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[00:00:01]

I'm Oprah Winfrey, welcome to Super Soul Conversations, the podcast, I believe that one of the most valuable gifts you can give yourself is time taking time to be more fully present. Your journey to become more inspired and connected to the deeper world around us. Starts right now.

[00:00:24]

He is one of my all time favorite people. And not just because his abs look like something chiseled out of marble or because he's among the most talented and charming blokes I know. What I love about Hugh Jackman is that he is 1000 percent so fully himself and so fully present in everything that he does. He is, of course, the main mutant behind the nearly two billion dollar X-Men franchise, but much more than an action hero. Hugh is a master showman.

[00:00:57]

He sings, he dances, and Forbes magazine called him the most powerful actor in Hollywood. In 2013, Hugh starred alongside Viola Davis, Jake Gyllenhaal and Terrence Howard in an intense crime thriller called Prisoners. But first and foremost, Hugh is a husband, a father and an all around good guy who recently co-founded a small chain of coffee shops for charity. Here in Manhattan, a next chapter.

[00:01:26]

Hugh Jackman and I get lost in conversation on a rainy day in his newly adopted New York City, we talked ourselves into a quiet little booth at the swanky Monkey Bar. I got to say, he was on the Oprah show many times back in the day, but we've never had a chat quite this personal. OK, first question to you.

[00:01:46]

I have to know, are these Photoshopped? No, I wish I in fact, when I looked at it, I was like, why don't I just eat pizza, drink beer and ask for photo shopping? Surely you can do that.

[00:01:58]

I mean, I feel like I can, like, climb them. That is more than this and that someone showed me this and I go, that can't be real. And that's going to be go. I'm going to ask him if I have to tell you.

[00:02:10]

I did I did a scene playing Wolverine and I was in the scene standing in front of a mirror. Yeah, I had showed off. In fact, everything was off, but the mirror was placed perfectly, couldn't see anything.

[00:02:23]

So and as I'm standing there in between scenes, I thought to myself, I will never, ever look like this again.

[00:02:31]

Hugh Jackman catapulted to international stardom in 2000 in the first of the wildly popular X-Men movies. He plays Wolverine, a powerful animal like Mutant, best known for his giant metal claws.

[00:02:46]

Now, more than a decade since that first film, Hugh is playing his iconic character for the sixth time. In The Wolverine. Looking like the Wolverine is a full time job, he works out nearly three hours a day. Imagine that eating every two hours. Imagine that at six foot two. He can bench press over 300 pounds. Imagine that. And once leg press a thousand pounds, you have this amazing ability.

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You can just do magic with your body. Is it? Yeah.

[00:03:21]

I've always been fascinated by the physical aspect of acting. You know, when I was taught acting, we did 10 hours of movement classes a week, not just dance, but how to use your body. And that obviously a lot of actors concentrate on the voice and your emotions, but your body is a great way to communicate.

[00:03:38]

So I sort of do thrill in whatever the challenges of that physically. And some of the blame is. For example, Tom Hooper said to me, I want you to be unrecognizable the beginning of the movie. And then we have to see 18 years later. And I just loved the challenge of that. My wife thinks I'm a little masochistic. She thinks that I secretly love Deb.

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I agree with you because I do use secret because I read someplace that you secretly love working out, do you?

[00:04:06]

Well, more and more I like it. I've liked them more in the last year. I have a trainer whose philosophy is not I'm not going to kill you every time I'm going to make it. So you want to do it.

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So I'd like to meet that trainer. So it's not you know, sometimes you try so hard that you just dread going. And I haven't trained like that. And actually the results have been better.

[00:04:28]

So are you are you training for Wolverine? Did you do three hours a day? Three hours a day.

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So two hours in the morning and about forty five minutes in the afternoon. OK, and what were you. It's very tough. What do you this is where you get to eat everything. You have 600 calories a day. Yeah, I read that in Hollywood Reporter.

[00:04:43]

This is the I literally ring Dwayne Johnson The Rock. OK, man, I've seen you in some movie. I said, what's going on? What what do I do? He's he went through the diet and it was six thousand calories eating every two hours, basically. Unfortunately.

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No, no, you're not easy to get 6000 of these. Yeah, yeah. That's one notch. Also a pizza. But no, it's I mean we'll look like two chicken breasts, steamed broccoli.

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So it's been some maybe some carbs. But as you get down to those kind of shots, yeah, that's when it becomes very scientific. That's when you go slightly less on no carbs. I even do a thing called water dehydration, which is what you did for Lamees, did you not?

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Yeah. Yeah. For the opening scene. Yeah. Yeah. So it kind of gets a little obsessive. I probably I'm someone who likes routine and discipline. Weirdly, I kind of revel when I've got a structure.

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So Wolverine is about bulking up and it's really for me. Yes. Bulking up but leanness malingers.

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He's the homeless people. Yeah. Unfortunately it's half, he's half animal. Half human. That's the struggle. And that's what's great about the character, because we all have that daily battle, the chaotic this is the control, the animal, this is the human that that idea, the part of a system that wants to be free. And we do what we want, but we live in a civilized society. So it's that dichotomy that he embodies fully.

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When you first committed. Yeah, I read that. That's the one thing the deputies got to do there is did you do it for the money?

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Did you do it for the money at first? For the audition. For the audition.

[00:06:24]

I wasn't here. I mean, how many film auditions came up?

[00:06:28]

Three every year. My hell, I would have done plays, academy eleven, whatever it was. And I never heard of X-Men. I mean, nothing to me. They did a worldwide search and I got three pages and I remember Deb reading it. She goes, A Wolverine senses danger. His nostrils flare and sneaked. I said, what? She sneaked SNC katik claws come out of his hands and she said, Oh, he can't do this.

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I said, this is ridiculous. He said, You're the Royal National Theatre. You can't be having Kolas come out of your hands. She said you're on your own. So I when I.

[00:06:59]

Hello, it is the only time she's ever been wrong in our eight years together that she'll admit it. Yeah. Yeah. Wolverine's been good to you.

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It's been great in every way. The last time we were together was we had that accident, and that's the last time it was too long. That was far too long. Hugh, how are you?

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We were in Australia for a big down under season 25, Xtravaganza Dyckman. Come on down to fit the go big or go home theme here was to zip line from atop the Sydney Opera House. And then this happened. He crashed headfirst into a bank of lights. Are you OK? I came in a little hot there. I think we need to stop a second. You heard his eye.

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Paramedics rushed in and within minutes it was headline news around the world. In the end, he walked away with minor stitches.

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Moments after that happened, when I realized that you were actually going to be OK. I thought this was Wolverine. It would have killed instantly. Instantly. How long did it take you to heal after that? Ten days.

[00:08:16]

Two weeks on that. Yeah. Now, actually, I remember getting the stitches. It was one of those things because it was very close to my eyes. So they put a mask over your face with just the slit for your eyes. So it's literally like a horror movie. The only thing you see coming towards you is that needle like right in your eye.

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But it was where you were. I was so worried.

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I was so worried, you know, and the very first thing you were worried. I was worried because, you know, you know, you hurt me and I could see blood. And at that point, whether it's ten out of ten or five out of ten, you don't know the difference. I thought my face could be open. My head could be off. I could be about to collapse. I actually thought I'd break my leg. So and I didn't turn around because for one of the first times ever, my son wanted to come to one of these events.

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I never take it. But he loves you, right. And he remembers you going down and reading a book to him and he goes, Oh, I like I probably you, baby.

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He's not a star famous person. He doesn't like any of it. He goes, I want to go and see Oprah. And I was like, well, this is 6000 people because I want to come. So he was sitting there in the front seat.

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That's what I remember most about that moment. That's when I knew that the heart of you is really a father because you wouldn't turn around.

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You said, I don't want to turn around because I don't know how bad it is, because my son is there, because you want your son to see you in that meeting.

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And he was crying. Yes. He was so tender attended. Why can't we just be a normal family? Why should we just be normal? What is my dad like? The wall I just walk on?

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We really have to do it.

[00:09:49]

That's what I said to the producers after what was wrong with the walk. It was Hugh Jackman. What on? You know what was funny?

[00:09:56]

I thought at the time, this is such a brilliant idea because as I come in, they're going to have to have shots of the harbour. It's going to be beautiful. Of course, the moment I got there, I realized there were twenty nine helicopters the entire time taking photos of the whole harbor.

[00:10:11]

So anyway, Hugh Jackman is one of the biggest stars on the planet, a brilliant, multitalented entertainer who seems to do it all, the dashing Aussie romance, Meg Ryan and Kate and Leopold and Nicole Kidman in Australia.

[00:10:28]

He is a Tony winner who's also hosted the Tonys and he scored rave reviews when he hosted the Oscars in 2009. In 2013, he received his first Oscar nomination with his dazzling performance in L.A. Misere.

[00:10:43]

I've always really adored you, but I knew after the interview that we did with you and Nicole for Australia, I knew that you were going to be big, big, big, big, big. Did you feel that? Did you feel that thing that happens, your star rising, that thing rising?

[00:11:01]

Did you feel that if I can articulate it that clearly, like it's funny you say that because Deb says the same thing. Yeah, well, she said it to me when we first met. She could feel it. She knew it. She knew it. I know what's going to happen. She has it scares me, you know, but I know this is what's going to happen to you.

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All we're doing. That's that soap opera, the. Yes, yeah. Yeah. My first job. And she was the star of it.

[00:11:23]

In 1995, fresh out of drama school, he was cast as a violent inmate in the Australian TV prison drama Carelli. It was a life changing role. That's because his future wife, Deborah leave Princess played his on screen love interest. Carelli only lasted ten episodes, but Hugh was on his way soon, starring in Oklahoma at London's prestigious National Theatre.

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Was it the dream to be an actor or was it to be a big movie star?

[00:11:56]

Oh, no, it was my dream. I probably achieved when I was twenty eight. Really, when I was at the Royal National Theatre. Yes, starring in Oklahoma and I was in the dressing room that Ian McKellen had just been in and I was able all those greats. There is a photograph of me aged twenty one like this outside the National Theatre that was to me the greatest actors at the time that were and I'd be to England a lot with Judi Dench and Ben Kingsley, Patrick Stewart, Ian McKellen, you know, like all these actors and I, the Royal Shakespeare Company, Royal National Theatre, this is the epitome.

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So when I was I remember walking home from work when I was like this, this was my dream. What's next? You know, we'll just see.

[00:12:41]

Twenty eight washed up. What am I going to do. Twenty eight I. Waking up twenty eight, I was in Baltimore and having a big cry because I thought I'd always done things, sort of been like a prodigy, and at twenty one I was this and this. And I was thinking, what else is going to happen?

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I am not the same. When did your show start?

[00:13:00]

My show started when I was thirty two. Really. Yeah. But at twenty eight in Baltimore I thought well don't. What else am I going to do. So when you moved. I moved. That's when I moved.

[00:13:10]

That's when I stepped in. It scathed. You know what, it really didn't scare me because I knew, you know, my life has always been because I think everybody's life has sort of a pattern and a flow. And mine has always been when I'm done learning and growing all as much as I can grow in whatever area I move to, the next thing, what I've done as much as I can do there, I move to the next thing I'm talking about you.

[00:13:33]

That is we're talking about a bit more of this episode after a short break. Today's episode is supported by better help. We are in extraordinary times. And if you're struggling with stress, anxiety or depression, you're not alone. Better Help offers online licensed professional counselors who are trained to listen and help, better help. Counselors specialize in many areas, including relationship conflict, anxiety, depression, loss, trauma and more. You'll securely connect with your counselor in a safe, confidential online environment.

[00:14:04]

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[00:14:24]

And our listeners get 10 percent off your first month with a discount code super soul. Join the over one million people already using better help. In fact, so many people have been using better help that they're recruiting additional counselors. In all, 50 states get started today at better help. Dotcom slash super soul. That's better help dot com slash super soul. Talk to a therapist online and get help. In 2012, you played Jean Valjean, an imprisoned peasant turned aristocrat, in the Oscar nominated film adaptation of Victor Hugo's Les Miserables, to get the gaunt look of the starving prisoner who went 36 hours without drinking any fluids.

[00:15:06]

Would you say that Jean Valjean was a turning point? Yeah, I think it was, yeah. I think weirdly for me. I mean, you know, me, Will Wolverine is not who I would immediately cast me is right, luckily for me, was the first job I did because I, I'd done the boy from Oz or Kate and Leopold. I would never been seen for it or if I'd been known for something else. But we they became known for that.

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And I always knew whether it'd be theater or music or other things that I could play. I feel confident there's many other things I could do. But actually Jean Valjean is probably the first thing outside. One of the first things that has really reached that kind of audience like an X-Men does.

[00:15:50]

Yeah, Lahm is a Broadway staple, was a challenging project to bring to the big screen in no small part, because Oscar winning director Tom Hooper insisted all songs be sung live during filming.

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Tell me about the process. Tell me about you wanted it. Right? You wanted it. You wanted that.

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It's a that's a frightening thing. Yeah. Because I probably protect myself by going, wow, you know, we'll see what happens, you know, we'll go along if something happened.

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So I auditioned early in the process early. I was the first person to audition.

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And what did you just audition would you have to do?

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I sang for three hours, so I sang all the material. You sang all the material. Yeah, but that was about 20 minutes. So we did I did an hour with the musical director first and and it was a funny story because I had a warm up and my singing teacher and my wheels have been stolen off my bicycle. So I literally ran with the frame of my bike down New York streets because I thought I was going to be life, that I've been stalking him up the steps, holding the frame of my bike.

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And it's funny and it's funny, Bojana, he was sweating terrible. And June, it was horrible.

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And so we went up and I sang for now. Tom came in. And Tom's very English is very polite, very charming to sit back and chair leg over, hands on his lap and listen. And I sang for 20 minutes. And true to form, as I know, that he really gave nothing out. I really had no idea, although I was fairly happy with how he'd gone. And then he said, OK, let's get to work.

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And he brought the chair up and he sat like here like we are. And he said Now. What I've just watched is probably an audition for a stage show, he says, but I'm going to be here for six months of your life. I'm going to be filming everything here. So we have to work all these songs so that you don't worry about the back row. You're just worried about me. And I have to feel everything. You're going to let us come into you.

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When I auditioned for Color Purple, I never wanted anything more in my life than I wanted to be in The Color Purple and won't, and since then have never let myself want anything that much. Because the feeling of putting yourself out there. Yeah. And with the possibility of being rejected.

[00:18:19]

Well, you know, my wife and I talked about this recently because you were a triumph.

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You know, it was a success and is a success.

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If you fail in those key moments, what happens to your spirit? Like I can pass you for years. And if you have two or three, Polda, maybe a marriage at work thing, it can be people break, you know, and it's it's putting yourself out there.

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Yeah, but you put yourself out there because you knew that you could rise to that moment.

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In 2000, he and his wife, Deb, adopted their first child, Oscar. Five years later, they adopted Ava.

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This is what's exciting is that you get to play Wolverine and now Oscar is old enough to watch some of them, right? Yeah. And what does he think of that he thinks are cool?

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That's as far as he's gone. It's pretty cool. Pretty cool that although just this morning, the father of a mate that he drives to school with is just said to me, Oscar's in the back telling my son Nick, who's Nick is a huge comic book fan, nonstop about the movie, about all the scenes he'd seen.

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This one's going to be really cool. This is the best one of them all. And Lalalala now, he's never really talked to me that much about it. And he was on set with me a lot. And he really loved the process of watching it. But it's a weird thing. I presume it's got a lot to do with the public private nature of our life and that he doesn't want me to be famous. He doesn't want me to be an actor.

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He doesn't he wants me to be his dad, you know.

[00:19:58]

In 2009, Hugh and his family moved from Sydney, Australia, to New York City, much to the delight of the paparazzi. They are often photographed around town, walking to school, buzzing through the streets on their scooters. Cameras are even there when Hugh hits the gym.

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It's interesting to me the way you seem to balance it. I mean, in Sydney, that felt like Hugh Jackman. But now New York feels like your kind of town and you are seen and photographed and you're on your scooter and have kids. And you're not one of those guys who's hiding from the paparazzi at all.

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I think if if if I chose a life, professional life or in any way, that would mean that I couldn't just go out with my kids. I would never forgive myself, in a way forced the situation where I'm going to live my life. If you can take photos like photos, they're not going to be sensational. You know, you might get a photo of me on my scooter with my kids. You can get a little bit of money for it, but not that much.

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I'm not going to be dating this person. That person getting drunk here and swearing, give me the middle finger. I say I'm just going to live a normal life and as much as possible. That's always been our approach. And we've managed pretty much to be able to do that.

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So how have you been affected by the rising sense of fame? Because, I mean, you're even more famous than the last time we met in Sydney. I mean, you got nominated for an Oscar. What did you think?

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I was blown away. I was literally I found out I was walking on the set. That's when all of a sudden I feel like the little kid from Sydney where he used to watch the Oscars with his dad and I used to get so excited because my dad worked for Pricewaterhouse as an accountant and those three daggy nerdy sort of accountants would come on, I'd get so excited for one day.

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It's going to be you, you know, and I immediately go back to that family in the world wanting to see it.

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Right.

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We used to stand and she put out so that it immediately reverted me back to a kid and actually is one of those rare moments where you stop and take stock and gun. And it's a weird moment of whatever happens in a business that can't be taken away from me.

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And it feels really great. Yeah, right. Yes.

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Yes.

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And also, you use so much of your relationship, not just relationship, but the character of your own father. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

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Well, I think it hit me weirdly late in the piece that my father is very similar to value. What I loved about John is he's a deeply religious man, my father very quietly religious.

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Like he's never said a bad word about anybody. He's very you know, various times, my lord, my brothers and sisters all go through their bits of not liking and not liking Dad or whatever. And he's never been back on your father. I did all this for you. He just takes it on like the way the white of the world.

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Did you ask him at one point, was he religious or how he demonstrated his religion? Yeah, he said he didn't talk about it much. I thought it was best to live it.

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We going to church now, handing out these fishes bad fish badges, and they encouraged everyone to put them on Acid said as a witness into the world says, I'm a Christian and they want to talk about listen to that. I said, why don't you why don't you wear one? And he said, I've always believed that actions speak louder than words. So unless your actions show that you're a Christian, that means nothing.

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And, you know, you just said he'd never said a harsh word about anybody. And he certainly had an opportunity to.

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When your mom left, when you were eight years old and he was a dad who had to go off to work at Pricewaterhouse every day. Yeah. Take care of five kids. Yeah. He could have been pretty bitter about that.

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Yeah. It must be really tempting at times to just say. But he never said anything bad about your mom even.

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Never, never. You never. He wouldn't hear it if there was anything you wouldn't hear. That is amazing.

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Yeah. That your mom left. Yeah.

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And people say to me and he did not say that I can't believe no one left me with you. He'd never, never nobody.

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That's part of sometimes I don't think that's a good thing. Dad kept a lot of these emotions inside. He just kept it within, you know, but he would never burden us with it. And that's that speaks to the character, right, of him.

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He was raised in Sydney, Australia, the youngest of five children, when he was eight years old. His mom, who he says battled depression, left the family and returned to her native England.

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You know, it's interesting, too, I read and it just when I read that, where you remember the morning she left and can you describe that in every way in the film of it runs like a normal day.

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She had a towel and a hair and around her and she said goodbye. And there was a weird kind of logjam at the door where was three or four, I don't remember her, but three or four of us saying goodbye. So we were lining up and I remember thinking I was just taking longer. I'm I'm going to go to school. And it was obviously mum saying goodbye, but I never before I left, I didn't think, oh, something's up.

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It just I can remember that now of her saying goodbyes, we went to school and then when we came back, there was something deeper in that goodbye.

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Yeah, yeah. Right. I don't think she thought she was going to leave for good then. I'm positive, actually. I think she thought this was something going on with Dad and her and her mother was sick in England. So I'm going to go back and see my mom and I think I thought I'd work it out.

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Yeah, I don't think I thought that this would be it, but yeah. But when I got home, I knew I knew that mom and left. How did you know. I just I just had a funny feeling in the house.

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In fact, from that moment on I could never go and I was terrified to go into the house. I was always first home. Right. Mom would be so from mama for a four or five years walking into the house. I used to sit out in the garden because inside the house was terrifying to me in the dark and being on my own until my brother and my sister came home. So there was something in that moment I knew. And I remember we were all waiting for mom and no one knew what was going on.

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And I remember saying to my dad, she's going to England and I she's going to England. He got really mad with me like this. And then he found a note or telegram and then he pulled us all together.

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And so how long after that time where she'd said goodbye at the door, was it before you actually saw her again?

[00:26:39]

It was around a year or Sundari within a year. She came back and then came back every year. And it was I always remember being very uncomfortable. I was sleeping on the couch and I was eight when mom left. So I knew a lot. But there's a lot I didn't know. So one year we went on a vacation together, all of us. It was obviously some kind of reconciliation that didn't work out. But so, you know, I did try to get back together.

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Yeah. And now you have a good relationship with your mother.

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Yeah. Yeah. You forgave her. Yeah. Yeah. And Mom would talk open. She would she wouldn't mind me talking about it because we've had everything. Yeah. She had very severe post-natal depression after I was born that played into it.

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And I think sometimes life gets too much for people. It's too much.

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You know what I admire so much about you and we were just talking about you on the way over here. Were you one of my favorite people on earth?

[00:27:41]

You to think? One of my favorite people on Earth.

[00:27:43]

But I was saying to the producer, the reason I admire you so much is because you live right in the center of yourself and you seem to live right in the center of life. You seem to have mastered that really well. Was that a conscious thing?

[00:28:01]

Tips help me along with that. Really within myself, I think is something I always was drawn to in terms of who am I, what I want.

[00:28:11]

Yeah, but what you see is really really. Yeah, but that's the work isn't it.

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I just want to be what you see is really who you are. You just really are the real you all the time.

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I have a job where I pretend to be other people, but I have to do it from a knowledge of who I am.

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I found this interesting when you started filming Lamees that you actually went to our friend Tony Robbins, of all people to help you. Had he been a friend before? Yeah. Yeah, OK.

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And I said, mate, I know we're friends.

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And I said, I really want to talk to you about something about last night, my friends, my and I chatted with him and I said, I hate it when sometimes the fear gets in the way.

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I hate that feeling of fear. I hate being afraid. I was a very fearful kid. I was afraid of the dark because I was afraid of heights. I froze rock climbing and my friends, I hated that idea. And I made myself get over those fears. And now I'm no longer. But if anything comes up to me and I know you relate to this, if I feel frightened of it, I have to attack it. I have to go in because I'm terrified that it will creep into other areas of my life and just start to take over.

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So.

[00:29:19]

So what were you afraid of? Not being in my best. Not making my best when it mattered for Volson Valjean. It's happened before. Yeah.

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But basically he said you cannot get rid of those nerves or the you can't get rid of them. And they appear for a reason because maybe you need to do more work. Maybe you're not ready. Yeah. That fear drives you. You said without that fear you would not be here today.

[00:29:47]

I know you have this theory too. I saw you an actor studio, which I thought it was a beautiful interview where you were talking about we are always and I think that this is not just for actors, but in life you are either improving or growing or decaying.

[00:30:02]

Yeah, I mean, it's the cycle of nature. And where we are, we governed by the laws of nature. All of us relationships, life, death, and it's never stagnant and stagnant is a horrible thing. Anyway, in nature. We the idea that marriage is to stay the same is not. You're either getting closer and you're more intimate and more honest, more caring, more loving or less.

[00:30:26]

Hugh was just 26 years old when he met Deborah Lee Furness, an established actress with more than 20 films on her resume. She and Hugh were married a year later and recently celebrated their 17th wedding anniversary.

[00:30:39]

When you're saying that life, marriage in particular mirrors nature, would you say that your work and your ascension into stardom has brought you closer together, has grown you?

[00:30:54]

As a couple, I think definitely and I say that with some. Little bit of reservation, I don't think they would mind telling you of all people, but it can be difficult at times because as she will, she'll call it the chopped liver syndrome sometimes. And it can be this Hugh Jackman and get that personal. I've literally seen her knocked away. You know, people try to push her aside. And as you know, Deb, Deb is way more vivacious, gregarious, outgoing.

[00:31:24]

She's like you. She holds rooms by nature.

[00:31:27]

So it's difficult. That's what attracted you to her? Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, you were the guy in the background and she was the spark. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:31:34]

And I have become infinitely more confident and infinitely, I think, braver and more within myself from being with it.

[00:31:44]

I've learned a lot from them. She trusts herself implicitly. She is fearless about everything she does in life. She doesn't care what other people think. It is a compulsion for her to act from her heart.

[00:31:55]

So how has it been for her to watch you and sort of she's sort of generally amazing.

[00:32:02]

I think she's been amazing and it was a choice. And that's where I suppose nature has helped like it did when I met her. David Dunne. Twenty five films. It was my first job. Yeah. She was like, I've been on that, I mean, at awards things. And I've won the awards and I've gone back to my hotel room with my award and I'm really lonely. And what's all this about? She wanted a family and a husband and children and she didn't want to miss that.

[00:32:29]

And we had children and she's been with them and it's been amazing.

[00:32:35]

Would you say you're in the Dharma, the word Dharma? Yes. Yeah, the feelings, your souls calling.

[00:32:41]

You're living in the heart of it. Would you say that you're living your dharma? You. Yeah. Are you there? Are you there?

[00:32:48]

I definitely feel family wise. Always felt that. And work wise that. That I'm in the right place for me, whatever I'm meant to learn or contribute or be part of that, I'm in the right place. So now I'm just going to keep watching the signposts, make sure that I'm. Staying awake, you know, I miss anything and fully aware, fully aware and sometimes harder to do when things are going well, easier to just cruise, feeling good is good.

[00:33:20]

And then all of a sudden you're not growing anymore and your life can contract.

[00:33:23]

So how do you make sure that doesn't happen to you? What do you do? You marry a woman.

[00:33:27]

Ideally, you meditate, you have children and you you show up and stay awake and enjoy. I think I can get serious. I can get a little serious sometimes. Deb's really help me just to enjoy and.

[00:33:44]

But the children too. I mean, I, you know, since it's your children, you became a different person with your children 100 percent. Yeah. You know, and that's I mean it. And you have always. Yeah. And you learn so much, you know. Patients not to be too judgmental, to be softer in the middle. That would give them a good structure from the outside, a more forgiving of myself, like I'm more forgiving and understanding of them and also the fragility I see in both my kids, you know, both are adopted.

[00:34:17]

I see sometimes fragility. So you have to be awake and listening, loving and caring for them in a very present way. And what's most important to you? What really matters? Right now, it's being hit and whether it's with you or with my kids, with my wife really living life, so I'm watching you live your life the way you do, makes me want to live mine on a higher vibration.

[00:34:50]

It is. Yes, it is. That's what you do for the best. Thank you. Can I eat the bread now? You eat. That was fantastic.

[00:35:00]

More champagne on my mind. This is Wine, Utah. Having far too much fun. Did you hear us at all? John is trying to stress John is so up in this now.

[00:35:11]

Yeah. Just I'm sitting in our presiding dad. I'm not like. That's what you want.

[00:35:19]

You are at the top of my list, the top of my list. You don't have to open this now.

[00:35:23]

You just open it at home and enjoy it. Yes. Yeah. This is going to be the end of this movie at the end of when I will never look like this ever again.

[00:35:31]

And this is where teachers all over the half. Yeah. Thank you.

[00:35:35]

So, Dad, tell me this. I mean, really, those are the these he told me that this was not retouched. He looks like is Photoshopped in the flash. I, I say it's ridiculous. You look Photoshop. So, you know, one is more disciplined. He works really hard at it. And it is no fun for the family because he never got to eat. It's like he's always having another cow or a chicken or a broccoli.

[00:35:58]

I was talking to him though about when he was on and did Australia how I could feel that star rising. And he said you also had felt that he said he felt it right at the beginning to I think women have an intuition anyway.

[00:36:11]

And I mean, even when we got together, there were so many things that we talked about. I just knew that that was going to happen.

[00:36:17]

Oh, well, you know what I love when you surprise him at the Tony Awards. I was I was terrified when in a rare public appearance.

[00:36:25]

Yeah. I'm surprised you by presenting an award at the Tonys honoring his Broadway and humanitarian work.

[00:36:32]

How did you do that? They rang me. They asked me and I knew when they said they said, look, this would mean a lot to him, would you do at the Tonys? And straightaway I was like and like this. I don't like doing the public speaking. I was like, oh, my God, what a choice. It was like Sophie's Choice because I knew he'd love it. I knew I had to do it. It was the worst thing keeping a secret.

[00:36:48]

And I'm terrible, terrible.

[00:36:50]

So I just thought I have to do this. So yeah, I mean, and I love and so when I worked out, I was nervous, but I don't even think about anything else I was looking at with his face because I wanted to see when he looked up and saw that that's what. Did you think she'd gone to the bathroom? I never saw her twice. And I remember thinking because they told me when my award was, I said, it's 12 minutes away.

[00:37:09]

And then all of a sudden I said, oh, now a special Tony Award presentation. Now, though, because I believe his mother was my fault, because I said no, you could talk to him.

[00:37:20]

And I'm like, when I walked out, I didn't think of anyone else. I just looked at his face. He was like, Oh, my God. But it was fun.

[00:37:25]

It was great. Yeah. Thanks for stopping by. Are you. Pleasure. Pleasure. Thank you, guys. What are you guys the best. QWhy in. Those guys, oh, my God, please. Oh, my God. In the world, Jesus. It's ridiculous. Can I just feel like six months from now I want to make sure that we're safe in here? No. Oh, my God. That is real. I know.

[00:38:11]

I have a real I'm Oprah Winfrey, and you've been listening to Super Soul Conversations, the podcast, you can follow Super Soul on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook. If you haven't yet, go to Apple podcast and subscribe rate and review this podcast. Join me next week for another super soul conversation. Thank you for listening.