You are listening to the Darren Wilson Show, I'm Darren, I spent the last 20 years devoted to improving health, protecting the environment and finding ways to live a more sustainable life. In this podcast, I have honest conversations with people that inspire me. I hope that through their knowledge and unique perspectives, they'll inspire you, too. We talk about all kinds of topics from amping up your diets to improving your well-being to the mind blowing stories behind the human experience and the people that are striving to save us and our incredible planet.
We've investigated some of life's fatal conveniences. You know, those things that we are told might be good for us, but totally aren't. So here's to making better choices and the small tweaks in your life that amount to big changes for you and the people around you and the planet. Let's do this. This is my show, The Darren Olean Show.
Welcome, everybody, to another edition of the journal lead show, thanks for tuning in. Thanks for trusting me with navigating you through and to and towards different people, different guests, different information. I'm stoked to have you here. Everyone's just kind of coming off of the Thanksgiving weekend. I hope that was bountiful and you didn't eat too much and you didn't eat too many animals and ate more plants. You know, I just have to say stuff like that.
Come on. I found some of the greatest plants in the world. I've dedicated myself to that. And if we can get our nutrients from plants rather than animals, then why wouldn't we do that? My next guest is connected to one of the most important things that we do do all of the time, and that is breathing. But here's the thing. All of us, most of us are not breathing correctly. We have devolved into allowing stress to take control and a hold of our breathing patterns, contributing to infinitely greater issues in our lives, in the formation of our teeth, our skulls, our nasal passages, our body's ability to receive oxygen.
And believe me, you want oxygen absorption because no disease, bacteria or virus can survive and an oxygen rich environment. So there's no better time to understand your breathing than right now to increase oxygenation in your system and also to lower stress almost instantly breathing through your nose. So Patrick McEwan has been an innovator, a renegade, and really the most common sense educator we have on the planet basically is bringing us back as mammals into primarily nose breathing. We have gotten away from that into a mouth breathing that causes a lot of issues which we get into on the show.
But Patrick wrote this amazing book. I've recommended more than almost any book, and that's called The Oxygen Advantage. It's been published in over 14 languages. He has instructed well over hundred instructors and how to teach people how to get back into this very basic, powerful way of breathing. And he has recognised all over the world and is the top authority into breathing and exercise, performance and sleep. Your sleep is going to improve and we're going to reveal some things in the show that's going to blow your mind in terms of increasing your sleeping patterns by doing a couple of little tweaking techniques.
He's worked with the military and a bunch of special forces, Olympians, coaches, athletes, fellow friends and expert world. So he is such a pleasure and he is such an authority. I can't wait for you to learn and expand and lower your stress, increase your immune response and just have a better overall quality of life. So hook in, hold on, take a deep breath and through your nose and let it out and receive my good friend Patrick McEuen.
OK, the myth, the man, the legend. Patrick, so wonderful to connect with you for those of you that are fans of Down to Earth. I actually was trying to get Patrick on that show and we just had to cut a bunch of other stuff as well. So we're exposing Patrick in this way. And Patrick, I have to say, dude, I've probably recommended your book more in the last two years than any other book. So, dude, welcome.
It is just my pleasure and honor to have you on the podcast.
Thanks very much. It's great to be here. It's great to, you know, to to show the awareness of breathing and what people can bring into their way of life to make quite a difference. Yeah. And this is something like it's it's the most obvious thing that hasn't been until just now starting to reveal itself. And it's literally it's literally in front of our face. And and the fact that you've been I would say that there's some other books that have come out, but you are the one that kind of took the listen.
Everyone knows a breathing and all of this stuff. Great, great, great. It's been around forever from yogic practice to Viravaidya to almost every type of religion. But there's an actual fundamental physical, physiological, biological, osteopathic, even functionality to breathing on so many different levels to switching from everyone thinks, well, you breathe through your mouth. Right. And and you just you sniff and smell things with your nose. And we've literally just missed the whole boat on this one.
Right. Yeah, no, for sure, and I think it's amazing and I'm not sure how how this happens. One guy said to me about a month ago, he said he says it just took you 20 years to be an overnight success. And that's and that's how I feel at the moment, because your breathing has taken off and it's especially taken off this year. And I think down I think what people think about breathing, their eyes glaze over.
I don't think they fully realize it. You know, there's too much of this bandied about to fill your lungs full of oxygen, breathe deep into into your lungs, take a full breath, take a deep breath. And, you know, in many ways, that's not even right. And in other ways, it's just scratching the surface to depths of which we can go here. And I'm not critical of anybody else because in breathing, I specialized primarily on the biochemical aspect of it for about 15 years and I ignored by mechanical and I ignored resonance breathing and cadence breathing.
And now I embrace all three and I embrace any aspect of breathing that we can bring in. It's it's the depth of it. The potential here is enormous. And even just taking one dimension of breathing the biochemistry, going down that route and then looking at the biomechanics, because when we start investigating the functions of the diaphragm, what it does, it's not just about breathing. You know, you can relate it to lower back pain. You can relate it to increased sports injury.
You can relate to functional movement and then cadence, breathing, resonance, breathing, resonance frequency of breathing. You know how that can impact the autonomic nervous system. So, yeah, it's amazing.
Yeah, man. So, you know, for those of you because I know you've definitely and it's been so great every time I see someone else interviewing you and Brian Rose or whatever.
Um, yes, he's he is getting out and the message is getting out. And so far and with the success of Down to Earth, there's been a lot of people that haven't been in this space. Right. And they're just waking up to a lot of incredible things about health, their lifestyle and and how our ecosystem is connected to the bigger ecosystem. So so if you could you know, I've read your books, I've watched your videos, I've gotten to meet you.
And if you could just back up, because I think I think your entry story is so important because something that is so important to you is the kids and that that that zone of zero to four, that zone of of four to 12 or whatever, that that 90 percent of the ability to breathe. But it all started for you because of the infinite issues you had with asthma and apne sleep apnea and a cascade of problems. So if you could just unpack that a little bit, because I want to start relating that, of course, to how parents right now immediately can help their children regardless of age in this.
And not to mention themselves because, oh, my gosh, if if sleeping disorders hasn't gone up exponentially, man, I don't know what has. So so could you unpack that a little bit in terms of your issues, what how you started in this space and and just explain that to people?
Yeah, for sure. I was a kid growing up and I was born in nineteen seventy three and my parents first noticed that I was freezing probably about two or three years of age. So off, down to the local doctor and the local doctor diagnosed me as having chronic bronchitis or bronchitis because asthma you typically don't get a diagnosis of asthma at least back then at an early age. So it was intermittent for the first few years. And the only way that I know I was a chronic Marguerita was when I look back at family photographs every time there was a photograph, not necessarily when I was smiling, but say, for instance, I had a shovel in my hand and a bucket of my hand.
My mouth was open. So I drew the conclusion and pretty much I was a map reader. But I really remember in high school, secondary school and also in university. And where it impacted me most was my feeling was getting worse. But I was waking up feeling exhausted. One year I did Erasmus programme with Uppsala University in Sweden, and I was I was staying in student dorms and the students told me that I was snoring unbelievably loud. And then they told me I stopped.
Everything and one of them was concerned because they thought I was going to die. Now, of course, I had no idea what this is. I only realized this about 10 years ago that this is obstructive sleep apnea. And it was I came across so despite like I was taking medication for asthma, two, three hospitalizations with asthma, I was always chronically fatigue. And I was the kid in school that was falling asleep at the desk. And my issue with this is for me to get grades, I had to spend so much more time studying.
And you know what? When you think of a kid's intelligence, it's often determined by what they achieve academically. But nobody is considering the sleep quality of these kids. And a child with high intelligence but with poor sleep quality is going to to you know, they're not going to do well academically. And yet this kid then will have self-esteem issues. You know, they'll probably know that there's something lacking, but they don't quite know what it is. And that was me.
And it's not just your sleep that's affected. Your mood is affected. My breathing was affected. My ability to partake in sports was affected, you know, and like some times people say, Dad, I'm I'm here kind of taking pity on myself. No, no, not at all. I was fortunate enough. We now know it was twenty five to 50 percent of the children in the same boat. And with the exception of a few very exceptional medical doctors, dentists, orthodontists, my functional therapists and California is a hotspot for us.
You know, they really are pushing the awareness out there and getting the boat out there. So lo and behold, nineteen ninety eight. I read a newspaper article, spoke about the work of a Russian doctor. He said two things. He said, breathe through your nose. He said, breathe life. And of course, I am reading this article knowing that I'm doing neither of those things because you would hear me breathing a mile away. I be the kid that would go to the parents having having dinner with them with the rest of the kids.
And I can remember my friend's parents giving out to me because I had very poor table manners. Of course, when you have a chronically stuffed nose, you have to eat and breathe through the same hole at the same time. So table manners goes out the window when that happens. So so my story was, you know, I went to sleep that night. I used to breathe right. Strip across my nose to help open up the nose. I use the nose on blocking exercise, which I got.
And that was in the early the infancy of the Internet. And it's simply holding your breath. And it actually did work. But I still felt our hunger because of years of my breathing. So I use breathe, breathe right. Strip across my nose to open up my nose. And I taped my nose that night. Sorry, I take my mouth that night. The next morning I woke up kind of, you know, just getting used to it.
I didn't really notice anything massive the next morning, but I did it a second night and that was when I noticed the difference. It was the second morning I woke up and I woke up feeling concentrated. I woke up feeling alert that and I often described this to people. If somebody was to hand me a technical paper, I could put my attention and I could focus on it and I could concentrate on. And there is no comparison when you wake up feeling concentrated and alert versus when you are waking up feeling groggy.
When you're waking up, it's almost like a hangover. And can you imagine these kids who are chronically my breathing? And just before I forget it, Karen Banach, she's a researcher and I believe she's an American researcher. She she did a study in Stratford-Upon-Avon in the UK back in the late 1990s into early 2000s. It was an eight year study. She looked at eleven thousand children and she looked at the relationship between sleep disorder, breathing, mouth breathing and special education needs and children with sleep disorder breathing at age five who were untreated by the time they were age, they had a 40 percent increased risk of special education needs.
And I remember Dr Christian gameness, Stanford medical doctor who passed on last year and he coined the phrase obstructive sleep apnea. He came up with the term and he developed the apnea high up the index, which is a measurement of the severity of the condition. I was in Brdo or somewhere else at a meeting and I was talking and he was talking. And I remember saying one thing. He said children's brains are being fried. And that's what he said.
He said, when an adult asleep out there. Yes, you wake up, you know, with that day. But when a child has any sleep disorder, breathing, including snoring, it's impacting cognitive development. There is a car crash waiting to happen here. Something is really about to take place. And, Daryn, this has been debated in the dental industry. Since nineteen oh nine, if you go into into Google and you put in dental cosmos, you will see an article written back in nineteen ninety four by the two.
Researchers at that time spoke about the child with the mouth open being inattentive in school. The face, the face looks dull and expressionless. The child can be waking up with a headache and the child's teacher accuses the child of daydreaming. So nothing has happened in one hundred and eleven years. Why has not happened? Why has changed not taken place in the US?
We're going to try to figure out what that is. But the thing that I really love is that it finally is scientifically the kids not sleeping and having apnea in some form or fashion is literally affecting their cognition, steering them towards basically on the spectrum or not on the spectrum. And from that perspective, every parent, every person listening to this is got to just go. This is astonishing. So for years, maybe all, most of my life, people have been asking me what kind of foods you eat, what kind of exercises do do, what kind of water should I drink, all of these things and so much more we put into a 21 day program.
So that can take you through a theme every day of knowledge, action, and then eating this delicious meals, working out, getting support, anchoring in these new habits. So you can do what? So that you can kick ass. So you have the energy, the vitality to live the kind of life that you really want. That's what it's all about. So all in this app, we have grocery lists, we have education about real hydration and what greater oxygenation and the balance of organization.
All of these things we are diving into as you're heading down this hero's journey of implementation into a new life to give you the kind of life that you actually want. So join my tribe. All you have to do is go to one to one tribe, dotcom, sign up and you get three free days. Join me on this hero's journey. Join the tribe. There was already awareness in the early nineteen hundreds, and yet is it a suppression or is it just kind of a sluff off once we kind of set up the American Medical Association that didn't necessarily thrive in the in the cornerstone of disease.
It really was kind of had a different idea of pharmaceuticals and whatnot. Like what is what is your from 20 years in this? What do you think happened in terms of losing that? What do you think happened and how that message was lost?
I don't have a clear explanation. If I was to tell you my my honest opinion, it could offend a few people. But my honest opinion is that there's no motive to make money from teaching breathing exercises. That's my honest opinion. It's not scalable. You can't you cannot patent a technology and it takes too much time. And I think, you know, I can see as well as, you know, if you if you say, for instance, if you're a health care professional and you're after undergoing huge training and you're graduating from university and typically you male student, you may have student loans of half a million dollars.
You've got a lot of pressure to start recouping money at this at this level. And you're going to stick to what you've been trained and you're not going to take risks. And neither will you take risks, because if you if you deviate outside of what's considered code of practice, you may get your wrist slapped. So the main driver, this was a discussion that we had with a number of doctors last week with the IAMS, the California based organization, and it was international dentist, an orthodontist.
And the same question came up and I said the only reason that change has not happened was because of money. And I said, the only reason that change will happen is if doctors can make more money by advocating Nazel breathing and correct breathing practice are if they stand to lose money, if they don't, if they get sued for not advising us. Because if when you look into the nose and when you look into the mouth, at the mouth exerts zero functions in terms of breathing, the mouth just isn't breathing.
Like you mentioned in the undertows. You come across that study two years ago, Neanderthal's, that these really wide facial structures, but also they had wide nostrils, they had really wide palates. They had plenty of room to take air in and out of the nose. Neanderthal's would not have been snoring. And snoring is not just it's not just about the airway being inadequate. We also need to look at flow. So the whole field of sleep medicine, it needs to be approached from the point of view of an engineer looking at the diameter of a pipe.
You know, if you listen to somebody snoring, you know, there's resistance to the flow of breathing there. And an engineer will investigate and the engineer will say, well, yeah, what is the diameter of the airway? But not only will the engineer look at the diameter of the airway, the engineer will wonder what is the flow to go through the airway and flow as breathing? And if you have somebody with a higher respiratory rate, I'm breathing faster and a little bit more chest breathing and mouth breathing.
That's going to increase flow, increase resistance. And that in turn will increase turbulence. And it was a paper published in one of the US journals looking at obstructive sleep up there. It was a study of ninety five individuals with obstructive sleep apnea. Now that HHI index, but mouth breathing was fifty seven events per hour and their blood oxygen saturation was dropping down into the mid sixty percent. Now we do braitling with elite athletes and you can imagine these guys are fit or super trained.
An elite athlete would really find it as a huge challenge to hold their breath, to stop breathing, to drop their blood oxygen saturation down to sixty percent. Now we have guys in that paper and I can send all these studies on to you. Ninety five individuals, those who are mouth breathing, having up to 60 events per hour and each hour, every hour, every week, every going on for months. Going on four years, their blood oxygen saturation dropping with knees are breathing.
It was twenty seven events per that could still significant, but it's almost half even by just getting the mouth closed, by getting the tongue and the roof, the mouth. And it's not alone because, you know, we need also to engage the diaphragm because there's a group of upper airway dilator muscles. There's a group of muscles in the throat that are designed to help maintain an open airway. But these muscles are connected to. Your diaphragm, when you breathe through your nose, you have better amplitude and engagement of the diaphragm because my breathing activates the upper chest, so nasal breathing alone and by teaching diaphragmatic breathing, diaphragmatic breathing increases lung volume.
And with an increased along volume, the throat is stiffer and less likely to collapse. There is order. There are other connections with breathing, too, in terms of reducing the chemo sensitivity to carbon dioxide, basically teaching somebody during the day to slow down their breathing, to breathe less air. And by exposing their body to slightly elevated carbon dioxide levels, they're able to change their sensitivity to the gas and as a result, their breathing becomes lighter during sleep.
Now, two days, there has been no research in the world. Looking at the application of functional breathing to sleep apnea, one paper was published by a doctor or a Harvard medical doctor, and he looked at one phenotype karluk gain. And yes, he was able to measure it using Breteau time. And we have been using Breteau time for breathing for 20 years. So I would love to see an awareness here and any research that's out there. This would be a pioneering study because the reality is both for children adenoid and tonsillectomy.
And if you wanted me to go down that route and to sleep apnea is being addressed. And for adults, the solutions are not working very well. The reason that the solution isn't working for adults is because the gold standard of treatment is a C Pap machine. It stands for continuous positive airway pressure. The compliance is typically 50 percent. So you have 50 percent of people with obstructive sleep apnea diagnosed with the condition. They are not able to tolerate the treatment.
Surely that should open the doors for new investigations to be able to offer people an approach and, you know, losing weight. It's all very well saying to lose weight. But the problem with sleep apnea is if you stop breathing during your sleep, it messes hormones and one hormone as leptin and the other one is ghrelin and ghrelin increases. And that's that's a you know, that promotes appetite. So you have the individual with sleep apnea. They're stopping breathing several episodes every hour going on throughout the night.
They wake up feeling exhausted. They're likely to be irritable. They have cognitive difficulty. They can't concentrate, which is normal. And also, because of the increased ghrelin, you've got increased appetite. You eat more food, you put on weight, you've got fat pads in the throat. Your tongue is getting bigger. You've got more fat in the belly. The diaphragm isn't working. The tongue occupies more space in the mouth. The diaphragm isn't working as effectively as it should do.
And as a result, the upper airway is more likely to collapse. So we yeah, we have to recognize that the treatment of adult obstructive sleep apnea is not working very well. Now, let's look at children. The gold standard of treatment is is tonsillectomy. And that night me, there was a paper published by the American Society, the American Journal of Respiratory and Critical Care Medicine, and by an author called Bhattacharjee. I can never pronounce his name correctly, but anyway, there it is now.
He looked at five hundred and seventy eight children and he concluded that of the five hundred and seventy eight children who were diagnosed with obstructive sleep apnea, who had their tonsils and adenoids removed, only twenty seven percent of them had their sleep apnea cured. And seventy three percent of these children continued to have residual sleep apnea post tonsillectomy and adenoid ectomy. Now we'll go one step further. Dr Christian Kimona has published papers on this, that tonsillectomy and that might be short term unless Nazel breathing is restored.
Now, here's another person's story. My own little daughter, Lauren, of course, she has my genetic profile, which is totally screwed up. I hinohara polish compromised breathing something, you know, and it is genetics and the environment coming in here. I was noticing that you were stopping breathing during sleep when she was a three year old. So the best available advice that I had back then tonsillectomy and not liked me. We went through the operation.
No, there was no follow up here in Ireland. There was no encouragement by the surgeon for the child to breach to the nose. And it was a year or so later dental. I was coming across gameness paper and the sentiment one, and he acknowledged it. But I then underwent an appliance called out of an orthodontic appliance that she had put into the roof for a remote, which expanded our palate. And we charged forward growth of the jaws.
And then I realized I took the wrong route. I should have went down to the orthodontic route first to develop her airways, to make room for her airway instead of just looking at the addnode ACTIMMUNE tonsillectomy. And it's not. And I'm against addnode acromion tonsillectomy, but I think it's time that we realize that if twenty seven percent of kids, if it's only curing them because it's not a walk in the park, you see your child coming out of the operating theater and that child is after undergoing general anesthetic, you know, they bounce back.
But it's trauma for the parents, it's trauma for that. They're the child, you know. So, yeah, I think really we need to start asking questions here. Yeah.
Let's you know, there's there's so many aspects to this because there's the exchange aspect. There's the chemical exchange, there's the biology, there's the anatomy side of this whole thing, which you speak so well of.
So let's let's say for the average person listening, let's let's break it down in terms of what those breathing will do for them. And then let's get into the nitric oxide exchange, the body's ability to receive more oxygen. The sympathetic response, especially now we need to shift into those. So so break down a little bit of the the benefits people would receive by nose breathing and also what they're counteracting as well.
Sure. Most people will think of the nose and they will understand that the nose is filtering air and that's all very well. So when you take a breath of air and through your nose, you are picking up a gas from nitric oxide and disgust is produced inside the nasal cavity and the sinuses surrounding the nasal cavity. And this was first discovered on the exhaled breath of the human being in nineteen ninety one. But when you breathe through your nose and you're carrying that nitric oxide laden air into your lungs, nitric oxide helps to redistribute the blood through the lungs.
And this in turn increases oxygen uptake in the blood by 10 percent. So the CO2, the pressure of oxygen in the arterial blood increases by 10 percent when you continuously breathe through your nose. And this was discovered back in nineteen eighty eight by a researcher called Swift. And when they looked at individuals post your surgery, when their jaws were wired shut, they were forced to breathe through their nose continuously.
The pressure of oxygen and blood increased is the highlight that just by nose breathing, you can increase your daily systemic performance of of just throughout the day, whether you're an athlete or not, by 10 percent, just by closing your mouth roof on the top of your your palate and a nose breathing 10 percent increase instead of oxygen saturation.
And this disgust nitric oxide for people with asthma or people would say any sort of respiratory condition. It's a natural sterilization of air. And even though the studies on nitric oxide in terms of the effect and covid, they've been mainly laboratory studies. But if you were to put into Google now, say, for example, put in nitric oxide and covid, you will see that there are studies underway of nitric oxide discussed as a treatment for covid. Now our nose produces a source of nitric oxide.
Yes. We don't know if the if the quantity in the nose is sufficiently high enough to make a difference, but at the same time, it makes logical sense to breathe in and out through the nose. So when we breathe through the nose, we are carrying nitric oxide into the lungs and nitric oxide is a bronchodilator it open up the airways. As I said, it's redistributing the blood throughout the lungs. It's increasing oxygen uptake. Now, Nazeer breathing also helps with more regular breathing patterns, and the nose also is more able to engage the diaphragm.
We know that when you breathe through the mouth and anybody can check this, if you were to look down at your chest, you take a breath through the mouth, you will see typically that the mouth engages the upper chest. Now, if we are breathing shallow. We are wasting a lot of air in dead space because the last part of every breath that we take into the body, the last part of that breath will stay in the nose, in the throat and the trachea and the bronchi in the bronchioles so we can improve alveolar efficiency.
We can improve the efficiency of the air that we are taking in. And I'll just give you a couple of months quickly. If one was breathing fast and shallow, which is very common and, you know, you could have a respiratory arrest of 20 breaths per minute. And we say that person is breathing shallow so they have 20 breaths per minute. They have a tidal volume of three hundred ml. They're taking six liters of air into the body.
But after six liters of air, three liters remaining dead space, it never actually reaches the smaller sex in the lungs for gas exchange to take place. Now, if that individual was to slow down to respiratory rate from 20 breaths down to, say, 12 or even six breaths, if they slowed it down to six breaths per minute, would a tidal volume of a thousand people still bringing in six liters into the body. But the amount of air getting down into the smaller sex increases from three leaders to 5.1 liters.
So there's a significant improvement. And, you know, I remember reading an article by this Italian cardiologist called Luciano Bernadi, and he spoke of his patients with chronic heart failure. And he said, My patients with chronic heart failure, they have exercise intolerance. They go for a walk. They're overly breathless. They don't want to do physical exercise. And he asked the question, was it the heart which was causing the problem or did they have overly sensitive chemo sensitivity to carbon dioxide buildup?
So he started teaching his patients, this is going back 20 years ago, slow breathing to reduce the chemo sensitivity to carbon dioxide and their exercise tolerance improved. I then had a client coming up and she had chronic heart failure. I had to go for a walk in my clinic and she was wearing pulse oximetry and she was desaturate ing down to ninety two percent of the time. She was kind of on the borders of going into hypoxia. But at the same time your normal saturation blood oxygen saturation should be ninety five to ninety nine percent.
I simply had our clothes remote, put her hands on either side at her lower two ribs to engage the lower regions of the lungs. And I had her slow down or breathing down to six breaths for a minute as she was walking and within about a minute her blood oxygen saturation increased to ninety six percent. Now, I couldn't help thinking that people with respiratory conditions. They're not told and this isn't a criticism. This is just the reality of it.
Many of your listeners will have asthma, 10 percent of the western population of asthma. How many of your listeners have been told to breathe in and out through the nose doesn't happen. And the other thing, as I'll say with your listeners, with asthma, they don't just have asthma. They're also more likely to be sleepy. They're more likely to be tired, and they're more likely to have a sleep disorder, breathing and anxiety, because even if we just have a stuffy nose, if we have hay fever, we don't just have a stuffy nose.
It's the impact that the stuffy nose is causing mouth breathing, and it's the impact that my breathing is having on our mood, my breathing is having on our sleep and sleep. If we aren't getting a good night's sleep, we are not getting the recovery. So, you know, then you could ask, well, why should we be breathing in an actual noise during physical exercise? Again, no comparison. They're starting to the science is starting to come out on this.
There's a professor of sports medicine college, George Dalam, from the United States. And he he's a well-known triathlete, but he works with the really well trained athletes, top class athletes. And he started a whole program of nasal breathing. About five or six years ago. He published a paper back in twenty eighteen. He got 10 recreational athletes. And he said to them, he said, you train for the next six months, but only breathe through your nose.
And after six months when the adaptations have taken place, then we'll test you, because there's no point in grabbing a bunch of recreational athletes who have been mouth breathing for the last 20 years during their physical exercise and saying, right today, guys, I'm going to have your breathe through your nose during your physical exercise and I'm going to see how you're going to get on. Of course, it's going to be dismal because their body has an adopted 10 days of breathing.
And when you first switch from mouth to nose breathing during physical exercise, the air hunger is stronger, but the air hunger is stronger because carbon dioxide is increasing in the blood and carbon dioxide because you're breathing through your nose. Carbon dioxide is not able to leave the blood through the lungs so quickly. So it increases and it's carbon dioxide that gives you that stimulus to breathe. Now, carbon dioxide is not just that waste gas, though, because discovered back in 1984 by a Danish physiologist called Christian Bhau, be sure that the pressure of carbon dioxide in the blood and resultant change the blood is a catalyst for the release of oxygen from the red blood cells.
So you can think of it this way. We take a breath of fresh air into her lungs. Oxygen passes from the lungs into the blood. Most of the oxygen and the blood is carried by hemoglobin molecules. But in order for hemoglobin to release oxygen, Reedley carbon dioxide needs to be present. And that's the BAW effect. Now, how many times have we heard breathe in as much oxygen as possible and get rid of all that waste, toxic carbon dioxide?
And, you know, it's unfortunate because anybody can check this just put in bore effect into Google, check the toxic hemoglobin dissociation, convert the oxygen dissociation curve. It's in pretty much any chapter that's on respiratory physiology. So back to George Dalam. What happened when he got his 10 recreational athletes breathing through the nose for six months. They were able to achieve one hundred percent of their work. Great intensity with nasal breathing, as with mouth breathing. But they had twenty two percent less breathlessness.
The fraction of expired oxygen was less, meaning that more oxygen was delivered to the body and carbon dioxide in the blood was forty four millimeters of mercury versus forty. And that's quite significant. And also air hunger had diminished. And typically, like I always say to the students, I'd say, yeah, you switch to Naza breathing your nose will be running for a couple of weeks, bring a handkerchief, which, you know, don't overly breathe too hard for your nose because it may irritate the inside of your nose and just gently allow your nose to acclimatize and to become conditioned to be able to handle air.
But the air hunger will diminish in time. And I would say give it about six to eight weeks and your recovery is better. Oxygen uptake, oxygen delivery is better. But the other thing is the connection with the nose and the diaphragm breathing muscle and the connection with the diaphragm breathing muscle and functional movement. So, for example, people who are upper chest breeders, the impact that can have because our diaphragm is not just for respiration. You know, if a weight lifter is lifting a weight, typically the weight lifter will breathe in and hold our breath.
And as they breathe in, their diaphragm is moving downwards. And it's almost that the abdomen becomes like a pneumatic balloon to provide stabilization for the spine. So the breath itself and the function of the dive. Helps with functional movement, and you cannot have good functional movement without functional breathing, and if an individual doesn't have functional functional movement, there is a greater risk of injury. So that's just with nose breathing. And that's kind of not even touching on dental health, you know, waking up but drying out.
We all know that saliva's is an anti package and we all know that my breathing is going to be increased gum disease and dental cavities. It's trauma to the upper airways and also my breathing. There's a 42 percent greater water loss breathing out to the out that we could say this about covid to we know or at least we think we know that covid is transmitted via water particles like an aerosol. And if you have a family member who's infected with covid, they will be likely to be in respiratory distress.
They feel that they are not getting enough air. They will naturally start breathing fast and shallow, which is the wrong thing to do because, you know, it's very inefficient and uneconomical, but because they are feeling they are not getting enough air, they will start mouth breathing and as they migrate, they're going to measure graser water loss into the atmosphere. So anybody in close contact to them is going to be a greater risk of picking up the infection.
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So I'm giving all of my listeners 15 percent off by going to Barracas Dotcom backslash, Daryn. That's B a r u k a s dot com backslash, Daryn. D a r i and I know you will enjoy. You know, his breathing has changed my whole workout, it's changed my life, it's been a calming, functional side of just dropping. Like what I really love is after a workout knows breathing and dropping the heart rate as quickly as possible, like just really shifting down.
And for everyone listening, if it isn't obvious by now, knows breathing will calm. The system is one of the great stress reducers that you could possibly imagine at the same time are increasing oxygen saturation and just improving your life, period. So when people are stepping into working out and then going, OK, I want to give this a shot with those breathing, it's almost like you have to back off on the amount of volume you may be doing at first in order for that six week ish kind of adaptation to happen where you're you're now knows breathing only and allowing your body to receive more oxygen in that way.
So so what are your recommendations in terms of literally as simple as a workout to the degree at which you can keep up with that nose breathing and allow yourself that time to to adapt? What's your recommendation there?
Typically know if it depends on the athlete that we're working with. If I'm working with a recreational, I will try and encourage them to breathe through the nose, through the entire process, in the nose, out the nose, in the nose, out in the nose to nose.
Yes. Now, if I'm working with an elite athlete, I'll pick times and I would like them to devote 50 percent of their training to Nasatir breathing. And there is a time when the intensity was an elite athlete that they will switch to my breathing and they have to do that to maintain muscle condition. Now, your ability to maintain days of breathing during physical exercise will also be influenced by nose and nostril airway size. Now you have a pretty well developed face.
You don't have a nose like mine, but a deviated septum. That fire by one nostril this time and the other one is slightly bigger. So for those individuals that may have a nose like mine, I'd suggest that you get a nasal dilator and it's just different nasal dilators on the market. And they are just little devices to help open up your nose.
But at least you won't be getting so frustrated that and that is for everyone listening to that little tape that goes on your nose, it just opens up your you know what I found to on that note, when I'm doing when I'm doing some intense stuff, I will smile like I will make I will make this smile. And I tell my my guys when we're doing that, like, smile, because that smiling opens up my my nose. Have you have you come across that at all?
Because it definitely works for me and it's not bad smiling and being intimidating for people. And when you're smiling, doing something hard and they're sweating what you were doing there, it looked as if you were doing what's called the Cotlar maneuver. So you have your hands, either side of your nose, of the lower parts of the nostrils, and you're just gently prizing the nostrils apart. And that was developed by the nose and throat doctor about 30 years ago, 40 years ago.
But I suppose. Yeah. And the dilator, there's air intake as well, which is a pretty good one. And there's other ones on the market. And then I would say to people, do a really good warm up and a good warm up should sustain go easy enough that you're walking or light movement, first of all, in and out through your nose. But don't hear your breathing. So don't have a belief that it's going to breathe because if you break big bridge or overbred, you can't get rid of too much carbon dioxide from the blood and just causes your blood vessels to constrict and just causes less oxygen to be delivered to to working muscles.
Bear in mind, if you intentionally force more air into your lungs, you are not oxygenating the body. You're you're you're not going to increase the oxygen saturation or if you do, it might be by one or two percent, but what you are doing is getting rid of too much carbon dioxide and that's reducing oxygen to the working muscles. So Neysa breathing, you could have your hands on either side of the lower two ribs. And as you breathe in, your ribs are moving now to Nazia.
Breathe out, your ribs are moving in. Then as you're moving and doing like movement starts slowing down the speed of your breathing. It's very good for the mind and it's very good as well that you're you're exposing your body to higher carbon dioxide. Now it does activate more parasympathetic response. A nasal breathing during physical exercise does activate more of a flow stage whereby you're relaxed and you're you're you're relaxed, but you're alert at the same time. So after a few minutes of that, we typically have athletes or recreational athletes going into a jog, witness or breathing.
And then what I do is I bring in two easy Bretholz. So I start jogging. I have them take a normal breath in and out through their nose, hold their nose and jog, holding our nose for about 10 or 15 paces, then let go breathe in through their nose. And about 30 seconds later, we do it again for about 10 to 15 paces. Now, after about a minute of light exercise, then I have them do really strong and long.
Bretholz and I have them as they are doing their warm up, take a normal breath in and out through the nose to nose and hold and are walking and then fast walk holding the breath brach jog, holding the breath, jog faster, holding the breath, keep relaxing into the body, keep going, keep pushing. And then when they need to let go when the air hunger is pretty strong let go. But get your breathing under control immediately and then wait a minute and do it again and we do it five reps.
So just to give you a nutshell, we spend typically about ten minutes with lateral expansion and contraction of the lower ribs, you know, light, slow, deep breathing. So those of you at the nineties generation LSD, and I'm sure you remember it so late, is about the biochemistry. Slow is about the cadence in terms of improving and increasing alveolar ventilation. And deep is about lateral expansion and contraction of the lower ribs. But then we want to stress the person so we have them to two easy Brito's just to prepare them and then we go into five strong Gretel's.
And the reason that we do the five strong prattles are it increases blood flow to the brain. That's one, because when you increase carbon dioxide in the blood, carbon dioxide is a vasodilation and that will increase blood flow to the brain. So even though you're holding your breath, your brain is actually getting increased blood flow and also increased oxygen because of a right shift of the oxygen oxygen dissociation curve. Another aspect is that you get spleen contraction. So we have a spleen.
Those of us who have spleen's intact and our spleen is located on the left side of the diaphragm and it contains about eight percent of our red blood cells. And it's really richly dense, packed red blood cells, 80 percent or haematocrit, like it's really good quality blood. When you do a breath hold for about 30 seconds or longer, your spleen will release red blood cells into circulation. Now, it's not known how long the released red blood cells stay in circulation before the spleen absorbs them, but it's thought to be ten minutes.
Dear inspectors were putting an extra load onto the breathing muscle, but also you'll open up your nose. So anybody with hay fever, anybody with bronchial problems. So during the warm up, I want to kind of put people through taking their attention. And to be honest with you, I got the idea first by giving when I was giving presentations, you know, 10 years ago, if I was asked to give a presentation to a large group of people, oftentimes health care professionals and the nurses would be there, even though, you know, I focusing on my breath, but at the same time, just the time that the nerves would be there.
So I'm saying, OK, I don't want to go out here and not being able to get a word out of my mouth. So what do I do with this one? So what I would do is I would typically meditate, would really slow breathing for about 20 minutes before presentation. But the only problem is I'd be too relaxed and I'd be calm but too relaxed. So then I would do a couple of easy pratfalls to stress myself and then I would do five strong pratfalls.
And that really puts you because it gets you from that down regulation. You're really being up regulated there and you're going up alert. So we want to do that for the athletes. But even the person training at a gym, you know, to do the same. So coming back to your question, we switch from Nazel to Tombak, breathing typically when we are breathing about thirty five to forty liters of air. And that's a fair volume of air, you know, that's, you know, so we can achieve a fair a quite a good work intensity.
I work great intensity. What of breathing. It's in around 85 to 90 percent. So if you devote all of your physical training to Nazel breathing, you will lose about 10 or 15 percent of your intensity in the initial few weeks. But if you keep doing it, you will surpass your surpass because it's all about, I suppose, quality. And yeah, it's really worth exploring. So yeah, if it gets to much switch from nose nose and if it gets really too high, the intensity, then you could go into nose and Outram out and then for a period of time into a motel room out.
And then when you reduce the intensity, go back to nose into nose, Outram out and then when the intensity drops again, back to nose, nose and then the recovery, same as the warm up, you know, hands on either side of the lower ribs. Any time that we are against our two breaths, don't breathe fast and shallow because again, we are wasting too much air in dead space. You know, if we are breathing rapid and shallow breathing or purchase breathing, all we are doing is about wasting.
About 50 percent of the air that we are taking in is staying in the Trocha, staying in the in the track and the bronchi. And it's not reaching the smaller. So if you want to recover, always kind of think of light, slow and deep breathing. Have your hands. Either side of the lower ribs as you breathe in, the ribs move out and as you breathe out, ribs move in and you recover quicker.
That way, you know, we're talking about the research is done on on issues, on severe issues and all of that stuff. But if you really look at it. Most people, especially from let's just look at the nose breathing, most people probably well over 90 percent of the people are definitely not nose breathing. So you're at a severe disadvantage to every Kaskade, every biological, every metabolism, every optimisation in your body, because you'll know that just by holding your breath and trying to hold your breath right now, you realize the importance of oxygen.
So if you're compromised from the very genesis of that mechanism and and it's funny that sleep also has become such a relevance in then in in our world right now.
Right. So there's sleep researchers. There's all of this stuff. But but but but the important marriage is this nose breathing aspect and the retraining and the UN training of the of the mouth breathing. So so as a, you know, a quick kind of way that people can start to move healthfully and effectively in changing their sleeping patterns, they have to look at this. And so what's the what's the best? Because I know this is going to come up.
We're going to get out the tape and and that's an aspect of it. So so I just break that down a little bit as to how people can because it's so important. They're unconscious, they're sleeping. And in order for their sleeping patterns to improve, they have to be nose breathing. So how do we go about that?
Yeah, first of all, start breathing through your nose during the day and start becoming really conscious of how you're breathing and if you are breathing fast and upper chest breathing, and if you're feeling caught for breath and you're feeling you're not getting enough air practice, some of the exercises that we spoke about a while ago, gently slow down your breathing and don't hold your breath to freeze your breathing while you're doing it. You just gently slowing down your breathing. What you want to do is you want to slow down your breathing to feel at tolerable air hunger.
And this will change your breathing pattern so that your breathing becomes lighter and slower and sleep. Now during sleep, make sure that you breathe in and out through your nose. And the only real way that you know this is if you wake up at a moist mouth in the morning. Now, just I'm going to say this and apologies to the female listeners. A man should wake up with two things. Number one is his mouth should be closed with the tongue and the roof of the mouth.
And he should also wake up one morning, what with an erection. And if it doesn't, it could signify that there's a problem with the heart. So that's really, really important. Regardless of age. Now you will see men. And the reason that men are men are more prone to obstructive sleep apnea stat statistically. Forty three percent of men over 50 years of age, almost one and two. And if you have a large neck size, so for example, greater than 16 inches, you're more prone to it.
So get the mouth closed. You should always wake up at whether weather moist in the morning. Now, Daryn, I disclose that we have our own tape. And the reason that we brought it out was we brought out a tape called my tape. We brought it out for children because we couldn't tape teenagers lips. And so we brought a tape that surrounds the mouth and brings the lips together. And for adults as well, because I can understand that many adults are going to be apprehensive about taping their lips.
But you could use anything, you know, if you want to use what we did use for 20 years, we were using three and one inch micropower tape that you'll get down in your drugstore if you're apprehensive about sealing your lips. And by the way, your nose will never fully block when your mouth is taped, because the more the wonderful thing about the human nose is, the more you use it, the better it works. And it is normal that when you're lying on your side that the nostril closest to the pillow slightly gets congested and this is normal.
And then you switch position and the other side gets so you're switching position anyway. So, yeah, I would say to I think the real elephant in the room for sleep quality, which doesn't get discussed, is the importance of nasal breathing. Any of you waking up at Hadhramaut in the morning and by the way, it's likely to be 50 percent of the people listening to this, 50 percent waking up in a dry mouth in the morning. They're not likely to wake up feeling refreshed, more likely to have had to go to the bathroom during the night.
And bad, Bret, associated with poor dental health and everything else associated with it in terms of mouth breathing is a stress activator. It's sympathetic, driven, you know, nasal breathing is really having a huge impact. And we know from people monitoring their their heart rate variability with orderings, et cetera, the feedback was when they got their mouth closed and breathing in an extra day knows that their sleep is deeper. They're waking up more alert, but they're more of the recovery is better.
So the Mayo tape, you'll see if you want to just to see what it looks like is myod tape dotcom. Now, did children's exercises, Daryn, are completely free. So if people go into YouTube and if they're put in my name, Patrick McKune, children's breathing, the entire program is completely free. Just nine exercises up there. The adults, if they wanted to see them, you can also practice them. But they are more they're more prone to to the kids because we wanted to put something out there for children that any child, regardless of income or regardless of parents income, we wanted it that a child could practice these exercises free of charge.
And, you know, because I think it's it's something that's so vitally important, that has been overlooked, like adults can make decisions and we can make choices on whether we want to take it on board or not. But for a young child who is there with the most open and a stuffy nose and any of the parents listening, if your child is a stuffy nose, just sit them down in front of the breathing exercise. Just little exercise there to decongest nose by holding the breath, gently nodding their head up and down.
And I did all of the exercises my daughter did I'm teaching with. So you understand that are safe because I'm hardly going to teach my own daughter if I thought was anything sinister. But yeah, you know, the information is all out there and the research is really getting out there. Now, the research and this is the wonderful thing about it, because how is this comes back to what we spoke about a. The very start, is this going to change, it is going to change, Daryn, but it's not going to change within the medical profession.
First, it's going to change with the mothers and fathers and grandmothers and grandfathers and sons and daughters. And they are going to be the drivers of change when they put it into practice. Now, in saying that we have the likes of Dr. William hanging from Agoura Hills in California, we've got Maneater Mark more joy, more, just some absolutely tremendous people putting it out there. Leadership usque you know, Kevin Boyd, like the list goes on and on and on, tremendous people.
And, you know, we're all in on the fact that we're all in this together.
I just want to say I'm so grateful for you because I know what it's like to spend kind of a lifetime doing something and you kind of beat on walls and you want to scream it from the mountaintops. But at the same time, you still continue. And to see it, the maturation of what you've been doing for a long time kind of being heard and being applied is phenomenal. And so I just want to thank you for solving your issues, but then also taking that message to the globe.
And again, I just want to help you do that. So.
Well, that's super done. Thanks so much. Of course, man. So, dude, so much to talk about here and we'll get you on again. I just really appreciate what you've done and the time today. And I'm so stoked for the people to hear this message that haven't heard it on this podcast. So thank you for you and thank you for the message that you've brought to the world.
Thanks so much and thanks for what a fantastic episode. So tell me, what is one thing you've got out of today's conversation? If this episode struck a chord with you and you want to dive a little deeper into my other conversations with incredible guests, you can head over to my website, Derrinallum Dotcom, for more episodes and in-depth articles. Keep diving, my friends. Keep diving. This episode is produced by my team at Must Amplify, an audio marketing company that specializes in giving a voice to a brand and making sure the right people hear it.
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