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What's that? Well, that's good. I am so excited for today we are interviewing and I say we because we all in this together, we're interviewing Lisa Turker for her new book, Forgiving What You Can't Forget. This book is incredible. It comes out November 17th anywhere books are sold. And you are definitely going to want to get this book. I mean, no matter what your life has looked like, this book is going to inspire you. Lisa is amazing.


She is a mom of five. She and her husband are just an incredible couple who went through a really hard time. But God has just walked her through some painful situations and just redeemed so many things in her life that really seemed unredeemable and that really seemed an even impossible to her, she would have said. But man, God was so faithful, God was so good. And she took the time to dive into God's word and take him at his word to see a good ending.


And so I can't wait for you guys to hear her story. It's going to be incredible.


Let's call Lisa. Lisa, I am so glad you were on this podcast, and you are one that I'm very excited to ask the world, that's a good question, too. What is the best piece of advice that you've ever been given?


Well, Sally, thank you for that. It's actually a Bible verse, I don't know if very many people give you Bible verses, but, oh, I love this.


So a long time ago, before I was really even living a Christian life, I came across a Bible verse. It's Matthew five eight. Blessed are the pure and heart, for they shall see God.


And I remember reading that verse and I remember thinking, that sounds ridiculous because you can't see God.


And if I could see God, I wouldn't struggle so much with having faith. But over the years I started to recognize that blessed is that person who desires to see evidence of God's goodness and faithfulness in their life. And when you desire to see God's goodness and faithfulness in God's hand of activity in your life, then you do start to see God.


And so I don't live it out perfectly. But I try to remember when I wake up in the morning and I pray when I get up from my prayers, I try to remember I just invited the divine presence of God Almighty to do life with me that day. And then I look for his hand of activity and it set my heart on such an adventure of truly learning how to see God.


Wow, that is so good. I love that, you know, those Bible verses that I mean, I know I've read it before, but it's never jumped at me like that is so powerful and it's so cool to because normally every time somebody gives me their best piece of advice, you can see it play out in their life. And for you even reading this book like you do see God and like everything. And you even talk about how sometimes that's that's a struggle because you want to, like, write the story of God before he writes it.


But I think it comes from that place of desiring to see the goodness of God in your story and that that's so beautiful. So I can't wait to dive into just this book and this message that you talk about. I just share with you before we got on that it truly was so impacting from my own life. And just reading it to interview you was something that ended up blessing me more than I would have ever imagined it would have. But it's called forgiving.


What you can't forget is obviously about your life story. So I wanted to ask you, first of all, forgiveness is obviously really a hard thing to do. It's something that a lot of people struggle to do and then to write a book about it, it would be extra challenging. I know about the book writing process and even that in itself is challenging.


And so what made you choose the path of forgiveness, which I know is a huge question to start with? And then how did you choose to write about it?


That's such a good question. Sadly, I have to say this message of forgiveness chose me and kind of chased me down. And I remember one of the early writing days my team showed up and they were ready to hear some chapters that I'd written. And I had not written the chapters that I needed to write, because as I started to sit down and put pen to paper, I felt so much resistance in my heart. And so instead of writing good, helpful chapters, I started making lists of all the reasons why forgiveness was impossible.


And I listed out things like, well, the other person hasn't said they're sorry and I don't know if I'm done hurting over this and if I forgive this, isn't that me saying that what happened doesn't matter and it very much does matter is forgiveness me betraying my own feelings? Is it me saying that, you know, I wasn't really hurt when the hurt that has been unleashed in my life is not just something I suffered one day, but I'm still suffering because of it every day since.


And then when what happened is unchangeable, is it even forgivable? And I had this misunderstanding that I thought the Bible said that in order to forgive, you have to forget. But, you know, I couldn't forget. And so therefore I felt like I couldn't forgive.


So what we decided to do is instead of me writing on forgiveness, first, we decided to hit the pause button on the book. And I studied what the Bible actually says and doesn't say about forgiveness. And we spent over a thousand hours studying.


Wow. And as I studied about forgiveness, I started to understand where things were falling apart for me. I had a very young, immature understanding of forgiveness. I really had a little girl understanding of forgiveness that I was trying to take into my very adult world.


You see, when I was a little girl, my mom, whenever I would do something to my sister, I said, I know you've never done anything. Dibella Ever. Never, never.


But I I had a tendency as the older sister to, you know, be mean sometimes to my younger sister and then she would cry.


My mom, the great judge, would appear and she would look at me and she would say, Lisa, say, you're sorry it was wrong for you to hit your sister.


And then very authentically, I would say, oh, I'm sorry. That's very really.


She would look at my sister and say, Now you need to say you forgive Lisa. She understands hitting is wrong. She's not going to do it again. So say you forgive her. So my sister would say she forgave me. And then she my mom would say, now the two of you need to hug and make up. And if you don't stop acting foolish, I'm really going to give you something to cry about.


And that was a good lesson on forgiveness.


However, I never let my little girl understanding of forgiveness grow up. And when I faced some very adult situations, forgiveness fell apart because I kept waiting for the other person to say they were sorry. I kept waiting for the great judge to appear to declare that I was right and they were wrong. And I kept waiting, that I felt like the other person needed to learn all the lessons of why they shouldn't have done this so that they wouldn't then hurt me again or hurt other people.


And so I started to understand as I got into this thousand hours of studying the Bible in forgiveness that I had a wrong understanding of forgiveness and it changed my life.


Wow. That is so powerful. And it's really cool to hear like from start to, I guess, you know, beginning of writing this book that that's the process. Because all the questions you were saying as to why you couldn't write the book from just reading the book, it was really all the questions that were answered from a biblical standpoint. And so to know that that was where you started like this is impossible because of this. But then you took God at his word and read the word thinking.


It said forgive and forget, because we hear that all the time. But it really says something completely different is is so huge. And I think a lot of times, you know, people don't know what the Bible says, but they think they do.


So they just assume what it says because they've heard a really good quote that sounded like it was a scripture and they go with that. But it's not based off of truth sometimes. And so that's where they get a little bit led astray. And so I think that is one encouragement to everybody listening to that. You know, if you're struggling with something, if it seems impossible, the word of God says like all things are possible through him, who gives his strength.


And so to take it to his word and find strength from his word is so powerful in this book. That's the whole book. I mean, you unpack the Bible so beautifully. Christian was sitting beside me and I just kept saying, dang. And I was like, listen to this. I mean, I read in so many parts, some of the revelation you put out just from the Bible was was huge. Something that I love that you said, as you said, God is not a do nothing God.


And a lot of people, I do think, say that why is God not doing anything? And especially a year like this, why is he not doing anything? Where is he? But you claim God is not a do nothing God. Where does that come from for you?


Well, I was at a speaking engagement one time and I was sharing my story and part of my story that, you know, I don't get into all the detail of my story in the book, but, you know, about what I was facing as you walk through the book and you follow along the narrative of what I was experiencing in my life. But part of it is that I found out my husband was being unfaithful and it was so shattering and so shocking.


I held it private for 18 months because I didn't want to invite public opinion into our very private pain. But after 18 months, I. I thought we were about to cross the finish line and be reconciled and then everything fell apart again. And our story was not a neat and tidy story of discovery and then repentance and then reconciliation. It was a very long, drawn out, hard process.


And there were so many times in the journey where I felt like it was going to be impossible for reconciliation to happen. And a big point that I make in the book is that, you know, just because we experience forgiveness, forgiveness is a command by God. But reconciliation is very dependent on, you know, whether it's safe and whether two people are willing to do the hard work to come together, some sharing, some of that at a speaking engagement.


And a lady raised her hand and she was also in a very devastating place in her marriage. And she said, I just don't understand what God is doing.


Nothing and say the I understood where that question was coming from because I knew what it felt like. Art didn't live in my home for two and a half years, so I went from having five kids and a full family. To all of the kids growing up and moving out, and when my last child moved out, so did my husband, so I was utterly alone when for my whole adult life, I'd been so so like my house had been so full of so much life and it was so hard.


And I knew what it felt like to wake up at two o'clock in the morning, terrified alone and having to realize all over again that my husband wasn't home. And, you know, and it was just it was just brutal. So I knew where this lady's question was coming from. Right. But I also knew that just because we wake up every day and we see certain realities in the physical, that's not the full story. Everything that we see with our physical eyes is what we are experiencing here and now.


But at the same time, God is always operating in the spiritual and we may not see it, but we don't have to see it to believe that he is doing something.


I combed the pages of scripture and I realize with God there's always and meanwhile there's always what you're experiencing. And at the same time there's what God is doing. And here's where I get in trouble.


And he mentioned this just a minute ago.


I love to say, you know, with God, all things are possible. And then I love to look at a hard situation in my life and run ahead of God and write out the script of all the good and all the possible that God should do. And then I want to hold God accountable to my version of good.


Yeah. And when God doesn't follow after my script, I can wrongly assume he's doing nothing when in reality he's very much doing something. It just wasn't the something I expected. But here's the good news. Sady good that God knows better than we know yet here I am on the other side of this journey with art and through a series of just crazy miracles, God did bring us back together.


But God never listened to one of my suggestions. He never followed after my plan because my suggestions to God could have only caused change, behavior and art. And God was after rescuing his soul. Yeah. So he did it differently. But he never was doing nothing. He was always doing something. I just couldn't see it. But we have to know God does his best work in the unseen.


That is so good. Come on. Somebody needs everyone about thirty seconds and listen to that whole thing again. That's so powerful. I quoted this from the book because I thought this quote was so good and it's what you were just talking about. It says you can't edit reality to try to force healing. And that's kind of what you were talking about. The whole sometimes want to play all the things that guy could do that would make this possible, that would make this good.


And I think sometimes even in just our Instagram blog world, you know, we do that. We want to edit things to make it sound better, look better.


But you really walked out the process of healing and forgiveness. And I want to ask this question that you really laid out in the book.


And this was something that really was a pivotal moment for me as I was reading, because you talk about just the hurt that you're going through, but at the same time the forgiveness that you were giving. And so I think a lot of people might have this question, too, like, can you forgive someone? And that thing that they did still hurt you.


You know, sadly, that is such an excellent question, because I think we've wrongly understood that once we forgive, all the hard feelings go away. And, you know, just because we forgive doesn't mean that we've been attended to all the emotional healing that needs to take place because forgiveness is both a decision and a process. So we make the decision to forgive. And sometimes our feelings haven't even signed on for that decision yet. But we don't do it by overriding our feelings because forgiveness is not based on our determination.


Forgiveness is our cooperation with what God is doing. So as God's forgiveness flows to us, we make the decision to forgive by letting God's forgiveness that flow to us flow through us. And so we have to understand that that forgiveness is a decision and a process. We forgive for the facts of what happened. That happens in a moment, in time, in obedience with God. But then we walk through the process of forgiving for the impact that that had on us.


That process of forgiveness is where we tend to all of the emotions and the emotional debt created.


And if somebody causes you a five dollar hurt, then the process of forgiveness will probably be pretty short. But if someone causes you a five million dollar debt, emotional debt of hurt in your life, that process could take a lifetime. So what my counselor helped me see and I also, in addition to studying what the Bible says about forgiveness for a thousand hours, I did so much counseling, I had to do a lot of counseling.


But what my counselor helped me see is that I used to get so aggravated because I would forgive someone. And then a month later I would be driving down the road.


I would get triggered in pain, and then I would be angry and bitter and frustrated all over again. And then I would feel like a forgiveness failure. So I don't know if that's ever happened to you.


Oh, yeah, for sure. Triggers are very inconvenient because you can't time them. So, you know, if I could say on Tuesday night at 7:00 p.m., I'll be sitting in my bathtub, that would be a great time to have a moment, a triggered moment where I have to process something emotionally. But that's not the way it happens. It happens like in the middle of everyday life. I mean, I'll be five minutes from getting on stage to do a message and suddenly something happens.


Somebody says something, I see something and I get triggered in pain and it's so inconvenient. But what I've come to understand is that that is not an act of cruelty by God, that we can't forget the ways that we've been hurt. The hurt stays as long as it needs to be tended to. And when we get triggered in pain, that's just a reminder by God there's more hurt that's sitting in our heart and we can have another marked moment of forgiveness.


I forgave them for the fact of what happened. But now I must forgive this person for the impact that this had on me. And I always add this little statement at the end and whatever my feelings will not yet allow for, the blood of Jesus will surely cover it. I love that because like I said, you know, sometimes our feelings won't sign up for this. Right. But that's where we cooperate with this gift of forgiveness that God allows.




And so powerful. It's such a good way to say and what my feelings, you know, won't allow. I know that the blood of Jesus cover actually quoted this to you that I love from your book. It says, Hurt feelings don't want to cooperate sometimes with holy instructions, and that's so true. But allowing God to come into that, those hurt feelings, you know, to forgive is so powerful.


You had a crazy physical experience to physically painful experience in the midst of this emotionally painful experience. I know with your colon and even with cancer and just several different things, but something that really stuck out to me was just the revelation that you kind of got about pain, that the pain is actually what saved you and that experience. Can you kind of share that story? Because I think even though it is so hard and it's even unimaginable to when you read the book, it's like, how did all this happen?


But what God showed you? And that was huge.


Sure thing, so, you know, when we have hurt that sitting in inside of us hurt that goes unattended to long and just sits inside of us too long, will eventually turn into hate, bitterness, you know, just huge traumatic emotions. And I read a book one time that said the body keeps the score. And that really does happen when we have all of this emotional trauma that sits inside of us. It can really cause a lot of physical damage as well.


And that's exactly what happened to me. I woke up about six months into this journey. I woke up one morning and I went to step out of bed and collapsed beside my bed. I was in so much pain and I couldn't even stand up. So I yelled for someone in my family to come and help me. They rushed me to the hospital. The doctors hooked me up to an IV to try to get the pain under control right away and started giving me pain medication.


But nothing was helping. So they decided, because I was in so much pain to admit me to the hospital and they were running tests, but all the tests were coming back that I was OK. So I laid in that bed in excruciating pain. Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. Wow. Finally, on Friday morning, a doctor came in and said, listen, we ran one last test and we finally figured out what was happening to you.


Your colon has detached from the abdominal wall. It's twisted around itself and cut the blood flow off inside of you.


And we're going to have to go in and remove most of your colon. And then he said something to me that shed so much light on this struggle I was having. I had been struggling so much thinking, God, where are you? Why aren't you taking away this pain?


If I had a child that was in this much pain and I had the ability to take away their pain, I would. So why aren't you doing that, God? And that's what I'd been struggling with that whole week. But that doctor right before he left to go to the doctor to prep for surgery, he turned around.


He looked at me and he said, Lisa, I know that you have been asking God to take away your pain, but I'm just telling you that if God would have done that, then you would have gone home. We would have sent you home. The only reason we kept you here in the hospital is because you were in so much pain. The only reason we kept running tests is because you're in so much pain. And if God would have taken away the pain, we would have sent you home.


Your colon would have ruptured and you would have died. Wow. And so I realized in that moment that God loves us too much to answer our prayers at any other time than the right time and in any other way than the right way.


We just have to trust when we are walking through pain. We can't try to figure out as we navigate our pain, is God good? We have to state at the very beginning of our journey. I know my God is good, my God is good to me, and my God is good at being God. Therefore, I can filter everything I'm facing through that truth and I won't get lost.


Wow. That is so powerful. That's so good. I need to do that in my own life. That's amazing. When you talk about and the book about forgiving God, I read something that looks like such a shocking sentence to me. I feel like what does that look like to forgive God? What does that mean to you?


Well, say to I know it is kind of shocking because, you know, you think, well, God's never sin. So God, you know, do we have to forgive God? And the reason I titled the chapter Forgiving God is because I think that's where a lot of people are when they go through something hard. And we know that our God is big and as strong and as powerful and as mighty and all capable. And so when God doesn't do what we think he should do or when God allows something and we cannot possibly understand why God would allow this, we can not only feel hurt toward the person that hurt us, but we can feel hurt that God didn't prevent this from happening.


Yeah, I don't know if you've ever had a situation like that in your life. Sure. Yeah.


And it's hard.


You know, it's really, really hard. So what I had to do is go through this process of do I need to forgive God? I have some really hard feelings.


It's all around me not understanding God and me not understanding why. If God saw that this was happening, why didn't he stop it? And so in the chapter, I really take people through a process of understanding. Ding, it's not that we need to forgive God.


God doesn't need to be forgiven, but we do need to process our hurt around what God allowed.


And at the end of the day, it really takes us on a journey of understanding that God does have good in mind. Yeah, but he also is a God that allows us to walk through things that don't feel good or seem good as we are on our journey with him. And that's where faith comes in and that's where trust comes in. And I can look back now, Sady and I can see so much more clearly what God was allowing. And I kept asking God bring aunt home.


Hmm. But God loved me too much to bring art home before God rescued his soul. And I kept saying, just bring him home, just bring him home. And I think God loved me too much to bring a broken version of art home that would have betrayed me and hurt me again. God did bring art home, but it wasn't until God had really done some work on art that art became the man that loves me, the way that God wanted me to be loved.


That's so powerful. That's beautiful. And even to say I got to see you in art recently and it's so amazing to see all together and just the strength that you do have and one another now again, and probably even a newfound strength. I wanted to ask you this last thing, because there is a shift in your relationship and yours, even just the whole process of getting back together. And you talk about that shift being the vulnerability that you shared.


And there is also a shift in the communication going from shameful things to hurtful things, shameful words to hopeful words.


What are they looking for your and then for other people going through maybe a similar situation.


How do you shift from speaking words of shame to really breathing words of hope or in life over each other?


Well, good question, Sally, I want to also state that sometimes forgiveness includes reconciliation and sometimes it doesn't. But God's redemption is there, no matter whether we experience reconciliation in our human relationships or not. And because of God's redemption and the redemptive work that God does in our life, we can change the way that we speak about situations and that we speak to people.


And so I had to let God show me before I ever knew if aunt and I were going to be reconciled or not. I had to let God show me how do I pursue redemption God, so that I don't always tell this story, proving how hurt I was. But I want to exchange that proof of hurt for wisdom and perspective that can help other people. And one day I was studying in Genesis. And if you've ever spent time with me sitting around studying the Bible, you know, I go back to Genesis just about every time I study the Bible.


But I was reading in Genesis one and two and then even Genesis three. And suddenly it occurred to me that when God said it is not good for the man to be alone. So he created a suitable helper for the man. What in the world am I supposed to help with? What does that mean? Suitable helper? And when I studied that, it means that the woman is in full view of the man and she is reflecting back to the man almost as a reminder to him.


And as I started to think about that, I was like, well, what am I supposed to remind him of? And as I looked at the story, sadly, I realized man was made from dust. And I think about this dust is something that we brush away, we brush aside. We don't give very much thought to. Right. We just clean it up and move on. And yet, God breathed his very own breath into this seemingly insignificant dust in and out of it created man.


So man is not just dust, he's also breath of God. Wow. And I think as women, we are supposed to speak that over these men in our lives, whether it's our fathers, our brothers, our husbands, you know, can you imagine if we can look at them and say you're not just the sum total of the mistakes that you've made that equals shame, but you are also a breath of God created by God to be a reflection of goodness and glory of God.


And you're supposed to shine that out everywhere you go. And, yes, you've made some mistakes that points to the dust reality of you, but you are also breath of God. And so if I speak that over them, then imagine the man then reflecting back to the woman. You're not just broken off bone. You know, when we see a carcass on the side of the road and I know some people take that those things home and decorate with them and I get that.


But for the most part, when we see dead, decaying bone, we don't think it's a treasure. What do we want to do? We want to bury it. But a woman is not just broken off bone meant to be buried. A woman is also touch of God, design of God's hand made by God and say, can you imagine if we could stop the echoes of shame that are hindering people all over the world? And if we decided to participate in the divine echo speaking life over one another, telling these guys ours, you're not just us, but you are the breath of God, and then them echoing back to us, you're not just broken off bone, but you are the touch and design of God.


And this divine echo would change all.


Come on. Yes, it's so good.


I'm getting so excited over here. It's crazy. Like I mean, reading the book and then hearing you talk. This message is just in you. Like, I like sitting here. I start clapping when you started talking because it's like she's going there. Like every part of the book that I just love is just flowing out of you because it's in your heart, like the Bible talks out there, good treasure stored up and the good man's heart. And it's just so in you.


And so, Lisa, thank you for the a thousand hours. Thank you for the wisdom that you poured in to be able to pour out and for just going to counseling and just staying in the marriage and you and art reconciliation. I know. So that doesn't happen for everybody. That's true. And there's so much hope in this book, even for that story if that plays out in your life. But for yours, reconciliation, it's been a beautiful thing to watch and to read about.


Powerful and so thank you for just who you are, for your whole family. You guys are amazing and doing such incredible things and we're so, so thankful to be you guys, this friend. Well, thank you.


Say, I feel the same way about you, and I pray many, many blessings over you. I think, sadly, the person I just described who is committed to speaking out the divine echo, I think you are one of the strongest voices of that. And I am so proud of how you speak truth and life over your generation. Thank you. That's like the best compliment I could get. Thank you so much. I appreciate that. Welcome back to the.


Well, that's good, I guess you practice that way too much, only one time, actually. Yeah, no matter who you are, right.


We are reading the good and bad advice endured by the words Get Pegues Instagram account. Thank you to everyone who follows along and sending good and bad advice that keeps his very entertained and no advice.


And so that we don't we kind of do as human, I guess.


OK, now we appreciate all of you that you were saying and getting bad advice. Here is what we got.


Question everything. Very simple question. I question everything. I don't think that's good.


I don't think that's going to get in what context? It's like. Well, okay. From a questioner, I get you OK, because I do question most everything out there. It's good, though. I think at some point you have to just trust God and begin to trust people. But I think there is wisdom to questioning some things. You know, I think some people naively jump into things before they thought about it. Where they ask questions and questions can save you from a lot of trouble later.


You know, asking questions up front can save you from questions you would have found out months later from people. So I think it's good to ask questions, but not if it's in a like, untrust for almost like I don't trust you to question everything. I'm watching every move, not just anybody. The government's out to get me. Like, you might not want to take it that far. Yeah. Yeah.


And I think definitely discernment can kind of coincide with questioning and actually heard something this morning. It was a quote by spurge and it said Discernment is not necessarily the difference between right and wrong, it's the difference between right and almost right.


Oh, that's good. Yeah. I was like, that's really that's really good. I like Bella. All right.


Just live a little less than a Kenny Chesney song. Is it a little more you halwa, is it.


Every person has to say I might be gifted and singing. You know, you might have a talent. I can harmonize. I just can't sing but just live a little. I'm a type one of the anagram. So inhealth I go to a seven which means kind of the adventure in Ventris. Yes. You asked me if I. So just live a little. I think that it's not bad advice necessarily, but I do think, you know, if it goes into the idea like just leave a little, have some fun, go levinsohn, then I think it's horrible advice.


Yeah, it is a little normally turns into a lot, but yeah, it can be good. Everything is good normally in context, you know, you can make that a good thing. Like for somebody like Christian who at times can be very like this, we're going to do this the way it's going to be done, like sometimes like you know, just little. Let's just go for it. Let's just have a good time because somebody like, hey, just come to this party, come and just have a drink like that is just like starting a conversation with the enemy, you know, horrible advice.


Don't listen to that person. Become the person you're looking for, is looking for. So I think become the person that who I'm looking for is looking for. So I want to become a man. Oh, that's good. That's good. I like that a lot.


I actually think that Mike Todd's relationship series, which we listen to before we did it, takes a while before the person and like preparing yourself to be the person who you're going to be in a relationship before you enter relationship. And that was great advice, because I felt by the time Christian I met, like, obviously I didn't have it all figured out.


And obviously we went through a lot, but I was like prepared to enter the relationship that we were going to enter because I was, like, confident who I was, like the job that I knew I wanted to do. I, like, knew the type of person I wanted to marry.


And so I had, like, a guidance of my life and who I was going for instead of just, like, floating around thinking like, oh, I hope Prince Charming, like, lands on my doorstep when, you know, there is like a preparation there.


Yeah. I think when you come to terms with who you are and who God has called you to be, I think you're able to walk in that confidence. And the person who's looking for a person like you, then you can you can be confident.


Yeah, that's great. I last question. Focus on discipline before desire.


It's good advice.


I know for me, a few years ago when I first started kind of following Jesus, that I desired him. But it was only as well as the practical points that I made to read or to pray, to want to go to prayer things, go to attend church and do these things with Bible study. And over time, that discipline really cultivated my desire.


Yeah, I do that even like social media. I honestly, I had the Bible app on my phone and like you don't always like when I click on your Bible app, like you just want to go to Instagram, you want to go to YouTube. And it kind of is a discipline to be like, actually, I'm going to choose that first. And every time I do, I get lost in it. And I'm so glad I did. I'll start reading somebody's Bible, say they wrote or I just get lost in a book, the Bible.


And then I'm like, OK, you I'm done with my time on my phone. And so sometimes that discipline starts as a discipline becomes a true desire. Yeah. So I think that's great advice. Yeah. Good.


Yeah, I think that's great too. And I think to you you don't want to get in to make it a habit to her becomes like a legalistic religious kind of mindset. But I do think that if you create healthy discipline so they can definitely form your desires.


Yeah. So good things, you're sitting and getting bad advice. The words get Instagram page, keep following along and send us some more advice and maybe we'll talk about it.


Goodbye. Thank you so much for listening to the Verdasco podcast. I have so much fun doing this. I hope you'll have fun listening. And don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Leggate City, Rob, and follow the podcast atwo. That's good podcast. I don't know where to live. Original and dotcom to see when I'm in a city near you or visit live original blog on our online store, which carries my exclusive words by City Rob line.


Also, be sure to subscribe to our podcast and leave comment so we can hear what you're loving. Also want to give a special shout out to my audio engineer, Marcus Cipolla, the whole team, United Talent Agency and my live original team. You guys are awesome and so are all of you, too.


Thanks so much for listening.