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I feel bad for that chick and I want to pay for its therapy. It's not the worst thing that's ever happened to a chicken. And I don't even know what the future holds for that chick. Exactly. You know, I don't know. Hi, everybody, welcome, welcome to a busy Phillips is doing your best, we're doing our best continuing the work into twenty twenty one of trying.


We should just point out that we're recording this on Sunday because Busi is doing her best, but she has a wild work week coming up. A lot of work. I have a lot of work.


And I didn't want to be exhausted and I didn't want to be Leupp French fries and I didn't want to be frazzled.


And I want to I want to be a good actor and learn my lines are busy.


And this is the busy up today. Taking care of the busy tomorrow. Exactly. Anyway, the reason I brought up that it's Sunday is because if we say anything about someone and then like something develops, it feels like so much just is developing every second this year, this weekend. I feel like there's so much happening. I also was like, maybe we just release the podcast early, but we haven't talked to the people that are editing it, so we don't know what they're what they're feeling down it.


That'll be me. And like someone will actually edit it, but that like. Yeah, well, I know you do the you do the heavy lifting of the of the creative decisions, but there's an actual editor guy who like cuts is like skilled at editing.


And also I think you could honestly, if you at the time I feel like you could do it. Kacie, I feel like you could just do it. I do. I feel like you could find me lying around some software and just I could do anything.


I believe in you so deeply that I feel like that's very deep and very kind.


Maybe someday I will learn how to do it. But for now, we depend heavily on Josh and more to to help us put the podcast together.


So, I mean, we depend heavily on Laura to make sure that I'm recording. So I don't know. I don't know. Why are you recording Chinderah? I am. I just know that I'm only recording with either Casey. Laura are busy ask. I never initiate recording myself. I love imagining that if nobody asked you would be passive aggressively, not record just to be like well you never asked. Well here's the thing. I haven't done it passive aggressively, but I have done it twice where I did it do that.


OK, you have to like I know it's Sunday. I just Casey and I haven't even talked about this, but I do feel like we have to talk about John Roderic.


I feel like it's like it's like he's really getting fuckin dragged in such an intense way, but also to know what's going on because I had no idea what's going on.


I had I also just like turned off Twitter because I didn't care.


We have to like at least if we're going to talk about that, we have to explain what it is, because a bunch of people who are not on Twitter, we have to OK, so we're talking about being can dad.


And I think the hashtag is just being dad now, but it's under politics. It's now being trending under politics, which is which is crucial because most investment we've had in decent politics in a long time.


So maybe they can do it.


Maybe because his father worked for JFK. I don't know. I'm struggling to find a reason why. Guys, full disclosure and we can we'll get into it. But Casey and I both know John Roderic. Ginger, you've met him, OK? Because if you told me that, I wouldn't have known. Here's the thing, right? Because anybody who ever meets me, if you are a white man, I do not retain you unless I will be seeing you again.


Confirmed by your partners. Yeah, like spouses, partners. If we go if I show up to work and you are in the office one time, I will not remember you. If you will be a recurring guest star, I will remember you. So you're not my main character, Tara.


Also, you have to be vetted. So if you're not a main character in a bitch in my life who has been vetted, you do not. I don't remember. So if you want to tell me that I would 100 percent been like I never met that man since I met her, that man, honestly, that you didn't have any interaction with him.


He John is a singer songwriter, has a podcast that he does the theme song.


Yeah, I think in his is his song is the theme for my brother, my brother and Me podcast, which is a huge podcast.


Oh, I was going to say it was the theme from the TV show on Nickelodeon, my brother. And then I was going to really know what the name of their podcast, The Brother is.


I don't know who we're talking about were the brothers. Well, you guys, this is this is where we get this is where we get into the ALAC. I have a. Lack of information regarding podcasts and stuff that men are interested in, i.e. like white men are interested in.


Yeah, my brother, my brother and me are the McElroy brothers who I bet you've I bet you've met busy at some point.


But I have I think one of them has deemed me, but also my grandma Moots second husband was McElroy. That was his last name from in Chicago. And I remember yes, I met those guys at the San Francisco Comedy Festival. The McElroy's one of the McElroy's. I don't know, I'm basically Santeros what I'm saying. But but the guy. But the guy is but I remember the my association obviously was my grandpa McCormac, who is the spirit that always gets me good parking spaces.


And if you need a good parking space, I'm just going to give this to you all for free.


You can say, Grandpa Mac, Mac, do your thing. Please find me a parking space. And I'm telling you, he delivers. He always had the best parking space for his giant Cadillacs. That's right. And he died when I was little, I, I never knew my mom's father, my my maternal grandfather by blood. So I only knew Grandpa Accomack and I just loved him. I just loved him. He was such a nice man.


And he liked, although I think was a member of a golf course that didn't let Jews or black people in. So that's probably in retrospect now.


I also also in retrospect, that was all of them.


All right. Were there were there any. Yeah. If it was like right now, I'd be like, damn. But if it was like 1950, I'd be like that checks out. Well, I'm not sure Dad was like early 80s, early to mid 80s. He probably was.


He probably passed away like in the late ish, like 86, 87 them somewhere around it.


If it was today, I honestly would be like that checks out. It's a lot of it's nothing. Everything's bad. Everything that you've ever had is connected to something bad, probably at one point.


Well, which brings us to brings us to we know John Roderic because he's through many friends of ours and he's performed with us in San Francisco Sketch Fest.


And I was a fan of his band, The Long Winter Long. I really yeah.


I really like some of the long winter songs, which is not just that band doesn't exist anymore.


I don't think I think it's kind of mostly him. So it well in that.


But yeah, he wrote a Twitter thread guys, a Twitter thread in which he details how he wanted his nine year old to work to learn to open.


A can of beans with a with a can opener opener. Yeah, old school, not just anyone, but by the way, does anyone have electric can openers anymore? Or was that just like very much like the 80s, early 90s?


You know what, my intern, when I worked at Letterman, shout out to Mark Gustave's, who went on to become the president of Just Keep Levine Productions with Jack Living with Matthew McConaughey whimsy. And he once gifted me an electric can opener as a thank you. And he just was like, I know it's like so retro, but it really is like the most luxurious thing to not have to twist a can opener like that. Some rich bitch shit to just use an electric can opener.


And it was really great. But they're so ugly and so like, does anyone have them, you know, a sharper image is not I don't have them. I feel like maybe 10 or 15 years ago I might have been on board, but I genuinely don't open enough cans manually to have an electric one. I have a pretty nice manual one. Also, a lot of cans have the pool tab now. The pop tops now. Yeah. So I don't know, but we're still getting off track basically.


Long story short, you can go read the thread, but his daughter was like, I'm hungry. And he told her to make some beans and she was doing a puzzle because he was doing a puzzle and she didn't know how to use a manual, how to open the can.


And I was like, oh, my God, I've failed as a parent. I'm going to make you learn how to do it. And yeah, that is like intense, it's like very he wrote it like like some sort of like novel. I don't know which he copped to later when, because, like the whole issue is he's been dragged, he's been dragged and like it continues on. He's been like trending in three different hashtags, I feel like for 24 hours.


But he copped to writing it in a literary style, like to get, you know, I guess to get attention and and it guys, we all fuckin try to do online every single person.


Exactly. Yes. So but he is being dragged somewhat supported by some people, but mostly. Yeah, it's mainly a bunch of people talking about how his daughter is going to really need therapy to unwind, to like unwrap the fact that her father would help her open this can.


I think that, like, I read it and I do not care. So I'll say that 100 percent. Number two, this is a fantastic the first time of the year to take it to the group chat like this was a thing he should have talked to his friends about in a podcast story, or it could have been a podcast or do you know what I mean?


Like, that would have been maybe serviced a little better. Yeah, but I put upon the tone of what I saw. The this is a tweet that I truly I don't know who who did it. Please don't tweet at me about it. But there is this tweet where they were like on Twitter. There's like always like a main character. And your goal is to not be whether it's good or bad as to not be the main character in the plot of Twitter.


So that's my vibe. So, like, it felt like this is why I say it felt like when he was writing that his hope was to be the main protagonist on Twitter that day. And it just turned out that it wasn't the good guy, the hero.


Yeah. I mean, it was very sudden that, like, I just I looked at my timeline and I saw one friend who I know doesn't know him being like, why are men this is like such a man thing to make a child go through six hours of, like struggling with a can opener to open beans just to, like, prove a point. And, you know, and I was like and it was kind of like a lighthearted but then I put my phone down and like, picked it back up like fifteen minutes later and I saw, like, Roxane Gay was commenting on being Can Dad.


And there there is like being can dad, Meems. And I was just like, wow, wow, wow, this is a lot. And so, of course, you know, I texted busy and I was like, oh, you're asleep right now.


But something is that I'm Roderic on Twitter.


Yeah. You want to sleep? If you were I went to sleep early last night and the tweets that I see, like, really gaining some traction here around like midnight, I think, or two in the morning. So, like, when I woke up being gay, was that full blown?


It was full blown and like people OK, I mean, Mark and I talked a great deal about it this morning. I don't know, like, I, I was like it just seemed very extreme, but I couldn't also tell if.


I couldn't also tell, like because if, like, they were having fun doing it like that because we weren't into shit like that. Yeah. And like she said, she cried, right. Yeah. So but not fun. Now as a little girl, as I mean like this is what I think, I think is bad. I think just teach her how to use the right. That's what I do to teach her how to do it. Because there's a thing.


Yeah. It's like a simple tool, like they don't know how to use it. That's just the point. Like, you have to teach somebody how to use a fucking cannon, but there's a grown ups who don't know how to use it. Six hours. I personally believe it's too long. If a little nine year old girl is crying, you have failed and you should apologize to her. And then that's the way I feel. As someone who's been a little girl, you sat at a table and needed help with math, with dad, who's a fucking math genius just because you fully understand it.


My tears. I don't want to do this anymore. Yeah, it's like it's not fun. So I fully understand. I think he made a mistake and I think that he can learn from it. But, like, that's that's my personal opinion.


He's pulled up. Everybody. Hi, it's me. Busy. Philipps And it's actually not Sunday anymore. It's Monday night, January 4th. And I just broke my dry January by opening up a beverage because I got home from work and I have to go back to work in like a very short period of time. And I was like, I need to decompress. You made you made it four days. But Casey and I, after we after we stopped the pod the other day, we all turned on our computers and were like, oh, no.


So much like I said, I only trust Angela Bassett. They only whites swear to God cases and all this text to us.


And she was like, oh, tweets of bad tweets have been unearthed and then being bad like left Twitter. And it's complicated. Like I, you know, because obviously, like we said, I, I've known him in real life, but like we don't know, we don't know all of it.


You know what I don't know. In those tweets we don't add and it's it's not it's all bad. And so Casey sent out this thing was like maybe we should just like get back on, because I think the rest of the conversation is really good and we trust Casey. And and then Shantaram said. I'm good because I only trust Angela Bassett. But by the way but I do want to say in like, I am never surprised by anyone.


Oh yeah. That's why I don't call for anybody. Yeah, no, no. I'm I have yet to be surprised by, like, somebody turning out to be fucking horrible. Yeah.


Like who who could it be. I mean, I know I I think I have yeah, I have no idea who could be good. The only person that would disappoint me and I've said it before, it's only happened for Angela Bassett, baby. She's the only one. She's the only person I trust. Yeah. So clearly, when we were talking on Sunday, the beam dad story was just about beans and dads and daughters, but then it developed into something else.


While we were recording the literally while we were doing the podcast that happened on the Trump tape was released, which, by the way, Shinjiro, did you listen to the Trump tape?


Oh, yeah. I listen to you listen to a case. I can't listen to his voice. I'm not I'm going to transcribe it on transcription software and read it. Oh, yeah, some people have, I think of The Washington Post. I think that might be wrong. I think The Washington Post. Yeah, I think it already has been transcribed. It is truly fucking wild. Listen to the whole thing. It's bonkers. OK, I will.


But yeah. Mean, we all should listen to it. We should all listen to it.


I mean, if you hate his voice you can read it. Yeah. It's just hearing him talk. Yeah. Is terrible. But the way that because when you read it you are a person who is not stupid. So when you read it it's like OK, but listening to him sounds insane. It just sounds. Yeah. Like someone should stop. Yeah. It's also wild that like this. How long has this been going on. And this is the same thing that he was impeached for before.


Right. Like that basically. Basically, I mean it's like a very similar, similar situation. But just to hear, just to hear it is is super. We we have been and continue to be a witness to all kinds of fucking history and, you know, a witness to some people revealing themselves in wild ways online. So as we I we feared recording the podcast on Sunday things things happened. Just Harry Styles and Olivia Wilde guys. Yeah.


I can't I can't even keep up. So we decided to interrupt what we recorded before. I mean, that's doing your best, you know, I mean, to come back and say, listen, other shit happened that hasn't happened yet. And so being dad is working his shit out off of Twitter, which is probably for the best because he's clearly got some stuff to to think over. And doing that on Twitter is not the best idea. And so but also, yes, the president and also Olivia and Harry, like so much has happened.


So much has happened. And also I just, you know. Yeah, if I don't know, it's all we just want to let you guys know that we know.


We know. We know now we know what happened. We do know we did it.


And we were sort of like the role. But except for Santero who's like, here's my take, no, I'm OK. And B and B, trust no one except for Angela Bassett. So I guess that's our next Mirch is trust No. One except Angela that I've never been wrong.


Never, never been wrong. You never know. You never been wrong.


So now I guess we'll just throw it back to ourselves on Sunday.


Yeah. Because we're going to continue this conversation and. And I think it's good. All right, guys. All right, take it take it away Sunday. Listen, by the way, this comes out on Wednesday. So if tomorrow some more shit happens, we're going to have to interject somewhere else in this pot or we'll leave.


I don't know, just I just let it go. We'll just let it go, OK? All right. OK, take it. Take it away.


Ladies of the past, please.


People leave me alone because I don't care enough to interact with you on that. I don't care. But I think it's an interesting idea. I mean, the reason why I brought it up and the reason why I want to talk about it is just like. Especially in light of my sharing about my own child last week and like how that was put into the world. And I'm really glad that I was able to talk to you guys about birdie and birdies, very glad that.


I. Talked about. Their feelings and, you know, the thing said something really interesting to me last night. And then I'll get back to why I wanted to bring this up, but so I went in after I put cricket to sleep, I went into Bird's Room and I was sitting there and I was like, so, you know, I haven't looked.


My publicist was emailed me and said that there have been like a lot of articles and stuff about the podcast and about me talking about your PR. preference and that you're out and gay. And I just want to check in with you, because I'm sure you either know that already or somebody will mention it to you or whatever. And I just want to see, like, how you feel about it. I said to Rachel Carton, my publicist shout out to Rachel Carton that I didn't need to see the articles.


I don't want to. I don't I like I don't I don't need to read them, you know, that's not I don't need to read other people's interpretations of what I very clearly said on this podcast, because that's just me directly talking. Right. And I'm bored.


And I said, but if you want to see anything or if you're interested or whatever and birds like, oh, yeah, no, I saw a ton of it and all of them except for maybe like two. So called me your child instead of daughter and that was awesome. And I was like, oh cool. Well that's great.


And then Bernie said, yeah, it is great. And those two were like, stupid.


Anyway, I was like, OK, well cool. And I said, but, you know, there's going to be like also there have been some comments on my Instagram and like there have been people like messaging me some pretty nasty stuff. And I just don't know if that will be a thing that maybe you will see. And I want to check in with you about that. Burty looked at me and said, wait, did you think that wasn't going to happen?


And I honestly said, well, I don't know. I guess I hoped it wouldn't. And I hoped that it I don't know. I hoped that it wouldn't.


And then Byrd said, yeah, well, fuck them. But honestly, I mean, honestly. And then said this, which is wild and sincere and maybe you can speak to this birdie was like, you know, Mom, coming out for most people is a never ending process. But you basically just like helped me because there's so many people now that I don't have to explain my pronouns and who I am.


It's just a given what the fuck I was like.


You're maybe a genius and I love you as a genius. I know. Well, there. Fuck. See, I'm trying. I'm trying. I'm practicing. You're trying to unlearn a lifetime of something.


I know. I know. And we talked about it last week and I Chinderah, I just thank you so much for all of the things that you said and like how. Just your perspective and how I really appreciate it, Fred. All right, functional beauty, functional beauty, dotcom slash, busy. You know what I did last night, but I put cricket in the bath after being upstate and then I used our function of beauty hair care system that was created specifically for cricket.


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We talk on the podcast a while ago about like why so many, like white gay people are like Trump supporters, like our black all the time, like no, pass it on this one. I do not pass the paper bag test. Right. And it's one of those things where like also the way that I present it, people just assume I'm queer. It's like a bold assumption. I think that one of the things to do because you have short hair.


Because I have short hair. Yes. So I'm saying this is a thing to like. I also I had giant titties before. Like even still I would be like I would have like I'll be like 40 G and like have on a t shirt and some will be like, hello sir.


And I'd be like, I, I'm not saying that there's a way to look like a man or a woman in quotation marks, but 40 G Titties is pretty ladylike on a given day in the Ralph's shirt.


Right. So it's like obviously. But what I found in like this is a theory, just like a thing that I found is that like a lot of just like white people have to come out a lot because when like white, let's say women identify as queer, the assumption for white women, unless they are like dressed really, really hardcore, butch or whatever, I guess is that they are straight and then they have to be like, oh, no, like because we say that whiteness equals femininity.


So like so many white women go out into the world and like backwoods caps and fucking overalls and fucking Air Force ones and Jordans, and it's like a cute thing that white girl is doing that day as opposed to if I when I go out into the world, I know that I will be seen as a woman on certain days. And I know that I'll be seen as like a bit confused or called sir on certain days. So like it is gender is very performative.


It's like if I wear a dress, everyone's going to think that I am a woman in 40 G titties.


And if I wear a sweatshirt and a backer's hat, everyone's going to think that I am gay. Like, those are just like bold assumptions that we make with, like, black and brown femininity. So Bret is absolutely right. We like have to come out all the time, but like to be like white. And then I will say I'm presenting. The assumption will always be that Bertie is straight because we associate straight femininity with whiteness, like pretty whiteness.


So I think that, like, you definitely help them. But I also think that it's such a big deal to recognize that also to be brave enough to do that over and over again, because that is trauma to have to come in. And it's like straight people don't have to do that. Just think about it like your gay cousin. Everybody has one they're always talking about.


They come home for Thanksgiving, like, do you know how, like, did your straight cousins have to come home and perform for your whole family? So I think that there is just like something to think about.


And I like and really like I think that this generation, like me, my generation is very fortunate to have Berdy and to have you and to have you all be willing to model this relationship because like, this is what it looks like when it's good, when when the parent is doing a good job in trying and when the child has the opportunity to be who they are and be open about it, because like Brian, it could just be like, don't say shit about me.


I don't want to be an example. I wanted to point out something busy because I don't think he'll point it out for yourself is that it's not like you just went to Bird and asked if you could talk about this.


It was an organic conversation that you were having about publicly talking about these things and getting better about it. And Bird offered go ahead and talk about this. I've had similar things with my kids. I never write or even talk on this podcast about anything with anyone important to me without letting them know that since the since the rabbit.


Yes, exactly. So minor is the dog named Ernie, what was the dog or what? Oh, no, you know, the thing like I've never I always let my kids know, like I said something about you on the podcast today. Are you cool with it? You know, we can cut it out if you're not cool with. Here's what I said. Whatever, whatever. That's the whole thing.


I was always waiting for Birdie to tell me that it was something.


If it was something, if it was something that they wanted me to do or to talk about.


The conversation was truly about how I felt like in our relationship and in my being their mom, that I could do better with the pronouns. And one thing that I felt like was difficult for me was that I had to do two separate things for public. Yeah. And private. And that was that has been a thing that's been since that came out with their pronouns. That has been a thing that I feel like has been an additional struggle.


And Bertie was like, yeah, well, you can talk about it fine. Or you and you can use the correct pronouns when you post on Instagram. That's fine. Right.


And so, you know, what's super fucking wild is some of the because, you know, I went through some comments and stuff.


I because I know that you all are my close friends listening, but I do use the close friends button on Instagram.


And because sometimes I just I'm like, I'm not interested in PopSugar, like pulling this and putting it on their fucking website, you know.


And this had already taken on our conversation about my kid had already taken on its own life that I have and they have no control over.




So I close friend, did some stories the other day about some of the fortunate things that people felt like they could do to me and say to me.


And because it was just it was really upsetting to me. And one thing that but one thing that keeps sticking with me is. People accusing. Whatever, whatever it is like at some version of like, you are disgusting, you're sexualizing your kid, like you're doing this, you're perpetrating this thing on your kid, you're using it for publicity, which is truly wild.


Guys, I can like post about a fucking possum in my backyard and I'll get 10 people, mag, you know what I mean? So calm the fuck down. I'm not hard up for the publicity, but also it's also like. Life is hard enough being like like. Young, like, queer, like, if you identify as a woman like Berdy, don't need none of this. Berdy has hot, cool, rich, famous parents. Britney lives in New York and it's fucking thriving already, can do whatever they bready can do, whatever they want.


You know what I'm saying? So the idea, the audacity to think that you know how hard it is to fucking be 12 when you're straight, cool and like this is the only time I'll cap for women. It's hard to be a straight, cool white boy at 12 or 13. The audacity to think that anyone wants more burden when they're 12 or 13 is it makes no sense. Anybody who's ever been to middle school in their lives in America knows that nobody wants extra anything when they're fucking 12.


So think about that before you try to say that like a ten year old doesn't know if they're gay or not. Nobody is like walking outside being like, you know what I want? I feel like being marginalized for the rest of my life.


Like barking. Exactly. And this recurring thing, which of course, everyone at home, it was block and delete all day long. Right.


I just wanted to get them out of my out of my inbox so I could get to the important things like cool companies that want to send me some free stuff or or like if a random famous person that I don't follow deems me, I need to see it like I have it all junked up by these bigots and these horrible homophobes.


So anyway, I like this idea that I was sexualizing my kid when in fact, like, they're these people's hetero normative anti prevents them from seeing that, like kids like all kids have feelings and. No. Their identity, like what what their identity is, and if you're somebody that's heterosexual and identify, insists gender, like it's not a question, it's not like it would never be if I was like, oh, my gosh, you guys, Berdy has, like Burty has a crush on a boy.


You know, everybody would no longer be like your sexualising. No. When, in fact, this kid is the one who over the summer was like you. I like I like the you know, I always have given my kids the photo approval thing on Instagram. But over the summer, was it over the summer? When was that case? You'll remember where Burty said to me, you got to stop. You can't post certain pictures of me because people are leaving weird comments about how beautiful I am and like my lips and about my lips.


And I'm a child. I'm a child. And I was like, yeah, dude, I know it's gross. I am.


And you can go to any Target Walmart and go into the little girls section and find T-shirts that say, like her sexy bitch.


Yes. You know, people are you guys that our new merch just like a one like a baby onesie that says bitch. I mean, that's so funny. It's funny because, like, it sounds surreal, but, you know, and somewhere deep in a Kohl's, there's a sexy bitch onesie right now.


I don't know even. Yes. Something like relatively benign, like heartbreaker, which is non gendered. It's still sexualizing a little kid because. That's correct. Pre imagining that they'll be in some type of relationship where they have a sexual advantage to break someone's heart. And it's weird and it's something that we do all the time.


And yeah. How many times. Oh yes. Baby is like look at those lashes. You're going to be in so much trouble. You know, people call little boy babies ladies man all the time.


You know, flirting is flirting. Look at him. He's flirting and it's like he's so hungry.


He's one you have boobs and he wants to be hot.


And it's so it's interesting because, you know, I had little boys, one little boy that was really like that, just really drawn to outwardly to paying attention, particularly to dark haired women, which I was at the time. And just really and then also had a little boy who never wanted to talk or interact with anyone who was outside of our immediate family and also not really with anyone in the family.


So, like, they're just people are very different.


And it's very weird what gets a reaction. And then you realize that the person is doing the thing that they're trying to accuse.


When when I was growing up, I'll say this when I was growing up, I like wasn't a hot baby.


So, like, what do you like and what are you talking about? I did like I was a very cute baby, but I mean, like, I call everybody a baby. I'm talking about like third or fourth grade, you know, like there's always like the prettiest girl and the cutest boy. Oh, sure, sure, sure. Third or fourth grade. I'll never forget when I was in like third or fourth grade and I was like, pride in my lisp giant glasses phase.


And in the summertime, this is the first time I'd ever seen this. Oh, like summer in Daytona. We like we're hanging out with my uncle's like church group or whatever. And the most beautiful, truly like looked like a Gerber baby, like beautiful little girl. She was probably like five or six inches, like black people with eyes that aren't brown. It's just like the world fucking flips over. And she had like gray eyes and she was like, so pretty.


And like everybody kept being like your daughter so pretty, your daughter so pretty. And like, this is the first time I saw an adult pulling adults aside and said, the next time you see my daughter, do not say that. Tell her she's smart. Tell her she's funny. Tell her you like her sneakers.


I cannot have every time I bring her somewhere, a group of adult men, a group of adult women, the only thing she hears all day is how fucking beautiful she is.


And like, that's not it's fine. But like, that can't be the only reason people talk to her. And I remember being like, dang, that makes it like not fully grasping it, but realizing that when people talk to me like I'm not like a cute little gray eyed girl, but everybody told me I was so funny and that, like, I was good at basketball. And the only time they ever talked to her, they were just talking about how pretty she was.


And I was like to be seven and to have no one ever talk to you as a person except for like a being about how you look. And it's like we don't think about it, but people do it constantly. Imagine the prettiest little kid you ever seen. I got you all day. All people say is how pretty you are, obviously not a bad problem to have, but something to think about.


I was going to say as somebody who has two children who along the lines of like.


Esthetically. Please. You got that? Traditionally, traditionally, yes, like whatever the standards are, especially like in this moment. Yeah. From day fuckin one, anyone. Oh, so beautiful. And I would say, oh, thank you. You know, she is so smart. She's so funny. Thank you. She's you know what? She's just the weirdest. She's the goofiest kid. We just can't get enough of her jokes. And like that was the thing that I would do and out like like out loud to the person so that the kid would hear.


And that's like a good way to sort of offset and and correct people in a way that's like not for like Shamy, but like also sends a message to your kid that, like, that's not the most important thing in the world. By the way, will it make it easier for you? Yeah, I mean, sure, that's part of the fucked up ness of this world, but much more important to cultivate other bullshit.


Yes. This is like, you know, improv is dead to me, but this is a true yes and moment is that you just. Yes. Those people, because you don't want to be like, no, my my child is ugly as fuck. You want to be like, yes. And, you know, so they'd be like, yeah. And they did this thing last night that was so funny. They have the greatest sense of humor.


Next time you come around, you got to ask him for one of their jokes, like a little smooth, you know what I mean? Yes. And they're really in the dinosaurs right now, you know what I mean? Really play up the things that you like about their personality. That is inherently there's not that side inherently come from the way they look. So this is the only time I'm really pushing. Yes.


And you guys don't read me.


I have a little experience with this, too, because my sons are also tall and handsome, young, gorgeous, handsome. OK, also, I say they're handsome. No one. No to anybody out there. If you've never seen them before, they're both over six feet. That's all it takes.


That's all I can say is that they are both over six feet tall and they have like symmetrical faces. The thing is like where their first one is like one is like could definitely be like a football hero and one is like rail thin, like a runway model. But she has considered doing for work. But, you know, it's it's that it is such a weird thing to have. And now they're getting to the age where I've had, like, grown women be like, how old is your son again?


And I'm like, oh, this is not this is not a conversation that I'm having with you, ma'am, but.


Oh, but which is you know, it's it's weird.


And we're just so trained to do it. But I have also had, like, the flip side, it's funny that my sons are tall and handsome and because my husband is like a smaller guy, I'm like, you know, I'm like a heavier woman.


And it's just weird that we made these two, like, very tall.


Well, I have to say, sometimes the most attractive people have children that just are not don't. That's what happens. That's what happens. You're ugly. You've got to mix it up. You've got to it. But I don't I don't know how it happened exactly.


That our sons look the way they look. My husband and I are perfectly fine. We're a beautiful people.


But what I was going to say is that you made them with pure love and that's why you're so tall.


And you go, oh, no. I was going to say that, you know, I've long had a Helzer practice of never commenting on the way anyone looks just like us. Yes. I don't like if I tell someone that they look amazing and they're like ravaged by an eating disorder, that's like I'm reinforcing something. Or if I tell, I went through a period in time where I was very ill and people kept telling me how amazing I looked.


And then they'd be like, What are you doing? What's your secret? I'd be like at the tumor.


And then, oh, I literally was like, well, keep it up. Oh, yes. And so that is when I was like, oh, shit. I know. So fucking dark. You're so close to death. Keep it up. I think it didn't even register with them that I was saying like actually have been kind of sick lately and they didn't really want to know the answer. They wanted to hear that I was like doing keto or whatever.


So that Panchito. I know that's not the point. It's true. It's true.


But that's when I really realized, like, how conditioned we are to just tell each other, you look amazing.


And then there are certain group of people that never hear you look amazing. And that's noticeable.


Yeah, I think I think, too, that I also learned on the Internet because I stay on the Internet because I'm a glutton for punishment. What are the. I also really because like one of the things like associating, like not being not attractive to being bad, like Mitch McConnell is an ugly bitch, but he is bad for other reasons. So like because there are people who aren't considered, like, conventionally attractive and we inherently are like, well, that person's ugly and they're bad.


And it's like that's not the correlation your personality doesn't correlate to, like, the way you look necessarily on the outside. So, like, it's all the stuff that we're like satiny. Here's the one thing I do want to ask, except if if people like Steve Bannon and Mitch McConnell. We're not horrible looking when they were younger and they've rotted from the inside out. Yeah, yeah.


Do you know what I'm saying? Because I do think I do. I have said that I do think sometimes people's outsides catch up with their insides. Yeah. And I think that they are rotten people. And that's why I like their flashes. Like falling on.


Yeah. Like falling apart. But then there's also like it's. But I get what you're saying. Yeah. It's like hard because it's like one of the major things too. It's like people always like to tell be like Trump's terrible. He's fat and it's all right. That is not a correlation to his racism, misogyny. And like all those rape allegations and like Trump, Trump is never going to hear you saying that he's fat to him. But you know who's going to hear it?


Every single one of your friends who is a good person, who is also fat is going to hear that you correlate fatness to badness. And so that's why I wrote an essay about this a really long time ago as it related to my weight. And like all this shit that I was going through in, like losing weight and gaining weight again, where I really became aware of just how much time we spend commenting on the way other people look, even when we're saying it's like a positive thing.


And so I made a decision at that point to only ever say it's nice to see you, which is why instead of saying you look amazing and what have you done to your hair or not saying something when someone doesn't look amazing or you look tired, whatever you look, you know, no matter what they're saying.


Yeah, but you said to me all the time, you know, people just feel the right.


And I think that people really have just gotten so accustomed to blurting out whatever pops into your mind about the way someone is presenting themselves. And so I just decided a while back that it is only within my rights to tell someone it is nice to see them when it is honestly nice to see them. OK, so we'll probably cut this out.


But Mitch McConnell was an ugly bitch when he was young.


But here's what I want to say. We can say that, but here's what I want to say. If Mitch McConnell was a good person, we would think he was more attractive. Maybe you would think that, like his his unusual look was endearing, probably because this is what I'm going to say here.


Look at this picture and tell me this is not a dude from Second City.


Oh, well, like you you like it's a dude from Second City who if he's funny, he fucks a lot for the point where yours why is he fucking in the Navy like he's on mainstage like Trilemma also like he is like oh Larry is like fucking funny.


And it's because I know he's an evil bitch. He looks like you think I know. I'm telling you, I think context does have something to do with it. And I do think that he's rotted from the inside out and that's why he's like falling apart.


But because also, have you ever, like, known someone that at first sight wasn't conventionally attractive and like and then like five minutes later you have like a giant crush on them because of like chemistry and they're. Yeah, well, OK. Can I just say that that I feel like is a man thing because I know the funniest, coolest dopiest bitches in the world and they do not fuck and I know the ugliest Worimi is nerdy, is loser, is boys in the world, but they are very funny and they do fuck.


So let's just talk about the patriarchy real quick because the patriarchy. But I really I genuinely am asking this question, is it the patriarchy or is it like. Survival of the fittest or whatever, like like whatever the the driving force, is that you that cause you to procreate with someone like someone who could take care of you or because like women are often like we're not. I mean, obviously women are looking for whatever, but a lot of times it's like it's like height.


Oh right. They're funny. They are the last guy who was really hot was a real dick. And this guy is just straight up not verbally abusive to me as still a lot of women. A lot of men are like, oh, she's so great.


I don't think I think like I don't know what it is for like, I'm sure that there is a book or many and many studies and someone will tweet it to us and give it to us.


But I just wonder that, like, in in terms of like what drives men to be sexually attracted to women? Like when if we're talking about hetero. Yeah. Normative, normative normatively.


What drives men to like want to fuck a woman. Is it like largely looks based. And if a woman is drawn to like want to fuck a man who's like smart and and funny and like interesting, you know, as someone as someone who is very funny, smart and interesting.


Let me tell you something. When you're in like very certain fields do not want to fuck power and then want to fuck anybody, like, I genuinely believe like a lot of my friends who have had really hard times have been women who, like, do not put up with bullshit. Right. And they are so funny and so smart and also so beautiful. But they don't put up like we talked about last week. They are in their own power and for some reason, a woman being in their own power, just like the guy who was like, you'd be hot if you shut the fuck up like that is different women.


A lot of times we're talking about heteronormativity. This is the most I've talked about hetero shit in a long time. But like women are often attracted to men who are in their power and men are taught to be in their power and men are attracted to women who are not in their power because that's what they've been taught, because we're also like be small. When you're a little girl, they put you down on the playground that nobody likes you. And if, like a man pushes you, that does not mean he liked you.


So, you know. Right. And also, I mean, every this is an area where we probably have like three very unique experiences where I think we can usually identify pretty strongly with one or the other of us. I would say that probably we have very unique experiences and everyone is different. Absolutely.


Yes, everyone is. But I mean, we're generalizing about generalizing about men. And, you know, this is a weird thing and it always shocks people when I say, like, I am like again. Have been heavier my whole life, I'm not super tall, I have a baby face, I'm whoever I am, I'm like funny and smart and outspoken, but also am known to be nice. I I think the most spicy statement I could ever make is that I have never had trouble getting attention from men.


And people are always like, why? And like, I don't know that it's necessarily the same type of attention that you would get busy or that like G.A..


I'm sure you that is not the same guy. But I'm also sure that you're male. You've had guys that have liked you. Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, like I also like sexuality is fluid. Like, I'm not like everybody assumes I'm a lesbian and like that's your own performative. Right. But like, I like gay men and like, I'm not dating them now. But I think that there is like I know that, like, I look good in a dress.


And if I wear a dress and I go out in a very particular type of man, we'll talk to me. Also, I know that if I go out in a cool pair of sneakers, do not let a man tell you that they don't know how to compliment the only tie. If I wear a really cool pair of fucking blazers, 15 white dudes will talk to me and they'll be so nice and they'll be like, first of all, they'll call me.


Do so right off the bat. I know they're not trying to fuck, but if I wear like a cool hat or like I have my skateboard, so many men will walk up to me and be like, that's a really cool board. Would you get it? I love your shoes. I love that outfit. And doing that, they're more than capable of not sexualizing you. So like, I have been on very both different ends of the spectrum.


I've had men like I've got to go get a security guard because a man was being, like, too fucked up. And I was like, I'm going to slap you, so let me go get somebody. And then I've also had the experience of experience of like men walking up to me and being like, fucking love those blazers. That's cool. I had a man from across the street. Yeah, let me cool shorts bro. Like that.


Capable. They're funny.


Do you know do you know the comedian Judy Gold.


Judy Gold is a good friend of mine. She's she's also over six feet tall. She's an out lesbian I wish married to be married to a woman for, you know, forever and ever.


Anyway, Judy Gold. She's great, but she was a writer at The Rosie O'Donnell Show at the same time that I was. And so and we were just buds. We went everywhere together. There was one time a very a person who's very famous, a very famous man, and he was like in love with her. And it was hilarious to me because I was just like, please, just like tell him that you're like it's in it's in the news, you know, like everybody knows and everybody knows that, like you're married to a woman.


And this person, I guess, just never heard it. Someone who's very famous in my blockbuster movie. And he was just like, Judy, I like your eyes turn to hearts. And it was so funny to me. But he was just seeing what he wanted to see. Well, you have to group chat who it is to us, you know what percent to bring it all back around.


Before we get to our guest, also, I have to tell you guys about the crazy like Jenolan Nutty in upstate over the holiday and how. We all I mean, like, there's so much Jena, that's my dog, guys, in case you don't follow me on Instagram. Jena like was wild. Maybe I'll talk about it after we come back from the area. But to wrap it all up, what I want to say about this. Is that like anyone, however you choose to put your your parenting or your kids online, you need to, like, really consider it?


Also just you know, I I know that people have lots of thoughts and feelings about how they keep people both in the public eye and in the private sector, should how they should share their children or should not share their children and if they should show their faces or not show their faces and people get real fuckin judge about all of it either way, all the way around.


And all I'm going to say is that. Parenting is fucking hard, and you got and nobody has a playbook for this bullshit, and so we're making it all up.


And so if you I would just say that using. To the best of your ability. As much critical thinking when it comes to sharing about your kids online with the knowledge that, like, it's going to be there forever. Like I heard, this one story goes. About this baby that had, like, really bad, like bowel problems and so the parents had like a like one of those photos server things with the doctor that wasn't like private and then the kids got older.


I mean, this is like like years ago. And the kid's like a teenager and Googled his or her name.


And what came up were like a photo was like a bunch of photos of like baby poops in a diaper, in diapers from there, like from this like period. Do you do they mean because was like gotten published long forgotten but just like just they were like how do we get these off of the Internet. This is the thing that shows up when you Google. Yes. This person's name, it's like, oh fuck that. That's a problem, right.


Yeah. You know what I mean? And like and and at some point maybe, you know, I always say like. Birdie has about forty seven books in them, and if I'm not like mommy dearest and at least the first one, it'll be a goddamn shock. But, you know. We all. As we all most of us had parents, most of us, some of us didn't have parents, you know, that like from the experience of being a kid, you all have that moment where, like, your parents become real people, you know, and some people it doesn't happen until they themselves become parents.


I'm guilty of that. And some people it happens much sooner. But I just think people need to like. Try to not judge others as much and for your own self, try to be really thoughtful and considerate about things you want to share and the ways in which you wanted to share it. For instance, Bird and I discussed. Me talking about the pronouns and not Berdy is out and gay, and I didn't I purposefully was like, I'm not doing like an Instagram post, I want to talk about it where I can have a conversation and where we can, like, say the things we want to say.


Do you know what I mean?


I'm just trying to like, no, you're you're making a really good point that it's when you're putting something out on social media or wherever you're putting out pocket, it's meant to be consumed. So you have to expect that it's meant to be consumed and then you have to assume that it will be somehow interpreted. Whether you agree with how it's interpreted or not, you don't have control of that. You can try you can try to say things in such a way where it's really funny.


I write stuff about my kid all the time, you know, one kid or the other. But they're grown men now. So every once in a while I'll be like, oh, my kid said such and such about Barney Frank or whatever. And then people will be like, Oh, I'm sure your kid really said that. And I'm like, Yeah, he's 18. He's like a middle man. I actually said, but people are just assuming that I'm doing like this performative parenting thing.


And I'm like, no, this is just like another person in my life. Performative parenting.


Thank you. I was that was I was trying to get there.


So, you know, you have to assume that people will interpret things in a way. One time my husband wrote this article for BuzzFeed about how we really let our kids watch whatever they wanted, like we never paid attention to age inappropriate things. We just let them watch whatever, not porn, but like we just let them watch whatever the conversation that you do have to have. Yes. And I'm sure they watched porn on their own at some point.


I mean, try to lock that down in modern times. But, you know, we my husband wrote this article about we let our kids watch whatever. We watch it with them often. We'll pre watch something they're interested in watching and we're just there to, like, answer questions about it. Whatever, whatever it was like a BuzzFeed thing from a guy that like, you know, he's not famous and our kids are not famous. And so many people were like, you're monsters.


Your children should be taken away from you, you're abusive. And you know the whole thing to the point where my husband was like, I will never write or say another thing about the kids, like in any type of like official hot take think piece capacity, but also like so we're just really cautious because, you know, he put something out there. He was trying to say a thing, but it was interpreted in such a way by some people who are like, that's great.


That's sounds amazing to me. That sounds like the right thing. And then some people were like, I'm calling Child Protective Services on you. The other thing that I do think is interesting is that like we all like everybody has essentially a public platform at this point. Most people, you know what I mean? So, like, no matter what your. Level of like, I don't know, being in the public eye, like every bitch has a podcast and also like if I write something which like one time I wrote something about my son was having a struggle, I put it on like my weird little Tumblr blog.


And again, I wrote it with my son's permission because we were going through a rough time. He was going through a rough time. I was going through a rough time as his mom. And he was like, I think it'd be good to write about because like maybe it would help another kid that's going through a thing like this. And so so anyway, the point is, I put it on my weird little Tumblr and that's fine. That's my like eleven people seeing it.


But then like I think Michael Ian Black shared it to like a million people and then it became a different thing.


So everybody has a platform, but there's always a chance that it can blow up to like exponential exposure, which is exactly what we were saying before.


It's like there's always like a major player on the Internet and like maybe you want to be a major player, but if you don't, you have to fully understand that if you put it on the Internet, it is. It's the World Wide Web. Anybody in the world with the Internet could probably see it. So I think that's the thing to people like just my followers. And it's like the world is following and you might mess around and be the the the lead actor.


And whatever play is playing out is that we want for better.


That way we want to better got a really you really have to consider that while our guests today. Really, they had they had thoughts, feelings, and they really wanted to explore someone who made a very public leap. Into trying to launch an app. That's. Jeremy Renner and Sarah Reynolds and Caroline Goldfarb made a very funny comedy podcast that I loved so much, but where you love podcasts, so for no time endorse a podcast.


I don't I don't I really don't like podcasts. It was so funny.


We were with Tommy Michel and Tommy would be like, Hey, Busi, have you listen to this podcast? I'm like, I have not. And then like and then like an hour later he's like, right. That reminds me of the thing from this podcast about blah. And I was like, hmm, yeah. I don't know what you're talking about.


And he's like, so on your podcast when a.. In case he clearly listens, the man clearly is like into all the podcasts, listening to them constantly. And he even, you know, in hours in fact shout out to Tommy. But he was like, how do you why did what I mean you guys just want to I mean, I get why you want to do a podcast, but like, you just really have no interest in other podcasts.


I really don't I really don't know what to say.


I don't know.


I don't like all sports, but only participate in one. That's right.


That's right. And you know what? And you know what? I like to listen to music all the time. I like to listen to my songs, my songs, calm me down. So but anyway. But I love I love Sarah Ramos'. I think she's such an interesting and unique artist. And Caroline I've been a fan of for a long time. I like her writing and she's the collective between the two of them. They've had like four hundred and seventy podcasts or something.


I don't know a lot of podcasts though. I do think. And they've collaborated on a lot of stuff and Sarah Ramos does those. She's had. Quite speaking of viral videos, speaking of being the lead leading player on Twitter and Instagram, Sarah's really carved a niche in a wonderful way, making the videos where she sort of redoes famous scenes from movies. I know you guys have seen them. I do think The Social Network one is probably one of my favorites that got really interesting during quarantine.


People would film their sides and then she would edit it together and she just did a thing. I posted it like two days ago. I don't know if you guys saw it where she did the tick tock deep dive into trying to figure out the tooth that the year two thousand New Year's Eve party that was cohosted by Natalie Portman and Britney Spears. And she was trying to get to the bottom of it, which, of course, we love because I'm busy tonight.


One of our favorite things was hot old gas, hot gas. I mean, she would have been like a correspondent to of busy tonight, our IP IP busy tonight, but we love we love these ladies. And, you know, also, Sarah was a child actor and Sarah had a pivot that, quite frankly, shocked the fuck out of me, shocked all of us. It really did not we did not know.


And I actually don't think I don't even know if it's like public knowledge, but I don't I don't think it is. It is the breaking news, guys.


This is breaking news because we all thought one thing and then we learned something very different than what we thought.


And is there I haven't listened to the interview yet, Casey. You have, because it was edited. Is there just a great deal of silence afterwards? Because I feel like I didn't speak for, like. Eight minutes, guys, just so you know, if there's not, we edited out eight minutes of silence where I was like truly I was like for the first time in my life. I don't know what to say. I did not know this information.


Oh, my God. Anyway, I love these ladies guys. Take a listen.


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We're so lucky to have two women that I am a huge fan of and lucky enough to be friends with Sarah for a long time now, I've known you for a long time.


Sarah, since you were a kid, was, I feel a child at that? Yes.


You were someone you hadn't gone to college yet, right? I was probably 18 or 19. That's a kid now. Casey, how old is your actual kid?


18, 18. OK, let's get to. But ladies, thank you so much. And Carolyn, I've been such a huge fan of yours for so long, your writing and all all of the things that you do, because I think you're really funny. And I I love pop culture as well. And I always have appreciated all of your take. They've always been the right ones.


Busy. Thank you so much. It's an honor. I'm kvelling. I'm freezing my pants with excitement.


It's have to say when I heard about the runner files, which is the podcast that Sarah and Caroline put together, ladies, this is maybe a surprise to you because you're on this podcast to promote that podcast. But and this is my own podcast. I don't listen to podcast. I'm not I'm not a person who has a particular interest or time.


And when I heard about the runner files, I committed to myself that it would be the podcast I would listen to this year.


It made the time. I made the fucking time because I love it.


So for the audience at home and anyone who hears this somehow, somewhere, at some point, can you very briefly give us the one sheet, what the runner files I can't screen share the one sheet if the runner files is a six part investigative.


You know, docu series, audio docu series, I would say, about the Jeremy Renner app, which is Internet ephemera that you may or may not remember. Some people think they know everything about it. Some people have never heard of it. Basically, Jeremy Renner had an app. You know, Caroline, what's an app? An app is a thing on your phone that lets you do stuff. So Jeremy Renner had one that was basically best described as it's like Instagram, but the only person on it is Jeremy Renner.


And some YouTube has put it, the only thing to do is give him money. That's a really, really bombastic way of putting it. But in short, we wanted to get to the bottom of what the deal with all that was, but also just Jeremy Renner in general.


Well, exactly. It's like how do you it? Every question we had led to seven hundred other.


Exactly like the mere idea that us like an Oscar nominated celebrity times two times, girl two times, he's the most self serious like action star. Why did he have a Jenky poorly functioning app. Like what was the what were the events that led to that. We knew there was more to the story. Then you guys start to dive in and you realize. He is an enigma, he definitely is the runner is a bitch that contains multitudes.


Oh, my God, he's got layers. He has layers.


And a lot of those layers involve motorcycles and vaguely misogynistic comments and actions. However, guys, can I tell you, my one runner citing, you know why we're here?


We want to hear. Yeah, of course.


Front row at Tori Amos at the Ace Hotel.


Well, that very much connects to the fact that as we, you know, talk about at length of the podcast, Jeremy Renner is a very creative guy with various financially lucrative side hustles, one of which is his music career.


He's a very musical guy and he seems to have spun this passing interest in creating adult contemporary rock music to kind of like a moneymaking hustle like Sarah and I discovered.


And I got to say, the podcast is full of twists and turns and there's great there's great guest stars and the actor that has been hired to. Be the voice of Jeremy Renner when reading quotes of his is fantastic.


Oh, and he did a fantastic job. One of the things one of the twists we discovered was that Jeremy Renner at one point was like had this shady deal with Jeep where he was like creating music for love.


It's not you don't find it to be tasteful doesn't mean.


It was essentially like a brand sponsorship. It's like what I'm trying to do all the time, Carol. He was he was following in the footsteps of the bacon brothers when his brother did the Poland Springs jingle.


I didn't even know that there was someone who was one degree separated from Kevin Bacon. He has a whole brother. I know a lot about the six degrees. I did not know he had one right next to him. I didn't know there was a bacon brother.


So, I mean, this is so many other tangents. But Caroline, isn't there a Britney Spears?


Kevin there's a Britney Spears Kevin Bacon cell phone commercial. That is it's it's mind boggling. It's like a twin. It's like a David Lantian kind of like you don't really understand it. It's really dark.


But when I think of the Bacons, you guys, we got to say, I always think the fact that they were swindled by Bernie Madoff Sedgwick and Kevin Bacon and I'm not on money side all their money, I don't know, but a significant amount.


Now, she got she got closer money. She does. Yeah. That TNT drama money joke. Anyway, way back I remember we were talking about Jeremy Renner did Brandon content for Jeab and it was a brilliant financial move from what we can tell, because what's better than licensing one of your songs to one commercial? Listen, all three of your songs have three separate they funded an entire Geep themed music video where he's like this master of ceremonies in this Geep desert scape wearing a sparkly trenchcoat.


You got to watch it. I've seen you and I go.


It's in the video for some reason. Guys, I that's the thing. Mystery's upon mysteries, the better files. So much so when you guys. So you guys have been friends for a really long time.


We met when we were teens. We did not go to high school together, but we did go to and this is as nerdy as it sounds, a teen improv class troupe at Second City Hollywood.


I'm familiar. It's not exactly I mean, and it was this teen improv class that met every week. And you would do a show at Second City every Wednesday night after you did like two hours of practice. And it was cool, like stage time. And we were like 15 or 16. But because it was just for teens, the age range was from like it was from like 11 to 18. And there were points at which there were like 17 like juniors in high school.


And we were doing improv with like full blown tweens.


So like a child actor. And Caroline was like a chic student at a L.A. private school. We were made for each other. You looking at made for each other. And then you, Caroline went to college. Sara was on the hit show Parenthood. My eighteen year old son was like, you are not even going to meet Haddie Braverman.


There is a fucking icon like she's a good straight up. And I was just some, you know, kid growing up. My parents are like as far away from the entertainment industry as you can be. My mom is a dental hygienist. My dad did websites at Nazli like I can't. And Sarah was like, oh, working like famous actress. Like, she wants to hang out with me at my dad. I look at my dad's condo in Sherman Oaks like this is the coolest thing ever.


And they're like, we bonded. She would take me on set when she did. Like, I'll never forget. My greatest Hollywood moment was going with Sarah when she did a guest spot on Wizards of Waverly Place as a werewolf love interest.


So I want to ask you guys, because we really talk about Pivot's here. I love that you guys are such close friends because you've been a witness to each other's pivot's in your lives. So, Sarah, since I did know you when you were a kid, sort of.


I remember when you made the decision to leave the show Parenthood, a huge hit show to go to Columbia.


Right. Was it not the country guys?


Columbia University. You decided that going to school was going to be and this isn't unusual. I'm going to say it.


This is an unusual pivot for an eighteen year old actor to make what what happened? Well, I had visited Caroline at Northwestern and I always visited my friends in college. And I was like kind of into the you know, I wanted to go. I was like applying to go to colleges when parenthood got picked up. And I was like, OK, I guess I'm not doing this, but I'm going to give you a little scoop here, because it actually was not my decision to leave parenthood like and that was kind of how they spun it, which I never had the confidence at the time to be like.


And people be like, why did you make this decision? You can't fit an amazing girl.


And I didn't have the wherewithal to be like, oh, actually, like they didn't ask me to come back to the show. That's like a family show or whatever. So I they didn't renew my contract, which I was like found out at my twenty first birthday, which is a whole other.


Oh my God.


Like what I we can't even get into that was there was like. It was just the floor fell out from under me. I was so confused by everything, but. I was able to then say, oh, my God, I don't want to be in L.A. anymore, like, what am I just going to, like, go on some auditions now? Well, like, everyone who, like, is part of my TV family is like going back to set like this.


I don't know if I can do this and did it at that point. I was like, let me just go try to go to college and we allow Sarah.


That is, first of all, super fucking brave. Secondly, I'm glad that you decided I like I have such admiration for you in so many ways. And like finding that out is I'm really speechless. I had no idea that that was what had happened and that must have been so fucking soul crushing. I can't even.


It was so it was really confusing that they then, like, made an announcement like, oh, Sarah is like going to college. And it really made it look like I made that decision, which made me feel like, oh, no, like, is this embarrassing? Like, is the truth so humiliating? They don't want anybody to know.


Will you, like, did them a huge favor or did you made it so easy for them? But ultimately, I am really glad talking about pivot's like it was scary and I didn't know how was going to work out, but I don't think the runabouts would exist.


OK, if it was I mean who's gonna say if the app would have even existed if Renner even would have done the app. We don't know. True butterfly. I don't know.


Butterfly Effect two ladies. I highly recommend seeking another person. Learn a lot about this kind of stuff from that.


But I think that that's like one thing that we really try to like to get at with the people that we talk to. And I truly didn't.


You guys at home, we do no pre interviews. I truly didn't know that. And in a way. I don't know, it's so much greater, like it's such a bigger deal to me, because not only did you make the decision to like, OK, well, I guess I'm going to try college for a bit and, you know, and see how that works. But then you gave. The network, like an easy way to explain where you had gone so that it didn't actually affect anyone's impression of, like, you as an actor, like, oh, they didn't like her acting right.


Whatever the case may be, guys, people lose acting jobs all the fucking time. I was fired from How to Train Your Dragon when I was pregnant with Berdy and replaced because they wanted someone more famous. And I was like, I like sobbed for days. It's fine. They only made eight of them.


Anyway, one of the things, too, that's really interesting, especially as we talk about Pivot's, is that like that specific experience is an experience that so many people, not necessarily obviously the the television industry aspect of it, but this entire year has been a rug pulled from under us type of year.


Everybody had planned. Everyone had expectations. Everyone had goals that a lot of people had. Twenty first birthdays. Yeah.


And even like going to college, like, I know Casey do the same thing. I call her son my son Lincoln, our son is in college in his freshman year, is in his home town house. Right. So I think that this is like very relatable in a way that like hasn't ever really been as relatable. Like usually. Yeah, it's just me, but like, this whole country got fucked. So it's like I think that, like, it's nice to know that, like, we can talk to you about it and be like, oh my gosh, like that is an experience like as you've come out of the other side of it because we're still in the thick of it.


Obviously you're still in the thick of this year. We all are. But to come out on the other side of it would like your friendships and these new creative prospects and all the cool shit that you've done. Like, how did you, like, feel? Yeah. How did you find your way back? Because one of the things that I admire so much about you and Mark and I talk about it is how you do all of these different creative endeavors.


And some of them are like hugely successful runner files. You know, what do you call your, like, shorts that you guys put on foreign scenes? Yeah, your corn zeins. I just admire that you put so much different kind of stuff out there and and find your way in so many different areas. And so do you think that's a direct result of the Parenthood Dangol debacle and then going to college because you were just like a straight up actor for hire child actor that was then on a hit show and like that trajectory is very fucking clear.


We've seen it a billion times.


I'm sure I would have done weird things anyways, like when I was on, I was making random video, music videos of the cast of parenthood, like dancing with songs like I was like always making insane stuff and made a short film at that time that went to Sundance. But I think. I know it just was such a pulling the rug out from under me that I was like, I don't want to go in a different direction. And I went to college to study creative writing like fiction writing, not like screenwriting or acting or anything.


I was like, I really need to have a different life than this because this is so small. But Caroline, I don't know. Do you remember this period at all?


I just remember getting a first row seat to how devastating being an actor can be like. And I don't want to put you on the spot or blow up your spot, Sarah, but like, I was there with you when you almost got roles on huge shows and it came down to you and one other person and like you would have put in hours and weeks and like I mean, you just can't even imagine. And I would just see you go through these ups and downs.


And it was hard, sad, hard to watch. And like like everyone saying, I think it's so brave. I always thought it was so brave and so cool that you, like, move to a new city, went to Columbia, just did it on your own. I always I always thought that was so amazing. And so you've earned everything you have. You're a really hard worker. You it's just amazing to watch. I'm always inspired and amazed by Sarah.


And it's going to say, Jack, of all trades, noticing any parallels between Sarah and Jeremy Renner, we're all thinking just a little bit, except for the personality, gender, misogyny, but of Jack of all trades.


I do want to say that is something that's that has I was just thinking about. Yeah.


Like, I wonder how attractive the project for a reason. Yeah.


Sympatico. Can I ask you to say, like you're in college, you're in Chicago at Northwestern. Right. And I know that you like I mean, second city, the Chicago second city is there. But like did you go there specifically to like one hundred percent for college, obsessed with comedy, did a ton of improv, which is so embarrassing and lame.


Like so yeah. But like to the Northwestern because like Stephen Colbert went there, Julia Louis-Dreyfus went there, Seth Meyers, like I was like, I'm going to go to Northwestern, I'm going to be on MÃ, which is like the coolest student improv show in the world. And like looking back on it, it was truly awesome, like a dirty shack, like singing and doing bad sketches. But that's why I went. I did it. It was so fun.


I made, like, all these comedy friends, but, you know. So how did you end up leaving college and then ending up back together where you are now?


You know, I it was so much of it was just driven by confusion and fear and just being like, OK, I have no prospects. No one cares about what I have to say, like I'm doing standup or improv, like after college. And it's just like I have nothing. No one cares about me. So I was like, OK, well, I'll start like being funny online. And then that's how I started doing this Instagram account called Official Sean Penn, which is like pop culture, comedy and.


Took off in a really fun way, and I was like, oh, my God, I'm like saying like saying crazy shit, posting pictures of like Judi Dench with, like, a fish on her boobs.


I knew of official champagne before I specifically knew about you because I was like, oh, this is like a cool thing.


And I think that one of the things that you're hitting that I think both of you have here is after your pivot is like you like wrote for yourself what people say to do all the time. But you actually did it. So like, well, as you're creating all this content that, like, really like is cool, how are you feeling with the response to it? And like, how do you decide to keep making more?


Well, we chose to release it in the six weeks leading up to the biggest presidential election of all time.


How did it get lost in the news cycle? I don't know. Perhaps. Yeah, I bet so.


I bet so many people were glad to have something to dive into.


And they're like direct democracy is at risk of incinerating. But like, sure, we'll listen to your podcast. But Sarah and I were like, what if Trump wins? We can't then release the Jeremy Renner podcast.


After that, it was very like two bad options.


There's no going back. The good news about podcasts, I guess, is that they exist into perpetuity. So listen, guys, anyone can catch up on the runner files. Yes. Do yourselves a favor. Click, subscribe and download.


Now it's evergreen. Yeah, it is evergreen. And I mean, I do have to say the Seth Rogen alone like giving his feelings about Renner on the on the reality show he was on. Why is that?


Why am I blanking on the busy, I have to say, and far be it for me to correct you, but I wouldn't say you share his feelings. But just to give some background, we found out that Jeremy Renner was on a Bravo reality show about struggling actors, and we could not find a fucking frame of this reality show online has been wiped.


Bravo's very good at scrubbing, scrubbing history you are using to season one of the IT factor is readily available anywhere you look for it. But the two starring Jeremy Renner. Oh, conveniently nowhere to be found.


And we went deep in forums and you could get a taste of like Jeremy Renner was wild and going crazy on season two and we have to find out more.


And through Twitter searches and like cross referencing, I saw a Seth Rogen tweet where he was like as anyone else, like, does anyone else remember Jeremy Renner on this reality show? I saw every episode. I want to talk about it. And we're like, oh, my God, this is the only person we can find who has knowledge. So he was sharing he was a true, like historian with the info that we needed and he just happened to be.


That's the universe looking out for you. You know what it's like to be there when it's better to be.


That's how powerful Jeremy Renner is that I feel like able to completely erase everything except for Seth Rogan's mind as Marvel.


Can you see, I wonder if you could call your old boss, Andy Cohen, and pull a favor for these lead and get at least one episode over to them that, you know, they could just watch and then return?


I feel like I've had closure on it. I probably don't. Busy. I'll come over. Did you guys watch the starlet on the CW back in the day? It's just a reality show about aspiring actors. It was aspiring actresses. The starlet was afraid.


I was afraid. The winner got like a walk on two line role on One Tree Hill. And Vivica Fox was judged at one point. This sounds like I do want to watch now. I love Vivica Fox.


And in her line of wigs, I feel like I think that the early or the it wasn't early 2000s, right. It was like sort of mid 2000s reality show competition shows that was like to me the like sort of peak when people weren't jaded yet and didn't know what they were yet. So they were coming in to a new experience. They were just people like taking their shots, you know what I mean? Like, they just were like we I don't know what this is, but now everybody is like, oh, I'm the bitch.


Like, I know what my role is on this reality show, so I have to right that. Right. But like, back then, it was just like no one had any fucking idea.


There was a time when reality was kind of just starting. And like everybody who is interested in being a performer was also considering like, well, will I get into reality? So, you know, like Jax Taylor from Vanderpump Rules, he was roommates with Channing Tatum.


Oh, and my paths to the Butterfly Effect yet again. Photo group photo from like. Early, two thousands. And it was like Jennifer Lawrence was in it. I'm going to butcher this, but it was just breathtaking. The young, desperate starlets that were, I mean, busy, you know, this I wouldn't really want to push you to tell us about your early Hollywood days. And I know it's kind of it was wild. There was there was a bar that's now gone called Dublin's on the Sunset Strip.


And Dublin's would have I can't remember what night it was, but it was called like young Hollywood Night. And it was hosted by Lake Shein last. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Like it was like they would have to hosts and like, you know, it would be like, you're exactly right. And Pantera Sarah who I don't know why she hasn't written the book, but she was this party promoter and it would be like Cameron Diaz and Shane West and like.


Yeah. And then like Jacks, you know, or like some person, you know, like somebody who then went on to be a reality star or whatever it was. Yeah, definitely. But I was I was like always on the periphery because I went to college. And so I was like in my early years on Freaks and Geeks, Colin Hanks, while he was a star in his own right on the show. Rosewell We went to college together at Loyola Marymount University.


So like we hung with our friends in Westchester, like who were still at Alemu. It wasn't like I auditioned for the brothers. So grounded. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We I just wasn't like I always wanted to like go to Sky Bar or whatever, but it wasn't that wasn't my journey anyway.


Not to bring it back to Jeremy Renner, but please, you know, a huge part of the podcast is like not a huge part, but he is a big karaoke person. And there seems to have been this Hollywood carry like early 2000s karaoke scene that Jeremy Renner was a really active part of.


And we were we put together this like bulletin board like strings. And it was like Jeremy Renner would do like weekly karaoke nights with Sam Rockwell and then Jeremy Renner and Michelle. Wait, wasn't it not Michelle Williams? It was someone. Sarah, do you remember?


Like what? It was Amy Adams. It was Amy Adams. Adam sorry. Makes more sense to busy busy. The busy obviously triggered something in my life, but it was well, interestingly, you know, Michelle was supposed to be Amy Adams part in Arrival.


No, the the movie the first her first big movie that like, made her some enchanted, enchanted Junebug, Junebug.


So I have always thought of the two of them as being sort of simpatico. Yeah.


Michelle, typically it's the Amy Isla Fisher. Yeah.


I'm not saying Amy and Michelle look alike. I'm just saying, like, I think of them in a weird teather.


Well, these are the kind of things that happen behind the scenes that nobody knows about sliding doors, etc. It was a real sliding doors because then, you know, Michelle did Brokeback Mountain and then they were both at the Oscars that year.




Oh, I love it. Kind of gross we live for.


I have an important question. I feel like it's important to me. Great.


I love I love the runner files. My question is when. OK, so it's a six part series. When you're pivoting out of this, do you feel as if you will further investigate another thing about Jeremy Renner, or is it possible you'll investigate another celebrity mystery?


I don't want to go deeper on Jeremy Renner hit the bottom of the barrel on rent or like there's nowhere left to go and we're at the core, it could get dangerous. We we were in danger at points, but we have some ideas floating around. I mean, I don't know, spoiler alert, but I just had a really good idea this morning of a mystery to investigate. And I'll tell you guys for the first time. And Sarah, you'll be hearing this for the first time as well.


Have you guys ever heard of the feud between Bea Arthur and Betty White on the Golden Girls?


No, I didn't know one existed. Apparently, Bea Arthur hated Betty White for like acting reasons, like attitude reasons, like they were at each other's throats. And at least I want Ryan Murphy to do a season of Feud. Well, there's the famous story.


There's this famous industry legend that I always hear in writers rooms. It's like the story that gets told writer's room, ghost stories that Bea Arthur took a shit in Betty White's trailer.


And it's a it's a myth. It's a legend. But I always hear it. I mean, how mad are we to be? Did she take a shit in the toilet or just like on a couch?


It's part of the mystery that we have to find out. I think I just feel like I don't know, I feel a closeness to Bea Arthur.


For some reason, I. I feel like it was a shit in the toilet that she didn't flush.


Yeah. I think it was left. Or she like in the trailer left streaks.


I think it's the former.


If I had to guess because just streak's you're not really sending a message with streak's.


Wow. It's a trailer. It lingers regardless. I mean, that also is so purposeful because, you know, she had our own trailers and no matter what she was that the message. Message.


Who wanted to sync up your own trailer when you can you can the hotbox Betty White message received.


So that's just one of the many mysteries that Sarah and I are considering taking on.


I think there are so many Hollywood mysteries, and I really I don't know if you're going to get one that has sort of as much meat in it as Renner File.


Oh, my. You're right. So much to mind from so much to and then not to feel bad at all about it was the perfect balance of silly and serious.


It was a once in a lifetime story. And and the reality is like putting together a full blown like level like serial level production quality podcast. When Sarah and I are both like I'm in a writers room full time, like Sarah doing a million other things like writing, acting. It was a huge creative undertaking and I will ever do it again.


We were originally going to do it like with a network and then pivoted and we were like trying to find another network, trying to find anybody to in some way help us on this journey. And it was just like, oh, maybe if we went that route, we might have had it out in like twenty, twenty two or something. It showed the world existed and we just decided to do it independently and release it completely independently. And she was a journey.


She was a struggle.


I feel like you guys lean and I feel like you could become like the Keith Morrison and Josh Josh Mankowitz of Celebrity Mysteries.


There are like a Dateline type. So much money.


But also while I was going to say but also maybe instead of independently producing it next time, maybe you do just like maybe Eric Clapton or I heard maybe these will be less cowardly this time around and they'll see.


Did you guys pitch it to podcast networks? There was a point at which we were Sarah, after I tell a story, told me we should edit it out.


We were very close to a deal with and we can bleep out the name of the company we had. The podcast is full of like clips of Jeremy Renner on TV and like late night appearances and clips from his songs. And like we have some awareness of how media works. Like the clips are really short, like we didn't, you know, whatever. We tried to keep it like modest. And we got a list of all like the media we use.


And they're like, so this is going to cost five hundred thousand dollars just to license all your, like, silly little Jeremy Renner clips. Like we're going have to take it up the chain with legal. I'm just like, oh my God. Like it was just all so serious. We're like, this is a silly fun thing.


It's really, really entertaining and funny. And like I laugh out loud, guys, I've long it's very funny. I've learned a lot listening to the film. I'm.


Full disclosure, not through the whole thing, because, again, our podcast exists in a way that you can listen to it whenever you feel like it and make it work for you.


You also have to savor it. You have to savor it because it's only a six episodes. Savor the flavor.


Yeah, you're absolutely right. And I did want to flagstick if you'd gotten to the moment where we do namedrop.


You see, I haven't gotten to it yet, but I'm excited. We do as part of a really exclusive group in Hollywood, which is the Hollywood power mom inures.


I'm not really a mom, Petronella, though, if you don't mind, because I don't I don't have any products. You don't want me coming all the way. What we posit is that social media for celebrities is like a very scary place and there's all kinds of things happening. And like, you can get lost in the shuffle or like fuck up and Versailles. But the people that seem celebrity wise, that seem to have social media on lock and make it work for them, are powerful Hollywood moms, some of which are entrepreneurs.


And just like the working moms are, because I like entrepeneur, but like to like let's just be honest, I'm not fucking Jessica Alba with my million dollars.


Well, I mean, I guess Kristen Bell now and maybe also there's so many low key entrepreneurs too, like I mean, Mila Kunis and her husband's investing in like Uber and stuff like she's adjacent.


Well, that's I also love calling him her husband. That is the thing that I enjoy.


I think that could be honestly, guys, just like the amount of money invested in, like, crazy real estate.


And like, I didn't fucking know I was around at that time. I literally lost all the money I had made in 2008 and a bad real estate investment because I, like, bought Rachel Bilson house and then it was like the market tanked anyway. So that's in my book, guys. But I just like I feel like that I would listen to that podcast next. You also tell me a really interesting story, a pop culture, more that I carry around with me that, you know, the woman, a woman who was cast as Samantha, I do Sex in the City and then recast the the the true story.


And I think it's now actually been put out publicly, like in the last several years. But Marc's writing partner, so my husband's writing and directing partner, Abby, Marc and Abby Matt at USC Film School, their their their final project, their movie that they made together, that they wrote and directed, they cast a woman named Lou Thornton, who then she and Abby became good friends and she was just an actor working in L.A. making it happen. And she had a lot of success.


Like I think she's like a you know, like all those women of that sort of era, like a guest star on Seinfeld or like, you know, whatever.


And and then she was cast as Samantha on Sex and the City. And the story is apparently that they had Darren Star had wanted. Kim, Kim Cattrall, Kim, Kim Cattrall, yes, Darren Star had wanted Kim Cattrall. She had passed they did like a casting session, they found Lou tested, she got the part, she did the table read, and then Kim Cattrall came back and said she actually did want to do the role.


And so they paid Lou out like she got, you know, like, yeah, in those in the way that you do. Like, she got paid out because there was no reason for her to be fired.


Right. But like, I don't I mean, I think she pretty much like quit after that and like, you know, has a family and like, whatever. But I think and I was not around at that time. Marc and Abby were around her at that time.


And I think it was just like a crushing blow that that's like gut wrenching. Yeah. My audition for Walk the Line still haunts me.


Oh, my God. Worst audition of my life.


Caroline, did you did you want to be on SNL? Was that you're like did you think that that was the goal, the goal for you? Yeah.


One hundred percent. You know, I was just kind of a basic little comedy nerd.


And I don't really like Northwestern unless they want to be honest.


I know either want to like do journalism or be on the no, but one hundred thousand percent I, I, I, you know, it's all I wanted.


It was my dream.


I would watch old SNL episodes.


My icon was Gilda like and I didn't even like, I didn't even know. I thought it's like what you should like, like it just felt like it's the only to watch old episodes of SNL and I would like be like frowning. It was so unhappy but I was just like, this is comedy baby. I write the real stuff.


No exaggeration, ladies. Almost every guest we've had on this podcast was spurred by their rejection.


I mean, that's the most amazing TV show, like just from a production standpoint and like the history of it, like everything about it. I still am an SNL owner. I get hard on like any little nugget of gossip about Lorne Michaels. Like, I want to know who the writers that we're hired, like I'll never break free of that hold SNL has over me. But like, after having learned about what it's really like to be a writer there, what the process is like, really like, I just know I would have crumbled in that environment.


And you're writing for Chad now, Caroline. I wrote for Chad last year. That's going to be on last year on TBS at some point in the New Year. And now I'm writing for a new Mindy Kaling show for HBO. Max called The Sex Lives of College Girls one. Guess what it's about, ladies? It's about sex. And it's going to be great. The cast is so it's like a girls age. It's like a girls sex and the City style structure where you have four female protagonists.


Their lives intertwine. It's something special. We got Timothy Shalom's older sisters, one of the girls like Tune in. OK, you guys, I'm going to let you go because I think we're all tired. But also, I want one. I have one. I have one last question for you, sir. Eremos, as a super fan of things, you continue to be a super fan, do you think? One hundred percent. And Caroline, would you say that that's like a defining characteristic of yourself in your pop culture, consumption and satire of pop culture, that you're a fan or do you think you hate it?


I wear it on my sleeve. I'm obsessed about it. But listen, before we go, I just want to say. I love that you both come from a place of where you really love the thing that you're sort of satirizing, and I think that's why it connects and is so infinitely fun to watch all of the different things that you both sort of participate in. And then collectively, what makes the runner files in particular so enjoyable to listen to?


Because it's not just a straight up like you think you're fucking better than this shit, and so you're making fun of it. It's like a genuine, like awe and love and respect. Ladies, I'm so glad you guys met in that Second City teen improv class hours ago, and you've maintained your friendship and your creative collaboration over your shared love of pop culture. And nowhere is it more evident currently than on the six part series, the Renner files available now where you get podcasts.


And don't forget to make a donation directly to the ladies. They'll tell you how when you listen to the podcast. I love you guys. Thanks for doing this. So thank you guys so much. So nice to meet you.


I'm. Guys, it's the new year and everybody's got different thoughts and feelings about their goals for this year. Look, Shintaro, I was just talking about how she's trying to eat a little bit healthier. And I also am trying to put good nourishing things in my body and the bodies of the people that I love that live in the house with me.


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There is honestly something for everyone. I love switching between the brands and now my listeners can enjoy both brands at a discount with me. So I don't know. I just get very stressed out like trying to plan meals, especially when I'm working and everybody's just got shit going on, you know what I mean? It's just hard.


Yeah, they're really great. I mean, they sent some food and I had a really great chili. I love a one pot and done kind of action. So now do they think the food they also send you, like good options for like your lifestyle? My lifestyle is a lifestyle. Maybe there is like over twenty three recipes offered each week, a range of flavors and cuisines and ingredients so you don't get bored. And I also just have to say I appreciate now that I live in New York City, like grocery store trips are arduous and I don't have a ton of space in this refrigerator.


And so it's nice to have things that are already proportioned ingredients. So I'm not over buying and I'm not being wasteful.


They sent me exactly one garlic clove. And let me tell you, it was nice, baby. It was nice to just have the water and not have to worry about the rest.


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Well, you know me, I love to work out and I love workout leggings and sometimes I don't love workout leggings, like, for instance, I'm not even going to lie, guys. I was wearing some workout leggings today. They're going in the trash. I hated them. I hated them.


I truly did. Is there anything worse than a leggings blowout? No, there's no. You know what I do love? I love my sweaty body leggings, my workout, like, I guess I love them.


In fact, I wore my sweaty body leggings all day the other day and I had a lot of drama happening. I'm going to talk about on this very episode with our dog, Gina.


And honestly. Very comfortable, I felt great at the end of the day, they've sold over five hundred thousand pairs, sweaty bodies, five star rated power leggings were the ones I was wearing.


And it helps you, like, crush your workouts all tucked in and they're like sweat wicking and they have little pockets where you can stash things because that's always the problem.


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Well I really enjoyed that guys. Can't recommend that podcast. That one podcast. The one podcast. That's like basically just six episodes. But it's real funny. You can do it, you could take essentially you could take a long walk and probably finish it. Yeah. But it's, it's worth it. I loved it. I love Sarah and Carol and I hope that they'll come back again. And that was really shocking to find out that leaving parenthood was not in fact, her choice.


Yeah. Still not over it.


And this is the eight minutes of silence. This is a real time scale. But besides that one podcasts, I know you don't like podcasts, but have you ever listened to a podcast? Yes. The very first Veyron podcast. Serial Serial. I was really I was an early adopter. I started listening to Serial like immediately. But that was when I was doing Cougar Town. I lived in Hollywood. We shot in Culver City. I had about depending on traffic.


Forty five minutes at the like at the shortest drive to work.


And I just got into that podcast like it just I was like immediately into it. I told everybody at work they had to do it like everybody. Like, what are you talking about.


That was my first big podcast too. And I think that a lot of other podcasts suffered from it because I spent so much time like chasing that serial dragon, you know, like once my issue wanting to have that serial experience again. And even like the second season of Serial, I was hostile toward, like, when they yeah.


I was there another crime, I was like, dude, I legit found Jay on Facebook before it got like taken down before he like I like I was like a crazy person.


I was obsessed with the story. I was like, he's in Rancho Cucamonga. Let's go. Like, I like, found him. I, I also I'm not a podcast bitch. I, I, I did listen to Serial because I was like and in Tallahassee for three months so I listen to it. So like I'll say this like I whenever I'm listening to people talk for a long time, I don't retain it. So like if, if you have a good podcast and you can give me the transcript, I'll read it and I'll remember it.


But if I'm just listening, I will retain it. I can't do it's not just I can do books on tape. I can listen to music because I know that if I miss it, I could go back one song and I'll be fine. But if I'm listening to a podcast or a book, I will listen. And this everything that is. Let me tell you guys that we we are visual learners because do you start you start just thinking my own thoughts when I'm like, you know, like just how I tune out my entire family up.


I'm like just thinking my own shit.


Sometimes while we're doing this, I tune out, know you're going to see it, you see me fade out. Listen. But I do also think that we are visual learners. Like if somebody comes up to me, if I'm like not getting a line exactly right on this show and the script supervisor comes up to me and is like busy, it's actually and says it to me. I'm like Mary like I love you. I need to see it.


Like you have to show it to me. I can't I can't have it. It won't stick in my brain unless I see it. Yeah. OK, did you guys have we didn't talk about what we're doing our best at this week. Yes. But Casey, what are you doing your best at this week.


I'm trying to invent a new type of headband. Oh, boy.


Oh boy. I really need to take me there. I just have, like, a really sensitive head. Yeah. Hurts behind your ears. Yeah.


Every time my ears look like I'm so sensitive. And I also have been having a hard time with my pillow lately where that, you know, I don't toss and turn all night. I kind of stay in one position. The only reason I ever reposition is because my pillow is like hurting my head, which is weird, but that's how sensitive my head is that like a pillow was it. And so and I've also had the I have that thing where, like, do you remember, like in the 90s, like it was kind of cool to wear like vintage Clip-On earrings.


Yeah, I had a yeah I had a bunch. You're right. One time I thought that I was having a literal aneurysm. I thought that I was about to die and I don't know why, but I just like took off a clip on earrings and I was like instantly cured of that is. How sensitive my hair is that I remember the pain of a clip on earrings. A. was unfortunately not at all. I'm not my granny. My granny never had her ears pierced.


My granny who passed it on, and she always had clip on earrings.


She let me try them on and they were too heavy. I have small ears. Yeah, of course. Of course. So anyway, I am like I have a really and also I think like I must have been left laying on my back so much as a baby on the back of my head is flat. So like you have a flat head. Yeah. The back of my that face to the back of my head is so flat that like I can't wear that kind of stretchy headband, don't work for anyone.




If I was ever to get plastic surgery I would just get like a silicone implant on the back of my head. OK, happens.


First of all. First of all, honestly, I swear to God, I bet you could just get filler put into the back of your lot of filler.


I don't know if it would be that much. I don't know. It's just a line of filler just to the base of your skull. I feel like you'd need like a whole breast implant back there. I don't know.


I think you're I think you're overestimating.


I don't think you do that you like a line search of this and somebody is going to say, well, either that or I'll make some calls to some to your maybe your surgeons.


G.A. will tell me if they would put a breast implant on the back of my head, I, I don't I'm going to go back in a couple of weeks. I'm sure.


I'm sure you could just just do some light investigating. But anyway, in the meantime, like, that's my goal for twenty, twenty one is to invent a pain free headband that works, that stays on my weird flat head because what I've learned, and especially from this podcast is anything that is going on with me. I'm not alone in this world. There's somebody else out there with a sensitive flat head who needs a headband, who just wants to have a cute headband.


And so, like, I'm doing it for me and I'm doing it for that person, whoever they are.


I have to say, I agree with you. Headbands are sometimes the most pain I've ever been in. There's nothing like your hair hurting the worst.


But Lisa is the doggy who makes the headbands and is my New York friend. And our kids are in school together now. Makes headbands that some of them do not cause me pain and then some of them do, and I'm trying to figure it out just like, you know, the difference. What's the difference? I don't know if it's down to, like the manufacturing of, like to know that when they mass produce. Clothing, a lot of times they pile all the fabric up, so let's say they're doing jeans, so they pile all the fabric up.


Yes, and the ones on top are bigger. The ones on top are smaller, the ones on top. And it spreads out. It spreads out. So they cut down like so a size six. If you get the size six from the top, that's like a true size six. But if you like, try on the size six that was cut from the bottom of the pile, it might actually be like closer to an eight because the fabric cuts out kind of.


Does that make sense to the way I'm explaining it? Yeah. So I know that was something that I knew. So I wonder if there was like something in the headband industry wherein I mean, honestly, KC, we just need larger headbands.


Yeah, maybe. Yeah. Or like something. I just want something that is like Yeah. That fits, that doesn't make me feel like my head is being crushed in a vise and like I am immediately going to blackout and fall down on the ground and that stays on because I just want to wear a headband and look cute. That seems reasonable. Shintaro, what are you doing your best at this week.


In the hour I'm doing my best at like not like a diet, but like eating healthy.


I have to, like, start work again this week. So like for all of the last year, I just kind of did whatever I wanted it, whatever I wanted.


And then, like, you have to just like eat something. You're like, I'm sick, but like, you still do this. Yes. So I would just be like, oh, this is gonna make me sick, but I have to eat it. But like now I'm like, I don't feel like being sick. So I ordered, like, a lot of, like, really good place called like Dave's Korean Gourmet.


I love Dave's like Korean Gourmet.


And yeah. So we ordered like miso paste and like a bunch of like, like rice noodles and like that to make kimchi kimchi.


I added, I added it, I combined it to compare with what I want I can say so kimchi and then like pickled radish and daikon and we like ordered a bunch of it have been like eating miso like every other day. So I just like spending a little bit of time, like not doing like a dry January but just doing like a oh like I've been eating like a bunch of stuff that my body did not want. Yeah. I'm just like, oh OK.


Well like I'm going to have like a really good like miso soup that's homemade for like we'll see how long this lasts.


But that's what I'm doing right now. It's just like trying to like reinvest in like nourishing my body with not you those all the time.


Yeah. Yeah. That's where I'm at. It makes a difference. My my my son. Your son Lincoln will be really proud of you because I think he's like on that similar journey, like the pandemic has been a little bit of a free for all. And he the other day he was like I think requested again, like something kind of on the clean side for dinner and said that he had been eating like a ninja turtle.


Yes. I truly well, I think, too, after the surgery, like because like, my dad used to her all the time, like no matter what, like I would work out for like twenty days straight, do yoga, do stretching, do lifting and like do everything right. But then like I wasn't getting the results that I felt, not weight loss, just like I should feel better and I'm not. So like I kind of like punished myself in that way.


But I was like, well if I could do twenty five days of yoga and working out and my knees still hurt, well I'm going to eat macaroni because it doesn't make a difference. But now that it does make a difference, I'm like, OK, body, you've kept up your end of the bargain so I will be nice to you and I will not eat this weird box today in that.


Sounds like what you're making is really delicious. Yeah, it's all good. Yeah.


So and listen, I'm all for doing all the all the things honestly all the things that's always been like the joke about me is that I'll try four thousand things at the same time. Then I'll be like I don't know what worked but I feel better. Like is it the is it the Ayurvedic thing. Is that the no sugar. Is it no wheat. Is that I stopped drinking. Is it that I'm exercising. Who knows. But it's there.


But, but I do think that like what I have. Found in the last, like I would say in the last. Maybe a year and a half.


Two, two years, what's time, we don't know, two year, half year, two and a half years is that for me, like weighing myself dieting, like sticking to like regimented eating does not benefit my brain or my body because I end up bingeing on the sugar and sweets and like things that I feel like I'm depriving myself of.


So if I just am like, oh, we ordered pizza last night, Casey, I saw your post and I was like, I literally just ate pizza.


I had pizza. It was so good. But like, if I, if I just it's just for me, like moderate, like really, truly. I finally fucking understood what moderation is. That being said, I've eaten so many fucking cookies this past month. Yeah. I'm a little bit with you on the like. I need to slow down on the cookies.


I, I think we were all just waiting truly I it would be whatever I want anyway. But like now then we have a new president. I'm like I feel better. I don't know if that makes it a bit like November 2nd. I was like, give me a pizza, sprinkle some Oreos on it, dip it in. Yeah, fudge it.


Like now and now I like I have like a new lease on life and I don't know if that feels weird, but like I'm just like man in twenty days we're going to start something new and maybe I should go jog right before we go on this new year. We all have holes and like your holes are like a little less shallow now. Yeah. Don't fill them with Oreos sprinkled pizza maybe.


Oh yeah. Maybe Saturday. I feel I feel like a sleeve of Tait's is like not in my in my post Biden world. Yeah. I mean like I think that's what it is for me. Yeah. Yeah. I ate so many.


Thin chocolate chip cookies, those 20, 20 up, those are hard to stop because they're so light and like it's fun to crunch things and then they, like, come in like kind of a moderate size bag. It's not like a giant bag. So you're like, next thing you know, the whole bag is gone. But that makes me feel better to know that you eat entire bags of those cookies as well. Oh, my God. And also, you know who the worst culprit is at this point?


One cricket silver. Yeah, I can see that, I can see that cricket will be like she's like the little mouse in the pantry and I'm like, what is happening? And then I'm like, Guys, there is one.


Thate Eisenbach was like, we have to stop buying them. And I was like, well we can't do that. But like she really should slow down on the tape. It's like it's too many. Like it's, she's so small, she's like the size of a box of Tait's. That's what I mean.


Like it's like also also like it's not moderation for Crick's because she doesn't eat anything healthy. Well that's not true. I mean, she's broccoli and all kinds. She's she's like a little bit of a fussy eater. But, you know, you know, I have you know, obviously, like we don't talk about I don't we don't ever like there's no good food and bad food. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah.


So food is food, but I'm like I think there are things that might nourish you more.


But like I mean, to be honest, I would not be surprised if in one year they came out with a study being like, you know what, there's a subset of people who perform optimally on one bag of tests per day and they actually shouldn't eat vegetables. It's horrible for them.


Well, that's me. That's me. Definitely. I'm probably cricket. OK, what are you doing your best at? A couple of things.


Number one, I feel like. I have done my best really listening to my kids needs and what they're asking for and how I can give that even if there is a part of me. That as my own person, I'm like Eak, but I don't want to subject I could do this, I don't want to do this because I think that that's a piece that, like, I didn't really talk about, you know, but that piece exists. And especially when I see the nasty, fuckin weird shit, I'm like, I want to protect this kid.


Right. But then I had a conversation with another friend of mine who's very much older and gay and. Her take was right, but that was the whole thing. That's why it was so hard to come out, because you didn't want to you didn't want your parents, like, always be worried about you and your sister and how the world would receive you and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.


And and I was like, oh, that put it in perspective.


So I've just been like going to people in. I don't know and like asking for help and advice and and I feel like I'm. Having more perspectives on things here today, I want to say that Gina Leonetti tried to commit suicide in the country and it was really traumatic.


She we took her to space, OK, because I just what can I just say? What the OK, when I hear something fucked up, I laugh. OK, I definitely might be interested in Tehran, especially if I die in a fucked up way when I hear something really that my gut reaction is to go, oh no. OK, so here's what I have it. So this is what I really want to talk about. I don't care.


I don't know. I'm doing my best. But just being Bertie's mom, I guess you could cut out all the other stuff. Let's just go with I'm doing my best at being a mom to my kids and really listening to what their needs are. Which guys, whatever at different times in my life has been easier and or more difficult, and if you're a parent, you fucking get it. And if you're a kid, I hope you get it.


Someone's kid. I hope you get it because it's hard to be a person. OK, so here's what I really wanna talk about.


We we went to visit my BFF Michelle and her husband and. For like New Years, they've been quarantined in their place that's outside of the city and they were like they've been, you know, they were like tested and then they've been quarantined for a period of time up there by themselves. No one coming or going except for, weirdly, the day we showed up in which an animal probably died under their house and they had to have like a person come to try to find it anyway.


You know, you has anyone you guys have had an animal die under your house, right?


No animal in my house under animals will go under house.


Yes. To die in your house smells weird. Yeah. Yeah, it's so we had one in L.A. once.


We had a possum that died under our house and it was like so disgusting.


Anyway, I visited my possums only live three years. I just want to point that out. My husband is obsessed with possums. All he does is talk about possum all day and the fact that you're seeing a possum died under your house. You just sentence me to like another week of talking about possum.


Well, the craziest thing it was, you know, obviously are no longer houses in L.A. and this was years ago. And the smell is like unmistakable. Like it is like a dead animal in in your house is like block like you're just, you know, it. So we call the exterminator people to come out to try to help us.


And then the guy was like, oh, we have to call Tony. And we're like, what?


Tony really could not find the animal. You have to the answer call Tony. And I was like, oh, my God, who's Tony? And they're like the littlest one.


Oh, like this guy showed up who was like he was small ish. But like more than that, he just, like, clearly had no feelings of claustrophobia or fear of it.


You, like, shimmied himself into the tiniest crawl spaces. And that was what was so annoying about this possum was the like chose the farthest, smallest place to die.


Anyway, that makes sense. It thought of something you didn't want to be a burden. But no, no, it was a it was not great anyway.


So so we go.


So we had all been tested and we also hadn't been seeing anybody either.


But like so so we went up there and we had like a really, really lovely time.


And Michelle has a dog that is like an older I think it's like a cavalier King Charles spaniel. And, you know, I mean, the dog's like 12. She's seen some shit. She's like over it. She's fine, she's whatever. And here we come in with Gina Leonetti, the Pupper, who turns one on January 11th, guys.


Oh, wow. So soon? Her birthday. And I was like, we had this whole talk about if we were going to bring Gina or if we were going to, like, leave her, bought her her favourite, like, dog place here in the city. And I was like, we got to bring the dog upstate. Gina was meant to be upstate. She's coming, love it so much.


And Mark was like very stressed about Gina upstate. Like, he was like afraid that she was going to just run and then, like, never come back.


Right. That's a valid fear. Yeah. And I was like, I don't know. I feel like we'll just like play let's play it by ear. And she has to come with us. Like, I can't have New Years without my love. Gina. So anyway, the first day. She was like. Following us and like a little nervous about the new environment, but like was super excited by the space, you know, and was like running around, running around and.


And I was like very stressed, like getting her, you know, in the middle and the Michelle and I had to talk, you know, because like I've been watching the dog, she's really attached to you guys. Like, she's not going to run away.


Like, she's just she's obviously loves you guys in a way that like she's like she always is like looking back to make sure you're there, you know? And I was like, that is true. I have noticed that, too. I think you're right. I think maybe we can, like, let her go, like, let her off leash letter realm.


And she's like, that's what the dogs do up here. You just have to like, let them go.


And I was like, OK, I'm sure I get so. So the next morning I wake up and I'm like up early. First I'm kind of tired and I'm like, I'll just stand outside and watch her go. So then she goes and then she does start heading toward this like Forest Brambilla area. And I'm like, fuck, look back and she's not coming. She's on the path of something. She smells something. And Tommy said that he saw me from the upstairs window and he was like you.


If I had written it for a film like I couldn't have, like, you nailed it. The indie movie I'm wearing, like my big puffer coat and I'm holding my coffee and like, I'm tromping through these things and like, trying to get the dog.


And like, I'm like, is anyone can anyone, you know, like, get her out of these bramble's anyway? So I was fine. I was like, oh, this isn't great though. But then I said to Mark, I was like, I do think as long as like, we keep her over in this area, she'll be fine. Right. OK, fine.


So Michelle and I were in the kitchen. And. I am I don't even know where to go with this. Mark. Was like, OK, let her go, and then he looked, I didn't see it, thank God, and she was standing in the middle of the frozen but not quite frozen pond. No, no.


Where like one misstep and it would have been. Like it's a wonderful life. Well, she didn't do it on purpose, she just was out. She thought that that was it was a dog. She said, why would she do it? Why not? She's exploring. OK, I know she's a baby. So anyway, thankfully, his calm tone got her back across the ice. She did not fall in. And I'm glad he didn't, like, step out onto the ice because then later Bertie went down there and was like at the little edge of it.


And just like like it was.


Oh, God, the heroin. So then wait. So then there were chickens. And Gina and again, so maybe Michelle, I was like, OK, why does Michelle hey, Gina, you know, here's what I realized.


I realized that she has a 12 year old daughter. Yes. Yeah. But I wasn't taking that into consideration. And so we were talking and the chickens were out of the coop. And I was like, I can't let Gina out.


Just know what. Luckily, I kind of tried to go after the chickens once and then the lucky.


Oh, what we didn't see and hear are now we know that now we're like now we're all on the same page.


Then to point something out, though, because you have the knowledge, you know, that Gina has tried to eat live birds.


We didn't know that. Well, now, I'm sorry. This is the point is that I'm rethinking the whole wing debacle, because you guys, when I tell you she she was so close to murdering a chicken in front of us as we were all screaming and Mark pulled up at that very instant I had my arms were full of like I had stripped the beds and I was like, whatever, it doesn't even fucking matter.


But my arms were full and it was muddy. So I didn't want to drop like laundry in the mud. And I mean and Mark pulled up right at that moment. And Gina is chasing this chicken has somehow new to separate one chicken away from the roosters and the other chickens and is chasing this chicken and is like feathers. She's like snapping and getting feathers. Feathers are being plucked out. And I'm screaming, what comes out? He's like out of the car because he had, like, gone to whatever.


Doesn't matter, he's back. And I'm like, yeah, that's OK.


And he's like, what's happened?


And like, she's about to murder the chicken. And then, like, around the house again for like round three, the chickens about to give up, she lunges and takes like not a joke or a huge bite as Mark, like, grabs her collar. Feathers fly everywhere, the chicken is safe.


We checked on the chicken, not injured, just lost some feathers, just traumatized, traumatized, literally traumatized because also, can you imagine the chickens like that other dog? This is not that other dog. The dog is so chill. It comes over and sniffs are like chicken feed and sometimes eats our poop and then like walks away. Gina truly tried to, like, murder that chicken. If she had if Mark hadn't pulled up, if she I would have watched her shake and wring the neck of a chicken in front of me and kill it.


And now I'm thinking that maybe she did in fact, kill the bird either because it's instinct. Yeah, well, that's what I saw. I saw the instinct kick in. And once once the bird gave chase and like, Gina was hot on on the chicken's tail.


Oh, my gosh. She was like she was like eyes glazed over like a shark and she was going for that fucking chicken.


But that's not the end of Gina upstate. I wish it were. There's one last thing. We're packing everything up. We're getting ready to go. And then I just hear her screaming and I'm in the house and he brings in Gina and she has somehow gotten her entire life left side of her face, left side of her entire body with some sort of like bramble thing that was like but not just like those ones that are like have all the little spikes on them that are get stuck in the hair.


They had those, but they also had good, you know, like some sort of goo attached to them and then also had, like, stick branches as a part of them that were also sticky.


And they're trying to grow more trees.


I'm not into that. So I spent then.


A literal hour and a half with Gina in the bathroom with a scissors and my own hairbrush and then gave her a bath and she has a pretty unfortunate haircut now, like, she just has, like, chunks of fur that I had to cut out because there was no way to get the I started like trying to pick them out, but especially like around her face, I was so worried they were going to go into her eyes and ears.


So I just was like, well, we're just cutting your little eyebrows. And that's just the way that we're going to have to do this.


Or, you know, she's really and you know, you're right, she was.


And then look and then we left as we were leaving, Mark was like, never again. I was like, well, I mean, she's got to learn. It's very stressful, I'm I I might be with Marc on this one. It would have been so much more pleasant without her.


She was like, well, now, you know, now, you know, she also just, like, wouldn't stop fucking barking. And she's not a barker. Like, she just was like barking at everything and well, maybe she's a down the house. It was a night I like, you know, like she was just like she was just on one with a dog. She's a city dog. Yes. I mean, who knows. Like dogs are like computers.


Kind of like, you know, how when you're blaming a computer, but you find out like come to find out it's actually your fault because it's just zeros and ones and you're not doing the right thing. That's how I feel about dogs. Like they're just going to do what they're going to do, like a dog computer. And you can only control your reaction to it. And I feel for you guys stress.


I mean, other than that, it was like really nice. So nice. And I thought that no, it was it was like beyond nice. It was like the nicest, nicest island. I Michelle and I took a walk with Gina, a two mile walk, because I thought, well, this will wear her out.


The chicken goes after the hurricane. Gina Anyway, we took a two mile walk on New Year's. Day, I think, was that was that New Year's Day that I found the two pennies, like in the snow. Yes, that was crazy. And even Michelle was like, well, you're just a straight up, which I don't know.


I found two pennies that mean. Yes, we're like miles apart. This year's going to be twice as good as last year.


Oh, man.


I mean, you guys, it's got to be better. Everything's already better. The coup still not happening. We're good. Golden. Let's do it.


What about all these fuckers that are like going to vote, that the election wasn't fair or whatever? And who cares? I don't care. I'm not going to talk about I hate them. He said that's it. And it's OK to hate them. Never forget.


So what we've learned is that some dogs belong in the city. I think she'll be good when she's older, maybe upstate, maybe I have to stay at my dog's turned nine, my, my, my Millie and my birdy turned nine, we got them in New Year's Day nine years ago. And we are still saying when they're not puppies anymore, they'll be calmer.


And, you know, our wild dogs are bracing for the fact that not only would they murder a chicken, they would also murder cricket because they would murder a child.


Yes, take the house one time and they lost their fucking minds. They wanted to kill her. They really did.


Those dogs were out for blood. Oh, no. Which is terrible. But I mean, look.


And I'm sure like they would have murdered her with love, but also would have, like, teamed up to take her down. She was so small. That's a problem in cats. She was too small. And I guess what I'm saying, they're like just on instinct.


They don't know cricket's great. They don't know cricket's the best. They're just like see like another creature. They think they can team up to take her down. And that's what they wanted to do.


I feel bad for that chick and I want to pay for its therapy. The worst thing that's ever happened to a chicken. I mean, and yeah.


And I don't even know, you know, what what the future holds for that chicken. I know. We don't know. Oh, did you guys do anything for two years?


I ate of some edibles and went to sleep. Yeah, I think I went to sleep by like ten thirty.


I did a deep clean. I do. I know there's like a bunch of like Meems about black people cleaning their houses, but like I did, I did like a really my house isn't dirty though so it was like a mop. Yeah. What's up. Clean when your house is already spotless. Yeah my house is already very clean. So I know there's also tradition for like black eyed peas and collard greens, but like I don't eat enough of collard greens and black eyed peas to make them.


And I didn't feel like it. So like I told my ancestors to be chill. Yeah, that's cool.


That's good. That's good.


We ate really good food. Michelle is like an amazing cook and so is Mark. And so Tommy would ask me what podcast's I wasn't listening to and I went and I would make spritzers and then Mark and Michelle cooked all the food.


That's awesome. Which was nice. Yeah, it was really, really nice. And it was it was also much I was like, this is so crazy. Like it's like almost normal, like it almost could be, this could be normal. And I was like, I know this must be what the Kardashians felt like when they flew to the island.


I think 80 of their closest friends, family to the island, like, oh my God. And then I was thinking about you guys. Did you get that text for me when Chrissy Teigen tweeted that she was just thinking about that time when John Legend thought he won an Oscar for Best Picture? Oh, yeah. Because he produced Lalala and. I guess it just made me laugh so hard that he replied with sad face emerges and then of course, that made me think of you and Michelle because you were there.


And that big moment I have that photo I have that introduced LOL.


And that's I mean, I'm trying to be a producer credit because that's how he he got to I was like, how did he get a Tony? And it was for producing Jitney. And I was like, I need to be talented enough to know what to produce so I can egert because I don't have the talent to get a Grammy unless I like write a book.


I'm like damn if I could just get my name on a producer credit. That's the thing I've been thinking about. That's a great goal. I mean I did write a book and I thought my audio book was really good and I did not get nominated for a Grammy. But that also come my about it.


I think the way who put you can't feel too bad about that because like the last two people to win were like Michelle Obama. That would have been my year. Yeah.


Yeah. Obama was your years. So I said, listen, obviously Shelly is going to win. Yeah. But does anyone call her Shelly has ever called. I don't think I like it. I noticed that Sasha is going by Natasha now.


She signed a holiday card.


Natasha, that's where Sasha is. Sasha must be short for Natasha. Yeah, I didn't know that.


I didn't know that either. Well, a lot of people don't know. And so when they sent they like posted their holiday card to social media this year, people are like, who's the. And of course, my kids were like that Sasha. Awful name because well, I did not know that I read the book and I think that was in the book. I don't know. It probably was. I just looked it up. I don't think John Legend did produce Lala Land, so he didn't he shouldn't feel bad about thinking that they won.


And I guess maybe he was like there in the celebration. Was he sitting near you?


Oh, he's he's he's in la la land.


Yes. In Sahelian Pado get to go you get to go on stage. That's what I was like, try to remember but then I remember like because I've only seen it once but I was like, oh he's in it. So that makes sense. Anyway, I seen it once, I got up on it on a tangent, but it just like again, we're talking about how everything feels so connected. You were with Michelle at the time that Chrissy Teigen tweeted laughing about her husband not winning an Oscar.


And it made me think of you guys in that moment being there and witnessing that whole thing together of when all these people thought they won the Oscars and and who was I sitting next to other than Ben Affleck?


I am not going to be able to circle or not going to be able we're not going to be able to wrap it up better than that. And that's it. You guys please subscribe. Please download. Play the call to our Lancasters. I don't know Mirch available. I can't sell those Ben Affleck shirts, but boy, would I have made a fucking mint if I had done it. But you guys have them, so that's all that matters. Yes.


And the man in me, I died and you guys are starting to get merch.


I'm starting to see photos of you guys in and.


Oh, yeah, please. Oh, my God. It's cute. Yeah. Tag us and we will put you in our stories. I'm not speaking for myself and I don't know why I used Royalle.


We but it's four o'clock. It's about time for me to think about dinner and think about the fact that I have to wake up at 5:00 tomorrow morning at work. I love you guys. We love you. And guys, I don't we don't know what's going to happen between today and Tuesday. We should have ended up Ben Affleck.


We could cut it with Ben Affleck. You guys, we love you.


Stay safe, safe, safe and calm.


And don't run on to a frozen pond that might be melting. OK, guys, till next week.