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Hello, Daddy Gang. Welcome to Flash Back Friday for Call Her Daddy. This is something I started to decide to do because I recognize that Call Her Daddy for three years almost has been exclusive to Spotify, and now Call Her Daddy is officially available on all podcast platforms. So some of you may have missed some episodes while I was exclusive. This week, I am rereleasing one of my favorite episodes from the past three years with Rachel Billson. I saw so many of you absolutely loving the Misha Barton episode this week on Call Her Daddy. And so many of you actually DM me being like, Oh, my gosh, please have Rachel Billson on next. I'm such an OC lover. Well, Daddy Gang, lucky for you. Little did you know, apparently, I did have Rachel Billson on. So we are having an OC week. Also, if you have never watched the OC, I highly recommend it as one of my all-time favorite television shows. Daddy Gang, I hope you enjoy this episode with Rachel Billson. I just remember Rachel was such an incredible human being. Her energy She was infectious, and it was just an all-around great episode where we talk about The OC and relationships and sex and dating.


So Daddy Gang, enjoy.


What is up, Daddy Gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper, with Call Her Daddy. Rachel Billson, welcome to Call Her Daddy. Thank you so much for having me. I am a big fan of early 2000s TV shows, and not to freak you out, I am the biggest OC fan. Maybe not ever, but like, ever. Are you serious? I still watch it to this day. You know those shows you go back and rewatch a little? Yes, of course. The OC always through and through to the core. Love it. That's so awesome. So I'm happy to have you on today. Thank you. Very fun.


Thank you. I'm flattered.


For my problematic listeners, you know who you are. If you've never watched The OC, you have to watch it. To give them a little background, it's basically these rich kids living living in Orange County, California. Drugs, sex, relationships, family drama, all the things. And you're doing a rewatch podcast.




Which is amazing. Oh, thanks. What is it like going back to relive the OC phenomenon?


Oh, my God. So it's so interesting. I was 21 when I did the show, and it was my first real big job. Watching it back, honestly, the first few episodes, I had such an emotional reaction. I got depressed. I was like, oh, my God, because it's like 20 years later, basically, right? And I'm like, so much life has happened. What did I do? What did I do?


When you say, what did I do, do you mean in terms of the show or just- No, just life. It's just life.


You're just like, whoa. It's just more like you're basically playing back the last 20 years-ish of your life. And you're like, it's all just going through your mind as I'm watching this because I'm looking at this little pudgy face, 21-year-old with a lot of bronzer on and questionable clothing, which is coming back, which is also very confusing. But I'm watching it just going like, oh, shit. And my boyfriend at the time was on the show with me. And so it brings up all that about life behind the scenes.


When you're that young and you're on a show and you're dating someone on the show and you're the it girl on the show, everyone's obsessed with you. But then you're saying, I'm looking back and that was still me as a young woman, and I'm watching back. So there's emotions for you. Oh, for sure. Yeah. And then everyone still wants to talk about it all the time to you. How does that feel?


Well, you know what? I will say I wasn't like... Misha Barton was obviously the it girl, and she was 16 years old. And I can't even imagine what that would have been like to be 16 that attention in every magazine cover. I still had a lot of anonymity in my own life and my boyfriend, and we were very domesticated and grandparents at the time. We were old people. Newspaper in the morning, same breakfast every morning. It was really- Wait, so you guys were the couple on the show? I feel like that is something like that. You know what? I guess you're right. But Josh Schwartz, the creator, would always take things from your own life and incorporate it into the show. Golden Girls, huge Golden Girls fan. He put it in the show, we'd sing the theme song. So there were so much... You had to be careful around Schwartz, like what you said or did.


Because he's like, That's the next week's episode.




What is the most common question you're asked about your time working on the OC?


I mean, A lot of it was just like, what was it like getting that much attention that quickly and working together and how was everyone on set? I know there's been mixed things out there. We had a great time. We had a lot of fun in general, together, personalities hanging out. But yeah, a lot of the things were like, how did it feel to have that much success that quickly?


It is a unfathomable feeling at that age. I know what I was doing at 21. It was not that. I was drinking in college being a full degenerative it, having sex and making bad decisions with my life. Oh, yeah.


I did that just earlier. But it's still on a a pedestal of people watching you.


And so I'm interested to know when the OC became popular, how did it affect you, your family, your friends?


Well, Like I said, because I was in a relationship, I was definitely on a different track and going through it together. So having that support really made the difference.


Okay, so to anyone that hasn't watched or the OC stands that are just like, just say the name, Summer Roberts, your character, was hot, popular, rich. He was the it girl. And then she starts basically getting into a relationship with Seth Cohen, who was played by Adam Brody. And so you have an on-screen relationship, and then you start an off-screen relationship. When was the moment you knew you had feelings for him?


Oh, my God. It's so funny. I feel like on screen was playing off screen because in the beginning, there was a triangle between another character, Anna Stern, played by Samira Armstrong, and then myself and Seth. And I felt like it played into real life a little bit. Samira and I were both like, wait a minute. I'm like, I like Adam. No, I like Adam. And it was happening off screen. And you know that competitive side of you with a guy and you're like, no, no, no. Hold on. It was like, I don't know if that heightened it. I obviously thought Brody was super cool. I knew him before the show. A friend of ours had dated him, actually. I know. So we knew him a little bit, and he was hilarious. And I'm a sucker for a sense of humor. Absolutely. I mean, that is my weakness.


So was there a moment on set that immediately you were like, I'm going to go for this?


I remember standing in the hallway. Okay, I don't remember anything. And the fact that I remember this is insane. I was standing in the hallway and I was dating someone else at the time, and Brody talked to me about the relationship and gave me advice on why I shouldn't be in it. And it was this moment of like, oh, I want to be with you. And it was this pivotal moment. And there was a Halloween party. I think it was a Halloween party. And he kissed me for the first time, and that was it. It was like, okay.


And that was off camera? That was that kiss you were saying off camera. I'm like, wait, was it Seth and Summer?


But the first time he kissed me on screen, I think that was the first time like, oh, is there something here? But that can be confusing. If you're doing a show or a movie and that happens, sometimes you get confused like, oh, do I really feel this way? Am I feeling something or is it just- Is it true?


I've heard from actors, you can tell a little bit if someone's more into you because there's an appropriate way to kiss a co-star.


There's no tongue in television. If someone tongue you, you're going to be like, Oh, either like, Oh, no, or like, Oh, wait a minute. No, I'm just kidding. No, I'm just kidding.


Did you guys ever do tongue on camera? No.


But then off camera.


No. Okay, wait. So that's really fun. And then do you have any advice for someone who is newly dating someone in their work environment?


Oh my God. Oh, advice. It sounds like I should probably be a pro with my track record. I think that just be friends first, because I think that'll help. Because usually it ends sometimes.


You know what? I love you being realistic about it. We love the realistic side of it. Oh, yeah.


I'm very real, to a fault.


So when you're on set, was there ever an instance where dating someone you're working with, was there ever something that was hard about that aspect?


When we broke up. That's the harder. And then we both dated other people on the show while we were together in real life. So sometimes you can be a little...


I mean, he was kissing- Were you dating people on the show for your characters? The characters, sorry. I was like, Wait, who did you date?


He was like, Kissing Olivia Wilde. And of course, I'm going to be like, well, fuck. But I also get it. Can I kiss her?


Was that when you guys broke up?


No, we were together. We were together while that was happening. That would be a hard one. That's a hard one, right?


Olivia Wild walks in her character. Yeah, you're like, and so cool.


And she's the coolest person in real life, too. So you're like, well, I love her. And you're like, wait a minute. Your boyfriend's kissing her, and then it can be confusing. Yeah, it's just that stuff. But that's normal.


So how long did you guys date for?


I think like three years, three and a half years.


And was that three seasons?


We dated pretty much the whole show.


It was such a huge show that blew up, and everyone was obsessed with you guys, the four people that were the main kids on the show, and to have you being able to have a relationship with someone, to be your rock and your go-to person while your life is changing before your eyes. Oh, for sure. That's, I'm sure, a bond you guys will always have in a cool way.


Yeah. And even reconnecting with him, I spoke to him. He came on the OC podcast. I saw that. Yeah, it was great. I love seeing him. Anytime I might see him, nothing but fond, loving feelings and great memories. So fun. Yes.


Okay, your character. You were so lovable. I'm wondering, how was your personal real life Rachel Billson high school experience compared to the OC? Oh, God. To the OC?


Oh, man. School for me, I wasn't so much an academic, I would say. It just didn't interest me. It's not like I couldn't do it. If I sat down and really studied and focused, I could do it. But my interests were all over the place. And growing up in LA, I think I grew up a little young. At 15, my friends and I, and Olivia was here with me, we'd be getting into the clubs. That's just what life is like.


That sounds like Summer Roberts.


I mean, a little bit. I still remember exactly what I was wearing, where I was, the time of day, who I was with for the season 3 finale. I got the chill.


I've never, and I still have not recovered from it.


I I mean... Spoil alert. You know who hasn't? Marissa.


To anyone that hasn't watched the show, pause and go watch it, please. Spoiler alert. The main character dies. Tragically.


Like, the most tragic...


Like, Fuck you, Volchuk. Okay. But he was so hot. Oh, my God. He was so hot.


Olivia dated him.


Sorry. You've dated him? Oh, my God. Absolutely. As you should. We have someone in the audience, and God bless you. Because I had his poster, this guy, Kam Gajande. Is that how he say his name?


I don't know.


Gajande? Gajande? Yeah. Okay. Well, I was obsessed with him. Anyways, Marissa Dies, Misha Barton's character. What was your reaction when you learned that Misha's character was getting pulled off the show?


It was very traumatic. Everyone felt it. It was so somber on set. Because you're a family, and it is like a family member is leaving or dying, and it was brutal. I mean, still, I can picture it in my mind, and it was traumatizing. Yeah, literally. Yeah. I don't remember behind the scenes, really, the last time she was on set or anything like that, but it was definitely a dark time.


Did you talk to Misha about her decision to leave the show?


I don't think I ever had a personal conversation. Why are you leaving? I think it was a joint decision. I don't think it was her decision, I'm going to leave, or Josh and Stephanie's decision to be like, We're getting... You're being killed off because whatever. I don't know what really happened behind the scenes as far as who made the actual decision. I think that Josh felt like a lot of her story lines had run through. I mean, what else could you put the girl through? She literally overdoses, shoots someone. I mean, every possible storyline was done with that character.


You're right. It didn't seem fitting for her to go. I think it was like she was going to go work on her dad's boat or something. Marissa is not going to work on a boat. No. Absolutely not. She's going to Fashion Week. How did the cast dynamic change for season 4?


Towards the end, I started to work on something else at the same time, simultaneously. I was so distracted that I wasn't really in it all the time presently, so I wasn't feeling all the things.


You had broken up with Adam at the time? Towards the end, yes. Okay. I guess it felt probably like time to move on, like by Season 4.


Yeah, especially working on another project, and it was a film, feeling like, okay, let's this is ending. What's happening? What's next? Totally.


We are both the daughters of therapists, but in your case, you were raised by a sex therapist.


Yes. So my mom's always like, I'm not a sex therapist. I'm more like a sex counselor, whatever. The woman will talk sex to your bloom in the face. As a daughter, your mom's a therapist. Yeah, but just really coming with it, no problem. I remember going on the Wendy Williams show, and I think I used cunilingus, and they had to bleep it out. I'm like, Is that a bad word? What did I say? Because my mom's always like, cunilingus, and all the proper terms. Right.


And you're like, That's what I grew up around.


I'm like, Isn't that what it's called? Oh, sorry. Eating me out? I'm like, Would that have been better, Wendy?


I totally get it. That's, I think, fascinating, where when you grow up, usually you're hiding everything from your parents. You're like, I don't even want them to know. And to be raised by a sex counselor or therapist, how do you think having your mom have that profession impact the way you handled relationships growing up?


It was always a very open household, like nudity, all of it. So feeling really comfortable in your skin, which was great. And talking about it all, the night I lost my virginity, I was very young, and my mom, the next day, sitting me down and being like, Let's talk about sex. I'm like, How did you fucking know? How do you know these things? It was just like that all the time.


She's like, Rachel, you're glowing, sweetie. I know.


She's like, Honey, there was a weird crunchy towel in the bathroom. No, that's not real. Not real. Condoms only. I was very young.


Okay. Okay, so did you then tell your mom in that conversation you lost your virginity?


Yeah, I was like, Yeah, I'm I did it. She's like, How was it? I'm like, It was very quick and whatever.


I mean, who is like, I had the best sex of my life.


My first time?


No, you don't enjoy it. No. You don't even know what your vagina is supposed to feel like.


No, you don't enjoy it. I didn't really enjoy sex until I was much older. I respect you for saying that because I think a lot of women, I've said a lot on my podcast, it's almost like you feel shame if you don't experience an orgasm or you're not enjoying it right away.


And so there's this weird thing. It's the worst thing. And then women don't I don't want to say they're not because I had a lot of teammates. I was on a soccer team in college, and everyone would just be talking about like, oh, my God, I had the best sex last night. And meanwhile, I'm like, out of these 12 girls talking, there's no fucking way every single one of them just had an orgasm last night. No, there's no way.


There's no way.


So it's like you lie about it almost because you're embarrassed and you want to fit in. For sure. And you're like, what's wrong with me? But I love that you're normalizing like, hey, I didn't enjoy sex till later.


I've always been brutally honest. I've never faked an orgasm. I'm not that person to lie to put on airs or whatever it is. It's like, no, never faking it. No, I can't do it. It took a very long time for me to be able to. And I think it's important. Why would you lie?


What is the best sex advice that your mother has given you, AK give it to us? Ak share it with us, Rachel.


Oh, God. I'm trying to think. I mean, she's always very into relaxing, to the point where your first your gyno appointment, envision your vagina opening a flower and take breaths. I'm like, All right, I'll try it. Here comes the rose. You know what I mean? But it's helpful because it makes it so relaxed. Just even having those visuals, which is super weird to some people, can be really helpful. I was 13 the first time I went, and you're young.


It's hard to do that.


Oh, my God. You're so in your head. That's the thing about orgasms, too. You're so in your head, and if you have that pressure or whatever, it's never going to happen.


Never. Ever. It's But it's so hard, and I just want to normalize that it is hard. You're not alone if you're listening and you haven't had an orgasm. Absolutely. You are not alone. No, you're not alone. I feel like in the past, I know I have definitely faked an orgasm. I know friends have.


I feel like most women have that I've spoken to.


I think There's two parts. Number one, maybe if I was in college and I was like, I'm never having an orgasm, I'm going to fucking fake it so it can be over, which I know is so bad, and I don't do that anymore.


There's another way to get them to finish. You say the right things. Absolutely.


Here we go. Oh, my God. Oh, it's great. Yeah, yeah. Here we go. And then I think the other part is, there's also sometimes where I know I'm having such incredible sex, but I just know that I'm not going to get there. And so I'm going to fake it because I genuinely I'm like, You know what? I had great sex, but I'm just going to fake it at the end because he probably is going to keep going because he thinks I haven't finished yet, and I know he can finish, so just go ahead. What do you do, though, if a guy is like, Have you finished? The pressure, how do you tell guys basically, No, I didn't finish?


You know what? I am so honest. I can have great sex. It's hard for me to orgasm, but after all, it's like, Oh, my God. That was great, or whatever you want to say. It felt so good. It's hard for me to orgasm. It has nothing to do with you. Obviously, I think we can get there, or sometimes if you can't, you don't say those things. But if it feels good, you want to give them props.


Obviously, the phenomenon of like, porn and guys being obsessed with trying to get a girl to squirt and get a girl to come.




They try so hard, and they're almost... Have you ever had a guy be so focused on trying to give you an orgasm? How do you go about that? Basically being tapping his head, being like, Okay, calm down. It's not going to happen. What do you do?


Yeah, he just pulled him up.


You pulled him up? Oh, yeah.


It's just not... I think a lot of guys, if they know what they're doing, they can tell if it's not going to go that way. I think that comes a lot with experience and age. With a younger dude, they might not really know, but a guy who's been doing it for a He gets to him. They know what's up.


I agree. I think sometimes, ladies, if you're listening and you're struggling with that, that's such good advice of sometimes you literally don't need to say anything. I've done that so many times where I'm like, Okay, come fuck me. Basically, just pull them up and like, Let's go. And then they'll be like, Oh, okay. It's just move on.


Yes. Okay.


Have you ever been in a relationship where your partner had different sex drives than you? And how did you guys handle that?


For sure. That's an example of getting in your head because I have been in one where Or maybe I haven't been as interested after a while in having sex with the person. In my head, I'm like, Okay, I had sex today. If I wait two or three days, okay, maybe I can do it again on Thursday, and then he'll be okay. But then you're in your head, and then you're like, Oh, fuck. I had that for a while, even after a relationship, being stuck in that and overthinking. We had sex today. Okay, when do I have to have it again?


That is the most relatable thing. Just to pause you right there, I can't imagine how many women are like, me too, Rachel. What the fuck do you do to combat that?


It's so tough because battling your head and your body because there's totally different things. And even if I want to have sex, my head could be like, no, I don't really want to. Then you're stuck in that pattern of like, Okay, I'm going to calculate this.


Do you feel like when that happened to you with that partner? Because I hear what you're saying. That specific, it felt like you're like, I'm not sure if I'm in this anymore. I don't know what I'm doing. Did it go on for a while? Did you end it? Did you find any remedy for it?


Yeah, it was probably the last year and a half of doing a pattern until it finally broke off. Just sticking to that and being like... Because I'm a people pleaser that carries I've run into relationships.


But I feel like in those moments, I feel like that's a good red flag for yourself to know Hey, Henry.


No, I'm letting... He needs his face. There it goes. Oh, my God.


Thank you. I think in those moments, what I would say to women is is number one, it may be a good red flag for you to be like, Hey, maybe I'm not as into this person as I thought.


Yeah, listen to what's going on. Totally.


Also, I would say I've sometimes had moments where I'm just out of it with my sex drive, and It's not my partner. Sometimes maybe finding time for yourself to masturbate. Right. Which is way easier.


Absolutely. If you need an orgasm, it's so much easier and quicker yourself because you know your body so well.


Then I feel like sometimes for me, and I don't know if you feel the same, but sometimes then when I do that, maybe I'll be a little bit more horny that day. Then I'm like, Oh, I would want to have sex tonight. Just making sure, just checking in with yourself is really what it is about, and it's really not about your partner.


Yeah, it can be either. There is a difference, for sure. Totally. I've been in both.


How do you approach bringing a toy into the bedroom for the first time with a partner?


I have very little experience with this. I didn't even have a vibrator until a few years ago. I was gifted one from a guy I was dating. I was I was like, fuck, yeah, that's awesome. Okay, he's totally open. I feel like that shows a guy with awareness, right? I've only used one with that person, and I haven't really brought it back since. But I would like to.


Did you like using it with your partner?


I did, except there was one thing we were doing, and it really hurt. It was not the right... I was like, Maybe this isn't the right way to be doing this. But I think it can be totally fun, and it should be more accepted. I know there There are guys out there that would feel like their ego hurt. Like, Oh, why do you need this? I can give you this.


It's like, no, your tongue can't buzz like that.


No, it doesn't actually vibrate. But just having guys that are aware and they're like, oh, this is going to help her. And then they actually are about you being pleasured as well, I think is awesome.


Have you used it alone eventually without your partner? Oh, yeah, for sure. And I think they're great. And I feel like I actually... It's funny. I was gifted one as well back in college. Like your first one? Yes. I was literally I was using a toothbrush at the time. It was an electric toothbrush in the back of the head. Hey, you know. And my friend Lauren was like, I went through a breakup, and she was like, Alex, come with me. I'm like, Where are we going? And she brought me to a sex shop, and she was like, We need to get you a vibrator because stop using your toothbrush. I'm like, I don't brush my teeth with it. Please let me clarify. But I think it was a cute moment because then afterwards, I definitely enjoyed time alone with myself, and I enjoyed time with my partner more. But I agree, you have to find the right one for sex. And I think You're right. It takes a certain partner, someone that's confident in themselves and wants to make sure that they're pleasing you. If maybe even if your partner was like, Oh, Rachel has mentioned, sometimes it's hard for her to orgasm.


Let me think outside the box because I want her to enjoy sex as much as I'm enjoying it. Let's get her a vibrator. I think that's someone that's really confident in themselves and the relationship and wants you to enjoy yourself. You recently mentioned that your breakup with actor Bill Hater was worse than childbirth.


Okay, I did not actually say that. I'm happy you brought that up.


Let's clarify.


I said, okay, obviously, he and I were not still together, so we broke up. But it was during a time where you could not leave your house, okay? You had to sit in whatever it was that you were going through. I had to deal with this. I had to deal with being alone and taking care of my kid and everything else. I'm like, Being isolated and not being able to connect with any humans, not being able to help myself. I got into a depression. All of these things that time, having to be forced to face all of your shit, I said was harder than childbirth. Is anything more painful? Fuck no. Maybe kidney stones, which definitely is a close second. But no, I didn't say that. Well, all breakups are hard. Of course. Especially when you are in something that you're really into and things happen and fucking things change. And there was a pandemic. There were so many things going on. Yeah, so it was a hard time.


I cannot imagine. I think I know a lot of people messaged me going through breakups in pandemics. I mean, people were going through so much in the pandemic, whether it was almost like a breakup within yourself of self realizing something. There was a lot. And so I completely understand what you're saying with regard to that.


No, think about it. And the first thing you want to do after a breakup is get out there and socialize and be out with your friends and do your thing. And you literally can only sit in a house with your child that you're taking care of. You can't even take care of yourself first. And just sit with life and everything that comes along with it. Totally. So it was just about being isolated and going through the pandemic with all All the things in life.


When you broke up because it was a pandemic, was it a phone call? Did you even get to see this person in person when you guys broke up?


Yeah, it was not in person. Yeah. Well, because in the beginning, when you're so isolated and you're so scared because you don't know. You're like, Oh, my God, I looked at someone. Am I going to die? And he has his own family he has to think about. I had my own family to think about. Obviously, Breyer's dad, it was our bubble. So we're not going to see anyone. He's not going to see It was definitely done in not your normal in-person way.


What helped you ultimately heal from the pain of that heartbreak with Bill?


You know what was so interesting? It was almost like a blessing in disguise. So having to be alone with all of the shit and your thoughts and not leave the house. I had to look at everything, and I'm like, okay, I've been in therapy for years, which I love. Big fan, big advocate. Huge. Do therapy. Write if that helps you. I was reading books. I was doing things that I never had time to do, and it gave me that time to just really do things for myself. Yes, I'm looking after my kid, but there was obviously shared time, so I would have time absolutely alone, alone, alone. I got to do the things that I always wanted to do, and it really helped me. It was like, Oh, I'm focusing just on me. It's not about the guy or the relationship. It's literally just about me as a human. I was happy that I was forced to sit in the pain or the hurt or all the feelings that come along with it because I got to get through it. Some people will hold on to that for years because they'll distract themselves. Totally. So you don't actually face those feelings you're feeling.


If we can talk about that a little bit, because I think a lot of people can relate to that topic of knowing something maybe isn't right. And again, being in a pandemic, how did you, or I I don't know if it was your decision, but come to that decision of, this is going to end, even if it's a pandemic, how did you get to that point to end it, or whoever ended it?


I think it was the stress of the situation in the world that led to it. No one knew how to be or react. I think it was just a result of that alone, the stress of it all.


Oh, really? Because do you think if the pandemic hadn't happened, maybe- I would think it probably would have went on maybe a little longer.


But then in retrospect, looking at it, you're like, obviously it would have ended because it did. But maybe it almost ended faster. Yeah.


So I guess that's a good way to look at a positive, because I think a lot of times We have- We get deeper into it and more time goes by, but ultimately it's not the one.


So it was, like I said, blessing in disguise in many ways.


Have you, through relationships now, when you think of the one and what your wants are, how have you found that through what you've gone through with your past relationships in your mind? I think that's everything.


I think people, and as you get older, I'm 40 years old, you go through all these experiences and you're like, Oh, I'm taking things from each thing. There's always a positive because it's like, I recognize something in this relationship that did not work for me. So the next time I need this. And I've gotten to a place now where I know exactly what I want, what I need. And for the first time, I'm not afraid to say it.


Can you give us an example of something from any relationship you've ever been in that you're like, this is something I know personally for me that just doesn't work for me in a relationship? And then also a need.


Someone controlling is never good. Never. And like I said, people pleasing I was definitely weaker, and I could be subjected to that and be like, Okay, yeah, I'll just do whatever he says. And that's a pattern with me in a lot of the relationships I've had. So that's something huge that I'm like, No, I need to make my decisions, and I need to stick to what I know and be strong. The strength in me would always be a lot weaker in relationships when I was younger. And now being older, I know exactly how to speak up for myself, I should say.


Have you gotten to a point, though, where you can recognize when it's happening and then know how to get out of it? Yeah.


I mean, it's one of those things because when you're in something and you don't see it, then you get out of it. It's so clear that now that you can recognize it because you've acknowledged that you can recognize it, anytime it comes up, you're like, Oh, no, he's doing this thing. I'm not okay with it.


What does it need? What are you like, these? This is something I definitely need in a partner.


I need someone make me coffee in the morning. Like, fuck, yes. Thank you. Honestly, I create just on top of me, missionary. Some dudes that aren't down with that. I need a man on top of me sometimes. You know what I mean? And that's another thing sexually. I'm like, yes, own it. I need to feel it. Like Carrie says in sex, I need to feel the weight of a on top of me. It's like, I can so relate to that.


Guys, if anyone's listening, Rachel needs coffee and missionary. I mean, I feel like it's doable. Are you currently single?


I am not. Okay.


Is he bringing you coffee in the morning? And is he doing Missionary?


Fuck, yeah.


That's actually great. Okay, great. Is there anything that you look back and you're like, there's a theme throughout people you've dated?


A theme? I have noticed... This is This is a generalization, right? I think I've dated quite a few actors, and I do think that some of them, not all, have very self-involved tendencies. I think that just comes along with the territory a lot of the time, right? I'm not saying all of them that I've dated have them, but it is a theme, and I don't like it.


Do you think you would ever stray from the actor?


Oh, yeah, for sure. Really? I always tell myself never again. And then, of course, you're in another project, another person. But no. And I will say, with respect for my daughter's father, he is not like that.


I get what you're saying of you don't want to fall into that tendency, and then you're on a movie set. Is it hard when you're single and on sets to not get involved in that stuff?


Well, for sure, because think about it. Any workplace you're in, you're surrounded by the people, you're around them every day, and you'll meet different personalities. And sometimes you'll really have chemistry with someone. It doesn't matter where you are. Yes, it's a set, but it's literally someone you're spending mostly 12 hours a day with. So you're going to get to know these people better than you would get to know someone you're just casually dating in the beginning because it's That's why I feel like a lot of people do get into workplace relationships.


I'm not encouraging it, everyone. But any job you're at, if you work in sales, real estate, it doesn't have to be entertainment. And you are with that person all day, every day. And it starts as a friendship, right? It starts as you're cordial, you're going to get to the coffee together, you're going to craft services together, and you're then talking about your life. And all of a sudden, that blossoms into like, oh, wait, maybe you could be. No, though, it could always end. Of course. And if it's going to potentially always end- Be friends. Be friends. And protect yourself and make decisions before you jump in. I think some people that have maybe... I think actors are lucky because then you're off to your next project. Right.


It's like summer camp A lot of the time. Yes.


And if you're in a 9:00 to 5:00, sweetheart, that's not summer camp. That is all day round, baby. So make sure you're going to be cozy if he's in the cubicle, and a couple of weeks later, you guys break up. For sure. Because that's difficult.


Way difficult.


Okay. You get very personal on your pod. Has it been cathartic to talk about your personal life on your podcast?


It has. I'm still a very private person. I won't name names, but we wanted to create a space. And you know what? Before we started, I listened to your first Call Her Daddy, and I was like, fuck.


My first Call Her Daddy podcast?


Yes. The fact that you were so just transparent and didn't give a fuck. You said... You know what I mean?


The guy texted me and I said, I want you to degrade me. Yes. Oh, my God. That's awful. God bless. I remember that recording that to this day. You do. Oh, my God. I remember going in there and just being like, I'm just going to say everything that happened this week. I had no idea what I I was doing. I'd never listened to a podcast in my life before I reported that. I think my voice was so affected, so fake. I was like, Hi, guys, this is Alex. I can't listen back.


Well, I get it. It's like watching your first project, you're like, Oh, my God, what is that? I get it. But that being said, just the very transparency and just being super honest and open, I fucking loved. My best friend Olivia and I were like, We want to create a safe space where women or Even men, we have men coming on now, just being open and honest and getting into it and not afraid to speak whatever's on their mind. Obviously, we go there about sex, but it's life, and we're moms, and it's a whole different thing, and it's a different phase of life, but it feels really good to have our own platform to do that.


I love that. I think that, listen, I have had some where I come up with fake names for people, and then people still find it out. So don't do that. If you're a private, Rachael, I'll give you that. Don't come up with like, Oh, this one's door number three, and this is slim Shady. Don't do that. But when you talk about the themes of what you're going through, that is relatable because we all can relate in some capacity. We're all human beings going through depression, anxiety, happiness, stress, sadness, hard times with your romantic, with your family, with your friends. And so I think it's cool to have anyone sit down in front of a microphone and be open. I think everyone can appreciate that.


I would hope so. And I think it's accessible and people that crave that authenticity. And I think for me, it's like, okay, I can speak personally about my own experiences, but I don't want to bring other people in that don't have a mic in front of them and can't either defend or share their side.


That is the catch-22 of it all, and I'm still trying to figure it out. I know, right? You got to push the boundary, but it's also respecting. For sure. I get it, respecting people in your life.




I think I read, you don't introduce your child to people you date.


I've learned from mistakes in the past that you don't want to do it too quickly. But luckily, she's only seven now, and she was a lot younger before and whatnot, so it probably didn't resonate as much as it would now, per se. But yeah, I think that's super important because I don't want it to look like some revolving door or I don't know how it's going to affect her. And she's number one for me. Totally. Hands down before work, before men, before anything. I don't take that lightly.


Have you had a lot of people that are respectful of that?


Yeah, I've only had positive experiences, luckily. But also that speaks to me knowing what I need and want now. So I'm not going to entertain anything if they don't understand the kid comes first.


And I think that's great. And it's also like, ladies, be fucking confident. You did the most incredible thing in the world, which is bring a human being onto this Earth. And if someone is not going to be positive and accepting of however you want to handle the boundaries, tell them to get back themselves and find someone better.


For sure. And a lot of women have those insecurities, I think. Absolutely. Being moms or whatever age you at that point and just thinking like, Oh, are guys going to want it?


It's like, oh, fuck that. Yeah, totally. Being a public figure most of your life, is there anything that you would like to share that you think maybe is a misconception about you or people maybe think about you that you're like, oh, I would like to clarify and just say my piece on that.


God. I feel like I've been fortunate enough to have mostly a positive response. And I think I love that. It's important to me how I carry myself, setting an example, whatever. But I'm fucking crass and have a dirty sense of humor. I'm not afraid to show it, and I think it'll come through on Broad Ideas, the new podcast. But I feel very fortunate. I feel like I've gone through this time of my life where I've been working or whatever in a decent way where I can be proud that my daughter will see how I carried myself.


What do you attribute that to? Because I think a lot of people like, Fuck, this shit. It got me fucked up by being in the public, whether it was maybe they didn't come from the best family to give them values or whether- No, that's... What do you think why you just end up having such a good straight and narrow path? There's not a lot of drama around you.


I think that the support system you have around you is huge. All my best friends are my best friends since high school and before in junior high. Never stray from that. I don't make new friends often. And my family, I have a very supportive family, and I grew up that way in a loving, open mom, clearly. And I think that is such a big It's a part of it. And people around you that know you so well, they can just... If you have a moment, you're like, No, no, no, no, no, We haven't worn it yet.


You can be real with each other. You can be real. Totally. No, I really respect you saying that. And I feel like it's really cool to get to sit down with you because we respect your work so much. And so now it's cool to be able to sit with Rachel Billson and talk with you and get to know you.


I'm such a fan of yours. I was like, oh, my God. I got to sit. It was just such a cool thing. And I think this is great. This is so beautiful what you're doing. I love it and inspired me to just be able to go there. You gave me the confidence. It's like, you can be who the fuck you are and say what the fuck you want and still be a successful woman in this world. And it's awesome.


Rachel, thank you so much for coming on Call Her Daddy.


Thank you so much.