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That's right. Free at zip recruiter Dotcom Rogan that zip recruiter dotcom RSG and zip recruiter Dotcom Rogan. My guest today is an amazing singer. She got famous as a child and is keeping it together as an adult and I really enjoyed talking to her. She's a cool chick.


Please give it up for the great and powerful Miley Cyrus government podcast, The Joe Rogan Experience trying my day job podcast my life all day.


Hello, Miley Cyrus. How are you? I'm good. Nice to meet you. You also I'm happy to be here. I'm happy to have you here. You have a fantastic voice, not just a singing voice when you're talking voice. Very unusual. It's like it makes you step back a little bit.


Oh, I've actually recently I was walking around in Boston and I went to a museum and this like older man walked up to me. I had no idea who I was. He was just enjoying the art also in the museum and started talking to me forever about my voice and my and then there was a college, some sort of trip to the museum. And then everybody started freaking out. And it was so cool to have someone stop me about my speaking voice because that had never happened to me before.


I think as I was turned around and I had the mullet so I could have been, you know, anybody, I could have been anyone.


It's a voice to have your voice. You didn't always have a heavy voice, though, like when my kids love Hannah Montana, by the way. Yeah. So when I would watch your voice was different.


It's definitely changed. I actually I kind of learned a lot about the voice and how our experiences affect our voice. I had a surgery in November on my voice. I had something called Rikki's Edema, which when my doctor told me about it, he said No one shy ever has this. This is for abuse of the voice. This is for people that talk way too fucking much.


And usually this happens when you're like in your 60s or 70s. How do I not have that?


I don't know. I don't know mine. I think honestly, really.


I started touring, you know, at probably 12 or 13.


And not only was I the adrenaline that you have after a show, it's not really the singing that affects your voice as much. It's afterwards you're totally on. And then it's really hard to get that sleep. You stay up talking all night later than talking all night, turned into smoking all night. And now this is kind of where we're at.


We got some dirt on her.


You know, she always can be like like a face. It collects wrinkles and it tells a story. If you look at yourself and you go, oh, I didn't have this until these this trip, you know, I sat on the sun. I party to make sure whatever your voice is the same thing, it collects dirt.


It's very distinctive. Yeah. Yes.


It gives me away. I mean, I'm pretty much one of the only chicks in L.A. with a mullet, so that gives me a way also. Well, you're not in the right neighborhood.


There's plenty. I know. I got a guy out to the to the desert, I guess. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Go out to Joshua Tree. Yeah, exactly. The chicks that are trippin. Exactly.


With handmade tattoos. I had a couple of those too.


But there's something very distinctive about a voice you earned. You know, it's true.


It's kind of like, you know, when you see somebody and and I think I think especially being like a female in the industry, I think growing up and changing and like kind of that there is such a kind of stigma with aging. It's a very kind of scary thing as a female in the industry. And I thought about it a lot and thought about my voice. I actually had someone when I was doing an interview a couple of months ago said, you know, she sounds like she stayed up all night smoking too many darts.


And I said, well, I fucking have. And that's just the truth. And, you know, that was anyone else. You know, it's kind of like your weather or your age or you've been through it and, you know, we'll talk about it as we go.


But they're there. Over the last year, I notice a really big change in my voice, kind of a heaviness to it. And I experienced some heavy things. And so I feel like it is a reflection. It is kind of a scar in a sense. But also just by having the surgery was kind of a gift also because I was able to understand my instrument.


No one ever explained that to me. You know, I sat in a room with the piano and did scales and shit, but no one taught me about how do you have longevity?


You know, you are in here with athletes all the time and recovery days on the most important days. I didn't get recovery days there. That was not important for someone that was making so much capital for such a big corporation. You know, off days are days that that money's not coming in. And I definitely probably didn't get the training that I needed to say, hey, you know what? I don't want to do this on fifteen. I want to do this.


I'm eighty. And that wasn't always considered. Definitely not complaining. It gave me an amazing launch pad for everything I'm doing now, but I hear it.


But it had to be really odd to be working that much and be a young girl.


The balance it trained me to have, it's something that I don't think you are going to get taught any other way besides jumping in the deep end of the pool and hoping you know how to swim. That's the only way I there was no way I could have prepared for the amount of balance I would have to learn to kind of teeter because, you know, at one point, again, it went from it was school.


Then it went from, you know, how many how much we can actually smoke and still play a teenage superstar on the Disney Channel and then like and then like, what's the answer to that question more than you would fucking thing?


I remember one time when I said I don't smoke anymore and I'm sober.


So but I I've been sober since the pretty much the vocal surgery kind of did it for me. I just learned so much about the effects, which, again, you're just not taught, it's not really the drinking, it's staying up all night. You know, once you have your drink, you end up smoking.


And I kind of I have I've become the face of a lot of things kind of against my will, I guess, from my opinions. When you're someone in my position, your opinion becomes your identity.


And it also becomes kind of almost like you kind of become this like preacher. You become this you know, they don't really let you just always have your own opinion. So I've decided to start telling people I live my own lifestyle.


Alcohol was never my problem. There was other things that I end up, you know, I like to go up. So I. I now just avoid really drinking because I like to wake up at 110 percent. But it's never really been my problem. And I could see myself having a drink of celebration in the future, but I get so fucking hung over now that I'm like, why would I celebrate with, like, just feeling like a volcano erupted in my brain, you know?


So so it's really just a personal preference.


But it's definitely not anything that I promote in. I think it's a lifestyle. Everyone should be. I think everyone should experiment. It's a good time. And you learn a lot of things about yourself and the people around you. But now I'm watching. I have younger siblings and they're going through that. And I don't know how my mom did it with me because it's scary.


Yeah, I don't think I think if we're going to acknowledge the fact that all these things exist, cocain exist, pills exist, marijuana exists.


We should teach people how to do it. Right. You really I mean, you're leaving children. It's the same thing with sex, right? Yeah. We leave children to there. There's the information that they're going to get from other kids. Yeah. And if you're learning about sex from another 14 year old or you're learning about coke from a 14 year old, that's not good.


Yeah, like someone we play this game with children where we try to pretend that, you know, they live in a movie. All right.


Well, listen to this is actually funny. You bring this up because I had the idea this week, not that I really have time to do this in the near future, but I would like to at some point my life.


I want to do my own children's book series of realistic children's stories because I don't like the idea that we teach them that this is sunshine world and everyone wants it a rainbow and everyone's equal.


And you need to say, like, that's not what are you going to do about it? That's not true. What are you going to do about it?


And I think there's a way to not terrify children of life, even though I go in and out of periods where I think life is really overwhelmingly terrifying. And that's coming from my position and my position. I tell myself all the time, if you're not enjoying this life, honey, you've got to come in in the next one, because I better fucking love this life. It's the best one. I couldn't imagine being in a different body and having different experience, an awesome life if you do it the right way.


It's an awesome life. And I also I didn't hurt myself beyond repair in my experiences. I survived.


And I don't even mean heart's still beating survival. I mean, I have a lot of people that love me around. I didn't kick all the people that had my best interests at heart out. That's the that's where you die.


If you kick everyone that says, hey, are you OK?


You know, out no, of course I'm OK. You'll just get the fuck out. And so now that I have people that I've had in my life, I feel that I have people in my life that I've known for fifteen, twenty years. And not many people in my position get to say that my parents are awesome.


My dad's loopy as hell, but I've loved him so much.


He has no way of ever hearing this because my dad doesn't have wi fi or anything but a BlackBerry. So I can tell you what I can do.


My dad has two Blackberries with an iPhone, which is not true, but that's what he says. So for his birthday, he said that he wanted to see if he could go 365 days without eating pizza because he had never done before.


So my dad has now gone a year without having pizza and my dad loves bubble bath. He's going to kill me for saying this, but his country loves bubble bath. It's hilarious. And so he loves to smoke a joint, eat pizza and get a bowl that he said, that's what I'm going to do for my birthday.


So for his birthday, I've organized a five foot pizza to be delivered to his farm so he can have all he can eat. And I'm the pizza delivery person on the box. I had someone draw it where it's me with my tongue out in a mullet delivering the pizza. And I got a bathtub on Craigslist and I put it my dad has five hundred acres. So I put it in the middle of the farm filled with bubble gum, just like my music video.


And so my dad's going to have a bubble gum bathtub and a five foot pizza for his birthday. That's adorable.


Next week that I like the fact that he has no Wi-Fi and no Internet, no Wi-Fi, no Internet every now and then.


It's good. That way he'll drive to my uncle's house to FaceTime us every now and then. Oh, wow. Yeah, well, he has to make a drive to Facebook.


It's not for all of us are just like my dad's kept us pebble's throwaway for sure.


We all live on property. We all live really close to each other.


So if you did this thing, like if you really decided to do children's books like realistic children's books, like how would you do that? Would you get a ghost author and sort of come up with the ideas, what you were trying to get across to kids? Well, will you wish somebody told you I like.


You mentioned that no one talks to us about drugs, I know this is going to be controversial to introduce drugs to kids. I think that there's a way and I have to think about it. Wayne Coyne is a good friend of mine, and I did the dead pets record with him. Flaming Lips have been my favorite band since I was in fifth grade. And he's obviously an amazing artist. And he just had his first child a year and a half years old.


He's six years, had a baby. They're coming to visit me right now.


And I would have him do all the illustrations.


So it stays in that kind of surrealist world, because I think I think that's what would get the kids to want to read this book is that the illustrations are still surreal.


And I like that about children's books. But I do think that we do need to talk about, you know, equality. And I do think there needs to be diversity in children's books.


And I think also we just need to talk about the fact I was actually happy to talk to you today because I didn't get to do therapy today because I would be with you. But it's kind of the same thing. And I was talking to him and I said, you know, sometimes it scares me that I'm too tough and I feel like I'm not jaded and I'm not cold, but I feel too tough. And he goes, well, I'm proud of that because life is tough and it's not to get hard.


What do you mean by that?


Well, you mean by you feel. I like that you're too tough. I feel that. I worry sometimes that. I can get over things easily, I don't fall to the floor and crawl up in a ball the way that I used to, and I think that's a part of me growing up, like when, you know, I recently just went through a very public divorce that fucking sucked.


What really sucked about it wasn't the fact that me and someone that I loved realized that we don't love each other the way that we used to anymore.


That's OK. I can accept that. I can't accept the villainize icing and the just all those stories that, like, it's just amazing to me that the public kind of thinks that there's no gap of time that they didn't see that could possibly be what led to this. Like, it's not one day you were happy on the carpet.


The next day you were making out with your friend in Italy. What the fuck? There was a lot of time in between that that you didn't see. It didn't go I didn't like I didn't, you know.


Yeah, but you can't rely on someone else's narrative right now, especially someone who doesn't know you. You really shouldn't even read what people write.


Well, what's crazy is my dad, again, you know, my dad's been a real figure in my life. And my dad, when he got his Grammy nomination, he wore a he went to the Grammys in a John three 16 shirt and he didn't get the Grammy. And the next day, The New York Post or someone put even God can't save Billy Ray Cyrus and his career.


And he was sitting next to Johnny Cash. They were going to something. I have a Johnny Cash tattoo that was handwritten to my dad from around that time. And he said, what the hell? Just like you say to me right now, you're my Johnny Cash. You know, he said, what the hell are you doing reading that? And my dad said, I just never really picked up the paper again. But again, my dad didn't buy that paper.


It was just kind of in your face. And he thought that was funny.


He does now. Now he just says, well, whatever will get Johnny Cash to come and sit next to me and talk to me now, he now he loves it.


And it's been really good to have him go before me. You know, it's kind of that buddy system. I think it'd be really scary if I want to maybe we'll see that.


But to your point of I don't click on this shit, you know, it comes into my life by a lot, by a magazine stand, which I like to walk on the street.


And it says, like Miley's on drugs and pregnant. And then I think one of those things are true, but not the other. Fuck you for lying about me.


Yeah, but that's all they have. I mean, what when someone's in the public eye and someone's as prominent as you are, you become a way for them to access money. Right. That's all you click bait advertisement and I totally get it.


It's that UN programming of also I think it's interesting sitting here with you is that all of this is kind of new.


I mean, even just like the idea of podcast, what I used to do when it was like promo time for a new record. OK, so I'm twelve years old and I'm print and physical copies of my album, so I have to write my fucking music, you know, six months before you actually. So I just had Dolly's new album for Christmas and I had to record a Christmas song in July. It was the weirdest thing I've ever done in my life.


But when you make physical copies, that's what you do and you're telling a story from always being behind, especially when it comes to the media.


So now what I love about this, what I love doing, you know, a show like yours is like we talk about it right now and people here right now. So you're getting the real information. You're not getting information from. All right. You know, I shot a magazine cover. I did an interview. I was lolla in love with my boyfriend. I mean, that literally happened when I did Vanity Fair. I flew there like a week after I got married.


By the time the damn thing was on the stands, I was divorced. It was old news.


It was like, come on, you know, you're really not able to tell your story in real time. And that's what I love about the new way that music is happening and streaming. And I love the idea that, like, I threw up that Flaming Lips record I did on SoundCloud and it was like, you know, no one had to buy it or I sound one hundred five.


But it's very exciting because I really hate it always being behind myself. And I think that's what now I can use my art as my kind of a.


I guess the way that I can talk to the press isn't what bothers me, it's kind of the public, you know, and I got in this habit where when people would meet me and because I didn't get to have it just became a thing that happened constantly was I'd meet someone and they go, man, you're not as crazy as I thought you'd be.


And I'm like, thank you. I don't know what you thought I'd be doing right now if you thought I'd be in, like, you know, space bundes, dropping acid or something. But people say that to me all the time that I'm not as crazy as they thought I would be. And that's just a weird thing to say to someone.


Yeah, but the public image, like what they sold of you, you know, here you are, Hannah Montana. And then all of a sudden you're this very sexual singer and you're doing all this crazy stuff and you're on television shaking your ass and everybody seeing that like, oh, Miley Cyrus is out of control now. She's well. So then that becomes the narrative.


It's funny when people make the narrative, when you become in control, that now you're out of it. Yeah, that was always really interesting.


Well, it's also youth, right? Like, think about the marriage thing, right? You take you say Vanity Fair, they write the article. You're deeply in love. By the time it comes out, you already divorced. That's so Hollywood. I mean, to them that's like, oh, we've seen this fucking story before. We know where this is going. Also your child star. Yeah. Oh, shit. We've seen this story before.


And so you get stuck in that narrative, too, right? Because they want you to fall down the exact same path.


They don't want you to pass. Yes. Well, and then fill it out for you. This is what she's doing now. She's on drugs and she's pregnant.


I've had to. I've had to now I don't read those types of things, but I've had to.


Unlearn that they're not true because sometimes I write things, I write things down when I want something to get put into my head, even if I'm going to have a hard conversation with somebody. Usually I kind of write a little mini script for myself. So I kind of know where I. I don't like going into something with no direction. What do I want this to go? What are my goals, what do I want? That's what any of your athletes would do.


It's like I know that I have that as an artist. I want to have a long career. I have to do the things to be able to have that longevity.


And so I would write down, you know, kind of a kind of an idea of where I'd want conversations to go even with the people in my life and what do I want out of them. And I had to stop going, hey, just because they wrote that down, it's true because something about writing it down gives a lot of power. I don't like to write down things that I don't mean.


That's why I don't write songs that I hate, because once you write it down, they are like alive.


So what you're saying is that like reading things that other people wrote about you made you think that those things were real. So, yeah, it fucked with your own personal narrative. Yes.


So I'm trying to prove something that I didn't need to prove. Like all of a sudden I'd be trying to prove that I'm not crazy when I knew I wasn't crazy.


And yeah, I just think also I mean, when we're talking about realistic children's books, I think the stigma that kind of surrounds, you know, youth growing up rebelling and then craziness and then what's the line between that and mental illness? And, you know, I do have some kind of genetic family history of alcohol. I mean, that totally gets erased when you're a celebrity. It's like Hollywood did this to you. It's like, no, dude, my great grandma was an alcoholic.


You know, my granddad was an alcoholic. My grandma was an alcoholic, you know?


So I. I obviously had it wasn't Hollywood, you know, it's genetic, I think, for you.


I mean, I don't think there's anything wrong with writing a book and running a realistic children's book, but I think you could do a lot of good.


But just making little YouTube videos, you make little YouTube videos, just talking and explaining, hey, this is what I did and this is where I fucked up. And this is why you shouldn't do it this way. These are the drugs you've got to be really careful about. These are drugs that are really dangerous. And look, if you want to have, like, one drink, you want to have one drink, you just have one.


You can drink if you can. If you can. Yeah, if you want to. If you want to smoke weed, take a hit. Yeah. I don't get crazy. Like figure this out. Like you can have a good experience on marijuana or you could fuck up your life and have a schizophrenic breakdown.


That's one thing that I like. You know, when I was smoking weed like my mom, all the weed that I don't smoke, she takes care of both my parents. I have nothing against weed, my whole family's bunch of stoners.


I just felt like when you're talking about kind of some of the the episodes that they can kind of bring on, you know, I maybe have a little some of those kind of tendencies already.


And that's that's something that people who love marijuana don't like to talk about. No. Pretty adamant about discussing that. Yeah, I know people that have lost their fucking mind. Me too early on edibles. Yeah, I know some people that literally became schizophrenic.


And I, and I really like looking at I like looking at facts like that. And I don't know, you know, I do think that there are I like I like information.


I'm a real I love to process new information. I love to receive new information. I love to go.


How do you get your information? Are you a person who reads do you watch documentaries?


I read and I kind of I was going on a school in on a trip when I was maybe seventeen years old and I was walking to the airport and I saw a book that said, Change Your Brain, Change Your Life by Dr. Daniel Aimen, who's now been my therapist for ten years. And I couldn't get on this plane.


I was having a full anxiety attack with smoking, a lot of weed taking a lot of times.


I was seventeen, seventeen, smoking a lot of weed and taking on issues. And I started getting a little yeah, I started getting a little cray cray know, recommend doing some things with, you know, causing some fights with my boyfriend that were unnecessary.


They got heightened. I remember one time I wrecked my car into my gate and I said, this is all your fault.


I was the one driving the damn car and the house is your fault. I did not have a great idea of reality at that time.


So I was going to I was leaving the country for the first time without my family. I was going to Costa Rica and I was walking to the airport and I saw this book Change your brain, change your life. I'm like, I want to change my life. I don't like where this is going. And my brain is actually I don't like who I'm living with. The person upstairs is like annoying the hell out of me. So I got this book and it got me to get onto the plane.


Now, I had a few anxious breakdowns on that one.


You know, when you go to places like going in the middle of jungle, you take all those little planes and all of a sudden you're on a four wheeler going to where you're going every now and then I'd have to stop.


So I would get so lightheaded and stabbing chest pains and all this.


And he said drop. We'd first of all, get rid of the we get rid of the psychedelics. And I also cut gluten from my diet from a little bit of a time so I could get an idea of like, what's my body on a natural level and.


I started doing, you know, kind of blood work and I did some spec scans, which he specializes in, so like actually looking at my brain because what I really like about the spec scan is, you know, you wouldn't tell me I have a broken arm without fricken looking at it.


I could tell you how it hurts, but it doesn't scan.


So a scan, we might have to look up exactly what it stands for because I don't I don't remember this, but basically it's kind of like an X-ray and it kind of shows you almost like in those thermal type colors of the activity of your brain. There we go.


Single photon emission. Computed tomography. Yeah. So I have one of these nuclear medicine study that evaluates blood flow and activity in the brain.


So that's my doctor. Aymond Clinics. That's that's his website right there.


And so I have a couple of these because it brainwork. You know what? So he says this isn't right. Surprisingly good for the abuse that it's had. I guess I saw it in my mouth, but I'm amount of time.


OK, so the amount of activity, if we're looking at like female and male brains, I mean, they're totally lit up in different spots.


You know, actually, I think he's even worked with some some athletes of yours. He works a lot of like with football players because he says, you know, like, you know, I'm almost like a football player for the life that I lead. I got to do everything else. Right. If you're going to go and live under this amount of stress, which is pretty abnormal, it's like you're getting hit in the head an abnormal amount of times, then I got to do everything else right.


So I got to be pretty diligent about my supplements. I got to really care about the food that I eat. My mom always says, like, you guys are overthinking it, having Cheetos every single day. True. For the rest of my life. And I'm like, yeah, but you're not like a you know, you're not a superstar that has to go on stage and do two hours shows. You know, my heart really needs to be in good condition.


I need to be in good condition. I can't by the way, my mom has crazy panic attacks. So, like, I can't believe that my mom has had me, like, had them slam the brakes on an airplane to take off and made me drive home from Canada to Tennessee. I drove from Tennessee to Canada nine times because of her anxiety. I've driven from Nashville to California like four times because of her anxiety. So I don't listen to my that she knows exactly.


My grandma was on a popcorn diet where she took a trash bag to the movie theater and filled it up with popcorn. And she's like, Don't I look good? I'm like on the outside, it's fine on the inside. I'm worried. Meanwhile, she's going to outlive all of us, so sometimes I'll worry about that. But I think I am kind of like an athlete in the way. Like if I'm going to be doing this kind of lifestyle, then I have to do everything else.




So my spec scan looks pretty good, but I like looking at my brain and knowing, OK, so this isn't looking at me and going, there's just something wrong with me. And I don't know why I had a head injury when I was, you know, two years old.


What happened? Oh, it's bad.


My dad had me. This is really bad. But he can't go to jail. I don't think that's long enough time away. He had me and a baby backpack and I was on a dirt bike with my dad and he was riding and a tree had fallen and he ducked and I didn't. I hit my head on the tree. Oh, Jesus Christ. So that's what's wrong.


Everyone's asking me that for, you know, that's a common theme with wild people. Do you know that? Yes. Sam Kinison got hit by a car when he was like a little kid and his brother Bill said it completely changed his life. We have to do the same thing with Roseanne Barr. She got hit by a car when she was fifteen. Before that, she was like mild mannered, really good at math. After she got hit by a car, she had to spend nine months in a mental institution, couldn't count anymore.


She became this wild lady who everybody knows as Roseanne.


Right. I mean, maybe maybe I'm thankful for it. Maybe it's like, I don't know, knocked me into this identity or something.


I think there's something she knows that there's something to that.


Dr. Aymond, we've talked about this a lot.


So when I get really overwhelmed, I also have a tendency that if I know something stupid, I just got to try it to know that it's stupid, which is makes it stupid because I already know about it. Sometimes I'm like, is it better to know it's dumb and do it or not know it's dumb and do it. Don't you think part of that's a head injury.


Maybe, but also it's a mile long of your breaks.


But you know, the way you developed as a human being, being that famous, you know, twelve years old doing stadiums.


But I do like I like looking at my brain and going, OK, listen, like someone cut my brakes right on my brain and I have to take all the things Omega. I've been was vegan for a very long time and I've had to introduce fish and Omega's into my life because my brain wasn't functioning properly and told that to the vegans that come for you, that's they're going to come for me.


But that's OK. I'm used to people coming for me and it's going to be that I call my salary.


Now I listen, if I give home, I have twenty two animals on my farm in Nashville. I've got twenty two in my house in Calabasas, like I'm doing what I need to do for the animals. OK, ok. But when it comes to my brain, you're not vegan. No. You can't be vegan and live in this kind of and happy in this quick. But sure you can. Some people can.


I could not because it was really I was going to die for your brain.


I feel that I'm slowed down now. I'm so much sharper than I was. And I think that I was at one point pretty malnutrition. Like I remember going to Glastonbury and. That was a show that I loved. I love my performance, but I was running on empty like I was on.


Can I ask you, were you doing a vegan diet, like, particularly? Yes, but were you doing intelligently? Like I said, I do all my protein drinks.


I've watched every bodybuilder's YouTube about how they still can't pay attention train.


That's all I'm saying. All of a sudden I'm like, those guys are like, why are my thighs, like, fucking huge?


Like a bodybuilder? Guys, they're almost all on steroids. It's it's it's it's not on steroids.


Well, they and they're you know, they're different bodies to some people. I have good friends that are vegan and they're fine on it. My friend John Joseph, he's been sick for like 30 years. So I think Nadiya's I was vegetarian. Vegetarian at one point or Pescatore. That's what I like to do. Yeah, that's what I'm meant.


There's a lot of people that function really well with that. But some people, it's everybody's different. You know, we all have different ancestors and they come from different parts of the world. And, you know, I don't know of the blood type thing is accurate, but some people really believe that.


So this is another thing that I like about seeing the brain is I try to eat from my brain type and not my blood type brains, my brain type. So my brain type. I really need brakes on my brain because I did not have that. I in my new song, it says I can't beat the devil on my tongue. That was like a really hard thing for me to learn how to do.


But instead of going, I'm just totally impulsive and the most reactive person ever, I look and go well. But my dad also slammed my head into a tree when I was two.


So, you know, maybe it wasn't dad. That's hard to hear that there's a shit. I've given him an award for worst dad ever at home for every time I go.


You know, if we're on Hollywood and there's the best dad award, I scratch out best and put worst. But he was also the best because he would allow me to do a lot of other crazy things that were awesome.


Well, you're fine. I'm fine.


My dad is drill chickens from the Malibu barn. That little red barn come down. Topanga, my dad, they were going to feed these chickens to the snakes and they let us back there. My dad was like, listen, I'm Billy Ray Cyrus. I'm going to totally distract him. You shove as many chickens in the back of the Corvette as you can while I'm signing autographs and we're going to get the hell out of here.


So I did.


I went and my brother got all these damn chickens and we shoved him in the back of his car and he was going to snakes when he was about to go work for David Lynch while he was going to audition for him for Mulholland Drive.


And my dad brought the chickens in the Corvette and he said, if you're going to have chickens in the Corvette, like you're playing the pool guy, you know, that's a pool guy thing to do. So my dad got the job.


So because he got the job, he had to stay in L.A. and we had to go back to Tennessee. So he told me and my mom to tell to people on the airplane that they were exotic Himalayan cockatoos. And we did. And they let them on the plane and we had them in the purse. And we we they lived in a bathtub and like on Hollywood and Highland in some hotel for a long time.


And we got home. And the night we got there, our dogs got in the chicken coop made them all. So they died anyway.


But that's the kind of dad my dad is. He sets you up for failure and for disappointment. But I like that about him because he made me tough.


Well, I mean, it's hard to keep dogs out of chicken coops. I had a dog got in the chicken coop, too, and I had a lot of chickens at one point in time. And then after the last fire out here, my chicken coop, my house did OK, but my chicken coop burnt to the ground and then we had to put them in a smaller chicken coop. And the coyotes got.


That's the thing. That's the thing. You can't blame Dad for nature. That's the way it is. You know, dogs will eat chickens. Yeah. They give them a chance. So we'll snakes apparently.


Fuck. Yeah, yeah, yeah.


So you your brain like when they do the scan, do they, do they tell you what you should do to make it better. Like what do they do. They look at and go oh you're fucked up. Well they tell you to make it better.


You know, he works kind of with you know, I guess a lot of you know, kind of mostly athletes, people that kind of live abnormal lifestyle and injuries. Yeah.


He gets positive cool picture with Tyson and he just works with all he I love seeing the other brains and I'm allowed to see also because it kind of is fun to I would love like a, but like what people just put their brain scans on.


But I like this one that's lighting up the right where I need, you know, you got something I don't have that would be actually amazing how it worked, because that's what personalities are weird. Like people sometimes you go down, they just work together.


Exactly. And I mean, it has to do with that.


You know, I'm not really looking now, I guess, for as much as I'm looking for the this I want the soul connection, but I'm more about the brain connection. I'm a very logical I like to have kind of logic in my life because I used to be kind of owned by emotion in a way. I was very emotional. And that's what I meant by I think we spun off of what I meant by Tough. So I used to be very emotional and I used to cry about things.


And now you get over things and also more like I would really kind of just like I would just become such a recluse. I had that tendency. My dad my dad said he's everyone's just getting on social distancing. He's been doing it since nineteen ninety two. Like my dad's been on social.


I said as soon as we walked in here, you know I it made moves around Achy Breaky. Part time, yes, right now, too, is that was right when I was born, and that is when it was all crazy. So that also explains I mean, I think somewhat of my just who I am, my personality, how I how I kind of your dad talk to you about what the anxiety was like for him when he became famous.


Oh, my dad your dad was my dad for people don't know, in the early 90s, your dad was a fucking superstar, but he had a very different lifestyle than I did as my dad grew up in a house that didn't even have an indoor bathroom.


My dad hadn't gone to the dentist until he was 30 years old. My dad had never gone to the dentist. My dad grew up poor. My my uncle still lives in the same house.


He hung into a bathroom now because my dad's a and put that in, but he still is in the same house and. Yeah. So my dad grew up in like you probably have seen. It's one of the poorer areas in the country. My dad grew up in Appalachia and Kentucky, so mom. So I've been there a bunch and I've been able to see where my dad's from. So he had a different relationship to fame because he went from nothing to everything.


I went kind of from having, you know. Everything, if we look at really the way I grew up, lived in a big house on a big farm, the only thing that was sad about is what didn't have kind of neighbors or normal kids around. So I lived on this big kind of isolated farm, but went to school, had this normal life. But I mean, if we really look at it, I didn't know when I was a kid that I had everything, but I had everything.


So I went from having it all to having more.


And that I don't know what's harder to kind of to kind of humanize, I guess, about yourself, because my life is is is very unique. And so it's very hard for me to sit with someone and relate to them. And I think that made me really scared because my mom doesn't like to be alone. So I have that fear in my mind if I don't want to be alone. But I think what makes you lonely isn't the amount of people are around.


But like, am I relating to people?


Am I really connecting when you must have a hard time connecting to people because they don't have the same life experiences? Your reality, it's like you're in a you're in a fishbowl, you're a different reality and you're hanging out next to people that aren't in the fishbowl. Here's a difference of the fishbowl.


So we usually put the fish in the fish bowl. And I you know, I buy in the fish, right. We do it. And I was born into it. But then again, I put myself into it. So if you get a beating, you're the one that does it.


You did it when you were a little kid and you didn't know what you were doing. But my parents didn't really want me to see my parents. My dad wouldn't even really go with us to the auditions. He was actually kind of mad at my mom about it. That was kind of a thing.


And then my mom's like, I'm going to do this, you know, she says in this small town, she's going to be like everybody else. It ends up on drugs.


So she took me to L.A. Mom like, hello. You even smoke weed yet? Well, this is that that's not the baby that I've ever heard of. Like, let's avoid drugs in Nashville, so let's get more and better a lot better drugs in L.A. So we've gone way off track.


What what bothers you about being more resilient? So that's what it sounds like it does. When you say more tough, you're talking about the difference between someone who reacts overly emotionally, something you would fall to the ground and curl up in a ball and cry about things and now you can get over them. That, to me, is the sign of perspective.


OK, so here's where it is. And I don't even want to have a conversation about, like, really, you know, sexism or men versus women cause like, I love dudes, you know, and I actually relate to dudes a lot more. But I think men in my life have told me that I'm cold, cold fucking bitch, because I leave when things are done.


I was actually going to say, well, meet up and dating bitches. I'm really into a lot of freaky things, but I don't fuck dead guys.


And when it's over, it's over and you're dead to me and we move on, you know. So that's what I feel about it. Let's have it and I'll do a lot of things, but I don't do that. And so I think that that's where I've gotten the idea, which actually I'm glad you just said that to me, because I get this kind of beaten into the brain from all different angles. My mom's like, you know, everyone else is proud of me for being, like you said, resilient.


And I have a lot of guilt. I'm a very guilty.


But that sounds like you're talking to guys who want you to feel guilty because you don't feel emotional about an ending. And this is the first time learn how to just let it go. If they like you or if they love you, they have to think of you as a heart.


They should want you to be happy. Just let it pass and then be friends. OK, so if they can do that, that's on them. That's not that's because you're an older man.


Because these guys that are you know, I definitely should be with someone. I think that I've got to find Nick Nolte.


This is what I'm thinking. This is what this is about. I'm thinking I don't need a man or a woman that's going to take care of me. I can take care of me because I've got money. I've got all the things that I need to take care of myself. I need them to be able to take care of them because somehow I keep getting into when you need someone with autonomy.


Yes, that's what you need, someone who don't need your constant approval and affection.


And now they're using this word. Need I just for the record, I guess I really don't need to be in a relationship at all.


So that's good. We got to this point. See, this is therapy. Yeah.


You don't need it, but it's it does sound nice. People can poison you with their ideas of what you should be. And if you don't meet up to their expectations and oftentimes their expectations of you are just to reaffirm themselves. They want you to love them. They want you to tell them how awesome they are. And if you don't feel that way, you're cold. Yeah, there's something wrong with you because they don't have autonomy. They can't exist independently.


Right. That's the problem. Right. The problem is a lot of bitches out.


I like it. You said it, not me. That's how I feel. And honestly, we're talking at a very this is a super like kind of pivotal moment for me right now. I haven't been single and like I guess really from 2015, I mean, there's been little month, so maybe about five years like I've had, you know, a few months here and there. I've been single, but not for a long period of time. And, you know, something I'm really excited about is FEMA performance.


It's coming up. And I love that it's the first time I'm going to be on that stage as a single, bad ass, groeneveld secure woman. That's done a lot of work like I've done. I've done the work. And that's the thing is some people say, you know, like how did you how did you get here? You know, you turned out pretty good. And it's like, dude, I've I worked really hard at it, but just seriously get it in your head.


Any time someone gives you a hard time about being strong, you're not a bad person just because you're strong, just because you don't cry as is used to.


That's ridiculous. So ridiculous perspective. That's all it is, you know, bad. But, you know, all these fucking animals you have, how could you be a bad person if you love animals?


I put this stuff called Monkey Butt on my dog. What is monkey? Every day this baby powder for dog butts. Because I, I got this got one of my my my friend who said, oh my God, this is all this over. My friend is sitting out there right now. Try to immediately, you know, make me happy because I just want to break up and showed me a hot guy on Instagram and I started school and I see him putting this powder on his dogs and I'm like, I don't want him, but I want that stuff for the dogs.


And that was great. So I ordered it right away. Monkey butt. So I have a dog.


Her she can't see, can't hear. She can barely walk. She was dropped at a fire station. She was overbred.


She's a bulldog, you know, and they breed them crazy and she can barely get off the floor. She's so overweight and her name is Kate Moss.


And what I love about it is I tell everybody when I'm coming to set, you know, I'm going to bring Kate Moss, make sure she's good. She's covered, tested. We're all good. And then all the men on sets face are the best because it's like I thought Miley Cyrus bring Kate Moss is going to be the best day of my life.


And then she comes in with her big ass, literally, that I have baby powder.


She has diapers because I put diapers on her for when she comes to set because her butt is like atrocious.


Do you just need to get her on a diet? I have on a diet, honestly.


I'll show you some pictures when we're done with this, because she had this thing called a cherry I and everyone, both eyes. So they were trying to get me to, like, either remove her eye or do all the surgery, whatever. I'm like, let me do this the old fashioned way.


So every day I get up, I clean her eyes, see, I'm not a bad person. I clean her eyes. I put four drops in two times a day, give her three tablets. She's lost probably ten pounds already. And the cherries are completely out of her eyes. She is healed. And what I love about her, and I'll show you these videos is she does she can sing.


That's what really locked. And so I've never known this to be for a dog to do this. When I do scales and I warm up for my shows, she howls and sings with me and she's got perfect pitch cool.


So I haven't even adopted her yet. I was forcing her and I was going to take her to set hoping, you know, somebody kids wanted a dog and they would want her. And the first thing that someone said is a face only a mother can love. And I was like, that's not true.


I love her. And so I love her because she started singing to me and then I adopted her right.


Then she's so ugly that they waived the adoption fee.


They said that's not a lie. They literally she was free. And I now dream remind myself, they say the best things in life are free. And when I look at her and her big ass, I know it's true. She's free. I had a friend who had wolves.


He had wolf dogs. And you could you could, like, sing in his house and the wolves start howling.


You go, you go and they will go see my mom. My dogs do that with the ambulance here. Oh, yeah, you do that. Yes. So they start going then my dogs are going. So all the dogs saying, but they none of them do it to scale like Kate Moss.


Oh that's adorable. Oh yeah. She's good. So yeah. Don't let anybody tell you that there's something wrong with being resilient. Yeah. I'm learning now that men will do that. I see a lot of men do that with women.


They want women to feel bad. I want them to feel bad for, for not being emotional.


I used to get small. That's what I'm telling you. See, that's what I used to be.


Really easy to kind of put me back in the, you know, kind of Jack in the box kind of thing. You know, you could get me to come out and just for a little while.


But it's it's it's become suspiciously convenient timing. It always seems that I get told that I'm a cold bitch before when you're done.


Right when I'm right. When I'm ready to put out fucking. Yeah, it happens every time because you're focused on other things. Focus on other things. Exactly.


And then it's like, you know, and then I, it's just it's all, it's a whole thing.


You, you have so much energy like the way you talk and all the sentences run on into the next. Do you exercise. Yes, I exercise.


What do you do. I love polarities and it's not super I guess cardio.


I think you need to do something to run a little bit more. It is. I got a bag being put in my house right now, so I'm going to next time I'm here, I'll show you.


I'll push it and protect your hands like these nails come off. I just haven't done this is Dolly style.


Everything about these tapes on honey, it's easy now. You just go watch. Would I like you? It's all this tape.


People that have played play guitar and. Oh yes. Legal instruments and they hurt their hands.


I actually had a I had a guy tell me that I had grubby little kid hands and I liked that about it because I did have dirt.


And that was because this was at a time where I was doing drugs and I wanted to know where the hell the gophers go. So I was a go for a hole in my back yard.


And I'm like, where do they keep going? And I see them pop up and they go in. I'm like, So you're going to China. You can dig if I can find a gopher. So here I go. You can't really dig China. And I know that much. And you can't find the Gophers either.


You can. Putin knows how to get them. I could not find the gophers and I looked for a very long time, I even tried to get him out with pizza. I brought pizza down into the hole hoping that, you know, everybody loves pizza.


Apparently not for you rarely see gophers, but you see their holes. That's what I'm telling you. That's where I was going to go. That's it.


You know, when someone tells you that they've been in line, they saw Jesus, you know, whatever I wanted to see, I don't even want to see Jesus. I just want to see a damn gopher.


So I went into the hole and I never saw Gopher see a Wolverine die.


Disappointed if I was one animal I could see in the wild. I'd like to see a Wolverine.


See, you're like, that's that's next level. I just want to frickin regular D'Aguilar Gopher in the backyard.


I've seen you rarely see him, but I know him, but I think he brings a dope.


Wow. I just think seeing one of them fuckers and that's rare. It's see one of those things in the wild.


Yeah. My dad, my dad wanted to see a bear for thirty years. He had this dream. This is so I have some I don't know if he's lying or if he's what the hell is going on. But we're on this plane and he's so tired, he's like, I'm going to see him. My dad's a little kind of intuitive that way. And he's like, I'm going to finally do it. I've been looking for thirty years. And when you look hard enough and you were diligent about what you want, you know, I believe that you get it due diligence.


And I've been looking for bears for thirty years, whatever.


And so he brought catnip to him so he could get the bear to come out.


I'm like, what the what's the deal? So of course my dad ends up going on some hike and he sees a bear and he leaves the catnip for as a tree. He ends up leaving. And now I was so scared. You know, catnip gets the cats hype like it's like crap. I'm like, please don't give Korac to the bear. I work.


So I was just I hope to God that I don't know. How would you know?


Has anyone ever given catnip to a bear? I'm sure someone that's very Ngige.


I'm pretty sure of one person's dogs. So why would it work on bears?


I don't know. Dogs aren't bears. I don't know. I seem to be, like, more close to a dog like than cat like.


Well, no bears ended up going ham and doing anything.


See a bear. He was somewhere on the East Coast doing a show.


There's plenty of places to see bears, you know, have to wait thirty years. My dad is lazy as hell.


And he said I looked everywhere, probably open this fucking door Barrowland and sat there and went back inside.


Well, that's what people think we're bears.


Let's go outside. Just go to the right place. Bears.


I went I spent a little bit of time in Vancouver, B.C. with my brother. There's actually one of the crazier things I've ever done. People think I'm so crazy, but this is the craziest thing. But it's not even that nuts. I, I was following like Nat Geo on Instagram and I love the pictures of the Spirit Bears. I love those like beautiful bears up NBC. And I kind of started reading about the Wolf call up there and I got really kind of invested in these animals.


And I sent a DM and said, is there any way that some point I could go with maybe some of your researchers and I could see some of these bears or wolves for myself because I think I'd be even more inspired to kind of like fight for them if I could actually see them and know that they're really real because I've only ever seen them from a picture.


And they responded and said, sure, you can come up and hang with the spirit. But this is kind of like, I don't know if it's cat fishing or I don't know what was really going on, but someone telling me, sure. So me and my brother load up. We I didn't really want to get my parents involved. So we got a coach flight and had to go to San Francisco. Then we got this shitty little hotel room because we were just trying to I didn't know how to do it.


Everyone's always done my travel for me managers and all these things. So I was just booking it.


So we end up taking like two little planes, three boats, and we end up getting to. But this dude, Ian, who shoots and for Nat Geo and shoots up and B and it was just amazing. And when I got to see all the spirit bears, I got to go into like where they do all their research on their boat. So they'll leave these like kind of like trap combs where they it just brushes the bear's hair when it when it walks by so they can understand kind of more about it and yeah.


Sort of looking about like all this information.


Again, this is one of the kind of weird things that I've done that I didn't really know who was going to be waiting on that boat. I mean, I know we tell girls not to go out into the middle of a boat.


How old are you when you were doing this? This was two weeks after the VMAs and twenty fifteen. So you're already super famous and you're super famous going out there to find bears with my back. There I am.


Yeah. There I am. Yeah. And do you find that if you're not glammed up and you can kind of sneak around.


Oh this is kind of funny because I think it's happening in a second. They gave me a caterpillar that if you look at your belly, your tongue goes numb. Oh, great. And I pretended that I was in my happened somewhere in here. Oh, yeah. Say the B.C. wolves.


But I feel like you don't wear makeup and shit. Can you sneak around.


Oh yeah. I sneak around pretty good. It's the voice. It's the Mecca. I just got up.


Yeah it's the voice and you fuck with your voice and make it high. You pretend.


Not really. Not really. I have a phone voice.


I think I apparently you know, I directed this last video and apparently when I read my presentations, I have like a different voice, you know, like when you answer the phone.


But I think it sounds the same. My my phone voice, I think is like. I think it just sounds the same. Mm hmm. Yeah, so that's what gets you that's what gets me time. No. Yeah, like wait.


But the voice telling you it's her. Yeah, exactly. You.


That's that source when you hear those whispers. Yeah. Those are weird whispers. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Your life of growing up famous is that that doesn't end well for most people. You're remarkably together for someone who grew up famous. You know, that's a it's a weird way. It's a weird alchemy to put together a human being where in your developmental stages, pre-teen, in fact, you're hugely famous.




What what do you think that did for you wanted to do? Do you do you think that's a good thing or do you think it's a manageable thing?


I would say it isn't recommended because like I kind of said in the beginning of this, it's it's like jumping in the deep end of the pool and not knowing if you can swim or not and it can go one way or the other.


Luckily I swam, but it almost always goes the wrong. I know almost all. And that, I don't think comes very recommended and I wouldn't recommend it.


I don't know.


I don't know what it is, but I feel I feel like I've kind of been given this like special.


I don't know the kind of special understanding of I don't even know where it comes from. So I'm really not religious. And I maybe it comes from like education of getting a good understanding of, you know, I've got kind of a good idea of like what fame does.


I'm kind of like looking at it from a level of were you thinking about this when you were young?


One thing about this when I was young, but I started thinking about it at the time where I think it kind of mattered that I could go one way or the other. And that was probably when I was 17.


And I bought Dr. Raymonds book about understanding, like kind of I get it why I can't get high enough like on drugs and why I end up doing more drugs than anybody else. I wrote a song where one of the lines says, I'll go toe to toe like I'm Ali. Like, I'll just I'll do more. That could be the biggest guy in the room. And I'll say I'll be able to do more drugs and you.


But it's because my level of what high is, is I felt it from I mean when you're having fifteen thousand people screaming, I'm a sing along to your songs.


It's like, you know how you're saying your float tank is getting high without drugs. It's like the times a billion.


Yeah, I'm sure. So it's really hard to to come down off that.


And I never luckily had a problem with like taking down downers to bring myself down. But there was a lot of people around me that was like, you know, just take half of these and you'll be fine.


Yeah. You know, so I'm lucky I didn't start messing with downers.


I think it also might have to do with your head injury. Yeah, yeah.


I know that there's there's a real big connection between people with traumatic brain injury and the need for either alcohol or cocaine or absolutely something to perturb your your natural state of consciousness.


And a lot of my brain is really, really on. It's got like overactivity. But then again, if you kind of look at the part, that frontal lobe that kind of tells you, you know, yes or no or stops you from making a bad choice, mind gets a little sleepy sometimes when I'm not doing, especially when it comes to the diet, when my diet isn't, you know, it's annoying because I do like to whine.


I'm country. So I like to eat bad food. I had never my mom used to get mad. If I would tell her I don't want butter, like my mom is like, great, for now I'm fine. And but I just remember going up by my mom, you know, we ate frozen waffles and all that. We don't know anything about nutrition. I grew up on that country diet and so I learned a lot. I honestly, I mark a lot of my I guess, kind of like my grounding in the weight that I have to my diet, to my supplementing, to my my maintenance, to the diligence to the sport.


That being an entertainer is it is a sport.


Yeah. Yeah, it is. Are you the boss. Yes. On the boss. You're the boss and the boss. Do you have a mentor. Do you have someone that you can consult with when shit is weird?


I send faxes back and forth to Dolly Parton because that's how she.


Oh shit. That's how I listen. If you need a mentor, that's the mentor. Exactly. A woman who's done it.


And I kind of I try to kind of, you know, my life moves so fast, I try to kind of send her a little kind of rundown of what's going on.


Every other month. You guys fax, she faxes me, then I send an email and they fax to her. They email the fax.


Yeah, it is she yeah. She she records everything on the cassette and all that, but she says she hears it on the cassette and so she's she I have actually a recording of her saying it at somewhere.


It's on the beginning of Rainbow Bolander at the end of it.


But she says, Oh, I listened to that. She goes, All right, I'm going to put this on my cassette, then I'm going to run it down on to a CD. Oh, I'm so high tech. Yeah, yeah.


We played Joline your your coverage only on this podcast once.


Thank you very much. Yeah. Thank you. Know when a lot of kids kind of think that's my song now that's what I like doing about covers. I think you were talking about that Cornell tribute at one point also. Yeah.


That's what I love my fans.


You know, they, they, they wouldn't really know unless I introduced it to them. And that's something that I really love.


And that happened recently with Midnight Sky and Stevie Nicks. There's a sample of age 17, which I got I got blessed by her to be able to allow me to do it, I had another melody, a, B melody. It's definitely below a B because it's not I just 17 and my top five favorite song ever. And she said, you can borrow from me any time, which like that's also so cool.


Yeah. Yeah. That's got to be pretty badass to be able to be in contact and to collaborate with all these amazing artist.


And I went on the road with Joan Jett for a little while to choose on on tour with the WHO. I went and hung out with her for a little while, for a little while to me, you know, even if I'd show up there and I'd maybe been partying too much and she would yell at her manager, Kenny, who's, you know, been her manager and in her band from the beginning, Kenny, we got get her like some Mexican food or something.


Look at her like she's she's like, yeah, she's going to break in half.


And, you know, all of a sudden all this food starts in my room. And, you know, I think she's probably seen, you know, not just in her own band, but, you know, she's seen everything.


She's seen everything. And I think she's seen it go the wrong way. You know how we're talking about whether you swim or drown. I think she's seen a lot more people drown. And so she always tries to feed me.


But that's where it's got to be really hard if you're a woman like her who's been there, done that, and then you see some young girl coming up and you're like, damn, this lady right now is in the waves. And, you know, and you've been in the waves many times where that ship is rocking back and forth and you don't know which way it's going to go. Yeah. When you're a seventeen year old kid and you're doing a lot of mushrooms and smoking a lot of pot and and and also you're super fucking famous and really people can't tell you shit.


Yeah. Which is part of the problem. I know. That's why my mom's the best. I didn't understand she was the best at the time. She's still taking my cell phone. I'm like, how can you take it. I'm paying for. And she's like, I gave you live shots, you know, and but my mom still took my cell phone until I was almost twenty.


You have like an almost manic way of talking. Your way of talking is almost like a fountain, like a crazy fountain, like words just keep coming and ideas just keep coming. I know. Like, how do you how do you shut that off?


I am into a lot of these. I love the idea of these hypnosis apps.


I have a lot of those which ones use. I like, I like Aymond clinics. I'm all about my boy doctor. I am. And I listen to Headspace a lot and I like calm. I use a lot of sounds great.


Yes. I actually my favorite thing about Headspace is I love the the sleep skat and my favorite one is the Cat Morina because I do love boats and I do love cats.


So that's a dream for me after a long day and I work on you when my house burned down I literally I'm not joking.


The Cat Morina got me through.


I was shooting in South Africa and every night I'd be like, hello and good evening. You're at the Cat Marina. Lucky for you, you love cats. What do you love more boats, you know? And it's like, hell, yeah, I'm at the cat Marina.


My house is on the ground in a million pieces and I'll never see anything that I loved inside it again. But I'm at the fucking cat Marina.


I'm not a doctor. But if I was out, I was prescribed to you some ridiculous, rigorous exercise. I think you are. You're like a little Ferrari. I need to get out there on the fucking racetrack.


Let's go. I really think that I go see all this fucking energy. Have them like that, ladies. Like an overflowing battery.


This is why I like this is why I like to work hard and make sure. Yeah. I love to work. You're a thoroughbred. I do. I won't. I don't work. That's when I get in trouble.


But you also got to think about there's genetics involved.


You know, your father is a musician and, you know, just and then all your life being in the public eye like that and performing and working and then just the amount of effort that you put in when you were a kid touring all the time, I mean, you're fucking geared for that shit, you know?


And I just feel like people like that. Your body can betray you sometimes if you don't have a lot of physical pain.


To be honest with you, I'm not something I'm working on and trying to figure out to. And that had a lot of physical pain, physical pain.


My hips, like, really, really hurt me. And my hips drive me crazy. Like, if I fly, I think I don't know, maybe it's just the stretch.


I do stretch. I'm actually overly flexible.


I'm like kind of double jointed everywhere. And so I have a lot of like shoulder like my shoulder will just slip out all the time. Like it kind of just does weird things and my arms twist and weird directions.


Are you physically strong? Physically strong.


I'm pretty strong. I've been stronger. I've been stronger. Maybe it's like a muscle thing. Maybe you need to exercise a lot.


I lift I, I really, really loved lifting and doing all my weight training, my resistance and then the kind of the veganism I was kind of trying to I think I'm really kind of building myself back up to realize what works.


I'm actually right now in a very experimental period. It's actually fun to talk about with you because I know that you kind of have probably some good suggestions on that.


But I'm experimenting a lot with, like my diet and my body and my routine and my exercise right now, because, I mean, kind of like, you know, leaving veganism is really terrifying. Like you said, the public kind of will destroy you for that.


And how long were you vegan? Since I was vegan from 2013 till 2019, so in 2019, what was the first thing that you ate?


My butt was has been cooked me cook me some fish on the grill. I cried, like for a long time. I cried for the fish and I little fucks that I take care of their kids.


Listen, I have some videos on my phone of my fish at home. I have a blowfish that runs to the side of the tank every time I come home.


So it really hurts me to eat because it thinks you're going to feed it. And I do every time. Yeah, that's it. I know.


You know, I haven't really had you get shot in the head. That fish doesn't give a fuck.


Well, that's what that's what my ex said about the dogs.


And I'm like, I can't do this. The dogs. And he's like, watch this. So it's feed them the fish like they're happy, you know, they'll eat it. But so that's what I had.


And it was because of a hip pain I had actually going to we were flying to, I think, Poland or something on a tour that I was on. And I started sobbing, crying on the plane so I couldn't see it any longer because my hips were hurting so bad. So this was pretty.


And laying on the floor quit.


And now I'm back on the I did a trial period of eighteen of like kind of removing things because I think when you try all these different diets, like, OK, now I'm going to try keto now and try and try this, you're doing it at such a kind of it's really hard to know what's affecting you.


So I tried to go slowly, like, OK, it takes a frickin long time, but going through and going, I'm going to eliminate this now and then I'm going to put it back and see.


I feel my body when I am supplementing, especially with the Omega is like the omegas have really changed my life for me. I think, again, you know, you kind of you kind of refer to me as something like a car. And I think that we are kind of like a car. And I was like so dry from having none of these healthy fats in my diet. I did what I could with like as many fucking avocados a day as I think things.


But it's hard to get the fat.


It's not as bioavailable when your brain is you know, your brain really needs those fats. And, you know, it was really, really hard for fish.


Oil is the way to go. Yeah, I know people don't like it and they don't like the idea behind it, but God damn it, it's so good for your brain.


Yeah, I love I do kind of like the fish egg vital choice also because I was great. I love fresh eggs the way to go. That's what I do. Yeah.


I mean it's really just my head so much now. It's an inflammation issue then.


Yes. Yeah, yeah. I think in general my brain like you're saying, is kind of on fire. It is inflamed. I think in general I'm inflamed. So I'm looking for in my life, not just in kind of like dating or relationships, but in general the people I like to have around. I like to have this kind of water signs. I like someone that can kind of or signs.


But I love water science because I love being around in general, like, I love people that are kind of like fluid and that can kind of put some of that on my flame because it gets overwhelming sometimes the amount of heat and like energy that I generate. I actually was reading something about ducks. That's interesting, the way the ducks handle their energy.


Ducks. Yes. How they handled the so ducks, you know, I guess their form of exercise. So apparently I was reading this in a book last night.


I don't know if it's I guess it goes with my realistic children's stories, but I was reading about ducks, how they, like, kind of ferociously flap their wings and then they kind of swim off in peace and you'll kind of you'll see these weird kind of patterns that they do, and especially if two ducks are together. So you sell a piece of bread in the water, one of the ducks get it. They get a little fight going on.


Then they both separate ways. They go to their own spot and start flapping their wings, all crazy to get out some of that energy.


And then they just swim away in peace. And I'm like, I guess that's kind of what you're saying, that I need to be more duck like I need to, whether it's the beginning of the day or the end of the day, I need something to go in, like flap my wings and get out that extra energy, because I think that's part of the physical pain. Like when I when I went to go check in on the pain before.


And I've been to a lot of people here and no one seemed to help me with the physical pain. It actually gets really, really bad. Like especially if I fly, I usually have to lay on the ground because my back hurts me so bad and my hips hurt me so bad. That's crazy. I know.


And I'm pretty young, but this young, you know, that's crazy. And there's no real injuries. You could point to that that caused me.


So I overdid Ashtanga yoga for a couple of years because I am extremist. Right. Hence there's a little controversy between Ashtanga yoga and the kind of like hip injuries.


Yeah, hip injury had an impact on everything and everything looks good.


You know, everyone says we have no idea, you know, kind of what's going on. But they're not really taking into consideration my lifestyle, which that has to do something.


You know, how to put it somewhere does amount of energy. I don't always get it out. You're right. I need to frickin run more. You know what? The running helped me a lot when the house burned down two in South Africa. I was running every day.


Yeah, I would think that someone like you, you need something rigourous.


If I don't work out, I'm not a great person. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, I can guarantee you. Oh yeah I know one we don't do calls or work meetings before I work out. That's, we know this OK. We've learned from the past that you have a trainer important.


Yeah I do. Yeah. A good trainer trainer. But I need to.


I think in times where my trainers kind of like family like for me now, and maybe getting a little too small to comfort, a little too soft in a way that when I'm going through, like, you know, this week, I went through like another public breakup.


I had the VMAs. The song was coming out at the same time. And when I got into the gym, like, I would sometimes just start crying because I love them like families.


When you walk in, I would just start crying because you know that you could be comfortable or just comfortable.


And then I think it's hard to go, OK, now I'm going to beat your ass because I think he thinks life is beating my ass. But maybe I need to maybe think, yeah, there's a job to be done.


Yeah, all the emotions. Great. And it's wonderful that he loves you and the guys are friends.


I think it's a little bit my, my my bad for, like, wondering how hard I want to be pushed.


Well, it's also you're the boss. That's the problem. Exactly. When you're the boss and you're Miley Cyrus, you can't say, listen, bitch, it's time to go to work.


Yeah. You know, he'll do it to me sometimes.


Like, I like you can't do it too much because then you're like, no, no, I'm the fucking boss. And then you go, then I think I go. And then I think I, I want to kind of in it is not give up. But then I think sometimes I wonder how much. And I really don't even like saying this because I kind of have guilt for my life. Like I don't mean it's too much like I can't take anything else.


Like I know that I don't have the hardest life. I know how lucky I am. Yeah.


But I know that don't you don't need to compare because just what, what you do is very difficult. Don't make any mistake about that.


I have a hard time with that. I feel very guilty. The nonsense. Throw someone else into your existence. First of all a you didn't choose it, OK? You were a little kid. You became famous by being in the public eye and just dealing with the things we're talking about, about people writing stories that are fake about you. All that stuff comes at a price. And if you read it, it comes at a heavier price. But even just knowing it exists, get it gets in your head.


You have to be very strong to be able to ward that off. And the idea that you don't and that it's easy and that a regular life is easier horseshit. Regular life is just a regular life. It's not easier or harder. But what you do is fucking hard. It's very hard. You're very famous. Being very famous is weird and being very famous. Your whole life is even weirder. So a normal person develops, right? You go through life and you meet friends and you have to show that you're a good person to get people to like you.


You have to show, you know, some sort of some excellence. It's something for people to praise you. You're getting fucking praise from the time you're a baby. But basically, it's a weird way to develop. Yes. And so for you to reach adulthood and try to be conscious and try to be sentient and try to like to just stay balanced, it's you're dealing with a situation that ninety nine point nine nine nine percent of the population has no fucking idea what you're handling.


Yeah. The only people that are going to understand that are people that also grew up famous.


Yeah. Which I have a hard time with because I haven't made that exactly. My peer group. And now I kind of am like I think I've been really searching for some sort of normalcy in my life and for sure. And so I think I haven't surrounded myself with the top. A lot of kind of people that are also at this thought, this level, because I feel I have a lot of guilt, like I feel like I could be I feel like that would make me shallow or something for only surrounding myself, for like rich and famous people.


But people do that because of the only ones that can relate to you. And that's what I'm working on. You feel like people that are regular folks, they treat you weird or they they they like you more than they should or that they you know, they praise you more than they should because you're an alien. Yeah.


You're just like, gosh, Miley Cyrus, you're not like a regular person that walks into a room and you'll never be a regular person.


And I think rather than trying to prove, like, excellence in any way, when I walk in a room, I try to prove really hard that I'm new. Normal. Yeah, it's exhausting. Yeah.


But I don't want to be normal, which is funny because it's kind of like you make a goal. You know, I do this with Ayman about making a goal and then going towards what I want.


It's like I don't want to be normal, you know, but I constantly struggle with am I a fucking rich asshole?


Well, this is the beautiful thing. The beautiful thing is that you're thinking you're thinking about all this. You're balancing it out. But this is not a path that very many people have gone through successfully. Yeah. And so that's something I'm careful because you hear right now you're OK right now. My Miley Cyrus in twenty twenty. You're great. You're good. I mean, you've gone through divorce. You've gone through this, you've gone through that. But you're right here right now you're OK.


Yeah. The path forward is treacherous. Yeah. It is going to be because you didn't develop like a normal person. Every fucking child star. I mean like maybe like Jodie Foster. Like how many, how many have made it through and see and I don't know her maybe that lady's crazy. She's an amazing actress. Right. There's a few that made it through. There's not many and it's not a good path. Yeah. It's not a path that I would ever recommend to somebody.


And once you've gone through it, there's no way to go back and do it all over again. Right.


But I say with confidence that I feel like I could be the one because I. I feel like I don't expect it to be easy and I don't even want it to be who actually I had a guy trying to be shitting me one time said, you want a guy that just do whatever you want. I said, that's where you're wrong. I want, like, all the challenging things. If it's something that's easy, I don't fucking want and I never have.


That's why I didn't keep living my life in Nashville, where we were the biggest fish in the small pond and all that kind of thing. You know, I needed more. And the reason why I say that with confidence is because I'm really willing to do the work. And I'm also I'm willing to look at myself from a human level and also look at like what my body needs to thrive.


And I know that it can't be cocaine for me and I know that it can't be alcohol. And I know that, unfortunately, I love fucking fish. But at this point, I got to eat it to be able to have my brain to work as quickly as you and I are going right now. And what I have to do later today and going to the studio tonight, and I I understand myself from a human there's nothing about me that thinks I am superhuman.


And I think that I think I would I would take that as something that. That makes me unique because I don't think that I'm really I know that there's something special about me in my life, but I don't feel that on this level of of being a human that I'm different. And so I know what it takes to keep this motor going in the end. And I also know when to take time. All those things.


You said it perfect. As long as you have doubt, as long as you want to do better, as long as you're recognizing who you are is not exactly who you want to be. You want to be better. You want to figure it all out. You want to work it all through. And you have this weird guilt from growing up in this weird way that has to be your fucking superstar.


When you're a little kid, the guilt, there's no way around it.


And if you hang out with normal people, they're going to stick that in your face and see a lot of people hold my guilt if they know it's a weakness. So they use it with me. Like, I've got to find people that don't do that. Yeah. That's why my my crew is pretty small.


Beautiful. Well, they're all nice people. They are all been my in my life for over ten years and that is possible.


People ask people that are famous like is it possible that you could find people that don't get weird around you? Yeah, you could find them, but they have to be strong people. Exactly. You have to have people that have their own personal sovereignty and people that can hold their own space. They don't need you. They just love you. Yeah.


That man, you know, I had someone that that tried to tried to hurt me and say that. I mean, I really have had I've I've had really amazing people in my life, but I've had people that have tried to hurt me, too. I even brought my little scarf just in case I got emotional, because I really might add someone recently tried to tell me that everyone in my life is afraid of me and that like that really makes me upset just because.


Well, I bet a lot of people in your life are afraid.


I think everyone in my life that I have in my close inner circle really loves me. And so to say that every one of my life acts out of fear of me, my mom, I'm almost fuckin thirty. She will whip my ass. It's like my mom will actually hit me.


But I mean in a bad way. I don't mean that they're afraid of you like like afraid you're going to do something terrible and they're afraid around you. I mean, you're a powerful thing.


You mean this there's no getting away from who you are.


You got to kind of accept that you're Miley Cyrus.


Yeah. Yeah. That's a very strange thing. This one Miley Cyrus in the universe that we know of, it's you and you're really fucking famous and you're really young. Yeah, it's weird. There's no getting around that. Yeah. And the fact that you feel guilt about all this and the fact you want things to be difficult, those are all of the best indicators that you're trying to do better. Yeah. You get it. Yes, you do get it.


And you know that you have a hard road and the people that don't think you have a hard road there are they're fucking mine. Like, I didn't get famous until much later in life. And it was a slow drip into my thirties and into my forties.


I think it was way healthier. That seems healthy. But I also, during the whole time did martial arts. So I was always humbled. I was always getting my ass kicked. Yeah. And I feel like those two things are the only things that saved me from my own brain. Yeah. Because you're like people are not designed to be famous. Yeah. That's why kings are all tyrants. Yeah. When you view the one person who gets to make all the calls, absolute power corrupts absolutely.


It's a common expression, right.


Yes. That happens with famous.


I'm trying to have a good relationship with the power and feel feel a healthy dynamic.


The way you're describing it is perfect. OK, how many would look the Ellen situation? I don't know, Ellen. She's probably a nice lady, but she's in control. She's in control of all these people and they're all scared of her.


She's like, fuck you, where's my tea? I know that that kind of shit. That's not a good place for a person to be to have that much control over, to be proud of myself that I don't live in that world.


And I think I could probably also mark that up to animals and how much I love them.


And I think that's what led to my veganism for a time, was like the fact that tonight I have to put powder on my dog's ass.


That makes me how to do.


I don't get with the apparently I think it kind of just hopefully seals in some way. How disgusting.


It's very, very out there and in your face. And I think it's more of like a concealer. But I'm really happy that Kate Moss. Hey, guys, I got to say, Kate Moss makes me put baby powder on her ass.


Just use that as the Deezer one time. Kate Moss, when we put baby powder on, it's called Monkey Butt. So I that that makes me happy. And like my one of my dogs, he's obsessed with drinking out of the pool.


And so he, like, throws up all the time and it's disgusting.


And it all dancing always makes me happy. And the one thing that I like about my dogs is that they don't know who I am. I mean, they know that they got a good living situation.


They're probably like, I wonder what she does for a living, but her life is pretty good and they get to go to other cool places also. But yeah, my dogs on the who I am, I like the cat, scratched the shit out of me all the time. And the pigs are horrible. They bite my ankles. I love it about them. Yeah.


Well I bet that's one of the ways you achieve balance is through animals.


It's probably you like them because they don't treat you like you're an alien. They just treat you like your mama.


Exactly. And they yeah. They're their appreciation and gratitude level is something that I aspire to kind of recreate in my own life. I love how gracious they are.


I think I really respect the way you're looking at things. I love you. I like the fact that you know that you're in this weird situation. And you actually feel guilty for it. You don't think it's necessarily good to feel guilty, but the fact that you do. Yeah. Is strong because it shows that you're conscious of how weird it is. Yeah. And we've been working on my guilt a lot.


And what's funny is like I always want to cancel therapy when nothing's going on, which I guess is when we kind of need it. But I always want to cancel it and then we start talking about guilt and like we got it, you know, we've got to work on your guilt or whatever. But I'm like, I only call you out of guilt. I don't want to do therapy and I don't even want to talk to you about what's going on my life.


So we can't get rid of it too much because guilt makes us do good things. I feel the same way about fear and anxiety. I'm too healthy to your healthy anxiety. That's one of the things I like about weed. That's the most I like to get scared. Do you like to get scared? Oh yeah.


I like to see the devil, my ideas. So I don't like that anymore. I like to see the devil I do not like.


I like to be paranoid. I like to freak out. I had I had a very great ayahuasca experience that I saw some things I saw, like I guess people take ayahuasca a couple of times and I've seen these snakes that end up like taking on the ground and you kind of meet Mama Ayahuasca and she walks you through everything.


So ayahuasca, the woman that I was seeing as at the time where I just kind of started to become like really dedicated to the veganism. And she reached down my throat and pulled out every dead animal I had ever eaten and made me throw it up.


But I didn't see the animal that it was like I didn't see like a cow or pig or chicken.


Like, I saw me puking up all the animals. I saw me picking up seals, picking up a seal, not fun elephants, all these other animals. And I would see all the animals coming out of my body. And you're not supposed to have, like, a companion in your ayahuasca trip. It's supposed to be just about you. But I, you know, like my life, the good perks, I got special treatment.


I could have my dog. So I had my dog and I held my dog the entire time. And I had a really, really intense trip. But since then, I haven't really loved getting high as much as I used to. It's like unlock something now. I'm like, I just don't want to puke up seals again.


Well, that sounds like you were dealing with some sort of personal. I was dealing with guilt. Yeah.


Not just guilt for being famous, but also guilt for killing other lives to feed your own life that you already feel guilty for.


Yes, it's all psychologically connected, just like what you see through psychedelics is in it's not just the psychedelic, it's what you bring to the psychedelic. That's what I set. And setting is so important.


Well, you're supposed to be sober two weeks before you actually do the Ayahuasca, which I was the only one that didn't do that.


Yeah, I don't know if that's necessary. I got great great GMT. We'll take you there no matter what. Done some good.


Dante, I it's all my personalities. The great me one time on DMT. Oh all my personalities I saw and then I was like I saw me is like a really ugly crier.


And then he's screaming, yelling at people and I am as nice as I was sitting on the couch and it started to hit me. They almost kind of like accordions back into my body, you know, my personality.


The thing about all this craziness and the the manic behavior and all of your guilt and all of your anxiety, there's something that comes out in your music. There's some there's some of that that comes out in this energy when you sing.


And I don't know if it would be there without it. I think all brilliant artists are crazy. I've never met one that isn't. There's something that they have when, you know, they're bottling it all up inside. And whether it's they're playing the guitar or they're singing when they sing, it comes out. Yeah. You know, and when you sing, it comes out. But it's kind of.


That's right. It's kind of new also. Like it's coming out in a whole nother way. You know, I, I look at you different. I'm very different. And I honestly feel like my voice changed a lot after the fire. I could sing better after the fire in some way.


It's almost like it like unleashed something like it did.


And like maybe that's what it was. Maybe I earned it. Yeah.


Maybe that's what it is, because I noticed that my voice got better as I was probably.


You're more comfortable with who you are having gone through that. Yeah. The thing about having like a really not an easy life, but a privileged life, like, you know, you've had so many doors open to you and so much wealth and so much success. Like when you do something hard or something hard happens to you, at least you go, OK, I got through that. That was real. Yeah, I earned that. I earned my my point of view, my place of peace after storm.




And every storm that you go through, that's why when you listen to Johnny Cash sing man, I mean that is like how old was he when he did that.


Covers like eighty.


I was on those tires. Yeah. Damn you hear that voice.


And it's like there's something didn't give me cause was thinking about it.


Right. There's something that comes through in the, in the music, in the voice. There's something that comes through in someone's art when they've experienced things. Yeah.


And this is, this is what you're getting and this is what your emotions and all that shit that that bothers you and freaks you out and all the chaos when you get in front of that microphone that comes out, it's almost.


Yeah. I guess your life. It's almost like. It's kind of art in the way of kind. I feel like I'm always doing performance art in some way, even in my personal life. That's a problem.


That's got to be scary. Hard to be in the moment.


Just be you always feel like you're putting on a show. It is. It's because your whole life you develop putting on a show.


And we talked, you know, obviously, I think a little bit about kind of in the beginning of this, talking about technology and how it's changed things for me in streaming and all these things.


But it's also giving everyone a voice. Yeah, the people that don't need one sometimes to say the things that they they say it gives them a lot of power. And you've got to have a lot of restraints, like, listen, you're sitting with someone that loves to do drugs. I can't take drugs anymore. I want to. But because there's a repercussion, I won't. That's the same way I feel about looking at shit and looking at Daily Mail and looking at these things.


I won't do it, not because it's not tempting and because in a way that gives you a rush to look at it. You get those adrenaline and the butterflies of someone that likes to get high gets you high drama. So I try not to watch any dramatic TV or things like that because I'm also kind of a parent. I'm a sponge. I never grew out of that. You know, kids, they hear something. They can do it like.


I've always been like that. You show me once. I can do it right now. But that's why I shouldn't watch dramatic television, right?


Well, that's why I always feel weird when girls are really into those true crime shows about rape and we're like, no, shut that off. Yeah, no, it's not Jesus Christ. I don't think it's really, really that healthy. That's why I love repulsed drag race.


It's like nothing really harmful is going to come out of this slop. And some wigs are calling it a day.


Would they do death drops when a whole other way than what you guys do out there on the mats. This is like this is some intense shit. I have never watched. We've never seen a death drop.


What is RU Paul's drag race do? What do they do? My God, watch. This is crazy. It's like they look honestly like RU Paul.


RU Paul. When I said earlier, I'm not religious. That's a lie. I am RU Paul's Patreon.


Like I fuck with Rupal, RU Paul's God RU Paul lives by. If you can't love yourself, how in the hell are you going to love anybody else?


Can I have a ranch in Wyoming. I love it. I'll figure it out.


Rupal Mamoru. She's my life and the reason I love to watch her so much is really there's this, there's this thing that they do on the show and it's called the Reading Room.


It's called the library. What is the show?


Because the name of the show. But I don't even know what it is, you know.


So the drag queens from all over the country and now they're going all over the world. They've got RU Paul's drag race everywhere. Oh, shit. Oh, yeah.


It's all over the world. I watch RU Paul's Korea, RU Paul's Canada.


We watch everything and says, oh yeah. Oh, this is one of my favorite Alyssa Edwards. I think I might even be in the audience. You know who that is. Yes, I know.


That's what I'm telling you. Look at that. Oh, my God. By the way, there I was. You look at our look at the way they're cloud your mazing. Oh, my God. Oh, yes. Take off the streets. See, I know that. Yeah, I know the trees. Oh, my God. That's a big person.


She's got some kind of a big, big girl. And she says, wait, come over here and pour some more food on this plate. I'm going to the gym, bitch. I'm losing no weight.


Look at me. I'm sickening. Yeah. Yeah, I'm sickening. I may be fat bitch, but you're ugly and I can lose weight.


Oh, shit. I'm right there. There I am. Oh my. I'm in the audience. So am I. To friends that are here with me today bitch.


She saw sickening Yats Kennedy. You know Candy, I know every single day I do the same move, they drop down and do the splits. That's what I think when I'm watching your shows, do you know all the same stuff?


But what this this move of the splits, they all do this. That's the move. It's the money move. The money moves.


Look, she got money in her hand. Look, they're doing it at her own money at her kid. She's going to she's in this show. I do the splits death drop.


I got a highlight video of all of these so-called death best death drops. Oh, I've seen this line. So is that death drop when you do the splits? That one's a death drop and split. That's also a very that's. Oh, here she goes. Yeah.


UCA yours now, Pam. So is that a dead drop? No, that was a splash. OK, what is the difference? Death drop. You'll see. It's when you go from standing. Let's see now that's a small split's.


You got to find jobs. That's not a death job. Look up. It's season, I believe maybe ten or no season nine. Lagon Just Charanga Lagann.


Just strange. Look on changa they go, what about Jinx. She just does a bad split Binsey that she needs a little bit.


That wasn't great. We love Monet. She's Miss Congeniality monads needs a little bit of flexibility.


I don't love her thong. I'm ok. That's funny. Like they have to go all the way. This is my favorite. Oh so she's got her own show.


She, she's, she actually did the VMAs with me. Now you have to. She's a friend. We'll split to be taken seriously. So that's a good one. That's a good one. That's a good one. I'm split. I'm clapping.


You can't have a bent knees that no disrespect. I mean, you're not. Going to get any cash on the stage, oh, if your knees bent, it's not good. Now that's all gone. She's got the best one. Boom. That was her big split. But she's going to probably do another desk job.


They're probably right here. This is a real death right here. Ready to go. Yea, that's a desk job.


That's a desk job. That is like a good way to blow out your ACL. Look at that right knee. They don't look good. Oh man. If I was doing commentary on her I'm to go. He's going to be her. Your boba. That is terrible for your joints. It's it's got to be awful. Oh, look at her knee.


She goes to camera. Okay, here we go back MICHAELS. Oh, that's a full sized split. Look at that. My goodness.


So when you ask me why my hips hurt so bad, it's this. No, I don't dustoff. I do not death drop that will fuck you up.


I mean, that's what fuck Prince's hip hop now.


I don't do that. I tried it one time at J.Y. and it was worth it. What is J.Y.? My favorite gay club in London.


Oh boy. You just fucking nailed on the head gay. It's so gay. Just called gay. Why not? It's iconic.


What is it? What are you doing? Was that what happened?


Oh, this one's really crazy. Oh, no. Oh no. Oh my God. Don't drop ever. Arthuis. So that's. Wow, that's brain-damaged.


Just drop. That's a drop of five feet up. That's honestly. But like I feel like I've come alive since watching this. What it does to me as like on on a level that I just like I love it so fucking much scoring them well usually in the past, like usually in the ball, which is what you're doing, you're bringing it to the ball like you're doing the wrong way.


OK, usually it's a one through ten, ten being the best and you say ten, ten, ten across the board.


So this what's happening here?


Oh, this is a really good performance that I love. Yeah. And these and these these are the other pit crew, pit crew. They're kind of like the the bitches that bring out the shit and like they're kind of like they kind of get um.


Yeah, exactly. Yeah.


That's what I like about the show too. And I think all the the men kind of like having to be the background dancers because outrageous. She's got her name.


Alaska Thunder after Alaska Thunder. Fuck. Yeah, she's one of my favorites. Might be my new favorite show. I'm telling you, Alaska, you have to start watching Alaska Thunder Fuck is absolutely my favorite clean Jesus. I love Katie girl.


I think you've already had three or four favorite Queens.


Just Alaska is the one that I love her personal music. What about Elyssa? You turn your back on. No, this is my favorite performer. Oh, this is my favorite performer slash dancer.


I don't in Alaska. It's got amazing music.


Oh so Alaska Thunder fucks her big hit single is called Your Makeup is terrible.


Oh oh. I'd have to watch this.


It's really good. That's detox. Detox that's. I actually grew up hanging out with her.


She worked at Beecher's man house which was like a freaky club.


I met this before I met him at the Comedy Store. So she, I end up I kind of that was like my, you know, Studio 54, like that era. That's what I did. So she was there. She was one of the performers.


I know her dad is hilarious and God damn it. So is this show like this every week? Yes. So every week is Rupal.


And until there's a new episode, I watched the same one every day. And who are the folks on the panel? So usually there's a guest judge and then his best friend, Michelle Bosarge, and that's Todrick Hall, who is like a big choreographer and artist.




I know a lot about this. You do? Yeah, they are. How often you just like you watch it too much. I'm so thirsty for new episodes. I'm watching through Canada right now. Rupal is not even on it.


It's just a spin off with what's going on that in Canada, if it's a spinoff, she's a genius, but she's the new McDonald's, so. Got it.


So she just said, listen, I'm just I'm on this and just spread it out to Thailand and love it. Ireland. Oh yeah.


Everywhere, everywhere around the world. Wow. They're really fun to watch. But without RU it's really not the same because she drops knowledge, no knowledge. What kind of knowledge.


Like when I do feel guilty about like all my, you know, kind of what we talked about it just like when I start feeling that guilt and I feel guilt that like when I tell someone I can't do this because I need to focus on me or I need to like, take the time that I'm cooking for you to be using that time for my meditation. And I've become that person like I just give so much and I just love that.


She says, if you can't love yourself, how in the hell are you going to love anybody else? I really love that could point to a really good point. I'm trying to dislike that needs to be tattooed on my and my brain.


So Rupal has also been around a long time, also a really great year, the ups and downs and look what she created like from a world that I mean still even in twenty twenty, that's just not acceptable.


I live in Nashville, Tennessee. It's none of my friends in Nashville. They all don't know what I'm watching. I can't believe that. And it's just like the way that she's won. I think she's up for like fourteen Emmys this year.


What was her, what did she break out with. What was like the first thing that she got popular booty.


What's her movie. Something Booty. Something you could look it up Rupal. Judy, I'm going to be so annoying. Yeah, but she's famous for a song like, yes, I like you better with that supermodel like a girl. Right, right, right.


Well, you was that wasn't it? Like what does the 80s, 90s that might have been right around the time your dad 90s and what he did in Colombia, I'll never understand. That would have been that would have pushed him over the top and I really would have. Yeah. Yeah. So Rupal Dragway. Remarkable longevity for Rupal, right.


I'm telling you, Paul Rupal is the only one that in my book compares to Dolly. That is crazy.


If you really stop and think about that, that is 30 fucking years. That's her. That's her. Oh wow. Look at the picture.


Here you go. Look, a beautiful look at the exaggerated femininity that drag queens embrace.


A love that aspect of it that's called that's called painting for the gods. Painting for the gods, painting for the God. Show me painting for the gods. I'm not painted for the gods. I mean, with the makeup. So when you're like you're painted for the gods, that means like your makeup is like you have drawn on that base.


Now is that it only is that a drag queen expression for the gods?


You can see drag queen jaclyn's all it's all good. OK, that one hung around. We love drag queen.


You know, I'm saying like there's certain expressions from there's even been saying I'm a drag queen on this show.


That is a straight male that just does dry. Wait, what does a straight make sure.


Yeah. That you could talk him into some gay stuff. He's a straight man.


Get him drunk. Sure. Not all of us aren't. He is.


Oh yeah. For sure. I believe.


Well he's probably really good at it. Right. Really good. As a drag queen.


He knows what sexy as he wants. Mhm. Right. Right, right. Yeah.


Well that was explained to me about some men who love women but like to dress as women like there's a kink. Yeah. They like to be.


I actually just a man for Paul's drag race. My name was B.J. if we can show you that because I'm kind of like a hot dude. I look a lot like Justin Bieber. People tell me that all the time. Like when I if I have a little scruff and like a side swoop, I go Bieber really quick. Really?


Yeah, but my name was B.J. on the show and I dressed as a guy and I kind of thought it was kinky, so. Yeah.


Do you feel like a bad girl when you dress like a boy like this is twenty.


Like playing with gender roles is just so not.


There's no shock value to anymore. No shock value, you know, shock value. Not in my not in my community. Oh, in your community of drug and my community and to the God we're paying for the gods.


We're beat the beat. That's like you're beating your mug. That means you've fucking pounded that shit into your face. Like even if you took a wipe and went like this, you'd still look like a woman like you have.


That's what it's called. Yes. Beat your mug. Yes, you should see me. If I had my brush in here, I'd show you how you do it. Wow. You just like pound it goes.


Oh, yeah. There I am. There you are. Oh yeah. So they can't see me. I'm in a double sided mirror so they just see themselves. But I see that that's you.


Yeah. Oh that's hilarious. That is the fake is looking beard ever seen in my life. That's like Team America world police. Remember when the dude had to put on a fake with the puppet, put the fake wig on the fake. It didn't work around.


They recognized me right away. But I swear it's the voice. But maybe it was the beard. It's your neck you might have in the beard.


My neck. You've got a girls night to film.


Yeah, you have a girl's neck. There's no way you're a guy. It's not even physically possible.


You sure? About 100 percent. Yeah. If I saw you if you were like with the fake beard on your face, you would know.


And then the neck, I'd be like, that's a chick. Hundred percent down.


Sorry, took some drag queens they could pass as a large one.


So I brought a scarf. But if I wear this, I still cover your neck.


Yeah. You need a hoodie or something like zip it up and put it over the top. I think you're a young boy who does not question.


Hoodies are now fashion, hoodies are fashion. I like wearing them in my own time.


Just don't wear these on your own time. But not in public. No. Why not? Because I'm Dolly Parton's goddaughter.


She would actually shame me to the end of the earth.


So are there rules I've done? He's like, I'm in here telling you about my ayahuasca trips. This is all fine and dandy with Dolly. Let's not even start talking about hoodies.


Oh, OK. You know, and I won't let you wear hoodies. I mean, Dolly just it's not Dolly approved.


This Earth needs to be Dolly approved telling you.


Oh, my God, that's so funny. Dolly is everything. Somebody had a funny tweet about Dolly Parton once. They said, I just saw a picture of Dolly Parton when she was younger. She was in the tweet, said, what the fuck did Jolene look like?


I want to know, who is Jolene Chickies. Right. She must have been ridiculous.


Must have been a fucking hundred fifty. I mean, there is no one more beautiful than she was about as hot as it girl.


I love the way that she created, like her identity to hide her identity from the town whore that everyone made fun of.


And she was like, I was looking at them like this is an entire brand. I loved it. And she goes, I just tried to recreate that.


That's a. Areas, yeah, and she also just was so nice. Oh, my God. I just came through and everything she did, it's like she was so likeable.


Man She brings Mirch everywhere and she will get from the bottom to the top.


Whoever worked on that set today, getting a dolly hat, you know, signed, getting donuts delivered, like she's just a she's just as cool as it gets.


I mean, I do think that that's a big reason, too, that I've been able to not even because she's going to be mad. But you just don't want to disappoint Dolly.


Well, it's just you are very fortunate to be connected to this like this lineage. You know, the fact that, you know, you're tight with Dolly fucking Parton, like if you're a young country singer, a man and you know Willie Nelson. Yeah. Shit. Yeah.


Are you tight with Willie? Like, you got to you got to cultivate that relationship. I was kind of my dad with George Jones. That's who I grew up around my whole life. Like George was my dad's right hand. I was really painful for him when he died because that was my dad's just steak in the grass, you know.


Yeah, for sure. Yeah. There's something about that. Right, like this old guard that, like, nurtures the young people coming up that I really want to I want to be that person.


If I, if I make it through the treacherous path you're going to because you're going to make you know. I think I think so.


If anybody's going to make it that's gone through what you've you've gone through the way you're looking at it is look, it ain't easy, kid, but you can do it. You can do well.


I would want to be that way with the next artist. And I still am like even from my position, I never like to see, say or seem like I think I know something that a new artist doesn't, but I've been doing it now 15 years. My show came out when I was twelve. I'm twenty seven. Going to be twenty eight in a month.


It's not even about whether or not you know something that they don't. It's just what you know, it's irrelevant. I don't know. It's what you know.


And I just feel like it's kind of, you know, I never knew jealousy or competition through Dolly, through Joan, through Stevie.


That's why when I reach out to Stevie, she says, like, I know that this girl, nothing's going on, but can we sit six feet apart in my backyard and talk? I just want to be there for you.


It's like she was the last time, you know? And it's like going through what I'm kind of been going through over the last two years. All these I think honestly, some of the physical pain is growing pains.


You know, like I feel like some of the growth that I've had less stress and. Sure. And quickly, just stretching like beyond beyond, you know, and I just I just.


So lack of being stable in your mind and the tension, that stuff manifests itself and back injuries all the time. Yeah. People always have weird back pains that are related to just their life being fucked up. Yeah, he just you just you're always tense. Yeah I know, I know.


Like my back cracks are crazy. Everything you know, down to when I'm asked what hurts, I literally feel embarrassed to say from the end of my toe to the top of my head pretty much hurts a lot in the time that I'm working on that pain management. And I do like CBD.


CBD awesome. Yeah. CBD gigantic. You love it. Yeah.


But for you, I can't say this enough. You need rigorous exercise, you need something like really hard. So when it's done you're fucking spent.


Yeah. Yeah.


Just laying on the ground. Can't breathe. Puddle of sweat. That type of shit. Your size. The demons.


I have a seven month old German Shepherd alone so that seems like a good if anyone's got a running partner, that's who's going to put me through it.


But you need someone to go.


That's a good question. You need a you'd need to purge the demons. You've got demons. Yeah. Yeah, they're in there. One hundred percent. Yes. But again, like, you don't want to be gonna hold on to them a little bit.


I'd like to use them to my advantage sometimes. Like, man, there's something about the demons that come out in the music. There's I mean, look, that's always why the great artist like the thing about Robert Johnson, right. They even thought he sold his soul to learn how to play the blues the way he did. And that's because it's because there's the fucking life experience came out in his music.


Yeah, you need both.


You can't be some person who just lives in a fucking monastery and breeze in and breeze out all day and then put out amazing art. Yeah, you have to have pain. And I know that.


And I think that's, you know, I guess one of our words we've used pretty consistently today is balance. Yeah. I think that's pretty much got to be my mantra. Yeah.


For you. I mean, you are you are born into this treacherous path of this crazy position that you find yourself thrust into when you're very famous at a very early age. And also there's also these weird expectations because you're famous for a Disney show. Right. Which is even crazier.


And then post Disney show, it's not raised by craziness and wild and, you know, being a provocateur.


And so now I feel like I'm breaking out of, like, another role in a way, you know, you becoming just yourself instead of a rebellious person who's trying to escape the the sort of the boundaries of your persona.


Yeah, well, that's why I wanted you know, I have in my music video, I have me with the microphone, with the. Microphone stand, and the reason why that was so important was like, I'm not just fucking getting naked anymore and swinging around, it's about the music comes first. And I feel like I think people are very visual.


And if you can hold the fucking microphone in your hand and say, this is who I am, this comes first, by the way, I don't come without this like at the VMAs, I try to get me to get rid of my microphone for something that I'm going to be doing. And I said, fuck no.


What do you think? I can't be Britney Spears with the headset and the snake. What's important? I don't want the snake. I don't want the gag, you know, and there was actually even some comments that day about which is an interesting conversation in regards to lighting, because I've been kind of learning a lot, you know, from directors. I didn't go to film school, but I have been put through that in that way. So I directed the last video and that's what I look forward to doing in the next ten years.


I'd love to write and direct and, you know, kind of work on film in that way. And so now I have a better understanding of cameras and lighting operation. And so I was just asking some questions about not even on some diva shit, like I only want to get shot and decide whatever. I wanted the lights to be turned off and then the lighting of the of the room to be just lighting me.


So no key, like no beauty, light and beauty. Light is always used on women. And I said, turn the fucking lights off. You would never tell Travis Scott or Adam Levine that he couldn't turn the beauty light off. I want this red lighting. They said, OK, OK, we'll do it. You know what? The same thing that we would do with the guys, because that's what I want.


And then something that I was doing, which I can't say, but something that I was doing for the VMAs, my bracelets kept getting caught and all the shit. And they said, you know, you want to be treated like a guy and looked like a guy. We wouldn't be dealing with this if a guy was doing it. And I said, well, a guy wouldn't be doing this because a guy doesn't sell your show sex the way that I'm going to.


And I and I'm aware of that.


I know about conversations with had these conversations with the directors talking to me. That's a ridiculous kind of ridiculous conversation.


Also embarrassing because the conversation once you see what happens on the show, you'll understand more if you see it.


But it might be hard not to. You know, if you take walks like I do, you might see it whether you want to or not.


If you take walks, if you walk down the street and there's I don't know, maybe people sell magazines, I don't know about them or else you'll see it at some point, you guys, he'll show me. So. Yes.


And so so they're asking a lot of questions about that. And, you know, like, well, how long is glam going to take and all the stuff.


And I was like, I mean, I can't really nail enough to it's like I did come from the world of Dolly Parton and I love pop culture for entertainment and escapism.


And again, you know, we're joking about the hoodie conversation. But I mean, like, you know, for me, I there's nights where I don't do that. You know, Chris Cornell, I had on a pair of black pants and a fucking Chris Cornell t shirt.


That's what it was. The VMAs is a pop culture show celebrating pop culture. And I wanted to bring, especially in this time of, you know, covid-19 all these at home performances, like I want to give my fans escapism, good old pop culture. This is surrealism.


How hard is it to deal with people that are directing you? Like how hard is it to deal with, like other people and their vision? And they're talking and this and they're that when you are just trying to get out what's in your head and what your your vision is done, you can get it done.


But I the my to the balance that I found is firm and kind. I don't lose my kindness, but I also don't become a mat. But I am firm about what I want. But in a way that you know, you might expect someone might see me and she was a diva, she was a bitch. But it's again it's like OK, like have the weekend come in here and say the same thing and you would say him, you know, or Kanye is like a creative God and it's like, come on, why am I not getting that?


I'm like, you know, a creative mastermind, but I'm because I'm becoming a bitch. It's like no one would ever say that about Kanye West choosing what lighting he wants on a performance.


It's such a delicate balance to. Right, because when someone's as popular as you like, you kind of, you know, what the fuck you want to do. Like and if this person who you're using is a director, if you don't have a deep relationship with them, that's why I started directing my own shit.


Yeah. And that's why I loved making my last videos so much and directing it was because, one, I thought about my scenes almost like a relationship.


You're having a relationship with it. When it's over, it's over. The what's painful isn't the relationship. It's that when it's done, you holding on for that extra, however long you try to make it work, something that's not working. That's what I did on the video and that's what I hated when I was a kid.


You know, from directors not knowing what they want and then getting frustrated with the child for not performing properly.


It's like you're not communicating. And I'm a child and you're an adult and you're not communicating properly. So you're working me into the ground to get something that you don't know what you want. And that was always really frustrating to me. And I think that's why now are non-negotiable in my relationship or dating life is you better know what you want because I'm just not interested in taking, you know, another ten years like I did with my first love figuring that out.


Now, when you were doing these, like when you're putting together music, do you have anybody that like if you're doing an album or you have a song, do you do collaborate with. People, would you write the songs entirely on your own and bring them to other musicians? How do you construct something? It's been different. So on banger's, which I kind of think my career is like as a solo artist, I guess kind of started there.


I mean I mean, not really when I when I started working, you know, on my very first record and it was called Breakout and it was because I was kind of breaking out of the character.


The how long ago was this like two thousand and seven, I guess maybe something like that 12, 13 years ago.


Holy shit. 2007 and already had two records out already, but they were S.A.M..


You were 14. I'm 27. Yeah, that's bananas. Yeah.


OK, so when you're on Hannah Montana and I already had two albums that were like no one had done all the things.


And so then I had this like how much were you working pressure every single day, every Sunday to Sunday. Every Sunday, because I want to Jesus Sunday. Because I wanted to any day. I remember one time I came home and my dad almost didn't let me go back on the road because I was so thin. And he was like, what are you going to eat? And I'm like, turkey glasses, you know?


And who's taking care of you when you're on the road?


If it's not your dad, my grandma, my grandma, my mom, my mom, my mom. It has been my like my mom is the reason I'm sitting here, so your mom and your grandma would come with you on the road and you would just go town to town, arena to arena.


Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Yeah. Sleep. Wake up. There you go. Here's my beautiful girls girls school. I did school in the morning.


School are you doing?


I had my teacher on the road with me who was like, she's the best who I loved and loved, but no kids. What do you mean no. No, no friends. No other. Just my little sister and my little brother. How weird is that?


That's pretty weird. It made me it made my sister's life a little difficult also because her idea of like success is completely blown out of proportion also. Oh, yeah. She was my brother, too. But my brother is very simple and I love him so much. And he'll probably be listening to this.


And my brother just has his chickens and his ducks and he's in Nashville and he's in, you know, small little place and he's living more I, I sometimes wonder if he's the smartest of us all.


I don't know. Maybe is less stressed. He has less stress. Yeah.


And that's the thing about stress.


It's like but he's also a fucking bad ass talent, but he just saves it.


He doesn't want to be on that level like he wants to make music because he loves it. He wants the people that are interested in him to hear it. He doesn't have the I got a grind.


Tell us some shit that's online right now. He has some shit that's online. Right. What's his name? Brazen Cyrus.


And how do you does he have an Instagram? He has an Instagram. He'll kill me.


But if he doesn't want he has a Spotify has a song. Yeah. Out and he did Fallon and after he did Fallon, he's like, I don't think I want to do that ever again. I'm like, what the fuck?


He's like, man, I was I was too scary. No, thank you. And he did it. I'm like, oh, good for him.


He had two shows, one at CityWalk Universal down the street. And he said, now someone that I was fat, my hair was ugly. I'm like, you know, how many times I've been called vampires ugly? And he's like, I'm not ready for that.


He didn't perform again. And he's like, Oh, I'm going to try it again, Phalen. I'm like, You're going to go from Universal City, walk to Valent, whatever.


So I go there and I try to change his shirt and he's like, No, this is me. I'm wearing my flannel, you know, the whole thing. So he goes out and kills it. It goes not for me. Wow.


That's well, you know, maybe growing up and seeing all the crazy shit that happened to you, it's almost like growing up around alcohol and never wanting to drink. Exactly.


You can go one way or the other. You either become my little sister who kind of wants it, you know, and she she's got a record out that I love called The End to Everything. What's her name? Noah Cyrus. And it's the most depressing EP you'll ever listen to.


She's twenty years old, is depressed.


She's she's emo. She's like an email.


She emailed me because she was on the road and she has a song where she says, my sister's like sunshine and they'll follow her wherever she goes. But I'm more like a rain cloud. You know, it's like she's really got this idea of me, but she needs to go to the doctor.


She is. We call up the doctor a lot. We have like a salary doctor that just. Oh, boy, we got to deal with that.


Yeah, she's she's dealing with it. You're dealing with the. But she's only twenty.


So I worry about the hardest age for kids today too. It's so hard.


Dude, if you don't look like these girls on Instagram, they don't even look like me. I know.


I want to see some crazy. Yeah I do. My ten year old did. We were in a restaurant. She took a picture of me. My ten year old thinks it's fucking hilarious when she does this. She you know where it is, Jamie, right. That he'll put it up on the screen. She took a picture of me and she she goes, let me take a picture. You make a face I like.


Well, you just crazy kissy face.


And then she put it through this filter.


That's me. No. Yes. That's not real. That's real. That's me. That's me. That's not real. Yeah, that's me. Are you kidding me? That's how bad these goddamn filters are. What's wrong with, you know, what's happening with the other. So that's the original picture, right. That's me and her at a restaurant and that's what it came what came out. And meanwhile, you know, my ten year old, she's fucking hilarious.


She thinks it's so funny. She's like, that's that's not right. That is how fucked up these goddamn filters are, that it's just a filter and an app.


That's why these girls are so insecure, because they think all these people that they see online are perfect. But every one of those bitches is using filters. All of them. All of them. All of them.


And even people that I'm friends with that contact me like this is crazy. I use filters, but that that's fucked up.


I don't have a filter on my phone. And I need to know, though, what your daughter's using.


Like, I don't understand this technology on it. It's trick or it's witchcraft. It's fucking trickery. Yeah, I know. I've never I couldn't believe that was real.


Anything I have on my phone is where I can swipe on the Instagram story thingy and turn Paris, where it kind of blurs out your pores or something. That's all I got. I don't even use that. It's ridiculous.


Pretty good. No, you look great. You don't look at sugar. No. Makes you look good. Cartoon. It doesn't make the shit with leggings.


Want that they want like no flaws. They want everything to be like cloudy.


Now that's basically what it does. It makes you feel good. But that's not good. I know, I know.


There's so much on programming to do on me, so much on every book. There's not much in programming. It's all these women out there that are the. These unrealistic expectations, like I'm sure you saw that Khloe Kardashian picture that looks nothing like her, where it goes from, like the hair lines, like the nonsense they used, they used Photoshop on it.


I mean, it's like CGI. You might as well be looking at a monster movie. She turns into a werewolf. It's not that's not who she is now.


It's crazy. I mean, and even like for me, I think, you know, in my real life, I don't wear any makeup. I don't even like today someone asked me, what do you use on your hair? And I'm like shampoo and conditioner. Like, I don't do anything to my hair. I don't really do anything. And that's been really fucking tough for me over the last few months, too, because I don't know why.


I guess I, I think as that keeps happening, like as these technology things keep happening on Instagram, these filters keep getting better and better.


I'm compared to the people altering, you know, themselves either physically, like with all these things you can do in lasers and all the shit or to the filters. And I've had a really hard time with that, you know, and I think it's hard for me the other day, you know, I get past walk around my neighborhood in like a really shitty, dirty Fleetwood Mac T-shirt that I've been in for five days.


And it hurts. Just don't go online. Just just detox from all that shit.


No, don't be real.


Just don't pay attention to all these other women that are doing these fucking wacky filters because that's where everybody gets fucked up. It's the comparison thing. There's a book called The Coddling of the American Mind by Jonathan Haidt, and he talks about young girls and depression, a gigantic uptick in depression that directly coincides with the invention of the iPhone, and that as the iPhone came up and then pictures and then social media apps. So at first it was a lot of it was social media and people being mean to each other on Twitter and all those things because you're not seeing each other.


There's no doubt about this, about the iPhone, kind of, I guess, mimicking. Yeah, right. Vegas slot machines and things. Oh yeah. Like it's actually isn't it. I think it was called. What I listen to is the slot machine in your pocket.


Yeah, well it is a lot like that. But the thing about it with women in particular with young girls is that they're comparing themselves to these cartoons, these people that don't even realize that picture of me.


You know, when I got sober, I had to delete all the apps on my phone where I could purchase things like I had to take off Amazon and all the things on my phone because walk around with that slot machine in my pocket.


All of a sudden I'm getting these bills and things. And yes, I care about that. And I want to live financially, responsibly and all the things.


And I'm looking at this. I'm like, I don't even remember doing this. Like, it's like being high on drugs. And things started showing up and you're like, what the hell, it's too easy.


I'm in the middle of a book now about that. It's called Irresistable Find that it's my Instagram to Jamie Irresistable, this book that is about how people are addicted. It's by Adam Alter and it's about how people are addicted to your phones and applications.


But it also goes into just the actual physical aspect of addiction and how it works on the brain. And how we always like to think of addiction is like it's something that you get hooked physically and you can't live without it. You know, it's something that you have a compulsion to to use. And you can't avoid that compulsion for some reason. And it doesn't even necessarily have to be good.


So and it can happen within, like, love and felt that, too, when it's like in the most stressful times in my life, it's like, OK, I can't reach for drugs anymore, OK? I don't want to reach for bad food. All right. I'm going to reach for someone to love me. And it's like, you know, coming down from something all the time will be all part of love is the most powerful drug you're ever going to take.


It's like cocaine when you. Yeah, it's dope and the straight dopamine right to the fucking dream.


And as a book Brain in Love. And I read it a lot because I had a tendency to to need someone in my life at all times. And I actually now I really love just factual information. So you can go I'm not a total freak that's got this.


I'm not a love addict.


This is actually what is happening to me on a level of this is uncontrollable, of you can control how it affects you and what your I guess you kind of learn to control your reaction.


Exactly. You can control your reaction.


But when you love someone the first couple of months, you know, you do feel like you're high on drugs. It is it it's the same it's the same drip.


It really is. It's dopamine.


And I kind really tell it kind of goes from like more like cocaine, which is kind of a quick hit and wears off really quickly. So you need a lot of it. And then it becomes more like, you know, kind of like heroin where it's something that almost soothes you. Actually, I called the the love of mine who I was with and we got divorced.


It was almost like a pacifier, like it was that thing that I just needed, not because we were in love anymore.


Well, because of the comfort and because my brain said, oh, this feels better. This is comforting.


But actually knowing that I was giving in to an addiction made me feel way worse.


I had the hangover. Next day we sleep together. Next day we wake up.


I'm totally hungover. Yeah. You know, I felt like a relapse every time I. Go back. Well, people do it to each other, you know, and it's not even anybody's fault. It's like you don't even realize that you're a part of this drug cycle. Yeah. And then you get involved in that and then you find some new person and you get lit up, maybe some new person you see at the gym or at the office or wherever you meet people always.


You know what's funny?


Well, what's funny about this is like, you know, I guess I just realized something about myself as all of a sudden it's like unavoidable. You know, I'm telling you, this is not true.


So this is where I now retract what I've said because I need to I need to work on this a little bit. So it's like, OK, it's so untrue for me to see all these bad things are in my face no matter what, no matter what I want to look at or not.


I have a really hard time looking at the good things, like when people send me the stats of my song, I don't open it. When people send me the charts of the views, I don't open it. It's a good cause. I don't want to get attached to success or numbers or mean that my art everyone's set, literally.


I'll show you the next manager, he said. Unless it's a drag queen death dropping to her new single, don't even bother sending it to her because she's not going to open it.


And that's good. That's a sign of you avoiding narcissist. But I wonder why I feel like I can avoid I can't avoid the bad things and looking at them like I'm maybe a little addiction of that, of looking at that. But then why don't I want the head of the positivity of, like, seeing the numbers?


Because you want to work hard, because you want things to be difficult. When you see too much success, you don't want to slack off.


I have no idea how many people listen. My song, I have the same thing. Yeah, I keep the same thing. I the same thing with podcast, the same thing with comedy specials. I don't read any of the reviews. I just keep moving.


That's what I do. And everyone's like, you want hear some stats. I'm like I literally you can ask them. I say I won't even know what it means.


You'll tell me some stats every now and then. I'll just go, what the fuck? I don't know what he means.


Yeah, it's well, it gets nuts now. I don't know what it means. Yeah. What does it mean. And a lot of the time. Million stream. What does that mean. A lot of in the world of like how many. Seven billion is enough for me.


It doesn't mean all I could do better. Right. Exactly. Yeah. Three million isn't enough.


Well that's I think that's a sign that you're looking at things the right way. I really do, because I think that's a sign of you. You know, what you were talking about earlier. You want to struggle. You want to you want to earn it, you know, and because you think that you kind of got these crazy gifts being famous at a young age and all this wealth and success at a young age, you want to earn it.


So when you see success and the trappings of success or wallowing around in all of your fortune, you don't want to do that. You want to hustle. You want to keep going. I think that's a good sign.


Yeah, I really do. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. At some point, you know, you can bring your kids, maybe you can do that weird fucked up thing to my face, whatever. You should come and see some of the animals, especially here in your Nashville. I think you'll totally get it. I think you'll totally get if you're ever in Tennessee and you come out to the farm and you see the horses and you see the pigs by my ankles and all these things, I'm sure I think I think you'll get a really good understanding of my life and who I am.


My last comedy special that I filmed, Strange Times for Netflix. And when I was when I warm up for shows, I've done all the work. I like to just put my brain in another place.


And I was listening to Malibu and that's what I thought you were going to say. All the people on the set were making fun of me so much. Anthony Giordano, who's who also directs the UFC, by the way. Yeah, I imagine a good friend of mine. He's like, what are you listening to? I go, Miley Cyrus. And he's like, shut the fuck up. I go, look, I go listen to it. I put it it's it's on him and I had him listen to it.


But that song is so removed from anything in me or my life. And I love your voice.


Thank God it's a little escape for me. That's cool. So I'd be like dancin backstage high as fuck, getting ready to go on stage listening to your song. Yeah.


Just wait for a song. That was the first song. Well, no, because I had done Dead Pets. Dead Pets was where I started writing like my music, where if you know, you look at the list it says because what's funny, OK, so if you look at Stevie Nicks songs, things have changed a lot in credits. A lot of it says written by Stevie Nicks. And it doesn't says any other writers, but there are other writers because there's music that was written.


She didn't play every guitar part and every piano part, etc. Now it's changed in our credits in the way we do things. So actually you have to put written by for anyone that wrote anything musical on the song. So any guitar parts, all that shit.


So if you start looking at some of the dead pet stuff, it'll say written by and they'll say a group of people. But all the lyrics were written by me. It's just any of the melodic stuff in the track.


So all stuff that's new for for money purposes. So I think the way that now streaming is kind of making things a little bit more difficult because you don't pay someone the way that you would record when record sales, they get their money, whatever, so that it's something to do with that. It's very complex. And they say that some of the best lawyers don't even understand quite what's going on in the music industry right now, because we're having such change, such a shift in the way that everything's happening from sales of records to streaming to videos to tick tock.


Tick tock is like a frickin label now. So they pay tick tock, tick, tick tock to your music because it counts as streams.


I don't even understand it. Why? I don't even understand it. But this is a thing.


Tick tock is weird. Do you pay attention. All that shit with like. The Chinese government owns it. No, I mean, I know that that's a thing. I also know that it was like, you know, this is the new way of the new label.


Basically labels paid to talk to to be able to have these kids doing. I don't know how to say it, but they fucking do. So then I said, please say it's all I know is like it's true. So say it.


So they pay to talk to certains.


So save you a tick tock, big time, tick, tick talkers that are like that from like millions. I don't know about millions. We have maybe a different idea of like Richie Rich, but for kids living in a house here that there's ticktock agencies.


Yes, tick tock agencies. So they like Marsia. I see a tick tock and it's like a black bear. I'm telling you, it's like some fucked up black machine. Oh, interesting. I didn't.


But the one thing that I told the kids that, you know, these kind of influencers, I've spoken to some of them before by doing some of this press, you know, they want me to play the song for them, whatever. And the one thing that I said that I like is like at least it's kids creating content for themselves because I have to go through all the middlemen. Before I could put out a fucking video, I had to ask, hey, Gary Marshall, Disney, is this OK?


Hey, this person can do this, but now it's like shit, grab your phone, put it up. You're in control of your own destiny, right?


You could I mean, if you wanted to, you could set your phone up and just live on YouTube and play an acoustic set and do whatever you want.


I love that about that. So that about today. Yeah, me too. I love Disney. And yeah. So so kind of to that point was when I was working on younger. Now that was the first record I was going to put out that was for sale because I did SoundCloud with my Flaming Lips record. So because I said people don't want to hear me singing a song called Bang My Box about me, like having sex on a lesbian strip club, well, then I'm not going to ask them to buy it.


I'm going to give it to them as a gift. And you're really the worst thing they can do. It a gift is throw it away or not open it like.


Well, that's one thing of being in the position where you're in that you could call the shots. Exactly. And boss.


And it's like, listen, OK, you're not gonna make money off of it's like that's fine. I'm sure they're still selling a toothbrush somewhere that plays my fucking song and I'll get a dollar from that.


He took doctors out there to bang my box.


I don't think anyone's talking to my box. Jamie, can you research that, please? I do.


I honestly, I think everything on the Internet has been done, but I don't think people take talk to my book.


Love to see a bunch of Paul's drag queens talking to banging my box. I don't think it's happening. It's in my box is very, very niche.


We could make that happen. I feel like we could put that out there into the Internet work.


If I sort of find now I'm trying to find a good version to show I'm trying to be quick about.


I'm scared. Oh, listen, Jamie can find it if it's out there.


He has connections to dark, dark and dark web. That's all I was wondering. You got that hook. You got that hooked up here into the ground.


He's the best goober on the planet. There's no one even close. Yes. He's a one handed best Google or two. I know. Look at this.


He goes with one hand while he's working with the other. Oh, my God. Let me give you some volume. Let me hear a little bit. Look at this guy to figure out how to get home. So we got a dude.


Oh. OK, they go, look, this is shit, it is, it's got to fucking like, listen, for now, it has to like now people know about it. I know it'll have more influence. Every tweet that shit later.


Send it to me and I'll read tweeted, I want you to bang my box. The point being is that that was free. And then getting to write younger now and writing Malibu. I wrote on the back of the car on the way to on the going of the voice because I was looking outside the window in the car thinking like all of it's true, like I had never really gone to the beach. The close I haven't really gotten was my parents taking me to Florida like one time.


And my sister got my toe caught in the revolving door and like, I had to go. The hospital was a nightmare and my parents were never going to vacation again. But most parents say I don't mean it. My parents fucking met. It meant that we never went on vacation again.


That's crazy that you did all that work and you never went on vacation.


Well, I went on my own vacations. We didn't go on a family vacation. That song is so obviously written by you. Yeah.


And that was one of the things that I think I liked about it, that it was when you listen to someone sing a song like a really good song, it's an expression of who they are at that point in time, in their life. And you can get wrapped up in their mind, you know. And I felt like that's why I like listening to other people, like listen to songs before I go on stage, because it gets me out of my own head and it gets me into someone else's head.


And then when it's time to go, you know, and they're like, you're on in three and then I'll take the headphones off, I'll do a shot, I'll stretch out a little. And then here we go.


That's me. Oh, hell yeah. That is that's me listening to your fucking song. That's crazy. Yeah. Legit. I'm not lying. That's nuts.


Well, it's an honor.


I play that when Anthony was listening to it's like you fucking idiot, what are you listening to. That's fucking vile. I never, ever, ever would have thought that never would have thought that.


I like it. Thank you. I like your music. Thank you. And I like you. You're a good person. Thank you so much. You too. I enjoyed talking to you. I did too. I'm glad we did this. Agreed. So you got something that's out right now. Yeah. What is it.


How do people get it. Well, it's called Midnight Sky and even this the title is kind of inspired by Harry's Heart of Glass. But I pulled inspiration from ages 17 to my favorite songs, Heart of Glass. The reason I love it so much is that the title isn't the repetition in the chorus. It's just a cool thing to say. It's not the chorus at all.


And so I thought, you know what my favorite part about it is, is I love the the kind of visual painting of Midnight Sky and what that means. And the midnight sky to me is like, if you're really fucking parting, the moon is a disco ball and the stars are all the reflection of light on the ceiling. And what I really like about the disco ball is that it's a bunch of broken pieces put back together again, that when you're finally enlightened, it makes this mesmerizing, totally attractive, like people.


It's like, you know, it's like the bugs to the light. Like people love disco balls, but it's really just a bunch of broken pieces put together until I felt like that was reflective of me.


Wow. Pretty deep thing about it. That's heavy. Yeah, that's heavy.


When I saw it, I thought, like, I recognize this, this is what I feel like.


All right. So that's it.


It's ended on that and it's everywhere. It's on YouTube streaming and yeah, it's everywhere.


And so hopefully people will watch it. All right. You're a bad motherfucker. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Bye, everybody. Cool. Oh, thank you, friends, for tuning into the show. And thank you to our sponsors. Thank you to Zipp recruiter. See for yourself how zip recruiter makes hiring faster and easier. Try it now for free. That's right. Free at zip recruiter dotcom slash Rogen that zip recruiter dotcom slash ah oh g a n zip recruiter dotcom slash Rogen.


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