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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the car radio studio. This is the Dave Ramsey Show where America hangs out to have a conversation about your life and your money. I'm Chris Hogan, filling in for Dave and Co, who spoke with me this hour is Dr. John Boloney. We are excited to have you here. Listen, I don't know what it is about me saying cohosting, OK? So here's what I'm going to do henceforth and forevermore.


I'm saying hosting with me this hour, you know, the word henceforth and you can't say no.


I don't know what it is.


It is this weird, tongue tied. But I'm just going to call myself out. I'm going to fix it from henceforth and forevermore and I'm done with it.


So it's very Shakespearian. On behalf of cohosts across America, we henceforth. Thank you, Christopher.


Hey, we are so excited to be back with you all. Listen, if you're out there and you've got a question, and I know during this time relationship, things can get tense, family dynamics can get off kilter, or maybe you need some help setting boundaries. Well, listen, I got the man in here that can help you with it. He's been helping people with emotions and anxiety for many, many years. And Dr. Guilani is in here and is ready to help.


Are you ready to get on this today?


I'm ready. And if you've got money questions, family life questions, you don't know where to park that retirement. You're stuck on the baby steps. I have the pleasure of cohosting henceforth with the one and only Chris Hogan. You can follow him at Chris Hogan 360 Dotcom at Chris Hogan 360. That's where him and his VIPs go to hang out. Well, I appreciate you being focused and not finished and all of that stuff that's.


There you go. You got it right. All right, here's the deal. Call us. Kelly is over there. She's sipping coffee. The phone lines are not full enough. We need you to call in. And here's the number eight eight two five five two two five again, that's eight eight eight two five five two two five. Find us on social media at Ramsey Show. We'd love to be able to talk with you. Some of the social questions are popping in, and I've got one for John.


And I'm going to I'm going to start off the hour with you right now with social media, just so everyone understands. This is from the Ramsey baby step community. Oh, this is from Jose. Jose says, How do I deal with the guilt of death? I am the one that brought it in and I feel guilty constantly. And I'm so afraid to come clean with that last part.


That's the bottom, right? That's it right here.


So I wanted when I heard I brought it in and I feel guilty constantly. My first question is why?


And then he says, yes, I haven't come clean. I haven't come clean.


So Jose, no one brother, you got to come clean. You've got to go to those who you have violated, including yourself. You're any kind of partner. You have some kind of family, church group, whatever you agreed. This is how we were going to live our life financially. And you violated that. You got to you got to come clean. And if it's just coming clean with Jose, man, look in the mirror.


Say I did wrong period. Hmm. You're holding a brick that says guilt. Put it down. Get the baby steps and go forward.


Yeah, here's the deal. I think that laying it out there and being able to see the debt for what it is, is first and foremost, the reality is never as bad as what our minds make it up to be.


Sometimes it's bad, but the solution is bad. That's right. And it may not be, but here's the thing. Stop guessing, speculating, intimating and all the other agents. Let's just talk about it and then see it and go, you know what? Here's the deal. I remember John, get this. I worked with some clients. The wife had thirty two thousand dollars in credit card debt. The husband didn't know about me and she wanted to reveal it in my session.


Oh, OK. And listen to me. This got things got tense. Yeah, OK. Because she had credit card statements going to the office instead of home and she was just making minimum payments and it was on stuff. It was in the closet. You know, he never saw it. And it's just it's a big that's a big bomb dropped in their financial lives. It's bigger than that.


It's a bomb dropped in their partnership. Yes. Because in our partnership, we tell the truth and our partnership we're connected, right?


Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And supported. Right. And so and so it's tough. But Hosie, I'm going to tell you, laying it out, talking about it, don't don't let that stress continue to drive the wedge between you and your significant other, because that's exactly what will happen. You will start to feel guilty, you will start to feel disconnected and it's over this thing that can be fixed and it's easier to throw in the same direction together than it is to be apart.


So today, sit down with them, lay this out, be upfront and real with it. And more importantly, I want you, Jose, to come to the table with options. What are you going to help do to clean it up?


And that might look like a second or third extra job, but it's an it's an option of showing your commitment to fixing it. That's exactly right.


Come with the plan. Come. With honesty and integrity and then put the guilt nonsense down and then move forward, I like that. Put the guilt nonsense down. All right, listen, we're going to the phones. We've got Nick on the line. And Nick, thank you for waiting, my friend. You've got a question. How can we help you?


Yeah, I was wondering if it would be better to get a financial adviser or go about trying to invest by myself. OK, how old are you, Nick? I'm 19, my brother Nick.


Nick, did you call in to the right shoe? Yeah, are you sure? Who taught you about money at 19 years old, buddy? Well, my grandma did a big part in it and a teacher from high school, well, she showed me, Dave Ramsey said, and I've been hooked everything.


That is fantastic. But so are you working full time or you're going to school? I'm a full time student, but I have a part time job right now. OK, oh my gosh, Nick. Yeah, he's like a unicorn. What do you want to study, buddy? I originally started out in trying to be a teacher, but very slowly up and down, trying to be a finance major.


OK, here, here's what I think. And I think this is an excellent opportunity for you and a couple of ways I would reach out and connect with the financial advisor and investment professional for a couple of reasons. Number one, to give you some guidance on investing, but also to help you get some research on the career to give you an idea. This is an opportunity for you to make a networking connection, as well as helping you get some professional guidance.


This is a win win all around. Now, Nick, you may say, hey, I know the asset classes and what I want to invest in and I can set this up on my own, but why not get that second opinion and grow your network? So that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what I would do. He called me sir, like I'm old. Ramsey's old. I'm young. All right.


So anyway, Nick, listen to me. I disagree, sir, but continue. OK, I'll deal with you at the break. Nick, I. Hold on. Kelly is going to get your information. I'm going to send you both of my books, retire inspired as well as everyday millionaires, because if you're wanting to get into the financial world, this is going to kind of give you some realistic knowledge and to allow you to grow. And I'm going to tell you, I applaud your grandmother and I have to applaud your teacher, the one that took the time to teach foundations in their high school, John.


That's our curriculum for high school and middle school students, because we know that this money stuff is a life skill. That's right. And if you don't know how to use money, money will use you, buddy. That's right. OK, now, you probably never made any mistakes with money.


Zero and by zero, I mean a lot to zero.


Holy smokes, I've made some mistakes, but I love it when teachers take the time to teach this curriculum because these young people, whether they end up going off to college or not, you got to know how to deal with money. You got to know the spin safe give and how to invest. And foundations and personal and personal finance is the course. You can go to Dave Ramsey dot com to learn more about it and bring it to your high school or middle school if you don't teach it.


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Hello, everyone, this is the Dave Ramsey Show, we have John Boloney and I are hosting the show together this hour and we are excited to take your phone calls. So we want to hear from you. That number to call is triple eight eight two five five two two five. Again, that's 888 255 225 also at Ramsey Show for social media. And then also, please, people get over and follow John Deloney at John Boloney on Instagram. He is so concerned about the number of followers that he has and I can hardly sleep at night.


I know you're losing sleep, but you can find him. There it is. He's got some some stuff that he's been posting and doing some things. And of course, you can find me at Krischan 360 as well. And we'd love to have you follow us and let us know what's on your mind. And we talk about it. So we're going to the phones because that's what we do. So let's load up the lines, give us a call.


Next, we're going to go to Effingham, Illinois. I've actually been there.


We've got Bailey on the line. Bailey, how can we help you? Hi there. I just found out about a couple of months ago that my mom had taken several credit cards out of my name. Well, I am.


How did you find out?


OK, so I talked to my boyfriend and he's like, hey, you should totally do like a credit check and go through, like a credit report. So I looked up my credit report and it showed that I had six credit cards taken out of my name and I was already in like sixteen thousand dollars worth of credit card debt. Wow.


How much credit card debt are you now? Now as the sixteen thousand dollars. OK, so she took out that in your name. Yeah, so you you do your research, you get your credit report, you find this out. Have you talked to your mom about it? I have and what they. She didn't like the idea of that. I knew about it and she was making payments previously and then she stopped the stand as I confronted her about it.


Well, wait a minute. You ask her about it, she confirms, but then she gets mad at you and she stopped making payments. Yes. Okay.


Bailey, how old are you? I am 21. Used to live at home. I do.


And I go to school full time and my state.


OK, so what your mom has done is she committed a crime against you like a legal crime.


Yes. And she also violated trust between a mom and a daughter. That should not have happened. And so I want you to hear me say what happened was legally wrong and what happened was morally wrong. And you should be justified in feeling hurt and feeling frustrated. And then when you did the right Grown-Up thing and you said, hey, mom, what did you do? And then she threw a temper tantrum by not paying her bills.


Right, right. All that is a gross violation of everything about your relationship. And so I'm sorry, Bailey, that sucks.


Yeah. Are you so you're going to school full time. Are you working part time at all? Yeah, I am working part time.


OK, because what's going to happen is you're going to start to get calls from these collectors. OK, so, I mean, have you talked to them yet? No, it's OK, here's the reality, and Dr. Maloney is correct, this is you have had a crime committed against you and you've got one or two options. You can report it because it is fraud. You did not sign this. You'd have to complete a police report and you'd have to walk through the whole entire process.


Or the other side is, is that you sit down with your mom and you guys devise a game plan on this thing getting paid off. You know, another step that you can take is to freeze your credit. That's where you would write a letter to each of the three credit repositories, Experian and TransUnion and Equifax. Let me say that again, Experian, TransUnion and Equifax to close it down. But, you know, this is something that's going to have to be dealt with now.


I'm going to be even more direct. Chris, can I be even. Come on, buddy.


Listen, the temptation right now for any 21 year old is to preserve the relationship.


How do I not upset Mom? How do I not frustrate?


Listen, your mom is, as I had a gross violation of you, and you now have to treat her like an adult that has violated your legal rights and your ethical rights. So you've got to I think Chris is right.


Immediately go freeze your your credit so that nobody else can take anything else on you. And I would sit down with my mom and say, you got 48 hours to clear this up or I'm going to have to report it, because now I've got to get a new Social Security number. I've got to get all these new things because I can't trust my mom. You also are going to have to find a place to live, and that's a part that you're going to have to take on because you're now a 21 year old adult having to deal with adult problems, which means the the home you're living in is not going to be a safe place for you.


Where are you going to go find somewhere else? This is grown up the way we say it is not by your hand, but in your lap. No, he didn't do anything wrong. It got dropped on you. But you've got to solve this problem aggressively and direct. Well, now, here's the thing. Going that route with aggressive, you're absolutely right. You've got to find a new place to live. You may have to adjust your school plan.


That's right. You may have to work full time to go to school part time. Right. And so this is the reality of this scenario for people that are out there listening. If you've never looked at your credit report, you can get a free copy of it each year. Again, there are three credit repositories out there. That means three places that house your credit, Experian, TransUnion and Equifax. You can get a free copy or you can get a try merge copy.


That's kind of got all three of those merged into one. You've got some debts that report to Experian that won't report to Equifax. So that's why I want you to see everything. John, unfortunately, this is the type of thing that happens a lot. And so that's why we talk about making sure that you have, you know, the right kind of protection, fraud protection, identity theft. We have it here as a benefit, as a part of Ramsey Solutions through Zander.


But, you know, out there, I'm encouraging people to really be aware. You know, we're in a technological society right now where information and data footprints all over the place, data footprints means it's wherever you go online, they can track you. That's right. OK, I'm just letting you know I'm like the technical logical savant. I just heard that the other day. But anyway, listen, bottom line is you want to have protection and identity theft.


Is there also for you that are out there? Maybe you've got parents that are aging or maybe you have grandparents and they're debt free. There's no reason for them to borrow any more. You can freeze the credit report by writing a letter to all three of those credit repositories. I believe you can call them now. You can call as well.


And that means freezing means no one can open credit in their name, not even you. You would have to unfreeze it in order to do that. And so, again, in this day and age, this is something you want to be aware of and again, be very, very smart.


And parents don't steal from your children. Yeah. Don't steal from your children.


Your children are not a backup piggy bank for you, particularly when they're 21 years old.


I don't understand this, you know, for but but bless his heart, like it was being paid on. And now that that she knows Mom's temper tantrum done right.


What are you seven know what she's going to be is in jail? Because if Bailey presses charges. Yeah, this is beyond grand larceny.


It's over a hundred dollars. Ha.


OK, this is a it's a no. This is real. We're talking twenty sixteen thousand dollar theft. And so, you know, I'm not saying Bailey's trying to do that to her mom. Right. But the bottom line is this. What's the game plan. Don't don't try to toss me this sixteen thousand dollar rotten egg and tell me I cooked it.


That's right. And don't don't throw a temper tantrum. When you get called on the carpet, you get called on the carpet is what it is. You say, I'm sorry, I did something I shouldn't have done.


I got in spot. I got in, I got messed. I mean, I made an ethical error. I screwed up. I'm sorry. Me make this right, not that I'm a pain anymore, hahaha, right, sister, that's not how it works, man. That's not how it works. Bailey man blessings to you. I know this sucks, but here's another thing you have heard.


I've heard you say this and it's what I like it. You choose relationship over being right. It's right. So in this scenario, if she's going to choose relationship, what does that look like?


If she chooses relationship? And this is what people who are not in power, this is what kids often do because they that's just still my mom.


It's still my dad. I'm just going to be cool. I'm a figure out a way to pay this off. And the guarantee is with a parent who gets called on the carpet, all parents screw up. Me too. All husbands and wives screw up. Me too. When you call in the carpet, if the response is repentant, dude, I screwed up.


I'm sorry I make this right versus well was not pain. That tells me that Baily's is going to happen again and it's going to happen again. And you are twenty one. You figured it out. It hurts and it sucks. And there's going to be a ripple effect through your family. But you got to act to protect yourself now because the one person is supposed to. Your mom chose not to.


Wow. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Hello, everyone. You're listening to The Dave Ramsey Show, Chris Hogan, John Timoney in this hour. And I want to remind you and let you know that I do have a show, the Chris Hogan Show, which we take calls and we have a lot of fun. I do a panicked or punk segment. I do an article breakdown. And we talk about the realities of what's going on and where we are and what we're going to do and what we need to do.


And so you can find that show, the Chris Hogan Show, any place where you listen to podcasts, Apple, all the Google Play, all the places. So when I invite you to come over and check out the show, you can also find it on Sirius XM on Mondays and Wednesdays.


In addition, there's somewhere else you can find that is the cast. If you like me, dude, do you do you driving to work? You listen to a podcast radio or just silence?


I listen to radio. Good for you. That's a good 18th century guy like myself. I love it.


Oh, occasionally I listen to podcast though, because Drivetime has become podcast time. And if you want to catch the Chris Hogan Show and Christy Wright and Rachel Cruise and Ken Coleman and and and you can download the Ramsey Network app, this is how you get better in every area of your life. We're talking about the whole gang, right? Dave Chris, Rachel Cruze, Ken Coleman, Andre Leadership, the Borrowed Future podcast, all of it.


One place you can browse by topic, save your favorite clips, share them with your friends, or if you're Hogan with your friend Cingular, you get better in every area of your life, from money to career and business.


This is your never get moment. Get all the education in one place. Download the Ramsey app and you get the Chris Hogan show in that bundle. That's awesome.


All right. All right. We got to keep you out of the sweet tea or something. Oh, what's going on?


But listen, if you're out there, you all are calling in. And I have to tell you, I won't be honest with you. You are being very open, honest and real with your questions today. And I have to commend you because these topics aren't easy when you start to deal with relationships and money or you start to deal with money stress, that helps you really just frustrated and irritated. You have to reach out and don't isolate. I have been a king isolator before and it is not healthy.


It's not the way to go reaching out, being able to talk about it. As John mentions, it's so therapeutic. It's so unbelievable when you realize that you don't have to do it alone and it just it changes your spirit and it helps you to have a different outlook on things. And so I just I want to encourage you out there, because I know a lot of people are at their wit's end. I know a lot of people are frustrated, irritated, and they're tired.


And what I want to do is encourage you. Just hold on. Well, hold on just one more day and reach out and do something a little bit different. It's going to get better. It is going to get better, I promise you. But what you have to do is not do it alone, because sometimes you get tired and you do need somebody that can hold you up. Hmm. You really do. And so I want to encourage you out there.


If you're at that point to reach out, call a friend, be able to talk about the stress. If it's a money situation, it can get fixed. I've seen people clean up a whole lot of stuff.


It's a relationship issue. It can get fixed. It can get fixed.


You know, I promise you, relationships can heal, they can grow, they can start over. They can take new roads, grow new roots, don't quit.


Yeah, that's exactly right. And I don't know why. I was just something in my heart said we needed to say that because I think there's somebody out there that's sitting in there going, I'm just tired, Chris. There's a million. You know, I'm tired, man. And it doesn't look like it's getting any better. And so and if they're alone, man, that's the thing. I can't imagine, you know, where you're feeling that way and you don't have anybody else to kind of just give you a perk up, nobody to kind of just say, hey, it's going to be all right.


It's not only that, Chris, it's the it's that you feel like you're a loser. You feel alone. Yeah. You feel like you're weak. You feel like I'm broken. I didn't do something right.


And me, like I've said before, I grew up in Texas as an introvert in in in Houston and then in West Texas. That's where they grow the cows that they get the leather from to build the straps on our boots that I'm supposed to pull myself up by.


And the chief lie is that I can do this alone, but I'm supposed to do this alone. We are not designed for that. Yeah, no. The Westerns, we need other people. You got to have it. You got to.


So I've got a YouTube video where I talk about the four people you need in your life. You need a coach, you need a mentor, you need a cheerleader and you need a friend. And obviously you can have multiple people be in those roles, but you need to have one of those four in your life. And I'll take it a step further and I'd encourage you to say you need to be one of those four in someone's life. Now, here me with this, because I don't care how much debt you have, how tight something is, I don't care how loan you feel if you are being a.


A cheerleader, a mentor, a friend. That means you're not doing life alone. That's right. That means you've taken the focus off of your situation enough to look at someone else's and go, I'm going to cheer them on. Right. It's the best way to get a new attitude is to find someone else to reach out and to grab or to cheer on and watch what happens. Right. We get too caught up in ourselves and too caught up in replaying the mistakes.


And I'm going to tell you, old hurt will do no harm to your new day. I'll tell you that one more time. If you wake up and you grab that mistake, that old hurt will do no harm to your new day. So what we have to do is make some decisions. Right. And do like in the movie Frozen Baby, I'm going to let some stuff go so my hands are freed up to grab some things that I need in my life.


And that's people. And I need your you need your faith. You need people and you need a purpose.


And the direction you're going, I think sometimes since we sit on the radio, Chris, there's there's you can hear this. You can be mowing your yard and this is pumping into your head. And you and I can sound like we got all together and that we're robots. Yeah. So I think it's fair to say this morning I got up at five 45.


I did my morning weird routine. And then I drove across the city of Nashville and I met because we got to do it social distance. I met in the backyard of a man named I. I'll call him Dr. Steve on the radio that I have given permission to speak in my life. And we sat on his back porch and we had coffee together and we talked about philosophy and how my marriage is doing, how his marriage is doing. I have to do this stuff every day.


I've got to do this stuff with a mentor every week, somebody I trust because my mental health demands it. Yeah, my spiritual health. I'll become a crappy husband again. I'll become a crappy parent again if I don't intentionally get other people in my life that will speak wisdom and hope and optimism and truth to me.


You're absolutely right. Listen, I did it twice this week. I sat down with a pastor yesterday to have lunch, to talk about kind of the the the being the best kind of dad. I could be sick of my boys at that same time, sitting down talking to one of my coaches and really talking about kind of the mental process, the game plan. Right. And so, listen, you're not telling us we're doing it. We are not robots and you got feelings.


And I'm going to tell you something. If you're not reaching out, connecting with some people, you need to get started on it and do me a favor. When you connect with your friends and you have some conversations, let's go a little bit deeper than the sports team. Hey, it's hot out here maybe because they aren't even playing right now and not the weather. But just, you know, I put some buddies. They know what I call.


They know we're about to get real because I'm asking how are you? What can I pray for you about? What are you struggling with, those kinds of things. And it just helps people to know they're not alone. So you go first. Don't wait on your friends to call you. You go first. Make a list of five friends you're going to check in with over this weekend. And I want you to call them. I want you to text them.


People have health issues. People have heart issues. People have emotional things going on. Reach out and check on them. You go first and watch what happens. It'll change the spirit of things. Boy, I tell ya, Bush, we talk about this all day, people.


So listen, we're out here for you. If you wanted to call, you can call us. The number to call is 888 8255, two to five or find us at Ramsey Show. We'd love to hear from you. We're going to go to the phone. We've got Caleb on the line. Caleb, how can we help you?


Hey, Chris and John Howard, and they're doing great, buddy, what's on your mind? Hey, so I've got a question and just asking for some advice. So this is actually the first time calling. So if I sound nervous, I OK, it's all right.


So my question is, should I continue working on my current job, but is it small and is struggling to scale up? Not necessarily because of covid, but just in general. I did join this company with the intention to help them grow the company as well as then give me experience in my career. Mm hmm. Now, I am going to be married soon. I'm actually getting married next weekend. Hey, Caleb and Caleb, I know you're a Texan.


Yes, I am, too. So I'm going to hold you over. Let's get to the break and we'll come back after the break to make sure we get this for questioning.


As we do. We want to hear it and want to know what's on your mind and your heart so we can give you some guidance. Stay tuned. People are coming back with Caleb. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. Hello, everyone. We are back and we are excited to be with you. You've got Chris Holguin and John Boloney cohosting with me this hour. And before we went to break, we were talking on the line to Caleb and Caleb wanted to know if he should stay with his current employer or move on.


Is that the gist of it, Caleb?


Yeah, that's that's pretty much the gist of it.


OK, so what is what do you mean move on? Do you have something else lined up or is another company talking to you or are you just ready for a change?


So not necessarily another company, but I think just getting in the mindset of moving on. Whenever I join this company, I joined with the intention of helping it grow as well as the experience. And so I guess I want to know if I should stay committed to that. Well, like I said, move on because I am getting married. So I'm not sure if I want to put my wife in the same situation I was when I was single.


What do you mean?


What do you mean by that? Just just as I said before, I never mentioned this, it's not a fake company. It is somewhat of a startup company. OK, so I'm not getting paid as much as I would want to get a decent meal right now, but probably not enough to be able to support a wife and a family in the future.


OK, got you. So you all do you have any kids yet? No, which is about yeah, OK, and is she working full time? I know she's working part time. Is she going to school? Yes, she is going to school. OK, so you're trying to you're thinking of the future, right? You're thinking down the road. What are you making right now?


So right now, making things like this, just have a conversation with my with unposted coming up to 35. OK, five thousand here.


All right. And what do you think you need to make to be able to support a family? I would say around 40. OK. All right, so here's what I like about what you've done. You kind of have a ballpark awareness. You said this current company is treating you well, correct? Yeah, they are telling me, well, OK, was there some hesitation in there, what what what's what's the problem? Well, I think I think when I started this company with this company, I was I was an intern.


I've worked my way up. It it has been quite difficult to get to where I'm at right now as far as they want to go.


OK, OK, so you think they're being a little stingy with the money? Yeah, I guess I could say that, yeah. OK, so what's what's out there for you that's better? It's what I would tell you, you know, as you dig into that to try to do your research. Now, I think it's great for you to be open and honest and have a conversation with your employer and your job. But ultimately, you know, don't don't wait on people to read your mind.


Like, go in and have a conversation, ask what is it you can do to help further advance the company, let them know, hey, I'm getting married and we're looking to start a family. And so I'm looking to be able to grow my income. And I think, John, when you have that up front honest conversation, everybody can get on the same page. Yeah.


And one of the kind of. How old are you, man? I am twenty four. OK, so simply put, in San Antonio, Texas, right now, there's a jillion jobs that's going to pay thirty five thousand dollars or forty 40000 bucks. You could go right now and figure that out and find it. OK, you know that I know that people in San Antonio know that. Right. So that's number one. Number two is you've got to sit down and do the hard work with you and this person you're marrying.


And you've got to find out what the word and this is. This is a word that we don't do well with Chris. Oh, the word enough is what financial amount? Because when I was 24, whatever the number I was making just needed to be more. Yeah. And then need to be more. And then I made this much money and then I just within three or six months was like, man, I'm not you know, this guy's making it.


Just keep going. And what I want to tell you is I've gotten to a place where I make more money my granddad could have ever imagined. Yeah. Didn't have didn't have the mindset to understand this. That's right.


You know, I'm thinking about and I wonder if I if I move this around, you've got you have a dollar amount that I need that I'm going to feel valued. I'm a part of a company that loves me and values me and has grown me from an intern to where I'm at right now. I walked in, they gave me five grand more right off the bat. Or you've got to have the courage to say, I'm good. Yeah, I need to move on.


And here's the deal. Moving on. You don't know how the next company is going to treat you, right? That's right. You don't know how they value you. Right. And so, Caleb, here's what I'm going to do, buddy. I'm going to give you Ramsay. Plus, it's going to give you an opportunity to get plugged in to really kind of get on the same page and see money, use the every dollar, use the app, all the tracking tools.


You're going to get a chance to kind of really get plugged in on your money. I love the fact that you are zeroed in as a 24 year old and thinking about the future brother gets me. No, no. And so well, so far ahead of me, man. He is really far ahead.


And so I'm proud of you. I just want you to get plugged in with Ramsey, plus get plugged into the community, get in there, talk, talk to people and learn. I think it's going to be so important and valuable for you as you start to move forward in life and sit down with your fiancee.


Chris, I love the way you said dream in HD. Yes. Draw a picture of what you want your life to look like at 25 and at twenty six. Put a deadline on. If I'm not at this point, if I'm not contributing in this way with this company that I'm going to move on when my wife graduates, we're going to move on whatever that looks like, but be intentional about it.


Otherwise the money's never enough, the job's never satisfied enough. It just keeps never being enough because that finish line just keeps moving on.


No, you're absolutely right. And it's and it's a it's a fictitious line. But there there there it really is.


And people I remember, I want to tell them myself. So you got me all feeling all vulnerable stuff. I remember back in my twenties. That's all right. Listen, I'm going to make more and and when I make more, I'm will get more serious. Hold on. And then when I make more, I'm a get more serious. You know what you end up doing? You end up putting off getting serious forever. Yeah, you really do.


And so don't do that. If you if that's you, if you're thinking like I used to think, I want you to shut that down today and go, I'm going to handle whatever it is I'm make it right now. Twenty thousand thirty thousand forty, whatever it is, I'm going to manage that to the best of my ability and watch what happens. It'll prepare you for things to be able to grow. And then when you get a raise, you actually get some more mileage.


Then you realize I got some knucklehead stuff in my past I need to get out. And when I get out of debt, I give myself a raise. I didn't have to go ask anybody for more money. I didn't have to go lobby for more money. I controlled it.


And that's the mindset you have to have with getting yourself out of debt. So that's the deal. You got to get serious about it, get plugged in and you can make some progress. You know you can do it. All right, listen, we got time for one more call.


Let's call word is it is. It is. We're going to keep taking them. We got Kyle in Chicago.


Kyle, how can we help you stay there? So my wife and I are in our late twenties, twenty seven point nine. Our house is between 1995 a year. And we were pretty much our baby. Step three, we just actually finished our six month emergency fund granulation that we think we are. We want to look at saving for a house. And so as we're looking forward to that, I mean, I love the idea of. Sound tax plan.


Oh, your phone's going in and out, but it seems like a grid and so I'm just I'm trying to think, you know. And losing your brother. Yeah, but you have to call us back. Listen, you get yourself out of debt. That's awesome. Being able to save up for a home. We call that baby step three. B is where you save up for a down payment. And so these are all things that are necessary.


You know, I encourage people to really get a vision of what it is you're looking to buy.


And then let's have a game plan. Let's start to talk about it. But I need to say this. Renting is not a sin, OK? I'm renting right now. Yeah, renting is not a sin. It allows you to be able to regroup between cells or bars or whatever it is. But you just want a game plan overall. And so, again, thinking forward, being proactive, these are all things that you have to do for your past.


How much do we save up for house, Chris?


Well, at bottom line, it depends on how much house you're looking to buy. I want you to have a minimum of 10 percent down for a down payment, OK? Minimum of 10. I prefer you go in with the 20 percent down payment so you avoid PMI, right? That's private mortgage insurance. That does not protect you. It protects the lender. It can add one hundred and fifty to three hundred dollars in payment a month, which is absolutely absurd when you think about the life of a loan.


And so we've got to go into it with our eyes wide open people. And when you do this, you don't make emotional decisions. We make business decisions because those are the things that matter. Now, John, tell everybody where they can find more about you and all the things you've got going on.


You find me on the interweb and on the computers and all of the zeros and ones world and the Matrix at John Deloney. Yeah. Go to John Deloney slash John Delaney. And again, I told you all earlier, anxiety.


He's got this article on there that you can check out on Dave Ramsey dot com. Where can they find you, Christopher. Where they can find me. Chris Ogen, 360 dot com. All right, listen, I need to thank our producer, James Childs, associate producer Kelly Daniel. I want to thank all of you all for tuning in. John, thank you for hanging out with me. Brought us in with you. It was fun to be able to tag team and hit these questions and listen, stay tuned.


Try to find us another time. We'd love to have you tune in. This is The Dave Ramsey Show.


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