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Live from the headquarters of Ramsey Solutions, broadcasting from the Dollars Car Rental Studios. It's the Dave Ramsey Show where dad is dumb. Cash is king in the paid off home mortgage has taken the place of the BMW as the status symbol of choice. I am Dave Ramsey, your host. Ken Coleman Ramsey, personality and host of the Ken Coleman Show, is my co-host today. Here on the air, open phones, a triple eight eight two five five two two five.


You want to talk about life and money and careers?


Maybe you got a job question. Ken talks about it all day long. Already been on the air for a couple of hours talking about this morning on his show, which is broadcast on Sirius XM and about 50 radio stations around America. Plus is an ever popular podcast, the Ken Coleman Show. So again, life, money, careers.


We're here to help boardroom talk about you, whatever you want to talk about right in front of you.


The phone number eight eight two five five two to five.


Thomas starts off this hour in Houston, Texas. Hey, Thomas, how are you?


Hey, how are you doing? Better than I deserve. What's up? Well, we're about to back up house. And you broke you broke up. Tried again.


Sorry. We're about to use that to sell our house. And we're about we're going to use the net to pay off our debt. Good. We'll have about three thousand dollars left over. I guess my question is, I know, baby step three is build your emergency fund. However, we're going to be moving into my mimos my my grandmother's house for about six to eight months. We've negotiated that. And so we only have a limited time to either do that or save for a down payment on a new home.


What what would you do in that situation? Should I negotiate a little more time or less?


What's your household income? I'm not at liberty to say right now. Nobody knows who you are, you're Thomas in Houston, OK, are you make north of 50 here, you make north of 50. Yes, OK. All right, so and you said did you say you're in the military? No, I'm actually I work in one of the refineries down here in south east Texas. And that's a big secret. OK. All right, anyway, the all right, you're making some money.


I just I just have I just have some co-workers that I'm OK. All right. I got you. OK, yeah.


Here's the thing. If you buy a house without an emergency fund, you are inviting an emergency. OK, and so you need your emergency fund before you close on the house now. How are we going to do that? You're going to work extra. You're going to negotiate some more time out of memo. You're going to do something else. But it just it seems smart because everybody wants a house and you want to own a house.


You want to get a house. Even if you've got to go move into a rental after your six months with me, more runs out, then that's fine.


I don't care about that. But I would not buy without an emergency fund because it's like sending out a beacon signal a tractor beam for Murphy crap to come into your life. We see it all the time. Yeah, there's no question about you gotta do the baby steps. You do the emergency fund because it is called an emergency fund and buying a house is not an emergency.




You know, I was talking we Chris and I were on your show Friday and somebody called in a call like this and I said, you gotta have the emergency fund. Because let me tell you what, I know how this happens. Yeah, your house will happen to you. And if you're not careful, all the progress you think you've made can really, really go to the back seat. And all sudden you're just you're regretting everything.


The other day, if I had a red flag. What if you bought a house and then covid hit and you lost your job? Yeah. Yeah. Now you resent the house. Now you're miserable, you're scared.


You know, it's just you got to have the emergency fund. But Dave had a red flag that I wanted to ask you about, and I could be just reading into it. But I didn't like maybe just his choice of words, but negotiating with me more makes me nervous, OK?


And what I mean by that is, is family can sometimes be a really, really tricky situation. If he was just using the word negotiation very loosely, as in, hey, mama, can we stay for extra X amount of months? That's one thing. But if it's like one of those, you know, she's only doing it for a certain amount of time and she's done with it, it could create some tension there. And it just made me it just triggered something.


Be careful. Just be careful. You don't want to mess up a relationship. So she said so that's all you need to go rent, go rent. That's what I thought. But if you sit down with her and you say, OK, well, here's the here's situation. I need to have my rainy day fund and then I need to have my emergency fund and with my income and here's our budget shower everything. Right.


And then she's participating in you, living the dream, you know, of doing it right and wisdom. And and, you know, my financial coach told me, don't buy a house until I've got an emergency fund because my mom said you'd understand that life happens and you need a rainy day fund because it's going to rain and covid is going to come. I mean, something's going to happen is the worst example of a need for an emergency fund I've ever seen in my life because it was so massive and it scared the crap out of so many people.


But and it put some 40 million people out of work. Hello, by the way. So to start with and but but, you know, it's if you have an emergency fund. And you don't have any debt and life happens in your life or to the culture, either one, and then you're ready and you're OK. It changes the the attitude, the way you sit about the way you approach life. So, yeah, please, buying a house is not an emergency.


And the key here is he said if we got 3000 left over. Let's put that in perspective, Dave. So that's three thousand dollars. That's not going a whole long way on a down payment anyway.


But that three thousand dollars will during the six months he could either save up a down payment or set up the emergency fund juxtaposition that 3000 gets you further with an emergency fund than it does a down payment. True.


Well, you don't get there either way. That's the right way to do it. Do it the right way. You won't regret it. Be the little pig that built the brick house.


It took longer, but he did not get flown over. It's good.


Sandy is in Little Rock. Hi, Sandy. Welcome to the Dave Ramsey Show.


Hey, Dave, can you hear me? Sure. What's up?


Well, my husband passed away in June. Oh, no. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fortunately, except for the house, we were debt free. Still, are I still in debt free? What happened? Cancer. He he was diagnosed in January and he was gone in June. Wow. How old?


He'd be 54 this month.


Wow. I'm sorry, but yeah. Yeah, it was it was not what we were expecting. It wasn't a plan.


It was not the plan. The plan was to continue with the steps and, you know, do do a bunch of stuff. But as it stands, I'm getting a little over 450000 in life insurance. And I'm just wondering, I've got 21 a little over 221 one on the house. And I I'm debating on either paying off the house and then since I want have a house payment, saving up money that way so that I can retire maybe in another four, four years or so.


Yeah. Or if I should just invest the insurance and, you know, get an income from it, you already know.


And what you pay off the house don't you.


I kind of knew that. Yeah. The second part of my question is before we were enlightened, we had whole life policies. I tell you what, you hang on. We come back from this break. I make sure I take enough time with you. You've had a hard year and I won't cut you off of the 10 second answer. We'll be right back. This is the day, Ramsha. One of the questions I get all the time is which life insurance company should I use for my term life policy?


Look, it can be a tough decision when there are hundreds of plans out there with rates all over the place and rip off riders. That's why the only company I use and I've recommended for over 20 years is Zander Insurance. They're a broker, which means that they shop only the top plans from reputable companies that I recommend. Call them at 800 three, five, six, 42, 82, or visit Zander Dotcom for instant online quotes.


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Her husband passed away in June, left 400000 dollars their debt free other than that, except their home and two hundred twenty one owed on the home. And of course, she's trying to get through the fog of grief and make some decisions. And that's how far we got in the discussion that I missed something. Sandy, not really.


What I was asking about before we went to break was I have a whole life policy and I know, but I got it before I knew better. If I take the reduced paid benefit, I will get one hundred four thousand when I pass and I won't have to pay anything else into it. If I cash it out, I'll get I forget if it's thirty two or thirty four thousand.


And how old are you. I am fifty eight. OK, are you ill. Well, I have I've have had a heart attack, but other than that, I you know, I'm fine.


OK, who is counting on you for income? If you were to pass, that would need money. Well, right now, my youngest daughter, I help her out every month. How old is she? She is 21. OK. Right. And then my oldest daughter, whose spouse has health issues I help out every month, but not to the same extent as realistically.


You don't have to support these grown adults if you pass away. No, no. I don't think they will. They will find a way. OK.


All right. So you don't have to decide anything today on the whole life policy, but you're under the illusion that it's paid for because that's what the salespeople told you. OK, but here's the real here's the reality. The interest on thirty two thousand dollars, if it were invested at 10 percent and a good mutual fund would be three thousand dollars. Right. Yes, that'll be a pretty dadgum good life insurance policy you're not getting you're not getting 3000 dollars, you're getting 300 dollars or thirty dollars growth on this street, 32000.


You're getting almost no growth on it.


And in the result and they took that they took what you should have been making and gave you a free policy and made you feel good about it.


Right. That's all it is, and so, number one, you could cancel the policy or you could get a small term policy if you wanted some additional money around for some reason for a lot less than three thousand dollars a year.


Yes, OK, but today we're 60 days the on side of your husband passing, you don't have to make a decision today, right?


You can take your time. But the answer to your question is, I would get rid of that garbage. That's what I was thinking when the smoke clears and you're thinking real clear and all that kind of stuff. I mean, you've had some time to deal with this because you had from January to June while he was ill. But it's still it's still a good idea to wait to make major financial decisions as long to give yourself a little room to cry.


Yeah, OK, so I'm OK if you don't catch the whole ePolicy until next year, but you will get around to it and I just wanted to break the mythology that you're somehow getting free insurance because you're not nothing's free with insurance.


Oh, no. I paid quite a bit into this, Paul, but it doesn't matter. It's never paid for as long as long as you're alive, there's a probability of your death which cost them money.


Yeah. And so you've got somehow somebody's paying for it somewhere and you can count on it being you.


Yeah, exactly. All right.


So now if you want to, it is a major decision to pay off the house today. It is also a major decision to invest the rest of the money that's left over after you pay off the house. I probably would wait on the investing part a little while, but go ahead, but go ahead and pay off the house. OK, because if you want to undo that later, you can undo it by just getting a mortgage, we wait.


We won't end up doing that. Right, but but there's no there's no downside to paying off a house. Now, the investing part, you know, if you kind of just are in a fog when you do that and then then the market goes down because the president burps or something, then then, you know, you start to be, oh, gosh, what a horrible year this has been.


Well, yeah, it has been a horrible year. And so I want you to wait a little while, not because of the market, but because of Sandy. Just give yourself at least six months. So if I'm in your shoes, I'm going to set my clock back in January or February or March and say, all right, I'm going to wake up then and I'm going to do something with the rest of the money that's left over after paying off the housing and investment.


And I'm going to look at this whole life policy then. OK, and just give yourself some breathing room emotionally, is that OK? Yeah, yeah, I'm so sorry. Yeah, I was, too. He was a good guy.


What a hard year, you know, and if you need it, if you need anything, Shandee, you call us any time. We're here to help you. That's what we do. Changes everything. Oh, it has been a year can that I think I'm told, Rachel, I'm going to have the biggest. New Year's Eve party, when 2020 is over, I'm going to have some kind of a blowout to celebrate this freaking year being done, it's great.


I'm available if you if you want to invite me. All right.


How about you? I'm going to invite myself to that one. You're you're pretty good. Got a party? Yeah.


I mean, if you're going to do a big blowout, then that means what do we now what do you think it's therapeutic. What is going to be involved in that?


You're going to burn something, blow something up, you know, shoot something the way you would frown on me firing off automatic weapons.


But it's tempting. Yeah.


Like there needs to be some ceremony will be some, you know, out of twenty twenty silencers whole you might not know, you know.


They would not know. They would not but they would not know. See I forgot about the suppressors but we could have also some fireworks. Those would be illegal. Yeah. And was trying to do a lot of illegal stuff because I'll be 60 by then. And you want to do illegal stuff when you're sixty. Yeah. OK, since I've been doing it my whole life so.




So right now folks, Dave is a civil disobedience guy. He's not breaking the law all the time. Always civil when I'm disobedient. That's right.


That's what I was set you up for that. And you walked right into. That's beautiful. I'm always civil. I'm always kind of disobeying.


Yeah, that's right. That's true. Yeah. I agree with you. I think a lot of people are going to be excited to go into twenty twenty one. Yeah. There's going to be like Prince needs to write up my. He can't but somebody ought to write a song about this.


All the Prince fans 1999. If you remember when you remember when Y2K was going to bring the end of the world.


I got to tell you, this is an in and I have teased our good friend about this. We have a mutual friend, I won't say his name, who wrote a book that scare the crud out of a bunch of people, including me. I had more canned green beans and jugs of water than you could put into an apartment. We were in a two bedroom apartment right over by the Marriott. And Cool Springs Kitchen is still in a two bedroom apartment.


Yeah, because I want to I thought we were going to have a generator in that third bedroom.


No, but I had a friend who had a generator, but I bought all the stuff thinking this could be a three month deal. So you bought canned green beans? I bought ammunition, yeah.


That's actually a great psychoanalysis, folks. You make of that what you want. People are enjoying that in the lab. They've bought ammo. I've beans. I don't know what the Siskin means.


I'm getting your beans. I bet that's the truth. I would have been out of luck.


They'd have been like some clown on the third floor, has got a ton of green beans and he's not armed. I would have fed the whole apartment community. I thought I was so smart. It's going downhill. It's going way down a point. I bought the fear. I bought the fear. I bought it hook, line and sinker. Oh, Y2K, we need a name.


Twenty twenty one. Something positive. Yeah, something like that. You're the monkey or something. Oh my gosh. This is the Dave Ramsey Show. You know, I don't sit back and just trust that politicians have my best interest in mind, which is why if I had student loans, I would not be waiting around for the government to save me right now, splash financial as some of the lowest rates they've ever had. If you have private student loans, get your rates down.


Now, no one's going to fix this for you. Take control of your own money. Go to splash financial dotcom slash Ramsey. That's how they will know you're one of our listeners. Splash financial dot com slash Ramsey. On the debt free stage right here in the Ramsey Solutions lobby, Larry and Carol Lee are with us. Hey, guys, how are you? Good. Good. How are you? Better than I deserve. Welcome. Where do you live?


Stevens, Pennsylvania. Awesome. And all the way to Nashville to do a debt free scream.


Took us two days to get here, but we made it. I love it. Well, welcome. And how much should be paid off? Hundred twelve thousand one hundred and thirty five dollars. Very good. And how long did this take? Five years and 11 months. All right. And your range of income during that time started out at thirty eight and ended at 137.


Nice jump in five years. Add an extra one in front of it. Not bad at all. What do you do for a living? I'm an architectural designer, Carolee.


I'm an office manager for him. Awesome. Very cool.


Good for you guys. So tell us about this. How did this journey start? Five years and 11 months ago?


Well, I went through that stupid thing called a debt consolidation. And then I was stupidly looking for the second one because I maxed out all the credit cards after we did the first one. Oh, the habits did not, you know, I'm normal. And then I came across your website and I'm naturally kind of a countercultural thinker. And your way of handling money was countercultural to the way the banks are telling everybody, you know. So I kind of latched on to it.


And one night I told her that we're going to start getting out of debt. Well, we all know how that worked. She just hangs her head and says, no, we're never going to get out of debt, and that's not going to happen. I just don't see it. And then we had a small loan. I think it was like 350 bucks. That was a personal loan we had to pay off. So we paid that one off within like the first week and a half.


And then the next one started a couple months down the road and she started saying, well, it might work after all. And then when she came on board, which I'd say took about a year before she finally got some traction with it, and then she actually became a little bit more diligent with it than I did over the years. There you go. And the office manager kicked in. Yeah, right. And what kind of debt was the 112 in total?


I was two personal loans, one debt consolidation, four credit cards and 37000 dollars that I owed Social Security.


OK, so in the five years and 11 months, when was the biggest movement on getting when did you pay the most debt recently or early in the game?


I would say was at the end of it. OK, it goes all dealing with the government. You know, if you had to make extra payments on a prepaid or a preset payment plan with them, then they're going to wonder, hey, where are you getting all this money? So we had a payment plan set up for the Social Security issue, which long story short, I had been on disability back in 98. I got on it and there was a misunderstanding and they yanked it from me in 2009, which was probably the best thing that ever happened to me, because now the paycheck relies on me and I don't look at myself as disabled.


And fortunately, she doesn't either. So then I realized I really got to kick my business into gear and start making some money. So what we did is we saved up a bunch of money to pay off. We saved up the balance of what we owed Social Security. And then we wrote one big check at the end of it. Oh, yeah. I'm just just him. Yep. That was the young argue with this. Exactly. Yeah.


Yeah, yeah. Got you. Well done. How's it feel. It's a long journey.


Well it makes me feel like I want to get up and walk.


But yeah it was, it was great. I think the biggest struggle was just fighting for that last one. You know, we got that 14000 dollars sitting there. It's like I got to hand all that over to Uncle Sam, you know, but realizing that if I don't, it's still his money anyway. Yeah. So when I got rid of that, it was like party time. There you go. Oh, man, it was great. Yeah.




So what do you tell people? The key to getting out of debt is diligence. Uh, I got to admit, I'm not the best budgeter. I'm more of ask myself the question of do I hold back by saying this is only a want, not a need, you know? And she found out the same way that that was the biggest question we could ask ourselves. Do we is this something that we need right now? 95 percent of the time?


The answer was no. Uh, you know, so that's how we started really saving up a chunk of money and not Social Security out. And and then we had a medical issue that we got some money back from Christian Healthcare Ministries to cover that. That jumped us from baby step to right in the baby step for wow, so now we're sitting on baby step four and we're ready to load up the Roth IRAs and get things moving. Very good.


What do you tell people? The key to getting out of that is.


Well, I like to stick to it. It's not always easy. And like you said about doing it now and it's just saying no and learning that it needs to be a habit.


Yeah. You get in a rhythm, especially when you guys because it's five years, 11 months. That's a journey. Yes, that's a process. Who were your biggest cheerleaders?


Well, to be honest, we didn't tell many people.


We were just pretty quiet about its two closest friends, Lawrence and Sheila from Colorado. They were probably our closest ones. Good, because he actually just paid off his property a couple of months ago. All right. So cool. Yeah. So that's that's the two biggest ones right there. My brother, of course, and he's he's on his own journey right now with that.


But yeah, it was pretty a quiet affair. But we're here and now we're not quiet about it anymore.


Well, we're glad we're proud of you.


I got to tell you one quick thing, though, Dave. You went on a rant a couple of years ago about tiny houses, and I'm a residential designer by trade, so. Oh, and you went on a rant about tiny houses on wheels are always going down in value. And that kind of struck a chord with me because I like to think that my clients are going to increase their personal value when they build a house that I designed. And then one day my computer broke down about four years ago and I didn't have it for two days.


So I spent my time on her computer just researching the Internet, see where I could find. And there were no Hanekom houses out there that were wheelchair accessible that I could find, that I would consider wheelchair accessible. So what I did is.


My brother works for me full time. I said, hey, you're taking a month and you're taking my ideas and you're making it into a working floor, plans, working blueprints. And now we have two initial handicap designs that came out four years ago. And those are kind of evolving into different models with the same floor plans. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.


And now those are being built in five different states with more being added every month.


And it's for you. We're on a roll. It's going to let you go. You go. Well, if you got wege, you can plant good grass and replace the weeds or you can burn your yard. And you're the guy that you're the guy that plants more seeds and replaces that weeds. Way to go. Thank you. Added value man. I'm proud of you.


And those those houses are on foundation. So I took your advice. Yeah. You know, and I tell people anything on wheels is going to go down there, like really. Well, yeah. If you can't get a loan for a tiny house on wheels from the bank unless it's an RV loan and they go, oh, I didn't know that. And a couple of them actually change the mindset and they went ahead and built one with a foundation.


OK, so that was still very cool.


Well, good for you guys. I'm proud of you guys. Well, you're certainly heroes. You've done a great job. Very, very well done. We've got a copy of Chris Hogan's book for you every day. Millionaires', that's the next chapter in your story for sure. And it's Larry and Carol leave from Lancaster, Pennsylvania.


One hundred and twelve thousand dollars paid off in five years, 11 months, making 38 to 137. Count it down.


Lazzara debt free scream three to one to God be the glory where debt free. Done. Well done. You know, there's a lot of ways that you can move the society around, you can you know, you can you can trash things or you can build things very well done.


Well, he just looked into a problem that he had a connection to and said, what's the solution? And that solution is going to make him a lot of money by saving a lot of people, a lot of time and money, making their lives better. And that's our hope. That's work that matters. It's good stuff. I hope so. Good stuff. Our Scripture of the Day, First Corinthians 15 57, but thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ fittings from said the rewards for those who persevere far exceed the pain that must precede the victory.


Good stuff. Well, guys, these are crazy times.


This could be your never again moment.


Never again will you be at the mercy of a global crisis. Never again will no emergency fund and debt keep you up at night. Never again will you let the news cycle put you in a panic because you're broke.


You can fix that and we'll show you how and when you have the right plan, the right tools, the right teaching. You never have to question if you're doing the right thing with your money. Ramsey Plus gives you all of that. It's our brand new all access membership and you can try it for free today.


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Hi, Nate. Welcome to The Dave Ramsey Show. How can Ken Coleman and I help you? Any kind of davits to talk to you guys here? I have more. Thank you. I'm more of a career slash financial question. I'm 23 years old. Just a little back story here, of course, from Milwaukee, Wisconsin. And I bought my first home at 19 years old, which, of course, after listening to, I kind of figured out that's a mistake.


However, I I was in school, I got an associate's degree and I.T. security, and then I continued my education full time to get my bachelor's, and it was pretty good. Thank you. So, of course, you know, I'm working full time and then paired with my three part time sales jobs. I don't really have too much time for studies, but I got it all done. Graduated in May and got my four point eleven or so.


Now it's time to get serious. I've my full time job. I work in it, but it's more of a help desk role and only make thirty two thousand a year. I've been with this company for about four years and not really seeing much, much movement in the direction that I spent all my time and your degree in information systems with a specialization in Internet security.


That what I'm understanding. Yes. Wow. OK, go ahead, what's your question I. Well, upon searching for jobs in my in my path here, I have realized that I need to step into a junior security role or a junior information security role, and they're just not paying what it would what it would take for me to pay my mortgage.


So what are they what are you finding that a junior security roles paying. Eighteen to twenty for an hour, so it would be a lateral move, basically, no, it's not right.


Something's wrong based on my location for a junior security role. It would, but that's contracted. I'm having a hard time finding, you know, not contracted girl. That's upwards of 30 to 40, which is the senior security person can make a couple of hundred.


Indeed. And so I can't believe these roles aren't starting at 50 to 60 grand. They are they're just extremely difficult to find right now, and I have been looking for a month before covid started.


So before we run out, before we run out of time, can what should he do?


Well, you wait right now because at this point, you're acting as though you've got to make a quick decision and go for what's available now, which are contract gigs, which don't pay what you need them to pay and what they should pay. So I would forget about the contract gigs and I would focus on, even though they're hard to find right now, that it means we're going to wait, we're going to be diligent. What I mean by weight is we're going to keep looking.


We're going to keep connecting. We want to get those jobs that are that are salaried and that make the kind of money that you and I talking about there. And until you find that, then you just sit tight. But there's no reason to take a contract job that doesn't pay well at all because it's just a function of we're in a tough economy right now. But I will tell you this. I shared an article on the Ken Coleman show last week.


IT security field is still doing very well and it's hot. And if Milwaukee's a tough area, I don't know how tired you are to a city. I come at things a little different. I left the nest in Virginia pretty early on. So you've got the whole nation to look at. So I think what you have to do here, my answer is don't take right in front of you. If it's not a good opportunity, wait for something, dig for something, go somewhere else.


Too many good opportunities with his background, a 4.0 that training. I'd be looking outside of Milwaukee if it's that tight in Milwaukee, you know, if it is, I don't know.


I want you to maybe change some of your job search strategies a little bit. I'm going to send you a copy Akins book, The Proximity Principle. I want you to read that.


I want you to go to Ken Coleman Dotcom and download the get hired digital course and get the the exactly the get hired digital course. Well, you want just.


Yeah, that's I tell you what, we'll give it to everybody else. You're going to get it. But let's Kelly, let's give it to him. It's a digital course. It's an eleven video lesson series where I walk through everything from the resume to the interview to how to get connected, how to use your web of connections. And right now it's only twenty bucks that Ken Coleman dotcom. But it's our gift to you. But you've got to make sure you're shaking the right trees and shaking the trees properly.


And I think he's got the right perspective on that. He's your hardworking young guy for sure. You're not afraid of hard work.


But I think that, you know, somehow you've gotten a skewed perspective of what you can earn because, I mean, we've got security people, Internet security people on this team and none of them are making eighteen dollars. The challenge he's facing is this.


He went and got a degree in it. He knows what he wants to do. But all he has seen so far is contract work, which pays less essentially. And what he's making now. And he's going, how do I do this? This is the only thing that I can find right now. And he's feeling like because of the degree, because he does have clear direction, that the only thing he could take is something that's subpar. And that's always the false choice.


It's a false narrative. You know, sometimes you going to have to reload and go, right, this isn't the right thing. Now, I'm going to wait a little longer to find the right thing. Dig a little harder.


Yeah, I just I, I really think that if you change your strategy on how you're looking and we'll give you the digital course and the both, I gave it to you and then tended to. That's good. You know, it's a walk though through those eleven video lessons. And I promise you it's going to change the way you're looking for position. Yeah. And sometimes that has everything to do with it the way you're applying, especially straight out of school and in a competitive environment right now, a lot of people looking for work.


So now you're up against a whole lot more people applying.


And here's the electricity. We were talking about that leadership position, leadership team meeting this morning. We had twelve people start today and we had several key leadership roles start today. And our guys were making the comment that our recruiters are having a blast just like a hot knife through butter, because there's so many people looking for work and we're able to find people right now that we've been looking for for two years in some cases. Yeah. And so that's the that's the employer's view of it, is there's a real supply out there.


And so the other side of it is if you're looking for a job, you're amongst a lot of fish in the pond, big stack.


So let's just see right now, we've got somewhere between 20, 22 million people unemployed. Just for quick math to understand what you're up against, folks, let's say it's 20 million people and they're sitting on average, ten resumes each. That's two hundred million resumes. You better stand out and so it can. Coleman Dotcom, we have a free resume. My God, Dave. Where we have an actual template and we've heard from thousands, tens of thousands of people have used it and it really works.


And we walk you through how to do it. We let you plug in the information that's free. Ken Coleman, dot com, he got to use it. But but it's more than just the resume. It's in the book, the proximity principle. We teach the web of connections and. And sociology studies back us up, acquaintances are how we get gigs, you better shake the relationship treat. Thanks for hanging out. Thanks for having me. Thanks, Esack.


Filling in for James Childs today. And Kelly Daniel, our associate producer and entrepreneur.


I am Dave Ramsey, your host at my post this hour in the books. We'll be back with you before you know it. In the meantime, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial base, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of peace price.


This is James Childs, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. Once again, you made The Dave Ramsey Show, one of the top four most popular podcast last year. To get your daily dose of motivation and inspiration from the Ramsey network, subscribe or follow today wherever you listen to podcast. Money isn't the only thing we talk about around here, get life changing advice on your career from my good friend and career expert Ken Coleman. Oh, my Ken Coleman show.


According to a recent Gallup poll, nearly 70 percent of Americans are disengaged at work. If you dread going into work every Monday morning and you're just trying to make it to the weekend, the Ken Coleman show is for you. Everyone has a sweet spot. Your sweet spot is at the intersection of your greatest talent and greatest passion. We will help you discover what it is you were born to do, and then we'll help you create a plan to make your dream job a reality.


You matter and you have what it takes. Join the conversation on the Ken Coleman show. Hear more from the Ramsey network, including the Ken Coleman Show, wherever you listen to podcast.


Hey, it's James, producer of The Dave Ramsey Show. This episode is over, but check the episode notes for links to products and services you've heard about during this episode. Thanks for listening.