Warhol were alive. Welcome, welcome, welcome to armchair expert. I'm Dan Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Pastrana. I got to tell you guys, this is one of the most exciting folks I could talk to, period in Monica. God bless you. You did your best to hang in there. And luckily, Travis is cute.

I think that got you through a lot of it's very, very interesting. He lives a life that I would fear greatly, however. And it's fascinating. Just jump into those people's worlds.

Yeah. You know, Travis Pastrana is one of these guys who I just idolize. He has done every single thing a human being can do on a motorcycle, in a rally car, in a NASCAR and maybe back flip does a monster truck one time. He is an extreme motorsports daredevil.

But I will say there are themes in this that transcend that, that are very interesting. So if you're motorsports is in your bag, don't worry. I think that we get into life themes for sure. Pretty profoundly. And I think it's really illuminating to hear how someone like Travis thinks, how he approaches his work, his job, the risk, how he ended up doing it. It's all very, very fascinating to me. And he's just a gem of a human being.

Yes. Sweet boy. He's a 17 time X Games medalist and he's five times North American Reilley Champion. He is the co-founder of Nitro Circus, Nitro World Games and Nitro Rallycross. Travis's new venture is called Circuit one nine nine. A future state of the art racing facilty, motorsports park and entertainment venue where everyone from beginners to Tier one athletes can pursue their passions and progress as safely as possible.

Yes. Good question. Yeah. Yeah. What is rally? Rally is a type of racing that doesn't happen, unlike a paved track. It happens in the woods most often or in Sweden. It happens in the snowy woods or it happens along mountain trails and it's cars racing over jumps, turns, always with a very death defying element because you're racing within the trees, there's no runoff. So if you crash, you're crashing into a tree at speed.

Is it still made lake? Is it still a made track? It's just outdoors in the element.

Yes. There's like a path cleared through the forest by and race on. It's incredible.

All right. Well, that's helpful. Yeah. Let's get into it. Travis Pastrana is a motorsports God on earth. Please enjoy this cute boy from Maryland. We are supported by third love.

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I hop in the shower and then I just rinse off all that stress.

Yeah, I decompress like I'm in a spa. It's nice.

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Visit Mowen m o e and dot com slash NBA and e b. I a and get one today. He's an. Oh, OK. OK. Now, here we go. Hi, how's it going? Go and get side.

I actually lost my voice yesterday at the event, so I were perfect for a 90 minute pop and audio podcast.

Yes, well, use sign and then I'll translate for the listener. Samuel, thumbs up. You know, it's kind of nice for me to see you in some way on my turf because usually. Well, I think I've only been around you two or three times, but it's always like in the sand dunes where your God I am. I am. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

So how's your was your wrist. Your hand. How's that healing?

Oh, well, it has healed, but now I have like a fifth knuckle on just the top of my hand. Do you have a few of those? What is the what seems to be the fragile points of your body?

Shoulders, knees for sure. Ankles. Now, see, when you start racing, most guys like Gumby, you end up with your feet and then you start break your ankles. And then when they break, then you step on your knees and then you start breaking back. Just kind of works its way up. Oh, you're so right.

And by the way, you're explaining something that my wife witnessed on Saturday, which was I was on roller skates and I went to sit down. And I realized, well, both my wrists are shot, so I can't put my hands behind me. You sit down. And then I thought, well, I'm gonna have to make a fist because that's generally like five to do a push up. That's what I got to do it this twice. Right.

My left wrist is fuse. So when I fall over, like you trip up the steps, you just take it to the shoulder because you can't. Oh, grab yourself. Look, I've ever even had your life, but that is where I met, where my wife was watching. We tried to sit down on roller skates and I just had to commit and just drop onto my tailbone because I can't I can't break my fall or anything. And I was thinking, yeah, these these injuries are starting to roll downhill and fuck up other things, without a doubt.

So I actually I had a growth spurt at twelve years old. I broke both wrists and I came back like literally my mom had to wait me because I had two full arm casts. I came back and I broke my left wrist and my left collarbone. I like the first ride back. And then I blew out my knee and I was like, OK, whatever you do, I just got back on the bike and like, just don't land on your wrist.

Don't lean on your wrist. And I sat back down and I broke my back. I was thinking, I'll take the risks, you know? So that's kind of one of those things.

Well, I kind of I used to his final lot and got thank God I haven't. And longtime. It does cross my mind if it goes down at this point. I don't know how deep the fight before everything's just broke, like even as I was winning. I'm sorry I can't hit you anymore because everything's broke now. That was the sidebar. Sorry, I'm sorry, but it does cross my mind. So. OK, so you're an interesting guest for us because our listeners aren't cherries are predominantly female.

And so I'm going to gender stereotype now. I don't I doubt many of them love Nitro Circus or Motocross or met the many things you and I love. We're like eighty five percent younger males, probably exact opposite viewership, but. Yes. Yes. Right. Yeah. You and I could team up if we could like converge the Nitro Circus and arm Terry Army. It would be really amazing. And these pair up perfectly and could find mates because there's you know, I'm saying the numbers are there.

OK. So what I want to say is they'll be a bunch of sportstalk but much bigger themes in your life that I think are very interesting themes that that people will really enjoy. So I have theories about you and I'm going to ask them. But let's start at the beginning. Travis, where were you born? And that was Marilyn. And was it pretty rural where you got brought home from the hospital.

So Annapolis is actually the capital of Maryland, but it's definitely a smaller city. So you have the Naval Academy, a lot of armed forces there for sure. Daffner, my dad was military, pretty much everyone in that area. But my best friend growing up became a Navy SEAL. So when you grow up with your dad being a drill sergeant, the Marine Corps, it's a pretty strict regiment. Yeah. Even though that band wasn't too far away, we grew up completely different.

Like, could be more, you know, the skate culture. I'm here to cater. My wife, Lindsay. She's a skater. But like they were, you know, get up at the crack of noon. And if I if I slept till seven out on the weekend, I was lazy, you know, pilot crap.

So get up at the crack and knew. Well, that's all going to tie into these different themes because you've avoided some pretty well-worn traps that a lot of folks fall into, both in what you do and what I do. I fell into them. And you you appear to have not fallen into them. But I was wondering, were you in a suburb like were you somewhere where you could ride a dirt bike as a child? Yep.

So my dad, he has five brothers and they had a construction company. So a really small construction company. But basically, my grandma lived right next to us. My dad's uncle lived right next to him and his brother lived right next to him. And then they rented the next house out there, ended up being my cousin. So we all lived on basically as Elliott Road, which is my grandmother's maiden name. And in the back was basically the shop where we had bobcats and sand piles.

And I got job all the time for moving all the different types of dirt on top of each other because they made figure jumps. Yes. Clay with the sand kind of deal. But, you know, it was a good childhood. What age did you get set on a dirt bike? I was four years old, wants to ride their bikes, but we rode go carts from the age of two and it was a pretty redneck upbringing, considering the kind of city, if you will.

So you're the kid. I would have befriended in Michigan to have access to all your sweet shit. I wanted all that shit, but we too broke. I in fact, one of my good buddies, his dad was a mason. And so they had some shit, you know, they had some property and they had some dirt bikes. And I lived there because of that.

All my uncles, basically, they all loved hot rods. They loved everything. And we just found them from ages of like ten, eleven, twelve says we could reach the pedals and the steering wheel. We go round up, do whatever we paper out whenever we had to do to get like a two hundred dollar car for the junkyard and then just make it run. Go it flips it straight, get it run again and then I save up your money again and make it happen.

So we had a little different childhood than most people. But yeah, my uncle's yard was a really close knit family. We didn't have a lot of money for sure, like everything was handy downs and, you know, ten years old and broken and everything. But it was kind of a really cool way to grow up. A lot of cousins and a lot of uncles doing crazy stuff all the time. Do you have siblings? No, only show.

We could have never afforded racing with more.

I was just going to say that helps big time. So when you got in the dirt bike, would you say. And we will not interpret this as bragging, but was it just a very natural fit from you from the get?

I was basically the runt of my family. My uncle was quarterback for the Denver Broncos, all American lacrosse wrestling. My grandfather was of Boxer in the Navy and I didn't get any of that. I couldn't throw catch, hit punch. I got beat up all the time, you know, for Thanksgiving football games. It was basically like, yeah, your five year old female cousin was going to hear here.

Yeah, exactly.

So I found the only way to really fit in with my family was to have a motor. So I couldn't do with my my own physical power. Yeah. So I was busy. How high can I jump off a bridge. How many flips can I do and how fast. That's just my right wrist. Oh my God.

So this is fantastic. Yeah. I was never good at soccer. I wasn't good at any things. But like BMX bike came around and I would hit the double and then I'd hit that ball. I thought, oh, this device can make me the athlete I want. Like, this thing can deliver on what I wish I was. My greatest strength is the willingness and kind of that understanding, like calculating risk, like, OK, can I make it?

And what are the odds this is gonna work now? I crash more than most people. I've had more injuries than than pretty much anyone else out there. But that's how I've made a career. Now we've gone this quarantine and all the stuff has some racing like, man, you're really bad on the simulator. I'm like, no, they took away all of my my edge. No one's afraid to crash the simulator. I'm exposed to be.

Right. OK, but and this will be, again, a theme that recurs, which is certainly you had a really high tolerance for fear. There's probably something wrong in your head. I remember reading and reading in like psychology that people who are risk takers, like they don't have Amayo in their brain, like people that tonna em out, they're satisfied watching the grass grow, but people non their brains are dead unless they're there's a threat of death. But you had on top of that a crazy gif on a motorcycle.

What age you start racing as you're racing at 44 years old. So. Yeah. Oh, you racing at that age. Yeah. Got my bike. Everyone in the family of motorcycles. My mom even started racing when I started racing. So it was pretty fun.

Oh, wow. And then when do you win your first championships. So first and it's your national championship was ten years old. So then I won five national championships and then won my first X Games. Well, won the world freestyle championship because it was a new sport. You know, when you start out with something that they haven't done for a long time, you're still kind of everyone's learning together. So it's it it's a lot easier for someone that's younger or hasn't been on a bike as much to really get to do.

Well. Timing was definitely on my side. So I won the World Championships support team, but it really wasn't a sport at that time. Was kind of like the guys that weren't good enough to race motocross played around. You know, in general, guys seemed to be either crazy, great racers or they were really good at freestyle. And certainly maybe there was overlap. But you actually won the AM a one twenty fives when you were. That's when you were seven.

Yes. Yes. Sixteen, sixteen. So you're the fastest man in the world on a one. Twenty five at sixteen.

I picked early you go to the X Games. The very first X Games is at ninety nine ninety nine yet 15 years old. And you win the freestyle competition which is where you're doing stunts, you're jumping off enormous jumps and you're doing tricks and you get at that time which still stands, you get a ninety nine. Right. You just, you decimate the competition and your feet numb and you're like 16. And so here's where I start noticing you.

I'm I guess if you were 16 I was like twenty four or something and it was very exciting that you were both that and you were the current champion on one twenty five. I thought, oh this doesn't really happen. This kid's really a Fien. I'm, I'm really excited about this person as was everybody in the motorsports world. And what were you doing all your tricks on a one. Twenty five and everyone else is on a 250.

Yeah, for sure. So it definitely sounded louder. Didn't go as fast as a loud noise. Had a lot of aggression. No I mean that's basically. My whole life, my dad said, look, you're your uncle was the greatest athlete might have ever come out of Maryland, and he's still working construction this summer and teaching in all the community college health to seniors. And they call him Coach P for lacrosse and football. And said, look, any day that you can do what you love to do.

Ride that train. So the wheels fall off. But you're always going to end up working as Joycean with us.

So whenever something came up with X Games, I was like, Dad, I like Mom, I want to do that. And they're like, well, you know, yeah, just have fun. As long as you're having fun, you're getting good grades. Like, go ahead. And never stop.

So it sounds like you were born into the very perfect family to pursue what you pursued. But did they wrestle when you started doing freestyle? Did they start getting scared? And were they expressing that at all to you? Because people are not yet, but people shortly thereafter start getting very, very hurt doing this like like don't walk again and stuff like that. Yeah, I mean, my mom was definitely tougher on, you know, at eighteen I'm backflipping into the Grand Canyon with parachute.

And I just, you know, all this stuff kind of I took a lot of hard left of through throughout my career. But at the end of the day, my mom, I think that when she realized that it meant that much. I just located my basically my pelvis shattered and my spine just pretty much went in her asshole, if you will. Yeah. Out of it. Yeah. It was it was bad.

I'm like two thirds my blood volume all. So I just kept passing out. I pass out every time I try to move me, I pass out. So I've got hurt and Havasu and I ended up flying to L.A., woke up two weeks later, almost died. Basically one white stunt was that. And have a sore. I was just I just didn't go fast enough. I was trying to make it jump on a freestyle course and I tried to jump to jumps and I went a hundred fifteen feet.

I had to go 120.

So all I feel this is going to be really hard for Monica. Right. We've given you like a Xanax or something. OK, so did Mom at all say to you, like, honey, I'm so glad you're on fire for this and passionate, but she still has to say, like, be careful. You even have to be careful. Switch your back.

Well, I mean, at this point. So like the parents that sold the boat, that's where you are on the weekends. And now Motorcycle's was what they did. All my uncles that were construction had basically taken pay cuts to cover our fuel to get to the races. We had awesome like sponsors that even though we can't pay amateur's, they were basically helping us in any way they could as friends to be like, OK, you need a new bike for the national championships.

Like you have to have this. And just the really the community, the family, everybody came around to support me doing this. And but my mom's like, you know, the chance of you making anything as far as financial in the sport. She's like, we want to give you the opportunity, go as far as you want. But when I hurt myself there and I woke up literally two weeks later and coming out of the medically induced coma.

And she said, are you sure this will you want to do? I said, Mom, when can I ride again? I want to do that jump. It's like, well, that was two weeks ago. And I know that sounds like a horrible idea. And I just I was like, well, like, you're lucky to walk again. You're going to be in a wheelchair for the next, you know, five months. Let's think about your education.

Let's get away from dirt bikes and even that moment in all that pain. All I want to do is get back on the dirt bike. And she's like, well, if you love it this much, yours. I can't take your life away from you as much as it is hard. Yeah, I, I think it's very hard for a lot of people to understand who don't have hobbies that are really dangerous. But it maybe is isn't true for you, but for some people they'd rather not be here.

I mean, for some people if they can't surf big waves, they'd rather just call it, you know, that's what they want to do. And that might shorten their time here. But that's how they want to spend that time here. It's hard to comprehend if that's not your jam.

I think if you don't have anything that you truly love, that is, it sounds silly to say something's worth dying for. Nobody wants to die, but a lot of people never live. And that's kind of the thing is like, what are you willing to sacrifice to have the best life you possibly can? And one of my heroes, Matt Hoffman, to live, to die happy. So whatever happens every single day, you live so that if the world ended the next day, you died.

Not feeling like you wondered if you could have been better and could have done more. I could have done something, man.

It's like great risk. Great reward. It's everything. Matt Hoffman. So people know he's basically the you of BMX bikes.

He was the pioneer. He was the guy that started everything. First X Games. He won the vert. So this is a guy that was go on 40 foot up. He was pronounced dead, you know, like completely out for, like, you know, two minutes. And they brought him back is a guy that came out. He couldn't get surgery to fix what he needed to do in the US. So two weeks before X Games, he wanted to check.

No, had a nine hundred. No one else had ever done it. He knew he could do it. He was dialed in, hurt himself. So he goes to Canada and they said, look, we can't put you under because that would technically be a surgery. But we can do this procedure as long as it's not, you know, surgery. Yeah. So a drill drill through there, like, you know that. But you can't numb, like, femur and tibia and everything.

And they played it everything and put some synthetic ligaments in there. And he went and landed the first ever know he had a nine hundred. So that's something to say. Like that's how much he wanted to do this and. It's something not many people can grasp. But, yeah, OK, so first of all, Travis is married. I just want to warn you. Well, that's actually what I'm getting at.

OK, so this is part of it. So when you have this thing you love so much that you'll sacrifice essentially your life for, do you have close relationships with other people along this time? Because I feel like as soon as somebody else close comes in, you feel like you owe them a little bit of you of your life so that when you put yourself at risk. Isn't that scarier or does it make it harder to do.

Yeah. I mean, risk reward always changes. If you're 15 years old, you've got and that's a nothing to lose, but you've got a lot more to gain. You know, I have a one X Games. I haven't done this. I need to prove. And even if you don't. That's how you you feel as you're young and you're fired up. Like, I need to do this. I have to land this trick. I have to set myself on the stage.

You don't have a wife or a girlfriend or kids, but everyone says, how can you keep doing this stuff when you have kids as well? I've trashed a lot and it's a calculated risk to say what is worth it? What is going to show my kids that you've got to go out. You've got to work hard. You've got to chase your dreams. You've got to live your life to the absolute fullest. But you've got to keep living, you know?

Yeah. You can't take these excessive risks. So it is joshin triple backflip. This guy, he's all I see almost my age, but no wife, no kids. And I were working for a triple back flip pretty much since the double back flip in 2006. Really quick.

I just got to say, Travis was the first person in the event to back flip a motorcycle. Wow. Wow. Yeah.

So. So that was about 40 feet above the ground or 50 feet. Now they're going 100 hundred feet above the ground. So got the take off that we had. We worked with Thomas Pazhani and all the Red Bull and Nitro. And we had gone through so much money and so much time and so many injuries trying to figure out how to get the motorcycle. That's two hundred fifty pounds to spin three times must slow down waiting the rear wheels, trying all different things.

And can I pause you for one second? I have to imagine because the Red Bull Bank is the fucking best in motorsports. So there are the I am assuming there's like physicists and engineers working on this at this point. Right? I mean, it is a real think tank. It's not you and your fucking yokel buddies go on like, how do we get a third rotation out of this? The problem is most of the think tanks don't work.

It's up.

But I'm not saying that smart people aren't smart, but in our stuff, like it comes down to, it's a feel that, you know, people that if you don't feel something, you don't really understand it. So we finally figured out how to get three around. But now I'm at about one hundred and ten feet in the air. My landing's about going to an airbag, which is still 60 feet below me. And I mean, so Joshy.

And he was peeing blood. I got a couple of broken ribs and that's to the airbag. That's the safest thing you can possibly do. I was scared going to the airbag and I had to stop thinking, if I'm scared, going to an airbag. What makes me think that when this is landing, wooden landing, 60 foot tall, I'm going 60 feet above that? Like, what makes me think that I'm going to have the mental capacity to commit to this?

And like you said, you're thinking, well, what if I get hurt or what if I die? My my wife. What about my kids? And I just it as soon as you start thinking about that, you realize that you're in over your head. Whether you are you're not. If you're thinking of anything but that trick in that moment, you're going to get hurt. And that was my first time that I thought my job is no longer to to be the guy that's pushing limit.

My job is to help these guys that are pushing the limit, do it and get back to their families.

Dude. Okay, so you're bringing up a great point. Okay, so I ride motorcycles in L.A. everywhere I go, I go to the track every time I can to race motorcycles and increasingly I'm having the debate while it's going on. Do you have the debate? Like, I'll be doing something and I'm loving it because, you know, the two kids and everything else. I'm just kind of like, OK, I love this so much. But then it crosses my mind what my kids will be like without a dad, a dad they knew for seven years.

And I'm like, God, how much do I love? It trickles in a lot more for me in the last couple years now, without a doubt. I was riding my Harley the other day just backwards, like just cruising. And I saw a deer on the side of the road, just wheeler, Marilyns, lot of deer. And I really I was scared all the way back. I'm like, how stupid would this be? I'm riding the speed limit, cruising, I guess, like, can can I do this?

Can I keep riding? Is that still safe? And then I was going to pick up my daughter and I'm like, can I have her on the back of this? Like, I'm I'm a good rider, but like waiting here, jumps out and runs us over. Like what? I don't know.

OK, so great. Now our somewhere where we really need to be, which is I have this ethical thing and I really want to know because. So you have a daughter, Addie. That's the exact same age as Lincoln. And I kind of been tracking you a little bit because I put Lincoln on an electric dirt bike, like just before her fourth birthday and she got good at and then I got her a little razor and she's fucking baller. And the razor.

Yeah, the little one. 70. Yes. And I can see the calmness when shit comes up and I'm like, oh, she's got it. She's got the thing. Everything can be upside down, and she's still thinking calmly. She got it. And it fills me with such delight. So I imagine, Addie, your daughter. She must be doing all this stuff, too. What?

She had the same thing, that 170. You know, now she's under pikes. But it's funny. I have two daughters and my oldest was added. I don't know how different your kids are, but my oldest Addie comes out and she was crying unless you had her in the air. She had to be in the air. She had to be moving. She started walking. She needed to be going somewhere. Doing something.

Travis. My kids knew sign like she knew sign language before she could talk. Right. And I hope this rope up to this little car she had in all day long. And I started swinging it around in the driveway. And the video is so scary. Like, I watch it now in the moment it felt right. But the video is scary. She's she's a real politics. It's she's going to be she has to be hitting 30. Right.

It's 17 years between her and then stop. And it's on video. And the first thing she does put her fingers together, which is more, more, more, more, more, more.

Yeah, the same same thing. But with with Adi Road is the second. No matter what's going wrong, she smiles as it goes more sideways as the Louvre is steps out as she over jumps. Our youngest, she was the happiest baby. But if you threw in the air, she would start crying. He's always saying, slow down. Our oldest is more. More, more. Faster. Faster, faster. Our youngest since day one. Like they raised in the same, I think like slower.

Don't like heights. Don't want to go fast. Let's. I want to drive with mom, you know dude.

Is exact same story just last night driving the minivan home on the one I want and I got fucking Lincoln saying go faster and Delta saying slow down.

So interestingly enough, our oldest, the crazy one never gets hurt. She's all right. Flying through the air and she tumbles and she just rolls with the punches. Our youngest one doesn't do hardly anything. And when she, too, sliding down the steps and she got scared. So what did she do? She put her feet out and everything and the thing ended up flipping. And she's not like, that's why I don't do this stuff. I'm like, you don't want your panties that you're you're right.

If you panic, your worst fears will come true.

First, why I can't stand Formula One. I've had never had an interest in it, but I watched this Netflix Formula One show.

Have you seen it? Well, it didn't. I have always been like such a big F1 fan. All of a sudden the Netflix came out and everyone's talking. Oh, yeah. You see this? I'm like, it's about time.

I'm that guy. I'm the poser for sure. I was like, I don't know. They never pass bubble or whatever. Phenomenal. And then I, I said to my wife, I'm like, I got to get Lincoln in a car like yesterday. Or C can never be in route to being a formula for her. And then I played the whole thing out and I was like, God, I'd be so proud. And then I thought, what if my fucking daughter died in some fucking ridiculous hobby?

I kind of forced I'm not even for it. She just would act interested because she loves me. Probably I can't tell when she's doing something for me or she loves it. How can I know? And I just thought, fuck. Is that the path I want to put her on? So you have a daughter. She would definitely be the heir apparent. She could probably be the best female motorcycle rider of all time. What are your thoughts about that?

Could you see her go through all the injuries you've gone through as a father that people say, would you want your kids to do whatever makes them happy? There's no amount of money in the world worth going through the injuries that I've done. But I would have paid every single dime, every dollar given up everything to have had the opportunity to live the life that I have because I love it. So whatever they're passionate about and I hope it's not motocross.

I hope it is cars are safer and safer. Both of my daughters, I want them to be competent on a motorcycle, but I hope they don't last too, as I did. Yeah, someone just crossed my mind because you're so immersed in X Games and all this different branding stuff. Do they tell you, like, stay away from that shit and aim everyone back over here? I mean, at the end the day, like, kind of now my job is, you know, going through boot campaign and stuff and trying to figure out with the head injury whenever instincts come out in football.

So, OK, like, let's let's figure out how, you know, there's guys that knock themselves out almost every night. The biggest thing their head like, OK, so is a serious is it not like, you know, as someone that's giving them the opportunity to do it to themselves and to travel around the world living a dream, like when do we have to say, you know, because doctors be like, oh yeah, they look, they look OK.

Look, I know this. I know him like people not all right or she's not right or whatever. So trying to figure out what is good or bad, I guess.

Yeah, well, it's very weird, right. To transitioning. Oh shit. Someone here has got to be the parent and that's now me, which is such a weird role. I'm so I'm not used to that, but I got to take that on because that is the role now.

Yeah. So the more brothers, they were quad racers and they went, they started winning X Games. Both of them are now gold medals. But Caleb ended up passing away like he got up and walked out with just the internal just cause it's so heavy. Yeah. And there's been a couple in freestyle motocross. My thing right now is trying to get where, you know, like NASCAR. I put in safer barriers after a night. Like, you're never gonna get away from the potential, but.

Make it so that you get away with 90 percent more. Yeah, the jumps are going to be bigger. You're gonna go faster. You're gonna be stronger. You gotta do more stuff. But let's make the landing so you can roll out of a little bit, you know.

Well, it's so you've I think and I don't know the history of it so well, but you've pioneered a couple things, right. So the foam pit, I at least I had never seen the foam pit. So it's so he started practicing where he practices amazing backflips and shit and lands in this enormous container full of foam squares.

Did you make that up? Carey Hart, actually. Oh, him and the guys. What word would emerge as a camp start on the East Coast? Now it's all over the world. They even have the hard rock hotels and stuff now. But basically they have all the best athletes and the most progressive training facilities. So they start out with gymnastics. They have so many Olympians that goes through there and then they move to skateboards and BMX and they took all the gymnastics stuff and basically rolled it out over to.

That's all I really quick monarch as a state champion cheerleaders. So just I want to see. So I've tumbled into a foam pit many times. They champ over here. So you guys are bowl champs. I haven't won. I've never won any. Yeah. Where is this place? BMX racing. That's the metal.

OK, well technically is going to be a hard left but cheer. So I am now it's your dad. Oh did I tell you what do. I've been throwing our girls in the air since day one and you know, they could do backflips. So my my oldest daddy, she's a flyer. She wasn't as flexible as she needed to be right away to get in there. But she's been working hard and they're like, well, you're your light.

You're like the youngest one of the team and you can do backflips.

So, yeah, that's pretty much. Yeah. I thought I was dreading it to be like an action sports athlete, but I was really just training you to be a flyer and share.

So it's the best. It's a fun world. Yeah. Did you I assume you watched cheer on Netflix?

Because I watched it, I was like, this is crazy. They're not taking any of the precautions that football does. And these girls are getting concussions, like more seasoned. Why does anyone give a shit about these girls? I put a fucking helmet on while you train. I don't know.

Stay tuned for more armchair experts there.

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OK. So the phone bit, so you started practicing in the foam pit. Now you have these humongous inflatable airbag landing ramps where those come from.

So, well, foam is a petroleum product. Motorcycles have a really hot exhaust pipe. And the biggest problem is when you land upside down. No matter what you turn off, gas pours out. And then the static electricity lights it.

Oh, my God. So have you witnessed this? Yes. So the red ball foam pit burnt down. There's been a lot of them that have gone up in flames. To make it safer, we started going to airbags. No airbags. It's a soft landing. You don't get stuck upside down with gas pouring on you and potentially lit on fire with dislocated shoulder or whatever. My mom broke her neck into our foam pit. No, she was the first.

She was fine.

She was just. What was Masaharu? A hairline fracture. Oh, wow. I'm surprised you even mentioned it.

Now, even with the triple backflip and stuff, we had to figure out a way to take the back row flat bag. The landing bag helped so you can actually get a feel of where the landing is going to be. And because when it's flat, you have to rotate or under rotate, depending which direction you're spinning or what not. So the more we can make it towards landing, the better. And now with BMX going the Olympics and you have all the snowboarding and everything else, every Olympic countries were coming tonight, your circus.

After we figured that thing out with the triple, they were like, OK, how did you make up a bag? That was a landing bag. Like, how does how does it go wrong? Surely that's got to be quite challenging. Yeah. I mean, it wasn't too challenging, but it is just when you have haven't seen it before, hasn't been done. And just in the last two years, the progression of the safety of the bags, your bags and all the other companies that are coming out, they're so good.

And you would realize we didn't need us as deep as we thought we did. Like, you just need. It's like when you do the bench press or something and like, you know, some puts a pinkie on there and it gets the rest of the way. You know, you don't you don't need a lot to protect you from a really bad injury. The only problem with the landing bags is the head, because your body is long as everything's tucked in.

You can draw from pretty high if you're, you know, landing fairly flat on your stomach or your back, you know, little limb out. You're going to break it and your head usually gets slapped pretty hard on the back. So, like, motocross had a really low kind of CTE probability. And that can set because usually if you try hard hard enough to be knocked out, you get something else, those broken. So what we found was that the safer that we're making it for, your body is actually making it potentially more problems down the road because you'll crash a jump nine, 10, 20 times and you'll be able to keep getting back up.

And you generally trash the trick the same way. So it hits the same spot. Every thing that you think you're doing better, you always have a consequence on the other side.

Yeah, your body's in equation and you're like, yeah, you're bolstering one end and then now you. This is a weak point. Okay, so you're just at an all time legend. We've also built this incredible empire. You're winning X Games. Your fucking jumping and flipping everything you could possibly do. And then you create a TV show, Nitro Circus, with a lot of the jackass folks. And the pilot, if I recall and I told you about this Monaca one time, he almost threw up the pilot.

You meet Travis on this show. He's in an airplane up in the air and he says, hey, I'm Travis Pastrana and this is Nitro Circus. He's in board shorts and no fucking shirt. And he jumps out of an airplane.

Oh, my God. And do I have that right either? Yeah. And he knows how to pass or fail. Those tests were always the best. It was actually it was a retinal test. You know, they said it gives you wings. I'll just check it out.

OK. So I'm watching that. And this is the first time I've now been put in the seat of, like, a mother where I'm like, no, no and no. I love Travis Pastrana. He is a motorsports FENA. I don't need him jumping out of a fucking airplane with no parachute. He just dives out of the airplane and he meets another dude in the air and he puts on a fucking parachute and then opens it lands safely.

Yeah. And you practice this.

Yeah. Well, so I'm not a great skydiver. Like, I got my license, which just like you get her license. That's the here. Your learner's permit. I mean, I get around fine. I it's like the things you go out with the best. Yeah. I mean that's the best part about base jumping and skydiving. The second you step off the bridge or building or plane, you're going as fast as anyone else can go. So, you know, you're already up.

You've got to figure it out from there. But so I jumped out. I tried to get away from these guys. I was doing everything that I could to basically play tag, assuming they were it. And I was trying to run. And they basically tackled me out of the sky and they just hooked up to the rock climbers.

OK. So the guys that our guys or girls, whoever chased after you in the air, I presume hopefully they were some of the best in the world, that skydiving.

I found a military guy and I figure, you know, military, they'd never leave me behind. So, like, I should be all right. We'll be great. So, I mean, that's hard to say.

Makes sense. But at the same time, they don't look like you got like. Yeah. I can jump out because the military's never left a guy behind. Well, OK. Yeah. That is a true statement. But this isn't I don't know that it applies here. So, yeah, I guess I.

Remember, I remember thinking, OK, if you found my threshold, I now mad at you because I want you to stay alive because I love watching you do shit, but I don't want you jumping out of fucking airplanes. All of them are scary, but within their if you love this stuff and I do, there's all this strata of actual danger. Right. So these wing suits are so fucking dangerous. What's that? So they get in these suits and they have, you know, kind of wings from your wrist down.

And they jump off a mountain and they fly and they can go really, really, really fast. Yeah. It's like us flying squirrel. But the problem is not a problem. The proximity fly because you can fly right down the mountains, through tunnels, through I mean, it's amazing. And the precision these guys have, that's where my wife drew the line. So I was starting to think about. She goes, look, you always have to do a little bit more, a little bit further.

She's like, you don't practice enough to be competent enough that this makes sense. And I fully agree. But you can do things safely. The problem is most of the people that are risk takers that are doing that are gonna be proximally flying. You're not going to say, hey, I'm not gonna go further. Closer next time. I'm not going to go faster because I'm not going to push myself harder. And eventually with that, it's not you know, you don't break risk when you find the limit.

It's too late. Yeah. I don't want those guys disintegrating, friend.

They were flying and they were gonna fly through these cables of a bridge. All these people gathered to watch. One guy caught a cable and literally dematerialise.

There was nothing left of this guy.

So one of my best friends, Eric Rohner, he was always kind of our voice of reason, like he was father of two kids, his wife, Monica. Just an amazing family, amazing human being. Was a skier, basically was his main thing. But Shane McConkey, who also passed away, was from the same area. They started ski base jumping and that kind of stuff. And out of all the stuff that Eric Runner did and all the stuff that Shane McConkey did.

They both died on things that I'm not saying their routine, but they were very, very minimal risk. So that put things in perspective for me to say, like, hey, sometimes things just go wrong. Yeah. When you're when you're in those sports, it doesn't really matter how good you are if you're pushing yourself, if something goes wrong, this outside of your control. McConkey, as he did in his binding, didn't unclip down. Now, here's a question I have for you, because I'm regularly in situations where it's a track day we're all riding.

And that did crashes, you know, and I'm like, you know, you go through this whole thing. It's like, oh, he just crash. Okay? And that could happen to me. And then you basically have to talk with yourself of why that doesn't pertain to you. And I wonder what your talk is. So mine is generally like, oh, that guy's younger. He's got more to prove than me. He's willing to ride over his talent level.

And I generally think at forty five I know where my talent level is and I say just under it. But that's also horseshit. Right. 100 percent. So what do you tell yourself when you've had friends or peers who have died or been, you know, dramatically injured, doing virtually what you do? What what do you tell yourself? No, I mean, it's kind of what you said. It's like thinking of your kids riding motorcycles. You're like, well, they're probably going to break a bone if they continue doing this, but it's not going to be the day that I ride your head.

Yeah, it's not today. I know you'll hurt eventually in this, but not not today. Yeah, you're right. You know, the numbers like I tell this to people who want to learn to ride a motorcycle who live in L.A., I'm like, well, you're gonna get hit by cars. Like, that's that's just I've been doing it for it's going to happen. Twenty five years here. I've been hit by two cars and that's coming. So, you know, do you want to learn if you're not good at is this where you want to learn where you know, even if you're great, you're gonna get hit by cars?

It's risk reward. But every time one of my friends, especially like as we've all had a bad injury and so many of my friends are like, oh, that's it, I'm done. I will never do this again. I'm getting a real job. And, you know, maybe a year, maybe five years goes by and then they come right back and right about the time that they're gone. This is so awesome. This is the greatest thing ever.

I'm on fire. Two months later, they're gone. Ambulance out. So every time I feel like I'm having a really great day, it's like we'd never say one last time. Not like, you know, not we're good enough.

So that kind of happen to you, right? So you left the X Games for a minute. You didn't compete in freestyle for a few years, right? You took a few years off. Yeah. Basically racing cars. So X Games started with me. I stopped racing motocross basically and went more just strictly to freestyle. And we had Nitro Circus starting up and we were traveling around the world with our best friends. You know, we met up with Jai Knoxville.

They got a show on MTV. Also, we got a live tour that's going on. I'm like, this is great. Like, you know, I love X Games, but every time I went there, it was like, I'm either going to be carted out of here. I'm leaving here with metal or on a stretcher. Yeah. And it's gonna be either gold or could it be stretch or so. And I think the best attitude to have.

But I was able to kind of start where this nitro circus, when we traveled around the world and had all my best friends, that's where I met my my wife. She was only skater that could do a. Gigantor ramp, which is the big Virk thing, and she's doing five Forty's and the general, there's not a lot of girls that can go out to a motocross track all day. We always forget to bring any food or water, anything.

It's hot or dirty. And we're loving life. And most girls are like, yeah, no, this is not where I parked. My car is not my scene. So when I found Lindsay, I was I was pretty stiff and just a really awesome human being. Yeah, it's pretty special. You guys found each other. OK, so you're an entrepreneur. Did you think you would be. Have you always had an interest? So really quick.

For anyone who wouldn't know, like Tony Hawk took this thing. He was a skateboarder. He was with Paul Burrell. He had a clothing line. He then had a board. Then he had this. Then he had a video game. You know, he was really, really good at building a humongous brand around that sport. And you've done the exact same thing. Were you setting out to do that? No. I mean, I just basically went off what my dad said and said, have as much fun as you possibly can everyday.

If it's not what you love to do, then it's not worth doing. So basically, I took all the wrong business decisions every time that I had money over here and I had what I wanted to do over there. I always went with that. Every time I had, like, for instance, what I'm most known for his friend doing a double backflip at X Games, but I think it is. So I still have kind of a motocross Supercross career potentially that that I can do.

That's where I'll try make the most money. I want to go to car racing and I've spent almost every dime that I made to that point, trying to chase this dream, thinking that I can I can drive cars and it ends up working out. But Colum McRae, who is one of the greatest rally drivers of all time, comes over. He's world champion, comes over to the United States, which we're known as, not very good drivers, even though I feel like NASCAR guys are absolutely amazing in IndyCar.

They just don't have a lot of respect on the world stage for whatever reason. So when Colin comes over, it's my third year in rally. No one even knows I'm driving cars. I spent every dime I've had trying to do this. And I get out there and I'm sitting second one tenth of a second behind world champion legend Colin McRae. And with one stage left to go, I have best trick. So in between the rally stages and the final stage, four X Games is Moto best trick.

I'm sitting third place with a trick that I had and I'm eight for 10 in the foam pit. I know if I crash like I'm try breaking my neck and I have my whole rally team there. I have my future that I've just spent everything that I've had trying to get into rally, knowing that I've already have a medal here. And what do I do? I just say, you know what? I'm going I'm not going to regret not trying.

I haven't learned it and worked out where this.

You write a scenario like that is so wild. OK. Now building the business. So you take Nitro Circus and you travel the world. You do like arenas. Am I right about that? Yeah.

I mean, down in South Africa, we're putting on shows with fifty thousand people sell out stadiums. Fifty thousand. Yeah. Here we were mostly like smaller, like MGM Grand Arena. That kind of stuff. We did the O2 Arena in London. We sold it out two nights in a row. Stuff like that. Went over to Australia and like Brisbane, Adelaide, we can usually do three to four nights complete sell out. So fifteen thousand a night, which is, you know, but that culture down there.

New Zealand, Australia, Western Canada too. Obviously, it's just more more action. Sports. Yeah. I was shooting a movie in New Zealand. I was like, I think I should have lived here. It's awesome. You can drive a jet boat on this little course.

They just put you in just way too much horsepower. And then Street by Tommy, another guy who has absolutely no business being in anything. They gave him, like literally he's doing like one hundred on this little jet boat.

You're going one hundred miles an hour and the track is ending in nine feet. And the guy's not lifting. No, you have to give it more throttle.

That's the street like Tommy. He went in at one hundred. Let go the throttle.

It was straight. And the problem is you flip on to land. So it's a field and they cut his little water trenches. But what do you start crashing? You flip onto the view.

Yeah. In a boat. Yeah. You're a boat barrel rolling. Yeah. And then Monica, the guy's going a hundred and they track is ending, like I say, in a couple dozen feet. And he just fucking whips the steering wheel. One eighty floors it even more. And you are like that going the other direction. Oh wow. It's the most surreal. Yeah.

It doesn't feel possible what happens in those. And we were driving. It was not possible. How many shows a year does Nitro Circus put on live shows. Well this year none. No, I. We were up to about 70 shows a year. And just trying to figure out the business plan. What's interesting, because when you're touring, it depends on if you can do more than one night in the same arena. Yeah. Good. Good.

Profitable. Yeah. So you have to go through and establish what Nitro Circus is. So anyway, that we had a TV show, people knew the name Nitro Circus, like Australia, New Zealand, like we were we came out with that movie. It got like two two percent on Rotten Tomatoes here in the US. And no one even though was out. And Australia are second to The Bourne Ultimatum, so there's not that many people over there, but still.

So without trying to count your money for you, which is a hobby of mine. Oh, what percentage of your income is Nitro Circus traveling live like? Are you nervous about how long it may be before that you can do that.

Yes. So what's really interesting was so we had kind of a world championships for the big air of action sports. If X Games and the Olympics are, you know, kind of standardized ramps, let's make it fair across the board. Nitro Circus is how big can we go? How far can we fly? And let's make the landings a little bit safer so we hopefully don't have anyone get injured kind of deal. Like, it's not logit, it's to an airbag.

It still hurts. And yes. Now doing two more flips than anywhere else in the world.

I could give a shit about that. Well, we we we just while I was showing her some clips of your stuff before we talked to you and I saw a bunch of airbag landings where I still absolutely mind blowing. That's horseshit.

Yeah. I mean, so many are on. Our goal is to push the limits and to do it as safely as possible. But whales, this year was the first time we had it outside of Salt Lake City and that was canceled. We had 70 shows that are now probably end up doing 20. It's not a good time to be in live entertainment. Yeah. And now with nature rallycross. So I'm kind of leading the nature rallycross charge, which is actually building my own facility just to prove that we can have huge jumps, that we can do it safely.

But I want to be able to have full control, creative control over the track. And I want to have the best drivers out there building a track that the challenges the drivers, because we've had a nitro circus not to take a step out, but when the athletes are having fun, the crowd's having fun. You could do the exact same show. You could do a better show. But if the energy of the athletes aren't there, it doesn't come across in.

And that's the NASCAR and all these sports. They're amazing, but they're so focused on winning. I want to bring it back where they're actually a little scared of the check there. Talladega rights, unless we get huge jumps. You get a time stuff. Now you're instead of just thinking, I want to win, you're thinking I'm scared. So just more challenging. Hopefully more fun. That's the goal. But so I'm kind of spearheading that. And so Ken Block, who's also trying to build up Rallycross and trying to figure out how to make this go bigger.

He doesn't want to say he doesn't want to do anything, but he's like, I've done every huge stunt I've ever dreamt of. And I feel like I'd do anything else. I'm going to die. Yeah. Like, what more can I do? So he passed the torch to me this year. So Gymkhana, which is one of the they shut down the Golden Gate Bridge. They shut down the 10 one to one freeway for him to drift around and do know pain.

He destroyed so universal. The entire studio was fucked up with tire marks. I was working there and I got to work after that weekend after they shut it down. Is the whole place was rubber.

And I'm like, what happened here? Oh, what other thing do. But really good time. So my goal is to build Rallier. Can you have all the best rally drivers in the world plus DAX Shepard in this thing?

Yeah. Sign up, man. Let's make it happen. So we let's advertise is all of the best drivers in the world. Okay. Driver DAX ever. That's exciting.

The electric cars coming out zero to 60 in under a second. Now they're going to they're thinking about doing not minivan's, but like smallish movies. Yeah. All the companies are asking for, like you mentioned, up like a minivan doing 016 under a sticker that's like a spastic drag car wheel drive. It's going to be awesome.

Yeah, you're probably pulling like four GS if you go nuts.

That's it. It's amazing. My goal is to continue progressing the sport. Continue having fun. I feel like I'm passionate about it. If I love it, then everything I'm investing is even if it doesn't succeed, it's still been an amazing life and it's still showing my kids not that I work per say, but, you know, you're up early. You travel. You're always working. You're working hard at hardly working. Yeah. Yeah, that's it.

But now, if I'm being too nosy, tell me. But if you add your pi, it's all the money you make in the year. What is from your endorsements? Is that the bulk of what you make or is it the Nitro Circus touring show or is it something else? I don't even know about. No, it's probably sponsors and that kind of stuff. So my wife always has a very difficult time, even though she's in the same thing.

Like she skates to Wainer, too. So she's looking at what it's going to gain, you know. She's a mom now and there's a lot. She won the world championship last year. She was 19 at 30 years old. So it was like a half lifetimes that she won at the time. Of course, I'm so, so proud of my life. But I was going down and I was filming this video and I put in eight hundred thousand dollars of my own money, which didn't get pretty much any of it back because the industry's just not big enough to really support that just because I was chasing these jumps on these tricks.

And Lindsay's like like, what are you doing? Like, this is are kids college fund.

What a fucking circus.

Being married to you. Does the sports. It's also like, no, I'm going to become a NASCAR driver and blow X amount of money.

Oh, everyone's like, why do you quit NASCAR? I'm like literally I wasn't good enough. And I raced to. I didn't want to ask you one question, but I've had this experience where I'm like, fuck, being craziest isn't good enough.

Yeah, that that was NASCAR. So imagine this. You race motocross your whole life or freestyle. You can take that little extra risk. You can. So for those, you know, like in a warped section is like a whole bunch of bumps that you have to touch your front and back, tired every single one, or you flip over the handlebars, but you can shift up, close your eyes, wheelie, and make a whole second. I know it doesn't sound like a lot, but you can make a second every lap to the wolves if you just are willing grazing all the dice.

Yeah, pretty much. So there's always that. And then like rally, it's snowing. There's a 100 foot cliff on the right side, trees on the left.

So if you'll take out more risk, you can be faster. Right. But if the walls weren't there and was a cone, everyone would be doing that corner a second faster. Yeah, but because there is the potential, a lot of guys slow it down. That's where I can usually step up and say, look, I know that this is my ability level and I can make up time if I need to push there. So with NASCAR and with any pavement, really, you can't make up time by being crazier.

You have to be a technician. You can't get in trouble. You have to be a computer. You have to drive. You have to break at the exact same point every single time. And you got you know, it's I it's very technical. I was like a 10 to 13 place NASCAR nationwide driver, but I crashed a lot more than I should have because when you're running tends to 13 place two hours into the race, you're thinking there's nine guys that are going faster than me.

Like, obviously, I should be going faster. So you just got to run out of patience, like, you know, that's as far as you go. Jimmie Johnson once said he said, if you think you're going slow, you are. If you think you're going fast, you're not. And if you think you could have possibly gone a little quicker, you could get used to that.

I mean, does it make sense? But I'm sure it does intuitively somehow. OK. Robbie Madison, that guy's special, right? Yeah. I think he did something that no one really did. I think he made an art form out of this. Like, I showed my wife the one where he rode a motorcycle in the ocean and it's mother fucker rode a dirt bike out into the ocean and rode a wave. There's some art form of his or some elegance to him that's so special.

Well, what's awesome about Matto is Matto was a top racer. He raced with Chad Reid like he was one of the best amateur motocross years that really came out of Australia. And then he gets into freestyle and he's like, man, I just I have so much more fun doing this. And then he has a couple of really bad injuries and he's chasing this. And he was at one point the best, but he never won like the X Games because he always got hurt or something came up.

So he started working. And he's like, what? My passion about, you know, he has a wife and couple of kids now. And it's funny because he's actually taking on not more risk per say, but things that seem like more risk. He jumped the shark, will architrave. He did. Unbelievable. But he takes the time, so he'll do one stunt a year. And when he dropped into the wave, he jumps in the jaws on a dirt bike riding off the back of a barge, hits this and he's got a full riding gear and everything.

You're like, oh, gosh, like you're going to trial if you fall off it. And he did crash. He was good. He's good. But everything that he does now, he's very methodical, usually don't get hurt doing the stuff. That's the craziest because you've thought of everything through. And he really gives it the time to make sure that he's gotten all of his I's and cross all those T's. And that's why Mattos is successful.

But he is in situations where you can't inch towards your goal. So to triumph stunt. What's he going to build? Sixty five AACTA Triumph's on his way up to that level where he finally jumps that high and lands like at some point there's a leap of faith. Maybe, maybe I'll guy maybe there's a way to inch up.

What are you promoting currently for me, just trying to get a little bit more support for basically I'm starting the track because I want to stay home in Maryland more. I've been traveling so much and especially now during this quarantine. I think, man, I have so much time with my family that, yeah, I would have never gotten back. And this is the first time ever I've gotten routine with my wife. And I mean, we're still skating and riding and stuff, but we're doing it here at home.

And homeschooling was a little difficult with off with the two kids. I was so bad at it, dude. Yeah, I was the PE teacher, so Lindsay took them so that I was OK. Just take you do the fun stuff that I always wanted to do anyway. But what I really got out of this and what I really want to do is push action sports. So many people want to come over and they want to learn backflips, they want to do stuff.

And I believe we can help people do this stuff safer. We can help the next generation come up. I mean, right now, video games are taking over the world, which is great, but kids aren't getting outside as much. And for me, like I grew up outside, I love being outside. My kids love go karts. They love BMX. They're always doing something, you know, trampolines. So I want to build this park where my wife, she works the Women's Sports Foundation, and she can help coach kids.

And my kids can come out there. We can go kart. So went down this huge road, spent quite a bit of money trying to figure out. Closest spot to my house that we could build this amazing facility that I could just work side by side with my wife, that we weren't going to be touring as much, but that was still help Nitro Circus and really help show what this rallycross track could be and help the Olympic training facility where we're bringing some of the top athletes from all around the world to come train there, which is I think would be fun for the community.

But there's Queen and Conservative Association, which is Queen Anne's County. They're basically a political activist group that is an antigrowth group. And they have a lot of money and they could not get one single person in the town of Selders Ville, Maryland, to oppose this. Everyone in the town wants it real. Seven people over in their county that were willing to go and they're filing every single thing they can file and basically trying to prolong this so we can't break ground for two, three years.

So if you live on the Eastern Shore. Well, well, today, like, I think it's gonna be an awesome thing for the community, for the state and hopefully for the United States in general, where you have all these other athletes coming in from all over the world, all of them, to come kick our butts. But, yes, it's it's going to be a lot of fun. So hopefully the Laks up on this and we'll we'll get the message out that it's not building a motocross track is going to be all dusty where we're working with electric.

We're trying to keep the noise down a little work within the town. But I just want to stay home, a family.

Let me ask you, because I'm an addict and a recovering one. And so I love drugs and I love all this stuff. I think there's an HBO Sports I watched on it. There's a very high rate of dudes in extreme sports that end up being meth addicts or opiate addicts. I'd imagine both the needing a thrill at all times would make you a nice candidate for that. And then all these surgeries. What's been your relationship with, like opiates and all that stuff?

Luckily for me, it opiates make me sick. Like, I hate like I have to come out of a seizure, like, I'd rather tolerate the pain. So I guess it's a blessing for the sports that we do for sure. Most of the action sports guys that I know that have gone down that road, it's been their back or they have something as a disc or something that just nags and they can't sleep. So they start with the sleeping pills.

And then when they start taking the sleeping pills, something clicks, something goes off, and then it's the opiates and the sleeping pills or it's the the alcohol and then the concussions on top of that. It's not a good mix for sure. And then plus one of the hard things is like one of my cousins is actually a the only smart guy in our family. He's a teacher. And he goes, I want to see like 60 Minutes on you guys, like at the end of like when we're about to die, when they do something on like that generation, the last of the like the crazy daredevil generation.

Yeah. Like what happens to you guys when you have kids? Like my wife, for instance, when she was 16, she was a snowboarder and a skater and she stayed with a 17 year old that was making a million dollars a year. And his brother and like a couple other people that are between the ages of 14 and 770, was the oldest kid in the house saying that living at Mammoth Mountain, you know, you're making less money travelling the world.

Best friends, you know, they find the parties, they find all this stuff. Everything comes to him so easily. And then at twenty five, you're beat up, you're hurt. You really you can't even stand up. Your knees are jacked up. You couldn't even get a job at McDonald's because you like standing all that time. You just can't physically do it. And then all of a sudden you're finding what minimum wages and what construction paychecks are.

And this is your lifestyle is so different. And then the only way to get that adrenaline rush, because you're not all the city not be able to afford the motorcycles and the cars and the the fun times. And that's kind of where that depression and the no sleeping and then the the I need some way to get that feeling back. So in my opinion, that's what I've seen.

Well, that's the thing that leads to depression. You have camaraderie and you're in a community and then you leave that community when you stop doing that sport. And that's like these football players, they all get depressed and they don't miss the money and they don't miss fame. They miss the camaraderie.

I agree 100 percent with that. Do you drink? Yes. OK, good. Only drink. Do you drink a lot. You know, when you've felt a little doctors things. Yes. Want one beer week. Five beers a week. Alcoholic.

You're like, did you see this? I love it.

So I just had to answer that question recently and I always lie. Oh, you do. I do. I don't want to be like, you know, say you drink six days away. Yeah.

A fairly socially. Yes. So we travel a lot. There's a lot of everyday. So I have first class. The booze is free. You would be in ways that.

Well, Travis, you rule. I want to hang out with you.

We usually go on a policy that's no new friends. But I think with our kids being the same age as liking the same stuff. This is gonna be great.

All right. Well, I adore you and I'm excited to come to your compound. I think about it all the time. Every single time I look at your Instagram page, I'm like, when will I get to drive on that wooded, beautiful track? It's so Gord, how many acres are you on? Well, the interesting thing is we had a neighbor that had twenty eight. And we had a motocross track on his property when I was like 12.

And then there was one hundred acres that got broken up into 20 acre parcels. And there's one military guy and the rest of us are motocross. And the military guy is awesome. So he flies his helicopter overalls all the time. So it's just for being right outside. We're 60 miles outside of the D.C. Beltway. And we are in the middle of redneck heaven. Yeah. Wow.

But where you go get your groceries, do you get sweated all the time there? No. Marilyn's probably the place to get recognized at least. I feel like Action Sports is like fight club. Like you don't speak about Fight Club during that MGB time was a little different. Yeah. Yeah. Pretty much everyone like anyone that has a flat brimmed hat or, you know, any moto thing or fox or whatever, you just get you get a little nuts.

Yeah. Yeah. All the way to the airport everywhere. When you go to sit down at a restaurant dinner, you always have like a free drink shows up from someone up. That's good. It doesn't really help that drinking earlier, but, you know, it's like I'm in that perfect spot.

All right, Travis. Well, again, I adore you. You I feel emasculated when I watch you do things. You're braver than I. You're more talented than I am now.

I'm so glad we got to talk. Thank you so much for having me on. Yeah. Next time we talk, hopefully I'll be able to actually speak. Perfect. Perfect. Round two where people can hear you. Right. Thanks. All right. You. Good to see you.

Stay tuned for more armchair expert, if you dare. We are supported by square. We love them, we use them both as consumers and as merchants. Now, you might know squares that little white card reader, but Square has a lot more tools that can help businesses, especially now that businesses are having to figure out when and how to safely reopen and make things work in this new normal. But businesses are stepping up to the challenge, like Cafe Reyna, also known as the Arrow in Portland, Oregon, owned by Erika Escalante.

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And now my favorite part of the show, the fact check with my soulmate Monica Padman.

Monica just talking the mikes nine feet from her. I forgot how to do that. You were just talking about watching Ocean's Eleven without me yesterday. Yeah. My young son is in town weekly and a shockingly weekly had not seen oceans.

I can not believe that I go neither. He's seen every movie. That's a big one to leave off, he said. Yeah.

But it's one of those famous movies I just have not seen. Is there any you've not seen like really famous ones. And I can't think of one really.

I don't think so. There has to be. You haven't seen.

Oh, this is ripe for an argument over what famous is. Have you seen my best friend's wedding? No. That's a very famous movie. Moderately successful.

Maybe like one hundred million. Oh my God. It's one of the most famous romantic comedies of all time. I believe you.

What is it? Someone's a wedding planner. No, that's the wedding.

Oh, and see that I know my best friend's wedding is Julia Roberts and Jay. Rob and Dermot Mulroney. Or Dylan McDermott. Now, Dermot Mulroney. Yes. And they're best friends. But they had this pact that they'll eventually get married. That kind of love, the way they've best friends forever.

And then he gets engaged. And so she kind of tries to sabotage Cameron Diaz. Oh, she tries to sabotage.

And at the end, she she basically surrenders and they get married.

It was one of the first romantic comedies for The Girl doing the boy. Yeah. That, like, flipped the end on its head. It is one of my top is up there with Ocean's Eleven.

Oh my gosh. Really. How many times have you watch it. Forty thousand. OK. I was guessing at how many times you'd seen Ocean's. I was telling Aaron it's like one of your top five. And I guess 40 times 40.

Yeah, way more than that. I yuans I use sets two times a year since it came out.

I don't think you understand how my life. I know you don't know. When I was a young gal I would watch. So much TV in movies and like, I would just all every night put something on. Yeah. And generally if I was attached to something at the time, it would be the same thing for like a month. Yeah. So I watched Ocean's Eleven every day.

You think like 40 times the first year for sure. And then I watched it on commentary like the same amount.

Oh wow. You're a true fan. It was. It was Brad. Yep.

Matt clone doctor. That's right. Yeah.

They were all in the commentary. I loved the commentary because like. Oh my God. But will hunting commentary as Ben and Matt. I could probably recite the commentary as much as I could recite the movie.

But what's your favorite part of the commentary?

Well, they talk about Robin, but this is before Robin died. But they talk a lot about they love them and how they wrote it for him. And that's just one part. There's many good parts. Yeah, I love the commentary. So much of these movies, especially these boy movies, because I felt like they were talking to me. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, sure. I felt like I was in on one of the real conversations.

Right. Amy, so many p q of course.

Of course. You were probably all a Titor. Big time, big time flustered.

Have you ever watched the commentary. Oh yeah.

My favorite movie Thief, which I've seen in excess of 200 times. I've listened to that commentary several times, but it's disappointing it. And I don't really want to get into why, because I would be publicly shaming one of the persons involved. But I just I held the movie and in this same esteem. Yeah.

I'm sorry that happened to you with the commentary. Thank you.

Thank you. I like extras, too. I use some really like extras. I think I've talked down here about anyone who wants to be a filmmaker. Should just watch the extras on Miller's Crossing so that you can hear Barry Sonnenfeld, who was the Coen brothers DP for, I don't know, five movies, the first five movies. He gives a tutorial on lenses and what they do. And as part of this extra and it's like it was like going to film school.

I'm like, oh, I understand lenses completely now. Yeah, that's nice.

It is nice. Yes, I see. So into something that you just want to consume. Every single element. You know, it's funny in the Sarah Marshall commentary. Yeah. Kristen isn't there but she like calls in for a little portion of it. Oh OK. Yeah. And that's before I knew or when I saw that.

Right. Right. We were just newly dating at that point. She was poly driving to your house. Oh my God. Oh my. Wow. Wow. There's a funny story in there, but it's embarrassing to me. But tell it, OK?

I was in baby mama. They came out back to back and baby momma had a date. And then Christine said Judd said he's he wants that date. Same studio. Oh.

And I said, well, I don't think they're gonna move a Tina Fey movie off a date. And guess what?

They they moved the date. Oh, man.

Is funny. I was trying to flex on behalf of Tina and I just like.

By proxy. Flex. Flex by proxy. Yeah. It didn't pan out my favor. It was really embarrassing. The movies are fantastic.

I loved Sarah Marshall. Yeah.

Yeah. Heads a great movie. It is a great, great movie. I, of course, is in love with Jason Segel. Yeah, of course he is. Bunnies and the Muppets. Yeah. Those are cute characteristics. Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of Intel, I didn't finish can.

There was one thing I was trying to say. Yeah. The Jerry Weintraub documentary is really fantastic. People should watch it. I think. I think it's on HBO or Showtime. Very interesting guy. He had been the manager, I want to say, of like Led Zeppelin. He was like the Colonel Sanders of not Colonel Sanders. That's Kentucky Fried Chicken. Colonel Parker, Elvis is kind of a puppeteer. Oh, I don't want to say he was a puppeteer, but he was he was very involved.

And Led Zeppelin's life in Sinatra's life. He made the original oceans with. Yes. Sinatra and Dean Martin and all these guys.

And then, you know, late in his career, he puts together Ocean's Eleven with that cast, which he didn't know at the time, really have kind of capital to do that.

That makes sense. Thanks.

Well, he hadn't had, like, hit movies for a long time, but he was a he's a legend. Totally a legend. Yeah. And weirdly enough, I went very early on. Shauna Robertson, Kristen's friend and a good friend of mine, invited me to his house in Malibu for a party.

And I'm like walking around this house and it is on like 10 acres on the ocean. The house is enormous. And I'm like, what the fuck did this guy do? Why is this guy so loaded? I go to the shitter and there's like two dozen gold records in the shitter.

Oh, Zap, Led Zeppelin, Zep and all these other ones. And I went, oh, OK. That's why this guy is a 50. Million dollar house. Any who. The way he put together the new Ocean's Eleven was he called Brad Pitt. Yes. You know this, right? Yeah. And he said, hey, I just got off the phone with George Clooney and Matt Damon. They want to make this movie Ocean's. We're going to go and they want you in it.

And Brad's like, wow. Well, they're in it. Great. And then he called. He said, I just got off the phone just like all them. But it worked out beautifully and everyone had a great time.

And sometimes I think that's when you talk about it on the commentary. They did. And they talk about it in the Weintraub document. Yeah, he does lie to everyone. But it worked. And you got to do that, I guess, as a producer on that scale to get that. That can't be done, really. It takes a unique person to get those three top. I mean, those three were at the top of their game. Yeah.

You can't get all three of them on top of their hotness.

Big time, top of their hotness. Angelina robbers. I mean, come on back to Jay, right?

Yeah. As is Cheadle.

Oh, my God. Is it a movie? What a movie. But speaking of MIJ, speaking of Muppets. Yeah. Speaking of Neach. OK.

Well, a little clunky on that transitions. A little while I was going to say thinking of these things for when it made sense, I got.

And now I have to do all this. OK, backtrack and gather any who. Travis Pastrana. Incredibly neach.

Oh sure. Sure, sure. Not not for dudes but yes, for you. Most dudes in America know who travels out of they're not in a motor sport.

You can know who he is and his. You're right. His Occupy. There's not hundreds of people making a living at his. That's right. It's very niche. It's very easy. Right. It is very nice. Yeah. You are in heaven. I was in heaven.

And if this episode served no other purpose than he and I are now communicating or texting each other. And as soon as corvids over Lincoln, I are 100 percent going to his compound. Yeah, right. Raiser's. Yeah. I guess he'll be driving mavericks but we'll be driving raiser's. Yeah. We're a Polaris family.

He is. He's left. Nobody knows any of these words. The five boys that listen to this show, no one. I'm talking to different manufacturers of theirs. There's three or four manufacturers of side by side. Stevie's employers is number one. They're the best. They're the best. They're the most reliable, best performance.

Everything a competing one that's really good is Canada. And they make a maverick. And Travis has gone to the dark side. OK. Also, if you own a maverick, I love you and I'll see you in the doing. So no shade, but I'm a player. Okay? I bleed RCR. Continue. Oh gosh.

Glassblowers ok. OK. OK.

So speaking of lingo that nobody knows. So a couple times you guys were talking about 120 fives and you said some other numbers and stuff. And you can just tell people now in case they've been waiting on bated breath to find out what that means. Well, I bet they're like you. And they just filed it in the white noise. Yeah. They had no interest. And they don't want an explanation. But I'll tell. I'll give you one.

OK. So an internal combustion engine works on the principle that there is a piston inside of a cylinder, OK? That piston goes up in the air and it compresses the fuel inside. And when it gets compressed, it makes it combustible. Then a spark goes off and explosion happens and the piston comes down. Now, the volume of that cylinder is measured in CCD in motorcycle's. So a 125 means there's one hundred and twenty five species of volume in the cylinder.

Got it. And then the step up from that would be 250. So there's two different classes in motocross. Back when they were two struck. That's a longer conversation. But in general, the original internal combustion engines were two-stroke, meaning the piston went up and compressed. That was one stroke it that ignited, exploded and went down and got rid of the exhaust in one. Now, the way your car engine works and now the current motorcycle's is there's four strokes.

There is compression, ignition, exhaust. And I'm forgetting one. But there's four process to get the gas in and the gas out as opposed to processes to get the gas in and out. Wow. Two strokes had this crazy power band. There were slow. And then also and they're outrageously fast. They're hard to predict now. Force trucks are just a very even power band. You just learn how glad I am.

It was a tutorial in any way, internal combustion engine on something new every day.

So back to why it was relevant is he was doing all of his stunts on a 125. Right. Half the displacement of the guys he was competing against. They had way more horsepower. Yet he was still winning. That's that's only reason it was worth bringing up. Yeah.

OK. So the one part where my ears perked up. No. Plenty of times my ears perked up. OK. They got really perked when you were asked talking about the foam pad. Oh. Aha.

And I obviously know so much about foam. Big from your chair back. Exactly. And then he was saying that it started at Woodward camp, which you knew about. I knew that because when I was younger, my best friends to my best friends were gymnasts for high level gymnast K, and they went to woodwork camp every day. I have to imagine a little paper to.

It's got to be costly to go to war. I'm sure it's not. All right. I'm sure it's not cheap. I hope they have a scholarship program.

Me, too. Yeah, I hope so, too. I've seen a couple HBO Real Sports about how costly like Little League Baseball's gotten. All these different sports were like to be competitive. You're expected to spend the summer at one of these camps and then the travel team and the hotel expenses.

It's like, you know, it could be fifty thousand dollars a year. You play Little League, which is if you're a poor kid. I don't know how you compete.

I now know what the solution is that Zindagi outlaw all that crab or scholarship. But I don't know. But it's it's not fair. I think scholarship.

Yeah. Even in high school, like it's expensive for cheerleading the uniforms, the this, the that. It really does add up. And if you don't have the money, well you're screwed. The only reason I'm not in the NHL currently is we didn't have money for me to do hockey and have ice time. I know I would have been in the NHL. Oh my gosh.

Retired 12 years ago to be depressed and I'd be back on the bottle.

That's the truth. Call my teammates. You guys want to get together?

Mm hmm. Yeah, we found management jobs with teams. And you did.

OK, so he you said that risk takers don't have as much AMAYO in their brain. Heyo are a family of enzymes that catalyze the oxidation of monola means montaño no means employing oxygen to clip off their Amien group. And Mayeux A is a logical enzyme to investigate in depression because it regulates levels of all three major mono amines serotonin nor epinephrine and dopamine in the brain. That's the one I always forget.

Noro apparat friend Bonneau Nora Ephron.

You always forget Nora. I. And then she was wonderful. Yeah, she was okay. Because of the vital role that embryo's play in the inactivation of neurotransmitters, MCO dysfunction, too much or too little is thought to be responsible for a number of psychiatric and neurological disorders. For example, unusually high or low levels of embryo's in the body have been associated with schizophrenia, depression, 8D, substance abuse, migraines and irregular sexual maturation. AMAYO Bee research suggests that high sensation seeking reaches into every aspect of people's lives, affecting engagement in risky sports, relationship satisfaction before and during marriage.

Tastes in music, art and entertainment. Driving habits of food preferences. Job choices and satisfaction. Humor, creativity and social attitudes. Oh, wow.

KILGANNON Right again. There's no I mean, I don't think I ever hold any mayo. No, no, no. That's why I haven't said yet the correlation. But that's just saying those are high sensation seeking people, which clearly you are. Right. OK, compared with low sensation seekers, high sensation seekers are more likely to smoke abuse, alcohol, drugs.

Boom bubble a bubble and are more attracted a high stress kircher's. Oh shit. We've been doing all this stupid psychological work and my trauma, my childhood, my background. And clearly it's just that I. Oh, we don't know yet. Having gone there. Well I now lack of Amayo Tom. Okay, you're right.

I'm trying to be risky and guess the ending for the personality trait may have a biochemical basis.

High sensation seekers have lower levels of monoamine, oxidase type B and ends think ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.

An enzyme involved in the regulation of neurotransmitters, particularly dopamine. According to Zuckerman's book, Behavioural Expression's and Biosocial Basis of Sensation Seeking and a research review chapter he wrote in the book Biology of Personality and Individual Differences.

Oh, that book. I also want to use my O levels tests. MLB levels test. Yeah.

Moreover, research Zuckerman published in 1980 determined that sensation seeking, which is higher in men than in women, peaks in the late teens and early 20s and gradually declines with age along with levels of testosterone. MCO, which is low in high sensation seekers, increases with age in the blood and brain. Are you going to tell people that you're on testosterone? I've said it on here several times. Yeah, well, you're on testosterone among testosterone. I am now currently at the levels I should have been at in my late 20s, early 30s.

Might when I got mine tested, my my levels were like in my late 50s, Ray. And I think there's some correlation between physical trauma and reduced testosterone production.

Is my father back to Chip?

My father had like zero testosterone. At a certain point and was on antidepressants. And then he got on testosterone and he no longer needed an in depressants. Yeah, it has a big effect on your mood for a male. That's the thing I like most about it. More optimistic. And a more hungry to work and hungry. I haven't noticed, however, food is affected my food intake. I get so many more steaks. I didn't even like.

Oh, my God. We just because of the NATO member, didn't even like, stay now.

I've never liked it my whole life. And then two years ago, I'm like, I'm going to try every single steak and see which one I like. And then I become like a steak. A file.

Oh my gosh. That's definitely the T.

I think I like sports more. Do. Oh my God. OK, so you said you say oh, you said you're definitely gonna get hit by Kapi.

You drive a motorcycle, which I didn't like. The most common motorcycle accident happens when a car makes a left turn in front of you. Yeah. This is the single most dangerous situation. A motorcyclist accounting for 42 percent of all accidents, including a motorcycle and car. Yeah.

You got to really be ultra focused when you're going through intersections.

I'll add, though, L.A. is a really big U-turn town, and that's where most of the people I think the PCH is the deadliest road in Los Angeles County. And generally, it's it's knuckleheads making a fucking U-turn.

They've parked at the beach and then they make a U-turn across like six lanes.

And a lot of motorcyclists have just been cruising down the road and also in some knucklehead bus, a U-turn out of nowhere.

OK, well, this is a scary paragraph about to read. OK. The NHTSA reports that that 13 cars out of every 100000 are involved in a fatal accident. But motorcycles have a fatality rate of 72 per 100000.

OK, so that's six. That's five times. Yeah.

Funtime Motorcycles are also at a greater risk of a fatal accident per mile. Traveled for every mile traveled motorcycles have a risk of a fatal accident that is 35 times higher than a car driver. In 2004, there were thirty seventh out, 2004.

Who cares? Well, motorcycles sales have declined. So maybe 2004 was maybe like peak motorcycle ownership. Oh, all right. Well, the millennials don't give a shit about motorcycles.

Sadly, they don't give a shit about any motorsports, sadly. I mean, it's good. It's good ultimately for the environment, I suppose.

Yeah, that's true. That's true. OK, so he talks about an electric car that's gonna go from zero to 60 in a second. And then you said that probably hits four GS. Huh. It actually hits two point seven three five GS to go zero to 60 in one second.

Yeah, that's bonkers. That's what drive cars did in the day. Back in the day.

It says right now none of this is you. You'll know more than me about this.

But it said that the Faster 060 is in a Tesla in Ludicrus mode. Well, this is the book Godi Varan. Yeah. Yeah. Kairouan.

They ran and they ran. Supersport are capable of a zero to 60 time of 2.5 seconds. They currently have the fast zero to 60 time of any production car.

Yeah, that's a one point four million dollar car and it has a double U engine instead of a V. And it has four turbochargers on it and it has like three or four radiators and it makes over a thousand horsepower and it's four wheel drive.

Oh my. It is insanely fast. I was at the auto show one year. Yeah. I went solely to see the vé wrong. Hey, I'm into them. Yeah. And I was looking at it through the ropes. They asked if I wanted to come look closer. So of course I said yes he did. I'd be more mad at myself for saying no. Okay. So I was now I'm in the car. Right. And then a guy leans down and he works through Bugaldie and he says, you can drive this thing.

And I said, absolutely. And he said, OK, meet me at this Beverly Hills dealership in a couple days. Oh, I think at the time there was only four in the country. Wow. And we went out on Burton way and I just did whole shots from light to light. And that thing would go. I could get up to like one twenty five between like are other cars on the road. Very minimal. Very safe.

Closed course. Closed course. You know, that means now when people fuck around on Instagram and cars and then they get shamed. Yeah. Some people been arrested. Oh my God. And they'll say closed course. What's that mean? Well, on Top Gear, we'll shut down two miles of Angeles, crest on it, and then we're allowed to do whatever walkers, cops there. Yeah.

So some people post close cause it's not really a closed course.

OK, yeah. And I'll leave it to people to decide.

All right. Well, that's it for Travis. It is. Yeah.

Oh, OK. What did they want to say about him?

Just I don't know. I'm excited to go to his house.

Yeah. What an interesting life. Wonderland or use meekest. One of them. Most unique American life experiences. Yeah. And I truly have no judgment, negative judgment, because I think it's amazing. I like that philosophy of what's the point of living if you're not living the life you want to live? And I also think, oh, my God, could I ever get close to a person like that? Yeah, you said it was a pretty selfish lifestyle afterwards and we had a mini debate about that.

Yeah, and that's fine if that's your choice.

But I do think, though, it's a little misleading because like, yes, I get your point that it's selfish because there's a threat of death. Right. But more often, a huge percentage of America, the the person's dedicated their life to their career, whether it's a lawyer or the CEO or all these different occupations that are like 70, 80 hour week occupations. Yeah. And so you've lost that person to that career in general. You're going to see them on the weekends, but they're stressed.

And Travis. Yes. Has the threat of death looming, but his time is less and he's at home with his family doing this thing.

So you've got to be really granular about what you want out of the relationship, because if it's safety, it could have the illusion of safety, but you could actually have much less of that person's life.

Yeah, that's true.

Everyone's different. And every person probably has a different answer to this. But if I was picking for my dad. Yeah. Would I prefer to have him work at Tinh and see him? Maybe not that much, huh. But feel pretty, pretty confident that he's not risking his life every day.

I would pick that. But, you know, it's funny because this is kind of your parents. What do you mean? Like, this is kind of the lens that your parents look at life, which is just like of safety.

But there's so many elements to safety. Like is safety. Emotional safety is safety.

Totally connection. And yeah, intertwined lives and is a physical safety. Now, I can tell you one thing I'm judgmental of in the way that you are, that I am not judgmental.

I'm not judgment. I really am not. I think whatever works, what works for him and his family, I think that's lovely. Yes. And I don't think you're making a character assessment of him. When I say judge mental. I'll say I'm judgmental of something I've noticed recently occasionally when I'm traveling. So I would never watch it in the home. My wife wouldn't allow it. I want my kids to necessarily see it. But I'll watch like three hours a you see you when I'm at a hotel.

And I've noticed the last couple of times I watch it that the fighters bring their kids. And I don't like that. I don't think a six year old should be watching their parent get bloodied to all hell and the fight having to be stopped. And I mean, I just format.

Yeah. I can't see how that's not traumatic. Now, I imagine the fighter is so confident about the contest that they're going to win in their mind. They're gonna be dominant and their child's gonna be proud of them. That has to be what they tell themselves. And 50 percent of the people in the ring are going to lose. Yeah. No matter how confident they are, that's just going to happen. And so half of the kids that go are going to watch their parent get obliterated.

And it's got to be very scary. Yeah. Not fun to watch.

So I don't. But they love that, too. Yeah. I wonder if he if they have a rule that, like, the family doesn't watch him do those stunts unless they know they like they worked out and then they can see him after the fact, but maybe not on the day watching the big stunt maybe. Yes. And I think seeing it has an added level of trauma, but there's a innate sense of insecurity you grow accustomed to. If your parent is putting their life on the line every day, that goes for military families, too.

It's the situation where it's like you go to bed at night and you're just not sure.

Yes. But I don't think any Navy SEAL would want their child to be watching the raid of Osama bin Laden's compound.

Leive. Right. No. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. Regardless of whether you see it or not, you you are then forced and you're forced as a child. You don't get to make this decision. You're right that you are now living in a state of some insecurity about the people you care about the most in the world.

And I think that probably has an effect, whether they even realize they probably think their parents are superheroes in some way, like they probably believe even more than the parent that they can do anything. Like that dad's a superhero. Well, which is well, yes. Yes. So it might not be full of anxiety. It might be full of like, oh, he's going to do it again. He can do it. They might not be nervous at all watching it.

But what I'm saying is I wouldn't want them to see when it goes bad.

Right. But he also, like, you know, he has a lot of people in his life who died. Huh. And that I didn't grow up with my parents having a bunch of people have vampires at your dad's job. Exactly. Let's switch from internal programming of like. Yes. This guy that came over two weeks ago is dead now. But you know what? I guess, you know, now that I'm thinking about it, I guess one of the elements that I think appeals to me about it is my endless desire for control.

And in some way, me getting killed by cancer pisses me off. Me getting killed by something I hate. Didn't want didn't sign up for. Versus me dying, doing something that I chose to do that I love. Some about that, to me, that feels better. I, I respect that. And to me, that's a selfish thing to say. Right. Sure. I would prefer you die of cancer, but not next year. No, not next year.

But if I died at 40 of cancer, as people do. And then I hadn't done anything I love because I was afraid of dying. And then this fucking stupid thing got me. Yeah. When I could have been doing everything I loved. Well, it's a balance right out of balance. And I don't think anything. Yeah. You love. I think I'm in the safe side of all these things. Yeah. You know, I'm not trying to set any world records or.

Okay. You just knocked on a wood desk I built.

Yeah. All right. I love you. I love you.