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Coming up on the Dr. John Deloney Show.


Trying to start this whole new life moving across the country, trying to break into an industry that feels impossible without having prior connections. And I'm terrified that, as I've heard you say before, me will follow me.


I'm going to tell you right now, if that's your mindset, it's going to eat you alive. It's going to kill you. We are back. It's the Dr. John Deloney Show. Kelly, I can see I'm loving this music, man.


That's what we were just saying. As soon as it starts, we just immediately...


It's so good. I sat down with Jason. I was like, Listen, this has to groove.


It does. I'm not even paying attention. I'm doing something else, and immediately I'm like, just...


Yeah. Hey, can we just... I know we're getting to the show. It's about marriages and relationships, mental health, and all that.


Be careful if I was about to say what I think you're about to say.


I was about to say about this morning.


I know, but I don't think we should.


About who I got to meet this morning?


No, that's fine. Not who you texted me about. No. Let's not say anything about that just yet.


All right, so here this is important. People have said, Hey, we love to see some more interviews. We love them. I have a very nontraditional list of people that I'm interested. One of them wrote back last night and was like, I'm in.


I now have his phone number.


Kelly is what some would call a stalker. But now this morning, I show up to work, and they're like, Hey, Deloney, we need you to come meet this guy backstage. And by the way, I knew he was coming because I brought one of my guitars so he could sign it. But one of my childhood guitar heroes, Brian Welch from Korn, was here today because that's just where we work, right?


That's what we do, yeah. That's just where we work. The first time he came, which was, gosh, probably 10 years ago, it was in our old building. I'm walking across the street to go to Devo, and I see this guy standing outside, and he's pretty distinctive. He Clearly, it doesn't work here. I was standing there and this guy was out there smoking a cigarette, and I was like, Is that Ed Welch?




Surely not, because why would he be here? I just was thinking, Okay, wow, we just hired a guy that looks just like him. When he walked on stage, but gosh, his story is just so- It's amazing.


He's just an amazing guy. It's incredible.




Yeah. And just getting to sit backstage and talk shop. I don't know. I don't know. We can share or not share, but what their projects are working on, all that stuff. It was just awesome. Here's the thing. I didn't get to say this much this morning. I remember very clearly, ugly Kid Joe. Remember that song, I hate everything about you, Bethany?


Yeah, such a great song.


But they were wearing jams, like shorts and T-shirts. That was the first band that did that because everyone was wearing leather or flannel. I was like, Those guys look like me. I remember that stamp like, Oh, you could do that. Then I remember Phil Anselmo on the walk video with Pantera walking out, shaved head and just being like, Listen here. I was like, I want that. Then the third one of those is when Corn came out with the song Blind. The video was real dark, and these dudes had tuned their guitars all the way down. They'd added another string, and they are adding a groove that I didn't know was possible in metal. Those are the three stamps when I was like, I'm going to do that. Now, clearly, I've gone sideways because now I run a semi-okay podcast. We're talking about mental health, right? I spent my years in… But inside my soul, I'm in a famous metal band or a punk band. This this morning was like my little… Backstage, they were like, What's wrong with you, Deloney? I just don't get star-stripped. And today I was, man. What a special day. Welcome to the Dr.


John Deloney show. They're probably going to edit all of that out because I'm still fanboying and glowing. But we're so glad that you're here. We talk about mental health, talk about your emotional health. When you get to meet childhood heroes and you just stammer on like an idiot. But so glad that you're here. If you want to be on the show, here's the deal. Show is real people going through real challenges in their life. It's tough stuff. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's really gnarly. But my promise is, I've been doing this for two decades, sitting with people when they're hurting, and we're going to figure out what the next right step is. If you want to be on the show, give me a buzz at 1-844-693-3291. 1-844-693-3291, or go to JohnDaloney. Com/askask. All right, let's get to it. Let's go out to Lexington, Kentucky, and talk Kayla. Hey, Kayla, what's up?


Hi. Thank you for taking my call.


Of course. Hey, you had to be on the phone for a long time, sit through all the ads, me talking about meeting Corn this morning. So thank you for being patient.


Of course. That's fine. What's up? I'll just get right to it. My question is, how do I move on with my life without regret after cutting off contact with my mom?


I can tell you right now, you don't. Regret is going to be part of this journey. What happened? I know. What a bum way to start to start like, you don't. Tell me about it. What happened with your mom?


I come from a long line of generational sexual trauma. I was sexually abused by my dad from the age of five till about 13. But I mean, The end game doesn't matter.


Every step matters. It does. I'm sorry.


But thank you.


Hold on, I don't want to leave yet. As the dad of a daughter who I can't breathe if she's not okay, I need you to know I was wrong, and I'm sorry. On behalf of dads everywhere, I'm so sorry.


Well, thank you. I appreciate that.


Your dad should have loved you as much as I love my little girl. I'm sorry.


Now I have a little girl who is the same age I was when all the trauma started. It's all getting- Yep.


I bet your body is lit up like a Christmas tree, huh?


Exactly. Yeah. I've actually started the prosecution process.


Oh, so you're going for it?


I'm going for it, yeah. I've realized that I'm breaking the generational curse that has been set on my family. But yeah, so as everything has been coming out and talking, I've realized that my mom has not taken the steps that I would take for my daughter now. I just have had a lot of resentment towards her. She found out in eighth grade what was going on, and she stayed with him until I finally, again, was like, Listen, I can't do this anymore. I was 21, and I was like, I got to start getting myself better, and I can't while he's in my life. They ended up divorcing. Now, as an adult, I had asked her what was going on? Please try and help me realize why you didn't leave him at the time. She told me that, Well, apparently, I, as an eighth grader, told her that I didn't want to ruin spring break plans.


I need you to hear what I'm going to say very, very clearly, okay? Hopefully, a therapist has told you this, but often I find that doesn't happen. Powerful life-altering nervous system-changing trauma happens when one of your parents sexually abuses you. Earth-shattering, nervous system-transforming trauma happens when you get the to tell another adult, and they do nothing.




I put your mom's violence up right beneath your dad's. What your dad did is evil and wrong and it's disgusting. There's a grotesqueness to it because it's so vulgar.




What your mom did was evil. Because there's a little girl coming to mom and saying, Will you protect me? And she said, No. I'm sticking with the monster.




Then all these years later, when you get the courage to go, Mom, what happened? She blames you?




I'm coming out of my skin right now and I'm trying to be cool. But I hate this happened to you. Actually, I'm going to change what I said earlier. You're not going to regret this forever. I was wrong. I was 100% wrong. That's what I get for talking too fast.


I screwed that I think I'm just battling with… She's been, obviously, in my daughter's life until just last October. Now, I'm just struggling with the How do I juggle? And thankfully, my daughter has not asked about her. She just is going on, but I can tell she can feel the hostile tension that I'm going through right now. I'm just trying to be the best wife and mom that I can without letting the trauma completely take over.


Here's a couple of really important things. I want to get this out of the way. With all 100% certainty, you need to have a professional walk with you through this, okay?




All right. I want you to go to look in your local area for a trauma-informed therapist, okay? Okay. That's a special training that people go through. Sometimes it's an entire program that they go through, but it's a way of looking at responses that makes sense. It's really where... I mean, that was a lot of my training was there, and that's why I tell people, No, you're not broken. Your body's working great, considering what happened to you. That's number one. I want to put that off to the side for a second. How old is your daughter?


She's five. Okay.


Your gut instinct is going to be to shield and protect her.




What she is going to do is she's going to absorb the tension that you are feeling re walking through hell. You're walking through it with a sword this time, but it's still going to be back through hell. You're going to have to go through old memories. You're going to get deposed. You're going to have your dad's lawyer, if he decides to be even a further pathetic coward, decides to get one and try to fight you and call you a liar. You're going to have to go through all those old stories and have people question your integrity and go through old high school boyfriend. You're going to have to go through all that. The problem is, if you're not, you're going to be walking a fine line. I'll talk you through it here, but you're going to have to let your daughter know that the tension you are experiencing has zero to do with her. Otherwise, she's going to do what you did, which is feel that tension in the home, make it your problem to solve.




That regret you feel is you have been protecting your mom your whole life. You've been making sure your mom is okay or doesn't get mad or doesn't find out your whole life Because when your mom says, No, I'm good. I'm going to stay with them. That little girl doesn't immediately go, My mom is evil. It goes, Oh, what did I do? How do I fix this? That was never your job to fix. But what we don't want to do, that's how trauma gets transferred. Either the act goes with it. You abuse somebody, which you're never going to do, or that inner chaos, that inner turmoil that You are fighting and scratching and claw every second of every day to give your daughter something you didn't have. But that angst and tension she absorbs. It's letting her know mommy is really scared today. She has to go do some large scary things. What, mom? I have to have some scary conversations with some big grownups that were mean to me when I were little. What happened? Well, that's grown up stuff. But I want you to know that every day I wake up, I'm so grateful that God let me be your mommy.


You see what I'm saying? What we're doing is we're going to normalize. Sometimes your body feels, especially when you're doing scary, hard stuff, your body reacts a certain way. That's normal. That does not impact my love for you. It's going to be weird for you talking through it because no one's ever muddled I'll do that for you. Ever. You don't want to go too far and be like, your grandfather. She's not ready for that because she's five. There will become a season. There will become time when you tell your story to your daughter. It's just not now. Tell me about your mom now. Is she fighting you? Does she want to see her? Is she giving you grief about babies? How is all that working out?


No, I think I talked to my brother a few days ago, and he saw her over New Year's, and I guess she told him that, well, she thought it was going to be a little bit hard at first, but it's not as hard as she thought having me cut her off. That was, I guess, the cherry on the cake for me is…


Such a coward. I don't know. What an absolute coward. I don't mean I don't mean to talk bad about your mom, but I sure mean to talk bad about your mom.






It's just a smack in the face because it's like, Okay, I understand. It all came to a head when I… She's remarried now, and One of my stepsisters was actually dating a pedophile. We all went to the wedding and come to find out. I didn't know any of this. She, I guess, just let me bring my daughter around a pedophile, and everybody knew except me. Come to find out, they were all like, Oh, no, we can't tell her. We can't tell her what's going on. But yeah, I just There's just been so many different layers. With that, finding out that she knew that there was a pedophile present who was on the sex offender's list and didn't feel the need to tell me so I could take the actions into my own hands, whether that be not going to the wedding or something. That's when I was like, Okay, I've known my whole life that I wasn't going to be protected by anybody. Now that I'm an adult, I can protect myself, and now it's my job to protect my daughter.


Good, dude. You have turned it. This is what that looks like. I need you to hear me, Kaylee. You have changed everything. This is what that looks like. As the great Terrence Reale, he says it. It's just dark. Oh, it's brutal. Here's what he says, and I love this quote. I'm going to butcher it a little bit, but family trauma rolls down a hill like a forest fire until one brave soul stops and turns and stares it down and gives peace to future ancestors they may never know. What gets left out of that famous quote is, and again, I messed it up, but that sentiment is, a person who stops and stares down a forest fire gets burned badly, and that's you. You have to deal with the pain of your mom going, Yeah, I don't care. He was sleeping with my husband when she was young. Good for her. You got to deal with a mom that didn't even step between you and a monster. She chose a monster. You got to... All of it. I could just go through. I'm not going to torture you with that. Then you have the brother going, Well, I don't know, man, or the sister being like, Well, come on.


This is what staring down a forest fire looks like. I think the pain you are feeling is grief. I don't know that you've ever been allowed to sit in grief because you've been too busy trying to keep yourself safe.




Is your husband a good man?


Yes, he is. He's the one that introduced me to your show.


Yeah, he's- He's amazing then. He must be the best guy ever. When you're safe, you can grieve. Here's why that's going to be hard for you. Grief would get you hurt in the past. You didn't have time for grief. You were too busy trying to protect yourself from the two freaking people who are supposed to love you the most. This pain you feel isn't regret. It might feel bad, if you will, but just because it hurts doesn't mean it's not the exact right thing. I'm pretty slow on the just cut people up. I'm telling you right now, I don't see a path forward where I would ever talk to that woman again.




What that means is you got to live in a world where your mom's not going to be there for you because she opted out. Hear me very clearly. You did not sever this relationship she did. She left you. If someone's in your home and they smash up your house and they run out at the front door and get in their car and leave, just because you closed the door doesn't mean you kicked them out. All you're doing here is closing the door. Your mom's burned your house to the ground enough. She got in her car with a monster and took off. What it looks like now moving forward is just a season of halacious grief. It's going to suck.




That's why I need you to promise me you're going to get with a trauma counselor who will walk with you. I'm going to send you my book, Own your past, Change your future. It's about this very thing, not sexual abuse as much as when everything falls apart. I had this picture of what my life was going to look like in this scary, scary question, What am I going to do now? And dude, you're already there. You're sitting with police officers. You're going to make sure this man cannot hurt any more people moving forward and is held accountable for what he did in the past. You're on your way. But we often see the bravery story and the strength story, and we don't realize how lonely that is or how scary that is or how much that hurts. That's a part of this journey, too. I want you to also pick up a book called Finding Meaning by David Kessler. It's the best book on grief I've ever read. It's a masterpiece. But it will walk you through some steps. I talk about all the time writing yourself letters, making sure you have a daily journaling practice, making sure you've got somebody that you can call in the middle of the night.


As this stuff starts to resurface, it's going to be gnarly. As your daughter continues to enter into ages when this stuff happened to you, your body has put a GPS pin in that, and it's going to go, young girl, young girl, look out. It's just going to start radiating, and people are going to come over, well-meaning people, kind people and your body is going to just be alarm central. It's okay. You're not broken. It's normal. There's nothing wrong with you. But we do need to do the work to learn a new way to respond to some of those things. It's just part of where you're at. But I don't think you're going to feel regret. What you're doing is right. You didn't kick anybody out. They burned your house down and walked out. With the remaining door frame, you just closed the door. I'm proud of you, Kyla. I'm proud of you. Hang on, we'll get you hooked up. We'll be right back. Hey, it's Deloney. Lent is one of the cornerstones of the Christian faith, and it's got a bad rap over the years. People think it's just like a month in a week, like 40 days of giving up a thing like candy or alcohol or whatever until we can get to Easter and we can finally get back to poisoning ourselves with junk food or staying up too late or whatever bad habits we tried to cut out.


Lent is so, so much more than just abstaining from some vice. Lent is about entering into a season of 40 days of reflection, prayer, and yes, fasting. It's about finding meaning, purpose, discipline, and finding connection with God, and finally letting go of trying to control everything. If you've grown up in a Christian faith and you've heard about Lent and you want to jump in with both feet this year, or if you're not a person of faith and you're always wondering what your coworkers are talking about during the season, my friends at Hallow have created the 40-day Lent prayer challenge. It's going to be an incredible 40 days, meditating on the theme of surrender. It's going to be led by Mark Wallberg. Yes, that Mark Wallberg, Jonathan Rumi, and more. There's going to be Lent theme music, stories, prayers, and even special things for your kids. I personally am going to take on the challenge, and I hope you'll join me and millions of others across the globe. Hallow is the number one prayer app in the world. For listeners of this show, you get three free months of Hallow, all 10,000 plus prayers, meditations, music, the lecture series, all of it by going to hallo.


Com/delonie. That's three free months of the app at hallow, H-A-L-L-O-W. Com/delonie. All right, we're back. Let's go out to Minneapolis. I said it right? Not Minneapolis.


Oh, that's true. You have done that before. Minneapolis.


Oh, that's true. You've done that before. A few times have you scoled me more.


Yeah, Minneapolis. It is Mini-Apple. Mini-little-apple.


Minneapolis. Home of the twins. Home of the Vikings. The great Kirby Pucket. The Vikings. Yes. And just cold, coldness. Our friend Nathan. What's up, Nathan?


Dude, what's up, man? It's crazy to talk to you.


It's crazier to talk to you, dude. What's up?


Oh, man. Before I say my piece, I just got to say I saw you on the Iced Coffee Hour, and that's how I found out about you. I was just like, Who is this ex Navy seal-looking tattooed guy talking about empathy and feelings? I'm confused, but I love it.


I appreciate it. I'm far from an ex-Navy seal. My buddies here in the Seals remind me you are not us. They don't even need to remind me. They just can walk by me and my body's like, ouch. So no, I'm good. But I love those dudes in an ice coffee. Those guys are great, man. So thank you so much for being with us. What's up?


Yeah. So it's going to sound like a quick ramble, but I just have these four bullet points I wrote down just because I'm a little nervous. So I'm just going to try and get these off real quick. Go for it. So I've always struggled with making new friends because I cling on to connections I already have, but I'm starting to grow apart from a lot of them. I had friends in high school, went to college, immediately met a group, but they started to fade into their own lives and social circles as the years progressed. Then COVID happened towards the end of my college career. And I never really branched out. After living at home for a few years and being close to paying off all my student loans, I've decided to go for a long-time dream of moving out of state to Austin, Texas, and pursuing a career in filmmaking. My brain loves to overthink and analyze every aspect of making the right decision, and it's paralyzing me. I'm scared. I'm not I'm interesting, smart, funny, or charismatic enough to build the life I'm proud of once I move across the country. I also feel like I've never quite fully connected to a community.


I always see the differences in me and them before I see the similarities. I'm 25 years old, never been in a serious relationship, trying to start this whole new life moving across the country, trying to break into an industry that feels impossible without having prior connections. I'm terrified that, as I've heard you say before, me will follow me.


So what's your question, man? That's a lot there, dude. Thanks for sharing that.


Yeah, I guess my question is, I How do I build confidence in myself that I have the ability to, I guess, achieve what I want to achieve and actually make some new friends in a completely new place? Because it's terrifying thinking about moving across the country and not knowing a single person. But it's just something that I feel like I have to do.


We have this myth about confidence. Confidence isn't something I can give you. Confidence is your body's accumulated evidence. I would ask you, have you been in situations before that you thought this is scary, and then you went and did it, knocked it out?


Yeah, I guess I have. Yeah, I guess. I don't know. I've always been, socially, I've always been afraid that I'm not interesting or funny enough to get people to like me.


What does that mean? What is interesting or funny? Because Dude, in the top several friends on planet Earth, I have. One is a banker.


You know what I mean? Okay.


He's one of my closest friends on planet He is my closest friend because he is an anchor into granite. He has the same haircut he's had since he was four. He pays his bills on time always? What? His networth comically surpasses mine because he just keeps making a great salary every year and doesn't spend it because he doesn't need it. He wears the same jeans, he wears the same shirt. He's He is stable. I wouldn't put him on my list of most interesting or funiest. He is hilarious, but in a very different way, not in a way that's going to end up on starting out live. I could go down the list of my closest friends. What you're talking about is a performance, and that's not how friendship works. If you turn human connection into a show, you will always go home lonely.


Oh, man. Yeah, I feel like I do that a lot.


Here's the root question here. Why do you not like Nathan so much? I don't want to oversell it. You hate Nathan. You're doing everything you can to not be Nathan. Why?


Yeah. I guess it goes back to how I grew up, and I guess I realized I had this anxious attachment style and this just codependency, and I never really- Okay, hold on.


I don't know. You just threw two buzzwords at me, and I'm going to keep digging on you. Is that okay? Yeah. And this is going to help the listener, too, because there's millions and millions of people that are like, Oh, I just have this attachment style. That's fine. Or I'm this Integro number, or I'm codependent, or, I'm OCD or I'm anxious, those are all real, very, very real. But I want to get beneath that. Why don't you like you?


I guess I just observe myself trying to get people to like me, and then I just become disgusted with myself.


Okay, but the way you just described that, you are watching a movie of your own life. You're not acting in Why aren't you the star of your own movie?


Yeah, that's a good question. I think... I don't know. It might have to do something with how I grew up. I grew up... I still live with my parents, and it's hard to get some perspective on this because we get along great now. But I grew up with it a very explosive dad in terms of his anger.


That explains the anxious attachment, right?


Yeah, I guess. Then my mom- Hold on.


Don't guess. If the one man who was put here on planet Earth to walk you through life, to model for you what love looks like, what masculinity looks like, what provision is showing up, and strength looks like, and vulnerability and care. You're actually tethered to a wild dog. You spend your whole childhood singing and dancing and performing so that you don't get bit. Fair?


Yeah, that's a good way of putting it.


You've taken that same skillset and tried to get some girl to love you like that, and tried to get a group of guys in a dorm to like you like that. And what they're looking at is a cool guy who's pretty smart and artistic and has big dreams for himself. And then why are you singing and dancing, dude? Just get a drink and chip. You see what I'm saying?


Yeah. I feel like I've been singing and dancing my whole life.


That's it. You have. And I'm telling you right now, if you hop in to go... What you said, I want you to pay very close attention to your words, and it's important. You don't know if you can cut it and go be a part of an industry. I'm going to tell you right now, if that's your mindset, it's going to eat you alive. It's going to kill you. Because the filmmakers don't join filmmaking to become part of an industry. The woman Sarah, who edits my show, is one of the most extraordinary cinephiles I've ever met. She gets up before work and edits. After she gets off of editing my show all day, she goes home and makes her own Movies. Why? Not to be part of the industry. She works on my show to pay bills. She is obsessed with storytelling and filmmaking and how it all works and how she can bring somebody from A to B through a story.




That's different than, I want to go make it in an industry. Because right now in this season, she's having to work on my crappy show to pay bills. I will be begging her for film work one day when she goes and becomes a famous director. I promise you. Because that's her world. Does that make sense?


Yeah, it does. I do love storytelling. I look at it like, oh, I'm on the outside looking in. I feel like that's how I always feel about certain communities. I'm on the outside looking in.


Okay, but here's what's really important. You have to get a gang of people where you can just be Nathan.




And as a guy who loves '80s hair metal and punk rock, and I'm a Christian, and I'm real into fitness, and I'm covered in tattoos, and I like hunting, and I drive a Prius, for God's sakes. Well, now I moved up to a hybrid Highlander, which is really great for putting groceries in. I don't fit anywhere. And I happen to have two PhDs because I'm a nerd, too. You're just as much likely to catch me at a academic lecture here in Nashville, Tennessee, over at Belmont or Vanderbilt, as you are to catch me in the mosh pit at the Turnstile show. Listen, my friends love me because that dude's just a weird man. That's just who that dude is. Does that make sense?


Yeah, it does. I've always felt like, oh, I don't know if I can be a part of this Christian community because I don't know my faith is as strong as them. I don't know if I can be a part of these guys. These guys like to party away more than I do. I always see the differences in every community I step into.


Here's your exercise.


I don't want to feel isolated.


Here's your exercise. I want you to do an experiment. No, it's not really experiment. I want you to do some work, and you might have to get counselor. I hired somebody this to help me with a project like this. What are your values?




Your beliefs are going to change. I hope your beliefs change your whole life. That's why you make movies. That's why you go to the movies. That's why you read books. That's why you listen to podcast. So A thing you thought over here is challenged over here. That's awesome. But my values are in concrete. They're in stone.




And so what does that mean? I don't do drugs, man. I never have. So I hang out with people all the all time that have very different lives than me and have very different choices for what they choose to put in their body. It's not even a thing, right? Because I have a set of values here. I'm also going to tell you this. If I had had this level of success when I was 28, I wouldn't have made it. I'd have blown the whole thing up.


Okay? Oh, wow.


I wasn't ready for it. Here's what I want you to hear me say. I'm going to give you a couple of really quick things, and I don't want you to internalize this, and then I want you to go do the next crazy thing. All right?




Here's number one. I want you to get unfathomably good at the thing you want to do. People over-dramatize it. Become the guy who always takes pictures at family gatherings. Become the guy who takes pictures at his local church of families. You know why? Because you're getting good at dealing with people and getting them to be where you want them to be. You help tell a story through their photographs, and you deal with difficult people and winding kids and dramatic adults, and you learn how lenses work. That's filmmaking, my friend. Write every single day, every day of your life. Wow. Okay? Here's the scary thing I learned. I went as hard as I could to get a master's degree and a PhD Because that's what I thought I had to have, to have credibility. I'll never forget the first conversation I had with a woman who had been sexually assaulted, and I was fumbling for the things to say. I remember thinking, Oh, that's what's important, not my degree on the wall, because that's not helping this woman. I really spent the next, hear me, decade of my life learning what to say when everything had fallen apart in somebody's life.


Then, dude, I happened along another degree along the way. Who cares? But my pursuit was not another piece of paper. My pursuit was not a job title or a place at this university or in your case, in the industry. My place was, there will not come a situation where somebody's fallen apart that I can't show up and be a moment of grace, a moment of peace, and give them some direction on what they could do next. I became really good at my job, not at the external stuff. Learn how lenses work. Learn how storytelling works. Do it everywhere, right?




Always. What you might find is that, dude, I like movies. I don't want to make them. That's a pain. Or you may find, dude, I am all in on this. The second thing is, is your body is going to feel anxious if you don't have money, if you can't eat, if you're not safe. I know the old saying is like, just go for broke. That's how you get broke. You're going to have to work jobs you don't like. You're going to have to work jobs that you think are different. Or like, Sarah, you're going to find a job that's industry where you learn how the whole thing works and you do your thing that you love at night. You're 25. This is going to happen for a long, long, long, long time. When you get to Austin, say yes to every single project you possibly can. I'll carry water, I'll do coffee, I'll be a grip, I'll be a whatever, fill in the blank, go through all those things. Keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it, keep doing it. The third thing is stop trying to find out where to get confidence and go do things that prove to your body that you can.


I can't overcome challenges. I don't feel confident. Cool. I'm going to start a daily exercise practice, and I'm going to become the most trustworthy person I know because I tell myself the truth. Because when I say I'm going to work out today, I go work out. I'm going to go do it. I'm going to get it done. Now we're cooking. You're going to have to make peace, probably with some professional help over time. Maybe not, but probably. With the fact that your nervous system is wired into love as a show, as a performance. I want you to practice just being your weird self. Just be your weird self. You're exactly as you were made to be in your experiences, and you're going to get weirder the further you If you go to Austin, I got tons of friends in the 512, you're going to get weird. That's the name of the town. Austin is weird. It's not about being the funiest. It's not about being the best dressed. It's not about being the most clever. It's about being you. The people in my life who I love, love, love, love are radically different than me.


I wouldn't call them the funiest. I wouldn't call them the silliest. I wouldn't call them the most prepared or the best looking or whatever. My friend Craig is way cleverer than me. My friend Todd is smarter than me. My friend John lets me know, Oh, that's going to be funny on stage, or that's not funny. Those guys all do the thing that I do better than me, but it's in a weird, over dinner, quiet, bankery, finance guy, air conditioning guy way. Go be you. The world doesn't need you to look like somebody else. That job is already taken. The world needs you. And I know that's something you stitch in a pillow, but I mean it with all my heart. Go be weird, Nathan. We'll be right back. This episode is sponsored by Better Health. Hey, it's Jeloni. Some people think relationships are going to be easy if they're going to be right. That's almost never true. Great relationships get that way because both people put in the work to make them great. And therapy can be a place to work through the challenges you face in all of your relationships, whether with friends, people at work, your romantic partner, or even how you get along with yourself.


If you're thinking about starting therapy, I want you to try better help. Because therapy isn't just for people who've experienced trauma. It's great for building skills so you can be the best version of yourself, so you can show up in those relationships and do your part to make the relationship great. Betterhelp is completely online, so it's flexible enough to fit your schedule. Just fill out a short questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist, and you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. Find the path forward to make all of your relationships incredible. Visit betterhelp. Com delonie today to get 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P. Com/delonie. All right, let's go out to Appomatix, Virginia, and talk to Keith. Hey, brother Keith. How's it going? What's up, man? I'm doing great. How about you?


I'm freezing. We had a nice little rainstorm last night. We got a half day of school, but it's chilly right now.


There you go. We have the tail end of it down here, but nothing like you guys got. So glad you all are all right. What's up, brother?


I am a coach of two college athletes. They're my sons. I don't coach them, but I am also a Office of coach here in the area. And these guys have been playing football ever since they could breathe.


They're your biological sons, and they play football, too? Yes. Okay. All right. Great. Okay.


And I've coached them since they were little, little, little. And now they're being coached by someone else. Awesome. Yeah. One son transferred from a university to a D1 school to a D2 school, and they're both now playing in the same university, which is really, really cool. Shaves on gas. There you go. So that's been awesome. For the first couple of years, they played quite a bit. And this year, for some reason, they have not played as much. My older son, who's a tight-end, hasn't played at all, practically. And my other son had an injury in the first game and just couldn't get back on the field for a lot of different reasons that I knew about and some things I didn't. The question is, how do I handle this frustration, this turned into anger over them not playing to the point where I was unable to sleep I was not angry toward my wife or my daughter who are still, we're all together and we're still living in the same house. But man, I was just for the last six months, a pain in the butt, and especially traveling up and watching them. I know this is a different question.


No, I was a coach. I get it. And I'm a dad. I get it. I'll just cut to the chase. I say for some reason, I get it, and it happens very organically, but you have tied your identity to their performance. And, bro, it's going to drown you. Actually, here's what it's going to do. It's going to burn your relationship with them. It's going to sever it, ultimately. And you all have had this one bond, this connection for so long. It's going to sever it, and it's going to be a lifetime of trying to repair it. And you and I both know old grizzled coaches whose kids don't want to come home. You and I both know old grizzled coaches. Their knees don't work. They got that weird shoulder. They always got a dip in their mouth, and their grandkids are awkward around them. You and I both know those dudes, right? Yes. Yes. Why is it... This This isn't about your boys, because you know football in many ways is a meritocracy. That coach, that college coach, he has to win to keep his job, so he's going to put the best players on the field.




For some reason, your boy's not playing is making you feel less than. Why is that?


I played at a school here locally and was in all America and what was supposed to be drafted in the third round. So there were three teams that are interested in me. And so when the time came to be recruited or they called before the draft, the majority of our coaching staff said, Yes, he will be a great asset to your team. Well, the head coach said no. Well, he was the most experienced coach out of all of them. He was an NFL Well-experienced guy, and he was trusted in the community. When he said no, they didn't draft me or give me a free agent shot. At that point, I felt that no one stood up for me.


Okay. Can I challenge you for a second?


Yes, sir.


You and I also know of athletes who go to jail, who get DWIs, who are under sexual assault investigations, who get drafted and drafted, and drafted, and drafted, and drafted, and drafted. Okay. Is there a chance that it didn't work out Instead of dealing with the grief of, I had this dream and it didn't work out, I had this picture of my life, what it was going to look like. It has been easier to take that whole dump truck full of crap and pain and dump it on one dude. Who, yeah, he may have tanked you. There's no question. That's happened. No question. But is there a possibility that it didn't work out? A second more important question is, dude, I can hear it in your voice. What is hanging on to that getting you right now?


Well, I think since the way I looked at it, and I know I called or I asked this question a couple of months ago. There's some things that I've done to work through it and- Hold on, you're avoiding my question, Coach.


Is that possible? That the story you've told yourself you weren't as good as you thought you were?


Oh, no. No, no. This is going to sound really arrogant, but I was good enough to play.


I find that hard to believe because those dudes have to win to make money. If you were the best guy, they would have figured it out because they figured it out for drug addicts and for former people who've committed this assault. They figured it out.


I mean, that could have been a possibility. I mean, I've just had friends who played in the NFL at that particular time that agreed with me and the other coaches of why it didn't happen.




I mean, the fact of it is there were too many people that were telling me that I should be playing.


Okay. But do you realize the step between... And I'm saying this with a smile on my face. If you were here, I'd be ribbing you. But there's a very Uncle Rico aspect to this, right? Because there's that waking up and it should have been, it should have been, it should have been, it could have been. And your whole life is passing you by like a train. And then you try to relive it with your boys.


Yes, I totally 100% agree with that. As far as passing by, different opportunities, getting my degree late, and then now just starting to do the things that I think God has for me to do. It's become really, really awesome with the things that he's allowed me to do right now. A lot of it has Just move forward. Like I said, I put a lot of things that you had said a couple of months ago, and I asked this question and read the book and did a lot of cool things and started to realize some things about myself. Maybe not the question that you asked the first time, but that could be definitely a reality. But the other stuff, I think I'm starting to move forward through that stuff. That's awesome.


I'm super proud of you. Tell me about your anger with your boys. Are you mad at them? Are you mad at the coaches? Are you mad at the universe? Who are you mad at?


I'm mad at the coaches. The boys I love dearly, and we've sat and talked about this in-depth, and I've explained to them that this is not about them. This is about me, and that I need to accept and love and enjoy them no matter what they do. And if they stand, they stand. If they play, they play. But I have to enjoy them and love them regardless. I think that has done really well in the last several months. But man, they just knew that I was not happy.


Yeah. Then you see that they start trying to get on the field or cut corners or not tell the trainer just how bad they're hurt or whatever, not because they have this innate lunacy to win. You and I have both been on athletes there. It's different than me. I remember being around a fighter during my training days, and one guy went pro, and I was like, Yeah, that guy was very different than me. You know those guys. But they start... Yeah. No, go ahead. They start trying to get on the field so that you'll chill out. Yeah. All right?


Yeah. They tried. There was this particular situation where Trey should have run on the field, and he didn't. I was like, What are you doing? God, No. But I get really anxious, and I'm looking forward to seeing how I handle this and move through it with different techniques that I've tried so far. They have one more year to play, so I'm excited to see how this looks.


Hey, I'm going to challenge you. You ready for my challenge?


Yes, sir.


All right, here's challenge number one. I want you to go to the games, and I want you to not wear the jersey. Here's why. Because I'm afraid that you are cheering in that you want your boys to do well, and everyone in the audience is going to look at you, and the stands are going to look at you. That's my boy.


Yeah, that's 100% right.


It's not about you. It's about their life. One of those boys, at some point, is going to come to you and say, Dad, I never really wanted to play. He won't fully mean that, but it will come out if it hasn't already.




I also want you to take an honest inventory because as you've told me your story, as you've told me their story, it all hinges on this one guy who just screwed us. I've just been around long enough. That does happen, dude. It does happen. But there's a lot of miserable people, whether it's a politician, whether it's an ex-wife, whether it's a coach or a teacher or a professor or whatever. If it wasn't for this one person or this one situation, and I always want to say, Dude, what are you going to do next?




The more you hang on to that past injustice in the present, the more you choose, I'm going to make right now suck. What a weird thing. You've told your players for years, you got to shake off that last play. Let's get back in there.




What I want to tell you is, yeah, I was good enough to play. I was. It didn't work out for me. Cool. Right?


Yeah. No, that's right. What other That's why I tell my kids when I coach them.


I know. Trust me, dude. I see a counselor myself because it's hard. It's easier to tell other people. Same with your boys. Same with your boys. I want you to ask yourself this hard question, too. How much of the coaching and the football and the relationship proxy, if you will, I can be around my boys. I'm going to be their coach. I'm going to be their this, I'm going to be their this. I often find dads, myself included, is that's an easy... I know how to do that thing, so I'm going to do that thing really well because I don't know how to do the other thing, which is to sit and read a book, which is to be... I don't know how to hug you when you got hurt, but I know my coach said, just shake it off. So I just start repeating stuff. My guess is, I don't want to say that the time has been wasted. It's been Your boys have gotten a dream. They've gotten to walk alongside their dad and cheer and be heartbroken. You've probably had some conversations with them when the coach line crossed over the dad line, and you'd like to have that stuff back.


Hopefully, you've apologized as a true man to them. But there's going to come a time when they just want their dad. Do you love me for me, man? Do you love me for me? And maybe that's the exercise to write each one of them a letter and to said, I've been your coach for 21 years. I need you to know. I see the man you've become. I see the way you treat your mom. I see the way you treat your sisters. I see the way you tip well at some crummy restaurant in the middle of the night. All the football stuff goes away, dude. But I see the boys becoming men in front of my very eyes. I want you to know that I almost can't breathe. I'm so proud of you.


Yeah, that's good. I have started to read a book, though. You You're saying that, but I've been starting to read books and relax and take myself away from stuff. I started to do that.


Good, good, good. But hey, I want you to be a real gangster. I want you to write that letter, and then I want you to get each boy and read it to him.




Look him in the eye and read it to him.


Wait, wait, wait, wait. You want me to write it and then read it to them, not send it to him?


Oh, yeah, in person.


Oh, yeah, that's cool. I just didn't know if you wanted me to send them the letter.


No, I want you to read it to him.


Okay, cool.


All right. Yeah, cool. I can't wait till you sit down to do it. Here's the deal. I also want you to write, I want you to write, Young Keith a letter. The Keith, the night before he finds out that his head coach didn't recommend him for whatever reason. I want you to write him a letter and talk about the disappointment, and you had these dreams, and you were going to be on the field, and all that.




Then I want you to tell them, You think that this is going to be the way that life has to work out for you, and it's not going to work out that way. But here's how freaking amazing it's turned out. Then I want you to start writing about your wife and write about that extraordinary daughter, and write about those boys who have come in and out of your life as a coach, and you have been the father for them. They did not have because their old man left. And, yes, you could have played as a lineman two or three years, and you'd have no ankle mobility and no knee mobility and one workable shoulder. That's all true. And you would have made some money Not anything like the other guys behind you that are getting their name in the paper, but you would have made some money. And instead, you've been a part of transforming family trees for two decades. I want you to write a letter to your young son that because I need Keith in the present to believe that because everything you're doing right now is still waiting for this NFL thing to happen.


It didn't happen with you. It's going to happen with your boys. It didn't happen with your boys. It's going to happen with my grandkids. Put that whole damn story to bed, dude, because that wasn't going to be what made Keith, Keith. The story that was in store for Keith, that Keith was writing with his life all the way was, I'm going to sit with young men and I'm going to teach them to get more out of themselves than they ever dream possible. I'm going to teach them how to show up and do really hard things that they don't want to. I'm going to teach them how to dig down deep, work as a team, all those things that you get from sports that I love so much. Then you are going to consciously transform your relationship with your boys to one where they have to sing and dance for you to one where, dude, I just get to bask in their glow. So I want you to go to games and not wear the shirt. I don't want them hearing you screaming. I want them to look up and you just pump a fist and you go, That's my boy right there.


I love you. And I want you to send them a text after the game. I saw you didn't get in the game one time, and I saw you cheering your butt off your teammates, and that is amazing. You played your part today. Not, your coach sucks. I'm coming after your coach. No, I'm not going to do that crap. Some kids are going to start. Some kids aren't even going to make the team, and some kids aren't going to go to college, and some kids aren't going to make six figures. And they're still our kids. We still love them. We still celebrate them. Cheer for them. Hey, Keith, I'm freaking proud of you, dude. I'm proud of you. You didn't fail in my eyes. I'm You're glad you didn't make the NFL, Uncle Rico. I'm glad. Because I'm glad that you were placed in the lives of all those young men. You planted seeds to trees of which you will never eat their fruit. That's amazing. Now go transform it with your own voice. Call anytime, brother. Proud of you. We'll be right back. Hey, what's up? Deloney here. Listen, you and me and everybody else on the planet has felt anxious or burned or chronically stressed at some point.


In my new book, Building a Non-Anxious Life, you'll learn the six daily choices that you can make to get rid of your anxious feelings and be able to better respond to whatever life throws at you so you can build a more peaceful, non-anxious life. Get your copy today at johndaloni. Com. All right, we are back. It's time for Am I the Problem? What's up, Kelly?


All right, so this is from Josh in Bristol, Indiana. All right. My brother-in-law attacked my wife on Facebook and then bashed our business that we own. Hold on.


Can we just... What? I love... This is very, very recent modern history, where we use such violent words to describe- Oh, attacked. Words. Sentences on an imaginary world. Yeah. They attacked me and bashed us. With knives and sledgehammers? No. Their keyboard. No. With thumbs ups and downs. All right, continue. All right.


So, attacked the wife on Facebook and bashed our business. He was drunk and being dumb. I no longer want to have a relationship with him or his wife. Some of my family members say to forgive him because he was drunk, but I don't see it as an excuse. I have no interest in talking to him unless it's about giving up drinking. Am I overreacting?


My gut says yes.


I think it... Is this the first time anything like this has ever happened?


Yeah, it depends. It does. It does. My gut says, and maybe I'm biased by the initial language. But yeah, I mean, I've got friends in my life that I love that do this stuff when they were drunk, and I had a hard conversation. Like, Dude, you cannot do that. That's not an excuse. We're not in there like, I'm sorry.


I think it's different if this is just the latest in a pattern. That's right. He refuses to apologize, refuses to get help. That's a different story.


I'm not going to put myself in that situation. Also, I don't need to make a big announcement. You know what I mean? I don't need to make a big... I'm ending... Dude, I'm just like, Hey, you're drunk all the time.


Talk to me when you're sober.


Or if you want to get help, I'm here.


I'll always be here for you. Always, yeah.


But if somebody just does a thing and they're an idiot online, I don't know. You know what I mean? I saw this on Instagram recently. It's some famous Hollywood actor, but he said, If somebody has a true, a real problem with me, I ask them to call or text me. If they say, Hey, I don't have your number, then I don't really care what you had to say. I love that sentiment. You're not in that- You're not in that circle.


That's right. You don't get to hurt me or you don't get to have input.


There's something to be said for, I don't know, dude. Somebody got drunk and screwed up, did something really bad, did something stupid and mean. We're going to sit down and have a hard conversation.


Yeah, because why? Do you have a problem with my wife? What's the problem? We need to have that conversation. That's right. Because it came from somewhere.


That's I'm going to defend my wife. You're not going to talk bad about my wife publicly. It might be that my wife says, Oh, we're never... Then I'm going to do what my wife says. They are never welcome. All right.


Well, they're never welcome here. I don't think this is a yes or the problem or no, you're not. It's just any more context.


I always err on the side of reconciliation. That's just my natural bent. I'm glad people didn't walk away from me when I've done dumb things, and I'm really, really glad I didn't walk away from other people because they're cornerstones of my life now.


I only have it because I literally get paid, just so you know. What's that? I haven't walked away just because I literally get paid.


No, you have to. One day, you're going to have enough money in the account. You can be like, Peace. I'm out. Awesome. All right. Hey, appreciate you guys. Thank you for being with us. Love you all. Go listen to some good tunes. Take care. Bye.