings or something?

Yeah. So I did it in a high yield savings, and that's part of the reason why I'm debating on doing this or not, because I don't want to take it out of there, necessarily. But like I said, life short. I've seen friends of mine crash in accidents and not be here anymore. But I've probably got about right around 185 grand saved up.

I think you can buy this car, Jason.

Here's our rule of thumb. Our rule of thumb is if you have a net worth of a million dollars and you're about there, well, and.

That'S a brand new car. Is this a brand new car? The 50,000?

If I bought a brand new, it'd probably be about 50 to 60 grand I could probably get a used one for. But I want something that's newly used. Like, I wouldn't want, like, a demo vehicle or something like that. I'm not interested. If I buy this vehicle, it's not going to be one that I'm going to go get another one in two years. I'm going to keep it until the wheels fall off, or at least until it's really old. I just feel like I want to go get something that I want if I'm going to go get it.

No, I hear, Jason, go get a car. Go get a car.

Yeah.

And pay your rental house off.

Yeah. Live on 200 and pay it off this year.

Here's your greatest hedge against something coming. And by the way, you bring up a great point, brother, and I just want to hit this. You make $400,000 a year racing cars, and people are going to look at you and you think this like, man, I'm in a job that anything can happen to any day, and I'm out of a job. That's true. And there are people who go to $400,000 a year jobs at their hospital or at their law firm, and they think I'm in a secure job. They're not. And we know this because we talk to them all the time where the hospital lays them off, or they have to go on furlough, or the law firm downsizes or whatever's going on. And so I think there's this illusion, Jason, that everybody, there's some jobs that are super stable and some that just are kind of fly by night. Everybody needs to look at their risk portfolio and say, hey, am I just hanging out in the wind? And if you don't owe anybody any money and then you can't race anymore, awesome, dude. You'll have two paid off rental houses, plus your property, plus a nice $50,000 car that you can drive for the next ten years, bro, you're set up.

You could go work at a grocery store for the rest of your life and you'd be all right.

Yeah.

You see what I'm saying?

That's true. I just always get nervous. I watch my parents grow up and struggle at times, and I just never wanted to be. I'm only 27. I'm probably going to get engaged pretty soon, and I'm always in this constant battle in my head of, do I go spend money and go get a car, or do I keep building wealth to the point where I never have to worry about money and my kids are going to be okay forever.

Yeah. And what I would say to you, Jason, is you can do both of those things.

Right?

You can do both. You don't have to pick one. And I think understanding that giving needs to be a part of your plan, too. You need to be saving, which you're really great at, and you need to enjoy some of this. Right. You're working hard for it and risking your life, literally driving this car. So those three things have to be part of your plan. I want you to be giving some. I want you to saving is there and go and spend and enjoy. And I think that this is one of those things that you have to build into your rhythm to know that you're going to be okay. You can spend some money and you're going to be okay. And the amount of savings with the rentals and what you have, your income, your retirement, all of it, just so.

You know, from where we're sitting, the fact that you make 400 grand a year and you have a paid for house and you've come up with the number of about $50,000, that tells me that you're being super wise, because that's just a small percentage of your income. And you got cash that you've been saving up and saving up and saving up. And most of the time on the show, we have people who call in and they make 28 five. And they have a $50,000 truck. Right?

Yeah.

And so that's not you. You're a wise kid. The only thing I would tell you is I know you got a killer interest rate. It's amazing. And everybody around you is like, bro, you should invest the gap, and then you can take home 7%. You're the one that goes to bed at night knowing, hey, this could all go away tomorrow. And I still have a house note over there.

Yeah, right.

Just get rid of the house note.

Yeah. Okay.

Solve for peace. You've been solving to survive for a long time because you watched how your parents live. You've done that, you've solved to survive. Now let's start solving for freedom. Let's solve for peace. I'm not going to owe nobody anything because I'm freaking jason. I'm a race car. Right? Like, it just sounds cooler, right?

Yeah. I appreciate that.

I'm proud of you, brother. That's so good, man. That's awesome. Congratulations.

Well done.

Yeah. Thank you very much. I appreciate the advice, too. And that was going to be my next question about the rental property. And, yeah, it makes total sense if I'm you.

I pay that off today and I go buy a car this weekend.

Yeah. Those are your two goals.

And then you can just drive around town in your new car, looking around and wondering how many other people who are 27 at the stoplight next to you have three paid for houses. And I'm going to tell you, very few of them. Very few of them, man. Wow.

So great.

It's amazing.

That is so impressive. Yeah. And even with the rental conversation, always remember, people, it's a part time job. It's a great investment. When you get to that point of baby step seven, to diversify and have some other things you're investing in, investing in real estate is a great one, but just do it with cash and do it slowly. But Jason's in a great position to be able to come completely pay it off.

That's another hour in the books right here on the Ramsey show. Stay tuned. We'll be back soon. Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, it's the Ramsey show, where we help people with their money. We help people build wealth, do work they love, and create incredible relationships. I'm John Deloney, joined by my friend Rachel Cruz on a special Valentine's day edition of the Ramsay show. We're taking your calls on money, life, work, marriage, all of it. Triple 8825-5225 that's triple 8825-5225. And real quick, before we go to the phones, join us in nashville for our brand new total money makeover weekend on May 10 and 11th. It's an entire awesome weekend. There's millions of you out there who've been listening for a while, and you're still sitting on the sidelines. No more sitting around. Some of y'all found us on YouTube, and you've just been binging the show. It's time to come experience this whole thing live. It's time to take action. In just one weekend, you're going to get a crash course on everything we teach about money. You'll hear all brand new stuff from Ramsey personalities on budgeting, beating debt, investing, and more.

No matter what, baby step, you're on, this event will light a fire under your butt to keep progress on making your goals. There's a fire under your butt. It's such a Dave line.

Dave wrote that copy.

There's going to be live q as all throughout the weekend, so bring your questions. And there's something different about our events. They're actually fun. We have a blast. You'll have a blast. Early bird tickets are just $99, but they're only for a limited time. If you want to get the best deal on tickets, this will be it. And the Ramsay event center only holds 2400 people. And people will come from all over the planet. So there's limited seats. So you don't want to wait to get your tickets. Get your tickets now@ramsaysolutions.com. Slash events light a fire.

I think you made that up. I didn't even see it.

No, it's in there. Look at this. No matter what, baby step, you're on, this event will light fire under your butt. Fantastic. My booty. I need some preparation eight. Let's go out to San Antonio, Texas, and talk to Keith. Hey, Keith, what's up?

Hey, good afternoon to you, too. I'm calling because I'm having a hard time trying to figure out how to get my wife, actually, gazelle. Intense and not ish.

Okay.

How have you.

She, is she there, Keith, by chance?

No, not right now, man.

I was like, this would be a fun combo. I want to hear her opinions on you, Keith. No, just kidding.

Well, a little bit of what's going on is right now, I'm in between going from primary job to my side hustle, I've pretty much let her do everything financially. As far as paying the bills and everything else, I rake in as much money as I can.

Hey, Keith.

Hey, Keith. Hey, Keith.

Do me a favor. Talk directly into your phone, brother.

I thought I would. I am.

All right. There you go.

It was just all mumbled.

Yeah. All right. So she's been doing all the money stuff.

Yeah. She's been handling, paying the bills and everything. And I do commend her. She does keep up with everything. I mean, we are not late on anything. And things are getting paid no problem. Where I'm having a hard time is I'm putting in minimum 60 hours a week between my main job and the side hustle. And she just has her one job and that's it. Between the two of us, our net take home pay is 100 to 110. A year. And 78 of that is just from me. And it's just real hard.

Does she take care of the house?

Yeah, and that's why I'm also having a hard time.

Have you guys sat down and done a budget together, Keith, and said, hey, here's how much we make as a household every month. And here is what we're going to agree on of, like, hey, yep, we both feel good about this, that this is where the money is going. Have you all done that?

Well, for the longest time we've had a budget. We've got a crazy detailed excel spreadsheet we've done.

But that's not the problem here. The problem here is that you don't think she's pulling as much weight as you and you're starting to resent her.

Why? Well, it's not so much that she's not pulling as much weight, it's that she's not fully committed to getting the debt gotten rid of.

That's why I was asking, though, keith, have you guys sat down together and said, ok, here is exactly where our money's going and we're going to agree this much money extra is going to pay off debt.

We have in the past, but then things slap us in the face known as life, and we fall off of our baby steps and then next thing you know, we're just back into the normal people life.

Okay, but in that answer, you said we, so that sounds like both of you. But on the other time, you're telling me it's her that keeps doing this?

Well, no, for like, I don't know, the last six months I've been trying is where I'm at right now. And I don't think she's gotten out of the last funk we had yet.

How much debt do you have, ma'am?

Without our mortgage, it's about $73,000.

Okay, and what is it? What's all the debt?

The biggest two are credit cards. One that's in her name, one that's in my name.

How much are on those?

52,000.

Oh, my gosh. What'd you all get? What'd you buy?

They're credit cards that we've had for a while. And whether it be her van needing a new engine, my truck needing engine rebuild or rear end replaced.

Okay, so I'm going to just call a little bit of a flag here. And I think it's both of your issues, Keith. I mean, you may be putting in more hours and I think.

I'm not going to argue that at so yeah.

So I think it gets to a point, Keith, that you both have to sit down and say, we're done with this. We're cutting up the credit cards. Debt's not an option anymore. If something happens to the car, we're down to a one car family. You get to this point that you're just like, we are done. We are done with playing this game. We are just normal with $52,000 in credit card debt.

Right?

I mean, there gets to a point that you just have to say, we can't keep living like this. And when you come together, you just cut mine up. Okay. Yeah.

Well, I thought I had some fraudulent charges on there, and I called the bank and said, cancel the card. Kill the account. Yeah.

Then you all need to have a sweet, romantic Valentine's night tonight where you both sit down and lay it out and honestly and tell her where you're at. Tell her not just, this is what I want to do, but it's like, man, I'm so tired. I'm so tired. I feel like I'm working so much and I don't feel progress. Not a blame on her, but of the habits you guys have created together as a family. And it's this point of how are you feeling about that?

Right?

I mean, where's the fear in it? You're scared. You guys talk about where you're at in life because this isn't working. She knows it's not working. And you guys get into these ruts at different times and suddenly you're out of the rut. She's still in it. But it goes back and forth is what it seems like. And it's kind of like, hey, let's paint a picture for our future and what we want together. That needs to be the conversation tonight. Keith.

Yo, yo.

Dr. John Deloney here with some big news. Money and marriage getaway is back. October 24 through 26th. Join Rachel Cruz and me for a weekend in Nashville, Tennessee to focus on your marriage. You're going to get two and a half days of teaching, take part in a bunch of live Q and A's, and get the tools you need to win with money and intimacy together. Tickets start at $799, and you can pick up the limited vip tickets left and get all the perks, including meet and greets with me and Rachel. Go to ramsaysolutions.com events. Welcome back. And guess what? Money and marriage getaway is back this fall. October 24 through 26th, me and Rachel are going to be hosting. We're running it back. The money, marriage weekend that was such a hit. We are running it back, and we are super excited. Platinum tickets are gone. They created some vip tickets. They had to move some tables around because those were gone, too. But they've added a few more. And ramsaysolutions.com events, one of the key parts of the money marriage event. And by the way, a couple of couples showed up and they were engaged.

They're about to be married. And then there were also a number of couples who were new empty nesters. There's a couple of couples who'd been married for decades and everybody in between. So if you're like, we're too old or we're too young, or we're about to get married, or we're really struggling. There was a couple of couples that found out some really gnarly things about their marriage on the way to the event and almost turned around and went home. So it's for everybody. Everybody, wherever you are or whatever stage you're in. But a cornerstone is the q a is people coming and saying, okay, what about our family? And it's cool to watch all these couples lift each other up and to be like, oh, yeah, that is crazy. And Rachel and I talk about our personal families, but we get a bunch of questions. We didn't answer all of them last year, and so we've got a few that are left here. So, Rachel, I'm going to pose one of the questions that an attendee asked last year that we didn't answer. Live. All right, here we go. My husband and I share bank accounts and Amazon accounts.

Do you have any tricks or tips to buy gifts for your spouse and keep it a surprise?

Yes.

How do you trick Winston?

People are always like, we need separate accounts because we got to buy gifts. I'm like, oh, my gosh. Okay, so first, very easy. If there is a celebration coming up, a birthday, Christmas, you know you're going to be buying each other gifts. So go get a visa gift card and go buy the gift. With a visa. They won't know where it's from, but they know you're going to be spending money. So that's one way. And then if you wanted an absolute complete surprise, which Winston did on our anniversary this year, he actually had a friend buy it and then paid him know. It was like, yeah, here's the money, and I'll just venmo you the know, I give her the.

So, multiple times over my marriage, my friend Tod and my friend John has bought a thing that I sent them and shipped to their house.

Totally and they hold it for. Right. That's right. Yep. I did that for my mom for concert tickets to surprise them. Yeah. And my mom got them.

My wife and I do a crazy thing, and here's how it goes. My wife will say, hey, it's your birthday. I just ordered something. Don't look.

Yeah.

And I'll go, okay. Just because I know, not easy. We're crazy, but we're adults. But she'll say, like, hey, there's a package coming. Don't open it. And I'll go, that's right. Okay.

Yes. We've done that, too.

I know.

Easy to solve. I hear people be like, we don't want same accounts, because if we want to surprise each other, and I'm like, oh, my gosh. Live a full life together, America.

Let's go Salt Lake City to the utes and talk to brother Ryan. Hey, Ryan. What's up? What's up, Ryan?

Hey. How are you?

You cool, man?

That's my one year old baby.

Suddenly you have a fire lit under your butt. What's up, man?

Speaking of. Yes.

So great.

She chose right. She heard you guys. My question is for my family's happiness, and we can get into that. What is the math that would make sense to justify us moving to California?

You're going to California.

I know everyone's.

You're like a steelhead. You're like a salmon swimming upstream, buddy.

Okay, so what's the situation? Is it family? What is it that's in California?

I mean, our love story. I met my wife there. We moved to Utah. I got a job. We bought a house when it was cheap in Utah. Wait, sorry, what?

Go ahead. Go ahead. Okay.

And we bought it for real cheap. And then now it's worth a lot. So can we move back? Is I guess the question, because we have a ton of equity in the house, and we spent four years there during grad school together, and it was the happiest time of our life. And my wife said, please, not on my graves. I do not want to move back to Utah. It's not the right place for, you know, we moved back here after grad school because we thought it'd be smart financially. And we've been dying to get out since. But everyone's telling us, don't do it. Don't go to California. You've got such a low mortgage payment on your house.

Here's the thing other people don't get.

We don't feel happy here.

Other people don't get a vote. Number one. Number two, it's like a counseling 101 principle that wherever you go, wherever you end up, you go with you. And so if your marriage is unhappy in Salt Lake City, it's going to be unhappy in Los Angeles. It's not the marriage.

Actually, I'm really fortunate to say that we are still madly in love. Eleven years later, five kids later, then.

Yeah, my wife and I needed to move from where we were, and we picked a couple of places across the country, and I applied for jobs, and Nashville was at the very top of our. It's been. It's transformed our.

Mean.

Geography plays a big role. But my wife and I moved with a bunch of problems in our marriage, and those didn't go away. We still had to sit down and overhaul the house.

Was how much you could sell your house for in Salt Lake. Equity wise, what would you walk away with?

We think equity wise, we'd walk away with about seven hundred k. Okay.

And how much do you guys make a year?

It's just me. 156 base and ten to 15 bonus.

Does that job go with you to Los Angeles?

Yes, it would. And we've been looking actually, in three different counties and actually not Los Angeles county.

Okay. Yeah, you've priced it out. And I would kind of just get an idea. Standard of living of, hey, this is how much, if, you know, groceries, but kind of just do a rough budget. Because here's what I don't want Ryan, to happen, is you move from Salt Lake to a more expensive area, and I'm not just talking California. This could be anywhere. Right. You put yourself in a more expensive area and you get down the road a year and you guys have no margin in your budget, and you're just like, oh, my gosh, that money. Stress starts to wither on this romanticized dream of what we always wanted, and reality sets in. Now, you guys may be in a great. I mean, I would run the numbers, and if you guys feel comfortable, and $700,000 is a great. That's great equity to be moving somewhere.

That'S at least 5% down on an orange county home.

Yeah, right.

I'm just pulling up.

But for real, though, Ryan, I want you guys to be grown ups in that sense, to actually run the numbers and say, yeah, we will be comfortable and we will thrive right in this. And that's great, and that's great. But I do kind of piggyback on what John said, that we can build something up sometimes in our minds. And the way it plays out isn't always what we had hoped and dreamed, that this thing would give us. Right. So just remember that. But also, I think that on the other side of the coin, sometimes moves are needed. And if you guys are not happy in Salt Lake. Yeah. Find somewhere else, another city that you guys want to be.

Yeah. I mean, a little context. We grew up Mormon, and now we're just Christian, and we're, like, second class citizens here. And we're used to the sun. And so we're stuck inside with our five kids. Five months.

Maybe it's time to go. I would also remember this. Sometimes, loved ones, when we say, hey, we're going to leave, they give us advice and wisdom to stay, and they find a bunch of reasons to stay. Here's what they're really saying. I love you, and I'm really going to miss you. And I think it's important to acknowledge that and internalize that. I had a budy that just kept saying, like, man, if you move to Tennessee, this and this and this. And finally, he was just like, bro, I just don't want you to go. And so I love the sentiment. I loved that he loved me that much. And the best thing for me and my family was to go. But that doesn't.

And the sun is other places, too.

But it doesn't give you a pass on math. And so to hear you say, no, we've got 700 grand. We're thinking this through, man. I say go for it. I say, absolutely, go for it, brother. Good on you. This is the Ramsay show.

Folks.

Changing your family tree takes more than rice and beans and side hustles. It's also about transferring the big financial risks off your family by having the right kinds of coverage in place. That's why my team created the coverage checkup quiz. It only takes about five minutes to find out what types of insurance you need and don't need to protect your finances. Make this quiz one of your regular checkups, starting right now@ramsaysolutions.com. Checkup. That's ramsaysolutions.com checkup.

Welcome back. This is the Ramsay show. I'm John Deloney, joined by Rachel Cruz. Taking your calls on money, work, life, relationships, your marriage, all of it. Triple 8825-5225. That's triple 825-5225. Let's go out to Green Bay, Wisconsin, and talk to the Jim. What's up, Jim?

Hey, guys. Can you hear me? Fine.

Doing great, brother. What's up?

Hey, before we start, nice to meet you guys. Your show has been a friend to me over the years, and thank you.

Well, you're a friend to us, man. We're grateful for you.

All right, do you want the question first or the kind of the situation that leads up to it?

You are driving this truck, brother. You just go however you want to.

All right, well, I'll just start with the backstory here, then. So, ever since I started earning money, the culture I grew up in, the kids give all their money to the parents till you're 21. So I've been in that system, earning money for the family and the farm. My dad was a severe alcoholic. I had to ask him to leave when I was 19, and three of my sisters younger than me were still at home. So I provided for them. They worked, too. We all kind of pooled the money and paid the payments and all of that, and I stayed. I got married through that time. All the sisters, they married and moved out, and I'm the last one home with my mother. How old are you right now? I'm 36.

Okay.

So I've been married for. This is my 10th year, to a wonderful woman. I got six kids. I've been supposed to been getting the property, but there was just kind of a loose agreement, I'm ashamed to say. I just never pushed it, like, to get a contract or something. So we had been paying the mortgage for first four years of marriage and helping out with some other ods and ends, and my mother needed a new house. So during this time, about five years ago, I co signed a mortgage. We got a small loan, and I built a house that she could afford, but it still needs work done because we went as far as we could with the money, and she moved in. And then I hit a breaking point there. Just couldn't keep up with all the work. Well, through all this time, I was also helping my dad sober off multiple times and all of that. But I hit a breaking point, and I told my mom that I did all the labor for free, and I donated a lot of material. I told her, I can either donate time or I can pay you fair rent, one or the other.

I can't keep doing what I'm doing. And I asked for a contract just for rent, because every time I tried to push for an agreement as far as future buying a property, I keep getting put off. So it's like, fine, I need some kind of contract, something for my family here. And no contract. She just demands that I pay a certain amount.

Jim, it's time to go.

Okay?

It's time to go. You have six kids, and they're watching their dad drown. Thank you, sir. Your mother is trying to play both sides of the fence here. And I get the cultural aspect up and through 21. And I also get that you were put into a father role because your father was struggling mightily and you took care of your little sisters, you took care of your mom. You're a noble man and you've continued to do that. But right now, as a 36 year old man with six kids and a wife of a decade going on decade number two, your mom is playing both sides of the fence. She wants to play mom when it's convenient and works out for her, which is, hey, son, will you come do a bunch of stuff for your sweet old mom? And you're a good son and you say yes, and then when it conveniences her, she wants to play landlord, which is, give me my freaking money, man. And that toggle back and forth is killing you. And it's time to not do business with her. Just have her be your mom. And if she doesn't want to be your mom, unless she's controlling your business, then that's a choice that she makes.

Yeah.

But you're going to lose your mom over bad business. And it's time to preserve your relationship with your mother and walk away. Get your own place.

Yes, sir. Okay.

And you're going to look back and go, look at all the equity I lost. Look at all the time. Don't do any of that crap. All that kept you afloat to today. We're just going to say, that was a rough season, man. And here we are. And at 36 years old, you're almost starting from scratch. You're going to build a legacy and you're going to change your family tree. And your kids, all six of them, are never going to experience what you went through, right?

Hell, no.

There you go. This is what changing your family tree looks like right here. It's time to move out.

Well, thank you, sir. I really appreciate it.

Does that give you peace?

It helps. Yes, sir. It helps a lot. Because I needed an outsider's opinion, because the only people that I've asked are connected to the situation.

It's too muddied.

Yeah, it's a mess.

They want me. They there so that they don't have to deal with the situation.

That's right. And I think it's time to take your brothers and sisters and say, I am handing this baton to you. I've done it for 36 years. It's time for you all to step in. And by the way, your dad, you can love him. It's not your job to sober him up. In fact, you can't sober him up. Only he can. You can walk with him, you can love him, but don't give him any money.

I agree with you there, but I was trying that for a period. But he got tired to the last time that I did it, and he moved somewhere where I can't pastor him. Okay.

All right.

I've let him go. I've let that part go. But the other part of this is he's still legally married to my.

He is. He can deal with his legal obligations.

But, Jim, for you guys, what does it realistically look like? Because the home you're living in was your mom's old home. Is that right? Was I following that correctly?

No. I built my own house. I pay taxes on it and everything, and I still have to pay rent for it.

Because your mom is on the mortgage. Or the house you built for your mom is the one she's living in?

No, I built a little shed that I live in.

Okay.

And then I built her a new house that she's living in. And the old house is junk.

Okay.

It's rotten.

Where do your six kids live?

Oh, they live with me and my wife. We're in our little shack. We're comfortable. We don't need a whole lot.

Jim, what do you do for a living, brother?

I'm a construction worker, and I was growing the farm business at home, so. Not a construction worker? I have my own construction business.

How much do you make a year?

What's that?

How much do you make a year?

Well, the last two years, my take home pay that I paid myself out of the business was 32,000. But I've made some big changes, and I'm expecting that to double in the next couple of years at the least.

Good for you. Good for you.

Hey, Jim. I want it to triple. Well, you work too hard, and you're too good at what you do. And you care too much. Those are three great traits for a leader.

Well, thank you, sir.

Okay. But you're going to have to scratch and claw, but I don't want you all living in a shack. I want you to get your family a home.

Yes, sir. That's my plan. You're confirming what was in my mind. Like I said, hear that? Outsider's perspective. Just make sure I'm not.

You're not crazy. Can I tell you, you may be around some crazy, but you're not the crazy one, Jim.

That's the feedback I've been getting.

I want to give you step one of your healing adventure. Okay.

Yep.

It's Valentine's Day today.

Yes, sir.

I want you to take your wife out. Just y'all two. No kids. It. I want you to figure that out. No kids. She doesn't get the babysitter.

You do.

And it might be you're one of your olders, one of your older siblings, but. Or one of your older kids. But listen, I want you to take her out. I want you to look at her across the table in a restaurant and say, for the last decade, you have watched me put everybody else first. That ends now. From this point forward, you're my wife, and I put you first. And we're going to make this thing right. You're a good man, dude. It's time to focus that energy on your wife and your six kids and give them a home. We'll be right back. This is the Ramsay show. Today's scripture of the day is ecclesiastes four, nine through ten. Two are better than one because they have a good return for their labor. If either of them falls down, one can help the other up. But pity anyone who falls down and has no one to help them up. Catherine Hepburn says, love has nothing to do with what you are expecting to get, only with what you are expecting to give, which is everything. Speaking of this ecclesiastes verse where if one falls down, one can help them.

Yeah, that's James. James Childs. I fall down at this job a lot, and James picks me up, man.

Trying to get bonus points from our producer.

I love you, John. Well, I appreciate you following. You live this scripture out. It breathes in you. I'm honored to know you, Anne. It's awesome. Let's go out to Sylvia in Minneapolis, Minnesota, which is a word that he worked with me on for a long time. What's up, Sylvia?

Not much. Everybody else calls it Minneapolis.

I used to always call it Minneapolis. And then one day James came in and was like, listen, you have to learn how to speak and read. And so it's Minneapolis. What's up, Sylvia?

Yes, so I have accrued about, I think, what, $35,000 about in debt. And I am 31, so I really want to start working that number down so that I'm not on a paycheck to paycheck budget or just being stressed out about finances all the time.

Yes, totally fair. What's the kind of debt?

So 13,000 is in a car that I have right now. I pay 380 on a payment monthly. Also, I have student loan debt. I think they are about, I don't know. Roughly about 18 of it.

Okay.

And I've got about 3000 in credit card debt.

Okay. How much do you make a year?

40,000.

Roughly 40,000. Okay. Yeah. What do you do?

I'm an assistant property manager.

Okay, awesome. Yeah. Do you have any money saved?

I don't, but we are, of course, in tax time, so I have some things that I plan to put away with that coming.

How much of a refund will you get?

I think about 4000.

Okay. That's great. I mean, great in the sense that that's your money that you'll be getting back, that you can use really intentionally. But that is one thing you could do is go in, if you have an HR department, and adjust your w two and be able your paychecks, and don't take as much out in taxes because this big refund means that's money that could have been working for you.

Yeah.

You loaned the federal Government $4,000 this past year. They're super grateful at no interest.

So adjust that so your paychecks are a little bit bigger, which will help with your cash flow. So that's one thing to do with this. If I were you, I would park $1,000 in a starter emergency fund when you get this refund. And then I would throw the rest of the credit cards and cut up your credit cards, too. Don't even give yourself the option to go back into credit card debts. Just get rid of them.

Okay.

And that'll feel good. I mean, that frees up. That's like, okay, now you have your car payment and your student loan left. And when you look at this equation, Sylvia, when it comes to just, like, the basics of starting all this out, really, there's two ways that money flows. Money flows in, money flows out. And so looking at your income, seeing, hey, what kind of side hustle can you do as you're getting out of debt? Because upping your income is going to be a real key part of getting out of debt faster. So this is probably going to look like working nights. Are you married, kids? What's your family situation?

I've got one child. I'm dating someone right now that I'm with. But outside of that, how old's your son?

Daughter?

My son. He's 13.

He's 13. Okay, cool. So that may look like maybe one Saturday a month and a few nights. I mean, doing what you can realistically to be able to bring in some extra money. So that's the income side. And we talk to people all the time, Sylvia, that are, I mean, they're on this process and they're making 1314, 2000 extra dollars a month, realistically of doing some extra stuff. So really get creative on that end and then be looking at your expenses. And I want you to do a budget. And at the end of this, Taylor is going to pick up, and we're going to give you every dollar premium, which is our budgeting app. And in that app, there's a lot of education to be able to teach you. Here's how to do a zero based budget. But I basically want you to take your income for the month, and you're going to list out everything you spend money on. And Sylvia, you're going to be mixing some expenses.

Yeah, you're going to be a lot of them.

Some things that your subscriptions. No vacation, no out to eat. I mean, I really want you to challenge yourself to really say, okay, we're going to cut a lot of this, and that's going to free you up with some money. And so the beautiful thing is, I'm going to make up a number, Sylvia, I don't know what it will be for you, but let's say you can bring in an extra 1500, and maybe you find an extra 500 in your budget to cut, right? That's $2,000 extra a month. And even that being thrown at your car, you're going to start to see that chip away. And what ends up happening is when people feel this progression of, oh, my gosh, I'm winning. I'm actually getting traction. I'm actually seeing a positive result with my money. It's a natural instinct in us that you naturally will say, okay, I can pick up two more hours here and make a little bit more there. Oh, yeah, we can cut the grocery budget another $100 here. I mean, you start to really get this momentum started, because for the first time ever, maybe for you, Sylvia, you're actually going to feel in control of your money, because you're going to be doing a budget and you're going to be working your way out of debt.

And when that car is paid off, and you may even look at, I mean, you could even look at selling the you. Have you kelly blue booked at all? I'm curious what it would be worth.

I have, but I think it's less than half of what the value is.

Okay.

How much I still owe on it.

You're pretty underwater. Okay. Yeah. And we always say if it's more than half of your take home pay, you have too much car, so you're not at that point. I mean, it's 13,000 versus 40,000, so you're at a manageable spot. It had been beautiful. If it was worth 16,000, you could sell it and just get rid of it and get a $3,000 car. But with this, again, it's kind of just this new way of looking at your money, and it's going to feel different, and it's going to be hard. But I think for you, Sylvia, there's going to be some peace in it, too, because you're actually going to have control over your income. You're going to have a plan on where you're going, and I think you're going to see progress really quickly.

So, Sylvia, can I tell you a wild story real quick?

Yeah, absolutely.

When I was 13, my mom, who had never gone to school, she'd never gone to college. She took her first community college class, and then she took another class the next semester. And then the semester after that, she took two classes, and it just kept going and going and going. And when my mom turned 57, she graduated with her phd. And at 63, she was tenured as a professor. But here's the important part of this conversation. At 13, 1415 and 16, I had a ringside seat to watching my mom work really, really hard. And I remember her coming and putting the laundry soap on the washer and says, your laundry is on you now, budy. I got homework, and I started having to fend for myself with frozen dinners and stuff like that. She would make meals on Saturdays, and I had to heat them up. Here's the thing. I look back and I have no excuses. On being a good dad, on learning new crafts, on changing as the world changes underneath me, because I watched my mom blaze a trail. And your 13 year old is going to watch you do this, and it's going to change his family tree.

Yeah.

You see what I'm saying? This isn't just you getting out of debt.

I really love that vision.

Yeah. You are going to change his life, because he's going to watch mom and he's going to be annoying. I got to do my own laundry. I got to do. Yep. Because mom's working another job and another. Proud of you.

Yeah, hold on the line. Taylor's going to pick up, and we'll give you financial peace, university, our nine lesson course, and every dollar premium, because we want to give you as many tools as possible, Sylvia, because this is possible for you, truly. And like John said, what your son is going to experience and the example you're going to set for him. It changes everything from this point forward because you chose to do something different.

Big time.

Shout.

So proud of you. So proud of you.

Taylor, Austin, Joe, our fearless leader and handsomest guy around, James Childs, and even Zach with the YouTube crew. Thanks to you, America. We'll see you soon on the Ramsey show.

Hey, folks, Dave Ramsey here. You know, budgeting doesn't have to be boring. You just need a budgeting app that's made with you in mind, and that's everydollar. The everydollar app has helped millions of people work the baby steps and take the stress out of planning and managing their money. Start budgeting with everydollar for free. Right now. Just go to ramsaysolutions.com everydollar and download the app today. That's ramsaysolutions.com everydollar.