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[00:00:00]

I mean, I think it was like the early 80s when this happened, I don't even remember the four legged duck. Hello, everybody, here we are, it's busy Phillips is doing her best episode. For it really feels like, oh, Jesus knocked my arm on this plate, that I have all my crystals and crystal necklaces on that was sitting in the window sill last night getting charged. And then, you know, this is Wednesday. So the full moon was technically this a very early one a.m., two a.m., something like that.

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But I go always I'm always charging when the moon is waxing, when it gets to this point where we're in the last like two, three days, I always just put those crystals on the moonlight and just try to get some as much positive waxing charge in there as possible.

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That's good, though, because I feel like you can't put it off. I, too, have a little tray for my crystals to be charged. And I do what I'm like, oh, look at the moon. I'll just put it out there. Yeah, because I figure you want to be you do want to be careful on a waning moon, though. You don't want the power to be sucked out. Shannara assigned to Jackson. Everybody say hi to her.

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Hi, your friend. I'm a crystal bitch. We all are crystal bitches. We're all little witchy.

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This has been a particularly interesting time to be a person that feels the weight of the universe in a lot of ways. Yeah, you see it before before you. Hi, Casey. And before anyone writes in and says, you know, I know people delight in being like, oh, crystals are bullshit. Well, you know what? It can't fucking hurt at this point.

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At this point, I'm willing to try anything. I want to hit things from all sides. That's where I'm at, like legitimately with this thing that I've been fighting in my body. Whatever we're now, I'm taking forty seven different kinds of like herbs and supplements from this herbalist guy, Michelle's guy in New York, also taking an antibiotic, guys, because let's just do it, you know what I mean? What other angle? Also doing so much therapy.

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Lots of talk about all of these things. Yeah. So in the hopes that one of these things is going to work. Oh. Also taking a brief hiatus from drinking because I think I need to just like give my system a rest. Not to say that, you know, maybe one of those things would have worked.

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Maybe we'll never know which one it was if I get better, which cares as long as that we're just like always the thing with me, like I'll always like I'll have an issue or something and I'll I won't do like a process of elimination, like try this thing. It didn't work. Try this thing. It didn't work. I'm like, let's try everything and then we won't know what it is that did work, but at least I'll feel better.

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So that's where I'm at right now. But I do have to say, this is a song that has been in my head for. You know that I wake up in the morning with songs like Stuck in my Head, right? Like like specific lines. Oh, do you know that? You know that you didn't. I think it's a it's actually some tide a little bit to like OCD. It's 11, 11 guys.

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I went, oh my gosh, OK, but wait, let me see if I have time to see it.

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I've had that stuck in my head on a loop just like twigs saying it's a sad day for sure.

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She does pole dancing. Yeah. And in the middle of her show, she brings out a pole and she pulled dancers for you and sings at the same time. And it is very cool and hot and impressive.

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It's just like she did it on the Grammys this year. Right? Like Usher did a tribute to Prince. Did you guys watch the VMAs? I just watched clips of what I saw hold. I thought old. I can't watch a whole the images right now. I just I like to go on Twitter and see what people are upset about or what they enjoy and then just watch clips of that.

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I'm like, oh, this is the moment where I'm just too fucking old for anything. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. And Kiki was amazing, you know, like, I love Kiki and I think she did like a nice job and but then, like, Lady Gaga, like I was like very like very confused by some of the things she was saying. I think it just must be hard to like. I don't know how you.

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I don't know how you, like, do that right now in the world. It's really hard to let go to an awards show and like, accept. An award not and again, I have zero shade for anyone who's going to go to an awards show and accept an award, I just personally, I'm thinking like, I don't know how you do that. Casey did the thing on Twitter where you post the photo from January where you have no idea what's to come or whatever, like not you know, most of us had no idea what's to come.

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And I didn't do it. But I was looking it did make me look. And I have all these photos of me and Michelle at the Golden Globes, you know, and I was like, oh, yeah, that's like definitely antithetical to this moment right now. Celebrating a well-deserved nod for her incredible acting. But at the same time, like, OK, you know, like putting on here's the good news. I'm not nominated for any awards for at least I mean, either I vote for the Emmys like I you know, I get the I'm a voter.

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I'm in I'm in the whatever Emmy thing. And I just like was like, what? I don't know. What are we even talking about? I can't I can't focus on that. This week was so sad. I've been so sad. I know you guys have been sad. Yeah, I've been sad. I have been sad.

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I mean, I like overall blanket sadness. I think we've talked about this before, like the duality of it all, like like a being grateful. But then just like there's like a sadness because we have empathy for the whole world.

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And then there's just like shit that happens that you're like, not now, not right. And obviously, Chadwick Boseman was not a thing that anybody saw coming. And it's like following the week with Jacob Bleak and then the 17 year old kid opening fire and then just how out of control everything in the world seems. I feel like a lot of people, like I didn't know him and I was the first celebrity I ever cried for. True. Wow.

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It felt it felt like it felt very personal to so many people and it felt like an insult, you know. But in terms of the way that Chadwick Boseman chose to live the end of his life, I have such admiration for, you know, just that what he was going through was what he was going through and he didn't he wasn't sharing it.

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And that's I also think that there was you know, there was a there's a piece of a little bit, which is like. You know, he did some incredible and really important and representative work in these last years while he was sick, and if Hollywood producers and directors and people knew that he was sick, I don't think that that would have I don't know if they would have. I mean, you guys, I couldn't get insured when I was pregnant with Burty to work on a movie.

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I mean, also that Martinson's were like, it's just too expensive. We're not, you know, like we can't take the chance. What if you like, what if something happens? You go into labor early. Oh, well, I'm beyond the liability. Liability. Yeah. So beyond the liability issues that anyone might have had, it also would have just changed the way that people write and write. He was in the business of playing very powerful, iconic characters.

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In the minute that you plant that seed in someone's head like that, I'm sick. And, you know, then people start to get ideas about what you can accomplish and what you can do with your life. And, you know, now we know the truth. He could do anything.

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And there and like I mean, also I think it also speaks to the way that he was battling cancer. And I have friends that were close with him, you know, that he didn't he really was like, I'm going to beat it. Like, you know, I think he was I think he was fighting the whole time and wasn't going to let it, like, slow him down or. Yeah, I saw a quote from that.

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They were like, how are you doing? And he was like, man, I can't wait to live to tell you. And it's so it feels so ominous now. But like him just being like Sounness is over. I can't wait to tell you all what I did for you, you know, and for himself.

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But yeah, it was like I drove to the beach to, like, look at something nice. We drove to the beach and we turned off our phones. And I looked at the sunset and I looked at the moon come up and I walked up the stairs and Chadwick Chadwick Boseman had died. And I was like, motherfucker. Like, I was so sad. Yeah. And it was like twenty twenty. It's been wild. You just watch the sun go down and then you see that like one of the brightest stars ever kind of left us.

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And the impact that he made in like I think that we've all been really sad about the whole world. But like I think this was like the first time that people were like, oh, like I don't know. I don't know. The last time a star like a movie star passing impacted a community the way that it did, like everybody loved him. Everybody was like, fuck. Right. So and also, I think it gave us like an outlet for collective to cry.

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You know, I think, like, this was like a reason that cracked everybody open. I just wish it wasn't such a real, real reason.

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I mean, the truth is, I've been thinking a lot this week. Feels like also I do think in the world and politically and everything, it feels a little bit like spinning off the rails. My therapist said this thing to me like like six months ago about specifically like about a thing I was going through.

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But she was like, you know, there's a theory and family therapy that a child in crisis will devolve and continue to devolve until the point at which the adult in charge comes in and takes complete control of the situation. And the child feels like they're going to be taking care of whatever that looks like and whatever that means. And then and then that's where they'll level out. But like until that moment, a kid will, like, continue to unravel, unravel to spiral.

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And I've just been thinking about that so much. I read some I read some articles about like what's happening in the country. And even with Chadwick, I was so, you know, my Twitter is like, yeah, like I mostly follow people who are in line with the things that I believe because I don't I don't you know, I don't want to get, like, outrageously angry when I read it, when I like log on to Twitter.

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But somebody retweeted some woman who was like Yashar. Ali retweeted some woman who was like something about like, did did Chadwick Boseman really die of cancer?

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Like, you know, like some conspiracy theory that, like, has to do with I don't I assume I didn't even, like, dig deeper into it. I assume it's like the Illuminati or whatever. Right. And I was just like, oh, no, I can't deal with this. This is where we're at. To me, the United States at this point is a child in crisis and it is just devolving and devolving because there is no adult that is like coming in and taking complete control of the situation and saying, like, OK, guys, guess what?

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The truth actually is the truth and it still exists. Science still is science and it exists. You know, we're going to do X, Y and Z, everybody, like, let's de-escalate the situation. I just like we need we need parents. Yeah. You know what I mean. Yeah, we for sure do. And we. I don't know what the solution is, because, I mean, you say I know you're not on Facebook either, but you see it, you just see it like you can see, you know, people from my high school believe the like people are lizard people and that we're being controlled by mind controllers with umbrellas.

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Like, here's the thing. Like there is there there is obviously there are bad things. Yeah. In this world there are terrible things in this world, but. The trick, the greatest trick, I guess, the devil ever pulled was getting people to focus on fairy tales to like avoid them having to confront the reality of the work and the minutia and like, honestly, the boredom of actually changing a system. Like, it's arduous and it's long and it's a grind and it's not fun and it's boring and it's bureaucratic.

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And there are like things and steps that you have to take. And it's so much easier, I think, for people to be like the monster is the pedophiles in Hollywood and like, come on my fucking Instagram and ask me where Birdie is, because they think I like sex trafficked my own child because I haven't posted her for a week like Jesus fuckers or wild. It's wild.

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But I mean, look at look at the Nexium documentary. I want to watch. I want to watch. And I didn't I haven't watched it yet.

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It's wild. I mean, these are people that some of these people are people that we work with in our industry. Not that I've ever directly, but Mark worked with like we if you look at like the head of this what I did I haven't heard back at. And Finmark, there she is not not sexy. Oh, yeah. Oh, wait, no, Marc worked with Alison Mack. Yeah. And I mean, he did on a pilot that that it was I can't remember was the pilot or they did they had a TV show the same year as Freaks and Geeks, like nineteen ninety nine.

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It was called the opposite.

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This is pretty stable. I only know. Yeah I tested for that part for Shankara. You would have been great. Yeah I didn't, I was. I don't get it. I watch eight seasons of Smallville.

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I dropped out the last two the but it could have been me, I could have been a nut for sure. Now busy. Whatever. Busy. You know you would have been, I wouldn't have fallen short. I'd be like I'm sorry, what are we doing now. But the point is, if you're watching if you know anything about the next Hollywood cult, this guy who's just like the nerdiest guy in your middle school, like the nerdiest guy that ever asked you out and, you know, just like a some kind of dendi looking motherfucker, you know, he just like he was able to get people to join this cult just by telling them they're special.

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And then once they were hooked, making all these like like insane demands and they submitted to being branded like it's wild and saying people, working people, professional actors and filmmakers in Hollywood, we're like, thank you for telling me this thing that I needed to hear. Yes. I'm loyal to you for all eternity. Please burn me with that. Everybody needs a group chat, guys. OK, which brings us to this. We've gotten a lot of submissions we're going to do.

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The cutoff date is let's do it 48 hours from now and then we can we put it together this weekend. Yeah.

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So so I had come I'd. At noon, noon Pacific. Get your if you want to if you want to be paired into a group chat. I think we're going to do well. We'll see what the final numbers are like. Three or four people. You really can't have more than four people and chat. I don't know too much too many things. It's too many pings. I'm on one that is like sometimes so ridiculous. Like, I will come back to my phone and it's five hundred messages.

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And I'm like, guys, I can't I'm not reading this, but OK, so so Friday at noon, if you want to be put into a group chat, send your name, your phone number, I guess. Right.

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As to why are we asking for. So how do we do it now. Just the email. We're to people on the app, on their email guys. And do the ones they can take it. So yeah. So just send an email with a few of your interests. What your interest, what you want to gossip and try to like. Is it like. Yeah, it's an applicant on it. And Darmouth is it like is it like social justice things.

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Is it politics. Is it thinking. What's your vibe. Is it baking. Know what you want to have a safe space to say some things so that you don't busted out on Twitter and get fired from your job and get fired from your job. Neun right now time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And also just in your email, maybe say that you give us permission to introduce you to other friends. Yeah.

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We're going to need we're going to be like. Yes, legal.

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No, not lawyers. We're just doing our best to guess at what the law is. OK, so listen. So like I know that this has been a lot of sadness and we've all been having a hard time. And but and I don't know about you. I've been like doing my best through it. I've made some decisions. I'm like, guess what? Like all the alcohol and pie isn't actually making me feel better. So I'm going to, like, just take a quick break.

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I'm not I'm like, try to focus on eating, putting healthy things into my body, but not like being crazy and like, you know, being focused on that either because that's not healthy, just a happy medium. I just need a happy like I had. For instance. For instance, let me give you a for instance. So last night after my two hours of therapy with my therapist, who I love, I did get my petty cash nachos that I love.

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I, I put I picked them up and I ate those nachos. What I did not have is the three margaritas that I normally have with the nachos. And let me tell you something. I slept better. I feel fine today. I don't feel like gross and like, oh, really did it last night, you know, like I feel fine. I'm happy medo I think, I think that's kind of like that was my happy, that's my happy medium.

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I'm not giving up all of the things but I'm just trying to be more aware, I'm trying to be more in tune so I'm doing my best. Chinchorro you're continuing to do your best with baking and there's another exciting thing you have to say.

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I mean I am. Yeah. I mean I think you should, it's, I'm really proud of you. I, I, I was about. Yeah but yeah. I got a job writing for Amber Ruffins new show which is so exciting because he gave me some beautiful flowers. You can't see them but they're behind me and a bottle of whiskey that I will be drinking and it was so cool. It's really exciting. She's like my fun black. Oh.

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So it's like super fun. I also am doing my best at I have here now if anybody knows me from the last seven years when Busy met me, my head was shaved and then I shaved it and it was blonde and shaved. And this is the first time I've ever like I've had like more than like a half an inch of hair in the last like seven years. So I'm doing my best at being able to do my own hair. Now, I know that that is a big thing, too, for like a lot of ladies growing their hair out right now.

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But like, I had to buy products. I had to I had to buy brushes. I had that many brushes. I didn't have no hair. I have a teeny weeny afro is what the black folks call it. But yeah, I'm doing my best at like, oh, this is the thing also, like, I cut my hair and then I thought it was just for me. But now that I've gone to therapy like a part of it was like the piss off my mom, you know, because she'd be like, is it going to grow back?

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And I'd be like, never. But now me and my mom's relationship is way better. I can grow my hair.

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Oh, my God, my hair. Like a metaphor for your fish and chip. Like the the amount of hair you have is the amount of goodness in your relationship. Truly, I feel like everybody can relate to that.

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I swear all I feel like all women have a lot of stuff tied to their hair and it like really signifies a lot to women and maybe men too. I don't know though about that as much, but I do know that like at times in my life, like cutting, chopping my hair off, dyeing my hair, like cutting bangs, never a good idea, you know, bangs and crisis guys. Do you do. Do not do. Bernie was going to shave her head during during the shutdown, the lockdown and stuff, and I was just like, well, if you if we get out of this situation and you want to shave your head, I am all for it.

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But this is a decision that you are making in crisis. Yeah, I feel like in twenty four hours you are not going to be OK with that.

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I think growing your hair out during crisis has been way more efficient than cutting my hair during crisis. So I also like theories, especially like I have a friend who had locks for a long time that like you hold a lot of energy in your hair. And so, like, sometimes when you're moving into new phases of your life, you either like you cut it or throw it out on the growing stage as a little as a little girl.

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My grandmother had hair. Her hair grew all the way down to, like, hurt her little ankle boots.

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She had she had horse girl. She's a she's a crook. Yeah.

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And they and they would braid it and put it all up and buns. And she was really sickly. And the doctor back in the 1990s or whatever was like all her strength is going into her hair. You have to allow her to cut it because her parents, like, loved her long, beautiful hair that they would then pin up. So, yeah. So she got like a little short Bob, but she's still still a little. Nope. She she's like fine.

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I think it probably had more to do with the fact that her hair probably weighed more than she did. And it hurts to have your scalp tugged on. Also, by the way, cricket just I just want to say, because cricket does have that long hair that we braid, but she that is her that is her choice. She wants to keep that hair. I have asked her if she would like to cut it any time she wants to cut it.

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It is I am here with the scissors and she doesn't want to cut it. She loves it. She said, what are you doing your best?

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I know I've been struggling a little bit this week, just not because of everything in the world alone. That would be enough. But just like so many of my friends got amazing news this week and I'm so happy for them and proud of them and, you know, but then I do that dumb thing where I compare myself to them and that starts to make me spiral a little bit. Yeah. And I love my friends and I love when my friends are super successful at things.

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And I never, never want them to be modest about that. I want them to brag and I want to brag about them. Yeah, but I have to learn how to stop doing that thing where I'm like, well what, what's happening with me? Like what am I doing wrong? So I've been trying to like channel that energy into home decor DIY project. That will probably be a disaster. Let me know if you help. I got a I got a new drill a month ago.

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Oh, I love a drill. Yeah, I'm just I'm trying to do two projects at one time. It'll probably come out to be the equivalent of like when your grandma would knit like a half. Barbie, you have crochet toilet paper holder to give you for a gift. When you were a kid. Did you guys have that?

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No, my grandma was really good at those things. Like she made an entire set of Winnie the Pooh dolls, her, me and one for my sister. Very cute. And she, like, made all these doll clothes for my Cabbage Patch kids that were like beautifully sewn and stuff. Like I was like a real mout was a real special grandma that in that way she was also like both of my grandmothers were really talented at that stuff too.

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It just was sometimes the choices like my my half Barbie have toilet paper doll was beautifully done. It just wouldn't it was like Barbie like coming out of the top, the process and then like the toilet paper was like her skirt. That's like one of those cakes I've made those cakes. Yes, yes. No, no, I never got that. Although my aunt who was like my godmother who passed away like last fall, Dorothy, she made me she showed me a four legged duck.

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So you and I know. But then and my dad I remember there was like this whole conversation with her when my dad was like, why did you give why? Why does the duck have four feet? And she's like, I thought that they did. I know what you're talking about. And she got so upset and she took it back. And then it became like this was like I mean, I think it was like the early 80s when this happened.

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I don't even remember the four legged duck. And then she took it back. But over the years, it like it transitioned into this, like, funny joke. She could like she could joke about it. And then she made me one like ten years ago. I got like so I have a crocheted four legged duck, which is really funny. Well, guys, she was just doing her best. I mean, she really was. She really was.

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And like, we we all we all are, you know, like sometimes you think a duck has four legs.

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So I mean, you know about my flounces thing, right. Do I need to say this again? What does? You don't know this. No, but I thought, OK, you know, like when you're measuring and cooking and it says F.L. ounces of fluid ounces. Mm hmm. I thought it stood for something called floor ounces, which was a unit of measurement used for liquid that I completely made up until literally like a year into my marriage with Mark.

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And we were cooking something in the kitchen and he's like, how much do I need? And I was like, I think they said eight, four ounces. And he's like, I'm sorry. What I meant was like four ounces is like water for like for, you know, four ounces are like the unit of measurement. Well, it stands for floor and he's like it most certainly does for that's worth thirty two years old. How long how many people have you said four ounces to I mean, for whatever reason it was stuck in my head.

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I also had like I had a few things like that, like I thought, oh, my aunt who passed away for some reason I conflated a story that I heard when I was little about her and I thought she was adopted. And I found that out like in my twenties. I asked my mom, like, so when Dorothy was adopted like that, it added up. My mom was like, what are you talking about? Your dad has two sisters.

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They're both his sisters. And for some reason, I had heard a story as a kid and I just like, I don't know, just made this thing up and lived with that. Do you have anything like that where you when I was little, I thought I had a twin sister that passed away.

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So I mean, because I found my baby book and it had a different name than my name we fill out.

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We need to talk about that. It's such a long story. But the upshot is that like my mom intended to name me one thing, what was that? And then Cassandra, which I didn't I wasn't even familiar with that name weight. I was this I think I know I know the story. And then officially on my birth certificate, maybe because my mom was like unconscious because it was the 70s. I was named a nickname KC, and that was like just what they officially went with since it was on my birth certificate legal.

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So then when I found my baby book, when I was like seven or something in the attic and it was filled out for Cassandra, and I was like, oh shit, I had a twin sister that died. And so I remember like being sick to my stomach. Oh, getting up my courage all day, I was like, I have to bring this up to my parents. And they like weirdly like took me bowling because it was summer that evening.

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And then so I remember at the little like bowling score table, I just blurted out and my parents were like, what the fuck are you talking about? Like, God, I do not have them there. There's nothing I don't have anything like that. I love that. Well, guys, if Florence's resonates with you, let me know. I still think I still believe it could be a unit of measurement. It probably in this week was definitely tricky and full of things, sadness.

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And it was not easy for everyone. However, I do we just have to acknowledge one person in the news and the media who really was doing her best, their best together. Niecy Nash got married and oh, to singer Jessica Batts. And the pictures are beautiful. And they look so happy about the I took it to the group, just I took the group chat. Our group chat was on fire about Niecy Nash yesterday about anything that Niecy Nash is so talented, so hot, the coolest black loved her forever.

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Black ever film Gay Out America. Twenty twenty. Come get it then. Then the thing about it is nobody knew my gaydar is good. I'd be like she gay. I did not know. Nobody knew the time line black twitter the group chat. We were all pleasantly surprised. Love to see it. That's all I know. I feel like.

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I feel like universally everyone when that maybe. And also when did they get married. It didn't. It seems like it wasn't, it wasn't like I feel like it like a while ago. Yeah. OK, man, I think it was a while ago. Here's the power in it. OK, like yes. What I said the power in it is that she used to be married to some dudes and she said fuck that and got a hot young queer woman who plays guitar.

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And guess what, if you're over 40 and you do not like any of the men that you're with, please stay a hot young woman who plays guitar because it's fucking cool. Man. I was like, that is cool. I did. I went to Jessica Beth's Instagram because, you know, you got to do a deep dive. Yeah. And she had like a million videos of her playing guitar. And it's like, I don't care who you are.

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Somebody playing guitar cool. It's not just for weird 20 year old boys at a campfire, OK, it's for hot black, but let's go get you up all day. It was awesome. That's all.

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Like, I'm very I feel like I feel like they got married a while ago. That was the sense that I got from the comments on the Instagram post. People kept saying, like, oh, I've been waiting for you to announce and you'd like to be a part of a different person. And you, VirnetX, she was there.

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I feel like Niecy held it until a moment when we needed it. And then she gave it totally agree with you. Yeah, I was like, we all needed that left. And when you sent me that, I was like Shinjiro. I was just like, yes, this is one hundred percent what I want to see right now. I needed something that was turning their joy, who are who are sharing their love with the world. And just it felt so lifting and nice.

[00:32:33]

It was just like something. I just wanted to look at pictures again because I was like I was excited. And it's not the main story still, which I don't understand why not by. But there was a story. Meet the new celebrity couples of twenty twenty. But and so I did click on that. And just real quick, I know we hadn't planned on that. Then we really need to get to our guest because she's amazing. But guys, did you know Trevor Noah and Minka Kelly are dating?

[00:32:56]

I just saw that yesterday. You know that. Did you know that Tiffany Haddish and Common are going out?

[00:33:02]

Yes, I did know that. That's black news. I love her. But I mean, I know both of them. I didn't know that Commins always been really quiet about who they used to date. Laura Dern. Mm. Oh, I knew that. Yeah. But that was like a low key thing, like people be like I remember that they like break up and then you'll be like Common was dating who. So he keeps his, he keeps his shit close to the chest.

[00:33:25]

I mean like I fucking don't comment.

[00:33:27]

I don't know, I don't know, I do not know a ton of people on this list. And Brian Austin Green apparently is dating someone named Tina Louise. I don't know who that is. And from Gilligan's Island. No, Tina Louise is not from Gilligan's Island. She's apparently a model. OK, well, that's that's good. And there's some kids from outer the show, Outer Banks that are dating each other, which I could just tell you from my personal experience, not a great move.

[00:33:56]

Kids in the outer banks, you don't know how long that show is going to go on for my friends. And you might be stuck in South Carolina with your ex boyfriend.

[00:34:11]

That's like improv. I used to do improv and like, everybody would just be like fucking improvisers. And then they put you on a team together and then you'd just be like on a team doing improv for free every Thursday night at 10:00 with your ex.

[00:34:25]

I don't we don't it's not something that it's like it's so difficult because like on the one hand, I fully understand dating the people that you're communing with in a creative way.

[00:34:35]

Yeah. Like like any time movie stars fall in love with each other while they're filming a movie, like, I'm like, yeah, I got it. Because you're seeing the person at their best, you know, they're like good at their job. They could show up and they're sexy. And so, like, sometimes you just kick other. Yes. And then you kiss them. Well, and by the way, there's money. You have to kiss them on screen.

[00:34:56]

And then it's like, well, where is the line? Who really were in our trailer rehearsing the scene, obviously. But I just feel like people don't ever taken on TV shows. It's such a monumentally bad idea because you can be on a television show for like seven years. Oh, my gosh.

[00:35:16]

You know what? If you're lucky. Yeah, God willing. But then you're trapped, you know, trapped again. I don't know who these people are.

[00:35:23]

You know who you know who we do know. We know today's guest producer, we really do. I would love to. So, guys, let's talk about Pivot's. This is, you know, the guest that we have will have varying degrees of Pivot's. I would say some are greater than others. For instance, you may look at my pivot and say, Busi, where's the pivot? You're essentially doing the exact same shit you've been doing for years.

[00:35:53]

You would be correct. It feels different. I will say, but you're probably right. Our guest today who we got to talk chat with last week, Michelle Kwan, has had a real pivot. You may know Michelle Kwan, as we did as a very celebrated and decorated and medalled ice skater figure skater. If you're like me and you love watching those figure skating Olympics, then you know her well. I would assume you know her very well.

[00:36:24]

She made a pivot, though, and she works in politics. I don't think a lot of people know that. Or maybe they do. I'm not sure. But we talked to her about all of that and and what she's been up to and what she's doing now, and it was informative and interesting and take a listen.

[00:36:46]

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[00:39:59]

Michelle Kawahata one, why do people say your whole name, your first name, last name, right. Does everybody say yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I've never obviously I've never met you before, Michelle Kwan. But what I saw you I was like, I have to say the whole name. It just feels apropos.

[00:40:19]

So I hope that's OK because I just turned 40 and I had a little freak out moment.

[00:40:26]

Well, tell me tell me, what was your freakout? Well, I have already one now. What about it? OK, I don't know what it what it is, but I think it was more the idea of when I was a kid thinking my parents like, you know, at a certain age, remember. And then your parents turned 40. Yeah.

[00:40:45]

Yeah. And I just I, I don't know. This time around, I maybe it was just everything that we're going through and everything that's happening in the world. And you're like, I turned 40, everything flies by and you just not that I don't ever for one moment take anything for granted. But I it just made me think even even more so like how I still appreciate everything, like being able to hang out with my family and my parents, you know, we're healthy.

[00:41:15]

And yeah, I do feel machol like because Casey is a little bit older, Shinta is a little bit younger.

[00:41:21]

I turned 40 a year ago and I do feel like there's something to it. Even if you're not a person that's caught up in like, I don't know, like, as, you know, like a patriarchal idea of what getting older as a woman means. There's something where it is a milestone year, like my parents are getting older, my husband's parents are getting older.

[00:41:43]

I yeah. And I think and it's like in your head, your parents are 40. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. In my head my parents are thirty two.

[00:41:56]

I think it's the moment where, you know, you just really realize like life, oh this is a downer but life is finite, you know. And, and that you're like you, you're maybe hopefully not but getting close to halfway there and you know.

[00:42:11]

Oh I have a hard time thinking of that. Michelle. Well, that is kind of a pivot. Turning 40 is like a moment where you kind of take stock of everything, but when you're someone like you, who you are.

[00:42:25]

So you are so incredibly successful as a figure skater and an Olympian. And now you've gone on you've had like a career pivot and you're incredibly successful in your career pivot, which we're going to talk about when you when when you get to forty. I would imagine that. Yeah, it's not a lot of thoughts of. Of missed opportunities or things you would have done differently career wise, but it's more just that, like time is flying or that's a fully loaded question, starting off with, like turning 40 where I'm, like, freaking out.

[00:43:01]

It's only one age that I totally have and I just couldn't get over it. And it was a bit emotional knowing that life is finite and we're all getting older, parents are getting older and my dog is getting older. But it is a time of reflection. Looking back at the fun things that I have been able to be a part of going to the Olympic Games, representing the country, which was such an honor, having traveled extensively as a diplomat, as a public diplomacy envoy on behalf of the Department of State and the half the country having the opportunity to work for Secretary Clinton on her presidential campaign as well.

[00:43:40]

And then where I am now, but at the same time. I'm it makes me really think about decisions going forward. I've always lived with the notion of no regrets, so I don't look at any of the decisions I made. Some were kind of not as good as other choices I could have made. I think I think now I kind of way weigh things differently than I did when I was a kid, which was like a little bit more like free, free styling, if you will, almost like figure skating, free styling and not choreographed and not going with it.

[00:44:14]

Now I'm like. Life is short. Would I be happier doing that or that, and that's how I kind of way things based on happiness, is that recent or is that I think it's more recent.

[00:44:27]

I mean, I've always been the I've always contemplated I'm always a worrier. I'm always like and like I analyze things to the utmost to to a fault. And it's it's it's a good thing and a bad thing as well. But I think it's a good thing when I'm weighing my happiness, my family time, my things that I really, really deeply cherish. There are things that I still really want to push for that I know will take up a lot of my energy and will cause a lot of heartache, but still worth it at the end.

[00:45:00]

Those are things that I still will pursue and continue and that I think has to go with passion to live your life with passion.

[00:45:08]

I agree with that wholeheartedly. But I do feel I wonder if that I feel like a lot of people right now, given the pandemic and what we've seen and experienced in the last six months, I would say globally, if that is part and turning 40, I mean, that's a lot.

[00:45:26]

You know, that's the current fire of the administration.

[00:45:31]

Everything that has sort of transpired since George Floyds murder, like if all of these things are adding up to a lot of people making that choice and thinking I'm only going to be motivated by X, whatever X is. And for you, it's like happiness.

[00:45:50]

I think it is everything you just said. And I think there's so much to think about these days now that we're home, you know, in our respective homes, I haven't had an opportunity to hang out with my family too much, very, very careful and social distancing. And if anything, it's outdoors and everybody's wearing a mask and it's just not being able to embrace your your loved ones and your friends and not seeing them. And also my colleagues that I'm working with.

[00:46:22]

It's hard.

[00:46:23]

I want to ask about that. Yeah. The little bit about your job now. Yeah.

[00:46:28]

So it's always been my passion to me, not politics, but like, follow your passion. That's that's what my I'm motivated by. And after having worked in twenty sixteen presidential campaign supporting Hillary Clinton, I actually never anticipate getting into politics, by the way.

[00:46:49]

So let's talk about that pivot real fast before we get into even the current state of things like where do I go? So you figure skating and things are going great and doing pretty good. Pretty are doing you are doing your figure skating. Turns out you're the best at figures. Just straight up, eight consecutive U.S. titles, twelve consecutive medals, the only woman in figure skating history to reclaim the world title three times. I mean, pretty impressive. Two Olympic medals, obviously.

[00:47:26]

I mean, I used to I used them.

[00:47:29]

They were actually all in in a suitcase. And if you look around my house, you don't see anything skating related. So I think I just kept it all in one area where it was like the trophies and the silver platters and all the medals went into a suitcase. But now they're just neatly at the ice rink that my family we have a business. So it's the ice rink right now.

[00:47:56]

Do you did you go to college while you were skating or or did you after a game.

[00:48:05]

You know, at 17, I went to I went to compete at the Olympics the following year, I went to school 19 at UCLA. I took about one full quarter of classes. I think it was 12 units. And then and then I was still competing at the same level. Right. Competing at the Internet. How hard? Yeah, almost impossible. And I kind of I, I said, you know what, I'm I might be breaking off too much.

[00:48:37]

I can't there's more that I can't focus on everything. So I ended up doing less courses and then being able to trade the same time, which was great because I had this balance between training really intensely, but also getting to escape into schoolwork, which sounds very funny, but it was nice to have that distraction when I was competing because oftentimes when an athlete, there's so much pressure that it almost alleviates it when you have something else going on in your life.

[00:49:11]

So that was a nice little balance. But then at that time, I felt like I was on a ten year track of graduating college, which is not tenure.

[00:49:20]

It's ten years before the ten year plan. Yeah, no. Then I ended up not really completing my education until much older when I finished skating and you can be six and then I focused on it. And strangely enough, I my my focus was political science and international relations. And it's good that my degree is going to good use.

[00:49:49]

Yeah, that's interesting. Why were you drawn to that in why were you drawn to that when you when you decided to like, go finish your college degree?

[00:49:58]

Well, when I first enrolled, when I was going to UCLA, it was psychology. And then I think my focus towards the psycho psycho bio and then like all students, we don't really know.

[00:50:11]

It's so weird that at 19 you choose or at 18 you choose what your major is going to be.

[00:50:18]

It's so what your life, what your life, what the trajectory of your life is. You know, it's very strange.

[00:50:24]

Yeah. I mean, that's why I love this concept, because life is full of pivot's. Yeah. I always knew that this pivot was always going to be the hardest the one from the sport I loved and was passionate about and never had a question. What I wanted to do, I wanted to be an Olympian. I wanted to win the next competition. I wanted to do. It was always like a goal in sight. And when I finished, I think it's similar to a lot of the professional athletes you saw.

[00:50:53]

I haven't seen it yet, but I can't wait to see it when I have. Time is the documentary that Michael Phelps and other athletes were part of. I saw it.

[00:51:00]

I've been watching a lot of documentaries during my time and it's so interesting. All the things that I'm learning that I need to unlearn I think is very powerful. I was like, oh, this is just about what is like to be an Olympian. And it's like, oh no. It's about the livelihood and the life of Olympians and people, not just athletes. And it's like that is a man who works at a tire store to support his Olympic dreams.

[00:51:28]

And it's like, what are we doing to support them mentally? And I was like, oh, I had to unlearn seeing Olympians as just people who play sports every four years. It's really great. But that that misconception works in the arts as well. And, you know, like especially musicians. I know. So I'm friends with so many musicians who, you know, are teachers and and house paint and house painters and have other and chiropractors and have other ways of making money because it is so rare that you're able to that it's like sustainable in that.

[00:52:10]

Same with you authors and authors to people I think like, oh, you have a book, you must be a millionaire. And I'm like, no, most people get like five thousand dollars or or you get an amount of money. But then it's like that's done and you know, and it's over. Yeah. So so you knew you wanted to go to school and having that break gave you the chance to when you came back, your major was political science.

[00:52:36]

You're like this is international studies that influenced by honestly traveling the world. No, I mean, you traveled the world as an ice skater. You did the Olympics. You met international people. Yeah, exactly.

[00:52:51]

Well, at the same time, I was appointed as an envoy and I was like I there was this sort of opportunity to meet people in the space of diplomacy. Arts and medication and sports and like, good when I just landed. Yeah, exactly, and I found that very fascinating. And I felt like just like the documentary. And I'm I have enough friends in the Olympics and professional sports that the transition transition is very difficult. And it's it's difficult in many in many ways when you it's about identity.

[00:53:29]

When you're an athlete, you're like, I am an Olympic figure skater. And it kind of sometimes overshadows you, sometimes pigeonhole to stereotype, you name it, and you try to go into other exploring other means. It's often very, very difficult because you have that either that opportunity to meet somebody and they just can't get past like your. Identity as a figure skater and right, and that's all they see, but you're like, well, I'm interested in this and this and this and they're still talking about sports.

[00:54:04]

And you're like, wait a minute, like or like if you're applying for a job, you might get the interview. But that's because they might be interested in talking to you as you what you what value and what what you can bring to the table. So I think going back to school was such an opportunity for me to learn and and really get lost and make mistakes. And like everyone else, you're you're getting an education to provide have the tools to be able to succeed.

[00:54:32]

Just skating where you're training and you're learning and you're learning jumps and spins and you put it all together. I think in getting my master's degree was also another where I was surrounded by people who were so bright and brilliant and working. They were 50 percent international students where I went at the Fletcher School at Tufts. And so I learned from my classmates and had these amazing conversations. And I don't know how I ended up pivoting, but it seemed like a seamless pivot in some regards, but it was a lot of getting lost as well.

[00:55:06]

I'm so interested in what you said about being able to make mistakes, because obviously in your prior life as a skater, a mistake is is deaf, can give you everything and the world is watching.

[00:55:19]

And if you make a mistake like that becomes so tied to who you are as as an athlete. So was that hard to get used to, like just being able to lean into mistakes and handle them? No, I think I always lean into mistakes, that's a one thing sports has taught me is like when you fall, sometimes it hurts and sometimes it's not embarrassing. You're in front of millions of people. There's a lot riding on the line. And you fall and you just get up and you're like, you know, hundreds of hours went into that fall by my bed, you know?

[00:55:56]

And those are the times when I actually get the moments, the best moments where I learn. And, you know, when you go to a job interview, I think one of the first of the ten questions they ask you is like, what's the biggest thing that you've had to overcome in sports? Made me tougher and stronger and and better. And I think one thing that I learned the hard way is how when you say, what would you tell your 18 year old self or you tell your 10 year old self, I finished skating and I went into pursuing my education.

[00:56:36]

I felt like this lost little girl and I felt like. Almost like everything was stripped away and I removed all the identity of being a skater, I removed everything and I started like blank slate and then realized, wait a minute, I'm not starting with a blank slate. I know how to work hard. I know how to make mistakes, learn from it. I know how to like I know how to do all of that and put my mind to it.

[00:57:00]

No, like, focus, focus, focus. I did that for twenty five years of my life. I could do the same and I'm not probably at the same par with everyone else, but I, I know what it takes. So I think in hindsight I wasn't coming at it older, know twenty six pursuing my degree, but I was coming in with like this newfound kind of like oh I hunger to learn and, and passion to be better and to be lost and be OK with being lost.

[00:57:38]

I actually have always sort of thought the college should not start right after high school. I think that like there should be I mean, if I'm if I'm being honest, I do think that there should be that, like in a perfect world of this country as we, like, look forward, because I think we have a lot to rebuild and rethink as we move into the future.

[00:58:00]

If people are open and willing to make that decision, as opposed to living in a fear based way, which is, I think, how we've been living for the last bit of time, I think that it would be really wonderful if there were like at least two years post college where kids went into a public service avenue, like they work at a shelter, they clean up whatever, you know what I mean? Because and get you get paid, obviously.

[00:58:32]

Right. Or your fucking college or your college is paid for. I don't know, guys, this isn't I'm not I don't have the policy made yet, Michel, is what I'm saying to you. The bill is not ambulating at the moment.

[00:58:43]

But I mean, I just think that there's so much value in those years in your early twenty years of making mistakes, messing up, figuring out who you are, figuring out what your values are, and then going back into school and being able to be excited about learning and like getting excited about the possibility of what your future is as opposed to just.

[00:59:08]

Wrote, Going into college after high school, like, this is what I do now, I go to college and, you know.

[00:59:15]

Yeah, anyone. Yeah, I think there's a lot to it, I think in the war and learning what you want first. And I think if I could tell myself, it's like make sure that you're exposing yourself to sort of all these ideas and you're surrounded by such an abundance of information like 18 year old right now at the fingertips, you can learn anything.

[00:59:41]

It's really interesting. And you have this whole you have this whole experience of you. You mentioned like you sort of fell behind when you went to college eventually as an older person. But really, you were kind of ahead because you had been like living life sort of in this non-traditional way and having these experiences.

[00:59:58]

And so you were doing the work in the envoys as Michelle Kwan, figure skater. Right. You know, cultural, you know, going into, you know, getting this experience. And so then post college and post your your graduate program. Was that when you were like, I think I can really go and work for this campaign, or was it just Hillary? Like, what did you what was the what was the light bulb moment for you?

[01:00:28]

Well, when I went back to school, so. Twenty six and then I ended up getting going and pursuing my master's degree. So that was another two years. And then after that I ended up working at the Department of State. So that's when. Oh that was Secretary. Yeah, it was Secretary Kerry. Clinton and then Kerry and. And then that was. Yeah. When a lot of my colleagues from the Department of State ended up moving to New York where the Hillary Hillary Clinton headquarters in Brooklyn was based.

[01:01:04]

And I said, well, her personal office is getting a rather large. And they said, well, you should just move to Brooklyn. And I said, are you sure? Move to Brooklyn? And and sure enough, I enjoy the campaign before her official announcement, which was very exciting and exciting to be a part of. But, yeah, it just sort of segued into where I am now, which, again, I didn't think that I would be here on another presidential campaign because, as you know, busy, it's like they're very, very young, usually early twenties.

[01:01:38]

The amount of emails is it's nonstop. And normally on a traditional campaign, you're traveling extensively, too. So it's it's a long hours. It's a lot of time, but it's so worth it.

[01:01:53]

So explain to people at home what it was that you did for the Clinton campaign and and now what you're doing for the Biden Harris ticket.

[01:02:04]

Well, in twenty sixteen, my job was the surrogate outreach coordinator. So essentially working with folks that are interested in getting involved in the campaign trail. Right now, I am the director of surrogates for the Biden Harris campaign. I've been on the campaign trail since day one was there when Vice President Biden made his announcement, which was really exciting. And what it means is like if you see folks that have endorsed Vice President Biden or Kamala Harris the ticket, then they're validators on television or radio.

[01:02:42]

Normally, we would have surrogates travel throughout the country to battleground states helping with organizing events. We're traveling, of course, virtually all over the country. And then we have building the biggest and broadest coalition of surrogates involved, which is reaching our African-American, our Latino, Asian-American Pacific Islander Women's LGBT coalition and just making sure that they're plugged in throughout the campaign, whether it's finance events, digital, social, Colligan Virtual Zoome. We have these calls all day.

[01:03:19]

Every day.

[01:03:20]

Yeah, till the end. Just to give you a little bit of background at home, I was asked and participated as a surrogate for Hillary Clinton. I know before I even did it, I was like, What are you talking about? So basically what I did was I had a speech that I put together like a stump speech that the Clinton campaign helped me with some of the points that they really wanted to make sure were hit. And I would go to certain events where Hillary Clinton herself couldn't be and I would speak at it.

[01:03:58]

So, for instance, I went to a couple of things here in California, in Orange County, and gave some speeches. And I went to very small towns and it was like a really I felt like I was I felt like I was in an indie movie the whole time because I, I flew into this. I think I went to Des Moines is where I started. I think I went to Des Moines. And then I went to like some small towns and we would show up to at the different campaign offices in the smaller towns and like bring pizza.

[01:04:35]

And I would do like an interview with the local news station. And I would talk to the volunteers that had assembled for phone banking and thank them for showing up and volunteering and encourage them to keep showing up and volunteering and like. So any time, any time you see any sort of like event for a candidate on on whatever level, truly. And it's like hosted by come see Sophia Bush talk with this person about, you know, Senator Herries, the.

[01:05:11]

But Senator Harris isn't going to be there. That is a surrogate. She is a surrogate acting for the campaign. And and trying to help get the word out, we have something called a Hollywood break where we break down things in the industry and I don't know if this is like a policy break or we just call this politics or Michelle Kwan break because, you know, but I think it's so interesting. Every day I'm learning more and more about what is happening policy wise or like what a surrogate is.

[01:05:42]

And it's like, oh, like that is something that I didn't know what that was called. But I'm like, I'm glad Michelle Kwan's in charge of it and you know what I mean? And I think that that is like a policy break in this in this moment where people get to learn, like everything that you see is like not by accident. Everything that's happening is very purposeful. And people are moving with purpose for this, moving with purpose for this campaign, moving with purpose for like the change that we want to see in America.

[01:06:12]

I love what you said, though, like move with purpose. And I find myself on the campaign trail thinking of that. And I think of my parents actually a lot when I'm campaigning, especially how they immigrated to the United States with nothing. And this idea of the American dream, the idea that if you work hard, play by the rules, that your dreams can come true and your little daughter or your baby girl can figure, skate and dream of being anything you want.

[01:06:40]

I think when you look at Senator Kamala Harris and what value she adds first, she's just this I mean, dynamic duo between Biden and Harris. I mean, it's an incredible take it from day one. They know what to do. I think what the surrogates and in terms of the campaigns is like busy when you were campaigning, it's it's you it's your personal connection to why you supported Hillary Clinton. And I think it's the same this time around, is that many people who have, you know, are on television talking about why they support Joe Biden.

[01:07:14]

And you talk you talk to former presidential candidates who are competing against Vice President Biden. They they have endorsed the VP and said, you know, as a colleague, I know that he can do it. I know he's capable. I've worked with him. I know he's a decent human being. I know that he has the best interests for the soul of the United States and unifying our country. And so what we're trying to do is really galvanizing support and making sure people are informed and having these policy policy breaks.

[01:07:46]

Right?

[01:07:47]

Yeah, yeah. Policy break. I think that's right. I found that whole thing really moving about. All the former candidates just coming out for Joe Biden and speaking up. It's kind of like the Olympics. You train your whole life for this thing. They're going to run for president. And then that's going to be kind of crushing when you realize, like it's not going to work this time and you have to make the decision to drop out. So to see everybody turn on a dime and be like, yeah, I dropped out.

[01:08:12]

But guess what, I'm not crying about it. But we have work to do. We have work to do. Yeah, I've got work to do.

[01:08:18]

And I think there is something interesting. I'm I'm I'm in a place right now of of both deep despair and incredible hopefulness. Yeah.

[01:08:29]

It's to do I don't I mean we discussed the duality that like the totality of it all of what, 20, 20 really is, which is like sadness and despair and like, oh my God, what if this continues and then the hopefulness of like but I know I'm not stopping even though I'm tired and my throat hurts and like, I haven't felt well for months. And I know that that's definitely psychologically linked to everything that's going on in the world because I've had seventeen hundred covid tests.

[01:09:02]

But like that, the hopefulness that like I know I'm not stopping. I know that the people around me aren't stopping. Even my friends who stopped last time because they were mad that their candidate didn't get in. And I did have those friends and we had a lot of uncomfortable dinner parties. But I know they're not stopping now. And I really feel like there is this sea change happening. And the one thing that I will say personally, because I'm just perfectly honestly, Biden was not my number one pick right initially.

[01:09:40]

But he's he's always like he's a professional and he's, you know. I feel like in this moment, the deal is all the people who showed up on this idea and voted for the other person, the current person with this idea that like. We should just have, like, some regular guy that's like me, you know, like he he should do it, like we should have this business, this regular guy in there. I actually think right now we have so many things to fix.

[01:10:10]

We need professional people who have who have it done it for them, have dedicated their entire lives, who are also racist.

[01:10:25]

That what it's exciting is seeing everybody unify as a party, seeing from day one, when you saw the debates, it was like 12 people on stage. Maybe Vice President Biden wasn't your first pick, but the way in which everybody sort of came together knowing what's at stake.

[01:10:50]

Yeah, I mean, for me, Michel, honestly, I'm just like because why not be honest? For me, it was just like. Another white dude like, you know. Yeah, you know what I mean? I just I really I really fucking oh, no, I'm going to cry.

[01:11:04]

I really I really want to I really want to see a woman in the White House and like my daughter, who's seven, I was reading her Comilla and Maya's big idea. It's her new favorite book by Mina Harris by Commonness, you know. Yeah, yeah. As amazing. And I posted the book on my Instagram guys. But it's a great book for your kids, even if you are not a Democrat. But if you're not a Democrat, I don't understand why you're listening to this podcast.

[01:11:39]

So I was reading it to cricket the night that it was announced that she was the VP pick and I was like cricket. You know, it's so exciting. I'm so excited to get to tell you that Comilla was just picked to be the vice president candidate with Joe Biden. And it's the first time that a woman of color has gotten a nomination from a major party in this in this way. And she was like, oh, this Comilla. And she's like, yeah.

[01:12:10]

Oh, cool.

[01:12:12]

And then there was a B and I like, you can't make this shit up with kids. And sometimes people accuse you of making shit up with kids. They're like, that's just your political agenda. But I swear to God, she was like thoughtful for a second. And then she was like, I guess like before I was alive, there was a woman president, but I don't know who that was. Who was that? And I was like, oh, cricket.

[01:12:36]

Oh, honey, no, there is actually it's only been it's only been, man. And her face, like, fell and she was like. That doesn't. That's weird, and I was like, it is weird. That's right, that's exactly that's exactly the word saying it right now.

[01:12:57]

Like there's never been a female president ever in our history.

[01:13:04]

So anyway, so that's my that was my. And I know Casey feels very similar. Well, we all have an agenda, you know, and that's that's one of the reasons why I feel pretty. I actually felt pretty good about how everything went, because I just feel like we're not just electing one person to one office. We're electing a person that will give. Give value to this idea that we need to put an exceptional team in place to do the work, so for me, it's really not.

[01:13:36]

That's why I found it so moving when everybody turned and endorsed Biden, when it became apparent that they couldn't couldn't stay in the race is because everybody was like, yeah, I'm going to hold on to my dream. Or like a lot of those people were saying goodbye to their dream probably and saying, like, this is much more important. This is much more than about one person. And so I was really I was really excited when he announced Kamala was going to be his running mate, because that means a lot to me.

[01:14:05]

And, you know, it's something it really it really is something. I mean, as a black woman in America, OUP, I'd say, well, I'm I'm really excited about Kamala. I'm excited about Joe Biden, too, because I am excited for someone to see the humanity in me, which I think I have been viscerally. I'm probably going to cry missing, missing since I watched becoming with Michelle Obama. And it's like, oh, like if I met her, she cared about me.

[01:14:43]

And I think that so many people in America right now doesn't matter what race you are, but like black, white, queer, they them. I think we're all looking for someone who's in charge of this country to see the humanity in the people who live here, who work here, who have the dream here, who are doing the work here. And I think that's the thing that's exciting to me. Like Carmela was my first pick for president because I'm Bednall Black Baby.

[01:15:14]

But I, I will say that I am excited for people coming together knowing that we are trying to make this a country where humanity is at the forefront. And I think that everybody's coming together being like we're all people. Right. We should definitely be fucking trying to help each other. Just even Jacob's sister, who spoke at that press conference when she was like, when you say when you talk about him, you know, use these words like father, cousin, brother, but most importantly, human.

[01:15:54]

Yeah. Tell me what tell me what we're doing. Tell me what every single person who's listening right now is doing. Because I can I am worried about two things. I'm worried about fatigue, uh, people feeling overwhelmed and exhausted and like, I just can't like what's the point? They're closing the post office is what the fucking point. They're going to steal it anyway. What's the fuck? You know, like, I'm exhausted. I worry about exhaustion and I worry about people thinking that it's in the bag.

[01:16:24]

So what do we do? How can we pivot to help? Yeah. Do you want to pivot to help you or. Yes, I want to pivot. Well, well, let's say yeah, I think the fatigue is real. I think everyone's just so exhausted and inundated with everything that's in the news. We have to be informed. We have to make sure, like if it's your Maylin, it's it's easy. Just make sure that you do it.

[01:16:50]

If you can vote early, do it if you can just get stay informed. If you want information from the campaign, go to the website. I also I like telling people to go to I will vote Dotcom as well because every state is a little bit different. Voting is different and some earlier, some more later. Some of the. So just stay in form. Do not do not be exhausted. Sixty eight days and stay involved. Sixty days.

[01:17:19]

It's not that long. It's really not that long guys. When you consider that we've been in quarantine now. Four hundred and eighty billion days.

[01:17:28]

Lessors for sixty eight days. Not too long. I went into labor with Berdy for sixty eight days now.

[01:17:35]

But if I'm happy right now with what we've got in the White House, make sure that you use your voice. People fought hard to make sure that you're able to vote. Everyone just do your part. Just be a part of us. Yeah.

[01:17:53]

Give us a little advice about what is the most effective way that just a girl in her house who has a little time on her hands thanks to the the pandemic. How can she pitch in at this point with with, you know, less than 70 days left?

[01:18:10]

Well, there's plenty of things to do. I always first say if you have a cell phone handy text vote, vote E two three zero three three zero. It's just an easy way to save for what's happening on the campaign. I direct people to I will vote. I will tell folks to volunteer go on the Joe Biden dot com slash volunteer, you can find all the information of what's happening in your area. You can participate by making phone calls.

[01:18:42]

I know that a lot of different nonprofit organizations are doing this as well, is like calling neighbors. We're not knocking on doors like traditional campaigning, but we're definitely still which is always scary.

[01:18:57]

Is canvassing can be fun. I've I've done some canvassing. Canvassing can be fun. But if you're like me, I'm getting so much better at it. But it was it is a little freaky. The last time I really I phone banked for Hillary a bit.

[01:19:11]

I phone banked for Proposition eight right after my daughter Berdy was born. I was a new mom. I had her in a sling. Guys, if you have that new baby at home, let me tell you, they love hearing your voice and you can just wear them and bounce and make those calls get involved.

[01:19:31]

Let's do it. Like, seriously. Yes. So much at stake in these elections. You cannot get tired. You could do anything for 60 days. Let's do it.

[01:19:39]

Like the other thing I was going to say is just because I have an investment in South Carolina, I've been doing a lot of work for Jimmy Harrison's campaign because I love him so much. But I know South Carolina is in desperate need of poll workers and people to help out on Election Day. To me on the phone lines, if people have issues and that is very important, because if you're somebody who is like concerned about, you know, elections being stolen or whatever, you know, why don't you go help out and man the lines for people who might be like, hey, I've been in line for three hours and they're saying they're going to close, you know, and get you know, you can you can do that, too.

[01:20:21]

Well, I think there's a lot of ways to get involved, like making sure that people have rides to polls and making sure that they're voting secure and safely wear your mask. Of course. And, you know, I think getting a mail in to me, I'm going to mail in my ballot. Yeah. So just you get it.

[01:20:41]

The text message that you said, you said three zero three three zero, right? Yeah, I heard I did it because I was a Florida registered for Florida for a long time. And then I moved to California and I changed to California and I texted. I was like, I just want to make sure. So even if, like, I know there's so much fatigue, there's so many people tired, even if you're like, I'm truly purely concerned about myself.

[01:21:07]

I texted that found out that I was registered. If if the only thing you could do in your heart is to make sure that you are good to go texting three zero three three zero, something I actually did. I made sure that my address was correct. I made sure that everything was up to date and that my my personal mail in ballot would be coming to my house, which was like sometimes sometimes you got to put your mask on first.

[01:21:31]

Yep. Agree with that. Mm hmm.

[01:21:34]

So, Michelle, what are you going to be doing between now and Election Day? What will I be doing? There are so many events throughout the country, so we have something like the Queer Eye is doing a fundraiser, a grassroot fundraiser with Dr. B and her family and the kids grandkids. So that will be fun. We've got all of these like how obsessed Imai with Jill Biden.

[01:21:58]

Oh, she's in a room.

[01:22:00]

I'm kind of obsessed with the Bidens as a couple. That's what I mean. They're like, yeah, there's love. They are pure love. I have the opportunity to sit next to Dr. Jill Biden on a plane ride from DC to Los Angeles. And it was the sweetest thing. She's very smart. She had like a stack of papers that she was grading. So she had like her red pen or highlighter. And for like a few hours she was like grading papers.

[01:22:32]

And I was thinking, this is the former second lady and she's a professor. She loves what she does. And and she I said, you don't have, like, a teacher's assistant. You don't have somebody. She's like, no, I grade every single paper. And I sit down with students to talk about going through all the things that they could do better on the next paper exam or blah, blah. It's like thoroughly impressed you.

[01:22:54]

Do you know what I like to say, Michelle? I like to say that. People's outsides always catch up with their insides and not that I like to focus on like physical attractiveness, but I think that there is a thing that you can see in politics when someone is moving through the world of politics, motivated by. Like positive things and change and hope, and it shows on them in a different way than the people that are like moving through with fear.

[01:23:34]

And I feel like. You're right, for 40 years of public service, Joe Biden and his and now Dr. Biden, who's been with him for I don't know how many years they've been together, but they're cute.

[01:23:46]

But like he looks he looks great, like he looks like he looks great to me, you know what I mean? Like they both are just they shine from the inside and now I'm a fan. Now I'm a fool. I'm like, stand up. When you're not evil, you're able to keep it tight.

[01:24:00]

When you feel Shantaram, say it again. When you're when you're not evil, you're able to keep it tight. That's why we're able to keep it tight and move with purpose. I like that with a purpose. I feel like we should make some T-shirts that say move with purpose. What do you think? Yes. Yeah, I love that. Let's do it. Do it. Michelle Kwan, it's like the busiest time of your life right now, and you made time to come and sit with us.

[01:24:28]

How you're like the nicest person in the world. Thank you so much.

[01:24:31]

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for taking the time. Yeah. And thank you for letting me say your whole name. I'm going to say it forever. Michelle Kwan was here. Well, guys, you know, we've really been we've been trying to do this, learning this new language, Bunjil almost never knew, and with Bible learning, a language is even easier. It can help you learn faster than you think. Baseball has lots of different languages that you can choose from.

[01:25:12]

It gets rid of all the roadblocks so I can just start speaking Spanish or French. Or German or any of the 14 different languages that I want and Bibles available as an app or online, so your progress will be sent across all your devices. Who doesn't want to learn a new language? You know what I mean. We should all want to expand ourselves and that way and at least be able to know how to ask how to get a tequila and where's the bathroom?

[01:25:48]

Well, right now, when you purchase a three month subscription, Babille will give you our listeners three additional months for free with the promo code. Our best use that code our best. It's three additional months for free. If you go to Babille dot com and use the promo code, our best on your three month subscription. That's be a BB l dot com promo code. Our best.

[01:26:21]

All right. Hi, it's us or back Michelle Kwan, so great, don't you guys love her? So I love her. She's so inspiring. When I was 10, I was putting on socks, skating around, trying to be her. And right now I'm thirty three and I will put on some socks and get her out and try to be just like Michelle Kwan right now.

[01:26:42]

Except it's like except your socks on your phone banking around Comilla. Yes.

[01:26:49]

I loved the thing that she said about how when she would fall ice skating, she was never embarrassed. She would just think to herself, you know, I tried my best 100 hours of practice went into that fall. That's like if I could apply that to my own life, like every time I fucked something up being like, listen, it took me a lot of work to get to the point where I could fuck this thing up, you know, like, that's all I want in life is to be allowed to have the opportunity to what we say all the time.

[01:27:16]

Right. Like men, men, yet infinite opportunity to make mistakes, fuck things up and get another chance. And women get.

[01:27:24]

Yeah, zero one. She was so great. Oh. One thing I do want to say before we move on from Michelle's interview, we recorded that last week. So she kept saying that this is 68 days away. It's the election is not 60 days away any longer. It's 62 days today. So everything that everything that she said, if you were feeling that it's actually more urgent, it's six days more urgent, then then Michelle said 62 days.

[01:27:49]

And if you're listening to this later, it's less than 62. So do all those things that you need to do to make sure that you exercise how to do. And if it's actor, I hope that we're cool. Oh, I hope I hope we're here. I hope we're cool, too.

[01:28:06]

I really do. Well, guys. What do we make? Kind of crazy, I'm feeling like I'm feeling I'm feeling OK again, like I feel like. I feel like this is this is a nice thing for me to do, to reset, to, like, come and talk with you guys, you know, a little bit. It really is. It always makes you feel better. A zoom group chat. Yeah, which I've done. I like really do a chapter like my favorite thing.

[01:28:34]

But truly, like every once in a while me and my friends will straight up, set up a zoom or like a face time and be like, should we see each other like it's my time, my friends all the time, my friend Liz Karkowski, all oftentimes she'll text me and she'll be like, I just made my coffee. Do you want to have a face time? And she's a real one. The only people who don't text me before the first time are like my mom, mom.

[01:29:00]

So give a fuck, Mom. They'll be like, What are you doing? I'll be like, Why? Let me know that you're going. I don't know. I got to go homies. They'll be like, are you good to let's face time parent. Can I tell you. I try to I try to surprise Casey from time to time and I'm like, she's always I will reject you. And then she's like you. Yeah. I feel like.

[01:29:22]

I feel like like my sister can FaceTime you without texting first. My I'm OK with my mom doing it's just mom because. Yeah. I'm OK with family members doing it. I'm OK with Michelle doing it. Michelle FaceTime me sometimes out of the blue like without warning. And that's like I also just know with her life and the way things are like if she has that moment then like I'm picking it up because I want to listen. But also she always looks good, Michelle.

[01:29:50]

So she has like yeah. She has like a skin advantage in like face timing it any time. Like I need to get a bra on. Oh yeah. Wait. Somebody wrote in and asked for advice. Do we want to give her some advice. Hey is he OK. And she a.. First off, I'm loving the podcast. This is from Marie by the way. Hi, Mary. Hi Marie. I'm glad you're loving the podcast, Marie.

[01:30:13]

That's just let's just get that out of the way. Honestly, I wish the episodes were longer. Well, you know what? US, too, and they are longer and then we have to edit them. I'd love to have more of you three in my life. OK, again, guys, always start with the compliments. I love it. All right, let's get to the meat of it, Murray. I don't know if you'd classify this as a pivot, since it's something a lot of people do, but I've recently pivoted to motherhood.

[01:30:41]

My son is four months old and finding my identity as a mother has really rocked my world. I've always been very independent and for a long time I didn't really want to have kids. I'm married to an incredible man who's definitely made to be a father. And while we were dating, I decided I also wanted to have kids. Giving birth was honestly horrible, similar to business experience with Bernie. I mean, girl, yes, I pushed for three point five hours, gave birth to a nine pound, 12 ounce baby.

[01:31:07]

Same same postpartum depression. Same also hit me really hard for the first couple of months. On top of that, he was born in April. Pandemic was already underway. Being quarantined from the couple of close friends I have as well as family has been really hard to. I guess I'm wondering how you found your identity as a mother, but still kept your own sense of self and identity. And he advice for not projecting your own issues onto your kid.

[01:31:29]

I have a long relationship with my therapist, so that is helpful. That's great. I really respect the way busy. Oh, hi. That's me. Seems to parent and how she talks candidly about it. I'd love to hear from all three of you. Oh my gosh. Thanks, ladies. Marie, Marie. Marie. First, it's only been four months my friend. I love you so much. I love how you're like. OK, so now what.

[01:31:52]

What am I doing? Am I. Am I doing it right? Is this right. Am I how do I get it back? What's going on? You want to be good at it. I get it. I get it. The first thing I have to tell you is that your baby is four months old and I'm gonna need you to breathe. Like, I hate giving advice to parents like people always that like whenever I do interviews with any magazine, you know, because I'm a woman, they're always like, what's your parenting advice?

[01:32:14]

What milestones are your kids hitting? I'm like, OK, first of all, she's 12. She told me to fuck off last week. What do you want from me for Milestone? But secondly, I really I really reserve. Advice, parental advice, because what works for everyone is different. However, if I could write a parenting book, it would be how to raise your second child first, because everything that I'm feeling from this letter from Marie right now, I remember intimately from giving birth to Bertie.

[01:32:48]

And if I could go back in time to twenty nine year old new mother, Bertie, four months old, my body highjacked, leaking and like. Not even being able to poop by yourself and then also being concerned about all the things, how am I going to, you know, make sure that she is a good person and how am I going to like. And I think that I would. Tell myself, Urgo, Marie, I'm trying to impart this to you.

[01:33:25]

That you really have to, like, try as hard as you can. Unlike remembering that everything is going you're going to you're doing great, like you're doing great and the kid is going to be fine and that you're already. She's already he sorry, I'm sorry, I'm talking to myself again, but you're a little your little buddy is already like. Doing better than you know. Anyone else looking like he's going to be fine and you just have to like you just have to breathe and you have to remember.

[01:34:05]

That, like him, missing a nap isn't the end of the world or being off schedule. That and it must be hard it must have been really isolating and felt even lonelier than it did before quarantine, I mean, because to be honest with you, people that were having babies in this time, I was like, yeah, so what? Because literally I felt like the most isolated I've ever felt after I had my kids. That is like just an odd thing that women go through once when they have babies and you can have partners that are like incredibly supportive and hands on, which I did not, but not in those early times with the babies.

[01:34:45]

But you're but you still can really feel alone. And you feel like even though you intellectually know that this is something that many, many people for. Yon's, yeah, have had children, it still feels it's new to you, you know, so like so of course it feels overwhelming and weird and scary, but I would just encourage you. To try and when you talk about, like, my identity as a mother and whatever, just try to find a little bit of space for yourself to exist, whether that's like it might be hard.

[01:35:25]

It might be it might be something you're not able to do right now because your baby's only four months old. And we still are sort of in the midst of this pandemic, depending on where you live. But. Finding a way to take. Thirty five minutes, just truly for yourself is great and probably very much needed.

[01:35:48]

Maria, I feel like your identity as a mother is just you who is now a mother. Like it's not a new special thing that you have to become. And it sounds like you care so much about doing a good job of being a mom. And just the fact that you care probably means that you are doing a pretty good job.

[01:36:05]

That was the thing, because this was the thing that I always that I came to realize the people that are like, concerned about fucking up are not the ones that are fucking up. Yeah. And Barrentine, it's the ones who are like, oh no, now everything's fine. Like those are the ones where you're like, oh no, that child just punched a dog in the face, you know? And you should also just try to as much as you can, enjoy this time with your baby and enjoy who he is as he grows up.

[01:36:40]

The whenever people ask me, like, what's your secret to parenting? Because people do sometimes my secret is always that I just liked my kids like everybody loves almost everybody loves their kids. Like it's the law. You have to you're required. But a lot of people I feel like don't try to like or know them so much or know them. And here's the truth. He's going to be who he is going to be. And all you can do is model being a good person, a caring and conscientious person.

[01:37:08]

Then he's going to be who he's going to be. And hopefully who he is is someone that you enjoy. And I bet you will enjoy him. You just have to remember that. And then, frankly, like some of the responsibility is on him about whether or not he's hurt. And I agree with but I agree with all of this. As someone who has not had a baby, I will say this, though. As someone who used to be a baby, my mom, my relation with my mother has gotten way better as I've gotten older.

[01:37:36]

But now that I'm older and I've gone through therapy, one of the things that I've realized is that my mother has always treated me like a person. And I think that some people don't respect children. Like when kids are like, I don't want to hug that aren't like my momma would never let me make me hug on. My mom has also always apologized to me when she hurt my feelings. Yes. I did not learn that the boundaries that my parents set for me were so important until I got into the into the real world.

[01:38:06]

As someone who has parents who have made mistakes, I have always felt, seen and loved. And if you're listening to a podcast thinking about how you can be a better mother, I can tell you as a child who has felt, seen and loved in a world where, like, it's not easy for a young black girl in the south, I think that that's awesome. So just knowing that that boy is seen and loved and is not just like that's like kind of the thing, right?

[01:38:36]

Yeah. We all want to be seen. And Marie. Fuck without. Without me crying right now. I just want to tell you that we see you and you're doing an amazing fucking job, and that's like. You know, and if you haven't heard it today, now you can just put this on a loop.

[01:38:57]

You're doing an amazing fucking job and that kid is like, lucky to have you as his mother. I'm in Rita Gomory.

[01:39:07]

Amen. And also, by the way, if you're listening to this and you're not a parent, you don't need to be a parent to see or hear people. It's something that you can do every day. It's something that you can reach out to people and say, hey, I appreciate that, or, hey, I want to check in on you and see how you're doing. It's the easiest thing and it means the world, the fun black art that you've always wanted.

[01:39:27]

That's who I am. I was talking about before. Yes. Go be the fun black guy you needed when you were 12.

[01:39:36]

And I think that that's really I think that that's really important. Like, I mean, for all of us, like moving through this world in this time, especially when I start the show and we're all kind of sad and then we're kind of inspired. Now, after talking to Michelle and and then hearing from Marie and her own struggles, it's like there's there are a lot of ways to like, first of all, to move through and acknowledge that, like, the pain and heaviness of this time is real.

[01:40:03]

And lawyers us to, like, acknowledge it and meet it. And that's OK. Like, it's OK. It's OK to, like, cry this whole weekend. Right. So now moving forward, though, what changes are we going to look for in our own lives and communities to make to like is that pain a little bit? Made me feel so happy to do those flowers and like arrange those flowers for you this weekend. You're so beautiful.

[01:40:32]

Bought them at the little flower shop. And I was like, my friend got this job. I'm really proud of her. Like, I want to just give her these nice flowers. And that's like a small thing. Right? Or there's the organization that I work with here where I'm like helping them with school supplies this week. Oh, that's so fun. I miss school supplies. I don't want to go back. I mean, you can't go back to school.

[01:40:57]

I do not want to go back to school, but I miss going to get a fresh trapper keeper and making my daddy pay for it. Do I miss it? You know, my eye. Is this in my book or have I just told this story so many times that I feel like people know it, but I don't think they do? You know, one of my most humiliating moments of preschool and one of the only things I remember is that I watched I like loved loved Bob Ross, who didn't I Bob Ross was on whatever program I went to.

[01:41:25]

I went to like morning preschool or after high school in Chicago. And Bob Ross was on, like, right before we left the house to go to preschool. And I went to preschool and we had an art thing. And so I was like, oh, I want to paint. I didn't want to paint like the landscape because I'm four years old. Yeah. But I was like, I wanted to paint a puppy. I was like, but I know from watching Bob Ross, this is all inside my head.

[01:41:48]

But I know from watching Bob Ross, you have to paint the background first. You paint that beautiful background that he does not like Brady background, and then you put the thing on top of it. And I worked so hard, you guys. And I made the most beautiful, like pinks and whatever background. And then they were like, it's time to clean up. It's our art times over. We're going to show everyone our art and tell what we painted.

[01:42:13]

And I was like, I just did the background. I just got back, you know, I'll be on it. I didn't get the puppy on it. I just got the background. And I was like, panicked, panicked. I panicked and I was holding the thing and I was getting so, like, flustered. And she was like, I'm busy. What is it that you painted? It literally was just like paint. It was nothing, you know what I mean?

[01:42:29]

It was just like pink on braid kind of paint. And I'm holding it up. I'm so flustered. I'm like, it's a puppy. All all the kids started laughing because it was just like so clearly not a puppy. And then I was like trying to explain. And she was like, this is just I just remember this so fucking clearly. And she was just like, it's OK, guys, you know, maybe that's what a puppy looks like to busy.

[01:42:54]

And he was like me. I had just gotten the background done. I didn't get to do that.

[01:43:00]

Bobby haunts me. It haunts me that well, it's it's so you you stayed the same, you know, like people always want us to just do things in a certain amount of time. And we're like, listen, it takes a little while to, like, get ramped up. And then, you know, then it takes it takes a while to get to the to the cake that we baked, actually. And then once the cake comes out, you know, it has to cool before you frost it.

[01:43:26]

Otherwise that frosting is going to melt. You're right. And nobody wants. And then melted frosting. I mean, but it's worth it. It's worth the wait. So everyone stop just trying to end art before we're done. Right. I haven't drawn the fucking puppy yet because I love you so much. I really do.

[01:43:46]

We're going to be back next Wednesday with another fantastic guest. We're talking to some. Really great people. If you need us, you can reach us at busy doing her best at Gmail dot com. And if you want to be grouped into a group text, your deadline is Friday, this Friday, two days from now, September, whatever, 4th, 3rd. I have no idea what day it is. It's Friday, Temba time as time as the Pentagon starts like gender.

[01:44:20]

Yeah.

[01:44:21]

And then also one more exciting thing. If you've been enjoying the theme song of ours written by Jonathan Coulton and performed by Busy Phillips, you can now download the entire song on iTunes. It's called Doing Her Best performed by mobile apps. You It's a BOP and you can have it on your iTunes library and you can do whatever you want to do while you're listening to it.

[01:44:45]

And maybe and maybe I need to switch the song in my head today from twigs sad day to doing my best by myself. I do. I do a trap and remix and have it. And did you listen to that guy's trap song about me? Oh yeah. There is. That song is so good. It's so funny. That song is so there is another song called Busy Phillips that is a trap song by another unrelated artist. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:45:17]

And it's just very good and very, very biographical in detail. Oh he did the research. He did not work. Did he name checks like that. Yeah. He's actually birdie at once so it's like you want to Nacho's. I'm like I don't know. I think you know if you want to create a busy Philipps playlist you can download Doing Her Best performed by Mackenzie Phillips and also this other busy Phillips song by this fine person. We also have an official Instagram account.

[01:45:47]

It's at BP is doing her best on instr and you can follow that in your comments have been so nice. It has.

[01:45:54]

They're like, OK, 22 this week. Yeah. It's really buoyed our spirits. Yeah, it's been nice and keep it kind of keep it kind. And if you have anything bad to say, just wait until I pay you in the group thread. I mean, you guys can talk shit about me and I don't, I don't know. I don't ever need to know truly. It's none of our business knows what you think about me. If it's bad, it's great.

[01:46:20]

Bring it here. I don't subscribe to that bullshit that if you read all the good things, you got to read all the bad. I don't believe in that cause I love you both. I'm sending you guys out there so much love. This week has been hard. We got through it together. We're going to continue to get through it. There will be hard weeks in the weeks ahead and there will be good weeks. There will be Niecy Nash getting married to her love.

[01:46:50]

Jessica Batts. We will have those moments, too. That's just what life is. But until next time, continue to do your best. I'm going to continue to do mine and I love you.

[01:47:03]

Bye bye.