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One zero. So it's a really big gamble. And then he did win the Super Bowl. So moral of the story is if there's a big championship, you should win. Then you should make a song several months prior and it'll encourage you to work hard because imagine how embarrassing you'd be if you made a Super Bowl shuffle and then didn't win the Super Bowl. Can you imagine that, Jimmy? Jimmy. And Jim is back in the room. Yeah, I fucked up, sorry.
At what point did you fuck up? Uh, you were talking about the Chicago Shuffle.
It was I was still talking about that, but, um. OK, well, basically, um, the Chicago Bears team made the song before they knew if they were possibly going to win and then they went on to win it. And and I was just saying how embarrassing it would be if they they failed to win after that. Mm. Right. Would be embarrassing. Yes, and then and then a few years ago, some made a parody which is called the Sex Offender Shuffle, and which was it was like the same video, but it was with sex offenders.
That sounds fun. Yeah. Anyway, how did I get onto that? Oh, Blackcomb, we're talking about Blackcomb, we're talking about the charts. What song was in the charts, Jamie?
I would have heard of it was Lola by the Kinks. Oh, cool. That's a good thing.
Someone I know made a hilarious version of it. That was about koruna back when. A while back back to be fair, back when it was still original to make songs about the coronavirus.
And it was pretty funny. They were like Korona.
Yeah. You're now Korona.
Yeah, it is good.
Anyway, Lola was in the charts time had articles on why Westerns are popular call. It's because the good guys win, apparently. You may remember, Jamie, that I don't have a time subscription, so I'm unable to read any of the articles beyond the first paragraph.
And maybe if people start watching this more, we'll have a budget and we can buy a time subscription.
We could buy them and I'd be cool in it. And people. So we I mean yourself to monetize it, though.
And yeah, we haven't done that. But yeah, it'd be nice to get some listeners and the US Marines to set up a camp for minority youths and not in that way. I realize that sounds.
Yeah. I presume you mean training camp.
There's no like an adventure camp. Like a summer camp and. Yeah, one of those. So it was a summer camp and it was for people from like troubled areas and generally minorities. And it got to go fishing and hiking stuff, but it was led by Marines. And I like to think it was the it would have been a sort of nice way to get back to the community. But I have a sneaking suspicion it's a sort of recruitment strategy to get.
Oh, yeah. Anyway, I find that interesting.
That's a war film and there is also a war thing. There was also an article by the end of World War Two. But again, I could only read the first the first paragraph, which seemed to be about the Cold War. So I'm not sure exactly how that linked on. Anyway, that was interesting. Something else is interesting is Life magazine has an article about how Charles Manson's like women, I guess, or his his cult people were still waiting on the ranch for him to return, even though he was in jail on trial for killing Sharon Tate and others.
So that's interesting, right? Yes, I was getting the timeline from you. Yeah, yeah.
Because I don't think we've talked about Charles Manson. Oh, we did. Because we talked to once more time in Hollywood.
I did. Yeah. Sorry, I forgot. Like, you forgot where we are now.
Well, I was like looking for films released in the 70s that were great. And I was like, oh, Chinatown was at least in 1974, I want to say. Right. And then I was like, oh like I forgot that the reason Roman Polanski fled Hollywood, I got the two horrible things involving Roman Polanski mixed up in my head, the criminal.
But, you know, when the when did he when did the second horrible thing happen?
I don't know the exact date sometime in the mid 70s. That must be. Oh, Jack Nixon's in 2010. I've not seen anything. Oh, I'm you know, talking about Jack Kennedy. Talking about Jack. Did you know that Jack Black has a YouTube channel where he plays video games?
Yes, I've known about it for years. I've shown you it on multiple occasions.
Well, I mean, I knew about it, but I was reminded about it yesterday when he uploaded a video of him shaving off his beard. And then I found it delightful video where he was a Tony Hawk and it was just a cool video and.
Oh, yeah. Hmm, say Tony Hawk's proscriptive tourbillon to remonstrance coming out two weeks from now.
This this video was the first ever announcement of that, Jamie. Oh, it's interesting you bring that up. And so, yeah, it was it was worth Tony Hawk. And then Tony Hawk says to Jack Black, I'm not suppose to tell you this, but that obviously is supposed to tell them this, because I think and it's like but we're remastering Tony Hawk's saucy one, too, and Jack plays it so cool. And then you gonna play the remastered one, Jack Black and his kids and then it go skating and there's there's there's Tony Hawk there and Rodney Mullens there and Eric Colston's there.
And all these like classic, you know, the most famous scarers, they were all just skin and bone. Jack Black's in a skateboard and it was epic. And I totally forgot in their YouTube channel. And it was it was cool.
It seems like he called it. Yeah. Did you ever play the first any of the first Gulf War Games?
No, I was a skate freak. I, uh, these are the new ones. Are the new old ones.
The old new ones, probably. No, I did I did actually play one of them. I played one on one PC and it was definitely one of the worst ones. Tony Hawkes, Pro Skater HD. I played, uh, which is famously bad. However, the the play style is still the same as the old ones. And I much prefer the the flagstick of skate. And you play with like you click the sticks as a portrait flick instead of.
Mm. And instead of pressing buttons which Tony Hawk sailboat. So I don't think I will, I'll wait for skateboard to come out.
And also there's Skater Excel and and Session are both right now.
So there's other I have a sneaking suspicion they time the announcement skate for coincide with skater I feel is too much of a coincidence with skater x. L know with Tony. Both Tony Harris was here.
I feel I think the gap I feel it's a weird coincidence that the two biggest skateboarding franchises are simultaneously making their return.
I think it's because of Skater Excel in session because they're both very similar games that came out in early access like two years ago. And they're both they were both getting a full release this year. And at the same time, the two major companies have been out for it for a good few years now, have announced new ones. So I think they're realizing that the market there and they're not wanting new people to muscle in the territory.
So we'll see as long as skateboards. Good. I'll be happy if it's Russian, but I'll be very upset because it could be awesome.
Check in three months. Who knows, apparently it's very, very far away escape for time in two years. Yeah, whereas Tony Hawk's Proskauer one to remeasured.
Cuminseed, should we talk about the film? Oh, yeah.
I mean, you know, I like our times, but we can start talking about ideas if that's any description and over over thing. I think that's a tangent.
I saw I think we should live up to the name you should do.
However, I do think it's probably nighttime and we usually go 15 to 20 minutes before we start talking about the actual thing.
I know hopefully no one's hopefully no one's clicked on this as our first new episode uploaded and expecting a deep analysis and patent and nothing else.
Because if so, yeah, we felt.
Passing General Patton was a World War Two general, either right or the United States of America. That's correct. General Patton was a four star general. We started second best when he was a three star general in this film.
He's a four star general, is a three star general in this film. He's a four star general in this film.
Well, wait till is cars and stuff have three stars in it and it's like it gets promoted in the first half hour. Does he? Yes. Well, no, he was forced sorry. He gets from go from it in real life itself.
Well, I don't know anyway. OK, I was going to keep doing the stupid voice, but you've broken me out of it, probably.
I'm sorry. This film, as we know, was released in 1970. The most interesting credit on it is that it was co-written by Francis Ford Coppola. Yes. Which is very interesting. I think there's a lot of DNA of his future projects in it.
What did he make, Jamie?
Well, Francis Ford Coppola is a little in the right director, but he made the famous film Bram Stoker's Dracula. That's great. Everyone's loved him ever since. A bit of a one hit wonder.
But who's his nephew? Jamie. Oh, Nicholas Cage. I found out today. Yeah. He's made such celebrated films as an alias of your face off. And what's the one vampire's kiss? One of the vampires is really good.
I can't remember. I love Nicholas Cage, though, and I can't remember the name of the vampire film. I'm not lost in the vampire film. I've seen so good konare. So National Treasure.
The rock, uh, well, also seen I think that's it. OK, yes, of course, you can kick ass and vampires case I've not seen, but that is an event, you know, the frozen ground. Yeah, that's 2013. So that and snake eyes.
Have I seen that? I think I've seen that. And he's he's awesome.
I did see snake eyes. I did see sneakers. Yes. I saw in Wildheart recently.
He was very good and he's. He really plays into his personality very well. Yeah, I'm surprised he hasn't cooperated with the bush because it seems like this to be a very natural fit for each other. And I think it worked with David Lynch.
Yeah, I think so. Lenience, not so over-the-top style with like very, very full on emotional sincerity. Yeah, I know what you mean.
I wonder if it would if it would be too much. And I wonder if you kind of just need one person like that. And yeah, I'm trying to think you, David Lynch tends to collaborate.
I mean, obviously, no comic listening on Laura Dern. Laura Dern is his main one.
And she. I don't tend to think of her as being massively like that. That's pretty reserved, just. MACLACHLAN Mm hmm.
Yes, maybe it was or maybe it's that that, like, fascination.
I'm sure I've seen Laura Dern talk with David Lynch and she's, like, absolutely fascinated by him. And he's maybe he's kind of fascinated by this other world and that kind of works together, whereas maybe Lynch and Cage together, we just like scrape against each other too much. I don't know.
Hmm. I suppose.
Anyway, I'm a big Nicolas Cage dude, and I didn't know that his real name is Nicholas Kim Coppola, and he was a nephew of of Francis Ford Coppola.
I don't know. His middle name was Ken. There you go.
The name is Kim. It's pretty cool, apparently. Apparently, the Coppola family is is a very creative lineage.
And who else is involved? Oh, God, you're asking me this.
Uh. Well, obviously, Sofia, Sofia Coppola is transfer Cooper's daughter and yeah, but, oh, I've lost I had to Wikipedia page. It's like the family tree of everyone is in it. And there was like the first people that came over to America from Italy were all were like peonies.
I thought I was going to ask composers a lot of Francis Ford Coppola, whose family are involved in the movie business, like the obvious explanation for that is like their father slash uncle is Francis Ford Coppola.
So I was wondering if, yeah, his his any of his predecessors had sort of his father was a composer, flautist, pianist and songwriter who and it looks like who contributed music for Francis Francis films by she was the that before it. And and his wife is described as the matriarch of the Coppola family. And she sent a bunch of films. And so.
Yeah, but I mean if so if you look at the couple of family tree and Wikipedia, I would say at least half of the people that are in this have Wikipedia pages about how they make films or are composers or whatever. His uncle was a opera conductor and composer. His dad was a composer. His. Brother was an author and a film executive and his sister was an actress, so, yeah, like the family, the whole family is is very.
Involved artistic and performing. Yeah, but the most interesting thing was I somehow did not realize that Nicolas Cage was so closely related and I think I was aware that. They were related, but not so closely. Hmm, interesting, interesting, so, yeah, I Patton was a U.S. Army general and or two. Established that the film Patton opens up on the very iconic shots I didn't realize came from this film, but now I do of General Patton against the big fucking flag.
I mean, this flag is a real chunka. You know, you've seen big fights before.
But see a you Mr. People on this one, one by two of the bars are as tall as a man. Mm hmm.
And there's there's God knows how many bars in the American flag stripes, you cretin.
No, no, Jim, I just don't respect the like. I shouldn't say that's going to get as bad. We're going to get sponsored now.
Uh, or is it cool nowadays to not respect Americans?
Like, I think it's kind of cool. Okay. You know, if you say, like, my disrespecting your show and your freedom, baby.
Yeah, that's right. That's true. That is weird. There's so many rules about the American flag, despite the fact that.
You know, it's a country, yeah, it's it's all about freedom anyway, and so it makes a little speech here.
I say, listen, this is a grand speech. He discussed the American attitude towards more, says, you know, no bastard ever won, lost by dying for his country. You made the other bastard die. And that's how they won.
Oh, because so on and so forth. Awesome as a film again, bro.
Oh, yeah, he does. Does also say the US has never lost the war, which was obviously true at the time, but has a string of dramatic irony given the period in which the film released.
This true? I would say this film, the discuss patterns, purposes and what I don't really feel like a massive plot summary, that I will try my best just this very long. But as with a great many of these epics, Lawrence of Arabia really is the best starting point.
It's never seen it, but I have seen it like, yeah, of course I've seen Lawrence of Arabia.
I mean, there's a lot of times you've not seen Jamie.
That's true. But this time I get to Lord over you.
And that's a very rare position is is I think I've got a box, a box of DVDs that are called like 20th century ethics. And and and that kind of puts me off point, because I know that there's like 10 hours of film in that box set free or whatever it is.
Lawrence of Arabia is very a very good film. I will go. Yeah, no, I definitely want to watch it. And I think we call the other. Another epic I want to see is Ben Hur.
And I was in Ben-Hur or Doctor Zhivago, which I don't know if that counts as an epic, but yeah, no, I think it does.
And it's more recent. I mean. Right.
Same director as Lawrence of Arabia. Is who's it directed by, David, llena? David Lean who? There is someone. Was it someone from another week there was in Doctor Zhivago or something? I can't remember how the. Anyway, by Tibetans, yes, so Passan looks like much like Lawrence of Arabia is about a portrait of a troubled man, a complicated wartime leader. So I feel it would be worth discussing who Pattern is before we set out.
Yeah. So Passan is is a real man's man.
He's very blustery, very aggressive. A great deal in war. He. Real, he is the spirit of a warrior, someone calls him at some point in the film, Lives for Battle relishes that he does.
He believes that he's the reincarnation of yes, we are not the reincarnation of a specific warrior, but that he's lived many lives of different warriors.
Yes, always war. There's a scene where he sees where it goes to the ruins of Carthage and he kneels down. As you know, 2000 years ago, the Romans fought like our Finian's here. I was there that day. I was there that day.
And he knows a lot of poetry and literature and stuff, but it's all based on war. And he does love history, but all his history is war based.
And yeah, so he is a very spiritual and sensitive man, but only in relation to war in Iraq. Yeah, an interesting way. Yeah.
Which I think is I mean I think there are people like that. I mean it's, it's not really a thing nowadays. But if you look at a lot of these old cultures, there's a lot of culture around being a warrior and being, you know, well, the film, all these characters around patency, a lot of times that is an anachronism.
He is I think someone says the 16th century man.
Yes, yeah. Yeah, they do. So he's he's sort of the spirit of those tribal times. Yeah.
Isn't him the tribal names of the sixteen hundreds. Exactly.
Fifty four countries of not tribes. It's true. It's true. As he walks among us today, I'm trying to find the words to express what sort of like default partners in terms of like. He's very no nonsense. He's very friendly, but sort of a kind of annoying way.
He's got a lot of respect for his enemy and yeah, you know, in a weird way where he wants. He sees the as honorable. So he wants to absolutely slaughter them, but then he has utmost respect for the effort that Putin and stuff and yeah, which is which which is something a bit different. Yeah, I'm just trying to. Figure out the ways to say his main deal is. His main attitude toward lust for battle, shall we say, but also an expectation as men will share that lust for sharing it, but also a sort of complete lack of empathy for those who don't.
Yes, one thing the film does in a way to find quite interesting is that a lot of the times all sort of peppering patterns, dialogue is doing quite terrible things, but just sort of not comment on it. In a way. There's like one bit where after he's conquered an Italian city where he says, like, my Italian prisoners were complaining that the latrines, I had to show them how to use a latrine. Yeah, I know. Like, it's never commented on again, which I quite like, actually, I think.
It's very much a film where it shows you this character and the film. I wouldn't say doesn't do too harsh in terms of it's a very critical film of him, but it's not it doesn't set out to demonize, but it's hard to lionize them either, which I think is the danger of these types of films.
Yeah, it tries to paint a nuanced portrait, and I think it succeeds quite well. Does quite well.
Yeah. You you understand where he's coming from and why he makes his energy does. But it doesn't always suggest that's the right thing to do or. Yeah. Yeah. Anything like that.
I mean, maybe, maybe just to stay at the outset that I think Pathans kind of a dick. Yeah. Yeah. OK, good.
I think that's the best thing about this film is that I think that as an intelligent or empathetic person, one would come away from this film understanding that I was trying to paint him as a deeply flawed person, but one with unique talent or for the way he was then.
Yeah, I mean. Going, but I also can very easily imagine that someone who I would dislike very much would walk away from this film and think, wow, isn't that Patton character great and completely uncritical way, you know? Yeah.
I mean, I think he's presented as a dick, but one that has to make is a dick for the right reasons.
See, that's the thing. I was wondering if our opinions on this would differ. But but I think he's a dick but gets results. It's fair. Yeah, but I don't know if the film necessarily sympathizes with him. I was going to say just to defend the point I made is that do you know whose favorite film, Mrs.. And no idea, Tricky Dicky, Richard Nixon himself a wonderful really.
Yeah, I was just I thought I thought Tricky Dicky was David Cameron.
Oh, there's plenty. The Tricky Dicky lives forever. But it's Tricky Dicky.
Know that Labor guy called David Cameron and he got kicked out?
Yeah. Yeah. Which is weird because Dickie is not a nickname for David. No, but he's quite funny video. Yeah, but yeah, just to reiterate my point, that I definitely think someone could someone what could emerge from that film if someone like Patan but, you know, just a regular schlub went into that film, big budget, not having absorbed any of the criticism, it's all gone. Yeah, the film really showed how great he was.
Isn't it nice having one? I don't know. I think that's kind of nice. I think these things can be relatively new ones. I don't know. It's almost like your films for the stupidest audience go.
Oh, no. Um. Yeah. Yeah, you're right, I think. Yeah, yeah, it kind of would work, you don't have to see that and you can watch a film and not get the nuances and the little bits, but also you can. Yeah, well, you're saying what I'm trying to say is that I think obviously we talked about this in the on the podcast public discourse in general, that there is obviously we can talk a lot about whether films glorifies certain behavior or if they fail to condemn it a lot.
I think the film, the film walks the fine line about it doesn't it doesn't super explicitly condemn Pathans behavior in that I think to the extent that I think if someone was watching without paying as much too much attention, they would perhaps not realize it was being produced at all. But I think. It is nuanced enough to hold him accountable and to not condone the way I think a lesser film would go, you know, when Patton, for example, said that, you know, he doesn't want any cowards in his unit when facing soldiers who have been shell shocked and, you know, basically been mentally scarred for life, I think a lesser film would sort of side with him or at least try to paint that in a noble light, whereas genuinely does show that as an act of violence and complete and utter monstrous lack of empathy on his part.
Yet I think this is a better film for being able to take that sort of nuanced approach.
Yeah, yeah. Because, I mean, I think he could have also gone the other way completely and just said he would wait. So you're saying, as you said, he could have showed. That is correct. The correct.
And it also could have gone the other way and showing it is like completely the wrong thing to do or like it was the wrong you know, it does show is the wrong thing to do.
But actually, it kind of the film explains why he did it. And I feel like I'm going to just not explain why he did. And just being like his own person.
Well, no, I think the film doesn't let him get away with his explanations for why he did. I think it holds them accountable for them. Yeah, but you can you can see the kind of scene that he is and you can see how impasto he justifies it.
You can see how he justifies everything it like.
You can see how with patterns, belief system, there is no room for how he conceives of a world. For someone to have a mental failing of any kind. He can only really understand it in very simple terms because that's ultimately how he views the world. Yeah. So whereas whereas it could have easily just not shown that just being like he's a dick.
Yeah, well, yeah, for no reason.
And, uh, uh, isn't it nice that films like us think, um, there's nothing I would like to be doing more eleven forty five on a Saturday night and thinking to me, oh yeah.
I should say. We'll come back to this when it comes up, because we're probably getting a little confused and also had time to think of my own.
So pattern begins in Tunisia in 1943. Oh, my God.
Really? I'm looking at the paper. I've got Jimmy. And when I go online, free of probably a 60 no, about 100 things I've written, maybe this is this is the real Omega.
So then I felt like my first line is that we're now in Tunisia in 1943. All right.
I promise to go to both listeners and you. I won't spend as long on the plot summary as I usually do. I'll just just to paint a picture.
Yeah. And so Tunisia, 1943 person takes over command is very successful there, at least annoyed at the British general. Montgomery is taking a lot of the credit and not really supporting him in the way that he's supposed to do.
Yeah, and there's there's a bit around here where I think they say that they've they've saved an area from Montgomery to take that might be later on. But I think it's I think it is during the Africa that and he's like, well, that's ridiculous. This is war and not not a glory hunting thing.
And then he goes and takes the place, which starts his thoughts, his rivalries.
And yeah, I suppose our introduction, not our second introductions or patterns that he takes over the army base from whatever the prior general was whipped up into the shape. We see patterns very, very into military discipline and yet paranoid that people haven't been wearing their helmets, including people like the chef and Delta and the doctor. Yes, the doctor actually says that he can't do his job with his helmet on. This is for a stethoscope. And Peyton doesn't accept that as an excuse.
He said you can cut you said you can cut a hole in your helmet.
Yeah, that and you know, one of the boys in the barracks was one of those 40s pin ups and he takes it down to the Bordeleau. And so we sort of see Passan very much in love with the spirit of war, which I think is the right phrase to use the war as an experience and the importance of discipline stuff, which is something that we saw in to the hero.
If you remember back taps of two, um, and the importance of Marcus Baruti puts on discipline and following orders and stuff. And I think you see a very similar kind of character thing with with Patton, where he views the.
I mean, it's it's the sort of military view is the reason that you do so much drill and uniform, you're be perfect, is because you need to be trusted to do the told and do what you need to do. And so that's kind of the idea that he's bringing in and said this is not a casual holiday and that you should be ready to OK.
So I think the film is at least a little critical of it, given that the examples it chooses are to really impractical ones with the chef and the doctor.
With the doctor. Yeah, I mean, and the chef, not so much. The chef, I think makes sense. And yeah, the doctor definitely is a bit impractical.
Yeah, I think it's I think it's trying to show that he's he likes the imagery of war even beyond the point of practicality or necessity.
Well, this is true because he he talks about designing uniforms a couple of times in the film. Yes.
And he talks about a uniform involves a solid gold football helmet. Exactly.
Which the army said was would get in the spotlight. And so, yeah, I think there is an element of that that idea of the Luke of war, the that that kind of thing that kind of reminds me of Jojo Rabbit and, you know, the guy the designs his own uniform. Yeah. Until you're a bit like the Nazi dictator, Nazi one. Yeah.
You know, yeah. Actually, in a way, I suppose. Pattern is pattern, anything more than just a grown up Jojo, except for a different side? You know, I mean, that's true, actually. And I mean, he's very much in love with the romance of being a soldier. I suppose the thing about Patton, which we want to mention now, I don't know, really comes off as a person is very uninterested in politics and thus almost completely uninterested in the actual ideology of the war he's fighting.
Yeah, I mean, for example, we're skipping right ahead. But right at the end, he wants to go to war with the Russians and he says, oh, don't worry, I'll I'll the guy says, but we're not at war with the Russians.
We just fought with them are at peace. And Montgomery says, don't worry, I'll I'll mobilize the Germans against them. I'll start a war in a week and I'll make them think it was their idea and which kind of shows that he's got no regard for that. The idea of politics and trade.
Yeah, well, that's what I say. Patton's only political opinion, which sort of becomes more prominent in the latter half the films that he really hates the Russians.
Yeah. Presumably, you know, I can't imagine it's a big family call me. I know I would accord with his ideology and the president is a smart person, so I'm sure he would also realize, you know, what, the extent of the threat.
Yeah. And I mean, there's also. A potential that it was it was over emphasized in the film because of the stuff at the time.
Yeah, I mean, I'm looking at his his his Wikipedia page right now. And there is stuff about him making aggressive statements or Soviet Union and all that kind of stuff. So it does sound like he did hold those views. But and yeah, I think it is important to question exactly how accurate those things are, not to be a big head.
And, you know, all American films are lies thing. But one thing I did notice is that the role of the Russians and actually taking Berlin is very, very minimized in the film. Yeah, it's more of a sort of. And also the Russians were there.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, they they are shown celebrating the. Yeah. The was and patterns. Definitely know how they've got there first. And I mean I think you could explain it as the whole film is, is really about the American army.
Yeah. You don't really see many British soldiers either. But yeah, it is true. You can definitely see that. I just know much about the Russians taking Berlin.
They weren't in the film. The filmmakers weren't in any rush to, you know, show the Russian contribution to the war, which was the period of the time that, you know, and the other thing about Patton, as well as what you just said about him not liking politics, is that he also doesn't really get the media.
And yet because several times in the film, he says things that are picked up by reporters and make it into the newspaper and that gets him a lot of bad press or gets into the newsreels, which are very nice little bit this film where it kind of cuts off from the the main action, which is widescreen color into the like classic little four by three black and white newsreels, which I quite like. Yeah, it's nice. It's quite nice. It's kind of like Citizen Kane, of course.
Yeah. The only thing I only film with newsreels, but yeah. So the reason I was growing up supporting doesn't care about allied politics in particular.
So there's always this tension between the US and the British and Patton just doesn't respect it at all and just sort of kind of does what he wants and is very open with the fact that he just kind of annoyed that he's not going to do what it wants to. And the person has a battle against what he thinks is against Rommel Rommel, who is shown as his rival in this film.
Yeah, Tunisia. And he wins, which is very nice for him. It turns out Rommel was away sick, that they had a note from his mum.
Yeah. So, you know, he's a bit sad about that, but, you know, you still beat him in a way. Yeah, well, the the other people are saying that if you beat his orders, you beat him and cancer goes viral.
Yeah, but yeah, but yeah, but no, we're not really.
And yeah, he clearly I mean, he talks, he talks before this battle. He talks about how in the ideal world and he looks over the dead and he says in the ideal world I would just call Raml up and he'd throw up in his tank over there and I'd be in my tank over here and we'd have a battle mano a mano and I would decide who wins the war.
I suppose one of the slightly strange things about Patton's ideology in the film is that obviously he's very into you know, he's lost the battle in a lot. But by the time of World War two, generals don't actually do much fighting. Well, exactly. I mean, there's a point on lines. There's a point where hilariously he's talking to a guy from the RCF and the guy said they're talking about how the RPF guy says they have air superiority. You'll never see any German planes.
And then hilariously, at that exact moment, some German planes fly over and start bombing them. And Patton's response, rather than diving under the table, is to say, well, we were we were discussing air supremacy. And then he jumps out the window and starts firing at the starts firing at the planes with his pistol. So, so clearly he.
He yearns for battle and he takes any opportunity for him personally to be involved in battle, even though, as you say, he's a general, he's not supposed to.
Well, I think most of what he does in the film is, you know, roll around in an Army Jeep and talk to people. Exactly. I mean, you can count the amount of times in the film that he actually shoots the gun. I think on freethinkers you can.
But he also is not afraid. I mean, he's not deliberately things up in Bales, but he's not afraid at all. So there's I'm thinking a bit later on where he gets he hears that there's some tanks that are stuck on one side of the river and unable to cross. So he drives across the river in his jeep and then surprised them by being on the other side of the river already. And he says, come on, guys, what are you doing?
Here is only three feet of water and numerous explosions going off around him and stuff.
So I think no, I'm not saying the film portrays him as a hypocrite. I'm just saying no. In love of an ideology, it doesn't actually apply to his own.
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I mean, I think the yeah, I agree. The fact that he's getting himself in these situations is proof that he wishes that era was still around. Yeah.
I mean, as a general, I mean, that would objectively be a bad idea. Yeah, of course. I anyways, but, you know, I mean, that's what he yearns for.
I guess if he wasn't a general, he probably wouldn't be in the war because he was six years old.
And so, yeah, that that's sort of the Tunisia chapter of the film and brought a couple of more things that I feel ought to be brought up. Now, General Patton visits the hospital when he's doing his first rounds, including in a place like this is sort of the first time that we see he's actually kind of a chair. So it's a very particular attitude towards military hospitals that we will forward later. But he says in this particular hospital that he learns that a lot of the men have self-inflicted wounds and says that they can't be treated with the others separately.
He says this with scorn. And then he says that says the doctrine in advance that no battle fatigue will happen in his unit. He doesn't believe in it and that cowardice is just, you know, snowflake mumbo jumbo and you just need to get back out there. And so, yeah, I suppose something that is true of both the real general pattern and the pattern, this film is that he just does not believe in mental illness or psychological trauma at all.
Which is something you see in a lot of people still nowadays.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So, yeah, not very nice man in that regard, and it's a flaw that the film will eventually take him to task for.
Yet other than that, you to say, oh yes, a soldier dies during the Tunisian battle. It's sort of minor officer, you know, being in the background of the scenes, contrary to the word here or there and Pathans, but again, very sensitive as a funeral, so to speak, some poetry. I think he kisses them as he's lowered the casket. And, you know, he's genuinely sad. There's no wood for a coffin and he can't have a sort of 12 gun salute.
And I'll give away that position.
Yeah, there's a genuine sorrow for definitely the fallen soldier. And anything else from this particular film, anything else from this film? Yeah, there's quite a lot actually left.
Yeah, there's a lot left I want to do. I was going to do it one at a time because the film very conveniently divided into three major sections.
I have already jumped about a lot, but um. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Oh, Patton sleeps in his uniform, which I found quite funny. Does he? I didn't even notice it. That's pretty funny. He's sleeping his four poster bed. Yeah, talking about Plotkin's believe in reincarnation, obviously, and is just the point that he's very, very into it.
Yeah, I truly believe that we cut to a scene in the Nazi headquarters where they're discussing him and one of them called the sixteenth century man so far in comparison to Don Quixote, which I thought was a really apt comparison. I was watching the film. I was trying to figure out what you reminded me of. And it turned out that was it.
Yeah. Really is Don Quixote boy, but one virtual talent, which is kind of interesting, yeah. Yeah, true. I like Don Quixote, good character. He's also described many times as a prima donna. Yes. Oh, improvement on his character, isn't she? Donna Prima donna prima donna is a leading female singer in an opera company. But the Commedia dell'arte, so she a character, I don't know anyway, prima donna is, yeah.
Sort of fall flat.
How would you describe your prima donna? I don't know.
And all she ever wanted was the word. Sure, yeah. But, yeah, he's a drama queen. To say, well, that doesn't really mean the same thing, I would say. Oh. I mean, I think there are different things I would say I don't think he's a drama queen. I would say primadonna means like you're very fussy and vain. Yeah, but drama queen means that you make up things or make things seem grander than they are.
I don't think he does the latter of that. I'd say part a prima donna. Right. Well, anyway, he's a prima donna, he's not a drama queen, in my humble opinion.
So one other thing, this is the second part of this film will involve an invasion, obviously, and. They discuss whether or not he's going to invade Sicily or Sardinia, but he but the German officer says that pattern will definitely invites Sicily because that's how the Athenians that, yeah, there's a military history.
This is a German officer that's been assigned to research him. So, yes, yes. Several times in the film, it cuts to these German officers that are talking about their strategy and what Patton might do in a bunker. And one of them has been assigned to research him and all the officers saying, oh, they're going to invade Sardinia. And and he says, no, he's a big fan of military history. The he was a Fenians. Yeah.
Yeah. Invaded Sicily. So that's what he'll do. And sure enough, it then cuts to Patton saying the opinions of editors say that's what we're going to do.
So, yeah, yeah, they got him. And I read him like a book. Yeah. Yeah.
So I which I didn't know until this film is what they called Eisenhower. Eisenhower, no. Eisenhower in the day or any time.
Sorry, has really annoyed Paskin because he's letting Montgomery get the cool part of the invasion plan. I've forgotten to put America first and think of it as America not.
Yeah, he thinks of it as an allied invasion, not an American invasion, which is quite an interesting think.
I'm the guy that plays Montgomery lose quite a lot like Montgomery. Would you say?
I don't know what Montgomery like. OK, cool. Sorry, nerd, I was too busy getting laid.
Well, you were studying the army generals, I was studying the shaggin and well, the real way you can tell Pathans the deck is because he's very interested in military history, which is the biggest red flag of any human being.
The actor, the the actors look quite a lot like the people they're playing, actually. Yeah, pretty well, yeah.
I think most of the actors in this film, I don't think. You are super great job other than the guy thing I would say.
I mean, not that they're bad, it's just that they're they're yeah, they're they're not particularly. And I looked up the cast and other than Peyton, they're not particularly famous.
And the guy that played Montgomery was a prison guard in A Clockwork Orange. So that was the most famous one I could find.
So it kind of looks like the. Chose them. They chose good actors, but perhaps chose ones that failed this specific parts, Bo and Luke, like the famous people, the River and the Roma, was a German actor who hasn't been anything I recognized.
So, yeah, when you're talking about, like these films, which are very hyper focused on one character in particular, it's not going to be any easier for anyone else. Exactly. Yeah.
And you just heard occasionally there might be two big people, but yeah. Yeah, it's definitely a character piece where they've got a big idea to play that and then surrounded him with with others. Yeah.
Yeah. Well the players and. So I'm a bit, but yeah, so we got our Barthel in Sicily, Passan completely disobeys orders, just pretends to not have gotten the telegram, telling him to stop moving, got into trouble and Patton thinks he can overtake him. He just doesn't do what he's told to.
Yes. So he wants to take the city of Masino in Sicily and then to round to talk because they're all going for Palermo, which is like the main place to get. And Montgomery's been stopped. And there's another US army that's in the middle in the mountains and started moving very slowly and then patent forces way round up round the left side of the island and up and then through to Palermo and ignores orders, as you say, to do so.
Yeah. So this kicks off the part of the film, which I like because I love it when films are very mean. And this part of the film is very critical towards. Yeah. So we start our battle in Sicily.
The first thing that we see is.
Jimmy Dorries, radio silence Yeah, never, never. Were you playing? I was I was looking at one person, you know, tries to rile up his voice. He says that he does this because he loves it. Yeah. And so one thing we see is that on the bridge, his troops are trying to transport some cargo across. That's been positive. There are two donkeys pulling stuff on the bridge and like, you know, we can't go.
There's two asses in the way, you know, the funny wordplay. So and without missing a beat, shoot them and shoot the horse, the donkeys in cold blood.
Yeah. And then tosses them off the bridge. Yeah. It tells them to toss them off the bridge and then. Yes, go.
Yeah. In a really quite nasty act of animal cruelty and violence. And we don't see the actual battle which is very bloody and traffic, a lot of explosions everywhere. And we see the soldiers. There's one who are beginning to get very annoyed about this in their own way. And one of them says the nice line are blood, his guts, and that they're paying the price for his hubris, as it were, or at least his passion, which I think is quite interesting.
I mean, obviously, General Patton, there's a lot of incredibly reckless things about this film, and almost all of them are at the expense of his men. Even his finest hour, I think, is somewhat tainted by it in the film, although it is portrayed in a somewhat positive light. And subpoenas are being I was going to say when the inves Berlin, but like his last and for that involves what every other general thinks is a disgusting abuse of his men.
Yeah. To see someone brings up like how how common soldier supposed to be, and he says it doesn't really care.
Yeah, let me get to sort of the aftermath of the Patton side wins, but he sort of goes into a tent to look at the injured. And, you know, again, in fairness, it's just, you know, he's says, you know, he goes around the very sensitively but listens to their injuries, says prayers for them and at some properly in Purple Hearts. There's one guy who's blind and just whispered in his ear, yeah, look, know what he says?
Yeah. We never know what he says, but, you know, which is kind of nice.
Can I say let me see one guy in the corner who's very deeply shell shocked, like just crying uncontrollably. I'm not able to get a handle on himself. And Patton is because as we know, he doesn't believe in this stuff, is unbelievably outraged that he's allowed to sit with a man who has physical injuries. He starts yelling at everyone and he starts yelling out the doctors asking why he was laughing. And he calls the man a coward and he says he should be he should be shot for insubordination.
He says, I'm going to shoot you right here. Yeah. Yeah, hypocrisy.
And then he slaps them quite hard two times, very clearly out of anger, which I feel is an important thing to note, given what I will say later. Yeah. And so, you know, CNN's scandal for as Patton has now assaulted one of his own men who obviously suffered for it. And so this kicks off a big scandal back home.
And so he's I think this is the first newsreel, isn't it? Yeah, no, I think it's the cartoon of himself, and that really annoys me. Oh, it's a cartoon. You're right. Yeah. You know, I was off the record as well.
That's the thing. What is lost favor quickly. Yeah. So you have to. Yes.
A cartoonist has drawn him, kicking one of his own soldiers with a swastika in his boot, which he's only angry.
AHP. Yeah, yeah. Just this. Well, that's the important thing.
And the fight to the bitter end of iron. I think he's angry. Pays off very, very quickly.
Yeah, exactly. But he's still not he often is. Never really admits fault in this matter. He really hates he's being taken to task for it, but he doesn't think I'm forced to make a public apology to the the soldier in question, the soldier's family and the entire army under his command. And later that he wrote to the family if all their sons would have been shot as an apology. And then his apologies to the army is very stilted and is mostly him justifying his actions by saying that he thought that this would be help him gain his self-respect.
He slapped him. Exactly.
I mean, it's at this point that you kind of see how you can see how he's and how he kind of explains it to himself where he's like. And he almost says he can understand why the man's a coward, but all he needs to do is realize what he's done and get some self-respect back.
And the best way to do that is to slap that is a very nice but with the apology I've got that's there again. But yeah, but the way he does it is that it's like I'd like to offer this and then he pauses for a very long time and he says explanation. And this apology, let just absolutely hesitation, was the last possible second to actually apologize as part of the vast, vast majority of it is him just trying to I'm not even sure he's explaining it to himself.
I genuinely think he's just explaining it to his men, although it's definitely up for interpretation. That's wrong.
Yeah, no, I do think it's been to his men. And but I think I don't necessarily think that. That's exactly how he thinks, but I think it does give an insight into. He's sort of views on why someone might act like that, like I'm not saying that he genuinely thinks that by slapping that specific man, he was getting his self-respect back. But it shows that he I think that is how he believes. Carrodus says. It's just that you've kind of lost some respect for yourself.
And I mean, you certainly think of it as a personal failing.
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And I think that's what you see there. Yeah, I mean, that's the way you frames the discussion. He doesn't consider it in any other light, even when trying to explain himself. So we find. So he's captured the city Palermo's it got there at the same time and he and Montgomery have a terse exchange during which there are two parades going on. They both play Stars and Stripes in Scotland, the brave at the exact same time, which sounds horrible as one would expect, which is a nice little bit of a character dynamic.
And yet you see that that that discordant, quite subtle. And little, yes, yes, yes, but Pathans, down the dumps, he's being he wanted command of the armies of your those days beckoning and he's been passed over for in favor of his immediate subordinate, Bradley, who's not as brilliant as Patton. But, you know, a good boy, he does his work on time. Yeah.
So, Pathans, very sad when he said all this over one measly slap again, really never really accepting the gravity of what he did. But regardless, feeling very sorry for himself. Yes. Yes.
I mean, it's intermission. Yeah. Oh, my God. I love it. I like it. So you don't get them in.
A lot of films was much worse once they got rid of intermissions, frankly. Yeah. Yeah. They don't play a song during the intermission, and that's very disappointing.
The song starts up towards the end of it. Yeah. Let's just let you know to go of the bathroom.
You're actually you've put the intermission too late by the way. Oh by. No, you haven't. No, yeah, don't don't doubt my ability. There's a different speech, there's a different speech after the intermission that accompanies the speech.
Yeah you go, son. OK, we're in Corsica now. You know, some time has passed, you know, probably a few months ago, you know, I'm in 1944.
A Channel Passim is still around baby, but is doing unimportant stuff. He continues to insist that the yellow rat should have been shot, but he's now got men than the men are still loyal to him. They don't want to ride with anyone else, but he feels he's you know, this is where he's sort of been put away for the rest to come here so he won't bother anyone.
Yeah, he's goes to talk to it in an English village. Sorry, he's brought up to London for some mysterious reason. And you think it's just, you know, sit there and as part of this. Yeah, as part of this, he's told that he's going to run the decoy army during D-Day, as we all know, that's obviously a very important part of the plan. And he sort of goes up to speak in front of this town hall meeting.
A woman, I guess, would be saying, I'm saying I'm just like it's an all female audience, I assume, because, you know, that's the make up or anything. Yeah.
I mean, there's a very nice, genuinely pathetic scene where General Patton has a new dog and he says he's called William the Conqueror because he's brave. And then he's like tiny dog barks Any whimpers and he says, you're a coward.
The dog and which I called Willy know both quite funny, genuinely quite sad.
And it's only it is a really effective way of sort of showing how he thinks or confirming things.
And this clip is quite funny when he's like, You're Cold Willy. No, you're not William. Yeah.
Even when he starts growing to like the dog, he continues to just hold it. Really? Yeah. And. But he talks in front of the village hall and, you know, he's just doing the pleasantries and stuff, and at one point he says he believes and he does like little gags about like, you know, all all the Americans would be jealous of how beautiful you are and all that sort of thing.
Yeah. And that's what's going to end war, because all the American women are going to get jealous and then divorce or men go back home. Yeah.
You know, solid patter. That's a nice little speech. Some get passionate. But Jamie, what does he forget to do?
Well, you see, at one point he says he's a great believer in American and British supremacy, which is all world supremacy, I should say, which is already quite a dodgy opinion to state. But at the same time, he was supposed to say or he should have said British, American and Russian word, oh, of course he should have done that was so silly of him.
Exactly. So now he's in a heap of trouble because he's made Russian statements and all supposedly off the record. But he's he's really scuppered himself during a time when he was very vulnerable anyway. And that strangely, this one, I think he is genuinely very remorseful about Putin's own analysis of his flaws. He believes his biggest flaws, that he can't shut up. And which, you know, is true, and it's definitely exemplified in that scene, but genuinely, really sad, not sad about this, he really feels these fucked up unprovoked and that the world is out of gas.
And Parsons, a very big believer in God, is very pious man again, always in a slightly strange way, the scene, I think, a little later where he says to lead the man in the prayer, but then he asked God to smite their enemies and destroy them. So, again, even in this particular fashion, whilst he is a very religious man, he still does it in a very violent way.
Yeah, I think all of his things are kind of lost his life. Yeah.
But he's because he is a pious man, is beginning to feel this point that God is out to get him, which understandably causes them a lot of emotional distress. But it turns out that his old pal Bradley wants to go see him in France. That's right. A hops off on a plane with the other spare parts, as he says, morosely. See him and he and Bradley have a lovely little talk in Bradley shared office.
And Bradley says he's got a plan for D-Day. But, you know, he wants Patton to have a look at it like, yeah, but, you know. You need a screw screw awful general to lead it, and he goes, yeah, I said the exact same thing. But during the scene, issues will last, but we discover that Bradley has very mixed feelings towards passion, so having served under him for so long is becomes very clear that whilst Eisenhower is a big fan of Patton, no one else really is.
Bradley in particular says that he, if he had been Patton superior officer excessively, would have had him fired. And it doesn't really trust them, even though he does acknowledge his talents. He thinks he's too much of a loose cannon to really have around that any sort of military. But, you know, Patton gets to gets going on this D-Day and he's extremely good. Is it much better than anyone sort of expected? So he barrels through and then Bradley says, OK, Patton, you you've done your best.
You need to cut off supplies of gasoline for you now because you need to support Montgomery doing all this stuff.
Oh, Patton's old enemy. Yeah. And Patton doesn't respond to this very well. He's very, very mad. You know, there's nothing I can do. He says. Is that the perfect moment, the perfect instrument. You could definitely take Berlin that we just had the supplies. Yeah. And I've been quite harsh on Patton throughout this discussion. So I should make it very clear that the film does consistently portray him as very talented at being a military officer.
He is genuinely very good at what he does. Yeah, there's no real reason the film gives us to doubt Patton's claims that you could make it to Berlin if you wanted to. But regardless, he's hung up high and dry. Patterns, sort of stick patterns thinking a bit ahead, and he thinks that despite the fact that there's no logical reason the Germans would do it because it's winter and they don't have any supplies, they haven't to find one last big offensive.
So he sort of maneuvers his troops in anticipation of that. Turns out he's right. And that does happen as one last big meeting with the generals. And they're all like, we need someone to relieve this army, either being completely overwhelmed. Does anyone have troops? They can get there in like a week. You can get in there two days and they go, Patton, that's ridiculous. Your men have no food and it's cold. You'll be running them dry.
And Patton says, they're my men. They'll do what I tell them to. It's not because they like me, man. And then, you know, the men do that, they go about it with a smile on his face, they very genuinely seem to like him and he goes up the snowy mountain pass. Last week I talked about our, like, snowy cowboys. I like snowy Armus to snow. It's cool.
Snow is cool. And this is where he prays for good weather. Yes. That's the prayer. Exactly. Yeah. So he is quite well done actually, because he's praying for the good weather.
And then that's shown over the images of people getting blown up and shot and killed and stuff.
Yes. And there's no there's no noise of any of those videos.
It's just him praying, which I quite liked. It was cool. Yeah. Yeah.
Like I say, the song treats I don't know about Cupolas or the his own religious beliefs, but the film treats Pathans faith very seriously. I buy into it as much as he does. I don't think I ever really want that. It's. Must be definitely looked at as of I don't think the film ever tries to show that I Pathans a hypocrite or a pious man. And. Even though one could also make the argument that he would be, yeah, depending on one's own versions on military and religion.
Yeah, but like I say, part of our, as we said, Pathans, a very spiritual person in a way which is quite peculiar, but makes sense as an individual who is so emotionally resonant with the idea of warfare. I know, yeah, it's very interesting film is a very interesting man, the character they created, this is where they win. Which one not to spoil the ending of World War Two for anyone, but that's what happens.
He wins and then you see all the Nazis killing himself and burning all the papers. Yeah, they're like, God, that got them.
And he really showed us. And I think that's true. I think the German high command had a lot of respect for Patton in the same way that he had a lot of respect for them.
Well, I think in that case, we might as well talk about this now, because it seems that the sort of opinion of Farson in real life was that Eisenhower didn't quite like him, although he definitely thought of him not as a man for grand strategy, but just like if you gave him a simple instruction, he would do it better than anyone else. Mm hmm. You know, I mean, it does seem that the British and French really fucking hated them.
Yeah. Or at least thought he was an idiot. Not Hitler seems to respect him and think there's a quote which apparently called him a damned cowboy general, that seems that seems like something Hitler would say.
So, yeah, very unpopular outside of America in real life. I suppose that would make sense for the character in the film. Yes, it is the Americans American, which of course means he would be repellent to anyone else.
That's true, but, yeah, um, so, yeah, they win the war and then they are partying in Berlin, but the Russians are the ones that are really partying because they're the ones doing it first, of course. And also the film doesn't show them taking it. It does show them partying and it shows all the Americans sitting looking very grumpy and then actually party to the Russian General Toasties translator and a translator says, and this Russians inviting you for a drink to celebrate the war.
And Putin says you could tell him he's a son of a bitch and he can go fuck himself or whatever it is. And then the the guy says, I'm not translating that and then translates it to the Russian guy. And then the Russian guy said something back and then translated says he also says, you're son of a bitch. And Putin says, well, let's drink one son of a bitch to another then. And then they have a nice little drink.
And it's very weird that they're showing to each other so much. But also they drink together.
That's fine. I've definitely seen that in somewhere before. And it was bothering me intensely.
Was in Petten 1970 film the film I was watching right then. No. Yeah, sometime before that. It's really been bugging me ever since. I'm not seeing other in the first scene with the flag, which I'm sure I've seen. You know, like a flip flop or something. I definitely want, you know, the rest. I definitely see that exact scene. Who knows?
It feels like it feels like it could be type two.
Not definitely seeing that person. This is sort of. This all begins the, I would say, epilogue of the film. Yeah, sort of passing in the world without war yet.
And this is where he says the figures are there where he says, I can go to war if the Russians. I guess I can. I can I can I can fight the Russians and then and I'll make it think that they did it. And then everyone says, no, the war is over.
We are recovering. And he's going, no, we're getting all the Germans to give all the weapons and stuff. We should be using them to fight the Russians. And everyone's like Peyton can come down and, you know, the war is over. We won. It's all good. And he's and then he foreshadows it and he says that we're going to end up fighting the Russians anyway. And whether he actually said that or whether that's a 1970's edition, who knows?
But, yeah, I think it's a very good microcosm of this character because is a completely insane thing to say at the time. It's very clearly Patton so desperately pleading. Yeah. Reality at large to let him return to the one environment in which he is comfortable. Yeah. You know what would be enormous human cost. Yeah. Is right. He is right.
He's predicted what's going to happen. And yeah, I think I think it's also interesting in the answers. The question is both literally and sort of rhetorically asked for the film, which is what's he going to do when the war is over? And, you know, a lot of people actually say he needs war and what's going to happen. And I think even without those questions, you still as the audience imagine it in this kind of Shoghi for four brief.
However long is ten minutes in this sort of epilogue or the ending, you kind of see what he's like about the war.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
He desperately desires more and he almost gets killed by, let's say, the runaway oxcart, which is quite strange in its own way, because I think I think the point of that scene you might disagree is that I think it shows a pattern, becoming aware of his own mortality for the first time, but very paradoxically, as soon as the war is actually over.
Yeah. As a sort of moment of vulnerability, which is quite the same way.
And of course, he did die in a sad way.
I don't know how he died, but it was very soon after the war he was driving in his car and he said, let me find the quote. It's quite interesting. And he said something about. A war and the cost of war. Let me find a quote before a picture, he said.
And so he was on a pheasant hunting trip with some other generals and he was looking at derelict cars on the side of the road. And he said, and I quote, How awful worries think of the waste. And then moments after he said he got his car was in a crash of an American army truck at low speed. Everyone else was fine, but he hit his head on some glass and began bleeding. And then he was paralyzed for 12 days.
And then he died and and he said that this is a hell of a way to die. And then he died in his sleep. And and obviously he wanted to be he wanted to die at war. So, yeah. And I think the oxcart is almost I don't know why they wouldn't show his death, but I think it's almost a prelude, a prelude to actually I don't know if you know this film as a sequel.
I didn't know it has a made for TV sequel from 1985. Yeah, I lot that. But I think that's fine. I think. I'm assuming at the time of this film, they didn't know they were making a made for TV sequel. Yeah, no, I was just kidding with that. I think it works to just allude to just show patterns, impending mortality. And like as the audience, we know he's not going to die. And it's obvious even if he didn't know anything about his life differently, then that's not going to happen for him.
And this idea that, you know, his death is coming, even if even if he had lived so, you know, 1970 or whatever, he would still die and it would not be the glorious deficits.
Yeah, well, he was I mean, he died at age 60.
So, yeah, you have to think the I what age is quite young, but for soldiers quite old. I wonder if he maybe potentially he wanted the war with the Russians because that would be his options to die in battle. And I wonder if he was almost disappointed that he didn't get that warrior's death.
Oh, well, definitely. But where is that?
Yeah, I definitely think that's what he wanted to do. You think an element of the to go for Russia could be and he knows his time's coming and he wants to go out that way now.
Definitely an element, but I do also, even if he thought he would live forever, he would still do the exact same thing.
Oh, I absolutely. But I think there's I think there's definitely an element of that. Yeah. Yeah. Certainly the desperation, the final interview with Carson, where he's just sort of wandering around on a horse in front of some reporters in a slow circle in various mirrors, and they ask him a bunch of questions maybe. And one of them is about the fact that Patton hasn't gotten rid of Nazis and the German government yet. Listen to all of them.
And Patton says he's not going to do it until they get replacements, which again, I think does show Patton's complete disinterest in the political motivations of the war he spent the last four years fighting. Yeah, and then he says that, you know, the Nazi party is basically the same as the Democratic and Republican parties, something which is the final straw. He finally loses favor with Eisenhower, and this is where he's completely tossed out of any sort of Army man.
And the more interesting part of that interview scene, though, is that there are forces about all going to be one more weapons. They're talking about values in the interview, but obviously in a subtext be nuclear bombs. And Patton says that he doesn't he hates the idea of one of the weapons because there's no generals, no heroics. If you're just pressing the button and killing civilians and there's no honor in battle.
Yeah. Which I think very much strengthened into this idea of the film. That pattern is. So the last vestige of a dying era in times of war is a very common theme to these incredibly long epics.
I don't know why I'm sure someone's written a book. Probably, probably, yeah, but it's just, you know. It's what it is. There's obviously a great deal of cynicism at the time towards nuclear war, yet it's very rare. Obviously, that's one chapter in history. And so conclusively as another begins, obviously the end of the Second World War very much as that. Uh, the market, so we're financing is Parthian walking his dog Willy in the countryside, and he recalls the Roman general speech and he says, well, you know, a Roman general returned gloriously from battle.
But, you know, one of the captured men, a slave, whispered in not conquerors ear. The Old Glory. Glory is fleeting. Yeah, I is this final note, just to confirm to anyone who was watching that passengers not happy. But not enough, Richard Nixon. Good. That was passing those. I don't know if I made it really clear in my thoughts, Ari was maybe quite mean as a character, but I really liked the film.
Um, yeah, right, is there definitely not an acquired taste, but these big affects are definitely something we need to be in the right headspace to enjoy them. Yeah, because they are they can be quite dry. But I really enjoyed this. I find it quite, quite compelling. Yeah, I did.
I liked the way and it kind of to the men that were in charge of the various armies in competition and but yet still showed the battles and stuff. It was kind of a cool mix. Interesting mix. Yeah. And in terms of both generals are on the same side and how you so roll and stuff, that was cool and yeah, I liked it overall.
How do you feel it compares to the other war films that we watch, vastly better films like they are to some extent comparing them is disgusting. I wanna know how we this catch 22.
Oh, I'm a lot less cynical. One thing. Yeah. I was going to mention, um.
Obviously, the context of catch 22 and. More films are pretty much more cynical towards war itself. I would actually say that this film is not that no, I don't think I would walk out of that film and think isn't more terrible. Yeah, it's human suffering, I think.
Old war film, obviously, all war films are in danger of glorifying war to an extent, I think, particularly because this. Film is filtered through Pathans own viewpoint, which is all about his own glorification of the war he's fighting. Yeah, I think it's an inevitable consequence. And I think also I mean, it is kind of a he is kind of like the leaders that you see in catch 22 and. Yes. Very much so, very, very much so.
Yeah, I think I'm talking about Francis Ford Coppola is where I think General Patton is very much a template for the character that will become kind of Cold War in Apocalypse Now. And it's a film which is much more freely critical of the American military establishment. Same sort of zeal of the drama of it all the same. I was watching this film in a historical vacuum. It's a very interesting and quite compelling portrait of a deeply flawed but also quite brilliant man.
But I keep thinking about is that it was obviously released in a historical context where America was fighting a deeply unpopular war and that was obviously needed or at least was in dire need of massive public support.
I feel that the fact that a film that was released that so glorifies war, even if it's quite critical, it nonetheless presents a very positive face in the Second World War. I feel it's not Winston.
No. And I also think watching it, if, like I could imagine, both a student hippie protester and also an ultraconservative, like all businessmen watching this film time and both thinking that it was fantastic. Yeah, I think it's a film that takes a harsh stance on this issue, which I suspect is why I had so much mainstream appeal at the time. People like Marsh, I suspect that all businessmen would have been less happy with. Yeah, and the other warfrom we watch is a conformist, oh, yeah, that's so much better.
I see it's very similar obviously with much, much less of a budget.
I can't really remember the conformists. I feel like.
Yeah, you kind of bounced off it. Yeah, I like the conformists long and I would say it's probably about is a better one than the Satullo go that far on a visual level. I think also on the character level right now, although again, they're both they're both portraits of deeply flawed men during wartime performance is much, much harsher to its protagonist for the very reason that he's a Nazi by a lot. Yeah. So I suppose in that way I find a more engaging film in the way I find.
You know, these cinematic explorations of evil. Yeah, that's more interesting. But certainly they're both very successful at what they do.
Yeah, definitely cool. Um. Got anything else? I had a few random folks. Oh, yeah, another piece of background about this film, which I think is quite important to note, is that it wasn't made with his family's permission, patterns of interest, which I think is kind of weird. And they tried several times. They couldn't do a happened was alive. And then they wanted to do it without getting the rights from us, whether it was where they said no.
So the Western widow died and then they immediately moved to try and make it worth the rest of those remaining family. And they also said no. Right. So they never got access to General Pathans Diaries. This is almost all based off of accounts of people around him. Yeah, I think that Bradley, who was a consultant on the film, it's based off a couple of biographies as well, right?
And I think one of the interesting things I found out in this film is that we very rarely see Passan doing anything other than performing to the people around him. And so we're always afraid that someone says, I don't know if you're pretending or not performing. So that's fine as long as I know. Yeah, but obviously we're always seeing backing from other people's point of view. And part of me was saying, I think this probably is partly an intentional draft choice.
But I do also suspect that maybe a part of it comes from the fact that obviously the stories we know a pattern or from other sources who didn't have any information about his private life.
Yeah. Probably, um. It was directed by Franklin Schaffner at General Kimmitt. I don't. He made Planet of the Apes oh, cool, and he also made Nicholas and Alexandra, which was another epic.
It was produced by Sam Spiegel, who produced the world famous.
That's meant to be taken, isn't it? Yeah. And it was it was a critical failure. Mm hmm. Yeah. And it was produced by Frank McMurphy, who is secretary of the general staff of the United States Department of War during the war and and spent 20 years trying to get the film made, as you were saying, with the family and stuff.
Yeah. Well, what did you say his job was?
He was secretary of the general staff of the United States Department of War during World War Two.
Yeah, I mean, that's what ties into what I'm saying. Like, I think. You could be a big old fan of war and still very much enjoy this film. I don't necessarily know if that's the strength.
Yeah, he was. Frank McMurphy, he was a he became a film producer, he was linked to the Army. I don't really know what the secretary of the general staff, the United States Department of War, does, but it sounds like quite an important role. And then he made a bunch of war films as a producer.
And so, yeah, that's right and right. Exactly.
And we've not talked about the person plays Patton is George C. Scott who.
Yeah. You know, the. His face looks much more familiar now. I'm seeing a black and white picture. Oh, he was in The Exorcist free. In all The Exorcist free. Oh, right. He was always saying he was in 1984 as Christmas Carol. Yes, he was also in Dr. Strangelove, which is what I know. Yeah, that was that was one which is basically the exact same character, isn't it? Yeah.
The more crazy I presumably he was cast in this following. Yeah. Good. He was in that. Yeah. Oh cool.
Oh yeah. He was also in Christmas Carol and the for free.
So very very cool. Yeah. I suppose. Yeah. You know what the existence of general book targets and. Something about that makes me feel better about this film, I suppose. Yeah, just yeah, just that there's something. And a somewhat mixed feelings on this film. I don't it's strange, I suppose just I feel this film does glorify passing a law and. Even the mother doesn't shy away, but was beginning to like does it, does it does it sort of make you think that maybe it's a bit more self-aware than it initially seems?
If you if you kind of look at the background of him having played having played the character. It's obviously very satirical in terms of and obviously you want me to assume quite heavily being cast off of that. And maybe it kind of makes you think a bit more that maybe the film is is I mean, we've never said the film is necessarily glorifying patent, but maybe it kind of makes you sort of confirms that the film is not, I think, the film's Minnesota attitude towards patterns that is very critical of him as a person, but is genuinely in awe of his birth and talent.
Yeah, which I think is fair.
I mean, if it's accurate as a fair and nuanced enough opinion to have. I suppose I just yeah. Yeah, cool. That's the opinion. I have mixed feelings. I think you're supposed to have mixed feelings coming away from the film. What would you rate it? Idrissa Abai oh, really, Abay. Would you not? Well, I don't know, I was going to retire and seek out to watch it, but don't pay for it.
But now that you're reading it, I am thinking, would I retire it by.
Actually, I do not regret the 40 pounds 49 I spent on the. Yeah, you know what, Jamie, I'm going to say bye as well. Yeah, OK, I agree. And then but I'm going I'm saying buy it with tentatively, tentatively saying buy it. Um, but I'm definitely saying if it's available, it becomes available on Amazon or Netflix or anything, then absolutely. Watch it. And but do also buy it.
Lawrence of Arabia first, if you haven't seen Luscher is a much better HD film.
That's why I should, um. Oh yeah. One last thing. Yeah. Well, the nomination for its soundtrack and I didn't like it that much. I don't get a lot of these films that got big nominations for soundtracks. And this time you've got one really good opposite of one big theme tune which they like show again and again. I don't even like that one big theme tune for this film.
I honestly can't even remember it. So that's why I'm I'm just looking at Frank McCarthy that produces movies and his films. He also made one about MacArthur General MacArthur, which is just called MacArthur, and it's two hours and ten minutes long. So I wonder if he felt. And, you know, I wonder if he thought this was so successful that he had to make another one. Yeah, I mean, I can definitely see how you'd think like, this is this is replicable success.
Oh, just because I did the research, I actually done research. I saw a copy of Mad magazine that was released the same month as part in the film and a parody of it as like it's like. And the limits to jokes, but I can see from the pages they've reprinted and uploaded online with that patterns for a lot, which he did, and that the film is really boring. So if you want to know what the cool kids of pattern time that was at.
Not fun. Yeah, I think it was a bit dull. Jennifer? And I can see why one might say that. So we. Don't you think we're done here? Could I see you? We'll be back to doing films that came out that week.
It's almost 1:00 in the morning and very we'll be watching Bellini's made for TV documentary about clowns.
So enjoy that I buy.