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On November 12th, 1995, Brenda Wei's body was discovered behind a dumpster in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia. Her throat had been slit with a solid alibi. The initial investigation cleared her ex-boyfriend, Glen, assoon of the murder. But nearly a year later, a new investigator was assigned to this cold case who used the ramblings of a crack addict seeking leniency in order to bring Glenn back into suspicion. The investigation continued down an increasingly ridiculous path involving psychics and even more crack addicts.

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While there was evidence pointing toward a bearded serial killer the entire time, police both disregarded and hid that evidence, though choosing to stay with a course they knew was a farce. And Glen spent over 16 long, miserable years behind bars until Innocence Canada was able to unearth that detail and sprinklered from prison. However, nothing will ever replace all of the years stolen from Glenn and his family. This is wrongful conviction with Jason Flom. Welcome back to Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flom, that's me, of course, I'm your host, and today you're going to hear a story from north of the border.

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We have two incredible lawyers, Shawn MacDonald and Phil Campbell from innocense Canada. Shawn, first of all, welcome to Wrongful Conviction. Thanks for being here. Thanks very much for having me. And Phil, I'm so glad you're here as well to highlight the work that Innocence Canada does, because I don't believe that this organization gets enough attention and we want to change that. So thanks for being here as well. Thanks so much, Jason. And of course, saving the best for last.

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We have a guy who I can only call a hero to so many of us, Glen Assoon, who went to hell and back and is here to share his story with us. So, Glenn, thank you for being here. Thank you. Glad to be here.

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Yeah, it's sort of a miracle that you made it through and that you are here and it speaks to your strength and your spirit. So I'm really excited that you're here and I'm sorry you had to go through this. Let's go back to the beginning, Glenn. Where did you grow up?

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I grew up in Sydney, Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, a small town. And how was your life before this? What were some of your hobbies? My hobbies.

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Just playing a guitar, trying to learn how to play a guitar properly and stuff, listening to country music and trying to play country music.

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And you were raising a pretty large family as well at the time, right?

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Yes. I had three kids to raise back in the 70s, and then everything went to hell in a handbasket.

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We're talking about Sunday morning, November 12th. Nineteen ninety five. Your ex-girlfriend, Brenda Way, was discovered behind an apartment building in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, and her throat had been slit. Even, I think for avid listeners of the show who've heard so many of these stories, this one is fucking sick. Now, this is where I want to turn to the legal team, because the preventable nature of all of this is so stunning to me. Tell me what the hell happened here.

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So at the beginning, police rightfully interviewed all the people they had contact with Brenda Way. They interviewed Glenn. They determined that he had an alibi. He was with his roommate and friend and Morse all night with two other roommates that night. So he had a supportable, credible, truthful, most importantly, alibi. And in the end, it appeared to us, at least on the record, that we review that they cleared him as a suspect or at least did prioritize him as a person of interest and moved on to look at other things.

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So we had this excellent alibi confirmed within hours of the discovery of the body. And sometime in the year or two afterwards, the Brenda Wade homicide shifted to two different officers. And those two guys decided that Larison must have done it. And really, it's a kind of classic example of the tunnel vision that so often characterizes wrongful convictions where you stop investigating a crime and you start investigating a person. And once they are fixed on Glenn, the first thing they had to do is discredit the alibi.

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So they pulled in Ann Morse, who had told the truth. They arrested her for obstruction of justice, for having told the truth. They told us she was going to jail for three to five years. They intimidated her and then they finally persuaded her that maybe she couldn't know and maybe she wasn't sure, even though she had always said before then and has always said afterwards that that statement I gave the morning Brenda was found was the truth. So they thought they had a little crack in the alibi.

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And then they started finding recruiting other witnesses. And there was just a daisy chain of witnesses, each less credible than the other. But collectively, they made up the case that the crown eventually put in front of the jury. It's like they send in the clowns, write one farcical witness after another is dragged into this. Can you walk us through this cast of characters real quick?

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Glenn was hitting the streets after Brenda was killed trying to find out who killed her. One of the people Glen was regularly speaking with was a woman by the name of Margaret Hattrick. Margaret was a well-known street prostitute. Now, it's interesting because at different times, Margaret Hattrick would call Glen and say, I have information on Brenda's murder. And there were a number of occasions where Glen brought Margaret to the attention of the police because she was telling him, I know what happened.

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I'm hearing on the streets what's happening in. Glen was saying, well, tell the police. Margaret eventually was picked up by the police in relation to a customer of hers who had died. And while she was speaking to the police about this, she said to them, well, I also have information on Brenda Wade homicide. And so the police officer said, OK, well, what do you have to say? And they sat down and she started to go on this rambling diary.

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About psychic visions and psychic dreams that she had where she saw areas of Dartmouth where Brenda was taken by different people and how she was killed to the point where the cops just said, look, thanks for the information, and they started to shuffle her out the door, or at least this is the way they recall the conversation and when they testified at Glenn's trial. And then Margaret suddenly said, well, I guess you don't care that Glen was at the site of the murder at four fifteen a.m. and the morning Brenda was killed.

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So suddenly they're saying that she's changing her evidence after forty five minutes of psychic ramblings, after months and months of ramblings with Glenn to the police and puts Glenn at the scene of the murder inconsistent with the alibi that they already checked out and found to be credible. And that was the moment where the new officers investigating this case had their witness. The investigation increased in pace from that point forward.

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The next development was the emergence of Brenda's sister, Jane. Jane told the police that she had found a knife and she said that she had been looking for the knife near the scene of the crime, which had been thoroughly searched by police because a psychic had told her that her sister was killed by a broken, kept knife. And lo and behold, she had gone out, looked around the area adjacent to the murder and found a broken tip knife. The police would ultimately sees this knife.

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The knife would have no forensic evidence that tied it either to the homicide or to Glenna soon. But it ultimately became an exhibit at trial and it became the focal point of the next key witness story, and that is a woman named Mary Cameron. Very Cameron was, unsurprisingly to us, a friend of Jane sister. And she popped up to the police with a story that she had been with a friend of hers. And Glenn had walked in and said, I killed her.

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I got her ear to ear. I cut her so hard, I broke off the tip of the knife. This is a confession. He supposedly volunteers in front of a complete stranger. And Mary becomes the next crown witness, even though the woman who she was with, her friend, who also knew Glen, flatly denied that any such conversation was taking place so that Margaret and now Mary.

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So Brenda's cousin is a woman by the name of Karen Wei. Karen, within two weeks of the murder, was at a bar with her boyfriend and heard two guys talking down the bar in this dark, seedy bar. And Dartmouth, one guy and the other guy. You should've seen the look on Brenda's face when I slit her throat. And the guy who said it was a burly guy with dark hair and a beard. And it was so disturbing to Karen, Karen called the police.

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Police show up and they do nothing. They take a report. That report gets filed. The officers did not go back to Karen way to try and talk to her about what she saw. They didn't go to the bar. They didn't look at cameras around the bar. They didn't do anything. And that description very closely tracks the description of Michael Wayne McGray, who is a serial killer currently doing life in prison, I think, for seven murders or maybe eight that he's confessed to so far.

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The detective that investigated Glen didn't give a crap about that evidence. Nothing was done with it.

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It's so sickening because aside from the grotesque injustice that was done to Glen and his family, all they had to do was follow up on that.

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And then the rest of this mayhem could have been avoided and these other victims would never have known the terrible fate that befell them. So it's just sickening. It doesn't make any sense. It's never going to make any sense. But, Glenn, back to you. So back in March of nineteen ninety eight, you surrendered to the police, right. And you still maintained this was just going to get worked out because you were somebody who absolutely believed in the justice system.

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Yeah, I was going to be worked out in two weeks time at the Tops because I knew I was innocent. I knew they were making a mistake, but I found out that there was a Canada wide warrant on for me. So I turn myself in to the RCMP. They arrested me. They took me on a plane, took me back to Nova Scotia, and I was never shown. Bush, all my life was in shackles and chains going to an airport.

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It was clogged full of people. It's just all happened so fast.

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So they gave you a polygraph, you passed the polygraph. But of course, they ignored that as well. And you were smart enough to see what they were up to, which is why you requested a lawyer. But now it takes a crazy turn in the courtroom. And Sean, if you could take us through that, Glen didn't see eye to eye with the lawyer that he had.

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Glen's approach was pretty simple. I'm innocent. Bring everybody in that you can find to say whatever they have to say, because the truth will show the jury that I didn't commit this. And that created tension between him and his lawyer that hit a crescendo and Glenn fired his lawyer at the very beginning of a long jury trial for second degree murder. And at that point, Glenn was granted a short adjournment to try and find another lawyer. However, inmates inside of correctional facilities can't just go to a phone any time they want, pick it up and dial a lawyer.

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They've got to have somebody accept a call. On the other hand, they have to have a lawyer who's willing to talk to them, and they have to have a lawyer who's capable and has the time to prepare for a murder trial. And in this case, those things didn't align and the court lost patience with him. And the judge said, I'm not giving you any more time. You're going to represent yourself with a great sex education. And don't worry about it.

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Everybody has to have their first case. And that is when Glenn's trial started.

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This is basically like asking someone to go perform surgery on themselves. I mean, I think that's not an unfair comparison because the odds of success are about the same. And at one point, Glenn, you told the jury you're innocent and that evidence was being hidden from them, all of which was true. And then the judge ordered the sheriffs to physically cover your mouth and drag you out of the courtroom in front of the jury as you screamed out your innocence.

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It's a fucking horror show. What was that like from your perspective?

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I said to myself, I need a lawyer. I can't do this. So I decided when the judge came in, I'm going to tell her that I need a lawyer. So long story short, I had no idea you can speak in front of a jury. And I stood up and said, Your Honor, I'm an innocent man. I need a lawyer. She said, take them out, take them out. So two sheriffs drag me across the courtroom floor right in front of the jury.

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The judge said, if I hear any more outburst from you, Mr. Soon, you'll be watching your trial short circuit camera. All I could do is stay up all night and read statements and write questions to ask these people. If I get them analyzed every time I would get to a point where I was putting them in a corner where they had no choice to tell the truth, to crown an object and clear the courtroom. I don't know how many times that jury was cleared in the courtroom.

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Several, and I was exhausted, but I kept on going through it.

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And of course, the results were predictable. September 17th, nineteen ninety nine, the jury went out and they find you guilty of second degree murder. And can you describe that horrible moment for us?

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It was a feeling I never felt before. I stood up and said, I'm wrongly convicted now. It's official. And she objected to it. She said, Mr. Stone, you had your chance to testify in the trial is over now. You can't be talking. I knew I was being railroaded. Railroaded to hell. This episode is underwritten by the AIG pro bono program. AIG is a leading global insurance company, and for over a decade, the AIG pro bono program has provided thousands of hours of free legal services and other support to non-profit organizations and individuals most in need.

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More recently, the program added criminal and social justice reform as a key pillar of its mission. This episode is brought to you by Stand Together, Stand Together is a philanthropic community dedicated to helping people improve their lives. For more than 20 years stand together and its partners have been on the front lines of criminal justice reform by empowering people to take action, supporting nonprofits and working with businesses. Stand together, tackles the root causes of problems in our communities and empowers those closest to the problems to drive solutions.

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Solutions like reducing unjust prison sentences through the first step act, empowering community based programs that help people re-enter society, and now working to bridge divides in our communities. To learn how you may get involved, visit. Stand together. Dogged conviction. There you are, sentenced to 18 and a half years to life on December 13th of 1999, I think many people in United States have a vision of Canada as a peaceful place with a more just system, not as violent, perhaps, but in fact, the prisons there are just as bad as here.

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And you were sent to one of the worst ones. Is that correct? That's correct. And I went to Dorchester Penitentiary and that's the last I seen of scenery because of the forty five foot wall around the place. And that's all I see is that wall. And it was dangerous stuff. We almost got killed a dozen times. I was telling anybody and everybody who would listen to me, I'm an innocent man. They made a mistake. So I knew a guy who has done leatherwork.

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I had a hat with just a blank hat and I got them to make up a patch on my hat, wrongly convicted, nineteen ninety eight. And I thought I'd had around the prison until I wore it out and then the guards took it from me. The guards came to me one day and said, we're putting you in a hole. I said, why put me in a hole. I didn't do anything so handcuff me, took me down the hall, it got me in there.

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And he shoved me against the wall and they got me on the floor. And I'm still handcuffed behind my back, my job. And this guy, he weighed about two hundred and seventy five pounds. He was beat me with it looks like a stainless steel pipe. So he was beat me over the head with that and he broke my ankles with it and they cut the clothes off me right there with a pair of scissors while I was still laying on my face, taking a beating.

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And they beat me half to death. And then they took me into a camera cell and just left me there for about five hours ahead of me was my underwear. They cut the boots off me and everything. The only thing was in there was a toilet and a sink and the sink didn't work, so the toilet did. I was beat so bad I flush the toilet a few times and I drank water in the toilet. I was so dehydrated from the beating it took me.

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Oh, I mean, it's hard to even hear this story. And I just, you know, I want to apologize to you on behalf of the entire human race because nobody should ever be subjected to a fraction of what you went through and you had to go through all of it. And here you are, a guy that I think a lot of people can probably relate to you more than you know. I mean, here you are, a guy in your 40s, five foot five, one hundred and forty pounds, no history of violence, no ability to navigate this foreign situation that you're thrust into.

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It's literally something out of a movie that would give anybody nightmares and you went through it. But somehow or other, you got through it and then, you know, things eventually turned around. How did Innocence Canada become aware of the case and how did you manage to unravel this insanity?

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Added around two thousand and six. I was in the Innocence Canada office for a meeting with our executive director, and I had some time to kill. And I was sitting in the boardroom and in the boardroom at Ines's, Canada. Like most innocence organizations across the country or the world, there's boxes of documents and memos everywhere. So I happened to pick one up and it was a memo written by a lawyer at Innocence Canada by the name of Jerome Kennedy.

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And Jerome had represented Glen a year beforehand on his appeal. And as I turned the pages, as everybody does with this case, I got madder and I got madder and I got madder. And by the time I finished that overview memo I was in and from that point forward, I knew that I wasn't going to stop. I was going to stop working on Glenn's case until we were able to get them justice.

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So I looked at the five witnesses that were called a trial from the perspective of an appellate lawyer. And Mary Cameron was the strongest crown or prosecution witness. But Sean did some digging on her and eventually she signed an affidavit that took back most of her evidence. And Kathy Villard, who witnessed the supposed confession, made it very clear that nothing like that had ever happened. We managed to develop links between the sister of Brenda Jane, who was led by the psychic to the knife with the three core witnesses in the case.

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Each of them had connections to Jane or to her family. And so the things started to crumble. But critical to it was a girl who also worked the streets of Halifax and who experienced something dreadful in the winter of nineteen ninety six ninety seven. We call her Megan. That's a pseudonym. But Megan had been picked up by a burly man with dark hair and a dark beard, and he had taken her out to an industrial site in the middle of winter at night in the dark, assaulted her and raped her and then, rather than killing her, drove her back into the city and in the course of that, admitted that he was the killer of Brenda Wei.

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Glen had been brought back from. British Columbia in the spring of nineteen ninety nine in a blaze of local publicity, arrested for the murder of Brenda, where Megan had seen that on TV and said, well, that must be the guy who assaulted me and confessed to killing Brenda Way. And so she went to the police with that story believing that it was true, although the man she described had striking similarities to the description of the man that Karen, we had heard, brag about committing the murder days after it had happened in nineteen ninety five.

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Glenn, as it turned out, had spent that whole winter when that attack took place in Halifax on the other coast of Canada. Thirty five hundred miles away and that could be documented over the crown at trial, ran a theory that Glenn had somehow gotten a plane ticket flow into Halifax in the middle of winter raped. Megan confessed to the murder of Brenda and then flown back without any other trace. No evidence of his presence in Halifax, no evidence of his flight from British Columbia to Halifax.

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By the time of Glenn's appeal in the early 2000s, Michael McGray, a burly, bearded man, had been arrested and publicly identified as a serial killer. Indeed, he had shown a propensity to brag about his killings, and he bragged about killings enough that he was quickly identified as a serial killer. With McGray in custody and publicly known as a serial killer, Jerome Kennedy, acting for Glenn on appeal, asked for disclosure of what the police had on Michael McGray.

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And the police came back with a document that said that he was not viewed as a suspect by the police in the killing of Brenda, where Jerome tried to advance that to the Court of Appeal. But it had no substance and it was rejected as a ground of appeal against conviction was upheld. So that's the case that we were handed and we thought that Michael McGray looked like a good suspect if we just had more evidence about him. And at that point, Sean, who was a lawyer but also an on the ground investigator in this case, got in touch with a couple of guys by just working the prison system.

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During the course of those inquiries, we found two people who had done time with Michael McGrath and both of those witnesses independent of one another, none of whom knew. Glen told us stories about McGray providing details of murders that he committed to them while they were in prison together. The story they told was chilling and it was chilling, not only because it demonstrated what we felt we already knew, which was that Glen was innocent. They were disturbing because of the detail they provided.

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And these people had no idea what details attached to Brenda was murder. But suddenly we're getting these people giving us affidavits, providing that detail. And we later found out that McGray had lives about 100 yards away from where the body was found. And we had another witness that came to us and told us they moved out of that apartment. McGray and his girlfriend's within 48 hours of the murder. And not only did they move out, they left their furniture on the front stoop.

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So we've got McGray as a very plausible alternative suspect in this case. Remember, Megan, Megan added one other really striking feature, the only very distinctive feature about her description. She said that the man who had confessed to Brenda's murder while raping and assaulting her, though it was the middle of winter and a very cold night with snow on the ground, was wearing socks and sandals on his feet. When we began to look at photos of McGray and then talk to these inmates who knew him, it became clear that that was a very well known characteristic of Michael McGray.

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So we've got a guy who fits the description, including in that unique way, who fits the M.O. perfectly. And so we were developing that for the minister of justice when something really stunning happened. We got information from a retired RCMP officer that he had been speaking with another RCMP officer who knew much more than we ever dreamed about Glen Sassoon's case and about Michael McGray. This fellow was an officer with the behavioral profiling unit of the RCMP in Halifax, and he accumulated every data point possible about McGray.

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He spent the better part of a year conducting an investigation into McGray, but specifically into the murder of Brenda away, which by this point was a solved closed case. And he eventually reached the conclusion that McGray or another guy he identified were very probable killers of Brend way in the Glen. Assoon was innocent. He had tried his best for months and months to get somebody in either the RCMP, which he worked for, or the Halifax Police Service, which had investigated this case to do something about it.

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And remember, Glen is still before the Court of Appeal while this is happening. And not only that, but Jerome Kennedy, his lawyer, has made a specific request of the prosecution to obtain information about McGray to see whether there was anything relevant that he could use on Glenns appeal. And rather than disclosing this information, the. He got back from the crowd who got it from the police was that there was no relevant information and McGray was not viewed as a suspect.

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It is hard to believe, but it is as blatant and as well documented as I have just summarized it. Eventually, we were able to establish exactly what I've just said. That is that the police themselves had identified Michael McGray as a suspect for the murder Glen was doing time for and had suppressed it throughout the appellate process.

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I'm going to just go through that again because it's so incredibly just breathtaking in terms of the misconduct while the Department of Justice was investigating. But unbeknownst to Glen or his legal team, this police officer, this good cop conducted a multi-year investigation into Glenns conviction and concluded that he was innocent. He had concluded that a serial killer, McGray, had lived a hundred yards from the murder scene and was the real killer. Oh, my God. And then it gets worse.

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So this guy, to his credit, told all of his superiors that he believed there was an innocent man in prison, Glenn, of course. But instead of looking into the claims and freeing Glenn, as they clearly should have done, they transferred this officer from his unit and destroyed the fuckin evidence that he had compiled over the course of his investigation. I mean, there's really there's a special place in hell for people who conducted themselves in this manner.

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I don't know how else to say it.

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So slightly less colorful language. That was our submission to the minister of Justice. Yeah, well, that's a good thing. I didn't read it. So between the information that suggested McGray was the killer and the massive constitutional violation represented by the non-disclosure of evidence of innocence, we eventually had a very powerful case for first getting out of jail, which we managed to do in 2014, and then getting him exonerated, which the minister of justice and then the Supreme Court of Nova Scotia did in 2009.

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Glenn, what was it like to walk out of this bike living to that? You were in this this torture chamber into fresh air for the first time in this in this century? It was the happiest day of my life. I couldn't I couldn't be any happier. And it was just an astronomical feeling of happiness to be a free man. And I don't know. I can't explain the feeling of euphoria that I felt when I first got to my brother's place.

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The first day I woke up a free man in a beautiful home. I went outside just to smell the air and I went out in the backyard and I wouldn't go knowers for about a week. I was too scared to go anywhere because I thought the cops were going to frame me again.

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So it took still almost another five years for the full exoneration. And I want to talk to the guys about how good did you feel? How good do you feel today knowing that Glenn is never going back? He's never going have to wear an ankle monitor again. He's never going to be subjected to this inhumane system again.

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You know, I think the person who summed it up best was the judge that acquitted Glenn on March the 1st of twenty nineteen of was Justice Chipman. And he said you kept the faith with remarkable dignity and that you are to be commended for your courage and your resilience. You are a free man. I sincerely wish you every success. And that sort of summed up our feelings to men has been steadfast. I mean, he is now a member of our family.

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He's not just a client. That that's the truth.

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You know, I get asked very often to things whether the people who framed the innocent man or woman faced any disciplinary actions, much less prison for their own misconduct. And whether or not the person who suffered so greatly, the exonerated person themselves, received any compensation. And I'm assuming the answer to both of those questions in this case is unfortunately, no.

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So no, actually, this case is really taken on an increased significance in Canada anyway, because it is the first case in Canadian history where the premier or in other words of the governor of the province in which the wrongful conviction took place, ordered his attorney general to start a criminal investigation into the officers who were involved and contributed to the miscarriage of justice and the destruction of the evidence. So the answer is yes to that.

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And the second part of your question with respect to compensation is also yes to the credit of Prime Minister Trudeau and Attorney General Lamptey and, of course, the government of Nova Scotia. They came to the table and took this very serious. They understood that it was an egregious wrongful conviction of sort of historic proportions. And we were able to negotiate a financial compensation package for Glen that as far as money can contribute, it's going to give him an opportunity to try and as best he can with the years he has left, move on with his life and have a pickup truck and a dog and a maybe a little place in the woods where he can sort of relax and try and find peace to the extent that he can.

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Well, that's amazing news. And I'm so glad they finally came around on this. But nothing is ever going to make up for all the time lost. This does go a long way towards making Glen more comfortable. As you said, I like the visual with the pickup truck and the dog, but he deserves every blessing that life has to offer. If anyone wants to get involved or help out with the great work that Innocence Canada is doing, your help would go a long way.

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So we're going to have a link in the episode BuYeo. And you can also follow Innocent's Canada on Instagram. Scroll down, click, get involved. And now this is as good a time as any to turn to the part of the show called Closing Arguments. First of all, I want to thank Sean McDonald, Phil Campbell and most of all, Glen Assoon for joining me and us here and sharing your story and your spirit with our audience. And now I'm going to turn my microphone off, kick back in my chair and just listen, as you say, whatever you want to say, whatever that's left to say.

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And let's start with Phil, then Sean, and finish with Glen.

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Of course, one of the things I find about innocence cases like Glenn's is the. When you look back on them, when you start to unravel them, you see so many places where things could have taken a different turn, where things could have gone right but went wrong. There's never just one thing. There's always a cascade of injustice and error. And when I think back to the original police who had a sound alibi and acted on it and treated it with the seriousness it deserved, that was one place where things could have gone right but went wrong.

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When I think back to the trial that Glenn went through and this was not a contest of equal adversaries. And then I think of the appellate process when the truth, not just a glimpse into the truth, but a full dossier on the truth about what I believe is the real killer in this case was available to the authorities and it didn't emerge. When you go through that kind of history, you realize what I think is the great lesson of the criminal law, which is that we should always approach this business of arresting people and charging them with crimes and putting them on trial and throwing them in jail.

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We should always approach it humbly because we are fallible and our processes is well refined and carefully reviewed as they are fallible. The police, we trust the prosecutors. We trust the juries, we trust all of those things will fail sometimes. And we are best to go at this whole business of crime punishment with a lighter, humbler touch. And this case just to me, illustrates, as so many do, how many ways there are to go wrong and how vigilant we should be to ensure that things go right.

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I look at this case as the evolution of not just a wrongful conviction case, but for me, looking back now more the evolution of a friendship and the friendship that I developed with Glenn from the first call that he made to my phone when it was only the two of us in this world, it was him on a penitentiary pay phone me on my phone talking to the guy that I clearly knew was in some deep, deep pain and the evolution of that as it expanded and we started to work harder and get more evidence as slowly as sort of the gratitude that Glenn and I felt as more and more people got involved, including Phil, including using the resources of Innocence Canada.

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We use many investigators, one in particular who isn't here today, who died. His name is Steve Jones, was an amazing investigator. I'm grateful to Steve. I'm grateful to Fred Fitzsimmons, who was another investigator who was an RCMP homicide investigator who probably put 100 hundred people in jail for murder, rightfully, but believed in Glenn's innocence. I'm grateful to everybody else that got involved, including celebrities like Michael B. Jordan supported Glass Case and did a video.

[00:36:05]

And we were in the process now of writing him to thank him. But the point is that as the case evolved, our friendship evolved. And as more people got involved, both Glenn and I are thankful to everybody that helped bring it to this point. Went over to you? Well, I just like to say to my two lawyers, Sean McDonald and Phil Campbell, I'm so grateful for your help and for saving my life because because you did you literally saved my life.

[00:36:33]

If you had to come along, I wouldn't have made it. I would have been dead by now. Just let you know, I had four heart attacks in prison and they only took me out for one. And I got a sense of my heart now, and I only got thirty five percent of my heart left because of what happened to me. Well, we love you, Glenn. Simple as that. Thank you for listening to wrongful conviction with Jason Flom, please support your local innocence projects and go to the link in our bio to see how you can help.

[00:37:10]

I'd like to thank our production team, Connor Hall, Jeff Clyburn and Kevin Ortiz. The music on the show, as always, is by three time Oscar nominated composer J. Ralph. Be sure to follow us on Instagram at wrongful conviction and on Facebook at wrongful conviction podcast. Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flom is a production of Vltava for Good podcast in association with Signal Company No. One.