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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the car rental studios. The Dave Ramsey Show, that is dumb. Cash is king and a paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. Chris Chris. OK, Chris Coleman. That's a combination of Ogen and Coleman. Chris Hogan. That guy is the Ramsey personality number one bestselling author. No, him. All I do is my co-host today.


The phone numbers, triple eight eight two five five two two five. Benjamin is with us in Washington to start off this hour. Hey, Benjamin, how are you?


Hey, David. Well, you know, I thank you for taking my call. Sure. What's up? So I'm married. I got a 10 month old and we're looking at getting out of baby step to paying off around 80000 dollars of debt. We've got twenty two thousand fifty two thousand dollars of student loans left. Good. Got about. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, I got it. It's been a journey, that's for sure. We've got about twelve thousand dollars saved and expecting an income boost around March.


And the boost may be just enough to cross the finish line with maybe a thousand dollars for an emergency fund. So my question is, is there any kind of real sign of trying to look through the archives? And I think I need to see some answers, but I'm just I'm here.


Stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. I'm confused. Did you just say it? Twelve thousand dollars in the bank. Yes. OK, well, you're not working the play, you're not working the baby steps. Well, where were you this past year? We were. So you're working your plan? Yeah, well, yeah, if you want to work out a plan, you're right.


Eleven thousand are checked today and now you're eleven thousand dollars on your student loans and your dollars in your account.


And then we can ask the.


Yeah, that might answer my question. I was going to ask about like a rule of thumb for my situation, considering we have a baby. But yeah. You know, it's ah. Your job.


No, no, you're paid to maybe, maybe. Yeah, that's true, yeah, Benjamin, the only the only time you would have adjusted is if you'd had a loss of income or been furloughed. Then we were telling people to stockpile money. But even in that, during that period, once your income got stabilized or your hours got stabilized, the money you had saved, you would get back on the plan. So you wouldn't you just you just need to write that check if you're going to do our plan.


Now, like Dave always said, yeah, you'd reserve the right to do whatever you want. But I want you to know this side of the finish line is better then when you finish the other 11000.


And that's what your household income, we pull it up here and they sort of, oh, roughly, you know, ballpark. I think we're about one hundred and twenty thousand.


This phenomenal way to go, dude. Well done. OK, so you're going to knock that other one out and what, too much.


Yeah, we're we're projecting in March, you know, and and, you know, actually I laid on that ten thousand dollars loan forgiveness that I know the government.


If you wait on the government to fix your life, your life's always going to suck. So that's a rule of thumb. Yeah. So what we're gonna do is go to eleven thousand a day. We're going to be debt free in the next two months, and then you're going to build an emergency fund. And you've heard us say it a thousand times. You wanted to know how much is in your emergency fund, three to six months of household expenses, which in your household, it sounds to me like, is five thousand dollars roughly a month would probably keep you afloat.


Seven hundred fifty seven hundred. OK, I was pretty close, almost like I've done this before in six, six times three or six times six. So we're between 18 and thirty six thousand dollars for your fully funded emergency fund. You've got a new baby. Everybody's concerned about that, including me. Why don't we round that up a little bit and just say we're going to be at about thirty thousand for your emergency fund when you're finished with that? I think the period of, you know, like taking it all off and then building it up, that kind of started from the thousand, you know, I think is the challenge.


And in my in my mind, I think that may be causing stress, but I want it to be OK.


I want to I wanted to be a whip on your back that causes you to run through the finish line at freaking sprint mode. Mm hmm. Yeah.


The purpose of this is for you to not be comfortable to run like your hair is on fire, to get out of debt. That's called Gizelle intensity. And that will cause you to be very freaking focused on not only getting out of this debt, but getting that emergency fund in place, because due to the number of people who can be debt free but they're home and have a fully funded emergency fund is only about 10 percent of the people in America that do it.


Now, everybody can do it, but almost no one does. Right. You're gonna be in the top 10 percent of Americans when you have no payments but a house payment and thirty thousand dollars in the bank, which which makes you officially the third pick. I mean, you are the pig in the brick house, right? Without a doubt. And when a pandemic comes in, he huffs and he puffs other people's house down. Whatever you're sitting there with thirty thousand dollars cash and not a payment in the world, but your house payment and a baby, you are protected.


Well, good, daddy. Yep. And here's the thing. Don't think about the money that's leaving you in the savings. Think about the money that's leaving you. That's debt. Think about the interest that you're paying, which is a penalty. So it's just a shift in paradigm. It's called it's called intense freaking. Lay your ears back.


Focus, get it gone. Get her done. Yeah, buddy. And you can. And just think of the legacy your 10 month old is going to have. Yeah, it's a game changer, my friend. So again, I understand that line of thinking, but you got to think different to the end of 90 days.


You will have as much money as you have today. No, you really will. You will be debt free. And you have started rebuilding that emergency fund. Yeah. So we're not talking about a long time. We're not leaving you out on the edge of a cliff all winter. You know, it's 90 days from today.


You'll be right back where you are today, except Sallie Mae will be gone. There's that.


There is big. That's big. So come on, buddy, you can do it benjaman you know what is interesting and the reason I point that out, Chris, is and for you guys listening, you need to you need to do this for yourself sometimes too. I have to do it too is sometimes how we perceive this.


Risk or this pain or this fear or this horrible thing, until we put a timeline on it and we go, well, that's not very long. That's right. By next Friday, this would be over. Right. You know, by. But, you know, this really sucks. But in a week, it'll be a memory, you know, or in three in three months. I'll be right back where we are, minus two to lunch.


So it's not like we're like leaving this little family in peril. No, not dangling on a thread because Ramsey doesn't understand that a thousand dollars isn't much anymore. You know, all this bull crap that you see on Twitter about us. Right. And how stupid we are and all that stuff.


So but I think the point is that.


You know, I mean, like, for instance, OK, we're not going to a restaurant, we're not going out, we're not going to go on vacation while we're in baby step to work is so intense.


We're selling everything. We're working extra. We're on beans and rice, rice and beans, scorched earth. We sell so much stuff, the kids think they're next. We're completely focused, completely focused, completely focused, completely focused, completely focused.


You don't do that for 20 years, right? Most people do it for 20 months, right? I think some do it for 30 months. Right.


Not many do it for three years. Right. That's almost everyone that we coach ends up dead free except their home inside of 36 months, like 90 something percent of the time. That's a good point. And you cannot in forever. You can do anything for a little while, people. That's it. Get it, this is the Dave Ramsey Show. Free at last, it was one of the best decisions of my life. That's what Neil said about using time-Share exit team to get out of his timeshare after the resort refused to let him out.


Listen, I've said it before. If you've tried selling your timeshare and can't. If the resort refuses to take it back, call timeshare exit team. The people I trust call eight four four nine nine nine exit or time-Share exit team dot com.


Ever feel like you'll never save enough money or pay off all your debt after a year like 20, 20, a lot of people lost hope and they feel like they're stuck. Well, money should not be one more thing that you have to worry about or be stuck about.


That's why in 2021, we are hitting reset, because no matter what's happening in the world, you can take control of your money. You just need a plan and a proven plan.


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Outrageously generous, all these things happen, so if you want to get in Ramsey place, that's where Financial Peace University is, that's where the every dollar premium app is the baby step tracker app. They ask a coach the communities that are going to cheer you on all kinds of other classes in there to man, this thing's chocked full. You can do a free trial. Wow, that's kind of ridiculous. So time for a reset. Go to Dave Ramsey, dotcom slash reset and the Ramsey plus team will help you with those small daily wins.


They'll hold your hand, show you exactly what to do this and then do this and then do this for 90 days. And there's nothing better than a great start. Dave Ramsey, Dotcom Reset. Jackson is with us in Utah. Hi, Jackson. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Thank you. I just want to first say thank you for your show. I've been listening for about a month now and I absolutely love it.


Well, thanks. How can we help?


So just a little background. I'm 19 years old. I have twenty three thousand dollars in the bank with a sixteen thousand dollar auto loan that I have a two year plan paid off. So I leave to basic training a week from today. And when I get back and I plan to have thirty thousand dollars before I go to school again in the fall. So my question is, should I invest in a Roth IRA right now or should I get that car paid off when you go to school in the fall?


Is the military paying for it? Yes, I'll get my tuition paid for 100 percent. Cool. Good for you. So which branch are you going into? Jackson. The Army National Guard. OK, good for you, that's a good program they've got we've been sponsored by them and been bragging on them for many years. They're just wonderful. It's a wonderful program you're doing right? A check and pay off your car today.


And paid off today. Mm hmm. Kind of put your stomach in your throat a little bit. Jackson. Yeah.


Yeah, well, you got a pretty expensive car for this situation. You could consider moving down in CA because you're a college student with a sixteen thousand dollar car.


Yeah. And the good news is your college is paid for. Are you getting a stipend as well?


Yeah. How much so. Well, not a statement but I will did get the benefits from the guy just comes out to almost a thousand dollars a month. OK, if that's what you ask.


And are you living on campus or at home.


So I just moved home from college in the fall or in the summer. I'll be living in student housing.


After days of training. OK, but in this coming fall, you said you're going to school, right? Yeah. And you will be on campus then. Yeah, is that paid for plus a thousand dollars or you need the thousand dollars to pay for that? No, it's the tuition paid for plus a thousand dollars. Now, what about the housing? No, I'll be paying for the hell out of the thousand dollars.




OK, so what I'm trying to figure out is if you pay off that car today, are you going to have enough money to go to school in the fall and pay your bills? Yeah, I plan to I have a job right now, I find work part time for 20 hours a week even while you're in school.


OK. OK, yeah that's wonderful. Yeah, that is. All right.


So if you can, I want you to go back and check my numbers, OK? But I think I'm understanding you with the tuition paid for in the thousand dollars stipend and the seventeen dollars plus you've got seven thousand dollars left over and you said you'd have 30 by the time you get back home. So that's another seven. So you have 14 in there. I just want you to be able to go to school with zero debt and no car payment and be able to eat.


If you can do all of that, I want you to pay off your car today. If you cannot do all of that, I want you to sell your car and move down in car and pay cash for the car that allows you to do that. One of those two things, I think you can pull it off. Yeah. If I've understood your numbers correctly in this conversation, I think you can pull it off now.


And Dave, you point out the point of understand that that's too much car for that, for his income in his situation.


He's a college student. Right. And he's and he's forward thinking. I mean, No. One to be nineteen and have twenty three thousand dollars saved in an accident. That's a big deal. And so great job there. Yes.


A thousand dollar loan. Not so great job. Not so good. Right. Yeah. So it's like the happy Hogan said, Hogan, you know, you don't want to do that. But Buddy, to to stroke that check if you run the numbers. Oh my friend, you said it's an emoji, right.


Is it a booty. Really happy Hogan said Hogan emoji or at least to me. Yeah, at least to me. We've got to mean we've got to do it. Speaking of, if you've not checked out the Chris Hogan Show, I want you to check it out. Get over there. Speaking of that, I am notorious for facial gestures and expressions. They've got Jephson things set up on the team shows during the show, but we have a lot of fun.


The Chris Hogan Show. Check it out. You can find it on YouTube, Apple podcast, Google, all the things. We have a lot of fun. It's color driven as well. And we do some segments called Panicker Pump. Do we get to see the happy Hogan? Yes, we do. We do. And Dave, I've got a flag that I throw on people who are doing stupid. I'm so like, throw a football throwback, throw a penalty flag on a football throw.


Right. But you got to come check it out. Are you wearing your little referee, man? No, they take it on and off so much I don't want to be wearing it. So frustrating to me that it's a hilarious. It is. It really is. So no, no mass hoggins. Don't mind just me having fun. Come on, check it out.


Happy Hogan. Sad Hogan emoji. I know there's going to be some money I can make on you someday. I'll sell that right now. I'm I'll put that on the store so I'll sell it for a dollar fifty. There you go. About a million em by nightfall. There we go. Make a few dollars. Here we go.


Say Philadelphia. Hey, Sam, what's up, man?


Sam, how are you? I'm doing well, thank you. Are you better than I deserve? What's up? Oh, I'm so happy to be. On the last two days, I probably injured, like, twenty five hours of your podcast, so it's really nice to be on and you need to get some sleep.


Are you, are you new today.


So I sort of see some of your Instagram videos maybe four months ago and I kind of recently just kind of get into podcasts. And I saw your videos the other day. I was like, OK, maybe I should try, you know, get into this and I am hooked. Now we're on our brother.


That's awesome. How can we help you today?


So personally, I'm following pretty well. I'm working. I have I was about fifty student loan debt. I should be done this time next year, which I'm really excited about. I'll be very good. But I'm actually calling about my parents because. How old are you? I am on Monday. I'll be twenty four. OK, and what's your household income.


I make fifty two, OK? And you want to know how to get them doing what you're doing. Yes, they are doing exceptionally well, I mean, they're making really good money, but I mean, they seem like they're saving more and they have debt and has a motorcycle, a car, and they sell the house to finish.


Now, what you're going to run into, Sam, is what we call the powdered butt syndrome. Once someone has powdered your but they don't really want your advice on sex or money. And so your chances of you teaching your parents this stuff is very low. The only thing I can suggest you do is you tell your story.


You don't tell them what they should do. You tell your story. Mom and dad, look what I'm doing.


Look what I'm doing. Look what I'm doing. Look what I'm doing. You might infect them with the virus. And I'm not talking about covid back. Yeah, the happy, happy Hogan. That is the happy Hogan families. Share it and tell about it, buddy. I'm telling you. Yeah. Just talk about your story. Tell them what you are doing. Oh, no. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Chris Hogan Ramsey personality is my co-host today, open phones, a triple eight eight two five five two two five eight two five five two two five.


Dave is in Pensacola. Hi, Dave. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. Thanks, guys.


Thanks for taking my call. I appreciate listening to your show. We enjoy it. Thank you. How can we help?


I have a question of your opinion on a medical bill. We have a Christian health care and we had an incident where I was injured and all expenses were paid except for transport. They don't cover transport unless it's life threatening. That's the policy we had. And also short transport was close to fifty five thousand dollars. Good Lord, would you do fly the bird?


Yes. I know, and I didn't even get the pair of shoes, that was a matter of fact, that was pretty much out for the whole the whole short flight I could have. So you got like seven. No, I didn't. It was it was just flown to another city to where they could do a surgery on on on my on my hand, they couldn't do it in the city that I was in and so in my hometown. So they chose to fly me elsewhere to have the procedure done.


Why did you not?


Were you awake? Who was advocating for. I was awake, but it was an amputee, I'd cut off, I'd cut off a finger and they felt like it was important to get me to the nearest city as quick as possible to have it reattached back on. Did it work reattached? No, I'm sorry. That's OK. You know, I had to go back a week later and have it. You have removed. It was just a it was my so but anyway, I that was my question to you.


Is it should I be, you know, concerned about that Bill, in terms of right now I'm just paying twenty five dollars a month. Yeah.


I have to be concerned about it. I mean, it's a legitimate bill and they can they can afford to send us the wrong word.


What should I expect to would you negotiate? Yes. You know, is that is that reasonable to. Yes. Try to pay that entire amount or should I try to negotiate that down? I will get your thoughts as well.


I mean, do you have fifty five thousand dollars? No. OK, then we don't have a choice. OK, what's your household income? About 70, OK. All right, I think I would talk to the president of that air company there, probably a local company there. And they where did they fly you from into Pensacola to where? Birmingham. OK, in a jet. Prop plane. Turbo prop. OK, well, their hard cost in that flight was a tenth of what they're charging you.


It did not cost them fifty five hundred dollars to make that flight and the turbo prop. Fifty five thousand. No, I said a tenth of that is their fuel, their fuel cost, and it didn't cost them.


Yeah, they already own the airplane. They got to put fuel on the airplane. They got to pay a pilot. And they're paying insurance and hangars and other stuff and they're running a business. I get all that.


But in terms of if you chartered a turbo prop from Pensacola private to go to a ball game in Birmingham, you would pay 5500 dollars over and back. OK, go look it up, go go look at a charter site, go look at air charters. OK, OK.


And that'll help. You mean that we're not putting this poor guy out of business by him charging you fifty five thousand. I understand it's a medical flight. Right. And all of those kinds of things.


But I don't that helps me with my conscience. In other words, of in your case, I'm going to call up and settle this for ten cents on the dollar. And what will help you to do that is two things. One is you need information.


So go to a charter site and just figure out, you know, find out, get a bid from a charter from two different charter companies for a turboprop like a King Air to to something like that. To engine craft. Right. Yes, sir. Yeah, OK. All right, you can tell I've done this before. All right.


So in terms of chartering stuff, so, yeah, go, go charter it, you'll be amazed and then go look at what it cost to charter and go call the president of the Life Flight Company, whoever they are, and say, listen, I only make seventy thousand dollars a year. My insurance does not cover this. I don't have fifty five thousand dollars. I'm grateful for the flight. Even though I didn't wasn't able to keep the finger.


It didn't work out. But I'm still grateful you all did your job. And I'm not accusing you of doing anything wrong. I'm asking for some mercy.


And I looked and I saw that I could have chartered the flight without it being a medical flight for about fifty five hundred dollars.


Would you consider working with me and giving me some kind of a discount so I can just write you a check and call this a day?


I owe you something I can't pay you fifty five and you're just being humble with your hat in your hand.


You're not being arrogant, you're not accusing him of ripping you off or doing anything wrong. He didn't do anything wrong. You didn't do anything wrong. Right. There's no there's no villain in this story.


OK, but but but he's not going to lose fifty five thousand dollars by you writing this down to fifty five hundred. He's going to break even. That's what I was concerned about, I wanted to make the moral morally right and think about the way I always think about these things, too, is if a guy called me and the thing was reversed, you own his company now and he's going to call you. I make seventy thousand dollars a year.


I don't have any money.


The you know, the digit you know, the reattachment of the finger did not work. But that's not your fault. You guys did your job. Thank you so much. I'm curious. I was curious of what it actually cost you to take me up there. And I know that you've got expenses and planes and I know you're running a business. And I'm not trying to I'm not trying to do this. I just don't have any money. And I'm trying.


And I looked it up and I could a private chartered this for about five thousand dollars or three thousand eight hundred dollars or sixty two hundred dollars or whatever the actual number is. It's going to be somewhere in there. It's going to be less than 10. Yeah.


And, you know, you know, would you take that if I can scrape that together and let's call this a day. And if somebody called you Dave in that situation and broke you even and you probably weren't going get your money anyway. Hello. Yes, sir. Yeah, because you don't have it, then, you know, I'm going I'm going to extend mercy to a guy like that that comes to me like that in our business. Now, if a guy comes in here yelling at us and his cousin Addison saying we ripped him off and we're supposed to give him a deal, I'll fight that guy down to the ground and break his, you know, no, we're not doing that.


Yeah, but, buddy, come in here with your hat in your hand and figure it, you know, different spirit, Dave. And I think you're doing the research. You going in having that conversation, you taking notes and being clear. It's all about the spirit that Dave's laid out for you here, for you to be able to take the approach. That's kind of the way you're wired anyway, isn't it?


Yes, sir, and that's why I wanted to ask the question, because obviously we could get a loan, we have no other debt. You have a small family debt, but we own our house. You know, we could make arrangements to do so. But with it being, you know, it just would be an extreme burden to have to do that.


I wouldn't even go into that what you were going to do now. That's right. This is just this is one of those situations where a Tylenol at the Walgreens is is is is a, you know, one tenth of a penny when you buy a whole bucket of them.


Right. And if you buy it at the hospital, it's six dollars.


Yes, sir. That's what this is. And, you know, again, the guy's not doing anything wrong. He's in a specific industry. That's the business model he's chosen to endorse, embrace. And the insurance companies will pay it most of the time. But you don't have that policy, right. And so you're there.


That's expensive. That's an expensive trip. I'll tell you. I'm sorry, Dave, but I think you've got a process to be able to walk through, my friend, to try to get so many ways. Yeah, it really is. It's ridiculous. It's what it is.


So when you're negotiating and you want to do the right thing, which is the only way you ought to negotiate, he with the most information usually wins. So gather up information, go get you some in this case, chartable, did some research and you know your financial situation. That's right.


And you share that with this guy and bring him up to date and see if he can't make a deal. And usually with an individual, you can make a deal. Good. Our Scripture of the day, Romans, 14, 18 through 19, whoever this serves, Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding. Winston Churchill said mountaintops inspired leaders, but valleys mature them open phones at eight eight two five five two two five.


You jump in, we'll talk about your life and your money. This is your show. Chris Hogan Ramsey personality is my co-host today. Mary is with us in Tacoma, Washington. Hi, Mary. How are you? I am well, thank you, thank you, thank you for taking my call. Sure. My question is actually from one of Mr Hogan books I read that you could move money from your IRA to your HSA one time, and I was wondering why you would do that and if I should do that.


But are you sure you read that right? No, I don't. I don't think, yeah, I may be wrong, but I don't think you can do that. I don't.


Yeah, I don't either. I don't think you can't either. Barry, what's the example? What are you what are you trying to do? I'm trying to accomplish. I know you.


I'm trying to max out my HSA for twenty twenty one and also on my, my IRA on. I lost some benefit to it a few years ago when I did something wrong. And I was hoping that you just kind of make that up with this transition from because I know you can move a little bit, you can't move all of it and and you can only do it once in a lifetime, really.


So you can read that. Did you read that in Chris's book? I did, yes, and then I went and looked it up on the IRS tax site, and you you can do that, you may know more about it than either one of us do, including the guy who wrote it in his own book.


What the crap. I don't I don't know what this is, but but but what are you trying to accomplish? Are you trying to fund the HSA or are you trying to max out your IRA?


I'm trying to max out my HSA. Why is about sixty two hundred dollars from my wi fi? And that's why I was calling, because Mr Hogan wrote it and I wanted to know why you do that, don't you?


Well, you'll have to me, because that doesn't sound it doesn't make sense. You know, the goal of having the money in your HSA obviously is being able to put that money there almost like a medical emergency fund. The goal and putting the money in your IRA is to be able to grow that right, to be able to afford your high definition dream.


So, you know, one is there as a safety net and they just see that you can invest. Right. But then the the IRA is there for your dreams. So the cross moving of those funds, it's there's no there's no there's no support, even if you can do it. And you've evidently looked it up and it's allowed one time. OK, that doesn't mean I would do it. And even if Chris Hogan said in his book and he forgot it, which I don't think happens, I think you're reading something else.


But because I have never heard of that and I read this book before it was published, so I would have caught it and I would have said, OK, are you talking about the lotteries?


I didn't know you could do that, but she's looked it up now. Let's assume you can do it, OK? Right. You and I just don't know which one, which is probably true. So that's OK. I mean, we can't know everything. And so I think she probably is right. You probably have a one time thing for whatever reason.


I still don't see any reason to do it. That you would do it. No, there's no. And so the answer would be unless you've got a really good reason and the reason and the movement, you know, causes the reason to occur. Right, then I wouldn't do it. I would do that. Not now. You know, I guess a reason could be if you had a huge medical expense coming and you wanted to pay for it with pre-tax dollars, you could dump a bunch of money over into your HSA by doing that, roll over and pay the medical bill.


And I've done it pre-tax dollars and save the taxes on the medical bill, which if you take it out of your IRA to pay the medical bill, you're going to pay taxes. Absolutely. So that would be a reason, I guess, if you had a huge you know, let's say you had fifty thousand dollars in your HSA and you had a medical bill that out of your pocket was going to be one hundred and fifty thousand. Then you want to move one hundred over there that save you 30 grand, right.


In taxes. No. To do it. So that might be a reason. I mean, I can start to work my way through this logically that there could be a rare circumstance in which it would you do it. But as a general planning tool, Chris is right. No, I would keep a separate one is for medical care. One is for dreams. And don't confuse the two.


Yeah, I have to research that. Yeah. Interesting. Interesting. Yeah, very, very different. OK, I have no idea but let's just go with all that. All right.


John Andrews with us, Andrews in Fort Worth.


Hi Andrew. How are you. Hey, Dave. This is an honor. I really do appreciate all your time. Thanks, man. How can we help?


So I work for the city of Dallas and I contribute to pension. So I've listened to you for quite a long time and I haven't heard much about pension. So I know you say fifteen percent of your income into retirement and me, my wife are right about that point. So I'm already being forced to take out about thirteen percent into this pension, which I know if I actually retire here it will be great, but it's not really growing much in that.


So I just don't know. Should I just, you know, aside from the thirteen point two percent and like a Roth or something, or do I just even count that? I mean, you plan on retiring from here, but.


Yeah. And, you know, and if you depending on your years of service, you might get a lump sum rollout if you left there and that kind of stuff. But still, it's not growing well and you don't have much control over it. So that makes it scary. And it's a pension and it's not in your name. If the city of Dallas became insolvent, you could lose it.


And that's happened in other cities. I don't think that's going to happen in Dallas. I don't have any reason to believe that. But but I'm just thinking through the situation versus a 401k is one hundred percent in your name are Roth IRA contribution your name and there's no way to if your city went broke, you don't lose that money, your company goes broke, you'll lose your 401k. So anyway, what I don't tell folks in these situations because you don't have control over it, because it's not growing as well and because it's not an asset in your name.


I count it, but let's count it maybe 50 percent translation instead of you putting in 15 percent of your income since you already put in 13 and a half in there, let's put in, you know, count that thirteen and a half at about half. Look all at seven percent.


So you need to put in you know, you need to put in about 10 percent of your own money and something else.


OK, give or take a portion of your own money and something else, maybe not the full 15. We're not going to ignore it and I've got to venture out there, but I don't want to count it at 100 cents on the dollar because of the concerns. Does that make sense?


Yeah, it makes sense. And I hate it this way because I've been noticing recently how much I'm actually putting in there. I'm putting in like three hundred some dollars a paycheck. That's a lot. And I'm thinking, man, I really wish all these years have been there for ten years how much money I would have, you know, so I just hope it doesn't grow as fast and everything.


Now, if your wife works outside the home of 4.5 percent of her income.


Yeah, I know she's a stay at home mom. So OK, then this is simple. Yeah. So let's see then. Let's call it.


You're going to you're putting in 13 and a half there and we're going to counter that half, and so you need to put in about eight percent of your income into something else. What do you make?


About 65 a year? OK.


All right. And so, you know, you can probably just do a Roth IRA and you'll be pretty close. Mm hmm. OK. OK.


And some good mutual funds. And that's just kind of your backstop if something got weird or sideways with the pension.


All right. All right. Yeah.


That'll make you feel better because you'll say, hey, I'm not all in on this pension. I've also got some other money growing. And as your income grows, you're going to you're going to be in a better situation.


Yeah. And you might want to more than one do. You might want to. Another Roth IRA in her name. Yeah. Which you could do. But, you know, you can do six thousand dollars. That's going to be that's can be pretty dad gum collection and won't kill you. And you know, you'll get to see that money Bill. And that's all in your name of course. Then you have control of it. Yeah. Click more investor at Ramsey dot com.


They'll help you get an IRA set up for a Roth and some good mutual funds. Good question. That was fun. Dave, thank you for having me. Well done. James Childs and Kelly Daniel in the booth. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. We will be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk degli with the prince of peace. Christ, Jesus.


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